Thanks Les, I appreciate the comment. I have a little fun sometimes with the videos, but for the most part I like to explain what's happening as its being done.
Thank you Drew for the vote of confidence. Most of the time a good percentage of logic and a few tools solve most problems. Of course some problems are tougher than others. Thank you for taking the time to comment as well as for watching.
Hands down one of the best diy videos on UA-cam for a job that most folks wouldn’t even attempt otherwise. I’m a first time small engine diy’r and you just made this seem simple. Thank you sir!!!
Thanks, I appreciate the kind words for sure. It's not the easiest thing to do, but so far it's been doing great !! There's no way those guides are ever going to move now. Saved the cost of a set of heads too, because I think that's what the dealers suggest.
Thanks for the very nice comment. I work on larger tractors much more than the small ones, but I do work on 'em when the opportunity comes along. I've got several more vids on mowers in the lineup waiting for editing.
Like I always told my boy....If its broke, go ahead and take it apart. The worst thing you can do is fix it by accident !! LOL He's a pretty good shade tree mechanic himself now !!
You sir are a valuable asset to us folks that work on small engines. I subbed after watching this one video, because I learned a few things and I know you and your channel is going to be very helpful to me.
Thank you for the kind reply. I don't get to work on the small guys too often, mostly old farm tractors and the occasional motorcycle or four wheeler, a fair share of sheet metal and some decent welding projects but I hope though that you find some things of interest here. Feel free to comment any time !! Have a wonderful day (-:
On one hand, I'm sorry it wasn't just a sheared key. On the other, I'm glad the issue was more serious because I learned about 10 new things by watching. Love this style. Keep up the good work!
I was shocked to see a perfect key. I would have bet ten bucks that was it. I get the chance ever so often to get into a small engine so its really not my forte. Usually its the little larger old farm tractors that get my attention. Like right now the skidsteer has a fuel related issue that's being addressed. Thanks cowpen for the cool comment !!
You are a FANTASTIC teacher! Current trying to diagnose a low compression issue on my 18hp briggs vangard on my Ferris walk behind. Machine doesn’t have an hour meter, but it’s in fantastic condition and seems like low hours. Have 90psi in one cylinder and 60psi in the other. It runs but under powered, especially under load with blades engaged. Intake had a bunch of oil in it. Not burning any oil 🤷♂️. Valves were out of adjustment, but after adjusting, we still have low compression… hmmm 🤔
Cylinder wear..?? or maybe rings. Valve guide wear..? That'd be my first guess without having it here in the shop. No leaking head or base gasket...? Thanks for the very kind comment Brad. And thank you for watching.
As a kid, I worked with an old uncle that on many occasions had to make a specific tool to work on a piece of broken machinery. Not always the best looking and sometimes crude, but most of the time it would work. Thanks Eric for watching and commenting.
Wouldn’t you know I’m in the middle of this job and don’t have a springer compressor that fits🤣 good ol tractorman saves the day with the wrench hack👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Well heck, I hope it worked well for you. Gotta be careful though on these small studs. It's easy to bend or snap one off. Thanks Doug for the cool comment !!
I gave up the needlenose for that duty years ago !! It's telescoping magnets all the way for me. LOL Yes, I use magnetic trays to hold tons of items during a job and most of the time on bit engine the whole pile of keepers are kept on one magnet in a big wad.
@@tractorman4461 Have you ever drilled a hole and used a set screw to hold the valve guide? I'm thinking of trying that. Maybe I really need to get a new head instead. Its a B&S 40777-019-E1 wherever look its says not available.
@@rickhubner I’m not sure there’s enough meat on the surface to sustain the set screw. In other words it’s not thick enough plus the intense heat and vibration would be a tough environment for that too. Some guys just peen the perimeter of the bore around the guide with a crisp ground center punch. But they admit that too is short term.
Great video, a very easy way to repair a valve guide that has moved is to just remove the spring take a punch and tap it back in place then take a pointed punch and make indentions around the valve guide in the aluminum surrounding the guide this will create pinch pressure around the guide keeping it place, it works great has i have performed this repair many times.
I considered that as an option Tim, but went ahead with this instead. So far so good too. I don't work on them professionally or for pay, so I'm not too concerned about the extra time doing this takes. Next one that comes in though, I will take your advice and give it a shot.
I had an intek engine with bent push rods. I ended up buying a new cylinder head for around 200 dollars installed it, set the valve clearance at .005 and now the engine runs great. I wasn't ready to follow the procedure you used because I don't have the skills or tools. Mower and engine now run great. I do plan removing the shroud next spring before mowing to clean the area around the cylinder head to prevent overheating. Seems like mice like to make nests in that area which cause overheating.
I do believe that route is the recommended one by the manufacturer. I think the key is keeping it blown clear to minimize the overheating in that area at the center of the V. Steel and aluminum expand at different rates....so its easy to see how the heat causes the guides to give way. Thanks for the comment Byron. I appreciate the time you took to watch. I kinda think its mostly the grass clippings instead of mice nests....but I can see either being the source of the problem.
After dinner I fell into dreamland only to awaken to a 44Vid! It had to be the Tractor Faeries With the help of the JO Faeries! A fine vid indeed! Magical it was coming to and seeing my 44 Friend Wendell before me eyes! So I Thank You Kindly for this surprise, good medicine. I can’t believe today marks the fourth week since I went under the Axe, amazing! Doc says I’m healing up good and all is well thus far. All that 44 cup raising has helped and another Thanks for that. My best to all at 44 Ranch with manyBlessings and as always, take it easy cuz ya know how ya are! DaveyJO
I am glad to hear you are well on the path of mending DaveyJO !! You'll be back in your shop in no time at all. Besides, everybody needs a rest on occasion. Tippin' and sippin' another cuppaJO in honor of Nurse Alice and her number one patient.
Well Bryan, its a poor boys repair, probably not sanctioned by the manufacturers, but at least it works. They want to sell a new head instead. Glad to see you enjoyed the video.
