Should You Buy an ADV or a Traditional Touring Bike? (discussion)
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- Опубліковано 20 тра 2024
- #motorcycle #adv #touringmotorcycle #advrider
Let's cover 8 main differences between ADV's and touring or sport-touring bikes. Are ADV's really better? If not, why are they seemingly taking over?
00:00 Intro
02:34 Price
03:15 Weight
03:52 Comfort
04:43 Pillions/Passenger
05:35 Luggage
06:25 Tech
07:01 Versatility
07:49 Seat Height
08:54 Your Thoughts?
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I decided long ago that Adv let’s me go anywhere. But my luxury touring lets me go very far very comfortably. The two don’t cross. So I have both.
Best of Both Worlds!!
That’s what I did. Africa Twin for exploring, Goldwing B for relaxed Touring
Flex 💪🏻!
There's an Australia youtuber, can't remember name, and he just has his Norden 701 trucked to where he wants to explore, then flies to that location.
@@lukeadv lol Norden 701 for adventure. 747 for comfort…. Dude for the win!
I'm an "older" rider.. age 67, started riding at 55. After riding cruisers for the past 12 years, I got my first ADV this year, the CB500X. In no small way, influenced by your reviews my friend. It's light, upright, easy to lift,plenty enough power, not intimidating, and I can finally do trails, dirt and gravel without fear. Most importantly it's FUN !! What a revelation! A whole new world of possibilities have opened up for me. I'm taking off-road lessons, and completed 5000 miles of touring (yeah,I'm retired) in the first 2 months of riding. I am Never going back to low & heavy v-twin. So to your question,I suppose there will be a diminishing number of the old school Harley-conscious image riders,as they age out of riding (have you even seen the greying at Sturgis, Laconia, poker runs, etc?). Younger riders won't even give that scene a second look. I don't blame them. The future is ADV. And you're in the right place at Big Rock Moto to take a leadership position in this transformation. Thanks for everything you do!
Thank you so much for your perspective as a long time cruiser rider and how you have enjoyed the Honda CB500x.
@@kevinb2844
- in south-eastern U.S. 60% of motorcycles are cruisers, so not everyone is switching to ADV;
- at Black Bike Week you will never see ADV
ua-cam.com/video/k2Oc2GQGlAg/v-deo.html
Also 67, started riding 3 years ago.... on my 2nd Harley touring, but getting tired of sitting low and making noise. Demoed the Triumph Tiger 1200GT, the BMW 1250RT, and soon the BMW GS. Also, I think the seating position of the Harley might contribute to low back pain which I never had until starting riding.
I rode my 2016 Africa Twin from California to South Dakota in 2020. I sold it to get a 2019 Goldwing non tour DCT. I rode my Goldwing on the same trip this year(June 2022). Both trips were pavement. From my experience the Goldwing outshined the Africa Twin by far on said trip. I’m 6’2” and rode solo.
One thing I noticed when I first switched from a cruiser to an adventure bike was how well it navigated obstacles in the road. Whether there is trash in the road like grass, oil or tire snakes or if you run off the road the adventure bike tends to be much more adept to handling obstacles. For that reason I believe adventure bikes are safer.
agree with you on that one. went off the road on a sharp curve when a blue jay hit my chest and then in my face, went off on wet grass with my KTM 390 Adventure with Dunlop TrailMax Mission tires, between the tires and traction control had no problem finishing the curve and then slowing down to get back on the pavement which was 2-3" higher than the grass.
i` Agree 100%➕Light Lbs HeLp.
Agreed, My KLR handles pot holes and unforeseen obstacles quite well.
Agreed. I had a hairy, gravely moment in the Alps on my ATAS. It never faulted. Great bike.
amazing point! agreed
I'm 45, and have been on 2 wheels since I was able to walk (very little exaggeration here). I've been through various phases in my life, which means I have ridden and enjoyed all types of bikes. In my most recent years though I believe I have settled on the adventure bike as the do everything machine. I no longer need to put my butt up in the air and do triple digit speed, I no longer need to go on hill climbs with my dirt bikes and dual sports and impress anybody, and I no longer intend on putting a thousand miles on in a day. So for me the all around winner is definitely the adventure bike. But to each his own, if it is two wheels, you are having a good time. 😁
For me it was a simple call, I used to tour on a GSX-R 600 (yes I know…).
I pointed that thing up way too many gravel roads, rough tracks and other places that it really didn’t work.
Hence the “upgrade” to a V-Strom, can go big kms on road, then go “ooh what’s up there” and have a fighting chance of finding out.
I guess this is kind of a personal choice, but over time I’ve leant more towards gravel, back roads and I guess ‘slower’ riding, so a V-Strom makes more sense _for me_.
Totally agree, a naked bike would be easier to ride than a sport tourer on gravel roads but it's still a handful. Since switching to a small ADV, I've had tons of fun going down gravel roads, dirt tracks, riding on beach sand, places I would have avoided on a naked bike or sportbike.
I consider ADVs to be large naked bikes with flatter, wider bars, less steep steering angle, and better wind protection.
@@fallinginthed33p Some naked bikes like the Royal Enfield 500 bullet are great on gravel and dirt roads. as were a lot of the older bikes form the pre 60's and going in to the 70's. But later started things like wider tires some witch were more for the track than the road. But now you pretty well have to go to a ADV or a true Duel Sport. ( by true Duel Sport are bikes that are very good off road and very good on road like the DR650 ) Me I want all 3 in my stable a good light weight ADV a true duel sport and a 90 % off road 10 % on road. All put a huge smile on my face.
I love my V-Strom, and don't see myself ever riding anything different as my main bike.
Let me tell you guys one thing: an ADV (a „travel-enduro“ as we call it in German speaking countries)rides A LOT better on street as you woudl imagine. I just compared the retro naked XSR 700 to the Tenere 700 (same engine) and it‘s incredible how you can go almost as sporty on the risd as the naked.
