HVAC Argument with other pros. High vs Low SEER systems. Simple Math.
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- Опубліковано 21 вер 2024
- For years as new technology has come out in the HVAC industry, there has been push back. Old school thinkers have used the extra cost as reason to not invest in the higher SEER heating and air conditioning equipment.
However, after installing enough systems to be able to compare utility bills from homeowners selecting good systems and best systems, we're now seeing the upside to investing in high efficiency systems.
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I retired from the business 5 years ago. I needed to replace the HVAC system in a foreclosure we bought as we were downsizing. I chose a different path, I put in a 16 seer heat pump with an HSPF of 10.5 and took the money I would have spent on an inverter system and installed a mini-split with a 30 seer and an HSPF of 14.2 in the lower level so our main living area is served by the more efficient unit most of the time and during extreme temperatures I run the main system. This is in effect a hybrid 2 stage because I set the mini- split 2 degrees above the main system. The results have been great, in 5 years in an all electric home in Pennsylvania with 2,000 square feet my highest bill has been $165.00 in January.
One thing that is also comes into play is the cost or repairing the new high seer inverter systems. I’ve been told something as simple as a $150 fan on a single stage 14 seer would cost $1500.00 on an inverter system. I’ve read that the first repair on the “Cadillac system “ wipes out any monthly savings you reap from the more efficient system. Do you agree ?
Top of the line systems come with 10-12 parts warranty when installed by a reputable company.
@@steveb8897 Yeah, but most don't come with labor included in their warranty for all those years. But your dealer might be happy to sell you a labor warranty at the time of the purchase. Also if the failure was due to a power spike or lightning strike, no warranty! (This is a big problem for these new heavily computerized inverter systems today). Also in order to qualify for the warranty, you MUST have the unit inspected and cleaned and tuned up by your favorite installing AC Company or you may void your warranty. And that annual or biannual requirement is not included in the cost of the system. And then there is that pesky hourly labor rate and trip charges and shipping fees and shop material fees and disposal and recycling fees and of course you can't simply add refrigerant to most inverter systems if they get low like you can with a traditional compressor system! No way! You have to remove all of the existing refrigerant and likely recycle it and start over with brand new expensive refrigerant and weigh it in because that's how most inverter systems do it these days and of course that's not included in your warranty....... and I could go on, but, you get the idea.
Yes, I am currently (mentally) working on making a decision between a higher seer system and lower-seer. And, this video helps me feel more confident in making the decision that I've analyzed and (potentially) selected. For me, I have to take a lot into consideration because I am replacing everything, and I have two systems -- one a 4 ton on 1st floor and 3 ton on 2nd floor. So, it is not a trivial decision. So, these type of videos do help all of us here in in YT Land to have a way to help influence our decision/s on which way we go. Because, for the direction I am going, it is like buying a new budget car. It is in the $20k's. Not a small sum, so your guidance helps everywhere here to make better decisions and protect their family's budgets. In my situation, I also have kids to think about, making the bills too, and still being able to take care of my elderly parents -- who depend on my financial decisions. So, thanks for the video.
Thanks pal. Is the higher SEER system you're looking at an inverter system?
I live in AZ. Both my neighbors replaced there AC's spring of 2023. One bought a two stage and the other bought a variable system. The 2 stage is "more efficient" in this application and was $4800 less. PS: You cannot just look at "savings per month" you do not use your AC all 12 months.
Like many things it depends. It depends on how big your house is, your electricity bill, how long you intend to stay there.
It’s not simple math. Utility costs are continuing to go up and money is worth more today than it is tomorrow because of inflation. That being said you’re right, it’s better to go with a higher seer rating product because of the long term savings.
Just had three daikin 19seer mini splits installed total cap of 4.25 tons .....area used to be conditioned 10ton package unit. Simple math!!! Great video.
Thanks pal!
Seer rating does not change tonnage. If if you went from a 10 ton package unit to a 4.5 ton mini split, and it effectively cools the space. That indicates the package unit was grossly over sized.
@@brettwing737 you are correct. The example was not the best, I agree.
