My mother loved the .25 ACP. She didn't know about gel tests and could have cared less about how far it penetrated into a chest cavity. She always told me if she got into danger, she was pointing her Beretta straight at the 'nads. She said even a grazing shot in that area would cause an attacker to lose interest. Found it hard to argue with her logic.
I say that also. When you're accosted by two shady men or several feral dogs on an empty, lonely country road, then any firearm or any knife in your pocket(s) will be the world's best firearm or knife. That mint-condition M1911 semi-automatic at home stored in its case in your closet - your pride and joy - might as well never have been bought.
Someting that the guy dont keep in mind its that every person its diferent,diferent size of hands and finger, him May have big hands and big fingers but there its some guys and Girls that have small hands and fingers that be a perfect gun for them,,Just like when you get gloves from the store ,you get Someting that fit on you ,or not???. That man only talk for him.
I used to be a crime scene investigator for a huge city. I've seen 3 shots of 25 ACP kill 2 grown men. One dropped immediately the other made it about 40 feet before he collapsed and expired. I've seen people dropped and killed with 22s, 32s, 380s, etc. Ive seen people live when shot with buckshot and one person shot with a 7.62x39 lived. I've worked probably ten cases where people died from being punched one time. Placement is what matters. I went from carrying a 10mm pre CSI, now I carry a small 9mm or pocket 380.
.22 LR won't be so bad, hell, my country Britain will only allow semi autos if they only chambers .22 LR. If the people that believe self-defence is a sin will allow you to have a semi auto with .22 LR, that's a good sign that it's pretty much useless. Fun, but useless.
Worked in a lot of ER's, never saw a gunshot victim who wanted to get shot again, no matter what caliber they were shot with. They all seemed pretty unhappy about the situation.
I know a guy who was shot in the face with a .25 and the bullet ricochet in his face to his neck and severed his spinal cord. He hasn’t walked since 1990. Never underestimate a gun’s caliber and potential damage. An easily concealed gun is a dangerous gun....
@Miles Doyle That's fine, I'd rather go to hell than be with some one that would damn people for being happy. I can't respect some one that would personally murder some one for victimless crimes.
While I agree the 25 is not the choice self defense piece, it was what my Aunt used to stop a home intruder who had cut her power and phone lines in the middle of the night and was making his way into her home. And yes it worked to save that “little old lady’s” life that night.
Saved my life, guy tried robbing me at a hotel i worked in north charlstion sc two hollow points took him down, he had 38 revolver, mine was a itailian galese
I'm pretty surprised that people who know something about guns rarely seem to get what the purpose of pocket or purse guns is. These small caliber guns are pretty much an ambush gun. What I mean is that the person carrying this small gun gets attacked or cornered by an aggressor then this small gun can surprise that attacker who probably assumed that their prey was unarmed. Look at the design of this Beretta and other guns like Walthers with a fixed barrel... You can push that barrel up against the attacker's torso and fire into them, something you can't do with the Browning tilt up barrel design since you most likely push the barrel out of battery and the gun cannot fire. Using a .25 ACP or like small gun like this is for very short range, 7 yds aimed fire is probably not how this gun was intended to be employed. This gun is for short range, instinctive shooting or even closer. This also answers the question on 'why would you make a gun with such small sights?' Because if you're far enough away to need sights, you should be running away from the situation to save your life. There were even some of these small pistols that were made without sights, again because the short range this weapon was meant for would make sights not necessary, point shooting... And yes, this type of pistol is best used with military ball ammo. But also, this gun is not going to kill buffalo but what it can do is break the attack so that the defender can have a means to escape. If you think of these small pistols in the conditions they were designed for then they make more sense. However, if you compare these pocket pistols to carry size guns like Glock 19, S&W MP etc, etc, then of course they seem useless.
"Because if you're far enough away to need sights, you should be running away from the situation to save your life" -- Exactly! AND... If you ever shoot someone who is 7 yards away, you're gonna have a heck of a time proving in court that you were defending yourself.
@@BobC59 I hope you guys don't get me wrong. I totally realize that 7 yds or 21 feet is not a huge distance. I have seen a few martial arts demonstrations on how quickly another person could close that distance and be on you pretty quick. I just think for people who choose to conceal carry in a legal fashion have to think about what their goal is on that worst night of their life... Do they want to just defend themselves and make it home or to some other area of safety? Or do they want to confront the attacker, stand their ground and make it a situation of 'Well it's gonna be you or me...' Stuckgrenade, you're exactly right, people need to understand the law 100%. And yes, you do have to pay attention to your surroundings and if possible you may actually avoid the attack altogether.
@@Jazzman-bj9fq Totally agree. Indeed someone can close that gap in a second at full sprint, so I guess my point is that one must ascertain whether that person is an attacker or a jogger or someone giving you your sunglasses you left on the restaurant table, etc... I don't see how anyone can determine someone is a threat until they are in very close (5 or 6 feet?) proximity. In which case, a "get off me" or "ambush" gun (whatever size you deem necessary) is what you need when out and about. I say 38 spl hammerless revolver for reliability and no jamming in a pocket, purse, whatever. In the home, however, anyone you see who hasn't been invited and appears threatening in you view, well, then you need a "stay away from me and my family" gun. A12-gauge, AR-15, .45ACP - whatever - down the hall or across the room is fine and dandy ;)
.25 ACP is so underrated. If anyone made a decent size .25 it would be awesome. Imagine a double stack .25, with a 3.5 - 4.5" barrel??? It would hold 30 rounds in a mag and would be so fun. KelTec could do something special with this.
The odds of even keltec designing a modern 25 from the ground up is unlikely due to the fraction of the market that would be interested. A double stack mag is also likely to make the gun larger than the old models. I do think 25 has an advantage In the guns that are this tiny. 25 will give you few if any failures as compared to 22lr. I would agree that 22mag is somewhat more effective. That said it’s still not going to go through bone and any gun in 22 mag except an NAA mini revolver will be large enough that you might as well go with 380. Not to mention that NAA’s are 5 shot and single action. Nevertheless in the tiniest useful semi-autos 25 does offer an advantage in reliability and arguably though negligibly in bullet weight, but no gun that small with such tiny sights is extremely effective at more than 5 to 10 yards at most for the average shooter.
On numbers alone there is little difference in 25acp a 22lr performance. Neither will go through bone or expand the bullet when using hollow points especially from a pistol. Really the only advantage to 25 is centerfire reliability. 22mag on the other hand is pushing the bullet faster and has been shown to expand a hollow point bullet from even a 2inch revolver, when using the right bullet and faster burning pistol powder . Also In a full size gun 22lr and magnum failures are typically less common and often are caused by the magazine’s or ammo itself. so the extra cost of the less common ammo and adaptation or design of a new gun for 25 simply isn’t worth it.
FYI North American Arms (NAA) made a .25 based on .32 necked down brass. Something I always wanted to try. It was called the 25NAA Guardian and it out performed just about all the pocket pistols. The .25/32 load delivers in excess of 1100 f.p.s. velocity to a 50 grain proprietary bullet from Hornady. This generates 134 ft. lbs of energy, specifically from the 2.5″ Guardian barrel. Compared that to standard .25 load of about 950 f.p.s. velocity of a 35 grain bullet with 63 ft lbs, or upped to the 760 f.p.s velocity with the 50 grain bullet with 65 ft lbs energy and you can see what a hot little load this is. Unfortunately this little firecracker has been discontinued. I think it was probably due to poor sales and information ads. I never knew about this pistol until a few months ago and I never saw it in any of the gun magazines I get or online. It may have also been all the BS about the .25 being less powerful than a .22LR that is just not true. The information they site for the .22LR for velocity & Muzzle Energy is usually comes from a .22 rifle barrel. When that same .22LR is fired from the 2.5 inch barrel like the .25 ACP, the .22LR comes up short of the .25 ACP. The .25 ACP also has the advantage of being a center fire cartridge giving far better reliability from misfires like the .22 rimfire ammo. The ammo was another problem being a proprietary round and from what I have heard was hard to find and now that has been discontinued. The only way to have ammo for this gun, if you own one, is to find or have a set of reloading dies made and neck down .32 brass. One might be able to neck .32 brass down by using the .25 resizing die to neck it like I did once when I was thinking about making a .25/32 by re barreling a .32 with a custom made barrel. It was a shame that the .25NAA Guardian was discontinued before it had a chance to catch on. You can still find one for sale online every once and a while, but ammo is almost nonexistent unless you make it yourself. The price for a used .25NAA runs between $200.00 & $400.00 and up. I still might pick one up and see about getting a set of reloading dies made. But I'm afraid the dies will cost more than the gun. BTY, I own and carry the little .25 Beretta every day. I live in AZ and most of the year people wear shorts, blue jeans or light clothing. That little Beretta fits in my denim jeans or shorts pocket and with a set of keys or something a git bulkier than the pistol, like a folded handkerchief at the bottom of the pocket with the pistol on top, no one notices you are carrying it. Even riding my bicycle no one sees the pistol in the pocket or it can be stowed in a fanny pack. I love that little Beretta, it has never failed me and I never leave home without it. But I've pocket carried & shot it so much it is showing quite a bit of wear now and needs some work and replacement grips. Beretta stopped making that .25 Jetfire & .25 Bobcat some years ago. There are others .25's still made but they are not as reliable as the Beretta. But if you want a high powered .25 pistol, try to pick up one of the .25NAA Guardians.
Not gonna lie, I'd totally want one... you could fit a quadruple stack 22lr magazine in the handle of the 92fs. Not sure how well that would feed though 😆
It's a common caliber for Saturday night specials. A lot of people could get an old junker for $20 at a pawn shop and if it wasn't .32ACP it was likely .25
A gun is a gun. A 25ACP will kill your azz dead just like a larger caliper gun will. This is a close quarters gun. You put a few rounds in someone at close range and they are toast! This kind of reminds me of that movie "Get Shorty" when the one guy laughs at the other guys smaller gun and then gets shot dead by the smaller gun. I know it's just a movie but it does make a point. 😅😅>>> ua-cam.com/video/O31rBYqYkuQ/v-deo.html
Actually owned the .25 beretta you just tested. Never used in in self defense, but it was good to know i had something in my back pocket if the situation called for it. My buddy that sold it to me said " 22 or 25 aint something, until its something busting at your nose." I carried it for a year until i saved up and got me a sig. So i mean it has its place in my heart.
To answer your question: No, the .25 ACP is NOT the worst self-defense cartridge. That dubious honor belongs to the 2.7mm Kolibri. Strong language will protect you better than that pea-shooter.
Wouldn't work on a mouse, either. The standard Kolibri cartridge produced muzzle energy of about 4 joules. By comparison, the average human being can punch with a force between 10 and 15 joules.
When I was an LEO I can recall two specific shootings involving a .25 ACP. The first one was at a nightclub, in the parking lot at 2:00 am closing (when most fights/shootings/stabbings occur at such establishments). Involved two women patrons. One had a .25 ACP and shot the other in the abdomen with it. Victim rushed to hospital by friends and did survive. Shooter arrested that night near the scene and pistol recovered in a car. It was a Jennings I believe. The second incident involved a guy with felony warrants for agg sexual assault-child. He ran, evaded from us and ultimately sought refuge in the attic of a home. The attic being in the roof, with a ladder that folded down to gain access. Attempts were made to talk him down/out and he put a .25 ACP in his mouth and pulled the trigger. DRT (dead right there), one less warrant in the stack. .22 rimfire short to .44 magnum....they'll all kill a human being pretty quick if the bullet hits the right spot, and they'll all not kill quick if the bullet hits the wrong spot. I'm a firm believer in familiarity and training when it comes to firearms for self defense. Also believe in keeping it simple. That pistol should come out of the holster or pocket cleanly, be very easy to point instinctively and should be above all reliable.
I been carrying my 25.acp for over 35 years, i put it in my pocket holster and no one even knows I'm carrying, most of assault happen at close range where the 25acp is effective with FMJ your looking for penetration not expansion like with hollow points, you get shot in the head at close range you are going down I don't care who you are, a 25acp is still a projectile period!
