We just received the kit this week to allow us more and better Direct support. Also, you may find that helicopters is where this really shines, in particular with force trim. Thanks for the video!
@@MattWagner can't wait to see how this develops over the next few months. I've not once ever flown a helicopter in the Sim. Maybe it's time for a change.
@@g-locmediaDCS Huey is one of the truest to life helicopter flight models I’ve ever flown in a sim and I’ve tried all kinds of payware across MSFS, X-Plane, and DCS. I find most somewhat disappointing to the real thing. HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend their Huey.
I have never tried any Moza products myself, but I have seen and followed a lot of reviews of their sim racing gear. The conclusion is that they usually improve their software a ton during years and years after release. If your first impression is the hardware is good but the software needs some work, that is actually very promising if we take into consideration their sim racing products as precedent.
yep you are right. Pithouse software has gone leaps and bounds even from one year ago. It's consistently updated and improved and no doubt it'll be the same for the flight software. They're even updating the hardware's firmware currently also for all wheelbases. The force feedback is already great but will be refined further when 3.0 is available for everyone. It's a fully fleshed out ecosystem in the sim racing world and theyve already demonstrated their ability to listen to the community and also branching out to other product lines. I'd have no reservations going forward with them. I know this sounds like a sales pitch lol, but just my 2 cents of what I have experienced with them and their sim equipment.
As someone that has alot of their high end race products. their support is horrible! One of the worse I've delt with only to be surpassed by corsair. However I still use all their sim racing products and I am happy with them once you get everything working. if you have to deal with support because of faulty products Goodluck it's horrible dealing with them. other then that they're great.
> The conclusion is that they usually improve their software a ton during years and years after release Indeed this is one of the main reasons (that and the TM grip support) is what made me pull the trigger on this thing. With powerful software really letting us dial in force require for deflection over ranges of travel this could be a game changer.
I have watched dozens of reviews on the AB9 and you are the first to mention a "detent" feel in the elevator, so possibly its just yours. I will be getting the AB9 but I will wait to see how well they improve the software.
If the detent is only there when the stick is powered, I would guess it could be a software problem? I have an AB9 on order. If the hardware is sound then I am sure the rest will be addressed as the software evolves.
@@g-locmedia My AB9 base will also feel like this when it is powered on, without removing the MH16 joystick, switch to WW16 joystick in the joystick setup page and reset the AB9 base, then switch back to MH16 after completing the reset, and it will be back to normal.
My body is ready for the FULL review 🎉 thanks for getting some of my suspense for this product under control. Let’s hope for the changes you brought up! Slange!
Virpil offers more grip functions than Thrustmaster, so the firmware has to be adapted to properly support Virpil grips. VPForce worked with Virpil on this, and perhaps Moza will do the same.
Keeping my eyes peeled for that full review. My biggest complaint about flight sim in general was that it doesn't FEEL like flying. This might be a great way to bridge that gap. Thanks for the quality content!
If you trim a Cessna in real life, and most planes, the yoke or stick won’t move, only the trim tab on the control surface. However in a helicopter with hydraulic cyclic trim the cyclic will hold its position with hydraulic pressure.
You’re right. Student pilot on diamond DA40NG and the stick becomes soft when trimmed but does not move just because of trim. I been training trimming on my todays lesson so I’m in the same opinion as @capdippe
That's cool they sent you this stuff. I ordered the base, stick, and extension 3 months ago when they were claiming they would all ship in 4-6 weeks. Now it's looking like it is going to be closer to 4-6 months and I haven't heard a peep from them.
Thanks for the first look, great video with great production! I had to laugh because your experience that you talk about is EXACTLY the same feeling I got when I went to a full motion platform. It is so interesting because we have the same challenges there... everything is dependent on the sim/software output of telemetry. I think with all the FF Sticks coming out, give it about a year and telemetry will be incorporated much more across the board... at least I hope so. I'm going to hold off on a FF Stick until then... but you did peak my interest as I fly DCS A LOT! Thanks again for all the effort you put into this!
Thank you for the kind comments on the video. Yes I wish all Devs would agree on a standard of output so we can get a nice baseline for most Sims. I do think it will come in time.
I like the flaps and LG effects. Since my flaps are on an axis lever on my Mongoose throttle, it was hard to tell how many notches you had moved with the flaps but now with the FFB on this, I feel exactly how many notches. Same with landing - sometimes you may not be 100% sure the LG has activated up or down (unless you check the lever in the cockpit of course) but the feedback tells you right away.
I use a Virpil Base + Grip +75mm extension. Would be interesting to know if I could just put the stick with extension on the moza. I have heard of some incombatabilities between the brands. EDIT: Wrote the comment before finishing the video. Thanks for the info!
Just upgraded my CPU, and I was very excited to play again, expecting gains compared to my previous one. That part didn’t disappoint-going from the 5900X to the 7950X3D. However, after I installed the MOZA cockpit and launched the simulator, the base went berserk with vibrations and noises. When I got into the plane, I finally realised that, in the last month or so, I hadn’t really experienced true force feedback. Suddenly, I could feel everything-the trimming was finally noticeable, and I was getting that amazing feedback. After flying without any specific purpose for about 10 minutes, I returned to the main menu, and once again, the base was vibrating and making noises like crazy. I started to worry, so I turned off the simulator and launched it again, but the problem persisted. I reset Windows 11, but now I can no longer get any telemetry service running. I tried re-launching it directly from the MOZA cockpit folder under the MFS folder, but something that worked in the past no longer works. I have no feedback at all now. I’ve tried reinstalling everything, resetting the base, and launching it when Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024 was already running (as I saw suggested somewhere), but none of these solutions worked. I was really hoping to spend my days off enjoying the simulator, but unfortunately, nothing is working. I’ve spent hours trying to fix it. Does anyone have a solution? I’ve submitted a support ticket, but I don’t expect an answer until after New Year. Those 10 minutes I experienced were the best I’ve ever had in a flight simulator. Please help me get back to that. Thank you, and by the way, great video!
I purchased one of these a few days ago mainly because 1) It's well priced, 2) It supports the open grip "standard" that Virpil and TM use, and 3) Helicopters I have a Moza wheel and know they are a good company, anmd most importantly they stand behind thier products and are always looking to improve. This is important to me, and I REALLY hope Moza will indeed be open to feedback and improvement in the software. This thing could be an absolute game changer with the right features in the software, because the ability to deeply dial in a force profile with full control over the settings would allow us to completely replicate real life aircraft.
@@g-locmedia No, I only ordered it a few days ago, so no idea when I'll get it. Sadly I'll also be traveling for work for two weeks, but I'm hoping it will be waiting for me when I get back :D I currently have the Flitesim CLS-120 FFB yoke and frankly hate it. Ripped it off my rig and went back to my Honeycomb Alpha for now. So if nothing else I'm curious to see if I just have unrealistic expectations of FFB devices in general. I'm very happy with my Moza racing base though, so I have high hopes :) Like I said though the software will be where it matters. If I can really dial in the stick travel, which basically means how much force over a given linear distance, and even better if you can have multiple zones in the same profile that would be amazing. For example the real F15 stick actually has two movement gradients. The first around a given travel distance of center requires more force to move, but once you get farther from center it requires less force to move. More than that, real stick have an important value known as breaking strength, or breakaway, which is the amount of force required before the stick will even start moving or deflecting. If they can manage to allow us to pull all these values into the software it will be an absolute game changer, and it seems it should TOTALLY be doable from a software standpoint if they are willing to do it.