So…the 10 to 20% a sport tourer does better in several occasions (passenger comfort and high speed comfort) is just nit worth it to skip the amazing enduros like Africa twin, Tenere 700, KTM Super Adventure
agree
As a 2019 Goldwing owner I’m convinced I bought the perfect bike for me. At 66 years old I’m a little reluctant to obtain the skills to become proficient at trail riding. Adventure bikes like the GS and Africa twin are super cool though and when I see one decked out with luggage I think to myself “should I have bought one of those instead?”. Then I crank up my XM radio ,turn on the heated seat and grips, put it in cruise control, put the wind screen all the way up and think to myself “ I’m good “ .
You're really good at picking up points that people might be curious about.
Really appreciate how well you explain such complicated stuff. Thanks, man!
I think you're spot on Ian. I went from a Concours14, to an Africa Twin, to an R1200RT, and now to a Tenere 700. I prefer the ergos of an adventure bike, as well as the taller stance. The taller stance provides a better vantage point to see those around me while I'm riding, and also have a more commanding presence so others can see me, similar to the SUV analogy you used.
I really like your discussion style for various reasons! Thank you for your informative videos.
I have been debating this for quite some time. Thank you for these information.
It’s great that you include the numbers in the metric system as well. Appreciate it.
Great video. I have a Concours 14 and I'm really thinking about getting an Africa Twin. Love your videos Ian!
The main reason I want an Adv is for inner city curb hopping and getting better camp sites
Best motorcycle content on the net! You always address the things that actually matter to average riders. Appreciate you, cheers!
you seem to cover every question i have just getting into biking, great videos!
In my country, it is understood that it is an age thing: more mototcyclists these days are 50+ years old and comfort is king as you get older.
Keeping your back and knees straight becomes far more important as you get older, so the upright adv bikes are great and also give you better visibility ahead which is always a bonus as you age.
so true.. same for suvs... laughed at them when I was younger, then got sick of diving down to get in and out of a sedan... lol.. now i "get it" 😆
I’m 25 and love my triumph scrambler 1200xe. It’s superior to other motorcycles, perfect amount of power and looks awesome.
great points
@@IanTheEarlobe Try a 500km trip in fall, you will change your mind. I have a r9t.
@@duosable Oh you mean Autumn.
If comments are the best indicator of great content, then you are Rocking it Big Rock Moto!!! Excellent job keeping your content interesting!😊
Enjoy your videos and perspective on riding. I agree with everything you've said. I have a cruiser (Victory Cross Country Tour) and an ADV bike (Triumph Tiger 900 Rally Pro). Both are excellent bikes, in my opinion, very easy to ride and very dependable. But they have very different missions, for sure. I enjoy riding both bikes very much - just depends on where and who I'm riding with. Also have a KLX300, but I never ride it, so it's going to be sold. Keep up the good work!
bought my BMW GSA 1200 2015 second hand because i like the look of it, it turns out its super comfortable, has height and therefore road presence . I've done a few low level tours in the united kingdom and Ireland areas and always got off the bike at the end of the day felling OK.
I found i have no problem in the twisty roads if the need takes me with enough lean to take away the chicken strips.
having said that I've had sports bikes and naked street machines and i love them all. we as bikers pour to much scorn on each other for the type of bikes we ride i feel , love all the bikes even the honda plastic you hire on holiday.
love the content , keep it coming
Great discussion! I moved from the old R90/6 BMW to an ATAS as it had many of the same qualities; not too big, very versatile and a great touring bike. It was also $10k cheaper than a GS. I still remember how hard it was to ride rutted dirt roads on the R90 with euro bars 😂
100% accurate review. Have had both bikes and concluded the same! Well done
Hello Ian. I'm 71 and new to riding anything motorized on 2 wheels. After months of evaluating reviews including some of your videos and many others I ordered and received the BMW R1250 2022 GSA 40 year anniversary. I hope to take some longer trips on that one once my caregiving commitments come to an end. I also have acquired the modern Vespa 300 GTS, BMW C400 GT and a used BMW G310 2018 for learning how to shift back in March. Being still 6' 7" tall , 260 LBS I find the GSA a great fit with a couple of adjustments. I love the scooters for zipping around town here in Illinois. I find that my interest in other types of bikes has not abated with the acquisition of these 4 so I relate to some of your comments in many of your videos I've consumed over the months. Thanks for doing these and doing them so well!
Great topic. Never really thought of it till you talked about it. Adv bikes are definitely all around and I'm noticing more of them all the time. I briefly considered a adv bike this past spring but my wife likes to ride and all the points you bring up are the same ones that turned me to a 1250rt. Adv bikes have their place but I never see them ever taking over the market. Gettysburg bike week just finished up a few weeks ago and it was probably 99.9% touring bikes with a sprinkle of sport and adv bikes. It also says something when harley jumps into the adventure market when they've always been focused on touring and street bikes.
Great video ! Good discussion in the comments as well. The large touring bikes are all capable at what they do. For me it’s the weight. Getting around small mountain towns can bring on challenges to these brutes. Years ago I had a Yamaha FJR and encountered several uncomfortable situations. 800 plus pounds is some serious weight. I agree that the adv segment is growing very fast. However, when I ride the Blue Ridge Parkway I see predominantly Harleys. Since we are so close to Asheville, Knoxville, Greenville and Charlotte. I don’t see that changing very much. I love my GS as it does everything I ask it to. Best!
I had an RT, then switched to a GSA but went back to an RT after 2 years. The RT fit my riding style better and I almost never go off road. For the solo long distance high speed riding I tend to do, the RT is perfect.
Best to keep the weight down low RT vs GS if one never plans to take it off road.
4 years ago I spent a ton of time researching and figured a sport-tourer was best for me, so I got a FJR1300. That bike was amazing but, over time, I found myself wanting (and doing) more off-pavement riding. A month ago I finally traded it in for a Africa Twin as I feel that's best for me today. I don't really regret getting the FJR at all, nor do I regret replacing it with the AT. Preferences change. Who knows what I'll want in 5 years but first I have a ton of logging roads to explore. 😊
Thanks for another informative video Ian please keep up the great work! I want a new AT DCT soo bad but my wife has suddenly peaked an interest in riding with me now and that goldwing is so slick looking now!
