As someone who is practicing abstinence something I’ve learned is that it’s a journey we may fall into desires but it doesn’t define us we get up and keep moving forward we can define the type of lifestyle we want, for me I’ve landed on the Christian prospective, of why I’ve chosen to remain abstain It took me a while to understand why I wanted to abstain but I’ve landed on I want to share myself with the person I marry and I only want to share that experience with them and practicing self control helps that it’s not easy but I know in the end it’s a choice I’m happy with making allowing the person I love and marry to be with me and though I’ve slipped and fell into sex in the past my future looks nothing like my past I’m not ashamed of my past it’s lessons I’ve learned that help shape me and I’m okay with that growing into the person I am now
Bruhhhhhhh very relatable... I grew up restraining myself from alot physically (wardrobe wise pentecostal ish) and mentally it leaked into my relationships and the way I interacted with the world. So much so that I began to grow mean and bitter. I was always so anxious. I'm still working on it but it's been very liberating to understand where the root of it began and how I should navigate myself and love me in every form. I gained a lot from meditation and journaling. Shame is so ugly it can really trick you into believing you're not worthy of basic needs. Thanks for sharing your journey man much love 💖
This is some of the best vocalizations of mind-body connection ive ever heard. Had this realization the other day when I actually said out loud that I despised my height. Always been self conscious about being 6'2 as a woman. I tried to take it back immediately, and soften the blow. But I couldn't help thinking that was the most honest opinion that came out. Made me cry tbh. So I love this. The harmony. Thank you for your words.
First and foremost, thanks so much for keeping this channel. I was pretty sad when I first saw that you planned to end it but simultaneous respected and understood how that could be the next step for you. This is a very vulnerable channel and I’m sure it’s not always easy putting this stuff all out in the open. Either way, I will continue to support you and enjoyed this video so much!! You’re the first person in this space of spirituality that I’ve truly connected with and felt seen by in a longgg time. You’re definitely doing a great thing here. All love from Indianapolis, IN!
Thank you for this inspirational video and vulnerability. Since you were that vulnerable with us, I will be confident enough to share my side of the story. The way I've been living lately, I'm ashamed and feel terrified to let other ppl know. Due to real bad mental health I have put aside my hobbies for the longest. I'm not as phisically active as I used to. I sit at home mostly. I keep telling myself that I will restart my boxing or karate membership, I will go out play bball and soccer, go for a bike or skateboard ride. I fail. Constantly. As a lifetime sporty person this is torture for me, especially my body. When I stretch and throw a few punches I get so content, but why can't I seem to get myself out this dang house. The body fat accumulated is laughing at me. But that's fine. One step and punch at a time. I need to stop being ashamed of myself. Rather say "Mary, it's okay, not your fault, you've been thru alot, so has your body. Don't shame it. Give yourself time to readjust, you've got this." Positive self talk is real talk. I know its hard but we are brave and wise enough to refocus and get back in touch with ourselves and understand our selfs needs
I grew up feeling very othered by my height and size. I was just naturally a taller, bigger person and was constantly reminded of it, directly or indirectly. It definitely had an affect on me and I’ll likely spend the rest of my life sorting through that. At 5’11” I can’t imagine your experience at 6’7”. While it’s gotten a lot better, I still feel consistently reminded of how much the world isn’t made for tall humans. I will say it increased my compassion for others, I never wanted them to feel that way and I continue to work hard at making others feel valued and significant. I know you used that one aspect of your story to make a larger point. How we think of ourselves is so important. Still, learning to be kind to oneself is super hard. I appreciate your vulnerability, you’ve always been brave that way.
Hey Joe, sounds like your a journey of mindfulness. Which requires deconstruction of ones thoughts, and bringing awareness and curiosity around it. The questions that you are asking about what honors and dishonors your body will lead you to a place where you will figure out what works for it, allowing for greater functioning. And also what hinders it, leading to dysfunction from a holistic stance. I love that your actively undergoing this process, because it takes a lot of unlearning, and self observation. In Christianity, there is such a push towards immediately suppressing urges and unhealthy inclinations, that we don’t even allow room to understand why the body is experiencing such urges or habits. And it’s important to do this especially from a non-judgmental space because are constantly reacting to our environment and trying to understanding why we behave the way we do. I hope this deconstruction towards mindfulness leads you to greater understanding and compassion on how to be kind to your body.
I'm 5 ft 11 and really had to learn how to be tall. So much unlearning and learning new healthy habits, the way you speak to yourself, selfcare and self love. Been thinking about taking a yoga class for years now. Love these types of videos 👏 👏
I'm not of Christian faith at all, I grew up around Eastern religion - but I've lately been rethinking how to reframe my mind-body connection (and avidly love your songs), and this video taught me a lot. I listened while studying, and took a lot of notes for both my Board Exam and phrases you included: comparative, temperament of our own voice, and freedom to no. Thank you for sharing.
I’m 5’11 which although, its not 6’7, it’s tall for the average woman. So I can relate to that awkwardness and feeling of “otherness” you describe. I would say though yoga was a big part of finally developing “oneness” with my body and finally feeling “comfortable” in my body. Yoga helped me finally feel “present” in my body which makes sense because it is an embodiment practice and yoga it’s self means “union”- union with self. So I hope you keep going and give yourself and your body grace as you grow in your practice! Thanks for sharing 💛
This is a good talking, I never thought about how it's a relationship that we have with our body. I'm trying to be healthier and its been a struggle understanding my body better is a first step.
I’m glad you’re talking about this. I’ve always been bigger (really i was just curvy but being held to white body standards). I actively hated my body and was so violent towards myself. I was super insecure, developed an eating disorder (no one talks about black girls with EDs), and carried a ridiculous amount of shame in my body. Long story short I’ve healed and grown but i never considered how Christianity played a role in my body image. I’m sitting here underdressed eating my breakfast (bread with butter and honey dew with Tajín) and I’m at peace and really happy and healthy. All of this to say gentleness is the key forever. Your body is the safest place to be so make sure you’re the keeper of this complex organism that houses your essence.
