Something I wanted to add that might lend credence to the theory that Radahn is being forced to be a consort is that he doesn’t have his horse. I don’t think Radahn would want to be lord to someone if he didn’t have his mighty steed with him.
I don’t remember what description it was and I haven’t watched the vid yet so idk if it’s discussed but it said something abt miquela being able to get everyone to follow him blindly but one person
Well, also the fact that Malenia had to go-to Caelid and spread her rotussy indicates that he was probably reluctant to be Miquellas consort. This golden femboy really has boundary issues, he even charmed Mohg without consent lol
So, since we are now talking about DLC lore, here are some thoughts about it: -We know from the Remembrance that Miquella wanted Radahn as his consort since childhood, but it isn’t stated anywhere that Radahn agreed to it or even that he had a choice. It is entirely possible that Radahn did not become a promised consort because he wanted to, but because Miquella’s “heartfelt wish” simply became part of Radahn’s fate. There would be no need for Miquella to bewitch Radahn if the general cannot escape his fate. -Except that Radahn does escape his fate, because he conquered the stars, as we know from the base game. And that is where the Battle of Aeonia comes in: it is highly unlikely that Malenia was unaware of Miquella’s plan; after all the twins are not rivals like the other demigods are, they’re quite close. The battle would be unnecessary if Radahn had agreed to become Miquella’s consort, but since he didn’t, Miquella sends Malenia to Caelid in order to kill Radahn while he bewitches Mohg. -Through Sir Ansbach questline we learn that Miquella used Mohg to access the Land of Shadow, which he needed to do in order to become a god and later revive Radahn (and is also the place where the creator of the Scarlet Rot, Romina, is; and we know Miquella was trying to cure Malenia, so I don’t think it is a coincidence). But while he succeeds in his part of plan, Malenia does not. As she releases her scarlet rot across Caelid, Radahn hears a whisper that tells him Miquella is waiting for him, a sign that he was supposed to die in that battle in order to be revived as Miquella’s consort. By surviving Malenia’s Scarlet Aeonia, Radahn loses his mind, but keeps his freedom. -However, while blocking his own fate with his victory over the stars, Radahn also blocked Ranni’s fate, interfering with her plans. Perhaps it wasn’t even what he intended, but it motivated Ranni to get rid of him. Which she does, by sending to the festival the only individual who has a chance against Radahn: our Tarnished. Due to the influence of his sister (or due to Alexander telling us about the festival; funny how either a demigod or a jar can be the cause of Radahn’s damnation), the general dies and his soul is now vulnerable to Miquella. -In the Land of Shadow, Miquella succeeds in becoming a god and manages to revive Radahn, now under his direct control. We can say his plan is a success, and the only reason Miquella’s victory is short lived is because our Tarnished, literally the strongest individual in the Lands Between, fights his/her way through the Land of Shadow and kills Miquella before he can do anything with his newfound power, thus ending Miquella’s “gentle world” before it can even begin. -I suppose this puts into perspective just how important our Tarnished really is. The only reason characters like Ranni, Fia, Shabriri, Brother Corhyn and even the Dung Eater in his own twisted way, have a chance of accomplishing their objectives is the fact that they bring our Tarnished to their side, and even then it all boils down to whether or not we want to help them. Looking at it from a lore perspective, Miquella’s only mistake is the fact that he doesn’t think to recruit the individual who not only took down Radahn the first time, but also defeated Messmer, Romina, Rellana and even a revived Radahn in his prime. -Miquella’s key to success would be offering the tarnished the chance to serve him, or perhaps more accurately, being blessed by the devs with his own ending, which could very well have been planned at some point because we can side with Leda twice during the DLC, we can rat out other NPCs to her, and if I am not mistaken we were told the DLC would have some “choices” in it (dammit FromSoftware this was the perfect opportunity, there should be an ending where you side with Miquella and I will die on this hill). (Sorry for the long post, I just really liked the lore in the DLC).
Actually, i think Malenia knew the plan If u read the description in his younger helm, Radahn heard Malenia mumble before she nuke the caelid : “Miquella await thee, promise consort”
It could also be that it was never Miquella's fate to get to the point of ushering in his new era. I like the theory that Miquella's curse is actually 'unlimited potential' (infinite youth and never growing up can be the symbolism for this) while Malenia's curse is 'unlimited actuality'. Both opposites of each other in true twin fashion lol Miquella may of had all the power to usher in an age of compassion but none of it was real, his love was a spell after all. Essentially the god of what could have been
@@lanxinus4154 Indeed. Pretty cruel on Malenia's part, as she is basically saying to Radahn that he is going to lose his life and later his freedom, but it basically confirms she was involved.
@jackcorwin8424 it was a speculation of mine from reading her remembrance, Plus in the base game it said the goddess of rot was sealed away and cursed Melania. Maybe she wasn't sealed to the lake of rot, but sealed away or banished in the shadowlands, and if the war in the shadowlands war and subjugation influenced by Queen Marika, just maybe she cursed Melania with Scarlett Rot, for Marika betrayal, I know it's a reach but Elden ring leaves a lot to speculation
Yeah you have to do Ansbach's quest to learn that. He tells you that Mohg's body was taken away to Miquella as soon as he was defeated, later you find a scroll and give it to him and he tells you it's to resurrect Radahn into Mohg's body
He may have forced Rahdan to become his consort. Not only does his eyes glow, but in his 2nd phase with Mik on his back, he can charm you for a 1 hit kill. (You will be on your knee worshipping him.) His age of "compassion" is a forced one. You will lose your sanity and freedom for compliance - no different than his mother with the Golden Order. (Losing grace and exiled.)
I have a different thought about Rahdan being forced to be his consort. In the early part of DLC, Miquella lost his charmed power. Rahdan is frightening in his own will in the last battle I have a theory that Mohg's soul is still inside his body somehow. In the second phase, Rahdan will use blood curse to attack you which only people bless by the formless mother can do. Miquella's Age will brainswash everyone to stop fighting but Miquella will also cage forever inside the tree. He does make huge sacrifices to do that.
@@Baslium With the grab attack in the final phase I don't think he lost his charming. When he broke his own great rune it shattered the charms in place, but I think the breaking of it was something to do with his ascension at the gate and imbuing his power into his new form. The only way to not get 2 shot by the grab attack in the 2nd phase is to use the rune to resist his charm. The description of it even explicitly states that it *only* has that power anymore, implying that the rest has been taken outside the rune, which makes sense if Miquella wanted to defy the golden order as well.
@@acidicreaver3024 I ain't tellin you to get it, but you do find the remains of his rune that can protect you from the charming. The weird part is you get it at the bottom of the Scadutree.
Mogh was Moghlested....My boi did nothing wrong! So Miquella, made his sister Melina, Rahdahn and even Mogh fall in love with him forcefully. P. Diddy in child's form
Things this DLC left out: We get new lore about a little sister of Messmer (probably Melina) but she doesn't get an appearance. We didn't get an answer or anything about the Marika/Radagon thing. (They could've use the Miquella/St. Trina stuff to just answer that) Miyazaki said that Marika became a God in the Land of Shadows but how? By the same method as Miquella or she use the Mother of Fingers? By some reason The Land of Shadows has Death Knights serving the Prince of Death but we get nothing about Godwyn. The Gloam Eyed Queen didn't get even a mention or anything.
This. I was really hoping for something that would change how the original game was viewed, some huge lore drops that reshaped what we knew, like Gael and the painter starting a whole new cycle in DS3, but we didn’t really get anything like that at all. Miquella just did the Marika thing so we have to fight Radahn a 2nd time and kill another demigod. Technically two, but Messmer had the decency to have a good fight
Atleast we finally know what Malenia whispered in Radahn’s ear when afflicting him with Scarlet Rot. Something that we have been wondering since the base game’s story trailer. It was Miquella all along!
Honestly, the Band of Miquella at the beginning made a lot of sense in a very dark way. All of those individuals had the capacity to become lords of their own. Each a legendary champion. If the entire Band worked together all the way to the end, Radahn and Miquella would have been stopped honestly quite consistently. Moore is unbelievably tanky, Leda with lightning damage. Ansbach and Hornsent with evasiveness and bleed. Freya with raw toe-to-toe damage. Dryleaf Dane covering a lot of offense and defense bases. Thiollier with evasive support. Of course the Tarnished of No Renown being a variable lord themself. The whole point of bringing them together was to ultimately destroy them all or leave them utterly crippled so the plan could continue. Problem is, Miquella truly underestimated how absolutely tenacious the Tarnished of No Renown is.
they all get stomped by our tarnished at the same time canonically tbh so they ain't stopping radahn lol. and thats with them together. you can't become a lord as a group, so as singular people, i wouldn't say they had the capacity to become lords of their own at all. not stat wise of course but lore wise, they'd probably lose to margit at worst and renalla or morgott at best.
@@EfecanYSL Idk man they are so tanky, they might actually beat them and besides that, not all of them want to be Lords, so technically they could coexist.
@@ancientbanana2449 He's not. People are propagating lazy and erroneous takes about Miquella. Wait until Vaati or SmoughTown the lore videos. Miquella isn't the monster some people are painting him to be
My guess is that Radahn's strong sense of duty (halting the motion of the stars) kept him from pledging his loyalty elsewhere, so he may have made a binding promise with Miquella about being his lord in the next life. If a seemingly good-natured little kid that admires you asks you to promise something crazy like that, you might just humor them. Given how pure of character Radahn seemed to be, he might not have accepted had he known exactly how much Miquella was willing to sacrifice to fulfill his end of the deal. We can't know the details of what Miquella promised Radahn in return, but the fact that he says "if WE honor OUR part of the vow", he is probably referring to himself and Malenia (and possibly even the Tarnished). That makes me think the vow has something to do with challenging and defeating Radahn. If this is the case, it may be a subtle hint that Radahn wasn't really complicit, because his reply to Miquella was "lol sure, over my dead body".
But I feel like if it wasn’t complicit, it would have been said. They explicitly say that Mohg was charmed and Radahn not being complicit adds to the horror of the situation and the game wouldn’t hold back from showing it. Everything describes their vow as something they made together and Radahn is promised, he made a promise to Miquella, so he agreed to his end as shown in the memory. Likely the twins end of the vow was give me an honorable death (to enter the land of shadow) and revive me when I get there. It makes sense with Malenia’s line as she blooms, it basically implies that Mohg already took Miquella- so it’s ‘Hey, this is the death you wanted, Miquella is waiting for you’
@@HeraldingHistorian I refuse to believe Radahn would doom caelid, the place he grew up in to go along miquella's plan. People on miquella's side don't notice how horrifying the result of caelid was, its literally the first area we stumble upon and see how horrifying it is. Considering how miquella wasn't near Radahn on the ending cutscene, I think its safe to say it might've been a Onesided wish.
@Tigerbro6 I don't think radahn knew that malenia would bloom. I think once malenia realized she wasn't going to win fighting normally, she decided to risk it all and ensure that radahn ended up in the land of shadow with whatever means necessary I.e. aeonian bloom. But unfortunately her plan didn't work and it scarred caelid forever, so the tarnished had to finish the job
@@Tigerbro6I think their duel was supposed to be honorable sword vs sword (assuming if Radahn didn't use gravity magic against Malenia but doesn't seem that way) though it seems like Malenia didn't want to lose hence doing a desperate move Nuking Caelid
Because Miquella steal mogh corpse and make it a vessel for radahn soul, that's why new radahn has omen horn in his arm, and he able to do mogh blood skill
The complete silence and eerie glowing eyes lead me to believe that Radahn is just a puppet at this point. Radahn was an intelligent guy, he's quite capable of articulating his own thoughts on a given matter. But he doesn't, at any point. There's no reason for him to be completely silent, and it is unsettling. In my opinion, either the Rot permanently shredded his mind to such an extent that a new body wouldn't fix it, or Miquella has charmed him to hell and back.
@@mellar5864 "Master of gravity magic" - gravity magic generally relies on _intelligence_ and he had enough strength of mind to continue holding the stars back while his brain was rotted. That's not dumb muscle.
a theory i kinda dont see alot of people talk about with fair reason but still kinda interesting. is that radhan wanted nothing more than to be like godfrey and follow in his footsteps to be like a son to him. what a coincedence that the body he ends up being revived into is the son of his personal hero. I know its more likely because as an omen mohgs body is immortal and doesnt need to return to the edtree and ressurect. but its still something to think about along with the other theories. a promise made perhaps when he was younger and didnt realize the weight of those words
Dude, I was just thinking about that this morning. This seems like the most logical explaination to me. Radahn was a Godfrey fanboy, so why would he pass up the opportunity to be the lord of a new age.
I could totally see that. Radahn and Miquella as kids talking about their goals. Miquella as young people promises radahn if he becomes god he would become his consort since radahn is such a fan of the godfrey ideology. Radahn grows up and becomes great in his own right, but since miquella is cursed to youth, he still has the same mindset he did as a child. So it sort of creates an obsession. He did all of this to get radahn as his consort. All the people he killed, abandoned, and betrayed.
Right now I'm about 85% for the 4th option. I don't see Radahn as the sort that would simply "bow" to the will of another. It also adds some credence to a possible _second_ reason why Radahn halted the stars: to stop Fate (not actually for Ronni but for *_HIMSELF_* ) Miquella could have potentially known how to halt or stop or manipulate whatever Fate is in this game (as he willingly discarded his St. Trina aspect which in the cutscene was his called his Fate). This also adds weight to the reason why the War of Aeonia occurred. The armor item (Young Lion Armor) even mentions that Malenia was apparently AWARE that Radahn wasn't Miquella's kidnapper. (Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort). This essentially adds the final bit of evidence needed that Miquella _STARTED_ the Aeonian War and was willingly kidnapped by Mohg, and also fooled millions of people into their deaths. This essentially means we might be fighting an absolutely subjugated version of Radahn, having being brought back to the world of the living postmortem.
I honestly believe that Radahn has been forced to be a consort of sorts in one way or another but while he was alive blatantly refused to be one so a alternative is to kill him and bring him back in a more moldable, subservient form as seen in the dlc. Man has been done more dirty than the smear campaign against Mogh lmao.
Radahn didn't bow to Miquella as in being subjugated by him. When they were both young, Miquella asked Radahn if he would become his Lord if Miquella was able to reach Godhood, thus creating their vow to each other. And by the way, Miquella's charm only makes you like him, it doesn't grant full out mind control AND it wears off eventually. I feel like the halting of the stars has more to do with stopping outer of space monster like Astel coming into their world
@@HuMaNise34 Radahn probably agreed to the vow initially because before the shattering only an empyrean was fated to ascend to godhood so Radahn becoming the consort of the most fearsome empyrean the one most likely to be the god of a new age was probably a good deal at the time but after the shattering Radahn could've changed his mind. However Miquella would not be denied his promised lord and his chance to fix the old order with a gentler touch.