The energy efficiency of equipment is grossly over looked when selecting equipment. In my case the area we are conditioning is a QC lab and the temp needs to be regulated at 68 degree. This in turn puts additional use on any system. That being said the SEER rating plays a even bigger part of the selection of equipment.
Looking to upgrade our 21 yr old system. Am learning so much watching your videos thanks!!
Thanks pal
What did you go with? We are looking to upgrade our now 20-year-old system soon.
@@X1OAFREED0M we went with a Bryant 2 stage furnace and heat pump. Have been very happy so far. Very quiet and efficient
I really think it’s because the techs who don’t recommend high seer equipment don’t know how to work on the equipment, stuck in the old ways and easy ways and don’t wanna adapt. I tell you what, the people that know how to work on them are 100% more valuable to the industry. And that’s why they are paid they way they do. People need to just learn.
That’s a good point. I hadn’t considered that.
u r probably right, and thats scary to know you'll have deal with that same level of expertise to fix/figure it out.
Sick burn dude 👍🏽
But…. I think they’re factoring in higher parts and repair cost. Even so, I think higher seer still ROI’s better than lower.
I went from a single stage AC to a variable one in my first house in 2016. I saved $150 a month and saw the drop in about 2 months. Not only did my electric bill drop like a rock my house was also alot colder in my house also.
I had a Trane 14 seer single stage package unit....switched over to a bosch 19 seer inverter Package unit in arizona... i also keep track of kilowatts the past 2 weeks so i can compare the new unit. If i save 20 kilowatts or more a day i am happy 😊
So, are you saving any yet? Please update all of us and let us know.
@@PoeLemic just got it installed less than 24 hrs ago. I will keep track of kilowatts usage and outdoor temps to know for sure here in a few weeks time
@@AZ_WEDDO Cool, do that. What are some of your lows & highs with KW with your former system. I'll cut and paste my stuff -- from below. I have (somewhere) 4200kw in low summer months then 5200kw in high summer months. But off-season is like 1800 to 2400/2500kw, but it is often less than 2000kw in the middle winter months. But let me cut & paste (from below discussion), because I'm deciding between a single-stage 13 seer or 14 serer versus 16 seer with two stages. Difference (for me) is like $6000 for two systems. So, it seems that it might take me a longer payback than 5 years, but even if it is 10 years ... who cares? They have warranties for 10 years parts, so I'll have 10 years GUARANTEED (unless house burns down) to get that return from the investment. I'd surely get $5000 back in savings (I would think) in 10 years, even if I only got 5 months @ $100/mo savings for 10 years. That's my difference back. Anwyay, here is the commentary below ...
@@AZ_WEDDO Poe Lemic
Poe Lemic
49 minutes ago
Yes, I am currently (mentally) working on making a decision between a higher seer system and lower-seer. And, this video helps me feel more confident in making the decision that I've analyzed and (potentially) selected. For me, I have to take a lot into consideration because I am replacing everything, and I have two systems -- one a 4 ton on 1st floor and 3 ton on 2nd floor. So, it is not a trivial decision. So, these type of videos do help all of us here in in YT Land to have a way to help influence our decision/s on which way we go. Because, for the direction I am going, it is like buying a new budget car. It is in the $20k's. Not a small sum, so your guidance helps everywhere here to make better decisions and protect their family's budgets. In my situation, I also have kids to think about, making the bills too, and still being able to take care of my elderly parents -- who depend on my financial decisions. So, thanks for the video.
@@AZ_WEDDO [Won't clean it up too much ...]
Poe Lemic
26 minutes ago
@R2 Gmail Most of the higher dollar, good company systems (like Mr. Griffin) is referring to -- have longer warranties than probably most older systems. Currently, I am shopping around for a higher seer system, and I am seeing companies offering -- at least -- 10 years for the parts, and some are offering 12 years on the compressor and then 20 years on the furnace. So, it's not like you have to replace it in that "7-10years" (like you said). But, again, that's what I am seeing with Trane, Rheem, Carrier, etc. But, not with the systems on the lower end (say 3 years or 5 years warranty).
