Full Auto vs. Semi-Auto with an AK
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- Опубліковано 30 вер 2024
- Anyone who really knows guns kinks that full auto has very limited practical use in the real world. It looks cool on TV and in movies, but is rarely used in the real world when semi-auto is an option. My buddy Dave and I did a drill to help demonstrate this.
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Just a thought...
Full-auto is never used to actually hit a target, but instead, to suppress fire. A whole area being hit with full-auto fire will likely discourage the enemy from moving out of cover and attempting to fire back. Anyways, great video!
exactly, auto is not for accuracy but throwing bullets at people.
Full auto in small arms is a very close quarter combat tool only. If someone very mad, determined on drugs/whatever is charging you like a raging bull you only have 2 seconds to squeeze off as many bullets as possible you need full auto. That's it's only use when not in a lmg.
+GunEnthusiast And who knows,, you might hit a few.
+Cha Dizzy Most casualties in Vietnam and the Middle East were inflicted with explosives, machine guns, and more accurate rifles (SMLE, G3, SVD, etc.). The AK is mostly irrelevant outside of ethnic cleansing in urban areas.
Seth Barcello Wondering how you got that data. Did you go from corpse to corpse asking what type of gun killed them?
BECAUSE WHO I AM DAWG
I was about to quote that shit lmfao
I guarantee he has fanboys out there with this as their ring tone.
Well, he is ex Delta so as far as I'm concerned he gets to say whatever he wants. He gave his best years to our country.
Yes i do salute him for his service, but the statement he made would only be justified if he made all three targets on point.
Larry was completely aware of how that's gonna sound at the time. What is humor?
"Because who I am Dawg"
Never saw that coming, God that was funny!
Yea I had to replay that, LAV is great!
That was embarrassing to me. Guys at the top of the game shouldn't have ego's. Ego's are deadly and dangerous. Then again, the top of the game doesn't make training video's and sell millions of dollars worth of product. They are killers, and killing is a sad business best forgotten.
He's a retired US serviceman, I think he's allowed to have a ego, don't you think?
Chloe Robinson No he's supposed to be ex Delta. Deltas are selected specifically because they do not have a propensity ego. Ego is deadly in a special operations environment.
Well, I don't think he's going to suit up and jump on a plane to a active war zone anytime soon? Give the man some slack. He is retired, he can do what he wants.
Go fuck yourself for trying to push your idea of how someone should be on another person. Not that Larry gives a shit anyway.
I find it interesting how at the beginning of a rebellion or armed conflict, footage of inexperienced and untrained fighters spraying away on full auto on an AKM is predominant. However, after a year or so the fighters in the footage tend to be firing on semi-automatic (think Syrian conflict). To me this illustrates how people tend to find over time that fully automatic fire is ineffective.
Don't underestimate full auto in experienced shooter hands. Two weeks ago mass shooting happened in my country. One guy, ex war dog, shot one and a half magazines from AK at full auto at a table in a cafe killed all 5 that he aimed at, injured 20, guy just flipped out and was disarmed by a guy who jumped at him and was arrested. There is a reason why full auto guns are banned for civilians, experiences soldiers use full auto for covering not really for picking out targets.
Yes for terrorists who intend to slaughter unarmed and unawared crowd it is indeed effective.
depends on the situation. even larry admits that there is a time for full auto, note he said very limited in the real world. full auto is used not for accuracy but for fire suppression. small units platoon and smaller, use full auto for breaking contact. can't do that effectively with semi auto or burst gun.
even more proof that full auto does have its place on the battlefeild is the us army going to the m4a1. which is full auto not burst. but it will agree with larry and you that most oftern 90% of the time, that does not mean you should discount it completely.
There are a few FUNDAMENTAL issues with how this video hopes to prove it's point. Firstly, they are firing the old AK round. 7.62x39mm. This round has significantly greater kick than the more modern rounds such as 5.56mm or 5.45mm, the caliber Russia and allies have switched to.
Second, this man is aiming at the enemy's HEAD. At a 10 meter range. This is the wrong response, center-of-mass shots are typically what happens if you are unfortunate enough to be in this situation.
These two points are enough to discredit the argument the video makes. However, the dude is correct. Full auto has limited uses, but let me give you a list of these:
- You are clearing a building
- You are in a jungle and run directly into the enemy (less than 50~m)
- You are ambushed (any kind)
- You wish to suppress an enemy which you have a general direction in mind
These are VERY important situations to have full auto in. However, most engagements happen at 300m, so he is "right"
Jack Bartlett
couldn't agree more Jack. great list could i add breaking contact as well to that list?
Two points-
1) if law enforcement here in the states OR any foreign military has full auto, we the people should be able to own it too. Fuck the GCA and the NFA.
2). Change your targets Larry. They suck to look at on video. No one cares that they are "different".
Love your videos, man.
RAGETREE The Second Amendment is an all or nothing affair. That "but" you use means you're not a true proponent of our Rights.
RAGETREE I totally agree with you, on this one, besides there are states that do allow full autos, just cost up the ass. Well and a lot of paper work.
spartan5811 What a completely unfair statement to make. Just because they, and I, don't see the practical need for civilians to "all" have full auto does not mean we are not "all for our rights". Cops can also use grenades, and other high end explosives. Should those be made readly available for all? There is a difference between not supporting our rights, or taking advantage of those rights. Hell look at the rest of the world and how they handle firearms. If we didn't have a Supreme Court that backed our Bill of Rights as much as they do we wouldn't be allowed to own and operate any firearm. We already are allowed damn near anything, is that not enough? Do you feel like you deserve a fully automatic firearm? That it's what, your right too? I say we take what we got while we have it. It's not the 18th century anymore.
