True story - My mother went to Lourdes and drank the waters there. She got amoebic dystentry, and spent 2 weeks in hospital. It's apparently quite common. Who knew that drinking untreated water that a bunch of sick people have been dipping thier hands and feet into would make you ill? Her parish priest said that it was God punishing her for singing out of key in the church choir every Sunday.
@@realBreakfasttacos To be fair, she can't sing worth shit. But yeah, pilgrims getting sick at Lourdes is pretty common. They never advertise it for some reason.
amoebic dysentery is not fun. I had it a long time ago, but did not have to go to the hospital. As a Navy medic, I had access to iodine treatment and recovered after about a month. Sorry about your mom. (And sorry about that parish priest, too. How unkind!)
The Christians have this a priori assumption that nature is inherently leaning in the direction of being chaotic and crazy, but we look at the universe we see order and balance, which is proof that there must be a God working behind the scenes, redirecting nature away from chaos and towards order. This atheist interlocutor keeps refusing to concede to these a priori assumptions. And they're getting more and more frustrated. He won't get intellectually bullied or cajoled into conceding positions that haven't been demonstrated. He's doing a very good job.
I am always stunned for a second whenever a believer brings up the Shroud as evidence, because it's a level of absurdity that borders on mental illness. Cu!t-Think Bra!n Rot on full display, I wonder if they're also flat earthers.
50:21 "Have you seen anything in the universe that was created without a cause?" What a classic example of Christian apologetic wordplay. The word "create" has both a colloquial definition and a theological definition. The question is worded in such a way as to confuse and equate the two. So that then, after you've given your answer, the Christian can play the Three Card Trick and trap you into conceding their argument. I think that the best answer you could give to this question would be, I've never seen creation in my life, so I have nothing to go on.
51:20 "Have you ever seen something come out nothing?" Seeing as how nothing doesn't exist, has never existed and cannot exist -- it is merely a human-invented philosophical concept -- the question is nonsensical.
"I have candy!", Timmy shouts. "You're holding a unit of canine excretion, Timmy.", the helpful stranger points out, "Are you able to show me some candy?". Timmy stomps his foot, "This is candy!". "Then eat it.", replies the stranger, laughing. Suddenly uncomfortable, Timmy retorts: "1:20:58"
What slimy, slimy, creepy behaviour from the Christians. They ask him several different questions all at once. He answers one of the questions with "No" and one of the questions with "Yes". They take the answer he gives that is most convenient to their agenda, and then they assert that he was actually answering a different question than the one he was. And then they spend several minutes taking an unearned, hollow victory lap. At 51:21 they ask him whether or not he's ever seen something created from nothing, and he says "Never." At 51:41 they ask him "So, you've never seen it then?" They ask him a question with a negative inside it. Which means that you would need to answer with a positive in order to affirm the negative that they are suggesting. So that's what he does. "I've already answered that. I said that I did." He gave a positive response to their negative question of him seeing something created from nothing. We then have to spend several minutes listening to those smug Christians claiming victory, only for the atheist to repeatedly inform them that they have misunderstood his answer. But they just keep ignoring him and assert that he said something that he didn't.
My apologies for those smug Christians. I hope that all Christians are not like that. The fact that one purports an atheist philosophy does not automatically mean that one is an immoral person. My Dad was an atheist. He was driving down the main street one day back in the 1950s. He noticed a beggar selling pencils for 10 cents apiece. Dad stopped, got out, and put one dollar in the man's cup for one pencil. this was at a time when a double scoop ice-cream cone sold for that same 10 cents. Dad would always give change to anyone who asked. I never noticed the religious people doing that.
Ha! The cashier would hold the shroud up to light to make sure the anti-counterfeit watermark is there. “Let me just see…Howard, give me a hand holding this up. Yeah, grab that corner.”
the laws of logic are axioms. axioms are certain propositions we assume to be true. they exist because we assume certain propositions to be true. if we don't assume certain propositions to be true, axioms don't exist. KEvron
What does the shroud prove, ideally? A man with a beard was crucified a long time ago? Anything else? Not even a baseball cap with the text: I am the son of God? Why are all "miracles" so ambiguous and difficult to secure? Can't we have a clear one, for once? One we all could agree on. What's the use of signs only the already convinced can "read"? The Spirit: Let's give those idiots another riddle and see what they come up with this time... ?????
