Cleaning a 70 Year Old Engine with Electrolysis
Вставка
- Опубліковано 1 чер 2019
- In this video I show you how I used electrolysis to clean a flathead v8 engine block from the 1940s. I've never used electrolysis before, and I was surprised at how well it worked and how easy and cheap it can be.
- Розваги
Nice video, your parts turned out great! A few notes for others interested in electrolytic rust removal:
This process produces hydrogen and oxygen gas. Work outdoors, and avoid sparks and open flames.
The process does not remove ANY of the base iron or steel. It only affects iron oxide, which is converted to an iron compound.
The presence of hydrogen can potentially cause hydrogen embrittlement, but the effect is likelly minimal. Might want to minimize current and time for suspension components.
Higher current will speed up the process. I routinely use 2-5 amps for pulleys and other small items. For engine blocks and other large parts, 10, 20, or more amps would be more suitable.
The water level will drop due to electrolysis (turning water into H2 + O2), and due to evaporation. Evaporation is sped up by heating of the water from current flow. Account for this if you're going to let it run overnight.
Current flow follows the path of least resistance, so exterior surfaces and those closer to the anodes will be cleaned fastest. Interior surfaces will be very slow. Anodes can be place inside the part to overcome this, but be careful to make sure they don't touch the part.
Don't use copper wire or copper clamps to connect the part to the current source. The copper will plate onto your part. Use carbon steel (not stainless) wire or clamps.
Steel anodes are sacrificial, as mentioned. As they oxidize, their resistance is increased. Clean or replace them periodically. Or, use carbon rods as anodes to avoid the problem altogether. Don't use copper or stainless steel anodes.
Have fun!
@Juden Arier I have read that it changes Fe2O3 to magnetite, Fe3O4. You're right, acids oxidize, and to put it very simply, this electrolytic method forces oxidation of one of the Fe atoms through electric current.
I have wrapped a steel electrode with fiberglass window screen material to insert it into close places. a rod like that could be inserted into the cam bore with good results if needed.
Nice info on those carbon rods, as they are non-consumables. Any idea on sizing for those rods, as pertinent to the electrolysis process. They're available through Ebay, but not sure if those available would be sufficient @ 7/16" & 1/2" x 12+". The rods would make getting deeper into an engine block by wrapping the rods in a non-conductive mesh (nylon screen?) and inserting that into the lifter or cam bores, or even deeper into the water jackets of old cast iron blocks.
Saw his clamp in there, but it's so big you might not see the copper?
Electricity follows all paths, not path of least resistance
The biggest gain we found on our cast 289 ford V8 blocks was that it really cleaned the water jacket out and made quite a difference on the temperature when running 😎
There are company's that sell a filter to go in the radiator hose. The old SB fords were really bad about casing sand and grit plugging the radiators
@Rat Fink That's bull . Buddy i have owned an automotive machine shop for over 30 years . Specializing in fords. 60's and 70's Fords shed sand and casting trash. Filters for the hose are made for just that reason. In the 60's and 70's there were many foundry's and the big 3 had and still have there own casting foundries. Blocks and heads were made in the old days with sand . The accuracy and quality was awful . I have sorted through a dozen blocks with a sonic checker to get one that has expectable core shift and cylinder walls on older castings. For high performance use. Now heads like AFR are permanent mold castings as many OEM or a lost foam method or wax cores. The old sand casting are long gone for engines and heads. it would be impossible to sand cast the complex thin wall casting of today with sand due to core shift and porosity.
@Rat Fink ua-cam.com/video/ziVhj2oifl0/v-deo.html
Here you go buddy
They call it Detroit mystery metal for a reason
@Rat Fink Do a little research then open your mouth
@Rat Fink Yes, but not everyone cleans their blocks the same way. Chrysler had an issue with their magnum v8 engines shedding casting sand and having premature water pump failures. A good engine block flush will clean it out, but a coolant filter is also an option
Cool - that block looked so nice. Only criticism I have (take it from someone who's done it for years) is to please wear safety glasses when pressure washing. Especially on irregular surfaces those little chunkies can ricochet back at you before you can blink. I've had bits of crud cut my face (no face shield) and was glad that at least I could still see at the end of the day because I was wearing a $2 pair of safety glasses. I had enough nasty things get in my eyes when I was young and immortal and too cool to wear them - now I just wear the glasses whenever there's a hazard because the world is beautiful and I want to see it, my children and, soon, grandchildren. If you're going to take good care and pride in that engine rebuild, please extend the same courtesy to your body.
murraystewartj wise comment
Couldnt have said that better myself.
thanks for this simple but important reminder🙏
All I have is a metal 55 gallon container can I use that instead of the plastic one Will it still work?
