Man I love your attention to detail. My pair of the peg plus is coming in the mail tomorrow. Really excited to feel the shoe. Supposed to be a rest day tomorrow, but might have to be postponed due to the arrival 😂
I hope you enjoy them. They are a subtle shoe. At first they may feel a bit slappy and veyr low to the ground...but give them time. You'll find the magic in them...they are really very good.
You're a marketing guy. With the popularity and usefulness of your matrices, I'm sure you thought of creating a matrix of all the shoes you've reviewed into one pdf, and offering it to your channel members to allow them to build a shoe rotation.
Nice comparison... This should help Nike back in the high performance training segment. I just got the speed 4 at about USD130. Even though haven't run in it yet. Looking at your performance table I'm glad I got this because of the suitability in the easier runs.
Hey Chris, I watch a lot of running related stuff on youtube and read as well on the subject. I've seen many shoe reviews and you are the only one I've subscribed because you explain everything in perfect detail and also give the history of the shoe line with perfect graphics which I like the most! Also, I think this is my first ever comment on a shoe review because I think I trust you the most :) Back in the day I was using the Nike Peg 32's since then a lot changed and I stopped running. In 2021 without any knowledge I bought Adidas EQ21 which most of the people might not even know about or even consider them as running shoes. I think they are pretty stable, and neutral however nothing special about them. 5 months ago I finally got my first ever super shoe which is Adidas Adios Pro 3, and I have been addicted to them. Since then I've been looking for a daily trainer that will complement them. However the market for daily trainers is even more chaotic then super shoe market lol. So I am still looking for my pair, after I saw your Peg 41 review that was it for me however further research scared me out since I am enjoying high stack PEBAX foam with the carbon rods that comes with the Pro 3. Finally I am planning to pull the trigger on Peg Plus as my daily after your reviews but I just wanted to ask in person as well! I really don't want 3 pairs of shoe rotation, I just want a shoe to do them all right next to my super shoe. Can I consider these as an all rounder for daily runs, long runs and tempo work! I am 6'1 and 187lbs. I mostly run 5Ks, and my long runs are 10Ks. Training for a half! Lastly going true the size would be safe? Cause my running shops don't have the shoe in store so I have to get them online :( Thanks in advance, and so sorry for such a long comment like this. Cheers!
Are you a heel striker? Mid foot striker? Forefoot striker? Do you pronate at all? Are you going to stick with the AP3 as your racer? Also… the AP3 isn’t PEBA foam, it’s a supercritical TPEE…. Similar but different. Right way the AP3 is an outstanding super shoe. I appreciate the kind words on the channel. Thank you so much. 🤙🏻
@@SagasuRunning Hey, thanks a lot for replying!! I am a mid foot striker and I think I have zero to mild pronation. I am planning to stick with the AP3 as my racer. Thanks for the correction on PEBA info, appreciate it!
Then you want the Adidas Adizero SL2…. Literally the perfect companion to the AP3. You’ll feel right at home AND will get a little taste of the foam you love…. The SL2 has a Lightstrike Pro core in it… not rods though. Excellent trainer, especially since you are racing in the AP3. I have a bunch of videos on the channel about the SL2.
@cemozd the Peg Plus is an excellent shoe, but more of a speed day shoe. Plus the geometry is totally different than the AP3…. So they aren’t a good pair.
Good to hear that you don't find a huge amount in it between the Speed 4 and Peg Plus. I essentially went from the Peg Turbo 2 to the Speed 1 as my "faster" daily trainer when the Turbos stopped. Regarding your matrix, before I got injured, I did a pretty much all out "shoeoff" 400m interval session in the Speed 4 and Speed 1 and, somewhat to my surprise, was basically nothing in it and I thought I was doing very close to what I might have run in say Vaporflys. If I hadn't done that sesssion I would also would have said the Speed 4 was not a shoe for the fastest stuff. That said maybe shows sometimes you just need to work with what you have and really any shoe will "go" if you try hard enough. If indeed I also find Nike are back in the game with a daily, faster, fastest shoe triple line up going to be hard to justify buying much else especially when a lot of brands make it hard for me to get their fastest shoes.
I had forgotten about your Turbo to ES1…. Makes sense, I see it now. For me doing all out in the ES4…. It’s the foam that lets me down. The speedroll does its job and the plate otherwise doesn’t get in the way but after a few reps I feel like I’m running on the ground in the ES4… not a nice feeling. And RE: working with what you got…. I totally agree. We all review and debate shoes here… but if I just had one or two shoes in my closet and didn’t watch UA-cam…. I’d just get on with it and all would be well. The curse of the gear nerd I guess.
Hi Tim, i look forward to your review of the Peg Plus! Love your reviews and all the analysis and the countryside where you run! The most obvious question is how does Peg Plus compare to Streakfly?! And, given the success of Asics Superblast, why didn't Nike stick with the original Peg Turbo-- maybe increase the zoomx stack layer size and keep a thinner react (similar to Superblast)?!
@@bluesque9687 I felt the Turbo generally wasn’t as popular as we think by those who liked it. Lots of issues with the separation and generally poor ratings compared to other shoes even on Nike website.,Will have to see how find it. Have feeling this will like a beefed up Streakfly.
The way how you describe the Pegasus Plus (non-plated, fast trainer that is comfortable enough for easy run but not great at it) could also be a great comparison to last year’s Hyperion Max, which is also a non-plated fast trainer
The max has too much foam...the Hyperion 2 is a better comparison. Also, the Hyperion 2 is a shoe I may cover later this fall...it is one I'm interested in for the reasons you stated. DNA Flash however can't match ZoomX... even remotely. I'd even put Saucony's PWRRUN PB ahead of DNA Flash (which I enjoy, but tis not a top tier foam)... DNA Loft v2 (not v3) is also one of my favorite foams...I like Brooks foams, but they need to step up their game in their performance shoes.
@@SagasuRunningRunning Warehouse has last year’s Max stack size numbers very similar with to the Hyperion 2.-Still, I look forward to the comparison w/ Hyperion 2’s DNA Flash v2
Thank you for the clip and I love to watch your videos in general, and really love the way you put things in a structured frame in particular. But while I enjoy the reference of pace matrix I do have a big question in mind, because we runners have so different in speed, for me 5:15/km is my race pace but for many this is easy or steady, do you think the matrix should add specific pace at the horizonal axis for reference?
