End of the Line: A Rant-rospective
Вставка
- Опубліковано 5 лип 2024
- End of the Line came out before my time as a content creator, so I never got to share my extensive thoughts on it. So let's do that...
Music Used:
- Checklist, Sacrifice, Epilogue - End of the Line
- Mechanical Mishap Soundtrack
- Good Times - Superliminal
Minature Skymin Artwork by Opossol: / opossol
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![End of the Line [SFM]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/6aLjwVVNq4s/mqdefault.jpg)
Sniper is still... sniper is still on the cliff... nobody saved him...
nah m8, he just killbinded and respawned in red base
@@jockeyfield1954 respectable, good for him
@Egg T sniper respawned it's okay we can all go home
@@Secre_Tariat oh thank god
;(
Its still one of the best SFMS to this day.
The Update though.....
Eh. It was over hyped, yeah, but, besides the pay mechanic, it's alright. The hats are atleast good, unlike robotic boogaloo.
Unfortunately it was chopped at the knees
Everyone expected a huge train heist level that would be similar to the trailer. I think. I know thats what I expected. Instead we got Payload 2: Electric Boogaloo
@@bugjams what are you talking about? We didn't even get the map because valve said it was too confusing for new players instead we got a half assed grappling hook game mode as a "sorry" from valve. It wasnt until later on until we finally got the map but to me it was far too late
Decent enough. If people knew where tf2 was going past 2015, they wouldn’t be trashing this update as much
Perhaps one of the most iconic SFMs in the History of Source Film Maker.
Almost got me with that 29 years ago
Imagine if End of the Line got revamped using S2FM, man that would be dope as hell
@@YurieSnowie imagine if valve cared lol
@@YurieSnowie that would be pretty cool
@@user-bw4ec4bm2t Yo that will be amazing.
I really almost thought you were going to rant about the sfm.
The SFM is genuinely good though. It's the update itself that sucked balls.
@@jaderabbit898 yeah, I agree about the sfm. I don't really care for the update, either.
Yeah,i watch it time-to time just because.
Same, I was so confused
Me too
Tldr: More content WAS gonna be in end of the line, but valve decided: "Fuck you, I'm gonna steal your original content made by the community and slap it into my own updates!"
Its almost like something exactly like that happened 2 years ago huh
@@rebull8262 Hmm
And VALVe wonders why people don't want to work with them for a major update. sm
@@mattwoodard2535 And they also have the audacity to not trust the community to make decent updates despite the fact they literally stole community weapons and they are well rounded and good
@@Tom-H1 They don't trust the community to make decent updates because of the flop that was the Invasion update.
So from the sounds of it, it seems like it's more valves fault the update flopped than the community guys who were part of the update.
yeah the community did great and alot of the content was added in other points so it was clearly fine, i dont know what valve was thinking
Thats almost always the case with valve and tf2
YEah, common with Valve but it also has a lot of fanboi defence.
they straight up ripped their content and left them with jackshit xd
It's about time Valve faced real consequences for their actions. Wallets don't speak when they've got Steam, the developers themselves need to face actual, physical threat. Blackmail them, send germs to their homes, hold their kids hostage, do whatever it takes to teach them a lesson. They need to learn to fear and respect the gaming community.
hope you don't mind me stealing "rant-rospective" that's actually godlike
Yeah... that is a name ill have to use if I ever get into content creation.
Do I start doing stuff like this for my content Ik definitely gonna use it for the video
I believe that her hearting your comment says yes.
I'm really glad someone finally acknowledges it from a standpoint that people were *waaaay* overhyped.
The community will overhype any update that comes across them! They overhyped the jungle inferno and look at how well that went for the community!
@@cursedhawkins1305 It wasn't THAT bad. Heavy got the most out of it though.
On the bright side the sentence "too confusing for new players" went on to become a pretty good meme lol.
especially critics and journalist because that's their accuse on why this game is bad
I loved the SFM so much that I forgot about the update itself.
Filthy w+m1 pyro bad!!!1!!1
ngl Merasmus screaming "BONUS DUCKS!!!" over and over is the only thing I remember outside of the SFM
I didn’t even know it had an update
End of the line feels more like a short film than a tf2 production. Even the recent high effort SFMs (See: Winglet) don't live up to it. It's just hard to beat it.
