Revisiting Chris Chan, the Internet's Monster - Your Questions Answered
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- Опубліковано 7 вер 2024
- This video is a follow-up to this one: • The HORRIBLE truth abo...
This video will revisit the dark story of Chris Chan and clarify a few important points.
#ChrisChan #lolcow #sonichu
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Christine Weston "Chris" Chandler (born: February 24, 1982 [age 40]), better known online as CwcvilleGuardian or Chris Chan, is an American UA-camr, vlogger, artist, musician, and cult leader known for creating the web comic series called Sonichu.
Chris originally identified as male, but came out as a transgender woman in 2016, and changed her name to Christine. Chris' internet career began in 1999 with the uploading of Sonichu comics to a personal website. She created her first UA-cam channel in 2007, which was around the time she became an infamous trolling target due to her comics and personal life. Christine has been noted as one of the first internet lolcows and one of the "most documented people online" because of her behavior both on and offline.
On March 17, 2000, Chris created the comic series Sonichu in a graphic design class; she wanted to use the characters Sonic and Pikachu on a CD cover, which wasn't allowed for legal reasons, so she combined features from Sonic and Pikachu to create a brand new character.[8] The first Sonichu comic was released on March 24, 2005.[9] She also created a virtual band called "Christian and the Hedgehog Boys", which featured characters from the Sonichu series as band members. 2 albums called Christian & the Hedgehog Boys and Christian & the Hedgehog Boys COMEBACK! were released in 2003 and 2009 respectively. The music was made by singing over pre-existing pop songs and changing some of the lyrics.[10]
Chris first gained the attention of several websites including 4Chan and Something Awful. Eventually in 2007, Encyclopedia Dramatica would make a page mocking Chris, and she would begin to leak private information about herself on Encyclopedia Dramatica, ruining her relationship with a friend in the process. This would grab the attention of trolls and fake girlfriends, which included Clyde Cash, CChanSonichuCWC, Ivy O'Neil, and Marvin. Chris has been ridiculed online for her art, views on women and homophobia, laziness, delusions, and narcissism, among other things. While there have been trolls who have attempted to help Chris change her life, some have negatively affected her mental health and well-being, such as BlueSpike, The Idea Guys, and Isabella Janke. Many people would become fascinated with Chris and begin documenting her videos and messages onto a fan-created website called the CWCki.
Scott Cawthon warned us
"Leave the demon to his demons. Rest your own soul; there is nothing else"
@JeffJeffsonthefunniguy isn't that true...
Huh a fnaf reference in a sonic video nice 👍
Cassidy:yep got that old man consequence Imma head out I not dealing with him
I’ve honestly always found Chris’ trolls more fascinating than Chris themself. Just the level of self delusion you have to have to convince yourself you’re helping someone by trolling them instead of enjoying escalating a bad situation. They went after Chris because it was *fun*, and had a nice little echo chamber of people egging them on. It doesn’t matter how reprehensible your target is, that says something about you and your values.
Yep. 2 wrongs don't make a right, and the people who relentlessly bullied, deceived & manipulated Chris online are worse people than Chris could ever be. That's not to say that Chris has never done anything wrong, but the worst things that Chris has done came after the online trolling had started affecting Chris's psyche.
Don't blame the trolls for what Chris has become. The trolls gave Chris the attention he has always asked for and used Chris as Entertainment. Its not their fault if Chris is too stupid and keeps falling for these guys. Every normal person would have left the Internet, but Chris just kept staying and in the end, ruined his life.
If you wanna blame someone, blame his parents. They made him into the monster he is and his mom got what was coming for her.
Now Chris is not just a lolcow anymore, but a literal motehrfker, an incestuous rpist. Chris will no longer be able to participate in a normal life and lost everything he ever had.
@@terron7840 People like you, who try to justify people relentlessly messing with a heavily mentally disabled person, are part of the problem. Both the trolls and Chris's moronic parents are the causes of why Chris's life has gone the way that it has.
@@Optimegatrongodzilla If you want attention on the internet, you get attention. Simple as that. Chris could have ended this cycle, but continued with his lunacy and look where he's now?
@@terron7840 Yeah, go ahead and blame it on the MENTALLY DISABLED VICTIM who craved attention due to not having friends, and the failures of their parents!
I don’t think people understand. There should NEVER be another Chris Chan. You shouldn’t even CALL someone the next Chris Chan. The creation of the original was the perfect, horrible storm of all the wrong conditions to make the first Chris Chan.
It's been thrown around so much in like 2017 I was called the next Chris Chan for saying my characters "felt like real people" even though they have almost two decades of stories. Made me laugh people didn't know writer's non-literally refer to their characters as alive.
Jadyn begs to differ.
It's really the most blatantly vile or pathetic people calling for another life to suffer for their amusement, because the one they already ruined has hit rock bottom.
@@thrusttheconehead5369 who the fuck is jadyn
@@Yzrch A commentary UA-camr that has been in some very deep stuff lately.
ua-cam.com/video/MGQq2o-tYo8/v-deo.html This video says a lot about her.
17:35 These internet controversies always seem to start with 'fun and games', whether it be light trolling or a simple prank. Some people need to learn where the line is and to tell themselves, "Enough is enough." The real tragedy is that this situation would never have gotten so out of control if a few key figures learned to real it in and call it a day.
The world is ableist & autistics are seen as the worst of humanity for existing. Can't fix malicious psychopathy or malicious narcissism
You are strongly assuming Chris wouldn't have been found by others. The trolls and Chris didn't exist in a vacuum. It may not have gotten as big. But Chris was always too messed up to not get found and exploited. You might think "what if nice people found Chris" they would've had the same reaction every reasonable person who met Chris. Either try to help and eventually give up because Chris is a brick wall. Or most often do what most people do when you see a guy who's muttering to themselves in a mall (which Chris did) or in this case making videos and websites for nobody yet talking like there's people there. Avoid the crazy person.
The only people who would've ever given Chris any attention long term were people who wanted to abuse them. Not being on the internet period was the only solution for someone like them
And if his parents actually tried to raise him, I hope he can get the help he needs if he ever gets out of jail.
@@legojay14so next let’s make sure people who fall for Nigerian scams lose access. Oh and take every tv and credit card from people who fall for televangelists.
