Geometry Dash's Biggest Cheater Was Finally Caught
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- Опубліковано 24 тра 2023
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A huge cheating scandal has shocked the Geometry Dash community. This is a very interesting story and there are a lot of lessons to be learned. Make sure to go check out the vids below too:
The Impact of SpaceUK Hacking: • The Impact of SpaceUK ...
The SpaceUK Hacking Situation: • The SpaceUK Hacking Si...
Doggie's video: • i verified slaughterho...
Thanks to @a1yn @syzzii @vulcanium4 @alexplaysgd @Zeronium @Zoink @Abyssoft for helping me research the game and story.
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Twitter: / karljobstgaming
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The amount of vindication Kolo must have felt after over a year of knowing the top player was a cheater must have been incredible.
I think I'd buy a crown and regal robe and make my face (and body) reveal if I hadn't already.
How a villain is made
I wouldn't feel vindicated at all, I would have long-since abandoned such a sicophantic community.
That would have drove me insane and no amount of vindication would alleviate the suffering I'd have endured for over a year.
@@operator8014 sycophantic*
sorry
I love how they specifically force you to record mouse audio so they can verify that the clicks sound on time only to then dismiss someone who pointed out that the clicks sounded wrong.
FACTS
That "you are wrong" was astoundingly rude. Whoever wrote that should be ashamed of themselves.
Trust me...they already were before that. Why do you think they'd say something so awful and incorrect?
Well one of the videos was wrong? How is it rude
@@nonyabidness6492 It would have been much more professional to actually explain why the video was wrong and/or why no action would be taken, rather than sending a blunt message with a cheeky emoji tacked on to the end. It comes off as a bit childish to just shoot back with "nuh-uh" when it's their job to actually investigate such claims and make informed decisions, and to communicate those decisions effectively.
@@nonyabidness6492have you ever delivered anyone any work of your own? Imagine you have spent many hours on some project and give it to your boss or teacher, and you just get back "you are wrong". No explanation of what or why, no thank you for trying to better the community and literally doing our job for us, no nothing, just a dismissal as if you are getting shoo'd away. It's incredibly rude. If I was head of that mod team and found that out I would give the moderator a really angry talking to and throw them out on the spot.
@@theWebWizrd yeah it's a videogame discord, if you think it's important you should touch grass
Its so annoying to see how bias moderators are. They ignore "nobodies" until a "somebody" raises the red flag
Isn't that just how any level of bureaucracy works? People will ignore problems until the problem can't be covered up anymore.
@@zchen27yeah, but I wouldn't expect a bureaucracy from a GD community from all places.
life works that way in general. people are d1ckh3ads
@@xaf15001 oh, i would. From keyboard warriers who have 9K hours in GD, i wouldnt expect anything less.
biased
A thing that wasn't mentioned in the video was that Kolo received a lot of backlash for their exposal. It had a terrible like to dislike ratio and a bunch of comments harassed Kolo. It's a shame that Kolo got a bunch of crap for speaking up against a popular person.
The person responsible for dismissing Kolo's findings never apologized to him either and is most likely still part of Demonlist team. All Kolo got was "I do not know which list mod responded dismissively on Twitter, but I would like to apologize anyway." which is worthless. That mod didn't just "respond dismissively", they ignored and buried the findings. They're incompetent and should not be a part of the team. But sadly, nothing will be done about that, and Kolo will not get the justice he deserves. Disappointing, but expected.
Nothing would make me want to play a game less than moderators who don't care at all about the integrity of the game. Disgusting.
thing is if kolo was taken seriously space wouldn't have stolen all of those verifications and his impact on the game's community would have been nowhere near as bad
It's not exactly uncommon for someone to be caught cheating in the speedrunning community and the person that caught them gets ostracized while the cheater continues to do what they do. No, I'm not saying it's common to cheat. Just the result when someone does cheat is a lot more common than most people think.
@@hollowman064 Cheating being relatively uncommon is likely the reason for said reactions
Can we quickly touch on how that moderator saying "You are wrong 👍" is probably one of the most toxic and horrible things a moderator could ever say? The moderator didn't even explain his reasoning or anything, he just said some snarky sentance and pretty much just ghosted him...
problem is that nobody knew who that mod is now, based on one of the comments.
i wouldn't be surprised that mod is a sock puppet account of spaceuk, or related to him
My first thought would be that they're buddies. It would explain him ignoring evidence it was first brought to them.
@@jcaesar19871 That could explain it, good thinking!
@@koweedate Hm, that's true. They could be nothing but a simple puppet...
I'd chalk it up to the stunted social skills that moderators usually have
I hope whoever said " you are wrong" wakes up at 2am due to cringe and feeling like an idiot atleast 30 times a year.
"YOU, ARE AN IDIOT!"
song intensifies
I hope they lose their job and end up homeless
Too nice, they should totally make a public statement and quit and get actively mocked on for 10 years. But that’s not going to happen since so many people are willing to wipe their ass
lol i think that's the exact perfect punishment/consequence
unfair.
While 1000% unjustified, it is still mistakes for just 2 messages.
(I am 100% sure SOMEBODY is going to bring up IRL illegal stuff. And like, isn't the reason why we jail those people so that it doesn't happen again? So if this person is at that level, no need to do anything)
The "theft" you talked about in the end is for me the most damaging part of cheating. Be it on Minecraft, GD or any other game, the cheater made players bang their heads into the wall for months or years trying to beat a run or player that doesn't really exist. It affects so many truly passionate people in so many horrible ways that it escapes my comprehension.
It can also push human limits into places they would of never pushed to otherwise. So it definitely goes both ways, not that cheating good or anything. But in GD especially this is very true. There has been serval evolutions of the games player skills because of cheaters.
The ends does not justify the means. Instead of good players having a friendly rivalry to get there first, they face frustration trying to mimic someone who didn't even do it
@@Moleoflands let’s not act like victims though, they wanted to push themselves to do it. Everyone wants to be the best, and the placebo effect is very strong in humans. The best need the very best to improve, even if the “very best” was actually a cheater. At the time they didn’t know that, they had hope that a human could beat the level if they tried hard enough, and what do you know, they did. I’m sure they don’t regret the experience, pushing to heights they never thought they could. I’m not justifying cheating, but its cool to me what humans can achieve when given hope even if it’s false. Like it or not, a lot of these “impossible levels” would never be attempted if not for these cheaters pushing people.