BurnThePope0514 I own a full auto legally. It is our Right. Restriction of one Right might as well be restriction of them all.
And who is going to be the last word on what is "practical" and reasonable? Feinstein, Bloomberg? See how that works? Our rights are our birthright. Any attempt, whether already codified in law or will in the future is an unconstitutional infringement. Everyone has a line in the sand. Mine was the AWB of 94. That happens again, I guarantee there will be a kinetic response.
As far as looking at other countries, fuck off. They get their rights from their govt. we give govt permission to exist. We can rescind that, too.
Hahaha, I love how all you internet commandos are trying to explain to the man that full auto was meant for providing cover fire. Like the man didn't know that. Lol
The whole point was busting Hollywood myths.
Jimi5.56 yeah because this delta force guy apparently doesn’t know what full auto is used for? Lol
Wtf is this comment doing here.
Keyboard warriors
Theyre just explaining this to everyone reading the comments because Larry didnt mentioned it
This is always the case on videos like this, or those about fight scenes being debunked in movies. The commenters think they know much more than people who have experience in the areas they’re talking about.
so, if semi auto is more effective, and then more lethal, shouldn't the law forbid semi-auto and force the people to buy full auto only firarms ?
:)
If they at all knew what they were talking about they probably would :)
Because full auto is good at killing crowds of people.
Armed Analysis you don't even need a firearm to kill crowds of people.
C. Gonçalves yeah bombs and chemical and bio weapons.
Timed and conceal bombs that blend in to the environment can provide time for an get away
No cause fully autos can be fired in bursts....
"because of who i am dawg"
It's so funny to see Larry use street slang.
No one on the "street" has ever said that 😂
chief, got news for ya! this comment seems to have been posted 5 years ago as I'm posting this.
I like the spray and pray method :)
bring tons of ammo then....your gonna need it.....
Otay!
Chuck Ward cod players ve like
**john rambo wants to know your location**
"that was a lot of fun, and I'm not going to lie about that"
you're god damn right
To be fair. That is a milled AK 47 with no compensator on it. A $10 slant break would would clean this up alittle more.
But you have a point. Full auto is crap. Burst is where the money is.
Was just about to post this question too. Would be interesting to see how the shot placement would be with a slant brake, or any muzzle device for that matter.
alucardshell I have an akm not full auto. But I can tell a difference when not using tge slant break. I would imagine the ak 74 comp does an even better job
TheTyrial86 And all burst does is automatically stop the fire after you're landed one shot and missed the other 2. Burst fire is literally the most worthless mode ever put on any weapon system, UNLESS it's a hyperbust that gives the ability to get both shots on paper. The only reason regular burst fire exists is to prevent troops from wasting ammunition. Another problem with burst fire is that if you let off the trigger before the burst finishes, the next time you pull the trigger, it'll just finish the previous burst. You may fire 2 rounds your first trigger pull then only get 1 round on your next trigger pull. Full auto with a nice low fire rate that makes the firearm easy to control and easy to fire controlled pairs with is the best of automatic fire for anything lighter than an LMG.
Tombs Clawtooth I have used burst. It is pretty reliable. And better under the condition. I am prior military so I understand what burst is meant for. Which is why I said what I said. Full auto for this application for evety troop is not a good idea since you have force multipiers like SAWs and 240G's
TheTyrial86 No it isn't a good idea for every troop, because a lot won't have the self control under stress to fire in controlled bursts.
If the person is fully capable of controlling the firearm, there's no purpose to burst fire as it is literally just training wheels.
Full auto is mainly good for two things. Close Quarters and suppressible fire. These guys are correct about the fact that it is much less useful than in the movies and that semi-auto is better most of the time, but there are situations where a high rate of fire can give you an edge.
0:36 just pause to admire that gun's beauty
If anything, this video actually showcases why full auto is so *good*
When you're in a situation where you have to rapidly hit multiple targets, you're not gonna sit there calm and collected and nail six consecutive semi-auto headshots. You sprayed a full mag into three fairly spaced out targets and hit all three of them. The semi-auto demonstration took nearly twice the time *while* you weren't taking incoming fire. Make those targets shoot back and you'll see why full auto's strengths can't be ignored.
Preach!!!!!
Not really. Semi auto was still far more accurate, which is exponentially more important than how many rounds you're getting on target. What you say about real-life scenarios also applies to recoil control; in a real situation, it's going to be far harder to control the kick of a gun. Combine that with the pre-existing issues of trying to be accurate and aware in the first place, and that means full-auto is generally not feasible.
@@michaelbrooks3220 You are correct 95% of the time, but i've actually seen a combat video from Ukraine where a gunfight was won because of full auto, it was in a trench at point blank. One turned the corner and they were face to face, both AK74's and the guy with semi auto only got 1-2 shots off and the full auto guy let it rip and the spray in that situation made it impossible to miss. So full-auto has its uses in trench warfare for sure... with 7.62x39 the recoil is too much, but in Russia and Ukraine 5.45 is perfect for full auto.
