7.62x39 AR vs AK Accuracy Test: Is it the ammo or the gun?
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
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We take two PSA rifles, one is the KS47 AR and the other is a GF3 PSA AK both chambered in 7.62x39. We conduct an accuracy test of not just the rifles but of some common 7.62x39 ammo.
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This test needed a magnified optic and more distance
You've clearly never seen tests done with iron sights I suppose. If a gun is 1 MOA at 50 yards it's 1 MOA at 500, the shooter on the other hand may not be. It's simple physics.
@@Militaryarmschannel no offense I'm well aware you are more experienced in firearms and shooting. However I have no doubt I've done more long range and can tell you, and long range guys would agree with me. That's not a great accuracy test.
@@clartro No offense taken. I know the long range world quite well. 7.62x39 isn't 6mm PRC. Beyond that, most militaries zero their rifles at 25m-50m. So yes, this is a valid test.
@Seth Rising 250 yards it's pretty damn far with a non magnified red dot optic friend.
@@Militaryarmschannel You're so cocky. You have a massive bias towards the ar. You're at 50 yards acting like a group that's half an inch tighter proves how massively more accurate the ar is. At 50 yards is that a noticeable difference? I'd argue no.
You should another video but a AR-15 vs AK in 556
I was thinking the same thing.
And after that, an AR in 7.62r vs an AK47.
Who’d actually want an AK chambered in 223/556? I’d say one of the biggest advantages to the AK over the AR is the bigger bullet.
@@ClassicalvsTactical same ammo different platform vs different ammo and platform, l don't think yield the same results.
AR vs Galil ACE?
Not asking you to do another video, but I'll bet if you used a Romanian Draco with a 12" barrel and compared it to a 12" 7.62x39 AR they'd be much closer. The shorter barreled AKs don't suffer the barrel whip of the 16" models and have been the most accurate in my experience.
That's true with all shorter barrels including the 12" 7.62 ar.
George Keith I know, I just expect the results would be more similar. Might show that the lack of a free floated barrel isn't the only factor detrimental to the accuracy of an AKM type.
Brandon Herrera from a k guys going to be pissed. LMFAO love that dude though
Nyet. Rifle is fine.
The A.K mother lover
Dudes a chode
James from TFB has enter the chat.
Homey got the coof!!!! Lolol
Yep. That is exactly what I have experienced. I am not a fanboy of either platform and own several of each. All are very high quality (BCMs for ARs...Arsenals for AKs). ARs ARE a bit more accurate. AKs always function and are easier to clean.
Another stellar review MAC! Thanks to you and your crew for all your hard work.
I would be curious to see if a KNS gas piston would help the AK any, you can see it is jumping around a lot more than the KS47.
Also FMJ-BT bullets won't really give you better accuracy in this instance but what it does do over the flat base bullets is give you less drop at distance and little bit more range before going subsonic.
Very kewl video! Thank you for doing this.
Their stll in the kill zone center mass. Either or!!!. Still like my sks. But the ar is what I'm used to.
take the cleaning rod out of the ak. you will get slightly better grouping. get an adjustable gas block on the ar and it will really shine
I wonder how the new AK-20 from arsenal would stack up since it's free floating.
Why didn't you include USA ammo manufacturers? That is all I hunt with. But may try PPU round nose to see if less shattering.
I'm glad this backyard science tried to take out as many variables as possible, different ammo selection, similar optic, same firearm manufacturer (similar manufacturing tolerances). Overall good video that answers an interesting question
Thanks for watching.
Yet the AKM has the slant compensator on that is known to affect grouping. Yes, i know i'm being anal and that ar-15 action is inherently more accurate.
Although they were interesting results, I can't say that I was completely surprised by them. The free floating barrel of the AR pattern rifle is more likely to give better accuracy based on everything that I have ever read, seen, or experienced.
A front end job on an AK (gas block/front sight combo) improves that. Much more consistent barrel harmonics without the FSB hanging on the end.
How did you post this a week ago when the video came out today?
@@alexanderluster402 MAC does an early release for his Patreon supporters.
It's not just that. It's the DGI system meaning the recoil is perfectly horizontal.
no barrel in a gasser is free floated. the handguard on the ar is free floated. had tim rested the ak on the mag or used a mag grip, it would have removed some of that difference. there is a reason east block guys do that and it's not just heat.