I'm sure there are much better ways to do this, but on this particular mower, being a bit old, I didn't want to spend big money on new heads or fancy machining. I think this will work for as long as this engine wants to run. I thought of peening the head around the guides to put more pressure on them then decided against it.
Great video I like the use of the old wrench for a valve spring tool every one’s always asking why I don’t get rid of the extra tools I’ve got lying around and that is why never know when you need to make or modify some too to the job your doing. Poor boy fix will last just as long as spending money on the project at hand my kind of video right here I watch all you put on here
Yeah, you're a guy like me...I try to throw NOTHING away until I am totally sure it has little or no value. LOL. Nothing wrong with that approach either. Thanks Timothy for the comment....and thanks for watching all the silly stuff I do just to get by without spending a ton of money.
Bonjour mon ami, you have written a great detail into your video description ! Yep that is in deed a bent exhaust push rod !!! You have a great choices about valves ; ) Great way to show us on how to make a tool ! Great trick on welding using copper tube ! It's alive !!! OUTSTANDING JOB mon ami Cheers !!!
Aw heck Jeffrey....I just figure if something is already broke, you probably can't hurt it so why not tear into it and you may just fix it by accident !! That's my story and I'm sticking to it.... Thank you for the very kind comment !!
Some guys will peen the head around the guide openings, but that seems to be only temporary. This, though unsanctioned by the manufacturer seems to be fairly permanent. A tiny TIG spot would be ideal, but a few blobs with a MIG is ok too. The copper may melt just a bit into the weld, but it is easily filed away.
Very cool fix. They didn't mention that one at Briggs and Stratton school when I went!! Maybe they forgot? 😊😊😊I've got a V-twin Briggs laying around that I was planning on using on a project. I think I'll check the guides before I use it now. Thanks for the tip. 👍👍👍
The horizontal twins are real bad for it when the clippings get impacted in the fins towards the center of the "V". Longer run times while in the overheated condition contributes to the movement of the valve guides....usually on the exhaust valves. The best remedy is to use a long nose air gun to thoroughly blow it clean as possible after every cutting. Good luck with yours.
This is a rare video my craftsman is a 25 hp love the mower. Been great for about 7 years it is used. Got a hunk of wood stuck in the deck, stopped it cold tore the electric relay to spin the cuttin blades spun off wrom the force. Think it saved my rods it still ran great after all this time i am replacing all that need it.
Wow !! Lucky you didn't really sustain any damage. Btw, the push rods are all the same size but if you get a set, you'll get two aluminum rods for the intake and two steel rods for the exhaust.
@@tractorman4461 thanks I have been taking all the info in. And getting parts now while I still can. She's running great. Would start hard till a vid said they set the choke wrong from the factory. Now after adjusting after 7 years it starts immediately.
Unfortunately I had to edit out a lot of the specific details to try to get it short as possible. Like the actual welding of the guides and grinding the welds and the specific steps to setting the Magnetron gap and also valve adjusting. It looks simple, but it takes a little longer to get them perfect. Thanks Jan for stopping in for a visit my friend.
I learned 10 years ago to tack in port exhaust guide There’s the best fix and I’ve done 75/100 with no come backs Just stick rod to it for less than second
Heck yeah welding it works good, but I bet that factory service recommends a new head for a fix !! I don't have a tender enough touch to hit it with a rod...that's why I used the mig and the copper wrap. Thanks Phillip for the added input concerning the repair.
Thank you very mucho for taking the time and show us this value information , the only thing is missing is parts number 🤔🤔 if you can be so kind and tell us we’ll really appreciate it thank you again for the help 👍💪🏻
The only thing I really had to purchase were the push rods and they were about $10.00 each. I don't think I recorded the part numbers, but I may have one of the bags still on the workbench. If so, I can add it here later.
TM44, yeah this is common on a lot of vtwins especially B&S. Hopefully your weld solves the issue. The way I fix these is measure down from top of guide to spring seat on guide that has not moved and record measurement. Drive out guide, place in lathe, spin .030-.040” deep ring @ .025” lower than spring seat height. Reinstall in head to recorded depth, then stake aluminum around guide into cut groove of valve guide. This solves problem of valve guide moving either way.
Whew..!! That sounds like a superb repair and not a shade tree job like I did Garny !! I think your technique will be the way I go on the next one. If I worked on these a lot more, I am sure I would pick up a lot of additional tricks. Thanks for giving a superb explanation for a much more reliable repair.
Valve guide repair went exactly as I imagined. There needs to be a flange or something that won't allow the guide to move. I'm piecing together an Atlas 12x54 lathe that may help make or repair parts.
The problem with the heads is the differing rates of expansion between the steel guides and the aluminum heads. This problem ensures parts sales for the manufacturer. I'm sure their suggestion is to replace the entire head. Good luck with your Atlas. I have a Jet 14 x 42 and an old Chicopee metal lathe from turn of the century.
Good Morning Bobby. This machine was headed to the junkyard when an old buddy gave it to me. He'd already given away two old Wheel Horses so I just got the 'leftovers'...LOL. Thanks for watching and sharing.
It's kind of a poor boys repair. I'm sure the dealer would recommend a head replacement. Sometimes peening around the aluminum opening will hold 'em in place for a while, but this will hold 'em for the rest of the life of the engine.
Thank you. I'm pretty sure the manufacturer would probably recommend replacing the head. But that'd be crazy without doing anything you can think of to make it work reliably. Thanks for watching and commenting.
Great video, How far did you drive the guide back in ? Did it stick up a little at your weld bead. I dont think it would be an issue if it did since the valve only rides the guide and is stopped by the valve seat. I have a Intek 25hp torn down and ready for this step. Thank you for this video!
I slipped the copper tube to just shy of the end of the guide to allow the smallest of a bead. It does not protrude more the a 32nd further than it did originally. Some guys peen the aluminum around the slipping guide but that is always a temporary fix as the aluminum eventually lets it slip again. Its the different expansion rate of the steel vs aluminum that eventually gets it to loosen. Don't worry about making a pretty bead unless you have a TIG and are really good. I just blobbed MIG on it and ground it down a little...but the copper is what gives it a sharp edge to the bead to rest against the aluminum surface. Just peel the copper off and it leaves the sharp edge. It may melt a bit of the copper into the bead, but its no biggie. Make sense..?? Good luck.
