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I've played both of these games inside out and upside down and I actually have to admit I do enjoy the more macro-management gameplay of the first game. Managing a ton of planets in MoO2 became kind of a chore after a while. Plus I just find the artstyle and very. . . charming, in that old-school Star Trek/Flash Gordon kinda way. But don't get me wrong, MoO2 is an excellent game, there are things they definitely improved upon. The art design presents a very dark, troubled galaxy, which is also very intriguing considering the state its in, being invaded by the Antares and all. The music just accompanied it so well, giving you a sense of that space-exploration wonder, while at the same time having a foreboding sense of dread. The heroes were a welcome addition for sure, as was the custom species generator. What I've started to not like about was the techology tree, how things weren't open to you if you weren't a Creative species (which led me to playing Creative all the time because that's just how I enjoyed playing it), whereas in MoO2, you discovered certain types of tech at different rates depending on your species, which made sense to me. If we could get a good amalgamation of the two, I'd totally be down for it. Too bad New MoO put those damn star lanes into their game. . .
I agree, MOO1 felt lived in. There was something about playing it back in the day that really drew me in and made me want to win. MOO2 may be technically better, but it's hard to beat that nostalgia, and simplicity. Great video!
I played the hell out of MOO 2 back in the day. I haven't played it since the 90s, but after seeing this review, I knew I had to get it again. Thankfully GOG had it for a few dollars.
I actually preferred the Moo1 slider system vs the Moo2 version. Gave you more of an Empire building feeling. Way less micro management, for me it worked perfectly.
@@georgsgrants9925 YMMV, the smaller scale of MOO2's system building was putting me off. For me, having dozens of systems and abstracting what happens feels more Empire-y than having a couple of very detailed ones.
@@georgsgrants9925 exactly. That's Abstraction for you - minute Details, like individual buildings, get abstracted, because that's below your paygrade as galaxy ruler. Also, individual pilots and governors don't matter on a galactic scale. Moo2 took the franchise in the wrong direction, like Ascendancy. Consider this: in civilization, it's OK to be concerned with individual cities, because it's just old earth. Would you want that Level of Detail on a galactic scale?
MOO2 was one of my favorite games when I was 13/14. Over time though, I came to enjoy 1 more because the level of Micromanaging in 2 was ridiculous in the late game. I still haven't tried 3 or the remake, despite owning both.
For MoO2 late game, my stunt was to queue as many buildings on a new colony, then each turn I would go through my list of colonies, sort them by increasing cost to finish a project, and click each one to finish them. When a world showed up as having nothing in its queue, I would fill it up again. Some micromanagement, but throwing cash at the problem let me rapidly industrialize my colonies, then set the colonies to grow population as fast as possible, then set them to produce Trade Goods. Toxic worlds were more annoying, as I would have to repeat-build Robo-workers on them and deport the organic people to another colony.
Not many games can claim to have created a genre, and got it right on the first go. MoO, Elite, and Rogue are the only examples I can immediately think of.
Dont forget, Freelancer spawning the arcade space combat trading genre. It took privateer and perfected it. KOTOR deserves mention too for basically spawning the space RPG genre. We wouldn't have Mass Effect or even Starfield without KOTOR.
@@Capt_CrimsoN KOTOr did indeed create the genre skyrim and greedfall were both spawned from, though it still didnt have the action combat. Its the missing link between Neverwinter Nights and Mass Effect so to speak.
Master of Orion 1 > Master of Orion 2 Both are great, though. IMO, while 1 may have less bells and whistles, it's a more pure strategy experience. I still play it today.
MoO1 is a grand strategy game, perhaps the first one. MoO2 is the best 4x game of all time. They dont supplant each other, and yet recognisably belong in a series. It is ki d of amazing they managed that.