That AK must have been confused by the brass cased ammo. 😝
The AK gets more accurate if you drop it in the mud, then leave it in your truck tool box for a summer.
This is why it’s superior
Aaaaaannnd there goes all of the in stock Golden Tiger and Bernaul ammo
I got 2k wolf mil spec HP yesterday, its made at the barnaul factory, so it should be pretty good too
I hope you bought it a couple of months ago when it was at the $200 per case price range.
@Jones good to know!
I only have one spam can of 7n6 left for my 74 and I'm scared to break into it.... Fortunately I have plenty of Wolf to eat through during these trying times 😂
Golden Tiger is actually Maxwell today. Their stamps are the same and they look alike as well.
I've always thought this should be a test same caliber same ammo, MAC always delivering the best review ever.. This test proves that the 7.62 AK round is very accurate, & both Platforms are plenty accurate for Battle accuracy, thanks Tim.
I agree with most of what you said except the 7.62 x 39 is very accurate... Out of an ak platform the accuracy is pathetic. 2 ish inches at 50 yds? Literally not far from handgun caliber levels of accuracy. I think my sub 2k can shoot a 2" group at 50 yards. All of my 5.56 rifles have been capable of under an inch at 50. I would argue that in an AR or other more accurate platform the ammo is acceptable and seems to get to .300 bo levels but out of most the common rifles the accuracy is quite bad
@@accordv6er he had no magnification My c39 shoots way better than that with a 16 times power scope, veprs will do the same
@@redfirekla fair. VEPRs are wonderful rifles. I want a 54R badly.... Then ammo and rifles went a away. I've had to find satisfaction with a 6.5CM AR10
@@accordv6er Tim had a modified vepr with mag conversion that shot sub moa at 100.
@@accordv6er Do you even shoot?? Not the most accurate but damn good in the right hands.
My wife's mother laughs at both of those rifles. That Sea Monster is only afraid of diets and holy water.
@@Chad-the-impaler Your mo' in law is Nanci Pelosi?!
Damn, sorry about that!
And mine is a hot blue-eyed, strawberry blonde that is 50% Norwegian Viking...
@Jones LMFAO! I was referring to my mother-in-law as well. No Freudian stuff going on here...
@@Knight_of_the_Old_Code well if she's that hot, could one possibly acquire some "stuff"? Asking for a friend.
@@Shadow6a LMFAO
I was in Barnaul several years ago, nice town. Greetings from Russia!
I’m shocked no one else tried to go to these measures before, I’m glad you guys went to the effort to do this video. Thanks for the top quality content.
The cartridge is capable of being accurate, My CZ 527 is very accurate.
I agree cheap steel case brown bear groups under a inch for me
Cheap Tula gives me 1.5" in groups at 100yds in my AR
Same. Also my Ruger Ranch in 7,62x39 does astonishingly well w steel cased.
@@NaNa-tg7tg Believe this or not, I'm actually looking in to the mini-30 tactical as a hunting/ SD gun, ruger fanboy anyway an looking for insight about them, your thoughts would be appreciated since you own one, thx
i grouped .4" and 1300 yards with my century arms
I feel like this was a pretty good representation in the difference of accuracy between both platforms using the same round. Even the most diehard AK guys know the AR is more accurate. 2-3moa is typically what people expect from a good AK, the worst AK's shoot 3-4. More interestingly though, I feel this also brings attention to the fact that not all rifles like all rounds! Why it's nice to get out and test loads before you go stocking up. Find a round your particular rifle likes to be fed.
Im a die hard AK guy and my ARs are more accurate. Its just how it is. I would trust my life with either one.
No one is denying AR being more accurate. But the fact still stands that that AK design is 70 years old while that AR is somewhat modern AR design. Would be better if it was tested on some a bit modern AK design. I would love to see the results of AK 15. It would be also really cool to see AR in 556 vs AK 19 which is also in 556. But now its not possible because of bans.
Bad AKs are much more inaccurate than that lol!
@@vasilije94 The AR was designed in the 1950's. It's a 70 year old design.
@@weasle2904 You don't understand what i wrote. In video he used old AKM for test and a new AR platform. Should have taken new AK platform as well for the test. Would be a lot more interesting and fair.
Thanks for the test and the video. Once again, it seems the ar wins out on precision. However, the ak's accuracy is respectable for a combat rifle. How a 70+ year old design is still relavant as ever today, is amazing. The ar design is 60+ years old now too. Every 2a loving american should have at least one of each.