This is why i don't include actual pace on the performance matrix. They are all relative to effort and amount of force you are putting into the shoe and the ground. Pace is totally relative to the runner... The types of paces or ranges are not.
I doubt that I will ever run in either of these shoes, but the Peg plus does look very nice. Maybe I'll get a pair for casual wear, if the price comes down far enough.
@@SagasuRunningWhy so? Just curious. To be honest, I've been caught in the recent NB hype and ended up with, in a word, regret. The 1080 v13 midsole was all sink no rebound that it saps the strength out of every stride. The Rebel v4, granted it's light, but also flat. The SC Elite v4 has more snap to it, but also feels slow and cumbersome. It's also waaay more expensive than the Alphafly from where I'm from. I have nothing but love for the Rebel v2, More v4 and the SC Trainer 2 which are still actively in my shoe rotation but, after being emotionally and financially traumatized by the recent 3 shoes I mentioned earlier, I'm not keen on any upcoming NB shoes, too.
Curious to see if any shoe can actually come out on top against any "Nike" shoe in these comparisons since it seems you have a pre-determined bias for any Nike shoe and Zoom X foam (or React) in any application, shape or size. Although it is your personal preference and experience of the ride feel and how it performs which goes into the matrices it seems like it could mislead viewers by the degree of favouritism to one brand. Enjoy your breakdowns and detailed analysis but it is a bit misleading for consumers that haven't tried many shoes or brands who would misconstrue every "Nike" shoe as the gold standard in the running shoe category. You seem to suggest the Peg Plus is the superior "performance" trainer to the likes of the Superblast, ES4, Boston 12, Takumi Sen?
I'm sorry, but Nike IS the gold standard...and even if you don't agree on that (as I agree it is subjective)...ZoomX foam is by far the gold standard in super foams still. Adidas's Lightstrike Pro is the only one in the same conversation. I don't believe I said the Nike was better in this video. I said it was MY preference and explained the reasons why. ZoomX foam is a far better foam than PWRRUN PB, but the two shoes solve the same problem in very different ways. Rewatch my Peg Plus vs SL2 video...I was very complimentary to the SL2/TS10 combo... it's the better pure performance combo out there, but it also is a trainer and a racer. The Peg Plus does not compare to the Superblast 2....two VERY different shoes. This video is very complimentary to the ES4 and unless you are a Nike fan (which i am due to fit AND I like running in one brand as I find having a brand's technology track from trainer to racer very important)...the ES4 is a great option between the Peg41 and VF3 (especially these two shoes). The Boston 12 is a great shoe...but it compares directly with the Superblast (that is a video I have made) not the Peg Plus, even remotely. I'm a HUGE fan of the TS10 and have made much content proclaiming how good it is, paired with the SL2 but also within the Adizero range.
@@SagasuRunning It goes without saying ZoomX in Nike's carbon racing shoes are the gold standard other brands are measured against but just interesting with your assessment of the Peg Plus being faster than the ES4. How does the Invincible 3 with ZoomX stack up in terms of speed? Just curious of the ZoomX performance in this application. You also said the Boston 12 is not a comparison to the Peg Plus but you compared the Boston 12 to the ES4 in a different video so it seems there is a comparison between the Peg Plus and Boston 12. You also compared in your matrix in the Peg Plus v SL2 video that the Peg Plus was comparable in use case and speed to the TS10, do you still agree with that assessment?
The Invincible 3 is a totally different shoe. Different engineering and design use case. It’s a big chunky cruiser, that can pick it up if needed in bursts (due to the ZoomX) but it’s definitely not a performance trainer. The Pegasus Plus doesn’t compare the the B12. Also very different engineering and feel. There is some overlap in the threshold area but the use case is very different. The reason I compared the Peg Plus to the ES4 is around flexibility and a surprising similar ride. The ES4 is a plated shoe that actually helps you learn how to run in a flexible shoe. That’s why I put it between a Peg and VF3, it fit well there. The B12 doesn’t, nor do any of the other plated trainers. On foot the ES4 and Peg Plus share some similarities in feel as well…. And both being PEBAX also is interesting…But the ZoomX midsole sets the Pegasus Plus apart as it gives that shoe much more range and performance. The shoe that will compete directly with the Pegasus Plus will be the up coming Adios 9. That will be the performance matchup that matters.
Im lucky to still have a pair of Boston 9 for Training. Absolutely love them. The Pegasus plus seems to be quite similar, both in stats and ride. Do you think it would be a good replacement for the Boston 9 as the workhorse in the rotation?
Not at all. The two shoes have very little in common. Specs aren’t even close but more important the ride is completely different. The only thing that is remotely similar is that both the Peg Plus and Boston 9 are trainers that you can effectively race in. But that’s a stretch. There really is nothing quite like the Boston 9 out there at the moment. However, there is a new shoe coming out that maybe be somewhat similar…. I’ll have it up on the channel in 4-5 weeks.
How do you compare these two against the SuperBlast 2? I feel like the SB2 is very much a performance trainer that wants you to go at higher pace and not really an easy run shoe. Maybe closer to P+ as far as use case.
I wouldn’t. The SB2 is a long run shoe. If it’s over 25k and has marathon pace in the workout…. The SB2 is your shoe. Otherwise it’s just too of foam. I cannot imagine doing speed work in the SB2. I tried 800s in the SB2 and it was brutal. Too clunky. Both of these shoes are agile and nimble. Two words that don’t apply to the SB2. It’s a great shoe but very optimized for what its design for…. Long runs.
I wasn’t a fan of the ES1 didn’t bother with the ES2. I did try the ES3 on and it was an instant nope for me due to how soft it was and the fit. I do really enjoy the ES4 though.