A good set of first impressions. I’m confident Moza can sort out the software, based on what they’ve done with their wheels, but the weakness with an extension is a concern, especially with a heavier metal grip like the Alpha Prime or the Thrustmaster grips. I’m sure they’ll bring out a stronger one fairly soon, so for now I’ll think I’ll wait.
Great video! Can't wait for these to get smaller and lighter, so that it can maybe fit on my MTS Hotas Right (swivel profile) which currently has the VKB GF Ultimate 2. It's been like two decades since my Microsoft FFB stick, and I miss it.
Thank you very much for the follow-up! I hope you keep following this base when software updates are out. Oooh and about the Trim Force: it would be really great if you could test it in a msfs helicopter?!? This would be really important to have. Thank you so much in advance!!
@@g-locmedia Now could be a really good time for it :) All the mission stuff coming for helicopters in MSFS 2024, the excitement of flying in cities and more. DCS Huey is a great helicopter to fly as well. Start with finding a tutorial of how to get it up in the air and a hover tutorial. That's almost what you need to enjoy another side of flying :)
I guess one thing that speaks for Moza is their experience in building force feedback hardware. Neither Winwing or Virpil has any experience in this as I now of. So long as Moza gets the hardware correct it should be ok as the software bit can be upgraded quite easily. The other way around, great software but bad hardware is harder to fix.🎉
I wanna see these used in star citizen. I also want moza to make non ffb sticks more in the same price range of vkbs. I cant buy $1200+ sticks lmao. I love moza tho. Got an r9 and i want the new csp2 pedals
As someone who's sworn by FFB sticks since the Logitech Force and Microsoft Sidewinder Force, it's great to see this is still going to this day My big question is does this work in Linux though? If I can get FFB either natively or through Proton it would be an easy sale for me
7:25 - that is my prime and immediate concern about any FF: does the trim work and behave/affect the stick as it would in a real aircraft? If not, it's a pass. So, they need to work on that. I must be able to change trim in flight and see it a) move the stick with my hands off and b) give me "zero" force when I trimmed the plane out.
Been waiting on ffb for a while, finally pulled the trigger and bought an ab9, taking a gamble as an X-Plane player, but I’d image they’re gonna update it, hoping for a more violent turbulence experience, like you’d experience in ga aircraft in high winds. I want to feel the stick try to rip away from me while flying through a storm
X-plane in my opinion feels way better with FFB devices in general but I have not tested it with AB9 as I don't think its compatible yet. But it is on the list.
I'm really very tempted. The last ffb stick I had was a sidewinder, and I loved that in flight sim. Flying was unparalleled with that. I use a virpil warbrd now with thrustmasters hog and f18 grip. Do you find this base does at least what the old sidewinder did?? Eg, at high speed the stick becomes hard to move and low speed the stick has zero stiffness etc with a good fluid variation of this effect at different speeds? I do get that some things will be different in modern software, because they haven't used ffb for a long time so a lot of software even has it completely missing, but with time I'm sure everything will catch up.
Thanks for the awesome review! I was considering buying this product hoping for the force sensing stick of the F-16, but your review has shown me that this is currently not possible. I hope that a software update will add that.
I took a look at when I went to FSE this year, and it seems....nice. It's something that I would wait a production year before I got one, but it shows prospect. I think the delay on throttles have put me off of it as well. I was expecting a full HOTAS sweet, but 4 months later, there is not even a hint of when we could expect that. I am penitently awaiting the Cyber Taurus from WinWing. The dollar to thrill ration seems best with them. A FFB would be great, but at 1,000, it's not an entry level system.
I have a bit of a noob question since I know nothing about force feedback sticks. Can these sticks play any games that are not intended for force feedback like Elite Dangerous, Project Wingman, Star Wars Squadrons, Nuclear Option, etc. Is there a setting in the program that makes it act like a normal joystick for games that dont have force feedback support?
My gut feeling is no. The Sim or game has to output some sort of telemetric data. I think you could make it work but there would be a large element of diy config needed.
That MOZA grip attachment looks identical to the winwing grip attachment. That one is the controller for the vibrating motors inside. Is MOZAs simialr? does that also control vibrating motors or is just extra swicthes?
@g-locmedia so I spend my time equally between MSFS and DCS. What would you recommend, this Moza or the Brunner yoke, based on feel and experience? Taking price difference out of it. Keep up the great work!!
@@sim-motion1228 that's hard. Brunner is much better than Moza in MSFS but Moza has more effects in DCS. Taking price out of it I think I'd go Brunner with the hopes they will add more effects.
The problem to me with these FFB joysticks is they're very expensive and they're massive. Somehow back in the 90's we had simple, desktop sized joysticks with FFB and they weren't crazy expensive. The MS Sidewinder retailed for under $190 in modern money. It's cool to have this higher end stuff, but I think the fascination with direct drive is a bit overplayed. In the steering wheel market direct drive has taken over and raised the price of "entry level" wheels because they straight replaced cheaper systems.
Great video, is the size of the base the same as other bases you've tested? Just don't know if it will fit the NextLeve Boeing full seat setup. Keep them coming.
@@g-locmedia DCS does them particularly well (MSFS feels off in comparison), and they benefit even more from VR than Jets/Props imo. That sense of depth REALLY helps. Best one to learn in in DCS atm is the Kiowa, or the Mi-8 for something heavier. And careful, the helo VR bug has bitten more than a few people who only used to fly jets/props lol.
I wish you guys would make some comparison between the Moza and the Rhino or FFBeast for example. Especially in regards to the MOST. IMPORTANT features of such a base: 1. Effects Quality and customizability 2. Overheat behavior (I see no ventilation holes in this base) What good is a FFB base in wich the FFB effects get tuned down after just a short amount of pulling Gs during a heated dogfight? I really can not imagine that the Moza base can score in either of these aspects. And yes, I am a Rhino fanboy. IMHO nothing goes over open source. IF anything ever breaks I wish you much luck with getting replacement from Moza. For the Rhino basically all mechanical parts can simply be re printed.
Everything apart from the most important part (motors and logic boards) anyway. It's one of the main reasons I didn't order the Rhino. At least on mine all of the hardware and electronics are open source and I can throw on any brushless motor I want.
I believe (and I could definitely be wrong) that they did DCS compatibility first but only just recently added MSFS so I do hope they just need a bit more iterative development on the software. If others can create the effects I assume the hardware is capable and it's a software concern. I say this as I've ordered and just waiting for mine to arrive but the biggest thing I want is to feel the trim so it's disappointing that isn't working in MSFS yet. Fingers crossed it's really close. So then its a case of do I cancel my order for now, wait another couple of months or hope Moza put the investment in
@@g-locmedia I agree and from what I'm hearing the software is updating and adding new capabilities rapidly. It's probably a good calculated risk to keep it, with the only slight risk being they don't sell enough and eventually abandon/prioritise the primary market
@@g-locmedia My base and flight stick are due to arrive Wednesday. Quick question, is there anywhere that Moza are posting release notes for features they add to Moza Cockpit? I'm being spoiled currently by the excellent comms of Beyond ATC on discord and wondered if there is something similar for Moza software, or is it a case of wait for a release and see what's new?
Few sims have DirectX native FFB. DCS and Il2 does, Xplane and MSFS dont. If IL2 doesnt work, it seems MOZA is not directX compatible, which WILL be a problem
@@strikkflypilot927the good news is Moza is supporting direct feedback DCS but I don’t play that (maybe I should start). MSFS uses telemetry based effects. My base arrived earlier this week and I’ve been testing. The review here is very accurate but I’ve concluded it’s still worth it for MSFS too. The feedback is still immersive even if it has some way to go. I’m still really enjoying it
Great video mate. Can you see a big different from Brunner? Do you think is it worth spend more money ? I have the Brunner yoke and As I'm a real 737 pilot I can tell you that the feeling is pretty much the same. Hope you can answer me
Great review. I really appreciated it. Have you had a chance to test it out with the A-10C2 in DCS? Wondering how well implemented that module is? Thanks!