Russians and even Spetsnaz shoots full auto... in CQB everywhere.. those AKs 74m and AK12 are accurate as fuck , so they can shoot auto... it is good supressing and good for short range
***** Love your comment, completely agree with all those statements. I think it 'tends' to be more useful at such close ranges because the chance of missing are a lot lower. It all depends on how well you can control the gun versus how much you need that enemy suppressed and how much you need that full magazine. Semi is great for most conditions.
something different is that video where spetznas shooting behind car in windows with full auto.. that is totally stupid, but when you are in room and only thing between you and your target is some good hard wall, than Full auto wins :)
Spetznaz units practice full auto regularly as any special forces unit does. It's what makes difference between a normal shooter, an actor, and a presenter. In the case if LAV it's because who he is...ex Deltz Force operator.
Larry Phillips and Emil Matursurro had to learn this the hard way in North Hollywood .....Feb 1997
During the Vietnam war I was an army ranger in a unit that had many newly returned ranger vets. These were soldiers who had served in 5 and 6 man teams conducting ambushes in enemy controlled areas. I asked about the AK, and their collective opinion was that if they were going to be shot at, they wanted to be shot at with AKs. “The first round will be on, the rest lost when they shoot full auto.” And the little people typically shot full auto.
When I asked about the SKS it was different. They got quiet. A couple of them visibly paled. They did said the SKS semi-auto fire was very dangerous because the enemy tended to reacquire a target after recoil, aim and fire. Those rounds may not have hit their target, but they were not lost in full auto climb.
Later in life I would teach AK in order to familiarize people with the weapon. Two things were apparent. Automatic fire put a round or two on the target, the rest were lost, to include firing over the berm. The other notable was the AK got hot enough to cook the stock finish out of the wood.
FYI - this info is 50 years old,
Still valid info
Weren’t Thompson’s used in Vietnam too? I heard that they could be quite useful despite their muzzle climb as well. The .45 rounds apparently put enemies down easily.
gilgamesh310 - The short answer is “yes, in limited numbers and applications.” I’m one of the small number of people who used the Thompson. It is too heavy to be practical, as is the ammo in large quantities. There is no muzzle climb to speak of if you have a good grip on the gun. Remember, it is a 10 pound gun shooting a pistol cartridge. It is strictly a short range option though it does hit hard in close. I preferred the XM-177 due to its light weight. Love the Thompson for a day at the range shooting government ammo that is delivered by a truck. On a modern battlefield i prefer something else, unless you are in a house or going room to room.
@@rascal0175 Thanks for responding. It's good to get this information from someone who actually has this kind of experience, rather than from young hotshots think they know everything from googling information for 5 minutes. I'm guessing shotguns were used for some of the purposes SMGs are too.
gilgamesh310 - It was all used but standard combat units had limited choices, if any at all. Everything had its use or place. Standard items were sometimes modified in the field or by armorers in the rear. There are influencing factors, like weather, terrain and mission. What is good for one purpose may be out of place in another, or even next to useless. There is no perfection with firearms that I am aware of, no one size fits all that is constantly applicable. Right now the M-4 seems an excellent choice, but I’d like to see them with a larger cartridge and a piston vice the system we have now.
Usually you work with what you are issued. Special ops has more latitude. In the end, you use what is in your hands.
I feel like you missed the point with full auto fire. It is to get rounds on target as quickly as possible as accurately as possible. Aiming for the head with the semi auto shots and with the full auto is useless. You should have done all shooting at or around the stomachs of the targets to properly test it. You may have also had quicker semi auto shots with it.
I think you should redo this one.
and ak 47 for full auto, COME ON DAWG
He aimed centre mass with full auto. so it is valid according to your theory.
Alex Nguyen no he aimed for the head
@Paul C you dont need to be in the military to Say he should aim for the chest in that test
3 targets hit within 3,5 sec with full auto- why bother about number of rounds?:))))))!
If you aim center mass with burst mode, you're likely to hit center mass with the first round and the second and third would likely find the throat and head. Anyone who's fired an M249 or a 240B knows how to walk it in.
But... But.. But in Call of Duty I get head shots all the time!!!!
I would say that going for the headshots caused the auto to fail. That is not how you fire bursts with an ak. You want to place your first shot center mass or even slightly lower, in expectation that the second one goes high and possibly to upper torso or head, also having the best chance of ending up on target if it goes sideways. So the test doesn't really count in that burst fire has some very nice applications in real firefights, for example when returning fire to someone behind soft cover such as a car body. Or if you need to move fast and shoot at the same time.
Russian "center mass" is different than ours too. We are supposed to aim for the space between the nipples (where you put your hands for CPR) were as they aim for the belt buckle and let 'er rip.
I agree with you. Great comment. Though you should say firing Bursts rather than Burst fire, because Burst fire is an option on some firearm that only allows you to fire typically 2 or 3 rounds :-) so what you're looking for is firing in bursts :-)
DrSabersky I didn't know that, I just learnt something new :-)
For sure... Bad video.
Ah the legendary ak "burst mode".
HIS TRAINING MAKES HIM SUCH A GOOD SHOT.
SORRY FOR THE UPPER CASE WORDS. MY KEYPAD DOESN'T WORK IN THE LOWER CASE :-(
I feel like training plays a big factor as well. If you train all your life for semi auto then of course you're going to perform better with it.