I love them both. The AK is a classic and a great rifle.
I know you won’t see this comment butt as I watched you shoot the drum in the KS-47 I saw your sight wiggle. Wonder if it is tight?
It looks like it's wiggling, but it's not. The sight is quite tight on the gun. I saw what looked like wiggle in the video during editing and went and got the rifle to double check, and it's still tight. 👍
Had the same thought.
Looks like the bill of his hat is causing an optical illusion as if the optic is wiggly.
In regard to this, I know youtube makes for some built in image stabilization. I've seen a few cell phone vids that look fairly stable, but the frame of the shot is wiggling about everywhere.
Some of the reivews from RegularCarReviews also has some of the same wiggling issues. It's a feature!
This test needed a ruger american in x39 to introduce a bolt action to really test the ammo aspect
Agreed. A buddy and myself were getting hits at 800 yards on a 12x18 silhouette target with golden tiger 124 gr in his Ruger American. Biggest issue we were having was we had to be absolutely precise with our wind calls and the velocity spread of the ammo was really starting to show itself as elevation but keep in mind at that distance the round has already been subsonic for a good 200 yards so the slightest variation can have massive changes in point of impact. What we gathered from that test is the round isn't any inherently any less accurate than any other cartridge with similar ballistics.
So many biased responses here, it's amazing that you guys pay good money for these videos and he dared go against you.
Oh wait...
Haha, it's the internet man. We have thick skin. Thanks for the support and for watching.
I guess the take away is that the AR is considerably more accurate than the AK but at the same time both platforms have piss poor accuracy. My Tikka T3 would be shooting through the same hole at 50 yards.
Tikkas are fantastic. Remember that these are both made by PSA, so they’re hardly match Rifles. I have a couple Larues that will hang with most of my bolt guns (actually outshoot my Tikka, but barely). I don’t know what the “most accurate” AK would be....
It’s very difficult to mount a proper scope on an AK, but a ransom rest would have eliminated the human error. The video is of great interest. You gave an excellent account of your shooting ability, narrative, content, and conclusions were all well worth listening to, and I thank you.
What are your thoughts on the quality of the PSA AK?
I've spoken about it in recent videos. I've put Russian wood on it and a bakelite grip... which means I really like it. 😃
Love my GF3. I picked up one of the "blemish" ones for about $500 and I've got around 1200 rounds of Wolf And Tula through it with zero issues.
@@saucemaster2 GF3 is a little finicky with magazines. AK-E doesn't have that problem. Not sure why because both are PSA rifles.
@@donaldvosburgh8337 Mines been fine with Pmags, Korean Steel, and surplus Polish polymer mags so far. But from what I can gather most types of aks run into mag issues at some point and might require a little filing on the mag catch. Thats just my experience though.
@@donaldvosburgh8337 WAAAY more than a little finicky! My brand new, from PSA armory AK ONLY accepted the one and only Pmag that it came with. It wouldnt even accept other Pmags i already had. Essentially, i had a 30 round SKS. Called customer service, they told me to watch one of their DIY vids on how to mod all of my other mags to fit. Crazy! Operator refused to let me dend it back for repairs til i did that. I called back and spoke to a manager. He let me send it back for repairs. The initial results were that it accepted some but not all of the various mags that my Century Arms AKs would load. Over time ive jammed, punched and crammed the "no go" mags in anyway over time and eventually the rifle DID accept my collection of steel and polymer, new and used, P Mag/Tapco/Communist/Korean mags. But it took time. Im ok with it...i guess. It works. BOTTOMLINE: Cant say ill buy another PSA firearm again.
The only thing a ks47 needs is a raptor charging handle.
Agreed. I run the Raptor CH on all my rifles
Converting it to side charging works much better IMO. I run a DDC Hard Charger on mine and it makes things much easier
Yeah that 308 spring is a bit stiff. I just got a jp silent captured spring for mine to get rid of the cheeze grater sound from the buffer
Close enough for government work. I’ll take one of each.
Interesting. The AK has much more bulk (bolt/carrier/gas piston) cycling rearwards compared to the AR. This might be a factor.
*screams in Brandon Herrera*
NOOO! RIFLE IS FINE! Hahaha
This was some very interesting testing, especially with those strange results from the S&B ammo! Great video as always, much love from Texas!