I pre-ordered in June and everytime I ask they keep telling me 2 weeks then weeks after that it’ll be weeks after that and it’s round and round it’s getting frustrating
@@TheSd1cko ya I was surprised when I saw the dates they’re giving on the website when people like myself ordered back in June and kept getting drug along
No, no more news that I’ve seen and I’m waiting myself, the Airbus EFIS is supposed to be the second item out but I’ve not seen anything about when that is coming, they said about two months at FSExpo, and it’s gone three.
@g-locmedia I watched another video earlier today, and the AB9 lost the center position. The creator had to remove the grip in order to recalibrate. Since most of my simming is multiplayer, that is just not acceptable. I can't just stop the sim and expect everyone to wait. I'll wait for post release reviews and reconsider. I'm glad you liked the F14 as much as I did.
Depends. If you love a bit of DCS as well and MSFS and X-Plane then the AB9 is the go. If you only MSFS or X-Plane then the Brunner far exceeds it in terms of feel in the air. These thing can all change with software though. Future is looking bright!
@ I’m looking to get msfs 24 ….. the ffb can improve on the AB9 and the versatility as u mentioned. And when taking price into consideration would the AB9 be the winner since there is a big difference ?
Ordered the Moza AB9! But.. just found out that a part of my chair will be in the way of an arm rest DIY solution. I need a "curved" extension. How many pins is used for the Moza AB9 ? (Going with my old Warthog stick)
Question about the conclusion were you say that MOZA has to implement more effects. Is it not the software that send the FFB signals? The MOZA software is purely trying to amplify effects that are being missed from software being played. At least, that is how i notice FFB difference with the MOZA R9 FFB wheel base racing AMS, rF2, R3E, AC and ACC. They all have very different FFB effects with the same MOZA software settings. I dont think MOZA AB9 isnt ready for FFB flying, i think games must put more effort into FFB effects
It's a bit on both sides. MOZA isn't picking up all the directx effects that's output and also not reading all the telemetry data from the likes of MSFS. However all the flight sims also need to do better in terms of feeding that information. As far as the MOZA not being ready its missing some really key games like X-Plane, Warthunder and IL2. Also the like of the turbulence effects in MSFS still have a way to go. Although it feels much more complete in DCS.
@g-locmedia what made me think it was you was even the voice / accent. I would never approach someone in person just because I've seen them on UA-cam (especially when they're on holiday) but I heard the person talking in the queue when checking in for the return flight and also had noticed when boarding the outbound flight. It was a crazy holiday because we also saw Keith Lemon, the 22 kids and counting family, plus a couple other UA-camrs around the parks, but I would never dream of invading people's family time.
The crime here is that for people like me who have been using a FFB stick since the late 90's we have been asking for proper support for 20+ years from these and other titles, people mocking us, people calling us out - yet finally here we are in 2024 and with new hardware and finally we realise the FFB implementation sucks for most games.......... F14 in DCS is among the best implemented for sure, the MB339 was also super cool as you felt the airflow across the wing like you were talking about in MSFS with the Cessna - Helo's and trim work perfectly in DCS as well, as do the trim in most aircraft in DCS, using a Rhino here, I have a suspicion under the skin the Moza might be the same stick ??? looks very "famliar", also the F16EX handle is exactly what I am using on my Rhino, a WinWing unit, which is also identical to the Moza, so in short I think the Moza is a Rhino base and WinWIng F16EX handle under licence .........certainly what it looks like anyway :)
@g-locmedia calibrates off center to the right and has communication issues with DCS. Their tech support has escalated it to R&D. Just taking forever because they're based in Hong Kong and it's a 13 hour difference. I'm hoping it's something that can get worked out because I can't justify $1500 US for a bruner.
I got mine a few weeks ago. It never worked. The motors never worked. Axis never worked. It’s in the middle of getting fix. REMEMBER it’s brand new. NEVER WORKED. 😮
Pour moi et surtout dans DCS les développeurs devraient plutôt opter pour une seule approche de retour de force, celle qui est la plus proche de la réalité juste, et oublier la multitude de réglages absurdes. Si tu achètes comme ici une base aussi onéreuse, c'est pas pour avoir des retours et réglages qui ne ressemblent pas à la stricte réalité, purement et simplement
Moza were a bit disingenuous with the force ratings (calculation on diagonal rather than each axis initially). But 9nm is a hell of a lot more than the MSFFB2 (even with a resistor modded Sidewinder).
Im going to be honest (owned many moza products) dont get your hopes up . Moza is the cheap option for a very good reason , because its cheap . The build quality looks good on the surface but the truth is the stuff is generally appalling . Nothing is built to last more than a few months , less if you use it alot . Average use time of my items before issues was around 120 hours . If you are really unlucky your product will arrive broken to begin with , or with missing parts, loose components . If this happens dont expect a swift resolution to your problems the customer support is a disgrace. One repair on a wheelbase took 3 months to get sorted . And moza software WILL try and kill your hardware every firmware update will be a lottery if your item will function as it did before or at all . Obviously i no longer own any moza gear and for anyone on the fence about what gear to buy ,if you value your money and time save for a better higher end product you will thank yourself in the long run that i promise you .
@@bodasafur6078 thanks for taking the time to share your experience. It is valuable for people thinking of purchasing to see things from different perspectives.
Lol what are you talking about, ive been using a r9 v2 base for years. Their stuff is solid. Do you own any moza gear? Whole paragraph dedicated to a load of ignorant bs 🤣
@@Broodjemetbeleg you've had your experience with moza ive had mine . Im telling it as it was simple . I clearly stated ive owned plenty of moza products and my conclusion is as ive posted. If moza is all you can afford great have at it , but if your budget is a little more flexible my personal advice is save for a better option . Moza is not top of line equipment thats just fact, sorry if that hurts your feelings but it is what it is . Personally i wish i had someone tell me before hand and save me the time and money but those are the lessons we learn . Good luck with the rest of your moza journey 👍
@@bodasafur6078 I cannot speak to car simming market ofc, but I can speak on the flight-sim market. Moza is not the cheap option in this case. Moza is a tier above the most expensive commercial products. A Virpil base will run you ~$250. Moza is more than double that for a base. Moza is cheap for ffb, but in a market with now 3 products that is not saying much. VPForce was one man making his own proprietary base in his basement, and Brunner is a company that deals with commercial companies as much if not more than consumers. Moza is the first to place a realistic price on the market.
@@g-locmediaoh ok, do you think I should just go ahead and get the AB9? I’m thinking of selling my Virpil CM2 base, Virpil Grip, and 200mm extension to get the Moza Grip and base.
I would have to guess by the way you explain your expectations of what you think it should feel like and what it actually does you've never flown a real aircraft. Some of the turbulence effects that you aren't feeling back through the stick you wouldn't in a real aircraft. I would Know. You would however feel that in your Butt in G-forces being put on you as well as in the rudder pedals more than a Yoke which you need to remember only work the control surfaces. That's a very small area compared to the rest of the wing and horizontal stabilizer in a game like MSFS. You'd need a Motion rig to really feel those forces. I've had landings on hot days 100*F+ going over a highway only 200 feet before a runway shove my Piper Arrow 150 feet up just from the convection radiation heat coming off the roadway. But that isn't something you feel in the Yoke. You feet it in your Ass as you get pushed upward and need to react to it. So those kind of things people need to understand you won't feel in the stick. Turbulence will be minor feedback. Prop wash, stalls, and other ground effects should give more feedback.
