In my opinion, Nightwing is the best example of a character growing up done right (if only they would do the same for Tim). Mixing Dad Peter (with Mayday) with Miles provides the perfect opportunity to pass the torch but still maintain the old nostalgia.
They're never going to have Peter pass the torch to Miles. Peter Parker did grow up from a teenager to a twentysomething, and he's been a twentysomething since the 1970s, and I guess that's where Marvel likes him.
Miles should stay in his own world. You can't mix the two without a disastrous fight within the fandom. People already feel like Marvel wants to replace Spidey with miles so you'd just prove their fears are true. Don't replace cornerstone characters, it never ends well for the new one. I can see something like Nightwing kinds working but let's remember that he's only been aged up to like mid 20's so not really that old. Any older and the whole pseudo sidekick thing gets really awkward. That's the other thing though: he's a side character. You can take risks with side characters and some work, others don't. You can't take the same risk with main characters. The Spiderman formula has worked for generations, why change it?
@@44excaliburand that's where they will destroy him (in the comics, everyone else has more curiosity and open mindedness to do something new or old at varying degrees)
@@pierreblanchon4722 Peter has been around since the 1960s. Four straight generations have grown up on Peter Parker. Guys like you need to let it go. Peter's not going anywhere.
Yes. Peter should grow up. Miles should be allowed to handle the teenage/college years adventures while Pete handles the rigors of balancing adulthood (marriage, kids, job, etc) with his superheroics. To watch him fail over and over and over again and learn no lessons as a, what, mid-20's to early 30's year old man is just... sad. It's not fun. It's repetitive and depressing. Let the man be happy. Let the man grow.
Peter is eternally 26-28. Even Batman has been “aged-up” but his body has been literally and metaphysically reset to mid 20s and early 30s. His “aging body” is always mentioned but he looks early 40s at most.
@@superjlk_9538 the physicality isn't the issue. It's not being allowed to learn from mistakes like a reasonable adult. Pete acts like he's 15, but he's as you said, eternally almost 30.
I agree. I'm fairly confident that the majority of the ASM readers out there are of an age where they want to see him keep going in life. Miles is there to be the awkward teenage superhero now.
The fact that younger generational characters filling Spider-Man's original niche (e.g. Ms. Marvel) are being sacrificed for the sake of Peter's arrested development is proof positive that Marvel Editorial's Midlife Crisis is suffocating not just Peter Parker but the rest of the universe as well
Not really because they actually didn't sacrifice anything if you payed attention to what's happening outside of Spiderman in the universe you would see that he's in his own bubble and everything is actually moving without him perfectly and they can easily bring back ms marvel which is what's going to happen because Krakoa exists If you look at the cover picture for Tony's and Emma up and coming wedding you will be able to find kamala in the crowd hanging out
No one bought Ms. Marvel. She was DOA no matter how hard they tried to resuscitate her. You guys are acting as if Miles Morales is taking off when he's not selling a fraction of what Spiderman does. The Spider verse movies are fine but they're not touching Spiderman's movies any time soon. Age him up and you're killing off the most beloved comic characters of all time for someone unproven.
I was young when I started reading Spider-Man comics and he was in a relationship with Mary Jane. I don't understand their desire to keep him young when young people literally don't care if he is or not. He's Spider-Man for crying out loud they're always going to love him. There's already a whole back log of old stories that nee readers can buy to witness his growth.
Probably because Peter's high school/college/young adult status always resonates with much younger readers. Including those who got into him through any of the movies. It's telling that Peter B. in Spider-Verse is the first time we've ever seen an older, middle-aged Spider-Man be an adaptation focus, NWH cameos aside.
Plus, if they just want to have a “Young Spider-Man”, Miles is right there. Peter being the seasoned older mentor figure who can retire with a happy family one day with Miles being the younger Spidey figure works very well as the crux of the Spider-Verse movies, and there’s no reason why that dynamic shouldn’t be carried over to the comics.
@@halfmettlealchemist8076 True, but for that to work, we need to see Miles age up a bit more. You know, go to college, find his own job and all that. Academically, Miles is still in the same position as his Ultimate self.
@@benwasserman8223 Agreed. Which is even more frustrating, as that makes it seem like the editorial is trying to paradoxically keep _both_ Spider-Men “young” and “relatable” to casual readers, which just makes everything even more confusing instead.
backlogs kind of suck tho for spiderman. the style is too "old". its never been an absolute banger like the original FF backlogs that are basically timeless
One thing I appreciated about Across the Spider-Verse was that one of the central themes of the story is about characters breaking the same old tired narrative forced upon them. “Canon events” and how Miguel believes every Spider-person is inevitably defined by them is a clear metaphor for (among other things) how many writers/editors believe that heroes can only be relatable or interesting through hardship and suffering, and how harmful that belief actually is to the very fabric of storytelling.
That whole plotline seems like a rant by writers with high time preference who would rather knock down the carefully built world so they can have their "super great" story *Now* damn the past or future.
@@davidmelon9409 And while Miguel (and the rest of the Spider Society, by extension) have accepted their fate to be trapped in an eternal cycle of tragedy and hardship - to the point where they are willing to doom themselves and countless other versions of them to this cycle out of the misguided belief that their very existence depends on perpetuating it - Miles, Gwen, Hobie, and the other “rebel” Spider-People reject the cycle and seek to break free from the concept of a universal/“canon” narrative so that they can define their own stories according to their own choices. It’s really fascinating stuff!
Peter and MJ should never have split up. They ought to be married and raising a child or two, and Peter should be managing his own business or teaching high school but otherwise paying his bills and providing for his family. The notion that marriage somehow closes off story possibilities is inane. Superman blossomed as a character when he married Lois and again when he and she had Jon; he's made an awesome husband and father along with still being a superhero.
I feel like the core of Spider-Man is the struggle of balancing his responsibilities. He has the weight of the world on his shoulders and he can't let himself fail. Keeping him in highschool feels such low stakes in comparison of fighting criminal empires or murderous psychopaths. Plus we have a younger Spider-Man as it is. We keep this up and Miles will grow up before Peter does.
That's already happened with Batman and Nightwing but you don't see much complaining. No reason to make a main character unrelatable to the vast majority of your audience for funsies.
@@daverhoden445 and Nightwing matured faster than Batman did. Jon Kent matured faster than Superman (regardless how they did it). What's your point? Characters don't need to fight each other. When you do that the new one dies every single time.
@@VirgilOvid Jon Kent is basically a prop of Tom Taylor who is just using Jon to continue his Injustice universe, which has fell out of popularity with many fans due to DC and WB games ignoring the Injustice series for 7-8 years.
@@VirgilOvidin fact I don't even think Tom Taylor knows what he wants to do with Jonathan Kent. He derailed the whole multiverse storyline with Jon and Ultraman. All so he could do a loose continuation of the Injustice universe. The current Jon Superman six-issue miniseries it's already going downhill and is losing fans. The writing makes NO sense and Jonathan is written like a naive child in an adult body. Him trying to redeem the regime members and Injustice Superman is ridiculous considering the blood that they have on their hands.
I've always considered Fatherhood the most respectable responsibility a man can take. Peter balancing a real family life besides dutiful son with his world saving and crime fighting would make sense to me. Also having a kid would make sense as a source of his money troubles, Kids are expensive.
@@marhawkman303 It's hard to find any trace of a lie in that sentiment! I personally wonder if that's why they took the axe to the marriage in such a ham handed and noxious manner.
Letting Peter be a family man would give weight to the money trouble he "somehow" consistently has. That could be made relatable by having him work at a science lab while trying to slowly revamp Parker Industries as a grassroots organization dedicated to young people.
Yeah it seems like the editors don't trust the writers to do interesting stories with a family and they don't trust the audience to be able to relate to them.
One of the frustrations I've had with status-quo changes since OMD is that they feel more like each era is its own gimmick rather than an ongoing character journey. Peter is the CEO of a company? Is it because he knuckled down, improved his financial knowledge and built up a business over many years? No! It's because his body was taken over by Otto, who did those things and when Peter came back he just took over. Norman Osborn is a good guy and Peter's friendly boss! Is that because he underwent a difficult arc of self reflection and realised the destruction he's wrought isn't what he wanted, finally seeing the light in Peter's way? No! He had his evil literally shot out of him by a magic gun. It's not like either of these examples weren't following up on previous storylines, yet neither change came from the character's own agency. MJ and Peter don't even get to break up because of relationship issues they might face, it's the devil! Or whatever alternate dimension thing Paul is about. Someone described the constant return to the status quo at the end of the run as putting the toys back in the toy box. Maybe that's appropriate because more and more it ends up feeling like being invited over to watch someone else play with their toy set. They clearly have a story going on in their heads, but you just see the characters being picked up and moved around while the player shouts dialogue you can barely follow the context for let alone get invested in.
Like I said elsewhere, I just think that the writing and editorial team is insecure about their romance and relationship writing skills. Which makes sense, wifey Mary Jane is too often just sat in her apartment worrying about Pete because of that lack of authorial vision, even in good Spidey storylines like Maximum Carnage. Personally I think having MJ be involved local politics would fit with her vibe, after all she's always been a willful free spirit type that isn't afraid to speak her mind and I don't see that changing because of a ring on her finger.
"Being married and having children is the death of a character's ability to be interesting" is SUCH a divorced dad line of a thinking and it makes me feel really bad if any of those writers have family that have to deal with that energy from them
I think it is a tie between editors seeing themselves in Peter and not wanting him to grow up because that would mean that they have to grow up, and a need for brand synergy between comics and other media, since movies and cartoons tend to show him as a younger man. It's basically all bullshit, though, since Spider-Dad from Across the Spider-Verse was the best thing to happen to Peter since Life Story.
The sad part is, Peter doesn't need to "grow-up" to be a responsible and awesome dad. Pete's always goofy self, gives off huge Dad joke vibes, in a 40 year old body.
Plus we’re also at a place where a lot of comic book fans are in that age group where marriage and kids can feel relatable to us again. We grew up with Peter Parker in many forms since the animated show and now are ready to see his next step. I feel like we’re in the right place for a new excess and next step, and DC has kinda shown it can do this well with Batman and Superman right now
@@WindyPoplars95 One of my personal favorite moments in comics in general, and a true highlight of MC2 was when Pete decided to have April come and live with him. See, Norman Osborn, in one of his many Goblin plans, had created a modified clone of Pete's daughter May. This clone eventually decided to go by the name April. Well, April was created as part of a plot to destroy Pete... but April chose to be a good person and not do as Norman wanted. Which creates a rather touching moment when April gets welcomed into the Parker house. Pete and MJ may not like that Norman created a clone... but... April needs to live somewhere, and this way they can give supervision.
I'd love for Peter to grow up in the comics... not just for storytelling sake, but because if Peter grows up, future incarnations of Spider-Man/Woman can be organically introduced. Mayday Parker's Spider-Girl, Miguel O'Hara's Spider-Man, Miles Morales' Spider-Man, these are all Peter Parker's potential successors that get relegated to different timelines or continuities because the mainline Earth 616 is perpetually stuck in limbo... They needed a whole multiversal war with Dr. Doom just to make Miles and Peter able to coexist in one universe... just so that Peter could remain perpetually young...
They all have space to exist in the ultimate-verse or some other multiverse. Cycling in new characters replacing ones people are attached to doesn't end well for anyone involved. Miles thrived having his own space but look at how things turned out for all the otherd who tried taking over the mantle.
@@VirgilOvid DC seems to have been able to do it when they actually tried. The Flash - Barry Allen, Wally West, Bart Allen Robin - Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damian Wayne
@@VirgilOvid what's your point? Peter grew up to be an adult and got married in the 70's until OMD Heck he has kid and is married in across the spider verse and Renow your vows and Spider Girl. Why are people so afraid of grown up adult Peter Parker? Peter B Parker ended up being one of the most liked versions of Spider-Man.
It really is interesting to me how well Superman has moved on to this "Superdad" mode, which may work better as he's always been a "paternal" type character, and it's even spinning off it's own "Bad Superdad" genre, as seen in Invincible and Jupiter's Legacy! Speaking of Superman, remember that interview where both the EiC of Marvel and DC were asked which character of the others would they most like to poach, and the DC head immediately said, "Spider-Man" and went on about what a perfectly designed character he was...which, given that Marvel was in the process of changing up some things in his status quo, may have been thinly veiled shade thrown at them...
@@PychoJetBlack The Marvel head (Jemas, I think?) gave a typically corporate answer, along the lines of "No one! Here at Marvel, we have ALL the best heroes!"
YA novels have the same thing as manga, that they don't have this invulnerability complex that panders to all these middle-aged campaign veterans, who used to patrol foreign countries while donning Punisher keychains. There's an understanding that surviving the battle roayle and being remembered for it is more of an exception, than a just the outcome every "hero" is kinda entitled to. Because that's how it is in real life, you can cry all the crocodile tears you want when most of your platoon members in a real war against a genuine threat, are not there to be remembered by their non-existent children. It's pretty silly to chase the dragon of relateability, when your starting premise is so laughable. But, why make stories for people who won't be growing old reading your comic anyway? The money dries up as soon as he vetearn's benefit.
