Can Tesla’s Cybertruck Finally Solve Towing? Not Yet...
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- Опубліковано 21 бер 2024
- Why Tesla's Cybertruck isn't quite ready for long range towing.
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The Tesla Cybertruck has absolutely dominated discussions amongst the electric truck scene, but can it handle the electric truck's biggest hurdle - long range towing? We'll cover four major subjects in this video:
1) Why do electric pickup trucks struggle with long range towing?
2) How does a truck's shape influence it's towing range?
3) Why do some trucks lose more range while towing than others?
4) How do options like the Cybertruck and Silverado EV stack up in long range towing applications?
References:
Car and Driver Tow Test - www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...
Mercedes EV Tow Test - doi.org/10.1007/978-3-658-370...
TFL Cybertruck Tow Test - • People Say the Tesla C...
TFL Silverado EV Tow Test - • You'll Be SHOCKED How ...
TFL Silverado EV Range Test - • How Far Can the 2024 C...
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Who else cracks up every time Jason draws the Cybertruck as a generic triangle, meanwhile all the other cars are pretty well drawn side views of an actual car. Great video as always.
Well, the cybertruck is a generic triangle…
@@ElZamo92 factsss
@@ElZamo92well, if it is that generic point me to anything else on the road that looks like it :D
and the 2nd type of triangle is basically Semi... he's a genius (Jason, not Elon...)
It really is a scalene triangle.
Fascinating. I didn't realize that having a super aerodynamic truck might actually work against the towing efficiency when a trailer is involved. But it makes sense!
A topper / shell will help fix that problem for the Rivian.
Literally just look at semi trucks
@miamisasquatch this is what I was thinking. The US's obsession with gross huge vehicles is just a race to recreating the semi
@@firstname405sports-utility-semi-truck
does it seem needlessly big? sure, but the RAM and F-250 are too
@@firstname405F-650 has entered the chat
AAAH I was not prepared for the animated whiteboard!
Haha, learned a new editing trick to get the arrows behind my hands - how cool! 🤓🤓
Nobody expects the animated whiteboard!
Fake news. He obviously had surgery to install dry erase markers into his fingertips.
I really like it
You'd think that instead of a "range extender battery" it would be easier to develop an aero package to be mounted on the bed. to improve towing efficiency. You can then have a more efficient regular truck and a more efficient towing truck at the same time.
Not just easier to develop - but also much cheaper to consumers. I'm really curious why that isn't a thing.
@@Muskar2because air drag coefficient doesn't affect the range that much, the battery size does.
@@Userext47 Did you even watch the whole video lol....
@@HuyVYes.... the whole point of that top right was to say aerodynamics doesn't matter when it comes to towing. Did you?
5:25 & 6:35 bro, did you even watch the video? @@Userext47
9:44 Out of spec did 70mph range test on the Silverado EV, down to when it wouldn't move anymore: 434 miles.
They also estimated the battery size at around 215kwh. Which is in line with the estimates here.
Amazing - 434 real world highway miles is quite good!
@@EngineeringExplained what was even more amazing was their Cyberbeast hit 304 miles out of a range estimate of 301. First time I’ve ever seen a Tesla hit its estimated range, especially at 70mph.
@@EngineeringExplained Especially for a vehicle that large!
@@paratus04That makes sense, it's most likely just the same platform as the Hummer EV but with a lighter and slightly smaller body on top (there's also an ultra luxury Cadillac EV on the same platform)
Year after year I never get enough of your explanations. The only UA-cam channel that has technical data to prove their point without biased opinions.
Happy to hear it, thanks for continuing to watch!
@@EngineeringExplained When are we going to see you on nebula
@@EngineeringExplained why did you congratulate gm engineers when all they did was put a big battery in the truck without disclosing the actual price?
@@a-don13 "@EngineeringExplained why did you congratulate gm engineers when all they did was put a big battery in the truck without disclosing the actual price?"
That's a good question.
@@EngineeringExplainedunrelated to this comment, but can you explain what’s going on with your Facebook group not posting your videos?
The trick to towing efficiency is getting the trailer lower than the roof of the truck. Look at 18 wheelers, the trailer fits right up against the cab to make one big shape, and trucking is efficiency oriented.
I haul dry van freight in a typical fleet semi truck. Most people get out of school thinking 12,000 lbs is the max amount of weight you can shift to the steer axle. I know the actual laws, and shift the 5th wheel forward until it's about 12,350 lbs (the axle rating is 12,500). This reduces the gap between truck and trailer, improving aerodynamics and giving me a slight edge in MPG. One thing to take note is that aerodynamic drag factors more into the equation when lightly loaded than when at max legal weight. This is why the extremely aero Tesla is best suited for hauling potato chips at 50mph.
It wasn't always that way. I think those fiberglass fairings started appearing about the time of the gas crisis in '73.
Some road tractors with low cab roof have fairings that angle upwards towards just above where the top of trailer will be. One example of this is the DAF XD.
Recently towed 500 miles with an R1T. It got about 1.4 mi/kWh with a 5500# trailer that had a very small cross sectional area. Can confirm the lack of pull thru chargers and that really you need that 200-250 mile range (total) when towing so you can go faster than 60mph and spend less time at chargers rolling off to a high SOC.
1.4 kWh isn't bad at all! But if the trailer is a tiny frontal area, then perhaps that's a bit disappointing, as it's still a pretty heavy range hit.
Chargers are also uncovered and unprotected from the elements. I bet a simple 18-24" snow storm would cripple most charging "Stations".
@@dieseldan420ca No.. lol.. It's waterproof
Have to assume driving faster reduces range, so trade-off between time spent driving and time spent charging.
@@calholliI think he means the snow accumulated by not being covered would make access with ANY EV impossible, which is completely accurate.
Trailer Aerodynamics - should be mentioned. Years back, I built an aerodynamic 8ft trailer for towing behind my G1 Honda Insight. I took it on a 1500 mile road trip. Averaging 60mph, my fuel economy over the entire trip was 57mpg. For reference, just opening the back hatch of the car wide open, with no trailer, no passengers and no payload, dropped the car to around 45mpg. A trailer that pays any attention at all to aerodynamics will dramatically increase EV towing range.
Edison Motors seems to have it figured out for big rigs. They’re even starting to do retrofits for passenger trucks. “Hybrid” EV drive with a diesel generator to charge the battery when needed
Series PHEVs are so cool. If we can’t have normal ones like the Chevy Volt, hopefully we can get cool SOFC / Direct Methanol or Ethanol fuel cells, or those interesting Linear Free Piston Generators on the “skid”
I've been arguing for that for years. Perhaps a 400cc hydrogen-powered (ideally) generator onboard an EV.