Approx 1:40 1) Christian makes some absurd claim about the hoax Jesus cloth thing. But he stutters repeatedly and repeats himself. 2) Atheist is confused by stuttering and repetition, asks the Christian to repeat himself. 3) The Christian, thinking that he can catch the atheist out for not listening, asks the atheist to repeat back to him his claim about Jesus clloth that he had just said. How absurd. You know for a fact that he won't be able to repeat your words back to you. Because he just asked you to repeat yourself. So why ask him to do that in the first place??? We know the answer to that question. The goal is not to prove the atheist factually wrong. It's about manufacturing a soundbite of an atheist being rude, so that it can clipped and shared around circuits.
The conversation should have stopped when they mentioned coins on the eyes. That would violate Jewish/Moses law. Coins on eyes is to pay the ferry man to the underworld. That's belief in a different pantheon altogether
brother you used to get me with the discord pings, and now its steam pings. I love the videos, but checking my apps aftering hearing a ping in a video is annoying xd
God of the gaps. We don't know anything about the energy of the universe prior to the big bang, its origin, its conditions, its behaviour, etc. THEREFORE, GOD.
Jesus promised a sign about the duration of his burial to be given to "an evil generation." We are that generation, and the images of Jesus' dead body on the Shroud are that sign. It is the only sign that we are going to receive. My advice is to discard the presumption of naturalism and make the most of this amazing gift.
You just need to stop rejecting the self evident truth of our shared naturalistic/atheistic reality that has been revealed to all of sound mind through both natural and special revelation in an undeniable way. You already knows no gods exist.
@jeffreyerwin3665 how so? Has the carbon dating been disproven? No. Has the fact that the weave used was not common during the time alleged been debunked? No. Was the finding of dye on the shroud debunked? No. Was the fact the first explicit mention of the shroud is by a bishop calling it a hoax been debunked? No.
True story - My mother went to Lourdes and drank the waters there. She got amoebic dystentry, and spent 2 weeks in hospital. It's apparently quite common. Who knew that drinking untreated water that a bunch of sick people have been dipping thier hands and feet into would make you ill? Her parish priest said that it was God punishing her for singing out of key in the church choir every Sunday.
WHATTTTT!??? That is so evil.
@@realBreakfasttacos To be fair, she can't sing worth shit. But yeah, pilgrims getting sick at Lourdes is pretty common. They never advertise it for some reason.
@@tussk. LOL. That makes sense.
amoebic dysentery is not fun. I had it a long time ago, but did not have to go to the hospital. As a Navy medic, I had access to iodine treatment and recovered after about a month. Sorry about your mom. (And sorry about that parish priest, too. How unkind!)
The Christians have this a priori assumption that nature is inherently leaning in the direction of being chaotic and crazy, but we look at the universe we see order and balance, which is proof that there must be a God working behind the scenes, redirecting nature away from chaos and towards order.
This atheist interlocutor keeps refusing to concede to these a priori assumptions. And they're getting more and more frustrated. He won't get intellectually bullied or cajoled into conceding positions that haven't been demonstrated. He's doing a very good job.
Yes he was awesome!!
I am always stunned for a second whenever a believer brings up the Shroud as evidence, because it's a level of absurdity that borders on mental illness.
Cu!t-Think Bra!n Rot on full display, I wonder if they're also flat earthers.
Who even knows anymore!
50:21 "Have you seen anything in the universe that was created without a cause?"
What a classic example of Christian apologetic wordplay.
The word "create" has both a colloquial definition and a theological definition. The question is worded in such a way as to confuse and equate the two. So that then, after you've given your answer, the Christian can play the Three Card Trick and trap you into conceding their argument.
I think that the best answer you could give to this question would be, I've never seen creation in my life, so I have nothing to go on.