My ks-47 really likes wolf polyformance 125gr SP, of course I can’t find it anywhere anymore. I have achieved sub moa accuracy with it. But most 122gr and 123gr loads I am lucky to get 3 moa.
I have shot AR’s my entire life. Thought I’d treat myself to something different and nice. I purchased a PSA GF5 -E with all the bells and whistles $1,400 after tax. The PSA would shoot basically 1” groups at 25 yards and 1.5-2” at 50. Going to 100 yards off bags and holding the best I could, I had about a 5” average with iron sights. I was really hoping for a bit better. Down the road, I may try different ammo but currently I am sitting on 800 rounds of Igman brass cass ammo. I’d love to see that 100 yard ground shrink down for the money spent. Thoughts?
Great comparison! I love the round, especially in the AR platform…
The free float handguard you were resting on on the AR vs the barrel mounted handgaurd on the AK will make a difference in accuracy. Should have used an old school handguard on the AR or found one of the very rare free float handguards for AKs. Or done a mag hold on the AK and rested on the mag.
I also Agree it would have been better with a magnified optic. The whole aim small miss small thing is real.
Would love to see this redone with guns that have similar style handguards and match grade hand loads. That with at least a 4x optic to take out all the variables possible.
Thanks for the test Tim! I have both the 16'' and 10.5'' KS-47 and love them both but i think my heart will always belong to the ak. I love how simple they are and i love the history and the variations of them from so many regions of the world. Always enjoy your videos brother so keep them coming and i'll keep watching!
Depending on what brand ak round they are all temperamental. I stick to 300BO
It would be interesting to see if someone like Rob Ski (a primarily AK shooter) got the same results as you did, given your history shooting ARs. Obviously the fundamentals remain the same regardless of what gun youre shooting, but different guns shoot differently.
No. I like this channel but obvious bias. Ive gotten pinpoint accuracy out of my c39v2 with cheap wolf.
@@dankorth1325 Yeah right... I've put all sorts of gucci barrels on aks like FB Radom, Bulgarian and quality US barrels and expecting more than 3 MOA out of an ak is unrealistic. The AK does not have a free float barrel like an AR and the standard size AK barrel is much thinner than AR. I love aks to death and they are certainly minute of bad guy out to 300, but saying that your c39v2 is a tack driver? I'm not buying it.
Cz bren 2ms 762x39 vs IwI Galil 762x39 who the winner 🏆 😆
I have been a bit disappointed with the available 5.45 ammo. The 7n6 was fine for the price, but the newly made stuff didn't seem much better despite the price. Took me 6 months of begging everyone I could think of to get the better stuff imported. Wolf now sells Barnaul made 65gr lacquer and sealant cartridges. My contact at Barnaul USA tells me 65gr Silver Bear should show up in July. The little bit I have been able to shoot seems to be an improvement.
I got a ton of silver bear when I bought my rifle. I've been impressed with it, but it hasn't been easy to find in quantity. For plinking I picked up some Monarch from Academy, which is made by Barnaul. It was a decent price, not anything near 7N6, but obviously not corrosive. My LGS had some Wolf 60 gr that has also run fine in my rifle. I think it came out to almost $0.30/round after tax.
Don't sweat the corrosive stuff. Just run some non-corrosive rounds thru before packing things up. It drastically slows down corrosion, but is not a long term solution.
@@ProbablyTooLoud yeah I don't typically mind it unless I'm pressed for time. But it's really not a concern anymore since 7n6 is drying up and basically everything else is non-corrosive
@@ProbablyTooLoud it's an AKM, not a museum piece. run some hot water through the barrel and chamber or Windex and then dry it out and oil it. done and done.
@@Irishcream216 Windex, or any other ammonia is not really necessary. You aren't trying to kill acid, just wash away salt. I just strip mine, hose it out with water and spray all the pieces up good with Ballistol pre-mix 10 parts water to one part Ballistol. Nice thing about Ballistol pre-mix is that you can saturate the components and reassemble them dripping wet with no worries about corrosion.
