INTP vs INTJ: How Each Type Avoids Getting Into Action (INTx Insights)
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- Опубліковано 6 вер 2024
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In this video Antonia & Joel talk about how INTPs and INTJs each have unique strategies to avoid getting into action.
#INTP #INTJ #MyersBriggs #PersonalGrowth #SelfHelp #PersonalityTypes #MBTI
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I spend almost every day genuinely believing that I have no energy, so I barely do activities that I don't have to do. That changes at night, when everyone else is tired but I have energy to burn.
thats me right now procratinating my sleep doing thinking wacthing 20 things at once lmao
As an INTJ people are always telling me to get out of my comfort zone and do x,y, and z. Then, I ask them to get out of their comfort zone and learn to code, plan on controlling their debt to income ratio, or make a 529 plan for their kids. Oddly, they look at me with a "why the f*ck would I do that" face.
Therefore the true objective isn't to "help me grow" but rather to make me more like them so that they feel more comfortable. ie. "there is something wrong with you (the INTJ) and not me".
Another question I ask them is "what are your flaws and weaknesses". 95% of people shut down with this question and avoid self refection. It appears EVERYONE has a comfort zone that they need to get out of, whether it involves doing 'exciting' things in the real world or mental tasks.
Ahh yes. The perils of being rare. People assume that you are abnormal
@@entropy8634 thats almost the same
As an INTJ, procrastinating for me is exactly like you described, I research and look at my project at many different angles before implementation, that sometimes is my best tool but sometimes it results in no action at all. Another scenario is that there must be something external happen to make the big picture in my head resolved, and I "wait" for that thing to happen before getting into action, which unfortunately is another form of procrastinating. (I could have done something in the meantime but I refused, that is procrastinating)
+ Pourya Es I think we need to mitigate this idea of "procrastinating".
I am convinced that there is absolutely nothing wrong with following what comes naturally to you (your body, your mental state, your values). We only procrastinate by someone else's standards.
I can go for days on end without DOING anything, but in my brain/head, there are continuous supernovae of ideas and how to apply them to solve my/other people's problems. Now, to the ExxP, I'm being a downer, and to the the ISxP I'm being stunted, and to the ExxJ I'm being anti-social. But to me, I AM solving problems...just taking my blxxdy time to make sure I do the isht THOROUGHLY on the first go. :)
I would say that, there is a time for being out-there and there is another time for being in-one's-head. Too often when young, we feel the "need" to do things like others (which are opportunities for challenge/growth), but this can end up a very frustrating and disappointing experience if carried out for long.
It's important to have tested one's stamina/endurance throughout the years, but it is even more beneficial to acknowledge one's limitations in the long run...
You have a good point for INTJs.
Although they have issues with things that "don't make sense", theirs is more about rejecting "inefficient, redundant" processes.
Usually, they end up taking action to correct these faulty processes.
INTJs are only out of action long enough for the time it takes them to take action...unless they have doubts about their performance for emotional reasons (i.e depression, low self-esteem, trauma).
Nachannachle good point. Wonder if Joel and Antonia have any suggestions if the trouble is emotional - low esteem or fear of failure?
Affirmation helps
INTJ here. This is spot on. I need to identify a reason to take action. If there's somebody willing and capable of making intelligent decisions, I have no qualms with letting them take the lead.
I (INTP) decided to get out of my comfort zone and set the goal to finish a full distance triathlon. I learned all about the gear I will need, about efficient running form, cadence, heart rates, training programs, base endurance, swimming form in pools and open water and much more. I watched dozens if not more than hundred videos about triathlon preparation. The more I learn about it, the more it feels like I already completed one myself.
I know this is a danger that comes with my personality type. I despise making a training plan and stick to it. However, I do train and I am now able to run 16km or cycle 100km. And I did this without getting the best gear yet. It bothers me a lot to do this without getting all the data I would love to have that comes from sports watches or with the gear that would save me a lot of energy. Getting into action is really really hard when you think you can do all of this theoretically. Try to shut down your brain for a minute, that's enough to pick up the phone and dial a number or get into your running gear and outside. Force yourself into action, it's fun when you are in it.
Funny story as an INTP gamer.
I played this video game with my friends that I really liked back in high school and got really obsessed with it. A sequel came out in Japan but not in English and I was too impatient to wait so I got a Japanese copy and have spent over 200 hours trying to beat the main campaign. The game features a lot of customizable parts for your weapons with different stats and skills attached. I've been testing and basically learning/memorizing Japanese kanji just to play a little video game on my PSP and I find it oh so appealing everytime I finish hunting a monster. Truly a splendid feeling to not be able to fully comprehend what the game wants of you but still managing to tough it out.
