Panasonic GH5 and the Atomos Ninja Inferno: Going Deep
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- Опубліковано 5 лис 2017
- We brought the Atomos Ninja Inferno with us on our road trip to New Hampshire, Maine and Eastern Long Island. Magnificent assists and screen, but interesting questions about where we are with HDR, HLG -- and weight.
Gear Discussed in this Review::
Atomos Ninja Inferno: bhpho.to/2wCBr5f geni.us/ninjainferno
Panasonic GH5: bhpho.to/2wi2J0Q geni.us/OCcig
Atomos Ninja Flame: bhpho.to/2zzi1Qa geni.us/ninjaflame
Atomos Shogun Inferno: bhpho.to/2zBi6T6 amzn.to/2hK2ja2
Atomos Shogun Flame: bhpho.to/2AcbYxc amzn.to/2y46hAK
Blackmagic Video Assist 4K: bhpho.to/2Ab1dLz amzn.to/2zyMAp7
smallHD Focus: bhpho.to/2Abqy85 amzn.to/2he49Dj
smallHD 702 Bright: bhpho.to/2Abqy85 amzn.to/2zywf3w
smallHD 703 Ultra Bright: bhpho.to/2AaCjLS amzn.to/2y3h3Hb
Convergent Design Odyssey 7Q+: bhpho.to/2zyL7ii
Zacuto GH5 Cage: bhpho.to/2wDtmO3 amzn.to/2hdiqQv
Our review of Zacuto Gear from our road trip: • Ultimate GH5 Rig, Zacu...
For our review of the Ninja Assassin from two years (!) ago with a more detailed look at the interface: • Atomos Ninja Assassin ...
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Gear used to record this review:
Panasonic GH5: bhpho.to/2wi2J0Q geni.us/OCcig
Sigma 30mm f/1.4: bhpho.to/2whK3hR geni.us/cSxX
Sony UWP D-11 Wireless Bodypack Lav: bhpho.to/2ydln7e
Edit suite (hardware):
Apple 27" 2017 iMac w/Retina 5K (Mid-2017), jacked: bhpho.to/2whuvKR
G-Tech G-Speed Shuttle XL: bhpho.to/2ydE5fc - Наука та технологія
Came for the product information.
Stayed for the audio massage.
I can't be the first person to point out that this guys voice reminds me of a smooth jazz radio DJ... I mean that in a good way though! I wish my voice sounded like his
Jeff Goldblum
Nice detailed report! - I always love it when you formulate the questions before rattling off a list of specs.
ookiemand I appreciate that - thank you.
Great informative video. I learned more than anything i ever seen. Thank you
Karim Jovian 🙏🏻
By far my favorite channel/videos on youtube. Also 100% sold me on the GH5 and proper lenses. Great work!
You'll love it!
Some good points, many of which I have been mulling over myself.
Hi Hugh, I hope you are getting over the flu. Another great discussion, which feels as if you have done this just for me. I have the GH4 with Ninja Assassin and now I have the GH5 with Shogun Inferno. I did not consider other monitors because the Shogun appears to have most bases covered with it's comprehensive tools and levels of functionality. i.e. Wave forms, Monitor modes and Assist. Not to mention the Cut and Tag functions. I am not sure if the other non Atomos monitors you mentioned have similar levels of functionality, but I specifically needed the recording capabilities and formats the Shogun Inferno offered.
Interestingly enough your presentation makes me re evaluate my choices of equipment and introduces me to new products. As always many thanks for the effort you put into producing a terrific and informative video presentation. Get well soon.
Thanks for the information!
Are you able to see the waveform once the desqueeze is enabled?
For some reason I cannot enter it once it is enabled and not sure if this is a bug or the combination is not available.
Great discussion, still loving the Sigma 30 I see.
Jon Pais Absolutely!
Hi, nice review!!! What aperture did you use to shoot this vlog? Was it 2.8 or 1.4? Keep up the good work and blessings my bro!!!
I usually shoot around 2.5
Thanks!!!
hugh-as always, a thoughtful conversation. though i am not convinced to go external monitor/external monitor recorder, i am convinced that i need a flu shot! hope you feel better soon. thumbs up.
i have gh5 tons of goodies, was thniking of getting the blackmagic 4k production camera for 4k raw shooting, but after hearing about the high bit rate of 10bit proress422 on this atmos inferno might be good enough for me. do you think you can tell much difference?
Rex Smith I don’t - see my convo with Doug Jensen from last summer.
How do I find tht convo
Rex Smith Sony FS5 RAW Upgrade: Footage by and Conversation with Doug Jensenua-cam.com/video/fY4xULlvv0k/v-deo.html
It appears Atomos heard you since the new Ninja V is on it’s way in another 30 days. I will have to decide between the Ninja V and what ever good small HD monitor in the same 5” may be going for.