I think by the time the internet discovered Chris, it was kind of too late for Chris to change in a meaningful way. His parents really screwed him up because they put him on this narcissistic loop of “I am always the victim because I have autism, and every time I do something unacceptable, it can be excused by my autism.” You can really tell by the Asperchu trolling, that Chris would not cave no matter how logical of an argument was made and would immediately shut down rather than actually learn or humbly accept that they were wrong. Someone with that kind of attitude or mentality doesn’t stand much of a chance once they’re an adult.
People always say "Chris should've gotten the help that he needed." And while I do agree, there is however a lot of evidence that shows that plenty of people tried to help him, but he was just incapable of accepting help.
As someone who also has mental health issues, ADHD depression, and PTSD, the world is often not socially oriented for those of us that deal with these issues on the daily. Additionally, as you said, it’s still relatively unknown just how exactly to diagnose and treat certain conditions. I for one have to force myself to do things, lest I sleep all day…😔
I agree, i have this things too and on top of that autism traits and one of them is chronic hyper sensitivity to pain, making mundane tasks uncomfortable and even extremely painful for me, and i got addicted (although i rather call this dependence as i intentionally started medicating and not got addicted because of recreational usage) to morphine. Now, opioid addiction, is something that's in the eyes of the society and medical community that's enough by itself to dehumanise me, doesn't matter that i did it because of the extreme desperation as medical system in my country is extremely outdated and noone wanted to help me, doctors i visited outright called me a liar when i was in immense pain and barely understood mine disorders, and i had no choice same with other self medication like hormonal replacement therapy and meds for anxiety that is so bad for me i cannot leave the home and would die from starvation, and given that i was homeless for over a year it's pretty safe to say, that if not before, for sure i would kms when i became homeless if i wouldn't self medicate, and this selfmed when i had money for it from the online sexwork, as i never was able to find a "normal" job, the selfmed proved to be extremely successful and proved everyone wrong when i literally started to go out everyday to the park, doing SPORTS when it was never possible for me and i was almost bedridden my whole life. now, my life actually crumbled down like over a year to two years ago and i was forced to stop hrt and other selfmed and was just left with morphine since i am physically dependent on it, due to a intentional firebombing housefire hate crime i suffered from, and a separation from my loved ones and death of my only friend, and subsequent homelessness, but i didn't gave up as i won with depression long time ago and i remember how happy i was when i was able to be medicated, i cried form happiness when i experienced life without pain and i cried from happiness just sitting in the park and looking at all the random small funny bugs that accidentally found their way onto my pants or shoes and was amazed by the sheer beauty of life, when something other than pain and suffering was possible for me to notice and experience, and i will never forget these moments and i will do everything i can to get there again, only things that will make me fail will be either imprisonment for an old case for weed possesion that ended up with a male prison sentence when i am transfemale, or going back ti homelesness again or being forced to irl sexwork because going back to either of these things will be enough for me to just break down, and right now it's just a matter of surviving in the same house with my abusive sadistic neglectful narcissistic mother, and somehow getting money needed for a computer so i could go back to earning money form sexcams and with the earned money investing in couple of the career paths i always planned that i will be able to perform and i have couple of good ideas that will let me break out of the sexwork-drvg dealing that i was always forced to survive, i was thinking about a crowdfunding but last time i tried because of the amount of bigotedness in my country i was just bullied and this and many other things and the way i was treated on the internet made me further isolate to the point I'm not talking or texting to anyone even on the internet, but why am i talkimg about this, i do because maybe its a cry for help but i just wanted to share that the case of chris chan is absolutely terrifying to me because i could've slipped to something similiar and become a lolcow because of my desperation for human contact, and i was one time doxxed and talked about on the chan site ehen i was younger, and i experienced bullying my whole life but if not for my social anxiety that prevented me from socialising and just made me isloate, i couldve easily become something's like a lolcow myself, it's absolutely terrifying when you realise how close you're your whole life from slipping when you're while life bullied and neglected and abused by your parents and the desperation for human contact with the cruelty on the internet that is so easily to experience, meeting the people that are bad for you etc, its just terrifying, paradoxically what kept me from going down a horrible path was the social anxiety i have, and only thing that let me be enough self conscious to bw aware of these threats was experimenting with dissociative drugs when i was 17-19 (im 23 now) that made me develop extreme introspection, and its just so scary because its enough to take these two things and you could easily get your life destroyed, as if my life isnt and wasn't bad enough, i can't even begin to comprehend what would be left of me if anything if i wouldn't free myself of bullies when i dropped out of school due to not being able to keep up due to my disabilities, it's just suffocating, only thing i wish is a safe place where i could be happy and away from all the mess that society is, an off grid house with some land that i could grow my own food in, poppies to make my own medicine and mushrooms and herbs for this purpose too, a solar panels and being able to thrive in my passions and ideas i always dreamt off, its sad and funny because if not for.my mothers neglect i would probably be now in a medical or psychology school, and soon have a degree ans easy life, it REALLY just boils down at the end of the day to parents and if they did the right thigs when you were growing up, i was unmedicated, neglected didnt went to special school and was called lazy when i showed symptoms of my disorders and Gaslit into thinking I'm making it up, even the constant pain i was experiencing that went worse and worse, im not even vaccinated for things becsuse my mother is a health nutjob. I wish to become everything that she's not and the fact that she's currently doing the same things to my siblings not learning from her mistakes because if her narcissism, just makes me sure of that. The only good thing she's done it showed me what to not be ever and what consequences it brings, but unfortunately because of that she never taught me what i should be and what i should do to survive in this world and instead of growing up i had to figure it out myself for past 5 years as i had to move out being jsut 17 ans somehow survive for the equivalent of 100$ a month (despite living in my country being 2-4x cheaper than USA) unfortunately no matter how desperate for change i am, i probably won't be able to get out of this mess by myself, as i never was able to survive by myself in the end of the day and for these 5 years i had to constantly rely on anither person it being a partner or a friend, and unfortunately most if not all of these relationships were toxic and unhealthy, but i learned that i truly am not able to survive on my own in this society in my current state thst becime worse and worse not counting the couple months of being functional while i was able to afford meds, i truly just hope that help will miraculously arrive in the right time before it's too late as I'm barely holding on, like it did all the other times because if it didn't it wouldnt be there to tell this anymore and it scares me (i barely survived this winter)
Thank you for clarifying your points on autism. I agree it's grossly unfortunate and inappropriate for Chris-Chan to have ever been a poster child for autism. If you ever want to learn more about autism, you have most of my contact details (as weirdly para-social as that might sound) and I'm always happy to have a chat.