Exploration is something that can keep me either hyper focused or on multiple subjects at once. I love it
Now you've just made me realize that watching all these vids about personality when I'm not even majoring in psychology is just my Ne manifesting.
As an INTJ exploration irks me. I know what I’m looking for I just need processes to be quick Ni Te coupling . INTPs seems to love trial and testing.
Thanks for another great video for INTx's. Seems very accurate and targeted for our types.
I find, as an INTP, that being inspired and/or having clarity about what to do is the key to getting into action. I can muster the energy to do some things, but the WHY needs to be there. I think Antonia mentioned in a podcast about clarity being important for her as well, as an ENTP. Introverted Thinking can develop clarity, but Ti + Ne can so easily blow it apart with the absurdity of it all.
INTP here. My motivation is similar to reluctant cat on a leash. Good luck getting me to move.
03:30 it could also be mentioned that Si kinda likes to bask in the stability of its current situation; it sees the absence of change as stability, something valuable that should be kept, which isn't always the case. On the other hand Se makes it easier for INTJs to interact with the physical world.
This would in part explain why INTPs tend to write more and act less than INTJs.
applies to INFPs who write more (about love, emotions, friendship, etc) and socialize less than INFJs, because they also respectively have Si and Se.
This gave me a good chuckle, you are right about INTPs and motivation. My mother made a remark about how growing up I would never do anything I wasn't motivated to do.
Oh dear. I pretty much always pop out as INTP. This vid has been super helpful. It looks like I have the motivation issues of the P with the desire for accuracy of a J! There is absolutely no hope for me 🤪! But thanks for the info. I think...
INTP listening, I wasn't going to add a comment because it seems redundant, but I'm trying to be more outward with my thoughts even if it is online. So far listening to you guys has been very much processing all of your information to my current and past self. Also listening to maybe hear something that you guys say about INTP's that I can't relate to, which hasn't happened yet.
A maybe non-redundant comment just came to mind ha. Have you guys heard of NVC (nonviolent communication)? I first learned of this in a brief one-day class I took when I was 16 years old. I took a huge interest in it, and looking back now after processing some of your information on INTP's I can see it intrigued me so much because it explained cleanly on how to communicate emotions, needs, and wants in a very organized systematic way. And now I understand probably why so many people around me I tried to introduce this concept to were not very interested in the process haha. Anyway I think it would be interesting to hear your thoughts on NVC. I still try to use this system sometimes when I'm in an INTP hissy fit if I can get a small moment of clarity.
Anyway thank you guys I'm very grateful for your work.
Welcome in the youtube comment section. How has your youtube- comment journey been so far?
Fellow INTP & NVC amateur here. You might be interested in the "Sex talks" essay by Rebecca Kukla (Feb 2019), online at Aeon. A commenter noted that it expanded his understanding of NVC communication since Kukla explores negotiation beyond the 'request' format. Just as you said, NVC educated my Fe child with Ti/Si style of teaching. Others would need to develop their harmonizing skills with different tactics to be more effective, though I'd say NVC is an important asset in anyone's tool belt.
You guys are doing great job, amazing channel
I have a feeling that what prevents me from taking action is the fact that
1)I want to know it all before I do anything / checking multiple sources & over analysing
2) Action itself, even though might be simple, is just less appealing than the theory & learning more
3) I am not persistent & it's hard for me to continue to perform the same type of activity regularly for an extended period of time if I don't see an immediate result (e.g. changing a habit)
4) There are are 100s of other ideas in my head(far too many) & I'm jumping from 1 to another, I guess not truly prioritising, which make me get excited about something & then losing interest over something else...
Relate to it a lot as intj. I'll give a very recent example: In a leading role, I had to recently provide very negative feedback to a coworker. The person was infj and took it extremely hard. So do I. It drained me so badly, I couldn't sleep well for many days. And I'm taking in it sort-of like my fault, because I should have planned and prepared well enough so that the situation didn't arise in the first place. So I'm all over the internet studying INFJ:s, trying to prevent these kinds of things from happening, because it tears me down emotionally and energetically.
Also, this is the main difference between ENTJ:s and INTJ:s (that I've noticed in my life). ENTJ:s such as a coworker to me is much more willing to take on risk and jumping into things without thinking, because when problems arise, they solve them quickly and efficiently and they don't put too much emotion into it so it doesn't drain them. Not so for me. So I plan and plan and plan, to create the perfect plan to conserve my energy.