Great test and thank you for your work on this ! I recently acquired a Zastava ZPAPer' which I love, and it is my only AK. It is truly a very high quality, beautiful firearm. But to your point about things and stuff contacting the barrel on an AK I think that you hit the nail on the head. But when it comes to the topic of accurate barrels and how they are mounted in a rifle, it is always in my mind about an article about the pre '64 Winchester Mod. 70 written by Ross Seyfried sometime around the late 80s or early 90s in Guns and Ammo. He stated in the article that the secret to the inherent accuracy of Model 70s was the forward screw attachment on the underside of the stock that threaded into the sight mounting bulge on the barrel that effectively unitized the barrel with the forward part of the stock, thereby helping to control or dampen somewhat barrel harmonics. Now aside from being beautiful rifles, I possessed at one time a pre '64 Model 70, caliber .270 Win. manufactured in 1948, known as a transitional rifle due to the evolving shape of the safety lever, that was scoped with a Leupold 3X9 vari-x 1. It was the most accurate rifle I owned at the time and was capable of 3/4" groups at 100 yards using my handloads. Now I know there are people now adays that will say " Yeah, that's pretty good ". As for me the experience was akin to my first time with Mary Lou, IF you know what I mean { wink, wink, wink.........and wink again }. And if you do not know what I mean.....give me a call @ BR-549 and I will explain.
Thanks for taking the rounds apart and showing us the differences. That was pretty interesting.
Can I convert either to a real round? 7.62x51!
Is there a difference in twist rates? The way the actions are built makes a huge difference in accuracy but twist rates might explain why the ak likes a particular weight of bullet.
I agree. But 122-123 grain is pretty standard for an AK. ARs tend to have a wider variety if weights that would put more emphasis on twist rate
You see ammo sensitivity a lot more with non-floating platform due to resonance issues.
The gas piston in the AK adds another variable. A moving part.
Both should be 1 in 9.5", no?
Ask people with a ruger American or CZ 527 7.62x39 can shot very well.
Would be interesting to add a Vz58 in the mix. Thanks for the interesting video!
The GT also has a hollow nose which lends to some "interesting" terminal performance. If you ever get bored and feel like grabbing an AK out of the vault you should do some gel tests with those rounds. I think that would be an interesting video. GT is hands down my favorite ammo for AKs
TJ4774 I love Golden Tiger.
Twist rates would be nice to know.
@E S how about barrel lenght of these carbines?
Isnt most used ammo TULA rather than other steel cased options?
It was very relaxing to watch this and I appreciated you looking objectively at this topic while other creator attempts have fell short. Keep up the great content.
Thank you and thanks for watching.
I'll just stick with my 300 AAC Blackout with a 125 grain Nosler Ballistic Tip or a Barnes 110 Tac TX.
I was completely entertained with this one, Tim. Thanks and great work!
Tim..... For fucks sake man please meltdown a bcm socom upper on a fa lower....... Eric and Chad can't afford the ammo to pull it off !!!!!!!
They make more money than I do!
Your test would possibly have been more revealing if you had used magnified optics and fired at 100 yards. In my experience bullets often do not completely stabilize until they are farther down range than 50 yards. Red dot sights do not offer the needed accuracy to actually do a test of this type either. Just my 2 cents worth. CMMG makes very good guns and offers their Banshee AR in 7.62x39. It has outstanding accuracy. Takes AK mags, has a bolt sized correctly, and is designed from the beginning for that cartridge. A comparison of their 5.56 offerings against their 7.62x39 would give even better results especially if fired with premium ammo instead of the stuff fired here. A for effort and thumbs up in any event!
Barnaul is good stuff and loaded decently hot.
Robski just mentioned that it's his favorite AK ammo recently. That might have more to do with it being unavailable.
I wouldnt say hot, more like standard or how it should be. 2350 fps is about where 762x39 is suppose to be
@@bloodking73 That's true. Feels hot in comparison to all the pud loaded stuff out there.
@@naderzein2435 fair enough lol
I like the AK better. It's a good all purpose gun.
It would have been interesting to see a Bren 2 in the mix.
I think I'm going to compare the Bren 2 directly to the AKM in a video.
@@Militaryarmschannel i would add the gun it replaced - the Vz.58 to the mix or replace AKM by the Vz. alltogether :)
i think it would be interesting comparing the Bren2 in 7.62 to modernized Vz to see if the change was actually worth it.
Lol how the hell are you supposed to zero something as inaccurate as that AK?