Also wear a mask, aerolized liquids are a health hazard for your respiratory system
holy shit finally someone that knows how to take out a rivet correctly on youtube!
Vivid Media idk I’ve seen some pretty horrific attempts on those random restoration on machinery and tools. You know, deep UA-cam late night videos
adjerram 🤣🤣🤣 I know right
I'm impressed with the results! Always wondered about using electrolysis on larger parts. Thanks.
Thank you for your super demonstration of the power to intensively clean deeply tarnished and corroded engine parts using this technique.
The parts were remarkably transformed, all without hard, labour intensive, hands on cleaning!
I did this to an MGB engine block, and I was amazed how much rust and scale came out of the water jackets. The engine runs nice and cool now.
Henry Ford would be very proud of you keep in his legacy continuing👍🏼
I always am glad to see when one of your videos has posted.
one of the best explained tutorials very nice. good tip on the aluminum and mention on the washing soda and not baking powder
Also a big advantage is that the interior rust in closed subframes is disolved.
European cars have often closed boxsections and subframes because of their monocoque construction.
Importent with those parts is that you drill some holes so the proces can also reach inside.
An additional advantage of those holes are that you can use a borescope to see inside and apply anticorsion into it.
Go back to school
That block and pan cleaned up awsome...good job man!
nice, can't wait for the engine build and see it running. keep op the good work, it's going to look very cool when it is done
I kept thinking...... what would 40 amps have done? Would it have worked better? Faster? Or made no difference? But I must say..... That bare Flathead block is a piece of art!😁
It would probably have pitted the hell out of the block. When you're doing electrolysis, you're removing material, and too much power can quickly ruin the part. Think of it like a welder in reverse. The more power you give it, the more material will be removed, and electrolysis doesn't care whether it's eating away rust or base-material. Electrolysis has no sense of humor, you see... lol Technically speaking, if you let the part sit in the tank long enough at even low amperage, there would be pretty much nothing left but a really crusty cathode.
@@MFKR696
That's contradictory to what he said. He said it only ate off the rust and grease and didn't affect the cast iron. I also seen another commentor say he uses 10 amps or more on large items. That's the problem with UA-cam. Do I believe the UA-camr and the other poster, or you?🤔
@@1956model1 Of course it's contradictory. That's kinda the point.
From what I have heard, only the rust (iron oxides) are affected by electrolysis because of the molecular charge causes the iron oxide to break up with hydrogen going to bubbles and oxygen going to the cathode. The black stuff is a mixture of iron metal and magnetite from what I know. I could be wrong.
Great results. A lot of the machinery and tool restoration channels use electrolysis on a smaller scale and now you show your only limit is the size of your container.
Just as you mentioned make sure the item is completely submerged or else you will end up with an etched line at the surface.
Fantastic results and again an informative video.
You were the only video that warned me about aluminum dissolving. I will be cleaning up a tool and one of the parts is aluminum with two steel rods sticking out. I don't want to risk pressing the rods out to de-rust them, so I'll work out a different way.
The blackened coating that remains is called Magnetite.
Yes, it is a different oxide state than common rust and is much easier to get off the metal.
I was thinking patina, it shows you I was at the back of the class with my helmet and crayons!
Should’ve just used a powerful magnet instead of a pressure washer. Should pull the magnetite right off.
I use a piece of a magnetar to remove it. :-)
That worked great! 👍
adding air bubbles from an aquarium air pump under the parts helps a lot...
It's amazing how fast you can move and clean that thing.
Excellent video. Thank you so much for not putting some really cheesy music over it.
Its so damned cool that you can accomplish these tasks with the tools you have. Great work
Something to know for all auto technicians 👍👏 brilliant ideas
Great video..... As always. Well done on the fantastic content, film and editing. Can't wait for the next video 👍
Very good video! Excited to see progress on the body work also!
Love your videos, looking forward to watching the series on the body work.
Winning, thank you for the upload. Going to get back to my 1977 K25 long box restoration... Engine work time woot woot.
An outstanding video, as usual! This is a great solution to home cleaning of Iron parts.
nice video and its always nice seeing younger ppl using old school techniques. this looks alot easier to do at home than an acid bath to clean a block up so i may just keep this fun fact for the future.
also next time you drill rivets it makes life alot easier if you tap the center out with a punch a little smaller than the shaft in the middle. then use a slightly larger drill bit than the hole and wiggle it around a little as u start drilling and the cap on top should start spinning and walk up the drill bit. then you just push the other side out if it doesnt fall out. or you can tap it from the side with a chisel but thats messier. my time as a mechanic helped me find that trick with rivets and instead of 30+ seconds a rivet sometimes its 10 or less this way. smack with a hammer and 1 bit. when drilling alot of rivets or in tight or bad spots it can make or break your day i hope it helps.