I really liked the "Renew Your Vows" miniseries, not really a fan of MJ sharing Peters powers but I really liked the whole, Peter focusing on protecting his kid and her making mistakes but unlike her dad who was figuring it out on his own she has someone there to help despite the fact that they but heads. Plus, now Peter has a whole slew of new problems and challenges to overcome.
I honestly liked MJ with powers, it was different. But idk if I'd make it canon in a mainline series. But it would make sense for their kid to have powers though.
I for one; have always been a fan of Spider-dad, even when I was younger. There's this part of me that just really liked the idea of Peter making small steps in his life that overall changed his status quo, but still let him be Spider-Man. Mayday also just needs to be a full on character again; rip off the baind-aid and lets see where the writers can go when they're not stuck with trying to keep Peter and his family in a very small box.
What applies to Spider-Man pretty much applies to every superhero character in comics. They need to let the characters grow and change (preferably slowly and naturally as they please). And then if new writers come around and want to "go back to past status quo", they can do a flashback story, or an elseworlds. It's painfully obvious that the comics are struggling with spinning their wheels back to "status quo", while not burning through all the good ideas and good will they build up.
Depends how you approach it. Marvel seems to be interested in more of a Charlie Brown dynamic for Spider-Man - the Peanuts cast remained young children going through mostly the same sorts of stories for 50 years, and people loved it.
New characters don't sell. Your fanbase doesn't want to get ride of decades of world building. There's no point aging up characters with well fleshed out stories for new ones that aren't so great. Plus no one wants to see their favorite hero old and decrepit dealing with aging.
There’s a theory that the reason Mephisto destroyed Peter’s marriages, because eventually May Day will find a way to destroy him… That would be a cool story to bring a Continuity. I hope Peter and MJ get back together, and I’m usually not big into kids, but I’ll even take a young May Day, I really enjoyed the renew your vows, storyline and collected each issue as it came out
That's what the Nick Spencer run's finale suggested. Though other people think editorial forced Spencer to shift his arc's plot from erasing OMD to Sin's Past in the final issues. Which, given the amount of time he alluded to Mephisto and OMD in the story, makes a bit of sense.
Memphisto dead at the end of the last avengers run with every version of him being killed and blackheart inherenting Memphisto's position And both Memphisto and black heart fuck with people for the sake of fucking with people because there it brings them happiness to see someone willingly fuck up there lives it's there whole mo Not whatever Choosen one bs that Spiderman writters keep writing
I'd like it if that story sort of over time started to look like more and more of an inevitability _because_ of Mephisto's actions. Like they got back together and had the kid at the right time because he interfered before, at some point he might kidnap her leading to a big rescue arc ending in say Magik offering to teach May Day magic so that she can defend herself, putting another piece of that prophesy into place, and so on so that eventually it would be Mephisto's own meddling that results in his undoing. Just my two cents.
@@GhengisJohn Memphisto is dead And magik isn't that friendly towards strangers and she wouldn't seek responsibility of someone's child when she pretty much abandoned limbo completely
I grew up in the 90's where Peter and MJ were married and the animated series lead to their wedding. To me, Peter's struggles were relatable but there was that element of hope in having someone special in your life to help you through. One More Day came around and spit on that idea and the Spider-Man comics have been tainted ever since. OMD and also Zeb Wells' run have showed us not to get invested in any relationship Peter may have (with MJ or anyone) because it ultimately won't lead anywhere. This especially hurts after Nick Spencer's run had their relationship rekindled only to be ripped away again. So yes, I would love to see Peter grow up and be happy, but it seems Marvel's decree that he be perpetually miserable. We have Miles now, so there's no reason we can't have both a family man Spidey in Peter and the coming of age story with Miles.
Nick Spencer’s run seemed to be heading towards undoing One More Day until editorial realised what was going on and squashed it. We were _this close_ to greatness 😭
@@philiphunn194 I doubt he would have undone it, but it at least acknowledged it and added Mephisto's real reasoning to erase Mayday so she wouldn't oppose his rule. But we got Sins Past erased, so we'll take victories where we can.
I genuienlly want Peter to be a dad and have those adventures you mentioned. Running late for his daughter's recital, keeping his superheroing a secret, the anxiety of seeing if and when the kid's show signs of powers, one kidnapping here or there but not too much. It's not that hard. Editorial just doesn't want it because they are hyper-fixaded on a single Peter Parker jumping from relationship to relationship and being miserable. I will never EVER forgive Quesada for OMD, and if and when it does get undone or they find another way to be together, I will be all the happeier.
@@OminousArtist I think it had more to do with my feelings about MJ at the time. I felt like she was more of a liability than an asset to Peter back then. I suppose to some extent I still feel that way, but I also get why they work (or would work) a little more now. And yes, I'd much rather they have divorced, or gone their separate ways organically than the diablo ex machina we got at Quesada's hands. I feel like if you're going to undo a marriage, then damnit that's not a trivial thing you wave a wand at. Show your work, show your readers the pain that would be involved. Yeah, I still have some lingering resentments over how Quesada handled all that.
Peter did grow up over the decades; first starting as a high school kid, going to university, getting that job as a photographer, dating women, marrying, then almost had the kids and BAM a neverending stream of reboots and retcons started rolling in. I used to love Spider-Man comics when I was a kid but I just gave up on them after One More Day. It erased decades of character growth.
I started reading Spider-Man when he was married to MJ. I don't understand how Peter being married makes him "not relatable" but having to sell pictures of his alter ego to a boss who'll make him look bad just so he can pay his rent is different. Him being married, having a kid, having to pay rent, and everything else are specifically what I love about him. Even as a kid, I could understand that he had to put up with a lot of shit that was just regular life. He wasn't making choices between good and evil. He was making choices between good and getting the respect of his peers. Between good and showing up for his loved ones. Between good and making life even a little easier for himself. There was tonnes of drama with MJ having to cover for him at cost to herself, or simply worrying about him or being lonely. I loved those stories as a kid. It's bloody great and it's built-in to his attachments. It's always about weighing one responsibility against another. Give him more responsibilities. Watch him shine.
I always maintained Spider-Man Peter Parker should finally grow up and mature and move forward in the comics, especially because across the spider-verse and spider-girl mayday parker series and renew your vows proves that peter parker and Mary jane being married and having there daughter mayday parker spider-girl alive and kicking in any universe shocker actually works, and I think its time for marvel comics to finally pull that trigger and let peter parker grow up and become a dad and passing the mantle of Spider-Man to miles Morales Spider-Man could actually work and move his story forward which i would be all for that because that means we can finally have a happy ever after for Peter parker Spider-Man story and end his story with a bang and the next generation could follow miles Morales as there new Spider-Man and boom problem solved everybody wins, and if people want to read more Peter parker stories alongside Miles Morales then here's my solution have the main ASM book be about Peter parker and Mary jane raising there daughter mayday parker spider-girl as a child and have miles Morales Spider-Man teach peter parker and Mary jane daughter to learn how to control her powers and having them team up to kick ass and save the day would be amazing story while peter and MJ get to still be good parents and still be around to have fun adventures and boom problem solved everybody wins. That way both sides could be happy and nobody loses but that's my opinion on this entire topic as a whole with Spider-Man needs to grow up. :)
@@jacobrivera1721 lol indeed fact on that one hundred percent, especially because if superman batman and wally west could have there kids Jonathan Samuel Kent superboy as his little 10 year old self Damian Wayne robin and Irey jai west become a great team called the super kids then I think marvel should do the exact same thing but with Spider-Man as well and having him have his three kids Mayday parker Spider-girl benjy parker and annie may parker becoming great friends to Dylan brock and normie osbon and forming there own team would be fantastic and tons of fun at least in my opinion.
My response to editorial's fear that Peter will be unrelatable and boring as a married father is to look to Wally West. Over the decades, we've seen him go from sidekick kid flash to an immature The Flash, to gaining maturity as he grew into the mantle to finding love with Linda and eventually kids. He's now a married father with three kids and still has many interesting and engaging stories being told. People want to see their heroes keep growing. Arrested development is not related
I say let Peter grow up and be a Dad. He’s tackled many responsibilities. From high school, college, careers, relationships, and marriage. Let him tackle the life of parent is hundred percent new territory. I agree with you a 100%. And I hate how writers always have to make some excuse of Peter not being Spider-Man when he has kids. For some strange reason always being losing a limb. Funny because get a prosthetic isn’t that hard especially in the marvel universe. Even more hilarious that Peter is literally one of the smartest people in the marvel comics. You could still have him be Spider-Man. Take your time with him being a Dad with baby and later raise Mayday(for example), different stage through her life. Have Mayday come to her own as Spider-Girl down the road and be mentor by both Miles and Peter. Start up a Spider Family. Look Batman hes had multiple protégés and comrades throughout different points in his life and he’s still interesting as Batman no matter what age. Look the Dark Knight Returns, Bruce was around 60 or older, but still had a compelling story despite the age. Let the characters grow when it’s necessary in stories. Let Peter Parker grow.
I think that could be an interesting angle. have him settle down, have a marriage that sticks, and then focus on other spidermen for the teenage superhero angle, or maybe have another clone (this would not be the first time peter has been cloned) taking on the teenage superhero angle for peter, with the older peter still occasionally being spiderman, but with a more supporting and mentor like role (think an uncle peter). his children, born naturally or adopted (or perhaps why not both) living a life with a dad who is genuinely a good soul, but can also be a bit of a dork . he is stuggling to get used to being a dad, and while he enjoys it, peter is still willing to throw hands with supervillains for his family and freinds. maybe have it be that we get to see both original peter and the clone peter developing different relationships, so that way we can have original peter with MJ (potentially after MJ's current husband either seperates from her or sacrifices himself for her), and the peter clone who is younger, more outgoing, but is still a sensitive soul can go with Felicia. both relationships have different obstacles, but you get to see how both their relationships and their kids play out. note, this does not mean ben rielly does not exist, nor does it mean kaine does not exist. both of them have their own very distinct baggage that make them very different characters to peter, even though that means that another clone would be running around. there is already a Bunch of Spidermen and spiderpowered superheroes with similar abilities to spiderman running around, having a 2nd peter who is young, strong, energetic and boisterous while keeping the older peter seperate from his younger more boisterous self who can show off his smarts, skills, and experience while he gets to be a spiderdad, wise mentor, and occasional grizzled badass who will knock a criminal or supervillain through several walls if they dare try to go after his loved ones.
Spider-man imparting wisdom to other characters never gets old for me, whether it’s hope summers, Franklin Richards, or his own kids The character has so much to tell and so much to teach, I just hope he gets more chances to actually impart that wisdom
When writers say they're mad about a character being married, it just sounds like they want things to always be the same so they don't have to write new material.
Absolutely Peter needs to be grown up. The Marvel writers continue to make him young just to retread familiar stories Spider-Man has gone through (I.e bringing back dead characters who should really just stay dead). Parker growing up and becoming a mentor and a father is best choice for him to explore new avenues of not just his character but also Miles Morales (something Spider-Verse is excelling at).
Thank you for posting this. Comicstorian and others recently did a similar videos. I hope more prominent comics youtubers continue to speak out about this. Maybe Marvel will start listening. As a side note the current storyline has completely ruined MJ's character in my opinion and they made her look like a complete b word. She pushed Peter back to protect him, he pissed off all his friends to get back to save her, and she just decides that she no longer loves him and she loves the guy she met there instead. Complete BS.
ya, and the way theyve handled Mj for the past 50 years, just kill her off or get rid of her, or make Peter a divorced dad that has to handle moving on without her
Mayday is one of my fave characters. I grew up reading her comics back in the 90s. The funny thing to me is, the issue isn't that Pete has to be single or married. It's that they just want to recapture all the best, first moments but they can't. You'll never get another Death of Gwen or "if this be my destiny" coz they've already been done. As much as people hated Dan Slott, at least he attempted some new stuff with Superior Spider-Man. He just had a bit of issues sticking the landing as ending a story is tough. I haven't read a Spidey comic in so long and I think I get more enjoyment out of the adaptations now as they can be fresh.
As a dad myself, I find myself enjoying the father/child characters more than anything else. It’s more relatable, even villain dads are more appealing. It gives the character something personal to fight for and protect, either directly or indirectly.
I enjoy seeing an Across The Spiderverse Peter as a dad with Mayday. Feels like Peter grew with me even though I'm an uncle, not a parent since I grew up with 1994 SpidermanTAS.
Spider-man like Hal Jordan and Johnny Storm in my mind are all characters that should grow up or be in a mentorship role or establish their own lives. Its unfortunate because Johnny Storm several times has matured, ironically when he was married to Alicia(Lyja), that had been undone because he is meant to be the hot headed, sarcastic character that isn't so serious, but it always sacrifices any development he gets. I mean Tomasi and Gleason's run of Superman shows that having a family can make a great dynamic and new challenges for a hero beyond something to punch. I argue the stakes are greater on a familial and heroic level with these changes. They gave Deadpool and Venom children and those specific runs where they are introduced are arguably liked by many people.
Also Mark and Eve have Tara in invincible, Clark and Lois have John in Superman, Bruce and Taila have Damian in Batman, Eddie and wade have kids, It’s not for Peter
@@DIEGhostfish It only makes sense after the retcon as all that connection would still be there it just would be needed time to rekindle. I never finished all of Defalco's run to see how it all panned out.