Not in my mind. It’s too clunky and has none of the feel of the VF. Plus having a non plated performance trainer is a game changer for maximizing training effect. Back in the day the In Invincible 1/Tempo/AF1 combo was the way to go for that path…. But in 2024 the VF3 is a better tempo shoe into the AF3. Basically I’d still go Peg41/Peg Plus/VF3 and then AF3
I haven't found a place near me with the pegasus plus so I can't comment on its fit based on personal experience. I've been looking for a daily trainer to replace my Noosa Tri's, I love them but the foam is a bit firm for longer runs for me. The other thing I would say is that the upper fit makes or breaks a shoe for me. I have to have stretchy upper and I have had issues in the past with flyknit both good and bad. The Noosa Tri is the best upper I've ever had. The 2nd best upper is the ES4, hands down subjectively speaking AND the ES4 has a softer landing IMO as well. For the pegasus plus, I could definitely tell that the strip down the middle of the shoe would cause me irritation. Idk why but aesthetics things like that always end up causing some kind of hot spot and irritation with my feet but I can't say definitively as I have not had the opportunity to try them on. Nike typically has better quality materials that other brands, I won't deny that ... but in terms of fit, I'd argue they probably fit pretty similar since both have a forgiving stretchiness to the upper. In any case, me personally, I try to stick to a 1-2 shoe rotation for training and 1 for racing. Given the pegasus 41 has a Wide option for me (normal width would be fine but all the padding makes the fit way too tight when laced up), the ES4 covers everything else and the 41 covers recovery days. Just my 2 cents.
The ES4 definitely has a looser fit, that is what I think of as "sloppy". I prefer a much more constricting fit, especially on a performance shoe. The ES4 is a great go between between a Pegasus and a Vaporfly, as I detailed in this video, prior to the Peg Plus it was the best option. I don;t know what shoe you are racing in but a Peg/ES4/race shoe does almost all of it. Like you I like to keep a very lean 2-3 shoe rotation and look for shoes that cover alot of basis. As for the racing stripe....I wish it wasn't there, but it is much improved from the Peg 35 Turbo or the Turbo NN. I have very sensitive big toe nails and have had zero issues with the racing strip thus far.
Neither is equivalent. The NB4 is a easy cruiser shoe. The SB2 is a long run trainer. The PP is a performance trainer. Three very different shoes with very different use cases.
No, not quite. The NB4/SB2 is a great combo and is only really missing true speed work (which is why I'd add a Hyper Speed 4 in there). The Peg Plus or ES4 is an either/or to me. Put one of them between a daily trainer and a race shoe.
So, for building footstrenght you would still grab the peg plus over the speed 4? Since I already got the speed 4. And about all the plate disucssion: have you taken a look Into xteps carbon plates? Their t700 plate has basically lateral and medial walls to enhance stability but also the plate is shaped like a frame in the forfoot, means in the midfoot is actually only foam, no plate. In the t400 plate its the same without the walls. Leading to a very mild forfoot feeling, moderate guidement and really good stability. Its a very interesting topic since no brand except them experiments so much with plates. Mayve li ning with their arrow shaped plated in the Feidian ultra.
Yes, the Peg Plus is one of the best options out there to build foot strength, from the major manufacturers that is. I'll have another shoe that is even better at some point later this month or next. I haven't looked at what xtep is doing. I have seen some recent Li Ning "concepts". Honestly, a lot of it seems gimmicky, "innovation" for innovation's sake, with no real purpose. I would be curious to run in some of them but that won't happen living where I live...
@@SagasuRunning arent many taiwanese also pro China? Last election it was something like 40-45% but yeah hot topic on UA-cam. The arrow shaped carbon plate and their jiang System in the Feidian ultra is defintely not a gimmick, the big jiang tech in their shadow lineup is defintely a gimmick and not even a fun one. I agree, they change for the sake of change since 1 year and thats not a good thing. Sadly in europe we do not get the mint Green color way for the peg plus... Only the white pink one and the blue Orange, which both do not look very great 🙄
@Chungdol Not the age group that are runners and buying running shoes…. It’s very divided along age groups. I like the white/red (pink) Turbo 1 color way…. But that blue/orange one is rough.
@@SagasuRunning ah that explains a lot! Its sad that especially the east asian cultures are so much divided by age, of course in the Western cultures aswell but not as crazy. We do have a small running Community here from the age 15 to 61, from poor to kinda rich, from left to right leaning and its a blast to have something so simple yet so beautiful that units us. 🤗 Edid: I have seen the white Red one in real pictures, looks indeed waaaaay better
Thanks for the review! I have about 40 miles in the peg plus and I am not getting the same feedback as you. I seem to be in the minority. It’s just not poppy or fast enough for speed work in my opinion. I’ve been using the novablast 3 for 2 years as a daily trainer and to me, they have a similar use case. Really fun for easy days and normal running and good for days when doing strides. But I wouldn’t want to take either out for 400,800,1 mile intervals or a tempo run. Maybe it’s that my speed is a little faster than average (5:30 tempo pace)? I’m genuinely confused what people are feeling here because I am in the minority. But not feeling this as a fast shoe.
I find these shoes come alive past marathon pace for me, which is 4:14/km...when I get into 5k pace (3:44/km) they feel even better...faster than that they are a bit too soft but totally fine for 3:30/km pace...however if I'm really getting after a 400 or 800 I'll put on a Vaporfly 3 or Takumi Sen 10. They definitely aren't as "poppy" as a plated shoe, but that is the point to me...the training effect. I love having a ZoomX option for this type of running that has no plate or shank and puts the emphasis on me, my form and my training.... If I want to go easy...Peg41s are ideal for that. I don't need the PP for that.
Does the Pegasus Plus have the same fit lenghtwise as the Pegasus 39, 40 and 41? The Glacier Blue/Lemon Twist colorway just dropped and I'm grabbing it as a birthday treat to myself haha!
Unlikely. It's not a shoe I'd run in or need. Plus I have a huge backlog of stuff to clear out in August and September and no room for new shoes (I already have some planned). The UB5x seems to be getting good reviews overall though.
Have you tried a topo cyclone 2. 5mm drop 23/28mm pebax kidsole. Very light for me - seems to fin the same space with a more natural footshaped toe box
After all my years of barefoot running I’m very much not a fan of “natural toe boxes” . If I want that I’ll run in my Lunas or barefoot. I’ll take “pointy” shoes for performance any day, especially for road running. If you find Rick Rubin’s “Tetragrammaton” podcast look for the episode he did with Golden Harper. A really great listen on the early days of Altra and thoughts on Topo.