EXCELLENT VIDEO. thanks for posting. How far in should the valve guides be to be considered correctly installed? Mine drifted out towards the rocker arms.
If you look back at the video around 1145 you'll see the amount I leave out for the tiny weld bead. The rest is pressed into the passage. The reason for the copper is to give a defined edge to press against the machined surface. Some of the copper will melt along with the weld, so you may have to use a crisp file to trim it back a little.
Yeah...the Missus would give me a bit of grief to pull out here apple pie to stuff an old head in the oven.....but that would work just fine as you indicate. Thanks Phillip for stopping in today.ll
Dear Sir, Your very knowledgeable. I recently replaced all my push rods on my Briggs and Stratton and had the adjusted properly and my oil pan gasket replaced. so when I tried to start it no start. I had fire in both plugs so I evenly took the valve covers back off and the spark plugs back out to double check the valve clearance so when I went to get it on top dead center of the exhaust stroke to my surprise neither side of the pushrods or rocker arms were moving. Can you tell me why please sir I would be grateful to any advise you may have at this point. Yours truely,Donald
I don't know if you have a neoprene drive gear on the cam or not, but it sounds like the camshaft isn't turning with the crankshaft. The cams rotation, as you know, is what pushes on the push rods. The push rods are all the same length, and the exhaust ones are the two steel ones, but they will interchange with the aluminum intake ones. That will have no effect on what you describe. Btw, I'm assuming you're talking about a horizontal V-twin.
Yeah, my old buddy (he turns 90 this sunday) had fiddled with this mower an hour or two here and there since '016 and gave up. He asked me to just get rid of it !! He bought a new Husky in '017. I was out there working on his old front distributor 8n for him and he unloaded this and a few other old items he wanted gone. But...dang it, he'd already given away two old Wheel Horse riders. Missed 'em by a hair. LOL Boy o boy, he is happy to get his 'Old Henry' out on sunny days to clear the pasture little by little with the bush hog !!
There's many ways to make the repair but most are probably not recommended by the manufacturer. Some guys use a punch and peen the head around the guide to smash it in a bit tighter, but that is almost always temporary. Some guys knurl the guides in a metal lathe, which is better, but much harder to do unless you are a machinist. Then there's guys like me. LOL Crude, but that thing is NOT coming out again !!
@@tractorman4461 I'm a machinist by trade I found valve guide that are .0003 larger so it be a press fit all I gotta do is take them to work press old ones out put new in
@@michaelparker5814 those should work. I might've done that if I had access to them. I pressed these out and back in with my old shop press here. Worked pretty slick. I wouldn't make a scab on a real machinists rear end, but I do have a lot of the shop tools that I love to play with when needed. My one horizontal mill is a Kerney and Trecker from around 1909 or so. I also have a 120 year old (+ -) Ames metal lathe from Chicopee Massachusetts. Plus some other old stuff too.
I don't consider myself a real machinest yet I've only been doing it for 6 years we just make a lot of heads so I can know the common sized valve guilds but I plan on putting green loctite when I press them in @@tractorman4461
@@michaelparker5814 Well Michael, I GUARANTEE you are much more of a machinist than I. LOL I do grind my own valves and valve seats, but I haven't been brave enough yet to cut new seats in...but I may sooner or later.
That's cool. I don't think it is a repair that is sanctioned by the factory though. But they are in business to sell parts and we just want to make a repair that will work for a long time. Thanks Ross for the input.
I hope it worked. The damage on mine shows that the valve struck it hard so I don't know if it'll work in the long run without breaking a valve head off. It might work though. Oh, and those roto-tiller tires are on backwards. They're supposed to be the opposite of a tractor since you want the traction to resist the tiller being pushed forward by the tines.
This one has held in place so far at least. But I'm sure there's no way its going to move now. I've never thought of the direction of the ag tread on the tiller being reversed. It was a freebie with a bad motor. I re-powered it with a Predator, but I no longer have reverse.
Dumb question ,I welded valve guide on number one cylinder exhaust ,ready to put new push rods in .Should I leave sump cover off to put push rods in so I can see that the cam is at it's base circle for the push rod I am installing ? I know that TDC is where you adjust valves but how do you determine if you are at TDC Compression Stroke or TDC Exhaust ? Or does it not matter?
I usually leave as much disassembled as possible during reassembly. The more you can see, the less mistakes you make. Compression stroke will be TDC with both valves in the closed position. At that point both valve tips should have the specified 'cold' clearance to the push rods. Hope that helps. Sorry I missed your comment earlier.
I have a Craftsman with the same motor. I ended up taking the heads off and peening the valve guides so they wouldn't slide out. I did that a few years ago but now I think the rings are getting a little weak as when revving up she'll blow a little smoke out. Either that or the valve seals are just getting worn to the point they're letting in oil. Thanks for the info Tractorman44.
Yeah, its one or the other. May as well do both at the same time. Peening is ok but its usually considered a temporary fix. If the fins in the block are impacted with debris for long periods of time, the heat is much more intense and that effects the guides/aluminum head because of the different rates of expansion and contraction between the two metals.
Sir, I am having a heck of a time finding the correct product code number for these push-rods. Any assistance would be very welcome. I have an 18HP Vanguard twin engine however, and my rods seem smaller than those shown here. The Briggs website has not been helpful. My model is a 356447 - 0164 - e1. if that helps. Thanks in advance.
Aw shoot....I tossed the package. My buddy has a Cub dealership in town, so I'm used to just walking in and telling him what I need and it just appears. I probably should record the part numbers because he's not going to be around forever. But I bet if you check Amazon with your engine number you can find them. You can use two steel ones too btw. The aluminum one is identical except for material. It's crazy but it seems like those are the first ones to bend.