@@PeterBeens hydrogen is kind of iffy.
It *can* work, but many other things can do the same thing, if not better. Look up Power-to-X technology, granted most of the “e-fuels” technology discussion is about making drop-ins for gasoline, BUT there are PEM fuel cels that run on pure methanol or ethanol, or SOFCs that run on CNG (Methane) or DME (Dimethyl Ether).
DME also works well in barely modified (just injectors, fuel rail, maybe some gaskets) Diesel Engines too.
The only point of using hydrogen, at least in my opinion, is for Rockets, and Fuel Cells + Industrial Gas Turbines, although even then better fuels for both.
(Although industrial The simplicity of electrolyser design may make up for complex materials needed for hydrogen storage/handling to avoid embrittlement, and pressures needed etc)
(I think Home Biogass Upgrading it CNG, Syngas-to-X, and maybe even Reverse Fuel Cells / Reverse Microbial Fuel Cells may be the way to get fuel from home akin to hydrogen, but in most cases a PHEV can just he charged at home much easier!)
@@PeterBeens400cc is too small. Once the EV/hybrid battery is done the backup power source needs to output as much power as it takes to accelerate the mass being moved and overcoming the drag force while pushing through the wind. And hydrogen is an expensive and inefficient source of energy storage.
Edison's solution is ok for their use case. They are designed for light loads up the mountain. And big loads down. For big loads up a mountain you will still need a bigger powerplant/generator to provide the power. At some point being able to drive the wheels "directly " from the engine is better. Which is why the under appreciated Chevy Volt is technically a hybrid.
My f150 has the large tank at about 130L. Empty and truck only I can easily get over 1000km hiway. If I tow a 20ft 4000lb camper I can go 500km. Every test I've done range is almost exaclty half.
I was just wondering about that. Is this only a problem in EVs because you can just stop at gas stations and fill up? You don't have to wait to charge?
Seems to be the case. I think TFL did a gas towing test right alongside the tests mentioned in this video and they did a little better than 50% with the gas truck, but that's probably because of the gas truck's awful aerodynamics -- you're paying most of the aero cost regardless of whether you have a trailer or not.
@@bvoyelr if an EV had 1000km rangs as well I don't think anyone would mind.
@@RobertJLessard Yes they would. There'll always be people who'll dismiss EVs if their worst quality isn't better than ICEVs counterpart - I've met many of them over the years.
@Muskar2 And why is that not justified? You are asking me to take my hard earned money from my labor and buy a brand new technology. If it isn't clearly better in nearly every regard than my already available options, why am I morally inferior for making that choice? Not everyone us born with a silver spoon up their ass, fyi.
With my 1990 D350 diesel, I get 23mpg clean and 18mpg towing on the highway.
Granted, I drive 55mph because that's the law. So maybe we shouldn't be testing at 70mph.
The degree to which trailer aero and vehicle-trailer aero compatibility have been ignored is INSANE. This should have been worked out with the first gas crisis in the 1970s!
It has been in the market where it's most important, and viable to do so - semi trucks nearly all have shrouds to match their aero to their box trailers
@@bosstowndynamics5488Sometimes, even when the cab is significantly smaller. Example: DAF XD.
OMG, the "old movie" effect on your old video totally cracked me up 🤣👍
4 years ago, pre-Covid, somehow feels like a different century and yesterday at the same time.
@@EngineeringExplained Wow! That's so concise and deep, you're absolutely right! Good to see you being still at it, I follow you since the days of the Honda S2000 tuning 🙌
I've towed a couple thousand miles in my model 3 SR+. I realized aerodynamics was way more important than weight. With an empty trailer (w/ back ramp grate) I got 700 wh/mile, full of boxes and a couch I got 550 wh/mile. I've replicated this many times and the key was keeping that airstream above the trailer before hitting that back grate. When I remove the mesh/grate back ramp w/ an empty trailer I get 400-550 wh/mile depending on weather/temp/speed/etc
Yup. Our Model Y Long Range got better mileage towing a double seadoo trailer with two bikes on it plus four on the roof, than it did towing an empty utility trailer with the expanded metal gate/ramp up. Once the utility trailer was loaded, the range improved to about the same as the seadoos plus bikes. :)
(That seadoos plus bikes trip was the acid test we were most worried about when we swapped the Santa Fe XL for the 3-row Model Y. It passed, and we've saved SOOOO much money not buying 60,000 km worth of gas this past year.)
The back gate is handy, but also a huge amount of drag. Most people don’t realize just how bad it is. Would actually probably be less drag if it was a solid plate instead of the mesh.
There are some designs that allow the gate to fold in half, or fold flat if you’re empty. That helps quite a bit, but is also typically more expensive.
100%. I tow a 5500 lbs travel trailer but have also towed a 5500 lb dump trailer several times with sod in it. The dump trailer is FAR easier to tow and puts far less strain on the tow vehicle.
Towing a travel trailer, like many truck owners do, at 65-70mph and then throwing a headwind into the mix requires a tremendous amount of HP. There have been times when I was towing on flat ground using a constant 220 hp to maintain 65mph.
Please do a video on Edison motors, diesel, hybrid, semi‘s and pick ups
The editing in this video was on point with the whiteboard graphics appearing behind you!
Hey thanks!!
Ditto, love the graphics update
So maybe a variable body shape? Like a cab-top spoiler which can be deployed for a towing mode to optimize aerodynamics while towing and stowed for better mileage without the trailer?
I was thinking the same thing, except modifying the trailer instead. Your solution sounds way better, though!
Good idea. Ideally it would be a Cybertruck that morphs into the shape of a Chevy Silverado EV anytime you need to do anything remotely truck-like with it.
Yeah. Was just checking the comments to see if somebody had mentioned this.
A canopy in truck bed that raises the height so it's at the same level as the trailer should be better than any of the options given.
@@AmiGanguli So like the "Cybertruck Basecamp" tent? Would be funny to see somebody test that out!
Current pickups have such accessories available for towing large trailers (cab spoilers) but I don’t think the impact would be great enough on its own to make up for the range impact towing in general has on a current EV.