I agree with you, that would explain why Malenia goes to Caelid to kill Radhan by Miquella's request, who let himself be kidnapped by Mogh to be able to go the shadow realm.
@@sparxskywriter2589 because of his allure, not because of his deeds in particular. Yk I still simp for Ranni but what she did to Godwyn seems to be utterly horrifying.
Yeh Godwyn was described as the greatest of the demigods, perhaps he was the only decent one? We will never know cause they didn't cook well enough for this dlc lore@@dice5709
@@dice5709 ranni's goal to get rid of her fingers and give herself freedom as well as everyone else is a good one and for a radical change like that there will be hard choice and sacrifices. i'm also assuming for the ritual to work and for her to lose only her body, someone else had to lose their soul. the question is why did she choose godwyn out of all other demi-gods, was it a condition in order for the numen assassins to help ranni with the scheme so they can get revenge on marika who betrayed them?
I feel like the ending doesn't actually add anything. The actual ending I mean, not everything else. Like you beat the final boss and then you see a memory that is basically just talking about him saying exactly what just happened.
I REALLY fucking hope there’s going to be a sequel for the dlc or even a new game because wtf. SOOO many things lore wise were left tf out and the ending is trash. Like we still don’t even know who tf Melina really is and her backstory
I call shenanigans. Radahn idolized Godfrey and styled himself a warmonging general. Meanwhile, we know that Godwyn won the war against freaking dragons by the power of friendship, spared and even incorporated the dragons into the system. It should have been Godwyn!
Godwyn was more like a father to them, yes he was their brother but the statues show that he protected and looked after them. so they probs saw him as a parental figure rather than a partner.
Now that I think about it why wasn't it? Literally keep the same lore but use Godwin. Combine his lore and say "he is death in soul but not in body thus we take new body for his soul. That being mogh's body" Would have been cool
@@boyanpetrov9975 the issue is the deathblight, if his body was taken as a vessel likely any soul put into it would likely go the same way as godwyn's soul. disintegrate to goop.. also if you saw godwyn's body in the game it became nothing but a very large and deformed mushroom tree. the mushroom tree would not be able to move around as well as where it is located, it'd be next to impossible to get that large of a mass out of where it was. so to put it forward, no, if anything it'd make no sense for that to happen and it'd give far more questions than answers on how did miquella get any form of godwyn out of the hole they put his body in as well as how did miquella fix the vessel to be free of deathblight when even godwyn's friendly dragon could not.
@zuziiice8907 you misunderstood me. I meant not for godwyn's body but his soul. Let the body stay there but use moghs body as a new vessel for godwyn's soul. And either make it a deathblight boss or say that death blight is only on his old body
What a great video. It's clear that by the time the Tarnished (the player) comes into the Lands Between, Miquella has already devised many things, including using Mohg to get to the "Shadow realm", where one could become a God, outside of the Order (perhaps) controlled by the Greater Will. My guess is that the scarlet rot "traps" Radahn's soul in the world of the living, without being touched by Death (and therefore, it is not 'recycled'). This would allow Miquella to use Mohg's soulless body to reincarnate Radahn. Makes you think of Ranni/Godwyn.
To clarify, the Ranni's ending was mistranslated. Its about making a world without the influence of gods, guiding light or grace. The freedom of stars with no god looking down. True freedom. A noble goal, but you know, she stole the rune of death and had 30 assassins murder her brother. Miquella definitely wouldn't be happy with his twin sister... Regardless they had a similar goal, just Ranni' involved a lot more bloodshed.
I mean Miquella also sent Malenia to kill Radahn, which led to Caelid being nuked. They're both not above killing their siblings to achieve their goals.
technically, if you choose to believe that Radagon wasn't always Marika, Godwyn wasn't her brother. Godwyn's father was Godfrey, and mother was Marika. Ranni's parents were Radagon and Renala
@@joesaiditstrue There's also the angle of did Ranni ever see Godwyn as her brother. Yeah, Marika officially adopted her + her sibs as royal stepchildren, but from Ranni's POV, Marika is the woman her father abandoned Rennala for and left her mentally broken. Ranni probably also doesn't know Radagon = Marika, so any kinship she feels towards Godwyn is likely nil.
Ranni's ending also doesn't imply that free will is eradicated. Miquella literally wants to force everybody to his will. Ranni wants to free them from the will of gods like MIquella.
@@danielrobinson7872 maybe that soul possessing our Tarnished is us, the players. We use the Tarnished of our choosing (astrologer, gladiator, etc) with each having their own backstory, to experience the lands between
Hundreds of millions of lives lost during the shattering war, demigods slaughtered, a literal God put to the sword, and a realm torn apart…..beCAUSE MIQUELLA HAD A CRUSH?!?!?!?!?!
I just thought of something interesting. I believe that Miquella sent Melania to kill Radahn just before charming Mohg to kidnap him from his cocoon without Melania knowing so that he could travel to the land of shadow to intercept Radahn’s soul thinking that Melania would be successful. Upon killing Radahn, Melania would then return to the Haligtree and find Miquella gone. She would then track him to Mogh and kill him, not knowing that it was Miquella’s doing, thus giving Miquella the required resources to resurrect Radahn by using and manipulating his own sister.
Now of course this doesn’t go to plan and we, the Tarnished, are the ones that deliver Radahn and Mogh to Miquella. I’m going to feel so bad killing them from now on.
@@captainlorax400 I thought about this too at first and Malenia has been my favorite character since day one, so the thought of Miquella using her or charming her when she was already in so much pain made me furious. But then I also thought about how Malenia was just so devoted to Miquella from the start that there wasn’t even a need to charm her. She was as loyal as loyalty can get so he didn’t charm her and told her all of his plans. She most likely willingly went along with them, not caring if she died for the cause because Miquella could supposedly bring her back even after death as a god. Basically Miquella’s idea boils down to: “I want to be a god so I’ll do whatever corrupt and terrible things I have to do to get there and then I’ll fix it all later.”
@@SuperFizzah Yeah straight up, the whole time I was playing and talking to Ansbach I took note of how Miquella was so good that it makes him evil in a way. Even if Malenia agreed to the plans and could be brought back to life later, should she have died, it’s still suspicious that Miquella was so willing to send his sister to war. I know I wouldn’t even if I could bring her back, and I don’t think Malenia would be willing to send Miquella to war if the rolls were reversed. The hypocrisy and blind faith in Miquella’s plan is so obvious. And also, how could he even know for sure that he’d have resurrecting abilities? Because Marika sure didn’t. Malenia was used in a way, even if she was willing.
I understand why they did Rahdahn but it should have been Godwyn 😬 - Miquella also refers to Godwyn as "Lord brother" in golden epitaph wishing for him to have a true death -Godwyn failed resurrection at castle sol -Miquella wanting to save "Those who live In Death" -Miquella becomes a God and with that Godwyn, the prince of death ascends to Lord/King of Death -Bringing it full circle with Godwyn being death being the catalyst for the shattering and ending it with not just his resurrection but giving Godwyn the "Lordling" a true death.
In the end you still get insidious, manipulative Miquella but at least reviving Godwyn makes a little more sense HELL he bewitched Mogh into making the MoghWYN dynasty literally fusing their names.
@@user-sp3pn2cs4e to me, this DLC is disappointing. Yea, beautiful map and world building, new items, it's like an Elden Ring 1.50... but too much hype. In the end, we do not know anything, just miquella's plan. That's it. Messmer? Semi-explained, but not much. Gloam-eyed queen? Nah. The DLC story trailer shows Marika holding a golden thread taken from a corpse. The golden order (before the exile of the rune of death) was born this way? IDK Let's just wait theories, but to me the lore is a big disappointment EDIT: after some weeks, a lot of lore has been revealed, and itbis amazing, but this DLC is a little disappointing anyway
I certainly think Godwyn would have been more interesting as a final boss but, at the end of the day, this is what we got and if we want to piece together the lore and the story we just have to work with what we are given.
It makes no sense that Radahn would willingly choose to be his consort. He held back the stars because he was destined to align with Miqeulla, and Ms. Goddess of Rot had to make sure he couldn't do so anymore.
The vow of consort was very probably based on the premise that radhan dies in a battle. He is the warmongering warrior type so it makes sense that he accepted to be a consort IF he fell in battle
I'm trying to remember off hand if the language was exact, but could this possibly mean that Miquella never wished to revive Godwyn at all? He was always referring to Radahn?
@@dracopo8862You must've forgotten that the Church of the Eclipse and Miquella wanted to resurrect Godwyns soul during the eclipse, but couldn't because his soul was eliminated by Destined Death
@@joesaiditstrue "A sword made to commemorate the death of Godwyn the Golden, first of the demigods to die. Infused with the humble prayer of a young boy; "O brother, lord brother, please die a true death." "
I wonder if Messmer & Melina's father is Midra, Lord of the Frenzied Flame? Both Messmer & Melina have kindling within them that can burn the Erdtree & the trailer talked about an affair. Maybe Marika had Messmer & Melina while Godfrey was away fighting the fire giants.
Unfortunately there is a body in Midra's castle that holds an item called 'Nanaya's Torch' and the body has the same clothes that the lady in the painting with Midra has so its probably not Marika. I feel like the 'affair' might refer to an agreement between Marika and an outer god to have her be the vessel for the elden ring. idk tho...Could also maybe refer to the initial joining of Marika and Radagon (if they were ever separate to begin with, which in itself is up for debate)
I think Radagon is the father not only because of the red hair but also "Messmer" follows the naming convention of the demigod siblings (Miquella/Malenia, Ranni/Rykard/Radahn) and when he takes off his helmet he's similar in appearance to Malenia
All you see in the DLC is the steps and path Marika took to become a goddess before coming to the Lands Between , I think she had Messmer and Melina before ever meeting Godfrey. If we go by the steps Miq took to become a god at the divine gate, Merika needed a lord and the only lord you fight in the land of shadows is Sage Midra. The lady we see in the pictures in Midras Manse is Merika but going by Nanaya. Now my theory is that she gave birth two the two children Messmer and Melina they were both Demi gods or Empyreans each a host to an Outer God one the flame of rune and the other death. She sends Messmer back to the land of shadows to enact her revenge for the Shaman people, and we know what happens to Melina
That's something that I noticed people complaining about, the lack of an explanation to what's going on, except there is plenty of lore that tells you what's going on, you just have to look for it
I might go with the theory that either Radahn changed his mind, or he might have been compelled at first. Later after the shattering/acquiring a great rune, breaks out of a spell. I think this because timeline wise, if Radahn said yes, what was stopping him and Miquella from becoming a lord and god soon after the shattering? I don't know if Miquella needed to destroy his flesh in order to do it, Marika seemed able to become a god and keep her flesh. Malenia's words to Radahn also seem more ominous than anything as well, but I guess it's up to interpretation.
Radahan didn’t want to go down without getting the final battle and when he did duel the strongest person maleina he was supposed to go to realm of shadow but he didn’t he stayed and got eternal aids and we the tarnished killed him and put miquella plan into motion
I think the most obvious answer is that Radahn promised Miquella the way one promises any child who asks if you'll marry them when they grow up: you laugh, say of course, and completely expect them to grow out of it. But Miquella is an obsessive, mind-controlling codependent psycho.
Due to both Mohg and Radahn being required for the dlc but nothing else i took it as Radahn turned Miquella down, or Miquella was talking to Mohg in his young cutscene. Seems like either way he needed Radahns soul separated from the rot after Malenia and put it into Mohgs body. Possibly Radahn at the end is actually Mohg
well, with how miquella was talking about him being the winner of the festival, likely that "war" was actually a festival to see who would win rights to be miquella's consort.
I missed Ansbachs quest but that's really cool that he reveals the mohg body snatching. I was confused enough when Radahn showed up and even morseo when he starts using bloodflame
You should read the Sumerian poem of inannas/Ishtars descent into the underworld, miquellas journey and discarding of their items throughout is similar to what happens to inanna
I like a theory I saw in a video that says that he agreed to the be his consort but miquella abandoned the order to which radahn is faithful to which made radahn change his mind.
I believe Radahn didnt agreed to be Miquella's consort He seems kinda loyal to the Golden order or at least he respects it, for instance we know that Godfrey was his biggest inspiration and Godfrey was the first Elden Lord and previous consort of Marika.
So just something I think is interesting that i'd like to add as to why Radahn could be forced into this: Radahn still had Marika's golden glow in his eyes until he was infected with scarlet rot. Siding with Miquella willingly would mean that Radahn would go against Marika, so he would have lost grace sooner. We know that Marika will drop anybody who is no longer of use to her, as she did with Godfrey. Also, I think there's definitely some symbolism of Miquella wrapping his arms around Radahn's neck. Just something I thought would he cool to mention, I'd like to hear what everyone else thinks tho
Godfrey WAS useful for her: As a trump card to sweep the Lands Between and and make a glorious return to Lordship in case the demigods would fail to duke it out conclusive. Likely, Godfrey was aware and on board with plan
Holy shit. Bro do yall remember during their fight, malenia said something to radahn just before she bloomed. What if she said something like "youll be his consort one way or another"
Something I noticed just an hour ago playing with Radahns armour on is that the armour (both the OLD and the new) has Miquellas sigil/emblem on the upper part of the cape! The same sigil that appears when casting Miquellas spells! It's literally on Radahns back even in the base game! You can also find St.Trinas sword in Caelid, as well as a large amount of Miquella Lillies overlooking Radahns arena (it's got the most dense amount of Miquella Lilies in the game).
Could it be that Radahn's soul cannot enter the Land of Shadows due to Marika locking away destined death and thus he is stuck as a broken husk in Caelid? And when the Tarnished finally ended him, he is free but without Destined Death he is kept from coming into the Land of Shadows to meet Miquella? Could it be that Malenia's devotion to Miquella was also compelled? Can't believe she would actually leave Miquella unguarded in the Haligtree and let Mohg just waltz in unchallenged unless it was all planned for Malenia to destroy Radahn. Seems like a secret only the three of them knee. We can probably make a more interesting guess as to what Malenia whispered to Radahn before blooming. "As I await his return" So we can speculate that by 'return', Malenia meant that Miquella and Radahn would do what they sought out to do. All that's left is for the Tarnished to play along unwittingly to retrieve the Rune of Death and remove all opposition in the Lands Between (Marika/Radagon and the Elden Beast) nder the pretense of restoring order.