I noticed your average AK user doesn’t actually aim, I wonder if that’s why
You’ve not shot a good AK before if that’s your statement. As long as I can see it, I can hit 2-3 inch targets from a standing position at 50 yards 3 out of 4 shots. If I take my time from a rest I can do better with both. Having said that, both of my AR’s might be slightly more accurate but not by much. My choice in guns depends on the situation and I have supreme confidence in both platforms. I would use my AK for rough environments with a possible shortage of parts. My AR’s would be my precision, longer range rifles. Both overlap in function.
The real test would be to try one of the CZ, Ruger, or Howa mini bolt guns and see what they can do.
I did a video with the CZ a year or more ago.
All capable of sub-moa, even with select steel.
Tim, I’d like to see this same test redone with their AK-E. It has an FN chrome lined, cold hammer forged barrel, 90* gas block, ALG trigger, and muzzle brake. See if those enhancements make for a more accurate rifle compared to the KS-47...
"The 7.62x39 is inaccurate."
"CZ 527 has entered the chat."
I did a video on the 527. I wasn't all that impressed, it was about as good as the AR with the Barnaul. Now the rifle sits...
I mounted a necg peep sight on mine and I've been pretty impressed with it's performance. Mine shoots pretty impressive groups at 50 yards with wolf and Tula. Maybe I just got lucky.
@@Militaryarmschannel MINE AT 50 YARDS PUT THE WOLF COPPER HOLLOW POINTS IN ONE HOLE, I WISH I HAD SHOT IT 100 YARDS TO SEE WHAT IT WOULD DO. I THINK I GOT LUCKY WITH MINE, THE RUGER M77 HOWEVER, DIDN'T SHOOT FOR SHIT AT THAT DISTANCE. MY M1500 HOWA REMAINS TO BE TESTED.
@Sam G. I'm going to mount a small optic like a 2-7x32 in mine to see if the accuracy holds up at a greater distance.
@@PastorDr.MartinSsempa THAT'S FUNNY YOU SAID THAT, THAT'S EXACTLY THE SCOPE MAGNIFICATION I HAVE ON MY CZ, WITH THEIR SCOPE MOUNT SND REAR SIGHT, YOU CAN'T JUST PUT ANY SCOPE YOU WANT ON IT. IT ALSO HAS TO LOOK AND FEEL RIGHT FOR THE BALANCE WITH THAT RIFLE.
Good test with expected results. I don’t think anyone out there really thinks that AK is more accurate than an AR. At the end, the average grunt’s practical accuracy depends probably more on his shooting experience with his specific firearm and on background knowledge of ballistics of his round and how to take into account environmental conditions. Bottom line, AR is inherently more accurate.
Thank you Tim and Jason for everything that you do for us.
Now do the CZ bren in 7.62x39
As a conservative Canadian I'm extremely jealous of your 2nd amendment and of your President !
2A is a mere shadow of what it's supposed to be, but thanks! And yeah, Trump is light years better than any liberal!
Thanks for the knowledge, Tim. I will stick with the AR platform !!!!!!!
I love Aks. To improve the accuracy just retrofit them with an AR upper and also an AR lower.
I still like the fact that the Ak isn’t as high maintenance
I’ve covered this on my channel between the KS47 16, 10.5 and 8.5” and then the GF3 16”. Was also 7 different kinds of ammunition. The 10.5” KS47 out performed the 16” GF3.
100 yards, 12x optic
There was significant more movement when firing the AK over the AR. You need to put them in a lead sled so the gun cannot move while firing.
David H its part of the stock design, inline allows less jump. No matter what you do,the AK will never be as good. As yes,ive built aks with “precision” in mind and they still never got impressive groups. Accept its a grunts rifle. And yes,rack grade m16s typically group the same as russian rack grade AKs. The civillian world is where its a huuuuuge difference.
Rifles are designed for accuracy. Machine guns are not. The AR was designed to be a rifle primarily and secondarily a machine gun. The AK was designed to be a machine gun first and secondarily a rifle. The AK is the only select-fire rifle that has full-auto rather than semi-auto in the next position after "safe" which shows what it's design priority is. You have compared apples to oranges.
I was able to get hits a couple hundred yards away with iron sights... some time ago. But I'm you're age and recently I've had to begin placing optics on everything I own...it sucks getting older.
Oh I just got used to the idea of any optics like 10 yrs ago, yeah getting old sucks, but its better than the alternative, lol.