Thank you for this, I never considered living like this i.e my mind living in relationship with my body and vce versa. This is a great perspective, honestly
I’m realizing more and more in my personal life how people view themselves and even God colors so much of how they act and communicate with others. I’ve always been one to try to at the very least, live in understanding with others whether we agree or not. I’ve seen how people speak unkindly to me and how they even threaten violence against me and it seems so foreign to me. They don’t live at peace with themselves so they can’t be at peace with others. Being loving and kind to yourself works wonders on how you interact with others. I’m realizing that people view God as this violent, controlling, oppressive dictator instead of a loving, kind, understanding father. I think this is why even people who claim to be Christian think violence, control, and oppression is ok. I think studies have proven that guilt and shame aren’t good motivators. Beating ourselves up doesn’t help us grow or change. I love what you said about living in harmony with yourself. When I say something “doesn’t sit well with my spirit” that’s exactly what I mean lol. It’s not in alignment with how I’ve chosen to move or exist. As I grow and change, I’m realizing how much grace I need to extend to myself and others. We’re all on our own journeys and though they may seem to run parallel to others, we’re not all picking up the same things at the same time. Sorry for being long winded yet again lol.
❤ another great video. I’m turning 27 this year and I feel like I’m just learning to love myself and my body, my height especially (I’m 5’11). Positive self-talk is important. And your point on freedom was spot on too!
Some of the truest words I’ve heard in a while. I resonated deeply with so much of what you said if not all. Despite what you believe or don’t believe anymore I appreciate what I perceive to be you working out this thing called life out if that makes any sense. Wanting to be real, true, alive, and human is such a good thing and I’m glad to see you doing all your figuring out. ❤
Y’all i was so shocked when he said he was 6ft7 ‘ coz he doesn’t appear that tall on camera and in pictures but Joseph have you consider modeling or did you consider it at some point in your life or been approached too
thank you so much for articulating these thoughts. I felt very seen by this. As a stallion for lack of a better term lol I've been kinda forced to navigate conversations of modesty and my faith since I was very young which has made me carry a lot of shame.This gave me a lot to think about. I may have missed something but I thought you were ending the channel, so I'm glad you're still sharing!
Thanks for your vulnerability and transparency Joe! I relate to few things you said especially being more petite and thin- just the inner voice and the way we speak to ourselves. Thanks for putting words to your human experience that resonate with us.
The section about being able to say no. WOW! You made concrete what was an abstract idea in my head. I’ve seen Reddit threads where men were asked “How long would you be willing to date a woman without sex?” And the answers astonished me. If we’ve created the sort of culture where I’ll get cut after 3 dates or 3 months because I’d rather wait for a loving committed relationship, are we REALLY sexually liberated? I think not.
Good stuff! I like how you said "it depends on where you want to land" as far as the bible. When I read the Song of Solomon the beauty of sexuality and our bodies is affirming. And seeing that beauty and preciousness in our bodies, when they are abused either with how we think or handle or physically violate their intended purposes, the consequences are disastrous.
In processing what you said, sometimes you can live in understanding with your body when it communicates it does not wanna do something, but once you choose to have "mind over your body" or push your body into an uncomfortable place, I can see that it can sometimes have benefits. I see exercising as main example of this or eating nourishing foods for your body. Your body might not enjoy that initially but in time, it can be trained to crave movements and foods that will overall lead the body to a healthier space. I enjoyed hearing your process and that sounds so hard living under this, my soul felt tired hearing you express how you interpreted paul's ethic of flesh. I understand how this mindset or interpretation can lead to having shame or harshness when relating to the body. I view the flesh as the carnal part of us and because of the curse, the body has been subjected to sin. So we have a carnal nature and a body and soul that opposes what God wills. And those desires that dishonor God - those desires are also expressed in the body. I believe that is the part that Paul called us to beat into submission. Understanding your body is for God and God loves it ultimately and knows what's best for it or what environment, it was designed to thrive. That's my engagement with this video. I hope you keep making this content, i have followed you from the beginning and I admire your vulnerability of sharing your journey. Your expressions have inspired me.
Ahhh! Eeee! There’s so much I want to say! 🤗🤗 I won’t, but mannn this topic is right up my alley..! I’ve come to a very similar resolve w/ how I deal with my body, it’s desires, and even the health I want to achieve. There are gains I want to see, but I know there’s a lot of mental health and care I must, MUST, do first. So giving a lot of grace to the me I am now (takes daily practice), until my mind is healthy enough to be the me I ultimately want to be. Speaking of congruence, I feel like true wholeness is when the spirit, soul, and body can agree. Where there is no strong tension between the three entities. That’s why as believers we can have so much unrest because tho we’ve grown spiritually, we have such deep soul wounds that eventually chafe against the spirit or body. Or vice versa, have done so much healing at the soul level, yet the spirit is impoverished. Man. Love this convo. And I said I wasn’t gonna say anything. 🙄😅🥹
i think the practice of asana (commonly referred to as yoga) is very much a mind-body connection. its why its called a "flow". not sure what ur relationship is with yoga these days ... but be mindful of your breath as ur guide. its like about the positions and more about the breath facilitating your transitions...
Wow this is just so heart warming and humbling. It's timing too; it highlights deeply rooted, common human experiences, for myself as a Woman too. It hasn't been easy for me but each day, I am learning to engage my mind in healthier ways, to be intentional about making healthier choices, to shed the lock-down weight. It has been fun but not easy... Also, this highlights key points of discussion from a male perspective, especially in spaces that tend to be Oestrogen heavy - (body image, self-love and well-being) I hope after this, Men might be encouraged to use their voices and find themselves on a healthier trajectory. Eye-opening, quality talks. I think it's beautiful how and what you've shared. We hope to journey with you more. Maybe you could bring us along to an open session one afternoon? Tc Joe and thank you!
Joe, you deconstructing. Undoing malconceptions that were driven by personal understanding and interpretation of the christian codex of livity. Good on you. We are co-travellers on this odyssey. You'd say you conflate flesh and the body in this analysis? The conclusions you arrive at are enshrined in a good understanding of the christian codex, nuh suh? That is, love thy neighbor "AS YOU LOVE YOURSELF" in a word. (That gentleness thing and the relation to sexuality and the freedom of not being a slave to anything are things I've tousled with too reaching conclusions similar to the ones you've settled on.) I see you applying good understanding of christian directions for livity. You embrace the wisdom there and, in addition, it serves as a great base from which you judge your new and ongoing experiences (inc. actions and decisions) as smart. I believe that the christian codex of livity is quite complete and robust and genuinely great, generally great. As you build your identity and codex as independent of that you will hold christian truths as your own as they ARE truths and truth is your standard. Twill be interesting how much overlap remains as you continue to experience and to craft your own way. Even if tis subsumed in the constitution of "the way" twill still be yours and you'll be better for it. Matured. 🙂
i generally conflate flesh and body in this. but of course, those who are somewhat familiar with the different ways that flesh and body are translated in the NT don't always mean the exact same thing. but the overarching theme throughout the bible is generally the same- "flesh/body = profane and to be cast down. spirit/soul = sacred and to be lifted up.