I'd like to add a few things that you missed or didn't have the time to add to the MOO 2 section that I think that those who have not played the game yet would find it interesting. - You can win diplomatically via diplomacy as well. Every few years, a election is held for the possible Emperor of the Galaxy and all the independent races participate. The two biggest empires who cast the most votes out of the lot are elegiable for the title. Each race votes for whom they like more. The number of votes you have at your disposal depends on your population count, so if you are in the lategame, hold a lot of planets and have practically won and don't want to commit interstellar genocide you can end your session peacefully that way. Or if you are really good at diplomacy. - There are a ton of really awesome racial characteristics. Telepathic races don't need to bother with building troop transports and conducting ground invasions of enemy planets, since their bigger ships have a super powerful telepath aboard who can mind control the whole population, turning them into your obedient slaves instantly without any destruction or loss of life at the cost of their free will. Lithovores eat rocks, thus you don't need to grow food to feed that race. Cybernetic races eat half the normal food and a bit of production and jury rig their ships during battle. Tolerant species do not give a damn about pollution and can inhabit all planet types without any population penalties. Subterranean races have twice the population limit for all planets, so almost every planet is useful to them... And you can also play as a hive mind or feudal state. - The space combat is delicious. Beams, missiles, torpedoes, anti personnel weapons, shields, cloaking, teleporters, special targeting computers that go for the weak spot, missile jamming, fighter and bomber escadrilles... If your race is good at close quarters combat or has superior armor and guns, you can board enemy ships if their drives are dead and they can't move, you have a transporter and can thus beam down onto the enemy ship, or -- best of all -- making a dramatic entry in specialized assault shuttles, 40k style! After the battle you keep the captured ships. If that ship has some nice stuff you don't have researched, you can take it to one of your systems with a port and then scrap it, which gives you a chance of your scientists succeeding in reverse engineering that tech, instantly discovering it for yourself. This also works on Antaran ships, so if you are lucky enough to capture one of them (by throwing enough men into the meat grinder and praying a lot to RNGesus), there is a good chance that you will get some of the absolute best technology in the game that will allow you to utterly dominate the other races.
Slightly more than your average 4x game, I'd say, and there is nothing wrong with that! There is a malus you can pick during race creation with which the Klackons start called "Uncreative". It makes your race not very good at coming up with new ideas or thinking differently from each other. What this means is that in the research tree, at the start the game picks 1 technology out of the 2-3 in every tier and forces you to research it. Say, instead of allowing you to pick between Alien Control Centeres and Xeno Psychology, the game will only allow you to research Xeno Psychology, and instead of letting you choose between an Anti matter Drive, bomb or torpedo, it will force you to research the drive. This does limit you somewhat and forces you to make due with what you have, however, there are ways to acquire technology other than researching it yourself. You can trade for it, demand it as tribute, use spies to steal it, discover it on planets which contain dead ancient civilizations, capture it after a ground invasion of an alien planet, and as I mentioned before scrapping if its ship technology you are dealing with. There are some really, really nasty random events that can happen. One in particular is built to please our gaming lord and savior, that being the elusive Hyperspace monster which appears sometimes and randomly munches a few ships that are traveling between systems every turn until it is full and goes away. It may eat one of your early colony ships for which you were putting a lot of industry into building, it may eat an enemy titan class ship that is coming to whoop your ass, some worthless scout -- or nothing at all. The most wise thing to do when that happens is to just keep everything valuable docked and wait and watch as the voracious space beast does its work. The Antarans are also a bit of a pain in the ass sometimes. Both Antarans and random events can be turned off at the start of the game if you like, but I think it makes the game less spicy overall.