It’s important to note that every increase in battery size pushes out the mileage for carbon crossover. In other words, the carbon cost of the battery is significant, and heavier EV’s are less efficient, so it will take more miles before the carbon footprint of a heavy big battery EV is lower than that of a conventional vehicle (since it generally starts out worse). Another commenter mentioned hybrid as a good compromise, and I think right now there is a very good argument to be made for plug in hybrids for their lower overall carbon system cost.
Better argument for variable size or modular battery swapping.
Compared to a diesel or even a large gas truck??? II would venture to guess that the crossover point would be reached relatively quickly.
@@davemiller6121 A Hummer EV, as an example, has a LOT of steel and lithium in it. Building it probably uses the lifecycle carbon of three Toyota RAV 4 hybrids. These large EV's are not "good for the environment" in the sense that a lot of people have been lead to believe.
Which is not to say that electrification is bad. Even if individual vehicles aren't necessarily low total carbon, electrification still has strong system benefits. But as a shorthand for personal decision making, if you want to know how to reduce carbon, the best rule of thumb you could use is probably just reduce weight * distance of the things you buy and use. Heavy things have a very high system cost in carbon.
@@jstogdill
The Hummer EV is the worst example. It's outrageously inefficient, even for a truck, and only a handful was made, so not even relevant. The best selling EV truck will be the Cybertruck, likely already this year, and it's almost twice as efficient, and also a ton lighter (means much less material).
And trucks are likely driven more, especially if used for towing, so they cross over much faster. Not to mention that diesel trucks are also heavy and burn a lot of gas, so even in miles the crossover point should be the similar.
@@andrasbiro3007 sure, I used the most extreme example to illustrate the point. It’s easy enough to do the math if you want to. Bottom line is no one is saving the world buying any of these trucks and using them for buying groceries. If we want to decarbon our energy and transportation systems we should be emphasizing very low weight EV’s like those described in Jason Fagone’s Ingenious and / or micro mobility solutions.
Fairings were introduced on semi tractors in the 70s to reduce drag from the front of the trailer. I remember pondering why didn't anyone think of this "duh solution" before. That started my life journey to visualize problems and work out solutions without applying math or going through design iterations.
Fuel was cheap and wheelbase was more important.
Lol, solutions without applying math. So visual design with no way to know if they are actual solutions.
@@SurmaSampo "solutions without applying math." There's a good story about Chris Smith (founder of Chris Craft, high-end speedboat manufacturer). In his early days he designed a speedboat for a wealthy client, but during tests they were having problems reaching the promised speeds. The engineers with him had determined the water flow around the hull was causing a vacuum to develop behind the boat directly in front of the motor, reducing the amount of thrust the propeller could generate. They were discussing changes they could make to the boat's hull shape so it wouldn't generate a vacuum, and the hydrodynamic calculations that would be required. Chris simply grabbed a drill and made a hole from the back of the boat to the cockpit (above the waterline), relieving the vacuum and fixing the problem.
@@solandri69What Chris created is a vortex generator.
There are also ways to improve the drag of the trailer. Some trailers taper toward the hitch, which is much better than a plain box shape. Another option is to attack the drag on the upper half, with the roof sloped to the front of the trailer. Alternatively, extend the front of the trailer (similar to some fifth wheel trailers) with a similar slope.
Though the best option is to match the vehicle to the trailer...like the Tesla Semi. Hopefully we will see the necessary charging infrastructure to support this in the near future.
Please do a similar comparison with gas/diesel towing so we can see side-by-side. All I hear is negativity about EV towing but I'm sure gas/diesel gets a huge range cut too.
Personal experience is petrol losses 20% when towing my racecar over 20 years. Different tow vehicles and different trailers over those years but always the same result.
Its not the range that is the issue, its what fraction of the time are you waiting for a charger, how much more expensive the same capability is, and whether there even are charging stations on the route your taking towing a boat to remote coastline or camper to a remote campsite.
However, towing long distance is also very pricy in fuel, so, IF! they could make the equivalent EV cost the same as a gas truck, (by making the ev cheaper not by penalizing gas trucks) then some people would be willing to wait a bit at the charger or go somewhat less remote places, to save money.
@@alexanderx33 Not to mention most chargers aren't placed for pull through so you will most likely have to unhitch which is a big pain. But hey it may be a good opportunity for one of these BEV pickup makers to have automatic hitching, just hold down a button and the pickup automatically lowers the rear and backs up until the ball is under the receiver then raises! Just have to hook up the chains and electrics!
A while back I happened upon someone who had done cfd on various types of trailers, they found that a boat has fairly low form drag as trailers go, but the hull creates a lot of induced drag
Plugin hybrids make THE MOST sense on a truck. Lots of space and there is a need for long range! Slap a 3 cylinder 1l engine in it and you’ve just doubled the towing range.
The Ram REV is a similar design but I believe they went with a larger generator so that if the battery does run out, there can still be sufficient power to maintain a climb or for needed acceleration. I too think a smaller generator is fine but I bet Ram does not want a potentially negative optic if people forget to charge it and complain about a lack of performance.
Even better: Put the engine on the trailer, and either hook up a power inlet to the EV to let the generator power feed the motors, or feed the rotational engine output directly to the trailer axle, so the trailer becomes self-propelling at highway speeds. No need for a gearbox: Just one ratio that works and engages at highway speeds and negates the load of the trailer. The towing EV will take care of the slower speeds where wind resistance is lower, and acceleration phases.
@@arantala That is not realistic as the added weight to the trailer will cost more range than if it were on the truck itself. Anything on a trailer will take more power to pull.
@@drscopeify I don't think that's a given at all. The greatest cost of towing long distances is in the air resistance. Weight is only relevant through tire rolling resistance, and in acceleration and on uphill routes. Adding a small 300 lb powertrain to a 5500 lb trailer isn't going to be a significant increase in rolling resistance if it can completely or even significantly negate the additional drag the trailer causes.
I'm personally not convinced by PHEVs in large vehicles, particularly not for long distance. From what I've seen, for longer trips PHEVs wind up doing a bit worse than diesel in terms of efficiency and emissions, and the sort of people frequently travelling long distances aren't likely to see enough benefit from short hops to make up for that. And something really important to remember is that *a lot* of light trucks don't actually need much range as they're actually used for shorter trips like tradespeople travelling to nearby jobsites and such. Personally I'm of the belief that PHEV in these settings winds up combining the horrible efficiency of gasoline engines in heavy vehicles with the higher cost of an electric drivetrain to deliver the worst of both worlds - they're really best suited for smaller to midsize light duty vehicles intended for personal travel, and even then only for people with extremely long commutes or with certain other edge case circumstances that preclude a true EV.