@@flightsfeelings I'd still pick a nit here... my reading of flesh is 'carnal nature' as opposed to the physical body, that that is what is deigned. But this is based on spotty memory. I haven't checked and I haven't really read the Bible in years. And I'm unfamiliar with the differences in the origin text. I was truly wondering. Good you could engage.
Dude I used to watch your stuff when you were Christian and was so inspired by it but then unfollowed when I left the faith lol. So happy to be following you again now
I am also in a similar journey to yours and you have helped me to better articulate what I feel presently as I unlearn some ideas from my previously held beliefs within the Christian context. You and Paul Maxwell have been most helpful in my journey. I am also curious to hear your take on shame because I think when it comes to leaving the faith there is always a backlash and the response from members of the faith is that you are going to lose what you gained from being a believer.
I love what you’re saying here! I found your content back in the Christian days, but I’m still rocking with what you’ve been putting out since. I’ve always viewed your insight as a source of wisdom, and I’m glad to be able to watch the journey. With that being said, I have a question. You described your approach in communicating with your body as a departure from the biblical view. In your opinion, could it also be possible for a faithful Christian doing honest exegesis to read the Bible and leave with this approach, or would a Christian have to abandon, ignore, and/or deliberately misinterpret the intended message of Biblical authors? I’m genuinely curious to see what you think. I don’t mean this message as an attack or a “call-out.” Your content has always helped me to think deeply about stuff like this. Much love, man!
i don’t feel attacked at all. thanks jonathan. i personally believe you can’t avoid this type of conclusion in the bible. it’s littered everywhere through different authors, not just Paul. so yeah you’d have to do some interesting exegetical gymnastics to avoid it lol. i do believe you can find passages that have “counter-themes”. like i mentioned, even paul seems to have a dualistic approach to the body. (he calls it a temple while also calling it “this body of death”. sheesh. )but in my own, possibly biased observation, this theme of having enmity with nature seems to be the broadest in the new testament, including Peter who says the flesh “wages war against your soul”. in general, the bible often has a very profane opinion of this current state of nature, especially the natural man. and this is due to the origin of sin. in genesis, all of nature is cursed. man is cursed. the ground is cursed. woman and even her mode of bringing life into this world is cursed. satan becomes the god of this world. and since then, there is a constant anticipation of the “new earth” and “new bodies” after the second coming of jesus. so you see, from the beginning, the righteous person is to be at odds with the world, and everything in it, especially his body.
ah, and how did i miss this in the video or even my comment, the most glaring example which is at the center of message of the gospel: the violence to the body of Christ on the cross. the weight of the sins of the bodies of humans is so heavy that the only holy body to exist must now suffer violence in the most extreme form of a gory crucifix in order to make things right. here, the metaphorical is now literal: violence to the natural body is the only path to righteousness and harmony.
@@flightsfeelings I hear you, that makes a lot of sense! Thank you for being gracious in your response to me. I know you must get a lot of crazy comments from people still in the faith. Alls to say, I’m grateful for the insight and conversation.
absolutely man. honestly, when the comments are generous and curious and not judgy or whatever, i enjoy engaging in the conversation. i think about these things a lot so it’s cool to talk to other people about it, even if they don’t have the same conclusions as me.
If it makes you feel any better, I’ve been practicing yoga for nearly 10yrs and there’s still positions that feel awkward or impossible. And definitely understand not wanting to exist in the space of sexuality in a casual frame of mind
Firstly, I wish I had the boldness to just share my heart the way you just did. I think you are right, many Christians have a negative relationship with their bodies, because some of the scriptures that you mentioned. But I think that comes from an error in our understanding what Paul means when he talks about the "flesh". While the word can refer to a person's body, it's hard to believe that Paul would be advocating for the unhealthy relationship that you are describing in the video. This is because its clear within the scriptures that the body is a gift from God. It's not this thing we have been burdened with. That being said, I feel that many Christians live with that negative view of their bodies. With regards to Paul using a metaphor of physical exercise to make a point about Spiritual discipline, I don't think he is saying that athlete should have a negative relationship with their body in order to achieve their goal. I think he is making about point of saying that, like the athlete, we have have to deny certain desires we may have in order to achieve our goal. But that doesn't make the body the enemy. Maybe one day I'll the boldness to make videos like you do. Putting ourself out there for people like me to leave comments about how they disagree 😅. Bless you! (and no, that was not me being condescending). I just downloaded Find Me on UA-cam Music, going to give it a listen soon.
thanks for watching Shivan! kinda addressed this in another comment, so i'll just copy it here and also customize it a bit: i understand paul is referring to fleshy desires in some cases rather than the actual physical body. however, 1. when referring to the body as a "temple", he indeed means the physical body. 2. where do fleshly desires come but from the physical body? they are an expression of the physical body. where else do sexual urges and lust come from but from the hormones of the physical body? what i am proposing in this video is just not a healthy relationship with my physical body, but also a healthy relationship with the desires that arise from this body, not a violent one. with that being established, in general, the bible often has a very profane opinion of this current state of nature, especially the natural man. and this is due to the origin of sin. in genesis, all of nature is cursed. man is cursed. the ground is cursed. woman and even her mode of bringing life into this world is cursed. satan becomes the god of this world. so you see, from the beginning, the righteous person is to be at odds with the current world, and everything in it, especially his body. and since then, there is a constant anticipation of the “new earth” and “new bodies” after the second coming of jesus. i do believe you can find passages that have “counter-themes”. like i mentioned, even paul seems to have a dualistic approach to the body. (he calls it a temple while also calling it “this body of death”. sheesh.)but in my own, possibly biased observation, this theme of having enmity with nature seems to be the broadest in the new testament, including Peter who says the flesh “wages war against your soul”. does this not suggest the body and soul are enemies? this is why i start the video by saying "the power of language". you can say that you find it hard to believe the body is the enemy as a christian, but language matters. and if the consistent language is one of enmity, distance, war, and death, how else should the christian be encourage to relate to the body and the desires that flow from it? the most glaring example which is at the center of message of the gospel: the violence to the body of Christ on the cross. the weight of the sins of the bodies of humans is so heavy that the only holy body to exist must now suffer violence in the most extreme form of a gory crucifix in order to make things right. here, the metaphorical is now literal: violence to the natural body is the only path to righteousness and harmony.