Poe Lemic
15 minutes ago
@Wayne Springer It is nice that you are discussing this matter with Mr. Griffin, because I am observing and trying to learn from what the two of you are discussing. And, I do follow it, but it is a big concern of mine (and many other homeowners) that videos that Mr. Griffin makes, highlight these issues. Even if they do not apply for every homeowner, it is good that he discusses it. Even in this video, I liked how he broke that situations where it would not produce an economically return for doing it. But, I'm in Houston, Texas, and I think that I might see some of the efficiencies (if I go with a higher system). Yet, I'm making the trade-off of how much the higher seer systems are versus the lower seer systems. For me, I think now that I've been quotes two 13 ton systems (4 ton lower and 3 ton upper) for $14500-ish, but the 16 ton systems are more-like $18k/19k (possibly $20k) systems. So, I like that Mr. Griffin is helping me think about and evaluate those issues.
For my last month, on my current system, I used 4200 kw for the month during May. And, my house uses -- somewhere around 1600/1800 kw in cooler winter months, because the house has gas for the heating ... so electricity is probably negligible to run the blower. But, in summer, I have seen 5200 kw as my highest. But, here we really use a lot from somewhat May (which is not so much usually -- but this year is much higher) and really use it until September, then it cools back down to 2200/kw after 9-21-2020 (or it did last year). So, I guess that's 5/6/7/8/9 -- yeah, about 5 months of really hot months (just as you said, Wayne). So, lot of this stuff I wouldn't know if both of you wouldn't have discussed it, and the fact that Mr. Griffin is talking all of us through these topics, I am very thankful.
Even if not all situations work out to do a payback in one year, just me knowing that there is possibility that I could payback the difference in 5 years. Well, that's an influencing factor in me considering a higher seer system. That's something that I hadn't put into my mental model for this business decision that I am going to have to make.
As a comfort consultant for a Lennox premier dealer, I loved binging your videos recently! Great info being put out there, wish you had more experience with Lennox to share more opinions of it though!
Damn, Man ... I wish that you were in my area in Houston, Texas ... after seeing your Warranty Protections ... 6:10 ... That really shows you are honest and believe in your work.
Oh thanks pal. I've been to Houston. I love it there. Y'all have some good restaurants 🙂
@@NewHVACGuide Well, yeah, we do have some good restaurants -- if any of the Good Ones survived Covid. [he he he] ...
And, if you are ever in Houston again, let me know ahead of time, and I'll buy you dinner and show you the A/C Unit that I think I am going to get, because of your advice. I haven't done it yet, but I am becoming more convinced monetarily that it is a good idea. But, BIG NUMBERS are scary to me -- until I also figure in payback if my bills go down some. Not that you said (i.e., nothing you said promised that) they would, but I believe they will and that is enough for me. Even only $100/month in summer difference (or even $60/$70) per month would make a big difference long-term, then if I can shave $30/$40 in other cooler months, then I can go from a normal new low-end seer to a middle-higher seer. That's what your videos taught me. Thanks.
Nobody is taking opportunity cost into account. If the variable speed option has a $5k premium over the single-stage, the energy savings better be recouped quick. If the person that bought the single -stage and banked the $5k into a conservative investment will double it about every 10 years. The Daikin calculator shows my break-even point at 8.3 years, but doesn't show that the $5K I saved going single-stage would have grown to $8112 with a 6% annual return. So it's not actually a break-even point. It's even worse for those that take out a loan with interest to purchase their unit.
Interesting point.
Have you considered systems that are not 5k higher? Budget friendly systems like the Fit?
The higher the SEER the less latent removal. If you live in a very dry state this doesnt mean too much, all you need is sensible cooling. But if you live anywhere that needs humidity removal then the higher SEER units suck. This is why all the units we sell have a variable speed blower with a dehum terminal. We use a Prostat thermostat/humidistat and when the humidity is higher than the setting the dehum terminal is deenergized and the fan speed reduces to 75% turning your a/c system into a dehumidifier until the humidity setting you set is reached. When your unit is operating as a dehumidifier all those SEER numbers go right out the window. This is why your ductless unit has a DRY mode. As far as the inverters go the technology is well wrought. Everything in my home is inverter driven ductless,well pump, even my generator is an inverter. Inverters have no inrush current so they are much easier to run on a generator. Most units will lets you select coil temps for high latent or high sensible for wherever you live. The only variable with an inverter is they need to use a rotatory compressor, they just havent been able to vary the speed of the scroll without problems. Rotary compressors have been around for many years and they work well but for some reason I am unsure of they didnt like to use them in air conditioning. We went right from the reciprocating compressor to the Scroll. Why didnt they use a rotary back then? If anyone knows I would love to hear the answer.