I figured that free-floating barrel of the AR was going to give it a good edge over the AK. Still both are more than capable for practical accuracy ranges (as 9-Hole Reviews have demonstrated repeatedly on a variety of weapon systems including ARs and AKs). My only gripe with the KS47 is the location of the charging handle since it's a T style, very awkward to work when you need to reload since it doesn't have a last round bolt hold open function. Other than that more than a worthy choice if you want 7.62x39, especially if you don't want an AK.
Still, if you are looking at an AK but are worried it's going to perform terribly, quite a lot of good quality manufacturers popping out and as demonstrated, effective accuracy. Not one inch groups but adequate for its intended role.
I'm very interested to see how Arsenal's upcoming AKs which promise a free-floating barrel would perform, and according to sources the AK12 and variants has a free float handguard. We've seen what the AK can do with its standard barrel config, so the newer evolved breed should be an interesting take.
this is exactly why i never understood the ak vs ar arguement. why compare a modern gun to one thats about 80 years old. the 47 pattern does exactly what it was built to do. hit a man size target under 500. i believe it was clint smith who said any rifle is usually more accurate than the shooter. that being said, it would be pretty cool to see how ar's would compare to something like the ak12.
There is something called the DDC hard charger that will extend the charging handle to the left side of the upper receiver. It would make for a more practical ks47
I don't understand why Ps47 and mutant don't come with a left side charging handle. Many ar 15s have that option and it is more needed on these ak ar hybrids
@@igotmeeseeks677 I mean the AR-15 was developed not too long after the AK, give or take the late 50s before the M16 came around the early 60s. The principles of both rifles designs are different, and the philosophy of use have been debated for many years.
Personally, I don't want to be on the business end of either. Some people will argue what's more effective, what has a better round but at the end of the day, someone who knows what both can do won't need to argue. You can bet your bum that most would have extra rounds on tap if they didn't get the job done and the fundamentals carry the systems further.
I can certainly agree there! I was more speaking to the fact the 47 platform hasn't changed much at all through the years where as the ar platform has seen a multitude of improvements through the years. Everything from twist rates to mag designs. It just feels more like an apples to oranges debate, vs if we were to compare a modern platformed ak to an ar. The ak accuracy myth was smashed imo when Brandon Herrera created the ak224, the 1000yrd ak. It proved an ak is just as effective when given the chance to be. Modern ak/are platforms are equals these days, at least I think so anyways.
GREAT VIDEO, MAC!! That was my main point in me building an AR in 7.62x39 cal.. I always felt the AR-15 should have been designed in a larger caliber.. I always preferred using the 7.62 in BOATAIL AMMO design by RED ARMY and the non boat TULA ammo in 154 grain.... Overall , I would rather use brass case 7.62x39 ammo.. But all the Soviet style steel/brass ammo preform great.... And may I add no fail or JAM feed issues in a AR style platform.
Prediction before watching the video: AR will have *marginally* better accuracy, but they will be overall very close. Guessing the gap will be bigger with nicer ammo.
Edit: Pretty much as expected
in actual combat shooting from hands and not bags the difference will be zero as the shooter error will have much bigger impact than miniscule difference free float and different system has on mechanical accuracy...
which is the reason ALL military firearms from last 30-ish years adopted piston gas system instead of DI, freefloat barrels and such are nice to have on DMR, but for infantry grunt rifle its pointless to use less reliable and more maintenance sensitive system to gain "advantage" normal soldier will never make use of ...
Imagine using a red dot and calling it an Accuracy test. Lol. Before long, Tim will be hanging out with Nancy Pelosi in the dementia ward.
I suppose you're never seen an accuracy test done with iron sights either.
Imagine being so ignorant do you think magnification equals more accuracy
@@Militaryarmschannel 🤣 epic
@@gunsgalore15 He didn't say anything about magnification. But A telescope with magnification and traditional crosshairs would provide a much more quantifiable test than a red dot where the dot includes the entire target.
Military Arms Channel Wait...so you think it wouldn’t have been better to use a high quality scope? Ok. You said you were going to try and take out human error as much as possible, and the a far better way to have done that would have been with a quality magnified optic. This isn’t a difficult concept.
Seen vids of TulAmmo and it's groupings, seemed to fair well. It's another widely available and would have been interesting to see
What this video really needed for it to go from a 10 to 11 was a special guest appearance by Rob Ski
From now on, any post or comment i see talking trash about the accruracy of the Mini 14, i'll just show them this video
That's a nice looking foregrip on that AK.... and here I am with a birthday coming up....