I really think that Radann didn't want to be Miquella's consort and that's why he sent Malenia to kill him. Miquella looks like a very manipulative person, and this theory proves this even more.
i am of the final school of thought. there are many reasons but the one i am fixated on is the compulsion aspect of miquellas kindness. order of thoughts one: his grab attack is a two hit instant win where the tarnish swear fealty with the end title being heart stolen two: he is shown to of been constantly hugging his twin three: Radhan and malania fight DURING the shattering a war from which no lord arose four: Margit defeated radhan in the begining of the war before he became MASSIVE as seen in the opening of the game five: Saint trina can pull anyone into a slumber and is known to quell the outer-god the freenzied flame( kalia questline) Six: Fort Sol is dedicated to trying to find a way to revive a demigod The fort is under his control Seven: Melania is passed out cold before we fight her eight: ranni found a way to split the body and soul and kicked off the shattering, this takes placed after miquella finds out that the golden order can do nothing to save melania nine: Messmer who still follows his mothers orders allows miquella to pass on abated even though he lacks graces but still holds a great rune Ten: he removes saint trina from himself, his own cross states its his mercy or something to that effect elven: Trina begs for us to kill miquella, since they were once one she would know him best twelve: There is mhogs feelings on the matter, that being wierd as hell, one would think it would be the formless mother he would want to be the knew god but instead it is miquella and finally there are all the berserk refences and miquella being griffif is a common allusion.
Tbh with the ending I find them to be more similar than ever. Look at Grifith post resurrection. He wants everyone to come to falconia because it's the last safe place on earth. And you can live safe and free under Grifiths kingdom and see all your dead relatives and everything's gonna be OK....meanwhile the rest of the world's turning to shit because of him. Now look at Miquella, same thing wants everyone under his rule, his kingdom. Weather you want it that way or not...
@@kevinfortsch thank you you're the first person to speak properly of the griffith references hahaha people seem to forget that when griffith revived also and started his machinations to change the world and create falconia, that he sacrificed like a bunch of people to get there. Miquella did the same, Caelid, Haligtree, Even his most loyal followers working with Lady Leda. Doomed all their lives as he shed his humanity completely for godhood. He commited the same sins Marika did to rise, I feel like Miquella's kingdom is doomed from the start. The lands between is completely far gone because of all of this. All because he selfishly wanted Radahn to go along his plan and overthrow the Golden Order. But its too late to save anyone so what would be MIquella's prerogative? We sadly don't get to know that, but I'm glad we actually fought Radahn in his prime. Always wanted that since the first trailer and always felt that Starscourge was not enough
@@Tigerbro6The way I see it, Miquella just truly believes that he will be able to succeed where Marika failed. He is too arrogant/jaded to see that he is already walking the same path and, like you said, thinks that he will just be able to make everything better once he becomes a god. And then our Tarnished comes along and stops his new dynasty before he can even get it started.
The line "If *we* honor our part of the vow" confuses me... Who is "we"? There's really only 3 options here: 1. *He refers to himself and Radahn* This doesn't make much sense because of the end of the sentence. The condition that "if they should honour part of the vow", Radahn should promise to be his consort, is illogical in itself. Radahn being Miquella's consort is most likely his part of the vow, so him fulfilling the condition (honouring the vow) and the desired result (him being Miquellas consort) cannot be one and the same act. We can also assume that he is talking directly to Radahn in the memory, so why should he adress himself and Radahn collectively in the subordinate clause, and then adress him with "you" in the main clause? Makes no sense. So it's much more likely that it's one of these two options: 2. *He refers to himself and Malenia* I find this one to be the most likely, because I, too, assume the main purpose of the battle of Aeonia was to kill Radahn and make his soul susceptible for the ritual with Mohg's body. Especially given the item description of the Young Lion's armor: "When Malenia, Blade of Miquella, let the rotflower blossom in Aeonia, Radahn heard a murmur in his ear- "Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort." However, I have a problem with this option. Let's say we assume that the memory is taken from a long time ago, potentially from even before the shattering. To me it seems as though the conversation in the memory is one of equality, both Radahn and Miquella talking and agreeing about their parts of the vow. It begs the question, what exactly was the content of the vow? What was Radahn promised in return for being Miquella's consort? If we assume Miquella promised him the same thing as us in the fight: "I promise you. A thousand year voyage guided by compassion.", and Radahn accepted this because of his "kindness" and good nature, why would they have to go through the elaborate act of killing Radahn and destroying all of Caelid in the attempt to do so, only to then revive his soul into Mohg's body? There must have been a shift in Radahn's mind. He must have changed his opinion on the vow. Either he was initially deceived and then found out that Miquella's promise to him was a lie, or perhaps he changed his mind after the shattering. We can't say for sure. 3. *He refers only to himself, however including St. Trina, thus using plural* In the DLC we come to find out that St. Trina has her own physical body, and that she exists apart from Miquella, even though she is still implied to be his discarded alter ego. Was she perhaps also involved in this vow? To me it seems like in the game, St. Trina is being portrayed as morally superior to Miquella, exposing the fallacy behind "Kind Miquella" and how we, the Tarnished, have to stop him from achieving godhood by killling him. So maybe St. Trina being involved in the vow was what moved Radahn to agreeing in the first place? And Miquella ridding himself of his alter ego is what caused the shift in Radahn's will to honour his part of the vow and become Miquella's consort? It's kinda frustrating that the final dialogue we get of Miquella is so open ended, but honestly what did we expect? Please let me know what you guys think about these thoughts! :-)
dont a lot of gay people refer to themselves as plural these days? I'd like to add i think its neat theres a gay ending. Fits with a lot of the themes and settings
Maybe St. Trina is The One Person He Couldn't Charm.... and She Went around Warning People and It Got Back to The General. Then Miqqi over here goes around saying His Alter Ego Is the Female He Couldn't Run Game On and She Even Went To The Shadow Realm to Tell On Miqqi.... Hmmmmm Miqqi is One Cold Empyrean incest baby😂😂 #salserojerseytv
All this new lore makes me think that Ranni's Age of Stars is possible the best ending by removing the influence of the Greater Will. (Now let's wait for more lore to understand shadow of the erdtree)
I think Radahn refused. I think the battle of Aeonia was part of the conditions that miquella needs to steal the heart of Radahn so he could have a fully compliant lord consort strong enough to topple the Golden Order. His armor set states “When Melania, Blade of Miquella, let the rot flower bloom in Aeonia she whispered these words in his ear. ‘Miquella is waiting, promised consort’” I think the battle was intended to lay the groundwork for Radahn’s subjugation. He could only be subjugated after his death and that’s why he fought so hard to live through it and why melenia was willing to sacrifice her pride to make it happen. That’s the only justification I can think of for Radahn leaving Leonard behind, he only learned gravity magic to ride his beloved steed after all.
What a masterpiece. Everytime i saw Radhan using that blood slash in his boss fight got me puzzled, now that you get that he is using Mogh's body makes so much sense. He doesn't know how to use blood magic but since his "body" have familiarity with, he can do one type o move that involves this magic. FromSoftware is on another level.
Miquella also knew that it could be quite useful to have a Lord that could control the stars, for in the stars are Fate writ. Notice that Miquella has four arms, not unlike the Wraithcallers. Like the Wraithcallers, Miquella can sway spirits, and hearts, to his designs.
@@BlackfangDragon in-game it is a symbol of Wraithcallers and the marionettes. Wraithcallers and Miquella both have Royal Revenants in their employ, and both know how to manipulate souls.
@@falgalhutkinsmarzcal3962 Except Miquella only gets extra arms AFRER he ascends and becomes a Divine being, one who has discarded everything else about himself including his flesh. It’s a sign of how he’s ascended.
Hey folks! Just wanted to say thanks for all the views and positive feedback on this video. I've never had a video get anywhere close to this number of views, so I'm very grateful to everyone who engaged with this one. I'll be dropping a follow up video on Tuesday taking a close look at all five sides of the debate about the vow between Miquella and Radahn. I have a pretty clear opinion on what I think happened, but I do believe all five sides are valid interpretations and I suspect we'll be arguing about which one is right forever! By the way - I will attempt to corral my reDAHNS in that video, but my Philly accent is a force to be reckoned with, so no promises 🤣🤣🤣
I think Miquella(Griffith like) Compelled Radahn to be his Lord But Radahn was so strong that he could deny it (a la Guts). After the shattering, Malenia, Blade of Miquella(Casca-esque) tried to take Radahn to Miqullea by force. That failed and when she was brought back her Rot started to infect his HaligTree. Already in his cocoon and Radahn still going off, he plots Radahn's death, Compelled Mohg to take him away. Perhaps he was going to sacrifice Those at the Haligtree to enter the realm of shadow, and the tree rotting foiled that. So instead just use blood. And the Blood of a Hornsent/Omen. Messmer was just left to his Genocidal Duties because Marika was Racist, but she hid away the Shadow Tree and the Tower to ensure that no other God could Ascend to her status. The Greater Will just wants a new toy or perhaps there never was a Greater Will. Since Miquella in his God form was more a kin to Halenia, Goddess of Rot, Rather than the Vessel for the Elden Ring. To me that is the most sound explanation of events. But i still need to do St. Trina stuff, so SMH.
I think this is a pretty good line of thought. I've always seen Miquella as like, the ultimate targaryen: convinced that he is the main character and everything revolves around him (I'll fix scarlet rot, destroy the erdtree and it's roots, cure my sister, give Godwyn a true death, bring albuniurics into an order, and lower gas prices).
You can't compare Casca to Malenia, really. Casca proposed to Gats to abandon crippled Griffith, which conversation finally broke the latter when he overheard it. Casca was a trully horrible person.
I think you are just trying to read Berserk's story into Elden Ring and make the story of the latter conform with the former. Yes, all Soulsborne is filled with references to Berserk, which are almost always very explicit, such as the enemy and boss designs, but I think it is important to judge Elden Ring's story purely by what is given to us in the game and to not try to bring elements from other stories in order to try and figure out what happens in the game. I think completely different pictures of the characters are painted if you do such a thing.
He didn’t try convincing Radahan once of the items in the game says miquella can charm everyone but one miquella told Radahan his plan to usher in a age of compassion and we all know Radahan was nice a So agreed to it but he needed to be killed and he was gonna die honorable so miquella sent his sister and when they dueled it ended in a stalemate and the scarlet rot didn’t kill Jim we the tarnished did and thts how Everything in dlc transpired
Radahn did not want to be gay so he rejected his ass, but even after we kill him in the main game, he somehow takes his soul and puts it in mogh body and forced to serve him yeah honestly this is really messed up.
I dont really get why there was so much focus on godwyn and miquellas relationship...i wouldnt be alone in thinking he was supposed to be consort...and perhaps thats why ranni eliminated his soul.
I personally think the only reason why Godwyn wasnt able to become his consort was because of the death of his soul. Radahn was essentially the strongest demi-god after the shattering, so Miquella bewitching him makes sense(and it draws Parallels between Miquella and Marika, and Radahn and Godfrey).
I think before Godwyn's death, He and Miquella had some sort of close relationship. The statue that has a person (likely Godwyn) protecting Miquella & his sister has one odd thing about it... there is death blight (Godwyn's plant from his corpse) growing on it in one spot... it is legitimately sprouting out of Miquella's ass. Idk if it is a joke by the creators but I saw a post on reddit about it. It looks like it was deliberately created like that and it is hard to miss once you see it.
Godwyns death was pre shattering. The demigods would've reasonably changed drastically over the course of a major war between them. It's just world building that miquella cared deeply for the very first true loss his family ever suffered
i assume Godwyn was miquellas 1st choice for consort, since he is also described as strong and honorable(befriending dragons). Hence all that shit that happens in Castle Sol and the description of the wep in there. ANd when its clear that Godwyns souls is gone, then the radahn shit happened, just my 2 cents on the topic.
@@eleele-ui5il I don't know, but it's so baffling. There's all sorts of extremely fucked up things happening in ER, but somehow what gets under people's skin is... incest? Lmfao
The whole marriage concept is weird in this game. The turtle neck item description says that people no longer have sex in the lands between (pre 1.0 patch) and there's the whole business about how people are born. It's heavily implied that the erdtree is the thing that births people, but not 100% clear. This makes me wonder some things: why an Elden Lord is necessary and what does the holder of that title do (or what does that title even mean, for that matter). One other thing that I conclude with all this is that incest and homosexuality are not a thing (since people don't have sex and don't have children through "natural" means), so Miquella "marrying" his brother is not really taboo, I'd say
Our tarnished strive to become lords, no other can stand before us. The flame of ambition shall not be snuffed out! Also, Miquella is a straight-up brainwashing tyrant. Whether his rule is just or not, no one would have a choice in his world.
Its cool that we finally know what Malenia whispered in Radahn's ear in the trailer, we've been wondering for years! From the Young Lion's Helm: "The golden helm worn by Radahn in his younger years. Proudly displaying his heroic red hair, it is fitting attire for a lion. When Malenia, Blade of Miquella, let the rotflower blossom in Aeonia, Radahn heard a murmur in his ear- "Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort." This means that presumably, Miquella had already been taken by Mohg by the time the two fought (not during the battle while Malenia was away) and Malenia was sent to kill Radahn so his soul could be manifested in the Land or Shadow (which is why we have to finish the job before we can start the DLC).
From my point of view I think it's most likely that Radahn initially agreed to become Miquella's consort. but later turned against the deal. The lore seems to place Radahn and Miquella both as a followers of the golden order early on. This is the point in time when the memory conversation took place. Miquella planned to succeed Marika as the new god with Radahn as his elden lord and consort. But after Miquella abandoned golden order fundamentalism when it couldn't cure Malenia's scarlet rot and he started his own new faction, that's when Radahn turned on the deal, as Miquella was not planning to uphold the golden order after Marika but replace it with his own new age. When the shattering began, Radahn initially claimed a great rune and assaulted Leyendell to become the golden order's new elden lord in a desprate attempt to change his own fate, but failed when Morgott unexpectedly emerged and repelled him, explaining that 1 pannel in the game's opening cutscene with Morgott and Radahn fighting. So then Radahn came up with a new plan, to stop the stars/fate in night sky. It's likely Radahn didn't even know about Ranni's plan to defy the golden order and stopping her plans was probably just a coincidence. His main purpose was to stop his own fate of becoming Miquella consort. Miquella then sends Malenia and her army to kill Radahn for 2 purposes, for the night sky to resume so Radahn's fate as Miquella's consort can continue and so his soul gets sent to the realm of shadow.
That's really good. It gives a deeper reason for WHY Radahn would reject a promise which was *allegedly* made. Radahn was a Golden Order fan boy with his idols being Radagon and Godfrey and Miquella didn't hold up his end of the bargain.