I have the same problem but one of my steel exhaust rods fell into the engine. Do I have to pull the engine and retrieve it or is there any chance it will just behave and sit in the bottom of the crankcase? Scag Tiger Cub, same engine. Thanks in advance
You will run the chance of cracking the crankcase if it were to become lodged between rotating mass and the side or bottom. Being as its the steel ones, I'd try ferreting it out with a flexible rare earth magnet. At least I'd give it one heck of a try. I've had plenty push rods bend and pop off, but never one to drop all the way into the cavity that I can remember anyway.
Keep it clean! It’s not just the fins on the head! Pay attention to the casting around the exhaust valve, oil with dirt makes multiple layers from the valve cover leaking. This causes insulation and the area directly at the surrounding casting of the exhaust guide cannot cool, only get hotter and hotter. Pay attention to the carb also, if it’s to lean that means more combustion heat. All these mowers these days are running so lean by EPA standards that they are asking to self destruct.
I think I touched on the heat being the issue when its allowed to get accumulated at the base of the fins etc. I just didn't go as detailed as your comment. But you made very good points, for sure.
That's not good. As long as the guides stay in place, you should be ok though. The intakes are aluminum and the exhausts are steel, but they are both too small of a diameter as far as I am concerned. But, that's just me. My valve stems mic'd perfect and they were clean as a pin, no nastiness inside at all. Even the cylinders were spic and span. Still showing the hone marks.
The torque spec varies from one to another. I have to refer to the manual but generally those small rocker arm bolts are in the vicinity of 20-25ft/lb if I remember right. If no manual is available, you can get by with torquing to the average spec for the diameter of the bolt/stud used. I wouldn't trust my memory though Gary. I'd try to find the spec on line or a Briggs small engine forum.
Im a small engine tech and i have a commercial ferris that had the exhaust valve come out. So u basically tacked a spot on the guide, grinded it just enough to leave a slight hump and then just drove it in? Does that work and won't it crack the head?
Basically that is what I did, but only on the actual END of the guide. I slipped the guide inside a piece of copper tubing exposing the small part I wanted to put the bead on. Even though the heat may melt a bit of the copper, it is easy to peel off and leaves a perfect circle around the guide that needs very little to clean up. It doesn't crack the head because the diameter of the guide that presses into the head is not changed. So far it has worked fine. I was thinking of knurling the guide on the lathe and pressing it back it but I couldn't figure out how to hold it in the chuck. I thought about peening the head around the guide bore with a sharp center punch but figured that would be temporary for sure. The small bead of weld cannot sip through the guide bore and so far has worked perfectly. The last option was to buy another new or used head. I'm sure this is NOT recommended by any manufacturer, but then, they want to sell parts.
Well, it is a poor boy's repair. But its cheaper than buying a new head. And on a positive note, it is still working fine today. I'm sure there are more acceptable techniques though.
Yeah, I think I mentioned that in the video. But sometimes the ol' arthritis makes it uncomfortable to do as a fella gets a few years on him. LOL I did a LOT of things back in the day that makes me hesitate today. Thanks Jeff for chiming in and have a great day !! Thanks for watching.
That caught me off guard Joe. LOL That's some funny stuff there. Hahahahaha. Thanks for watching and bringing out the first chuckle of the morning. Btw, the old Briggs is still humping along just fine too !!
That's an option for sure and others just peen the area around the guide and others just buy a new head. Thanks for the input and yes, knurling is probably the best repair.
Thank you David for the very kind words. I don't get to work on these too often but I do enjoy getting into them. I hope you have found other things of interest here as well.
You are correct, that's a non-disputable fact. But I can't tell you how many comments I get on various videos that love to see the various tools used to do the same job but on different applications. Some people are visual learners and need to only SEE what's happening and others need the verbal interpretation of the work to benefit more thoroughly off of a video. I personally watch videos with my right finger on the FF button to get through the parts I feel are non-pertinent. I really don't advertise my videos as 'how to' videos anyway. They are 'how I do' videos, and sometimes I go to LA via Omaha to solve the problem.
You are an excellent teacher. No silly stand-up comedy. Your down-to-earth explanations are appreciated.
Thank you
Thanks Les, I appreciate the comment. I have a little fun sometimes with the videos, but for the most part I like to explain what's happening as its being done.
That was awesome. When guys like this speak, anyone with a half a brain knows to just listen and take in as much information as you can.
Thank you Drew for the vote of confidence. Most of the time a good percentage of logic and a few tools solve most problems. Of course some problems are tougher than others. Thank you for taking the time to comment as well as for watching.
Amen
Best understanding video I have seen on UA-cam about lawn maintenance
Thanks man....by your username, can I assume you watch my tictok videos...?? If so thank you for watching them as well as these over here.
Hands down one of the best diy videos on UA-cam for a job that most folks wouldn’t even attempt otherwise. I’m a first time small engine diy’r and you just made this seem simple. Thank you sir!!!
Thanks, I appreciate the kind words for sure. It's not the easiest thing to do, but so far it's been doing great !! There's no way those guides are ever going to move now. Saved the cost of a set of heads too, because I think that's what the dealers suggest.
Man you need to be teaching classes somewhere. I am glad to have found your channel.
Thanks for the very nice comment. I work on larger tractors much more than the small ones, but I do work on 'em when the opportunity comes along. I've got several more vids on mowers in the lineup waiting for editing.
And yet another piece of equipment saved instead of heading to the junk pile! Enjoyed watching.
Like I always told my boy....If its broke, go ahead and take it apart. The worst thing you can do is fix it by accident !! LOL He's a pretty good shade tree mechanic himself now !!
You sir are a valuable asset to us folks that work on small engines. I subbed after watching this one video, because I learned a few things and I know you and your channel is going to be very helpful to me.
Thank you for the kind reply. I don't get to work on the small guys too often, mostly old farm tractors and the occasional motorcycle or four wheeler, a fair share of sheet metal and some decent welding projects but I hope though that you find some things of interest here. Feel free to comment any time !! Have a wonderful day (-:
On one hand, I'm sorry it wasn't just a sheared key. On the other, I'm glad the issue was more serious because I learned about 10 new things by watching. Love this style. Keep up the good work!