I was an X-Ray Tech for 40 years. 30 of those years was at inner-city Level 1 trauma centers in St. Louis Mo and Richmond VA. My experience with X-Raying victims of shootings is that .22 and .25 calibers killed most of those victims. Personally, I carry a S&W M&P 357Sig compact when possible and a Raven MP-25 always.
I remember there being an incident where a bodybuilder told his roommate (or something) to shoot him in the chest with his “teeny mouse gun” .25 acp pistol, because he figured it couldn’t possibly penetrate his large frame. It killed him on the spot. It happened around where I live, but I don’t remember the specifics. I’m sure there’s a news article somewhere. Anyways, alls I’m saying is even the tiniest guns we perceive as weak are still more than capable of ending a mans life.
Years ago working the grave yard shift at a factory here in Baltimore a guy brought one of those raven .25 autos to work and we took it outside and i shot one of those big empty 55gal steel drums 25-30 ft away,went thru one side and almost out the other,i was impressed.A very underestimated little gun.Bernard goetz used it as the subway vigilante in the 80s.
@@ViktoriousDead i believe it some UA-cam Copple had his wife shoot at him with a desert eagle blocking with 2 dictionarys of corse he died never underestimate peoples stupidity
@@davidcarter1013 ,NO,I was a CO where Bernard Getz was housed on Rikers Island.Getz used a S&W J frame chiefs 5 shot 38 spec 2 inch revolver he bought in NH
Yeah, but that being said, mouse guns are fairly tricky to be accurate with. You have to really get a feel for how to hold it and aiming down a channel sight sucks.
@Gray Au, what exactly do you mean by "less deadly"? Do you mean it has less ability to kill or do you mean that it has historically killed fewer people?
Hey Lucky Gunner, I dig your videos a lot but just a little piece of advice...take it or leave it. As an active duty marine, failure drills are nothing but second nature as I’ve done countless drills with my M16A4. After the Marine Corps/US Government has used and tested different variants of failure drills (on real human beings in combat) they have seen that a failure drill to the HEAD is extremely ineffective. Mostly due to the extremely small margin of what we call the “T-Box” meaning the parts of the brain behind the eyes and nose. That essentially is the switch off button if shot because the cerebral cortex being directly behind it. In comparison, they have rolled out a failure drill with 2 to the chest and 1 to the PELVIS. Shooting at the pelvis, especially with 5.56 out of an M16, has shown to have leaps and bounds more stopping power for multiple reasons. 1) A shot to the pelvic girdle is much larger and easier to execute in a high stress situation. 2) As the pelvis is being impacted by the rounds permanent and temporary cavities it will almost certainly shatter the pelvic bones and hips. - this renders the assailant almost immediately immobile, and also you have a very good chance of severing the femoral artery which will make them bleed out very quickly. Just a quick explanation and maybe you could even do a video about the differences and how the military has transitioned to the two the the chest one to the pelvis. Thanks for reading whoever actually takes time to read this shit✌🏼✌🏼
Sorry reading this late, but isn't one of the differences the amount of energy, While yes .556 is considered weak by rifle standards, I don't think of any pistol cartridge under .357 as being able to shatter bones (reliably) . But to your point the brow on a human tends to be thick so? Plus the study he mentions all rifles and shotguns tend to be FAR more lethal - incapacitating . (Ironically .22 was the most lethal - highest kill ratio, it's just if you don't kill them with the first shot the 2nd 3rd.... ain't going to help.) and hey a red Ryder bb to the eye will ruin a bad guys day...
Don't think you'll have much probably with a slug or buck anywhere on the target. If it doesn't kill him. It'll knock him on his ass after hitting him multiple times quickly. If he's wearing armor. And you can take it from there.
hot2warm haha...i offered my rent money to a weekend warrior who kept (for weeks) telling me my 25 was useless as a self defense gun...the money was put on the table and i told him that i would at least knock out a tooth or take an eye out at the 10 foot distance from my doorway to my work area. Needless to say,i paid my rent on time and he never brought up my choice of carry again.
hot2warm this is the point, often just having a gun, and gun, is enough to end an attack, most criminals are not looking for a challenge, they want easy targets and if they even suspect you might resist they will move on to a different target. People, yes even criminals, tend to move away from gunfire as quickly as possible they don't think, oh it's only a X caliber, no big deal. Sure one if these might not stop a determined attacker, but I know bouncher from a bar in NJ who took six in the chest, at close range froma .38 before he grabbed the shooter and chocked him to death. While I wouldn't rely on a .25 cal, I'm also 6'8" or so and can easily manage and conceal something much bigger, and no I wouldn't even suggest one to anyone else, but if push comes to shove, and in probably 99.9% of the cases, it's better to have an underpowered pistol than no pistol at all. Also remember, ever barrel looks much larger when it's being pointed at you. 😄
hot2warm, that's what I do when people bash this "useless" cartridge. I say "Okay, you're such an expert. Tell me where you want to get hit by one." Crickets can be heard chirping 2 states away. They logged off and left the chatroom. I've fired a Beretta like this and the recoil is much harsher than you'd expect. Blazer brand ammo will easily burrow itself 0.25" into a fat log from 25 feet. Imagine what it does to human flesh from almost point blank range...
I got shot in the knee with a .25 auto. It sucked, it didn’t cripple me or really even take me out of the fight. It still hurt and went all the way through my knee and out the side. It’s not a man stopper but it will hurt/kill you.
I remember, long long ago, a gun magazine's article about a roughly 1/4 scale 1928 Thompson submachine gun, chambered in .25 ACP, that was fully functioning.
To most aggressors a gun is a gun and a gun that an average person can comfortably shoot is far superior to a more powerful one that the typical person has inadequate training with. You are spot on - context matters.
The one fact that many seem to forget is that regardless of the cartridge used. A large percentage of people who are shot will stop their aggression not because they are incapacitated, but because they don't want to be shot anymore.
@retro gaming time with joe Indeed, I saw a video of a dude shoot a 300 lb farm hog with a .177. One shot in the head and it died instantly. Modern pellet rifles are no joke. That’s a 300 pound animal with a thick skull. Proof: ua-cam.com/video/1zLFLuV5pM0/v-deo.html&feature=share
Young people slang says bodycount is now how many people you've slept with, they interview random people on tik tok and ask, "So what's your bodycount?" and my first thought was anyone with an actual bodycount probably keeps that to themselves, no?
@@PaulGutierrez8605Kind of sad, right? The fact that they're keeping a 100% accurate count and also constantly looking to increase the number. I swear, kids these days have got nothing about them that's remotely interesting, so they try to one up their buddies in this really weird and rather concerning competition.
The thing is, I carried a Bodyguard 380 for 5 years before switching to a Kel Tec P32. I can shoot faster & more accurately with the .32 then the .380. And I think that's more important.
@@Danstheman1357 I know, right? I was extremely disappointed and Ruger said it tested fine. I've adjusted grip pressure, shot the required number of rounds through the gun, everything, and it hands regularly enough I can't carry it for self defense. I like my Glock 43 a lot better. It's very reliable, clean or dirty and no break-in period. I'm building a p80 Glock 19 for my wife right now. I can't wait to try it out.
RGV shooter... for those that don't believe you if they watch the very first and second James Bond I can't remember exactly without watching the movie but I can almost guarantee you that the pistol he carries is a 32 Caliber not a 380 and not! A 9 mm I've seen all those early movies several times but not lately as a lot is going on in life and my memory but the pistol almost looks like a 7.65
What if... They made a bodyguard with the nicer sights, but made it in 25acp double stack? So, like, a 10 plus one pocket carry. With no recoil. I think that would be a remarkable gun.
I carry a backpack everywhere, so my EDC is a Full-sized Walther PPQ m2 .45 with a pair of mags. However, between me and @LordOfNothingham , which of us will have the gun accessible fast enough should we get mugged? A lot of good my 45 will do if I can't get to it.
In the 70's a security guard at my college carried one. Wasn't supposed to be armed. But it was inner city Baltimore and he walked the campus at night. I'd ask him what does your gun want to be when it grows up !
Great work, thanks. We were fortunate enough to take a course with Col. Cooper, and he taught us the "Mozambique" drill - just like your failure drill. He said that it was developed for use against an enemy wearing body armor in -of course - Mozambique. I have the Beretta in both the .22lr & .25acp, and have only tested the .25, for which I used to get the pre-fragmented Glaser round, against gallon water jugs. The jugs split completely down the side; my Beretta .380 did about the same, also with Glasers. Based on its small size, and the improbable-to-duplicate fact that it indexes perfectly in my hand every time I grab for it, I have the .25 in my pocket often; I stand with whoever said "the best gun&cartridge combination is the one you have right NOW".
Years ago I was a TV news camera man. One of the last stories I covered was a fatal shooting where the deceased was shot once in the head with a .25acp. Ask him if he thinks the caliber isn't able to defend yourself with. It is obviously not the best, but if you want one, or use one, it certainly CAN do the job, and has done the job for decades now for some people. /shrug
True it will kill you if you get hit in the head or if it happens to hit a major organ like your heart, but think practically. We all know accuracy goes out the window in high-stress situations, and if you manage to hit your target, it will most likely be a body shot. I would rather trust my life to a larger caliber that can incapacitate in 1-2 body shots the majority of the time than a .25 acp that fails over a third of time.
@@SirBilliam96 Read my answer to Greg. A 25ACP head shot gave a guy in my home town a head ache! And another answer where my 45LC 255gr LFN was barely enuf. LOL
@@SirBilliam96 so true. Thats why people who do carry the pocket pistol should train and train to do mag dumps to center mass with hp rounds. Give yourself as much of an edge as possible with them pistols. It was my first pistol. My 18th birthday my gramps handed me a Jetfire and a 12 gauge. Happy birthday.
Lyn Thompson from cold steel did a video in which he talked about a buddy of his in south Africa, who Carries a 25acp. He claimed that he had been assaulted three times and all three times has killed the assailant
I used to carry a Raven 25 in an empty Marlboro pack as a hold out piece back in the day. Last resort but always better than nothing. Loaded Glazer blue tips in it. I wouldn't wanna take a round from it.
@@BeefNEggs057 'Fer sure, getting hit with any caliber slug is definitely gonna ruin somebody's day. Kinda like the famous Mike Tyson quote..."Everyone has a plan 'till they get punched in the mouth."
I can’t explain why, but this exquisite little weapon feels so good in the hand. Beretta designs the most stylish and ergonomically perfect handguns. While people argue endlessly about the merits or failings of this controversial caliber (.25 acp), what’s often overlooked is the added measure of security one feels holding a weapon that just feels right. I have both a pre-1968 950B Jetfire in .25 acp and a 950B Minx in .22 short. I absolutely love both these guns.
The worst self defense cartridge will always be the "no" cartridge, which is the one you have when you're not armed. Other than that, I think it's interesting that even some years ago, the 380 ACP did so much better than the .25 and not much worse than some significantly bigger rounds. Of course, those 380s probably weren't shot out of a 2.5" barrel either. Good stuff.
Frank Hellman I found a box of some old Italian 380 military ball and chronoed them through a Beretta model 34. That 94gr bullet was going over 1100 FPS out of that old school service pistol. Back when 380 was considered a viable service cartridge it was a different animal than what we think of as 380 today
@@saviostrawn8737 How old was it? It's not uncommon to see ammo actually get hotter after sitting around for 50 years. It could have been 950 fps stuff when it was made.
People need to understand that the human body isn’t designed to be shot with a bullet. Shot placement is the key with any caliber, on that note any caliber can kill or incapacitate.
I have a 950 .25 and absolutely love it. It’s my go to summer gun for pocket carry/gym shorts. It’s not a gun I would want to engage someone with but back against the wall, it will get the job done (hopefully). I did open up the rear sight a bit with a Dremel and it made a good difference.