My issue with the idea of "Radahn wanted a worthy death" why though? There is 0 reason for him to willingly want to die (even if he knew he'd come back). On the other hand there can be few reasons why I believe Radahn didn't want to become Miquella consort. 1 - Radahn is literally holding back fate, by holding stars (this would suggest more personal reason as to why he did so. He did it to escape his own fate of joining Miquella, which also accidentally screwed with Ranni). And he would know about it since he is part of Carian Royalty 2 - Radahn is noted to be kind in his remembrance. I doubt he would be willing to screw over Mohg/anybody else just because he wanted a worthy death.
All endings are mutually excluding and stand as opposition to each other. Miquellas ending wouldn't be anything special, this is not the reason why not to give us the age of compassion ending. The only reason we have no choice but to fight Miquella isn't because we are a threat to Miquellas age and he to our ending where we become a Lord, it's because we weren't given a choice to not fight him in the first place. There was no quest or an ending given where we side with him instead of fighting him. Why were we deprived from that? Why are we being forced by the game to become an Elden Lord? We had a choice not to link the flame in the Dark Souls 1 and 3, why are we being forced now to become Elden lord? We were brought back to life so we can become Elden Lord just like we were brought back to life as an ash so we can link the flame and yet we were given an option to not link the flame (even though it wasn’t a canonical ending in DS1) but we weren’t given an option to not become Elden Lord? Just because we were brought back to life so we can become a Lord that doesn’t mean we should become one and it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be able to step down, there were so many other Tarnished who decided to do something else with the life that was given to them. Miquella’s age of compassion would be an ending where we would step down from the position of a lord, it was really a missed opportunity. We aren’t even an Elden Lord yet, like Miquella said we are an “aspiring lord". We were given a choice to join Ranni (an empyrean) but we weren’t given a choice to join Miquella (also an empyrean)? Although the position of a consort is full, Miquella still calls us to join him ,,let us go together’’ AND EVEN CASTS HIS HAND TOWARDS US IN THE SAME MANNER RANNI DOES WHEN WE MARRY HER. We could become Miquellas champion just like Radagon was during the Liurnian wars (When Marikas consort was Godfrey). So many other characters were given multiple endings, and yet a character as important as Miquella wasn’t? Even tho the age that Miquella promises is morally questionable it doesn't mean we shouldn't be able to side with his view. We were able to become A Frenzied lord and dung lord, which are both morally wrong endings( the one burns the world the other curses it). If we were to follow the same logic, we wouldn't have gotten those 2 endings. I don't care if Miquellas age of compassion would be filled with brainwashed zombies, that's not a reason to not give us another ending to the game. The choice to kill Miquella isn't obvious: Would you kill one person and let everyone be brainwashed or would you spare the person and let everyone be brainwashed? Giving us a singular solution to the problem ( kill Miquella) is a bad story telling decision and its undermining Miquellas character. Therefore, morality isn’t the reason the age of compassion got killed off. Why weren’t we given then a chance to join Miquella? The only real reason is because the writer didn’t want us to do anything else but kill him and become an Elden Lord. For me, this is a very disappointing reason and ruins the DLC (from story perspective the gameplay was amazing). Let me make myself clear, im mad because i wasn't given an option ,by the game, to chose if i want to join Miquella or kill him, not because the ending itself is bad (i think its a legitimate choice to kill Miquella but it shouldn't be an only one).
why werent you given a choice to not kill gwyn? why werent you given a choice to free gherman? why werent you given the choice to do anything? your complaints are rather silly, the age of compassion from god form miquella would never come to pass the way pre-god mequilla intended, thats the moral of the story. also this is a dlc ending, not a freakin main game ending, so comparing them is silly and mindless. man the complaints about this dlc are getting stupid. imo this dlc is laughably above any other dlc, hell this expansion alone is better than bb or ds3s main games XD
I didn’t play the dlc yet but I feel like considering radahns character I feel like he said “give me a good battle or defeat me in battle and I will be your consort” he did respect Godfrey the most also it could’ve been he sunt malenia to nuke him but i don’t get why if malenia was strong why she couldn’t be the consort is it because she was already god level?
I feel like we’re missing something. I feel like we could do something with the golden circlet received and the blossom received from St. Trina. Those do not feel like endgame items, but rather keys. I just don’t know where to use them. I could just be desperate for more of an ending though.
i personally doubt radahn was mind controlled because the goal was for him to die, so there wouldn't be a need for that, unless he was mind controlled into taking his own life, which he didn't. i also doubt that radahn didn't agree since the whole thing is that there was a promise made. this leaves one possibility, miquella said that he will give radahn a good fight and a glorious death in battle and in turn after radahn dies he will become lord so he can keep fighting forever. this is also why he kept the stars away, to keep ranni's fate from interfering with his own for as long as he could until the time would come that he would be one with miquella
As Rhadan is the best character in Elden Ring I was so happy when he appeared before subsequently having that happiness beaten out of me by his two swords. Can’t wait for all the lore videos, it feels like almost every part of the lore has been expanded.
Radahn likely learned gravity magic to halt the stars because he knew of both Ranni's and Miquella's plan and rejected them both. Radahn is actually smaller in his prime, but grew massive and had his skin changed to stone after becoming the Starscourge, so I don't believe he learned it only to ride his horse Leonard. Radahn was a "leal hound of the Golden Order" just like his Father, Radagon. His emblems he showed off were of the two Elden Lords, Godfrey and Radagon. Both Ranni and Miquella would threaten the Golden Order, either by removing the influence of the gods entirely or by having the god (Miquella) being intimately influencing everything with his ability to compel affection. There is no way he would side with his sister or his half-brother, and likely learned gravity magic to halt the stars (and likely his own fate) after learning of both of their plots. This is why we see the Starscourge, not the Prime Radahn, fighting Malenia. Miquella originally was like Radahn, and supported the Golden Order. We see in the Ymir questline and in the golden order incantations that something caused Miquella to abandon the Order, and everything else, to become a god. Miquella's original plan was to have Radahn become his consort, and to abandon everything in the Land's between. We see this because he was draining his Empyrean blood in his Haligtree, seemingly to challenge the power of the Erdtree. When Radahn refused, Miquella made a new plan. He had to have Radahn killed to loose his soul and the stars, then have Mohg, Lord of Blood, drain his Empyrean blood and continue the plan in the Land of Shadow instead. So Miquella waited centuries in the Cocoon, hoping that a Tarnished would kill the two demigods for him. This is likely why he employed so many of them to his cause, from all walks of life. He just didn't pick the right Tarnished. Miquella is a monster, without love. We know this, because his capacity to love was embodied in St. Trina, who he discarded below the Earth. Radahn never consented to being Lord to a foreign order, which is why he still has no voicelines and his eyes glow yellow. When Radahn rejected his affection, he sicced Malenia on him to kill him, then took advantage of Mogh to eventually steal his body. This is why Morgott calls all of the demigods, bar Mogh, willful traitors. Godrick employed grafting when assaulting the Capitol ended in failure Miquella betrayed the Golden Order by seeking a new one Malenia fought by Miquella's side Radahn sought the Elden Ring after the shattering, we see him fighting Morgott in a piece of art (But Morgott says his name with respect, seemingly) Rykard gave himself to the serpent Ranni gave herself to the moon, and killed her brother Godwyn
I definitely feel like this was supposed to be Godwyn and was changed because Radahn became so popular. There's just a lot of stuff that connects better to Godwyn than it does to him... Not to mention the irony/foreshadowing of Mogh's dynasty being 'Moghwyn' and then him literally being used to rebuild Godwyn half and half.
It feels weird that they would replace godwyn because of radahn's popularity, when many people where hyped for the dlc to see more about godwyn and miquella, making theories about the as popular as radahn was.
No, this feels like Cope. Godwyn's soul was dead and I think people are putting far too much onto Godwyn because we got so little of him. It's explicitly stated over and over again that godwyn's body is all that remains, his soul was completely gone when Ranni organized the Night of Black Knives.
say it with me guys. GODWYN'S SOUL IS DESTROYED. repeat 5 times, Godwyn's soul is destroyed. They made it sooo clear in the base game how terrifying it is that a demigod's soul can be destroyed, that's why Maliketh sealed Destined Death. Why is it so hard to understand?
@@sparxskywriter2589 could have had tarnished kill ranni, since she orchestrated it, also could have used godwyns fish body to put radhans soul in. i mean, he made mogh into radahn, ya know
I think radahn turned down miquella and as a carian he's ate relies on stars movement he then proceeds to conquer them and hold them back leading miquella to send malenia to kill radahn
Miquella’s actions may have been questionable, but once I beat him I felt like a monster. Especially after reading the remembrance. It was such a sudden and massive drop in climax that I began questioning whether I should’ve left him alone or not.
But that's just the thing. Unlike the others in the Land of Shadow, we still see the Grace of Gold. Even if we were already Elden Lord in the base game, Miquella's actuons force us into action. There's also the fact he abandoned his love and compassion, traits necessary for truly good ruler. If his grand plan for the Age of Compassion was to just charm everyone like he tries to us in the fight, it'sno better than mind control. It sounds like a rule that's peaceful but stripped of free will. That's my 2 cents anyway.
what about the HEART STOLEN moment. IF we are the Elden Lord can still be affected by that spell how do we know that Mohgg, Radhan and even Melenia were not also under Miquella''s control too ?
I feel like everyone is focusing on the same aspects of the story, but something I want to know (and I haven’t heard anyone talk about it), is what did Miquella pull out of Godwyn’s eye and offer to the divine gate in the trailer? They showed that in the trailer like it was important, and then there was nothing about it in the actual game 🤷🏼♂️
I’m of the thought that Radahn refused Miquella’s request. Radahn seems like he would be too prideful to bend the knee to another. Plus, it seems like Radahn was more aligned with Ranni and Rykard more than anything. Rykard helped with Ranni’s plan to kill Godwyn and maybe the reason was because Godwyn would become Miquella’s consort so in order to stop that, she destroyed his soul. I also believe Radahn’s conquest of the stars is unrelated to the plots of the other demigods. I believe he did that just to call down the star beast (Astel and fallingstar beast) in order to fight them.
Astel almost assuredly came long before radahn as they were buried long before the golden order had conquered everything so still during the Godfrey era
radahn is too chad to let another man mount him. so miquella seethes and brought him back unwillingly through death without his consent. worst lil boy period. yuck.
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Something I wanted to add that might lend credence to the theory that Radahn is being forced to be a consort is that he doesn’t have his horse. I don’t think Radahn would want to be lord to someone if he didn’t have his mighty steed with him.
wasn't it also likke that he learned gravity magic so he was still able to ride his beloved horse despite his huge size?
@@shinrok Yep, the dude is easily one of the most wholesome characters in the game.
I don’t remember what description it was and I haven’t watched the vid yet so idk if it’s discussed but it said something abt miquela being able to get everyone to follow him blindly but one person
Radahn likes battle, Miquella wants peace, their ideologies are too incompatible.
Well, also the fact that Malenia had to go-to Caelid and spread her rotussy indicates that he was probably reluctant to be Miquellas consort.
This golden femboy really has boundary issues, he even charmed Mohg without consent lol
So, since we are now talking about DLC lore, here are some thoughts about it:
-We know from the Remembrance that Miquella wanted Radahn as his consort since childhood, but it isn’t stated anywhere that Radahn agreed to it or even that he had a choice. It is entirely possible that Radahn did not become a promised consort because he wanted to, but because Miquella’s “heartfelt wish” simply became part of Radahn’s fate. There would be no need for Miquella to bewitch Radahn if the general cannot escape his fate.
-Except that Radahn does escape his fate, because he conquered the stars, as we know from the base game. And that is where the Battle of Aeonia comes in: it is highly unlikely that Malenia was unaware of Miquella’s plan; after all the twins are not rivals like the other demigods are, they’re quite close. The battle would be unnecessary if Radahn had agreed to become Miquella’s consort, but since he didn’t, Miquella sends Malenia to Caelid in order to kill Radahn while he bewitches Mohg.
-Through Sir Ansbach questline we learn that Miquella used Mohg to access the Land of Shadow, which he needed to do in order to become a god and later revive Radahn (and is also the place where the creator of the Scarlet Rot, Romina, is; and we know Miquella was trying to cure Malenia, so I don’t think it is a coincidence). But while he succeeds in his part of plan, Malenia does not. As she releases her scarlet rot across Caelid, Radahn hears a whisper that tells him Miquella is waiting for him, a sign that he was supposed to die in that battle in order to be revived as Miquella’s consort. By surviving Malenia’s Scarlet Aeonia, Radahn loses his mind, but keeps his freedom.
-However, while blocking his own fate with his victory over the stars, Radahn also blocked Ranni’s fate, interfering with her plans. Perhaps it wasn’t even what he intended, but it motivated Ranni to get rid of him. Which she does, by sending to the festival the only individual who has a chance against Radahn: our Tarnished. Due to the influence of his sister (or due to Alexander telling us about the festival; funny how either a demigod or a jar can be the cause of Radahn’s damnation), the general dies and his soul is now vulnerable to Miquella.
-In the Land of Shadow, Miquella succeeds in becoming a god and manages to revive Radahn, now under his direct control. We can say his plan is a success, and the only reason Miquella’s victory is short lived is because our Tarnished, literally the strongest individual in the Lands Between, fights his/her way through the Land of Shadow and kills Miquella before he can do anything with his newfound power, thus ending Miquella’s “gentle world” before it can even begin.
-I suppose this puts into perspective just how important our Tarnished really is. The only reason characters like Ranni, Fia, Shabriri, Brother Corhyn and even the Dung Eater in his own twisted way, have a chance of accomplishing their objectives is the fact that they bring our Tarnished to their side, and even then it all boils down to whether or not we want to help them. Looking at it from a lore perspective, Miquella’s only mistake is the fact that he doesn’t think to recruit the individual who not only took down Radahn the first time, but also defeated Messmer, Romina, Rellana and even a revived Radahn in his prime.
-Miquella’s key to success would be offering the tarnished the chance to serve him, or perhaps more accurately, being blessed by the devs with his own ending, which could very well have been planned at some point because we can side with Leda twice during the DLC, we can rat out other NPCs to her, and if I am not mistaken we were told the DLC would have some “choices” in it (dammit FromSoftware this was the perfect opportunity, there should be an ending where you side with Miquella and I will die on this hill).
(Sorry for the long post, I just really liked the lore in the DLC).
to add on to Radahn not working with Miquella is that by holding the stars Radahn prevented Miquella from killing (or reviving) Godwyn
Actually, i think Malenia knew the plan
If u read the description in his younger helm, Radahn heard Malenia mumble before she nuke the caelid : “Miquella await thee, promise consort”
It could also be that it was never Miquella's fate to get to the point of ushering in his new era. I like the theory that Miquella's curse is actually 'unlimited potential' (infinite youth and never growing up can be the symbolism for this) while Malenia's curse is 'unlimited actuality'. Both opposites of each other in true twin fashion lol Miquella may of had all the power to usher in an age of compassion but none of it was real, his love was a spell after all. Essentially the god of what could have been
@@lanxinus4154 Indeed. Pretty cruel on Malenia's part, as she is basically saying to Radahn that he is going to lose his life and later his freedom, but it basically confirms she was involved.