Best way to test it would be to take two large varied groups and train each of them in the two different types of fire, then compare the results afterwords.
I'm no expert but he "wasted" 80% of his ammunition, but he wiped out a small fire-team worth of targets in 50% of the time he did with the semi auto. All the "missed" rounds *could* potentially have been hits had those targets "moved". Isn't the US Army going to A1 trigger groups on all their M4's?
If those had been people, and they had been moving and ducking for cover and shooting back and Vickers was full of adrenaline and scared, he'd have hit none of them most likely. People are hard to kill.
***** The burst trigger weight is inconsistent in semi auto because of a cam being cycled. The full auto trigger gives you more accuracy in semi auto due to consistent trigger weight and the option to open up if you really need to. Soldiers can still be trained to use discipline to limit their shots to bursts, so I don't understand the need for burst mode.
"because who i am dawg." was the best line ever.
If semi auto is more effective then why did they even bother outlawing full auto?
Because they don't know anything about weapons.
Full auto is useful for suppressive fire but semi is best another time.
Before I was in the Light Infantry I always thought full auto was it too but I learned that semi auto with anted shots is much better.
Full auto is most useful if you need to peel off and get out of there, for ambush, or if you are on support for an attack.
To be honest after being in full auto isn't even a big deal to me anymore. Semi Auto AR is fine.
Best *at other times*
What the heck
*aimed shots*
Lol
bratz2 it still should be legal, imagine how much more money would be spent on rounds... If they're looking at stimulating the economy then the firearms industry is a good place to start
Mikhail Faustin Because full auto is better and this video is just trying you to back off and not purchase it.
I must agree with you guys totally, when i was in army back in 2002 (just regular regiment of transmitions (donno if it's translated correctly), main job was to manage and secure the encrypted converstations between army units, deffinetly not an assault regiment and nothing to do with special forces), as an operator who mainly works in the car/truck/apc i was equipped with an AKMC /russian C=S in english/ (short version of AKM designated for the vehicle crew with the butt folding to the front not to the side of the gun "640 mm lenght in mobile position". To say more extra words, near my barracks we had some other ones from another specialised regiments and all of them had a different way to carry their riffles and mg's at the marching ground, some in front, some at the back, with barrel to the top or to the ground, this gun had the last option. To be honest we was trained at the shooting yard not so often as any other specialised regiments (main time spent at classrooms and vehicles), but i remember the old sergeant's words who teached us to fire: "one-two, one-two one-two boys, no Hollywood and you-ll live longer" we was making jokes at him but in 18 y.o heads with hot blood couldn't fit a simple thing that u're equipped with just 2 extra clips (3 in total) wich all could be depleeted just at the first half minute of any battle, and after that u must suck your digits and pray :).
Tnx a lot for the work that u're doing and for the nostalgy what fills me now:), i'm sorry for the long text and not propper english.
andykorso your comment makes no sense
andykorso i read all of that, yea 18 yr olds got them thick skulls
Bro he didnt even control the spray pattern of the ak he must be a silver noob or something
Isn't the real world function of full auto suppression? If soneone dumps a mag in your direction, surely most human beings are going to take cover...
Duhhh
Technically even bolt action rifles can suppress. Just ask the British in the 2nd Boer War. Realise that "suppress" is a military euphemism stemming from the need to generalise, like how "casualty" may be either injured or dead. Suppress means you shoot at the enemy so effectively they are all either dead, wounded or have given up trying to fire back. That's key, when they can tell the fire is so accurate they have no choice but to duck below the trench line and stay there, that is suppressed.
Obviously if you can fire faster (like you have machine guns and other side only has bolt actions) you will have an edge in suppression fire but its a fine balance, you may suppress them just as much firing a shot once every second. Then you can suppress them for about half a minute every mag. But if you rock n roll full auto you're going to only suppress for about 3 SECONDS per mag.
Full auto is important for dealing with the hardest sort of target and that is a fleeting laterally moving target. Can you hit a target running about 7mph laterally? You need to not only track the moving target but aim ahead of them as well. This is where full-auto really excels and semi-auto cannot really compete. That is to point significantly ahead of where the target is running and squeeze off a long burst. At 600rpm it's impossible for them to run "between" each bullet, even if by extraordinary luck as they approach the stream the first bullet barely nicks their breast pocket, the next bullet will clip their spine at a rate of 600rpm, 10 shots per second 0.1 second gap between each bullet.
Trying to fire semi-auto as fast as possible just isn't good enough, split times of 0.2 are about as good as you can do.
The M16A2's burst sucked because the burst was too short in duration, you have to precisely estimate the lead so well it's hardly any better than just leading a single shot.
My source for this is the BREN gun manual of arms, detailing how the weapon is expected to be used and its relative strengths and weaknesses. It is considered a dedicated purpose of the section machine gun - unique to its full automatic fire - that it is for more than suppression but denying movement. A bolt action rifle can be enough to force someone to keep their head down just by shooting any head that pops up. But any rifle, even semi-auto, struggles to track and lead fast moving target.
That's the difference between suppressing the enemy and truly pinning them down. Pinning them down for long enough to move close enough to throw grenades at them till they surrender, call artillery in on them or another squad move into a high enfilade position to rain in fire, or someone crazy enough to get into their trench/bunker system and clear them out in close quarters. But that's not going to happen if they can scatter after they get suppressed.