@@WorldKeepsSpinnin while part of what you say is true, if someone wants to "test the human limits", they could make a tool-assisted run well advertised as such. the cheater essentialy did this (used a tool to make his runs) but sold it as his own play. i don't think what they did was forgivable, his intentions weren't good-hearted and he was obviously deceitful, i can't see how what he did was virtuous in any way
@@WorldKeepsSpinnin as the person after you said, make a TAS run and show it off. Take Zeromaster in the doom community. He's taken on a few impossible doom challenges, and shown how they could theoretically be beaten. Like spending the equivalent of multiples months to get enough revenant rockets to get 100 % kills in nuts. Or beating Map 30 in Doom 2 pacifist style
He even used a TAS to grind out the right angle to shoot a wall with to trigger an all ghost glitch to set a world record on E1 M7. By having a TAS grind, then replicating it himself, he saved years of trial and error
What upsets me most, is that when SpaceUK was originally called out to the moderators with video evidence, they didn't even bother to explain properly or talk to the person sending it like they were an equal.
They just gave a rude, self important reply of "you are wrong.", as if they are the absolute authority.
"Experts" are often wrong, regardless of what we're talking about. It's often the aggregation of the community that correctly solves problems. Markets rule.
@@Fingolfin3423 I absolutely agree. People get comfortable with their authority, and can't fathom they'd be wrong.
@@Fingolfin3423 Unfortunately most markets are controled by those with power to benefit themselves, and are not actually free.
@@Fingolfin3423 Hail Fingolfin!
Usually the type of person who wants to be a mod is the type of person who should not be a mod
As the guy who "competed" with space. The whole situation left me so confused ill never be able to explain in words. Thanks for the video i am glad i could help. Don't mind the [ZBOT] tag next to my name on the pointercrate stats viewer. Its a joke and mockery of space (i swear)
we believe you mr. zonk
oink
Zoink from acheron
ur next
LOL Zoink you are always so funny
GGs best player
Kolo and the guy who added the zBot watermark are the true heroes of the story. As a GD player who’s played for many years and am not as on top of the community now, I had no idea it was this bad. SpaceUK is truly a disgusting person for robbing so many legit players of the glory they deserved. Can’t believe he got away with it for so long.
I was a fan of themutetroll back when he first uploaded his video about hacking. I've known it was bad for a long time
typical english moment
@@user-uu5xf5xc2bwell that's a moronic thing to say.....
Kolo is the absolute king in this story. The mod who rejected him could have easily told others and see if something suspicious was happening, but instead, they just completely ignored it. spaceuk sucks and should have been caught years before.
This too is a huge part of why so many "biggest cheating scandal" situations happen in speedrunning! Moderators who behave like this are (almost) as guilty as the cheaters themselves, especially if change doesn't happen soon...
thank you so much for covering this, as the creator of slaughterhouse its hard for me to know the entire verification was a lie and hope a great moment like doggie being the first isnt robbed of anyone in the future as it has before.
ICEDCAVEEEEEE
caved ice
🧡
icedwave 🥶
Bro your level is badass
I appreciate you covering this situation man, you did a great job. I actually didn't know all the details surrounding Kolo's claims, and seeing that demon list moderator's response feels pretty crushing. I remember grinding Acheron for months to be the first victor, just for Space to pick it up and "complete" it within a week. The worst part looking back is that I didn't even feel that disheartened by him beating it, because I saw Space as this guy that was just untouchable, like, I didn't even compare myself to him he's so good. That's how this man was viewed in our community and it's very unfortunate that it took so long for him to get caught.
Yooo doggie
You are the ACTUAL best player of 2022. Keep your head up high you legend.
It's just sad that so many are apparently willing to ignore the terrible things he did and the terrible person he is.
I think he'll be back with some new cheating method. Won't be believing him
It’s the moderators’ fault for ignoring Kolo, all of it coulda been avoided years ago
"This guy is cheating, here's the proof"
"Nuh uh"
I hope which ever mod simply said "You are wrong" is no longer a mod. They clearly suck at their job.
We unfortunately will never know because even the mod team doesn't know who did it since the account is run by multiple people
@@anti7654 That's why you never have a collective account like that. You have an account with separate admins so everyone is identifiable. That said I bet they know exactly who it was.
As someone who was consistently trying to compete with space for a year, seeing this news was just crazy. All the time and effort myself and others were actually putting in just for one person to barely do anything and reach the spotlight, its just terrible.
ong trirck
yo trick wsp
How does it feel to earn that many First Clears... retroactively?
Agreed
space had the spotlight but now it's all gone. you play fair and square and even if your objective was unreachable, that made you a better player. keep going champ, you'll stay a legend
As a relatively new member of the Demonlist Team I am very dissapointed in the snarky response given to Kolo, I am glad we are past this.
Did you guys ever find out who did it?
@@sweetrocks610 We have not, it was two years ago tbf
there's also a possibility the person that sent it doesn't work for the demon list team anymore, its mod team is constantly changing
@@s3batr0nic Edit: I now understand why the "statute of limitations" exist and have therefore been convinced that I am wrong.
Original comment for posterity:
Are you saying that it's okay to do something wrong if it's sufficiently long ago? If so, how long would I have to wait for murder to be okay? And if there's a line for things that you can just wait out could you tell me where that is?
@@hejgustavful Lmao, he's saying it was two years ago so finding evidence of who did it is difficult, not that it was so long ago so who cares. Don't immediately jump on the worst interpretation possible.
Everything about this whole situation is so infuriating to me. I feel so bad for kolo aswell. And the fact that so many people are just welcoming space back into the community with open arms is so weird. Space stole so much recognition from the people who would've been top 1 if he didn't cheat. Genuinely robbing them of potential revenue.