There's a lot of effects in there that wouldnt be reproduced by a stick or yoke however feel the main point of something like this is to fool the brain into being more immersed. There's so many variables here from the software settings and Sim telemetry to the individual model of the plane and even the way that's developed. One of my mates is an airline pilot but also flies some GA. He hasn't tried this stick but he has been on my Brunner setup and says it feels really quite good. I do also have a motion platform but it will never get any kind of sustained g forces but it does trick your brain enough for it to be enjoyable.
@@g-locmedia For those that can afford a motion setup for racing or flying, they do really give a good representation of the real thing. As much as they can that is. But to temper the expectations, thinking, and thought process of how this stick (As I've ordered mine) should work. Anyone reading this needs to understand **You should only feel the feedback as it pertains to what the control surfaces are pushing back through the system** That is proper Realism. So to make a point if you get pushed around in a storm the stick should in NO way shake violently like you will see the plane getting pushed around. up and down or left and right. The small control surfaces aren't getting slammed around like that. Just so long as people who buy FF flight controls understand that. They can enjoy true realism and immersion that us real pilots do even if you don't have a motion rig to toss you up and down. 😄
@@stevenwest3191I think it's better when there is a choice, and the user can turn on what gives them the best feedback and feeling of immersion. With mine I can tune each feedback effect individually and am glad for it (particularly as you don't get all the feedback you would get in the air with G-Forces and gravity etc, even with the best motion platform in existence).
@@Teh-Stig I'm talking about true to life, which is what Moza is trying to do as best as possible. You want something as fake and over reactive as possible then I'd suggest this item probably isn't for you.
@@stevenwest3191 I don't really know what you are trying to say here, with Moza trying "as best as possible". They really aren't doing anything different to existing solutions. Hell, they actually stole the VP Force implementation in spite of GPL licencing requirements. Again, it's best if people can tune things to get them as realistic as possible (or as realistic as they want). I'm on FFB stick number two and have tuned each to be as realistic as possible as it relates to forces, but I also add some effects which I'd feel through the airframe rather than stick necessarily (e.g. rolling on ground, landing jolt, landing gear/air brake buffeting vibration). Feel free to share what you do or don't use when your device arrives, but telling people what they "should only feel" doesn't really help anyone apart from you with your own sense of superiority.
We just received the kit this week to allow us more and better Direct support. Also, you may find that helicopters is where this really shines, in particular with force trim. Thanks for the video!
@@MattWagner can't wait to see how this develops over the next few months. I've not once ever flown a helicopter in the Sim. Maybe it's time for a change.
great to hear, thx
@@g-locmediaDCS Huey is one of the truest to life helicopter flight models I’ve ever flown in a sim and I’ve tried all kinds of payware across MSFS, X-Plane, and DCS. I find most somewhat disappointing to the real thing. HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend their Huey.
I have never tried any Moza products myself, but I have seen and followed a lot of reviews of their sim racing gear. The conclusion is that they usually improve their software a ton during years and years after release. If your first impression is the hardware is good but the software needs some work, that is actually very promising if we take into consideration their sim racing products as precedent.
It certainly is and they do seem to be listening to the community with feedback on the software.
yep you are right. Pithouse software has gone leaps and bounds even from one year ago. It's consistently updated and improved and no doubt it'll be the same for the flight software. They're even updating the hardware's firmware currently also for all wheelbases. The force feedback is already great but will be refined further when 3.0 is available for everyone. It's a fully fleshed out ecosystem in the sim racing world and theyve already demonstrated their ability to listen to the community and also branching out to other product lines. I'd have no reservations going forward with them. I know this sounds like a sales pitch lol, but just my 2 cents of what I have experienced with them and their sim equipment.
As someone that has alot of their high end race products. their support is horrible! One of the worse I've delt with only to be surpassed by corsair. However I still use all their sim racing products and I am happy with them once you get everything working. if you have to deal with support because of faulty products Goodluck it's horrible dealing with them. other then that they're great.
> The conclusion is that they usually improve their software a ton during years and years after release
Indeed this is one of the main reasons (that and the TM grip support) is what made me pull the trigger on this thing. With powerful software really letting us dial in force require for deflection over ranges of travel this could be a game changer.
I have watched dozens of reviews on the AB9 and you are the first to mention a "detent" feel in the elevator, so possibly its just yours.
I will be getting the AB9 but I will wait to see how well they improve the software.
Yea. the detent is only there when the base is powered on.
If the detent is only there when the stick is powered, I would guess it could be a software problem? I have an AB9 on order. If the hardware is sound then I am sure the rest will be addressed as the software evolves.
@@g-locmedia My AB9 base will also feel like this when it is powered on, without removing the MH16 joystick, switch to WW16 joystick in the joystick setup page and reset the AB9 base, then switch back to MH16 after completing the reset, and it will be back to normal.
Nice . I will try this. Thanks for saring
You can see the base rocking at 13:00. I think it needs to be more solidly affixed to your rig.
My body is ready for the FULL review 🎉 thanks for getting some of my suspense for this product under control. Let’s hope for the changes you brought up! Slange!
I'm sure a few of them will. I'm excited to see where the software goes in the next few months
Virpil offers more grip functions than Thrustmaster, so the firmware has to be adapted to properly support Virpil grips. VPForce worked with Virpil on this, and perhaps Moza will do the same.
I was on the understanding that it should just fully work, but maybe your on to something. Interesting info. Thanks for sharing
lets hope so
@@jasonmeister6988 i have the t50-cm2 grip and there are options for virpil grips in the software, but the lever does not work for me at the moment
Keeping my eyes peeled for that full review. My biggest complaint about flight sim in general was that it doesn't FEEL like flying. This might be a great way to bridge that gap. Thanks for the quality content!
If you trim a Cessna in real life, and most planes, the yoke or stick won’t move, only the trim tab on the control surface. However in a helicopter with hydraulic cyclic trim the cyclic will hold its position with hydraulic pressure.
Thanks for the insight on that, Are you a pilot?
You’re right. Student pilot on diamond DA40NG and the stick becomes soft when trimmed but does not move just because of trim.
I been training trimming on my todays lesson so I’m in the same opinion as @capdippe
Man, definitely try these ffb joysticks in VR with a motion sim. It’s where it shines. Immersion is through the roof.
@@johnmann7o2 nice. Yes I have the VR headset there and it's awesome
That's cool they sent you this stuff. I ordered the base, stick, and extension 3 months ago when they were claiming they would all ship in 4-6 weeks. Now it's looking like it is going to be closer to 4-6 months and I haven't heard a peep from them.
I've heard another person say that too. They are supposed to be shipping around now.
@@g-locmedia I contacted Moza today. They stated they just shipped the base today, but the grip and extension will not ship until mid October now.
Mine got shipped i get it in 2 days after 6 Weeks so for me its just in time
Great review with the usual top quality editing. 👌
Thanks mate. Have you tried he the AB9 yet?
Thanks for the first look, great video with great production! I had to laugh because your experience that you talk about is EXACTLY the same feeling I got when I went to a full motion platform. It is so interesting because we have the same challenges there... everything is dependent on the sim/software output of telemetry. I think with all the FF Sticks coming out, give it about a year and telemetry will be incorporated much more across the board... at least I hope so. I'm going to hold off on a FF Stick until then... but you did peak my interest as I fly DCS A LOT! Thanks again for all the effort you put into this!