I have a 2020 Goldwing Tour and in my opinion it is simply unmatched on the highway for long distance touring. Recently I purchased a 2022 CB500X and I must admit that this little bike has impressed me. I find that when I grab my gear to ride, more times than not, it’s on the CB500X. I can’t deny that more than a few times over the last couple months I’ve considered selling the Goldwing and getting a larger, more tour worthy ADV bike. Time will tell, but having sort of the best of both worlds is working for me now.
Great video as always. I have owned both adventure bikes and tourers. I have enjoyed both. Basically it depends on your mission or how you are going to ride your bike. I switched from a 1200 GSA to a K1800GT when I met my wife so that she could ride with me. She got hooked and now rides her own 310R. Looking at upgrading her bike to a 750GS while I’m debating between an 850GSA and 1250GSA. We love to ride on trails and disperse camp and live in NV.
You said it perfectly in the intro. It's your bike, do what you want with it. I agree to the handling aspect too. Dirtbikes have alway been funy, easy and comfortable to ride. One thing I love about my AT is that im riding a big dirt bike on the street. It's a blast, comfortable, with tons of power. To each his own, but personally, the ADVs make all around sense.
Worked my up to an Electraglide Ultra Ltd and toured Britain frequently, loved it. Got taken out by a car driver and wrote it off😥
Bought the 1200 Triumph Trophy SE, a fraction of the weight, super comfy, all the tech, loved it, great economy too, as my Son was coming up the 'bike tree' he got a Suzuki 650 VStrom XT and with a view to exploring Trails and even Norway, I swapped my Triumph (best bike I should never have sold) for a 2011 BMW 1200 GSA (I'd avoided getting one previously as everyone seemed to have one) when I bought one I found out why😁
Super comfy (with a Sargant seat), take the hard luggage off you have near sports bike performance and handling secure lockable luggage and great weather protection.
Good off road too.
But....as the years move on, Son moves away, the touring is now solo and if you have ever tried to lift up a laden GS that has sunk into the campsite overnight, you'll realise it is not a one man job and the 2011 is the biggestand tallest of all the Advs.
Still want the Adventure bike upright comfy seating position, weather protection and go anywhere ability, but now want, both feet on the floor, especially laden , fuel economy, lighter weight, so now we are looking at mid range adventure bikes.
Love the 659 VStrom but found the rear suspension too hard, love the Triumph and BMW mid rangers to but the one that makes me smile alot...2021 Honda CB500X with Givi hard luggage.
Solo riding, touring, going to the shop or luggage off trail bashing, great bike and more than adequate for UK speed limits.
Great conversational video, thank you 👍😁
Oh, the Honda CB500X! That is the bike I want to get to replace my Yamaha Super Tenere, which I've only had a year. The Tenere is great on the highway and twisties and good on the little dirt I've had it on. But it's a beast to move around in my garage, as it's top heavy and I'm tired of struggling with it. I transitioned from riding cruisers to the Tenere as I wanted a bike capable of taking me off the highway a bit. I like the upright riding position of the Tenere. But I have heard so many positive things about the CB500X that it will be my next bike. I am looking forward to having fun with it!
@@nancyfithian4984 I've got one, it's a great bike. Super efficient, I get about 300 miles/ 500km range.
1 Person job to lift any bike while camping, just Jimmy a log under, then canter lever up, or rig a pulley system; (always carry a tow line)/ Best way to winch yourself out of anywhere!. Never be stuck, just because you think you are stuck!
@@macdragon76 Have you ever used/tried one of your practical options yourself?
I like the video!
I’d add that the touring or sports touring class will never go away, because they do a lot of “road things” better than an adv.
I have an adv, because they make sense, but if I could suddenly stop going to work and have weeks and weeks to travel… it would be hard to beat the Goldwing, K16, street glide, RT, etc
i think you are spot on in your arguments here. i have a tiger 1200 explorer and have taken my girl on it. she doesnt like that it is so tall. i dont take it offroad either. i could have a touring bike lika a fjr1300 instead but i think im going to go for a smaller adventure bike instead. im very tempted to get a honda cb500x but im gonna check out the v-strom 650 first. i tried the tiger 660 but thats a very road oriented motorcycle with alot of sporty feeling. it felt to me that it was just constantly hunting for more revs and more speed. it was boring to go slow and the whole assembly for the front that is holding the windscreen had alot of flex. going faster at dual carriageway made it rock back and forth. it felt cheap in that regard. blinker button had no tactile feel whatsoever. engine gave off alot of heat. best display on the market in my opinion. it was crystal clear even in direct sunlight. maybe i got carried away here but my point is that a tourng bike doesnt have to be large or low. i just a saw a kymco scooter on my countrys equivalent to craigslist that had 60,000 miles on the clock. turns out some people put more miles on their scooters in a week than some adventure tourers do in an entire year. everything is possible if you have the will for it.
worst thing though if you are considering changing your adventure bike for a tourer is that you might only have adventure styled gear which would make those absolete and you would have to buy new gear. this happened to me when i changed my sportbike for a tiger 1200. now riding around in full leather gear on my tiger 1200xc.
sorry for the monoloque haha.
Awesome review, and THANKS. I have been riding a cruiser for a decade plus, but am I am leaning toward the adventure bike now. (I enjoyed watching the racer go past at 4:15... wicked!)
Versatility is my reason for getting my BMW R1250GS Adventure. Be able to travel over many road conditions made it the best choice for me. Having the ability to carry stuff in removable panniers was appealing to me. The robustness and sophisticated rider aids made it an easy choice.
I've owned 2 motorcycles, a 1994 ZX6 and a 2004 CRF250R, and I loved them both for different reasons. The 94 ZX6 was more of a sport touring than an true sport/racing bike, and I logged thousands of miles on it, including a 3-day stint from Monterey, CA to central TX. My CRF I rode off-road because I became tired of fearing for my life on my ZX6 on the highways here in Maryland where I currently live. Unfortunately, that bike was stolen, so I've been bikeless for about 10 years.
I'm looking for a new bike, and one of my current passions is backpacking. I was looking at a dual sport to use as a moto camping bike, but unfortunately in the Mid-Atlantic, long road rides are required before getting to even forest roads. I stumbled across your channel as well as others and found a fondness for ADV bikes and now I'm on the waiting list for a CB500X. I wanted something small that wouldn't break the bank on upfront and insurance costs, but something that would handle highway stints just long enough to get me to back roads and some limited off-road use.