I'm not sure autism is viewed all that differently then than it is now. When I was diagnosed 20 years ago, I was told I would struggle to live independtly, find a romantic partner or hold down a job. Today, I have a mortgage, I'm married with two kids, and I'm 10 years into my career.
Through support groups and the like, I sadly met a lot of kids and adults who repeatedly heard, "You can't do X, Y or Z because you're autistic." They believed it to the point they saw failure as a foregone conclusion and understandably gave up hope. Had I been diagnosed at a younger age, I might have easily adopted that mindset and never achieved anything. I can somewhat see why Bob wouldn't want that for his son.
How does that compare to now? As recently as 2022, I've heard podcasts of doctors with PhDs specialising in neurology openly describing and discussing autism as a "disease" that needs to be "cured". We have autistic people living in care homes where they are abused. Autistic people committing suicide because, to quote one note, "The world isn't designed for people like me." Only 22% of autistic people are employed, and that includes zero-hours, part-time, self-employed, etc. Autistic people in full-time employment? Probably less than 10%. Autistic people who live independently? Maybe the same or fewer.
I would agree that we have autism awareness, but not autism acceptance, not even close.
It's not parasocial, Webster, we've chatted enough, I'd happily consider you a friend.
@@ChannelPup Thanks man. Likewise. :)
You missed the part where they have the uncontrollable urge to fuck there own mom
Yeah thats, like a goo person that would be jesse gender, and yes even with the hogwarts attempt, you copuld neve make her looking bad. Because she is that good of a person. And aware and social competent. Dunono even with that,
Or loner box who is really reasonabl and that but content in the dirtback let. an did even a video rom eexperience on autism and radicaliation on gamergate. (autism doesnt mak you vunerable, but loniliness does)
Ther e ar great aces on the internet, even vaush, who is a good person but very controversal. And hated a lot or unreasonable reasons. Yeah thr is enough valid criticism, you dont need to make him a monster. He isnt.
I mean ther are way bettr aces o autism out there. ::( And yeah vaush is controversal but a good decent person thats just , very controversal.
It's his parents and peers who caused him to turn out the way he did, hopefully he can get the help he needs whenever he gets out of jail.
I binge watched the whole GenoSamuels documentary, and honestly, after the 10th episode I just wanted it to stop. It got too sad and manipulative, Chris got completely detached from reality and the trolls didnt know when to stop.
They never do. He could have taken his own life. They don't care.
@@A_UA-cam_Commenter I wouldnt be surprised if that was the end goal for some of them
@@A_UA-cam_Commenter
You ever heard of "an heroes"? If Chris did that, the torment wouldn't have stopped.
Chris was detached from reality at 7 and 8 years old ! he seriously believed that a damn animatronic Christmas bear was god speaking to him through the bear, that goes beyond a kids imagination, that is some straight up schizophrenia shit . chris brought 90 percent of the abuse on himself, in fact, chris, himself has a history of bullying and manipulating folks when he was in middle school and high school.
@@NidoBot In Bluespike's case, more than likely as he responsible for the more damaging trolling. Liquid Chris knew when to call it a day.
You know 'the real' Chris failed when Liquid Chris improved in life. And that really makes the whole story even sadder.
I do have 2 questions:
1) did kacey improved in life just like liquid chris?
2) is there a time in one of genosamuel documentary videos that mentions Chris Chan's school life?
@@manuelvasconcelos8982 Chris' school life was talked about in detail in between part 2-5 or so.
@@manuelvasconcelos8982 yeah, very detailed. It explains his schooling and why his parents didn’t help him to the full extent etc.
@@manuelvasconcelos8982 I think so.
@@Leotv19 ok thanks
I commented on the last video voicing my opinions on the Chris Chan situation and my own experience with having autism. I got a lot of support from it and I just wanna say thank you all for the kind words, it really means a lot that people DO in fact care about people on the spectrum ❤ I also think this is a lesson to be learned from anyone on the spectrum who witnessed the fall of Chris Chan. People can be cruel, but there's always people out there who DO care about you regardless of whatever may make you "different" from everyone else 🌻
I didn't and i became homeless, the story of Christine chandler is truly awful to experience as an autistic individual
i really appreciate how respectful you are throughout your videos. sometimes i watch other random chris chan videos and some treat it like a TV show of sorts. it’s very refreshing to see someone talk about this through a lens of realism
to kralju moj
Chris-chan is a very sad story.
In the end they were left out by the system, not saying that they should be forgiven for what they did to heir mom, but still, Chris was failed in every possible way.
I do believe some people who trolled truly thought Chris was just putting on a show, that they were pretending to be autistic, because many people did that back then, heck many people are still doing it for clout on Tik Tok, look how many teens are pretending to have mental disorders just for that, so why people wouldn't think that Chris was putting on an act.
Bob and Barb failed them, I think Barb was worse than Bob, to be honest, Barb was a very controlling person and very narcissistic to the point that she gas lit both Chris and Bob.
Chris was already set up to fail, having such a dysfunctional family.
But yeah, I don't think people should be putting the trolls on pedestals and being seen as characters from a show, they did damage an already fragile person, and Bella and Bluespike were the worst, Bella is truly the worst to be honest and no doubt about that, because it was her who managed to convince Chris to do what they did to Barb, she was pulling the strings and pushing Chris to the point of no return, and she knows that, and she knows that she could and did get away with what the did.
Chris' trolls belong in jail.
not defending chris but i don't really have any sympathy for his mom considering she had a hand in turning chris into what he is today
To quote the G-Man from Half Life 2:
“The right man in the wrong place can make all the difference.”
Your previous video was always going to be tricky, because it forced people to face things they didn’t want to think about when it came to Chris-Chan.
Chris-Chan really was the perfect storm, a blend of the time they were born and grew up in, the mental conditions they had that people didn’t understand, how people around them reacted to their actions and their relationship them, their personality and of course the Wild West that was the internet at the time and how they evolved along with it.
There really is no better way to describe Chris-Chan than being “the right man in the wrong place who made all the difference”.
(Am I the only one who now wants a mod of Half Life 2 where Gordon Freeman reacts to events with recorded Chris-Chan quotes?)
“damn dirty combine…..”
I would gladly for a mod like that, along with DarkSydePhil over Barney and LowTierGod over Eli Vance. (Bonus points for Terry Davis over Dr. Kleiner.)
@@notimportant3033 That would amazing! I wish I had the skills to do something like that! Who would we get to be Alyx and Dr. Breen?