Technically if the Tarnished gets their heart stolen in the final fight then Miquella does ‘bring them to his side’
Finally, someone doing a video on the endgame dlc lore!
Literally took the words from my mouth 😂
I know right they told us who cursed Melania, it was Romina I can't wait for that video
I’m literally tweaking while vaati doesn’t update
@@ryancox5313where can I read this in game?
@jackcorwin8424 it was a speculation of mine from reading her remembrance, Plus in the base game it said the goddess of rot was sealed away and cursed Melania. Maybe she wasn't sealed to the lake of rot, but sealed away or banished in the shadowlands, and if the war in the shadowlands war and subjugation influenced by Queen Marika, just maybe she cursed Melania with Scarlett Rot, for Marika betrayal, I know it's a reach but Elden ring leaves a lot to speculation
i just realized that radahn uses bloodflame magic because of using mohgs body
That just clicked with me, I always felt that that attack was completely out of place but it makes sense now haha.
it adds a sense that your fighting 3 demigods as the final battle
Isn't a point to be made that this creature is not exactly Radahn? And more like a puppet of some sorts controlled by miquella?
Yeah you have to do Ansbach's quest to learn that. He tells you that Mohg's body was taken away to Miquella as soon as he was defeated, later you find a scroll and give it to him and he tells you it's to resurrect Radahn into Mohg's body
He may have forced Rahdan to become his consort. Not only does his eyes glow, but in his 2nd phase with Mik on his back, he can charm you for a 1 hit kill. (You will be on your knee worshipping him.)
His age of "compassion" is a forced one. You will lose your sanity and freedom for compliance - no different than his mother with the Golden Order. (Losing grace and exiled.)
I have a different thought about Rahdan being forced to be his consort.
In the early part of DLC, Miquella lost his charmed power. Rahdan is frightening in his own will in the last battle
I have a theory that Mohg's soul is still inside his body somehow. In the second phase, Rahdan will use blood curse to attack you which only people bless by the formless mother can do.
Miquella's Age will brainswash everyone to stop fighting but Miquella will also cage forever inside the tree. He does make huge sacrifices to do that.
@@Baslium With the grab attack in the final phase I don't think he lost his charming. When he broke his own great rune it shattered the charms in place, but I think the breaking of it was something to do with his ascension at the gate and imbuing his power into his new form.
The only way to not get 2 shot by the grab attack in the 2nd phase is to use the rune to resist his charm. The description of it even explicitly states that it *only* has that power anymore, implying that the rest has been taken outside the rune, which makes sense if Miquella wanted to defy the golden order as well.
@@acidicreaver3024 I ain't tellin you to get it, but you do find the remains of his rune that can protect you from the charming. The weird part is you get it at the bottom of the Scadutree.
miquella is the worst. even his other half st trina said to take him out lol
Where are we getting the idea that Miquella wants to rob everyone of "sanity and freedom"?
Mogh was Moghlested....My boi did nothing wrong! So Miquella, made his sister Melina, Rahdahn and even Mogh fall in love with him forcefully. P. Diddy in child's form
It doesn't have to be. Is it really that unlikely for Malenia to really care about Miquella? Leda still follows him even after the spell is broken.
If you ignore everything related to the Blood Mother, then he did nothing wrong.
Your hornor the only crime of my client is all the crime he commits
Nah mans got Miquellested 😭😭😭
I think you mean Malenia... Melina is the one that sticks with us to eventually burn the Erdtree.
Things this DLC left out:
We get new lore about a little sister of Messmer (probably Melina) but she doesn't get an appearance.
We didn't get an answer or anything about the Marika/Radagon thing. (They could've use the Miquella/St. Trina stuff to just answer that)
Miyazaki said that Marika became a God in the Land of Shadows but how? By the same method as Miquella or she use the Mother of Fingers?
By some reason The Land of Shadows has Death Knights serving the Prince of Death but we get nothing about Godwyn.
The Gloam Eyed Queen didn't get even a mention or anything.
Wondering if there's not a sequel planned. A lot of loose ends that can still be explored
Instead we get a boy who likes a strongman😭
This. I was really hoping for something that would change how the original game was viewed, some huge lore drops that reshaped what we knew, like Gael and the painter starting a whole new cycle in DS3, but we didn’t really get anything like that at all. Miquella just did the Marika thing so we have to fight Radahn a 2nd time and kill another demigod. Technically two, but Messmer had the decency to have a good fight
@@Morgan_BC mesmmer is a badasss
gonna wait elden ring 2 in 10years later for the answer maybe
Atleast we finally know what Malenia whispered in Radahn’s ear when afflicting him with Scarlet Rot. Something that we have been wondering since the base game’s story trailer. It was Miquella all along!
"This is for not taking my brother's hand"
Back shot.exe
Honestly, the Band of Miquella at the beginning made a lot of sense in a very dark way. All of those individuals had the capacity to become lords of their own. Each a legendary champion. If the entire Band worked together all the way to the end, Radahn and Miquella would have been stopped honestly quite consistently.
Moore is unbelievably tanky, Leda with lightning damage. Ansbach and Hornsent with evasiveness and bleed. Freya with raw toe-to-toe damage. Dryleaf Dane covering a lot of offense and defense bases. Thiollier with evasive support. Of course the Tarnished of No Renown being a variable lord themself.
The whole point of bringing them together was to ultimately destroy them all or leave them utterly crippled so the plan could continue. Problem is, Miquella truly underestimated how absolutely tenacious the Tarnished of No Renown is.
they all get stomped by our tarnished at the same time canonically tbh so they ain't stopping radahn lol. and thats with them together. you can't become a lord as a group, so as singular people, i wouldn't say they had the capacity to become lords of their own at all. not stat wise of course but lore wise, they'd probably lose to margit at worst and renalla or morgott at best.
@@EfecanYSL Idk man they are so tanky, they might actually beat them and besides that, not all of them want to be Lords, so technically they could coexist.
Lots of bad takes. Lore wise they'd all get stomped no diff
He's so Griffith like holy shit
@@ancientbanana2449 He's not. People are propagating lazy and erroneous takes about Miquella. Wait until Vaati or SmoughTown the lore videos. Miquella isn't the monster some people are painting him to be
My guess is that Radahn's strong sense of duty (halting the motion of the stars) kept him from pledging his loyalty elsewhere, so he may have made a binding promise with Miquella about being his lord in the next life. If a seemingly good-natured little kid that admires you asks you to promise something crazy like that, you might just humor them. Given how pure of character Radahn seemed to be, he might not have accepted had he known exactly how much Miquella was willing to sacrifice to fulfill his end of the deal.
We can't know the details of what Miquella promised Radahn in return, but the fact that he says "if WE honor OUR part of the vow", he is probably referring to himself and Malenia (and possibly even the Tarnished). That makes me think the vow has something to do with challenging and defeating Radahn. If this is the case, it may be a subtle hint that Radahn wasn't really complicit, because his reply to Miquella was "lol sure, over my dead body".
But I feel like if it wasn’t complicit, it would have been said. They explicitly say that Mohg was charmed and Radahn not being complicit adds to the horror of the situation and the game wouldn’t hold back from showing it. Everything describes their vow as something they made together and Radahn is promised, he made a promise to Miquella, so he agreed to his end as shown in the memory. Likely the twins end of the vow was give me an honorable death (to enter the land of shadow) and revive me when I get there. It makes sense with Malenia’s line as she blooms, it basically implies that Mohg already took Miquella- so it’s ‘Hey, this is the death you wanted, Miquella is waiting for you’
@@HeraldingHistorianDo we ever see it written that Radhan was meant to be his consort, or does it just say "Lord brother"?
@@HeraldingHistorian I refuse to believe Radahn would doom caelid, the place he grew up in to go along miquella's plan. People on miquella's side don't notice how horrifying the result of caelid was, its literally the first area we stumble upon and see how horrifying it is. Considering how miquella wasn't near Radahn on the ending cutscene, I think its safe to say it might've been a Onesided wish.
@Tigerbro6 I don't think radahn knew that malenia would bloom. I think once malenia realized she wasn't going to win fighting normally, she decided to risk it all and ensure that radahn ended up in the land of shadow with whatever means necessary I.e. aeonian bloom. But unfortunately her plan didn't work and it scarred caelid forever, so the tarnished had to finish the job
@@Tigerbro6I think their duel was supposed to be honorable sword vs sword (assuming if Radahn didn't use gravity magic against Malenia but doesn't seem that way) though it seems like Malenia didn't want to lose hence doing a desperate move
Nuking Caelid
so those are omen horns on Radahn's arms! thought it was just his armor.
well noticed
Because Miquella steal mogh corpse and make it a vessel for radahn soul, that's why new radahn has omen horn in his arm, and he able to do mogh blood skill
Leftovers from Mogh.
little leftovers from a mohg corpse
Hes also tiny from the og radahn which signify hes not in hes own body
Thank you so much for this video. This helped explain so much! Also The Game Of Thrones music in the background was such a sweet touch to this!
The complete silence and eerie glowing eyes lead me to believe that Radahn is just a puppet at this point. Radahn was an intelligent guy, he's quite capable of articulating his own thoughts on a given matter. But he doesn't, at any point. There's no reason for him to be completely silent, and it is unsettling.
In my opinion, either the Rot permanently shredded his mind to such an extent that a new body wouldn't fix it, or Miquella has charmed him to hell and back.
Def mequella charming him since it's his whole thing
"Radahn was an intelligent guy, he's quite capable of articulating his own thoughts on a given matter." Source?
@@mellar5864 "Master of gravity magic" - gravity magic generally relies on _intelligence_ and he had enough strength of mind to continue holding the stars back while his brain was rotted. That's not dumb muscle.
a theory i kinda dont see alot of people talk about with fair reason but still kinda interesting. is that radhan wanted nothing more than to be like godfrey and follow in his footsteps to be like a son to him. what a coincedence that the body he ends up being revived into is the son of his personal hero. I know its more likely because as an omen mohgs body is immortal and doesnt need to return to the edtree and ressurect. but its still something to think about along with the other theories. a promise made perhaps when he was younger and didnt realize the weight of those words
Dude, I was just thinking about that this morning. This seems like the most logical explaination to me. Radahn was a Godfrey fanboy, so why would he pass up the opportunity to be the lord of a new age.
I could totally see that. Radahn and Miquella as kids talking about their goals. Miquella as young people promises radahn if he becomes god he would become his consort since radahn is such a fan of the godfrey ideology. Radahn grows up and becomes great in his own right, but since miquella is cursed to youth, he still has the same mindset he did as a child. So it sort of creates an obsession. He did all of this to get radahn as his consort. All the people he killed, abandoned, and betrayed.
@@eyesofthebeast that would be interesting that miquella is not just cursed from growing up phisically but mentally
Right now I'm about 85% for the 4th option.
I don't see Radahn as the sort that would simply "bow" to the will of another. It also adds some credence to a possible _second_ reason why Radahn halted the stars: to stop Fate (not actually for Ronni but for *_HIMSELF_* ) Miquella could have potentially known how to halt or stop or manipulate whatever Fate is in this game (as he willingly discarded his St. Trina aspect which in the cutscene was his called his Fate).
This also adds weight to the reason why the War of Aeonia occurred. The armor item (Young Lion Armor) even mentions that Malenia was apparently AWARE that Radahn wasn't Miquella's kidnapper. (Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort). This essentially adds the final bit of evidence needed that Miquella _STARTED_ the Aeonian War and was willingly kidnapped by Mohg, and also fooled millions of people into their deaths.
This essentially means we might be fighting an absolutely subjugated version of Radahn, having being brought back to the world of the living postmortem.
I honestly believe that Radahn has been forced to be a consort of sorts in one way or another but while he was alive blatantly refused to be one so a alternative is to kill him and bring him back in a more moldable, subservient form as seen in the dlc. Man has been done more dirty than the smear campaign against Mogh lmao.
Radahn didn't bow to Miquella as in being subjugated by him. When they were both young, Miquella asked Radahn if he would become his Lord if Miquella was able to reach Godhood, thus creating their vow to each other. And by the way, Miquella's charm only makes you like him, it doesn't grant full out mind control AND it wears off eventually. I feel like the halting of the stars has more to do with stopping outer of space monster like Astel coming into their world
@@HuMaNise34 Radahn probably agreed to the vow initially because before the shattering only an empyrean was fated to ascend to godhood so Radahn becoming the consort of the most fearsome empyrean the one most likely to be the god of a new age was probably a good deal at the time but after the shattering Radahn could've changed his mind. However Miquella would not be denied his promised lord and his chance to fix the old order with a gentler touch.
I agree with you, that would explain why Malenia goes to Caelid to kill Radhan by Miquella's request, who let himself be kidnapped by Mogh to be able to go the shadow realm.
Maybe even using Moghs body was in some way able to link Moghs infautation for Miquella with Radhan
So the 'kind' one turned out to be the most 'messed up' one!!
They've been saying since the base game he was the "most fearsome" of the demigods
@@sparxskywriter2589 because of his allure, not because of his deeds in particular. Yk I still simp for Ranni but what she did to Godwyn seems to be utterly horrifying.
Yeh Godwyn was described as the greatest of the demigods, perhaps he was the only decent one? We will never know cause they didn't cook well enough for this dlc lore@@dice5709
@@dice5709 ranni's goal to get rid of her fingers and give herself freedom as well as everyone else is a good one and for a radical change like that there will be hard choice and sacrifices. i'm also assuming for the ritual to work and for her to lose only her body, someone else had to lose their soul. the question is why did she choose godwyn out of all other demi-gods, was it a condition in order for the numen assassins to help ranni with the scheme so they can get revenge on marika who betrayed them?
Dude is like an androgynous chimera. Of course he is messed up.
you beat everyone on the lore explanation video. thanks
I feel like the ending doesn't actually add anything. The actual ending I mean, not everything else. Like you beat the final boss and then you see a memory that is basically just talking about him saying exactly what just happened.
Agreed
I REALLY fucking hope there’s going to be a sequel for the dlc or even a new game because wtf. SOOO many things lore wise were left tf out and the ending is trash. Like we still don’t even know who tf Melina really is and her backstory
Exactly, it's just "yeah, Miquella always wanted this" and so long, DLC's over
its unfinished, dark souls 3 tier. probably went through dozen rewrites last year
@@sweetgee9589 His*
I call shenanigans. Radahn idolized Godfrey and styled himself a warmonging general.
Meanwhile, we know that Godwyn won the war against freaking dragons by the power of friendship, spared and even incorporated the dragons into the system.