To each their own. But I personally regularly have challenges with pointy shoes to le comfort than Altras. Endorphin speed 1 too tight. I blame this one for a toenail loss which just shouldn't be necessary Endorphin speed 3 borderline- toe pains - may have contributed (toe mails was after an ES1 workout z but had ran a training 42.3km in ES3 a few days before with some discomfort) but can just about train in them. Saucony ride 15 I could live with. Tried a variety recently - puma velocity nitro 2, mizuno wave rebellion - Scott carbon rc. Best workers for me. Escalante 2.5 joy as a daily - Torin 5 - up to threshold - long runs - daily. Beautiful. Altra torin 7 are borderline. I managed to run through a pair 800km - occasional discpmfort as I got a little faster and into warmer spring with midfoot tightness - toebox fine. A brief rest for 5 minutes an hour usually kept me going. Altra Vanish carbon 2 racer (36mm superforam & plate) I was able to go straight into a 25km hard workout with pleasure then second run was goal marathon in 3:05 - which might have been better if I had paced more evenly). Topo cyclone 2 - almost as comfortable as an everyday - and quite comfortable at lower paces as an escalante . But... light - pacey - now my go to interval / 5k / rep pace choice - but easily manageable up to half marathon. Altra esalanre racer - masochist lightweight hard-core trainer for aster workouts (but the cyclone 2 is lighter and feels faster)
Very much. That’s the beauty of running. The last “natural shaped” shoe I ran in was an Escalante. I tried the new one on over the winter and it was an instant no. I highly recommend that podcast I mentioned. Golden dives into the early days of Altra and where all the concepts came from. Really interesting.
Sure… many have used the standard Pegasus for many marathons. It won’t be the fastest option but it will definitely work. Same for the Pegasus Plus… though it will be considerably faster…. It will also work.
As Business Analyst, I want to view videos like this, so that I am quickly informed without wading through multiple videos and making assumptions. Appreciate what you do. Outside of this, what is your occupation? Seems like you are likely in a similar field? Thanks and keep up the great content.
I'm a product designer, though I have worked with countless BAs over my career. You nailed why I format these videos as I do. They are a searchable topic that jumps right in and gives me space to really get into the details without having to cover other shoes (which get their own "vs" videos). Thank you for noticing and watching! 🤙🏻
@@SagasuRunning I mean more old school Salomon as lately Salomon hasn't made many exciting shoes and their fit changed. But S/LAB pulsar 3 should work for high arches. Also I never tried their road shoes.
la speed para entrenos mas lentos q la pegasus? lo dudo mucho, son mas ligeras y llevan placa aunq sea de nylon, yo tengo las 3 y son espectaculares, dudo q las 4 sean mas lentas q las nike, yo diria q al contrario
Zoom X is still the KING in my opinion. I have ran on Turbo 1 and 2 in my 1st 3 marathons back to 2019. Great sharing! Love your taste on running shoes. Thanks
I hope you dont get offended but clearly you are a nike fanboy...how can you compare a non plated with plated....😮 And once again you pulled out the supertrainer reference multiple times.....😊
I never said I wasn’t a Nike fanboy, since the first video on this channel. That shouldn’t be a surprise. Nor do I see this as an issue. We all have our favorites and preferences, in anything we do. It’s only natural. In my case o do make a point to call something four if it’s purely my own personal preference, which I did in this video. However…. I don’t think I follow comparing a non plated shoe to a plated shoe. If a non plated performance trainer had similar or better performance than a non plated performance trainer… why wouldn’t you compare them? The benefits of training (primarily) in non plated shoes are clear and immense. So if one can get the same or better performance in the better training shoe…. Why wouldn’t they? 🤨
Not a fan of Saucony hmmm !!! I've had maybe 4 different models of Saucony shoes all great had some great Nike shoes too I've been running 50 years had disappointing shoes over the years like Brooks early models .I guess its a advertising thing like Hoka but this video was very interesting thanks
I was a Kinvara runner years ago...until Saucony...well Saucony'd that shoe and since then they have been spotty for me. I have a video getitng into my history with the brand, why I don't care for them and their iffy future... ua-cam.com/video/DNeLQKLTfJo/v-deo.html
My speed 4 is approaching 300km. A pure joy to run in. Thanks for the content. !
Nice. I doubt I’ll get mine that far…. But I do enjoy them. Thank you for watching! 🤙🏻
Man I love your attention to detail. My pair of the peg plus is coming in the mail tomorrow. Really excited to feel the shoe. Supposed to be a rest day tomorrow, but might have to be postponed due to the arrival 😂
I hope you enjoy them. They are a subtle shoe. At first they may feel a bit slappy and veyr low to the ground...but give them time. You'll find the magic in them...they are really very good.
You're a marketing guy. With the popularity and usefulness of your matrices, I'm sure you thought of creating a matrix of all the shoes you've reviewed into one pdf, and offering it to your channel members to allow them to build a shoe rotation.
I actually have it all in one file…. And that’s a good idea. Let’s see what other shoes come out this year and see where we are at year end. 🤙🏻
@@SagasuRunning 👍
Nice comparison... This should help Nike back in the high performance training segment. I just got the speed 4 at about USD130. Even though haven't run in it yet. Looking at your performance table I'm glad I got this because of the suitability in the easier runs.
The ES4 is very well behaved for easy running. It shouldn’t be…. But it is. Enjoy them!