i remember that :) i don't think anyone wanted to win that way though because your game would end so early lolol. and combat was the best part. customizing ships. stacking ships with Mauler Device :)
Aaron Bowley Aw yeeeeah, that reminds me, I forgot to mention miniaturization in my first post. Another really awesome part of this jewel. It goes a bit beyond the meaning of the word itself. In the game, after you research a tech and then advance in its respective field several times more, that weapon/component takes up less space on your spaceships and is far cheaper to build as the word suggests. However, weaponry has the additional benefit of gaining some cool special modifications you can install if you decide to put them on your ship. For example, your beams could become armor or shield piercing, fire a continuous beam or not be affected by distance, your missiles could gain anti-jamming measures or become MIRVs, etc. It adds another layer of choice to the ship design. And it does not create the Space Empires 4 effect unacomn was talking about in the video. The basic laser is not the best weapon in the game because as you go on you can shove a crapload of them on your ships. Mods or no mods, after some time their damage becomes too insignificant to keep up with the constantly improving shields and armor, not to mention that a lot of the later weapons have powerful, unique properties built in them from the start. Its a fucking shame Steve Barcia doesn't make strategy games anymore.
These are two of my favorite games of all time. I'm always hard pressed to decide which i like best. The tactical combat, the leaders and system-planet colonization, i definitely find better in MOO2. However, the tech (much more tech, randomized each time you start), the scale of the galaxy and the planetary populations, the espionage (actually being able to chose which planet to target, what to do on it AND frame someone else for it) are better in MOO1. Which one is better? Hard to tell really...... i guess it depends on what your main focus of a 4X experience is. To me, it's MOO1. If nothing else, then because i've never had 2 MOO1 games that were exactly alike, even when playing with a same race. On the other hand, in MOO2 things became quite repetitive after a while (especially with a creative trait). Not that it stopped me from playing it countless times for decades mind you. But this is where MOO2 falls apart IMO. It works well in early and mid game. But late game....there just isn't enough content. If you like huge maps, with many races, that play out differently every time, MOO2 is not for you. EDIT: another thing about tech...... i missed how in MOO2 you couldn't invest research in all tech at the same time and your investment wasn't influenced by the race you were playing.
DUDE! do you know whats crazy? the last couple days i've been looking up reviews for these games and retrospectives... and then you post this now? dude you're in touch with the universe i swear.
Great point about the news network! It was awesome to be hearing about the success and failures of the different species in the galaxy (especially the ones getting destroyed). it added a cool suspense especially early in the game before you had even really made contact with all the races!
Defeating the Guardian doesn't win the game in MoO1. It gives you some randomly selected super-advanced tech and then you can colonize the best planet in the galaxy exactly like MoO2.
If you are the first to be able to defeat the guardian, you can defeat all others, no doubt. So you might as well just slaughter the opponents to your domination.
Master of Orion 2, love that game, really love the groundcombat as well, it feels like star wars the few time you actually get a huge land battle. Also love Reunion by Digital Reality, so good mood. My favorite is Imperium Galactica 2 though.
MoO2 had no definitive tech end. You could continue researching a field and reduce the size of the associated ship items. Wich meant you could stack more guns on your ships.
@Gormen Freeman it's not in the ship building menu. It's supposed to be in the tech tree. My memory isn't what it used to be, and i haven't played either game in a few years, but i think it was in MOO 1m that after researching enough future techs, the tree for that tech would say maxed. Ergo, you could not miniaturize any further. A lot of weapons could be downsized to take really small amount of space, even just 1 point, but not all.
@@ilejovcevski79 Wow. You must have played games on large or hugh maps to be that far along and still not have won the game. I play only small maps. It seems like the games would just get longer and more tedious but not more fun or even challenging game playwise.
For me, the first one is my biggest love of the two, though both are amazing games. It took a while to get used to the bars and the way production and pollution works, but then MOO1 just clicked with me. MOO2 just feels a bit too much, dealing with colonies and improvements when I just want to concentrate on running the empire.
i would to build a game similar to this one, That can capture a sinilar sense of "holy crap what is all this and how do i use it" but thats better than the remake. some day. Someday soon.