@@DIEGhostfish Its not new, I am more referring to Tom Defalco making Alicia being a Skrull while married to Johnny where there was nothing beforehand to indicate she was a Skrull.
Could you imagine Miles mentoring Mayday? I’d love to see that interaction as Miles becoming like an uncle to her and his younger sister and mayday being friends growing up.
My opinion: Spiderdad & Mayday should be the future of this franchise. Everyone that still wants a young, free Spiderman has other options, notably Miles Morales.
Oh absolutely! I think his arrested development ALL started when they "killed" Mayday. It didn't hit me how upset I'd be with the marriage removable until I realized that years of comic stories have been so... Stagnant. Now I'll do anything for Mayday and Annie to be in universe, as sisters, I even want to push my luck by adding April (Mayday's clone) and Benjy to, have an entire family. If you let me write it (I have ideas), I'm gonna go nuts with it, hell, I'd even get a entire like minded staff to get more ideas and expansions in it... Let us cook so editorial doesn't have too. Rant over lol
I think the problem is keeping Spider-Man in a character limbo. He could get married, or he could be a life long bachelor with a new love interest every few years, but it needs to be moving forward.
I would like to see more of an older spider man like what we got in No Way Home w Tobey Maguire. Give him crippling body pains to show he is physically older, and put him in the mentor role for Miles to try and guide him and make him stay out of life's pitfalls
@@steakcrust558 I remember hearing about Peter being a science high school teacher for a bit. I also remember hearting that the writer for that arc wasn't very good, but having Pete the science geek be a high school teacher with a young kid is great way of making him relatably broke, if that's the angle they still want to go with him.
@@fluidthought42 It's a really good arc, actually. The storyline involves Pete noticing problems with some of his students (one's homeless, another has a brother in prison after getting caught by Spiderman, etc) and he goes out of his way to help them and nurture their gifts. The author was abused as a kid and discouraged by his parents from following his passion for writing, but he was encouraged by his high school teachers, and you really feel that in the story. I disagree on the writer not being good. His run was generally pretty fantastic. The only issues I had with him were: 1: He brought in supernatural elements to Spiderman's origin, which I don't think works very well. 2: He's the one who breaks up Peter and Mary-Jane (though this is because he was forced to by management).
I like what the Insomniac games do with Peter. He starts off older and more experienced and his relationship with MJ. Miles pops up and Pete is free to do stuff like actually go in a vacation. Not necessarily replacing or passing the torch, but more as making it so he's always needed and others can somewhat fill his shoes.
I just wish writers would stop making Peter extremely miserable for the sake of constantly trying to shake things up. And also stop the love triangle with Black Cat. I'm tired of it. Just move ON. 😭
Agreed! Marvel needs to just let Black Cat move on from Pete and get a girlfriend already, they both deserve better than getting yanked around like this
the editorial team involving Spider-man are pretty much the true villains for Spider-man because every time he tries to better his life, they pull the rug from under him
The current run of spider man has only made me go back to the renew your vows comics and the original spider-girl comics. And while Peter does strike me as the kind of guy that would put his family first above being a super hero, I honestly think him having a super hero family would be the best outcome for him. Not only handling a more adult responsibility, but also having a child that can learn how to be a hero without that tragedy, symbolizing the growth and impact Spider-Man has on the world, a reward for everything he has done throughout his life.
I constantly feel like "Peter Parker graduating from high school so early in his run" has to be one of Marvel's biggest internal regrets. It seems like they just wanted Peter to stay a teenager, or a young adult, and as such they always try to avoid things that would clash with Peter being treated like a youngster (like being married, or a father). It is getting to a point where it might get weird to see Peter still acting like he's an insecure 15 year old, when he's supposed to be, like, in his mid-20s. Imagine seeing, in real life, a 25 year old still acting like a teenager, or at least acting like he has yet to move on to what he was like in high school.
MY Spider-Man will always be the JMS version in early to mid 2000s Amazing Spider-Man. Unfortunately, that run ended with One More Day and it doesn't feel like Spider-Man has grown or moved forward back to that level of maturity since, which has been forgotten for nearly 20 years now.
Marvel loves its status quo for Spider-Man, but if DC can give Batman & Superman a son I think it should be fine. I can understand not wanting to write a baby forever, and aging her up to maybe a teenager which means Miles would be a grown man but they can work around it, just go to that different Universe where they age faster and tell stories that happen over there for a bit
Dc can afford to do reckless shit they can reboot marvel doesn't Batman pushing 60 and is a shell of himself and can't fight crime they will easily just reboot him and the universe Marvel wouldn't Neither the 2 of them handle continuity the same
I’m glad people are still talking about this. We need to keep this up since I think Marvel is just trying to ride this out until we forget about One More Day. I really think One More Day needs to be undone. Heck Superman and Batman have children now that are staying. Spider-Man should grow up too.
It's certainly ironic. Marvel will gladly retcon just about everything in their universe... except the one thing people desperately WANT them to retcon.
If we were living in the best timeline, Peter would be a dad with MJ, Miles would be the Spider-Man while also mentoring Mayday Spider-Girl and Dylan Venom
I think Peter should be allowed to grow up, have kids and genuinely be happy/ move past his stress trauma. It feels like the fans who object to Peter moving on are stuck in a trauma bonding nostalgia loop where Peter needs to be constantly miserable in order to rise above it, like Batman during that 2016 marriage fakeout event (I'm still salty about it but moving on). Joe Q/ the other marvel staff shouldn't have taken their real life struggles with marriage out on the characters unless it's fanfiction. It's also why people were PISSED thay Peter could own and run his own successful company and actually have enough money to pay his bills/ not struggle for once in his life. Just let the guy be happy and open the shenanigan door to fatherhood
People wanting him to grow up are the ones stuck in a nostalgia loop. They can't let go of something they've grown out of. Instead of moving on they want the characters to be theirs and only theirs. Spiderman has been a best seller for multiple generations for a reason. He's s character new fans can relate to and old fans can loom back fondly on. Don't cling to the past and demand everything be catered to you and only you. Grow up and let him go.
I was confused that Peter held onto Otto's business more than anything. Being a CEO doesn't seem like Pete's style, unless it's like super small scale business that I dunno creates and prints 3d molds or an analysis lab that is used for super science gigs at night. Small business owner Pete I can see fitting him more easily, and less Stark/Wayne flavored.
I appreciate that they brought both Ben and Mayday into the new Spiderverse movie. Hopefully their popularity will make the writing team in charge of the Spider-Man comics realize how much we want a proper Spider-dad story with Uncle Spider-Ben and so on. I would love that, but alas, one can only hope
"The deal with Mephisto is symptomatic of a bigger problem for the character, and the people who write him: The unwillingness for the character to become an adult". - Lewis Lovhaug
I was introduced to Spider-Man in the 90s animated series. In which he was graduating college and getting engaged to Mary Jane. I vividly remember when the Raimi Spider-Man film was coming out thinking "Why are we in high school? Spider-Man is 30." and that "Spider-Man is 30" (also btw the age I deem Dick Grayson) has been how I view the character for at least 20 years. So every moment of adaptation, and regression has been objectively frustrating. Until Into The Spider-Verse & Peter B Parker. Finally Spider-Man was able to not just be an ouroboros of "High School, maybe College, MJ, *RESET*, Repeat." And the defining characteristics of Peter Parker remain intact with Peter B Parker. He's still a schlubby, immature, down on his luck, quippy, likeable oaf despite also being a literal genius. It's the most at home I've felt with the character since I was a child. Not to mention the diversification of the Spider-Man character & concept allowing for room to let Peter Parker be more than a stunted manchild forced to try to recapture the "glory days" (read Lee/Ditko, which is not my glory days & I'm old now). Teen Spider-Man exists now, literally in Miles & emotionally with Kamala Khan (well done screwing that one up Marvel "time of commenting"). There's tens of thousands of stories waiting to be told if you'd just let them go forward. And even if those stories aren't Pete & MJ are together & having a child and the stories are Peter is CMO of Stark Industries & he's engaged to, I dunno, Johnny Storm or Carlie Cooper, or someone new. As long as it's created from a real place & organic & not a mandate (editorial or personal) then it's growth. Not repetition. TL;DR Fuck yeah let Peter Parker grow up! Because when he isn't he's an awful character to try to care about.
I've always referred to Peter Parker not being allowed to grow-up as being the Peter Pan Syndrome. This is especially true in non-comics media, but Peter should be allowed to grow up. I thought dissolving his marriage was a horrible idea - and still think so to this day.
I was in high school at the time when Peter married Mary Jane. I was all on board with it because it felt like Peter was growing up with me. I can see the argument against it, but at the same time there was a time when Mr. Fantastic wasn't married to the Invisible Woman. They just carried on and told stories about that married couple. Why not with Spider-Man? He could have still been married and have a youthful appeal by telling decades worth of stories about a young married couple. Ah, such was not to be.
I like the idea of Spider-Man semi retiring but still keeping his ear on police dispatch comms, waiting for a serious enough event that Miles and other successors can’t handle before he swings out as the “big gun”, to tilt the odds back in the other Spiders favor. I also imagine he’d occasionally hit the town as Spider-Man just to stay in shape, and do research and detective like work for other Spiders that they might not be able to do; reading monthly science journals, breaking down complex blueprints the others might find on their adventures, examining samples discovered at crime scenes. Theres still so much a Father Parker could still do.
I'll never understand why editors hate growing up a charchter, like Pete. I think you can tell great stories about Peter being married to Mary Jane and have kids, while still being Spider-Man. Kinda like when Bruce was "killed" by Darkside, I would have loved if they continued Dick as Batman, and Bruce be actually dead
@@philiphunn194 Grant Morrison actually stated once that they would have written Dick Grayson Batman and Damien Wayne Robin for 5 more years, but DC had them bring back Bruce Wayne early.
Characters not growing up mostly stems from Marvel & DC higher ups thinking that kids won't read the book once they get married and have kids, and thus they keep the character younger to have that "Infinite Child Money". Ironically kids money is being spent on Manga and not American comics, because manga characters are actually treated like.....people and characters(weird concept I know).
@@williamradke4290 And, as best I can tell (not a huge manga reader here), manga often tell consequential storylines that have big developments for their main characters. It's like they're not afraid to actually let life happen to their protagonists.
I think the problem with Spider man not growing up is that since so much of his stories have explicitly been about taking responsibility and balancing his superhero life with his personal one… the fact that all of his attempts to do that keep falling apart after 60 years, kinda makes it feel like he’s in a constant unending spiral of failure and it’s just sad a this point. And look some characters can get away with being the perpetual young irresponsible bachelor (nobody is making petitions for Johnny Storm to settle down) but that has never seemed like someone Peter is or wants to become. I think the Spiderverse movies really hit the nail on the head with Peter B Parker in regards to how modern Peter feels. No matter how young they draw him or how much they retconned his life experiences he no longer FEELS like your quirky, relatable but luckless 20 something friend Peter Parker, he feels like your 40 year old divorced buddy from college who is “Such a nice guy, he’s just fallen on hard times recently. Can he just sleep in our couch for one more day, honey?”
Honestly a story arc of Pete crashing on the couches of different superheros sounds great. He'd be too loud for Daredevil, too messy for Ben Grimm, too annoying for Doctor Strange etc.
I feel like so many of these issues with Peter's romances could have easily been fixed. Like, with the Gwen problem, she could have just been written better if she was so unlikable. After all, that managed to be done when it came to Spider-Gwen and the Gwen from the first amazing Spider-Man film, so it's not that difficult to do. And I'm pretty sure undoing Peter's marriage is one of the DUMBEST decisions in comic history, second only to the romance between Batman and Batgirl in DC. Like, Peter Parker can still be relatable, but also be a husband and a father, considering many marvel needs who grew up with the character have also managed to marry and have kids of their own, so I that aspect, he would still be relatable. On top of that, Spider-Man is not a character that is meant to be a Self insert. After all, he's not a freaking isekai Protagonist. So like, Marvel's gotta clean up their act with Spidey for crying out loud.
Spider family being a thing like the super family I think would help so many of the Spider-Man related characters and the multiverse characters people want in canon find a spot to all have stories together
Married to MJ with his rugrats Mayday and Annie climbing on the ceiling while working as a scientist or college professor with a reasonable salary while close to and maybe working with Miles and his brothers Ben and Kaine as they all operate as Spider-Man.
I've posted this before on other platforms but my idea for the spider man related characters are Have Peter be a teacher whose married with kids. Have Miles be the teenage/college aged spider man alot of fans are used to and who younger fans can relate to. Have Ben in Las Vegas be the adult freelancer who can be used as editorials punching bag and who struggles and ish. Have Kaine in Houston as Scarlet Spider again. Have Jessica Drew be removed from the spider verse and just be the avengers member and secret agent. Have Silk get a bigger role and maybe mentor Peter's kids. Spider-Gwen in her own universe again. Anya Corazon maybe be partners with Silk? Or have her be the multiversal traveller that people think Miles and Gwen are.
I’m not going to say that Peter’s life should be totally without conflict - he needs something to drive the story forward, after all. But at the very least, he deserves to be married to MJ, to have a stable job, and to be able to live a long and happy life.