Hmmm, that’s an interesting point 🤔
It isn't quite that simple. TVM should be included in any savings calculation. $100 5 years from now isn't worth the same as $100 now (inflation, opportunity cost, etc.) which would decrease the cost effectiveness of the system as it ages; especially since the SEER rating is supposed to decrease as the system ages; that would need to be calculated in if it isn't a linear decrease (I don't think it is based on the calc you gave before using, IIRC: SEER * (1-.01^AGE)), which would always increase the cost effectiveness of the system relative to the old system. Regardless, thank you for the videos!
I always enjoy your videos.
Just curious if the reported savings are from their old system or what they would have saved based on a new 14-15 SEER system? The reason I asked is we did a calculation when I was in school over 20 years ago comparing the payout of a 10 VS 13 SEER system and it worked out to about 12-13 years. I know many things have changed since then.
I ran the Daikin energy calculator for my home because I am in the process of evaluating a new heat pump.
Daikin's projected cost for cooling was about $170 peak in the summer and $450 peak in the winter for a single stage heat pump. My actual cost for a single stage heat pump in a 3300 ft2 home is about $170 peak in the summer and $100 in the winter. No natural gas is available in my area.
I estimate a 20% savings going from my current single stage to a good two-stage unit. I estimate a 30% savings based on AHRI values and a good Bosch unit. That works out to about $300/yr for the two stage and $500/yr for a Bosch inverter.
I am leaning toward a two-stage unit in my case. A two-stage unit should match well with my two zone home better than my 16 year old single stage heat pump. Time to repair in my area is a problem with inverter systems. The repair techs I talk to say to avoid inverters to avoid long outages.
Check out my latest video about techs saying no to new technology. It addresses this exact issue.
Another factor in todays world is potential solar upgrade cost. If you plan to add solar to your home during the life of the replacement HVAC unit you can substantially lower the solar cost due to decreased kWh demand
If you look at the climate where I live in Colorado. Let's say I convince a customer to install a high seer a/c system. That a/c will only run 3 to 4 months a year at most. So even if they save 100 dollars a month which is a savings you rarely will see. It will take that customer 13 years to recoup the extra 5000 dollars they spent up front on install. That doesn't seem like a good investment to me. Pay 5000 up front and in 13 years if the system is still operating as designed, hasn't been butchered and you still live in the house then you will start making money on it.
If we are talking high seer heat pumps then there is slightly more merit because they run year round. But I find the price difference between a new installed 80plus gas furnace and 13seer a/c vs a 20 seer or better heat pump with heat strip to be far more than 5000 dollars. Its probably closer to an added cost of about 10000 dollars. So still in my book I don't think its worth it, to each there own though.
If you’re doing straight AC, then the math may not work but you can use the same idea for furnaces too. Comparing AFU ratings and prices.
Yeah his math is completely wrong he need to learn and understand.
The price chart looks ridiculous on the thumbnail. That’s not savings to me.
My HVAC guy put in a 16 seer Rheem hybrid system. My house is a pole building house super insulated very air tight. R48 walls r 60 roof. HVAC is in the conditioned crawlspace with an hrv my HVAC guy didn't think I'd ever make up the savings going from a 14 to 16 seer unit due to the low heating and cooling demand but we'll see
Even in AZ we don’t run AC 12 month a year, saving in AZ only happen about 6 months per year.
simple math for sure but you should at least calculate the saving by the months you use the AC in Chicago that's about 6 months
I've tried to tell you multiple times quit using dollars as a figure it means nothing a person could have an 800 ft² house another person a 10000 ft² house saving a $100 a month to the other is 2 different things use percentages
"You'll save $100.00 a month." -- wow my AC will be free
14seer all the way, unless 2stage or variable speed is needed for say zoning ect. its not about energy savings its about reliability, and durability against power surges/ random part failures.