Hoovy tube is the overhyping King, his animations aren't even that great to begin with compared to winglet or someone established
How in God's name Hoovy tubes videos are high effort
@@defunctaccount1944 yeah, but he's still pretty good.
I am looking forward to this 3 hour SFM that Hoovy is working on. Curious to see how it goes
@@defunctaccount1944 he is good, but I definitely agree with his quality not being on par with some *extremely* well done Saxxy entries, Winglet, and Fortress Films to name a few. I think if he works harder on the writing and puts more Valve quality work into his products instead of characters doing *literally* nothing at certain points of his animation, then I’d rank him high.
"Too confusing for new players" was even used for removing arena from the match making. It's such a bullshit excuse lol
No arena in match making makes me sad
I miss territory control/TC_Hydro
seriously, arena is literally just deathmatch, probably the most know game mode in the history of games
@@DrOfficedog Look under the misc game modes dude, Hydro lives
Also cool to find another who appreciates it
I still dont get how arena is confusing
The "its too confusing for new players" argument valve used is so incredibly hypocritical and stupid. They literally don't even have a decent tutorial in the game, and it drives me mad.
Also, thank you so much for making this video! You always supply the best information and explaining when it comes to video essays. Truly lovely stuff and very entertaining as well. Keep up the good work
I don't think it really matters if it's hypocritical or not as the argument can be made that if the game is already confusing, you shouldn't add even more unique confusing things to it.
Valve also doesn't give much information away as it rarely if ever has any positive effect on basically anything, so they rather just keep working on their projects. I'd guess that "too confusing for new players" was probably shortened quite a bit in order to avoid criticising the map or its creators for example.
@UCo6DpbImragYDpxTMCvSkNw I almost had a reply to that in my original comment xP
I think that the statement kind of lost its point as it was said that cp_steel was added to the game in 2008. TF2 in 2008 was quite a bit different to TF2 in 2014 and I'd guess that to be the same for the TF team as well. Maybe the 2014 TF Team thought they should remove cp_steel as well, but decided to take no action as removing a map from the game will cause backlash from people who enjoyed the map. Opinions change and the opinions at the time will be the ones reflecting their actions.
We could even see the TF team changing their opinion of the End of the Line map later on, so it's not unreasonable to think that opinions can change between 2008 and 2014, especially as team members change.
@@Vekkuli001 So fucking what? Its still super hypocritical
@@Toons595 Considering the first sentence of my comment talks about how it being hypocritical doesn't matter, I can reply "So fucking what? It still doesn't matter"
@@Vekkuli001 And I already responded to that explaining how you're wrong. I guess reading is just really hard for some people
“END OF THE LINR WAS A GREAT SFM”
“She meant the update”
“Oh”
@Egg T y yeah
End of The Line had so much potential. Worst of all no new weapons.
WHAT ABOUT THE CROSSING GUARD!??!!?!?!?!?!!1?!?1!1
You can thank the over abundance of weapons in the updates that are just stat swapped.
There were two new weapons, at least in the smissmas update 2014...
It not about Weapon, it about TF2 Shorts.
The thing is, a constant in TF2 development is trying to make sure already existing things are working and balanced, rather than create something new that’ll be broken somehow on launch.
Valve just absolutely loves Vita-Saw'ing important bits out of updates. Practically every time we get cosmetics, if you look on the actual Workshop, a lot of the ones we get are part of SETS that Valve only took one-or VERY rarely, two-parts of and left the other(s) out. That really, REALLY pisses me off.
I can forgive some cosmetic sets being incomplete since, with so many cosmetics in the game already, you can find a similar one to replace the missing one
What I cant forgive is that some or most of the time, the missing piece(s) is(are) the coolest piece(s) of that cosmetic set.
@@bloodbrawler1438 ...not to mention most of what we do get are halloween locked
5:40 Still love how hydro was still included and yet snowplow was not
I still prefer Dustbowl.
an elegant environment.... for a more civilized time.
Hey guys! I forgot to actually say that those Q&A screenshots came directly from McVee's Tumblr, so they're legitimate answers.