I wanted to like it but I don't like it. Too much time before anything happens. Too much time to build ships. I do like being able to design ships on it. Too little control of ships during battle and since it takes a long time to build ships the battles are tiny. All that effort, time and turns to get ahead with technology but it's is so sparingly applied.
finding this video very late, much like I found the games very late. I've played a ton of 4x games from past 2000s, along with other strategy games including RTS and even a lot of paradox interactive games. Master of orion 1 and 2 are both master pieces of their genre, and so incredibly defining, that they ruined a lot of newer 4x games for me, I just end up going back to them now. The moo2 mods are also great. I play moo2 almost exclusively modded and moo1 is still great, along with the faithful remake for modern systems.
I eventually learned my lesson, I don't even buy 4x space games anymore. After getting a few on steam and realizing they still are lacking compared to moo2, I just play moo2 every now and then or when a new 4x space game comes out and lloks interesting. I know it will be inferior to moo2, so why waste my time.
@@Capt_CrimsoN I thought I have played it but am away from my computer right now. Looking at the screen shots I am doubting if I have though. Not liking that it has $300+ in stuff to buy on steam. But looks like I can buy the base game and get the pass for a month to try it with all content. Can I design my race? Can I design the load out for my ships? Do I get to control my ships directly in combat? A huge number of games not giving me those three options, especially the last one, is part of what keeps me coming back to MoO2.
@@donalddavis7423 Yeah, that's typical for Paradox unfortunately and some of the DLC is a must have, while others just arent. One difference between Stellaris and MOO2 is that Moo2 is effectively 4x whereas Stellaris is grand strategy. You can absolutely design your own ships, and tell them where to go. Space battles are a mix of rock paper scissors. You can have ships that function like artillery or close combat. Ground battles exist as well and there is some depth there in what kind of soldiers you choose to have. Whether it's standard troops, cyborgs, psionic soldiers, clone army, etc. Stellaris takes after a TON of popular sci-fi media. But being a grand strategy game means that everything happens on a grand scale. Oh and you can definitely design your own race. Actually the race creation part is probably one of the biggest strong suits in the game. There are also several end game threats, just like in MOO2.
I actually don't like Master of Orion 2. I find it very flawed and annoying. Master of Orion 1, while flawed as well, looks better, plays better, and feels larger on scope. Feels more alive. Something MOO2 never did. I also hate how most races looks like in MOO2. That being said, I wouldn't mind playing Multiplayer sometime, since I own both.
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The 1.50 fan patch for Master of Orion II has been in development since 2016 and the most recent version can be found at moo2mod.com.
MOO2 lives!
Thanks for that heads up. It has now been released in 2021.
I've played both of these games inside out and upside down and I actually have to admit I do enjoy the more macro-management gameplay of the first game. Managing a ton of planets in MoO2 became kind of a chore after a while. Plus I just find the artstyle and very. . . charming, in that old-school Star Trek/Flash Gordon kinda way.
But don't get me wrong, MoO2 is an excellent game, there are things they definitely improved upon. The art design presents a very dark, troubled galaxy, which is also very intriguing considering the state its in, being invaded by the Antares and all. The music just accompanied it so well, giving you a sense of that space-exploration wonder, while at the same time having a foreboding sense of dread. The heroes were a welcome addition for sure, as was the custom species generator.
What I've started to not like about was the techology tree, how things weren't open to you if you weren't a Creative species (which led me to playing Creative all the time because that's just how I enjoyed playing it), whereas in MoO2, you discovered certain types of tech at different rates depending on your species, which made sense to me.
If we could get a good amalgamation of the two, I'd totally be down for it. Too bad New MoO put those damn star lanes into their game. . .
LIKEWISE!
My dad mater of Orion II for 20 years and mastered every mechanic and was god like in the game
omg that intro of v1/MOO1 brought back old memories!
Master of Orion 1 was so much better than 2 or 3, simplicity of it was beautiful
I agree, MOO1 felt lived in. There was something about playing it back in the day that really drew me in and made me want to win. MOO2 may be technically better, but it's hard to beat that nostalgia, and simplicity. Great video!