Space is not welcomed in the community. Many of the comments shown on his recent videos are ironic and almost everyone actually involved in the community is in agreement that he doesn't belong. Obviously there will still be some people that support him going forward but I believe this is a small minority
Mostly kids who don't know or care what happened I believe
To be fair the comments are his viewers. The actual community might look differently at it. Still disappointing but not expected considering the whole dream situation that happened even earlier. The favorism in online communities has only gotten worse with time.
Feelsbad for Kolo, like he KNEW this guy cheated but was brushed off.
The only time they found out that it was true when a mod official took it seriously.
Sums up IRL. You won't get noticed if the admins don't do something and will only give attention if a higher authority will say something or if you have the power to do so.
As a person very involved in the geometry dash community this exposal was crushing. Yes the history of the game was changed forever, but space made countless friends in the community and he lied to every single one of them for YEARS. Thanks for covering this Karl!
gl on silent clubstep ur gonna beat it really soon‼️‼️
Geom dash
GL on SC
Yo its that funni silent clubstep guy
I'm convinced exposal isn't a word, could find two definitions on non reputable sites that disagree with each other. Doesn't really matter but it's driving me crazy lol
If I was Kolo I would've immediately turned into the pettiest guy on the planet lol. I would've replied "I was right 👍" one time for every single day they spent dismissing the work and effort put in exposing this guy. Crazy that this is how a startling amount of people act when given even the tiniest bit of authority and power
Unfathomably based grudgeposter
I would respond the exact same wat
I'd rent an SMS gateway with a dozen SIM cards and just blast "You are wrong" at his phone for a few weeks.
This problem exists with all kinds of situations where people are given a modicum of power. Be it your local HRA, or a discord/forum mod or any sort of title that gives a person some authority over others. They tend to feel that they have earned that power and that others are inferior to them.
I like that. Shoutout to Kolo, may he be rightfully petty and may it be good.
seeing Karl super focused and serious on beating jumper in the video background at 6:22 is amazingly hilarious
He looks 50 in that.
GD players have 4 main endings
1: You get bored of the game and retire
2: You dissappear from community with no trace
3: You get exposed for cheating (applies to pro players)
4: You get canceled for grooming minors in discord
i'm still going strong but most likely to happen to me is option 1
Why is this so true
@@no-one-1 I got the first one already
5: you fake killing yourself (triaxis)
@no-one-1 inb4 it's 4
Thank you for covering this! The community appreciates it
Vouch
IT RELEASED???JISHHSOSBEBEIIAV
UNBAN ME PLEASE 6 MONTHS ALREADY
@@williamdavila6702 💀
aeonair
Kolo should send a 3 words reply back to that moderator: "I was right 👍"
EDIT: Looking at the comments makes me wonder why I am still here.
True
@@wolfetteplays8894 why are you still here
@@volturnes4734 why are you still here
"eat my butt" would work too
@@shadenwaywhy are you still here
She: how could you not know this, I have been giving signs all the time...
Her signs: ZBot watermark
I love how Karl can take a game that I have zero interest in, and get you invested in not only the who, but the why of a games fanbase, and showcase why people love a game in very understandable ways.
Thank you so much for this video. It isn't very often our community is seen by the wider audience and I can speak on behalf of everyone when I say we appreciate you so much for this.
The situation with Space hits pretty close to home for me, too, as I was the #1 player in 2019 and experienced similar events to Doggie with the level Zodiac. So I could almost relate to everything that happened but today's top players were affected far, FAR worse than I or anyone before them. Nothing beats the damage that Space did and I can't begin to imagine anything topping it forever.
echnical !
@@JXChannel T
@@JXChannel Thomas
Technical? Arent you supposed to go boxing ring? What are you doing here? Go boxing ring!
@@kyperactive wrong technical
They never apologize for cheating, they always apologize for being caught.
Completely for many, they don't even regret it.
They never come up with an original comment, they just repeat an old adage.
@@Snookbone I'm sorry the comments are not up for your standards, would you like to try another comment section, my highness?
Andromeda and more are the true W's
Andromeda a gd cheater after he got exposed he beat 90% of the levels he hacked before quitting
crazy to think that this would've lasted a lot less if the moderator just...did his job lmao
Kolo is like the superhero after the supervillain convinces everyone that he's the good guy.
It was a pleasure working with you on this, Karl. As shocked as I was of the initial scandal I am equally as hopeful that something like that will never happen again!
common vulcanium W
@@miky1774 agreed
"Shocked" "scandal", lmao. Go outside bruh
@@daddyfuse50 - 🎪
keep being hopeful. you guys claim to raise your standards, but it has happened time and time again. who should trust the dl now?
Kolo deserves more recognition and definitely a major apology from the mods that were super rude to him when he was just trying to bring attention to someone threatening the integrity of this particular speedrun community. Honestly the least they could have done was look into it, even if they didn't have the means to prove beyond reasonable doubt that spaceuk was cheating.
You do know it could be a thing that happened multiple times that someone like kolo accused someone of cheating and it could've been proven false and due to the amount of times it happened might be why just a theory
@@Tsuyuri193 it's their job and that's the risk, if they cannot burdened that responsibility then don't bother to be a mod. As Karl pointed out, the cheater rob any joy and happiness of pure dedication and perseverance from players who in fact beating the stage legitimately, also the various game awards that the cheater absolutely didn't deserve.
The least they could do is say "Not enough evidence". They couldn't possible confirm with certainty he is wrong, they should know that
They should’ve look past the bad impression
I agree, that “you are wrong 👍” would have made me so upset, I would have wanted a more clear answer like “thank you for showing us these videos, but we believe that your claims are not correct because…” etc. Otherwise it just sounds disrespectful and like I wasn’t taken seriously.
Huge respect for Kolo. My man is ahead of the competition of detecting cheaters lol
That "You are wrong" is the most power that mod has ever felt after being bullied all the way through school and likely still into adulthood.
Hard not to laugh at him
I really appreciate the guy who added a secret watermark to zbot. People like him are the unsung heroes of these stories.
Should have done both a secret and obvious one
Even without it he would've been banned. Added salt to the open cut🧂🧂🧂
just do what i do put malware in your software and if they cheat goodbye harddrive just tell it to deltree /y c:/*.*
@@ghoulchan7525if he did an obvious one, cheaters like space would’ve noticed and it would be even harder to catch them.