The people around him made him what he became, I have autism and know what it's like to be constantly bullied.
There were no heroes. There were only villains and victims, if not both at the same time.
Not to be rude, but isn't this comment a duplicate from the first part?
I'm so glad I wasn't exposed to something like this as a kid. I don't even want to imagine what would have happened to me.
Chris Chan believes that they're a woman, but Chris also believes that they're a Goddess, Jesus Christ reincarnated, able to transform into a sonichu, able to transform into a my little pony, married to their own OC's and the pokemon Mewtwo, able to travel between this dimension and a made up cartoon one, that their dead father is now alive as a sonichu in that made up cartoon dimension, that serial killer Ted Bundy is not only a sonichu but was framed and is actually innocent, the list goes on. Is accepting it when Chris says they're a woman actually playing into their harmful delusions, or is that the ONE THING out of a long list of things they believe that isn't delusional?
CWC is a mess y'all
Exactly this is why I have always said Chris isn’t trans he has no idea what being trans is he’s too deluded to know what most things are he just has completely devolved into his own mind
He’s a product of his environment. Trolls should own their creation with all things in context.
The Chris Chan Saga is the ultimate epic. It is as grand and engrossing as The Lord of the Rings, if not more.
But this is an epic that happened in real life, and is ultimately a dark tragedy that just falls harder and harder into complete despair the longer it goes.
I keep pondering how I could have turned out like Chris Chan, since I have had many of the same experiences he had.
And yet, I keep following this saga as the Internet’s epic.
I am in awe at how one person’s life has had mountains of lore and text around him. So much that even Tolkien did not write this much about an entire fictional fantasy world, much less one person.
Watching the GenoSamuels documentary when Kacey had her final phone call with Chris it's haunting how accurate she was in determining Chris's fate...
People who idolize liquid chris and further justify their sentiment by bringing up that he's a doctor now or something as if they're the ones doing it need to be locked up in a psych ward. Chris chan is a despicable human being but Liquid absolutely played a part in creating the Chris that we know today and he should absolutely be held accountable for his past actions. He was not a kid like Blue Spike, not that that excuses any of the heinous things that he did, but it's absolutely shocking that nobody has even attempted hold Liquid accountable.
"Bu-but he was funnie!!!"
Honestly, if you use entertainment as your justification for bullying, you're a sociopath in the eyes of anyone else.
It was the people around him who turned him into what he became.
🗣️🗣️🗣️ LIQUID DID NOTHING WRONG
Honestly, I believe he would have turned out the same without Liquids involvement. Yeah, what he did wasn't nice but I don't think he should be held accountable for who Chris is now. That should go towards trolls like the Idea Guys. Not saying what Liquid did was justifiable, I just think what he did wasn't an important factor in making Chris who he is today. But hey, I could be wrong.
@@FourDozenEggs You don't know that for sure.
I have actually been diagnosed with Aspergers. I was previously diagnosed with a few other disorders on the Autism Spectrum, including ADD, ADHD, and autism, in that order, which just goes to show how little people really understood these mental disabilities over the past 20+ years.
The Autism Spectrum might be the hardest to define out of any mental illness. The unfortunate fact is that sometimes you get that label attached, and there's not much anyone else can do for you. Sometimes, you have to take a good, hard look at yourself and figure out what works best for you, because there is no one, universal answer for everyone in the Spectrum.
Personally, I'd say I've done a pretty good job adapting my mental tendencies towards my daily life, but I know it isn't so easy for others. I will say it's important to have a healthy mindset, so not having that can be potentially devastating for an individual. I can't express how vital self-exploration is for this disorder.
I agree.
Chris had no healthy mindset given the fact he was produced by two ghouls who basically never raised him to have a healthy understanding of reality and basically ignored their hopeless cause when Chris became an adult.
Its actually somewhat a tragic tale.
As a trans person, I don’t think a cis man pretending to be a trans woman would go as far as to self harming in an attempt not give themselves a sex change… just sayin…
Screwing with your hormones and having surgery could easily be considered self harm, don't you think?
Yeah. I think the whole debate around that is ridiculous and stupid.
To be fair tho chris chan is an idiot who also believes men have a finite supply of semen.
As a trans person, pretty sure if your only motive is to open up the dating pool and you also ID as sonichu, you're just nuts.
You don't think someone can be deluded into doing such a thing?
In the end, Chris chan's biggest failure was his stubborn refusal to learn from his mistakes. Like, after so many miasdventures in the store you would think he finally understood his idea doesn't work and tried something different. But no.
Maybe if a guard that he 'cursed' hit him in the face during the incident might have forced him to snap out of it. But I am not sure.
Alec Benson Leary is kinda the unsung “hero” of the story.
He didn’t get as much of a rile out of Chris as Liquid did, but he also didn’t get cruel.
He just tried to make Chris see the error of his ways and was extremely patient with him until eventually realising he was a lost cause
“Hero” is probably the wrong word but he’s easily the least harmful and aimed to be the most helpful troll by offering some much needed tough love.
The Lars thing doesn’t really bother me since it wasn’t done out of actual hatred for black people but instead to point out how Chris actually saw people as these stereotypes and was none the wiser to people playing on them
The whole Chris Chan thing is a very weird and messed up series of events. I do think, had he not been noticed, trolled and followed extensively, his life would be a lot different and perhaps more normal. So overall I think he is the victim in all this, despite all the horrible things he has done. The whole thing has almost been romanticised into an easily digestible story, you forget it's a real person who was trolled to ridiculous degrees. At the core of it, it was the internet bullying a heavily autistic person. The internet's monster that we created I guess.
Either that or Chris is actually just a messed up immoral person and it would've played out the same anyway. Even if you ignore all the internet stuff, he's still someone who fell through the cracks of society and was left to rot.
I also think it's pretty ironic that people only use their preferred pronouns if they are deemed worthy of them. That's not really how it works is it? If you start questioning if their transition is valid, where does that end? Do you need to start going through a trans test to see if you are worthy of your preferred pronouns? Well people have different measures on what they might regard as valid or not, so I don't think people should open that can of worms. I find it pretty hypocritical.
Too be fair Goomba, I think it’s the latter, since Chris has done terrible things even without trolling influences (Touching Megan inappropriately, being racist to black people at the game place, running over Michael Snider with his car.) and plus the guy says that FICTIONAL CHARACTERS are real, how good would that make the transgender community look if anyone said Chris is a respected member of them?