Stop asking the 25 ACP to do more than it was designed to do.. If someone shoots several 25 ACP rounds into a bad guy's chest, he will no longer be in the fight. Job Done!
@@QuantumMech_88 Robber held up my neighborhood video store, pre-redbox. The responding officer was shot just above one eye, didn't penetrate the skull 💀 and exited near his ear. Cop's epic response: "Did you just try to shoot me?" Robber gave up upon discovery that the cop was bullet proof...at least to .25 he was carrying.
@@polymathicperturbations1476 Robber held up my neighborhood video store, pre-redbox. The responding officer was shot just above one eye, didn't penetrate the skull 💀 and exited near his ear. Cop's epic response: "Did you just try to shoot me?" Robber gave up upon discovery that the cop was bullet proof...at least to .25 he was carrying.
If a company put some effort into a strong and reliable gun, and good modern ammo tech .25 would take off. If glock made a .25acp, everybody would buy it.
For me it's not about the guns, it's about the ammo price-to-power ratio. Show me .25 ammo that can match 9mm in value, and I might consider it. Until then, no.
I know of 2 who died from a 22 gunshot. Short and LR. Another by 22 ratshot....and yet another by a tiny 1” pocket knife blade. I wouldn’t say the 25 ACP is the best defense cartridge, but it is well beyond lethal.
A girl I went to highschool with got drunk and put 1 of her dad's pistols in her mouth and pulled the trigger it was a 22 pistol loaded with rat shot....it was like 5 hours before they got her to the emergency room. But she lived.. she stopped comming to school but I actually ran into her many years later and she was doing well.. talked fine and no visible damage but omg what a horrific nightmare that must habe been
@@Kadeo-ms6qw what happened there, the guy inherited a 22 revolver, knew absolutely nothing about guns. It was loaded with ratshot & all he knew was he wanted to kill himself over a woman. So BANG! roof of his mouth, in her driveway. Not exactly instantaneous. I think everyone should know their gun, calibers, ballistics, and most importantly, keep the business end out of their mouth.
@@GModBMXer That's some low-effort trolling, try harder! For the record, Browning did have designs that didn't work well but that's not one of them. Try the FN Trombone.
From my experience in Vietnam. Most of my initial rounds fired were not intended to hit a target. They were suppression fire. It is hard to hit a target when you are throwing yourself into cover. You want to make the opponent dig for cover too. It doesn't make any difference what size of projectile you are sending downrange, as long as people are ducking. Once in a position to initiate/respond to the situation then aimed fire is important. I would always want the larger caliber, but a .22 or .25 is always better than a .00.
% incapacitated could also be effected by the less experienced shooter. As I imagine most people choosing to use a .22lr or .25ACP firearm will most likely be doing so for reasons related to recoil, size or cost of the gun. Whereas the majority of trained and capable shooters would not be included in that statistic of % not incapacitated.
25acp loads vary widely. Out of a short barrel some loads are weaker than 22lr and some loads are a bit more powerful than 22lr and with the hard jacket penetrate a lot better.
This is an area where I believe that the Leighigh Defense loads could work better than hollow points. The .32 caliber Cavitator will reach the FBI minimum penetration unlike the majority of .32 caliber hollow points. If Leighigh could get a .25 ACP round to reach the FBI minimum penetration standard, that would be better than the current crop of .25 ACP hollow points. The .25 ACP also performs better than .22LR in the "ignition" of the rounds. It is common for even a good quality rimfire to experience more frequent misfires than a centerfire/primer fired pistol.
This is the whole reason the .25 was invented by JMB. Mimic the ballistics of .22 LR, with centerfire reliability. That said, rimfire reliability, with high quality ammo, is far better now than it was 116 years ago.
@@VMEMotor5 .25 was made to burn off in the time the slug takes to exit the muzzle of a pistol barrel thus using all of its energy in propelling the round. whereas 22lr will still be burning afterword thus reducing it's effectiveness on non rifle length barrels.
@@thescatologistcopromancer3936 even brass knuckles? They're a good litmus test. It seems like if brass knuckles are legal that basically anything you can think of is legal.
I purchased my beretta 21a 25acp for my backup pocket carry. After 5 years it is usually my primary. I know I usually out gunned I figure if I shoot 9 bangs the bad guy normally would run by then
.25acp is not for getting into a conflict. It's a runaway gun. Mine has let me run away three times so far. Lot of people have tried to tell me how inferior it is to their 9mm, 45acp, .40 etc. Strange thing is, when I ask them where their favourite super caliber is they never seem to have it on them, always locked away in the safe. Even more strangely I also own the same calibers they do and those guns also seem to spend most of the time in the safe and probably for the same reasons. I've seen a lot of small women get suckered into buying 9mm which hurt their hands and got traded in for a .22 and I learned really quick when I had a spinal fusion done that for the the next 8 weeks the only firearm I could have used in an emergency was the .25acp. So the only caliber that counts for anything in self defence is the one in your hand.
I had a Baretta model 20 in .25. It was the fastest shooting semiautomatic I ever shot. A friend videoed my shooting this at our range. I was able to have six casings in the air at the same time. During this time I was able to put all seven rounds in the middle of a tombstone target at 15 feet in just over one second. It was like shooting a fully automatic. The trigger pull was extremely short and sharp. Anyone who can take seven rounds to the center of mass in about a second can have my wallet :) Is it as good as a 9mm? Of course not. Is it worthless? I don't think so. As others have written, a .25 with you is better than a 9 at home
My edc gun is either a 9 mm or a 40 cal. My backup is 25. Just like real estate----location, location, location. Shots or lots, where it's located is #1
I personally love my often maligned Raven MP-25 "Saturday Night Special". It's surprisingly reliable, accurate at 7 yards, and super tiny. Only bad thing is that the safety on it is known to be a bit iffy as the safety only blocks the trigger with only a tiny little lug holding the striker back that could fail if bumped hard . So it's not the safest to carry with a round in the chamber especially in your pocket with the barrel potentially facing your junk. But aside from that it's a super fun little pistol to shoot and potentially useful as a carry gun if you have time to rack the slide.
If you have the balls to stand in front of any fast-moving projectile, you might not be very bright. I wouldn't want to be hit with a rock, but that doesn't mean I'm going to count on a rock to protect me from an armed assailant.
I was a paramedic for 30+ years and responded to multiply shooting. My "field" experience is this. It's not the caliber, it's the shot placement. I had PT's hit with 357's/'45"s + that walked away. On the other hand, there have been both suicides & intentional shootings that involved calibers less then 9MM/380 caliber I.E. .25" or less caliber that have produced fatalities. Every one of these was traced to shot placement. It is where you put the projectile that is important more so than the size of the projectile.
I don't really care what people carry i personally carry a 9mm because thats what i'm comfortable with. But for anyone who mocks any hand caliber and claims it doesn't have "enough" power I ask them to perform one simple test, Take a round to the chest at the average distance of a civilian defensive shoot, then comeback and tell me your experience.
Just because something can kill doesn't mean it is ideal. There are better cartridges for defense than a 22; however, if you only have a 22, then use a 22. Another way to pose the question is would you rather take 1 45acp jhp to the center body mass or 3 22lrs?
@@hotsexyjesus4367 i think a big point people overlook is that the extra capacity in a panicked situation might count for more than people give it credit.
Use the sight anyway! As far as i know it looks better in court if you do because that "proves" that you intended to shoot and therefor fear for you life... ( Or however the warped mindes of US attorneys work).
One thing I've noticed in all articles about how lousy a .25 pistol is, "small, non-existance sights." May I ask, "Is anybody target shooting with such a weapon." John Browning designed it as a almost non-existance, very close range, self defense pistol. I've ground the sights off mine and practice drawing and firing at 6 feet, max.
i feel like etching sight lines into it (maybe literally an arrow down the middle?) would be most realistic. something to aim with that wont hang in a pocket
@@richardweilandt3315 That's how I trained as an L.E.O. Most encounters are said to be at about 3 to 4 yards, with no time to aim. (unless you are a modern American Cop, who stands off at about 30 yards; does a mag dump and misses )
The baby browning was designed to be a "rib-gun", meaning short distance defense within 7 yds. So, sights were no a major concern. Also note that this was the gun and caliber of choice for resistance fighters during ww2.
I met a french resistance fighter she showed me her baby browning. She told me she slept with 3 german officers and killed all 3 with that 25 I trusted the look in her eyes when she told that story.
Honestly I'm a guy who just likes elastic waistbands and is never going to strap on a holster every time i go grocery shopping. A little Phoenix .25 is the only sort of gun I could see myself realistically throwing in my pocket every day.
I have a Phoenix Arms .25...I don't carry it anymore, but it used to be something i could put on my ankle and roll my jeans over. Never had any issues shooting it either. And at $125 i couldn't be mad at it.
I worked in security at a large Medical Center back in the early 70's,and can recall a couple "guests" in the morgue who gained entry with a 25 cal ticket,they would consider it more than adequate ,at the moment I have been carrying an LCRX 22mag with 3" using Hornady C.D. rounds nearly every time I carry ,for now I don't need the recoil of my 2 1/4 inch 357 I , normally enjoy shooting it (SP 101) but am in the middle of healing from the fusion of C1,and C2,a;so bolted to the skull, (done at the same Med Ctr I worked at for 8 months way back then)feel great doing fine,but a bit reluctant to subject things to that jolt for now,the pain that preceded the fusion I'm in no hurry to repeat ! (have the computer skip the space between in,and security,and you get a word sometimes accurate to the situation !glad I proof read !
I personally was asked this at a range while testing various guns and types of ammo for myself and several clients. I fired a really low quality ( must have been a Lorcin ) .25 cal , with fmj at a hard block of 4x4x4 pressure treated wood as a target. It went 3/4 through, from 50 feet. The 25 acp found more friends that day. The gun stopped working and was not worth looking for parts.
100% of the people watching this video or that produced this video are alive regardless of their choice of carry gun or caliber. 9 rounds of .25 acp or anything else dumped into someone right away should give you the chance to continue to watch videos and argue about caliber for as long as we all want to do so. In all the years of participating in the internet firearms community (going all the way back to the late 90's), I am aware of one particular incident where an active participant in the firearms internet world used a .25 Beretta. I believe the guy was a pawn shop store owner. I think I first read his account on the old rec.guns message board. He had other guns available about his shop, but for varying reasons none were available or loaded at the time of his attack other than a little Beretta Jetfire. He had been hacked and stabbed with a sword believe it or not and the only gun he could get to was the little .25 in his pocket. The round ended the attackers actions right then and there and he lived to tell his story. thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39634 To me, that is the purpose of these little guns. They provide an unobtrusive way to keep a little gun on you no matter what. No sights needed, no fancy stoppage drills, just point and empty and then get ready to start ripping out eyeballs and fighting for your life. Just like what happens with every other caliber or handgun choice.
I had a Tanfoglio knock-off of the Jetfire for a while back around 1981. I loved that little pistol -- despite what you say about sights, I found it plenty accurate and (perhaps more importantly for under-pressure shooting with such a tiny gun and sights) I found it pointed very well for me (this will obviously vary depending on your hand size and grip preference). Honestly, the only thing I didn't like about the tiny pistol was the magazine catch on the heel of the grip (virtually every European designed small pistol has this). Another really nice feature was that I could carry it in the same pocket with my wallet, and still sit down comfortably. Like some other good guns I had around that time (XP-100 in .221 Fireball!), I stupidly traded it away at the local pawn shop, losing value on every trade. Wish I could afford one again; I love .25 ACP.
I think what it is being carried for matters as well. I sometimes carry a 25 acp in addition to my primary carry weapon. I do this because a situation may present itself where drawing my main carry would not be as inconspicuous as a pocket draw. Also, I would only choose this option if the attacker was right on top of me (at most 5 feet away).
It may be wrong but I subscribe to the believe that in a 1 on 1 self defense situation that nobody wants to be shot with any caliber. Self defense doesn’t necessarily mean lethal force, it means getting out of a bad situation. If you shoot someone who is not shooting back they probably aren’t going to stick around to get shot more. . . In theory.
