This is not a hate video on d4 at all. I think the game is perfectly fine and honestly getting a couple of hundred hours is not bad for the cost. I'm sure i will also do more with seasons and play around here and there. Overall though it may take a few years for the core to get to where it needs to be if it ever really gets there
At fairly early stage of the game is almost just dungeons. Late game definetly needs improvement. Casuals won't even get to that point to understand. It's not even the lack of quality of life that bothers me the most when things to do and look forward to are dull. IT's fine for a single playthrough. They should've started at least where d3 left and not wait another 10 years for the same. And let me tell you that closed beta from 9 months ago had more content. WT5 inc, but that won't change things much because when you get to 100 it's all the same overgearing plus the shakos and grandfathers and 8tier gems when things to do are dunnngeons (the same).
The Aspect system is horrible. You have no storage space to keep all those Aspects specially when you want to keep stuff for the different builds and other classes. I feel once you find a higher version of an Aspect it should be a permanent thing that you can reuse. The Aspect should be in a tab where you get a list of all Aspect that you extracted from your items without taking stash space. Rerolling a stat gets way too expensive and make your only potential upgrade useless which is super dumb. Sorting loot for 3x more time than it took you to do the actual dungeon and having such a hard time to figure out even if the item is an actual upgrade is a pain in the ass!
I think once your aspects are extracted, they should go into a bank separate from your item stash, same as gems, and be organized like the codex is. Stash should be for gear only, not to save aspects specifically
ive never played D2, got Diablo 4 when it released, finished the campaign, and now about 15 days later im playing D2 resurrected, it feels way more complete and fulfilling, i will return to Diablo 4 when the upcoming buffs and season 1 begins, although i wont leave D2 now either because its just too good, and the music, oh god its too good, normally when i play a game i turn off the music because i prefer my own vibe but diablo 2 has the best soundtrack, it reminds me of the age of myth soundtrack, so legendary.
what a load of horse shit. buying d4 on release and for some unknown reason skipping d3 which looks like d4, opting for a 25 year old game. what's your bnet?
The best items ive found in D4 have been exciting because most of the items dont do anything; a lot of builds use similar aspects/affixes/skillsets because they are the only ones that 'add up' to something significant in the end. Really they need to add more reasons for people to be excited about experiencing the content here because imo its just not fun
I feel like D2 is roughly the same. You're always chasing a handful of runeword, uniques, and each class has a handful of certified Uber killer builds.
@@phant0mdummy Yeah, this. People don't care about Echo of Lilith just like people don't care about World Diablo or the Ubers. Diablo 2 would also need a difficulty level after Hell, with another tier of gear to make me come back (Nightmare has Exceptionnal gear, Hell has Elite gear, what about Torment with Divine gear or something next?).
@@tomm5462 I'm saying everyone blindly praises D2, cause nostalgia, but doesn't realize that it has limited build variety and zero endgame. Yet we complain when D4 has lots of varied activities, but oh it isn't so good after lvl 80... Like okay? It's vanilla. A new world tier will arrive. Just grind your toon until it isn't fun,then try another class or wait for season 1. Overall it's a great game. My biggest issue is they someone botched the UI, inventory management, and didnt bring a dozen things over from D3 that shoulda been day one features.
@@phant0mdummy d2 is the same but people want to tell you d2 itemization is the best ever Like it's literally the same as d4 You want the best itemization? just play poe
I put into d4 350+hours and still enjoying it a lot , really love pvp , played d2 for 14 years both games are epic. Dunno why people complaining so much a about d4 , its a fresh game , d4 need some time till its perfect , but the game already is in a great shape.
Dear Mr LlamaSC, I can only thank you for all the content on D2R you made across the years. With the launch of D4, it made me go back playing D2, then on last week I bought D2R. D4 really isnt for me, and Im having a real good time with D2R. Your videos helped me a lot to make this decision 😊❤
@@7gamexexactly what Im thought. Although also sems like a few of the complaints are not just present in D2 as well but worse than in d4. D2 is grinding the same 1-3 tiny areas over because literally nothing else gives any significant progreß. And getting max lvl requires literally thousands of kills of exactly the same boss.
@@Orion3Tthe thing is, d2 isn't about hitting max lvl(to most people) it's about hunting for those significant items for you or alts, or to have value in trading for something you really want that'll significantly impact your characters power. D2 has that excitement of finding a unique ring.. maybe it's a soj.., finding certain uniques or runes is an amazing feeling.. very rare, but not impossibly rare. Even if it wasn't good for you, it can still have value to help get what you want, or value for another character, or even make you want to make another character to use it. D4 has.. search through hundreds-thousands of rares for a 1% higher stat. The playthrough was fun in d4.. but at 100, I feel no(absolutely 0) urge to log in and play. And you can say I played too much.. sure I did.. but I also did the same in lost ark for the past year... d4 lasted a few weeks to lose interest
Coming from someone who worked in game industry for a while. There is a huge difference between balance changes and “why don’t we do this and that.” The former is tweaking numbers in excel and the later is requesting new features that’s 90% the time not in the engine. That’s why hot-nerfing my barb takes 12 hours and requesting a gem tab takes 12 weeks. The bigger the production it takes longer to push a feature down the pipeline without breaking stuff. First the feature need to be designed, and then find a gameplay programmer who can implement the feature, and down to the QA and push for a release and include in one of the patches. Gameplay features don’t grow on trees no matter how big the company is. New elements for season one and the balance and it’s roadmap had probably been decided 3 month before the game was out. And people who work on season one are often also the same people who are supposed to work on a million new features requested by fans. So this is a situation that nobody wins as season one schedule is set in stone.
@@edsherwook5196 what does open world have to do with it? They already have zones that are marked with a appropriate level. Just done scale monsters away from that level. Its a no brainer. RPGs have been doing this since day one. Dynamic Scaling is something they put in, not the other way around.
@@mathiasseverin5673 whole point of an open world is to not make it not linear where you can bounce around. If it doesn’t scale then your stuck making your way through a bunch of low level Guys for no experience
@@edsherwook5196 that explains why they scale up beginner areas. Its bad game design, but its a fair reason. I would do it differently. I would have gradually added certain high level monsters there. Like, spawn of Lillith. That way, you could go back and feel powerful against wolves, but also be on the lookout for spawns of Lillith. But why they make high level areas feel impossible if you havent gotten the right level is beyond me. Must be bad game design.
I noticed a lot of this stuff even before I was done with the campaign. It is the reason why I rate D4 at around a 6. It is absolutely a case of death by a thousand paper cuts. "Trivial" things, except by the bucket load.
Itemization is the biggest flaw of the game, which is sad because items are literally what should be the addicting part of the game’s formula. So many conditional affixes “+ dmg while / to” that make items so bland, they’re not even fun to pick up and look over. What happened to “crushing blow”, “faster cast rate”, “mana leech (main resource leech?)” life tap, etc. getting rid of stats also means items no longer have stat requirement, which leads to less player engagement to their build. Having gear being locked behind lvl required from when you picked it up is such a horrible decision… I can go on but I’m sure this is a wall of text already. The itemization needs a complete overhaul from the ground up.
Also back on D2R. Itemization. Diablo for me was all about finding interesting items/runes. In D4 it's mostly stat/damage changes and an aspect on items. Most aspects are inefficient or pointless too. D4 items just feel mindless and boring. Takes the point out of the grind. Weapon scaling is not fun either. I don't want to find a very good item to only have to upgrade it at a later level. Also want to be able to find items other characters can use and to be able to freely give them to my friends. I really hope the game gets better and I will try it again I am sure. The truth is... D2R still feels fun for me to play while D4 is boring and I get tired playing it. Running around the same areas doing fetch/search quests is not fun either.
totally agree with your point on sequels should be an improvement. clearly d3 and d4 teams are totally disconnected from eachother, feels like i went back 10-15 years playing d3 and poe when they just came out. so many basic things feel so outdated that should of been in the game as common sense
Completely agreed. Even Diablo Immortal was a more complete experience and innovated on the genre. I really loved that the 3 top DPS players would get additional loot and an announcement, and dps trackers have been a thing for years in wow pve. It feels as if the dev's aren't actually gamers.
@@OMFGRAZORGATOR Yeah, tbh if Diablo Immortal wasn't so damn greedy it would be seen in a much better light for how it progressed the ARPG genre. D4 really played it too safe and did nothing innovative. For a game that took them so damn long to make, the excuse of, "well the framework for a good game is there" isn't enough. We shouldn't need to wait another 8 years for Blizz to perfect it. This game had more dev hours spent on developing it than any ARPG in history. It has no business being this hollow.
Yeah as a lifelong d2 player I am extremely let down with the itemization, the differences in character strength, the simplicity of the game (it’s too easy) the skill tree and paragon tree (what a joke) how they purposefully designed it to make you waste your time running around to and fro whether it’s questing for nothingness or just trying to go from waypoint to chest as you mentioned. The list is way too big but I agree with pretty much most of what you said in the last few videos. It’s a shame they don’t care at all about the lifetime players like us who loved d2 and even some of you who loved d3 and they just decided to put out the most purposeless Diablo game ever. Unless you care about cosmetics that are overpriced and make you look more like a douchebag then an actual player. Rant over
yup that's a pretty good point. there are so many tried and true basic features missing and problems created that were already fixed in previous titles, it's like they're trying to invent the arpg genre all over again starting from scratch everywhere
What i like about Diablo 2 is, white items, magical items, rares, uniques, set items, they all have use. Now D2 has problems as well, like some builds barely function unless you have some of the rarest items in the game, game sometimes really make you work towards your builds. With D4 it feels like they are just redoing all the wrongs of D3 plus added bonus, i have this feeling it's just gonna be a cash shop cosmetic simulator in a year with what they are prioritizing.
I agree w you on this, Patrick. My Level-91 Light Sorc still uses the Level-20 something Magefist gloves. That same ‘dynamic’ doesn’t seem to exist on launch D-4.
feels like you guys are pushing this cash shop cosmetic shit further and further, every time it doesn't pan out to your expectations. Like a doomsday prophet seeing how the world is still alive after his prediction and pushing his deadline by a year, praying he's eventually right.
Who would have guessed that... oh well I did. Lead director with big mouth was telling people D4 is competition to PoE. And it lost already because of that 70 bucks price tag. in two years d4 is dead or barely alive. because that is what bliz does. make a cash grab game, get the most out of the cummunity and then add the next number to the title for next cash grab.
Given the evolutionary trajectory we saw in D3, the status of this game relative to where it will end up indicates that it is currently approximately in an alpha phase.
It’s not 2012. I’m a firm believer that blizzard knows this is a very important title for them to get right. Although the skills need balancing, we’re not even close to how unbalanced the overall game was in d3 at launch.
@@marcosyy87 pre-alpha is early development stage when certain pieces of the game may be carefully crafted for sneak peeks, but massive chunks of the game are missing or not working. As much as I hate D3 as a whole, ROS was a significant improvement on D3 and I would hardly consider it a pre-alpha
I'm glad you brought up the point of learning from past mistakes and experiences. I've seen a lot of people throw around "live service" and "the game has only been been out x long" as an excuse for various QoL features not being implemented yet. It feels weird to even say "QoL" sometimes because it feels like a minimization of problems that can be quite impactful to a player's perception of the game. As mentioned many of the features being discussed were already addressed in D3 which is their own IP. It would make sense to take what was previously addressed into consideration when developing. They were previously implemented to enhance the experience of the game after all and it should have been a high priority to have them in place as part of the core build instead of playing catch up on something they're charging $70-100 for. Going to the 'next thing' shouldn't feel like taking a step back in areas tackled in the past and frankly some of it almost feels like an insult to the consumer. Of course, it's more understandable that addressing problems around completely new systems that players are exposed to is going to take some time to fine tune.
I'm not going to say that you or Llama are wrong. But what seems strange to me is structuring an argument around "here's why I won't be playing D4 right now" followed by going back to a game (D2R) that has some of the exact same issues. Where's the search function, gem tab, (or heck - inventory space on a fully built character that is overloaded with Charms), etc. in D2R? I get it that D2:LoD came out two decades ago, but when you're okay with a shitty system in one game but cite that same shitty system as a deal-breaker for another game - then the logic becomes inconsistent and the basis for the decision falls apart. I would like to take the criticism seriously but it's difficult to do so when there's such a heavy, nostalgia driven bias at every step of the way. This is coming from someone that is an avid enjoyer of D2R and Llama's content btw. This video would have landed a lot better for me if he had just said "I'm going back to D2R because I enjoy it more".