As far as that last paragraph, let’s just only refer to any sex offenders (likr Chris Chan) as “it”. No “he/him”, “she/her”, or “they/them”, whatever; just “it”.
Yeah Chris is a sad person and he's a monster too, he did so many bad things with or without troll influence
@@ashlynbrown3728 The worst thing that Chris did came after years of online trolling though. Before that, the worst thing that Chris had done was yell "Curse-ye-hame-haaaa!" at Mary Lee Walsh. As far as Chris "being a creep towards Megan", some autists, including Chris, lack an understanding of the concept of personal space.
@@ashlynbrown3728 It all comes down to bad parenting. His parents enabled his behavior, told him to stay unemployed for the benefits, never let him grow up and paid random girls to be his "friends", which only inflated his ego.
I think the biggest take away from all this is that we shouldn't excuse bullying vulnerable people in any capacity. For the trolls, making hell for Chis Chan was just another game, no different to how they would've tortured people in the Sims. Chris Chan being an awful person was just the cherry on top, an easy excuse for them to keep bullying.
It's what Crit Facts (a channel dedicated to calling out and fighting back against Transphobia, who you should seriously subscribe to) calls "Salient Exemplars". These are the scapegoats who bullies can point to as justification for their hatred, asking all members of the minority group to bow and apologise for the actions of any one person - regardless of whether the reasons for their awful behaviour are in any way related to said minority status.
Put simply, we should oppose bullying, because as with your use of gender neutral pronouns towards Chris Chan suggests, we shouldn't be the arbiter of someone's identity validation based on whatever behaviour we don't like. It's a dangerous slippery slope.
there is nothing inherently wrong with the age his parents had him, there are many parents who had kids much younger and still ended up with children with disabilities. Thing is they were very clearly unfit parents from the get go, since apparently chris' half brother had a lot of horror stories about growing up under them, but even if he never testified their abuse, there's plenty of evidence over the years of just how incompetent and manipulative they were.
I think it's less the "risk of disability" thing and more that just being so old at that point they'd be too old to care for him properly by the time they have him.
The vid was crafted extremely well. Most people would just call chis chan crazy and leave it at that but u actually went into detail and provided a pretty clear picture of what lead to their downfall in a respectful but critical way, the perfect mix for a situation like this imo. Anyways hope this helps, keep up the good work! Can't wait to see what u think of the new content for frontiers once it comes out and whatever else u plan on covering!!!
Thank you so much, Ty!
I have autism myself, but I do think it would be remiss to say that his actions were not influenced by autism whatsoever. In fact I think it's clear that almost everything he does is influenced heavily by his autism. I think people shy away from saying this because it feels like saying "Chris Chan's actions are influenced by the symptoms autism" is equivalent to saying "Autism causes this litany of terrible things", but these two things are not the same. To go even further, it actually doesn't make any sense to say that someone with autism's behaviour, particularly socially, is not influenced by autism, because this is one of the main symptoms and if nothing they did was influenced by it, they wouldn't have autism in the first place.
Autism doesn't cause someone to commit crimes or incest, but people are very complex. Autism also affects people by degrees. If your autism limits you severely in your ability to understand social interactions, you are going to inevitably act strangely and often inappropriately. The extent to which this is the case varies by person. This is not to say that autism causes people to do terrible things, but you can see clearly how his autism coupled with his childhood, treatment by others, and a whole host of things that are just impossible to quantify like personality, thoughts, empathy etc. made him spiral over time.
Just because someone is influenced by circumstance or genes doesn't mean that when they commit crimes, they are to be thought of as good or not responsible for their actions. You can be or become a terrible person with autism just like you can be or become a terrible person without autism, but undoubtedly, especially with his level of severity of autism, it has played a huge part in his choices and thoughts and behaviours and should be properly taken into account as a disability. Taken into account does not mean "let off the hook", it means to take it into account when thinking about the problem of Chris Chan. This means different things to different people, it's up to each individual to judge him how they see fit. In a court, it would be and should be properly taken into account as a mitigating factor, but hopefully he would still be made to account for his terrible crimes to the appropriate degree, given all the information they have.
I'm still convinced that "Alec Benson Leary" is actually Adum from Yourmoviesucks. I just can't unhear all of their similarities.
To be fair, you can't really educate Chris either. It should be noted that Chrises successes in school was, more than likely, out of pity and chances are hes probably shouldn't be as high education wise as he is(Which also only further inflated his ego and made him think he does nothing wrong).
Chris listens to no one but those he chooses to listen to. Under normal circumstances, being made a fool of does teach a person something, but Chris chan failed to learn from even that.
Chris is straight-up immune to good advice, he's too narcissistic to accept his own flaws and errors.
It would probably require some sort of hypnosis to seriously help him.
I usually use they/them for Chris to be safe. I don't think Chris is sane enough to really be properly trans, especially given their views of women.
I think you should *_always_* believe trans people when they say they are trans. But I think Chris is the exception. Not out of bias against them, but because I know their history and unstable mental state.
I mean... he's stuck in the past, so I personally use his previous set of pronouns.
Just call Chris a he, Chris is clearly using transgenderism to improve his dating prospects with women.
@@terron7840 I personally just don't wanna step on any toes. Not Chris' toes, but like... the toes of trans people who are invested in the situation.
@@chelledoggo Hes not even oficially trans.
@@terron7840 I know. Again, this is more for the sake of not offending other people. I couldn't care less if I offend Chris at this point.
The funny thing is (atleast from what Geno said.) Kasey hated Alec. Mostly cause she wanted Liquids trolling to be the end of it all.
Her narcissism was ridiculously obvious.
She wanted it to end there and it really should have.
@@Topdoggie7 I do agree, it really should have ended there. She just went about it the wrong way was all.
@@torygreen1200 The reality is no troll is in control of the next one so it always spirals into a new saga.
@@Topdoggie7 100% agreed there!
Unfortunately for Chris it all goes back to horrible parenting.
And those parents paying Chris'groping victims for silence. Would have been better if jail or therapy happened in college and Chris got straightened out.
@@Topdoggie7 This is the first I'm hearing of Chris Chan groping people in HS or College and I've seen a lot of CWCkie articles and videos.