Hey Chris, I watch a lot of running related stuff on youtube and read as well on the subject. I've seen many shoe reviews and you are the only one I've subscribed because you explain everything in perfect detail and also give the history of the shoe line with perfect graphics which I like the most! Also, I think this is my first ever comment on a shoe review because I think I trust you the most :) Back in the day I was using the Nike Peg 32's since then a lot changed and I stopped running. In 2021 without any knowledge I bought Adidas EQ21 which most of the people might not even know about or even consider them as running shoes. I think they are pretty stable, and neutral however nothing special about them. 5 months ago I finally got my first ever super shoe which is Adidas Adios Pro 3, and I have been addicted to them. Since then I've been looking for a daily trainer that will complement them. However the market for daily trainers is even more chaotic then super shoe market lol. So I am still looking for my pair, after I saw your Peg 41 review that was it for me however further research scared me out since I am enjoying high stack PEBAX foam with the carbon rods that comes with the Pro 3. Finally I am planning to pull the trigger on Peg Plus as my daily after your reviews but I just wanted to ask in person as well! I really don't want 3 pairs of shoe rotation, I just want a shoe to do them all right next to my super shoe. Can I consider these as an all rounder for daily runs, long runs and tempo work! I am 6'1 and 187lbs. I mostly run 5Ks, and my long runs are 10Ks. Training for a half! Lastly going true the size would be safe? Cause my running shops don't have the shoe in store so I have to get them online :( Thanks in advance, and so sorry for such a long comment like this. Cheers!
Are you a heel striker? Mid foot striker? Forefoot striker? Do you pronate at all?
Are you going to stick with the AP3 as your racer?
Also… the AP3 isn’t PEBA foam, it’s a supercritical TPEE…. Similar but different. Right way the AP3 is an outstanding super shoe.
I appreciate the kind words on the channel. Thank you so much. 🤙🏻
@@SagasuRunning Hey, thanks a lot for replying!! I am a mid foot striker and I think I have zero to mild pronation. I am planning to stick with the AP3 as my racer. Thanks for the correction on PEBA info, appreciate it!
Then you want the Adidas Adizero SL2…. Literally the perfect companion to the AP3. You’ll feel right at home AND will get a little taste of the foam you love…. The SL2 has a Lightstrike Pro core in it… not rods though. Excellent trainer, especially since you are racing in the AP3.
I have a bunch of videos on the channel about the SL2.
@@SagasuRunning Thanks a lot Chris! I will definitely consider the SL2 as it makes sense to pair it with the AP3! Cheers, mate🤙
@cemozd the Peg Plus is an excellent shoe, but more of a speed day shoe. Plus the geometry is totally different than the AP3…. So they aren’t a good pair.
Good to hear that you don't find a huge amount in it between the Speed 4 and Peg Plus. I essentially went from the Peg Turbo 2 to the Speed 1 as my "faster" daily trainer when the Turbos stopped. Regarding your matrix, before I got injured, I did a pretty much all out "shoeoff" 400m interval session in the Speed 4 and Speed 1 and, somewhat to my surprise, was basically nothing in it and I thought I was doing very close to what I might have run in say Vaporflys. If I hadn't done that sesssion I would also would have said the Speed 4 was not a shoe for the fastest stuff. That said maybe shows sometimes you just need to work with what you have and really any shoe will "go" if you try hard enough. If indeed I also find Nike are back in the game with a daily, faster, fastest shoe triple line up going to be hard to justify buying much else especially when a lot of brands make it hard for me to get their fastest shoes.
I had forgotten about your Turbo to ES1…. Makes sense, I see it now.
For me doing all out in the ES4…. It’s the foam that lets me down. The speedroll does its job and the plate otherwise doesn’t get in the way but after a few reps I feel like I’m running on the ground in the ES4… not a nice feeling.
And RE: working with what you got…. I totally agree. We all review and debate shoes here… but if I just had one or two shoes in my closet and didn’t watch UA-cam…. I’d just get on with it and all would be well. The curse of the gear nerd I guess.
Hi Tim, i look forward to your review of the Peg Plus! Love your reviews and all the analysis and the countryside where you run!
The most obvious question is how does Peg Plus compare to Streakfly?!
And, given the success of Asics Superblast, why didn't Nike stick with the original Peg Turbo-- maybe increase the zoomx stack layer size and keep a thinner react (similar to Superblast)?!
@@bluesque9687 I felt the Turbo generally wasn’t as popular as we think by those who liked it. Lots of issues with the separation and generally poor ratings compared to other shoes even on Nike website.,Will have to see how find it. Have feeling this will like a beefed up Streakfly.
The way how you describe the Pegasus Plus (non-plated, fast trainer that is comfortable enough for easy run but not great at it) could also be a great comparison to last year’s Hyperion Max, which is also a non-plated fast trainer
The max has too much foam...the Hyperion 2 is a better comparison. Also, the Hyperion 2 is a shoe I may cover later this fall...it is one I'm interested in for the reasons you stated. DNA Flash however can't match ZoomX... even remotely. I'd even put Saucony's PWRRUN PB ahead of DNA Flash (which I enjoy, but tis not a top tier foam)... DNA Loft v2 (not v3) is also one of my favorite foams...I like Brooks foams, but they need to step up their game in their performance shoes.
@@SagasuRunningRunning Warehouse has last year’s Max stack size numbers very similar with to the Hyperion 2.-Still, I look forward to the comparison w/ Hyperion 2’s DNA Flash v2
Thank you for the clip and I love to watch your videos in general, and really love the way you put things in a structured frame in particular. But while I enjoy the reference of pace matrix I do have a big question in mind, because we runners have so different in speed, for me 5:15/km is my race pace but for many this is easy or steady, do you think the matrix should add specific pace at the horizonal axis for reference?
This is why i don't include actual pace on the performance matrix. They are all relative to effort and amount of force you are putting into the shoe and the ground. Pace is totally relative to the runner... The types of paces or ranges are not.
I doubt that I will ever run in either of these shoes, but the Peg plus does look very nice. Maybe I'll get a pair for casual wear, if the price comes down far enough.
ZoomX for casual wear is not for me. WAY too soft…. Though I do like the look of the Peg Plus aesthetically.
RN4 is a better casual shoe, but kinda sucks for running.
Thanks for the review! Are you going to test the New Balance Fresh Foam Balos soon?
Nope. I won't be covering New Balance on the channel this year. Sorry.