@@Aaron-zu3xn literally illegal lol
Props to the chad cheat developer for leaving a good watermark in their system!
ikr it's actually genius
it’s genuinely a really good watermark. its subtle enough to the point where hackers wouldn’t notice it but noticable enough where if you knew you could easily tell
@@Lunar1314_ wait
Holy crap it's you
@@ecatskidLMFAO
@@Lunar1314_ because you're like 9. Haven't even used other bots I guarantee you
Not gonna lie, that Geometry Dash team has to be the most unprofessional I have seen
To be fair, that was one dude who at the time was 16 years old, so its not really fair to lump the whole team like that. I’ve talked to many of the moderators to submit runs and they’ve been nice and professional.
@@Zlbm0 They hired a 16 year old to mod? 💀
It was one guy
The demonlist is not an official mod team by any means. It's just a bunch of random Geometry Dash players who are friends with the person who made the unofficial demonlist website. The demonlist mods just decided to start acting like they were of high authority, and few people have protested. The real official mod team is a group of community figures picked specifically by RobTop himself, and they mainly just decide which levels to send to RobTop for approval before establishing them as star rated levels. As far as I know, there is no overlap between the demonlist mod team and the official mod team.
"You are wrong"
Well that didn't age well. Shame on that guy.
I love how Karl gets me so invested into a community for a game I know nothing about
Thank you for being a part of this amazing community for like 1 day
NPC comment
@@simonlutgens NPC reply
Me too, never even heard of this game before but the story was still interesting.
@@hackergaming5451 NPC reply to getting called NPC
The most insane thing is that Space's main rival Zoink was debated to a better player than a HACKER. (Not just in terms of points, but in skill too.) He is able to beat levels very quickly too.
Reminds me of riot and cyclic back in 1.9
I'm a bit concerned because this same conversation happened in the sm64 community once... the result was saddening.
What if Zoink is a hacker too...
This debate is so frivolous imo, like bruh Zoink actually beats stuff on stream, plus he is much more consistent at streaming than Space ever was
I think that makes sense, since a cheater trying to avoid being caught will do good, but not TOO good. Space had to hold back and avoid beating levels too quickly, and maybe pick and choose which levels to sandbag on to avoid scrutiny. Zoink isn't held back by that, he can beat levels as quickly as he is able to without any concern because he didn't cheat.
that whole "you are wrong" response boils my blood and I have zero stake in this lol. Just ridiculous. Gaming communities are crazy.
I'm glad Zoe the mod reported her findings, or else Kolo might never have found vindication.
I call BS. I think the mods know EXACTLY who rejected Kolo, and are only trying to cover their asses because they are largely embarrased about getting caught dropping the ball so hard.
Bs doesn't exist
@@browl218browl218
@@browl218 browl218
@@browl218 browl218
@@browl218 browl218
>"You are wrong👍"
>Refuse to elaborate further
>Let the plebs wonder about the reason your massive intellect judged them incorrect. They will never understand.
>And even if they turn out right, tell em you're well past this and to get on with the times.
Sigma mod
Always love hearing someone act super obnoxious when they're the ones in the wrong. Way to do your job, mod team.
The fact that you're not even in the GD community and that you made (in my opinion) the best video on this whole situation is crazy. Good job, as always.
It is why jobst is so popular! Lots of these videos he does are about games he doesn’t play! But he really takes the time to understand the most minute details. And then unpack them in a way us Neanderthals can follow!
He is an absolute legend.
That's what real quality content is like. Stuff takes time and effort to make, especially when he's trying to portray to us what's happened in a digestible and interesting manner.
Chill link spitting facts
As his closest friend I remember finding out about this and feeling nothing but pure shock when I found this out to be the unfortunate truth, we were so close to the point there’s people that think I was involved in his hacking.
I think what this situation has taught us is that as a community we need to be a LOT more on guard when someone displays for example unexplainably fast progress on things, with a lot of hackers they seem to disregard the fact that taking shortcuts doesn’t leave you unscathed in the end
++ this video is amazing, i wish i could have helped more than providing a few screenshots however it turned out amazing and i hope it brings some attention, not only to the game and to you, but also to people who plan to cheat their way to the top in future. very nice job as always karl :)
yeah, whats important is that we learn from this so it never happens again.
Friends with a fake for 2 years?
A person like him has no true friends. To be a friend, you need to have an understanding and respect of mutual trust and honor, he is nothing but a fake, maybe even a sociopath. I'm sorry this (he) happened to you.
@@holysecret2 Or maybe the guy didn't care enough about internet fame to make it legit, unlike a real life person who's usually completely different because they have to be people instead of anonymous users... or idk, it could be anything, people can be weird, but you're making assumptions about a guy you don't personally know and his personal relationships. Please don't do that.
Nostalgic Kuromi PFP dude
10:48 that’s okay that upside down section in Can’t Let Go is quite the difficulty spike for beginners
From the perspective of a video game WR holder, not only does "being good doesn't make you less likely to cheat" but being good can also make you bored, tired, and lazy. I've looked into the practically non-existent hacking scene for my game and fiddled around with glitches and cheat engine in my spare time because it can mess with the game in new and interesting ways. One of the most fun I've had with my game in years was when someone made a fan engine and it was glitchy as hell, because it was silly and novel. But I'd be the first to fight that using these things shouldn't be allowed in "official" runs. Because the fan engine you can go in and switch up parameters really easily.
I’m glad he brought up Space’s new channel, because it really is rough to see how parts of our community won’t hold him accountable and still revere him as some sort of god
Never heard of this game before but those fake celebrations were more cringe than I can handle. How does anyone look up to someone this pathetic?
from what i understand, he re-completed two of his earlier cheated runs(that of #2 and #1 hardest at the time), but without cheats this time around.
so i guess it's not really unexpectable that someone would still cherish him.
Personally I think it's nice that he gets to beat them legitimately and show off his skill but the hero worship is kinda gross. Like, I do think people caught cheating do deserve a chance to make amends but this is way too soon and clearly just a grab for attention and devotion again.