It should have been Godwyn!
Godwyn was more like a father to them, yes he was their brother but the statues show that he protected and looked after them. so they probs saw him as a parental figure rather than a partner.
Now that I think about it why wasn't it? Literally keep the same lore but use Godwin. Combine his lore and say "he is death in soul but not in body thus we take new body for his soul. That being mogh's body" Would have been cool
@@boyanpetrov9975 the issue is the deathblight, if his body was taken as a vessel likely any soul put into it would likely go the same way as godwyn's soul. disintegrate to goop.. also if you saw godwyn's body in the game it became nothing but a very large and deformed mushroom tree. the mushroom tree would not be able to move around as well as where it is located, it'd be next to impossible to get that large of a mass out of where it was.
so to put it forward, no, if anything it'd make no sense for that to happen and it'd give far more questions than answers on how did miquella get any form of godwyn out of the hole they put his body in as well as how did miquella fix the vessel to be free of deathblight when even godwyn's friendly dragon could not.
Personally, I think it would've been Godwyn if he was able to die a true death
@zuziiice8907 you misunderstood me. I meant not for godwyn's body but his soul. Let the body stay there but use moghs body as a new vessel for godwyn's soul. And either make it a deathblight boss or say that death blight is only on his old body
I really want to thank you for making this video. I’ve been dying the past few days for someone to break it down!
What a great video. It's clear that by the time the Tarnished (the player) comes into the Lands Between, Miquella has already devised many things, including using Mohg to get to the "Shadow realm", where one could become a God, outside of the Order (perhaps) controlled by the Greater Will.
My guess is that the scarlet rot "traps" Radahn's soul in the world of the living, without being touched by Death (and therefore, it is not 'recycled'). This would allow Miquella to use Mohg's soulless body to reincarnate Radahn. Makes you think of Ranni/Godwyn.
To clarify, the Ranni's ending was mistranslated. Its about making a world without the influence of gods, guiding light or grace. The freedom of stars with no god looking down. True freedom.
A noble goal, but you know, she stole the rune of death and had 30 assassins murder her brother. Miquella definitely wouldn't be happy with his twin sister... Regardless they had a similar goal, just Ranni' involved a lot more bloodshed.
I mean Miquella also sent Malenia to kill Radahn, which led to Caelid being nuked. They're both not above killing their siblings to achieve their goals.
technically, if you choose to believe that Radagon wasn't always Marika, Godwyn wasn't her brother. Godwyn's father was Godfrey, and mother was Marika. Ranni's parents were Radagon and Renala
@@joesaiditstrue There's also the angle of did Ranni ever see Godwyn as her brother. Yeah, Marika officially adopted her + her sibs as royal stepchildren, but from Ranni's POV, Marika is the woman her father abandoned Rennala for and left her mentally broken. Ranni probably also doesn't know Radagon = Marika, so any kinship she feels towards Godwyn is likely nil.
Ranni's ending also doesn't imply that free will is eradicated. Miquella literally wants to force everybody to his will. Ranni wants to free them from the will of gods like MIquella.
Without god all is left with aimlessly existence. Ranni ending is the age of depression.
I have been waitin for some new lore-crack. I'm smoking yours. Thanks
The Rains Of Castemere playing in the background
If a lords soul has to be returned... what does that say about our tarnished? 🤔
This is actually a fantastic point. Our hero might just be a random body possessed by the soul of a Tarnished.
It's an RPG they will never confirm anything about ur character the whole idea is that it is whatever you want it to be
SO, ARE WE GODWYN?
@@danielrobinson7872 maybe that soul possessing our Tarnished is us, the players. We use the Tarnished of our choosing (astrologer, gladiator, etc) with each having their own backstory, to experience the lands between
@@soraeverblue not to mention the start of the game is something entering our body(could be our soul)
Hundreds of millions of lives lost during the shattering war, demigods slaughtered, a literal God put to the sword, and a realm torn apart…..beCAUSE MIQUELLA HAD A CRUSH?!?!?!?!?!
that is LAUGHABLY inaccurate, but still pretty funny XD
@@flamingmanure Glad you got a laugh out of it xD wasn’t trying to be accurate really lol
I just thought of something interesting. I believe that Miquella sent Melania to kill Radahn just before charming Mohg to kidnap him from his cocoon without Melania knowing so that he could travel to the land of shadow to intercept Radahn’s soul thinking that Melania would be successful. Upon killing Radahn, Melania would then return to the Haligtree and find Miquella gone. She would then track him to Mogh and kill him, not knowing that it was Miquella’s doing, thus giving Miquella the required resources to resurrect Radahn by using and manipulating his own sister.
Now of course this doesn’t go to plan and we, the Tarnished, are the ones that deliver Radahn and Mogh to Miquella.
I’m going to feel so bad killing them from now on.
@@captainlorax400 I thought about this too at first and Malenia has been my favorite character since day one, so the thought of Miquella using her or charming her when she was already in so much pain made me furious. But then I also thought about how Malenia was just so devoted to Miquella from the start that there wasn’t even a need to charm her. She was as loyal as loyalty can get so he didn’t charm her and told her all of his plans. She most likely willingly went along with them, not caring if she died for the cause because Miquella could supposedly bring her back even after death as a god. Basically Miquella’s idea boils down to: “I want to be a god so I’ll do whatever corrupt and terrible things I have to do to get there and then I’ll fix it all later.”
@@dude_boi6677and people are saying he isn't Griffith...
@@SuperFizzah literally griffith but less narcissistic
a machiavellian saviour you can call
@@SuperFizzah Yeah straight up, the whole time I was playing and talking to Ansbach I took note of how Miquella was so good that it makes him evil in a way. Even if Malenia agreed to the plans and could be brought back to life later, should she have died, it’s still suspicious that Miquella was so willing to send his sister to war. I know I wouldn’t even if I could bring her back, and I don’t think Malenia would be willing to send Miquella to war if the rolls were reversed. The hypocrisy and blind faith in Miquella’s plan is so obvious. And also, how could he even know for sure that he’d have resurrecting abilities? Because Marika sure didn’t. Malenia was used in a way, even if she was willing.
I understand why they did Rahdahn but it should have been Godwyn 😬
- Miquella also refers to Godwyn as "Lord brother" in golden epitaph wishing for him to have a true death
-Godwyn failed resurrection at castle sol
-Miquella wanting to save "Those who live In Death"
-Miquella becomes a God and with that Godwyn, the prince of death ascends to Lord/King of Death
-Bringing it full circle with Godwyn being death being the catalyst for the shattering and ending it with not just his resurrection but giving Godwyn the "Lordling" a true death.
Godwyn was dead in soul: yea, his body was alive, but his soul was dead
In the end you still get insidious, manipulative Miquella but at least reviving Godwyn makes a little more sense
HELL he bewitched Mogh into making the MoghWYN dynasty literally fusing their names.
@@user-sp3pn2cs4e to me, this DLC is disappointing. Yea, beautiful map and world building, new items, it's like an Elden Ring 1.50... but too much hype. In the end, we do not know anything, just miquella's plan. That's it.
Messmer? Semi-explained, but not much.
Gloam-eyed queen? Nah.
The DLC story trailer shows Marika holding a golden thread taken from a corpse. The golden order (before the exile of the rune of death) was born this way? IDK
Let's just wait theories, but to me the lore is a big disappointment
EDIT: after some weeks, a lot of lore has been revealed, and itbis amazing, but this DLC is a little disappointing anyway
I certainly think Godwyn would have been more interesting as a final boss but, at the end of the day, this is what we got and if we want to piece together the lore and the story we just have to work with what we are given.
@@mr.wooper6605and where does all thing dead go? The lands of shadow.
It makes no sense that Radahn would willingly choose to be his consort. He held back the stars because he was destined to align with Miqeulla, and Ms. Goddess of Rot had to make sure he couldn't do so anymore.
We know none of this, but we knoe almost nothing now because they completely threw in some random BS lol
Miquella probably ordered Malenia to kill Radahn so he can get his soul, even though she failed to do so.
Dude really did everything he could to not be trapped with Dark Souls Femto
Read the Young Radahn’s armor set, and then watch the story trailer to the main game, especially the part where Malenia and Radahns fight is shown
The vow of consort was very probably based on the premise that radhan dies in a battle. He is the warmongering warrior type so it makes sense that he accepted to be a consort IF he fell in battle
I'm trying to remember off hand if the language was exact, but could this possibly mean that Miquella never wished to revive Godwyn at all? He was always referring to Radahn?
Radahn was not dead before the creation of the golden epitaph so…
Miquella never wished to revive Godwyn, he wanted to grant his body a real death
@@dracopo8862You must've forgotten that the Church of the Eclipse and Miquella wanted to resurrect Godwyns soul during the eclipse, but couldn't because his soul was eliminated by Destined Death
@@joesaiditstrue "A sword made to commemorate the death of Godwyn the Golden, first of the demigods to die.
Infused with the humble prayer of a young boy; "O brother, lord brother, please die a true death." "
I wonder if Messmer & Melina's father is Midra, Lord of the Frenzied Flame? Both Messmer & Melina have kindling within them that can burn the Erdtree & the trailer talked about an affair. Maybe Marika had Messmer & Melina while Godfrey was away fighting the fire giants.
my theory is that the father is the fell god, it can burn the Erdtree, the golems are connected to it, and both Melina and Messmer both have red hair
Unfortunately there is a body in Midra's castle that holds an item called 'Nanaya's Torch' and the body has the same clothes that the lady in the painting with Midra has so its probably not Marika.
I feel like the 'affair' might refer to an agreement between Marika and an outer god to have her be the vessel for the elden ring. idk tho...Could also maybe refer to the initial joining of Marika and Radagon (if they were ever separate to begin with, which in itself is up for debate)
No, only child of Radagon whose had a red hair
I think Radagon is the father not only because of the red hair but also "Messmer" follows the naming convention of the demigod siblings (Miquella/Malenia, Ranni/Rykard/Radahn) and when he takes off his helmet he's similar in appearance to Malenia
All you see in the DLC is the steps and path Marika took to become a goddess before coming to the Lands Between , I think she had Messmer and Melina before ever meeting Godfrey. If we go by the steps Miq took to become a god at the divine gate, Merika needed a lord and the only lord you fight in the land of shadows is Sage Midra. The lady we see in the pictures in Midras Manse is Merika but going by Nanaya. Now my theory is that she gave birth two the two children Messmer and Melina they were both Demi gods or Empyreans each a host to an Outer God one the flame of rune and the other death. She sends Messmer back to the land of shadows to enact her revenge for the Shaman people, and we know what happens to Melina
That's something that I noticed people complaining about, the lack of an explanation to what's going on, except there is plenty of lore that tells you what's going on, you just have to look for it
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I might go with the theory that either Radahn changed his mind, or he might have been compelled at first. Later after the shattering/acquiring a great rune, breaks out of a spell. I think this because timeline wise, if Radahn said yes, what was stopping him and Miquella from becoming a lord and god soon after the shattering? I don't know if Miquella needed to destroy his flesh in order to do it, Marika seemed able to become a god and keep her flesh. Malenia's words to Radahn also seem more ominous than anything as well, but I guess it's up to interpretation.
Radahan didn’t want to go down without getting the final battle and when he did duel the strongest person maleina he was supposed to go to realm of shadow but he didn’t he stayed and got eternal aids and we the tarnished killed him and put miquella plan into motion
I think the most obvious answer is that Radahn promised Miquella the way one promises any child who asks if you'll marry them when they grow up: you laugh, say of course, and completely expect them to grow out of it.
But Miquella is an obsessive, mind-controlling codependent psycho.
Due to both Mohg and Radahn being required for the dlc but nothing else i took it as Radahn turned Miquella down, or Miquella was talking to Mohg in his young cutscene. Seems like either way he needed Radahns soul separated from the rot after Malenia and put it into Mohgs body. Possibly Radahn at the end is actually Mohg
Read the Rememberajcs and armor
Thank you ive been waiting for a lore video
honestly im a little bit disapointed in that ending, but i know we still didnt connect all the dots so i have still hope
wheres that final cutscene when in the first teaser trailer
@@Nolimitsbestfriend what?
@@NolimitsbestfriendIt's not in the game
@@LSB44446 unfortunate
4:06 so essentially i get to invoke revenge and hard counter miquella with mohgs great spear
Since radahn is referred to as the "promised consort", i believe he must have promised to become miquellas consort.
Other way round. Miquella promised Radahn he would become his consort.
Against his will? @@Megidolaon999
Or Marika promised to Miquella that Radahn would be his consort 🤷🏼♂️ there are too many questions and not enough answers 😩
It could also be Promised consort on how every god needs a consort like in the age of star the lord of night is the promised consort.
well, with how miquella was talking about him being the winner of the festival, likely that "war" was actually a festival to see who would win rights to be miquella's consort.
I missed Ansbachs quest but that's really cool that he reveals the mohg body snatching. I was confused enough when Radahn showed up and even morseo when he starts using bloodflame
You should read the Sumerian poem of inannas/Ishtars descent into the underworld, miquellas journey and discarding of their items throughout is similar to what happens to inanna
I like a theory I saw in a video that says that he agreed to the be his consort but miquella abandoned the order to which radahn is faithful to which made radahn change his mind.
Fast turnabout! Nice work 🤙
I believe Radahn didnt agreed to be Miquella's consort
He seems kinda loyal to the Golden order or at least he respects it, for instance we know that Godfrey was his biggest inspiration and Godfrey was the first Elden Lord and previous consort of Marika.
So just something I think is interesting that i'd like to add as to why Radahn could be forced into this:
Radahn still had Marika's golden glow in his eyes until he was infected with scarlet rot. Siding with Miquella willingly would mean that Radahn would go against Marika, so he would have lost grace sooner. We know that Marika will drop anybody who is no longer of use to her, as she did with Godfrey.
Also, I think there's definitely some symbolism of Miquella wrapping his arms around Radahn's neck.
Just something I thought would he cool to mention, I'd like to hear what everyone else thinks tho
Godfrey WAS useful for her: As a trump card to sweep the Lands Between and and make a glorious return to Lordship in case the demigods would fail to duke it out conclusive. Likely, Godfrey was aware and on board with plan
Absolutely killer video mate. Love the detail and the honesty with speculation. Subbed x
Holy shit. Bro do yall remember during their fight, malenia said something to radahn just before she bloomed. What if she said something like "youll be his consort one way or another"
That's what the item description for Radahn's new set implies, yes
@Navelia I hadn't gotten it yet. But thanks for letting me know bro.
“Miquella awaits thee honored consort” I think is what she says
Loved hearing the rains of castamere in the background
If you read young Radahn’s armor set, you’ll find out Malenia is fully aware of Miquella’s plan. Radahn most likely did not consent.