Thank you for the kind comments on the video. Yes I wish all Devs would agree on a standard of output so we can get a nice baseline for most Sims. I do think it will come in time.
@@g-locmedia Yep, we need something similar to DirectX only for telemetry for both motion and Force Feedback... maybe someday.
I like the flaps and LG effects. Since my flaps are on an axis lever on my Mongoose throttle, it was hard to tell how many notches you had moved with the flaps but now with the FFB on this, I feel exactly how many notches. Same with landing - sometimes you may not be 100% sure the LG has activated up or down (unless you check the lever in the cockpit of course) but the feedback tells you right away.
I use a Virpil Base + Grip +75mm extension. Would be interesting to know if I could just put the stick with extension on the moza. I have heard of some incombatabilities between the brands.
EDIT: Wrote the comment before finishing the video. Thanks for the info!
I can confirm I've been using a virpil extension with the moza stick. It works.
Just upgraded my CPU, and I was very excited to play again, expecting gains compared to my previous one. That part didn’t disappoint-going from the 5900X to the 7950X3D. However, after I installed the MOZA cockpit and launched the simulator, the base went berserk with vibrations and noises.
When I got into the plane, I finally realised that, in the last month or so, I hadn’t really experienced true force feedback. Suddenly, I could feel everything-the trimming was finally noticeable, and I was getting that amazing feedback. After flying without any specific purpose for about 10 minutes, I returned to the main menu, and once again, the base was vibrating and making noises like crazy.
I started to worry, so I turned off the simulator and launched it again, but the problem persisted. I reset Windows 11, but now I can no longer get any telemetry service running. I tried re-launching it directly from the MOZA cockpit folder under the MFS folder, but something that worked in the past no longer works.
I have no feedback at all now. I’ve tried reinstalling everything, resetting the base, and launching it when Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024 was already running (as I saw suggested somewhere), but none of these solutions worked.
I was really hoping to spend my days off enjoying the simulator, but unfortunately, nothing is working. I’ve spent hours trying to fix it.
Does anyone have a solution? I’ve submitted a support ticket, but I don’t expect an answer until after New Year. Those 10 minutes I experienced were the best I’ve ever had in a flight simulator. Please help me get back to that.
Thank you, and by the way, great video!
I purchased one of these a few days ago mainly because 1) It's well priced, 2) It supports the open grip "standard" that Virpil and TM use, and 3) Helicopters
I have a Moza wheel and know they are a good company, anmd most importantly they stand behind thier products and are always looking to improve. This is important to me, and I REALLY hope Moza will indeed be open to feedback and improvement in the software. This thing could be an absolute game changer with the right features in the software, because the ability to deeply dial in a force profile with full control over the settings would allow us to completely replicate real life aircraft.
Have you had a chance to use it yet?
@@g-locmedia No, I only ordered it a few days ago, so no idea when I'll get it. Sadly I'll also be traveling for work for two weeks, but I'm hoping it will be waiting for me when I get back :D
I currently have the Flitesim CLS-120 FFB yoke and frankly hate it. Ripped it off my rig and went back to my Honeycomb Alpha for now. So if nothing else I'm curious to see if I just have unrealistic expectations of FFB devices in general. I'm very happy with my Moza racing base though, so I have high hopes :)
Like I said though the software will be where it matters. If I can really dial in the stick travel, which basically means how much force over a given linear distance, and even better if you can have multiple zones in the same profile that would be amazing. For example the real F15 stick actually has two movement gradients. The first around a given travel distance of center requires more force to move, but once you get farther from center it requires less force to move.
More than that, real stick have an important value known as breaking strength, or breakaway, which is the amount of force required before the stick will even start moving or deflecting.
If they can manage to allow us to pull all these values into the software it will be an absolute game changer, and it seems it should TOTALLY be doable from a software standpoint if they are willing to do it.
Great review and insight. Keep up the awesome content!
Great review, Thank You
@@edwardwilliams599 thanks so much. Ty he full review shouldn't be too far away.
A good set of first impressions. I’m confident Moza can sort out the software, based on what they’ve done with their wheels, but the weakness with an extension is a concern, especially with a heavier metal grip like the Alpha Prime or the Thrustmaster grips. I’m sure they’ll bring out a stronger one fairly soon, so for now I’ll think I’ll wait.
@@doifeellucky the weakness is quite personal and some people may not think that but I thought important to share
I hope they eventually make a good direct drive yoke. It was disappointing that the Iris Dynamics one never got off the ground.
I can see one coming
Great video! Can't wait for these to get smaller and lighter, so that it can maybe fit on my MTS Hotas Right (swivel profile) which currently has the VKB GF Ultimate 2. It's been like two decades since my Microsoft FFB stick, and I miss it.
I have a sidewinder here I bought on ebay but could never get it to work.
Thank you very much for the follow-up!
I hope you keep following this base when software updates are out.
Oooh and about the Trim Force: it would be really great if you could test it in a msfs helicopter?!? This would be really important to have.
Thank you so much in advance!!
You're not the first person to ask about choppers. In all my time simming I've never flown one. Maybe its time to change that.
@@g-locmedia Now could be a really good time for it :)
All the mission stuff coming for helicopters in MSFS 2024, the excitement of flying in cities and more.
DCS Huey is a great helicopter to fly as well. Start with finding a tutorial of how to get it up in the air and a hover tutorial. That's almost what you need to enjoy another side of flying :)
Got my AB9 today. Going BACK tomorrow.
@@JohnnyFaber what happened?
I guess one thing that speaks for Moza is their experience in building force feedback hardware. Neither Winwing or Virpil has any experience in this as I now of. So long as Moza gets the hardware correct it should be ok as the software bit can be upgraded quite easily. The other way around, great software but bad hardware is harder to fix.🎉
Yea, they have loads of experience. I'm very confident this is going to turn out great!
Virpil software is not great either. I think Moza will do their best to make this successful.
Interesting video mate. Thanks for sharing.
Thanks mate
I wanna see these used in star citizen. I also want moza to make non ffb sticks more in the same price range of vkbs. I cant buy $1200+ sticks lmao. I love moza tho. Got an r9 and i want the new csp2 pedals
As someone who's sworn by FFB sticks since the Logitech Force and Microsoft Sidewinder Force, it's great to see this is still going to this day
My big question is does this work in Linux though? If I can get FFB either natively or through Proton it would be an easy sale for me
I honestly have no idea about Linux
Thanks G-LOC!
7:25 - that is my prime and immediate concern about any FF: does the trim work and behave/affect the stick as it would in a real aircraft? If not, it's a pass. So, they need to work on that. I must be able to change trim in flight and see it a) move the stick with my hands off and b) give me "zero" force when I trimmed the plane out.
It does in DCS but not yet in MSFS
could you make a video of how to the setting on MSFS 2024 and DCS?
Maybe I can tackle this in the new year.
Been waiting on ffb for a while, finally pulled the trigger and bought an ab9, taking a gamble as an X-Plane player, but I’d image they’re gonna update it, hoping for a more violent turbulence experience, like you’d experience in ga aircraft in high winds. I want to feel the stick try to rip away from me while flying through a storm
X-plane in my opinion feels way better with FFB devices in general but I have not tested it with AB9 as I don't think its compatible yet. But it is on the list.
I'm really very tempted. The last ffb stick I had was a sidewinder, and I loved that in flight sim. Flying was unparalleled with that.