@@abhidey646 I get what you're saying but D2 kind of is what it is. It's a 23 year old game that has had a cult following despite its flaws and all and the whole point of D2R was basically just to freshen it up a bit and capitalize on its popularity -- not significantly alter the core systems turning it into a notably different game potentially removing the 'charm' of what made it what it is. People love/loved it as it is for decades and it kind of exists in its own bubble for enjoyment. D3 was a step in a very different direction for the IP that has been more catered to casual acceptance in the modern era. D4 obviously took a whole lot of inspiration from D3 in the terms of the systems/features that were introduced in that one. Progressive dungeons, the rerolling systems, legendary power imprinting and extraction, paragon, etc. It's different when they basically carry over those systems albeit labeled differently and make them in at least some ways worse and less convenient in the newest title of the franchise. I imagine many people consider D3+D4 to be closer together in terms of expectations. The point is those systems were introduced, people got a taste, and many of the problems with those systems were addressed in the previous title yet not in the newest seemingly through reasoning of cutting corners and rushing a product more so than a conscious design choice meant to be 'how it is' long term. Even if someone ends up still enjoying D2 more, that doesn't invalidate concerns here for the direction of D4. It can be a matter of principal more so than "Why go back to old game that's missing a bunch of potential QoL?" You're free to assume someone would just primarily play D2 anyway but for all you know if it seemed like things were being better handled that might not be the case. It's kind of like classic WoW versus retail WoW. You might like one more than the other. You might play both. You might play one more than the other. With classic WoW your expectations are set. It is its own thing. With retail WoW you can still disagree w/ the direction of the game and the direction of the game can influence which you decide to play more if at all.
What's even worse about the "live service" excuse is that they could be rebalancing things every single week if they wanted, instead they just give us vague promises for changes that might come 8 months down the road. It's pathetic
I'm still trying to figure out how diablo 2 is still so fun after thousands of hours. I'll never understand it, same game each time same bosses to level yet the game is just something so addictive.
thats because you can get random stats on items, it doesnt feel like d4 were your literally doing the same dugeon over and over again. The builds on d2 are simple and easy to make and understand so is the skill tree.
Here's how: Multiple talent builds for every character class are viable, even if they're not all A-tier or higher. Multiple gear builds for every talent build are viable, even if they're not all A-tier or higher. Items are meaningful, have variability, and are tradeable. Let me restate that last bit, because it's extremely important. Items are meaningful, have variability, and are tradeable. And lastly, the leveling process is fun, and is clearly a part of the game. Modern games tend to end up being cookie cutter centric, where you can technically clear with an off-meta build, but you're weak enough with one that nobody will want to group with you for any challenging content, so you have to roll with a cookie cutter build. Items tend to be infinitely replaceable and ultimately meaningless and unmemorable. Items also tend to be 'bind to character' or 'bind to account'. Basically, modern games are terrible design from a gameplay standpoint. They're designed for monetization. Diablo 2 is not. There's a lot of room for improvement, in it, but it's still based on solid design.
Campaign score: 10/10 - Completion: 100% Itemization/Hunting for loot: 2/10 - Completion: 15% maybe? Leveling: 4/10 - Currently level 51 Hours played: Maybe about 40ish? Huge fan of Diablo 2. What keeps me hooked in that game is the hunt for gear, runes, gems, charms, crafting mats, etc. I feel like the itemization in Diablo 2 is so good, you're always hunting for something. The new items and content added in each season are helping it feel exciting on a game that otherwise is already damn good to begin with. I loved the campaign of D4. Cinematics and story were A++. However, the itemization and hunt for gear isn't there. At least not for me. I don't feel compelled to grind mobs or bosses because I don't feel interested in picking up any gear. The first time I got genuinely excited about getting loot was when I got my first piece of unique gear. All throughout the leveling, I was never excited for getting gear. The biggest satisfaction I get with items is when I salvage all my items at the Blacksmith because I know I'm building up my inventory of crafting mats. But then what do I spend crafting mats on? Upgrades. Ehhh... I like upgrades, don't get me wrong. But it's a lack luster experience compared to throwing in a Grand charm and 3 P gems into a box and rolling the dice. And then doing that over and over until you either say "screw this" or you happen to get the Skiller with 30+ life! Such a rewarding experience and feeling. Diablo 4 doesn't do that for me, sadly. Similarly, I was never excited for leveling because the stats felt irrelevant to me. I think this is because I haven't learned the game well enough to understand which stats I need to care about. But as I leveled, I never looked at any of my main stats. I ocassionaly looked at crit chance, or thorns; things like that. But I never tried to optimize my gear because I just felt, what's the point? As I level higher, everything around me scales anyway. Why waste mats and gems and gold at level 50 when I could do it and get a better pay off at level 60 or 70? Not sure if I'll keep playing D4 long term. I have the itch to go back to D2R
@@Stavroization ok but I did, hunting for gear is bad. You get upgrades regularly till 70-75 then it gets progressively rare, and the problem with that is the loot comes in mountains, and you just notice half of your game hours go by sifting through the stuff, which gets to the point around lvl 90 that you say "fck it, I just need the xp I don't even bother picking up anything anymore", and that includes the uniques too as you will find the same 3-4 unique all the time I have literally 7-8 lam esen staff frost burn gauntlet, esu boots, penitent boots and the ice pants 2 stash tab full with them I don't even know why, im just gonna vendor them soon anyway. Nothing exciting in finding any of these. Legendaries only interesting if they have a perfect lgendary affix and only as long as I pull that off from the thing.
@@Stavroization am I supposed to grind another 40+ hours through the higher world tiers, nightmare dungeons and helltides in order to start having fun and be interested in hunting for loot? I feel like it's more of the same, just with higher numbers and maybe a couple fun aspects that I can tailor to a build. Is that all this game is? Make a build that can more quickly kill mobs that drops loot you don't care about searching for?
@@TheMeerkat88 I'm confused with what you're expecting. You're on this channel which i presume then you're not new to arpgs. This is pretty normal for the genre.
@@Stavroization I guess was expecting D4 itemization to be more appealing. I was hoping there would be secondary progression collections, like runes, charms, keys, organs, etc. Even the gems you collect only serve a single purpose: add an affix to a gear slot. After you've socketed your gear, what purpose does collecting gems serve? Diablo 4 is a well polished game for an ARPG that "fits the mold" of other ARPGs. It reminds me a lot of D3. I hear it's similar to POE, albiet more simple. I was hoping D4 would break the mold and introduce new itemization mechanics/collections/systems that would keep me hooked in the end game like D2 does. I don't feel compelled to make a bad ass character because there's nothing to collect (aside from gear you find yourself), there's nothing to trade, there's no economy and thus no real wealth building mechanic aside from gold, which is only used to reset talents and upgrade gear/gems/enchant.
Agree with most your thoughts and knew you had a good basis based on your ARPG xp. The dungeon change is one more step to feeling more like a mobile game. They built this vast world and should continually encourage exploring it. This takes away from it, they could of made the dungeons Region based so you didn’t have to run to a specific spot, giving more flexibility and maybe add hidden things to certain dungeons we could discover over time. Just get rid of scaling and make itemization better. It's not that hard. The base game looks and handles very well, just hope they improve these things or the player base will be very small this time next year.
Sounds like D3, and they turned it into the most boring basic bitch game, at a fundamental level, they dont understand the things that really make a good game, they made everything these modular, complex seeming but actually shallow systems, forced gameplay styles and poor itemisation concepts, all in the face of a directly scaling environment removes the feeling of power creep and progression, such a fundamental hook in arpgs, every class has a couple of viable builds and so many skills and item requirements are simply LOCKED IN, you dont have an option or its just so much worse than not taking that skill/stat, it wont be effective. On top of all this they are most likely going to listen to the wrong people and change the fundamental gameplay loop and systems to a worse gameplay experience overall, because it will be more convenient, they are addicited to appeasing the widest playerbase, which will drive away a large portion of the actual arpg fans, plus a large potion of the wider player base who wasnt going to hang around anyway. I really hope i'm wrong and a lot of these things get incrementally improved upon, but I wont hold my breath... when I saw D4 in beta using basically the D3 base, I knew they would make the same mistakes because they dont really understand what was wrong with D3 in the first place. Good combat feel, fluidity and movement marred by very poor itemisation, class/skill, scaling and systems design
WHY does NOONE ask that they don't have a GEM bag after 10 Years of Diablo 3 and we have asked for it the entire time!!! NEVER got it! Yet in Diablo IV it's still the top thing asked for! Because they are trying to entice you into playing longer into seasons. Carrot on a Stick for Quality-of-life changes.
The itemization being a step back from D2 is the most glaring flaw for me. It holds together up to level 70 or so, but it needs another tier at least of noticeably qualitatively better gear (and tier 5 difficulty to go with it). They are holding back too much obvious stuff so that they can add it over time, but people won't bother to stick around.
in d2 you could find useful uniques 2 hours in. in path you could find an exalted orb in the first five minutes. what items are we excited to get while leveling in d4?
Rebalance D2 items and sets to be situational or at times on par with rune words, add clans and a in game market, and add more difficult or added mechanics for bosses and we can play D2 forever. Add more d2 itemization to D4, remove monster scaling, and open trading with in game market and more difficult bosses and we can play d4 for 30 years. ;)
they should copy/paste the itemization from d2 into d4 lol but for real I think the major issue with D4 is the affixes and aspects. All the other issues like scaling and trading can be fixed but the itemization needs a complete overhaul.
Sometimes I think the towns were designed with spite in mind...like Mephisto had drawn them. For instance you want to reach a vendor and just when you can see his shack/stall you find that there is no direct way of reaching and you have to either go around or dismount to climb up or down some ladder 😂
There's a main town -- I forget which one -- where the blacksmith is in a little cubby hole that opens up and to the right. When I'm walking away after using the blacksmith, I obviously start clicking down and left. My character immediately goes into a long sitting animation. Because there's a fucking interact-able stool right in the path out. I see you, Mephisto.
I mean if all the towns had the same layout of. All the shops right next to eachother. It'd be kinda dumb too. There is no win here so I'm glad they went with you gotta run around. I don't wanna stand in the same town all day everyday D3 exists for those who like not moving
@@jonathanrothmare3509 you say that like it would be the only other way, but I would be contempt with just not blocking the direct path, they can be in different places. And if you were to analyze historical cities you'd quickly learn that merchants would mostly be in a designated quarter of sorts and not scattered about.
@@Dreadbaron you mean the enchanter. Who jokes about placing a soul inside of another human body. In his explanation on how legendary aspects work? (But not in line of earshot of the church). Would be grouped up with the black smith and apothecary? You think humans just love hearing a anvil slam. While a blacksmith fits everyone's horses every morning with horse shoes?
Well said. The world is lovely at first and then falls into an incredibly repetitive mess lacking a lot of qol and quality testing. I'm having fun, I'll probably play through and season 1, but if we don't see big improvements to those blatantly obvious pain points early, I'll probably put the game down until at least the first proper expansion, and that's a shame considering the potential and the quality in the environments and music and voice acting. I just hope blizzard can pull it's head out of Activision's ass long enough to realize 4 quests and 4 events based on an early 2000s mmo format aren't enough to make a world feel alive anymore. See you in season 1 ^.^
Hey, Lama love your stuff, Im a super casual D2 player have been for for a decade now, I just got my friend into it (thanks to D2R) and we just got to act 5 and it already clicked for him. Keep up the great vids Mr!
The real problem I that the dev team are probably being pushed for the expansions because the higher ups are so money hungry. And that's imo the root cause of all the issues.
D4 campaign, atmosphere, graphics, lore, cinematics is 10/10. Rest is meeeh. Itemization is lackluster(missing of sets or purpose for white and blue items) and boring, lack of runes/runewords, charms, thorches and whole combat spender/builder phylosophy is not my taste. I still play D4 because I did not finished my goals yet, but I am looking forward for going back to d2r.
I don't think llama will ever find a more complete game than D2. have to realize the nostalgic impact that game had on us when we were younger, heck I still remember playing d1 and d2 when I was a kid and had so much fun! still amazing games to play today, but I still feel my perception of them is definitely clouded a bit by nostalgia.
I loved the game, but I don't enjo the grind in d2 as I do in d4. D4 is not perfect but it's a really good game. Ppl can play d2 but for me it's too bboooooooring
That's what they want you to think but that's all bullshit. No, D2 was a passionate and complete whole product. D4 is a soulless garbage, that's why you feel that way. Personally, I haven't even played d2 that much, yes I played it in my childhood once or twice but nowhere near as the uber enthusiasts so I don't have that nostalgia you talk about. I genuinely and objectively believe that d2 and d1 is more fun and better game than d3 and d4 COMBINED. Why? Because it has depth, it has polish, those later games are just empty husks. It's something like Gothic 1-3 in comparison to Gothic 4 or Duke nuke manhattan project versus Duke nukem forever, just it's all about bonafide quality and how the game feels. I REPEAT IT'S NOT NOSTALGIA! It's what THEY want you to believe! You are basically being gaslighted
I agree with most of your points. However for me the biggest problem is that there is no endgame content that has meaning. I'm lvl 70 now and i have pretty decent gear. But what is there to do now? World Bosses are far to easy, pushing nightmare dungeons and maybe drop a piece of gear that is 2% better? meh idk. Also as far as i heard uber lilith doesn't really give any good rewards either. Until now i really liked the game, it felt like my character was continuously getting stronger. Now i don't feel like that anymore.
This is what I don't really understand. Your description fits more perfect for D2 than for D4. You get to the point where you are at max gear with potential single digit % upgrades way faster than in D4 actually. At least for casters Run way less dungeons with less variance and less challenge !?!? You can argue that you can find loot for other characters too, but would it really make a difference if D4 had that possibility too?