Treblaine jesus do you take that much time out of your day to write that whole thing
mitchell brenner About as much time as it took you to read it.
Treblaine nope... I took about 4 seconds to look how long it was then replied to you nice come back bitch
Full auto is great if you find yourself in a WW I trench
3:00 was awesome I'm gonna start going to a range
Some of the comments are pretty laughable. Don't worry guys, the odds of you ever having to provide cover fire for your friends and family are rather low. Sweet vid though, not sure why I would ever want a full auto, sure the fun factor, but it just isn't worth the money to me, and all that damn paper work doesn't help. My buddies Dad spent 15k on a either 70's or early 80's M16/Ar-15 (can't recall which at the moment). It is a blast to shoot, just not totally practical or necessary outside of 'duty' related fieldwork. I know for me personally i don't feel like my rights are repressed by not owning one, and if you do then maybe you should rethink about what rights are and are not.
I think the NFA is bullshit and should be repealed, but that said I would never own a fully automatic gun because of ammo and parts replacement costs.
This is a business, to make money, not anything having to do with killing and fighting and practical mindset. No one would want to take that "class" willingly and if they did, they wouldn't want to repeat it. The guys who trained Vickers laugh at this stuff and he knows that. You don't see SOG and LRRP and Recon guys who fought in Nam doing brand-name training classes and products. Vickers was a peace-time "Delta" not a guy who waded knee deep through blood and guts and horror for years on end.
Alison Vogler Haha you obliviously don't know anything about Larry Vickers or "Delta". Maybe this will help you out a bit: vickerstactical.com/about-larry-vickers-2/about-larry-vickers/
I know the men who trained Larry.
semi-auto cover fire is just fine. more efficient too, less reloading = more cover time.
Keep the great videos coming Larry. Do you think that as the future of military weapons progresses that full auto will be limited to crew served/ suppresive fire weapons? Perhaps more training focus on accurate hits on target vs suppresive fire with standard issue weapons like the M4 platform? Do you think that the Army in the future will go with the IAR to supplement the M249 at the squad level or stick to what it has now? I know its not relative to AK platforms just a thought. Also, are you going to be turning something off soon?
Fully auto is more for a room clearing device. Semi is for long range target
full auto cant even suppress if it lasts 3 seconds only
That's why the only weapons that get used on full auto are belt-fed machine guns.
Jordan Jenkins I'm just saying you can go full auto in a room you khow......
We got some experienced school shooters in this thread
icyl burst
Why did you do this video with one of the harder to control full auto rifles?
Also, you know that the AK's muzzle rise is substantial in full auto so why did you aim for the head? Wouldn't it have been prudent to aim lower knowing the aforementioned?
He probably used an AK because they're always AKs in the movies.
AK slant brake or many of the aftermarket brakes would have helped. Aim for the chest/stomach and that 2nd/3rd would have hit the neck/head.
***** The message is the same though muzzle brake or not.
I've hardly ever used the burst on my M16 outside of "Huh, I wonder what it is like to try it" moments.
they aren't so hard to control, have you ever shot one before?
Jay M It's not easy to control in full auto mode
How the hell did he get a pure Soviet AK? Wonder where he goes.
To be fair, he was using an AK47. Heavier than the more common AKM, so that might soak up some recoil, but had no muzzle brake. I hear the AK tends to pull the barrel a bit up and to the right when firing without a muzzle brake, correct me if I'm wrong. Still, no argument here, full auto looks like a lot of fun, but isn't very useful practically. Looks like he managed 1-3 lucky unaimed hits on each target with 30 rounds in 3.5 seconds in full auto, while with 3 more seconds, he managed 2 thoroughly accurate and lethal hits on target with just 6 rounds. That's at 15yd, too... which is ridiculously close range. With every bit farther out you put the targets, the chances of hitting diminish immensely. At 50m (55yd), except for the initial shot (if aimed), he'd be lucky to get a couple grazing hits I wager. Basically it's just suppressive fire, hoping to get lucky with a hit or two.
Even with firearms with less felt recoil like an M4A1 or AK-74, I'm skeptical on how many shots can be put on target with a mag dump at just 100m (110yd), ESPECIALLY if it's done while standing. While prone... who knows. With a well trained shooter, a solid stance while prone, and a stationary man-sized target... a good amount of a 5.56 or 5.45 mag might manage its way on the paper. It'd definitely help if the firearm was a heavier M249 or RPK-74 though lol More weight generally results in less felt recoil.
NormanMatchem You are quite right saying that the AK47 has up-and-right barrel tending. During my army serving, I tried shooting my AKM without the compensator (or muzzle brake, as you call it). I was getting a rather predictable result: most of the bullets just hit the sky. ))
When I did military training, full auto on Assault rifle was basically for suppressing fire - to make the enemy keep their head down.
+Karp Calmari I know exactly what you mean, I do the same on BFBC2 Vietnam..
Exactly. It's for suppression
I love full auto and wish I could own one.
My favorite is the HK51.
In regards to how efficient a full auto really is at engaging targets, I believe nothing compares to a 12 gauge with buck shot.
9 projectiles on target with every press of the trigger.
Hope you post a video comparing the FA and shotgun.
That's a nice AK and cool video. If I were to ever own a transferable AK, it would be a milled one like that.
An original Type-2 might not be a great test of this due to the higher cyclic rate. But we're only talking a 100rpm difference or so, so who knows.