I was shocked to see a perfect key. I would have bet ten bucks that was it. I get the chance ever so often to get into a small engine so its really not my forte. Usually its the little larger old farm tractors that get my attention. Like right now the skidsteer has a fuel related issue that's being addressed. Thanks cowpen for the cool comment !!
You are a FANTASTIC teacher! Current trying to diagnose a low compression issue on my 18hp briggs vangard on my Ferris walk behind. Machine doesn’t have an hour meter, but it’s in fantastic condition and seems like low hours. Have 90psi in one cylinder and 60psi in the other. It runs but under powered, especially under load with blades engaged. Intake had a bunch of oil in it. Not burning any oil 🤷♂️. Valves were out of adjustment, but after adjusting, we still have low compression… hmmm 🤔
Cylinder wear..?? or maybe rings. Valve guide wear..? That'd be my first guess without having it here in the shop. No leaking head or base gasket...? Thanks for the very kind comment Brad. And thank you for watching.
Wendell, you're a man of knowledge. Great job.
Well Mike, I'm just too cheap to pay somebody else.... LOL. Thank you for the complimentary comment.
@@tractorman4461 Simply Amazing.....
Nothing like fixing stuff when you use the tools you have on hand, or make, good job there Sir!!!
As a kid, I worked with an old uncle that on many occasions had to make a specific tool to work on a piece of broken machinery. Not always the best looking and sometimes crude, but most of the time it would work. Thanks Eric for watching and commenting.
Wouldn’t you know I’m in the middle of this job and don’t have a springer compressor that fits🤣 good ol tractorman saves the day with the wrench hack👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Well heck, I hope it worked well for you. Gotta be careful though on these small studs. It's easy to bend or snap one off. Thanks Doug for the cool comment !!
@@tractorman4461 worked very well, I made a post about it👍🏻
The magnet was a great little trick - it also helped me keep track of the keepers while I was tinlering !
I gave up the needlenose for that duty years ago !! It's telescoping magnets all the way for me. LOL Yes, I use magnetic trays to hold tons of items during a job and most of the time on bit engine the whole pile of keepers are kept on one magnet in a big wad.
@@tractorman4461 Have you ever drilled a hole and used a set screw to hold the valve guide? I'm thinking of trying that. Maybe I really need to get a new head instead. Its a B&S 40777-019-E1 wherever look its says not available.
@@rickhubner I’m not sure there’s enough meat on the surface to sustain the set screw. In other words it’s not thick enough plus the intense heat and vibration would be a tough environment for that too. Some guys just peen the perimeter of the bore around the guide with a crisp ground center punch. But they admit that too is short term.
@@tractorman4461 Just thanks & I agree 100%
Great video, a very easy way to repair a valve guide that has moved is to just remove the spring take a punch and tap it back in place then take a pointed punch and make indentions around the valve guide in the aluminum surrounding the guide this will create pinch pressure around the guide keeping it place, it works great has i have performed this repair many times.
I considered that as an option Tim, but went ahead with this instead. So far so good too. I don't work on them professionally or for pay, so I'm not too concerned about the extra time doing this takes. Next one that comes in though, I will take your advice and give it a shot.
I had an intek engine with bent push rods. I ended up buying a new cylinder head for around 200 dollars installed it, set the valve clearance at .005 and now the engine runs great. I wasn't ready to follow the procedure you used because I don't have the skills or tools. Mower and engine now run great. I do plan removing the shroud next spring before mowing to clean the area around the cylinder head to prevent overheating. Seems like mice like to make nests in that area which cause overheating.
I do believe that route is the recommended one by the manufacturer. I think the key is keeping it blown clear to minimize the overheating in that area at the center of the V. Steel and aluminum expand at different rates....so its easy to see how the heat causes the guides to give way. Thanks for the comment Byron. I appreciate the time you took to watch. I kinda think its mostly the grass clippings instead of mice nests....but I can see either being the source of the problem.
After dinner I fell into dreamland only to awaken to a 44Vid! It had to be the Tractor Faeries With the help of the JO Faeries! A fine vid indeed! Magical it was coming to and seeing my 44 Friend Wendell before me eyes! So I Thank You Kindly for this surprise, good medicine. I can’t believe today marks the fourth week since I went under the Axe, amazing! Doc says I’m healing up good and all is well thus far. All that 44 cup raising has helped and another Thanks for that. My best to all at 44 Ranch with manyBlessings and as always, take it easy cuz ya know how ya are! DaveyJO
I am glad to hear you are well on the path of mending DaveyJO !! You'll be back in your shop in no time at all. Besides, everybody needs a rest on occasion. Tippin' and sippin' another cuppaJO in honor of Nurse Alice and her number one patient.
Thank you great how to and even better explanation of several things!
Well Bryan, its a poor boys repair, probably not sanctioned by the manufacturers, but at least it works. They want to sell a new head instead. Glad to see you enjoyed the video.
Nice idea about putting a spot of weld on the guide. I've a John Deere with a B&S Intek engine with a bent exhaust and intake rods to get fixed.
I'm sure there are much better ways to do this, but on this particular mower, being a bit old, I didn't want to spend big money on new heads or fancy machining. I think this will work for as long as this engine wants to run. I thought of peening the head around the guides to put more pressure on them then decided against it.
It’s the best fix but 95% of the time it’s exhaust so I do both with welder
Great video I like the use of the old wrench for a valve spring tool every one’s always asking why I don’t get rid of the extra tools I’ve got lying around and that is why never know when you need to make or modify some too to the job your doing. Poor boy fix will last just as long as spending money on the project at hand my kind of video right here I watch all you put on here
Yeah, you're a guy like me...I try to throw NOTHING away until I am totally sure it has little or no value. LOL. Nothing wrong with that approach either. Thanks Timothy for the comment....and thanks for watching all the silly stuff I do just to get by without spending a ton of money.
Bonjour mon ami, you have written a great detail into your video description ! Yep that is in deed a bent exhaust push rod !!! You have a great choices about valves ; ) Great way to show us on how to make a tool ! Great trick on welding using copper tube ! It's alive !!! OUTSTANDING JOB mon ami Cheers !!!