So for me, the ADV is to use around town and make it to a few trails for riding and camping. One thing of note: coming from an ultralight backpacking background, the options available for even "smaller" luggage options for adventure bikes seems downright spacious!
I don't personally think ADV bikes will push out sport tourers, there are plenty that still prefer the feel of sport touring over ADV. Remember when we though SuperMoto would take over the dual sport world?
Hello 👋 Ian from Greece!! You know I’ll watch your videos anywhere I may be in the world😃😃 And again another great video !!
Traded my 2018 HD RG-Ultra for a 2022 Pan America. Weight, power, off-road ability were key delineators and the Pan Am was simply more fun to ride.
#yammienoob did a great comparison with the HD Pan-America and the Husqvarna 501. Awesome bike!
i want to ride one , have had 1200GS-BMW & 2 KTM Super adventures ect , if you think that PanAmerica has off road ability try the KTM890/Husqvarna901 package !! that PKG is next level good , for real next level weight vs power and low center of gravity ect.. nothing ive ridden is even close to comparable including a heavy modified Tenere' 700 & Africa twin and my own well set up 1090r
Very well presented! I can see the trend in vehicles you describe.
Great Video Ian. I was riding my Triumph Tiger 800XCA solo and I loved it. I took it on and off road thru Arizona, Colorado, Utah, Nevada and California for years. However, I had my share of drops because I am only about 68 inches tall and was never able to flat foot both of my feet which is a horrible feeling in uneven terrain. Additionally, I never felt comfortable riding two up on the Tiger because I could not flat foot it and would certainly tip over with a high center of gravity bike. I sat on the new Tiger 1200GT and it was the same story. Therefore, I just bought a 2022 Honda Goldwing Tour model and I absolutely LOVE IT!!! Very low CG, very powerful with a lot of tech and handles superbly. Very confident riding two up. For me, it was difficult to leave the wonderful ADV Bikes but it was the correct choice to get the sporty Goldwing. PS... if I was to get another ADV bike, I think I might go with the Harley Davidson Pan America because of its ride height adjustment and potential low seat height. I still would NOT ride two up on my ADV bike unless its shorter distances on road.
I bought my GS in 2016 I was 68 and I am 74 now. I have numerous pieces of metal holding me together. I was looking for something fun to ride on the street and highways that was comfortable and didn't weigh 800 lbs. Off roading is in my past and I think the GS is a great road bike.
Consider a large scooter like the BMW C400 GT. Lots fun and very easy to ride. Unless you want to do serious long distance rides then take a touring bike.
Yes. But given your situation; wouldn't that bike make more sense if it was lowered a little; had more of a on road suspension, and that way you wouldn't have to make compromises to go off road when you never go off road.
up until the last couple of years I only rode upright sport touring motorcycles. They were fast enough, gave excellent handling and comfort. I now own a mild adv bike a gen 1 wee strom, it is very similar in comfort (if not better than my sports tourers) similar performance and handling (especially with good after market suspension) is lighter and easier to maintain(no all encompassing fairing that needs to be removed before anything substantial can be done).
I loved my FJR and put nearly 50,000 miles on it before switching to a GS and although I miss the power I wouldn't go back. Here in the mountains with access to miles of fire road, trails and the BDR's in the Western states the GS is the right choice. My wife likes the GS much better than the FJR with it's higher passenger seat height. She now can look over rather than around me and with the top box fitted she finds it a lot more comfortable.
I bought a used bike (2006) to test the waters and other than the servo-pump for the boosted ABS it's a bike I can do all the work on. While TFT displays, electronic riding modes and all the hi-tech that's on new bikes is no doubt nice, it's all stuff the owner can't do a thing with. When you have a mechanical in the back country it's reassuring to be able to pull out the tool kit and have a fighting chance of doing something about it.
I really enjoy your reviews for their attention to detail and thoroughness. For me a rider that lives in a brutally hot climate (Central Texas) for a big part of the year, one glaring omission from your reviews and all others is the amount of heat a bike throws off on the rider. It’s not just engine size that determines this but it’s about the way the manufacturer has designed the wind management to deflect the heat. I’ve owned and ridden well over 100 motorcycles in my time riding so I believe I am very qualified to comment on this.
Where’s the comment? Lots of reviews mention engine heat b
Very good comparison, your video content is great!
Your analysis is spot on. I knew when I got into motorcycles I wanted versatility. I started with a 250 Rally dual sport, then moved up to an Africa Twin. The AT has made me a much better rider on the Rally off road. I want a Gold Wing and a 450RL. A stable. A Honda stable. Lol.
"Versatility" is spot on for me. I like traveling long multi week trips, but not ready to give up gravel and forestry two track in Canadian Rockies. So ADV is still my style and love my Africa Twin :-) Great content, cheers :-)
Again an excellent brief. I concur with these statements. Going fwd with you ask for comments, I also see two factors that benefit to adventure bikes these last 20 years : 1. The high increase in pressure on speed limitations, which pulls bikers away from sports bikes, and incidentally benefits to other bike categories o/w advs; 2. The progressive dégradation of road quality due to the diminution of government and local public budgets, benefits to more suitable bikes (from my few visiting in the US including California, it seems to me this may apply oversea too).
Now what the future is made of? Can't say it makes me happy, but it looks like there's a wave for non-petrol vehicules (electric, hydrogen...)
I wanted to love the Goldwing, but I kept reaching for the T7. It’s just more fun to ride an ADV bike. I actually traded my Goldwing for a Tracer GT9.
Good choice! I migrated to the Africa Twin but a tracer gt9 would have been a more refined choice.
@@jondotcom8706 I bought a late model V-Strom 650, and had I been a little better off financially, I would have gone straight for a Tracer 900. Delicious engine, and Yamaha quality go together like peanut butter and jelly.
If I were to do it differently then
my current 012
Yamaha Super Tenere,,
I would definitely have taken the Yamaha Tracer9 GT. The triple engine is brilliant😍👍.