51:20 "Have you ever seen something come out nothing?"
Seeing as how nothing doesn't exist, has never existed and cannot exist -- it is merely a human-invented philosophical concept -- the question is nonsensical.
I think it is just a mix of low iq and a lack of understanding anything.
"I have candy!", Timmy shouts.
"You're holding a unit of canine excretion, Timmy.", the helpful stranger points out, "Are you able to show me some candy?".
Timmy stomps his foot, "This is candy!".
"Then eat it.", replies the stranger, laughing.
Suddenly uncomfortable, Timmy retorts: "1:20:58"
1:26:00 Timmy TAGs out.
The stranger laughs.
LOL great observations. He used the R word something like 15 times. Every time someone responded to him basically. I had to cut out so many lol.
@@realBreakfasttacos You're doing duck-god's work, Taco. You been working it real good lately.
What slimy, slimy, creepy behaviour from the Christians.
They ask him several different questions all at once. He answers one of the questions with "No" and one of the questions with "Yes".
They take the answer he gives that is most convenient to their agenda, and then they assert that he was actually answering a different question than the one he was.
And then they spend several minutes taking an unearned, hollow victory lap.
At 51:21 they ask him whether or not he's ever seen something created from nothing, and he says "Never."
At 51:41 they ask him "So, you've never seen it then?"
They ask him a question with a negative inside it. Which means that you would need to answer with a positive in order to affirm the negative that they are suggesting.
So that's what he does. "I've already answered that. I said that I did." He gave a positive response to their negative question of him seeing something created from nothing.
We then have to spend several minutes listening to those smug Christians claiming victory, only for the atheist to repeatedly inform them that they have misunderstood his answer. But they just keep ignoring him and assert that he said something that he didn't.
It is just intellectual dishonesty.
My apologies for those smug Christians. I hope that all Christians are not like that. The fact that one purports an atheist philosophy does not automatically mean that one is an immoral person. My Dad was an atheist. He was driving down the main street one day back in the 1950s. He noticed a beggar selling pencils for 10 cents apiece. Dad stopped, got out, and put one dollar in the man's cup for one pencil. this was at a time when a double scoop ice-cream cone sold for that same 10 cents. Dad would always give change to anyone who asked. I never noticed the religious people doing that.
Ironically, that check can only be cashed at the First Bank of Turin (FBoT).
That is too funny.
Lmfao! 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
Ha! The cashier would hold the shroud up to light to make sure the anti-counterfeit watermark is there. “Let me just see…Howard, give me a hand holding this up. Yeah, grab that corner.”
Oof, the leprechaun demonstrates the opposite of critical thinking. And the other guy who kept using 'symmetry breaker'like his life depended on it
LOL
"A room full of Christians"-Is this similar to what is expected to meet those who will spend eternity in Heaven (+ God and Jesus, of course)?
Who even knows. Sounds like hell though.
the laws of logic are axioms. axioms are certain propositions we assume to be true. they exist because we assume certain propositions to be true. if we don't assume certain propositions to be true, axioms don't exist.
KEvron
Excellent point!
The luminosity needed to make the markings on the shroud would've created heat that'd vaporize the material...these cretins lol
LOL excellent point!
@@dolosevensix Hahaha That’s the first thing that crossed my mind when he was making that claim
@@dolosevensix it's like how they used to tell kids to hide under a desk if a Russian nuke hit.
@fentonmulley5895 i did those drills when i was super little, seemed dumb lol
That's what makes it a miracle, silly - the impossibility!
What does the shroud prove, ideally? A man with a beard was crucified a long time ago? Anything else? Not even a baseball cap with the text: I am the son of God?
Why are all "miracles" so ambiguous and difficult to secure? Can't we have a clear one, for once? One we all could agree on. What's the use of signs only the already convinced can "read"?
The Spirit: Let's give those idiots another riddle and see what they come up with this time... ?????
The shroud is actually a fake.
@@realBreakfasttacos It is not .. . .
The images on the Shroud are a clear miracle.