@@SagasuRunningWhy so? Just curious. To be honest, I've been caught in the recent NB hype and ended up with, in a word, regret. The 1080 v13 midsole was all sink no rebound that it saps the strength out of every stride. The Rebel v4, granted it's light, but also flat. The SC Elite v4 has more snap to it, but also feels slow and cumbersome. It's also waaay more expensive than the Alphafly from where I'm from. I have nothing but love for the Rebel v2, More v4 and the SC Trainer 2 which are still actively in my shoe rotation but, after being emotionally and financially traumatized by the recent 3 shoes I mentioned earlier, I'm not keen on any upcoming NB shoes, too.
newbalance are the most overhype shoes on the market
Curious to see if any shoe can actually come out on top against any "Nike" shoe in these comparisons since it seems you have a pre-determined bias for any Nike shoe and Zoom X foam (or React) in any application, shape or size. Although it is your personal preference and experience of the ride feel and how it performs which goes into the matrices it seems like it could mislead viewers by the degree of favouritism to one brand. Enjoy your breakdowns and detailed analysis but it is a bit misleading for consumers that haven't tried many shoes or brands who would misconstrue every "Nike" shoe as the gold standard in the running shoe category. You seem to suggest the Peg Plus is the superior "performance" trainer to the likes of the Superblast, ES4, Boston 12, Takumi Sen?
I'm sorry, but Nike IS the gold standard...and even if you don't agree on that (as I agree it is subjective)...ZoomX foam is by far the gold standard in super foams still. Adidas's Lightstrike Pro is the only one in the same conversation.
I don't believe I said the Nike was better in this video. I said it was MY preference and explained the reasons why. ZoomX foam is a far better foam than PWRRUN PB, but the two shoes solve the same problem in very different ways.
Rewatch my Peg Plus vs SL2 video...I was very complimentary to the SL2/TS10 combo... it's the better pure performance combo out there, but it also is a trainer and a racer.
The Peg Plus does not compare to the Superblast 2....two VERY different shoes.
This video is very complimentary to the ES4 and unless you are a Nike fan (which i am due to fit AND I like running in one brand as I find having a brand's technology track from trainer to racer very important)...the ES4 is a great option between the Peg41 and VF3 (especially these two shoes).
The Boston 12 is a great shoe...but it compares directly with the Superblast (that is a video I have made) not the Peg Plus, even remotely.
I'm a HUGE fan of the TS10 and have made much content proclaiming how good it is, paired with the SL2 but also within the Adizero range.
@@SagasuRunning It goes without saying ZoomX in Nike's carbon racing shoes are the gold standard other brands are measured against but just interesting with your assessment of the Peg Plus being faster than the ES4. How does the Invincible 3 with ZoomX stack up in terms of speed? Just curious of the ZoomX performance in this application.
You also said the Boston 12 is not a comparison to the Peg Plus but you compared the Boston 12 to the ES4 in a different video so it seems there is a comparison between the Peg Plus and Boston 12. You also compared in your matrix in the Peg Plus v SL2 video that the Peg Plus was comparable in use case and speed to the TS10, do you still agree with that assessment?
The Invincible 3 is a totally different shoe. Different engineering and design use case. It’s a big chunky cruiser, that can pick it up if needed in bursts (due to the ZoomX) but it’s definitely not a performance trainer.
The Pegasus Plus doesn’t compare the the B12. Also very different engineering and feel. There is some overlap in the threshold area but the use case is very different.
The reason I compared the Peg Plus to the ES4 is around flexibility and a surprising similar ride. The ES4 is a plated shoe that actually helps you learn how to run in a flexible shoe. That’s why I put it between a Peg and VF3, it fit well there. The B12 doesn’t, nor do any of the other plated trainers.
On foot the ES4 and Peg Plus share some similarities in feel as well…. And both being PEBAX also is interesting…But the ZoomX midsole sets the Pegasus Plus apart as it gives that shoe much more range and performance.
The shoe that will compete directly with the Pegasus Plus will be the up coming Adios 9. That will be the performance matchup that matters.
Im lucky to still have a pair of Boston 9 for Training. Absolutely love them. The Pegasus plus seems to be quite similar, both in stats and ride. Do you think it would be a good replacement for the Boston 9 as the workhorse in the rotation?
Not at all. The two shoes have very little in common. Specs aren’t even close but more important the ride is completely different. The only thing that is remotely similar is that both the Peg Plus and Boston 9 are trainers that you can effectively race in. But that’s a stretch.
There really is nothing quite like the Boston 9 out there at the moment. However, there is a new shoe coming out that maybe be somewhat similar…. I’ll have it up on the channel in 4-5 weeks.
How do you compare these two against the SuperBlast 2? I feel like the SB2 is very much a performance trainer that wants you to go at higher pace and not really an easy run shoe. Maybe closer to P+ as far as use case.
I wouldn’t. The SB2 is a long run shoe. If it’s over 25k and has marathon pace in the workout…. The SB2 is your shoe. Otherwise it’s just too of foam. I cannot imagine doing speed work in the SB2. I tried 800s in the SB2 and it was brutal. Too clunky.
Both of these shoes are agile and nimble. Two words that don’t apply to the SB2. It’s a great shoe but very optimized for what its design for…. Long runs.
Great review. Very thorough. As Vaporfly 3 lover, I look forward to purchasing a pair of Plus's. I believe they are available next week?
August 8 for the US and August 15 for some EU countries I believe….
I recently grabed a pair of vapors and you sold me on the Peg plus to pair with it.
They will be a great training pair. Enjoy them!
The previous Speeds were a better shoe but they shifted to the higher stack. My only issue was the traction on wet surfaces with the 2
I wasn’t a fan of the ES1 didn’t bother with the ES2. I did try the ES3 on and it was an instant nope for me due to how soft it was and the fit. I do really enjoy the ES4 though.
@@SagasuRunning What is your weight, Chris? Just to compare
@femaciel as of this morning I’m 167 lbs.
In theory… could the Tempo Next % been the in-between of the Peg & the Vaporfly? (Granted… Tempo next was really the training shoe for the Alphafly…)
Not in my mind. It’s too clunky and has none of the feel of the VF. Plus having a non plated performance trainer is a game changer for maximizing training effect.
Back in the day the In Invincible 1/Tempo/AF1 combo was the way to go for that path…. But in 2024 the VF3 is a better tempo shoe into the AF3. Basically I’d still go Peg41/Peg Plus/VF3 and then AF3
I haven't found a place near me with the pegasus plus so I can't comment on its fit based on personal experience. I've been looking for a daily trainer to replace my Noosa Tri's, I love them but the foam is a bit firm for longer runs for me. The other thing I would say is that the upper fit makes or breaks a shoe for me. I have to have stretchy upper and I have had issues in the past with flyknit both good and bad. The Noosa Tri is the best upper I've ever had. The 2nd best upper is the ES4, hands down subjectively speaking AND the ES4 has a softer landing IMO as well.