A few mil guys I know who cross trained a lot in the ME stated that with an AKM, keeping doubles on target was not very hard. Beyond that, it was next to useless, and they tried to keep the guys they were training to avoid it completely, try to remind them that there was a reason why they were getting issued RPKs and PKMs alongside.
I would bet this test done on any 74/100 series in 5.45 or 5.56 would be a lot different.
"Pretty much useless" Ya That's why the government made the manufacturing of machine guns illegal in 1986 and made it impossible for us common folks to buy one legally because there "Pretty much useless" but then on the same hand are military still has there full auto's even though there "Pretty much useless" and Unless you got 30k to drop on one you will never be able to own one legally. Thanks Ronald Ragan!
Are you really comparing accuracy between a semi auto and full auto? Was the test really necessary?
this is VERY well done and VERY accurate to real life. Thanks for making this clear for everyone.
Ask any soldier and they will tell you they NEVER use full-auto. Usually it is Single Fire...possibly sometimes semi-auto..
Man, single fire and semi auto is the same thing
"I will admit...thats a lot of fun" while keeping a dead serious face killed me!!! hahaha great channel!
Burst fire or the best 1 bullet by 1 + high damage bullet 7.62
would love to see this with a decent low recoil SMG.
Hey larry, if you ran the same course of fire with an ak-74(with full auto capability), do you think the results will be very different?
Of course they would, the recoil is much more manageable and MOST 74's have a nice break on them.
Thanks for the video Larry! I agree that full auto is tons of fun, but limited effectiveness. Best with SMGs in CQB, LMGs for suppressive fire etc. Interestingly enough, I fire more accurately with a FA fire control group in bursts on an M4 than I do with the burst fire control group. Less parts might be the ticket. Oh, and NOTHING beats the Geissele SSF on a M4/M16!
Disagreed, not totally useless in real world, perfectly proven useful in your last situation. If those targets are three real people coming over while firing their weapons at you, you're only chance of survival is by killing them as fast as you can, and full auto is the only mode that can hopefully clear them out in a single sweep in a second. But anyways, thanks for the great demo!!
In a second you can fire about 10 shots with AK.
Good luck with hitting at least 5 of them.
5 / 3 = 1.666...nah, not enough to kill a bad guy.
I'm over here just chillin drinking a beer and out of nowhere a Larry Vickers, THE Larry Vickers said "because of who I am dog!" I sat up so fast and asked myself, "woah! did Larry just do that?! I did not expect that!" Wtf lmao Larry's a gangster
But what if troops on the battlefield are low grade draftees? The south vietnamese felt overwhelmed during Tet facing full auto spraying VCs with their semi auto garands and carbines. Was it a psychological factor?
Full auto fire is very scary sounding to non experienced fighters.
Jane Doe They described how the AK full auto chatter made mockery of their single shot garrands and carbines.
That sound must have suppressed them far better than the inaccurate rounds fired.
Full auto is a big deal when both sides are low grade draftees.
Probably would have been better with some kinda muzzle break
Who is here to compare with the last update of csgo?? :)
I
The point of this video is to show that You are not trained to controll full auto recoil.
maybe should have got someone from russian fsb alpha or spetanaz to show how its done
abraham seras It's funny considering the fact that he did.
Don't even waste your time. This guy is convinced that he can "one up" various firearms professionals from his chair in an Akron ghetto. If you give him the chance, he'll tell you all of the SOF units that he "served with." Lol
+Connor von Kill dude watch his video "Why I'm Fat". Then you see that he was indeed a Delta Force member.
Loaded language like ghetto is a racist asteism. Russian fsb and spetsnaz alpha are special operators who use the ak platform exclusively wow I'm sure they could do it much better than what you might think. And conner your word of mouth doesn't make everyone arbituarly concede. Kyle lamb presented the 1-5 drill and the chaos drill. These drills plateau at some point. This is so because of the space in between targets in the drill as well as their size of the targets and distance from the shooter to the target.
+Connor von Kill so your under the impression that by some arbitrary reason that truth is something that can be subverted just on the basis of YOUR perception of the character of a person. Lol that's a direct rhetelogical fallacy.
Am I the only one who thinks they are gonna shoot each other? 🤭🤭
YOU MISSED THE TARGET IN FULL AUTO 'COZ YOU MOVED YOUR AK-47 AIMLESSLY. JUST STICK ON EACH TARGETS AND YOU GONNA HIT THEM MORE. DON'T BE AFRAID THAT YOU GONNA EMBARRASS YOUR UNRELIABLE M-16 :)
Dillon Flannery Ak-47 is accurate because it killed 58,000 US troops in Vietnam which the North Vietnamese Army and the Vietcong were victorious.
Dillon Flannery LOOK LOSER THOSE TWO MILLION VIETNAMESE WHO DIED THERE WERE MAJORITY VICTIMS OF INDISCRIMINATE HEAVY BOMBING OF YOUR USELESS B52 WHICH BECAME THE BIGGEST MISTAKE OF YOUR COUNTRY. WHY NOT ASKED SOME AMERICAN VETERANS OF HOW UNRELIABLE WAS M16 RIFLE AS A TOY GUN DURING THE WAR. IT WAS A LAUGHING STOCK AND ALSO BECAME A DEADLY CAUSE FOR THOUSANDS OF US SOLDIERS WHO DIED IN THE FIELD DUE ONLY TO MALFUNCTION. IT WAS SO PATHETIC!