Do you think lower running speed system is less wear and tear. Like a car running 30 mph vs one running 100 mph? I've heard it argued that the is more durability.
I'm not sure one is significantly better than the other in my experiences.
@@NewHVACGuide but to get that lower speed running you have what is like a more complicated transmission, with more parts.
Variable speed units have their place, in say for instance a new home with spray foam and a tight building envelope.
But from experience your not doing anyone any favors selling them the high seer on an older home.
They need a 14seer unit and to invest on insulation upgrages.
Another great one bro! 👊🏼
3 weeks ago, i went from a single stage, 5 ton, 17 yr old Rheem heatpump to a 2 stage, 16 seer, Carrier heatpump system. is that an Inverter type that you talk about? I'm not seeing a big savings , yet. i live in san antonio, Texas. temperatures are starting to climb, maybe ill appreciation it more as summers heat up. btw, would you recommend i pay $800 more to have an NIM controller board and thermostat upgrade, so the outside and attic units can communicate????? Im told that interface controller is on backorder with no expected arrival date known, and prices or going up because of high demand and supply shortages--- is that true???
Equipment shortages are very true currently. That said, your two stage system is probably running on 2nd stage which is 100% equivalent to the single stage. First stage will be running more on milder days.
Staged systems are different from inverter systems. An inverter system is hundreds of stages (sorta) being able to ramp up and down.
What is your thought process on the American Standard Gold 16 Heat Pump? Unit is for a primary home.
i call bs... you could give a percentage instead of 100s.... what were their bills originally $1000 a month
Hmmm, well the other way to look at it is if in your example, you start out spending $10K instead of $15K for a new unit, you get instant savings of 5K!!! Yeah, you may spend a little more each month on heat or cool, but every year, your spending dollars that are worth LESS than today's dollars, so is it really costing you more money? And we all know with more complex systems, there is the potential for more stuff to go wrong.. That's just the nature of mechanics and especially electronic devices that hate heat and power surges from the power company and local lightning strikes like we have here in Florida. Those things are likely going to be the cause of electronic device failures over time. Yes, some of the electronics are a little more reliable today then they were years ago, but due to the chinese cheap components installed on most circuit boards even in these "American Made" AC units, regardless of where its made, you are still going to see many more high tech electronic failures than mechanical ones. Cars are a great example of this. The more high tech, the more cost to repair and more likely something will break. If you buy a solid inexpensive system, do normal preventative maintenance and take that extra $5K and stick it into some type of appreciating asset, I believe you will be surprised how much money you'll save over time as well as how much you can earn on the money you saved. Dollars in your possession today are worth more than they will be tomorrow or next week or next year. Also, if you only plan to live in the home for a couple of years, (the national average is something less than 7 years) you may never get your money back in the "Savings" promised with a more expensive system. If you are replacing a system in a rental unit, best to install the cheapest fully functional unit you can because renters just won't take care of it and you should plan on replacing it more often anyway. Just some food for thought...
What do think of refrigerators and washing machines with inverters?
Lack of knowledge is the greatest contribution for bias. I find the longer someone has been around in anything, they lack knowledge on new technology or techniques and are more biased towards what they originally learned or what not to what they know.
Love the videos! Have 2 bids I need to choose between, having analysis paralysis!
$9750 - Lennox SL280V Furnace, ML14 AC
$10258 - Trane TUD2-9V, ML14
Thanks pal. Which one are you gonna choose?
Went with the Lennox! I had a better gut feeling when it came to the company/technicians. It’s doing the job so far
We who own laundromats have inverters running on every washing machine. When a component fails we send the inverters to a laundry electronics repair company that repairs the inverter/boards. Us their a reason why hvac inverters cannot have repairs done to them?