@@_dr_9869 Let me get this straight. Spaceuk cheats, gets caught, lies about how long they were cheating for, gets exposed again for cheating far longer than they claimed they did, claims to be doing everything legit...and you think they deserve any type of trust or for people to turn a blind eye to everything that happened?
He can never be trusted again. For all we know he just found a new, better way to cheat that's harder to expose.
I guess I can trust if space beat the golden (his first hacked level) legit, but definetly not the other one, everyone supporting him are kids who dont understand that someone could keep lying after they get caught initially.
Its awesome seeing someone from outside of the Geometry Dash community do so much research to understand the little but important details that make up the game and whatnot.
Seriously, to those outside of the community, so many things have been developed within the world of this little square game and its crazy
yo stallion whats up
Especially with how big the community is but people outside the community never talk about it I think is cool
weed
I second this, hi Stallion
@@Weed69420 i agree
Is it just me, or does the message "You are wrong" with a thumbs up afterwards just completely tick me off so much.
That's genuinely how a good 70% of the GD community behaves. They can never express an opinion as just "I think -" or "I'd like it more if-" it always comes from a high and mighty place. So if someone dislikes a level you created, they say something like: "Your level sucks. Maybe if you did this, it would barely qualify as mediocre, not that your feeble brain even has the capacity to comprehend such a long word as that." Meanwhile all their levels suck too.
Man, Karl, I've been subbed here for some years now and just wanted to acknowledge your video quality gradually getting better and better over the years, it's been awesome to watch you evolve as a creator. Please understand I'm not implying that your original material wasn't solid as well, but in comparison your current work you have come lightyears in nearly every category of video creation. Mind you I've never been involved in any speedrunning communities (let alone tried playing them myself, unless you count my baby sister and I always fighting over who was better at the games on our PS1 lol) but, while I can't remember exactly how I found you here, I'm happy to say that you single-handedly opened me up to this whole niche world that I kinda knew existed, but not nearly to such a large and serious degree.
You've introduced me to a whole lot of not only extremely talented, but some of the most intelligent and flat out interesting people I've ever known about in my life. Not to plug myself here but I'm a battle rapper - that is to say that I belong to a very niche community of highly talented, versatile, intelligent/quick-witted and notably unique individuals as well. I love watching people dedicate serious time, effort and energy into very niche things that the majority of people don't even care about enough to know there's even a community centered around it, and the video game speedrunning people, such as yourself, are no exception. I also love that you seem to be more of a fan of it than anything else. Because as such you're genuinely interested in the nuts and bolts of it all, which is what makes you discussing it so interesting, even to those of us who know little to nothing about speedrunning.
Anyways, just wanted to give you your roses while you're still here to smell them. Godspeed, my friend. Thank you for introducing me to your world.
e: Also fuck Billy Mitchell.
I’m not familiar with this community but I appreciate you redeeming Kolo’s reputation, Karl. The man loved the game enough to call Space out and can now hold his head high knowing he was the first to see it. I’m willing to cut him some slack for the error about splicing.
It's more important to share suspicions and be wrong than to hide suspicions and end up being right--and the community reaction should never be to dismiss the suspicions wholesale. Trust, but verify, on both sides.
For real... Hail Kolo - FUCK the mods who were clearly working with the cheat, until the evidence became so obvious... they then turned around and made themselves look like the white knight who discovered it. Worthless POS. They are worse than the cheater... they knew it was going on, then turned around and tried to take credit for the take down they knew was happening all along.
To be fair, splicing is a much easier method of cheating to 'prove' and much more likely to be accepted as suspicious then the click variance was at the time. How many people have been caught out by splicing?
He was just so sure that Space had cheated he fell victim to confirmation bias. >.
Kolo was unreasonably shafted by that Mod's response.
If Kolo still around, Mod Team should owe him an apology.
@@mike81356 I believe that they did, but i'm more disappointed that it happened in the first place
Every cheater tries to admit a small number of runs are faked thinking it will get them off the hook, but it should be extrenely obvious that if youre caught your entire catalogue is going to be scoured.
Keep bringing light to these frauds Karl. Shout out to the hard working community members that catch them.
Your honor I only evaded 1 tax
Honestly, it probably makes it worse for them. Once they admit to cheating a bunch of runs, the people who are checking them don't need to waste time on those runs
@@muchotexto4248i only killed one of those people not all 7 of them
Schmooey did that
@@JackieBright Honestly I don't see how lying hurts the person either. They're still going to suffer all of the consequences if they get caught just once. It's not as if if this person admitted to all of it immediately they'd suffer significantly less backlash, or be welcomed back into the community. It's so common despite being such a long shot because, at the point it's attempted, there's nothing left to lose.
You've came so far man... currently catching up on your content... ALWAYS interesting. And I always learn a thing or two about different games. I like the vibes from your channel. Keep it up you bloody legend 👏
After all this calmed down Demon list should’ve tweeted at Kolo “you were right 👍”
Also the watermark thing was crazy.
Such a great video! Good job Karl!
the legend himself 🗿
This needs to be pinned
And good job to you for discovering this initially and sticking to your guns about it.
The absolute legend has arrived!
The legend!
One big thing I never see anyone mention was when space originally intended to quit shortly after completing the main list. It was super weird at the time because instead of just leaving the community he went out of his way to take down every completion video and had moderators remove his Pointercrate profile. In hindsight it makes total sense considering he probably just wanted to ensure noone would ever find out he hacked so his reputation could never be touched. He only put the videos back up and had his profile reactivated after there was major disapointment and confusion in the community which put a lot of focus on the missing videos. He may have suspected if people collected downloads of his privated completions they might look at them more closely so just putting them back up was less of a risk, but nonetheless its truly scummy.
There was a lot of stuff like that I didnt include because the vid was getting too long. But there are tons of weird details like that.
@@karljobst You still did a great job at showing the magnitude of the situation. As someone who did look up to space I personally wouldve wished a focus on his "skill" even more because as Im sure you are aware he wasnt only *the* player, it didnt feel like he ever struggled. He beat top 10s in so little attempts it was insane. I mean even his reaction to beating Slaughterhouse was so careless it was like he didnt even take the game seriously.