@@opadrip Chris groped Megan repeatedly, it's in the parts of the letters usually not read in docs. Chris groped Emily, it's documented. Chris non consensually kissed stranger's at 2ManyGames. Bob often "negotiated" with the principal and Chris' friends as well as had lengthy talks. Chris in multiple photos can be seen being way too close to the girls, touching them, and them looking uncomfortable but they'd be paid afterwards. In multiple occasions we can see Borb got involved and basically paid for silence. And when they weren't there, the autism card was milked for every drop.
@@opadripI think they might be confusing the Megan situation with Chris's high school experience
Chris-chan's situation is both heartbreaking and disgusting to hear about, let alone watch.
A lot of problems can arise from Autism depending on how you're raised and if your parents can reel you back or not.
Speaking from experience, there's been numerous moments where I would just... explode... for no reason whatsoever. I'd try to hit people, I'd pound my fists onto whatever's in front of me and I'd destroy *anything* I'd see for no reason whatsoever.
Being autistic is something that made me cautious for pretty much *anything* and even would cause me to lock up for no particular reason. Even now if I was told to do something I would just lock up, not move and eventually I'd forget and would need to ask again.
I know I can do what I'm asked, I know what I was told to do, but for some unexplained reason my body will just refuse to actually do what I was told and will just lock up or continue doing what it is I'm doing until I eventually find the ability to overpower my body and actually get something done unless I know how important it is.
Actually, scratch that. Even if I knew what was really important there's still a high chance I could just forget until it randomly pops into my mind but by then it'll be too late and chances are it'll already be done.
The most cooked thing for me is that Liquid Chris is a legit doctor. He recently finished med school.
the fact that Kasey actually thought Chris was fat enough to die before age 30 really shows you how much she genuinely cared about Chris’s health as some people claim
The fact that a group of people has you petrified to use the proper names for things is ludicrous to me. Don't be afraid of cancel culture. It will crumble in time.
Something that isn't talked about much in regards to Chris Chan is the Guard Dogs. These were people who genuinely tried to help Chris and defend them from the trolls. Of course, given the events of the most recent chapter of Chris's life, they've understandably abandoned this pursuit, but let's take a moment to remember that Chris did have people pulling for them.
I know there are some people that don't like the they/them pronouns. Sometimes, you just can't win no matter what you try to do.
I don't like them but hey I just gotta ignore them
I think the reason for that is because they/them is usually reserved for many people. Like, is the person I'm speaking about a hivemind? Do they have multiple personalities or clones I need to be aware of? _Have my outlandish conspiracy theories of an astrally-linked neural network finally been proven right!?_
...Then again, most individuals with they/them pronouns end up acting the same way in the end, so that's most likely what it is.
@@Tendo987 why care
Yeah, whether it's transphobes who hate those pronouns being used to refer to a singular known person, or allies of transgender people who believe even using 'they/them' was transphobic because it's not strictly the pronouns CWC was using.
@@Leotv19because they are not singular pronouns.
I don't think cyraxx the goblin is the next Chrischan. Yes, the little creep can be manipulated, but not to the level Chrischan was
I made the picture of Cyraxx dressed as Chris Chan
It's sad how many people have excused the trolls in the previous video, some of them even tried to discredit the video because they didn't actually have a solid justification for their actions.
as an aspie myself, of all the trolls i do respect alec the most, he was just very logical with his criticisms of chris, like you said, the hate towards aspies and his hypocrisy about copyright infringement.
I’m not gonna lie, i did not have “the inventor of the absorbsorbalof will make 2 video essays on Chris Chan” on my bingo card for this year.
Not complaining tho, these are great videos
Frankly, I find the whole "Chris Chan is/was a homophobe, so it's okay to attack them" arguement to be a weak excuse at best and flat out hypocritical at worst. Lets face it, the real reason they targeted Chris was because Chris was an easy target rather than anything resembling actual justice. Plus, considering the platforms they operated from (4chan, kiwi farms, etc) and what they were doing in general, i doubt the trolls were very progressive people themselves.
Chris has/had a lot of awful traits, but most of that stemmed from upbringing and what he learned from being raised by television in the 80s/90s. But yes, the trolls are mainly people that had entirely too much time on their hands.
Chris Chan's misfortune was being born autistic in 1980s rural Virginia. The 1980s, as you correctly pointed out, were far more socially conservative and less accepting/understanding of people who were "different". This meant the chips were stacked against Chris from the get-go and that he was most likely never going to get the help he needed until it was too late.
thank you for talking about the exhausting pronoun debate. People get so heated over other's using they/them pronouns when discussing Chris-chan and it's so annoying. Like we're being super neutral here and y'all are still upset? Is the only fun part of your day to point out to some stranger online that "uHm aCtuAlly cHriS iS a gUy sO it'S hE/hiM" in the comment section of Chris-chan a Comprehensive History part 67? Really?
Yeah, it's dumb.
I was introduced to Chris Chan with the GameStop incident a UA-camr named alphaomegasin made a video on it
What really gets me is that the original trolls stopped trolling Chris when his father died and my thoughts are that if his father didn’t die, then Chris would’ve been trolled for about 2 to 3 more years at best EDIT: Also Chris isn’t into the trans community at all he’s doing it to get women and he actually admitted it (it’s on the cwcki idk where tho) and he still hates men and wants straight people in the LGBTQ community and made his very own SLBTQ community so seeing Chris’ history with the LGBTQ community….just take his “transition” with a grain of very small piece of salt
Chris doesn't even understand the LGBT so trans was even more confusing for them. I honestly think it took until 2021 for Chris to understand straight isn't supposed to be in the LGBT but it sort of went over Chris' head.
Liquid Chris is back and now fighting Cyraxx. It seems like he's played by the other twin who's a musician and not the one who became a cancer researcher.
It's a different person playing Liquid Chris. Neither twin is (still) playing Liquid.
Chris Chan is a weirdo and has no boundaries. He was allowed to do whatever he wants without consequences. What little consequences he did have went away after his mother's mind went. He was free to do whatever he wanted and look what he did.
Why didn’t bob cut off the internet
Barbara threatened suicide so he backed off.
Alec's Lars impression was questionable, but watching Chris show the genuine ability to make friends with a complete stranger despite the assumed racism was low-key wholesome.
It also made me realize just how detrimental Chris's refusal to make male friends was. You need to be socially competent before you can make it in a romantic relationship, and Chris wasn't willing to do that middle step.