I think he should move on to getting married. Though at this point, I'm so tired of all the pushing and pulling, I'd settle for "any" of his past girlfriends to get hitched to him. So long as the story getting there is good enough, and that they STICK WITH IT.
He deserves to be married with mj and have mayday and Annie, like it’s time for Peter to retire and let miles take over miles knows what he’s doing and he can do both and miles is a responsibility spider people!
I grew up reading Spider-Man when he was married. Sales were good, the stories were great, and I miss that dearly. Him being single now feels wrong, like a huge regression, he does not feel like where he is supposed to be.
I've been reading the strascinsky and romita jr. amazing spiderman run from the 2000's after morlun, and I'm loving those stories even more than the current ones, I love the superior spiderman arc and the parker industries also because is another layer of responsabilities for peter, and the stories where peter is still married to mary jane anre heartwarming, is spiderman with a more mature take.
YES! Bring back MJ & Peter. Good stories can still be written with a happy married couple at it’s core. The whole endless cycle of get together, break up, get together again, break up again, and so on, has been so overdone in all media. Everything with Peter is about struggle and perseverance in the face of incredible odds. Give him that piece of a happiness that gives him the reason it’s all worth while.
Going off on prob the easiest solution for the issue is having Miles be the younger character that Peter was when he first began. Gen Z and younger have 10x more relatability to Miles as he grew up in our era, he deals with our issues, and his family dynamic is particularly relatable to tons of kids, teens, and young adults alike. Spiderverse is proof of this. Miles is the younger generation Spider-Man which is okay! As for Peter who many Millennials and older Gen Z like myself grew up with, seeing Peter with MJ and casually growing older is almost engraved into our brains. We saw Tobeys Spider man grow old into graduating College, saw animated Peter’s marriage in the 90s cartoon, and were there for most of his later marriage (pre One More Day) in the comics which many consider to be one of his best runs. People who grew up with Peter want him to grow up with us, and I find it disappointing how Marvel refuses to let it happen. When I eventually have kids myself, I wouldn’t be surprised if Miles is the one they look up too because he is just that more relatable to a younger audience.
I am born after one more day… I’ve never lived in a world where Spider-Man was married but my gosh it’s my favorite era of comics. Let Peter be a father already man. I’m 10 years away from being peter’s age and he hasn’t progressed once in my life.
Undoing the events of One More Day, getting Peter together with MJ and letting him be a dad is the only thing that could possibly get me collecting new Spider-Man comics ever again.
I do feel that Spider-Man has suffered a nasty case of Arrested Development ever since One More Day. Heck, I know some people who claim that happened during the Clone Saga. One of the reasons the Clone Saga dragged on so long was simply because the writers were running out of ideas, and seemed incredibly reluctant to take the 'next step' in the character's development. Peter Parker had developed very slowly over the course of thirty years from a punk teen Ayn Rand enthusiast to a married man with a child on the way. The next step would have been to actually have Peter be a father, but it just didn't happen. Instead they reverted to type, and Peter coasted along in the nineties and early 2000's. JMS tried some interesting things with increasing Spider-Man's power level and making him a teacher, but then One More Day basically undid that entire run. If I look at Spider-Man books since OMD, I notice little has actually changed for Peter Parker directly. If you think about it, the biggest events in Spider-Man since then happened 'around' Peter rather than 'because' of Peter. Superior Spider-Man was about Peter literally being replaced by Doctor Octopus. Then there was Parker Industries, which was created by Doctor Octopus, not Peter. The third one I can think of off the top of my head was the Spider-Verse, but that was about him interacting with OTHER Spider-Men. Even when Peter has developed cool gadgets or learned martial arts in Dan Slott's run, he never actually keeps using them, always reverting to a base point, making what he invented or learned temporary gimmicks rather than actual growth. Spider-Man no longer grows, he's like a hamster on a wheel, and the only thing that changes is the wheel he's running in. Also, as an aside, "It was like ordering the MC2 from Wish" made me laugh so damn hard.
There was so much lost potential, adventures, misadventures, hijinks, KICKS( wait, no. Kicks are Bad!). But honestly, you could have had peter work at Horizon Labs before him and MJ starting up Parker Industries in partnership with his former Boss Max and staffed with people he trust and works with as spider-man. Then, you can have all the crazy stuff around MJ being pregnant (for a second time if you stick with the stillbirth having legit happened) such as supervillian baby shower crashers or accidental body swap between Pete and MJ before the birth. You could have lost spider-baby loose in the lab setting off all the machines. I and several now parent comic fans were ROBBED!
They should definently have Peter grow up. Its ironic because I personally am not a big fan of kids and marriage, but I am a big Spidey fan and want to see him grow and be happy even if that means marriage and kids. Plus, Miles, Mayday and Annie May are such interesting characters that deserve to have the mantel passed on to them and to have their own adventures with Peter as their mentor. It just makes sense.
Right now, we have a Spider-Boy running around who's seemingly been retconned into life, trying to recapture the energy of a Young Peter, while current Peter is an ever-suffering never-happy burnout because "reasons". Can you imagine if Peter was still married, grown up and basically retired, while Miles is Spider-Man and a young Mayday is the teenaged Spider-Girl. Can you imagine if Peter was allowed to finally be a man? Instead of an overgrown teenager, a case study for arrested development.
These old farts need to stop trying to hold on to the Lee/Romita college Spider-Man era and realize most modern audiences are tired of it and actually want character progression for Peter
And if they truly want to keep that lee/romita era they should seriously consider doing a universal reboot because at this point that stage doesn’t work for this peter anymore
I’m a 29 year old fan and has been reading SpiderMan since I was a teenager. I would like Pete to grow, embrace the responsibilities of adulthood, and to be happy with MJ and a child. Miles Morales is a perfect SpiderMan for the younger generation. We can have both as fans.
Fully agree. I've been saying this for years to all of my friends who still care to listen lol. Peter having the balance not only the responsibility of his job, with Spider-Man; but also being married, a father, and a mentor opens up so much potential, and possibilities for new Spider-Man stories. Marvel could even have it's cake, and eat it too with the miles being the new, hip Spider-Man with the exaggerated swagger of a young black teen lol.
Just have him and Mary Jane get remarried and have a child to move forward with the stories and for people who want to see young Spider-Man stories just bring back ultimate Spider-Man or just read Miles Morales Spider-Man comics!
My intro to Spider-man was the 1960s cartoon I watched in the early 1970s in syndication. I knew Parker to be interested in Betty Brant and not the other two.
I think Spider-Man renew Your Vows would be one of my favourite comics if it had been given a fixed length to have a complete arc. The way it was they basically forgot most of what happened in the first run then tried to go fast while not tying stuff up because they got cancelled at an awkward point. The way it is now it’s still a pretty good comic where you can basically ignore surroundings stories
I feel like that was a good opportunity to bring the marriage into the main Marvel timeline after Secret Wars. Too bad, Marvel wants Peter to be a manchild for the rest of his life.
This talk of Spider-Man "growing up" reminds me of the theory that Franklin Richards's, son of Reed and Susan, birth or sometime after it was the point where the Earth-616 universe ceased evolving in pseudo-real time as it had previously. I, for one, would enjoy it if you made a video discussing the topic sometime before the heat death of the universe.
Spider-Man fans genuinely make me sad because so many of them want Peter to never change and it is neither realistic nor good for his continued story. I wish so bad for Peter to finally find happiness and maybe even step down because there are so many stories that are now just like his. Miles, Gwen, Mayday, Miguel these are all just the other Spider's that can fill the gap he leaves behind but, people are afraid of change and they just want Peter to remain a constant.
it always baffles me when people talk about spiderman being relatable, because we all get bitten by radioactive spiders and have to balance our school and hero life
Another factor in writers/editorial pushing against the marriage is probably that people specifically want Peter and MJ to have a HEALTHY marriage, which is antithetical to the Spider-Man's traditional soap opera style of storytelling, where relationships exist to make the characters' lives MORE unstable and angst-ridden.
Marvel can always go back to how it was during the 80/90’s when they had the regular titles ( Amazing, Spectacular ect) that had Peter as a married adult…and the MC2 line where they had a retired Peter who was a husband & father of his legacy character Spider-Girl/Woman…& they had a line of comics for younger readers Marvel Adventures Spider-Man that had Peter in High School with for quite a bit of the run arguably his best GF for in & out of the costume Sofia Sanduval…Keep Up The Outstanding Work Sasha 🖖🏾
I actually would like to see a comic where Spiderman is an adult, (whether or not he's married with kids), being both a superhero as well as working as a Scientist, self-employed business owner or whatever. Just as long as he can be an adult, relatively successful, (because he can't avoid having life kick him in the testicles, but that doesn't mean he can't have some wins), and able to not have to forever be stuck in Highschool. If the writers have any talent they can pull it off, and maybe this time it will stick.
As someone who grew up reading Spiderman in the 90s and is now a Dad, I really love Spider-Dad. It's like me and Spiderman grew up together. Spiderman isn't that young kid anymore. He's older, he's mentoring Miles, he's got an adult life and adult responsibilities. I would love to see Peter start a family and juggle Dad life with Spiderman Life.
If Peter is supposed to grow up as his books progress through the years then marriage and self-sufficiency should be on the table for him. Quesada is wrong and he will be wrong forever.
I am a 90's kid and so PeterxMary Jane was the ship I knew best and loved, yes there were others but it just was ahead. Knowing all the What Ifs and such that honestly show they can be married and Peter can still have adventures tells me that he should be allowed to move forward. He's been around for 60+ years and not even the old legends of Superman and Batman have remained as banished back to square one as Spiderman (Though they try). Plus, both Superman and Mr. Fantastic are married and are parents, and get along with the super life just fine. I also just like the interesting family dynamics that could happen, I feel the Human Torch would just confidently strut in to being an uncle again while other Spiderman related folk can learn their place in the overall family :)
In my opinion, Nightwing is the best example of a character growing up done right (if only they would do the same for Tim). Mixing Dad Peter (with Mayday) with Miles provides the perfect opportunity to pass the torch but still maintain the old nostalgia.
They're never going to have Peter pass the torch to Miles. Peter Parker did grow up from a teenager to a twentysomething, and he's been a twentysomething since the 1970s, and I guess that's where Marvel likes him.
Miles should stay in his own world. You can't mix the two without a disastrous fight within the fandom. People already feel like Marvel wants to replace Spidey with miles so you'd just prove their fears are true. Don't replace cornerstone characters, it never ends well for the new one.
I can see something like Nightwing kinds working but let's remember that he's only been aged up to like mid 20's so not really that old. Any older and the whole pseudo sidekick thing gets really awkward. That's the other thing though: he's a side character. You can take risks with side characters and some work, others don't. You can't take the same risk with main characters. The Spiderman formula has worked for generations, why change it?
@@44excaliburand that's where they will destroy him (in the comics, everyone else has more curiosity and open mindedness to do something new or old at varying degrees)
@@pierreblanchon4722 Peter has been around since the 1960s. Four straight generations have grown up on Peter Parker. Guys like you need to let it go. Peter's not going anywhere.
@@VirgilOvidyeah...he should go back to africa!!! Or puerto rico??? If he went back to puerto rico he would still be american right?
That moment when Otto Octavius managed to live a better, more healthy, and more mature life as Peter than Peter himself ever did.
Except for the whole fascism thing.
@@OtakuD50 Look... to be fair, the spider bots patrolling the city was a really good idea.
@@OtakuD50 Surveillance and a private army isn't exactly the same as the the bald meatball's deal.
For all his faults, Otto was legitimately trying, and recognized his faults. We should all be so lucky.
@@darryljack6612 sure the got hacked and may count as violating the privacy of people
BUT... they were good at reducing crime.
Yes. Peter should grow up. Miles should be allowed to handle the teenage/college years adventures while Pete handles the rigors of balancing adulthood (marriage, kids, job, etc) with his superheroics. To watch him fail over and over and over again and learn no lessons as a, what, mid-20's to early 30's year old man is just... sad. It's not fun. It's repetitive and depressing. Let the man be happy. Let the man grow.
Goddamn right
Peter is eternally 26-28. Even Batman has been “aged-up” but his body has been literally and metaphysically reset to mid 20s and early 30s. His “aging body” is always mentioned but he looks early 40s at most.
Also, let mayday be canon again already!
@@superjlk_9538 the physicality isn't the issue. It's not being allowed to learn from mistakes like a reasonable adult. Pete acts like he's 15, but he's as you said, eternally almost 30.
I agree. I'm fairly confident that the majority of the ASM readers out there are of an age where they want to see him keep going in life. Miles is there to be the awkward teenage superhero now.
The fact that younger generational characters filling Spider-Man's original niche (e.g. Ms. Marvel) are being sacrificed for the sake of Peter's arrested development is proof positive that Marvel Editorial's Midlife Crisis is suffocating not just Peter Parker but the rest of the universe as well
Not really because they actually didn't sacrifice anything if you payed attention to what's happening outside of Spiderman in the universe you would see that he's in his own bubble and everything is actually moving without him perfectly and they can easily bring back ms marvel which is what's going to happen because Krakoa exists
If you look at the cover picture for Tony's and Emma up and coming wedding you will be able to find kamala in the crowd hanging out
So nothing matters like always.