What you say makes sense…from your perspective which I understand and respect.
No ‘must’s and ‘should’s will make me do it if I have decided that I will not do it.
After A LOT of deliberation I have reached the conclusion that it would not work and it does not make any sense to even waste my time on it. No loss there. After all, the world is full of intelligent and competent extroverts. I’m sure one or more of them will come up with something maybe even better than my idea. No, I am not lacking confidence and I don’t fear failure (people really need to stop saying that; it’s very irritating). It’s just that I DO NOT WANT TO do it. And that’s that.
You two are by FAR my favorite analysts when it comes to MBTI. Your evaluation is just so... Accurate.
As an intp I felt sad when you said reading and researching isn't real action. Because it took much willpower to let me do that too. Although sometimes when I was really interested I can lose sleep just gathering information. But I got you. I want to do something. But I want to gather information while other people can just take action just like that. Comparatively they are more fruitful/ productive than I am. Although sometimes I can be busy but not productive or accomplishing anything matter to the world. But I don't care. I'm contradicting myself even in my own comment. 💛😂
Looks like I am not a typical INTJ. I see myself as a creator and my main task is improving all the things and processes around me. The research and sketching out is only a small part of my total time usage, actually building what I developed takes the most time because most of the time, it takes longer than anticipated. For over a year now, I run myself for maximum output, that means being productive something between 80 and 100 hours a week. There is a limit somewhere, because from time to time I really lack the energy to do even more, but that is after doing what has to be done now, to stay in the schedule and be efficient (I really have a problem making other people wait for me). If I add up the time I need to build everything I am determined to build and what is already sketched out in my mind, I lag half a year behind or so. One part is true: confronted with a new problem which has to be solved immediately, I have to process it first before I jump into action. But most of that processing is done in that downtime I mentioned earlier, so it isn't really an issue.
Me lacking motivation because it doesnt make sense is true. To elaborate on that what doesnt make sense to me make sense to others, and then I will get cognitive dissonance because of this hence resulting in more laziness of action
😂 INTJ female with ESTJ husband. This is the only reason we argue. I always need to think things through. I take notes, then make a provisional plan, then make an actual plan, then check if anything is wrong with it .... and my husband has already done whatever it was we had to do (not perfectly imo 😂)
INTJ male with ESTJ dad. Basically same issue. He complains I dont take actions and move quicker and I keep telling him I have to think a lot what I am going to do first.
Really appreciating this INTx series! I'm INTP and my fiancee is INTJ -- these are almost hilariously accurate. And of course helpful for understanding the other view point/growing as a person.. Motivation is always a struggle for me; so hot and cold. I love the point you make about using exploration to find motivation and drive; I've experienced this but never was able to identify why/name it. For me its yoga, getting into nature, going to a concert... Good to remember I can always use that exploration as a tool to find motivation. Thank you!!
Thank you guys so much for this! I always thought I’m just lazy and not accomplished enough and not engaged enough with the world by not getting out as much as others. It’s just low energy management. I wish I could overcome my low energy and experiment more instead of waiting until I feel I know enough.
Your energy can go up sometimes when a project needs to be done and you are surround by truly lazy people. Surprisingly the reluctant leader INTJ can come out and more energy comes with it. Thats my experience.
My J/P is split right in the middle so that video has been super helpful :D.
Most INTPs are enneagram 5. To integrate they must go to an enneagram 8 which is correlated to extroverted sensing and being in your physical environment. So good job on noting that.
Great commentary - you guys really know your stuff! - from INTJ; I also get the doing stuff/research thing happening ... so much done, so much more to keep doing ... so time consuming ...
Well, I have both of this reasons for not taking action.
What keeps an INTJ from taking a "real" action in the outside world. I happen to have spent a month or two on researching a lot. Like a lot. Not completely without taking an outside action (only to get frustrated with the inefficiency of something poorly planned). Yes, the purpose is king. The older I get, the less the chance I am able to engage when there's no meaningful purpose in sight. It feels dramatic and it is so too. And it is true too that an INTJ needs it measurable and kicking. This is basically what I am doing while gazing at the screen for months (because I can!) - I am building the purpose, that meaningful, measurable reason for me to take an action on the ground. Building it out of nothing tangible, out of ideas, experience, beliefs, commitment.
Appreciate you guysss!! Love the channel!!
I just found out about you guys through psychology junkie and am loving everything!