Happy birthday! The wood stocks are from Sovietstocks.com.
It’s not so much the rifle, it’s more the shooter
I can safely say that it's obviously the muzzle device. From a reputable source(Battlefield 3 and 4), we know that a compensator has a higher accuracy penalty than a flash hider.
LOL
Love my KS 47. 8000 rounds no cleaning so far
TheInkCanvas yes just testing it it was the first psa and only I own AK 47 so I was trying to see if I like it and how long it would last
I was looking at 7.62x39 in the AR platform for quite a while and could not find anything I liked for the price point, so I just bought another AK. While this test showed the AR to be a tad bit more accurate, the AK was accurate enough... except for that S&B stuff.
Also, the powder in that S&B stuff is a whole bunch different from the others. With my very limited reloading experience, it looked more like a pistol powder. Could that affect the accuracy from the AK?
I would like to see a Piston AR vs a Direct Gas impingement AR for Accuracy
All else being equal, I'd expect better accuracy with the DI.
@@c.j.rogers2422 yeah marginal the DI will be best
I would be curious to see the results with an AR15 that is not free floated. While free float rails are definitely a common item these days, there are plenty of rifles in circulation that aren’t free floated. I suspect the AR wins anyway, but this test almost seems like comparing a rack grade AK to a “match grade” AR.
AR vs Sig556R in 762x39? Can you compare since some seem to think that the Sig556R is the Cadillac of AKs
Next do both in 5.56
I really thought both rifles would have had around 1 inch groups at 50yds, some of those groups I would consider pretty horrible even at 100 yds.
AK's - designed by the primitive, for the primitive.
Smh Buy 1ONE AR ?
AND 2TWO DIFFERENT ?
UPPERS = 3THREE GUNS IN 1ONE ! PACKAGE ...
HELLO ? COD ...
AR ? ATI & RADICAL ? AR, SAYS " HELLO " 5.7 & 762 UPPERS !?! ...
So...... in 7.62X39 the ammo is adequate but the AR rules over the AK in accuracy got it. Hi MAC from Greenwood In.
Ive been loading 7.62x39 SST and making cloverleafs at 100yrds with a 10.5" BCA upper. Soon ill get a 16" upper. Id like to compare it to an AK of the same length because i am extremely impressed with the sst reloads.
Funny I didn't receive the notification for this video, just found it! 🤔😁🇺🇸☠️
That's 2 of us, an I subbed Mac along time ago
For reference: PWS MK116 MOD 2-M -Caliber: 7.62x39 GAS PISTON 1:10 barrel twist rate with Trijicon ACOG® 3x24 BAC Riflescope - 7.62 x 39mm / 123 Grain Ballistic Reticle TA50-C-400235 Low Height, Red Crosshair Reticle, Tritium / Fiber Optics Illuminated 50-yard group firing Hornady Black 7.62x39mm Ammo 123 Grain SS, it will group 1/2 inch consistently.
Another American made rifle but uses proprietary 7.62×39 DURAMAG SS™ magazines but it too is a long-stroke gas piston like the AK-47. Your two selected rifles' price-points match much more closely and a better choice for a comparison. Nevertheless, the PWS is a real-deal SHTF battle-rifle. I must be honest, It has never tasted steel-cased ammunition so, factor that in.I do have an extra parts kit on ice should I need to use steel-cased ammunition. How is the PSA's extractor holding up using steel case in drum magazines?
AR platform is INHERENTLY more acurate, but barrel length is very important for 7.62x39. it simply doesnt have enough juice in the case to propel a bullet of that diameter properly, so a bit longer barrel makes the most of that ammo.
I have an AR-47 (Frankenstein rifle) on a standard AR lower with Primary Arms 1-6x24 ACSS 7.62x39 scope runs like a champ. I have shot that rifle out to 600yd recreating the IV8888 test with wolf Polyformance 124gr, 2330fps ammo from years ago. I got the same results. I could hit everything out to 500yd, after that the round went subsonic. My groups with my gun at 200yd is 3in to 3.5in with Red Army Standard 124gr 2427fps. I Love my AR-47 and Primary Arms Scopes. Get yourself an AR-47 rifle you will love it.
I like my SLX from primary arms. It was dead center out of the box...I'm sure that was just luck tho