For the pegasus plus, I could definitely tell that the strip down the middle of the shoe would cause me irritation. Idk why but aesthetics things like that always end up causing some kind of hot spot and irritation with my feet but I can't say definitively as I have not had the opportunity to try them on. Nike typically has better quality materials that other brands, I won't deny that ... but in terms of fit, I'd argue they probably fit pretty similar since both have a forgiving stretchiness to the upper.
In any case, me personally, I try to stick to a 1-2 shoe rotation for training and 1 for racing. Given the pegasus 41 has a Wide option for me (normal width would be fine but all the padding makes the fit way too tight when laced up), the ES4 covers everything else and the 41 covers recovery days.
Just my 2 cents.
The ES4 definitely has a looser fit, that is what I think of as "sloppy". I prefer a much more constricting fit, especially on a performance shoe.
The ES4 is a great go between between a Pegasus and a Vaporfly, as I detailed in this video, prior to the Peg Plus it was the best option. I don;t know what shoe you are racing in but a Peg/ES4/race shoe does almost all of it. Like you I like to keep a very lean 2-3 shoe rotation and look for shoes that cover alot of basis.
As for the racing stripe....I wish it wasn't there, but it is much improved from the Peg 35 Turbo or the Turbo NN. I have very sensitive big toe nails and have had zero issues with the racing strip thus far.
Could you do a comparison between the plus and the superblast or novablast, whichever is the equivalent.
Neither is equivalent. The NB4 is a easy cruiser shoe. The SB2 is a long run trainer. The PP is a performance trainer. Three very different shoes with very different use cases.
So would you say like Novablast 4/Superblast 2 two shoe rotation, a Speed 4/Peg Plus two shoe rotation covers everything?
No, not quite. The NB4/SB2 is a great combo and is only really missing true speed work (which is why I'd add a Hyper Speed 4 in there). The Peg Plus or ES4 is an either/or to me. Put one of them between a daily trainer and a race shoe.
Interesting Pair!
...and both run great.
Informative Review👌.
Thank you for watching. 🤙🏻
So, for building footstrenght you would still grab the peg plus over the speed 4?
Since I already got the speed 4.
And about all the plate disucssion: have you taken a look Into xteps carbon plates? Their t700 plate has basically lateral and medial walls to enhance stability but also the plate is shaped like a frame in the forfoot, means in the midfoot is actually only foam, no plate. In the t400 plate its the same without the walls. Leading to a very mild forfoot feeling, moderate guidement and really good stability.
Its a very interesting topic since no brand except them experiments so much with plates.
Mayve li ning with their arrow shaped plated in the Feidian ultra.
Yes, the Peg Plus is one of the best options out there to build foot strength, from the major manufacturers that is. I'll have another shoe that is even better at some point later this month or next.
I haven't looked at what xtep is doing. I have seen some recent Li Ning "concepts". Honestly, a lot of it seems gimmicky, "innovation" for innovation's sake, with no real purpose. I would be curious to run in some of them but that won't happen living where I live...
@@SagasuRunning arent many taiwanese also pro China? Last election it was something like 40-45% but yeah hot topic on UA-cam.
The arrow shaped carbon plate and their jiang System in the Feidian ultra is defintely not a gimmick, the big jiang tech in their shadow lineup is defintely a gimmick and not even a fun one.
I agree, they change for the sake of change since 1 year and thats not a good thing.
Sadly in europe we do not get the mint Green color way for the peg plus... Only the white pink one and the blue Orange, which both do not look very great 🙄
@Chungdol Not the age group that are runners and buying running shoes…. It’s very divided along age groups.
I like the white/red (pink) Turbo 1 color way…. But that blue/orange one is rough.
@@SagasuRunning ah that explains a lot!
Its sad that especially the east asian cultures are so much divided by age, of course in the Western cultures aswell but not as crazy.
We do have a small running Community here from the age 15 to 61, from poor to kinda rich, from left to right leaning and its a blast to have something so simple yet so beautiful that units us. 🤗
Edid: I have seen the white Red one in real pictures, looks indeed waaaaay better
@@Chungdol Such is the way of the world… sadly.
Thanks for the review! I have about 40 miles in the peg plus and I am not getting the same feedback as you. I seem to be in the minority. It’s just not poppy or fast enough for speed work in my opinion. I’ve been using the novablast 3 for 2 years as a daily trainer and to me, they have a similar use case. Really fun for easy days and normal running and good for days when doing strides. But I wouldn’t want to take either out for 400,800,1 mile intervals or a tempo run. Maybe it’s that my speed is a little faster than average (5:30 tempo pace)? I’m genuinely confused what people are feeling here because I am in the minority. But not feeling this as a fast shoe.
I find these shoes come alive past marathon pace for me, which is 4:14/km...when I get into 5k pace (3:44/km) they feel even better...faster than that they are a bit too soft but totally fine for 3:30/km pace...however if I'm really getting after a 400 or 800 I'll put on a Vaporfly 3 or Takumi Sen 10.
They definitely aren't as "poppy" as a plated shoe, but that is the point to me...the training effect. I love having a ZoomX option for this type of running that has no plate or shank and puts the emphasis on me, my form and my training....
If I want to go easy...Peg41s are ideal for that. I don't need the PP for that.
Appreciate the thoughts here. Maybe I haven’t pushed them enough yet to get the benefits. Good word
@jaredyounger9085 Keep working on them. There is a lot of potential in them.
Does the Pegasus Plus have the same fit lenghtwise as the Pegasus 39, 40 and 41? The Glacier Blue/Lemon Twist colorway just dropped and I'm grabbing it as a birthday treat to myself haha!
It's very similar and a classic "Pegasus" fit, but a little more pointy, therefore a little longer (a few mms).
@@SagasuRunning Great! Thank you!
The Turbo 2 was ahead of it's time when i retire the speed i will get the plus prob
The Turbo sure was, though the Peg Plus is a much better shoe.