Seriously - get a Bright Tangerine Titan arm. I did - wonderful piece of kit. Brilliant video essay btw.
L4LTV yesssss!!! I did a review on the Titan arm it’s one of my fav pieces of kit and I NEVER leave home w/o it
L4LTV Will have to take a look!
Sully - yep - also use it on a PIX-E5 + couple of Professional 7.2v 7200 batteries and you are good to go all day. Great review.
Couldn't justify the added size and weight of these for my nimble gh5 setup but man this new Ninja V that's coming out is perfect for my workflow. Hugh, do you think the GH5 will support external Prores raw recording?
Also, thanks for another great video. I have just outgrown my 2tb late 2016 mpb internal drive for a great short I shot last week (4h22m of footage = 1.5tb fcpx library size) so finally pulled the trigger on a 2tb glyph atom raid that you reviewed so wonderfully.
Congrats on acquiring the Glyph. I know exactly what you're going through! I don't know if the GH5 will support external ProRes RAW. I'm still at the stage where I'm just trying (and failing) to match colors across three cameras. Sigh.
You didn't get a flu shot and got sick, I did get it a few days ago and I did get sick. Anyway, very good video thanks for the detailed info. I normally shoot V-Log L with my GH5 and had considered in the future, getting an inferno or flame whenever I have enough money. I have wondered how the ProRes or DNxHR compares to the internal GH5 codec as I have noticed with V-Log L that when I shoot internally either with 4K 150Mbps or 400Mbps, both 10-bit 4:2:2, I am noticing magenta color blocking in some shadows and I am wondering if that is related to the codec (macroblocking from a H.264 coedc) or some other noise issue.
I have found that 400Mbps gives slightly cleaner shadows, but no real improvement to the image quality over 150Mbps other than motion looks a little smoother and in editing I can go to any point in the video and grab a still and its not blurred (unless the subject was moving faster than the camera shutter speed) but it is in 150Mbps. Since ProRes or DNxHR don't use macro blocks, if the magenta color blocking issue was macroblocking I am seeing, that wouldn't happen if the videos were recorded externally onto those, but I haven't had the opportunity to test that to see.
I did get a quick chance to test HLG vs V-Log L before I got sick. I normally expose +1 stop with V-Log L. I shot 2 videos close to a small lake with reeds, trees on both sides and a blue sky with some cloud so a lot of shadows. I shot the first video in V-Log L at +1 stop like I normally do to prevent lots of noise in shadows and not to blow out highlights. I then switched to the hybrid-log gamma profile without changing any settings and the exposure jumped from +1 stop to just over +2 stops over exposed and the highlights still looked OK and not blown out (although I could have turned down the exposure slightly for better highlights)
So from my quick test, it looks like HLG might give you more stops of exposure before highlights are blown out, although I don't have an HDR/HLG monitor and was only going by the HLG view assist on the GH5 and what I was seeing on my Dell Ultrasharp monitor on my PC.
Sorry to learn that it hit you, too. Looking forward to your continued testing - sounds like you're all over it!
Hey Hugh! Do you know if i can use an nvme drive (through a sata enclosure, in the SSD caddy)? I have tried 2 SSDs so far, but they cant reach the advertised 10bit-4K-60fps. (Sandisk ULTRA II 480Gb, and a midrange Corsair). Their customer support offers very little to no help unfortunately. Also no 1080p 120fps or 240fps is available. Thoughts on that? Cheers!
I’ve sent them a note asking about drive compatibility. How close do they get? OTOH, dem’s are the frame rate limitations of the recorder.
Thank you very much for the quick reply and the note! The limit is 120fps @ 1080p as i see on their spec sheet. I get no option for such framerate on my monitor. My issue is, that i can't keep buying SSDs until i find the one fast enough for enabling all those options. The Sandisk Ultra ii (with updated firmware) is recommencement by atomos but still doesnt work.
I don't get the 120fps with my Samsung 850 Evo too. And i am not able to set 4k60p at 10bit in the GH5s menus.
Have another reply here too! In order to set 4K 60 10 bit, you need to set the camera in NTSC mode (needs a restart) and then go "HDMI rec output" and set the 10bit mode from the last menu selection. If your camera is set to cinema 24 mode, you dont need to go to the "HDMI rec output" as it records 10bit by default.
I just got a reply from another channel too, that the camera just automatically outputs 10bit via the HDMI port. So great, that there is no confirmation via the menu, and it isn't described in the manual.