@@flightsfeelings You raised some good points. I think the temple imagery is so important in this conversation. Depending on what god is worshipped in any given temple, that will determine the ethic or practice of that temple (what is allowed or forbidden in that temple). I think the same is true with our bodies. On your second point about where these desires come from. It seems to me that the scriptures consistently point to outside forces trying to influence and overcome us. To hijack and take us captive, using our bodies/temples for their purposes. This is seen in Genesis 4 when God speaks to Cain. He tells him that somethings is crouching at the door and its desire to consume Cain. But then God says that Cain should rule over it. The story is Adam and Even is similar in that there is an outside force trying to influence their activity. Unfortunately, we buy into these influences attaching ourselves to their ideas even to the point where we attach our identity to it. I think that's when we start struggling in relation to what are our desires versus the desires that are "crouching at the door". When it comes to language, I think you are right, it does matter. While there is war within the body, against the "flesh" (those forces that desire to consume us), it doesn't mean that we are at war with the body. I think at the point, a discussion about worldviews are important because I don't believe that the NT writers held a naturalistic worldview; I don't think they believed that hormones were the root cause of our desire to break the law of God. As to Paul talking our current temple the body of death. It makes sense for him to do that, because our bodies are in a state of decay and will ultimately die. This tarnishing/decaying is a result of us yielding to those forces. Turning the temple of Life into a temple of death. I wish we could talk about Christ, His body (His physical one), and His death on the cross. Christ allowing that to happen to Him was the way He won the fight against those forces (Colossians 2:6-16). Unlike Cain who gave in to that influence, Christ ruled over it; defeating it. The horror of the crucifixion is a clear image of what it looks like when we allow those forces to rule over us instead of us ruling over it. This conversation could do on forever, because I'm really enjoying this. Thank you for taking the time to respond to my initial comment. I really appreciate it.
It's so fascinating when someone's biggest insecurities is another person's greatest desires Whether they want to have that body or... have that body 😄
@@flightsfeelings agreed... if only we could see ourselves how others see us Or simply just believe what they say they see...hmm ( Had an aha moment for myself)
is this your new place? I like the light. the other place seemed kind of closed in and dark. I realize living in a place without natural light affects my mental. If this is your new place I love it. I would love to live in that space.
It's hard to understand because of the english langage I believe, but the flesh is not the body, it's not the same word in the original langage. The flesh inhabit the body who is a structure.
Adding this here since it appears comments are turned off on your video on absolute morality. Without God you have exactly a 0% chance of having absolute morality or real morality. In fact, God is really the only way that real absolute moral values can exist. If you believe that murder, is really absolutely wrong, your only hope for grounding that belief is God. Now for the critique that Christians don’t really have absolute morality. Or they do in theory but not in practice. Your critique is with regards to accessibility to the moral standard. Yet, the vast majority of moral standards are presented clear as day within the Christian worldview. There’s no real debate as to whether murder is immoral or whether adultery is immoral per Christianity. Now let’s grant that there may be certain moral situations for which we don’t have a clear prescriptive text in the Bible. We have the leading of the Spirit as you mentioned, but we have something else on top of that: grace. That’s why the Christian view of morality is so robust. We have clear prescriptive texts on the vast majority of moral issues. Where we don’t have clear prescriptive texts we have the leading of the Holy Spirit. And on top of that we have the grace of our Father who loves us dearly. Grace compensates for our ignorance or limit in knowledge. Christians do have absolute morality and especially for the gray areas we have the embrace of our Savior.
“without god you have exactly 0% chance of having absolute morality.” yes. i know. did you even watch the video? even your other rebuttals. it’s like… i’m not gonna respond to this if you’re not actually engaging with what i already said. feel like i’m just gonna be repeating details what was already addressed the video
@@flightsfeelings I was engaging with the 3rd point you made in the video. It's a little difficult to engage with every single argument you made in a 35min video. I hope there's some grace for that. There were four main points it appeared you made. 1. Morality does not necessitate God. 2. The moral argument is not exclusive to Christianity. 3. The way you arbitrate between religions and absolute moral systems is through personal judging, essentially creating a relative moral world. 4. There are disagreements on morality which functionally make the Christian behave like a relativist. He in essence would be no different than the moral absolutist. 1. The moral argument in certain formulations does not necessitate the existence of God. However, the argument is meant to keep a person consistent in their beliefs. That is, if you believe real objective morals exist, the only way you can have that is God. Atheists can argue that neither morality or God exist and that would evade the moral argument. The atheist is being consistent with a high price tag which is the intent of the argument. 2. The moral argument is not exclusive to Christianity. Agreed. It was not meant to be. It definitely could not be used in conjunction with certain religions due to their definition of God but it is not exclusive to Christianity. 3. The way you judge between moral systems or really any truth in that matter is with coherence, correspondence, and pragmatic truth tests. That doesn't make us the ultimate judge. It makes us observers of reality. If the Christian moral system is true, then the claims it makes ought to be true. Christianity makes claims that are falsifiable historically. 4. You made it sound in your video like Christians could functionally not really live as absolutists but only as relativists because everything was open to interpretation and debate. Yet the vast majority of moral issues are clearly prescribed. These can be known absolutely. Sure there are moral gray areas but like you brought up, the Christian would say we have the leading of the Spirit in those areas. That doesn't make us relativists. And even if some misinterpret the leading of the Spirit it doesn't do away with an absolute morality (which I think you would agree with), it just means we are fallible. Grace covers our fallibility.
In 1 Corinthians 12:13 Paul does say that everything is permissible for him but not everything is beneficial. So one may go and fornicate because they have the free will to do so but it doesn’t mean it’s beneficial for them.
i just love listening to joe speaking about anything, please keep uploading! it’s very therapeutic for me 🙏🏼
Before I even start watching, I just want to say that I'm glad you're not ending the chanel 🥺 thank you for that
As someone who is practicing abstinence something I’ve learned is that it’s a journey we may fall into desires but it doesn’t define us we get up and keep moving forward we can define the type of lifestyle we want, for me I’ve landed on the Christian prospective, of why I’ve chosen to remain abstain It took me a while to understand why I wanted to abstain but I’ve landed on I want to share myself with the person I marry and I only want to share that experience with them and practicing self control helps that it’s not easy but I know in the end it’s a choice I’m happy with making allowing the person I love and marry to be with me and though I’ve slipped and fell into sex in the past my future looks nothing like my past I’m not ashamed of my past it’s lessons I’ve learned that help shape me and I’m okay with that growing into the person I am now
Bruhhhhhhh very relatable... I grew up restraining myself from alot physically (wardrobe wise pentecostal ish) and mentally it leaked into my relationships and the way I interacted with the world. So much so that I began to grow mean and bitter. I was always so anxious. I'm still working on it but it's been very liberating to understand where the root of it began and how I should navigate myself and love me in every form. I gained a lot from meditation and journaling. Shame is so ugly it can really trick you into believing you're not worthy of basic needs. Thanks for sharing your journey man much love 💖
This is some of the best vocalizations of mind-body connection ive ever heard. Had this realization the other day when I actually said out loud that I despised my height. Always been self conscious about being 6'2 as a woman. I tried to take it back immediately, and soften the blow. But I couldn't help thinking that was the most honest opinion that came out. Made me cry tbh. So I love this. The harmony. Thank you for your words.