@@SagasuRunning great to hear another reason to buy it i had the nature it was alright i tried to like it and i did but it wasnt special
@legocommanderwolffe8383 Ya, the Peg Plus is definitely not the Next Nature (thankfully!).
Do you plan on reviewing the ultraboost 5x?
Plan on buying the 5x and the Pegasus plus tomorrow morning and than see which one I like more.
Unlikely. It's not a shoe I'd run in or need. Plus I have a huge backlog of stuff to clear out in August and September and no room for new shoes (I already have some planned). The UB5x seems to be getting good reviews overall though.
I'm curious which you'll prefer. You know my vote... 🤙🏻
Have you tried a topo cyclone 2. 5mm drop 23/28mm pebax kidsole. Very light for me - seems to fin the same space with a more natural footshaped toe box
After all my years of barefoot running I’m very much not a fan of “natural toe boxes” . If I want that I’ll run in my Lunas or barefoot.
I’ll take “pointy” shoes for performance any day, especially for road running.
If you find Rick Rubin’s “Tetragrammaton” podcast look for the episode he did with Golden Harper. A really great listen on the early days of Altra and thoughts on Topo.
To each their own. But I personally regularly have challenges with pointy shoes to le comfort than Altras.
Endorphin speed 1 too tight. I blame this one for a toenail loss which just shouldn't be necessary Endorphin speed 3 borderline- toe pains - may have contributed (toe mails was after an ES1 workout z but had ran a training 42.3km in ES3 a few days before with some discomfort) but can just about train in them.
Saucony ride 15 I could live with.
Tried a variety recently - puma velocity nitro 2, mizuno wave rebellion - Scott carbon rc.
Best workers for me. Escalante 2.5 joy as a daily - Torin 5 - up to threshold - long runs - daily. Beautiful.
Altra torin 7 are borderline. I managed to run through a pair 800km - occasional discpmfort as I got a little faster and into warmer spring with midfoot tightness - toebox fine. A brief rest for 5 minutes an hour usually kept me going.
Altra Vanish carbon 2 racer (36mm superforam & plate) I was able to go straight into a 25km hard workout with pleasure then second run was goal marathon in 3:05 - which might have been better if I had paced more evenly).
Topo cyclone 2 - almost as comfortable as an everyday - and quite comfortable at lower paces as an escalante . But... light - pacey - now my go to interval / 5k / rep pace choice - but easily manageable up to half marathon.
Altra esalanre racer - masochist lightweight hard-core trainer for aster workouts (but the cyclone 2 is lighter and feels faster)
Very much. That’s the beauty of running.
The last “natural shaped” shoe I ran in was an Escalante. I tried the new one on over the winter and it was an instant no.
I highly recommend that podcast I mentioned. Golden dives into the early days of Altra and where all the concepts came from. Really interesting.
Can the Pegasus be used for marathons?
Sure… many have used the standard Pegasus for many marathons. It won’t be the fastest option but it will definitely work.
Same for the Pegasus Plus… though it will be considerably faster…. It will also work.
As Business Analyst, I want to view videos like this, so that I am quickly informed without wading through multiple videos and making assumptions. Appreciate what you do. Outside of this, what is your occupation? Seems like you are likely in a similar field? Thanks and keep up the great content.
I'm a product designer, though I have worked with countless BAs over my career. You nailed why I format these videos as I do. They are a searchable topic that jumps right in and gives me space to really get into the details without having to cover other shoes (which get their own "vs" videos).
Thank you for noticing and watching! 🤙🏻
Nike are super tight on my feet... and i have narrow feet.
I have neither wide nor narrow feet but high arches and a high volume foot. Nikes have always fit me nearly perfectly.
Most Nike shoes give me issues too.
Ye I have high arches and I swear by Nike and Salomon.
I have never had the same success with Salomon sadly.
@@SagasuRunning I mean more old school Salomon as lately Salomon hasn't made many exciting shoes and their fit changed. But S/LAB pulsar 3 should work for high arches. Also I never tried their road shoes.
price
Not a problem. Both shoes priced appropriately for their category and tech.
la speed para entrenos mas lentos q la pegasus? lo dudo mucho, son mas ligeras y llevan placa aunq sea de nylon, yo tengo las 3 y son espectaculares, dudo q las 4 sean mas lentas q las nike, yo diria q al contrario
No según mis pies y datos....
Zoom X is still the KING in my opinion. I have ran on Turbo 1 and 2 in my 1st 3 marathons back to 2019. Great sharing! Love your taste on running shoes. Thanks
I fully agree. LSP is a close second and very good, but very different. Glad I'm not out there alone in my tastes. 🤙🏻
Ye ZoomX is soft at all paces, whereas the beaded pebax is kind of firm and only livens up at tempo pace.
…. And PWRRUN PB falls off a cliff when you put too much into it. It’s got a limited range but it feels great in that range.
I hope you dont get offended but clearly you are a nike fanboy...how can you compare a non plated with plated....😮
And once again you pulled out the supertrainer reference multiple times.....😊
I never said I wasn’t a Nike fanboy, since the first video on this channel. That shouldn’t be a surprise. Nor do I see this as an issue. We all have our favorites and preferences, in anything we do. It’s only natural. In my case o do make a point to call something four if it’s purely my own personal preference, which I did in this video.
However…. I don’t think I follow comparing a non plated shoe to a plated shoe. If a non plated performance trainer had similar or better performance than a non plated performance trainer… why wouldn’t you compare them? The benefits of training (primarily) in non plated shoes are clear and immense. So if one can get the same or better performance in the better training shoe…. Why wouldn’t they? 🤨
Not a fan of Saucony hmmm !!! I've had maybe 4 different models of Saucony shoes all great had some great Nike shoes too I've been running 50 years had disappointing shoes over the years like Brooks early models .I guess its a advertising thing like Hoka but this video was very interesting thanks
I was a Kinvara runner years ago...until Saucony...well Saucony'd that shoe and since then they have been spotty for me. I have a video getitng into my history with the brand, why I don't care for them and their iffy future... ua-cam.com/video/DNeLQKLTfJo/v-deo.html
Yeah saucony are out to make all their shoes higher and higher stack and wider and wider