I do get that that wasnt super important for the overall story though and talking about all these magical achivements hed supposedly done could still kind of put him on a pedestal he definitely doesnt deserve to be on.
Overall great video and nice to see GD being represented in more 'mainstream' audiences. I feel like you rarely see people outside of the core community mention GD
I dont think it's scummy tbh, there's another reason he mightve done it, he could've felt bad yk?
@@ZainAhmed456 not really its like saying i feel bad in athletics so let me just use peds to shit on everyone else
@@ZainAhmed456 Dont give him any credit. If he felt any kind of remorse he wouldve come clean, not obscure evidence
They way you did the looping storytelling in this vid was brilliant, well done, sir.
I love the bit about the hidden zbot watermark, it reminds me of a story Oddheader shared on his channel about a programmer who had his software stolen by someone at his clients' office, only to enter a secret button combination and display an image of Sailor Moon, proving that he was actually the original creator of the code. Never underestimate how clever programmers are!
bro really punished them in the name of the moon 💀
wasnt that programmer then fired for putting that easter egg in without permission?
@@Spottedshade 🤟👈
@@goldenpig6453 I don't think so, although I think the video is called "Ten Easter eggs that got people fired". I feel like it was used as an example of the opposite (an Easter egg that saved someone's job) but I'm not sure.
That sounds very illegal to put a trademarked image in a software you are going to sell.
I've talked to SpaceUK a few times and he seemed like a really chill guy. Seeing this whole hacking scandal play out was more disappointing to me than anything and its a shame that he wasn't who I thought he was. I'm so glad you made this video to bring attention to this, it doesn't go unnoticed
the first two sentences of that are almost the exact same as a few sentences from doggie's video
flaaroniii
yo flaaroni tho
I introduced my friend to geometry dash. He quickly became much better than me. But we still looked at spaceuk as the goat. We were severly shocked and disapointed when all of this came out. I thank you for making this video, and brining more focus to it. Since most in the community don't seem to know.
"You are wrong 👍"
This aged horribly like dry aging a steak in dirt
thanks for covering this, it's always cool to see the gd community unite against cheaters
With pedophiles barely and if they feed their ego
Yo wassup can u tell me ur ign? I wanna see ur profile if thats ok, no pressure tho.
Verifier of Super Probably Level, Imma beat it soon as my first extreme
One of your best one's ever Karl.
You nailed it at the end when you talked about robbing people of those special moments that they can be proud of, no matter what they are.
Imagine being awarded a Silver Medal at the Olympics in front of the whole world and then finding out years later, you were the actual Gold Medalist!
Not exactly this but someone in my class was caught being a cheater for a very important exam. He got flack for the whole time he was there lol
I absolutely loved this game back in the day. I’m so sad that this has happened, thank you for sharing and I’m glad that they’re exposed now!
not only was this video mega freaking enjoyable and interesting so far but I LOVE HOW YOU SNUCK IN THAT MASS EFFECT OST
Remember: if cheating subtly doesn't work, try cheating blatantly.
I don't get how you even get caught cheating in a game like this. You could write a script that would mouse click for you perfectly because basicallly every level is just a sequence of timed clicks and holds that will never change so it wouldn't be hard to make a script just do that sequence for you
@@qlcrane8019 Did you even watch the video?
Demon list mods microanalyze clicks to account for outside noise, etc. If all the clicks were the same sound or volume, it would instantly be a red flag. Some sections such as spam would naturally require shorter, faster clicks that are almost continuous, while other sections require long holds. This difference in volume, sound, etc. that is seen on a legit run is impossible to be replicated by a bot or macro, ESPECIALLY for spammy/fast click sections that are in almost every top demon. For those sections you would need to record the sequence of clicks in successive order in one take rather than just recording one individual click and applying it to every input. And given that the entire sequence has to match not only the frames of the previous clicks in the sequence but also the frames of every other click in the botted level, it's basically impossible to not have at least one inconsistency.
@@mandriva4280 He didn't, obviously.
To expand on the ending of this video, Space did more than just steal the verification title from Doggie. He also stole many, many first victor titles from that actually deserved that attention. In GD, the “first victor” is the first person to beat the level after it’s been verified and uploaded. Being the first victor of a demonlist level is a big deal, and can get you a lot of attention from the community. The worst part is not only did he commit the “subtle” theft of stealing that pride and accomplishment from deserving players, he actually caused real damage by stealing millions of views on his completion videos, robbing those players of real world money they would have otherwise earned legitimately. Space knowingly caused real world damage to competing players (many of whom were his friends) for years and never confessed until he was forced to.
You perfectly described the real lasting damage these cheaters cause, and this is why I won't ever not get angry at people defending them, saying that they are not terrible people or that it's just a game.
Amazing to see such a great video on a non-GD channel. You’ve done a fantastic job for both fans and general viewers
Seeing Karl focus on jumper like players do on extremes is amazing
Kolo's video commentaries were pure gems, people even saying that they were professional video editors by many years and that the frame delay was normal, man... lol
Those people annoy me so much lmao
“I can do this well so I’m correct and you’re wrong.”
I hope the mod who so *smugly* responded that the evidence was wrong, obviously without looking into it at all (or they wouldve given an explanation) is utterly ashamed of themselves....
Typical mod.
I highly doubt they are _capable_ of shame given that response. I hope they are no longer a mod.
@@TheZotmeister they probably are
Thankfully, this video was finally done. I'm so happy that Kolo also thought the same way.
I had heard this story so many times before this video and I still learned things from it. Amazing video! :)
As a frequent watcher, I always thought that legit top players in any other game would feel only relief after someone's exposal. After this incident, I realized truly how big of a theft cheating really is in such a game, because for the first time, it is actually associated with a game I used to be passionate about. I will never experience the disappointment or the robbery first hand, because I will never be a top player, but it truly made me put everything in perspective and realize that cheating is very far from just lying.
as a geometry dash player, this video is definitely the best one covering this situation. thank you karl jobst
denni from geometry dash
DENNIS ONMYT GOT IM BNIG FAN!!!!!!!!!
hello Denni
delete your comment from space's tartarus video bro
@@GDNashitWhat if he doesn't, the hell you gonna do.