@@broco1163 I've played more builds with my rogue over the last 2 weeks in D4 than I ever played as a amazon in D2 and D2R... All these comments about lack of things to do in D4 compared to D2R really blow my mind. Outside of when they finally introduced Terror zones in D2R, once you hit 90 what the fuck else did you do in D2 besides run Nil, Chaos Sanc, and Baal for experience, and NM Andy & mephisto, Hell countess, pit, lower trav, chaos sanc, and baal for gear... There was literally a loop of shit I would do just to try to get gear or runes so I could buff my build by a fraction to farm it more efficiently. Heaven forbid you die in D2 and lose like a week of fucking farming in experience...
Agree with you MrLlama, the "game journalists" and supposed critics giving this game 9/10 and 10/10 are either paid off or out of their minds. The gameplay of D4 is seriously messed up right now and does not even come close at all to the gameplay of D2, it's really unfortunate.
Well it's NOT Diablo 2. So no shit it doesn't feel like d2. D2 was also while good. Was super far from. Perfect. Even today. It's at best a highly rated ARPG that's sorta over hyped because at the end of the day. They're. The same fucking thing. Button mashing action games
Said it before and I’ll say it again. You’re the only one who has made this statement with the conditions and truly meant it and you have my upmost respect for that
Wow the people in the comments here(and other forums) are something else man. The game has been in development for how long by a multi billion dollar company and this is the product? It’s not hard to tell it’s just going to follow the roots of immortal and be a cash grab. Cash shop day 1 and “seasons” coming soon. Also him playing 200 hours doesn’t change anything, at all. If you played 200 hours over the course of a year it doesn’t change anything. The points are still valid and you’d run into them eventually. D3 was not perfect at launch either so I hope it can be improved significantly but as it stands I have to agree on just about everything. Why do they have the WoW team working on diablo? Lol Been having more fun on D2 honestly.
I'm too busy in my life to properly play games anymore unfortunately - so I have retired to just watching streams on twitch and YT. I played A LOT of D2 and D2R (after first launch), so I was really excited to watch some D4 streams. One of my biggest disappointments as a "consumer" of D4 rather than a player is that during battles the screen just looks so cluttered, I can't even tell whats going on. During any battle scene, the main fighting area is just blasted with text labels like "Vulnerable", "Dodge", damage numbers, etc... Its really annoying because I honestly can't even tell what is happening in a fight, unless its a wizard playing from distance. I'd give the viewing experience of D4 a 3/10, as someone who doesn't play games but just watches streams. With D2R at least you get a really strong and clear understanding of the battle that is tacking place, where damage is being dealt, who is taking damage, what skills are being used by the enemy monsters etc. D4 is just - the fight begins and you have 1,000 text labels flashing on the screen. This is my main disappointment. As a result I have probably watched only about 5-6 hours of D4 streams now in total, whats the point of watching it when I can't even properly see the fighting in what is supposed to be an action rpg?
I totally agree that they should focus on CORE game mechanics before maximizing the "flair". Damage bucket system (vulnerable essential for all builds), lack of ranged game play (melee sorcs?), monster level/character level power progression (why do you get weaker as you level?), what to really do after level 80?, making trading more viable etc.
Melee sorc? That's always been a thing. Hate to inform you. Even back in D1. We used to build sword shield mages using simple magics. And really over powered mana shield. D4 makers your " weapon" tied to your main basic skills which for. The sorc. 3 of 4 are ranged spell attacks. I think you dunno what your talking about. At all
@@jokinplaysgameswhat people mean by this but are calling it melee sorc and not really saying it properly is that every build uses frost nova for vulnerable which means you are always in melee range. Ice shards, teleport group frost nova one shot everything and if it spreads then you can keep going. Arc lash same cept you pop unstable. Firewall/meteor. Use ultimate then teleport frost nova and use skill. So every build is in melee range. 80-90% of the time
Hey Llama, I have been following you for many, many years. Seeing your Tyrael's Might video inspired me to complete D2 Holy Grail of my own back in the day. I appreciate your venture into D4 and the honest feedback you've given, as I suspect your perspective about it's state is pretty close to my own. I think your input has convinced me to hold on to my money for now and check out the game later when the price comes down and the game mechanics are better developed. It's a shame you are getting backlash for submitting feedback. I think it's largely due to the fact that many people want to hold on to their belief that the product they paid 100$ for is excellent in every way and they tend to lash out at people that challenge that in any way.
I don't think people said Diablo 4 game is excelent, but it has indeed a very good base and they can build on it for years to come. They laid the ground work for an amazing game which will continue to grow and have lots of things to offer once they are develeloped.
@@alexbarcan4705 Let's hope that is indeed what happens. Heroes of the Storm and Diablo 3 were both basically abandoned by Blizzard and it feels like the same is now happening to Overwatch 2. I'm pretty sure no ARPG in existence reached their mechanical peak at launch, but rather many years after. Let's hope D4 continues to evolve so that it can reach that peak and is not just discarded by Blizzard's upper management once the initial buzz surrounding it's launch has died down.
@@alexbarcan4705 agree. Of course game isn't perfect. There are annoyances. But. The game imo opinion is worth full price still. Do uniques etc. Need more detail sometimes. Yes. Do we need a teleport button to ur friends. Yes. Voyaging to a dungeon on that big map is a no for me dog. But storyline, voice acting, interesting side quests, actual good variety on each build. All great things. I feel most ppl are already overpowered, fixing resistance, would that make it more fun? Idk. Gotta be some challenge. I love D2R but don't recall it's storyline to be as compellingly as D4. Definitely good base here. Hope to see even better things to come. 8 out of 10 imo.
I paid 100 Euros too and i was back ro D2 way earlier haha. Trying out season 1 in d4 tho. But im still so disapointed from the summon necro in d4 and the loot system and the horrible grind.
They should add timed magic-find buffs for completing side content in the open world. Like…+15% for completing a tree of whispers quest, +5% for completing an event, etc.
I agree! I love the game but I'm out after I get this sorcerer to 100. 4 stash tabs is barely enough for one build. It's inexcusable. If they'd written 'Only 4 Stash Tabs' on the box I wouldn't have bought the game 🤣 I think it's outrageous. If I have to throw away every single item I get (in a looter!!!) why go get the items? I can't experiment with any other classes or builds.
so after a week of D4 today I just logged into D2R to play with a very minimalistic hydra/f.orb Sorceress on Hell Act1, on Stony Field I ran into a pack of "elite"s with all kind of nasty aruas and I felt more adrenalin than through a week of D4 play!!! Btw she's lvl 56, with Spirit, Pledge, Lore, Stealth, a +1skill amu, magic gloves with resistance, rare rings with fcr maxmana resistances, rare boots with 30% run maxmana resitances, and a pathetic white belt to open up all potion rows and a couple of resistance and max life charms. And hell I love and appreciate every piece of my gear MUCH more than any "legendary" in D4 (why the f is called "legendary" anyway if you sell 100+ piece / hour 🙄). Using on hotkey: F.Orb, Hydra, Teleport, StaticF, Frozen Armor, Telekinesis I wish to D4 developers to listen to Llama, Asmon, Quinn, Raxx and turn D4 into a great game because currently it is super easy, not a single scary moment and it is super boring... and don't name something legendary if it's swarming into your bag.. which you will sell for gold in town because it's USELESS... legendary my a$$ with love :) Edit: I forgot to mention that I run faster in D2 than my mount in D4 (without the teleport...) :)))
I arrived there in beta and didn't even bother buying it. I've been keeping an eye on it in case they do come closer to something I'd want to play... but really I just think it's fundamentally flawed form the get go. I agree with you 100%. For me the biggest flaw by far, it the itemisation. In D2 you would hunt whites, greys, blues were worth picking up, hell you could get a jmod and be filthy rich from one blue. Rares were worth getting and commonly used. Items were NOT implicitly tied to builds (I mean there were some, but they were more BIS, rarely actually required or it wouldn't work), rather the interactions between them made builds work. Every single category was something you actually wanted to hunt. There were multiple ways to achieve those goals. Hell, even racking and LK runs were valid ways to farm certain items. You had choice and agency, you weren't forced to interact with different parts of the game implicitly, they were just a good way to enjoy it. It's a far better game
Yeah, agree completely. In my playthrough I found NO items that felt exciting to find. I sort of gave up after that. Also, that you can hotkey 16 skills in D2 and like 5 or 6 skills in D4 is annoying to me.
You brought up my main issue with d4. D3 has so much quality of life and it feels like not only did they not improve on that QoL state of the game, but they literally removed quality of life that was already established.
I own Diablo 1-2-3-4. I have spent years on each. I think you are right. I think Blizzard developed D4 juuust enough to make the high sales and not get too many bad scores and refund requests. Now, the development continues with us to be part of it and do a lot of beta-testing and fine tuning. Don't get me wrong. With people's participation a game can really become something great. It's just that they should have released a little later, with social features and end-game systems figured out better. They gave us something to sink in a couple hundred of our hours while they make more of it and fix their rushed mistakes.
Yeah stupid amounts of CC and nonsensical fireworks exploding the entire screen while an entire novel of CC text appears above monsters because you wouldn't be able to tell what you were doing to them otherwise is real fun. So much better than monsters having individual characteristics and combat feel, being able to actually see all of what's happening and dropping actually interesting loot.
The visuals are beautiful, the combat is fun and engaging, and every NPC and quest are voice acted with well written quest lines. The game needs work, but it has been out less than a month, so seriously WTF? It takes ONE minute or less to ride your horse to any dungeon on the map. You people are nuts.
D4 is by far the best "state-of-release" of any Blizzard game I can recall. I'm enjoying it, but as with WoW Vanilla....nothing every replaces your first love.
From the perspective of someone who played a lot of d2. Almost every season of d3. And d2r whilst waiting for d4 I can’t help but feel I paid a lot of money to continue being a beta tester And season one is the “real” launch
@@Freezerburn137 those tremendously hold the game back. same with wow having a store or any videogame @2006 that started to implement microtransactions. a few is manageable but past that it's no longer a game but a store with graphics. The golden age of games was before microtransactions took over. A big fat content-rich expansion/DLC is perfectly fine though. =)
Good to see you keeping an open mind on TPing to NM dungeons whether you are or were right or wrong or not. I was worried that was going to be a change to appease a small number of high play time players, but I thought I was too casual to really know better so I didn't speak up. I feel like a lot of the systems that support the open world design are under assault right now by the community and if they aren't defended the essence of the game will change forever. I don't think it is always a good idea to change the game just because some things are annoying for people playing 80 hours a week. Some things need to be changed, but I think the developers should always ask themselves is this contrary to our design goals?
My biggest issue with the open world experience is how bad the servers are. Because of this I'd take an offline mode 10 times out of 10. Also horses getting stuck on random crap all the time makes riding it to different dungeons pretty annoying. ngl. They need to work on making horse travel better, also increase the speed of horses without boost. I shouldn't be faster than a horse on foot no matter if it's at a full gallop or not. It encourages a terrible playstyle of using all your boost, dismounting to run, getting back on the horse when boost is ready. And all of those horse issues make me understand why there is such a large outcry to remove the traversal part. Even at the expense of a populated overworld.
I actually agree with your stance on Sigils/Dungeons. Just teleporting in is a bit world breaking. Maps work if PoE because you use them to open rifts into other worlds via a device in your Hideout. Keystones in D3 I guess for a similar reason? (honestly never paid attention to the greater rift lore) If sigils in D4 are going to follow suit it would be nice to at least have some NPC talking about "temporal disturbances" or something. Separate and apart from this, if they make this change for Sigils then there's really no reason why sigils can't take us to "dungeons" that aren't on the world map. Other than of course not hiving made them yet, but there's no Mechanical or Lore reason why players couldn't expect a season based "new Sigil rotation" as they will no longer need to be placed "in world".
I find D4 to be pretty boring overall, while I’m still playing D2R since launch (and D2 since 2000). It’s just a better game. And for half the price too. D4 has poor itemization and I hate beating on constantly level scaling trash mobs forever just to kill one. Level scaling needs to go, itemization needs a huge improvement.
If they don’t focus on seasons, there will be no game left to fix. As a software engineer I understand dev team at all, because it is how to keep software up. There are X amount of development resources and to fix Y amount of issues. So you have to prioritize, QoL improvements wont kill the game. I think they are focusing to fix balance stuff that can kill the game first. You have to accept some mechanics in d4 is out like this, either good or bad, those stuff can be changed but not with a hotfix patch. Remember they spent years to build the game, changing a major mechanic in a week is not possible. In the mid run they will address those issues.
I second this notion d2r 4 life d4 is great but you can't beat d2 with any comparison its just too amazing thanks for all the great informational content broski stay up
D4 is fun. But it lacks the character that D2 has. D2 is so meticulously created, down to the finest details. I'd still play D4 while my friends are still in it, but not for long. Once seasons start, I think i will quit the game. I played D2R last year and woah it still blows my mind after 20 years. How different items and skills and runewords interact with each other to give you different permutations of gameplay styles etc. It's just better. I am with you on this MrLlama
I like diablo 4 but there will never be a game as great as diablo 2. I really love the negotiating and the trade system in d2. Just create a game with a item in the description and an asking price and still ppl join and try to buy it for an ist less or something. It’s sad that you can’t trade legendary items in diablo 4, what’s the reason for it?