First and foremost, thanks so much for keeping this channel. I was pretty sad when I first saw that you planned to end it but simultaneous respected and understood how that could be the next step for you. This is a very vulnerable channel and I’m sure it’s not always easy putting this stuff all out in the open. Either way, I will continue to support you and enjoyed this video so much!! You’re the first person in this space of spirituality that I’ve truly connected with and felt seen by in a longgg time. You’re definitely doing a great thing here. All love from Indianapolis, IN!
Thank you for this inspirational video and vulnerability. Since you were that vulnerable with us, I will be confident enough to share my side of the story. The way I've been living lately, I'm ashamed and feel terrified to let other ppl know. Due to real bad mental health I have put aside my hobbies for the longest. I'm not as phisically active as I used to. I sit at home mostly. I keep telling myself that I will restart my boxing or karate membership, I will go out play bball and soccer, go for a bike or skateboard ride. I fail. Constantly. As a lifetime sporty person this is torture for me, especially my body. When I stretch and throw a few punches I get so content, but why can't I seem to get myself out this dang house. The body fat accumulated is laughing at me. But that's fine. One step and punch at a time. I need to stop being ashamed of myself. Rather say "Mary, it's okay, not your fault, you've been thru alot, so has your body. Don't shame it. Give yourself time to readjust, you've got this." Positive self talk is real talk. I know its hard but we are brave and wise enough to refocus and get back in touch with ourselves and understand our selfs needs
The title alone got me stopping/dropping EVERYTHING!
I grew up feeling very othered by my height and size. I was just naturally a taller, bigger person and was constantly reminded of it, directly or indirectly. It definitely had an affect on me and I’ll likely spend the rest of my life sorting through that. At 5’11” I can’t imagine your experience at 6’7”. While it’s gotten a lot better, I still feel consistently reminded of how much the world isn’t made for tall humans. I will say it increased my compassion for others, I never wanted them to feel that way and I continue to work hard at making others feel valued and significant. I know you used that one aspect of your story to make a larger point. How we think of ourselves is so important. Still, learning to be kind to oneself is super hard. I appreciate your vulnerability, you’ve always been brave that way.
Completely agree- I’m also 5’11 and can relate to that awkwardness and feeling of other.
Hey Joe, sounds like your a journey of mindfulness. Which requires deconstruction of ones thoughts, and bringing awareness and curiosity around it. The questions that you are asking about what honors and dishonors your body will lead you to a place where you will figure out what works for it, allowing for greater functioning. And also what hinders it, leading to dysfunction from a holistic stance. I love that your actively undergoing this process, because it takes a lot of unlearning, and self observation. In Christianity, there is such a push towards immediately suppressing urges and unhealthy inclinations, that we don’t even allow room to understand why the body is experiencing such urges or habits. And it’s important to do this especially from a non-judgmental space because are constantly reacting to our environment and trying to understanding why we behave the way we do.
I hope this deconstruction towards mindfulness leads you to greater understanding and compassion on how to be kind to your body.
I'm 5 ft 11 and really had to learn how to be tall. So much unlearning and learning new healthy habits, the way you speak to yourself, selfcare and self love. Been thinking about taking a yoga class for years now. Love these types of videos 👏 👏
I'm not of Christian faith at all, I grew up around Eastern religion - but I've lately been rethinking how to reframe my mind-body connection (and avidly love your songs), and this video taught me a lot. I listened while studying, and took a lot of notes for both my Board Exam and phrases you included: comparative, temperament of our own voice, and freedom to no. Thank you for sharing.
I’m 5’11 which although, its not 6’7, it’s tall for the average woman. So I can relate to that awkwardness and feeling of “otherness” you describe. I would say though yoga was a big part of finally developing “oneness” with my body and finally feeling “comfortable” in my body. Yoga helped me finally feel “present” in my body which makes sense because it is an embodiment practice and yoga it’s self means “union”- union with self. So I hope you keep going and give yourself and your body grace as you grow in your practice! Thanks for sharing 💛
This is a good talking, I never thought about how it's a relationship that we have with our body. I'm trying to be healthier and its been a struggle understanding my body better is a first step.
I’m glad you’re talking about this. I’ve always been bigger (really i was just curvy but being held to white body standards). I actively hated my body and was so violent towards myself. I was super insecure, developed an eating disorder (no one talks about black girls with EDs), and carried a ridiculous amount of shame in my body. Long story short I’ve healed and grown but i never considered how Christianity played a role in my body image. I’m sitting here underdressed eating my breakfast (bread with butter and honey dew with Tajín) and I’m at peace and really happy and healthy. All of this to say gentleness is the key forever. Your body is the safest place to be so make sure you’re the keeper of this complex organism that houses your essence.
Thank you for this, I never considered living like this i.e my mind living in relationship with my body and vce versa. This is a great perspective, honestly
Thanks for your transparency ! I have always been very skinny and teased about it. Now I’m in my late 20s finally accepting my appearance.
I’m realizing more and more in my personal life how people view themselves and even God colors so much of how they act and communicate with others. I’ve always been one to try to at the very least, live in understanding with others whether we agree or not. I’ve seen how people speak unkindly to me and how they even threaten violence against me and it seems so foreign to me. They don’t live at peace with themselves so they can’t be at peace with others. Being loving and kind to yourself works wonders on how you interact with others. I’m realizing that people view God as this violent, controlling, oppressive dictator instead of a loving, kind, understanding father. I think this is why even people who claim to be Christian think violence, control, and oppression is ok. I think studies have proven that guilt and shame aren’t good motivators. Beating ourselves up doesn’t help us grow or change. I love what you said about living in harmony with yourself. When I say something “doesn’t sit well with my spirit” that’s exactly what I mean lol. It’s not in alignment with how I’ve chosen to move or exist. As I grow and change, I’m realizing how much grace I need to extend to myself and others. We’re all on our own journeys and though they may seem to run parallel to others, we’re not all picking up the same things at the same time. Sorry for being long winded yet again lol.