I think Ram might have the right idea for occasional towing by having a gasoline range extender in their electric trucks. Runs as an electric only truck most of the time, but then uses the gas engine to extend the range when towing. Way more cost effective than massive heavy battery packs that aren’t needed 95% of the time.
Speaking of the range of the Silverado, Out of Spec did a 100%-to-dead test in ~65F weather, and got a very impressive 434 miles on a 70mph highway loop test that they've used for dozens of other EV range tests. That 514 miles that Jason estimated seems very optimistic, though, given OOS's result. He didn't mention what speed the TFTruck test was done at, tho.
"hey guys, we fixed this problem with out new tesla trailer, it has extra batteries on it when you need to tow longer distances... now only 89999.99$"
Well, tha'ts actually what should be done. Put the extra batteries on the thing lowering range.
When you don't need it, you don't drag all this extra weight.
@@xmtxxand aero can be matted with the truck to produce the greatest efficiency possible.
Yeah a trailer that weighs so much due to the extra batteries all it can haul is 2 bicycles. Fanbois will call it "revolutionary" in hopes of being invited to lick elon's ass
Yep and it will be ready by 2025 or 6 or 7 or 32. And it will cost three times as much. But at least it will be bullet proof, and fully amphibian.
I cannot fathom how an intelligent person thinks this will work?
@@nothere9551 I'm far from being an Elon fan (the pan is a psychopath). But we tend to forget that the guy (his teams), is always late for delivering what everybody else thought, was impossible.
That's something
As a child we would tow our boat from Omaha to Ogallala 330+ miles. That would require one charge stop and full charges at each end. It's impressive that the Chevy can support 300kW charging but there are many videos that show when you are sharing the network you really get 50. You can triple those charging time (or more if the site is full, which they often are now). There's still a long way to go before the consumer experience is where it should be.
5m of vid, not towing, not an ev owner, but already like the beauty of your explanations
So the problem isn't being solved, it's being buried under tons of batteries.
"We have a 600 mile towing range!"
"What's the curb weight of the truck?"
"17,327lbs..."
I'm actually curious why Tesla or someone hasn't made a more aerodynamic trailer. It's been patently obvious since EVs came out that aero was important. Seems like not a huge task to make one with a teardrop profile.
Tbf, it's the same way regular trucks solve the problem, how far do you think an F150 would tow if it didn't have a huge tank?
@@badbasic
And the tank full of gas weights?
The problem is not ev cannot do long range, it is the weight and volume penalty comes with it.
@@jintsuubest9331 If you want to tow really heavy loads, weight is frankly your friend. While the range issue is apparent and real with EVs while towing, weight and torque make it effortless and safe. If someone gave me a huge, unbalanced load to tow, I would take Silverado EV over a regular truck in a heartbeat. If it's a light trailer, a regular F150 is still a better tool for the job.
@@badbasic
Assume 6 pounds per gallon gasoline
23 gallon tank F-150 = 138 pounds
36 gallon tank F-150 = 216 pounds
Difference: 78 pounds
Aerodynamic trailers have lower effective volumetric capacity for the size of their footprint. This means larger and generally heavier to carry the same or less stuff.
I didn't even think of this pull-through charging problem, that's a great point!
The location of the charge port is tied to this, also. If it is on the rear of the vehicle, you WILL have to unhitch unless you can find a pull-thru station (and I have yet to ever see one in reality in my area). If it is near the front, you still might have to unhitch, but there's a fighting chance of making it work if the trailer sticking out doesn't cause a traffic problem (give it 50% odds). Ford and Rivian both have the charge port on the left front (with the nod to the Rivian for needing the shortest cable). I don't know why GM put it on the left rear of the Silverado given that all their other EVs thus far have it on the left front. (And yes, Tesla is wrong. LOL)
That's the one thing I hate when we tow the seadoos with the Model Y. Fortunately it's only a problem for two or three days of the year, most of our trips with them don't require a charging stop.
Yep the GM and Tesla trucks are going to be inconvenienced unless they fit them with auto trailer hitching, which would be pretty sweet. Still sucks to have to unhitch just to top up the battery though. You would think at least Tesla would have put the charge port in the front for the Model X and CT. But I doubt the usual Tesla driver will be towing anything substantial enough to eat into the range too badly.
Thanks for the video. You do a good job at lots of data in a short video. Thanks again
The point you made but didn't follow up with is the drag of the trailer. A 6,500lb trailer that is all flat steel, out of the wind would get much more range than towing a 12' tall cube van of the same weight.
Rather than larger batteries, maybe trucks need a "drop in" power generator to make it a temporary hybrid. I've seen a couple of interesting hybrids.
One is a DIY Tesla that had a small diesel dropped in the back. It is still a work in progress.
The other is the Edison hybrid truck designed for BC log hauling. They are in the process of getting it licensed for the road. It uses a relatively small engine (you can actually drop any motor in) to charge the batteries. All drive power is electric. Since you have an optimized generator on board the batteries can be smaller, say than a Tesla transport truck. It is designed with the known constraint/fact that it will be travelling empty up hill, then using regenerative braking when heading down hill with a heavy load. There is some loaded travel on flat land. Edison is also working with another shop to develop a "kit" to convert ICE pickup trucks to hybrid electric.
I’m wondering how this translates to the non-North American market. In Europe, for instance, craftsmen typically use vans instead of pick-up trucks and we use our normal cars for towing all kinds of stuff. I can see the vans getting larger batteries, but not our regular Volkswagen Golf (which in Europe is rated to tow up to 3500 lbs) and similar sized cars.
My 2003 Volvo v70 has a range of ~700km (450 miles) with its 70 liter (~18 gallons) tank, while towing a 2 ton(~4200pound) horse trailer. And that is, beside the price ofc, the main reason that i won't get an electric yet. Right now its a 5-6 hours to go the longest "normal" trip with the horses, with an electric car it would take ~9 hours since i'd have to wait for the car to recharge twice to get there. For smaller trips electric is great though and im hoping for cheaper, denser batteries in the future.
EVs aren't practical yet for towing. But for daily driving non towing, EVs are superior as long as you can charge at home overnight.
@@matthewd6306I'm going to re-emphasize one of the first points Jason made in the video - EVs are fantastic at towing, they're only impractical at *long range* towing. That distinction is extremely important because there's loads of short range towing needs that EVs are fantastic for because even after factoring in the range penalty they're still much cheaper to run than an ICE towing the same trailer.