I agree with you on this one.. they are re-inventing the wheel for no reason. Need more Bank space, More bag space, horse rework, rubberbanding fix. The TP to Sigil dungeon is something already we can fix in game by just running the same sigil in a row. Have to ride to the first one then the rest u can port out and open the next and go back into the same portal. As a clan i would tell the guys to name the sigil they have the most and then we run up to 10-15 in a row. My own opinion is they rushed the game out half baked.
Llama, I appreciate this video and your previous videos talking about D4. I was on the fence about buying it for myself, and you convinced me that it is not worth my money at this time. I might grab it down the road after they make significant improvements and/or a big sale.
I agree 100%. There are basic things that are missing. They will get fixed, but it's a legitimate question to ask why are features that are in every other major action RPG not there on day one. Especially after getting feedback for so long.
Yup I’m still loving D2R every single day. I still love the hunt for loot and every season kinda brings some freshness to restart. Similar to wipes in tarkov or rust. D4 just wasn’t it for me tbh d2 will never get old
I totally agree with what you said about them starting from scratch. They are acting like this is a whole new project, like they are reinventing the wheel or something. Most if not all of the issues people have with D4 are things that have already been solved in other ARPG's or even previous Diablo games. It's so frustrating for them to be acting like they have to relearn everything again. I get the feeling that many of the people working on this game have never played a Diablo game in their life. That's the only explanation.
So weird, I was literally searching your channel yesterday for this summery type video. I've yet to purchase the game, I learned my lesson from D3 to wait it out and see how specifically the end game is. With what I've been seeing across the board how the game after 70/80 is pretty dreadful and still having so many flaws is enough to stop me from buying it now. £60 Is a lot of money and I'll keep my money until it's in a good state.
@@andrewhandelsman834 Last Nintendo game was the previous Zelda, breath of the wild, best game I've played in the past 10 years. I'll get the new one when I get some time.
@@showmetheway2 Glad to hear that, I'll for sure give it another look when things are in place at that time. I'm currently looking at Last Epoch, I recently got interested with the ironman mode they have.
Absolutely agree with your take on D4, it's not polished enough...and the point you made, taking things/working systems from the previous games and build upon THAT is so true! I will still watch your D2 Content, but probably try Last Epoch and POE 2 when it comes out? Would make the Variety of the Channel better, and i would love to hear your take on that Games!
Guys, you can stop disliking these videos. D4 is the fricking "fastest selling "Blizzard" game of all-time” no matter how many design decisions Llama criticises. :D
My biggest gripe with the game is with the entire Unique item system. Coming from D2 the unique items were chase items and made up the majority of the "post story" content, and though the "Big 6" uniques have the TC87 feel from D2, there is the entire swath of uniques that could have filled the TC63-TC84 bracket that we just don't have in D4. In my mind they should entirely re-do the unique system based on the "big 6" model with additional restrictions: First Unique items should only be available in WT4 and have a locked minimum level of 65. Second they should always drop at higher-than-normal item power (big 6 are always 820) that way you could potentially get lucky and loot them early in WT4 and equip them for a big boost. Third, they should be Bind-on-Equip. Currently the game's trade economy is pretty stagnant as there aren't many "big ticket" items on there to build wealth towards on your account. By making unique items BOE they could be freely traded and make up the backbone of the economy like in D2. Fourth, they need to be Build-Defining. If you get the teleport unique chest it should be tuned so that it is such a big boost to teleport that it changes the way you interact with the skill; and they could do this with basically every skill in the game. The one caveat to this level of power is unique items should be "equip 1" so there wont be any need to balance the game around stacking multiple uniques. Currently several of my uniques are just chillin in my stash collecting dust because of the poor itemization, low stat rolls or item power and that sucks. Lastly, they should be rare: I don't want to see one in less than 30 hours of game time. This means we will have literally hundreds of hours of time to chase them all SSF, or if we don't want to play SSF, we have the option to trade the one that drops for something that changes our build for the next 30+ hours of play. As it stands there is nothing to chase at endgame and I blame the Unique system for that, though I am from D2 so I acknowledge my bias.
This is the biggest complaint I have as well. D2-like itemization is also my biggest gripe with the game. We are just farming for stats on items and it gets boring instead of “OMG I FOUND MY FIRST SHAKO” and “Well, I just found a Skulder’s and it’ll do between now and my Enigma”, etc. Not having gone the D2 route and going in-between D2 and D3 is just not what people wanted.
@@NicolasWithNoH there is a whole subset of UA-cam content creators that did "1000x of _____ run Drop highlights" videos that literally have nothing to show right now. I saw a clip of a windforce drop in d4 and the guy literally just put it in his stash because the bow he had equipped was better. No D2 Dopamine Hits in D4.
Good points! But really, is D2 better. I played quite a lot of D2R and thousands of hours D2, and it misses so much what modern arpg´s are offering today. I think D4 will improve with seasons. My biggest issue is the end game, mob density and a few QoL stuff you also mentioned. I don´t see any reason to go above lvl80 just to kill Echo of Lilith. Maybe I am just getting old and don´t have all the time in the world =)
In relation to the dungeon teleporting thing. I watched a great video from Mark Rosewater whos a lead designer on Magic the gathering. he said that your audience is really good at identifying problems, but not usually very good at suggesting the right solutions. I always kind of think about that when stuff like this comes up. But I do agree with your points, that moving through the world should just be more interesting.
@@attractivegd9531 its dumb because these suggestions 99% of the time are purely self serving and have no intention of improving the game, just give instant gratification. none of the players have the responsibility of a game designer, next to none of the insight or experience either. thus "he said that your audience is really good at identifying problems, but not usually very good at suggesting the right solutions." if most of the casual player suggestions were to be implemented, you'd get to lvl 100 in a day and have full bis, with a kill everything/loot everything on the screen button,.
@@Mabbah066 it's a really good game but the gameplay is dated and the lack of end game kills it for me I don't wanna do bal runs over and over again. That's not an end game
You are the best MrLlama, thanks for being honest with yourself and your subscribers. we all here know what D2R is way better than D4, but you have a really big balls to say that loud as the biggest diablo youtuber.
I agree with you, Everyone is scratching their heads saying how was this game even remotely ready to be shipped. They basically need a complete 180% overhaul like final fantasy did and not to mention why we we see amazing boss fights like andariel in the campaign 1 time and then in endgame we get a random spider....The games a flop so far and Ill be going back to d2 as well. Luv ya llama good video.
Dude will do Baal/Mephisto runs on his death bed 😂 I can kinda understand for example PoE players that are playing the same game for 10+ years since beta as it was continuously improving and the content was being added regularly so it kept it fresh and the meta was shifting multiple times too making the seasons more engaging, but playing the same game with the same exact content for 20 years is fucking bonkers to me. At this point, i'm pretty convinced it's not really about Diablo 4 in his case. It's about game x not being Diablo 2 for him. And i am 99,3% sure that if D4 was a lot better than it is now, but still wasn't similar enough to D2, he still wouldn't play it :D It is like those people who are stuck in their ways and never will change them, no matter what. P.S. Please no bot replies about how D2 is a better game than D4, cause that's not what this comment is about.
I love your d2 content. I don't think I could ever be as entertained on d2 as you have though. I only wanted to achieve my ideal builds for each class. But outside of mods, I was getting very irritated with d2r muling. My stash is full and I am not keen on muling in order to obtain my eventual holy grail.
@@Travnorton5 blizz had 10years+ to give people no reason to come back to d2 lol. They lost the core game, now d4 just some overhyped "10/10 play the way you want. We have 150+ dungeons and endless customization" lmao cmon now
It's normal dude, change is hard, I would have resisted change if I were in your position, imagine building your whole career on a game, and a new game from the franchise comes out and you are not at the top of that game ... I would have resisted with my every bone ...
Good news, imo. Everyone seems to be streaming D4 right now but D2R is still there and still a great game. This channel has always had great D2 content, so great to hear you will continue with it.
I forced myself to finish the campaign and once I got into the paragon board I stopped playing and went back to D2. It felt like a crappy WoW simulator.
@@greenbeetlessi got bored of d2 after the 5th season in a row of playing it 😂. I shall return to it sooner or later.. gotta give it some time for it to be exciting again.
This is not a hate video on d4 at all. I think the game is perfectly fine and honestly getting a couple of hundred hours is not bad for the cost. I'm sure i will also do more with seasons and play around here and there.
Overall though it may take a few years for the core to get to where it needs to be if it ever really gets there
At fairly early stage of the game is almost just dungeons. Late game definetly needs improvement. Casuals won't even get to that point to understand. It's not even the lack of quality of life that bothers me the most when things to do and look forward to are dull. IT's fine for a single playthrough. They should've started at least where d3 left and not wait another 10 years for the same. And let me tell you that closed beta from 9 months ago had more content. WT5 inc, but that won't change things much because when you get to 100 it's all the same overgearing plus the shakos and grandfathers and 8tier gems when things to do are dunnngeons (the same).
diablo 4 is a disappointment, ill stick to POE 2
The Aspect system is horrible. You have no storage space to keep all those Aspects specially when you want to keep stuff for the different builds and other classes. I feel once you find a higher version of an Aspect it should be a permanent thing that you can reuse. The Aspect should be in a tab where you get a list of all Aspect that you extracted from your items without taking stash space. Rerolling a stat gets way too expensive and make your only potential upgrade useless which is super dumb. Sorting loot for 3x more time than it took you to do the actual dungeon and having such a hard time to figure out even if the item is an actual upgrade is a pain in the ass!
You do you, just remember you are an influencer and thats all I can say.
Dude they would have done a good move asking you to work there
I think once your aspects are extracted, they should go into a bank separate from your item stash, same as gems, and be organized like the codex is. Stash should be for gear only, not to save aspects specifically
100% bro. There should be a tab in the codex that stores all your aspects.
Yeah like Immortal, even if they’re still consumed after use.
no hope for D4 when they can't even let us teleport by right click like D3. it'll take them another 10 years to get where we want D4 to be..
ive never played D2, got Diablo 4 when it released, finished the campaign, and now about 15 days later im playing D2 resurrected, it feels way more complete and fulfilling, i will return to Diablo 4 when the upcoming buffs and season 1 begins, although i wont leave D2 now either because its just too good, and the music, oh god its too good, normally when i play a game i turn off the music because i prefer my own vibe but diablo 2 has the best soundtrack, it reminds me of the age of myth soundtrack, so legendary.
Yeah. It is an incredible game.
and there is mouch more to do than d4 xD after 20+ years d2 is still more complex and better than d4. What happened to this world?
what a load of horse shit. buying d4 on release and for some unknown reason skipping d3 which looks like d4, opting for a 25 year old game. what's your bnet?
D2 is such a great game. Glad people are still finding it!
Grats to having taken the first steps into a larger world :D
The best items ive found in D4 have been exciting because most of the items dont do anything; a lot of builds use similar aspects/affixes/skillsets because they are the only ones that 'add up' to something significant in the end. Really they need to add more reasons for people to be excited about experiencing the content here because imo its just not fun
I feel like D2 is roughly the same. You're always chasing a handful of runeword, uniques, and each class has a handful of certified Uber killer builds.
@@phant0mdummy Yeah, this. People don't care about Echo of Lilith just like people don't care about World Diablo or the Ubers. Diablo 2 would also need a difficulty level after Hell, with another tier of gear to make me come back (Nightmare has Exceptionnal gear, Hell has Elite gear, what about Torment with Divine gear or something next?).
@@phant0mdummy d2 and d4 are completely different games you cant compare it if you were to say d3 i would understand
@@tomm5462 I'm saying everyone blindly praises D2, cause nostalgia, but doesn't realize that it has limited build variety and zero endgame.
Yet we complain when D4 has lots of varied activities, but oh it isn't so good after lvl 80...
Like okay? It's vanilla. A new world tier will arrive. Just grind your toon until it isn't fun,then try another class or wait for season 1.
Overall it's a great game. My biggest issue is they someone botched the UI, inventory management, and didnt bring a dozen things over from D3 that shoulda been day one features.
@@phant0mdummy d2 is the same but people want to tell you d2 itemization is the best ever
Like it's literally the same as d4
You want the best itemization? just play poe
I’m surely not the only one excited that lama is going back to d2. I love the hell out of that game
I put into d4 350+hours and still enjoying it a lot , really love pvp , played d2 for 14 years both games are epic. Dunno why people complaining so much a about d4 , its a fresh game , d4 need some time till its perfect , but the game already is in a great shape.
Dear Mr LlamaSC,
I can only thank you for all the content on D2R you made across the years. With the launch of D4, it made me go back playing D2, then on last week I bought D2R. D4 really isnt for me, and Im having a real good time with D2R.
Your videos helped me a lot to make this decision 😊❤
I also recommend Last Epoch. If you don't want to deal with early access, the full release has been stated to be near the end of the year.
Yes so fun playing a dead game where people just live on forums trading useless FG. D2 been dead to anyone with a brain for awhile.
@@realrealityeast6278 It's not dead, though. There are more games right now than when I quit ladder a month ago.
@@realrealityeast6278 lol its not useless it has monetary value and could be used to transfer wealth across many other games.