I use a virpil warbrd now with thrustmasters hog and f18 grip.
Do you find this base does at least what the old sidewinder did?? Eg, at high speed the stick becomes hard to move and low speed the stick has zero stiffness etc with a good fluid variation of this effect at different speeds?
I do get that some things will be different in modern software, because they haven't used ffb for a long time so a lot of software even has it completely missing, but with time I'm sure everything will catch up.
@@TheSd1cko I've used the old sidewinder and this far exceeds it. And yes you'll get more or less authority at high and low speeds
great review I would think a force feedback joystick would best be for helicopters.
Thanks so much for the kind comment. I don't fly choppers in the Sim but I can imagine it would work very well
Thanks for the awesome review! I was considering buying this product hoping for the force sensing stick of the F-16, but your review has shown me that this is currently not possible. I hope that a software update will add that.
If you only fly f16 I'd look at the winwing MSFSSB F16 stick.
Also I just changed to the F-18 profile which I enjoyed more. At the end of the day for me it's about enjoying the Sim 1st realism 2nd
I took a look at when I went to FSE this year, and it seems....nice. It's something that I would wait a production year before I got one, but it shows prospect. I think the delay on throttles have put me off of it as well. I was expecting a full HOTAS sweet, but 4 months later, there is not even a hint of when we could expect that.
I am penitently awaiting the Cyber Taurus from WinWing. The dollar to thrill ration seems best with them. A FFB would be great, but at 1,000, it's not an entry level system.
This one is 600USD. I'm expecting Winwing's to come in around the same. They have been very quiet on that front though. Interesting times ahead.
I have a bit of a noob question since I know nothing about force feedback sticks. Can these sticks play any games that are not intended for force feedback like Elite Dangerous, Project Wingman, Star Wars Squadrons, Nuclear Option, etc. Is there a setting in the program that makes it act like a normal joystick for games that dont have force feedback support?
My gut feeling is no. The Sim or game has to output some sort of telemetric data. I think you could make it work but there would be a large element of diy config needed.
That MOZA grip attachment looks identical to the winwing grip attachment. That one is the controller for the vibrating motors inside. Is MOZAs simialr? does that also control vibrating motors or is just extra swicthes?
The design is based off an F-16 fighter jet so they will be similar
@g-locmedia so I spend my time equally between MSFS and DCS. What would you recommend, this Moza or the Brunner yoke, based on feel and experience? Taking price difference out of it. Keep up the great work!!
@@sim-motion1228 that's hard. Brunner is much better than Moza in MSFS but Moza has more effects in DCS. Taking price out of it I think I'd go Brunner with the hopes they will add more effects.
The problem to me with these FFB joysticks is they're very expensive and they're massive. Somehow back in the 90's we had simple, desktop sized joysticks with FFB and they weren't crazy expensive. The MS Sidewinder retailed for under $190 in modern money. It's cool to have this higher end stuff, but I think the fascination with direct drive is a bit overplayed. In the steering wheel market direct drive has taken over and raised the price of "entry level" wheels because they straight replaced cheaper systems.
I mean.. there is no sim aside from DCS world XD. Thank you for the video!
Do you think that notch on the elevator will affect the pitch control as much as the turtle beach velocityone yoke did?
Hardly even there compared to the velocity one yoke.
Would be nice to see the internals
Thanks for the he feedback might share that in the full review
Is ab9 compatible with the NLR : Flight Seat Pro?
Would like to see the F4E in DCS or Huey
Something I haven't tested but will try the F4 out this week
I cannot afford this but it does look pretty cool if they can tweak it and expand compatibility
Yea I think more compatibility will come soon
Great video, is the size of the base the same as other bases you've tested? Just don't know if it will fit the NextLeve Boeing full seat setup. Keep them coming.
No its a fair bit bigger. Check out the previous MOZA AB9 video for a size comparison between the Brunner and the AB9.
7.5 inches hight
6 inches width
9 inch depth
roughly lol just mesured mine for my sim
Amazing video. Do you have any plans to review the Winwing airbus Joystick?
Thanks so much. Unfortunately I don't have any plans for reviewing that winwing stick
Would love to hear feedback on how DCS Helo's feel with the stick as well.
I actually have never flown a chopper in all my time flight simming. Might have to do some research and give it a go.
@@g-locmedia DCS does them particularly well (MSFS feels off in comparison), and they benefit even more from VR than Jets/Props imo. That sense of depth REALLY helps.
Best one to learn in in DCS atm is the Kiowa, or the Mi-8 for something heavier.
And careful, the helo VR bug has bitten more than a few people who only used to fly jets/props lol.
I wish you guys would make some comparison between the Moza and the Rhino or FFBeast for example.
Especially in regards to the MOST. IMPORTANT features of such a base:
1. Effects Quality and customizability
2. Overheat behavior (I see no ventilation holes in this base)
What good is a FFB base in wich the FFB effects get tuned down after just a short amount of pulling Gs during a heated dogfight?
I really can not imagine that the Moza base can score in either of these aspects.
And yes, I am a Rhino fanboy. IMHO nothing goes over open source. IF anything ever breaks I wish you much luck with getting replacement from Moza.
For the Rhino basically all mechanical parts can simply be re printed.
Everything apart from the most important part (motors and logic boards) anyway. It's one of the main reasons I didn't order the Rhino. At least on mine all of the hardware and electronics are open source and I can throw on any brushless motor I want.
I believe (and I could definitely be wrong) that they did DCS compatibility first but only just recently added MSFS so I do hope they just need a bit more iterative development on the software. If others can create the effects I assume the hardware is capable and it's a software concern. I say this as I've ordered and just waiting for mine to arrive but the biggest thing I want is to feel the trim so it's disappointing that isn't working in MSFS yet. Fingers crossed it's really close. So then its a case of do I cancel my order for now, wait another couple of months or hope Moza put the investment in
I'm super confident they will add this
@@g-locmedia I agree and from what I'm hearing the software is updating and adding new capabilities rapidly. It's probably a good calculated risk to keep it, with the only slight risk being they don't sell enough and eventually abandon/prioritise the primary market
@@g-locmedia My base and flight stick are due to arrive Wednesday. Quick question, is there anywhere that Moza are posting release notes for features they add to Moza Cockpit? I'm being spoiled currently by the excellent comms of Beyond ATC on discord and wondered if there is something similar for Moza software, or is it a case of wait for a release and see what's new?
Few sims have DirectX native FFB. DCS and Il2 does, Xplane and MSFS dont. If IL2 doesnt work, it seems MOZA is not directX compatible, which WILL be a problem
@@strikkflypilot927the good news is Moza is supporting direct feedback DCS but I don’t play that (maybe I should start). MSFS uses telemetry based effects. My base arrived earlier this week and I’ve been testing. The review here is very accurate but I’ve concluded it’s still worth it for MSFS too. The feedback is still immersive even if it has some way to go. I’m still really enjoying it
Good info, but I see the base moving a lot. Isn't that dampening the forces to much?
Very true. With force feedback the stiffer the mount the better it's going to feel. I'm looking at jerry rigging something to make it stronger.
Aaaand we're all still waiting for the sustained combat-turn to see how long before the over-heat cutout takes to rear its head. Puhleese. :D
the base is moving too much. you may need to get a better mounting solution. great review. cant wait for mine.
@@mrGTRspec yea it it moving a fair bit.
How does the AB9 compare to the Brunner when using extensions? In regard to the strength of the force feedback.
The Moza feels about 25-30% stronger. That's a guess though.