Not only did he steal the record for being the first to beat the level, but he also got player of the year which would of gone to someone else.
two years in a row
This guy won an award voted by the community as best player of the year. I had no idea he cheated for that long. Thanks for covering it.
Thanks for covering this! Geometry Dash has had hacking scandals before but this is by bar the biggest most insane one. Hopefully this community is able to recover from this kind of betrayal of trust and get better at spotting this kind of thing.
While I'm much more interested in the level creating side of the game, top players and big achievements mean a lot to this community and have a big impact on it's well being.
You are wrong 👍
@@TheIndispensableOpposition Xd, nice one. 😂
*far 🤓
I'd say cyclic hacking was bigger
from the outside looking in, the game has a very high skill ceiling with custom content, and great systems in place to catch hackers/cheaters. also, awareness of how to catch cheaters is now at an all time high. i think the human element of trust just got in the way of properly checking everyone with the same scrutiny, definitely looks like the mod team learned from that though. I dont see any reason the community wont still thrive after this
much love to yall actually putting the time in to grind these levels, or supporting those who actually put the time in. the precision looks insane, reminds me of these top level guitar hero players nowadays. the dedication and pride is just awesome to see
I'm glad you covered this topic, but I would like to say something. The part that pisses me off the most with this scandal is the other levels on the demon list. Levels like Abyss Of Darkness, Sakupen Circles, and especially Silent Clubstep were all deemed to be harder than Slaughterhouse, which would place them all at #1 on the demon list. But because of spaceuk's biased opinion, they were all moved down below Slaughterhouse, robbing them of the #1 spot. Since this came out, Silent Clubstep has moved up above Slaughterhouse, but still at #3. Many people are still pissed that this once impossible level was robbed because of a biased cheater. Everyone, and I mean EVERYONE, said this was #1 at the time.
This isn't true, many people said silent clubstep wasn't top 1 at the time, including cursed and trick. Also it's nerfed so it's not actually the true silent clubstep.
@@big_numbers Cursed also cheated it by changing the hitbox size at the 8JoH
@@BlueSailor19 That was an accident, it wasn't on purpose
@@BlueSailor19 atleast he apologized like a normal human and it was an acident
more people actually said ~top 3 to 4, i saw someone make a chart with the sc difficulty ratings from players experienced with the level before it got placed. just clarifying
11:50 The Mass effect exploration OST always fill my heart with joy
I think it's crazy that someone with very little involvement with and background knowledge of this game and its community can make a better Geometry Dash video than most GD UA-camrs, which really says a lot about both our community and you. Just like your previous uploads, this was a really good video!
You are watching the wrong people then, there are a lot of gd creators that put an insane amount of effort into their videos.
Unfortunately 100 "different" 5 second long "the worlds smallest violin" shorts get 10 times the views
@@erlouwer this is true. People like onealphahelix make videos that are pretty easy understand and are 100%, reliable since they are active in the community. Unlike some that create videos to bait kids for clicks
@@erlouwer man, everyone in this community wanted to jump on this topic so quickly that yes, this is one of the few videos that is actually informed and high quality about this situation
You act like he is some outsider and creating a new physics theory.... this sh*t isn't that hard. He isn't unifying general relativity with quantum mechanics as an outsider with no academic experience....
I am honestly amazed at what other people are 'amazed' about. This is some low level stuff. He makes good videos, which is a skill anyone can pick up; it just takes a little effort; it isn't that 'crazy.'
@@pyropulseIXXI god man why so negative
As an observer of this situation in the GD community, this whole situation really comes across as deliberate negligence to me. The Demon List has been known for years for having ridiculously strict rules for players submitting records, even going as far as not allowing records of players accidentally exiting before reaching the end of a difficult level when it has already been beaten (usually due to ending logos showcasing all creators that took part in making it, which can take over 30 seconds before reaching the level end). To see them deliberately put a blind eye to someone that they believe is legitimate because they have shown they are a good player before is reckless and unprofessional, especially for a list team who demands a lot from you to be considered fully legitimate. I understand that laziness does come in every now and then and that is perfectly reasonable. But when someone has provided with facts that bring up genuine concern, dismissing the portions of things found that are correct and taking the parts that are incorrect as the full truth is just a demonstration of favoritism.
As you said Karl, being a good player doesn't make you any less likely to cheat. What did happen here could have been avoided if there was more care put into actually looking into everything that was being said. But alas, the GD community now has to deal with this impact that SpaceUK caused which will never go away.
If anything, being a top player can make you feel more obligated to cheat, dream is another good example
Well said.
i read this in your voice 💀💀💀
One thing: was click variance believed to be credible evidence of cheating at the time Kolo uploaded his video? If it wasn't, I can kind of understand that they wouldn't look into it. But if it was, then yeah that's kinda probably just favoritism. Though let's not forget that according to Karl, it was probably just one stupid mod that rejected Kolo's proof, and the rest had no idea.
@@Topunito from what I remember people just literally used to think that those were lags because the only person seriously using this as exposing was eiriley and non-russian speaking community didn't want to listen to him most of times
Props to Doggie! It is very sad all this cases of cheating are beign discovered, if there is a community prompt to cheating its the gaming one, thats why we should be more carefull with this stuff, very sad. 😔
The moderation team for Geometry Dash is so goofy.
The demonlist has absolutely no association with geometry dash officially, its just a community project.
@@megadubstepxd9462 I see I see thank you for clearing that up
I don't even play this game, yet it still has me mad at how Kolo never really got justice. The fucking cheek of calling it "Blatant misinformation and bad data." Yeah, you can definitely tell this was 2020 when the easiest way to dismiss anything of possible merit was to just call it "misinformation." Why didn't they check who posted it? It was using their Twitter handle. Of course they could check the logs. Of course they could check who posted it. My guess is it was someone important enough where they didn't want to address it. If I was to go full tinfoil hat, it might even have been the mod who repeated word for word what Kolo said as it became more and more apparent that SpaceUK was in fact cheating.