@@TurdFergusson318 Almost all of those stories you hear are fake: www.snopes.com/fact-check/stella-awards/ The only exception is when the defendant settles to avoid legal fees. American courts do not outright deny such lawsuits, lawyers happily charge the same arms and legs as always, and the law does not allow victims of such absurd suits to demand legal fees if they win unless they counter-sue someone who likely cannot pay them anyway. That's a genuine need of reform, but only in the sense that our legal system is a money-go-round for lawyers.
I’m with Jeff to some extent. However, in my experience, shot placement is more important than caliber. I would rather be missed with a 45 than hit with a 22. I would say that if you have your heart set on a super small pistol, get a 22. You can afford to practice more. If chances of a gunfight are slim, carry a pistol. Anything greater, bring a rifle.
My great uncle whom was a police officer back in the 1970s was killed in the line of duty by a 14 year old armed with a Colt Junior .25 Auto. The FMJ bullets perforated his heart and lungs which inflicted lethal wounds, but he was still able to draw his revolver and fire towards the youth. He then collapsed and died at the scene before the next arriving officer arrived. Damn shame I never met him, I would've loved to have gone to the range with him and get to know him.
Alot of drug dealers mob guys and pimps carried them small cheap easy to get rid of , just walk up to some one or pop one in the neck . Bad little guns .
Worth noting that the Beretta, Browning, and other pocket handguns have mag-releases that are perfect for one or two-handed grips, if you're right-handed.
I'm kinda in the camp of smaller calibre, though I carry a 9mm. My reasoning is, if I have to fire again, I can, and if I have to fight with my hands, at least I have the advantage of not leaking. If it comes to that, I mean the attacker continues to attack, It would, in theory be harder for a prosecutor to argue that you used excessive force after the guy went down. That all being said, the smallest I would carry is a 9, and maybe a 380 if I had that option.
If you want a small gun--and there are many valid reasons for wanting such--a fine choice, in my opinion, is the Kel Tec P32 with the ten-round extended magazine. Very light, flat, fits unobtrusively inside virtually any pocket and inexpensive as well! I have carried and shot it for over twenty years. As for reliability, I have never once had a single problem, not one, and that's with several absolutely stock guns. None of that "fluff and buff" stuff, though if you want to do that I have no objection. The reason I recommend the ten-round extended magazine is not for the added ammo capacity, though that is a not unwelcome benefit, but for the strong, secure grip on the weapon the extra grip length affords. Without that extra inch or so of grip length the gun sits atop one's fist in a somewhat wobbly manner. If used for protection it may well be in a physical struggle, especially if used by a woman defending herself against a male attacker. A solid, secure grip on the firearm greatly increases her chance of prevailing in that situation. The gun as originally designed works just fine, no problem there. But the first time you pick up one with the ten-round magazine inserted, you will immediately understand what I am talking about, and you'll never look back. Paul
Back in my LEO days we had 3 folks DRT from a hit in the noggin with a .25 acp. I mean one shot, down and out immediately. Two were contact or close contact, but one was intermediate range (think half-way across a room) through facial bones and out the back of the skull. The only other .25 acp shooting we had was one that hit an officer's vest (did a lot of crazy stuff then, and wound up going under his vest at the seam, but was pretty spent by then so he was back at work in a few days. Sure, little bitty, low powered cartridges don't have the best success rates, but I can tell stories of much larger cartridges (.38 +p, and even 12 ga 00B) even from contact shots not fully doing the job, either. My takeway was that ANY properly manufactured, reliable firearm an proper ammo beats no gun and ALL self-defense rounds CAN be effective but NONE are always effective. There are "Better" choices now days, sure, with a few caveats, but the .25 out of a properly speced gun (i.e. one not made as cheaply as possible and/or with a corroded bore) shooting quality ammo (agreed that FMJs are usually best) is still a viable defensive round. Excellent video.
I take my family shooting all the time. Out of all the different calibers we shoot, the 73' Star Starlet 25acp is the favorite hands down. The wife and kids all say it is easier to follow up accurately with another shot, and their targets don't lie. This pistol seems more accurate when you don't use the sights. Shooting and training with Mozambique Style,(triple tap...two in the chest to open them up, and one in the bucket for grand finale), this small caliber is pretty much guaranteed to stop anyone. Plus 1k+ rounds fired through it, no failures. Plus, extremely concealable. In my opinion, an excellent weapon for what it's intended purpose is. My Dad handed it down to me, it was his carry. My Dad used it during a robbery. Dropped behind the counter and sprayed rounds all over the store, the perp ran back to his car at the gas pump about 35 yards from the counter, and Dad put one in his left butt cheek. The guy got away but got arrested at the hospital with gang green in his ass. Cops chewed my Dad out for not killing the guy, but my Dad had the last laugh.
The 1968 gun control act is what really killed the .25 & .32 auto's, not public opinion or so called youtube experts. With the act of '68 it stopped the import of very small handguns, therefore the only small pocket guns that were allowed were ones made domestically such as Raven or Jennings and those guns were of questionable quality which led many of the next generation associating .25 & .32 with cheap guns. Prior to the gun control act, .22 cal & .25/.32 auto were extremely popular carry calibers. @ 2:30, no you're wrong. It is not a failing of the design. I own a Beretta mod 950 and I can draw, cock the hammer back with the thumb of my strong hand as I'm bringing the pistol up on target & fire just as quickly as drawing out & firing a double action revolver or striker fired poly pistol. It takes practice.
you are largely correct. as far as the .32 acp people here in the USA have .380itis. The .32acp WILL tumble in flesh! it is FAR more effective than many realize. but yeah GCA 68 killed the "pocket pistols".
My mother loved the .25 ACP. She didn't know about gel tests and could have cared less about how far it penetrated into a chest cavity. She always told me if she got into danger, she was pointing her Beretta straight at the 'nads. She said even a grazing shot in that area would cause an attacker to lose interest. Found it hard to argue with her logic.
Only problem is criminals have extremely tiny penises so that's a hard target to hit
😳
Shot placement is important.😬
Your mom is more dangerous than the people that would try to attack her 💀
mama shodan out there straight blastin folks in the dick.
As usual, the 25 you have in your pocket is better than the 45 you left at home.
Please no more.
Better than a pocket knife I suppose.
Yeah but not much. Haha
I say that also. When you're accosted by two shady men or several feral dogs on an empty, lonely country road, then any firearm or any knife in your pocket(s) will be the world's best firearm or knife. That mint-condition M1911 semi-automatic at home stored in its case in your closet - your pride and joy - might as well never have been bought.
Someting that the guy dont keep in mind its that every person its diferent,diferent size of hands and finger, him May have big hands and big fingers but there its some guys and Girls that have small hands and fingers that be a perfect gun for them,,Just like when you get gloves from the store ,you get Someting that fit on you ,or not???. That man only talk for him.
I used to be a crime scene investigator for a huge city. I've seen 3 shots of 25 ACP kill 2 grown men. One dropped immediately the other made it about 40 feet before he collapsed and expired.
I've seen people dropped and killed with 22s, 32s, 380s, etc. Ive seen people live when shot with buckshot and one person shot with a 7.62x39 lived.
I've worked probably ten cases where people died from being punched one time.
Placement is what matters. I went from carrying a 10mm pre CSI, now I carry a small 9mm or pocket 380.
I like my 950BS 25 because it's light and easily concealed. My 92F is too big and heavy for concealed carry.
Solid information, thank you…
nobody cares nhihghghehr
@@drephy841 nobody loves you.
@@trippie_fabio3181 lmao. Got 'em
I believe that whatever caliber the gun is, from .22 short to .50 BMG, getting shot is a very bad experience you want to avoid at all costs.
I'd much prefer a .50 BMG, hopefully I'd die
.22 LR won't be so bad, hell, my country Britain will only allow semi autos if they only chambers .22 LR. If the people that believe self-defence is a sin will allow you to have a semi auto with .22 LR, that's a good sign that it's pretty much useless. Fun, but useless.
@@autistichades5552 mmh i have my doubts,a 22 that i can carry,even a single shot,would be a godsend.
Itsawolf 1959 I’m glad u think so too bruh🤷🏽♂️🤦🏽♂️🤦🏽♂️
Worked in a lot of ER's, never saw a gunshot victim who wanted to get shot again, no matter what caliber they were shot with. They all seemed pretty unhappy about the situation.
I know a guy who was shot in the face with a .25 and the bullet ricochet in his face to his neck and severed his spinal cord. He hasn’t walked since 1990. Never underestimate a gun’s caliber and potential damage.
An easily concealed gun is a dangerous gun....
A concealed gun is insurance
I was shot through the neck with a 9mm. It bounced off my spine leaving me partially paralyzed. Extremely lucky to survive at all
@Miles Doyle That's fine, I'd rather go to hell than be with some one that would damn people for being happy.
I can't respect some one that would personally murder some one for victimless crimes.
Exactly u are correct
Anything .22 and up will leave an intruder smelling like shit just call the cops if your legal if he breaks in your house 💯
While I agree the 25 is not the choice self defense piece, it was what my Aunt used to stop a home intruder who had cut her power and phone lines in the middle of the night and was making his way into her home. And yes it worked to save that “little old lady’s” life that night.
wtf
Saved my life, guy tried robbing me at a hotel i worked in north charlstion sc two hollow points took him down, he had 38 revolver, mine was a itailian galese
chris barr What did happen after that
Yeni Patek Mille he lived his life
@@yenipatekmille9830 the robber died laughing.
@@Getoverhere666 XD
843
I'm pretty surprised that people who know something about guns rarely seem to get what the purpose of pocket or purse guns is. These small caliber guns are pretty much an ambush gun. What I mean is that the person carrying this small gun gets attacked or cornered by an aggressor then this small gun can surprise that attacker who probably assumed that their prey was unarmed. Look at the design of this Beretta and other guns like Walthers with a fixed barrel... You can push that barrel up against the attacker's torso and fire into them, something you can't do with the Browning tilt up barrel design since you most likely push the barrel out of battery and the gun cannot fire. Using a .25 ACP or like small gun like this is for very short range, 7 yds aimed fire is probably not how this gun was intended to be employed. This gun is for short range, instinctive shooting or even closer. This also answers the question on 'why would you make a gun with such small sights?' Because if you're far enough away to need sights, you should be running away from the situation to save your life. There were even some of these small pistols that were made without sights, again because the short range this weapon was meant for would make sights not necessary, point shooting... And yes, this type of pistol is best used with military ball ammo. But also, this gun is not going to kill buffalo but what it can do is break the attack so that the defender can have a means to escape. If you think of these small pistols in the conditions they were designed for then they make more sense. However, if you compare these pocket pistols to carry size guns like Glock 19, S&W MP etc, etc, then of course they seem useless.
@Stuckgrenadepin exactly!
"Because if you're far enough away to need sights, you should be running away from the situation to save your life" -- Exactly!
AND... If you ever shoot someone who is 7 yards away, you're gonna have a heck of a time proving in court that you were defending yourself.
@@BobC59 I hope you guys don't get me wrong. I totally realize that 7 yds or 21 feet is not a huge distance. I have seen a few martial arts demonstrations on how quickly another person could close that distance and be on you pretty quick. I just think for people who choose to conceal carry in a legal fashion have to think about what their goal is on that worst night of their life... Do they want to just defend themselves and make it home or to some other area of safety? Or do they want to confront the attacker, stand their ground and make it a situation of 'Well it's gonna be you or me...' Stuckgrenade, you're exactly right, people need to understand the law 100%. And yes, you do have to pay attention to your surroundings and if possible you may actually avoid the attack altogether.