Thanks for the insights - from an INTP.
Spot on! From an INTJ
INTP married to INTJ. We don't get out a lot. ; \
Severian ... genuine question.
Are the two of you content with that status? Or do you think it would make your lives richer to have more contact with the outer world?
(Intp here, just now getting into "relationships" and pondering compatibility markers i.e. 2 introverts vs 1 introvert plus 1 extrovert.
Both for the couple's happiness. And the home environment of a couple's eventual children )
Thanks
Severian ... no worries, I know that feeling well.
I'm male, early 30s, and only recently begun "dating". For significantly more info on all that (far more than anyone would care about), feel free to look at my uploads.
Cheers
Interesting, will do! I know there's all this gender equality bs going on these days, but I think that inherently a male INTP (for example) could get along better with a nurturing F female, than could I, as a female with an F male. You have twice as many options! Anyway, will watch, & continue on with my ever more ponderous tome of an answer. (Lol, JK. Sort of.. ;))
Also lol, when I sat down to "jot out" an answer, I realized there are so/too many variables! There's my actual experience variables, vs. theoretical variables, vs. chemistry between two people variables, etc... Yikes!
So, short(ish) answer: we are content, but we do need E friends to give us the push to get out. So that's kind of a pain, lol. But it IS a workaround for two strong I types. That being said, some I's are fine going out in the world, so it would vary person to person. Isfjs & Infps are people-people, for example, so they would take more care to maintain friends, & get out & about.
Only you can answer the question of whether an E person would wear you out. I'm a strong 5 on the Enneagram, & wouldn't be able to keep an E type happy in the long run. They'd wear me down over all.
As for children, you'd be surprised how you'll rise to the occasion to do what needs to be done. I went into ISFJ mode when my ENFP was young. I was room mom, joined mommy&me type groups for HER sake (which had a nice side effect of me meeting other moms/gathering knowledge re: kids, etc.) So, marry who you fall in love with, are compatible with, have similar lifestyle desires (politics & religion are often helpful of course). My advice as a married for 20+ yrs.to INTJ w/ a grown ENFP is, don't over-think the I/E dichotomy, imho, the S/N is extremely more important (if you want a mind-mate, & not just a help-mate.) That being said, I've noticed quite a few INTP males like ESFJ wives to take care of them, & manage the household. But they'll never understand you. Anyway, I'll continue to follow your dating adventures to see what becomes of your fate. Good luck! ;D
Recently, I have consistently come up as INTJ on 4 tests from 4 different sites but I have come up as INTP in the past. I don't know if I'm INTJ or INTP with an INTJ mindset. My ADHD really complicates these things too.
underwater adhd really makes me confused about this. Hell I wonder if my adhd causes me being an intj idk
Me to
It may be worth having a look at their methods and sources - if they even provide that.
That way, you'd be able to tell if those 4 sites you mentioned have similar methods to each other, and different methods to the ones you've done before. For instance, two hypothetical tests may have a question that reads similarly, but has a very different weighting for deciding if you're INTJ or INTP.
In a nutshell do you like accuracy or efficiency more:
•accuracy: INTP (Ti)
•efficiency: INTJ (Te)
-> ask yourself if you had to make a cake, would you be happy if it tasted good even tho you did not follow the recipe (INTJ) . Or would it bother you a bit that you didn’t follow the instructions and didn’t get to experiment to find the right balance of ingredients (INTP).
Enegram and temperaments come into play a lot of us are 5s or 6s, easy to confuse.
~an INTJ
INTP here, I need to study for a test that's next week and here I am, on UA-cam... I need help.
Great video. I've watched it several times. I'm an ESTP and have no problem "getting into action." However, getting into action effectively often involves sitting down and learning something first. Very difficult for an ESTP. When I do spend time in learning mode (not by doing but by reading and research) then I feel that I've accomplished nothing. It seems that learning does not count as a valid activity in my mind.
Anyhow, I wanted to comment that I love your videos and articles. You have great insights into the personality types. :-)
I can relate to both. Again.
Haha. Love that you guys are chillin so much. Haha
I disagree with a point; proving things is base to the nature of Ti (taking in information and "creating" new information from it) and proving things (especially in Mathematics and Physics) doesn't necessarily need you to go outside, so proving something (an accomplishment, depending on how difficult it was) doesn't need you to go outside and it isn't a "snack" if it was difficult.
Thank you, love you both! Can you make these videos into podcasts please? 😊
Another great video; so "me" that I found myself finishing your sentences. Thank you.