Dillon Flannery YOU CANNOT FIGHT A WAR THAT IS NOT YOUR WAR AND IT'S A GREAT LESSON FOR AMERICANS THAT IT IS NOT GOOD MINDING OTHER BUSINESS. THE ONLY THING THAT VIETNAM NEEDS WAS THEIR OWN INDEPENDENCE AND INFACT THE FIRST AMERICAN SERVICEMEN WHO HELPED THE LATE HO CHI MINH TO FIGHT AGAINST THE JAPANESE COULD TESTIFY THAT. ACTUALLY, HO CHI MINH DID NOT TRUST CHINA NOR RUSSIA SO THAT'S WHY HE DECIDED TO WRITE A LETTER TO PRESIDENT ROOSEVELT TO HELP VIETNAM ABOUT THEIR INDEPENDENCE FROM FRANCE. IF ONLY AMERICA HAD A WISE DECISION TO HELP VIETNAM RATHER FRANCE THEN I'M SURE VIETNAM WILL BECOME THE FIRST COMMUNIST ALLIED COUNTRY IN FAVOR FOR THE US WITHOUT LETTING THE 58,000 US SOLDIERS TO DIE IN VAIN.
Dillon Flannery SOMETIMES YOU SHOULD USE YOUR MIND FIRST BEFORE BULLET IN ORDER TO SAVE THE LIVES OF YOUR SOLDIERS AND ALSO BILLIONS OF DOLLARS THAT YOUR COUNTRY WILL ONLY SPENT FOR WAR. ONLY A MORON PERSON CAN HASTILY MAKE WAR WITHOUT THINKING FIRST BETTER OPTIONS. THEREFORE,, PSYCHOLOGICAL WARFARE IS BETTER THAN MILITARY WARFARE.
Dillon Flannery YES YOU ARE 'COZ UR SO HAPPY THAT THERE WERE 2 MILLION VIETNAMESE PEOPLE DIED THERE WHO BECAME VICTIMS OF YOUR SELFISH GOVERNMENT BEFORE.
liked for "who I am dogg!" 🤣
I disagree with the claim that in the real world it is "pretty much useless". In the real world, you aren't going to be taking on 6 assailants at once. You may come across one hostile in your line of sight and you'd better be able to put enough lead in him to put him down before he does the same to you. It's also a lot easier to operate under high stress situations.
Hey man, Don't diss full auto. Imagine if instead of 3 separated target you were shooting at a horde of zombies of infected corpses. THEN full auto is your best friend. 30 bullets, 30 hits. 3.5 seconds.
+Chaotic Chris This is how that scenario would play out: 30 bullets, 30 hits, 3.5 seconds, 0 headshots = You're still going to be zombie lunch.
idk if theirs like 20 bad guys in-front of me id like just to have a full auto assault rifle with a extended mag or a LMG if i can ever own one
And you will be using up all your bullets and 10 of them remained unharmed.
Aero Windwalker
okay but sure they'd be scared shitless i know i would be after hearing automatic fire
Aero Windwalker
so when ISIS shoots up people theyd kill more people if they used semi auto?
James Grill For a trained shooter most definitely, unless the terrorist has a machine gun and do not need to worry about reloading.
ESPECIALLY for a relatively untrained shooter, semi-auto is more likely to score hits. The use of full auto by default is due to a lack of training. And machineguns absolutely need to worry about reloading, a PKM like ISIS is so fond of can run through a 200 round belt in around 15 seconds.
Do test with ak74 bet the results are different
where did he get a real Kalashnikov. that's a $20 gun in Libya. but a $50,000+ in the USA. very rare gun.
+kenneth stinson
That $20 gun in Libya, is also made in Libya, and is not so "real".
Those bad guys were all shot at least once, and 6 rounds hit flesh in 3 and a half seconds! 6 shots on 3 targets in that time is very impressive. It's the magic of full auto!
Thank you Steven Seagal.....
Semi auto is far more effective than full auto, yet new full autos are banned. *logic thrown out the window*
NoahThomas29 full auto is very useful when the gun is mounted or on a tripod
I like that old-school milled AK47, AKA not an AKM. You don't see those much.
galbas78 new grip tho
***** Yea, with vented gas tubes and dull wooden furniture
Это не советский ак47 это подделка
If there had been an effective recoil compensating muzzle device on the end of the barrel, the results of the full auto firing would've been much better.
Pretty much useless unless you are shooting at 300 closely packed people in a bar.
Sadly, he didn't have a full-auto.
+Phaze252 I don't even think he had a AR
They both are useless unless you are in that situation. What would you use an AR for, hunting?
Sadly? It would have made it better if it was? Just for your argument? It should be LUCKILY he didn't have a full auto you friggin moron!!!
I thought it was a Sig MCX-- not technically an AR-15.
is that a milled polish or yugo ak?
It looks polish to me.
just one tap bro
When it comes to hitting on target in full auto: couldn’t you simply aim lower for the first shot? If you’re trying to hit the head, if you aim for the chest if the waist, you’re still likely to hit a vital spot on the first shot, and then as the muzzle rises, you’re likely to hit the upper body or the head with enough control, which can be learned with practice.