My personal opinion is that most electronic circuit boards are extremely complex these days, and not really designed to be repaired, unfortunately. I'm an electronics guy, and I can tell you that most customers would rather pay for a new guaranteed board and the labor to do the swap than to pay someone like me to have to spend hours troubleshooting and repairing a circuit board with no guarantee that it will work or for how long. Unfortunately, electronics today are designed to be a throw away commodity. They are just way too time consuming and expensive to repair. Much cheaper in the long run to simply replace. That's just the way it is in the real world.
SEER number is NOT real, here is why: The SEER number requires your house system be in perfect compatibility with the air conditioner. This includes the duct work and the fan that moves the air through the duct work which is usually inside a furnace. If they are all not perfectly compatible you will not get the SEER number and will NOT get the energy savings.
Def isn’t always accurate. But it’s still a way to compare apples and oranges
Great videos! I am receiving quotes for heat pumps I am located near Richmond VA. I have a quote between a 14 seer and a 16 seer and the difference in cost is $1200. Using the calculators I have found online my 20 year savings would only be about $1000, but I know that heat pumps run more than other systems, would you happen to know the number of hours an average heat pump runs in Virginia, so I can get a better estimate of savings?
I don’t have any numbers like that. Every house is different. If the 14 and 16 seer systems are both single stage, you probably will not see a significant difference in your utility bills. If the 16 seer is two-stage or inverter, you will see a larger difference
Bird in the hand.....
My guy said inverter is too sensitive to power glitches and lightning. Requires multiple more services calls.
Your guy might not have a choice soon. Sounds like he’s inexperienced and it’s inverters.
Let me clear this Bernie Sanders math up. Your savings will depend in what part of the country you live in example. If you live in Florida and you get let's say a 18 seer system for 15k. You are running your system mostly the whole year ( 8760 hours) you can see a faster return in your investment 5 to 8 years. However if you live in Michigan where you run your system on and off for 3 to 4 months that 5 to 8 years know becomes 20 to 25. So it would not be worth it to get an 18 seer system. If you went balls out in the north and got a 22 seer you probably are not going to live long enough to see a return on your investment PERIOD.
lol. "Bernie Sanders math"
I can do a 4 ton split system for under $4000, what does an inverter system cost ? How long does that take to recover?
I just had a question for you. Do you know if there’s any problem with getting equipment at this time? Is that still an issue?
There may be a few issues, but things are significantly better than they were. We are not having trouble getting equipment unless it’s something that is just simply not in stock, and our supplier has to order it from the factory.
Building an off-grid solar/battery powered 1600sq lakehouse slab on grade. Looking at geothermal. What's your honest opinion?
Option A. Geothermal
Option B. Propane heater and efficient air conditioner.
What would you do if you where building off-grid?
Thanks much.
Have you gotten quotes?
How about a "cheap" propane heater like an rinnai direct vent in the center of the house and then a couple mini split heads that are capable of heating too?
What’s your thought on a upstairs unit. I understand putting in the high seer unit downstairs what do you recommend to pair the upstairs with ?
Depends on the home. We have some customers that don't go upstairs much and opt for a unit they plan to run less
I want to take advantage of the 2023 tax credit and on the Daikin website is shows the DZ17VSA up to seer 18 and then the DZ6VS shows up to 17.5 seer 2. Is the DZ17VSA phasing out ? Thanks
Does the DZ17VSA qualify for the 2023 tax credit as I cannot find a seer 2 rating for this unit
When you live in a mild climate and also have the cheapest electricity in the country... paying $80 a month on average to heat and cool a 1500 sq foot house.. my unit? 13 seer installed in 2009.... I don’t think top tear would have saved me anything.
You’d be surprised 😉
You are right
I have a 2 tom 13 seer Lennox system and the compressor burnt up due to the filter at the unit not being changed cause I didn't know one was there. They dont offer a 13 seer replacement heat pump so was wondering, can I use a 1.5 ton 14 seer heat pump without haveing to switch out the air handler unit? If so, what brand HP do you recommend to work with Lennox?
I recommend only installing systems that are AHRI matches
Getting a complete swap out 16 SEER 4 TON American standard silver with 96% gas furnace...All components line set, whip, drain, pump, thermostat for $6500 am I getting ripped off?