I'm happy that heroes comics (just dc and marvel) are dying because of that.
No one bought Ms. Marvel. She was DOA no matter how hard they tried to resuscitate her. You guys are acting as if Miles Morales is taking off when he's not selling a fraction of what Spiderman does. The Spider verse movies are fine but they're not touching Spiderman's movies any time soon. Age him up and you're killing off the most beloved comic characters of all time for someone unproven.
@@VirgilOvidI agree. I don't think Peter should be aged up, I just think he should move forward
@@VirgilOvidif hes unproven let him prove himself
I was young when I started reading Spider-Man comics and he was in a relationship with Mary Jane. I don't understand their desire to keep him young when young people literally don't care if he is or not. He's Spider-Man for crying out loud they're always going to love him. There's already a whole back log of old stories that nee readers can buy to witness his growth.
Probably because Peter's high school/college/young adult status always resonates with much younger readers. Including those who got into him through any of the movies. It's telling that Peter B. in Spider-Verse is the first time we've ever seen an older, middle-aged Spider-Man be an adaptation focus, NWH cameos aside.
Plus, if they just want to have a “Young Spider-Man”, Miles is right there. Peter being the seasoned older mentor figure who can retire with a happy family one day with Miles being the younger Spidey figure works very well as the crux of the Spider-Verse movies, and there’s no reason why that dynamic shouldn’t be carried over to the comics.
@@halfmettlealchemist8076 True, but for that to work, we need to see Miles age up a bit more. You know, go to college, find his own job and all that. Academically, Miles is still in the same position as his Ultimate self.
@@benwasserman8223 Agreed. Which is even more frustrating, as that makes it seem like the editorial is trying to paradoxically keep _both_ Spider-Men “young” and “relatable” to casual readers, which just makes everything even more confusing instead.
backlogs kind of suck tho for spiderman. the style is too "old". its never been an absolute banger like the original FF backlogs that are basically timeless
One thing I appreciated about Across the Spider-Verse was that one of the central themes of the story is about characters breaking the same old tired narrative forced upon them. “Canon events” and how Miguel believes every Spider-person is inevitably defined by them is a clear metaphor for (among other things) how many writers/editors believe that heroes can only be relatable or interesting through hardship and suffering, and how harmful that belief actually is to the very fabric of storytelling.
I noticed that too. As thought the Spider-people are at the whims of a malevolent god that demands tragedy at all costs and hates happily-ever-afters.
That whole plotline seems like a rant by writers with high time preference who would rather knock down the carefully built world so they can have their "super great" story *Now* damn the past or future.
@@davidmelon9409 And while Miguel (and the rest of the Spider Society, by extension) have accepted their fate to be trapped in an eternal cycle of tragedy and hardship - to the point where they are willing to doom themselves and countless other versions of them to this cycle out of the misguided belief that their very existence depends on perpetuating it - Miles, Gwen, Hobie, and the other “rebel” Spider-People reject the cycle and seek to break free from the concept of a universal/“canon” narrative so that they can define their own stories according to their own choices. It’s really fascinating stuff!
@@DIEGhostfish That is…not at all what I got from that. I guess it’s open to interpretation? Let’s just agree to disagree on this, I suppose.
@@halfmettlealchemist8076 I find authors who rant against canon exceptionally selfish and shortsighted.
Peter and MJ should never have split up. They ought to be married and raising a child or two, and Peter should be managing his own business or teaching high school but otherwise paying his bills and providing for his family. The notion that marriage somehow closes off story possibilities is inane.
Superman blossomed as a character when he married Lois and again when he and she had Jon; he's made an awesome husband and father along with still being a superhero.
trash MJ completely. I dont see how we can move forward w her
Zeb Wells/Marvel Editorial: HAHAHA! Oh, you're serious. Let me laugh harder. HAHAHA!
@@PychoJetBlack good thing zeb sucks butt chunks
So true!!
@@PychoJetBlack Absolutely 100% accuracy. Can't stand them.
I feel like the core of Spider-Man is the struggle of balancing his responsibilities. He has the weight of the world on his shoulders and he can't let himself fail. Keeping him in highschool feels such low stakes in comparison of fighting criminal empires or murderous psychopaths. Plus we have a younger Spider-Man as it is. We keep this up and Miles will grow up before Peter does.
That's already happened with Batman and Nightwing but you don't see much complaining. No reason to make a main character unrelatable to the vast majority of your audience for funsies.
Miles is already maturing faster than Peter did.
@@daverhoden445 and Nightwing matured faster than Batman did. Jon Kent matured faster than Superman (regardless how they did it). What's your point? Characters don't need to fight each other. When you do that the new one dies every single time.
@@VirgilOvid
Jon Kent is basically a prop of Tom Taylor who is just using Jon to continue his Injustice universe, which has fell out of popularity with many fans due to DC and WB games ignoring the Injustice series for 7-8 years.
@@VirgilOvidin fact I don't even think Tom Taylor knows what he wants to do with Jonathan Kent. He derailed the whole multiverse storyline with Jon and Ultraman. All so he could do a loose continuation of the Injustice universe.
The current Jon Superman six-issue miniseries it's already going downhill and is losing fans. The writing makes NO sense and Jonathan is written like a naive child in an adult body. Him trying to redeem the regime members and Injustice Superman is ridiculous considering the blood that they have on their hands.
I've always considered Fatherhood the most respectable responsibility a man can take. Peter balancing a real family life besides dutiful son with his world saving and crime fighting would make sense to me. Also having a kid would make sense as a source of his money troubles, Kids are expensive.
yes, great responsibility indeed. i find myself wondering if some writers just... can't figure out how to write a happy family.
@@marhawkman303 It's hard to find any trace of a lie in that sentiment! I personally wonder if that's why they took the axe to the marriage in such a ham handed and noxious manner.
Letting Peter be a family man would give weight to the money trouble he "somehow" consistently has. That could be made relatable by having him work at a science lab while trying to slowly revamp Parker Industries as a grassroots organization dedicated to young people.
@@idongesitusen5764 Yeah, being a family man isn't cheap. having a 1 bedroom apartment is.... peanuts in comparison.
Yeah it seems like the editors don't trust the writers to do interesting stories with a family and they don't trust the audience to be able to relate to them.
One of the frustrations I've had with status-quo changes since OMD is that they feel more like each era is its own gimmick rather than an ongoing character journey.
Peter is the CEO of a company? Is it because he knuckled down, improved his financial knowledge and built up a business over many years? No! It's because his body was taken over by Otto, who did those things and when Peter came back he just took over.
Norman Osborn is a good guy and Peter's friendly boss! Is that because he underwent a difficult arc of self reflection and realised the destruction he's wrought isn't what he wanted, finally seeing the light in Peter's way?
No! He had his evil literally shot out of him by a magic gun.
It's not like either of these examples weren't following up on previous storylines, yet neither change came from the character's own agency.
MJ and Peter don't even get to break up because of relationship issues they might face, it's the devil! Or whatever alternate dimension thing Paul is about.
Someone described the constant return to the status quo at the end of the run as putting the toys back in the toy box. Maybe that's appropriate because more and more it ends up feeling like being invited over to watch someone else play with their toy set. They clearly have a story going on in their heads, but you just see the characters being picked up and moved around while the player shouts dialogue you can barely follow the context for let alone get invested in.
Like I said elsewhere, I just think that the writing and editorial team is insecure about their romance and relationship writing skills. Which makes sense, wifey Mary Jane is too often just sat in her apartment worrying about Pete because of that lack of authorial vision, even in good Spidey storylines like Maximum Carnage.
Personally I think having MJ be involved local politics would fit with her vibe, after all she's always been a willful free spirit type that isn't afraid to speak her mind and I don't see that changing because of a ring on her finger.
@@fluidthought42it’s cuz they’re all man babies and can’t write a responsible relationship they can’t even fathom
"Being married and having children is the death of a character's ability to be interesting" is SUCH a divorced dad line of a thinking and it makes me feel really bad if any of those writers have family that have to deal with that energy from them
I think it is a tie between editors seeing themselves in Peter and not wanting him to grow up because that would mean that they have to grow up, and a need for brand synergy between comics and other media, since movies and cartoons tend to show him as a younger man. It's basically all bullshit, though, since Spider-Dad from Across the Spider-Verse was the best thing to happen to Peter since Life Story.
Damn right, every word of it.
Or alternatively, they're unable to let Peter grow up because they themselves are stuck in a perpetual child-like mindset.
I mean, it really displays a lack of either imagination, perspective, or narrative courage to try something new with the character.
These are absolute facts, recently I've been wondering the same thing
The sad part is, Peter doesn't need to "grow-up" to be a responsible and awesome dad. Pete's always goofy self, gives off huge Dad joke vibes, in a 40 year old body.
Plus we’re also at a place where a lot of comic book fans are in that age group where marriage and kids can feel relatable to us again. We grew up with Peter Parker in many forms since the animated show and now are ready to see his next step. I feel like we’re in the right place for a new excess and next step, and DC has kinda shown it can do this well with Batman and Superman right now
And a lot of people who actually buy comics may be more likely to do so just to own a feel good family moment or two with our favorite characters.
Batman has been the same since Frank Miller in the 80s
@@steakcrust558Batman has a son now.
@@Superninfreak true, but that hasnt changed him in a significant way
@@WindyPoplars95 One of my personal favorite moments in comics in general, and a true highlight of MC2 was when Pete decided to have April come and live with him. See, Norman Osborn, in one of his many Goblin plans, had created a modified clone of Pete's daughter May. This clone eventually decided to go by the name April. Well, April was created as part of a plot to destroy Pete... but April chose to be a good person and not do as Norman wanted.
Which creates a rather touching moment when April gets welcomed into the Parker house. Pete and MJ may not like that Norman created a clone... but... April needs to live somewhere, and this way they can give supervision.
I'd love for Peter to grow up in the comics... not just for storytelling sake, but because if Peter grows up, future incarnations of Spider-Man/Woman can be organically introduced. Mayday Parker's Spider-Girl, Miguel O'Hara's Spider-Man, Miles Morales' Spider-Man, these are all Peter Parker's potential successors that get relegated to different timelines or continuities because the mainline Earth 616 is perpetually stuck in limbo... They needed a whole multiversal war with Dr. Doom just to make Miles and Peter able to coexist in one universe... just so that Peter could remain perpetually young...
They all have space to exist in the ultimate-verse or some other multiverse. Cycling in new characters replacing ones people are attached to doesn't end well for anyone involved. Miles thrived having his own space but look at how things turned out for all the otherd who tried taking over the mantle.
@@VirgilOvid DC seems to have been able to do it when they actually tried.
The Flash - Barry Allen, Wally West, Bart Allen
Robin - Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake, Damian Wayne
@@looneypenguExcellent point.
If Bruce, Clark, and Logan can have kids; Peter can too.
Mark Grayson
@@ecantu2301Darkwing Duck 😂 .
But seriously he had a kid before any of them. ❤
Bruce, Clark, and Logan have always been adults. They haven't aged either.
Technically Logan could be Bruce and Peter's Granddad
@@VirgilOvid what's your point? Peter grew up to be an adult and got married in the 70's until OMD
Heck he has kid and is married in across the spider verse and Renow your vows and Spider Girl.
Why are people so afraid of grown up adult Peter Parker? Peter B Parker ended up being one of the most liked versions of Spider-Man.
It really is interesting to me how well Superman has moved on to this "Superdad" mode, which may work better as he's always been a "paternal" type character, and it's even spinning off it's own "Bad Superdad" genre, as seen in Invincible and Jupiter's Legacy! Speaking of Superman, remember that interview where both the EiC of Marvel and DC were asked which character of the others would they most like to poach, and the DC head immediately said, "Spider-Man" and went on about what a perfectly designed character he was...which, given that Marvel was in the process of changing up some things in his status quo, may have been thinly veiled shade thrown at them...
What character did Marvel want from DC?
@@PychoJetBlack Batman I'd wager.
@@PychoJetBlack The Marvel head (Jemas, I think?) gave a typically corporate answer, along the lines of "No one! Here at Marvel, we have ALL the best heroes!"
YA novels have the same thing as manga, that they don't have this invulnerability complex that panders to all these middle-aged campaign veterans, who used to patrol foreign countries while donning Punisher keychains.
There's an understanding that surviving the battle roayle and being remembered for it is more of an exception, than a just the outcome every "hero" is kinda entitled to. Because that's how it is in real life, you can cry all the crocodile tears you want when most of your platoon members in a real war against a genuine threat, are not there to be remembered by their non-existent children. It's pretty silly to chase the dragon of relateability, when your starting premise is so laughable. But, why make stories for people who won't be growing old reading your comic anyway? The money dries up as soon as he vetearn's benefit.
There's anime like Alice adn Zoroku, Hinamatsuri, Barakamon, and Mob Psycho 100 all with cool uncles to varying degrees.
I really liked the "Renew Your Vows" miniseries, not really a fan of MJ sharing Peters powers but I really liked the whole, Peter focusing on protecting his kid and her making mistakes but unlike her dad who was figuring it out on his own she has someone there to help despite the fact that they but heads. Plus, now Peter has a whole slew of new problems and challenges to overcome.