@@PaydayGabeBCNV heck ya. I like my big twin, but wish it had a smooth, high- revving triple or 4- cylinder. A little pricey to swap at this point, but TBD!
Yeah, I've got the same except my Tracer MT09 is the first model 2015 and the T7 is recent. The triple and the twin are beautiful motors pared to lovely motorcycles.
I went the DR650 route after buying, then selling my vfr1200x. I considered the super 10, AT, etc… but the reality was the DR did everything I wanted my ADV bike to do. I also bought a very cheap, Kawasaki Voyager 1200. Now I’m getting to cut the fat out of my collection. I highly recommend getting a heavy touring bike (goldwing) and pairing it with a light dual-sport. (Crf300, klx300, dr650,drz400 etc) it’s been a great combo for me
I have had both of those bikes and I stayed with the Goldwing DCT 2019.
It all came down to comfort, the Goldwing is just the perfect bike for me.
The Africa Twin was fun but it was really too big and heavy for off-road... I tried it, but because it's so big I was afraid of dumping it and smashing something expensive to fix.
Great channel. Americans are in love with projecting an outdoorsy lifestyle. Image is king. My favorite bike of all time was my midnight blue 2003 K1200GT. AMAZING. Heavy. Solid. Almost nimble. My next bike is going to be a 2008-12 1200GS purchased from a low milage IMAGE owner who bought it for commuting while projecting that rough enduro lifestyle - with, of course - Michelin Pilots.
I got my F650GS Dakar mostly because of my height. With 1.90m I sit very uncomfortably on most naked bikes and on all sports bikes. And then I fell in Love with Adv Bikes because of their versatility and the ability to go anywhere. You can easily keep up with everyone else in the twisties, you can get groceries thanks to the Luggage, you can go on vacation thanks to the comfortable seat and soft suspension,… its just great. And like I said, the ability to go anywhere. And with that I don’t want to pretend I ride 90% off road and blast through single trails or something like that. Just the simple fact that you ride on any road condition. One of my main routes goes around a mountain and next to huge lake. It is a very beautify view every single time and I often go there to relax. But the road is very damged from bad weather. So you have a lot of potholes and pieces where the road has been repaired sloppily and so on. This is no Problem at all for an Adv Bike. But I went there once with a naked bike I was repairing for a friend and it was just unbearable.
I recently picked up a gs Dakar. It replaced an mt07. Gs is just as fun in the twisties, yet so much more comfortable and all round capable.
Comfort is also very much something you get used to. I am 1.90 as well and drive an Aprilia Falco, which is not all out sports ergonomics, but it is not far off. After some getting used to, i am very comfortable except for city riding. On the highway, there is no pressure on my wrists at all, i can just put the tips of my fingers on the handlebars.
I was making the choice between a sport-touring and ADV bike myself a few weeks ago. After having done a test ride on an ADV bike once, and having taken it off-road I was sure I wanted an ADV bike.
However, if I had no desire to go offroad, I think I would have gone for sport-touring. It has a lot more feeling in the corners, better wind protection, looks better (personal opinion ofc) and is cheaper for how much they offer.
Great video for those who are trying to figure out which bike suits them the best.
I've been riding on and off for almost 50 years. My first bike was a '76 Suzuki RM125.
I did the (usual) progression of going from dirt bikes in the 70's to crotch rockets in the 80's and 90's then to the big cruisers as I aged into my 40's and 50's.
Now that I'm in my 60's (with two degenerative discs in my back) I needed to lighten up the weight, switch to a more straight-up riding position, and have suspension that absorbs the bumps and pot holes in a more forgiving manner. The perfect bike for me ended up being the Versys 650. It handles like a dream, has more than adequate power, and it's so smooth and comfortable that I can ride 3X the miles I could do on my Suzuki C50 before my back and butt need a rest. Some people argue that the Versys is more ST than ADV, given the smaller front wheel. All I care about is that I can still ride. A few of my diehard Harley riding friends are still punishing their bodies for brand loyalty and the cool factor. They're always swapping out seats and parts to improve comfort, but never seem to realize that what they actually need is a different bike. So, these days I'm happy and smiling while I'm riding, while some of them look and feel absolutely miserable after 50 or so miles in the saddle.
I think there comes a time when you have to listen to what your body is telling you, especially when it comes to riding. You can't fight Father Time. All you can do is adjust accordingly.
Yes!!!
You just justified a brand new AT.
Had no clue I was gonna pull the trigger today and drop 15k.
I’m a dead man-
But I’m not complaining.
I came from a Sport Touring background and slowly grew to like ADV bikes primarily for the longer travel suspension and more upright "dirt bike" ergos. I did a back to back ride between my KLR 650 and BMW R100RS and found I was less fatigued after 100+ miles each way on the KLR than my R100RS. That started to sell me and the BMW turned into a Vstrom 1000. Today I own both standard/retro styled bikes and ADV/Scrambler/Dual Sport bikes and I like both for different reasons. But a Moto Guzzi Stelvio is my long distance bike of choice. My wife and I just finished a 5k mile trip through 6 states and 2 Canadian provinces including the Canadian Rockies and it was a fabulous bike for that type of ride. I personally find a lot of practicality with ADV bikes. They are more flexible in use than the dedicated Touring/Sport Touring bikes, and I don't necessarily mean going off road.
ADVs I would argue are segment that grew out of dualsports and events like the Paris to Dakar racing scene. Bikes like the XLV750, the DR Big, and the various larger GS models from 800+, had fans but were considered to large and heavy to be competent dualsports or off-roaders. The GS was always there, and perhaps the marketing teams decided to create a new market segment with these larger capacity, off-road capable (albeit not terribly off-road desirable), cargo carrying touring bikes.
Earlier attempts include Honda's Veradero XLV1000 (sporting a VTR1000 v-twin mill), the XTZ660, and variants of the Tenere with larger capacity engines.
I have also heard of a JDM XR1000, but that whilst fun, sounds a bit cray-cray.
For me, I would happily daily an XR600 all day. An Africa Twin if I had to eat miles with gear, or that georgous 1200cc Tiger you reviewed other week. Damn Triumph have been making some sublime machines of late. For me the dualsports are my bread and butter with their ADV cousins being a more comfortable touring and luggage carrying option. Did I gush about that Triumph yet?