Great video mate. Can you see a big different from Brunner? Do you think is it worth spend more money ? I have the Brunner yoke and As I'm a real 737 pilot I can tell you that the feeling is pretty much the same. Hope you can answer me
In MSFS and X-Plane there is a fair difference but as the software develops I think the gap might close a little.
Great review. I really appreciated it.
Have you had a chance to test it out with the A-10C2 in DCS? Wondering how well implemented that module is? Thanks!
I could be wrong but looks like you’re mounted to a NLR rig? I have the NLR Boeing, how does it mount?
@@tjtowner3349 this is mounted on a flight Sim pro to that middle mount from the the base.
I pre-ordered in June and everytime I ask they keep telling me 2 weeks then weeks after that it’ll be weeks after that and it’s round and round it’s getting frustrating
I can ask again to direct to see if pre orders are actually shipping. Where are you located?
@@g-locmedia thank you , I’m in the US
I'm glad I've just seen this. I was on the fence with ordering and thought the 14 day time line seemed a little optimistic given it is a new release.
@@TheSd1cko ya I was surprised when I saw the dates they’re giving on the website when people like myself ordered back in June and kept getting drug along
@@fridge7515 you are not alone. I am a breath away from cancelling the entire thing
How do you get the FFB gunfiring movement under DCS with the Mustang ? I don't get it 😕
Have you tried turning the effect all the way up? Maybe they've done an update as it was definitely working when I was playing a few days ago.
@10:20 "I find myself spraying way too much just for the sheer joy of it".....don't we all mate, dont we all....
on a more serious note, would love to see how you think the software has improved since your original review
@@midnight7297 the full review is coming but in still waiting for X-Plane il2 and warthunder to be added.
Excellent review. Please consider splitting your videos into chapters. Thank you.
Sometimes I do for the longer videos but I can appreciate this one is still 15 mins long. Will do that in the future.
have you had a chance to try the apache or any of the helicopters in DCS? i need ffb after trying it once.
I haven't mate sorry.
@@g-locmedia awww.
If you do, please post a review. Even a short, I've got the base in my cart now, just waiting to hear how it is with apache
Has Winwing come out with the boeing/airbus cockpits?
Not that I'm aware of
No, no more news that I’ve seen and I’m waiting myself, the Airbus EFIS is supposed to be the second item out but I’ve not seen anything about when that is coming, they said about two months at FSExpo, and it’s gone three.
Thanks alot!!
Will you try to test the FFBeast?
I'd love to if I get the chance
What third party sticks can be used?
I canceled my Canadian pre-order today.
What was the reason for cancelling?
@g-locmedia I watched another video earlier today, and the AB9 lost the center position. The creator had to remove the grip in order to recalibrate. Since most of my simming is multiplayer, that is just not acceptable. I can't just stop the sim and expect everyone to wait.
I'll wait for post release reviews and reconsider. I'm glad you liked the F14 as much as I did.
@@VR_Aviator the F14 is brilliant. Interesting about losing the centre position.
@g-locmedia DCS One is the channel. The chapter in the vid is Control Error.
@@VR_Aviator I'll check this out mate. Thanks
$600 gets you an entire cockpit so 1 part at $600 is not cheap by any dimension especially since you need to buy the grip on top.
@@b6s4shelter it's not cheap but in terms of the full landscape off FFB sticks it's on the lower end.
@@g-locmedia I know. I build a full 6DOF rig... Absolutely sick how immersive it is... Piggy bank is crying...
If had to have only one FFB item which one would you choose. Ab9 or brunner mk2 ?
Depends. If you love a bit of DCS as well and MSFS and X-Plane then the AB9 is the go. If you only MSFS or X-Plane then the Brunner far exceeds it in terms of feel in the air. These thing can all change with software though. Future is looking bright!
@
I’m looking to get msfs 24 ….. the ffb can improve on the AB9 and the versatility as u mentioned. And when taking price into consideration would the AB9 be the winner since there is a big difference ?
Is this true Force Feedback or only Vibrations?
Full force feedback
Ordered the Moza AB9! But.. just found out that a part of my chair will be in the way of an arm rest DIY solution.
I need a "curved" extension. How many pins is used for the Moza AB9 ? (Going with my old Warthog stick)
It uses the same 5 pin mini din connector as the Warthog stick/base.
good review
Thanks. Hopefully you found it helpful
Holy Crap, how many beers can you store in there?
I reckon about 6
Can it detect V Ring state?
I don't fly choppers but I reckon this would very much depend on the sim
Question about the conclusion were you say that MOZA has to implement more effects. Is it not the software that send the FFB signals? The MOZA software is purely trying to amplify effects that are being missed from software being played. At least, that is how i notice FFB difference with the MOZA R9 FFB wheel base racing AMS, rF2, R3E, AC and ACC. They all have very different FFB effects with the same MOZA software settings. I dont think MOZA AB9 isnt ready for FFB flying, i think games must put more effort into FFB effects
It's a bit on both sides. MOZA isn't picking up all the directx effects that's output and also not reading all the telemetry data from the likes of MSFS. However all the flight sims also need to do better in terms of feeding that information. As far as the MOZA not being ready its missing some really key games like X-Plane, Warthunder and IL2. Also the like of the turbulence effects in MSFS still have a way to go. Although it feels much more complete in DCS.
@g-locmedia Really silly question. Did you have a 2 week holiday in Orlando recently?? If not, you have a doppelganger with the same accent 😂
Really lol. That's wasn't me
@@g-locmedia then you really do have a doppelganger (or a relative) who I was on the same flight with 😁👍
@@TheSd1cko man that's crazy. Lol. I have no relatives that look like me that I know of. Maybe I'm an adopted twin. Nothing would surprise me.
@g-locmedia what made me think it was you was even the voice / accent.
I would never approach someone in person just because I've seen them on UA-cam (especially when they're on holiday) but I heard the person talking in the queue when checking in for the return flight and also had noticed when boarding the outbound flight.
It was a crazy holiday because we also saw Keith Lemon, the 22 kids and counting family, plus a couple other UA-camrs around the parks, but I would never dream of invading people's family time.
@@TheSd1cko ha ha. Crazy
The crime here is that for people like me who have been using a FFB stick since the late 90's we have been asking for proper support for 20+ years from these and other titles, people mocking us, people calling us out - yet finally here we are in 2024 and with new hardware and finally we realise the FFB implementation sucks for most games.......... F14 in DCS is among the best implemented for sure, the MB339 was also super cool as you felt the airflow across the wing like you were talking about in MSFS with the Cessna - Helo's and trim work perfectly in DCS as well, as do the trim in most aircraft in DCS, using a Rhino here, I have a suspicion under the skin the Moza might be the same stick ??? looks very "famliar", also the F16EX handle is exactly what I am using on my Rhino, a WinWing unit, which is also identical to the Moza, so in short I think the Moza is a Rhino base and WinWIng F16EX handle under licence .........certainly what it looks like anyway :)
"I find myself spraying way too much." We've all done it.
Lol. 100%
I'm having nothing but issues with mine 😢
@@BSO_Actual what's happening with it?
@g-locmedia calibrates off center to the right and has communication issues with DCS. Their tech support has escalated it to R&D. Just taking forever because they're based in Hong Kong and it's a 13 hour difference. I'm hoping it's something that can get worked out because I can't justify $1500 US for a bruner.
@@BSO_Actual I haven't had any issues with mine like that. They did recently update the firmware though
@@g-locmedia how recently?
@@BSO_Actual about a week ago I think. that's when I updated mine
I got mine a few weeks ago. It never worked. The motors never worked. Axis never worked. It’s in the middle of getting fix. REMEMBER it’s brand new. NEVER WORKED. 😮
Has the customer support been ok?