One of my favourite games masters of Orion 2. I have 3 but it’s different then 2.
I played the hell out of MOO 2 back in the day. I haven't played it since the 90s, but after seeing this review, I knew I had to get it again. Thankfully GOG had it for a few dollars.
I actually preferred the Moo1 slider system vs the Moo2 version. Gave you more of an Empire building feeling. Way less micro management, for me it worked perfectly.
Moo1 was larger scale but had less depth. It was more like a paradox game than civ.
But at the same time it doesn’t really FEEL like an actual galactic empire. MoO2 is better in that regard.
@@georgsgrants9925 YMMV, the smaller scale of MOO2's system building was putting me off.
For me, having dozens of systems and abstracting what happens feels more Empire-y than having a couple of very detailed ones.
@@MrZauberelefant Smaller scale? MoO1 didn't have any system building, just the 5 sliders. And just 1 planet per system.
@@georgsgrants9925 exactly. That's Abstraction for you - minute Details, like individual buildings, get abstracted, because that's below your paygrade as galaxy ruler.
Also, individual pilots and governors don't matter on a galactic scale. Moo2 took the franchise in the wrong direction, like Ascendancy.
Consider this: in civilization, it's OK to be concerned with individual cities, because it's just old earth. Would you want that Level of Detail on a galactic scale?
Still playable today and still better than many modern space 4X's, that tells you how a game is a classic.
I'm still playing MOO2!
I alternate between MOO1 and MOO2. If you play you must use 100m and the patched 1.5 url above. All other star games and most 4x games are cr@p.
MOO2 was one of my favorite games when I was 13/14. Over time though, I came to enjoy 1 more because the level of Micromanaging in 2 was ridiculous in the late game. I still haven't tried 3 or the remake, despite owning both.
For MoO2 late game, my stunt was to queue as many buildings on a new colony, then each turn I would go through my list of colonies, sort them by increasing cost to finish a project, and click each one to finish them. When a world showed up as having nothing in its queue, I would fill it up again. Some micromanagement, but throwing cash at the problem let me rapidly industrialize my colonies, then set the colonies to grow population as fast as possible, then set them to produce Trade Goods. Toxic worlds were more annoying, as I would have to repeat-build Robo-workers on them and deport the organic people to another colony.
Not many games can claim to have created a genre, and got it right on the first go. MoO, Elite, and Rogue are the only examples I can immediately think of.
Starflight. Produced by Electronic Arts, no less.
I foresee great things for EA!
Dont forget, Freelancer spawning the arcade space combat trading genre. It took privateer and perfected it. KOTOR deserves mention too for basically spawning the space RPG genre. We wouldn't have Mass Effect or even Starfield without KOTOR.
@@Capt_CrimsoN KOTOr did indeed create the genre skyrim and greedfall were both spawned from, though it still didnt have the action combat. Its the missing link between Neverwinter Nights and Mass Effect so to speak.
Master of Orion 1 > Master of Orion 2
Both are great, though. IMO, while 1 may have less bells and whistles, it's a more pure strategy experience. I still play it today.
MoO1 is a grand strategy game, perhaps the first one. MoO2 is the best 4x game of all time. They dont supplant each other, and yet recognisably belong in a series. It is ki d of amazing they managed that.
I've never found better turn based strategy games than Master of Orion 2 and Heroes of Might & Magic 3.
MOO 2 is still one of my favourite games
I'd like to add a few things that you missed or didn't have the time to add to the MOO 2 section that I think that those who have not played the game yet would find it interesting.
- You can win diplomatically via diplomacy as well. Every few years, a election is held for the possible Emperor of the Galaxy and all the independent races participate. The two biggest empires who cast the most votes out of the lot are elegiable for the title. Each race votes for whom they like more. The number of votes you have at your disposal depends on your population count, so if you are in the lategame, hold a lot of planets and have practically won and don't want to commit interstellar genocide you can end your session peacefully that way. Or if you are really good at diplomacy.