Very cool. Thanks for sharing your technique. 👍
Dude, perfect timing. I need rust taken out of coolant passages on an ls motor. Thanks!!
I love the make shift horse. I am glad to add that to memory for the future.
Very clever young feller! Nice job!
There is a problem with using electrolysis for cleaning an engine block. That is many use small plugs of aluminum to blank off oil galleries, these can be hidden in the end of drilled holes that you wont see. When the engine is rebuilt there isn't proper oil control through the block and it fails immediately after rebuild. Any bearings that go through the process will need replacement, Camshaft etc. This isn't the case with all engines but some do this.
Your supposed to strip the block bare first, duh
Nice Engine Block. I'm glad you found out the benefits of electrolysis...
@macroMachines it doesn't really matter whether you set it at 2, 200, or 400 amps. The battery charger is constant voltage supply there for it will always output 12V. By ohms law the system (being the whole electrolysis system) will draw whatever the amount of current ( or "amperage") necessary to act on 12V. I would recommend leaving it at 200 because then the system will be working at full capacity. By leaving it a 2amps you MIGHT (I could be wrong) be keeping the process from running at its fullest. Best way to check is by using a multimeter connected in series (NOT parallel) and checking the amount of amps it is drawing. If it is stuck at 2amps, you might be holding back the process.
Thank you very much !! I have rusty block to clean and this helps me so much. Thank you...
informative. to the point. very well made video. no life story about the parts etc
I like the simplest way to clean metal. I dipped a whole car frame and the suspension in citric acid. Came out super clean. Way better than sandblasting.
man that looks amazingly clean great job!
Excellent. We have a C59 block as well at the machinist. Wish I saw this before.
Positive = Anode
Adding a small amount of laundry soap helps to shift the oil.
The Block looked Really Clean👍🏼
To be more specific, due to galvanic reactions and the properties of aluminum, it would be eaten away because it would effectively turn into a sacrificial anode, much like the Zinc bricks that are used as sacrificial anodes on boats and ships. Because of the galvanic properties of Zinc and Steel in sea-water, on a boat/ship that's electrically grounded through the hull, the combination of salt-water and angry-pixies will pull material away from the Zinc bricks instead of the hull. If they weren't there, the hull would ablate to nothing in no time just from being grounded the way it is. A ship is essentially a giant anode, and the ocean is essentially a giant cathode. I know this has nothing to do with anything, but I thought it would be interesting to mention.
I have a patent in electrochemical regeneration. You are 100% correct. 👍
@@jamieoconnor8692 I know lol.
That can prove problematic on dissimilar metal constructions. Which a lot of engine parts are now a days.
@@LynxStarAuto Indeed
@@morglavey922 I'm sorry to hear that. It's a shame to see anything go to waste like that.
Looking forward to you building this engine. I never built a flathead so it will be interesting to see. I think some time with a drill and various wirecups would do wonders on the surface now and buy a set of engine brushes for journals and passages!
Awesome reminder of the effectiveness of electrolysis.... I'd forgotten it.
I would recommend that at the begging of these type of videos you add a disclaimer about the dangers of doing this
Thanks for the info. Will definitely try this out.
I'm impressed. That does look good.
Great video! To the point and no bs music. You taught me something, thank you.
IVE NEVER SEEN THIS DONE BEFORE. GREAT VIDEO!
Do you live in a cave? :-))
Good job! What a difference.
now you peaked my interest i want to see you put this flathead together and get it running now
*piqued
Great results I would be careful hoisting the motor on the crank journals
Great video and great idea! The only thing I would do different as I would pressure wash it prior making the wash powder more effective and removing 100% of grease and grime
Macro:>) I am impressed to see a young man showing interest in restoration. Thanks for the good hope you have given me
Nice finish. I like it.
awesome work.. thanks for sharing!
Great job !!! I hope you are studying to be an engineer a hands on engineer . You do great work .I'm sure your father is a great teacher !!!
Very much appreciated and impressed
Wow good job , I’ve been looking into various cleaning methods while doing an engine rebuild for my m113 engine & soda blasting worked well for my aluminum cylinder heads . Definitely gunna try this method in the future.
Wow, what a difference.
Great info, Thanks!
Nice work.
Definitely planning on doing this with my 68 383 big block mopar. Scored it and 906 heads from a guy for $300. His kids had torn the plastic off the block while it was in his shed so the entire block is coated in a surface layer inside and out. Going to drop it into my 95 Dodge Dakota (V6 Magnum) And rebrand it the Dakota Super Magnum as the 383 and 400 used to be called the "magnum" as well.