I honestly liked MJ with powers, it was different. But idk if I'd make it canon in a mainline series. But it would make sense for their kid to have powers though.
Was the first Spidey series I read in DECADES and it was fun and entertaining ❤
I for one; have always been a fan of Spider-dad, even when I was younger. There's this part of me that just really liked the idea of Peter making small steps in his life that overall changed his status quo, but still let him be Spider-Man.
Mayday also just needs to be a full on character again; rip off the baind-aid and lets see where the writers can go when they're not stuck with trying to keep Peter and his family in a very small box.
Mayday is life. The world needs more of her back in the comics.
What applies to Spider-Man pretty much applies to every superhero character in comics. They need to let the characters grow and change (preferably slowly and naturally as they please). And then if new writers come around and want to "go back to past status quo", they can do a flashback story, or an elseworlds. It's painfully obvious that the comics are struggling with spinning their wheels back to "status quo", while not burning through all the good ideas and good will they build up.
I don't think certain core elements should be tossed out, but definitely good for them to grow.
Depends how you approach it. Marvel seems to be interested in more of a Charlie Brown dynamic for Spider-Man - the Peanuts cast remained young children going through mostly the same sorts of stories for 50 years, and people loved it.
In some cases, they can even make the elseworlds Canon eventually, like how Miles is now in the main mcu in comics
New characters don't sell. Your fanbase doesn't want to get ride of decades of world building. There's no point aging up characters with well fleshed out stories for new ones that aren't so great. Plus no one wants to see their favorite hero old and decrepit dealing with aging.
@virge4321 True about most new characters, but we also don't like seeing the marriage destroyed either
There’s a theory that the reason Mephisto destroyed Peter’s marriages, because eventually May Day will find a way to destroy him… That would be a cool story to bring a Continuity. I hope Peter and MJ get back together, and I’m usually not big into kids, but I’ll even take a young May Day, I really enjoyed the renew your vows, storyline and collected each issue as it came out
That's what the Nick Spencer run's finale suggested. Though other people think editorial forced Spencer to shift his arc's plot from erasing OMD to Sin's Past in the final issues. Which, given the amount of time he alluded to Mephisto and OMD in the story, makes a bit of sense.
Memphisto dead at the end of the last avengers run with every version of him being killed and blackheart inherenting Memphisto's position
And both Memphisto and black heart fuck with people for the sake of fucking with people because there it brings them happiness to see someone willingly fuck up there lives it's there whole mo
Not whatever Choosen one bs that Spiderman writters keep writing
And we _could_ have gotten that story, but _nooooooooooo_ ...
Goddamnit Marvel.
I'd like it if that story sort of over time started to look like more and more of an inevitability _because_ of Mephisto's actions. Like they got back together and had the kid at the right time because he interfered before, at some point he might kidnap her leading to a big rescue arc ending in say Magik offering to teach May Day magic so that she can defend herself, putting another piece of that prophesy into place, and so on so that eventually it would be Mephisto's own meddling that results in his undoing. Just my two cents.
@@GhengisJohn Memphisto is dead
And magik isn't that friendly towards strangers and she wouldn't seek responsibility of someone's child when she pretty much abandoned limbo completely
I grew up in the 90's where Peter and MJ were married and the animated series lead to their wedding. To me, Peter's struggles were relatable but there was that element of hope in having someone special in your life to help you through. One More Day came around and spit on that idea and the Spider-Man comics have been tainted ever since.
OMD and also Zeb Wells' run have showed us not to get invested in any relationship Peter may have (with MJ or anyone) because it ultimately won't lead anywhere. This especially hurts after Nick Spencer's run had their relationship rekindled only to be ripped away again.
So yes, I would love to see Peter grow up and be happy, but it seems Marvel's decree that he be perpetually miserable. We have Miles now, so there's no reason we can't have both a family man Spidey in Peter and the coming of age story with Miles.
Nick Spencer’s run seemed to be heading towards undoing One More Day until editorial realised what was going on and squashed it. We were _this close_ to greatness 😭
@@philiphunn194 I doubt he would have undone it, but it at least acknowledged it and added Mephisto's real reasoning to erase Mayday so she wouldn't oppose his rule. But we got Sins Past erased, so we'll take victories where we can.
I genuienlly want Peter to be a dad and have those adventures you mentioned. Running late for his daughter's recital, keeping his superheroing a secret, the anxiety of seeing if and when the kid's show signs of powers, one kidnapping here or there but not too much. It's not that hard. Editorial just doesn't want it because they are hyper-fixaded on a single Peter Parker jumping from relationship to relationship and being miserable. I will never EVER forgive Quesada for OMD, and if and when it does get undone or they find another way to be together, I will be all the happeier.
You and me both, man. I'm STILL angry about OMD, and I wasn't the biggest fan of the marriage at the time that story came out.
@@spideylibrarian Would you have simply wanted a divorce between him and MJ? What didn't you like about the marriage?
@@OminousArtist I think it had more to do with my feelings about MJ at the time. I felt like she was more of a liability than an asset to Peter back then. I suppose to some extent I still feel that way, but I also get why they work (or would work) a little more now. And yes, I'd much rather they have divorced, or gone their separate ways organically than the diablo ex machina we got at Quesada's hands. I feel like if you're going to undo a marriage, then damnit that's not a trivial thing you wave a wand at. Show your work, show your readers the pain that would be involved.
Yeah, I still have some lingering resentments over how Quesada handled all that.
Peter did grow up over the decades; first starting as a high school kid, going to university, getting that job as a photographer, dating women, marrying, then almost had the kids and BAM a neverending stream of reboots and retcons started rolling in. I used to love Spider-Man comics when I was a kid but I just gave up on them after One More Day. It erased decades of character growth.
I started reading Spider-Man when he was married to MJ. I don't understand how Peter being married makes him "not relatable" but having to sell pictures of his alter ego to a boss who'll make him look bad just so he can pay his rent is different. Him being married, having a kid, having to pay rent, and everything else are specifically what I love about him. Even as a kid, I could understand that he had to put up with a lot of shit that was just regular life. He wasn't making choices between good and evil. He was making choices between good and getting the respect of his peers. Between good and showing up for his loved ones. Between good and making life even a little easier for himself. There was tonnes of drama with MJ having to cover for him at cost to herself, or simply worrying about him or being lonely. I loved those stories as a kid. It's bloody great and it's built-in to his attachments. It's always about weighing one responsibility against another. Give him more responsibilities. Watch him shine.
Yes, Peter Parker needs to be allowed to grow up.
At least a little.
Yeah, but Marvel won't let him.
(Captain America walks into frame) “So, you gave up your happy marriage to the devil.”
I always maintained Spider-Man Peter Parker should finally grow up and mature and move forward in the comics, especially because across the spider-verse and spider-girl mayday parker series and renew your vows proves that peter parker and Mary jane being married and having there daughter mayday parker spider-girl alive and kicking in any universe shocker actually works, and I think its time for marvel comics to finally pull that trigger and let peter parker grow up and become a dad and passing the mantle of Spider-Man to miles Morales Spider-Man could actually work and move his story forward which i would be all for that because that means we can finally have a happy ever after for Peter parker Spider-Man story and end his story with a bang and the next generation could follow miles Morales as there new Spider-Man and boom problem solved everybody wins, and if people want to read more Peter parker stories alongside Miles Morales then here's my solution have the main ASM book be about Peter parker and Mary jane raising there daughter mayday parker spider-girl as a child and have miles Morales Spider-Man teach peter parker and Mary jane daughter to learn how to control her powers and having them team up to kick ass and save the day would be amazing story while peter and MJ get to still be good parents and still be around to have fun adventures and boom problem solved everybody wins. That way both sides could be happy and nobody loses but that's my opinion on this entire topic as a whole with Spider-Man needs to grow up. :)
Fact on that
@@jacobrivera1721 lol indeed fact on that one hundred percent, especially because if superman batman and wally west could have there kids Jonathan Samuel Kent superboy as his little 10 year old self Damian Wayne robin and Irey jai west become a great team called the super kids then I think marvel should do the exact same thing but with Spider-Man as well and having him have his three kids Mayday parker Spider-girl benjy parker and annie may parker becoming great friends to Dylan brock and normie osbon and forming there own team would be fantastic and tons of fun at least in my opinion.
My response to editorial's fear that Peter will be unrelatable and boring as a married father is to look to Wally West. Over the decades, we've seen him go from sidekick kid flash to an immature The Flash, to gaining maturity as he grew into the mantle to finding love with Linda and eventually kids. He's now a married father with three kids and still has many interesting and engaging stories being told. People want to see their heroes keep growing. Arrested development is not related
Marvel editorial needs to take a good long look at Wally West.
I say let Peter grow up and be a Dad. He’s tackled many responsibilities. From high school, college, careers, relationships, and marriage. Let him tackle the life of parent is hundred percent new territory. I agree with you a 100%. And I hate how writers always have to make some excuse of Peter not being Spider-Man when he has kids. For some strange reason always being losing a limb. Funny because get a prosthetic isn’t that hard especially in the marvel universe. Even more hilarious that Peter is literally one of the smartest people in the marvel comics. You could still have him be Spider-Man. Take your time with him being a Dad with baby and later raise Mayday(for example), different stage through her life. Have Mayday come to her own as Spider-Girl down the road and be mentor by both Miles and Peter. Start up a Spider Family. Look Batman hes had multiple protégés and comrades throughout different points in his life and he’s still interesting as Batman no matter what age. Look the Dark Knight Returns, Bruce was around 60 or older, but still had a compelling story despite the age. Let the characters grow when it’s necessary in stories. Let Peter Parker grow.
I think that could be an interesting angle. have him settle down, have a marriage that sticks, and then focus on other spidermen for the teenage superhero angle, or maybe have another clone (this would not be the first time peter has been cloned) taking on the teenage superhero angle for peter, with the older peter still occasionally being spiderman, but with a more supporting and mentor like role (think an uncle peter). his children, born naturally or adopted (or perhaps why not both) living a life with a dad who is genuinely a good soul, but can also be a bit of a dork . he is stuggling to get used to being a dad, and while he enjoys it, peter is still willing to throw hands with supervillains for his family and freinds. maybe have it be that we get to see both original peter and the clone peter developing different relationships, so that way we can have original peter with MJ (potentially after MJ's current husband either seperates from her or sacrifices himself for her), and the peter clone who is younger, more outgoing, but is still a sensitive soul can go with Felicia. both relationships have different obstacles, but you get to see how both their relationships and their kids play out. note, this does not mean ben rielly does not exist, nor does it mean kaine does not exist. both of them have their own very distinct baggage that make them very different characters to peter, even though that means that another clone would be running around. there is already a Bunch of Spidermen and spiderpowered superheroes with similar abilities to spiderman running around, having a 2nd peter who is young, strong, energetic and boisterous while keeping the older peter seperate from his younger more boisterous self who can show off his smarts, skills, and experience while he gets to be a spiderdad, wise mentor, and occasional grizzled badass who will knock a criminal or supervillain through several walls if they dare try to go after his loved ones.
MC2 had the leg thing as the explanation for why Pete quit being Spider-Man. Barely came up other than that.
Peter Parker: *begins to grow up*
Marvel Comics: "We don't do that here".
Spider-man imparting wisdom to other characters never gets old for me, whether it’s hope summers, Franklin Richards, or his own kids
The character has so much to tell and so much to teach, I just hope he gets more chances to actually impart that wisdom
When writers say they're mad about a character being married, it just sounds like they want things to always be the same so they don't have to write new material.
Absolutely Peter needs to be grown up. The Marvel writers continue to make him young just to retread familiar stories Spider-Man has gone through (I.e bringing back dead characters who should really just stay dead). Parker growing up and becoming a mentor and a father is best choice for him to explore new avenues of not just his character but also Miles Morales (something Spider-Verse is excelling at).
Thank you for posting this. Comicstorian and others recently did a similar videos. I hope more prominent comics youtubers continue to speak out about this. Maybe Marvel will start listening.
As a side note the current storyline has completely ruined MJ's character in my opinion and they made her look like a complete b word. She pushed Peter back to protect him, he pissed off all his friends to get back to save her, and she just decides that she no longer loves him and she loves the guy she met there instead. Complete BS.
ya, and the way theyve handled Mj for the past 50 years, just kill her off or get rid of her, or make Peter a divorced dad that has to handle moving on without her
Mayday is one of my fave characters. I grew up reading her comics back in the 90s. The funny thing to me is, the issue isn't that Pete has to be single or married. It's that they just want to recapture all the best, first moments but they can't. You'll never get another Death of Gwen or "if this be my destiny" coz they've already been done. As much as people hated Dan Slott, at least he attempted some new stuff with Superior Spider-Man. He just had a bit of issues sticking the landing as ending a story is tough. I haven't read a Spidey comic in so long and I think I get more enjoyment out of the adaptations now as they can be fresh.
As a dad myself, I find myself enjoying the father/child characters more than anything else. It’s more relatable, even villain dads are more appealing. It gives the character something personal to fight for and protect, either directly or indirectly.