Glad you enjoyed it Dave !! So far it is still purring like a kitten too !!
@@tractorman4461 That is great !!!
you never cease to amaze me !
Aw heck Jeffrey....I just figure if something is already broke, you probably can't hurt it so why not tear into it and you may just fix it by accident !! That's my story and I'm sticking to it.... Thank you for the very kind comment !!
What a great idea and will consider trying this. Thanks so much. You are very helpful.
Some guys will peen the head around the guide openings, but that seems to be only temporary. This, though unsanctioned by the manufacturer seems to be fairly permanent. A tiny TIG spot would be ideal, but a few blobs with a MIG is ok too. The copper may melt just a bit into the weld, but it is easily filed away.
Very cool fix. They didn't mention that one at Briggs and Stratton school when I went!! Maybe they forgot? 😊😊😊I've got a V-twin Briggs laying around that I was planning on using on a project. I think I'll check the guides before I use it now. Thanks for the tip. 👍👍👍
The horizontal twins are real bad for it when the clippings get impacted in the fins towards the center of the "V". Longer run times while in the overheated condition contributes to the movement of the valve guides....usually on the exhaust valves. The best remedy is to use a long nose air gun to thoroughly blow it clean as possible after every cutting. Good luck with yours.
This is a rare video my craftsman is a 25 hp love the mower. Been great for about 7 years it is used. Got a hunk of wood stuck in the deck, stopped it cold tore the electric relay to spin the cuttin blades spun off wrom the force. Think it saved my rods it still ran great after all this time i am replacing all that need it.
Wow !! Lucky you didn't really sustain any damage. Btw, the push rods are all the same size but if you get a set, you'll get two aluminum rods for the intake and two steel rods for the exhaust.
@@tractorman4461 thanks I have been taking all the info in. And getting parts now while I still can. She's running great. Would start hard till a vid said they set the choke wrong from the factory. Now after adjusting after 7 years it starts immediately.
@@neilstern7108 Awesome !! Good luck with your upgrades to the unit.
Awesome fix 44, I never go so far with an engine, good video to refer back when I need info, thanks for sharing my friend
Unfortunately I had to edit out a lot of the specific details to try to get it short as possible. Like the actual welding of the guides and grinding the welds and the specific steps to setting the Magnetron gap and also valve adjusting. It looks simple, but it takes a little longer to get them perfect. Thanks Jan for stopping in for a visit my friend.
@@tractorman4461 No problem my friend, what matters is I have a contact for help should it be necessary, that alone is a source of valuable info.
I learned 10 years ago to tack in port exhaust guide
There’s the best fix and I’ve done 75/100 with no come backs
Just stick rod to it for less than second
Heck yeah welding it works good, but I bet that factory service recommends a new head for a fix !! I don't have a tender enough touch to hit it with a rod...that's why I used the mig and the copper wrap. Thanks Phillip for the added input concerning the repair.
Have you tryed driving it back in place and tacking it thru ports with out pulling head ??
It’s what I will try next on a junk mower that I buy
Thank you very mucho for taking the time and show us this value information , the only thing is missing is parts number 🤔🤔 if you can be so kind and tell us we’ll really appreciate it
thank you again for the help 👍💪🏻
The only thing I really had to purchase were the push rods and they were about $10.00 each. I don't think I recorded the part numbers, but I may have one of the bags still on the workbench. If so, I can add it here later.
hi there nice work a bit complex for me . good show john
Thanks John, but I think with your varied abilities you are being quite modest. Thanks for the visit.
Great work as always man! It's alive!!!
For NOW it is anyway huh. Might blow its top tomorrow but right now its purring right along Andrew !!
TM44, yeah this is common on a lot of vtwins especially B&S. Hopefully your weld solves the issue. The way I fix these is measure down from top of guide to spring seat on guide that has not moved and record measurement. Drive out guide, place in lathe, spin .030-.040” deep ring @ .025” lower than spring seat height. Reinstall in head to recorded depth, then stake aluminum around guide into cut groove of valve guide. This solves problem of valve guide moving either way.
Whew..!! That sounds like a superb repair and not a shade tree job like I did Garny !! I think your technique will be the way I go on the next one. If I worked on these a lot more, I am sure I would pick up a lot of additional tricks. Thanks for giving a superb explanation for a much more reliable repair.
Valve guide repair went exactly as I imagined. There needs to be a flange or something that won't allow the guide to move. I'm piecing together an Atlas 12x54 lathe that may help make or repair parts.
The problem with the heads is the differing rates of expansion between the steel guides and the aluminum heads. This problem ensures parts sales for the manufacturer. I'm sure their suggestion is to replace the entire head. Good luck with your Atlas. I have a Jet 14 x 42 and an old Chicopee metal lathe from turn of the century.
Great job has always. All my very best
Good Morning Bobby. This machine was headed to the junkyard when an old buddy gave it to me. He'd already given away two old Wheel Horses so I just got the 'leftovers'...LOL. Thanks for watching and sharing.
Great video sir. Very helpful 👍
It's kind of a poor boys repair. I'm sure the dealer would recommend a head replacement. Sometimes peening around the aluminum opening will hold 'em in place for a while, but this will hold 'em for the rest of the life of the engine.
Great job! Thanks for the new video
Thanks Kevin for watching. It was a tough one to edit. Thanks for taking the time to comment.
OUTSTANDING VIDEO !!
Thank you. I'm pretty sure the manufacturer would probably recommend replacing the head. But that'd be crazy without doing anything you can think of to make it work reliably. Thanks for watching and commenting.
Great video, How far did you drive the guide back in ? Did it stick up a little at your weld bead. I dont think it would be an issue if it did since the valve only rides the guide and is stopped by the valve seat. I have a Intek 25hp torn down and ready for this step. Thank you for this video!