@@Jazzman-bj9fq Totally agree. Indeed someone can close that gap in a second at full sprint, so I guess my point is that one must ascertain whether that person is an attacker or a jogger or someone giving you your sunglasses you left on the restaurant table, etc... I don't see how anyone can determine someone is a threat until they are in very close (5 or 6 feet?) proximity. In which case, a "get off me" or "ambush" gun (whatever size you deem necessary) is what you need when out and about. I say 38 spl hammerless revolver for reliability and no jamming in a pocket, purse, whatever. In the home, however, anyone you see who hasn't been invited and appears threatening in you view, well, then you need a "stay away from me and my family" gun. A12-gauge, AR-15, .45ACP - whatever - down the hall or across the room is fine and dandy ;)
@@BobC59 or through the wall
.25 ACP is so underrated. If anyone made a decent size .25 it would be awesome. Imagine a double stack .25, with a 3.5 - 4.5" barrel??? It would hold 30 rounds in a mag and would be so fun. KelTec could do something special with this.
You’re literally better off with a .2/LR/22mag the pistol yoj describe is made in those calibers
Just get a 380 they make them as small as those 25s or a much bigger easier thing to handle
The odds of even keltec designing a modern 25 from the ground up is unlikely due to the fraction of the market that would be interested. A double stack mag is also likely to make the gun larger than the old models. I do think 25 has an advantage In the guns that are this tiny. 25 will give you few if any failures as compared to 22lr. I would agree that 22mag is somewhat more effective. That said it’s still not going to go through bone and any gun in 22 mag except an NAA mini revolver will be large enough that you might as well go with 380. Not to mention that NAA’s are 5 shot and single action. Nevertheless in the tiniest useful semi-autos 25 does offer an advantage in reliability and arguably though negligibly in bullet weight, but no gun that small with such tiny sights is extremely effective at more than 5 to 10 yards at most for the average shooter.
On numbers alone there is little difference in 25acp a 22lr performance. Neither will go through bone or expand the bullet when using hollow points especially from a pistol. Really the only advantage to 25 is centerfire reliability. 22mag on the other hand is pushing the bullet faster and has been shown to expand a hollow point bullet from even a 2inch revolver, when using the right bullet and faster burning pistol powder . Also In a full size gun 22lr and magnum failures are typically less common and often are caused by the magazine’s or ammo itself. so the extra cost of the less common ammo and adaptation or design of a new gun for 25 simply isn’t worth it.
FYI
North American Arms (NAA) made a .25 based on .32 necked down brass. Something I always wanted to try. It was called the 25NAA Guardian and it out performed just about all the pocket pistols. The .25/32 load delivers in excess of 1100 f.p.s. velocity to a 50 grain proprietary bullet from Hornady. This generates 134 ft. lbs of energy, specifically from the 2.5″ Guardian barrel. Compared that to standard .25 load of about 950 f.p.s. velocity of a 35 grain bullet with 63 ft lbs, or upped to the 760 f.p.s velocity with the 50 grain bullet with 65 ft lbs energy and you can see what a hot little load this is.
Unfortunately this little firecracker has been discontinued. I think it was probably due to poor sales and information ads. I never knew about this pistol until a few months ago and I never saw it in any of the gun magazines I get or online. It may have also been all the BS about the .25 being less powerful than a .22LR that is just not true. The information they site for the .22LR for velocity & Muzzle Energy is usually comes from a .22 rifle barrel. When that same .22LR is fired from the 2.5 inch barrel like the .25 ACP, the .22LR comes up short of the .25 ACP. The .25 ACP also has the advantage of being a center fire cartridge giving far better reliability from misfires like the .22 rimfire ammo. The ammo was another problem being a proprietary round and from what I have heard was hard to find and now that has been discontinued. The only way to have ammo for this gun, if you own one, is to find or have a set of reloading dies made and neck down .32 brass. One might be able to neck .32 brass down by using the .25 resizing die to neck it like I did once when I was thinking about making a .25/32 by re barreling a .32 with a custom made barrel.
It was a shame that the .25NAA Guardian was discontinued before it had a chance to catch on. You can still find one for sale online every once and a while, but ammo is almost nonexistent unless you make it yourself. The price for a used .25NAA runs between $200.00 & $400.00 and up. I still might pick one up and see about getting a set of reloading dies made. But I'm afraid the dies will cost more than the gun.
BTY, I own and carry the little .25 Beretta every day. I live in AZ and most of the year people wear shorts, blue jeans or light clothing. That little Beretta fits in my denim jeans or shorts pocket and with a set of keys or something a git bulkier than the pistol, like a folded handkerchief at the bottom of the pocket with the pistol on top, no one notices you are carrying it. Even riding my bicycle no one sees the pistol in the pocket or it can be stowed in a fanny pack. I love that little Beretta, it has never failed me and I never leave home without it. But I've pocket carried & shot it so much it is showing quite a bit of wear now and needs some work and replacement grips. Beretta stopped making that .25 Jetfire & .25 Bobcat some years ago. There are others .25's still made but they are not as reliable as the Beretta.
But if you want a high powered .25 pistol, try to pick up one of the .25NAA Guardians.
I want to see a full size Beretta 92fs chambered in .25acp. Standard magazine will hold 55 rounds. :)
Funny. Ha ha ha.
Perfect
Make it full auto and a +50 grip extension
That would be awesome.
Not gonna lie, I'd totally want one... you could fit a quadruple stack 22lr magazine in the handle of the 92fs. Not sure how well that would feed though 😆
idk man. i watch a lot of forensic files and it seems like a .25acp is used in every other murder
It's a common caliber for Saturday night specials. A lot of people could get an old junker for $20 at a pawn shop and if it wasn't .32ACP it was likely .25
Earl Lee I got a flesh gun
@Earl Lee 'high numbers'.... big deal, so just shoot more 'often'.
.32 is the best mouse caliber hands down.
A gun is a gun. A 25ACP will kill your azz dead just like a larger caliper gun will. This is a close quarters gun. You put a few rounds in someone at close range and they are toast! This kind of reminds me of that movie "Get Shorty" when the one guy laughs at the other guys smaller gun and then gets shot dead by the smaller gun. I know it's just a movie but it does make a point. 😅😅>>>
ua-cam.com/video/O31rBYqYkuQ/v-deo.html
Actually owned the .25 beretta you just tested. Never used in in self defense, but it was good to know i had something in my back pocket if the situation called for it. My buddy that sold it to me said " 22 or 25 aint something, until its something busting at your nose." I carried it for a year until i saved up and got me a sig. So i mean it has its place in my heart.
To answer your question: No, the .25 ACP is NOT the worst self-defense cartridge. That dubious honor belongs to the 2.7mm Kolibri. Strong language will protect you better than that pea-shooter.
2wingo We are talking about self defence against humans, not little mouse, which the 2.7mm must have been designed for.
Wouldn't work on a mouse, either. The standard Kolibri cartridge produced muzzle energy of about 4 joules. By comparison, the average human being can punch with a force between 10 and 15 joules.
2wingo I killed a mouse before with an airsoft gun with 1 to 2 j of energy
If you can find one!
.22 short.
When I was an LEO I can recall two specific shootings involving a .25 ACP. The first one was at a nightclub, in the parking lot at 2:00 am closing (when most fights/shootings/stabbings occur at such establishments). Involved two women patrons. One had a .25 ACP and shot the other in the abdomen with it. Victim rushed to hospital by friends and did survive. Shooter arrested that night near the scene and pistol recovered in a car. It was a Jennings I believe.
The second incident involved a guy with felony warrants for agg sexual assault-child. He ran, evaded from us and ultimately sought refuge in the attic of a home. The attic being in the roof, with a ladder that folded down to gain access. Attempts were made to talk him down/out and he put a .25 ACP in his mouth and pulled the trigger. DRT (dead right there), one less warrant in the stack.
.22 rimfire short to .44 magnum....they'll all kill a human being pretty quick if the bullet hits the right spot, and they'll all not kill quick if the bullet hits the wrong spot.
I'm a firm believer in familiarity and training when it comes to firearms for self defense. Also believe in keeping it simple. That pistol should come out of the holster or pocket cleanly, be very easy to point instinctively and should be above all reliable.
Hey, I'm just impressed that the Jennings managed to shoot someone, and that someone was not its owner.
@@jshepard152 😜
What he said. Shot placement is the one ring to rule them all.
I think Wild Bill Hickok was killed with a .22 short.
Like the man said reliability, who wants a watch that dont keep time...
I been carrying my 25.acp for over 35 years, i put it in my pocket holster and no one even knows I'm carrying, most of assault happen at close range where the 25acp is effective with FMJ your looking for penetration not expansion like with hollow points, you get shot in the head at close range you are going down I don't care who you are, a 25acp is still a projectile period!
Thank you sir for your words
22 and 25 put many in the ground more than some people realize
I was an X-Ray Tech for 40 years. 30 of those years was at inner-city Level 1 trauma centers in St. Louis Mo and Richmond VA. My experience with X-Raying victims of shootings is that .22 and .25 calibers killed most of those victims.
Personally, I carry a S&W M&P 357Sig compact when possible and a Raven MP-25 always.
I remember there being an incident where a bodybuilder told his roommate (or something) to shoot him in the chest with his “teeny mouse gun” .25 acp pistol, because he figured it couldn’t possibly penetrate his large frame. It killed him on the spot. It happened around where I live, but I don’t remember the specifics. I’m sure there’s a news article somewhere. Anyways, alls I’m saying is even the tiniest guns we perceive as weak are still more than capable of ending a mans life.
Years ago working the grave yard shift at a factory here in Baltimore a guy brought one of those raven .25 autos to work and we took it outside and i shot one of those big empty 55gal steel drums 25-30 ft away,went thru one side and almost out the other,i was impressed.A very underestimated little gun.Bernard goetz used it as the subway vigilante in the 80s.
I doubt that
@@ViktoriousDead i believe it some UA-cam Copple had his wife shoot at him with a desert eagle blocking with 2 dictionarys of corse he died never underestimate peoples stupidity
@@davidcarter1013 ,NO,I was a CO where Bernard Getz was housed on Rikers Island.Getz used a S&W J frame chiefs 5 shot 38 spec 2 inch revolver he bought in NH
@@josephfemoyer7218 I stand corrected then,but i did read years ago that it was a .25,big difference in a .25 and a .38.
doesn't matter what caliber. if you can't hit the target, what's the purpose having a big gun. carry what you can handle and be safe.
Yeah, but that being said, mouse guns are fairly tricky to be accurate with. You have to really get a feel for how to hold it and aiming down a channel sight sucks.
@Gray Au, what exactly do you mean by "less deadly"? Do you mean it has less ability to kill or do you mean that it has historically killed fewer people?
19NSX Acura that’s a big “if”. it’s better to reduce the size of your “if” by increasing the size of your caliber.
@Common Sense Realist pretty cheesy line. I have been shot with a .25 it took 5 minutes before I realized I was shot. Hopefully your a better aim.
Is this person saying bigger guns are harder to shoot ? Cause that’s the opposite of reality
Hey Lucky Gunner, I dig your videos a lot but just a little piece of advice...take it or leave it. As an active duty marine, failure drills are nothing but second nature as I’ve done countless drills with my M16A4.
After the Marine Corps/US Government has used and tested different variants of failure drills (on real human beings in combat) they have seen that a failure drill to the HEAD is extremely ineffective. Mostly due to the extremely small margin of what we call the “T-Box” meaning the parts of the brain behind the eyes and nose. That essentially is the switch off button if shot because the cerebral cortex being directly behind it.
In comparison, they have rolled out a failure drill with 2 to the chest and 1 to the PELVIS. Shooting at the pelvis, especially with 5.56 out of an M16, has shown to have leaps and bounds more stopping power for multiple reasons.
1) A shot to the pelvic girdle is much larger and easier to execute in a high stress situation.
2) As the pelvis is being impacted by the rounds permanent and temporary cavities it will almost certainly shatter the pelvic bones and hips.
- this renders the assailant almost immediately immobile, and also you have a very good chance of severing the femoral artery which will make them bleed out very quickly.
Just a quick explanation and maybe you could even do a video about the differences and how the military has transitioned to the two the the chest one to the pelvis.