- There are a ton of really awesome racial characteristics. Telepathic races don't need to bother with building troop transports and conducting ground invasions of enemy planets, since their bigger ships have a super powerful telepath aboard who can mind control the whole population, turning them into your obedient slaves instantly without any destruction or loss of life at the cost of their free will. Lithovores eat rocks, thus you don't need to grow food to feed that race. Cybernetic races eat half the normal food and a bit of production and jury rig their ships during battle. Tolerant species do not give a damn about pollution and can inhabit all planet types without any population penalties. Subterranean races have twice the population limit for all planets, so almost every planet is useful to them...
And you can also play as a hive mind or feudal state.
- The space combat is delicious. Beams, missiles, torpedoes, anti personnel weapons, shields, cloaking, teleporters, special targeting computers that go for the weak spot, missile jamming, fighter and bomber escadrilles... If your race is good at close quarters combat or has superior armor and guns, you can board enemy ships if their drives are dead and they can't move, you have a transporter and can thus beam down onto the enemy ship, or -- best of all -- making a dramatic entry in specialized assault shuttles, 40k style!
After the battle you keep the captured ships. If that ship has some nice stuff you don't have researched, you can take it to one of your systems with a port and then scrap it, which gives you a chance of your scientists succeeding in reverse engineering that tech, instantly discovering it for yourself.
This also works on Antaran ships, so if you are lucky enough to capture one of them (by throwing enough men into the meat grinder and praying a lot to RNGesus), there is a good chance that you will get some of the absolute best technology in the game that will allow you to utterly dominate the other races.
Slightly more than your average 4x game, I'd say, and there is nothing wrong with that! There is a malus you can pick during race creation with which the Klackons start called "Uncreative". It makes your race not very good at coming up with new ideas or thinking differently from each other. What this means is that in the research tree, at the start the game picks 1 technology out of the 2-3 in every tier and forces you to research it. Say, instead of allowing you to pick between Alien Control Centeres and Xeno Psychology, the game will only allow you to research Xeno Psychology, and instead of letting you choose between an Anti matter Drive, bomb or torpedo, it will force you to research the drive.
This does limit you somewhat and forces you to make due with what you have, however, there are ways to acquire technology other than researching it yourself. You can trade for it, demand it as tribute, use spies to steal it, discover it on planets which contain dead ancient civilizations, capture it after a ground invasion of an alien planet, and as I mentioned before scrapping if its ship technology you are dealing with.
There are some really, really nasty random events that can happen. One in particular is built to please our
gaming lord and savior, that being the elusive Hyperspace monster which appears sometimes and randomly munches a few ships that are traveling between systems every turn until it is full and goes away. It may eat one of your early colony ships for which you were putting a lot of industry into building, it may eat an enemy titan class ship that is coming to whoop your ass, some worthless scout -- or nothing at all. The most wise thing to do when that happens is to just keep everything valuable docked and wait and watch as the voracious space beast does its work. The Antarans are also a bit of a pain in the ass sometimes. Both Antarans and random events can be turned off at the start of the game if you like, but I think it makes the game less spicy overall.
i remember that :) i don't think anyone wanted to win that way though because your game would end so early lolol. and combat was the best part. customizing ships. stacking ships with Mauler Device :)
Aaron Bowley Aw yeeeeah, that reminds me, I forgot to mention miniaturization in my first post. Another really awesome part of this jewel.
It goes a bit beyond the meaning of the word itself. In the game, after you research a tech and then advance in its respective field several times more, that weapon/component takes up less space on your spaceships and is far cheaper to build as the word suggests. However, weaponry has the additional benefit of gaining some cool special modifications you can install if you decide to put them on your ship. For example, your beams could become armor or shield piercing, fire a continuous beam or not be affected by distance, your missiles could gain anti-jamming measures or become MIRVs, etc.