I would hazard a guess that the moderator only looked at the second video and not the first. The second video was absolutely wrong, and only a fool would continue to listen to someone who lies.
Also, there really is a ton of misinformation out there. It is so much easier to create bad information than it is to create good information. You can literally just make shit up on the spot, and that's bad information. If you want good information, you actually have to put the effort into researching something. It also takes a lot of effort to debunk bad information. All of this puts the truth at a disadvantage, so we as humans need to compensate for that by quickly identifying and removing bad information. Sometimes small mistakes are made in this process, like with this moderation decision, and sometimes huge mistakes are made that completely warp your entire perception of reality, as you believe that lies are the truth and the truth is a lie.
Unfortunately in this case, Kolo's only mistake was posting two videos in the same comment. Humans are practically incapable of responding to two things in the same train of thought. If you've ever asked two questions in a single email before you know this to be true; people will only respond to the first question and forget that you even asked a second one. You really have to dumb yourself down when interacting with the general public. Use simple words and sentences, and numerate your questions. Most people won't even know what I mean by the word numerate in that last sentence; that's the level we're at nowadays.
@@123457474869 Youre so delusional that it is laughable. I agree that people nowadays are stupid, but not THAT stupid as to not know what numerate means
@@123457474869 Numerate is an adjective, not a verb. Someone who is numerate is someone who understands numbers. "Numerate your questions" is complete word salad.
I cannot believe the fucking audacity you have to act all smug and superior when you're literally using words you don't understand in order to look smarter lmfao
@@123457474869that makes me disappointed in humanity
I was an early viewer of Space and would watch him on twitch back in the day (you can see me in the chat at 22:15). For 2 and a half years I thought I knew this guy, until one day what was hiding in plain sight suddenly crashed down on everyone like an anvil. Just like that, the greatness I thought I had witnessed was all gone. Thank you for making this video, you couldn’t have put it any better into words - we as a community really do appreciate this.
ok
U were a mod. Damn
Word.
Damn
parasocial relationships are bitch
Is he still repeating "I just beat acheron" in a hospital with a straitjacket
The worst part about all of these cheaters is the lifestyle and accolades they get from being the best, and cheating the genuine top players out of their moment of glory, awards, sponsorships etc...
He didn't cheat. He just harnessed some of Billy Mitchel's power.
Spaceuk: that's right we are gonna cheat
He just had a really expensive gaming chair
💀
The Douche of Dash.
@@traktor420 It was made of 100% BillyMitchelium, wich costs 1 impossibaquattoduojillion $ for a gram
As a biomedical engineer, I think the fact that most of these speedruns need to contain video is the problem. The reason all these scandals go on for so long is because the mods never believe the #1 player is a cheater so they don't check their videos as thoroughly as they would if you or I submitted a time. You can tell by the snarky response from the mod that the fact that Space would cheat wasn't even conceivable to him. In the medical field, we avoid this issue by doing "blind reviews" where if I submit a research paper, my name gets removed. That way a paper from me would be treated the same as a paper from Stephen Hawking because there's no bias. However because speedrunning submissions require video, and the mods would obviously recognize Space on video anyway, it's a lot harder to remove bias.
Oooh, that's an interesting point! Yeah, at some point, if you prove you're legit, people won't believe that you cheat.
That reminds me of the Overwatch system for determining if players are cheating in Counterstrike. Identifying information is removed and multiple random "trusted players" are tasked with reviewing the demo and determining if the subject is cheating by consensus. Pretty clever way to do it.
You are wrong 👍
@@sheltongolden4394 this would be a hard thing to fully implement on gd. in this game you can customize your icons, that is, you can make cosmetic changes to how your icon looks, such as changing its colors or choosing the models used for each gamemode. there are millions of possible combinations, called _icon sets_
the vast majority of players pick one icon set they like and stick with it, rarely making any changes. it often gets to the point where their icon set becomes part of their identity as a player (*many* players have part of their icon set as ther pfp, for example). in fact, most people would be able to recognize a well-known player only based on the icon set theyre using
as you can imagine, this makes it very hard to remove identifying factors from the gameplay, as youd need to see the icon in order to check if the run is legit or not. its still entirely possible that a player changes their icon set for a completion, or that they use someone elses icon set for a bit, but most of the time mods would be able to recognize most top players, and the bias would still be present
I'd like to point out that academic journalism is not immune to cheating either. I'm not 100% sure if this is the same process you're talking about, but Bobby Broccoli has some fascinating documentaries about scientific scandals, and the one that kicked him off was about Jan Hendrik Schön. Jan won a lot of awards and recognition, had a LOT of papers published in both Science and Nature, but was completely bullshitting all of his work. He figured out how to work people and how to play the system, to the point that yeah...a fuckton of people, when the experiments couldn't be replicated, they just thought he _must_ be _just that good._ Fraud never entered the majority of people's minds. The fact he was working in a niche field and allegedly doing things that had never been done before (so the majority of reviewers would not have the expertise to verify if the entire thing was correct) really helped...which is similar to speedrunning a game. Niche field, with the most recognition given to people who have done things other people haven't yet. Usually tho, other people can eventually replicate or surpass those achievements, which makes it harder to know if it was cheated...but "the one who did it first" is still held in high regard.
It's not really an issue with anonymity, is my point. It _can become_ an issue once someone builds a reputation, but in other speedrunning communities, concerns about cheating are always taken seriously, so long as some evidence is presented.
Impressed by the Amt of info u put in all these vids… do u play all these games or do u just do a godly amount of research? Very nice work either way
Imagine someone already being on to you, you getting away by sheer luck and deciding to just continue doing it lol
I honestly feel pretty bad for Kolo because he gave all this evidence that SpaceUK was cheating but everyone said he was wrong
Glad your attention was brought to this. Thank you.
whered you go
Hi
30:11 There's more than this. He regularly shows up in other players streams and gets treated as if he's still the god everyone believed he was. I wrote in the chat at some point why no one seemed to care about it and several people started talking shit to me for not forgiving him literally a week after it all happened. It's a game that I spent a lot of time playing, hoping to become one of the best players in at some point but damn do I hate the community with my whole hearth.