Something I noticed just an hour ago playing with Radahns armour on is that the armour (both the OLD and the new) has Miquellas sigil/emblem on the upper part of the cape! The same sigil that appears when casting Miquellas spells! It's literally on Radahns back even in the base game! You can also find St.Trinas sword in Caelid, as well as a large amount of Miquella Lillies overlooking Radahns arena (it's got the most dense amount of Miquella Lilies in the game).
Could it be that Radahn's soul cannot enter the Land of Shadows due to Marika locking away destined death and thus he is stuck as a broken husk in Caelid? And when the Tarnished finally ended him, he is free but without Destined Death he is kept from coming into the Land of Shadows to meet Miquella?
Could it be that Malenia's devotion to Miquella was also compelled? Can't believe she would actually leave Miquella unguarded in the Haligtree and let Mohg just waltz in unchallenged unless it was all planned for Malenia to destroy Radahn. Seems like a secret only the three of them knee. We can probably make a more interesting guess as to what Malenia whispered to Radahn before blooming.
"As I await his return" So we can speculate that by 'return', Malenia meant that Miquella and Radahn would do what they sought out to do.
All that's left is for the Tarnished to play along unwittingly to retrieve the Rune of Death and remove all opposition in the Lands Between (Marika/Radagon and the Elden Beast) nder the pretense of restoring order.
I really think that Radann didn't want to be Miquella's consort and that's why he sent Malenia to kill him. Miquella looks like a very manipulative person, and this theory proves this even more.
i am of the final school of thought. there are many reasons but the one i am fixated on is the compulsion aspect of miquellas kindness.
order of thoughts
one: his grab attack is a two hit instant win where the tarnish swear fealty with the end title being heart stolen
two: he is shown to of been constantly hugging his twin
three: Radhan and malania fight DURING the shattering a war from which no lord arose
four: Margit defeated radhan in the begining of the war before he became MASSIVE as seen in the opening of the game
five: Saint trina can pull anyone into a slumber and is known to quell the outer-god the freenzied flame( kalia questline)
Six: Fort Sol is dedicated to trying to find a way to revive a demigod The fort is under his control
Seven: Melania is passed out cold before we fight her
eight: ranni found a way to split the body and soul and kicked off the shattering, this takes placed after miquella finds out that the golden order can do nothing to save melania
nine: Messmer who still follows his mothers orders allows miquella to pass on abated even though he lacks graces but still holds a great rune
Ten: he removes saint trina from himself, his own cross states its his mercy or something to that effect
elven: Trina begs for us to kill miquella, since they were once one she would know him best
twelve: There is mhogs feelings on the matter, that being wierd as hell, one would think it would be the formless mother he would want to be the knew god but instead it is miquella
and finally there are all the berserk refences and miquella being griffif is a common allusion.
Tbh with the ending I find them to be more similar than ever. Look at Grifith post resurrection. He wants everyone to come to falconia because it's the last safe place on earth. And you can live safe and free under Grifiths kingdom and see all your dead relatives and everything's gonna be OK....meanwhile the rest of the world's turning to shit because of him.
Now look at Miquella, same thing wants everyone under his rule, his kingdom. Weather you want it that way or not...
@@kevinfortsch thank you you're the first person to speak properly of the griffith references hahaha
people seem to forget that when griffith revived also and started his machinations to change the world and create falconia, that he sacrificed like a bunch of people to get there. Miquella did the same, Caelid, Haligtree, Even his most loyal followers working with Lady Leda. Doomed all their lives as he shed his humanity completely for godhood. He commited the same sins Marika did to rise, I feel like Miquella's kingdom is doomed from the start. The lands between is completely far gone because of all of this. All because he selfishly wanted Radahn to go along his plan and overthrow the Golden Order. But its too late to save anyone so what would be MIquella's prerogative? We sadly don't get to know that, but I'm glad we actually fought Radahn in his prime. Always wanted that since the first trailer and always felt that Starscourge was not enough
@@Tigerbro6The way I see it, Miquella just truly believes that he will be able to succeed where Marika failed. He is too arrogant/jaded to see that he is already walking the same path and, like you said, thinks that he will just be able to make everything better once he becomes a god.
And then our Tarnished comes along and stops his new dynasty before he can even get it started.
@@Tigerbro6 lol "prime Radahn" is that fucking thing modders made, not the end boss of the dlc 😂🤣
The line "If *we* honor our part of the vow" confuses me... Who is "we"?
There's really only 3 options here:
1. *He refers to himself and Radahn*
This doesn't make much sense because of the end of the sentence. The condition that "if they should honour part of the vow", Radahn should promise to be his consort, is illogical in itself. Radahn being Miquella's consort is most likely his part of the vow, so him fulfilling the condition (honouring the vow) and the desired result (him being Miquellas consort) cannot be one and the same act.
We can also assume that he is talking directly to Radahn in the memory, so why should he adress himself and Radahn collectively in the subordinate clause, and then adress him with "you" in the main clause? Makes no sense.
So it's much more likely that it's one of these two options:
2. *He refers to himself and Malenia*
I find this one to be the most likely, because I, too, assume the main purpose of the battle of Aeonia was to kill Radahn and make his soul susceptible for the ritual with Mohg's body. Especially given the item description of the Young Lion's armor: "When Malenia, Blade of Miquella, let the rotflower blossom in Aeonia, Radahn heard a murmur in his ear- "Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort."
However, I have a problem with this option. Let's say we assume that the memory is taken from a long time ago, potentially from even before the shattering. To me it seems as though the conversation in the memory is one of equality, both Radahn and Miquella talking and agreeing about their parts of the vow. It begs the question, what exactly was the content of the vow? What was Radahn promised in return for being Miquella's consort?
If we assume Miquella promised him the same thing as us in the fight: "I promise you. A thousand year voyage guided by compassion.", and Radahn accepted this because of his "kindness" and good nature, why would they have to go through the elaborate act of killing Radahn and destroying all of Caelid in the attempt to do so, only to then revive his soul into Mohg's body?
There must have been a shift in Radahn's mind. He must have changed his opinion on the vow. Either he was initially deceived and then found out that Miquella's promise to him was a lie, or perhaps he changed his mind after the shattering. We can't say for sure.
3. *He refers only to himself, however including St. Trina, thus using plural*
In the DLC we come to find out that St. Trina has her own physical body, and that she exists apart from Miquella, even though she is still implied to be his discarded alter ego. Was she perhaps also involved in this vow? To me it seems like in the game, St. Trina is being portrayed as morally superior to Miquella, exposing the fallacy behind "Kind Miquella" and how we, the Tarnished, have to stop him from achieving godhood by killling him. So maybe St. Trina being involved in the vow was what moved Radahn to agreeing in the first place? And Miquella ridding himself of his alter ego is what caused the shift in Radahn's will to honour his part of the vow and become Miquella's consort?
It's kinda frustrating that the final dialogue we get of Miquella is so open ended, but honestly what did we expect? Please let me know what you guys think about these thoughts! :-)
dont a lot of gay people refer to themselves as plural these days? I'd like to add i think its neat theres a gay ending. Fits with a lot of the themes and settings
Maybe St. Trina is The One Person He Couldn't Charm.... and She Went around Warning People and It Got Back to The General. Then Miqqi over here goes around saying His Alter Ego Is the Female He Couldn't Run Game On and She Even Went To The Shadow Realm to Tell On Miqqi.... Hmmmmm
Miqqi is One Cold Empyrean incest baby😂😂
#salserojerseytv
😂😂 Tha Comments This DLC Creating Is Unreal....
There is another ending but people have not found it yet. And there is a missing cutscene that was shown in the trailer but not in the game
All this new lore makes me think that Ranni's Age of Stars is possible the best ending by removing the influence of the Greater Will. (Now let's wait for more lore to understand shadow of the erdtree)
Faaaaaactz
I think Radahn refused. I think the battle of Aeonia was part of the conditions that miquella needs to steal the heart of Radahn so he could have a fully compliant lord consort strong enough to topple the Golden Order. His armor set states “When Melania, Blade of Miquella, let the rot flower bloom in Aeonia she whispered these words in his ear. ‘Miquella is waiting, promised consort’” I think the battle was intended to lay the groundwork for Radahn’s subjugation. He could only be subjugated after his death and that’s why he fought so hard to live through it and why melenia was willing to sacrifice her pride to make it happen. That’s the only justification I can think of for Radahn leaving Leonard behind, he only learned gravity magic to ride his beloved steed after all.
What a masterpiece. Everytime i saw Radhan using that blood slash in his boss fight got me puzzled, now that you get that he is using Mogh's body makes so much sense. He doesn't know how to use blood magic but since his "body" have familiarity with, he can do one type o move that involves this magic. FromSoftware is on another level.
Miquella also knew that it could be quite useful to have a Lord that could control the stars, for in the stars are Fate writ. Notice that Miquella has four arms, not unlike the Wraithcallers. Like the Wraithcallers, Miquella can sway spirits, and hearts, to his designs.
Multiple arms can be a symbol of divinity depending on the religion.
@@BlackfangDragon in-game it is a symbol of Wraithcallers and the marionettes. Wraithcallers and Miquella both have Royal Revenants in their employ, and both know how to manipulate souls.
@@falgalhutkinsmarzcal3962 Except Miquella only gets extra arms AFRER he ascends and becomes a Divine being, one who has discarded everything else about himself including his flesh.
It’s a sign of how he’s ascended.
@@BlackfangDragon Marika does not have four arms, does she?
@@falgalhutkinsmarzcal3962 Miquella isn’t Marika, just as Malenias transformation is very different from her brothers or mother.
babay Radahn to baby Miquella: "Sure, I'll be your consort"
Adult Radahn: "Oh shit, I thought we were just playing a game when we were kids"
So why did miquella choose radahn as his consort instead of melania
Because He Can Never Be His Own Man....... So He Got The One He Looked Up To The Most
Hey folks!
Just wanted to say thanks for all the views and positive feedback on this video. I've never had a video get anywhere close to this number of views, so I'm very grateful to everyone who engaged with this one.
I'll be dropping a follow up video on Tuesday taking a close look at all five sides of the debate about the vow between Miquella and Radahn. I have a pretty clear opinion on what I think happened, but I do believe all five sides are valid interpretations and I suspect we'll be arguing about which one is right forever!
By the way - I will attempt to corral my reDAHNS in that video, but my Philly accent is a force to be reckoned with, so no promises 🤣🤣🤣
👍
I think Miquella(Griffith like) Compelled Radahn to be his Lord But Radahn was so strong that he could deny it (a la Guts). After the shattering, Malenia, Blade of Miquella(Casca-esque) tried to take Radahn to Miqullea by force. That failed and when she was brought back her Rot started to infect his HaligTree. Already in his cocoon and Radahn still going off, he plots Radahn's death, Compelled Mohg to take him away. Perhaps he was going to sacrifice Those at the Haligtree to enter the realm of shadow, and the tree rotting foiled that. So instead just use blood. And the Blood of a Hornsent/Omen. Messmer was just left to his Genocidal Duties because Marika was Racist, but she hid away the Shadow Tree and the Tower to ensure that no other God could Ascend to her status. The Greater Will just wants a new toy or perhaps there never was a Greater Will. Since Miquella in his God form was more a kin to Halenia, Goddess of Rot, Rather than the Vessel for the Elden Ring. To me that is the most sound explanation of events. But i still need to do St. Trina stuff, so SMH.
I think this is a pretty good line of thought.
I've always seen Miquella as like, the ultimate targaryen: convinced that he is the main character and everything revolves around him (I'll fix scarlet rot, destroy the erdtree and it's roots, cure my sister, give Godwyn a true death, bring albuniurics into an order, and lower gas prices).
You can't compare Casca to Malenia, really. Casca proposed to Gats to abandon crippled Griffith, which conversation finally broke the latter when he overheard it. Casca was a trully horrible person.
I think you are just trying to read Berserk's story into Elden Ring and make the story of the latter conform with the former. Yes, all Soulsborne is filled with references to Berserk, which are almost always very explicit, such as the enemy and boss designs, but I think it is important to judge Elden Ring's story purely by what is given to us in the game and to not try to bring elements from other stories in order to try and figure out what happens in the game. I think completely different pictures of the characters are painted if you do such a thing.
Miyazaki is such a hack
He didn’t try convincing Radahan once of the items in the game says miquella can charm everyone but one miquella told Radahan his plan to usher in a age of compassion and we all know Radahan was nice a
So agreed to it but he needed to be killed and he was gonna die honorable so miquella sent his sister and when they dueled it ended in a stalemate and the scarlet rot didn’t kill Jim we the tarnished did and thts how Everything in dlc transpired
Radahn did not want to be gay so he rejected his ass, but even after we kill him in the main game, he somehow takes his soul and puts it in mogh body and forced to serve him yeah honestly this is really messed up.
I dont really get why there was so much focus on godwyn and miquellas relationship...i wouldnt be alone in thinking he was supposed to be consort...and perhaps thats why ranni eliminated his soul.
I personally think the only reason why Godwyn wasnt able to become his consort was because of the death of his soul. Radahn was essentially the strongest demi-god after the shattering, so Miquella bewitching him makes sense(and it draws Parallels between Miquella and Marika, and Radahn and Godfrey).
I think before Godwyn's death, He and Miquella had some sort of close relationship. The statue that has a person (likely Godwyn) protecting Miquella & his sister has one odd thing about it... there is death blight (Godwyn's plant from his corpse) growing on it in one spot... it is legitimately sprouting out of Miquella's ass. Idk if it is a joke by the creators but I saw a post on reddit about it. It looks like it was deliberately created like that and it is hard to miss once you see it.
Godwyns death was pre shattering. The demigods would've reasonably changed drastically over the course of a major war between them. It's just world building that miquella cared deeply for the very first true loss his family ever suffered
i assume Godwyn was miquellas 1st choice for consort, since he is also described as strong and honorable(befriending dragons). Hence all that shit that happens in Castle Sol and the description of the wep in there. ANd when its clear that Godwyns souls is gone, then the radahn shit happened, just my 2 cents on the topic.
@@justaguy6401agreed
Well at least we all learned which one of Marika's children resembled her the most.
😂😂
Crazy how Miquella called Radahn his consort (half brother btw), and then proceeded to ride him mid battle.
Siblings, parents, children being "married" was a usual thing in ancient myths about gods. How can anyone be surprised?
@@eleele-ui5il shiii you right.
@@eleele-ui5il I don't know, but it's so baffling. There's all sorts of extremely fucked up things happening in ER, but somehow what gets under people's skin is... incest? Lmfao
The whole marriage concept is weird in this game. The turtle neck item description says that people no longer have sex in the lands between (pre 1.0 patch) and there's the whole business about how people are born. It's heavily implied that the erdtree is the thing that births people, but not 100% clear.