Thank you for your informative videos. Yes, ADV bikes in my opinion offer the best of all worlds, Comfort for long distances, gravel roads are no problem. Sitting higher up improves the view of traffic and possible hazards up ahead for early warning evasive moves. I love my V Strom 1000, TtransAlp 700 and 650GS. I would only consider a touring bike if my wife was going to accompany me on tours.
Sorry forgot to say a great up load and very very informative My comment was not meant to be a negative one just an old rider with not a lot of money trying to get the best ride to see me out so to speak Hope that makes sense and does not offend !!
very knowledgable well put review
A just love your reviews mate. A think u are wonderful at wot u do. Love from Scotland 👌👍💚
Glad you kept this as apples to oranges. I just bought a new Goldwing Tour DCT and there is no comparison against any ADV. Test rode a GS1200 and unless I was going on a serious off-road long distance tour, it would have been a ridiculous purchase. Super cool to look at but more work and way too top heavy. The GW is pure (on-road) enjoyment and super comfortable over long distances. Ideally, one would own two types of bikes for the right purposes. I do think that if you have a hankering for off road adventure and are skilled enough, go for an ADV. The Africa Twin would be my choice for the tech.
Hello Ian, I have a suggestion for a future video topic. We enjoy seeing all of the videos and motorcycle reviews, and it is the nature of the channel to ride something for a year or three, then move on to something else. Keeps the content fresh, so to speak. On to my suggestion: how about listing some adv / dual sport etc. motorcycles, in which the average person could expect to be happy with the performance and reliability, 10 years down the road? "There are some bikes you date, and some you marry"
Great work
It was the mindset "This bike can take me anywhere" that led me to the ADV bike world. I've really enjoyed moto camping off of my 2021 AT and find it quite comfortable on those long stretches of highway when necessary. You're right Ian; ADV bikes are the SUV of the two-wheeled world and I think that's what makes them so popular. There are so many dirt and forest service roads around me that I'd hate to have to turn back due to the bike. I've seen some pretty incredible places thanks to this bike.
Same. Why ride on just pavement when you can ride anywhere?
I currently ride a 2019 Goldwing DCT Tour and I think the answer is both. I'm going to add an Adventure bike of some kind in the next couple of years. My Goldwing really knocks down the miles but sometimes, there's that dirt or gravel road that calls to me too. I grew up riding on the dirt so that still has great appeal to me even 50 years later.
Hi, I came into adventure bikes off the back of riding ZZR 1400's, which had amazing power but no all day comfort, so from a whim one day I just popped into my local Motorrad dealership swung a leg over a 1200 GS that was twelve months old, and from their I was hooked with the comfort the versatility this sort of bike offers. since then I've had two more 1250 GS ADV's, for me at 65 years old I just would not want any other bike, they just do everything so well.
I started on a cruiser. I went to an ADV because it seems more comfortable to me, it's also a lot more maneuverable. I also live out in the country where dirt roads and washout is common, so the ADV comes in handy. I'm looking into ADV camping too. Still have my cruiser, but I definitely use the ADV more often.
I feel like a mid-sized adventure bike is the best Swiss Army knife in motorcycles right now. Something with 70-100hp and between 400-500lbs. You can really do almost anything with a bike like that. They have enough on road performance where they aren’t boring or slow, and they can be pretty capable off-road. If you can only have one bike and want it to be able to do a lot of different things, I feel it’s the way to go.
VERY true
how would a mid-size perform on a long trip, two up loaded with luggage?
Yep, my new do-it-all motorcycle - Vstrom 650 - enough power, not too heavy, not too dear, super comfortable 👍
KTM 890 Adventure or Norden 901.
I ride to have fun. 80 or even 60 km/h on gravel or forest road is so much more exhilarating than 100 or 120 km/h on pavement. No speed traps on gravel, no line-ups, way smaller risk of serious injury (due to lower speed = lower kinetic energy). I am too old to race off-road, but still too young to get bored on asphalt.
Hey 👋 Ian, ya know I was all over bikes 30 years ago. And I had never heard of Adventure bikes before last year.
Now wow they are all over, its really the swiss army knife, crescent 🔧 wrench, of biking 🏍
Creature comforts, tech, and the ability to modify and or add what you want for customizing.
The Goldwing, amazing machine and what it does so well.
That’s my exact combination currently, except I have a DCT on my AT. I got hooked on the Adv format when I had a VStrom 650. I’m debating letting go of the Goldwing because of the weight of the bike (Goldwing). Additionally, once I saw the NT1100, I had planned to get one, but never knew if it would be released in the US, the AT is 90% an NT1100 as far as I am concerned. By the way, I am dealing with the seat height by putting on the Seat Concepts single pan comfort seat, it’s a little lower than the standard seat in the low position. Great video, my debate continues.
Update: I recently upgraded to a suspension lowering kit for my Africa Twin from HyperPro, which includes new fork springs, and rear shock spring, which lowers the bike about 25mm. The new springs feel far better with much less front end dive than the standard suspension springs. The shop also lowered the front end a bit. Feeling a lot better, and more stable with this new setup.
What timing, this is the exact question I find myself struggling with. I'm debating adding a 3rd bike to do some long distance touring, like a Road Glide or Goldwing, vs upgrading my T7 to a GSA. My wife has suggested the GSA and that is the more economical route for me. If I had unlimited funds I would just add the touring bike, as every motorcycle I've ridden is enjoyable, and the more the better. But in practical terms, it's hard to argue against the value and versatility of an ADV. I haven't answered this question for myself yet. I'd like to just add a dedicated touring bike, as I really like my T7 for how I use it, but a GSA would fill the same use and be good for touring as well. Thanks for raising this question. I look forward to the discussion in the comments.