If you're curious, since I don't mention it in the video, this is my exact view I had years ago when EotL first came out. My thoughts were so strong they've not changed throughout the years. EotL makes me passionately pissed, because of everything I explained in the video. The one thing I personally really liked from the in-game content was the cosmetics. I'm a sucker for winter themed clothing and EotL was the perfect update for me in the cosmetic category. I still use several of them on my current loadouts.
And yes, the Flashdance Footies are my favorite cosmetic and the Killer solo is my favorite taunt.
But the SFM is fucking great.... sweet nostalgia
@@user-bw4ec4bm2t 29 years ago?!?! THIS VIDEO IS 12 MINUTES OLD!?!?
I just realized that’s part of your name.
@@wizardofthedumb6640 u got jebaited lmao
@@wizardofthedumb6640 You got bamboozled, look at you
@@wizardofthedumb6640 Your name says it all.
I only just recently got back into TF2 with my buddies after having never touched it after the original Scream Fortress update and I do not regret it considering the more stories I hear about waiting for updates or when updates arrive and are just not all they were meant to be.
The TF2 community is fantastic and doesn't deserve Valve
Let’s say there are good and bad part (eg. Holiday punch event scam, tacobot) of the community. Still, the good part deserves more recognition.
Thing is we don’t have a clear clue on valve’s policy and what happened to the devs during the update (and we might never know).
@@tikoblocks3224 ??
@@tikoblocks3224 How is valve a good company then
@@tikoblocks3224 Yeah, that's pretty much a common misconception that people usually have when it comes to Valve. Other than that I completely agree that they're a good company and i prefer the way on how they run their business.
You know you are early when Justin Y. Or the guy with that funny smile in the sniper are not here yet
Second dudes name is stickmaster
@@themalcahtwinz4743 yeah I forgot his name and wanted to make the joke before they arrived XD
StickMaster500
There's also that one guy with a moustache. Or the one without, I'm not sure there's two of them.
anyone remember pablo, the guy with the aheago lucario as the icon
The End of The Line weapon was "3lb Trigger", that's now known as Back-Scatter out of all things. As title implies, it was suppose to work sorta like Loose Cannon, as that you have to hold the trigger to shoot. With key difference that you have to charge it max in order to shoot at all (Since the gun has a very hard to press trigger).
Man that still sucks as a gun especially for Scout
3lbs is actually a rather light trigger pull, unless its LITERALLY 3 pounds in actual weight
3lb trigger is super light in real life like on precision rifles and the like
@@Cosmic_V4570 I think that was joke of the name.
@@elkpants1280Well I think it DID implied that it has heavier trigger than stock scattergun. Don't forget that Scout isn't the strongest person out there.
6:33 and Wutville was LESS confusing? yeah, sure Valve.
The map wasn't even completed apparently
Not confusing, just bad
Valve: what kind of idiot would approve of snowplow?
Anyway, you're showing this wutwille map? K add it in whatever
With Wutville it's even worse. That map had been abandoned for 4 years!
The funny thing is, the Invasion update ended up being even worse than this.
Ehh, the Invasion Update itself was fine. The Behind-The-Scenes of its development, though... yikes, total shitshow.
@@papersonic9941 If Invasion was released today, I'm sure that most of the players surely would consider it a masterpiece
@@quiver5756 the tf2 playerbase has such horrible abandonment issues that they freaked out when the tf2 twitter account changed their header last year lmao
@WhiteNoise People expected too much from Invasion. Then (and now lol) players were convinced of "New PVE mode incoming, Blu Team would fight with Aliens during MvM timeline omg"
.
And they blame the creators, even when they never promise anything about a new co-op mode. C'mon that's is just too much work for a community team.
And I guess people were disappointed that the new weapons were only reskins, plus there's no balance changes either. Even if the team can't rebalance weapons and people already knew Valve wouldn't work in anything for the Update.
@WhiteNoise Hell no. Jungle Inferno and Blue Moon fixed the Pyro, while Invasion added 3 reskins. Also JI has Lazarus and Banana Bay.
Valve with other communities? Great!
Valve with TF2 communities? Not so great...
More like afk lol
I need to say this, I love these Mini-Skymin drawings!
widzu95
same!