Very nice turnout!
Good work. That block and pan are in excellent condition. I don't think I've ever seen a flathead Ford V8 that didn't have cracks between the valves or cylinders.
Well I dont know that for sure yet, but fingers crossed!
@@MacroMachines So far, it's looking very promising.
Great job. Keep going!
One thing I'd like to mention is you need to blow all the parts off with compressed air before any assembly is done wiping them with a towel or rags leaves lint on everything and when you start the engine up the lint will go into the oil pan and plug up the oil pickup screen. You really won't be able to see the lint but it's there I have 45 years experience in doing transmission work and I've seen many do-it-yourselfers wipe
parts with rags and then it will plug up the screen after the transmission is run for a few minutes so never wipe the parts with rags or a towel always use compressed air to blow everything dry
he used wd 40 too
Works much better if you degrease it first. Also use paint remover prior to remove paint. There is also a product that will not allow flash rust. Eastwood after Blast is one of them
Could you please teach us how to add a safety fuse? Your videos are so succinct, thorough, and useful, thank you so much!
Well done.
Hell of a good job
If you needed a bigger vat. 1 of those 275 gal. Totes would work with multiple parts to clean
Reminds me of me as a teenager 60 years ago--No goggles! No gloves! No steel toed boots! No long pants! I survived! Still have both eyes, and all my fingers and toes!
You can get similar results using water and molasses. You need to degrease first as the oil will kill the microbes that form to eat the rust away. Same black iron oxide coating when you pull it out of the water that will wash right off. I use one small jar in a rubbermaid trash can with water with great results. Nice video.
Nice job!
one of the most informative youtube video . well done and thumb up
my pleasure to subscribe to your channel
Thank you, well done.
Nice I shall be trying this sometime
This method works well with certain relics,old tools anything rusted.
great video tanks for sharing .. cheers .. you put only soda right ..
I'd really like to see the 200 amp setting, haha!
You'd be disappointed. I've done it before. All that really means on the charger is that it's CAPABLE of 200 amps, not that it's going to push 200 amps. It ramps the voltage up from 12 to 20 to push more current to the battery that you're charging. If your battery is super dead, you may actually see 200 amps flowing. But in the case of an electrolysis setup, your current is based on how well you have placed anodes and how much washing soda you've used. You're never going to get 200 amps unless you're shorting your parts against the anodes, which would just cause the charger to trip off (hopefully).
Its as if manufacture's or government saw to many torture movies & banned the production of good battery chargers-sux!!! Because, One cannot revive a dead battery with these supposed smart chargers-they suck compared to the older ones!
Muy bueno su video y explicación. Excelente aporte a la humanidad. Dios lo bendiga.
Thank you for sharing!
Thanks man very informative
Looks good.
Dude, i like that wheel barrow set up you have. Did u make it or do they sell ones like that?
Great job!
luckiest guy ever.......great builds in this guys future
Very cool. Thank you.
I've used this process and it does work great. There is a video of a guy that took a completely rusted 1918 45 caliber pistol and made it work again using this process.
I see you have a later model block. Are there any cracks by head bolt holes or valve seat areas ?
34 dirty engines disliked this video.
65 jealously filthy engines disliked this video! Clean up your act you filth!
Limpeza em bacana um bom trabalho....
The water and molasses mix does the same rust removal, but takes a lot longer, in the tropics can take 4 or 5 days to completely clean a block like that sidevalve. A lot longer process in sub tropical environments.
results could be far better if first, you have used white spirit or diesel to remove the grease. In addition, a brake cleaner is also a good option before starting the electrolysis.
If you want to save on WD40 you can mix yourself, 8 parts of solvents like gas/petrol and 2 parts of fresh engine oil. Use it for year to protect bare steel tools etc, you can wipe it off and layer of oil is left, just like with WD40.
I like your wheelbarrow good video
I have done this as well. It even removes any paint. There is more cleaning, the closer the surface is to the electrodes.
That home made wheel barrel thought!!!
Thats the nice thing about this process. ive done entire engines that are 80-100 years old and it removed all the exterior rust. you can even dump the water on plants and it wont harm them depending on whats left over
Only if your plants can take a dose of washing soda! The washing soda doesn't change (except for the part that breaks down the grease, and you can use the same solution over and over. I wouldn't dump it anywhere that you value the plants. It takes paint off too, and if you had lead paint on your piece, you'd end up with that in the sludge, so careful where you dump that.
@@87mini ive had no problems the few times ive done.
@@41Zman That's good to know. I'll wait till my wife's gone, though...