Come on Larry!!! How am I gonna convince myself to buy a $20,000 Full Auto AK? If your gonna make videos telling me I'm better of with a semi auto?
but remember, one bullet hit is more than enough to kill or hevily injure a man.
If a real enemy Soldier knows you are less likely to shoot them with full automatic, wouldn't that be defeating the purpose of "suppression' cover ?
Full auto is mainly used as cover fire during a fire fight. They also call it, the "spray and pray" method. My dad was in Vietnam, he says that they rarely actually aimed their rifles. The only ones who aimed were usually snipers.
Anytime I fire a 7.62 AK, it just beats the living crap out of me (recently tried a full auto one that was cool, but not pleasant to shoot). Is that just me or does anyone else have this problem?
This is a clear case of devising a test to get a predicted out come. Using a three round burst to the center of mass at 25 yards would produce superior results in the real world. It is obvious to anyone who has fired an AK full auto before that burst dispersion was to large for head shots at 25 yards. The same is not true for body shots which would capture a burst group size of 12" with no problem.
What are you silver 1? Everyone knows you pull down with the AK when shooting full auto.
Sorry nut nobody in the Soviet Union was trained or supposed to fight at 15 yards aiming for the head..
The WHOLE reason for going to AK47 was to go full auto at that range.
I mean full auto not 2-3 rounds bursts. So at 15 yards with an AK47 most Soviets will press the trigger untill the mag is empty. Sorry but thats how this is seen in Russia :)
Well hang on. In 3.5 seconds, the shooter was able to make hits on three assailants with almost zero effort. It was “squeeze the trigger and sweep”. Those hits are to the torso, so those guys are having a bad day, and with some deliberation of not sweeping and holding on each target for a second, each would be pummeled. Ineffective, my ass.
AND c’mon, no one is going for headshots in auto. Run the gun in semi and auto, 2 rounds each target center mass. GUARANTEED you’re faster with the MG and just as effective.
Give me a break
I would love to see the same thing with AK-103 (or AKM with AK-74 style muzzle device) and AK-74
Thank you. This helped me with a forensic science ballistics class assignment. :)
Full auto isn't useless but it does have limited uses. It's also generally a lot more useful if your gun is more stable/supported on anything. I'd imagine it's useful at close quarters if you want your target or targets dead as a doorknob or for serious suppression. I'd think it's useful for mid-to-long range suppression IF your weapon is very stabilized/mounted. At long range it's only useful for some small amount of suppression or otherwise pointless and dangerous.
Drive-by shootings typically occur with fully automatic weapons because the vehicle allows one to get close and leave the area of the target quickly, and at that range, full-automatic is often guaranteed to kill. So it has uses, though they're of course limited to how stable and accurate it can be.
“Did I shoot 2 or 3?”
Dirty Harry has entered the chat
Part of the point is, even though he only scored 6 hits with a 30 round sweep, all three guys would still be either dead or seriously wounded if they weren't wearing body armor. And the target spacing at 15 yards was a bit excessive for that kind of fire. If you're going to do something like that, you'll want to try to position yourself where you don't have to sweep as wide an angle.
I mean, getting 3 or 4 hits on 3 different targets with one trigger pull is pretty good actually. Sure you wasted a lot of ammo but all 3 of them would probably die from multiple 762 rounds in the abdomen.
If you used a smaller caliber gun (like an mp5) for cqb I think full auto could be useful.
Thanks men....and that AK looks very nice!
Not true. Full auto is great for pinning down, scaring and confusing enemies, great for controlling a small area where enemies may try to run fast accross but where the time frame for aiming properly is very short, and great for close quarter fighting. But yeah, don't expect accuracy when using it and use in short bursts only. And of course, if the target is moving slow or standing still in the open, never use full auto if you want to hit it.
I know this to be true to the word and that is why Americans are dead on with our weapons is cause of semi auto aimed fire. Full auto is good for making the enemy scared of a lot of rounds fired their way but its not hitting anything. Larry outstanding video and too many of our people are stuck on Hollywood and believe it to be true and you are showing them the reality of the weapons of the world. Great Job and one service man to another Hoorah!!
whoooh, our lovely soviet AK, in USSR we all know how to disassemble/assemble it.)
Vietnamese army will teach you to hold the AK horizontal because this weapon has a higher recoil. Holding it that way will spread the bullet side way and increase the chance to hit multiple target in the battlefield :)
i was actually looking for csgo AK guide or something, but this is really interesting too...
I would not say it is useless, if there are three attackers with guns, facing a guy doing full auto against them, it is very hard for them to stand there and try to shoot at you, if you do semi auto, you probably will be dropped by the third guy by the time you shoot at the second guy...
ak47 like the one in this video is a nice type 3 ak47 milled wow now full auto in a .30 cal weapon is just harder to control and well very powerful so there is a trade off.
There is NO muzzle brake/compensator on the muzzle... even a simple slant brake would have improved the score, in my opinion. Full auto is a tool for suppression, not necessarily for killing.
Steve Miller Agreed, full auto in bursts keeps heads down and beats up an area making it harder for the enemy to move forwards or re-position also to put the shits up them, which always helps.
The AK-74 is more accurate than the AKM in full auto. The AKM fires the 7.62x39mm Soviet round, while the AK-74 fires the 5.45x39mm Soviet round. They are both Russian assault rifles during the Cold War. The AK-74 is technically an AKM with a flash suppressor and it fires the 5.45x39mm Soviet round.