I slipped the copper tube to just shy of the end of the guide to allow the smallest of a bead. It does not protrude more the a 32nd further than it did originally. Some guys peen the aluminum around the slipping guide but that is always a temporary fix as the aluminum eventually lets it slip again. Its the different expansion rate of the steel vs aluminum that eventually gets it to loosen. Don't worry about making a pretty bead unless you have a TIG and are really good. I just blobbed MIG on it and ground it down a little...but the copper is what gives it a sharp edge to the bead to rest against the aluminum surface. Just peel the copper off and it leaves the sharp edge. It may melt a bit of the copper into the bead, but its no biggie. Make sense..?? Good luck.
EXCELLENT VIDEO. thanks for posting.
How far in should the valve guides be to be considered correctly installed? Mine drifted out towards the rocker arms.
If you look back at the video around 1145 you'll see the amount I leave out for the tiny weld bead. The rest is pressed into the passage. The reason for the copper is to give a defined edge to press against the machined surface. Some of the copper will melt along with the weld, so you may have to use a crisp file to trim it back a little.
Would be easier if you heat up the head and drive guide in place makes sense and you doing a great fix
Yeah...the Missus would give me a bit of grief to pull out here apple pie to stuff an old head in the oven.....but that would work just fine as you indicate. Thanks Phillip for stopping in today.ll
Dear Sir, Your very knowledgeable. I recently replaced all my push rods on my Briggs and Stratton and had the adjusted properly and my oil pan gasket replaced. so when I tried to start it no start. I had fire in both plugs so I evenly took the valve covers back off and the spark plugs back out to double check the valve clearance so when I went to get it on top dead center of the exhaust stroke to my surprise neither side of the pushrods or rocker arms were moving. Can you tell me why please sir I would be grateful to any advise you may have at this point. Yours truely,Donald
I don't know if you have a neoprene drive gear on the cam or not, but it sounds like the camshaft isn't turning with the crankshaft. The cams rotation, as you know, is what pushes on the push rods. The push rods are all the same length, and the exhaust ones are the two steel ones, but they will interchange with the aluminum intake ones. That will have no effect on what you describe. Btw, I'm assuming you're talking about a horizontal V-twin.
Great job thanks for the great video. 🇺🇸👍👍
Cool Tony...I am glad you enjoyed it. It's a pretty good running motor now. Thanks for the visit !!
Nice work Tractorman...
Thanks Paul. I appreciate your time. And thank you for commenting.
..... saved another one ......... nice , TM44 .......... you da man !!!
Yeah, my old buddy (he turns 90 this sunday) had fiddled with this mower an hour or two here and there since '016 and gave up. He asked me to just get rid of it !! He bought a new Husky in '017. I was out there working on his old front distributor 8n for him and he unloaded this and a few other old items he wanted gone. But...dang it, he'd already given away two old Wheel Horse riders. Missed 'em by a hair. LOL Boy o boy, he is happy to get his 'Old Henry' out on sunny days to clear the pasture little by little with the bush hog !!
This vid was super helpful I got a mower from my boss with one dead cylinder and this was the exact issue 😁
There's many ways to make the repair but most are probably not recommended by the manufacturer. Some guys use a punch and peen the head around the guide to smash it in a bit tighter, but that is almost always temporary. Some guys knurl the guides in a metal lathe, which is better, but much harder to do unless you are a machinist. Then there's guys like me. LOL Crude, but that thing is NOT coming out again !!
@@tractorman4461 I'm a machinist by trade I found valve guide that are .0003 larger so it be a press fit all I gotta do is take them to work press old ones out put new in
@@michaelparker5814 those should work. I might've done that if I had access to them. I pressed these out and back in with my old shop press here. Worked pretty slick. I wouldn't make a scab on a real machinists rear end, but I do have a lot of the shop tools that I love to play with when needed. My one horizontal mill is a Kerney and Trecker from around 1909 or so. I also have a 120 year old (+ -) Ames metal lathe from Chicopee Massachusetts. Plus some other old stuff too.
I don't consider myself a real machinest yet I've only been doing it for 6 years we just make a lot of heads so I can know the common sized valve guilds but I plan on putting green loctite when I press them in @@tractorman4461
@@michaelparker5814 Well Michael, I GUARANTEE you are much more of a machinist than I. LOL I do grind my own valves and valve seats, but I haven't been brave enough yet to cut new seats in...but I may sooner or later.
Excellent fix I’ve done it before works
That's cool. I don't think it is a repair that is sanctioned by the factory though. But they are in business to sell parts and we just want to make a repair that will work for a long time. Thanks Ross for the input.
I hope it worked. The damage on mine shows that the valve struck it hard so I don't know if it'll work in the long run without breaking a valve head off. It might work though. Oh, and those roto-tiller tires are on backwards. They're supposed to be the opposite of a tractor since you want the traction to resist the tiller being pushed forward by the tines.
This one has held in place so far at least. But I'm sure there's no way its going to move now. I've never thought of the direction of the ag tread on the tiller being reversed. It was a freebie with a bad motor. I re-powered it with a Predator, but I no longer have reverse.
Dumb question ,I welded valve guide on number one cylinder exhaust ,ready to put new push rods in .Should I leave sump cover off to put push rods in so I can see that the cam is at it's base circle for the push rod I am installing ? I know that TDC is where you adjust valves but how do you determine if you are at TDC Compression Stroke or TDC Exhaust ? Or does it not matter?
I usually leave as much disassembled as possible during reassembly. The more you can see, the less mistakes you make. Compression stroke will be TDC with both valves in the closed position. At that point both valve tips should have the specified 'cold' clearance to the push rods. Hope that helps. Sorry I missed your comment earlier.
I have a Craftsman with the same motor. I ended up taking the heads off and peening the valve guides so they wouldn't slide out. I did that a few years ago but now I think the rings are getting a little weak as when revving up she'll blow a little smoke out. Either that or the valve seals are just getting worn to the point they're letting in oil. Thanks for the info Tractorman44.
Yeah, its one or the other. May as well do both at the same time. Peening is ok but its usually considered a temporary fix. If the fins in the block are impacted with debris for long periods of time, the heat is much more intense and that effects the guides/aluminum head because of the different rates of expansion and contraction between the two metals.