I enjoy seeing an Across The Spiderverse Peter as a dad with Mayday. Feels like Peter grew with me even though I'm an uncle, not a parent since I grew up with 1994 SpidermanTAS.
Spider-man like Hal Jordan and Johnny Storm in my mind are all characters that should grow up or be in a mentorship role or establish their own lives. Its unfortunate because Johnny Storm several times has matured, ironically when he was married to Alicia(Lyja), that had been undone because he is meant to be the hot headed, sarcastic character that isn't so serious, but it always sacrifices any development he gets.
I mean Tomasi and Gleason's run of Superman shows that having a family can make a great dynamic and new challenges for a hero beyond something to punch. I argue the stakes are greater on a familial and heroic level with these changes.
They gave Deadpool and Venom children and those specific runs where they are introduced are arguably liked by many people.
Johnny 100% should have stayed with/been put back with Lyja
Also Mark and Eve have Tara in invincible, Clark and Lois have John in Superman, Bruce and Taila have Damian in Batman, Eddie and wade have kids,
It’s not for Peter
@@DIEGhostfish It only makes sense after the retcon as all that connection would still be there it just would be needed time to rekindle. I never finished all of Defalco's run to see how it all panned out.
@@Ashguy733 What new retcon?
@@DIEGhostfish Its not new, I am more referring to Tom Defalco making Alicia being a Skrull while married to Johnny where there was nothing beforehand to indicate she was a Skrull.
Could you imagine Miles mentoring Mayday? I’d love to see that interaction as Miles becoming like an uncle to her and his younger sister and mayday being friends growing up.
My opinion: Spiderdad & Mayday should be the future of this franchise. Everyone that still wants a young, free Spiderman has other options, notably Miles Morales.
Look at Miles' sales numbers and get back to me. No, fanservice movies don't count, we're talking comics.
Oh absolutely! I think his arrested development ALL started when they "killed" Mayday. It didn't hit me how upset I'd be with the marriage removable until I realized that years of comic stories have been so... Stagnant.
Now I'll do anything for Mayday and Annie to be in universe, as sisters, I even want to push my luck by adding April (Mayday's clone) and Benjy to, have an entire family.
If you let me write it (I have ideas), I'm gonna go nuts with it, hell, I'd even get a entire like minded staff to get more ideas and expansions in it... Let us cook so editorial doesn't have too.
Rant over lol
I think the problem is keeping Spider-Man in a character limbo. He could get married, or he could be a life long bachelor with a new love interest every few years, but it needs to be moving forward.
I would like to see more of an older spider man like what we got in No Way Home w Tobey Maguire. Give him crippling body pains to show he is physically older, and put him in the mentor role for Miles to try and guide him and make him stay out of life's pitfalls
@@steakcrust558
I remember hearing about Peter being a science high school teacher for a bit. I also remember hearting that the writer for that arc wasn't very good, but having Pete the science geek be a high school teacher with a young kid is great way of making him relatably broke, if that's the angle they still want to go with him.
@@fluidthought42 It's a really good arc, actually. The storyline involves Pete noticing problems with some of his students (one's homeless, another has a brother in prison after getting caught by Spiderman, etc) and he goes out of his way to help them and nurture their gifts. The author was abused as a kid and discouraged by his parents from following his passion for writing, but he was encouraged by his high school teachers, and you really feel that in the story.
I disagree on the writer not being good. His run was generally pretty fantastic. The only issues I had with him were:
1: He brought in supernatural elements to Spiderman's origin, which I don't think works very well.
2: He's the one who breaks up Peter and Mary-Jane (though this is because he was forced to by management).
@@ThejollyFrenchman
Hey, I can hold a grudge while giving credit where it's due. It's like walking and chewing bubblegum.
I like what the Insomniac games do with Peter. He starts off older and more experienced and his relationship with MJ. Miles pops up and Pete is free to do stuff like actually go in a vacation. Not necessarily replacing or passing the torch, but more as making it so he's always needed and others can somewhat fill his shoes.
I just wish writers would stop making Peter extremely miserable for the sake of constantly trying to shake things up. And also stop the love triangle with Black Cat. I'm tired of it. Just move ON. 😭
Agreed! Marvel needs to just let Black Cat move on from Pete and get a girlfriend already, they both deserve better than getting yanked around like this
That's more editorial's doing than the writers.
the editorial team involving Spider-man are pretty much the true villains for Spider-man because every time he tries to better his life, they pull the rug from under him
The current run of spider man has only made me go back to the renew your vows comics and the original spider-girl comics. And while Peter does strike me as the kind of guy that would put his family first above being a super hero, I honestly think him having a super hero family would be the best outcome for him. Not only handling a more adult responsibility, but also having a child that can learn how to be a hero without that tragedy, symbolizing the growth and impact Spider-Man has on the world, a reward for everything he has done throughout his life.
imma just say it, if the writers think giving spidey a happy life makes him "boring," they're bad writers
I constantly feel like "Peter Parker graduating from high school so early in his run" has to be one of Marvel's biggest internal regrets. It seems like they just wanted Peter to stay a teenager, or a young adult, and as such they always try to avoid things that would clash with Peter being treated like a youngster (like being married, or a father).
It is getting to a point where it might get weird to see Peter still acting like he's an insecure 15 year old, when he's supposed to be, like, in his mid-20s. Imagine seeing, in real life, a 25 year old still acting like a teenager, or at least acting like he has yet to move on to what he was like in high school.
MY Spider-Man will always be the JMS version in early to mid 2000s Amazing Spider-Man. Unfortunately, that run ended with One More Day and it doesn't feel like Spider-Man has grown or moved forward back to that level of maturity since, which has been forgotten for nearly 20 years now.
Marvel loves its status quo for Spider-Man, but if DC can give Batman & Superman a son I think it should be fine. I can understand not wanting to write a baby forever, and aging her up to maybe a teenager which means Miles would be a grown man but they can work around it, just go to that different Universe where they age faster and tell stories that happen over there for a bit
Dc can afford to do reckless shit they can reboot marvel doesn't
Batman pushing 60 and is a shell of himself and can't fight crime they will easily just reboot him and the universe
Marvel wouldn't
Neither the 2 of them handle continuity the same
MJ: "How old are you?"
Peter Parker: "17".
MJ: "How long have you been 17?"
Peter Parker: "A while".
I’m glad people are still talking about this. We need to keep this up since I think Marvel is just trying to ride this out until we forget about One More Day. I really think One More Day needs to be undone. Heck Superman and Batman have children now that are staying. Spider-Man should grow up too.
It's certainly ironic. Marvel will gladly retcon just about everything in their universe... except the one thing people desperately WANT them to retcon.
If we were living in the best timeline, Peter would be a dad with MJ, Miles would be the Spider-Man while also mentoring Mayday Spider-Girl and Dylan Venom
I think Peter should be allowed to grow up, have kids and genuinely be happy/ move past his stress trauma. It feels like the fans who object to Peter moving on are stuck in a trauma bonding nostalgia loop where Peter needs to be constantly miserable in order to rise above it, like Batman during that 2016 marriage fakeout event (I'm still salty about it but moving on).
Joe Q/ the other marvel staff shouldn't have taken their real life struggles with marriage out on the characters unless it's fanfiction. It's also why people were PISSED thay Peter could own and run his own successful company and actually have enough money to pay his bills/ not struggle for once in his life. Just let the guy be happy and open the shenanigan door to fatherhood
People wanting him to grow up are the ones stuck in a nostalgia loop. They can't let go of something they've grown out of. Instead of moving on they want the characters to be theirs and only theirs. Spiderman has been a best seller for multiple generations for a reason. He's s character new fans can relate to and old fans can loom back fondly on. Don't cling to the past and demand everything be catered to you and only you. Grow up and let him go.
@@VirgilOvidbro we get it you want peter to be some lame ass loser forever
I was confused that Peter held onto Otto's business more than anything. Being a CEO doesn't seem like Pete's style, unless it's like super small scale business that I dunno creates and prints 3d molds or an analysis lab that is used for super science gigs at night. Small business owner Pete I can see fitting him more easily, and less Stark/Wayne flavored.
I appreciate that they brought both Ben and Mayday into the new Spiderverse movie. Hopefully their popularity will make the writing team in charge of the Spider-Man comics realize how much we want a proper Spider-dad story with Uncle Spider-Ben and so on. I would love that, but alas, one can only hope
"The deal with Mephisto is symptomatic of a bigger problem for the character, and the people who write him: The unwillingness for the character to become an adult".
- Lewis Lovhaug
I was introduced to Spider-Man in the 90s animated series. In which he was graduating college and getting engaged to Mary Jane. I vividly remember when the Raimi Spider-Man film was coming out thinking "Why are we in high school? Spider-Man is 30." and that "Spider-Man is 30" (also btw the age I deem Dick Grayson) has been how I view the character for at least 20 years. So every moment of adaptation, and regression has been objectively frustrating. Until Into The Spider-Verse & Peter B Parker. Finally Spider-Man was able to not just be an ouroboros of "High School, maybe College, MJ, *RESET*, Repeat." And the defining characteristics of Peter Parker remain intact with Peter B Parker. He's still a schlubby, immature, down on his luck, quippy, likeable oaf despite also being a literal genius. It's the most at home I've felt with the character since I was a child.
Not to mention the diversification of the Spider-Man character & concept allowing for room to let Peter Parker be more than a stunted manchild forced to try to recapture the "glory days" (read Lee/Ditko, which is not my glory days & I'm old now). Teen Spider-Man exists now, literally in Miles & emotionally with Kamala Khan (well done screwing that one up Marvel "time of commenting"). There's tens of thousands of stories waiting to be told if you'd just let them go forward. And even if those stories aren't Pete & MJ are together & having a child and the stories are Peter is CMO of Stark Industries & he's engaged to, I dunno, Johnny Storm or Carlie Cooper, or someone new. As long as it's created from a real place & organic & not a mandate (editorial or personal) then it's growth. Not repetition.
TL;DR
Fuck yeah let Peter Parker grow up! Because when he isn't he's an awful character to try to care about.
As long as responsibility exists, no matter what he will be Spider-Man only death can stop him being Spider-Man
I've always referred to Peter Parker not being allowed to grow-up as being the Peter Pan Syndrome. This is especially true in non-comics media, but Peter should be allowed to grow up. I thought dissolving his marriage was a horrible idea - and still think so to this day.
Yes characters should change and grow. THAT is what makes them relatable.
I was in high school at the time when Peter married Mary Jane. I was all on board with it because it felt like Peter was growing up with me. I can see the argument against it, but at the same time there was a time when Mr. Fantastic wasn't married to the Invisible Woman. They just carried on and told stories about that married couple. Why not with Spider-Man? He could have still been married and have a youthful appeal by telling decades worth of stories about a young married couple. Ah, such was not to be.
I like the idea of Spider-Man semi retiring but still keeping his ear on police dispatch comms, waiting for a serious enough event that Miles and other successors can’t handle before he swings out as the “big gun”, to tilt the odds back in the other Spiders favor. I also imagine he’d occasionally hit the town as Spider-Man just to stay in shape, and do research and detective like work for other Spiders that they might not be able to do; reading monthly science journals, breaking down complex blueprints the others might find on their adventures, examining samples discovered at crime scenes.
Theres still so much a Father Parker could still do.
I'll never understand why editors hate growing up a charchter, like Pete. I think you can tell great stories about Peter being married to Mary Jane and have kids, while still being Spider-Man. Kinda like when Bruce was "killed" by Darkside, I would have loved if they continued Dick as Batman, and Bruce be actually dead
The dynamic of a well-adjusted Batman and a lunatic Robin was so fun. I wish they'd kept that going a bit longer.
@@philiphunn194 Grant Morrison actually stated once that they would have written Dick Grayson Batman and Damien Wayne Robin for 5 more years, but DC had them bring back Bruce Wayne early.
@@mttylerdurden9 Really? That would have been awesome - I feel bereft now 😭
Characters not growing up mostly stems from Marvel & DC higher ups thinking that kids won't read the book once they get married and have kids, and thus they keep the character younger to have that "Infinite Child Money". Ironically kids money is being spent on Manga and not American comics, because manga characters are actually treated like.....people and characters(weird concept I know).
@@williamradke4290 And, as best I can tell (not a huge manga reader here), manga often tell consequential storylines that have big developments for their main characters. It's like they're not afraid to actually let life happen to their protagonists.
I think the problem with Spider man not growing up is that since so much of his stories have explicitly been about taking responsibility and balancing his superhero life with his personal one… the fact that all of his attempts to do that keep falling apart after 60 years, kinda makes it feel like he’s in a constant unending spiral of failure and it’s just sad a this point.
And look some characters can get away with being the perpetual young irresponsible bachelor (nobody is making petitions for Johnny Storm to settle down) but that has never seemed like someone Peter is or wants to become.
I think the Spiderverse movies really hit the nail on the head with Peter B Parker in regards to how modern Peter feels.
No matter how young they draw him or how much they retconned his life experiences he no longer FEELS like your quirky, relatable but luckless 20 something friend Peter Parker, he feels like your 40 year old divorced buddy from college who is “Such a nice guy, he’s just fallen on hard times recently. Can he just sleep in our couch for one more day, honey?”
Yes. It feels like an unending case of man-child syndrome.