Speaking as a trans non binary person, I personally think it's the right move to call Chris Chan by they/them pronouns. In most circumstances it's just decent to call people by their preferred pronouns. However in Chris Chan's case, they're a person so detached from reality that it's hard to know where their self i.d. is coming from. Like, they also identify as a goddess and Jesus and Sonichu all simultaneously. But all that said, there are certain points in the Chris Chan saga that do make me believe they experience gender dysphoria. I think that much is genuine. So yeah they/them is I think probably the best thing to go with.
One thing that you didn’t mention in either of your CWC videos so far is that Liquid Chris was actually played by two different trolls
From the CWCki:
“Liquid was played by identical twin brothers Chris and Jon Duckworth. Chris portrayed Liquid on UA-cam and in the PVCC Forums, while Jon portrayed him during the Sing-Star Challenge.”
I believe that Jon also voiced Matt during the “doghouse weighed more than any tombstone” call
The Asperchu Saga was honestly the more interesting of the troll sagas.
Chis has an big issue when trolls questioned his personality, identity, sexuality which in turn changed him from the core and out.
i hesitate to weigh in, but as a (mostly) closeted transfem, i think the last thing people should scrutinize about cwc is gender. i believe doing so paints a message to trans folks "if you do something bad, the mainstream will reject your identity even more fiercely". cwc is with no doubt a terrible person but this is just my opinion. no space should include people who are harmful, but to reject the labels entirely is also harmful to the whole
Well said.
Agreed. Personally, I think the whole argument around Chris' actual gender identity is ridiculous and a waste of time. Just because someone's Trans doesn't mean they can't be a bad person.
Definitely understand not wanting to get involved in social commentary. It tends to be a dumpster fire in this new age of internet. However, I really like what you have to say!! I agree with your views completely on Chris, and I think your opinion is super valuable. You're treating Chris like a person and not a spectacle, something that still is a common occurrence today. You have a good message, consider keeping it going.
Actually they shouldn’t call out people like him, they shouldn’t contribute to the destruction of a person like that no matter how terrible they are. I guarantee nobody calling out a racist online is making the situation better, they’re just enraging a broken person.
That's not a bad point to be fair. I can respect that.
Agreed. Honestly, Chris chan was just a random nobody with no power over anything. Calling him out wouldn't accomplish anything, especially since there are far worse people with far bigger platforms than him.
Better than "calling people out" is to talk with them.
Remember: Aiming for the middle is going to piss of the extremes on both sides, but please the vast majority of people. The extremes are louder, but it works well enough for me.
I, personally don't use she/her for Chris because of how he has explained why he transitioned, but I 100% respect your choice in the matter
He was always an extremely feminine man. I'm not sure how feminine man and transwoman are different other than outward expression.
My mans spent five minutes talking about Chris Chan's gender ToT
Really, unless your lifespan is literally 5 minutes, these kinds of comments are just pretentious and unnecessary.
@@opadrip Same goes for your comment there buddy. xD
Bravo. This is the context that completes your previous video.
Is the audio cutting out sometime around the 16:00 mark for anyone else?
Yes
U said in the original vid that u thought liquid Chris and kasey’s dad were played by the same person but I seriously doubt that bc it’s pretty obvious the person playing kasey’s dad wasn’t putting much effort into having a deep voice mean while liquid at the end of one of the calls breaks character and his voice is on the higher side and in general doesn’t sound anything like kasey’s father
Yeah I think it was Alec who played the father
It's not his fault he turned out the way he did, he just needed parenting and support, hopefully he can get the help he needs whenever he finishes paying his debt to society.
The Chris Chan story has no heroes, only villains and victims. The only truly innocent party in the whole story was Megan Schroeder who only wanted to be left alone.
Megan was genuinely kind to Chris, but he did wonderful at ruining their friendship.
This is indeed a story with no heroes and mostly villains. You will see millions of men helping a girl in need, but never a straight white male. We must laugh at his pain and say that he has all the power when there is none.
Chris Chan is a queer half-Cherokee female though...
must be why he has so many white knights nowadays?
Actually, they shouldn't call people like Chris Chan, they shouldn't contribute to the destruction of a Sonic/Pokemon fan like that no matter how terrible they are on the Internet, and it's actually somewhat a tragic tale for him, I hope Chris Chan learns his lessons and I just wish his father Bob cut out the internet, so that People will not talk about Chris Chan, but anyways, I agree with you on revisiting Chris Chan, and as always, Great Video Channel Pup! Stay Safe!
Do you respect chris identifying as Jesus?
very sad to see him labeled a monster but this is the actual -gods honest truth.
I'm only early in the video (will edit later if I have more to say), but as a trans person (transmasc) I really appreciate you and other people who use they/them at least. Yes we have reason to believe that she may have had bad motives for transitioning, but it is a common thing spread by transphobes as well and I don't want to accuse someone of having those motives. I also know that trans people are also saying this and I understand why but you got to realize you're saying the same thing transphobes say about all transfem people. If it was a choice why would we (trans people) put ourselves through that? Also using someone's preferred pronouns is about respecting the whole trans community, we can't decide to not respect one's pronouns even if they're a bad person.
Thank you for defending your stance on using they/them.
About autism: I do not have autism, but I have ADHD and my sibling is confident that they have autism. I know maybe a little over the basic information I think?
It can vary a lot from person to person, why it is referred to as the autism spectrum. Why your friends seem very different. It can possibly help explain some things, such as struggling with socializing. Autism may have had a factor, but there was certainly other things factoring in as well.
I will also ask my sibling when they get home (if I remember) they're thoughts on this since they know more.
Also thank you for your video in the first place. After learning more about the situation a couple years ago I realized how much other people have taken advantage of her and made things so much worse. I have only started to see videos talking about how outside factors affected her last year. I feel like things would not have gone as bad as they did if she was just left alone.
really happy you talked about alec in this vid, i think i was one of the people who left a comment about him on your previous video, i completely forgot he was lars, that is definitely one of his weaker points.
You were actually a genius with the gender stuff. Using they/them pronouns for Chris to not get called out by anyone who debates about Chris’ gender was a big power move.
And about the call with Liquid and Kacey, all I can say is… Jeez. Liquid was way too harsh on Chris.
Only to get called out by those who has a problem with they.
Can't please everyone.
liquid chris was good when he first started the impersonation as a joke between him and his friends but he definitely lost his way with the trolling. i used to think he was the least harmful troll but as time goes on, i don’t think that defense of liquid chris holds up anymore
I mean... if a man's deliberately _asking_ for it, _someone's_ gotta provide them what they want.