What's the additional cost of purchasing an atomos to be workable (batteries, xlr etc)? I'm new to the video game but the a7ii screen is lack luster
Love listening to Jeff Goldblum's reviews! Are these expensive monitors like the Ninja V even worth buying now even after the 2.4 FW update? Seems a bit overkill since the GH5 does most things internally quite well already.
I love my Inferno. Got the smallrig cage for it. Recording 60p 10 bit HQ Pro-res eats data. IMO it makes it easier to shoot V log and I'm happy with it. The weight sucks but that's mainly because of the batteries. I can see it in high noon light no problem. Glare is an issue the smallrig hood helps.
Thanks for sharing!
Steve Do you shoot with the GH5?
I only have two hands. How many thoughts do you want me to hold?? But in all seriousness great video. Keep it up
jpolo975 :)
I use the iPhone video assist app ($20) and it gives me what I need, and I have it on my iPad too hooked up on a tripod...the iPhone is mounted on the cage. BEST $20 I've spent. Still haven't found a reason (yet) in my filming to get an atomos.
David Kashner I will check it out, though I’ve found my 7+ useless in bright daylight.
Three Blind Men and An Elephant Productions
www.adamwilt.com/fieldmonitor/
GH5 owner here. I have a question for you. I will be shooting indoors, sometimes with green screen. One or two actors. I have a very capable computer build with GTX 1080 graphics and BenQ calibrated monitor, 14 bit/60 hz. Motu 8m for XLR ins. It’s all on a rack on wheels, and I’ve rolled it to shooting locations. Were I to get a capture card, what can the Ninja offer that my system doesn’t have? It seems like a piece of redundant equipment to me. Thanks for your input.
I've heard that the new GH5 update (2.0) renders the Atomos useless in terms of quality. You get the same quality recording internally with the 400mbps
Nope. Definitely an improvement over the internal 400mbps. Plus 4k 60p 10 bit.
Yes the 60p 10 bit is a plus!
Thanks, Hugh, for another thorough and thoughtful post. I have an Atomos Assassin which I've used with my Sony a7S. The fact is, I use it less and less often. For one thing, I find that 4K is still a bit over-hyped when it comes to my particular client base. Most of what I do winds up being viewed on computers - and this includes corporate training videos, non-profit fund-raising videos, and other formats that may get screened in front of an audience once - but then lives on through social media and intranet sites. I shoot wedding videos for two national wedding photography companies - and their delivery is, to this day, on DVDs. I kid you not. So, over time, the heaviness and imbalance of the Assassin - plus worrying about the power to it - the recording media, on and on - maybe I'm just lazy but I found that when I'd go out without the Assassin - that I was simply having a BETTER TIME shooting. I'm more mobile, can be more spontaneous, can easily move from a tripod to a gimbal, etc. At one point I even bought a cage for the Sony - with the thought that it would make it ergonomically more pleasant to use the Assassin. And it did. It also made it very, very difficult to access the shutter button when I wanted to use my hybrid for, ya know, hybrid stuff. The best thing about the Assassin, for me, was it's use as a monitor. An overlarge, overweight, power hungry monitor. I sort of hated myself my spending the cash on the smallHD monitor - since I already owned one. But WOW - I'm so glad that I did. Light, well-balanced on my a7S and my a6300 - it feels like it adds nothing to the camera. The image is sharp, the tools - especially the focus peaking - are so simple to use - and accurate. It has made my a7S a much better tool. It has, very quickly, become as essential on that camera as the lens. I also tried it on my FS5, and, yes, it's a whole lot better than the camera's LED and EVF. The thing I miss most about using the Assassin is that, for me, the ProRes codec makes life in post so much easier and faster in every way. But we can't have it all - yet.
Thank YOU for taking the time to watch and to contribute to the conversation. You're talking about the smallHD focus? As for post: you find it faster even after transcoding upon import?
Yes, the smallHD focus. I forgot, there are many models from which to choose. And, also, yes. When I'm color grading or using other effects, the rendering seems to happen more quickly when I upload in ProRes as opposed to an internal Sony codec - in 4K. The difference was far more noticeable, say, a year ago. Perhaps FCPX has improved its handling of Sony codecs along the way? But even today, FCPX seems quicker across the board with ProRes 422. Or I have a subliminal expectation that Apple products work better with other Apple products. That's entirely possible.
VIDJACK Wait - when I import to FCPX, i I have FCPX automatically archive the source media and transcode to ProRes. I then edit in best quality, which is ProRes. Are you saying that ProRes from the Inferno is easier for FCPX to handle than ProRes to which it transcodes? Am I missing something?
I don't think you are missing anything. I think, quite possibly, I am. I'm going to re-trace my import steps and make sure I'm transcoding to ProRes.