Honestly its on Microsoft to implement ffb in the 2024 sim, not on Moza.
They do output a lot of data as Brunner seem to make the turbulence and wind effects work really well. I'm sure it will get there though.
I wanted to see helicopters
I don't know the first thing about choppers. But I might give this a try.
Pour moi et surtout dans DCS les développeurs devraient plutôt opter pour une seule approche de retour de force, celle qui est la plus proche de la réalité juste, et oublier la multitude de réglages absurdes. Si tu achètes comme ici une base aussi onéreuse, c'est pas pour avoir des retours et réglages qui ne ressemblent pas à la stricte réalité, purement et simplement
Its like AMD, give them a few months with software
I'm confident it's going to be pretty good
9nm constant and 12nm peak seems pretty weak. How does it translate in hand?
MSFF2 had insane amounts of force, will anything ever compare to it.
Moza were a bit disingenuous with the force ratings (calculation on diagonal rather than each axis initially).
But 9nm is a hell of a lot more than the MSFFB2 (even with a resistor modded Sidewinder).
I think everything I've seen so far seems to suggest this is a good first pass.
I'll stick with building my FFbeast over the coming months.
@@asawyer2872 nice. Im keen to know what you think about ff beast. Reach out once youre done.
@@Teh-Stig What sim do you play with it?
@g-locmedia only DCS so far, but on the MS FFB Pro it replaced I also played a lot of IL-2, MS Flight Sim 2020 and X-Wing Alliance with FFB.
Im going to be honest (owned many moza products) dont get your hopes up . Moza is the cheap option for a very good reason , because its cheap . The build quality looks good on the surface but the truth is the stuff is generally appalling . Nothing is built to last more than a few months , less if you use it alot . Average use time of my items before issues was around 120 hours . If you are really unlucky your product will arrive broken to begin with , or with missing parts, loose components . If this happens dont expect a swift resolution to your problems the customer support is a disgrace. One repair on a wheelbase took 3 months to get sorted . And moza software WILL try and kill your hardware every firmware update will be a lottery if your item will function as it did before or at all . Obviously i no longer own any moza gear and for anyone on the fence about what gear to buy ,if you value your money and time save for a better higher end product you will thank yourself in the long run that i promise you .
interesting
@@bodasafur6078 thanks for taking the time to share your experience. It is valuable for people thinking of purchasing to see things from different perspectives.
Lol what are you talking about, ive been using a r9 v2 base for years. Their stuff is solid. Do you own any moza gear?
Whole paragraph dedicated to a load of ignorant bs 🤣
@@Broodjemetbeleg you've had your experience with moza ive had mine . Im telling it as it was simple . I clearly stated ive owned plenty of moza products and my conclusion is as ive posted. If moza is all you can afford great have at it , but if your budget is a little more flexible my personal advice is save for a better option . Moza is not top of line equipment thats just fact, sorry if that hurts your feelings but it is what it is . Personally i wish i had someone tell me before hand and save me the time and money but those are the lessons we learn . Good luck with the rest of your moza journey 👍
@@bodasafur6078 I cannot speak to car simming market ofc, but I can speak on the flight-sim market. Moza is not the cheap option in this case. Moza is a tier above the most expensive commercial products. A Virpil base will run you ~$250. Moza is more than double that for a base. Moza is cheap for ffb, but in a market with now 3 products that is not saying much. VPForce was one man making his own proprietary base in his basement, and Brunner is a company that deals with commercial companies as much if not more than consumers.
Moza is the first to place a realistic price on the market.
A great hardware but with some drawbacks. It is too huge for a Desktop mount....
The do have a desktop bracket. It's fairly good but unless your desk is bolted down it will shake everything
600.00 is not budget
@@billpii6314 it's at the budget end of FFB sticks if you look at the full landscape.
Yes it is.
I think I'm gonna wait for winwing!!!
They've been really quiet with theirs. I'm keen to see what they produce.
@@g-locmedia They are waiting for patent approval but are ready to go!!!
@@g-locmediaDo you think it will be better?
@@ItzJPV way too early to tell I reckon. I think it's around 20nM also but I know that ffb strength is only a very small part of good FFB.
@@g-locmediaoh ok, do you think I should just go ahead and get the AB9? I’m thinking of selling my Virpil CM2 base, Virpil Grip, and 200mm extension to get the Moza Grip and base.
I would have to guess by the way you explain your expectations of what you think it should feel like and what it actually does you've never flown a real aircraft. Some of the turbulence effects that you aren't feeling back through the stick you wouldn't in a real aircraft. I would Know. You would however feel that in your Butt in G-forces being put on you as well as in the rudder pedals more than a Yoke which you need to remember only work the control surfaces. That's a very small area compared to the rest of the wing and horizontal stabilizer in a game like MSFS. You'd need a Motion rig to really feel those forces. I've had landings on hot days 100*F+ going over a highway only 200 feet before a runway shove my Piper Arrow 150 feet up just from the convection radiation heat coming off the roadway. But that isn't something you feel in the Yoke. You feet it in your Ass as you get pushed upward and need to react to it. So those kind of things people need to understand you won't feel in the stick. Turbulence will be minor feedback. Prop wash, stalls, and other ground effects should give more feedback.
There's a lot of effects in there that wouldnt be reproduced by a stick or yoke however feel the main point of something like this is to fool the brain into being more immersed. There's so many variables here from the software settings and Sim telemetry to the individual model of the plane and even the way that's developed. One of my mates is an airline pilot but also flies some GA. He hasn't tried this stick but he has been on my Brunner setup and says it feels really quite good. I do also have a motion platform but it will never get any kind of sustained g forces but it does trick your brain enough for it to be enjoyable.
@@g-locmedia For those that can afford a motion setup for racing or flying, they do really give a good representation of the real thing. As much as they can that is. But to temper the expectations, thinking, and thought process of how this stick (As I've ordered mine) should work. Anyone reading this needs to understand **You should only feel the feedback as it pertains to what the control surfaces are pushing back through the system** That is proper Realism. So to make a point if you get pushed around in a storm the stick should in NO way shake violently like you will see the plane getting pushed around. up and down or left and right. The small control surfaces aren't getting slammed around like that. Just so long as people who buy FF flight controls understand that. They can enjoy true realism and immersion that us real pilots do even if you don't have a motion rig to toss you up and down. 😄
@@stevenwest3191I think it's better when there is a choice, and the user can turn on what gives them the best feedback and feeling of immersion.
With mine I can tune each feedback effect individually and am glad for it (particularly as you don't get all the feedback you would get in the air with G-Forces and gravity etc, even with the best motion platform in existence).
@@Teh-Stig I'm talking about true to life, which is what Moza is trying to do as best as possible. You want something as fake and over reactive as possible then I'd suggest this item probably isn't for you.
@@stevenwest3191 I don't really know what you are trying to say here, with Moza trying "as best as possible". They really aren't doing anything different to existing solutions. Hell, they actually stole the VP Force implementation in spite of GPL licencing requirements.
Again, it's best if people can tune things to get them as realistic as possible (or as realistic as they want). I'm on FFB stick number two and have tuned each to be as realistic as possible as it relates to forces, but I also add some effects which I'd feel through the airframe rather than stick necessarily (e.g. rolling on ground, landing jolt, landing gear/air brake buffeting vibration).
Feel free to share what you do or don't use when your device arrives, but telling people what they "should only feel" doesn't really help anyone apart from you with your own sense of superiority.