Perfect commment
You seem happier knowing you can go back to your D2 grind. Good for you, man. Ty for your input on d4 and being honest about your experience!
I mean, of course we knew he was coming back to D2. Most of his videos were just pointing out that D4 isn't D2...
Hopefully he stays in that shitpile game...hes a clown😂
@@7gamexexactly what Im thought. Although also sems like a few of the complaints are not just present in D2 as well but worse than in d4. D2 is grinding the same 1-3 tiny areas over because literally nothing else gives any significant progreß. And getting max lvl requires literally thousands of kills of exactly the same boss.
@@Orion3Tecurrent endgame d4 is significantly worse than endgame d2
@@Orion3Tthe thing is, d2 isn't about hitting max lvl(to most people) it's about hunting for those significant items for you or alts, or to have value in trading for something you really want that'll significantly impact your characters power.
D2 has that excitement of finding a unique ring.. maybe it's a soj.., finding certain uniques or runes is an amazing feeling.. very rare, but not impossibly rare. Even if it wasn't good for you, it can still have value to help get what you want, or value for another character, or even make you want to make another character to use it.
D4 has.. search through hundreds-thousands of rares for a 1% higher stat.
The playthrough was fun in d4.. but at 100, I feel no(absolutely 0) urge to log in and play. And you can say I played too much.. sure I did.. but I also did the same in lost ark for the past year... d4 lasted a few weeks to lose interest
I've yet to get bored or not find something I haven't done or built in D2 still and I've played since 2000.
Cool.
Sounds like you got the tism
@@shockwave.9749 No, I'm fully functional and not broken.
I just know what I like.
Maybe look into your mental health
Also lay off the tap water
Coming from someone who worked in game industry for a while. There is a huge difference between balance changes and “why don’t we do this and that.” The former is tweaking numbers in excel and the later is requesting new features that’s 90% the time not in the engine. That’s why hot-nerfing my barb takes 12 hours and requesting a gem tab takes 12 weeks.
The bigger the production it takes longer to push a feature down the pipeline without breaking stuff. First the feature need to be designed, and then find a gameplay programmer who can implement the feature, and down to the QA and push for a release and include in one of the patches. Gameplay features don’t grow on trees no matter how big the company is.
New elements for season one and the balance and it’s roadmap had probably been decided 3 month before the game was out. And people who work on season one are often also the same people who are supposed to work on a million new features requested by fans. So this is a situation that nobody wins as season one schedule is set in stone.
As long as enemies scale in power to match your level, i feel no progression in the game, and for me, that needs to be fixed before anything else.
Don’t know how you would in open world game but agree I don’t like scaling
@@edsherwook5196 what does open world have to do with it? They already have zones that are marked with a appropriate level. Just done scale monsters away from that level. Its a no brainer. RPGs have been doing this since day one. Dynamic Scaling is something they put in, not the other way around.
I couldn't agree more.
@@mathiasseverin5673 whole point of an open world is to not make it not linear where you can bounce around. If it doesn’t scale then your stuck making your way through a bunch of low level Guys for no experience
@@edsherwook5196 that explains why they scale up beginner areas. Its bad game design, but its a fair reason. I would do it differently. I would have gradually added certain high level monsters there. Like, spawn of Lillith. That way, you could go back and feel powerful against wolves, but also be on the lookout for spawns of Lillith.
But why they make high level areas feel impossible if you havent gotten the right level is beyond me. Must be bad game design.
More guided playthroughs with non speedruns builds for d2 from you would be a blast,i would watch that sooo much
MrLlama can only go fast. It's in his nature. :3
who the f uses Gavrilo as an avatar rly ? xD
@@CraftyF0Xa man of taste, thats who 😂
@@TheStormloader Thats right brother !
Def my fav by Llama. FREEZADIN GUIDED PLEEZE
I noticed a lot of this stuff even before I was done with the campaign. It is the reason why I rate D4 at around a 6. It is absolutely a case of death by a thousand paper cuts. "Trivial" things, except by the bucket load.
I think you're spot on. I'm hopeful that D4 will bring me back in the future. Hopefully sooner than later but for now I'll be playing other games.
Itemization is the biggest flaw of the game, which is sad because items are literally what should be the addicting part of the game’s formula. So many conditional affixes “+ dmg while / to” that make items so bland, they’re not even fun to pick up and look over. What happened to “crushing blow”, “faster cast rate”, “mana leech (main resource leech?)” life tap, etc. getting rid of stats also means items no longer have stat requirement, which leads to less player engagement to their build. Having gear being locked behind lvl required from when you picked it up is such a horrible decision… I can go on but I’m sure this is a wall of text already. The itemization needs a complete overhaul from the ground up.
Also back on D2R. Itemization. Diablo for me was all about finding interesting items/runes.
In D4 it's mostly stat/damage changes and an aspect on items. Most aspects are inefficient or pointless too. D4 items just feel mindless and boring. Takes the point out of the grind. Weapon scaling is not fun either. I don't want to find a very good item to only have to upgrade it at a later level. Also want to be able to find items other characters can use and to be able to freely give them to my friends. I really hope the game gets better and I will try it again I am sure. The truth is... D2R still feels fun for me to play while D4 is boring and I get tired playing it.
Running around the same areas doing fetch/search quests is not fun either.
totally agree with your point on sequels should be an improvement. clearly d3 and d4 teams are totally disconnected from eachother, feels like i went back 10-15 years playing d3 and poe when they just came out. so many basic things feel so outdated that should of been in the game as common sense
Completely agreed. Even Diablo Immortal was a more complete experience and innovated on the genre. I really loved that the 3 top DPS players would get additional loot and an announcement, and dps trackers have been a thing for years in wow pve. It feels as if the dev's aren't actually gamers.
@@OMFGRAZORGATOR Yeah, tbh if Diablo Immortal wasn't so damn greedy it would be seen in a much better light for how it progressed the ARPG genre.
D4 really played it too safe and did nothing innovative. For a game that took them so damn long to make, the excuse of, "well the framework for a good game is there" isn't enough. We shouldn't need to wait another 8 years for Blizz to perfect it. This game had more dev hours spent on developing it than any ARPG in history. It has no business being this hollow.
Yeah as a lifelong d2 player I am extremely let down with the itemization, the differences in character strength, the simplicity of the game (it’s too easy) the skill tree and paragon tree (what a joke) how they purposefully designed it to make you waste your time running around to and fro whether it’s questing for nothingness or just trying to go from waypoint to chest as you mentioned. The list is way too big but I agree with pretty much most of what you said in the last few videos. It’s a shame they don’t care at all about the lifetime players like us who loved d2 and even some of you who loved d3 and they just decided to put out the most purposeless Diablo game ever. Unless you care about cosmetics that are overpriced and make you look more like a douchebag then an actual player. Rant over
yup that's a pretty good point. there are so many tried and true basic features missing and problems created that were already fixed in previous titles, it's like they're trying to invent the arpg genre all over again starting from scratch everywhere
@@OMFGRAZORGATOR As a Diablo fan since pre LOD and as a long time WoW player, I feel genuine concern for the future of the Diablo franchise.
What i like about Diablo 2 is, white items, magical items, rares, uniques, set items, they all have use. Now D2 has problems as well, like some builds barely function unless you have some of the rarest items in the game, game sometimes really make you work towards your builds. With D4 it feels like they are just redoing all the wrongs of D3 plus added bonus, i have this feeling it's just gonna be a cash shop cosmetic simulator in a year with what they are prioritizing.
I agree w you on this, Patrick. My Level-91 Light Sorc still uses the Level-20 something Magefist gloves. That same ‘dynamic’ doesn’t seem to exist on launch D-4.
@@AlekTrev006why are you that big of noob still using lvl 20 gloves kid??
feels like you guys are pushing this cash shop cosmetic shit further and further, every time it doesn't pan out to your expectations. Like a doomsday prophet seeing how the world is still alive after his prediction and pushing his deadline by a year, praying he's eventually right.
Because they know you will take your wallet for them 😉
Who would have guessed that... oh well I did. Lead director with big mouth was telling people D4 is competition to PoE. And it lost already because of that 70 bucks price tag. in two years d4 is dead or barely alive. because that is what bliz does. make a cash grab game, get the most out of the cummunity and then add the next number to the title for next cash grab.
Given the evolutionary trajectory we saw in D3, the status of this game relative to where it will end up indicates that it is currently approximately in an alpha phase.
D3 vanilla was a good beta. D3 ros is pre-alpha
Same thing with d2
It’s not 2012.
I’m a firm believer that blizzard knows this is a very important title for them to get right.
Although the skills need balancing, we’re not even close to how unbalanced the overall game was in d3 at launch.
@zyklonbeast2711 That...seems like a good idea, i may do that.
@@marcosyy87 pre-alpha is early development stage when certain pieces of the game may be carefully crafted for sneak peeks, but massive chunks of the game are missing or not working. As much as I hate D3 as a whole, ROS was a significant improvement on D3 and I would hardly consider it a pre-alpha
To each their own. I played d2 for ten years and i whole heartedly believe d4 is the better game.
I'm glad you brought up the point of learning from past mistakes and experiences. I've seen a lot of people throw around "live service" and "the game has only been been out x long" as an excuse for various QoL features not being implemented yet. It feels weird to even say "QoL" sometimes because it feels like a minimization of problems that can be quite impactful to a player's perception of the game.
As mentioned many of the features being discussed were already addressed in D3 which is their own IP. It would make sense to take what was previously addressed into consideration when developing. They were previously implemented to enhance the experience of the game after all and it should have been a high priority to have them in place as part of the core build instead of playing catch up on something they're charging $70-100 for. Going to the 'next thing' shouldn't feel like taking a step back in areas tackled in the past and frankly some of it almost feels like an insult to the consumer.
Of course, it's more understandable that addressing problems around completely new systems that players are exposed to is going to take some time to fine tune.
I'm not going to say that you or Llama are wrong. But what seems strange to me is structuring an argument around "here's why I won't be playing D4 right now" followed by going back to a game (D2R) that has some of the exact same issues. Where's the search function, gem tab, (or heck - inventory space on a fully built character that is overloaded with Charms), etc. in D2R?
I get it that D2:LoD came out two decades ago, but when you're okay with a shitty system in one game but cite that same shitty system as a deal-breaker for another game - then the logic becomes inconsistent and the basis for the decision falls apart. I would like to take the criticism seriously but it's difficult to do so when there's such a heavy, nostalgia driven bias at every step of the way.
This is coming from someone that is an avid enjoyer of D2R and Llama's content btw. This video would have landed a lot better for me if he had just said "I'm going back to D2R because I enjoy it more".
@@abhidey646 I get what you're saying but D2 kind of is what it is. It's a 23 year old game that has had a cult following despite its flaws and all and the whole point of D2R was basically just to freshen it up a bit and capitalize on its popularity -- not significantly alter the core systems turning it into a notably different game potentially removing the 'charm' of what made it what it is. People love/loved it as it is for decades and it kind of exists in its own bubble for enjoyment.
D3 was a step in a very different direction for the IP that has been more catered to casual acceptance in the modern era. D4 obviously took a whole lot of inspiration from D3 in the terms of the systems/features that were introduced in that one. Progressive dungeons, the rerolling systems, legendary power imprinting and extraction, paragon, etc. It's different when they basically carry over those systems albeit labeled differently and make them in at least some ways worse and less convenient in the newest title of the franchise.
I imagine many people consider D3+D4 to be closer together in terms of expectations. The point is those systems were introduced, people got a taste, and many of the problems with those systems were addressed in the previous title yet not in the newest seemingly through reasoning of cutting corners and rushing a product more so than a conscious design choice meant to be 'how it is' long term.
Even if someone ends up still enjoying D2 more, that doesn't invalidate concerns here for the direction of D4. It can be a matter of principal more so than "Why go back to old game that's missing a bunch of potential QoL?" You're free to assume someone would just primarily play D2 anyway but for all you know if it seemed like things were being better handled that might not be the case.
It's kind of like classic WoW versus retail WoW. You might like one more than the other. You might play both. You might play one more than the other. With classic WoW your expectations are set. It is its own thing. With retail WoW you can still disagree w/ the direction of the game and the direction of the game can influence which you decide to play more if at all.
They should remove the ability for players to attack monsters until Season 2 - "There was an issue with it, and it's coming back later" :p
What's even worse about the "live service" excuse is that they could be rebalancing things every single week if they wanted, instead they just give us vague promises for changes that might come 8 months down the road. It's pathetic
I'm still trying to figure out how diablo 2 is still so fun after thousands of hours. I'll never understand it, same game each time same bosses to level yet the game is just something so addictive.
I love d2 but these peole are nuts playing the same game over and over and over and over....
thats because you can get random stats on items, it doesnt feel like d4 were your literally doing the same dugeon over and over again. The builds on d2 are simple and easy to make and understand so is the skill tree.
Here's how:
Multiple talent builds for every character class are viable, even if they're not all A-tier or higher.
Multiple gear builds for every talent build are viable, even if they're not all A-tier or higher.
Items are meaningful, have variability, and are tradeable.
Let me restate that last bit, because it's extremely important. Items are meaningful, have variability, and are tradeable.
And lastly, the leveling process is fun, and is clearly a part of the game.