It adds another layer of choice to the ship design. And it does not create the Space Empires 4 effect unacomn was talking about in the video. The basic laser is not the best weapon in the game because as you go on you can shove a crapload of them on your ships. Mods or no mods, after some time their damage becomes too insignificant to keep up with the constantly improving shields and armor, not to mention that a lot of the later weapons have powerful, unique properties built in them from the start.
Its a fucking shame Steve Barcia doesn't make strategy games anymore.
When I think about the complexity of these games... and then I see whats on the market now.. I get sad lol
These are two of my favorite games of all time. I'm always hard pressed to decide which i like best. The tactical combat, the leaders and system-planet colonization, i definitely find better in MOO2. However, the tech (much more tech, randomized each time you start), the scale of the galaxy and the planetary populations, the espionage (actually being able to chose which planet to target, what to do on it AND frame someone else for it) are better in MOO1. Which one is better? Hard to tell really...... i guess it depends on what your main focus of a 4X experience is. To me, it's MOO1. If nothing else, then because i've never had 2 MOO1 games that were exactly alike, even when playing with a same race. On the other hand, in MOO2 things became quite repetitive after a while (especially with a creative trait). Not that it stopped me from playing it countless times for decades mind you. But this is where MOO2 falls apart IMO. It works well in early and mid game. But late game....there just isn't enough content. If you like huge maps, with many races, that play out differently every time, MOO2 is not for you.
EDIT: another thing about tech...... i missed how in MOO2 you couldn't invest research in all tech at the same time and your investment wasn't influenced by the race you were playing.
Excellent history, thanks.
DUDE! do you know whats crazy? the last couple days i've been looking up reviews for these games and retrospectives... and then you post this now? dude you're in touch with the universe i swear.
:)
Great point about the news network! It was awesome to be hearing about the success and failures of the different species in the galaxy (especially the ones getting destroyed). it added a cool suspense especially early in the game before you had even really made contact with all the races!
Defeating the Guardian doesn't win the game in MoO1. It gives you some randomly selected super-advanced tech and then you can colonize the best planet in the galaxy exactly like MoO2.
True!
True!
If you are the first to be able to defeat the guardian, you can defeat all others, no doubt. So you might as well just slaughter the opponents to your domination.
I agree that there are too many MOO clones. I liked Ascendancy, Fragille Allegiance and Stars!. Space 4x has a place for innovation.
MOO II: odd gui which almost scared me off, but immersing as hell.
Master of Orion 2, love that game, really love the groundcombat as well, it feels like star wars the few time you actually get a huge land battle. Also love Reunion by Digital Reality, so good mood. My favorite is Imperium Galactica 2 though.
MoO2 had no definitive tech end. You could continue researching a field and reduce the size of the associated ship items. Wich meant you could stack more guns on your ships.
This was also true in MOO1, with a noticeable difference that the tech miniaturization worked on the Orion tech as well (death reays, armor and so).
@Gormen Freeman did it say maxed? If so it means no further miniaturization is possible
@Gormen Freeman it's not in the ship building menu. It's supposed to be in the tech tree. My memory isn't what it used to be, and i haven't played either game in a few years, but i think it was in MOO 1m that after researching enough future techs, the tree for that tech would say maxed. Ergo, you could not miniaturize any further. A lot of weapons could be downsized to take really small amount of space, even just 1 point, but not all.
@@ilejovcevski79 Wow. You must have played games on large or hugh maps to be that far along and still not have won the game. I play only small maps. It seems like the games would just get longer and more tedious but not more fun or even challenging game playwise.
@@mrwonderfulone what do you mean haven't won the game? Master of Orion?