Honestly a story arc of Pete crashing on the couches of different superheros sounds great. He'd be too loud for Daredevil, too messy for Ben Grimm, too annoying for Doctor Strange etc.
I feel like so many of these issues with Peter's romances could have easily been fixed. Like, with the Gwen problem, she could have just been written better if she was so unlikable. After all, that managed to be done when it came to Spider-Gwen and the Gwen from the first amazing Spider-Man film, so it's not that difficult to do. And I'm pretty sure undoing Peter's marriage is one of the DUMBEST decisions in comic history, second only to the romance between Batman and Batgirl in DC. Like, Peter Parker can still be relatable, but also be a husband and a father, considering many marvel needs who grew up with the character have also managed to marry and have kids of their own, so I that aspect, he would still be relatable. On top of that, Spider-Man is not a character that is meant to be a Self insert. After all, he's not a freaking isekai Protagonist. So like, Marvel's gotta clean up their act with Spidey for crying out loud.
Spider family being a thing like the super family I think would help so many of the Spider-Man related characters and the multiverse characters people want in canon find a spot to all have stories together
What do you think should be Peter's status quo?
Edit: lmao I phrased this so awkwardly
Married to MJ with his rugrats Mayday and Annie climbing on the ceiling while working as a scientist or college professor with a reasonable salary while close to and maybe working with Miles and his brothers Ben and Kaine as they all operate as Spider-Man.
I've posted this before on other platforms but my idea for the spider man related characters are
Have Peter be a teacher whose married with kids.
Have Miles be the teenage/college aged spider man alot of fans are used to and who younger fans can relate to.
Have Ben in Las Vegas be the adult freelancer who can be used as editorials punching bag and who struggles and ish.
Have Kaine in Houston as Scarlet Spider again.
Have Jessica Drew be removed from the spider verse and just be the avengers member and secret agent.
Have Silk get a bigger role and maybe mentor Peter's kids.
Spider-Gwen in her own universe again.
Anya Corazon maybe be partners with Silk? Or have her be the multiversal traveller that people think Miles and Gwen are.
I’m not going to say that Peter’s life should be totally without conflict - he needs something to drive the story forward, after all. But at the very least, he deserves to be married to MJ, to have a stable job, and to be able to live a long and happy life.
I think he should move on to getting married. Though at this point, I'm so tired of all the pushing and pulling, I'd settle for "any" of his past girlfriends to get hitched to him. So long as the story getting there is good enough, and that they STICK WITH IT.
He deserves to be married with mj and have mayday and Annie, like it’s time for Peter to retire and let miles take over miles knows what he’s doing and he can do both and miles is a responsibility spider people!
I grew up reading Spider-Man when he was married. Sales were good, the stories were great, and I miss that dearly. Him being single now feels wrong, like a huge regression, he does not feel like where he is supposed to be.
I've been reading the strascinsky and romita jr. amazing spiderman run from the 2000's after morlun, and I'm loving those stories even more than the current ones, I love the superior spiderman arc and the parker industries also because is another layer of responsabilities for peter, and the stories where peter is still married to mary jane anre heartwarming, is spiderman with a more mature take.
YES! Bring back MJ & Peter. Good stories can still be written with a happy married couple at it’s core. The whole endless cycle of get together, break up, get together again, break up again, and so on, has been so overdone in all media. Everything with Peter is about struggle and perseverance in the face of incredible odds. Give him that piece of a happiness that gives him the reason it’s all worth while.
Going off on prob the easiest solution for the issue is having Miles be the younger character that Peter was when he first began. Gen Z and younger have 10x more relatability to Miles as he grew up in our era, he deals with our issues, and his family dynamic is particularly relatable to tons of kids, teens, and young adults alike. Spiderverse is proof of this. Miles is the younger generation Spider-Man which is okay! As for Peter who many Millennials and older Gen Z like myself grew up with, seeing Peter with MJ and casually growing older is almost engraved into our brains. We saw Tobeys Spider man grow old into graduating College, saw animated Peter’s marriage in the 90s cartoon, and were there for most of his later marriage (pre One More Day) in the comics which many consider to be one of his best runs. People who grew up with Peter want him to grow up with us, and I find it disappointing how Marvel refuses to let it happen. When I eventually have kids myself, I wouldn’t be surprised if Miles is the one they look up too because he is just that more relatable to a younger audience.
I am born after one more day… I’ve never lived in a world where Spider-Man was married but my gosh it’s my favorite era of comics.
Let Peter be a father already man. I’m 10 years away from being peter’s age and he hasn’t progressed once in my life.
I have a Old Comic where Spiderman is a GrownMan and Has a House Wife and Daughter
Undoing the events of One More Day, getting Peter together with MJ and letting him be a dad is the only thing that could possibly get me collecting new Spider-Man comics ever again.
I do feel that Spider-Man has suffered a nasty case of Arrested Development ever since One More Day. Heck, I know some people who claim that happened during the Clone Saga. One of the reasons the Clone Saga dragged on so long was simply because the writers were running out of ideas, and seemed incredibly reluctant to take the 'next step' in the character's development. Peter Parker had developed very slowly over the course of thirty years from a punk teen Ayn Rand enthusiast to a married man with a child on the way. The next step would have been to actually have Peter be a father, but it just didn't happen. Instead they reverted to type, and Peter coasted along in the nineties and early 2000's. JMS tried some interesting things with increasing Spider-Man's power level and making him a teacher, but then One More Day basically undid that entire run.
If I look at Spider-Man books since OMD, I notice little has actually changed for Peter Parker directly. If you think about it, the biggest events in Spider-Man since then happened 'around' Peter rather than 'because' of Peter. Superior Spider-Man was about Peter literally being replaced by Doctor Octopus. Then there was Parker Industries, which was created by Doctor Octopus, not Peter. The third one I can think of off the top of my head was the Spider-Verse, but that was about him interacting with OTHER Spider-Men. Even when Peter has developed cool gadgets or learned martial arts in Dan Slott's run, he never actually keeps using them, always reverting to a base point, making what he invented or learned temporary gimmicks rather than actual growth. Spider-Man no longer grows, he's like a hamster on a wheel, and the only thing that changes is the wheel he's running in.
Also, as an aside, "It was like ordering the MC2 from Wish" made me laugh so damn hard.
Marvel did have him grow up, then a miscarage and One More Day happened.
Keep Miles as the classic teen Spider-Man and have Peter grow
There was so much lost potential, adventures, misadventures, hijinks, KICKS( wait, no. Kicks are Bad!).
But honestly, you could have had peter work at Horizon Labs before him and MJ starting up Parker Industries in partnership with his former Boss Max and staffed with people he trust and works with as spider-man. Then, you can have all the crazy stuff around MJ being pregnant (for a second time if you stick with the stillbirth having legit happened) such as supervillian baby shower crashers or accidental body swap between Pete and MJ before the birth. You could have lost spider-baby loose in the lab setting off all the machines.
I and several now parent comic fans were ROBBED!
I love some of your ideas man, lost spider baby loose in the lab has so much potential.
I ain’t gonna lie. When ATSV came out this summer, I was very happy when I saw Spidey with his daughter. It’s about time he got everything he wanted.
They should definently have Peter grow up. Its ironic because I personally am not a big fan of kids and marriage, but I am a big Spidey fan and want to see him grow and be happy even if that means marriage and kids. Plus, Miles, Mayday and Annie May are such interesting characters that deserve to have the mantel passed on to them and to have their own adventures with Peter as their mentor. It just makes sense.
Peter and MJ should’ve have stayed married and have had Mayday, April Annie and Ben by now
Right now, we have a Spider-Boy running around who's seemingly been retconned into life, trying to recapture the energy of a Young Peter, while current Peter is an ever-suffering never-happy burnout because "reasons".
Can you imagine if Peter was still married, grown up and basically retired, while Miles is Spider-Man and a young Mayday is the teenaged Spider-Girl.
Can you imagine if Peter was allowed to finally be a man? Instead of an overgrown teenager, a case study for arrested development.
These old farts need to stop trying to hold on to the Lee/Romita college Spider-Man era and realize most modern audiences are tired of it and actually want character progression for Peter
And if they truly want to keep that lee/romita era they should seriously consider doing a universal reboot because at this point that stage doesn’t work for this peter anymore
I think he can and should move forward with family life. It takes responsibility to be a father, and he is powerful in that aspect.
I’m a 29 year old fan and has been reading SpiderMan since I was a teenager. I would like Pete to grow, embrace the responsibilities of adulthood, and to be happy with MJ and a child. Miles Morales is a perfect SpiderMan for the younger generation. We can have both as fans.
Fully agree. I've been saying this for years to all of my friends who still care to listen lol. Peter having the balance not only the responsibility of his job, with Spider-Man; but also being married, a father, and a mentor opens up so much potential, and possibilities for new Spider-Man stories. Marvel could even have it's cake, and eat it too with the miles being the new, hip Spider-Man with the exaggerated swagger of a young black teen lol.
Just have him and Mary Jane get remarried and have a child to move forward with the stories and for people who want to see young Spider-Man stories just bring back ultimate Spider-Man or just read Miles Morales Spider-Man comics!
Something has to change most definitely
Because I’m completely apathetic to spidey comic now
My intro to Spider-man was the 1960s cartoon I watched in the early 1970s in syndication.
I knew Parker to be interested in Betty Brant and not the other two.
I think Spider-Man renew Your Vows would be one of my favourite comics if it had been given a fixed length to have a complete arc. The way it was they basically forgot most of what happened in the first run then tried to go fast while not tying stuff up because they got cancelled at an awkward point.
The way it is now it’s still a pretty good comic where you can basically ignore surroundings stories
I feel like that was a good opportunity to bring the marriage into the main Marvel timeline after Secret Wars.
Too bad, Marvel wants Peter to be a manchild for the rest of his life.
This talk of Spider-Man "growing up" reminds me of the theory that Franklin Richards's, son of Reed and Susan, birth or sometime after it was the point where the Earth-616 universe ceased evolving in pseudo-real time as it had previously. I, for one, would enjoy it if you made a video discussing the topic sometime before the heat death of the universe.
Spider-Man fans genuinely make me sad because so many of them want Peter to never change and it is neither realistic nor good for his continued story. I wish so bad for Peter to finally find happiness and maybe even step down because there are so many stories that are now just like his. Miles, Gwen, Mayday, Miguel these are all just the other Spider's that can fill the gap he leaves behind but, people are afraid of change and they just want Peter to remain a constant.
it always baffles me when people talk about spiderman being relatable, because we all get bitten by radioactive spiders and have to balance our school and hero life
Another factor in writers/editorial pushing against the marriage is probably that people specifically want Peter and MJ to have a HEALTHY marriage, which is antithetical to the Spider-Man's traditional soap opera style of storytelling, where relationships exist to make the characters' lives MORE unstable and angst-ridden.
well you just use the drama to threaten the happy family life.
Just waiting for the day miles gets a kid and Peter's still exactly the same.. They'll do it too
If batman and superman can both be dads then Spider-Man can too i want mayday to be canon so so bad
Marvel can always go back to how it was during the 80/90’s when they had the regular titles ( Amazing, Spectacular ect) that had Peter as a married adult…and the MC2 line where they had a retired Peter who was a husband & father of his legacy character Spider-Girl/Woman…& they had a line of comics for younger readers Marvel Adventures Spider-Man that had Peter in High School with for quite a bit of the run arguably his best GF for in & out of the costume Sofia Sanduval…Keep Up The Outstanding Work Sasha 🖖🏾
I actually would like to see a comic where Spiderman is an adult, (whether or not he's married with kids), being both a superhero as well as working as a Scientist, self-employed business owner or whatever. Just as long as he can be an adult, relatively successful, (because he can't avoid having life kick him in the testicles, but that doesn't mean he can't have some wins), and able to not have to forever be stuck in Highschool.
If the writers have any talent they can pull it off, and maybe this time it will stick.
As someone who grew up reading Spiderman in the 90s and is now a Dad, I really love Spider-Dad. It's like me and Spiderman grew up together.
Spiderman isn't that young kid anymore. He's older, he's mentoring Miles, he's got an adult life and adult responsibilities. I would love to see Peter start a family and juggle Dad life with Spiderman Life.
If Peter is supposed to grow up as his books progress through the years then marriage and self-sufficiency should be on the table for him. Quesada is wrong and he will be wrong forever.
Hell even on the 90s cartoon they made it clear
"Well Stan we all have to grow up sometime I suppose, even us characters of fiction"
Been saying this for years. Don't ever need to see Peter in high school or college again.
I am a 90's kid and so PeterxMary Jane was the ship I knew best and loved, yes there were others but it just was ahead. Knowing all the What Ifs and such that honestly show they can be married and Peter can still have adventures tells me that he should be allowed to move forward. He's been around for 60+ years and not even the old legends of Superman and Batman have remained as banished back to square one as Spiderman (Though they try). Plus, both Superman and Mr. Fantastic are married and are parents, and get along with the super life just fine. I also just like the interesting family dynamics that could happen, I feel the Human Torch would just confidently strut in to being an uncle again while other Spiderman related folk can learn their place in the overall family :)
Wally West charted the exact course that Marvel chickened out of sending Peter down and proved it works really well.