❤ another great video. I’m turning 27 this year and I feel like I’m just learning to love myself and my body, my height especially (I’m 5’11). Positive self-talk is important.
And your point on freedom was spot on too!
Some of the truest words I’ve heard in a while. I resonated deeply with so much of what you said if not all. Despite what you believe or don’t believe anymore I appreciate what I perceive to be you working out this thing called life out if that makes any sense. Wanting to be real, true, alive, and human is such a good thing and I’m glad to see you doing all your figuring out. ❤
Y’all i was so shocked when he said he was 6ft7 ‘ coz he doesn’t appear that tall on camera and in pictures but Joseph have you consider modeling or did you consider it at some point in your life or been approached too
Same! Imo he does look really tall, but I didn't know he was that tall 😂 and with that good skin, he's def model material
Too tall to model I think.
thank you so much for articulating these thoughts. I felt very seen by this. As a stallion for lack of a better term lol I've been kinda forced to navigate conversations of modesty and my faith since I was very young which has made me carry a lot of shame.This gave me a lot to think about. I may have missed something but I thought you were ending the channel, so I'm glad you're still sharing!
i’m gonna keep trying lol. can’t let the negativity shut me down
Now that was a word!👏🏿🙌🏾🙏🏿 Thanks for sharing. Your words deeply reaonated with the journey I feel like I been on myself.
Thanks for your vulnerability and transparency Joe! I relate to few things you said especially being more petite and thin- just the inner voice and the way we speak to ourselves. Thanks for putting words to your human experience that resonate with us.
The section about being able to say no. WOW! You made concrete what was an abstract idea in my head.
I’ve seen Reddit threads where men were asked “How long would you be willing to date a woman without sex?” And the answers astonished me. If we’ve created the sort of culture where I’ll get cut after 3 dates or 3 months because I’d rather wait for a loving committed relationship, are we REALLY sexually liberated? I think not.
Good stuff! I like how you said "it depends on where you want to land" as far as the bible. When I read the Song of Solomon the beauty of sexuality and our bodies is affirming. And seeing that beauty and preciousness in our bodies, when they are abused either with how we think or handle or physically violate their intended purposes, the consequences are disastrous.
Great thoughts Joe, thanks for sharing!
thanks gideon
In processing what you said, sometimes you can live in understanding with your body when it communicates it does not wanna do something, but once you choose to have "mind over your body" or push your body into an uncomfortable place, I can see that it can sometimes have benefits. I see exercising as main example of this or eating nourishing foods for your body. Your body might not enjoy that initially but in time, it can be trained to crave movements and foods that will overall lead the body to a healthier space. I enjoyed hearing your process and that sounds so hard living under this, my soul felt tired hearing you express how you interpreted paul's ethic of flesh. I understand how this mindset or interpretation can lead to having shame or harshness when relating to the body.
I view the flesh as the carnal part of us and because of the curse, the body has been subjected to sin. So we have a carnal nature and a body and soul that opposes what God wills. And those desires that dishonor God - those desires are also expressed in the body. I believe that is the part that Paul called us to beat into submission. Understanding your body is for God and God loves it ultimately and knows what's best for it or what environment, it was designed to thrive. That's my engagement with this video.
I hope you keep making this content, i have followed you from the beginning and I admire your vulnerability of sharing your journey. Your expressions have inspired me.
Really appreciated this conversation, much needed reminder-thank you for sharing! And here’s to being more gentle with/to ourselves🙏🏽
Ahhh! Eeee! There’s so much I want to say! 🤗🤗 I won’t, but mannn this topic is right up my alley..! I’ve come to a very similar resolve w/ how I deal with my body, it’s desires, and even the health I want to achieve. There are gains I want to see, but I know there’s a lot of mental health and care I must, MUST, do first. So giving a lot of grace to the me I am now (takes daily practice), until my mind is healthy enough to be the me I ultimately want to be. Speaking of congruence, I feel like true wholeness is when the spirit, soul, and body can agree. Where there is no strong tension between the three entities. That’s why as believers we can have so much unrest because tho we’ve grown spiritually, we have such deep soul wounds that eventually chafe against the spirit or body. Or vice versa, have done so much healing at the soul level, yet the spirit is impoverished. Man. Love this convo. And I said I wasn’t gonna say anything. 🙄😅🥹
i think the practice of asana (commonly referred to as yoga) is very much a mind-body connection. its why its called a "flow". not sure what ur relationship is with yoga these days ... but be mindful of your breath as ur guide. its like about the positions and more about the breath facilitating your transitions...
Wow this is just so heart warming and humbling. It's timing too; it highlights deeply rooted, common human experiences, for myself as a Woman too. It hasn't been easy for me but each day, I am learning to engage my mind in healthier ways, to be intentional about making healthier choices, to shed the lock-down weight. It has been fun but not easy... Also, this highlights key points of discussion from a male perspective, especially in spaces that tend to be Oestrogen heavy - (body image, self-love and well-being) I hope after this, Men might be encouraged to use their voices and find themselves on a healthier trajectory. Eye-opening, quality talks. I think it's beautiful how and what you've shared. We hope to journey with you more. Maybe you could bring us along to an open session one afternoon? Tc Joe and thank you!
Joe, you deconstructing. Undoing malconceptions that were driven by personal understanding and interpretation of the christian codex of livity. Good on you. We are co-travellers on this odyssey.
You'd say you conflate flesh and the body in this analysis? The conclusions you arrive at are enshrined in a good understanding of the christian codex, nuh suh? That is, love thy neighbor "AS YOU LOVE YOURSELF" in a word. (That gentleness thing and the relation to sexuality and the freedom of not being a slave to anything are things I've tousled with too reaching conclusions similar to the ones you've settled on.)
I see you applying good understanding of christian directions for livity. You embrace the wisdom there and, in addition, it serves as a great base from which you judge your new and ongoing experiences (inc. actions and decisions) as smart.