@@bosstowndynamics5488 the even simpler answer is batteries are too expensive so their gas tank is too small.
@@hugegamer5988 Well yeah, but that's still only a problem for long range towing (and while battery cost is part of it, so is battery weight).
I love this channel. As someone from a non-engineering background, you make these topics not only interesting but easy to understand. The whiteboard is also amazing. If I had teachers like you throughout school maybe I would have become an engineer.
What I understand from this video is that having a bed for towing is inefficient because the wind goes down hitting the trailer. So, the future of EV towing will be done by Vans?
Everything should be vans. Respect the van people.
@@majist0 Totally agree, Van's rock
We’ll see how the Ram REV performs. Reliability and complexity will (at least initially) be a concern but the premise sounds promising.
For the next few years, this looks like a really good solution for those who routinely tow larger trailers long distances.
Aptly named the Ramcharger.
It would make for a rather expensive trailer, but from an efficiency point of view, wouldn't it make sense to put an extra battery on the trailer? At least that way, you're not dragging around giant battery unless you need it. Or tow a generator. You lose the benefits of pure electricity, but you only need it when towing long distance.
Anything over 250 miles is considered long distance with evs
Thanks for the insightful review! As always, great algebra!
Energy density is the issue, hybrid is the best solution that’s why trains have been that way for longer then any of us have been alive. Problem on the road is weight but progress has been made on that making it a more viable option.
Airflow is neat, for class 8 all the manufacturers say to keep the trailer within 36” to keep the drag low.
"4 years ago, I explained why I din't think it would be succesful .. But today, I received a check to say otherwise.."
Kidding. I love your videos and you are a great teacher and I have learned so much form you. Just couldn't miss the importunity for a joke. :)
This brings of the issue of trailer aerodynamics, which I hope you'll address in a future video. Recently, we took a three month tour of the U.S. pulling a teardrop trailer behind out Mazda CX5 (2.5 liter 4-cylinder). With a very strong tailwind in New Mexico, at 65 mph, I got over 30 miles per gallon. Driving through South Dakota into a headwind, I got 18 mpg. My average for the trip was about 21.5 mpg. I doubt that the teardrop shape is as aerodynamic as most people think. But it's probably better than most travel trailers that are shaped like a brick, and have external air conditioners, awnings, and other flow disrupters.
There's no getting around frontal area with trailers, except with pop-ups. From there, the factors are how the air hits it, and leaves it, and tear drops are pretty good in those regards. However, frontal area is still frontal area.
@@paulmryglod4802 All true. A teardrop has an aero-looking profile and is better than a box. But from an aerial view, it still looks like a box with fenders and wheels sticking out into the wind. If it were wider and the wheels were enclosed, it might be more aero. Also -- it seems to me -- although the sloping rear is aero at low speeds, laminar flow is lost at high speeds and air becomes turbulent. The question is, at what speed does this occur? As a teardrop owner, these are a few of my thoughts.
@MrTeff999 yes good observations. There is some data on this I found years ago, page-2 Google stuff. Airflow separation occurs fairly soon at like 45-50mph, which surprised me, based on my recollection (not positive about this)
Low rolling resistance tires, enclosing them within the structure, making the bottom flat and relatively smooth are all good moves.
Years ago, I drove from Florida to NY and for fun tried all the easy stuff to improve mpg. I started with a heavily loaded manual Saturn wagon with luggage, kids, fiance. I added an air damn to the front, all the way to an inch above the ground, I added coroplast underneath the body to make it smooth, air damned half the radiator opening, had aftermarket smooth hub caps.
I went from 31mpg highway to 41mpg average for the trip. The airdamn broke shortly after and milage went down to 33, so I figured keeping the air out from underneath, and having the car lower was the majority of the improvement.
We NEED a video made by YOU about RAKE !!!! And not only about AERO but how it affects weight transfer, rotation and Dynamic and static weight distribution PLEASEEEEEEE
An obvious fix for the CyberTruck would be to change the side profile to more of a wedge shape by placing a large, appropriately shaped fairing in the truck bed. That fairing could be collapsible or deflatable for easy configuration change.
Towing solution: integrated battery in trailer.
Better towing solution: on board generator.
Ie edison motors. Using half the engine to pull twice the weight with 4x the MPG (going from 5 mpg to 20 mpg with the same not-aerodynamic body is pretty impressive.
Best towing solution: Dont use an EV
Airstream has a concept trailer with electric motors
Imagine what a joy that will be when you have to do a mid-trip charge.
Awful solution.
This is why we need serial hybrid trucks. Unlimited range with an all electric drivetrain and an optimized single-speed range extender.
A much smaller, cheaper battery, with easy fast fill-ups WITHOUT disconnecting the trailer.
There no such thing as unlimited range stop drinking the Toyota Kool-Aid you have range until you out of gas and the battery is dead 😂 you do not go forever
diesel electric... been around for long, long time in trains.... not sure why it hasn't been adopted for heavy trucking with addition of a battery and auto start/stop for traffic.. battery helps with boost and hills like that koenigsegg
with engine running only at it's most efficient rpm/peak of powerband... runs very clean and delivers most possible mpg
@@wachinpntdry. A few companies have built hybrid tractor power trains but cost was always the factor. Even when some companies proved in the long run the shipping companies would save money (like a lot more) they couldn't stomach the upfront cost of the system and retraining mechanics and such. Shipping companies tend to be extremely thrifty and conservative unless laws tell them to do otherwise, unfortunate it takes that type of arm wringing.
That's the concept of the edison truck semi, they will sell that for pickups in the future
@@raphiseth6942Yes, I have a reservation to do a conversion.
ICE range extenders would be so much more efficient at solving the range problem. The Silverado probably carries 1000lbs more battery that what most people need 95% of the time and even that is just adequate. A 40kW generator set could be installed in the trailer or truck bed when needed and save a lot of wear and wasted energy hauling around unneeded batteries.
Great analysis
Keep up th good work
Despite the issues (and you might want to look at HGV / Trailer fairings used to streamline trucks in Europe) I still gave this video a thumbs up. 👍
What issues? You're talking about something different from pickup trucks.
2/3 less range with a 6,500 lb trailer. Wow !!! It would have been interesting to know about the percentage of range loss with a gas or diesel pick-up in the same conditions.
In my experience with a gasoline truck my mileage drops to about half when pulling a heavy load.
With diesel it dropped less than 25%.
Same model truck(Nissan Titan) same trailer just different engines.