I have been following this channel since it was young, and I am so happy that its still going strong. Ever since I watched your original TF2 mod video I knew this was going to be my favorite TF2 related channel, and to this day I still think that's the case. You have improved a ton, but kept the same as you used to be in your content and style. I really hope more videos keep coming, and I wish you the best.
Please give my non-TF2 videos a shot. I can't keep doing this game forever.
@@SkyminSlash I mean, technically you could. You'd hate yourself if you did though lol.
i didnt even know end of the line was an update, and just thought it was an SFM
Jesus, it was in 2014? That was 7 damn years ago. Damn, time flies, I still remember when it was just released.
Last time was this early these types of comments were still funny
So, you've never been so early?
Been loving these new vids sky
piemations junior
I’m still of the camp that thinks this is good enough to be its own movie if we’re not considering the length requirements.
It’s just so cinematic! And cohesive!
I really love this video. It’s well thought out and concisely written. I would love to see more videos like this, wether it’s about TF2 updates or some other games changes. I really enjoyed how you went over each aspect of it the hats the actual update etc. I’d love to see more content like this.
"oh yeah, play that sax mister mundee" -Skymin 2021
When I first heard about EOTL, I remember hyping up the animation, only to later find out it was an update once the crates started dropping. So when it eventually came out, I wouldn't say I was disappointed by the lack of content thereof.
I do feel that Valve is definitely to blame for the execution of EOTL, as although it was a "small" thing that ended up big, Valve were the ones who decided to cut the content. Snowplow essentially would've "changed" the perception of the update, but not even glorified Attack/Defend was what it was made out to be. I do wish in a different timeline, this update worked out successfully, and didn't end up on the list of bad community updates alongside the likes of Invasion (inner practices of the team moreso than content) and Robotic Boogaloo.
Ooooohhh boy....
My favourite update of all time.....
I miss those days
When you play TF2 since 2013 you see a lot of things
SFM creator: I can’t make any promises
Community: where are our promised weapons
Loving this new style of content! These mini video essay type videos are super entertaining and interesting!
I had never heard of this SFM before. Thank you very much for introducing me to this, that was one of the best videos I've ever watched.
Gotta say, your new format is great!
Also, the SFM was beautifully made, and it made the Thermal Tracker exist.
I loved the superliminal music in the background
actually the most confusing map in TF2 is tc_hydro but luckily that map is buried deep within obscure tf2 maps like ctf_well, fastlane, yukon, standin, ravine, cactus canyon and asteroid
Ctf_well used to be played a lot before the Meet n Match update
Ctf well is great dont you dare diss my favorite map
Yea, I hate Hydro. I always get lost on that convoluted map. I really don't understand how anyone can find Steel confusing though, it's rather straight forward.
Ctf_well is not obscure.
The panic attack, quickie bomb launcher and iron bomber were probably weapons that were meant to be added in EOTL since the weapons conveniently came out just 2 weeks after the EOTL update
I just watched end of line a couple minutes ago and then this comes out!
Loving this type of videos and the constant upload rate. Keep up the great work
Another great video Skymin. I always love your uploads, and look forward to the next.
End of the line as the animation is incredible and even almost unbeatable in quality. its story is very creative, too and also the fact that it didn't need too much dialogues to tell it
End of the line as an update is literally like any other recent updates with nothing new except cosmetics, cases, and weapon reskins but none of what the community actually wants
Its always a good day when a new skymin vid comes out!
The sfm itself is almost perfect. My one and only complaint about it is that one scene where the medics miles and it looks like it is straight out of one of those goofy 2010 terribly distorted comedy sfm’s
OH GOD EVERYONE IS POSTING TF2 VIDEOS. IT'S BEEN SO LONG
Excellent video, very informative. I started playing TF2 for the first time back in 2014 but I didn't play it a lot like now, so I wasn't even aware when that thing came out. Since then, I always heard that, aside from the amazing SFM short, the update was pretty bad. It's good to know what happened behind the scenes.
Good video, and TY for including Bagel in the background :)
Never seen this channel before and I get recommended this informative and retrospective vid. Gud content
I was off tf2 when that happened so thank you soo much for clearing up the fog around it for me.
I liked the way you used music to express your fustration about this whole mess of an update.(how to write a map explonation part had a musical buildup.)
My take about the matter is: End of the line update was sacrificed on the altar of corporate ego.