Thanks for reading whoever actually takes time to read this shit✌🏼✌🏼
Sorry reading this late, but isn't one of the differences the amount of energy, While yes .556 is considered weak by rifle standards, I don't think of any pistol cartridge under .357 as being able to shatter bones (reliably) . But to your point the brow on a human tends to be thick so? Plus the study he mentions all rifles and shotguns tend to be FAR more lethal - incapacitating . (Ironically .22 was the most lethal - highest kill ratio, it's just if you don't kill them with the first shot the 2nd 3rd.... ain't going to help.) and hey a red Ryder bb to the eye will ruin a bad guys day...
Thank you for your service 💯
Yut
did your government test lethal chemicals on you & are you ok with this
Don't think you'll have much probably with a slug or buck anywhere on the target. If it doesn't kill him. It'll knock him on his ass after hitting him multiple times quickly. If he's wearing armor. And you can take it from there.
Nobody volunteers to get shot by any of the so-called underpowered cartridges, and for good reason. no one wants to get shot . Period.
hot2warm haha...i offered my rent money to a weekend warrior who kept (for weeks) telling me my 25 was useless as a self defense gun...the money was put on the table and i told him that i would at least knock out a tooth or take an eye out at the 10 foot distance from my doorway to my work area. Needless to say,i paid my rent on time and he never brought up my choice of carry again.
hot2warm this is the point, often just having a gun, and gun, is enough to end an attack, most criminals are not looking for a challenge, they want easy targets and if they even suspect you might resist they will move on to a different target.
People, yes even criminals, tend to move away from gunfire as quickly as possible they don't think, oh it's only a X caliber, no big deal. Sure one if these might not stop a determined attacker, but I know bouncher from a bar in NJ who took six in the chest, at close range froma .38 before he grabbed the shooter and chocked him to death.
While I wouldn't rely on a .25 cal, I'm also 6'8" or so and can easily manage and conceal something much bigger, and no I wouldn't even suggest one to anyone else, but if push comes to shove, and in probably 99.9% of the cases, it's better to have an underpowered pistol than no pistol at all.
Also remember, ever barrel looks much larger when it's being pointed at you. 😄
hot2warm, that's what I do when people bash this "useless" cartridge. I say "Okay, you're such an expert. Tell me where you want to get hit by one."
Crickets can be heard chirping 2 states away. They logged off and left the chatroom.
I've fired a Beretta like this and the recoil is much harsher than you'd expect. Blazer brand ammo will easily burrow itself 0.25" into a fat log from 25 feet. Imagine what it does to human flesh from almost point blank range...
I wouldn't want to get shot by a pellet gun either, but that doesn't make it a good choice for trusting your life to.
I got shot in the knee with a .25 auto. It sucked, it didn’t cripple me or really even take me out of the fight. It still hurt and went all the way through my knee and out the side. It’s not a man stopper but it will hurt/kill you.
I remember, long long ago, a gun magazine's article about a roughly 1/4 scale 1928 Thompson submachine gun, chambered in .25 ACP, that was fully functioning.
now that would be something...
To most aggressors a gun is a gun and a gun that an average person can comfortably shoot is far superior to a more powerful one that the typical person has inadequate training with. You are spot on - context matters.
@no candy facts tho
John Browning was too smart to waste his time on an ineffective round or the firearm platform for it.
Everyone has an allergic reaction to high velocity lead in any caliber.
The one fact that many seem to forget is that regardless of the cartridge used. A large percentage of people who are shot will stop their aggression not because they are incapacitated, but because they don't want to be shot anymore.
Every caliber has it's own bodycount!
Kolibri
@@nodo7575 maybe a bird on accident.
@retro gaming time with joe Indeed, I saw a video of a dude shoot a 300 lb farm hog with a .177. One shot in the head and it died instantly. Modern pellet rifles are no joke. That’s a 300 pound animal with a thick skull.
Proof: ua-cam.com/video/1zLFLuV5pM0/v-deo.html&feature=share
Young people slang says bodycount is now how many people you've slept with, they interview random people on tik tok and ask, "So what's your bodycount?" and my first thought was anyone with an actual bodycount probably keeps that to themselves, no?
@@PaulGutierrez8605Kind of sad, right? The fact that they're keeping a 100% accurate count and also constantly looking to increase the number. I swear, kids these days have got nothing about them that's remotely interesting, so they try to one up their buddies in this really weird and rather concerning competition.
The thing is, I carried a Bodyguard 380 for 5 years before switching to a Kel Tec P32. I can shoot faster & more accurately with the .32 then the .380. And I think that's more important.
That’s what it’s all about really !! What you can shoot good with!!
Yeah my lcp 2 is possibly the worst little gun to shoot that I've experienced
@@Danstheman1357 I know, right? I was extremely disappointed and Ruger said it tested fine. I've adjusted grip pressure, shot the required number of rounds through the gun, everything, and it hands regularly enough I can't carry it for self defense. I like my Glock 43 a lot better. It's very reliable, clean or dirty and no break-in period. I'm building a p80 Glock 19 for my wife right now. I can't wait to try it out.
A hit with a 22 Short is better than a miss with a 50 BMG.
RGV shooter... for those that don't believe you if they watch the very first and second James Bond I can't remember exactly without watching the movie but I can almost guarantee you that the pistol he carries is a 32 Caliber not a 380 and not! A 9 mm I've seen all those early movies several times but not lately as a lot is going on in life and my memory but the pistol almost looks like a 7.65
A Raven P25 in the pocket is better than a glock on layaway.
The NRA Rifleman Mag picked the Raven as one of the two most important handguns ever. Cheap and reliable. Check it out. Not a lie .
I got pearl grips on my MP25
I miss my Raven. Have a rugar lcp 380 . The Raven felt more classy or classic.
Or, put another way, a .25 in the pocket is better than a .45 left at home.
No, it really isn't.
Never understimate .22 and .25
What if... They made a bodyguard with the nicer sights, but made it in 25acp double stack? So, like, a 10 plus one pocket carry. With no recoil. I think that would be a remarkable gun.
Smith and Wesson listened to you...the bodyguard 2.0 is awesome.
I love my 25. Throw it in my pocket and nobody knows it’s there.
Same w/my LCP .380, w/7rd mag. The 7rd. mag for this model gun, You can get good hand-hold on it. Makes a big difference.
I carry a backpack everywhere, so my EDC is a Full-sized Walther PPQ m2 .45 with a pair of mags.
However, between me and @LordOfNothingham
, which of us will have the gun accessible fast enough should we get mugged? A lot of good my 45 will do if I can't get to it.
@Dennis Young
I think so. Do you disagree? If so, why?
Lol same to me
Nobody knows it's there... where's my keys? BANG!
In the 70's a security guard at my college carried one. Wasn't supposed to be armed. But it was inner city Baltimore and he walked the campus at night. I'd ask him what does your gun want to be when it grows up !
Give the guy a break.
GYPSY KING FURY today up
My lady works in th O.R. She said small calibers are hard to patch up. The rounds bounce around and there is alot of "what if's" to worry about.
It's why a hitman may use .22LR, easy to deaden muzzle report and can quite reliably go through someone's head at point blank.
Great work, thanks.
We were fortunate enough to take a course with Col. Cooper, and he taught us the "Mozambique" drill - just like your failure drill. He said that it was developed for use against an enemy wearing body armor in -of course - Mozambique.
I have the Beretta in both the .22lr & .25acp, and have only tested the .25, for which I used to get the pre-fragmented Glaser round, against gallon water jugs. The jugs split completely down the side; my Beretta .380 did about the same, also with Glasers. Based on its small size, and the improbable-to-duplicate fact that it indexes perfectly in my hand every time I grab for it, I have the .25 in my pocket often; I stand with whoever said "the best gun&cartridge combination is the one you have right NOW".
Years ago I was a TV news camera man. One of the last stories I covered was a fatal shooting where the deceased was shot once in the head with a .25acp. Ask him if he thinks the caliber isn't able to defend yourself with. It is obviously not the best, but if you want one, or use one, it certainly CAN do the job, and has done the job for decades now for some people. /shrug
True it will kill you if you get hit in the head or if it happens to hit a major organ like your heart, but think practically. We all know accuracy goes out the window in high-stress situations, and if you manage to hit your target, it will most likely be a body shot. I would rather trust my life to a larger caliber that can incapacitate in 1-2 body shots the majority of the time than a .25 acp that fails over a third of time.
@@SirBilliam96 Read my answer to Greg. A 25ACP head shot gave a guy in my home town a head ache! And another answer where my 45LC 255gr LFN was barely enuf. LOL
You can kill someone with a ballpoint pen, or your bare hands. Stopping a violent attack, on the other hand...
@@SirBilliam96 so true. Thats why people who do carry the pocket pistol should train and train to do mag dumps to center mass with hp rounds. Give yourself as much of an edge as possible with them pistols. It was my first pistol. My 18th birthday my gramps handed me a Jetfire and a 12 gauge. Happy birthday.
He must have had a thin skull.
Lyn Thompson from cold steel did a video in which he talked about a buddy of his in south Africa, who Carries a 25acp. He claimed that he had been assaulted three times and all three times has killed the assailant
I used to carry a Raven 25 in an empty Marlboro pack as a hold out piece back in the day. Last resort but always better than nothing. Loaded Glazer blue tips in it. I wouldn't wanna take a round from it.
But .25 ACP guns are always so adorable!
Hang one from the car mirror.
They are so cute!
They are always TIGHT little pieces...
So you’re volunteering for a shot from one then 😂?
@@BeefNEggs057 'Fer sure, getting hit with any caliber slug is definitely gonna ruin somebody's day. Kinda like the famous Mike Tyson quote..."Everyone has a plan 'till they get punched in the mouth."
I can’t explain why, but this exquisite little weapon feels so good in the hand. Beretta designs the most stylish and ergonomically perfect handguns. While people argue endlessly about the merits or failings of this controversial caliber (.25 acp), what’s often overlooked is the added measure of security one feels holding a weapon that just feels right. I have both a pre-1968 950B Jetfire in .25 acp and a 950B Minx in .22 short. I absolutely love both these guns.
The worst self defense cartridge will always be the "no" cartridge, which is the one you have when you're not armed.
Other than that, I think it's interesting that even some years ago, the 380 ACP did so much better than the .25 and not much worse than some significantly bigger rounds. Of course, those 380s probably weren't shot out of a 2.5" barrel either. Good stuff.
Now add + p and some new fragmentation and penetration rounds and the .380 ACP is a viable "break contact" defense round.
Frank Hellman I found a box of some old Italian 380 military ball and chronoed them through a Beretta model 34. That 94gr bullet was going over 1100 FPS out of that old school service pistol. Back when 380 was considered a viable service cartridge it was a different animal than what we think of as 380 today
@@saviostrawn8737 - Awesome!
That is pretty cool! You should do a video on them.
@@saviostrawn8737 How old was it? It's not uncommon to see ammo actually get hotter after sitting around for 50 years. It could have been 950 fps stuff when it was made.
You don't need sights to shoot someone 2ft. From you😜🙈
this guy mounts scopes on his carry guns (yet he never carries so it's just as accurate)
Exactly what i was thinking
james wheat this guy mounted a scope on the hood of his car
bradford at any distance over 1 foot i use a scope and i mount the gun for accuracy
@@kennethconner90 this guy says a Vulcan 20mm gatling gun is not sufficient for self defense
People need to understand that the human body isn’t designed to be shot with a bullet. Shot placement is the key with any caliber, on that note any caliber can kill or incapacitate.
The .25 ACP performs the same as a .22 LR when they have the same barrel length. The .25 ACP is centerfire therefore it's a bit more reliable.
Frosty Fire this is the key here. If you calculate a 22lr mouse gun is adequate, carry a 25 to get the centerfire reliability
Hmm, never had a misfire in my 22.
The .22 Beretta I have is very picky. It won't reliably feed most brands of ammo I've tried. You must use very specific ones for it to work.
Maybe but a .22 magnum has much more power especially with hollow points
@@massmedia7158 I love me a rough rider .22, such a great plinking gun.