In 2020, I decided to gave up sports bike riding and migrated to adventure bike riding from a GSXR1000L2. I was riding sports bikes all the way since 1995. My main reason was comfort since I had spinal injury sustained from a motorcycle accident in 2000. As I aged, the injury seems getting more attention now n then. Why I chose ADV and not other touring models are because ADV gives me more flexibility to the places I want to go. It also gives me the flexibility of mounting what I need. For example, crash bars, skid plates, lightings, hard or soft luggages in various sizes. ADV bikes not only are off road capable but it's good ground clearance is also an advantage against flash floods during monsoon seasons. With good protection, ADV bikes can withstand impacts better during fall too. My first ADV experience is a brand new 2018 Suzuki DL1000XT. I love the bike but recently I decided to add another pre owned Yamaha Super Tenere XT1200Z into the family. Although these 2 bikes might feel similar, but their wind protection for riders are different. Last but not least, if I want a horsepower trip, I still have a Yamaha FZ1S on standby.
Five years ago I moved from the Austin area to Spain's La Safor mountains. My last two bikes in the US were a ZX-14 and Hayabusa. When I came to Spain I had to rethink my motorcycle choices. I decided to go with a R1150 GS because I could restrict it for an A2 license and it still had enough torque to ride well. I also thought it would be good for two up. But one of the big reasons I went to the adventure bike is because there are a lot of dirt and gravel roads here.
Once I got my A license I bought a 2021 KTM 1290 Super Adventure S. I decided to stick with an adventure bike because there are still dirt and gravel roads here but I wanted more of that Hayabusa fun factor.
The KTM does most things pretty well. It's pretty comfortable at freeway speeds, handles like an oversized sports bike with a claimed 160 hp on tap, has a decent sitting position and lots of electronic suspension magic. In general it's a fun bike though not perfect.
I ended up trading the 1150 with a friend for his 2006 K1200 GT. It's kind of a touring bike. They call it sports touring but I think it's a little weak on the sports part. But it's heavy, has good torque and the engine is pretty smooth. It has cruise control too. I decided to clean it up and use it for Sunday rides with my wife. I may find that for somme
The ugly truth is that the old K bike does some things better than my Super Adventure. The engine is smoother, it has more torque at 1500 rpm and especially importantly I am flat footed at a stop. I think that last point is important when riding two up because holding the bike on tip toes with someone on back is easier to get into balance trouble with.
Ultimately I would probably buy something other than the adventure bike except for one thing - those dirt and gravel roads. I don't ride them a lot but they are out there and it's good to have options. With a non-adventure bike they really aren't much of an option.
As an example of the dirt and gravel roads I'm referring to here's a video I shot a while back on the GS. The video starts about a mile from my Spanish home.
ua-cam.com/video/gH0Sz_iPSzU/v-deo.html
Great channel!! Thanks for the effort!
Do you think you can share some easy dirt road for beginners to try out off-roading in Southern California?
Ian,
Great Video, and a lot of valid points. Well done. Liked the bit you added in at the end, which leads me to believe there might be an ATAS video coming soon.
That mosko pico tank bag looks like it fits perfectly.
Ok… what’s telegram?
@bigrockmoto, msg sent.
I agree with this reasoning and I go one step further by saying that with this shift of the markets to the "ADV" sector, we are also witnessing a higher interest of the market in the mid size ADV bikes as the ones to be more practical, all rounders, and maintainable...
I watch most of your videos Ian, and all I’ve watched have been very interesting, this is a subject I’ve mentioned a few time with my friends and colleagues, I’ve had numerous GS models since the early 80 s , now everyone has an off-road vehicle whether it be car or bike, I don’t intentionally ride off road but I’ve been buying these bikes for years because I enjoy riding and looking at them. The latest GSA with tft screen gives you all this information , bit of an overload imho do we need it all ? They are all tall and most are heavy , im 6 ft too , so I don’t have a problem most of the time. But on the Africa twin and the gsa I’ve dropped them , I bought an R18 custom last week a much lower but heavier bike , this will be my main bike , sold my gsa , my friends couldn’t believe it. Did a run out in the mountains of Wales yesterday around 200 miles and loved it. This is really low but it makes for a more stable bike and rider when stopping , I did t miss the TFT screen ok there’s a few modes to scroll through but it’s all simple to understand. Ok do I now sell my suv ? I have been thinking about it. That’s all it was , im not really interested in cars , 👍
Got a KLR for commuting 25 min, and also the endless backroads in the area. Then discovered these things have an enormous aftermarket and following. It was about a year of back roads and getting used to the height and balance, and squirrelliness of gravel and dirt. Then I was doing all the trails I used to do in the truck and atv. The poor atv and truck barely get used now😄
I've tried out about 30 bikes so far and the up right position is best for me. Adv bikes have the best ergonomics for me. Super sports are fun but just brutal on the sternum. The cross over bikes like the cb500x, tiger sport660, nc750, f900xr, versys, vstrom, and a bunch of others that share the same up right position, and are sporty and with wider pegs make great gravel slayers.
Cruisers...the noise, the style, the history, but I can't sit long on them my lower back and legs get numb. Same goes for the spyders. The sitting position is to similar to a snow machine, and for the same reasons I sold my sled two winters after I bought it.
Road legal enduros are a great way to get around the city, trails and getting to the trails with hauling it. Can quickly build buke skills. But fuel range and medieval ergonomics get old. And with most, the maintenance intervals would mean I'm going to be rebuilding the top end twice a year. But a great excuse to get a second bike from one of the above 😆
Adv bikes usually come with a rack. Taller windshield. Crutches that for some reason people like😆 fully loaded with gadgets. Looks like your just in from Dakar😆
I jusk like the riding position. I would like a smaller enduro to give the klr a break from the trail, but a tiger sport660 or cb500x is probably what I'll get next. But an Eagle Mike piston kit sounds nice too and $12000 cheaper😄 But for just getting to point A to B for visits or store/shop runs and commuting where I don't have time for detours, the cb or tiger fits the bill.
Good, balanced video. I have ridden for years, but am not quite the daredevil I once was (67 now). Am short at 5-7 and stubby legged, so tall bikes are unsettling in stop and go street riding. That said, the Adventure bike concept struck a chord with me, so I got one that was not too aggressive. For me I settled on the NC700X.
I am used to full on dirt bikes that weigh 220#, so I fear trying to pick up a heavy bike after a shitter. So at 470#, I NEVER try to do really hard trails (I am already headed for inevitable back surgery).