My '01 diesel pickup drops from 19 MPG highway when empty, to about 12.5 with an 8000 lb box trailer. Before I had the box trailer, I had an open trailer which weighed about 4000 lb with a car on it. I used to get about 16-17 MPG. I think the difference once again came down to aero: The box is much taller than the cab of the pickup, while the highest point on the open trailer was lower than the cab.
I think one thing that was glossed over was the first comparison between trucks hauling the same 6500lb. trailer. The Hummer is a much larger and heavier vehicle, so the trailer would be a smaller percentage of the total (truck+trailer). It would make sense that the range drops a smaller percentage then also.
I think that the new Ramcharger promises to deliver great towing range and an easy recharging/refueling option. Basically, it’s a range extended EV or plug-in serial hybrid with massive battery-take your pick of preferred description. Can’t wait to see how it performs in towing tests
I would love if you would take a look at Edison Motors concept topsy
Pulling a 3000 lb trailer with my V6 Jeep Liberty at 65 mph I can get about 11 mpg. I have seen up to 14 mpg towing that trailer while following a semi truck. The best gains are from semi trailers with no aerodynamic tail flaps, but with side skirts and rear bumper areas under the box that block airflow coming from under the truck. That 3 mpg is a 27% gain in efficiency for me on long trips. I am not driving closer than 2 or 3 seconds behind the truck so am not drafting them unsafely and still have time to react. My Scangauge II gives me real time feedback so I can find the sweet spot with the least turbulence. Anyhow, any of those rigs in the video could probably get 20-25% more range by informally joining a semi truck convoy on the interstate and learning how to drive more efficiently in groups. As for me, doing that translates into 50 more miles per tank while towing on long highway trips, which really helps the vacation budget. Interestingly, it is only about a 10% gain in mpg while not towing!
Love a good Fenske video! Practical. Useful. And none of the opinion BS- here is the physics of towing. A dash of future outlook. Boom, done.
You mentioned that the drag due to the trailer is a major issue. Why not then create a bed cap accessory that optimizes the shape of the truck for towing. This would work with the cybertruck and others.
One option is just slow down. 2x the distance at 50 vs 80 is pretty dramatic.
Probably shouldn't be north of 60 towing something substantial anyway.
Didn't matter as much in the past, as ICE engines are typically geared for peak efficiency north of 55mph. Eventually more people will realize the strengths of electric drivetrains.
For extreme temperature and especially long range towing a small efficient integrated fuel burning range extender would be amazing, at least considering current technology, Though the battery and drive unit in the trailer seems interesting as prices come down.
Excellent video - thank you!
Another banger🎉.
Hey, could you make a video explaining the cvts used in agricultural tractors? I can't seem to understand how they work.
Why not hybrids to bridge the range and charging issues?
Ram REV is going to do just that.
I think that's the best option for the time being, at least until battery power density gets higher.
@@MrJustinOtis Yeah some of these pickups have almost 200 kWhr of batteries, that's insane! They can make dozens of HEV and PHEV commuting appliances for that amount of batteries in one pickup and have a much better impact on fleet emissions overall.
Drag is one thing, but the biggest reason is motor load and slip. When a motor slips under load the rotor bar gets further away from the pole. The formula for magnetic flux in a motor is divided by the distance away. When electric motors are at a certain load thresh hold the efficiency falls off of a cliff.
What do you mean by when the motor slips? Like the rotor moves past a portion of the stator without somehow applying the inductive or magnetic force?
Does that really come into play at constant highway speeds even under the extra drag load of a trailer?
@ALMX5DP The angle difference between the poles and the shorted rotor bars that line up with the poles. The more load the greater the angle aka slip.
It's fundamentally an energy problem (kWh onboard), not so much a motor problem. TFL truck did a range test Silverado EV vs gas Ford F-150. 38 mpge vs 10 mpg, that's nearly 4x the efficiency - crazy cool!
@@yoice2k ah, but aren’t these motors designed to be operated within a certain parameter and load? I can see some efficiency loss but is it really that great if the loads are already figured into the system and its capabilities? Do we know what the relative efficiency loss is for instance on a Tesla at different load levels?
Thanks for another awesome video!
The more I watch videos on EV the more I like my 2014 Audi Q7 TDI. Awesome seven-seater family carrier that has a towing capacity of 5500 lb and "recharges" in a couple of minutes:)
The important thing to understand is that if your trailer had *any* focus in aerodynamics, it would improve things a lot. More of often than not the trailer design iminates a brick on wheels and has equally good aerodynamics.
How about the cheap option: create a shroud that can be fitted on the back of the vehicle fill that gap in an aerodynamic way.
something like that is really the only feasible option since no matter how aerodynamic a trailer or vehicle itself is, the actual drag is going to be determined by the combination/ interplay between them... some sort of flexible shroud that's easy and quick to deploy/stow
I still remain baffled why these companies don't implement a petro-based APU (range extender), composed of a small turbine running a generator, with maybe a 2-10 gallon fuel tank. Just like the APU on an aircraft. Depending on recharge rates, it could give nearly unlimited mileage, could bolster stationary charging, and would be superb for apartment dwellers and overland-ers alike.
I agree, but I think the liability of running an unattended source of CO2 in an unventilated space is too great for any company to tackle it.
@@1Esteband One could disable it for use in any structure or garage. GeoFencing + Include ambient CO2 and CO sensors to detect when concentration gets too high even in a ventilated parking garage.
@@1Esteband ICE vehicles have the exact same problem. It's (mostly) been solved by consumer education about not running engines in closed garages.
I love physics and listening to you explain logical explanation of problems based on the science and its mathematical formulas.
Thanks again, Jason!
My non-expert impression is that the aerodynamic penalty for towing will vary significantly with the height of the towed load. Does a low load height (e.g., a pop-up camper) really have a bigger penalty behind an aerodynamic car than it does behind a pickup?
I wouldn’t trust a range test where the battery was only taken down to 57%. A lot of manufacturers do not use a linear percentage curve, and most of the time it drops off quicker below 50%. Still seems like the Silverado has a massive battery though!
lol!!!!! what do you know about that!?
Out of Spec just did a range test with the WT4, 434 miles of range till it stopped. 2mi/kwh. Maybe they'll do the WT3 soon.
In a lot of EU places towing is not allowed at 70mph, often it is more like 55. Same for semi trucks. If range is such an issue why not drive at a lower speed? Consumption drops a lot. I have a hard time understanding why y'all making this a bigger problem than it needs to be.