Modern games tend to end up being cookie cutter centric, where you can technically clear with an off-meta build, but you're weak enough with one that nobody will want to group with you for any challenging content, so you have to roll with a cookie cutter build.
Items tend to be infinitely replaceable and ultimately meaningless and unmemorable.
Items also tend to be 'bind to character' or 'bind to account'.
Basically, modern games are terrible design from a gameplay standpoint. They're designed for monetization.
Diablo 2 is not. There's a lot of room for improvement, in it, but it's still based on solid design.
Nostalgia
it's the itemization
Have the exact same feeling after a few hundred hours into d4 right now, and most people will feel the same as more they progress.
Skill synergy wasn't in D2 until like 14 patches into LoD. The copium of D2 players is unreal
@@ryandavis2464 and its like 20 years later and this modern AAA game still hasnt implemented such a simple concept. unreal
@@ryandavis2464d2 was fresh new, with a smaller team. D4 has had decades of lessons learned, and a huge team.
Campaign score: 10/10 - Completion: 100%
Itemization/Hunting for loot: 2/10 - Completion: 15% maybe?
Leveling: 4/10 - Currently level 51
Hours played: Maybe about 40ish?
Huge fan of Diablo 2. What keeps me hooked in that game is the hunt for gear, runes, gems, charms, crafting mats, etc. I feel like the itemization in Diablo 2 is so good, you're always hunting for something. The new items and content added in each season are helping it feel exciting on a game that otherwise is already damn good to begin with.
I loved the campaign of D4. Cinematics and story were A++. However, the itemization and hunt for gear isn't there. At least not for me. I don't feel compelled to grind mobs or bosses because I don't feel interested in picking up any gear. The first time I got genuinely excited about getting loot was when I got my first piece of unique gear. All throughout the leveling, I was never excited for getting gear. The biggest satisfaction I get with items is when I salvage all my items at the Blacksmith because I know I'm building up my inventory of crafting mats. But then what do I spend crafting mats on? Upgrades. Ehhh... I like upgrades, don't get me wrong. But it's a lack luster experience compared to throwing in a Grand charm and 3 P gems into a box and rolling the dice. And then doing that over and over until you either say "screw this" or you happen to get the Skiller with 30+ life! Such a rewarding experience and feeling. Diablo 4 doesn't do that for me, sadly.
Similarly, I was never excited for leveling because the stats felt irrelevant to me. I think this is because I haven't learned the game well enough to understand which stats I need to care about. But as I leveled, I never looked at any of my main stats. I ocassionaly looked at crit chance, or thorns; things like that. But I never tried to optimize my gear because I just felt, what's the point? As I level higher, everything around me scales anyway. Why waste mats and gems and gold at level 50 when I could do it and get a better pay off at level 60 or 70?
Not sure if I'll keep playing D4 long term. I have the itch to go back to D2R
Dunno how you can rate the hunting for loot when you haven't even gotten to that part of the game yet.
@@Stavroization ok but I did, hunting for gear is bad. You get upgrades regularly till 70-75 then it gets progressively rare, and the problem with that is the loot comes in mountains, and you just notice half of your game hours go by sifting through the stuff, which gets to the point around lvl 90 that you say "fck it, I just need the xp I don't even bother picking up anything anymore", and that includes the uniques too as you will find the same 3-4 unique all the time I have literally 7-8 lam esen staff frost burn gauntlet, esu boots, penitent boots and the ice pants 2 stash tab full with them I don't even know why, im just gonna vendor them soon anyway. Nothing exciting in finding any of these. Legendaries only interesting if they have a perfect lgendary affix and only as long as I pull that off from the thing.
@@Stavroization am I supposed to grind another 40+ hours through the higher world tiers, nightmare dungeons and helltides in order to start having fun and be interested in hunting for loot? I feel like it's more of the same, just with higher numbers and maybe a couple fun aspects that I can tailor to a build. Is that all this game is? Make a build that can more quickly kill mobs that drops loot you don't care about searching for?
@@TheMeerkat88 I'm confused with what you're expecting. You're on this channel which i presume then you're not new to arpgs. This is pretty normal for the genre.
@@Stavroization I guess was expecting D4 itemization to be more appealing. I was hoping there would be secondary progression collections, like runes, charms, keys, organs, etc. Even the gems you collect only serve a single purpose: add an affix to a gear slot. After you've socketed your gear, what purpose does collecting gems serve?
Diablo 4 is a well polished game for an ARPG that "fits the mold" of other ARPGs. It reminds me a lot of D3. I hear it's similar to POE, albiet more simple.
I was hoping D4 would break the mold and introduce new itemization mechanics/collections/systems that would keep me hooked in the end game like D2 does. I don't feel compelled to make a bad ass character because there's nothing to collect (aside from gear you find yourself), there's nothing to trade, there's no economy and thus no real wealth building mechanic aside from gold, which is only used to reset talents and upgrade gear/gems/enchant.
Agree with most your thoughts and knew you had a good basis based on your ARPG xp. The dungeon change is one more step to feeling more like a mobile game. They built this vast world and should continually encourage exploring it. This takes away from it, they could of made the dungeons Region based so you didn’t have to run to a specific spot, giving more flexibility and maybe add hidden things to certain dungeons we could discover over time. Just get rid of scaling and make itemization better. It's not that hard. The base game looks and handles very well, just hope they improve these things or the player base will be very small this time next year.
Sounds like D3, and they turned it into the most boring basic bitch game, at a fundamental level, they dont understand the things that really make a good game, they made everything these modular, complex seeming but actually shallow systems, forced gameplay styles and poor itemisation concepts, all in the face of a directly scaling environment removes the feeling of power creep and progression, such a fundamental hook in arpgs, every class has a couple of viable builds and so many skills and item requirements are simply LOCKED IN, you dont have an option or its just so much worse than not taking that skill/stat, it wont be effective. On top of all this they are most likely going to listen to the wrong people and change the fundamental gameplay loop and systems to a worse gameplay experience overall, because it will be more convenient, they are addicited to appeasing the widest playerbase, which will drive away a large portion of the actual arpg fans, plus a large potion of the wider player base who wasnt going to hang around anyway. I really hope i'm wrong and a lot of these things get incrementally improved upon, but I wont hold my breath... when I saw D4 in beta using basically the D3 base, I knew they would make the same mistakes because they dont really understand what was wrong with D3 in the first place. Good combat feel, fluidity and movement marred by very poor itemisation, class/skill, scaling and systems design
WHY does NOONE ask that they don't have a GEM bag after 10 Years of Diablo 3 and we have asked for it the entire time!!! NEVER got it!
Yet in Diablo IV it's still the top thing asked for! Because they are trying to entice you into playing longer into seasons.
Carrot on a Stick for Quality-of-life changes.
The itemization being a step back from D2 is the most glaring flaw for me. It holds together up to level 70 or so, but it needs another tier at least of noticeably qualitatively better gear (and tier 5 difficulty to go with it). They are holding back too much obvious stuff so that they can add it over time, but people won't bother to stick around.
in d2 you could find useful uniques 2 hours in. in path you could find an exalted orb in the first five minutes. what items are we excited to get while leveling in d4?
Rebalance D2 items and sets to be situational or at times on par with rune words, add clans and a in game market, and add more difficult or added mechanics for bosses and we can play D2 forever. Add more d2 itemization to D4, remove monster scaling, and open trading with in game market and more difficult bosses and we can play d4 for 30 years. ;)
they should copy/paste the itemization from d2 into d4 lol
but for real I think the major issue with D4 is the affixes and aspects. All the other issues like scaling and trading can be fixed but the itemization needs a complete overhaul.
Sometimes I think the towns were designed with spite in mind...like Mephisto had drawn them. For instance you want to reach a vendor and just when you can see his shack/stall you find that there is no direct way of reaching and you have to either go around or dismount to climb up or down some ladder 😂
There's a main town -- I forget which one -- where the blacksmith is in a little cubby hole that opens up and to the right. When I'm walking away after using the blacksmith, I obviously start clicking down and left. My character immediately goes into a long sitting animation. Because there's a fucking interact-able stool right in the path out.
I see you, Mephisto.
Lmao indeed
I mean if all the towns had the same layout of. All the shops right next to eachother. It'd be kinda dumb too.
There is no win here so I'm glad they went with you gotta run around.
I don't wanna stand in the same town all day everyday
D3 exists for those who like not moving
@@jonathanrothmare3509 you say that like it would be the only other way, but I would be contempt with just not blocking the direct path, they can be in different places. And if you were to analyze historical cities you'd quickly learn that merchants would mostly be in a designated quarter of sorts and not scattered about.
@@Dreadbaron you mean the enchanter. Who jokes about placing a soul inside of another human body. In his explanation on how legendary aspects work? (But not in line of earshot of the church). Would be grouped up with the black smith and apothecary?
You think humans just love hearing a anvil slam. While a blacksmith fits everyone's horses every morning with horse shoes?
100% the live service model concept is already more important then the actual content. An many many more issues.
Best take on D4 state as a sequel I heard so far. And I heard lots of it.
Best wishes for you and your family!
That's because the bigger UA-cam channels are paid for fake reviews.
Aka sellouts
Was being a bit of a dick at the end there, his wife definitely needed help "well we're streaming we're doing stuff right now" oof buddy
Well said. The world is lovely at first and then falls into an incredibly repetitive mess lacking a lot of qol and quality testing. I'm having fun, I'll probably play through and season 1, but if we don't see big improvements to those blatantly obvious pain points early, I'll probably put the game down until at least the first proper expansion, and that's a shame considering the potential and the quality in the environments and music and voice acting. I just hope blizzard can pull it's head out of Activision's ass long enough to realize 4 quests and 4 events based on an early 2000s mmo format aren't enough to make a world feel alive anymore. See you in season 1 ^.^
I like that cameo at the end there, embrace your family, they're welcome to be part of the stream! 😊
I wouldn't want to expose my baby to millions of people online.
@@hayder627 Not the kid either ;)
Hey, Lama love your stuff, Im a super casual D2 player have been for for a decade now, I just got my friend into it (thanks to D2R) and we just got to act 5 and it already clicked for him. Keep up the great vids Mr!
The real problem I that the dev team are probably being pushed for the expansions because the higher ups are so money hungry. And that's imo the root cause of all the issues.
D4 campaign, atmosphere, graphics, lore, cinematics is 10/10. Rest is meeeh.
Itemization is lackluster(missing of sets or purpose for white and blue items) and boring, lack of runes/runewords, charms, thorches and whole combat spender/builder phylosophy is not my taste. I still play D4 because I did not finished my goals yet, but I am looking forward for going back to d2r.
I don't think llama will ever find a more complete game than D2.
have to realize the nostalgic impact that game had on us when we were younger, heck I still remember playing d1 and d2 when I was a kid and had so much fun!
still amazing games to play today, but I still feel my perception of them is definitely clouded a bit by nostalgia.
I loved the game, but I don't enjo the grind in d2 as I do in d4. D4 is not perfect but it's a really good game. Ppl can play d2 but for me it's too bboooooooring
@jojojo6937 for some reason I'm exactly the opposite... the d4 grind is just not doing it for me... but d2 still is... shrug
D4 is a boring ass slog the entire way.
That's what they want you to think but that's all bullshit. No, D2 was a passionate and complete whole product. D4 is a soulless garbage, that's why you feel that way. Personally, I haven't even played d2 that much, yes I played it in my childhood once or twice but nowhere near as the uber enthusiasts so I don't have that nostalgia you talk about. I genuinely and objectively believe that d2 and d1 is more fun and better game than d3 and d4 COMBINED. Why? Because it has depth, it has polish, those later games are just empty husks. It's something like Gothic 1-3 in comparison to Gothic 4 or Duke nuke manhattan project versus Duke nukem forever, just it's all about bonafide quality and how the game feels. I REPEAT IT'S NOT NOSTALGIA! It's what THEY want you to believe! You are basically being gaslighted
I agree with most of your points. However for me the biggest problem is that there is no endgame content that has meaning. I'm lvl 70 now and i have pretty decent gear. But what is there to do now? World Bosses are far to easy, pushing nightmare dungeons and maybe drop a piece of gear that is 2% better? meh idk. Also as far as i heard uber lilith doesn't really give any good rewards either. Until now i really liked the game, it felt like my character was continuously getting stronger. Now i don't feel like that anymore.
This is what I don't really understand. Your description fits more perfect for D2 than for D4.
You get to the point where you are at max gear with potential single digit % upgrades way faster than in D4 actually. At least for casters
Run way less dungeons with less variance and less challenge !?!?
You can argue that you can find loot for other characters too, but would it really make a difference if D4 had that possibility too?
You've just described D2 bro! 😂
@@AiNnyan1 This really is what I don't understand. A lot of people have gripes about D4 that literally describe their other favorite ARPGs.
@@broco1163 I've played more builds with my rogue over the last 2 weeks in D4 than I ever played as a amazon in D2 and D2R... All these comments about lack of things to do in D4 compared to D2R really blow my mind. Outside of when they finally introduced Terror zones in D2R, once you hit 90 what the fuck else did you do in D2 besides run Nil, Chaos Sanc, and Baal for experience, and NM Andy & mephisto, Hell countess, pit, lower trav, chaos sanc, and baal for gear... There was literally a loop of shit I would do just to try to get gear or runes so I could buff my build by a fraction to farm it more efficiently.