Sounds reasonable
Hello love the videos, question I live in northern Virginia and need to replace HVAC system. I live in small house 1000 Square foot ranch one level on a slab. What seer would you recommend? I have currently a 2 ton 14 seer . thinking about going 16 seer. Thanks
Go inverter! 🙂
Just curious what are you’re thoughts on Bryant heat pumps ,I’m checking out a high efficiency split system the 284 anv 3 ton model ,just wondering the reliability and such , thanks in advance ,great educational videos ,thank you !
Bryant is a Carrier line of equipment and essentially the same products in a lot of cases. Although I'm not a big fan of Carrier, there are plenty of heating and air guys that love them
Thank you so much for you’re honesty , I appreciate it , I am checking out multiple brands and such and have had several bids now , some are relatively close to each other a couple that carry the same brands as the others but don’t advertise it ,I guess since it’s not their flagship product ,are worlds apart ,as such a carrier 18 seer 5 stage heat pump system 5 k difference between the two companies for exact same product and scope of work , mind blowing, thanks again and good day to you sir
Wow, that is mind blowing. Good luck on your project!
Yeah... I started my HVAC replacement saga about two months ago when I came back from Brazil to find an unbearably hot house... (95+F inside)... First thing I did was to get recommendations from friends about contractors. (I live in Fort Lauderdale FL. It's as hot and HUMID as it gets). First two guys, highly recommended, were a disaster... Red flags all over the place. And the more they tried to convince me that "these new highly 'efficient' and advanced units are too expensive, break all the time, are too complex, not worth the investment" (I mean, they went out of their way to repeat that over and over and over again...) the more I thought: "This guy is lying! He is not qualified to install a better system, and/or would have a lower profit margin, and/or does not know how to maintain newer systems, and/or whatever." I decided to do my own research and pretty much found out what you explain in this video. I decided then to switch my tactics. First I researched what were the best 4 brands. Then I visited their websites and chose the models I believed were the best bang for my buck. THEN, most important: I used the recommendations on the manufacturer's websites to schedule appointments with contractors certified by them! Man... The experience was night and day. No more scary conversations trying to sway my opinion here and there, no more "We will need to remove your closet and drill holes through your walls to pass a new drain line, etc., etc., etc." I am just now waiting for 2023, since I know everything will change with new regulation, manufacturers will need to adapt, than by March I will reassess, get new quotes from the two contractors I liked the most, and probably go with a 4 TON variable speed 20+ SEER unit (Probably a Carrier Infinity 26 or whatever replaces that in 2023). Thank you for the great video! Best, Raphael.
Well if you are waiting for the new systems you will need to wait till 2025 as thats when everything changes to the new refrigerant. 2023 is just a new seer rating with model revamps. Fyi your old duct more than likley isnt going to be sized correctly for a 20seer+ unit and will need to be redone or you will lose all that extra efficiency you paid for and burn up blower motor modules
I'm getting frustrated selecting a heat pump. I type heat pump into the search bar and all I get is all these things that look like cooling systems and the descriptions talk about how good they are at cooling but they have vague specs. I'm in Ohio. If i get hot I turn the fan on. Idc about cooling. But if I search electric furnace I get all these bad ass heaters with BTU ratings and some are like 110,000 btus and I'm like oh yeah baby 😎. That just sounds so much better than a device that costs the same but it cools at 14,000 btus and it says "with heater". What am I missing here? Like .... how hot are these things exactly? Idgaf about how cold they are. If my pipes freeze and burst while I'm away for a week then I'm gonna be outside. I'll have all the cold I will ever need then.
In MN where we use our AC for 3.5 to 4 months does an inverter system make sense? I would spend for the upgrade if so. One local company said only a 13 seer system makes sense. What about geothermal vs air?
I would defer to your local contractor on that. Every market is different.
How much does it cost to replace the inverter when it breaks?
Now your on the right track, thinking ahead...
What do you think about a Lennox XC25? I’m looking to upgrade from a Goodman single stage 4 ton
I have personally never laid hands on one. The supplier for Lennox in our area is awful
What do you think about the Lennox XC25? Want to switch from a Goodman 4 ton single state
I have personally never laid hands on one. The supplier for Lennox in our area is awful
Deciding between a 14 seer trane heat pump and a 16. Is there a difference in comfort?