I have a 950 .25 and absolutely love it. It’s my go to summer gun for pocket carry/gym shorts. It’s not a gun I would want to engage someone with but back against the wall, it will get the job done (hopefully). I did open up the rear sight a bit with a Dremel and it made a good difference.
These little guns are meant to draw and empty into someone who accosts you then run like hell.
Stop asking the 25 ACP to do more than it was designed
to do.. If someone shoots several 25 ACP rounds into a bad guy's
chest, he will no longer be in the fight. Job Done!
5 rounds into the face is an infinitely better idea , but I see your point .
I'll stick with a 38 Snub and stay far away from crappy pocket autos .
Advice from the airsoft neighbor kid . ^
A friend's dad got a 25 unloaded into his gut.
He beat the crap out of the shooters, I think one even died.
@@QuantumMech_88
Robber held up my neighborhood video store, pre-redbox. The responding officer was shot just above one eye, didn't penetrate the skull 💀 and exited near his ear.
Cop's epic response:
"Did you just try to shoot me?"
Robber gave up upon discovery that the cop was bullet proof...at least to .25 he was carrying.
@@polymathicperturbations1476
Robber held up my neighborhood video store, pre-redbox. The responding officer was shot just above one eye, didn't penetrate the skull 💀 and exited near his ear.
Cop's epic response:
"Did you just try to shoot me?"
Robber gave up upon discovery that the cop was bullet proof...at least to .25 he was carrying.
If a company put some effort into a strong and reliable gun, and good modern ammo tech .25 would take off. If glock made a .25acp, everybody would buy it.
I wonder if federal could make a good HST in .25acp.
I would not buy it.
agreed
25 Magnum or 260 Rowland, modern pressures with an extra mm or two of case to keep from blowing up old guns.
For me it's not about the guns, it's about the ammo price-to-power ratio. Show me .25 ammo that can match 9mm in value, and I might consider it. Until then, no.
I know of 2 who died from a 22 gunshot. Short and LR. Another by 22 ratshot....and yet another by a tiny 1” pocket knife blade. I wouldn’t say the 25 ACP is the best defense cartridge, but it is well beyond lethal.
A girl I went to highschool with got drunk and put 1 of her dad's pistols in her mouth and pulled the trigger it was a 22 pistol loaded with rat shot....it was like 5 hours before they got her to the emergency room. But she lived.. she stopped comming to school but I actually ran into her many years later and she was doing well.. talked fine and no visible damage but omg what a horrific nightmare that must habe been
Man, I would be embarrassed from beyond the grave if .22 ratshot was what did me in.
@@Kadeo-ms6qw what happened there, the guy inherited a 22 revolver, knew absolutely nothing about guns. It was loaded with ratshot & all he knew was he wanted to kill himself over a woman. So BANG! roof of his mouth, in her driveway. Not exactly instantaneous. I think everyone should know their gun, calibers, ballistics, and most importantly, keep the business end out of their mouth.
I whole heartedly believe that's John moses browning could NOT design anything wrong. Also LOL@ thugasuraus
I do not want to run into the 14% of men who weren't incapacitated by a 45
The m2 was pretty garbage
Please show US All Just ONE of your patented weapons design(s). We will be waiting Einstein...….
@@GModBMXer That's some low-effort trolling, try harder! For the record, Browning did have designs that didn't work well but that's not one of them. Try the FN Trombone.
what's the price of
pocket defence nd
mathod to purchase.
narinderkohli71@gmail.com
8699402000.
From my experience in Vietnam. Most of my initial rounds fired were not intended to hit a target. They were suppression fire. It is hard to hit a target when you are throwing yourself into cover. You want to make the opponent dig for cover too. It doesn't make any difference what size of projectile you are sending downrange, as long as people are ducking. Once in a position to initiate/respond to the situation then aimed fire is important. I would always want the larger caliber, but a .22 or .25 is always better than a .00.
% incapacitated could also be effected by the less experienced shooter. As I imagine most people choosing to use a .22lr or .25ACP firearm will most likely be doing so for reasons related to recoil, size or cost of the gun. Whereas the majority of trained and capable shooters would not be included in that statistic of % not incapacitated.
25acp loads vary widely. Out of a short barrel some loads are weaker than 22lr and some loads are a bit more powerful than 22lr and with the hard jacket penetrate a lot better.
This is an area where I believe that the Leighigh Defense loads could work better than hollow points. The .32 caliber Cavitator will reach the FBI minimum penetration unlike the majority of .32 caliber hollow points. If Leighigh could get a .25 ACP round to reach the FBI minimum penetration standard, that would be better than the current crop of .25 ACP hollow points. The .25 ACP also performs better than .22LR in the "ignition" of the rounds. It is common for even a good quality rimfire to experience more frequent misfires than a centerfire/primer fired pistol.
Brasstard 7.62 I see the problem with 25 ACP is limited mag capacity of the pistol
There are many different 22lr types. The most powerful ones will outperform the most powerful .25ACP loads from a same length barrel.
did he ignore the fact that centerfire is vastly more reliable than rimfire:? If it doesn't go bang when it matters, it's useless.
I've been shooting .22 for years. I had jams but very few misfires.
@@1voiceofstl I got a shit box of federals one time. Every other round misfired. Other than that, I've only had misfires every couple thousand rounds.
This is the whole reason the .25 was invented by JMB. Mimic the ballistics of .22 LR, with centerfire reliability. That said, rimfire reliability, with high quality ammo, is far better now than it was 116 years ago.
@@VMEMotor5 .25 was made to burn off in the time the slug takes to exit the muzzle of a pistol barrel thus using all of its energy in propelling the round. whereas 22lr will still be burning afterword thus reducing it's effectiveness on non rifle length barrels.
@@misery13666 I should have said mimic the ballistics of .22LR in a short barrel.
Whaatt in my country we can’t even knife anyone in self defense. That round looks good enough
Here in Portugal we can only use. 25 all 60 %of gun deaths are. 25
You should move to New Hampshire for the Free State Project and escape tyranny. fsp.org
@@starrychloe NH here. No concealed carry permits needed, full open carry allowed, no bans on any knives or martial arts weapons.
You're in the wrong country.
@@thescatologistcopromancer3936 even brass knuckles? They're a good litmus test. It seems like if brass knuckles are legal that basically anything you can think of is legal.
I purchased my beretta 21a 25acp for my backup pocket carry. After 5 years it is usually my primary. I know I usually out gunned I figure if I shoot 9 bangs the bad guy normally would run by then
.25acp is not for getting into a conflict. It's a runaway gun. Mine has let me run away three times so far. Lot of people have tried to tell me how inferior it is to their 9mm, 45acp, .40 etc. Strange thing is, when I ask them where their favourite super caliber is they never seem to have it on them, always locked away in the safe. Even more strangely I also own the same calibers they do and those guns also seem to spend most of the time in the safe and probably for the same reasons. I've seen a lot of small women get suckered into buying 9mm which hurt their hands and got traded in for a .22 and I learned really quick when I had a spinal fusion done that for the the next 8 weeks the only firearm I could have used in an emergency was the .25acp. So the only caliber that counts for anything in self defence is the one in your hand.
I had a Baretta model 20 in .25. It was the fastest shooting semiautomatic I ever shot. A friend videoed my shooting this at our range.
I was able to have six casings in the air at the same time. During this time I was able to put all seven rounds in the middle of a tombstone target at 15 feet in just over one second.
It was like shooting a fully automatic. The trigger pull was extremely short and sharp.
Anyone who can take seven rounds to the center of mass in about a second can have my wallet :)
Is it as good as a 9mm? Of course not.
Is it worthless? I don't think so.
As others have written, a .25 with you is better than a 9 at home
Chris does some of the best videos of this type in the business. Well spoken, good editing, just awesome.
Thanks!
Having an understanding of lighting works wonders too. Love the videos.
derweibhai long winded
Agree.
My edc gun is either a 9 mm or a 40 cal. My backup is 25. Just like real estate----location, location, location. Shots or lots, where it's located is #1
I never saw anyone say "shoot me, that's a little bullet". I also haven't seen any bullet that won't kill someone when neatly placed between the eyes.
I personally love my often maligned Raven MP-25 "Saturday Night Special". It's surprisingly reliable, accurate at 7 yards, and super tiny. Only bad thing is that the safety on it is known to be a bit iffy as the safety only blocks the trigger with only a tiny little lug holding the striker back that could fail if bumped hard . So it's not the safest to carry with a round in the chamber especially in your pocket with the barrel potentially facing your junk. But aside from that it's a super fun little pistol to shoot and potentially useful as a carry gun if you have time to rack the slide.
If you don't have balls to stand in front a loaded .25 acp gun. It means that is a lethal caliber, period.
If you have the balls to stand in front of any fast-moving projectile, you might not be very bright.
I wouldn't want to be hit with a rock, but that doesn't mean I'm going to count on a rock to protect me from an armed assailant.
Being lethal doesn't mean it's effective at protecting yourself
A one inch blade to the throat can easily be lethal doesn't mean you can count on it
I was a paramedic for 30+ years and responded to multiply shooting. My "field" experience is this. It's not the caliber, it's the shot placement. I had PT's hit with 357's/'45"s + that walked away. On the other hand, there have been both suicides & intentional shootings that involved calibers less then 9MM/380 caliber I.E. .25" or less caliber that have produced fatalities. Every one of these was traced to shot placement. It is where you put the projectile that is important more so than the size of the projectile.
Last time I was this early my name was Chris Baker, also. Oh, wait.
Lmaooooo
I don't really care what people carry i personally carry a 9mm because thats what i'm comfortable with. But for anyone who mocks any hand caliber and claims it doesn't have "enough" power I ask them to perform one simple test, Take a round to the chest at the average distance of a civilian defensive shoot, then comeback and tell me your experience.
😂😂😂 smartest comment yet
Just because something can kill doesn't mean it is ideal. There are better cartridges for defense than a 22; however, if you only have a 22, then use a 22.
Another way to pose the question is would you rather take 1 45acp jhp to the center body mass or 3 22lrs?
@@hotsexyjesus4367 There's a reason why mass shooters use .22, it's effective and deadly.
@@hotsexyjesus4367 i think a big point people overlook is that the extra capacity in a panicked situation might count for more than people give it credit.
I think I could take a round of .22 short from a naa revolver. Not a rifle though.
I had a Baretta Jet Fire. 25, it was one of my favorite guns, it got stolen and I was unable to replace it. I really miss it, loved that gun.
I have a F.I.E. Titan. .25acp 400+ rounds not one failure I love it and you can get them for about $100 or less.
I can't imagine having to use this type of caliber at a distance that would require using the sights in the first place.
Use the sight anyway! As far as i know it looks better in court if you do because that "proves" that you intended to shoot and therefor fear for you life... ( Or however the warped mindes of US attorneys work).
@@RiderOftheNorth1968 Just lie lol they can't prove you weren't using the sights unless you shoot like an LA gangster
You wont need sights....just like a Seecamp.
One thing I've noticed in all articles about how lousy a .25 pistol is, "small, non-existance sights." May I ask, "Is anybody target shooting with such a weapon." John Browning designed it as a almost non-existance, very close range, self defense pistol. I've ground the sights off mine and practice drawing and firing at 6 feet, max.
i feel like etching sight lines into it (maybe literally an arrow down the middle?) would be most realistic. something to aim with that wont hang in a pocket
That's how it should be used. No sights, up close and personal
@@richardweilandt3315 That's how I trained as an L.E.O. Most encounters are said to be at about 3 to 4 yards, with no time to aim. (unless you are a modern American Cop, who stands off at about 30 yards; does a mag dump and misses )
The baby browning was designed to be a "rib-gun", meaning short distance defense within 7 yds. So, sights were no a major concern. Also note that this was the gun and caliber of choice for resistance fighters during ww2.
I met a french resistance fighter she showed me her baby browning. She told me she slept with 3 german officers and killed all 3 with that 25 I trusted the look in her eyes when she told that story.