Heaven forbid you die in D2 and lose like a week of fucking farming in experience...
Agree with you MrLlama, the "game journalists" and supposed critics giving this game 9/10 and 10/10 are either paid off or out of their minds. The gameplay of D4 is seriously messed up right now and does not even come close at all to the gameplay of D2, it's really unfortunate.
i gave the game a 5.5/10
They most likely only played it till the end of the story lol. Prob never even heard of the term "endgame"
Maybe it is a 9/10 game, not a 9/10 ARPG ...
Well it's NOT Diablo 2. So no shit it doesn't feel like d2. D2 was also while good. Was super far from. Perfect. Even today. It's at best a highly rated ARPG that's sorta over hyped because at the end of the day. They're. The same fucking thing. Button mashing action games
Campaign til end of story is good, hell even until 70 is very good. After that, it feels bad. Probably was 8.5/10 for me til 70. Now it’s like 4/10
Said it before and I’ll say it again. You’re the only one who has made this statement with the conditions and truly meant it and you have my upmost respect for that
Wow the people in the comments here(and other forums) are something else man. The game has been in development for how long by a multi billion dollar company and this is the product? It’s not hard to tell it’s just going to follow the roots of immortal and be a cash grab. Cash shop day 1 and “seasons” coming soon. Also him playing 200 hours doesn’t change anything, at all. If you played 200 hours over the course of a year it doesn’t change anything. The points are still valid and you’d run into them eventually.
D3 was not perfect at launch either so I hope it can be improved significantly but as it stands I have to agree on just about everything. Why do they have the WoW team working on diablo? Lol
Been having more fun on D2 honestly.
I'm too busy in my life to properly play games anymore unfortunately - so I have retired to just watching streams on twitch and YT. I played A LOT of D2 and D2R (after first launch), so I was really excited to watch some D4 streams.
One of my biggest disappointments as a "consumer" of D4 rather than a player is that during battles the screen just looks so cluttered, I can't even tell whats going on. During any battle scene, the main fighting area is just blasted with text labels like "Vulnerable", "Dodge", damage numbers, etc... Its really annoying because I honestly can't even tell what is happening in a fight, unless its a wizard playing from distance. I'd give the viewing experience of D4 a 3/10, as someone who doesn't play games but just watches streams.
With D2R at least you get a really strong and clear understanding of the battle that is tacking place, where damage is being dealt, who is taking damage, what skills are being used by the enemy monsters etc. D4 is just - the fight begins and you have 1,000 text labels flashing on the screen. This is my main disappointment. As a result I have probably watched only about 5-6 hours of D4 streams now in total, whats the point of watching it when I can't even properly see the fighting in what is supposed to be an action rpg?
I totally agree that they should focus on CORE game mechanics before maximizing the "flair". Damage bucket system (vulnerable essential for all builds), lack of ranged game play (melee sorcs?), monster level/character level power progression (why do you get weaker as you level?), what to really do after level 80?, making trading more viable etc.
Melee sorc? That's always been a thing. Hate to inform you. Even back in D1. We used to build sword shield mages using simple magics. And really over powered mana shield. D4 makers your " weapon" tied to your main basic skills which for. The sorc. 3 of 4 are ranged spell attacks. I think you dunno what your talking about. At all
@@jokinplaysgameswhat people mean by this but are calling it melee sorc and not really saying it properly is that every build uses frost nova for vulnerable which means you are always in melee range. Ice shards, teleport group frost nova one shot everything and if it spreads then you can keep going. Arc lash same cept you pop unstable. Firewall/meteor. Use ultimate then teleport frost nova and use skill. So every build is in melee range. 80-90% of the time
@@jokinplaysgamessorry.. you don't. Mostly because of vulnerable dmg, makes pretty much every viable build go in close.
@@jokinplaysgames Just play diablo 2 and you'll experienced a ranged sorceress.
I have less than 10 hours into D4 and i already know it's never going to be more than a game I play occasionally.
100% agree ..The campaign was brutally arduous to me..Maybe I am old and jaded but I just didn’t really find enjoyment from the campaign.
@@AtxTrev you're not alone, i found the campaign very uninspiring and couldn't bring myself to get through it
I liked it.
I refunded my purchase after the closed beta. Haven't looked back since.
D4 just feels like playing Diablo 3 2.0 Only played about 10 hours so far but thats my first impression
Thanks for your honesty as usual. That's why I think they should hire modders. Modders would fix everything in like a day or two lol.
Hey Llama, I have been following you for many, many years. Seeing your Tyrael's Might video inspired me to complete D2 Holy Grail of my own back in the day. I appreciate your venture into D4 and the honest feedback you've given, as I suspect your perspective about it's state is pretty close to my own. I think your input has convinced me to hold on to my money for now and check out the game later when the price comes down and the game mechanics are better developed.
It's a shame you are getting backlash for submitting feedback. I think it's largely due to the fact that many people want to hold on to their belief that the product they paid 100$ for is excellent in every way and they tend to lash out at people that challenge that in any way.
I don't think people said Diablo 4 game is excelent, but it has indeed a very good base and they can build on it for years to come. They laid the ground work for an amazing game which will continue to grow and have lots of things to offer once they are develeloped.
@@alexbarcan4705 Let's hope that is indeed what happens. Heroes of the Storm and Diablo 3 were both basically abandoned by Blizzard and it feels like the same is now happening to Overwatch 2. I'm pretty sure no ARPG in existence reached their mechanical peak at launch, but rather many years after. Let's hope D4 continues to evolve so that it can reach that peak and is not just discarded by Blizzard's upper management once the initial buzz surrounding it's launch has died down.
@@alexbarcan4705 agree. Of course game isn't perfect. There are annoyances. But. The game imo opinion is worth full price still. Do uniques etc. Need more detail sometimes. Yes. Do we need a teleport button to ur friends. Yes. Voyaging to a dungeon on that big map is a no for me dog. But storyline, voice acting, interesting side quests, actual good variety on each build. All great things. I feel most ppl are already overpowered, fixing resistance, would that make it more fun? Idk. Gotta be some challenge. I love D2R but don't recall it's storyline to be as compellingly as D4. Definitely good base here. Hope to see even better things to come. 8 out of 10 imo.
I paid 100 Euros too and i was back ro D2 way earlier haha.
Trying out season 1 in d4 tho. But im still so disapointed from the summon necro in d4 and the loot system and the horrible grind.
They should add timed magic-find buffs for completing side content in the open world.
Like…+15% for completing a tree of whispers quest, +5% for completing an event, etc.
theres so many things like this that need added, its painfully obvious and an easy fix.
I agree! I love the game but I'm out after I get this sorcerer to 100. 4 stash tabs is barely enough for one build. It's inexcusable. If they'd written 'Only 4 Stash Tabs' on the box I wouldn't have bought the game 🤣 I think it's outrageous. If I have to throw away every single item I get (in a looter!!!) why go get the items? I can't experiment with any other classes or builds.
Don't apologize for your feelings on D4. If people can't handle it... that's their baggage to carry, not yours! :)
so after a week of D4 today I just logged into D2R to play with a very minimalistic hydra/f.orb Sorceress on Hell Act1, on Stony Field I ran into a pack of "elite"s with all kind of nasty aruas and I felt more adrenalin than through a week of D4 play!!!
Btw she's lvl 56, with Spirit, Pledge, Lore, Stealth, a +1skill amu, magic gloves with resistance, rare rings with fcr maxmana resistances, rare boots with 30% run maxmana resitances, and a pathetic white belt to open up all potion rows and a couple of resistance and max life charms. And hell I love and appreciate every piece of my gear MUCH more than any "legendary" in D4 (why the f is called "legendary" anyway if you sell 100+ piece / hour 🙄).
Using on hotkey: F.Orb, Hydra, Teleport, StaticF, Frozen Armor, Telekinesis
I wish to D4 developers to listen to Llama, Asmon, Quinn, Raxx and turn D4 into a great game because currently it is super easy, not a single scary moment and it is super boring... and don't name something legendary if it's swarming into your bag.. which you will sell for gold in town because it's USELESS... legendary my a$$
with love :)
Edit: I forgot to mention that I run faster in D2 than my mount in D4 (without the teleport...) :)))
Biggest issue that needs fixed is Bobby Kotick.
I arrived there in beta and didn't even bother buying it. I've been keeping an eye on it in case they do come closer to something I'd want to play... but really I just think it's fundamentally flawed form the get go. I agree with you 100%. For me the biggest flaw by far, it the itemisation. In D2 you would hunt whites, greys, blues were worth picking up, hell you could get a jmod and be filthy rich from one blue. Rares were worth getting and commonly used. Items were NOT implicitly tied to builds (I mean there were some, but they were more BIS, rarely actually required or it wouldn't work), rather the interactions between them made builds work. Every single category was something you actually wanted to hunt. There were multiple ways to achieve those goals. Hell, even racking and LK runs were valid ways to farm certain items. You had choice and agency, you weren't forced to interact with different parts of the game implicitly, they were just a good way to enjoy it. It's a far better game
Yeah, agree completely. In my playthrough I found NO items that felt exciting to find. I sort of gave up after that. Also, that you can hotkey 16 skills in D2 and like 5 or 6 skills in D4 is annoying to me.
i look forward to more d2r videos llama! big win for me personally
You brought up my main issue with d4. D3 has so much quality of life and it feels like not only did they not improve on that QoL state of the game, but they literally removed quality of life that was already established.
I own Diablo 1-2-3-4. I have spent years on each. I think you are right.
I think Blizzard developed D4 juuust enough to make the high sales and not get too many bad scores and refund requests. Now, the development continues with us to be part of it and do a lot of beta-testing and fine tuning. Don't get me wrong. With people's participation a game can really become something great. It's just that they should have released a little later, with social features and end-game systems figured out better. They gave us something to sink in a couple hundred of our hours while they make more of it and fix their rushed mistakes.
I really like D4. I don’t think I’ll go back to D2 or be interested in D2 content anymore. Hope to see you back for the season releases.
Same here. I think D4 has an amazing base to work from and it’s going to get better and better. It’s time to move on from D2
D4’s got the best moment to moment combat of any top down ARPG by light years.
I think so too. Only play sorc but early and mid game feels pretty good to read attacks and teleport and evade, time freezes and stuns.
Agreed.
Yeah stupid amounts of CC and nonsensical fireworks exploding the entire screen while an entire novel of CC text appears above monsters because you wouldn't be able to tell what you were doing to them otherwise is real fun. So much better than monsters having individual characteristics and combat feel, being able to actually see all of what's happening and dropping actually interesting loot.
The visuals are beautiful, the combat is fun and engaging, and every NPC and quest are voice acted with well written quest lines. The game needs work, but it has been out less than a month, so seriously WTF? It takes ONE minute or less to ride your horse to any dungeon on the map. You people are nuts.
D4 is by far the best "state-of-release" of any Blizzard game I can recall. I'm enjoying it, but as with WoW Vanilla....nothing every replaces your first love.
From the perspective of someone who played a lot of d2. Almost every season of d3. And d2r whilst waiting for d4
I can’t help but feel I paid a lot of money to continue being a beta tester
And season one is the “real” launch
I’m going back to d2 also . It’s just the nostalgia and excitement of mf that does it
It's not perfect but what it does it does well and the paladin is God tier in diablo 2
D2 is better. By a decent amount. Trying to tell someone this fact who started on d3 will never understand that, but it's just true
who really thought d4 was going to be great after d3 and immortal. They are so damn similar.
@tyler6644 it can't be good. any game that involves items or gear / cosmetics will be poisoned by corporate greed.
@@Freezerburn137 those tremendously hold the game back. same with wow having a store or any videogame @2006 that started to implement microtransactions. a few is manageable but past that it's no longer a game but a store with graphics.
The golden age of games was before microtransactions took over.
A big fat content-rich expansion/DLC is perfectly fine though. =)
i literally played 2k hours of d3. if it just ends up like d3 i am a happy customer
Good to see you keeping an open mind on TPing to NM dungeons whether you are or were right or wrong or not. I was worried that was going to be a change to appease a small number of high play time players, but I thought I was too casual to really know better so I didn't speak up. I feel like a lot of the systems that support the open world design are under assault right now by the community and if they aren't defended the essence of the game will change forever. I don't think it is always a good idea to change the game just because some things are annoying for people playing 80 hours a week. Some things need to be changed, but I think the developers should always ask themselves is this contrary to our design goals?
My biggest issue with the open world experience is how bad the servers are. Because of this I'd take an offline mode 10 times out of 10.
Also horses getting stuck on random crap all the time makes riding it to different dungeons pretty annoying. ngl. They need to work on making horse travel better, also increase the speed of horses without boost. I shouldn't be faster than a horse on foot no matter if it's at a full gallop or not. It encourages a terrible playstyle of using all your boost, dismounting to run, getting back on the horse when boost is ready.
And all of those horse issues make me understand why there is such a large outcry to remove the traversal part. Even at the expense of a populated overworld.