Not really, 14 seer has a single speed motor. 16 seer has a variable speed which can dehumidify a little better than the 14
80% Furnace and AC condenser & evap coil with WiFi T- stat 14 seer Rheem system $6320 installed my home had 10 seer Lennox when I bought my house is that a good price or to much?
Every market is different. Get 3 quotes if you’re not sure
@@NewHVACGuide Ok thanks.
i have to disagree with you on this one. as far as cooling goes here in florida you will never save enough on your electric bill to pay for 20+ seer equipment. not even close. i have an 1800 sq ft home with a 13 year old 13 seer ac system and my electric bill never goes above $200 and most of the year its below $140. once you get above 16-17 seer the savings isnt greater than the cost. that being said the high seer inverter systems are going to make the house more comfortable but the electric bill isnt going to be any less than if it were a 16-17 seer. might be different up not due to heating but not here.
Definitely can’t save $300 a month if your bill is $200 a month 😉
You have am 1800 sq ft home, in florida, and your electric bill is $200/month?? Man... What do you set your thermostat to? 150F? Mine is close to $600 at the height of the summer months, and I never bring the thermostat bellow 77F. Seriously. You're blessed. You must have the most efficient 13 year old 13 SEER AC systems ever! Good for you, sincerely. Best, R.
@@BRBearUSA tsatat set to 78 when at work and 76 when at home. The highest my electric bill was this year was $190. I live alone , only have a few loads of laundry a week and dont cook. A lot more than just ac makes high electric bills
If I only run my ac 4-5 months will it pay for itself to pay $5,000 more?
Maybe not. Our area runs heat pumps 12 months of the year.
But simple math… $5000, 5 months, 10 years. Would need $100 savings per month to break even. So depending on the systems, if one’s not that more efficient, no. If your electric bill is already only $100, no.
My electric bill is about 120. 00 a month average with a 10 seer , replacing with 16 seer if i go up to 22 will cost me 6,000.00 more i don’t think i will recover the difference (simple math) 😀
I think you are right. Every house is different. You’re very lucky to have a power bill so low.
I think you are right. Every house is different. You’re very lucky to have a power bill so low.
My system has GOT to go. Its a 24 year old York 3.5ton. Its the base grade. It was mnfg. in 1997... First four letters were EKFM.... so base builder grade.
my electric bill last month was ~279.00. 209 of which was JUST the HVAC, the entire rest of my house was only 70.00 to run.... yikes.. Next spring I think I have to go whole hog and upgrade everything, as much as that will suck to have to do. I do plan to stay in the house a very long time so I think for me it will make sense to get the best I can afford.
Makes sense!
+Jurassic Tech you’ve certainly gotten your moneys worth out of that system.
What area
@@buddy7485 midwest
You can get in a goodman for cheap right now till EOM Dec
Are you in Florida? I would hire you to save me money
I wish pal. I’m in Virginia
Really depends on where you live. Florida makes a lot of sense to do high efficiency. In New Jersey we have probably less then 30 days over 90. Takes forever to get a return on investment. Heat makes sense to do high efficiency.
Location definitely makes a difference
Just did a Bosch 5 ton inverter unit. Works great. Expensive but they wanted heat pump and it goes down to 5 degrees I think
I like them too. I put one in my own home
@@briansterling5567 just got mine today bosch 19 seer package unit...
You qualify for a tax credit with 16SEER systems, so it might be worth it to go for 16 over 14 SEER.
I hadn’t heard that. Can you send me a link to a website with the info?
Electric company in Florida offers a $500 rebate if you go with a 16 seer or higher. A minimum of 16-SEER or 15.2 SEER2 for heat pumps. $500
You only use ac in the summer. Your math is wrong
We install heat pumps. They run all year long. Math is right 🙂
Can you answer a question please? I got a quote for 2 comfortmaker 2.5 ton 15 seer units. When i signed the documents to install those units are 14 seer units. The salesman said it’s the same thing no difference but i feel like I’m getting scammed. Can i get your advice?
Also shouldn’t the 14 seer be cheaper?