I used to have a Colt Junior. It's fun to plink with, but .25ACP is so expensive...
JD, that's why I reload my .25 Auto ammo using cast lead bullets I make....far cheaper!
these videos never disappoint. The use of real world data isnt found in many videos. Awesome job
Honestly I'm a guy who just likes elastic waistbands and is never going to strap on a holster every time i go grocery shopping. A little Phoenix .25 is the only sort of gun I could see myself realistically throwing in my pocket every day.
Not sure why but I’ve held onto the 950 I bought in the 80’s. Might just be I think the tip-up barrel is just so cool.
I’ve seen a lot of The First 48 homicide show and Homicide Hunter Lt. Joe Kenda. I see a lot of dead people who got hit with a .25, just saying
I have a Phoenix Arms .25...I don't carry it anymore, but it used to be something i could put on my ankle and roll my jeans over. Never had any issues shooting it either. And at $125 i couldn't be mad at it.
my mentality is, if it's twice as ineffective ill just use twice the bullets
YEP,just empty the clip
I worked in security at a large Medical Center back in the early 70's,and can recall a couple "guests" in the morgue who gained entry with a 25 cal ticket,they would consider it more than adequate ,at the moment I have been carrying an LCRX 22mag with 3" using Hornady C.D. rounds nearly every time I carry ,for now I don't need the recoil of my 2 1/4 inch 357 I , normally enjoy shooting it (SP 101) but am in the middle of healing from the fusion of C1,and C2,a;so bolted to the skull, (done at the same Med Ctr I worked at for 8 months way back then)feel great doing fine,but a bit reluctant to subject things to that jolt for now,the pain that preceded the fusion I'm in no hurry to repeat ! (have the computer skip the space between in,and security,and you get a word sometimes accurate to the situation !glad I proof read !
I personally was asked this at a range while testing various guns and types of ammo for myself and several clients. I fired a really low quality ( must have been a Lorcin ) .25 cal , with fmj at a hard block of 4x4x4 pressure treated wood as a target. It went 3/4 through, from 50 feet. The 25 acp found more friends that day. The gun stopped working and was not worth looking for parts.
Great info 🇺🇸
Good to see you commenting! G-Thumb as well!
Mrgunsngear Channel indeed
100% of the people watching this video or that produced this video are alive regardless of their choice of carry gun or caliber. 9 rounds of .25 acp or anything else dumped into someone right away should give you the chance to continue to watch videos and argue about caliber for as long as we all want to do so.
In all the years of participating in the internet firearms community (going all the way back to the late 90's), I am aware of one particular incident where an active participant in the firearms internet world used a .25 Beretta. I believe the guy was a pawn shop store owner. I think I first read his account on the old rec.guns message board. He had other guns available about his shop, but for varying reasons none were available or loaded at the time of his attack other than a little Beretta Jetfire.
He had been hacked and stabbed with a sword believe it or not and the only gun he could get to was the little .25 in his pocket. The round ended the attackers actions right then and there and he lived to tell his story. thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39634
To me, that is the purpose of these little guns. They provide an unobtrusive way to keep a little gun on you no matter what. No sights needed, no fancy stoppage drills, just point and empty and then get ready to start ripping out eyeballs and fighting for your life. Just like what happens with every other caliber or handgun choice.
I had a Tanfoglio knock-off of the Jetfire for a while back around 1981. I loved that little pistol -- despite what you say about sights, I found it plenty accurate and (perhaps more importantly for under-pressure shooting with such a tiny gun and sights) I found it pointed very well for me (this will obviously vary depending on your hand size and grip preference). Honestly, the only thing I didn't like about the tiny pistol was the magazine catch on the heel of the grip (virtually every European designed small pistol has this).
Another really nice feature was that I could carry it in the same pocket with my wallet, and still sit down comfortably.
Like some other good guns I had around that time (XP-100 in .221 Fireball!), I stupidly traded it away at the local pawn shop, losing value on every trade. Wish I could afford one again; I love .25 ACP.
I think what it is being carried for matters as well. I sometimes carry a 25 acp in addition to my primary carry weapon. I do this because a situation may present itself where drawing my main carry would not be as inconspicuous as a pocket draw. Also, I would only choose this option if the attacker was right on top of me (at most 5 feet away).
If a bad guy is coming at you to do harm, and all you have is a 22lr rifle, then at that moment, the 22lr becomes the best cartridge in the world!
My grandpa on lethality of any cartridge " do you wanna get hit with it?" Then it's effective
It may be wrong but I subscribe to the believe that in a 1 on 1 self defense situation that nobody wants to be shot with any caliber. Self defense doesn’t necessarily mean lethal force, it means getting out of a bad situation. If you shoot someone who is not shooting back they probably aren’t going to stick around to get shot more. . . In theory.
NtheKnife318
No they're probably running to the nearest lawyer...
@@bw83m94 so they can sue you for shooting at them after they tried to either mug, rape, or stab you?
BW83 M unfortunately that’s probably true. “I was just trying to take this stuff that didn’t belong to me and they had the nerve to shoot me!”
@@TurdFergusson318 Almost all of those stories you hear are fake:
www.snopes.com/fact-check/stella-awards/
The only exception is when the defendant settles to avoid legal fees. American courts do not outright deny such lawsuits, lawyers happily charge the same arms and legs as always, and the law does not allow victims of such absurd suits to demand legal fees if they win unless they counter-sue someone who likely cannot pay them anyway.
That's a genuine need of reform, but only in the sense that our legal system is a money-go-round for lawyers.
Robin Bot What do any of those have to do with a self defense shooting or a small caliber pistol??
I’m with Jeff to some extent. However, in my experience, shot placement is more important than caliber. I would rather be missed with a 45 than hit with a 22. I would say that if you have your heart set on a super small pistol, get a 22. You can afford to practice more. If chances of a gunfight are slim, carry a pistol. Anything greater, bring a rifle.
Getting shot with a .25 acp would probably suck, and I doubt that anyone would ask for seconds.
I have witnessed a lot of people killed with a .25 back in the 70's and 80's.
Excellent video 👍
My great uncle whom was a police officer back in the 1970s was killed in the line of duty by a 14 year old armed with a Colt Junior .25 Auto. The FMJ bullets perforated his heart and lungs which inflicted lethal wounds, but he was still able to draw his revolver and fire towards the youth. He then collapsed and died at the scene before the next arriving officer arrived. Damn shame I never met him, I would've loved to have gone to the range with him and get to know him.
@Born Unloved
Nope, placement and bad luck.
Even a few with .22 shorts.
Dropped where they were standing, head shots .
Alot of drug dealers mob guys and pimps carried them small cheap easy to get rid of , just walk up to some one or pop one in the neck . Bad little guns .
I see the use of 25acp as a table gun and get off me back up gun. 3 yards or less is what's best. That my 2 cents.
@Mark W not "many" states only new Mexico. Some others make you specify what gun on your license but that's not a specific multiple gun restriction
@Mark W Yeah, that's not true at all.
Minnesota doesn't limit how many handguns you can carry with a permit to carry.
Um says check your local laws.
So which are these "many" states?
Worth noting that the Beretta, Browning, and other pocket handguns have mag-releases that are perfect for one or two-handed grips, if you're right-handed.
I'm kinda in the camp of smaller calibre, though I carry a 9mm.
My reasoning is, if I have to fire again, I can, and if I have to fight with my hands, at least I have the advantage of not leaking. If it comes to that, I mean the attacker continues to attack, It would, in theory be harder for a prosecutor to argue that you used excessive force after the guy went down.
That all being said, the smallest I would carry is a 9, and maybe a 380 if I had that option.
That Beretta was my first handgun, bought in the late 90’s. Wish I still had it
I've had a Beretta Jetfire for about 20 years! It's extremely accurate for what it is! More accurate than my Kel Tec p3at that's for sure!
The .25 auto has a place. I am certain you would not want one pressed into your belly at close range.
As a trauma surgeon, your premise that the 25 ACP is not deadly, is very wrong.
If you want a small gun--and there are many valid reasons for wanting such--a fine choice, in my opinion, is the Kel Tec P32 with the ten-round extended magazine. Very light, flat, fits unobtrusively inside virtually any pocket and inexpensive as well! I have carried and shot it for over twenty years. As for reliability, I have never once had a single problem, not one, and that's with several absolutely stock guns. None of that "fluff and buff" stuff, though if you want to do that I have no objection.
The reason I recommend the ten-round extended magazine is not for the added ammo capacity, though that is a not unwelcome benefit, but for the strong, secure grip on the weapon the extra grip length affords. Without that extra inch or so of grip length the gun sits atop one's fist in a somewhat wobbly manner. If used for protection it may well be in a physical struggle, especially if used by a woman defending herself against a male attacker. A solid, secure grip on the firearm greatly increases her chance of prevailing in that situation. The gun as originally designed works just fine, no problem there. But the first time you pick up one with the ten-round magazine inserted, you will immediately understand what I am talking about, and you'll never look back.
Paul
The smaller and slower your rounds get, the more shot placement becomes a major issue.
Back in my LEO days we had 3 folks DRT from a hit in the noggin with a .25 acp. I mean one shot, down and out immediately. Two were contact or close contact, but one was intermediate range (think half-way across a room) through facial bones and out the back of the skull. The only other .25 acp shooting we had was one that hit an officer's vest (did a lot of crazy stuff then, and wound up going under his vest at the seam, but was pretty spent by then so he was back at work in a few days. Sure, little bitty, low powered cartridges don't have the best success rates, but I can tell stories of much larger cartridges (.38 +p, and even 12 ga 00B) even from contact shots not fully doing the job, either. My takeway was that ANY properly manufactured, reliable firearm an proper ammo beats no gun and ALL self-defense rounds CAN be effective but NONE are always effective. There are "Better" choices now days, sure, with a few caveats, but the .25 out of a properly speced gun (i.e. one not made as cheaply as possible and/or with a corroded bore) shooting quality ammo (agreed that FMJs are usually best) is still a viable defensive round. Excellent video.
It happens, but I wouldn't bet on it.
I take my family shooting all the time. Out of all the different calibers we shoot, the 73' Star Starlet 25acp is the favorite hands down. The wife and kids all say it is easier to follow up accurately with another shot, and their targets don't lie. This pistol seems more accurate when you don't use the sights. Shooting and training with Mozambique Style,(triple tap...two in the chest to open them up, and one in the bucket for grand finale), this small caliber is pretty much guaranteed to stop anyone. Plus 1k+ rounds fired through it, no failures. Plus, extremely concealable. In my opinion, an excellent weapon for what it's intended purpose is. My Dad handed it down to me, it was his carry. My Dad used it during a robbery. Dropped behind the counter and sprayed rounds all over the store, the perp ran back to his car at the gas pump about 35 yards from the counter, and Dad put one in his left butt cheek. The guy got away but got arrested at the hospital with gang green in his ass. Cops chewed my Dad out for not killing the guy, but my Dad had the last laugh.
Any gun is better then no gun. :) done argument settled.
The 1968 gun control act is what really killed the .25 & .32 auto's, not public opinion or so called youtube experts. With the act of '68 it stopped the import of very small handguns, therefore the only small pocket guns that were allowed were ones made domestically such as Raven or Jennings and those guns were of questionable quality which led many of the next generation associating .25 & .32 with cheap guns. Prior to the gun control act, .22 cal & .25/.32 auto were extremely popular carry calibers. @ 2:30, no you're wrong. It is not a failing of the design. I own a Beretta mod 950 and I can draw, cock the hammer back with the thumb of my strong hand as I'm bringing the pistol up on target & fire just as quickly as drawing out & firing a double action revolver or striker fired poly pistol. It takes practice.
you are largely correct. as far as the .32 acp people here in the USA have .380itis. The .32acp WILL tumble in flesh! it is FAR more effective than many realize. but yeah GCA 68 killed the "pocket pistols".
Re; GCA 68, yet I'll bet many politicians carry " mouse " guns, the iron & the irony ?