Having to run to nm dungeons is indefensible. It's a horrendous experience. Nm dungeon tp should have been in the game since launch
QoL Jumpscare
I actually agree with your stance on Sigils/Dungeons. Just teleporting in is a bit world breaking.
Maps work if PoE because you use them to open rifts into other worlds via a device in your Hideout.
Keystones in D3 I guess for a similar reason? (honestly never paid attention to the greater rift lore)
If sigils in D4 are going to follow suit it would be nice to at least have some NPC talking about "temporal disturbances" or something.
Separate and apart from this, if they make this change for Sigils then there's really no reason why sigils can't take us to "dungeons" that aren't on the world map.
Other than of course not hiving made them yet, but there's no Mechanical or Lore reason why players couldn't expect a season based "new Sigil rotation" as they will no longer need to be placed "in world".
I find D4 to be pretty boring overall, while I’m still playing D2R since launch (and D2 since 2000). It’s just a better game. And for half the price too.
D4 has poor itemization and I hate beating on constantly level scaling trash mobs forever just to kill one. Level scaling needs to go, itemization needs a huge improvement.
If they don’t focus on seasons, there will be no game left to fix.
As a software engineer I understand dev team at all, because it is how to keep software up. There are X amount of development resources and to fix Y amount of issues. So you have to prioritize, QoL improvements wont kill the game. I think they are focusing to fix balance stuff that can kill the game first. You have to accept some mechanics in d4 is out like this, either good or bad, those stuff can be changed but not with a hotfix patch. Remember they spent years to build the game, changing a major mechanic in a week is not possible. In the mid run they will address those issues.
I second this notion d2r 4 life d4 is great but you can't beat d2 with any comparison its just too amazing thanks for all the great informational content broski stay up
D4 is fun. But it lacks the character that D2 has. D2 is so meticulously created, down to the finest details. I'd still play D4 while my friends are still in it, but not for long. Once seasons start, I think i will quit the game.
I played D2R last year and woah it still blows my mind after 20 years. How different items and skills and runewords interact with each other to give you different permutations of gameplay styles etc. It's just better. I am with you on this MrLlama
I like diablo 4 but there will never be a game as great as diablo 2. I really love the negotiating and the trade system in d2. Just create a game with a item in the description and an asking price and still ppl join and try to buy it for an ist less or something. It’s sad that you can’t trade legendary items in diablo 4, what’s the reason for it?
I agree with you on this one.. they are re-inventing the wheel for no reason. Need more Bank space, More bag space, horse rework, rubberbanding fix. The TP to Sigil dungeon is something already we can fix in game by just running the same sigil in a row. Have to ride to the first one then the rest u can port out and open the next and go back into the same portal. As a clan i would tell the guys to name the sigil they have the most and then we run up to 10-15 in a row. My own opinion is they rushed the game out half baked.
I just want a "completed quest log" so I can complete the game, feel satisfied, and move on
Llama, I appreciate this video and your previous videos talking about D4. I was on the fence about buying it for myself, and you convinced me that it is not worth my money at this time.
I might grab it down the road after they make significant improvements and/or a big sale.
Definitely worth buying and playing the story.
I agree 100%. There are basic things that are missing. They will get fixed, but it's a legitimate question to ask why are features that are in every other major action RPG not there on day one. Especially after getting feedback for so long.
Pure laziness
@@ryu-ken corporate set an aggressive release date, I think. It had to be "ready."
"They will get fixed"
Not sure how you say this as if it's matter of fact. It's not, especially with Blizzard.
Yup I’m still loving D2R every single day. I still love the hunt for loot and every season kinda brings some freshness to restart. Similar to wipes in tarkov or rust. D4 just wasn’t it for me tbh d2 will never get old
they just need to actually put more rwork into d2r, maybe add mtx so they can fund a team to work on adding more fore seasons like d4 and pope
Art / Sound / Theme nothing beats diablo II
I totally agree with what you said about them starting from scratch. They are acting like this is a whole new project, like they are reinventing the wheel or something. Most if not all of the issues people have with D4 are things that have already been solved in other ARPG's or even previous Diablo games. It's so frustrating for them to be acting like they have to relearn everything again. I get the feeling that many of the people working on this game have never played a Diablo game in their life. That's the only explanation.
So weird, I was literally searching your channel yesterday for this summery type video. I've yet to purchase the game, I learned my lesson from D3 to wait it out and see how specifically the end game is. With what I've been seeing across the board how the game after 70/80 is pretty dreadful and still having so many flaws is enough to stop me from buying it now. £60 Is a lot of money and I'll keep my money until it's in a good state.
Ever spend $60 on a super Nintendo game?
I'm so sure that you'll have WT5 soon. The game already feels like it's balanced around having a tier unlocking around level 80.
£60 is a lot to spend for 200+ hours of entertainment? Interesting.
@@andrewhandelsman834 Last Nintendo game was the previous Zelda, breath of the wild, best game I've played in the past 10 years. I'll get the new one when I get some time.
@@showmetheway2 Glad to hear that, I'll for sure give it another look when things are in place at that time. I'm currently looking at Last Epoch, I recently got interested with the ironman mode they have.
Absolutely agree with your take on D4, it's not polished enough...and the point you made, taking things/working systems from the previous games and build upon THAT is so true! I will still watch your D2 Content, but probably try Last Epoch and POE 2 when it comes out? Would make the Variety of the Channel better, and i would love to hear your take on that Games!
Bro for real! Fuck diablo take care of and enjoy ur Family its the best thing u can have in life. These are just pixels not worth to talk about it.
Guys, you can stop disliking these videos. D4 is the fricking "fastest selling "Blizzard" game of all-time” no matter how many design decisions Llama criticises. :D
If I close my eyes, it's like John Mullaney plays Diablo games.
sounds nothing like him lol
Glad to see you back on d2r
You actually didn't think he was leaving did you?
My biggest gripe with the game is with the entire Unique item system. Coming from D2 the unique items were chase items and made up the majority of the "post story" content, and though the "Big 6" uniques have the TC87 feel from D2, there is the entire swath of uniques that could have filled the TC63-TC84 bracket that we just don't have in D4. In my mind they should entirely re-do the unique system based on the "big 6" model with additional restrictions:
First Unique items should only be available in WT4 and have a locked minimum level of 65.
Second they should always drop at higher-than-normal item power (big 6 are always 820) that way you could potentially get lucky and loot them early in WT4 and equip them for a big boost.
Third, they should be Bind-on-Equip. Currently the game's trade economy is pretty stagnant as there aren't many "big ticket" items on there to build wealth towards on your account. By making unique items BOE they could be freely traded and make up the backbone of the economy like in D2.
Fourth, they need to be Build-Defining. If you get the teleport unique chest it should be tuned so that it is such a big boost to teleport that it changes the way you interact with the skill; and they could do this with basically every skill in the game. The one caveat to this level of power is unique items should be "equip 1" so there wont be any need to balance the game around stacking multiple uniques. Currently several of my uniques are just chillin in my stash collecting dust because of the poor itemization, low stat rolls or item power and that sucks.
Lastly, they should be rare: I don't want to see one in less than 30 hours of game time. This means we will have literally hundreds of hours of time to chase them all SSF, or if we don't want to play SSF, we have the option to trade the one that drops for something that changes our build for the next 30+ hours of play.
As it stands there is nothing to chase at endgame and I blame the Unique system for that, though I am from D2 so I acknowledge my bias.
This is the biggest complaint I have as well. D2-like itemization is also my biggest gripe with the game. We are just farming for stats on items and it gets boring instead of “OMG I FOUND MY FIRST SHAKO” and “Well, I just found a Skulder’s and it’ll do between now and my Enigma”, etc.
Not having gone the D2 route and going in-between D2 and D3 is just not what people wanted.
@@NicolasWithNoH there is a whole subset of UA-cam content creators that did "1000x of _____ run Drop highlights" videos that literally have nothing to show right now.
I saw a clip of a windforce drop in d4 and the guy literally just put it in his stash because the bow he had equipped was better. No D2 Dopamine Hits in D4.
Ya'll just hating on D4 so much it's insane. Can't you just give them some slack and wait those 5-10 years til they finally reach v1.0? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
Good points! But really, is D2 better. I played quite a lot of D2R and thousands of hours D2, and it misses so much what modern arpg´s are offering today. I think D4 will improve with seasons. My biggest issue is the end game, mob density and a few QoL stuff you also mentioned. I don´t see any reason to go above lvl80 just to kill Echo of Lilith. Maybe I am just getting old and don´t have all the time in the world =)
In relation to the dungeon teleporting thing. I watched a great video from Mark Rosewater whos a lead designer on Magic the gathering. he said that your audience is really good at identifying problems, but not usually very good at suggesting the right solutions. I always kind of think about that when stuff like this comes up. But I do agree with your points, that moving through the world should just be more interesting.
Yeah because everyone is selfish and just want what they want even if its dumb.
@@realrealityeast6278 And it's dumb because you declared it is?
@@attractivegd9531 its dumb because these suggestions 99% of the time are purely self serving and have no intention of improving the game, just give instant gratification. none of the players have the responsibility of a game designer, next to none of the insight or experience either. thus "he said that your audience is really good at identifying problems, but not usually very good at suggesting the right solutions." if most of the casual player suggestions were to be implemented, you'd get to lvl 100 in a day and have full bis, with a kill everything/loot everything on the screen button,.
I applaud Llama for being able to play the same game for 15+ years and not get bored.
I like d2 too but the endgame sucks. I don't get how people put this much time into it
@@nostrollerslife I bought it while waiting for D4 but i could only play for 2 hours...
@@Mabbah066 it's a really good game but the gameplay is dated and the lack of end game kills it for me I don't wanna do bal runs over and over again. That's not an end game
@@nostrollerslife I played Diablo 2 when it launched for hundreds years ago and thought it was the best game ever.. ;)
@@nostrollerslife Best endgame of all ARPGs ever. Unless you have to have race against time stuff to be content
You are the best MrLlama, thanks for being honest with yourself and your subscribers. we all here know what D2R is way better than D4, but you have a really big balls to say that loud as the biggest diablo youtuber.
I agree with you, Everyone is scratching their heads saying how was this game even remotely ready to be shipped. They basically need a complete 180% overhaul like final fantasy did and not to mention why we we see amazing boss fights like andariel in the campaign 1 time and then in endgame we get a random spider....The games a flop so far and Ill be going back to d2 as well. Luv ya llama good video.
Dude will do Baal/Mephisto runs on his death bed 😂
I can kinda understand for example PoE players that are playing the same game for 10+ years since beta as it was continuously improving and the content was being added regularly so it kept it fresh and the meta was shifting multiple times too making the seasons more engaging, but playing the same game with the same exact content for 20 years is fucking bonkers to me.
At this point, i'm pretty convinced it's not really about Diablo 4 in his case. It's about game x not being Diablo 2 for him. And i am 99,3% sure that if D4 was a lot better than it is now, but still wasn't similar enough to D2, he still wouldn't play it :D It is like those people who are stuck in their ways and never will change them, no matter what.
P.S. Please no bot replies about how D2 is a better game than D4, cause that's not what this comment is about.
I love your d2 content. I don't think I could ever be as entertained on d2 as you have though. I only wanted to achieve my ideal builds for each class. But outside of mods, I was getting very irritated with d2r muling. My stash is full and I am not keen on muling in order to obtain my eventual holy grail.
I feel like all of these issues can either be tracked down to incompetence or greed.
Him going back to D2 is no shocker.
What do you expect? Theres nothing todo in d4. It's a shit game that cost 70+, unfinished, early access bs
@@billlam7756I agree with that. BUT, even if the game was amazing, he’d still return to D2 eventually. That’s what he’s known for and loves it.
@@billlam7756 I love D2 and it holds a place in my heart, but D2 is all about farming like a couple areas and that's it, nothing more.
@@Travnorton5 blizz had 10years+ to give people no reason to come back to d2 lol. They lost the core game, now d4 just some overhyped "10/10 play the way you want. We have 150+ dungeons and endless customization" lmao cmon now
@@billlam7756 I didn’t say anything about D4 being a good game.
$666,000,000 made
10 million copies sold.
I wouldn't give a shit either.
It's normal dude, change is hard, I would have resisted change if I were in your position, imagine building your whole career on a game, and a new game from the franchise comes out and you are not at the top of that game ... I would have resisted with my every bone ...
Good news, imo. Everyone seems to be streaming D4 right now but D2R is still there and still a great game. This channel has always had great D2 content, so great to hear you will continue with it.
I’m so tired of the “it just came out” argument. The things that are being pointed out are not innovations. The knowledge already exists.
Imagine if people kept making that argument with Fallout 76 instead of rightfully saying that it sucked.
I got bored around 20 hours and stop playing at 40 hours.
I forced myself to finish the campaign and once I got into the paragon board I stopped playing and went back to D2. It felt like a crappy WoW simulator.
Completed campaign, got wt 3 an lvl 50, then bored. Haven't played since.
@@greenbeetlessi got bored of d2 after the 5th season in a row of playing it 😂. I shall return to it sooner or later.. gotta give it some time for it to be exciting again.
@@chasehunt4415 I’ve only played a season of D2, maybe I can cycle through both games.
@@greenbeetlessd2 is ass 💀
“Sad man can’t find it in himself to finally move on.”