Sir, I am having a heck of a time finding the correct product code number for these push-rods. Any assistance would be very welcome. I have an 18HP Vanguard twin engine however, and my rods seem smaller than those shown here. The Briggs website has not been helpful. My model is a 356447 - 0164 - e1. if that helps. Thanks in advance.
Aw shoot....I tossed the package. My buddy has a Cub dealership in town, so I'm used to just walking in and telling him what I need and it just appears. I probably should record the part numbers because he's not going to be around forever. But I bet if you check Amazon with your engine number you can find them. You can use two steel ones too btw. The aluminum one is identical except for material. It's crazy but it seems like those are the first ones to bend.
what specification of the engine lubricant
Good job!
Still running strong too !! Thanks for tuning in today.
I have the same problem but one of my steel exhaust rods fell into the engine. Do I have to pull the engine and retrieve it or is there any chance it will just behave and sit in the bottom of the crankcase? Scag Tiger Cub, same engine. Thanks in advance
You will run the chance of cracking the crankcase if it were to become lodged between rotating mass and the side or bottom. Being as its the steel ones, I'd try ferreting it out with a flexible rare earth magnet. At least I'd give it one heck of a try. I've had plenty push rods bend and pop off, but never one to drop all the way into the cavity that I can remember anyway.
Keep it clean! It’s not just the fins on the head! Pay attention to the casting around the exhaust valve, oil with dirt makes multiple layers from the valve cover leaking. This causes insulation and the area directly at the surrounding casting of the exhaust guide cannot cool, only get hotter and hotter. Pay attention to the carb also, if it’s to lean that means more combustion heat. All these mowers these days are running so lean by EPA standards that they are asking to self destruct.
I think I touched on the heat being the issue when its allowed to get accumulated at the base of the fins etc. I just didn't go as detailed as your comment. But you made very good points, for sure.
I have the same mower similar problem bent exhaust pushrods from running bad gas varnished in the guides
That's not good. As long as the guides stay in place, you should be ok though. The intakes are aluminum and the exhausts are steel, but they are both too small of a diameter as far as I am concerned. But, that's just me. My valve stems mic'd perfect and they were clean as a pin, no nastiness inside at all. Even the cylinders were spic and span. Still showing the hone marks.
Do the rocker arm bolts need to be torqued? Or just snug?
The torque spec varies from one to another. I have to refer to the manual but generally those small rocker arm bolts are in the vicinity of 20-25ft/lb if I remember right. If no manual is available, you can get by with torquing to the average spec for the diameter of the bolt/stud used. I wouldn't trust my memory though Gary. I'd try to find the spec on line or a Briggs small engine forum.
Im a small engine tech and i have a commercial ferris that had the exhaust valve come out. So u basically tacked a spot on the guide, grinded it just enough to leave a slight hump and then just drove it in? Does that work and won't it crack the head?
Basically that is what I did, but only on the actual END of the guide. I slipped the guide inside a piece of copper tubing exposing the small part I wanted to put the bead on. Even though the heat may melt a bit of the copper, it is easy to peel off and leaves a perfect circle around the guide that needs very little to clean up. It doesn't crack the head because the diameter of the guide that presses into the head is not changed. So far it has worked fine.
I was thinking of knurling the guide on the lathe and pressing it back it but I couldn't figure out how to hold it in the chuck. I thought about peening the head around the guide bore with a sharp center punch but figured that would be temporary for sure. The small bead of weld cannot sip through the guide bore and so far has worked perfectly. The last option was to buy another new or used head.
I'm sure this is NOT recommended by any manufacturer, but then, they want to sell parts.
Brilliant.
Well, I don't about that, but it IS a poor boys country bumpkin repair. Btw, it's still running strong !!
@@tractorman4461 see, awesome, thank you for the info.
Yep I old tools for airing up cly and change out valve seals
Heck yeah...what ever works. As long as the end result is reliable. Thanks for the visit today Phillip.
Good video !!
Well, it is a poor boy's repair. But its cheaper than buying a new head. And on a positive note, it is still working fine today. I'm sure there are more acceptable techniques though.
I use two thumbs, a magnet and a rag.....works fine
Yeah, I think I mentioned that in the video. But sometimes the ol' arthritis makes it uncomfortable to do as a fella gets a few years on him. LOL I did a LOT of things back in the day that makes me hesitate today. Thanks Jeff for chiming in and have a great day !! Thanks for watching.
Tem o manual?
Não, não tenho o manual dela.
Man you look like Tommy chongs brother lol good video tho
That caught me off guard Joe. LOL That's some funny stuff there. Hahahahaha. Thanks for watching and bringing out the first chuckle of the morning. Btw, the old Briggs is still humping along just fine too !!
95% of the time. Just did just adjust the valves they say about every 100 hours. It depends if you run a company or not
Good advice Michael. The damage to this one was before it came to live here. An old buddy gave it to me after it shot craps in his pasture.
With a lathe available i would have knurled the guide..
That's an option for sure and others just peen the area around the guide and others just buy a new head. Thanks for the input and yes, knurling is probably the best repair.
downward stroke?, don't you mean sideways stroke? being a tipped over motor and all.
Hahahaha… good one. Probably should be outward and inward. LOL.
I know a master of his trade when I see one...Tractorman44 has convinced me of his deep knowledge of these engines. I listen to learn from the master.
Thank you David for the very kind words. I don't get to work on these too often but I do enjoy getting into them. I hope you have found other things of interest here as well.
Too much Jaw Jackin about valve spring compressors. Not pernatant to Fixing the issue
You are correct, that's a non-disputable fact. But I can't tell you how many comments I get on various videos that love to see the various tools used to do the same job but on different applications. Some people are visual learners and need to only SEE what's happening and others need the verbal interpretation of the work to benefit more thoroughly off of a video. I personally watch videos with my right finger on the FF button to get through the parts I feel are non-pertinent. I really don't advertise my videos as 'how to' videos anyway. They are 'how I do' videos, and sometimes I go to LA via Omaha to solve the problem.