I'm so glad someone noticed that!
@@SkyminSlash *oh my gosh she replied to me...
Rightly spoken about Snowplow. I like the map a lot on the few times I've been able to get on to it, hidden away in the misc maps playlist. Ugh...
I personally find the sfm itself, while spectacular in its visuals (The Ubercharge shot is pretty awesome) and quite nicely shot for the most part letting it stand up as a good quality film, not very well written if it wanted to be considered an "official" sfm (In my view if it is part of an official update, it's therefore part of the canonical portrayal of TF2) which was where a lot of my gripe in the update came from. Most of the mercs aren't in character at all, and the humour of the short is almost slapstick, rather than gritty or satirical, which Fortress is known for. That all said, I wasn't aware of the development horror story behind it all, and taking that into account, means it was probably written before the becoming official thing was a thing. Cheers for the insight!
The whole thing seems like a terribly shady pr stunt pulled by VALVe to effectively get work done for free, then using scrapped pieces on their own stuff and spread update content over time. Condolences to the dev team that worked on pieces involved, regardless of how it wound up in the game!
Christ was the Duck thing fucking stupid though...
i didn’t even know it was an update until like two years later, i just adored the short it’s beautiful
I absolutely love End of the Line. The scene where Scout runs through the fray of flying trains is one of my absolute favorites. Forever love this short
I was glad to see a nice video on my birthday! Thanks
End of the line team: So we're adding a unique map, cosmetics, taunts and weapons.
Valve: *Ye we're gutting your update*
Valve a while later: *secretly steals & adds their items*
Didn’t know anything behind the scenes when this update came out, so this definitely was an eye opener for me.
Haven't seen you in a while ngl. Good to see more TF2 content creators getting recommended!
Hi I’m new to this channel, and I love tf2. I really didn’t know there where still people this passionate about tf2 and I’m here for it! New subscriber, for you!
just to name a few other TF2 channels i watch, have fun:
durrbill
LazyPurple
MrPaladin
HintShot
Oh so that's where the "too confusing for new players" joke originally came from.
sniper is still stuck in the snow someone needs to save him
Very informative. I always knew there were problems with that update, but didn't realize how screwed it got. sm
I will always appreciate this update for giving me the pool party taunt.
thanks for reminding me of my favorite Merasmus quote:
BONUS DUCKS!
I really liked the sfm clip tho
im glad the sfm short is now being the most beloved
I still laugh at the title "robotic boogaloo"
this is the best take on this update I've seen so far. great video
I still like watching the Short.
Long and Short: SFM was amazing... and Valve was Valve...
i love your schedule
I started playing the game during EoTL, and had no idea it even had an sfm :o
I love the tiny Skymin art.
3:30 "Any time there was a possibility for a high-quality TF2 SFM, I am absolutely all for that."
I feel the same way and it made me want to get into SFM but my PC can't run it well. Skymin's voice is cute and the idea that I could potentially impress her has now inspired me to finally upgrade my PC
The update may not have been good but the short was absolutely AMAZING
15 seconds into the video... she mentioned that it got released in 2014 and it hit me hard how long ago that was
My duck journal is one of my most prized possessions. Collecting ducks was so much fun, I wish it would come back, at least once :(
End of the line's short is in my opinion the best part of the update and it was literally the only it was supposed to be.
Sooo you mentioned Steel.
I wanna say after years of playing TF2 on multiple accounts i still 90% of the time don't know where the A point is when im red and yes i do know when im in spawn theres literally a door that has the letter A next to it but i always forget about that door when im playing.
Honestly? The EOTL short is what makes me animate in SFM so much. I use it as a reference point constantly because of simply how well put together it is.
I still listen to the soundtrack too.
This Video is excellent. Great Job!
Glad I saw the short before I understood what the update was about.
That heavy vs train song tho
Yeah the short was what I was most hyped about, too. Practical Problems was one of my favorite SFMs of all time and I watched it a lot. EotL was shaping up to be even better (and it was!). I thought them getting an update was cool, but I didn't actually care until a _map_ was said to come with it. I was all-in on the new map and usually always am, since I don't really do cosmetics.