Cause no one wants to make travelling take any minutes and seconds longer than it needs to. People dragging portable houses around to go camping and fishing don't care about avoiding consumption and maximizing efficiency. They care about camping and fishing.
Bcuz ppl will be 1-2h late for their camping!
But seriously, driving 70mph vs 80mph or 60 vs 70 doesn't make much difference at all for ~95% of the people. It's not about range or charging (or price anymore). It's about ideology of "me like my car making nois".
It will take a while for some people, but in the end, we will all have no choice but to change our driving habits. I was able to do that when gas prices started skyrocketing, and I am doing fine. My Tahoe gets half the mileage when towing my trailer than it does without, so I am not that surprised. The lack of drive-through charging is something I never thought about before, though.
It's because here in the United States on the superhighways you very often see people Towing trailers at 80 even sometimes 90 miles an hour which is about 150 kilometers per hour. If you were Towing at a much slower rate you start impeding traffic
@@InvestmentJoy towing at 80mph is just bloody dangerous, say whatever you want.
I‘d love to see the same Mercedes Test conducted on ICEs with similar shape differences. I know they have better mileage per filling than EVs, due to energy density of petrol, but I’d be interested in percentages. Since this all seems to come down to aerodynamics, the easiest approach would be aftermarket towing spoilers (like on Tractor Trailer roofs) and optimised aero of stuff you pull.
As a fellow engineer, I love your unbiased,fact-based analyses. Keep it up, please!!!
I have two Model Ys and occasionally tow a small boat short distances - less than 25 miles. It works well for that. If I need to go a long way, I still fall back on my 2007 Silverado and will keep it for that reason. I will trade it in for an electric truck at some point, but not yet...
While trying to make the ultimate hauling passenger vehicle, they're going to accidentally reinvent semi trucks.
I am probably missing something, but to me it would seem that a simplified series hybrid setup solves this problem for potentially very little cost. If we ballparked numbers of say, 1.0 miles per KWH, wouldn't something as small as a 2000W generator (something that retails these days for like $400) be enough to keep EV batteries charged in virtually all circumstances? Seems like the solution already exists and would be very inexpensive, but I am probably missing something.
Edison motors is doing a similar thing with the vocational elheavy truck market. Check their youtube
Do you know what powers generators?
That something is the devil's elixer known as gasoline! It's the new "Nazis". Even "Clean Burning" natural gas is not good enough these days. Only wind (that doesn't always blow) and sun (that doesn't always shine) are what is best for this Brave New World!
If a vehicle draws 1 kWh per mile, and is travelling > 1 mile per minute (i.e. > 60 mph), that suggests you would need a ~60 kW generator capacity to operate the vehicle at that rate without depleting the battery.
@@toohardtowatch Thirty 2000W generators will do the job. You just need a really long trailer ;-)
Sounds like it might help to have some kind of "towing skirt" to span between tow vehicle and trailer? Or something like one of those "roof pods" shaped to smooth the airflow of the whole rig? Maybe you just need the kind of deflector they fit some big trucks with?
Another thing that might be handy is electric trailers? Let the trailer do its share of the work, and when you charge, charge from two charging outlets at once.
Wow, I actually watch the entire thing.....very impressive and informative presentation.
I would go to say wieght makes no difference what so ever unless your towing up a infinite hill.
Where range becomes a issue is generally highway driving and the extra 1% tyer and bearing drag is just so insignificant compared to the aero drag of just having a window open, ignoring the whole trailer.
How could weight not matter for both acceleration and for going up hills? Thousands of extra pounds is not negligible.
long trip at relatively steady speed, on relatively flat terrain, the weight is a minimal factor, it's all about the aerodynamic drag, (and rolling the extra 2 or 4 or more tires doesn't help).. but even gentle inclines require significantly more energy to climb....
stripping a couple hundred pounds from your car isn't going to make any measurable difference in your MPGs, but even with a "magic" trailer that's aerodynamically perfectly matched to your tow vehicle, your mpgs would be much less with trailer loaded as opposed to empty unless your entire trip was all flat and very few instances of slowing/stopping and acceleration
With the efficiency of electric drivetrains, my guess is that driving under 55 will net way more range when empty vs weighed down with cargo. When air drag goes down, rolling resistance becomes a larger factor in relation. But ICE engines aren't usually geared for peak efficiency under 55, so we don't see that benefit normally. This is why PepsiCo thinks the Tesla Semi is best suited for hauling potato chips at 50mph.
I think in the future we will see trailers and camper trailers with built in batteries and electric motors.
Absolutely not. That would double or tripple the cost of most trailers.
It would cost a lot and double your charging time.
@@flyingphoenix113do you know how much new camper trailers already cost?
@@chsi5420 exactly the reason we dont want them to cost double
We recently towed a small trailer with 5 mountain bikes on it behind a Hyundai ioniq 5. The decrease in range was significant, but not dramatic.
Towing a horse box would probably have been quite more difficult, range wise.
Don't tow anything bigger, wider or taller than you have to, and you'll be fine. Also, the reduced speed limit when towing, means you're pretty much tailgating lorries the whole way, giving you back some of your lost range.
Maybe car manufacturers could sell some sort of body attachment you can put on your truck when towing to help push the air over or around the trailer. Would be less aerodynamic than the truck on its own, but would still be better than the air hitting the big flat surface of a trailer. Another option would be to start designing more aerodynamic trailers with EVs in mind.
Trailer with own motor and battery is solution.
Make it standard communication. Many trailers already have CAN BUS communication for lights and brakes.
Also, internal combustion vehicles would become hybrids.
Or, make internal combustion trailers, like Ozzies do with Road trains. Nothing extreme, something low like 2L air-cooled flat 4 making 120HP, which is more than enough for 120 km/h on a flat road.
This is the real answer. Bonus points for summon and auto docking, solar panels as air deflectors and roof.
Or modular batteries that can be installed in the truck's bed when towing.
Or just get a modern economic Diesel truck. You won't need to over engineer basics concepts as towing.
A driving towed axle would bring all kind of trouble...
But, we are trying to solve a problem with real solutions, not just ignore it, like most people. @@vask3863
If you have to tow long range, just get a diesel truck. Maybe supplant it with a smaller, cheaper EV for office commutes and grocery getting. I agree with Jason on short haul and non-towers though.
For the price of the tesla range extender you could buy a used diesel truck for your towing duties
@@krisramos7453 how much is it?