A leprechaun and a symmetry breaker walk into a bar...
A very low epistemic one.
ROFL
@@deviouskris3012 They were meeting Bill Craig, who had arrived early and already grabbed a table.
1:10:53 energy has always existed; never been a time when it didn't.
KEvron
Great point!
Approx 1:40
1) Christian makes some absurd claim about the hoax Jesus cloth thing. But he stutters repeatedly and repeats himself.
2) Atheist is confused by stuttering and repetition, asks the Christian to repeat himself.
3) The Christian, thinking that he can catch the atheist out for not listening, asks the atheist to repeat back to him his claim about Jesus clloth that he had just said.
How absurd. You know for a fact that he won't be able to repeat your words back to you. Because he just asked you to repeat yourself. So why ask him to do that in the first place???
We know the answer to that question. The goal is not to prove the atheist factually wrong. It's about manufacturing a soundbite of an atheist being rude, so that it can clipped and shared around circuits.
Excellent observation!
If you rearrange the Shroud of Turin such that it looks like it's covering a body, it demonstrates that Jesus had a body like a salt shaker.
LOL
The symmetry breaker guy kind of sounds like Joe from Family Guy when he gets excited.
That is too funny.
The conversation should have stopped when they mentioned coins on the eyes. That would violate Jewish/Moses law. Coins on eyes is to pay the ferry man to the underworld. That's belief in a different pantheon altogether
LOL EXCELLENT POINT!!!
coins on his eyes are not proven.
brother you used to get me with the discord pings, and now its steam pings. I love the videos, but checking my apps aftering hearing a ping in a video is annoying xd
LOL my friend kept sending me DMS about icarus. I'll try to figure out how to turn those off
55:43 Taco asks for a miracle.
I was not granted the miracle.
Dan McClellan has a video that discusses the Shroud of Turin hoax.
There are quite a few people that have covered the shroud hoax.
Dan has a bias for an obvious reason
We have ancient cave drawings that are a photographic negative, it's nothing special.
Excellent observation!
no, yu do not have any such thing....
Its clear that English is a second language Its pretty disgusting that they interpret his accent in the most ungenerous way.
I agree!
How 'i think the universe is eternal' then becomes 'so you think something comes from nothing', so much bad faith, just like their religion
It is just dishonesty.
God of the gaps.
We don't know anything about the energy of the universe prior to the big bang, its origin, its conditions, its behaviour, etc.
THEREFORE, GOD.
Great point!
Jesus promised a sign about the duration of his burial to be given to "an evil generation." We are that generation, and the images of Jesus' dead body on the Shroud are that sign.
It is the only sign that we are going to receive. My advice is to discard the presumption of naturalism and make the most of this amazing gift.
You just need to stop rejecting the self evident truth of our shared naturalistic/atheistic reality that has been revealed to all of sound mind through both natural and special revelation in an undeniable way. You already knows no gods exist.
@@realBreakfasttacos Circular reasoning.
BTW, where can I get a good breakfast taco?
@@jeffreyerwin3665 LOL that is not circular reasoning. Don’t even go there. I’m literally making a video about people who misuse fallacies
Who invented a photocopier 2000 years ago. Why don't they teach this stuff in history class?!!
Who knows!?
Debating prots is low hanging fruit. Maybe one day
Maybe one day!
Yay!!!
Glad you are enjoying it so far!
The arrogant ignorance of theists knows no equal.
That is an excellent explanation of what they do.
Ooof, the shroud of Turin again? The thing that has been debunked over and over? lol
RIGHT! I'm shocked people still say this stuff.
Not true/ the so-called debunking has itself been debunked.
@jeffreyerwin3665 how so? Has the carbon dating been disproven? No. Has the fact that the weave used was not common during the time alleged been debunked? No. Was the finding of dye on the shroud debunked? No. Was the fact the first explicit mention of the shroud is by a bishop calling it a hoax been debunked? No.
Using DNA as an example of design is Ray Comfort level of trashy apologetics.
Everyone know the shroud is BS except these clowns and Otangelo.
This is soo true.