And then the map was removed. I was frustrated.
i got goosebumps when i reallized there was superliminal music playing in the background haha
I know this is an old comment
but here's what I think they should've done for the game, in the way of maps and weapons
I think the setup of having a train on the map and the game mode being around it is fantastic, but the way valve executed was..beyond bad tbh
here's what I think would be cool:
the map would start looking exactly like the sfm, the blue team would have a blue base in the snow, with some props of guns, the train wagons which they can interact with (like pulling or lowering them) and overhaul look at how the train looks like, as well as being able to climb on it and jump from wagon to wagon, and going outside would allow you to see a sniper body, half-buried in the snow, with a mug inside of it (like the trailer) or even, a spy buried on the ground
the red team would start at their normal wooden like base, being able to see the train tracks, the environment and the little houses in there with the kittens' orphanage and the kid's orphanage etc, with even a little detail of being able to enter the house where heavy and medic were playing chess and being able to see (based on rng) either the board completely fine, or with some pieces moved, or just straight messed up on the floor (like medic did in the end) also, you could see the medic's jacket with the chess piece he was holding at the end of the trailer
so, the battle:
ideally, the game would consist of the blue team being on the top of the train defending it, it would be like a point capture/king of the hill like, then the red team would start at the cabin where sniper and scout were, they would get into a truck, a very big one for the entire team, and the truck would drive behind the train, from there, the red team has to capture point to point, each point would make the wagon disconnect and allow the truck to get closer, which would make more sense instead of the red team just spawning all the way back behind o in the middle of a wagon, upon getting the last point, the train would slowly stop while the blue team would..well, lose
altho if the blue team hold until the end, you will be able to see the train getting out of the snowy area and enter the red base, where it would proceed to hit the barrels and explode every single thing on the map, killing every player close to the explosive wagon (I mean let's be honest is a train with a wagon filled with bombs so, makes sense the explosion kill everyone close to it)
and sometimes, while on the tracks, the train will pass close to a mountain where it has a chance of a rock falling, anyone hit by it will die, altho it won't be hard to dodge it
and for weapons....well the only idea I got is a Demoman shield, basically, is the train sign basically, what would it do? well, while charging, the demo will have an extra 50% charge and 100% damage with the bash of the shield and 15% turning, hitting enemies won't stop/slow down you, you will keep charging like a train (eh? eh? get it? because train and-sorry) and airblast has 50% less effect in you (u cant just airblast a train for god sake), altho, when he does that, he cannot melee or shot his grenade launcher, and while doing so, Demoman's scream will be louder, quite literally like a train, making so that is easy for the enemy to hear and having a chance of preventing you from hitting them, also don't forget that you don't get a lot of turning with this, so watch out so not charge on thee the wrong direction, also it would give you 25% blast resistance (I mean shooting a grenade/rocket at a train would fuck it up really badly) and 40% fire resistance (fire vs train? really?)
that's what I personally think the end of the line update should've been like, sure my comment is old, and the things I said here are probably really unbalanced or not fun, but I think it would at least fit it with the update itself, thanks for reading my comment
ah, end of the line.... just a few months later
The base jumper was the weapon that was taken. Look at the staff who made the update and check the base jumpers concept artist.
great video, and on the subject of forgotten or bad updates, maybe talk about the invasion update, i herd it was not very good and i only started playing tf2 last year, so i didn't get to experience
7:10 so much pain in that voice that I had to pause it and steel myself to listen to the rest of it
I love seeing when Skymin posts a new tf2 yt video but I hope she isn't feeling pressured into making them, nonetheless I still close whatever I'm doing when a new Skymin vid gets uploaded
I sometimes wonder if I'm secretly some kind of demon.
Like when I look back at the end of the line update and fondly remember leveling up my Duck Journal.
The flash dance footies was my first cosmetic that i got from a multi class cosmetic crate and im not disapointed
Nice to know that my comment from the Powerhouse video at least helped inspire this one by bringing up Snowplow.
The SFM short is really good
They cut Snowplow and yet Wutville made it in with the state it was in
She's back baby
I paid No attention to the update and was just amazed by the sfm cause of how amazing it was. The hats were also really cool I use a lot of them for my loadouts
Funny thing is the first map I ever played was Steel. I didn’t care that it was confusing, because as a new player all I care about is the basics. Shoot bad guys and stand on flashing point.