I believe that the christian codex of livity is quite complete and robust and genuinely great, generally great. As you build your identity and codex as independent of that you will hold christian truths as your own as they ARE truths and truth is your standard. Twill be interesting how much overlap remains as you continue to experience and to craft your own way. Even if tis subsumed in the constitution of "the way" twill still be yours and you'll be better for it. Matured. 🙂
i generally conflate flesh and body in this. but of course, those who are somewhat familiar with the different ways that flesh and body are translated in the NT don't always mean the exact same thing. but the overarching theme throughout the bible is generally the same- "flesh/body = profane and to be cast down. spirit/soul = sacred and to be lifted up.
@@flightsfeelings I'd still pick a nit here... my reading of flesh is 'carnal nature' as opposed to the physical body, that that is what is deigned. But this is based on spotty memory. I haven't checked and I haven't really read the Bible in years. And I'm unfamiliar with the differences in the origin text. I was truly wondering. Good you could engage.
Joe you’re awesome!❤️
thank you cristian!
Dude I used to watch your stuff when you were Christian and was so inspired by it but then unfollowed when I left the faith lol. So happy to be following you again now
Beautifully spoken
I am also in a similar journey to yours and you have helped me to better articulate what I feel presently as I unlearn some ideas from my previously held beliefs within the Christian context. You and Paul Maxwell have been most helpful in my journey. I am also curious to hear your take on shame because I think when it comes to leaving the faith there is always a backlash and the response from members of the faith is that you are going to lose what you gained from being a believer.
You’re a wise man Joseph
I love what you’re saying here! I found your content back in the Christian days, but I’m still rocking with what you’ve been putting out since. I’ve always viewed your insight as a source of wisdom, and I’m glad to be able to watch the journey.
With that being said, I have a question. You described your approach in communicating with your body as a departure from the biblical view. In your opinion, could it also be possible for a faithful Christian doing honest exegesis to read the Bible and leave with this approach, or would a Christian have to abandon, ignore, and/or deliberately misinterpret the intended message of Biblical authors?
I’m genuinely curious to see what you think. I don’t mean this message as an attack or a “call-out.” Your content has always helped me to think deeply about stuff like this. Much love, man!
i don’t feel attacked at all. thanks jonathan.
i personally believe you can’t avoid this type of conclusion in the bible. it’s littered everywhere through different authors, not just Paul. so yeah you’d have to do some interesting exegetical gymnastics to avoid it lol. i do believe you can find passages that have “counter-themes”. like i mentioned, even paul seems to have a dualistic approach to the body. (he calls it a temple while also calling it “this body of death”. sheesh. )but in my own, possibly biased observation, this theme of having enmity with nature seems to be the broadest in the new testament, including Peter who says the flesh “wages war against your soul”.
in general, the bible often has a very profane opinion of this current state of nature, especially the natural man. and this is due to the origin of sin. in genesis, all of nature is cursed. man is cursed. the ground is cursed. woman and even her mode of bringing life into this world is cursed. satan becomes the god of this world. and since then, there is a constant anticipation of the “new earth” and “new bodies” after the second coming of jesus.
so you see, from the beginning, the righteous person is to be at odds with the world, and everything in it, especially his body.
ah, and how did i miss this in the video or even my comment, the most glaring example which is at the center of message of the gospel: the violence to the body of Christ on the cross. the weight of the sins of the bodies of humans is so heavy that the only holy body to exist must now suffer violence in the most extreme form of a gory crucifix in order to make things right. here, the metaphorical is now literal: violence to the natural body is the only path to righteousness and harmony.
@@flightsfeelings I hear you, that makes a lot of sense! Thank you for being gracious in your response to me. I know you must get a lot of crazy comments from people still in the faith. Alls to say, I’m grateful for the insight and conversation.
absolutely man. honestly, when the comments are generous and curious and not judgy or whatever, i enjoy engaging in the conversation. i think about these things a lot so it’s cool to talk to other people about it, even if they don’t have the same conclusions as me.
This was healing.❤
If it makes you feel any better, I’ve been practicing yoga for nearly 10yrs and there’s still positions that feel awkward or impossible. And definitely understand not wanting to exist in the space of sexuality in a casual frame of mind
wow. this is so good. thanks for sharing.
Firstly, I wish I had the boldness to just share my heart the way you just did. I think you are right, many Christians have a negative relationship with their bodies, because some of the scriptures that you mentioned. But I think that comes from an error in our understanding what Paul means when he talks about the "flesh". While the word can refer to a person's body, it's hard to believe that Paul would be advocating for the unhealthy relationship that you are describing in the video. This is because its clear within the scriptures that the body is a gift from God. It's not this thing we have been burdened with. That being said, I feel that many Christians live with that negative view of their bodies. With regards to Paul using a metaphor of physical exercise to make a point about Spiritual discipline, I don't think he is saying that athlete should have a negative relationship with their body in order to achieve their goal. I think he is making about point of saying that, like the athlete, we have have to deny certain desires we may have in order to achieve our goal. But that doesn't make the body the enemy.
Maybe one day I'll the boldness to make videos like you do. Putting ourself out there for people like me to leave comments about how they disagree 😅. Bless you! (and no, that was not me being condescending).
I just downloaded Find Me on UA-cam Music, going to give it a listen soon.
thanks for watching Shivan! kinda addressed this in another comment, so i'll just copy it here and also customize it a bit:
i understand paul is referring to fleshy desires in some cases rather than the actual physical body. however, 1. when referring to the body as a "temple", he indeed means the physical body. 2. where do fleshly desires come but from the physical body? they are an expression of the physical body. where else do sexual urges and lust come from but from the hormones of the physical body? what i am proposing in this video is just not a healthy relationship with my physical body, but also a healthy relationship with the desires that arise from this body, not a violent one.
with that being established, in general, the bible often has a very profane opinion of this current state of nature, especially the natural man. and this is due to the origin of sin. in genesis, all of nature is cursed. man is cursed. the ground is cursed. woman and even her mode of bringing life into this world is cursed. satan becomes the god of this world. so you see, from the beginning, the righteous person is to be at odds with the current world, and everything in it, especially his body. and since then, there is a constant anticipation of the “new earth” and “new bodies” after the second coming of jesus.
i do believe you can find passages that have “counter-themes”. like i mentioned, even paul seems to have a dualistic approach to the body. (he calls it a temple while also calling it “this body of death”. sheesh.)but in my own, possibly biased observation, this theme of having enmity with nature seems to be the broadest in the new testament, including Peter who says the flesh “wages war against your soul”. does this not suggest the body and soul are enemies?
this is why i start the video by saying "the power of language". you can say that you find it hard to believe the body is the enemy as a christian, but language matters. and if the consistent language is one of enmity, distance, war, and death, how else should the christian be encourage to relate to the body and the desires that flow from it?
the most glaring example which is at the center of message of the gospel: the violence to the body of Christ on the cross. the weight of the sins of the bodies of humans is so heavy that the only holy body to exist must now suffer violence in the most extreme form of a gory crucifix in order to make things right. here, the metaphorical is now literal: violence to the natural body is the only path to righteousness and harmony.