This makes me wonder some things: why an Elden Lord is necessary and what does the holder of that title do (or what does that title even mean, for that matter).
One other thing that I conclude with all this is that incest and homosexuality are not a thing (since people don't have sex and don't have children through "natural" means), so Miquella "marrying" his brother is not really taboo, I'd say
Great video and explanation. Cleared up a few questions I had.
I’m at the last boss and wondering why we don’t let Miquella win?
Our tarnished strive to become lords, no other can stand before us. The flame of ambition shall not be snuffed out! Also, Miquella is a straight-up brainwashing tyrant. Whether his rule is just or not, no one would have a choice in his world.
Nice you explain it very well. Not speaking really fast, easy to digest, thanks.
the final option is the only one that makes sense of why Malenia had a showdown with Radahn, and why she's just mindlessly waiting for Miquella
Its cool that we finally know what Malenia whispered in Radahn's ear in the trailer, we've been wondering for years! From the Young Lion's Helm:
"The golden helm worn by Radahn in his younger years. Proudly displaying his heroic red hair, it is fitting attire for a lion. When Malenia, Blade of Miquella, let the rotflower blossom in Aeonia, Radahn heard a murmur in his ear- "Miquella awaits thee, O promised consort."
This means that presumably, Miquella had already been taken by Mohg by the time the two fought (not during the battle while Malenia was away) and Malenia was sent to kill Radahn so his soul could be manifested in the Land or Shadow (which is why we have to finish the job before we can start the DLC).
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From my point of view I think it's most likely that Radahn initially agreed to become Miquella's consort. but later turned against the deal. The lore seems to place Radahn and Miquella both as a followers of the golden order early on. This is the point in time when the memory conversation took place. Miquella planned to succeed Marika as the new god with Radahn as his elden lord and consort. But after Miquella abandoned golden order fundamentalism when it couldn't cure Malenia's scarlet rot and he started his own new faction, that's when Radahn turned on the deal, as Miquella was not planning to uphold the golden order after Marika but replace it with his own new age. When the shattering began, Radahn initially claimed a great rune and assaulted Leyendell to become the golden order's new elden lord in a desprate attempt to change his own fate, but failed when Morgott unexpectedly emerged and repelled him, explaining that 1 pannel in the game's opening cutscene with Morgott and Radahn fighting. So then Radahn came up with a new plan, to stop the stars/fate in night sky. It's likely Radahn didn't even know about Ranni's plan to defy the golden order and stopping her plans was probably just a coincidence. His main purpose was to stop his own fate of becoming Miquella consort. Miquella then sends Malenia and her army to kill Radahn for 2 purposes, for the night sky to resume so Radahn's fate as Miquella's consort can continue and so his soul gets sent to the realm of shadow.
That's really good. It gives a deeper reason for WHY Radahn would reject a promise which was *allegedly* made.
Radahn was a Golden Order fan boy with his idols being Radagon and Godfrey and Miquella didn't hold up his end of the bargain.
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Thank god for you man, Vaati is slacking you're my new goat
my biggest question is if Miquella is dead now and we wont see him in the future?
I enjoyed this and will be waiting for more content… subscribed!
Rumor has it you can use mohg’s shackle in this fight
Troll
My issue with the idea of "Radahn wanted a worthy death" why though? There is 0 reason for him to willingly want to die (even if he knew he'd come back). On the other hand there can be few reasons why I believe Radahn didn't want to become Miquella consort.
1 - Radahn is literally holding back fate, by holding stars (this would suggest more personal reason as to why he did so. He did it to escape his own fate of joining Miquella, which also accidentally screwed with Ranni). And he would know about it since he is part of Carian Royalty
2 - Radahn is noted to be kind in his remembrance. I doubt he would be willing to screw over Mohg/anybody else just because he wanted a worthy death.
All endings are mutually excluding and stand as opposition to each other. Miquellas ending wouldn't be anything special, this is not the reason why not to give us the age of compassion ending.
The only reason we have no choice but to fight Miquella isn't because we are a threat to Miquellas age and he to our ending where we become a Lord, it's because we weren't given a choice to not fight him in the first place. There was no quest or an ending given where we side with him instead of fighting him. Why were we deprived from that?
Why are we being forced by the game to become an Elden Lord? We had a choice not to link the flame in the Dark Souls 1 and 3, why are we being forced now to become Elden lord? We were brought back to life so we can become Elden Lord just like we were brought back to life as an ash so we can link the flame and yet we were given an option to not link the flame (even though it wasn’t a canonical ending in DS1) but we weren’t given an option to not become Elden Lord? Just because we were brought back to life so we can become a Lord that doesn’t mean we should become one and it doesn’t mean we shouldn’t be able to step down, there were so many other Tarnished who decided to do something else with the life that was given to them.
Miquella’s age of compassion would be an ending where we would step down from the position of a lord, it was really a missed opportunity.
We aren’t even an Elden Lord yet, like Miquella said we are an “aspiring lord". We were given a choice to join Ranni (an empyrean) but we weren’t given a choice to join Miquella (also an empyrean)?
Although the position of a consort is full, Miquella still calls us to join him ,,let us go together’’ AND EVEN CASTS HIS HAND TOWARDS US IN THE SAME MANNER RANNI DOES WHEN WE MARRY HER. We could become Miquellas champion just like Radagon was during the Liurnian wars (When Marikas consort was Godfrey). So many other characters were given multiple endings, and yet a character as important as Miquella wasn’t?
Even tho the age that Miquella promises is morally questionable it doesn't mean we shouldn't be able to side with his view. We were able to become A Frenzied lord and dung lord, which are both morally wrong endings( the one burns the world the other curses it). If we were to follow the same logic, we wouldn't have gotten those 2 endings. I don't care if Miquellas age of compassion would be filled with brainwashed zombies, that's not a reason to not give us another ending to the game. The choice to kill Miquella isn't obvious: Would you kill one person and let everyone be brainwashed or would you spare the person and let everyone be brainwashed? Giving us a singular solution to the problem ( kill Miquella) is a bad story telling decision and its undermining Miquellas character.
Therefore, morality isn’t the reason the age of compassion got killed off.
Why weren’t we given then a chance to join Miquella? The only real reason is because the writer didn’t want us to do anything else but kill him and become an Elden Lord. For me, this is a very disappointing reason and ruins the DLC (from story perspective the gameplay was amazing).
Let me make myself clear, im mad because i wasn't given an option ,by the game, to chose if i want to join Miquella or kill him, not because the ending itself is bad (i think its a legitimate choice to kill Miquella but it shouldn't be an only one).
why werent you given a choice to not kill gwyn? why werent you given a choice to free gherman? why werent you given the choice to do anything? your complaints are rather silly, the age of compassion from god form miquella would never come to pass the way pre-god mequilla intended, thats the moral of the story. also this is a dlc ending, not a freakin main game ending, so comparing them is silly and mindless. man the complaints about this dlc are getting stupid. imo this dlc is laughably above any other dlc, hell this expansion alone is better than bb or ds3s main games XD
🍿 🍿 🍿 🍿 @@flamingmanure
I think it's an interesting conversation around the vast difference in the children raised by Rennala vs the ones that aren't.
I didn’t play the dlc yet but I feel like considering radahns character I feel like he said “give me a good battle or defeat me in battle and I will be your consort” he did respect Godfrey the most also it could’ve been he sunt malenia to nuke him but i don’t get why if malenia was strong why she couldn’t be the consort is it because she was already god level?
Malenia couldn't be the consort because she's an Empyrean too.
seeing this video, i noticed that Miquella's left arm doesnt seen to be there in the cutscene before the second phase cutscene
I feel like we’re missing something. I feel like we could do something with the golden circlet received and the blossom received from St. Trina. Those do not feel like endgame items, but rather keys. I just don’t know where to use them. I could just be desperate for more of an ending though.
i personally doubt radahn was mind controlled because the goal was for him to die, so there wouldn't be a need for that, unless he was mind controlled into taking his own life, which he didn't. i also doubt that radahn didn't agree since the whole thing is that there was a promise made. this leaves one possibility, miquella said that he will give radahn a good fight and a glorious death in battle and in turn after radahn dies he will become lord so he can keep fighting forever. this is also why he kept the stars away, to keep ranni's fate from interfering with his own for as long as he could until the time would come that he would be one with miquella
As Rhadan is the best character in Elden Ring I was so happy when he appeared before subsequently having that happiness beaten out of me by his two swords. Can’t wait for all the lore videos, it feels like almost every part of the lore has been expanded.
Radahn likely learned gravity magic to halt the stars because he knew of both Ranni's and Miquella's plan and rejected them both. Radahn is actually smaller in his prime, but grew massive and had his skin changed to stone after becoming the Starscourge, so I don't believe he learned it only to ride his horse Leonard.
Radahn was a "leal hound of the Golden Order" just like his Father, Radagon. His emblems he showed off were of the two Elden Lords, Godfrey and Radagon. Both Ranni and Miquella would threaten the Golden Order, either by removing the influence of the gods entirely or by having the god (Miquella) being intimately influencing everything with his ability to compel affection. There is no way he would side with his sister or his half-brother, and likely learned gravity magic to halt the stars (and likely his own fate) after learning of both of their plots.
This is why we see the Starscourge, not the Prime Radahn, fighting Malenia.
Miquella originally was like Radahn, and supported the Golden Order. We see in the Ymir questline and in the golden order incantations that something caused Miquella to abandon the Order, and everything else, to become a god.
Miquella's original plan was to have Radahn become his consort, and to abandon everything in the Land's between. We see this because he was draining his Empyrean blood in his Haligtree, seemingly to challenge the power of the Erdtree. When Radahn refused, Miquella made a new plan. He had to have Radahn killed to loose his soul and the stars, then have Mohg, Lord of Blood, drain his Empyrean blood and continue the plan in the Land of Shadow instead. So Miquella waited centuries in the Cocoon, hoping that a Tarnished would kill the two demigods for him. This is likely why he employed so many of them to his cause, from all walks of life. He just didn't pick the right Tarnished.
Miquella is a monster, without love. We know this, because his capacity to love was embodied in St. Trina, who he discarded below the Earth. Radahn never consented to being Lord to a foreign order, which is why he still has no voicelines and his eyes glow yellow. When Radahn rejected his affection, he sicced Malenia on him to kill him, then took advantage of Mogh to eventually steal his body. This is why Morgott calls all of the demigods, bar Mogh, willful traitors.
Godrick employed grafting when assaulting the Capitol ended in failure
Miquella betrayed the Golden Order by seeking a new one
Malenia fought by Miquella's side
Radahn sought the Elden Ring after the shattering, we see him fighting Morgott in a piece of art (But Morgott says his name with respect, seemingly)
Rykard gave himself to the serpent
Ranni gave herself to the moon, and killed her brother Godwyn
I definitely feel like this was supposed to be Godwyn and was changed because Radahn became so popular. There's just a lot of stuff that connects better to Godwyn than it does to him... Not to mention the irony/foreshadowing of Mogh's dynasty being 'Moghwyn' and then him literally being used to rebuild Godwyn half and half.
It feels weird that they would replace godwyn because of radahn's popularity, when many people where hyped for the dlc to see more about godwyn and miquella, making theories about the as popular as radahn was.
No, this feels like Cope. Godwyn's soul was dead and I think people are putting far too much onto Godwyn because we got so little of him. It's explicitly stated over and over again that godwyn's body is all that remains, his soul was completely gone when Ranni organized the Night of Black Knives.
say it with me guys. GODWYN'S SOUL IS DESTROYED. repeat 5 times, Godwyn's soul is destroyed.
They made it sooo clear in the base game how terrifying it is that a demigod's soul can be destroyed, that's why Maliketh sealed Destined Death. Why is it so hard to understand?
@@sparxskywriter2589 could have had tarnished kill ranni, since she orchestrated it, also could have used godwyns fish body to put radhans soul in. i mean, he made mogh into radahn, ya know
@@sparxskywriter2589 I was personally hoping that we'd be able to fight godwyns nightmarish body at some point in the dlc
Playing the rains of castamere at the end was just perfect
Finally some LORE!!!!
I think radahn turned down miquella and as a carian he's ate relies on stars movement he then proceeds to conquer them and hold them back leading miquella to send malenia to kill radahn
Miquella’s actions may have been questionable, but once I beat him I felt like a monster. Especially after reading the remembrance. It was such a sudden and massive drop in climax that I began questioning whether I should’ve left him alone or not.
But that's just the thing. Unlike the others in the Land of Shadow, we still see the Grace of Gold. Even if we were already Elden Lord in the base game, Miquella's actuons force us into action. There's also the fact he abandoned his love and compassion, traits necessary for truly good ruler. If his grand plan for the Age of Compassion was to just charm everyone like he tries to us in the fight, it'sno better than mind control. It sounds like a rule that's peaceful but stripped of free will. That's my 2 cents anyway.
this would've been way cooler with radahn's body, mohg's incorruptible blood, and godwyn's soul
You forgot to add that you can see St Trina and that she tells you to kill Miquella. After you do and go back to her she’s on the floor dead.
what about the HEART STOLEN moment. IF we are the Elden Lord can still be affected by that spell how do we know that Mohgg, Radhan and even Melenia were not also under Miquella''s control too ?
Such an underwhelming ending.
Just finished it and thought i was missing something, it ended so suddenly, terrible ending to such an incredible game
I feel like everyone is focusing on the same aspects of the story, but something I want to know (and I haven’t heard anyone talk about it), is what did Miquella pull out of Godwyn’s eye and offer to the divine gate in the trailer? They showed that in the trailer like it was important, and then there was nothing about it in the actual game 🤷🏼♂️
Probably because that was Marika not Miquella
Miqulla telling me to bow and let him and radahn fix the land between is funny because I already inherited the frenzied flame
I’m of the thought that Radahn refused Miquella’s request. Radahn seems like he would be too prideful to bend the knee to another. Plus, it seems like Radahn was more aligned with Ranni and Rykard more than anything. Rykard helped with Ranni’s plan to kill Godwyn and maybe the reason was because Godwyn would become Miquella’s consort so in order to stop that, she destroyed his soul. I also believe Radahn’s conquest of the stars is unrelated to the plots of the other demigods. I believe he did that just to call down the star beast (Astel and fallingstar beast) in order to fight them.
Astel almost assuredly came long before radahn as they were buried long before the golden order had conquered everything so still during the Godfrey era
@@UnholyWrath3277 True. Although the other Astels and fallingstar beast likely came down when Radahn did his star caller cry
radahn is too chad to let another man mount him. so miquella seethes and brought him back unwillingly through death without his consent.
worst lil boy period. yuck.
Rains of Castamere was a shock to hear in the background