@@ChristopherBurtraw $16k
Always love your videos and explanation using math and science to show the results.
TFL callout!
I imagine what you tow makes a huge difference, too. Flat front cargo or camper, open equipment trailer, boats of various shapes.
Can we PLEASE get a SOFC truck! That is my dream. Slap some Ethanol/Methanol, CNG, or DME in there, and enjoy that Electric with all the range!
Sounds like a engineering nightmare, too much complexity.
@@ogzombieblunt4626 not too much, fuel+air goes in, electricity goes out.
I think they still have an engine air filter type thing, and an exhaust of sorts.
There are commercialized CNG run SOFC generators sold as Uninterrupted Power Supply Generators / Similar Large Scale Gensets.
There are also commercialized Hydrogen PEM Cars, i forget the Toyota one’s name.
CNG is *heavily* commercialized, you local garbage trucks may even use it.
DME is a near drop on for propane storage wise, and DME-Diesel Engines were in some trials with Volvo, and Oberon Fuels currently sells it in the USA.
It’s *very* high technology readiness level for all the components, and if you count Hydrogen PEM cells, currently on the road.
Also small “Swiss Roll Reformers” are intriguing, although i am not too certain the TRL of those and similar “mini-reformers”
Main cause, at least in my opinion, is “Technological Lock-In”. Batteries were already being made for electronics, cars just needed more. Fuel Cells aren’t as mass produced yet, so not chosen. Yet not chosen so not many produced and so on.
That’s my rant at least!
a generator would be a great idea for those rare long trips. remove from tray when not needed. hire it out even.
Ah yes, the consumer Rent-an-engine segment is so lucrative. Totally worth the effort and cost creating and developing this entirely viable secondary market.
Are you trying to get Elon to hire you? 😂
“Range Extenders” are neat!
My dream car/(mini-)van would be something with an option for those, or more likely a range extended PHEV (so no complicated transmission)
As avocado aficionado said though, limited market so sadly capitalism wont make it. Would be a neat community project!
I forgot the specifics but i think some car modding channel mounted a genset in a tesla?
@@AvocadoAfficionado If the equipment was standardized and easy to use it would sell well. There are already trailer rentals, a trailer with a range-extending generator is just an extension of this existing market.
@@ericlotze7724 Are you thinking of Warped Perception? He added a custom generator to a Tesla but it was a bit underpowered.
@@eDoc2020 ah that’s who it was yeah! I’m mainly there for the clear engines and odd fuels, so haven’t watched too much of the other stuff yet, but yeah great channel!
Sounds like we need more active aerodynamics. The onscreen text mentioned that one of the trucks had a spoiler which pointed the air back down thus giving it worse aero when towing. So why doesn't it just have a towing mode where it tips that spoiler up?
At the start you mention the importance of aerodynamics and tyre sizes, but then later on when doing the towing comparisons you just mention the weight of the trailer.
How important is that weight when you're doing a constant speed on a highway? Isn't size/ shape of the trailer and number and size of the wheels more important?
The problem with towing is a trailer requires a certain amount of energy to move from A to B, it doesn’t matter what energy source you use in your truck how efficient it is the trailer doesn’t care, it will take the same amount of energy out of you energy source regardless, that’s why being efficient like a cybertruck is useless in towing, it has to small of a energy reserve and can’t give too much of it to the trailer
Yep, as he said it's all about battery capacity. Just like getting the 35gallon optional fuel tank instead of the 20 gallon tank.
If it was possible to stick a 500kwh pack in an electric truck we'd have great towing numbers, and that would also give you exceptional unladen numbers, just like a standard truck.... But it would weigh too much....
Easy: the sedan is towing an air brake while the SUV less so. Makes sense.
If the ideal solution is a wedge-shaped truck that eliminates the gap between the truck and the trailer, then it would seem the ideal solution is a shroud that eliminates the high pressure area on the trailer and takes advantage of the Cybertruck's wedge-shaped front end.
So in my opinion there’s a very easy solution, manufacturers could design a removable adjustable towing spoiler as to direct the air moving over the vehicle over the trailer,the bigger the trailer you adjust it higher with in reason,hgv’s already have theses on top of there cabs for better fuel efficiency
so as i understand this, all these towing inefficiencies can be fixed with a Canopy topper smoothing the wake over the trailer!??!?
Towing is like Kryptonite to EV's
So you are saying EVs are the Superman of the car industry!
Literally any vehicle outside of a Semi
Driving is like kryptonite to EVs.
Imagine if we gave gas powered cars 2000 lb fuel tanks. They could drive across the country and back on a single tank.
Batteries are the Superman of EV's. I reserve highest regards to ICE vehicles. imo; EV's still remain on a separate menu from the main course. @@dfreadhoff
@@dfreadhoffnot really since superman has cold breath and the cold kills batteries faster. Also evs arent as versatile as superman. Yeah yeah i know ima 🤓 lmao
Great video, but you have some comparison inaccuracies. You should correct the 1st comparison: 1) note C&D tested an F150 Lightning Lariat or Platinum with 22" wheels (has a reduced EPA range of only 300 miles). A F150 lightning with 18" or 20" wheels has an EPA range of 320 miles. 2) do NOT use EPA range (mix of city/hwy) compared to towing on the highway at 70 mph. Instead use the trucks actual 70 mph range (~255 miles for an F150 Lariat/Platinum with 22" wheels and ~270 miles for trucks with 18" or 20" wheels).
Big problem with a bigger battery is still charge time. Double the size of the battery pack and now charge twice as often … still a long way to go. Just seems like this isn’t the use case for EV’s. Use the right tool for the job.
Bigger batteries can charge faster than smaller batteries.
they just need to make traillers with swappable battery modules or not, maybe small motor in axis for few extra hp, or for regen at least:)
or even go crazy since trailers dont have THAT big of a volume limit and plate one with supercapacitors all the way, charge it 100% in 5 minutes :)
Very interesting video and nice food for thoughts.
In my mind this sounds a lot like active aerodynamic devices might reduce the towing impact - vortex generators and spoilers (both adjustable in a towing mode) might help reduce the drag at the trailer...
This was a great breakdown on a topic that is often argued with all the new EV trucks being released.
Funny how aerodynamics wasn't considered that much before the EV topic, now its fundamental
"Wasn't considered that much". 🤡
Aerodynamics has been very important ever since the fuel crisis of the 1970s.
@@sevenflashowls 70s? It was a selling point of first Tatras in 30s! It's only that in 70s everybody started using full scale wind tunnels