For me, the first one is my biggest love of the two, though both are amazing games. It took a while to get used to the bars and the way production and pollution works, but then MOO1 just clicked with me. MOO2 just feels a bit too much, dealing with colonies and improvements when I just want to concentrate on running the empire.
A game that stood unsurpassed until stellaris, which only manages to do so by copying its formula wholesale and expanding on the picks.
i would to build a game similar to this one, That can capture a sinilar sense of "holy crap what is all this and how do i use it" but thats better than the remake. some day. Someday soon.
Great games! And now we have shitty games that require almost quantum computer to run.
Can you do the Hidden and dangerous games?
Two classics. I still consider GalCiv 2 to be the greatest 4X space game ever made
I wanted to like it but I don't like it. Too much time before anything happens. Too much time to build ships. I do like being able to design ships on it. Too little control of ships during battle and since it takes a long time to build ships the battles are tiny. All that effort, time and turns to get ahead with technology but it's is so sparingly applied.
Dude!!!
finding this video very late, much like I found the games very late.
I've played a ton of 4x games from past 2000s, along with other strategy games including RTS and even a lot of paradox interactive games.
Master of orion 1 and 2 are both master pieces of their genre, and so incredibly defining, that they ruined a lot of newer 4x games for me, I just end up going back to them now.
The moo2 mods are also great. I play moo2 almost exclusively modded and moo1 is still great, along with the faithful remake for modern systems.
MoO2 is amazing. Original MoO is great. MoO3 had good points, but fell flat in the delivery. New MoO is good, but the starlanes are bullshit
ya tried the new one, i was just ehh no fun
Pretty sure gas giants couldn't be built into a habitable planet.
They could in MoO 2 with one of the later game construction techs.
Nothing beats Stellaris now.
I'd still rather play MoO2 or DWU than Stellaris. *shrug*
@@imasspeons your loss bro
MoO2 was the only 4X that worked for me. All the clones and remakes don't do it right. Usuallly the space combat isn't as fun.
5:50 huh?
:P I love the subliminal messages in your videos.
I eventually learned my lesson, I don't even buy 4x space games anymore. After getting a few on steam and realizing they still are lacking compared to moo2, I just play moo2 every now and then or when a new 4x space game comes out and lloks interesting. I know it will be inferior to moo2, so why waste my time.
What about Stellaris?
@@Capt_CrimsoN I thought I have played it but am away from my computer right now. Looking at the screen shots I am doubting if I have though.
Not liking that it has $300+ in stuff to buy on steam. But looks like I can buy the base game and get the pass for a month to try it with all content.
Can I design my race? Can I design the load out for my ships? Do I get to control my ships directly in combat? A huge number of games not giving me those three options, especially the last one, is part of what keeps me coming back to MoO2.
@@donalddavis7423 Yeah, that's typical for Paradox unfortunately and some of the DLC is a must have, while others just arent. One difference between Stellaris and MOO2 is that Moo2 is effectively 4x whereas Stellaris is grand strategy. You can absolutely design your own ships, and tell them where to go. Space battles are a mix of rock paper scissors. You can have ships that function like artillery or close combat. Ground battles exist as well and there is some depth there in what kind of soldiers you choose to have. Whether it's standard troops, cyborgs, psionic soldiers, clone army, etc. Stellaris takes after a TON of popular sci-fi media. But being a grand strategy game means that everything happens on a grand scale. Oh and you can definitely design your own race. Actually the race creation part is probably one of the biggest strong suits in the game. There are also several end game threats, just like in MOO2.
@@Capt_CrimsoN I'll give it a closer look. If nothing else it might be a wishlist add.
I actually don't like Master of Orion 2. I find it very flawed and annoying.
Master of Orion 1, while flawed as well, looks better, plays better, and feels larger on scope.
Feels more alive. Something MOO2 never did.
I also hate how most races looks like in MOO2.
That being said, I wouldn't mind playing Multiplayer sometime, since I own both.
Orion 1 is great. I dont like Orion 2