I think the technology that has enabled this recreational market the most is tires. Street capable skins that perform reasonably in the dirt was a game changer. Back in my enduro days we held our breath on the pavement connecting the off road sections. Those soft compound big lug tires had no grip and would be worn out in 2 or 3 long races.
You should experience both!
Two totally different journeys.
I've done two cross-USA and back again trips in two years. One on Tiger 1200 XRx. One on BMW K1200LT. Totally different journeys!
With the Tiger, when I saw gravel, I thought, "Yes!". With the K1200LT, when I saw gravel, I thought, "Oh, $#%!!". The big K1200LT made my trip across much shorter in miles/day. I could simply stay on it longer and go faster. The curves were sooooo much fun on the K1200LT. Not that curves are boring on the road-biased Tiger, mind you! But the gravel roads and remoteness I experienced on the Tiger are some of the most powerful memories for me.
I think everyone should experience both platforms. It's a big world out here. Come see it! I have been creating videos of the two trips on my channel for all to see.
Great video, I appreciate how you break everything down. I myself am struggling between having a large ADV bike or a HD bagger touring bike for solo camping adventures (99% on-road). I am not really planning on dirt riding as I would have to drive hours to find anything like that, but it would probably end up on dirt roads and some grass. I know I can only have one though as I only have one space at my condo.
ADV of course try V strom 1000 from 2014 -
The topic of comparing Adventure bikes and Touring bikes is a nice topic, I expect that the future is in favor of Adventure bikes.
It would be valuable if you put a vlog dedicated to all kinds of adventure bikes around the world
(thank you)
My decision was since motorcycling to me means "freedom" I favored versatility over all (well, after price to be fair). I didnt want to feel like my bike prevented me from riding somewhere I came across and I'd take the lack of comfort as the trade off. If i wanted to be comfortable I'd take a four wheeled method of transportation instead. Great video!
This is a must a know info we need to ,as you said, and yes indeed, we all have different taste and purpose. For myself, I'll go with the Atwin, versatile, powerful enough...it just can take you anywhere with the same amenities as a touring bike. But, not everybody likes the same color . Thanks man for share, I'm gunning for the ADV
Ian I have both, well 3 bikes. 2018 Goldwing, 2007 BMW R1200R, 2022 Harley Davidson Pan America. All are very different. My wife who will ride with me for 1-2 week trip and on weekend trips will not ride on anything else. Plus we have a Bushtec trailer for it. My R1200R that is my fun bike. I got the Pan Am because I want to solo tour and go to Deadhorse AK next year so I needed some thing with off road capabilities and comfort. Plus it gives me a year to see if the HD will survive this year. If it has too many problems then I can get a GS.
It all comes down to what the buyer wants in the end.
Thank you for your very informative and well shot video. You point at a question that I’ve been asking myself for some time, too. I think ADV bikes are obviously a must if you’re planning to leave the hardback. I for myself live in Europe (Belgium) and it’s so good as completely prohibited to venture with a motorbike off the tarmac. The same goes for a lot of European countries where we don’t have the luxury of your wide open spaces in the States or in Australia. On the other hand we have some great roads (albeit also a lot of traffic). I’ve been actually “swimming” against the trend as I have recently traded my GS for a different kind of motorcycle. You compare ADV bikes with traditional touring bikes and you mention some specimen (Goldwing, FJR, Concours) all of which have one thing in common, they are heavy bikes. There’s nonetheless a different and very overlooked category of bikes that I find are very well suited for riders like myself who like to ride “sporty”, never do off-road are not too tall or big and take their motorcycles on trips: In Europe we call them “sport-tourers” or “sport-touring bikes”, I traded my GS for a Kawasaki Ninja 1000sx and I cannot recommend that bike warmly enough, it’s smooth, comfortable, easy to ride but when pushed it’s soo fast. Ride safely
I agree! I just purchased a 1000sx here in the States and love it for the mix of sport and comfort for long touring.
I have a 2018 Goldwing manual. Now looking to add the Africa Twin Adventure ES DCT.... for the opportunity to ride off road. Keep up the good work!
Very hot topic. I am on an MT-07 and I am thinking about my next bike. On the one hand I love the look and potential of an ADV bike but on the other hand I know I will almost never go off road, plus I appreciate dynamic handling on twisty mountain roads. I think bikes like GS1250, Tiger 1200 and similar bikes are going to have touring/dynamic versions as well as ADV versions as they have already starting doing so. So, you can get the ADV look but the comfort and handling of tourer (for people like me). Those who want the full ADV experience, can get the ADV version.
Great video again! I wonder how do they compare on road?
Another great video Ian..myself personally I grew riding dirt/dual sports..I have ridden some cruises and just don't like the seating position.. I currently have a 2020 wr250r and I am awaiting my 2022 tenere 700 to show up at my local dealership..
Just watched one of your previous reviews and I really like your videos a suggestion would be recommend what lvl of rider the bike is for as well
I'm a dirtbiker always an explorer at heart... My snowmobile could take me way way back in the back country.... I have an XR400R and it's awesome but to small as a crusier on hwy... So almost 50 here and I got my license and picked up a 2021 MotoGuzzi V85TT, lots of power for off-road actually more then enough.. air cooled motor for reliability and looks that take me back to the Dakar ... That combo kept me looking over and over at this bike....... Now I'm offroading everywhere I need my crash bars which are on order already ........
👍👍👍 Ian. Those are all issues I have been mulling over for the past few months. I’ve been on Goldwings since 1975 and at 76 I’m seriously considering a trade for a’22 Africa Twin AS. That is if I can find one. I detest dirt/gravel roads on my Wing and it’s hard to find good camping along the pavement. Yes, I think you are right. ADV bikes will get much more popular than my Highway Sofa. Thanks for the thoughtful comments.
I've been following you for a while and you make beautiful videos with always good explanations. I myself drive the Honda Goldwing 2018 manually and I am very satisfied with it, it is the best motorcycle I have ever driven, both comfort and performance. I also like adventure motorcycles they are lighter and can handle all terrains but are they also so luxurious for long distances and then you also have the problem as I am only 1.70 or 5.7. I still want to test one to know the difference. Keep the videos coming.