@@flightsfeelings You raised some good points.
I think the temple imagery is so important in this conversation. Depending on what god is worshipped in any given temple, that will determine the ethic or practice of that temple (what is allowed or forbidden in that temple). I think the same is true with our bodies.
On your second point about where these desires come from. It seems to me that the scriptures consistently point to outside forces trying to influence and overcome us. To hijack and take us captive, using our bodies/temples for their purposes. This is seen in Genesis 4 when God speaks to Cain. He tells him that somethings is crouching at the door and its desire to consume Cain. But then God says that Cain should rule over it. The story is Adam and Even is similar in that there is an outside force trying to influence their activity. Unfortunately, we buy into these influences attaching ourselves to their ideas even to the point where we attach our identity to it. I think that's when we start struggling in relation to what are our desires versus the desires that are "crouching at the door".
When it comes to language, I think you are right, it does matter. While there is war within the body, against the "flesh" (those forces that desire to consume us), it doesn't mean that we are at war with the body. I think at the point, a discussion about worldviews are important because I don't believe that the NT writers held a naturalistic worldview; I don't think they believed that hormones were the root cause of our desire to break the law of God.
As to Paul talking our current temple the body of death. It makes sense for him to do that, because our bodies are in a state of decay and will ultimately die. This tarnishing/decaying is a result of us yielding to those forces. Turning the temple of Life into a temple of death.
I wish we could talk about Christ, His body (His physical one), and His death on the cross. Christ allowing that to happen to Him was the way He won the fight against those forces (Colossians 2:6-16).
Unlike Cain who gave in to that influence, Christ ruled over it; defeating it.
The horror of the crucifixion is a clear image of what it looks like when we allow those forces to rule over us instead of us ruling over it.
This conversation could do on forever, because I'm really enjoying this.
Thank you for taking the time to respond to my initial comment. I really appreciate it.
It's so fascinating when someone's biggest insecurities is another person's greatest desires
Whether they want to have that body or... have that body 😄
“ain’t that the nature of the beast? to always want what it can’t have.” -my childhood barber probably quoting someone else
@@flightsfeelings agreed... if only we could see ourselves how others see us
Or simply just believe what they say they see...hmm ( Had an aha moment for myself)
Are you still going to upload the video with your former pastor?
i think so
is this your new place? I like the light. the other place seemed kind of closed in and dark. I realize living in a place without natural light affects my mental. If this is your new place I love it. I would love to live in that space.
Thanks !❤
Great video
Thank you✨
It's hard to understand because of the english langage I believe, but the flesh is not the body, it's not the same word in the original langage. The flesh inhabit the body who is a structure.
yes. i’m very aware of this. not a novel or hard concept. already addressed that in my reply to someone else.
God is still using you.
sure
Adding this here since it appears comments are turned off on your video on absolute morality.
Without God you have exactly a 0% chance of having absolute morality or real morality. In fact, God is really the only way that real absolute moral values can exist. If you believe that murder, is really absolutely wrong, your only hope for grounding that belief is God.
Now for the critique that Christians don’t really have absolute morality. Or they do in theory but not in practice. Your critique is with regards to accessibility to the moral standard. Yet, the vast majority of moral standards are presented clear as day within the Christian worldview. There’s no real debate as to whether murder is immoral or whether adultery is immoral per Christianity.
Now let’s grant that there may be certain moral situations for which we don’t have a clear prescriptive text in the Bible. We have the leading of the Spirit as you mentioned, but we have something else on top of that: grace. That’s why the Christian view of morality is so robust. We have clear prescriptive texts on the vast majority of moral issues. Where we don’t have clear prescriptive texts we have the leading of the Holy Spirit. And on top of that we have the grace of our Father who loves us dearly. Grace compensates for our ignorance or limit in knowledge. Christians do have absolute morality and especially for the gray areas we have the embrace of our Savior.
“without god you have exactly 0% chance of having absolute morality.”
yes. i know. did you even watch the video?
even your other rebuttals. it’s like… i’m not gonna respond to this if you’re not actually engaging with what i already said. feel like i’m just gonna be repeating details what was already addressed the video
@@flightsfeelings I was engaging with the 3rd point you made in the video. It's a little difficult to engage with every single argument you made in a 35min video. I hope there's some grace for that.
There were four main points it appeared you made.
1. Morality does not necessitate God.
2. The moral argument is not exclusive to Christianity.
3. The way you arbitrate between religions and absolute moral systems is through personal judging, essentially creating a relative moral world.
4. There are disagreements on morality which functionally make the Christian behave like a relativist. He in essence would be no different than the moral absolutist.
1. The moral argument in certain formulations does not necessitate the existence of God. However, the argument is meant to keep a person consistent in their beliefs. That is, if you believe real objective morals exist, the only way you can have that is God. Atheists can argue that neither morality or God exist and that would evade the moral argument. The atheist is being consistent with a high price tag which is the intent of the argument.
2. The moral argument is not exclusive to Christianity. Agreed. It was not meant to be. It definitely could not be used in conjunction with certain religions due to their definition of God but it is not exclusive to Christianity.
3. The way you judge between moral systems or really any truth in that matter is with coherence, correspondence, and pragmatic truth tests. That doesn't make us the ultimate judge. It makes us observers of reality. If the Christian moral system is true, then the claims it makes ought to be true. Christianity makes claims that are falsifiable historically.
4. You made it sound in your video like Christians could functionally not really live as absolutists but only as relativists because everything was open to interpretation and debate. Yet the vast majority of moral issues are clearly prescribed. These can be known absolutely. Sure there are moral gray areas but like you brought up, the Christian would say we have the leading of the Spirit in those areas. That doesn't make us relativists. And even if some misinterpret the leading of the Spirit it doesn't do away with an absolute morality (which I think you would agree with), it just means we are fallible. Grace covers our fallibility.
6ft 7😯
Bruh I thought you were like 6’ - 6’2
😎
In 1 Corinthians 12:13 Paul does say that everything is permissible for him but not everything is beneficial. So one may go and fornicate because they have the free will to do so but it doesn’t mean it’s beneficial for them.
absolutely. still agree with that.