Everything I accomplish is in my head :/
Hey, I’m an INTP, and I just want to make sure I’m understanding accurately. How would you qualify “outside world” and “real world feedback” to online work, such as content creation or ad management? Would it be really just trying things and topics out to see what works, or trying out ads and gathering the data to see what is being well received?
Wow yall should really consider writing a book!
I’m stuck between INTP and INFJ.
I took the personality test a few times and I keep getting INTP and INFJ
Easiest way to tell is probably based on the position of Fe in the stack. As INTP, with inferior Fe, you’re more likely to have had experiences of conflict in the social world. You may have moments where your Ti wants to prove some social norm/rule to be stupid. It may have caused you some trouble with others, and you probably feel bad for doing it only afterwards when your Fe finally kicks in. On the other hand, INFJ’s are close to their Fe (auxiliary) and place high value on social harmony. They’re unlikely to to go on logically denouncing social rules. They may come off as less harsh than the INTP in terms of that logicality (tertiary Ti vs dominant Ti). They usually give off a very peaceful/zen empathetic vibe.
However, if an INFJ gets stuck in an Ni-Ti loop, their intuition+thinking combo can seem very very similar to an INTP’s Ti-Ne combo. Especially since there is Ti in common. In a loop the INFJ may analyze a topic and try to fully understand it at its core. But loops usually only happen during unhealthy mental periods, which are often temporary.
That’s what I have to say about the demain differences, hopefully that helps. (INTP myself)
Peace...
Have you seriously considered I *S* TP?
Haley 123 those types are so different it's not even funny, but mbti tests are horribly horribly shallow (and often wrong). Rather then relying on the test and guessing, I personally recommend UA-camr CS Joseph. He has tons of videos discussing the cognitive functions, breaking down types, and more. If you're still interested in the topic, there's lots to learn over there.
Mr InvestiGator Ok👍
INTP's deal in objectivity, not subjectivity. They are after objective reality, unlike INTJ's, who are only ever after their end goal. An INTP would sacrifice their beliefs for a steadier foundation. INTJ's would not.
INTJ. You are right. I pass into action with parcimony when I'm really needed and when I can measure efficiency of my work. (I do not accept a lot of contrats, once there where even a woman who bugs me for months so I accept to do a contrat for her when I refused about 5 times before and gave her a written list of the names of my competitors !) More precisely :
There is two ways I pass into action : (1) when I'm in a situation where I learn (then I do what others expect me to do until I get what I wanted to know/understand and then I pass to the second reason, usually dealed before the step 1) and (2) when I do things on the way I wish, with the timeline I wish and when I'm authorized to take the risks that I consider being appropriate (that make others unconfortables, I know).
What prevent me to get into action is when someone else could do the job, so my skills are not specially usefull. If I have to follows protocols, laws or limitations then anyone else can do that implicating I'm more useful elsewhere. When I have to be diplomatic and do compromises (If I have to compromise a result to confort hierarchy, I prefer to let them to do their own way alone and sometimes they are even happier with their fail because they feel harmony so why would I brake that ? Usually compromises are from people who don't assume the results (so they don't take in charge the situation... it's why they hired me !), but they want to save their own interests in the process... so no !).
The absence of volonty to do compromises doesn't means that I asked no ones to develop the way I will apply nor that I consulted no scientific journals... I consulted a lot (and understand implications) but then, I know what I want to try, how and why, how to measure the results, what I will try if a specific result occurs or what if it is this other result... I totally assume fail if it's happen (and know the percentage of possibilities that it will happen) and I will manage it until I get to the fixed objective.
The bad side of that is that I pass into action only if I get the latitude that I consider I need (or I work for myself, what happen half of the time)... the good side is that organizatons where I pass into action knew who they where hiring and beneficiate of my solving abilities with problems they tried to solved couple of times before hiring me. I'm efficient but cannot be half-efficient... I'm Black or White... no grey zones : or I'm needed or someone else want to do it... so let him try... then call my if he fail and don't manage his own results :P
+Veronique Cloutier Brilliant comment! :)
Didn’t recognize both of you , very funny
Interesting video, but I cannot stand anyone who does not remove their sunglasses when talking to you. Show me your eyes,
INTPs have to risk failure to move forward to see what works and what doesn't, which is hard to do. INTP Abraham Lincoln is known for his multiple failures getting elected to office before becoming president.
I'm an INTJ and I'm so bored I can't watch this...sorry!
Is this mgtow?