OK. I see what I've done wrong. It's my impatience with the transcoding from Sony codecs. I realize that previously I started working with the clips on the timeline before they were fully transcoded. The improvement in performance resulted in my allowing for the completion of the transcoding before beginning work on the timeline. In other words, I'm a dolt.
I agree about flu shots for most people; BUT this year it would not have helped you avoid it, as they missed it completely in terms of strains.
Personally the worst I was sick was after having the shots... The flu is the natural way your body updates it’s immune system every year, a little sniffle and it’s done (are you resting once a week?) if so you won’t even notice it... it’s been years since I remember getting the flu, like 4yrs no sick days from work
11:28 Nice Match
There is no doubt that the GH5 is a highly capable video making machine. It has great versatility. Jumping ahead into the future we'll be looking at 8K video and I don't doubt Panasonic will lead the interchangeable lens market in that area. I do however have to wonder how micro four thirds will manage the much higher sensor resolutions required to support 8K. Whilst processing keeps improving its clear that producing a 32MP+ M43 sensor is going to be challenging whilst maintaining any semblance of low light shooting capability. I guess what I am alluding to, is 4K going to be the limit for Panasonic's GH series of cameras going forward?
I wouldn't be too surprised if Panasonic decides to upgrade the sensor size to something like a Super 35 or APSC for their GH6. I just don't see them ever going down the full frame route, tbh. And that's a good thing in my opinion.
Flornmonk Makes sense, however is this possible without having to completely start again with a whole new lens mount/system? The M43 lenses wouldnt be able to cover the full size of an APSC sensor particularly whilst maintaining sensor shift technology.
Yeah they'd have to pretty much say "bye bye" to all their current glass. Maybe they could offer a M43 "mode" on the GH6? Kinda like how the A7Rii can switch between fullframe and Super35.
Flornmonk I dont think that would be possible unfortunately. A resdesigned mount for a larger sensor would mean current M43 lens mounts would be too small to physically attach unless there was some sort of passive adapter that didn't affect the flange distance. I suspect Panasonic will release 6K video next which would only require a 24MP sensor and hope processing improves by the time they have to look at 8K. With Sony having 4K now on their APSC and FF bodies a move to 8K will be straight forward, I can really see them being dominant in the coming years. This is of course if Canon and Nikon don't seriously up their game in the video department any time soon, which going by current trends is looking unlikely lol
Flornmonk in talking with several Panasonic reps they said IF they put a new sensor in their next GH camera which they said at this time they have no plans to, they would in fact have a crop mode that would allow you to shoot with “legacy” glass. In other words MFT Glass. What I think most likely is that in keeping with their “cinema” touches, I feel they’ll equip the GH6 with a true Super35 size sensor and not an APSC or APSH size sensor. This would make the GH6 a perfect body to pair with a EVA-1 as they will have the same potential sensor or sensor size. I also think they’ll have 8K on the GH6 and they’ll do something like RED did with the 8K helium sensor that is Super35 size
I may be wrong about this, but I believe your 2017 iMac is capable of displaying Billions of colors (10-bits per channel) and also operations in P3 colorspace, which is the defacto standard for a lot of folks who are grading HDR content today. So technically, it is "capable" of giving you an HDR experience with still or video imagery (though may not be capable of the high contrast ratios of some more professional displays or monitors). What it lacks is native support for all three pre-defined HDR delivery formats. To put it another way, as a media creator, you're pretty good to go (or at least get started), but if you want to consume HDR media on your iMac, your milage will vary considerably depending on the application you are using and the media you are playing back. In case anyone is interested, I'm finding Apple's WWDC presentation titled "Get Started with Display P3" quite helpful: developer.apple.com/videos/play/wwdc2017/821/
Lol... know I'm more confused than ever! The good news is, there are many options. The bad news is the costs! If I was to invest in all this for my GH5 it would defeat its purpose for what the GH5!! It make way more sense as the smart people will put this kind of money that keeps adding up, towards a Professional Film Camera body that includes most of this stuff without adding so much stuff.
The reason you constantly get the flu now is because you took the shot. Now you'll have this forever :(
I theoretically love the GH5 (I do not own it), but for some reason the micro 4/3 sensor scares me off. Can you explain to me the downsides of a small sensor? I'm looking for a professional camera for professional video work. I'm leaning towards the a7iii.
Love the review and how informative it is but you aren’t getting an academy award. All the pauses get annoying and it feels like a drama movie. You’re just reviewing a product and I love the information, I just wish it was delivered without the acting therefore shortening the video.
Bla bla bla bla
Get a flu shot? What has that got to do with videography?