So what you're saying is, Chris Chan must be stopped at all costs...?
This is just a sad story all around.
As someone who is on the spectrum myself, I cannot stand the notion of Chris-Chan......I despise them simply because it is used as a scapegoat for those like me who want to make an honest living and indulge in their hobbies and interest. Hell, I draw fancharacters and buy action figures as hobbies only secondary to gaming....but because of who this freak is, it paints ALL of us in a bad light
I hate to say it but, just imagine if Chris Chan committed suicide between 2010 or 2012. The first thing the trolls is going to say. It's wasn't their fault that Chris Chan committed suicide. But you heard every proof that they were trolling and bullying Chris Chan.
Hey really good follow up, but I wanna bring up something that you never brought up about either of these vids.
And that’s when the Miscreants (the trolls that trolled Chris during the classic era) left Chris alone to let him grieve when his father died. If the trolls were truly that malicious then they would’ve made their antics worse.
According to the GamerFromMars documentary about Chris they said that him loosing bob and living without him made him and his mother incredibility venerable.
If the trolls were that malicious as you claimed in your last video then they would’ve thought that would’ve been a great time to mess with him more but they didn’t, again, to let Chris and Barb grieve. And hell, even the CWCki was down for a little bit when Bob died.
They also destroyed the infamous “black tape” which was supposedly a recording or video of Chris talking or crying over the death of Bob. This tape has never been shown to the public out of “respect and the lack of entertainment”. So take that what you will.
I just wanna know what your thoughts about this specifically as I think this kinda goes against some of your claims in the last video you made.
Well, they're still shitty people for doing what they did. Admittedly, that proves they had standards unlike many other trolls, but deciding it wasn't funny to troll Chris anymore doesn't change what they did before that.
Sockness giving Freddy Kruger vibes in that striped shirt and brimmed hat.
24:22 "You dont need to form these Wile E. Coyote schemes." lmao at the mental image you gave me of Wile E. Coyote at a computer trying to troll Chris chan.
Clile E. Cashote.
Sound cuts out from 16:03 to 17:27
Probably cut due to its content
@@hyliannerd4541 oh yeah, didn’t think about that. Sorry
Yeah the background music in the original bit of footage was copyright protected. I figured at least the text was on screen.
One a weird note if my life took a weird turn I could be Chris Chan... sort of. I just took the complete opposite role they did and that is likely why I am not the subject of the video. I back in 2003 has somebody make fanfiction of me being R word to death by a pack of all-male lions in a Lion King like porn. I thought it was funny.
I got many more people to troll me over that but I genuinely talked to them. They find me very weird but they now defend me in fact one is now basically family. Like he owns the keys to my house and car, they have even taken my car without saying in advance and I do not care.
Chris Chan went the other way and became a predator and it is documented from start to finish, what a strange hourny.
Well this was A Unexpected Video of Touching this Subject Again but It’s Good to Know More Information on This Disaster,I Also Understand Why you’re Not making these Types of Videos as you would Rather Make Fun Videos Your Passionate About which I Can Respect That.
You're underated my guy
And Chris Chan is now out of jail. Court order.
Is it bad that I listened to this while re-reading the Sonichu comics?
18:20 - EXCUSE me?!
The sad thing is Chris probably absorbs it better through weird skits in this type of approach rather than sitting down and trying to talk to him like a normal human being when trying to give advice or something
I find it a bit sad to see that a fanbase behind something like Sonic or Pokemon has this kind of individual that some people use to describe that said fandom. But mostly the Sonic the Hedgehog series back in the early-mid 2010s. Some people were using Chris to define or personify a certain subgroup of people who were "fans" of Sonic the hedgehog. Using Chris Chan's imagine as a lack of a better words, an "ambassador" who represented the hatedom that the franchise received back then. Now it seems the fanbase wants to move on from that and longer wants to associate them with the brand.
At the very least something like Star Wars, DC or Marvel doesn't have a monster individual that people use to describe whenever a certain IP goes through a hardship. At least not that I'm aware of. Maybe they only blame the official creators and the companies that currently own those brands.
Uh. Well. Most every fandom has a Chris Chan. It's small potatoes to list only those two.
How do these people have a following, much else able to live with themselves for what they did?
Without the trolls, Chris would have still been in a terrible financial situation, probably still without a girlfriend, and probably still would have done what he did with Barb. But, he probably wouldn’t be talking about dimensional merges, probably wouldn’t be transgender, and would still be vehemently racist and homophobic. Chris stood no chance with parents like Bob and Barb, at least the trolls got him to stop with the homophobia and racism, and like it or not, probably kept him in a home longer than if he wasn’t infamous.
People don't understand that people didn't really understand the internet back then as much as they do now. People saying bob and barb should have not allowed unrestricted access to the internet forget bob and barb more than likely didn't understand what the internet was really apart from emails which they likely struggled understood at the time. That plus our lack of understanding autism back then too. It was a perfect storm for chan to become what he was
Would any of the awful things that Chris did now have happened if it weren’t for the trolling. In the end he’s still to blame for all of the terrible things that he did, but I wonder if the trolls almost pushed him to this point
no they did push him, not almost. literally he was edged on by a girl who got off to abuse. you're still right, he is still responsible for his actions. His actions were his but he was definitely edged on
Chris tried to (quite literally) put a curse on Mary Lee Walsh because she told him not to use the attraction sign on the campus of PVCC without any input from the trolls. He also tried to run Michael Snyder over without any input from the trolls. But that's not a justification for the trolling.
He was a victim of circumstance just as many like him including those who perpetuated his abuse and trauma leading to his decisions are.
To quote Merry Christmas Mr Lawrence "Youre the victim of men who think they are right just as one day you and Captain Yonoi believed absolutely that you were right.
And the truth is of course that nobody is right."
You had Sockness at the start and he's got an impairment without a doubt. In fact, I'm not convinced he can even be considered as a troll. A negative effect for sure, but it feels like he's not playing.
Sockness isn't so much of a troll as he is an obsessed sycophant. I think he genuinely believes in the magic bs.
16:04 - Why did the audio cut out?
What chris needs more than anything else is rehabilitation, which i think hes getting some in jail. Nothing you can do will help him in any way.
I believe they're expected to go to a half-way house after jail, which is meant to rehabilitate them ready for society. Personally I think permanent assisted living is the only way to go.
That call is honestly crazy...
From 16:05 to the end of the call was downright despicable in my eyes.
Great Video once again