Legit, I have seen real Tolkein "super fans" making critical videos of this show that (put together) would last several times as long as the first season itself. Films are rarely ever so bad and far from the source material.
Would you like to make a comparisson between "House of the Dragon" and "The Rings of Power"? I think it would be very interesting to see the ways they approached their story and especialy the depiction of a medival fantas world.
@@oliverebbing6637 i actually didnt like house of the dragons either,there is something off for me with this 4k ,super models,makeup ,perfect hair and clothes look brand new,i need to see the dirtyness of medieval life,i cant get into tv shows now a days because of the perfect styel everything is
No no no, calling it fan fiction is insulting to the fans. Because while they may not always be able to produce something of extreme quality, at least there will be a passion and love behind what they write that these people writing the show have never know and will never know. Evil cannot create, only corrupt. And we are seeing that in its fullness here with LotR.
That and currently he was only the Spider-Man to adapt the stories where Peter was an adult. One of my big issues with the other remakes (less so with Tom Holland where they at least built him a supporting cast for his high school) was they kept putting back in High School as a teenager which wasn't that long of the period in the comics and the most popular storylines occurred when he is in college or an adult. I never understood why he bring him back to the high school days.
RoP was mysteriously bad. It's hard to believe it wasn't intentional. The dialog, costumes, acting, plot, action, marketing, every aspect was a disaster. I cannot wrap my mind around it.
When we look at amazon's output with videogames, it makes me think that it must be the producers and management who are in their positions for reasons that are not based on merit or ability. Amazon projects have similar issues throughout genres and now seemingly even types of media.
Someone wrote all of that, so it was intentional. They also saw it and decided to keep going and in the end decided to release. They also decided to atack fans.
Yeah, Amazon doesnt understand that throwing money at a problem won't automatically solve it. They could throw 10 bln. at the show and it still wouldnt help if the writing remains that bad. One can only polish a turd so much after all..
I think that was a potential fear among Tolkien fans during the show's run-up: That people, generally, would internalize Rings of Power as being indicative of Tolkien's work, or even as a prevailing expression of Tolkien's work. Fortunately, the show turned out so crap that such fears may have been a bit overblown.
Yeah, i was scared it would be SUPER "MEH" then people would see it, go "people who like LOTR have shit taste" and never touch it again. Thankfully it was utter garbage.
Actually, I think Tolkien fans (I play LOTR MMORPG) were really looking forward to seeing a Second Age adaptation especially when Amazon was announcing how much 💰 thy were going to put into the project. The rumor of it started so long before it came out and then we got this steaming pile of 🐂💩
And yet I watch positive 'reaction' videos saying things like 'It's so cool to get this back story about Galadriel' 'Oh, this explains why Gandalf likes hobbits' etc etc. A whole generation of people who think Sauron was just misunderstood, and even if Tolkien didn't say anything like that, think that this Sauron is a 'richer' and 'more complex' version than Tolkien's, and so a superior creation. The irony is that Tolkien wrote the things he wrote as a reaction against the post-WW1 modernism-and that this production is an example of that sort of modernism. Of _course_ Tolkien's work is 'old fashioned': that was a deliberate choice on his part. If you don't like it, adapt something else.
I really think it is. I’m not part of the fandom (yet) and even I know that Rings of Power shouldn’t be considered a representation of LOTR. I think anyone who knows how a fandom works is willing to watch the “right” versions, e.g. Fullmetal Alchemist.
You raise so many good points here, but what hit me the hardest was when you talked about "the passing of the torch". You are *absolutely right* about that point - this was the *perfect* opportunity, *from a marketing perspective* , to allow this IP to be introduced to a younger generation. This is me speaking as a person who has been working in Marketing for over a decade. This was an *unforgivingly massive* blunder and missed opportunity to capture both an existing audience and simultaneously bring in an entirely new generation who could have been hooked FOR LIFE. Massive...massive missed opportunity.
Only flipside is that it brought a lot of people back to the books, seen so many say in comment sections that they (re)read the books, especially the Silmarilion (mostly the groups from his pig in lipsticks analogy)
I feel this way about much of Hollywood these days. They have targeted, rather than utilized reactors for the most part (possibly for the best as what I'm seeing them attempt is pretty dark), and then went out of their way on many properties that could have made them 10 if not 20 times as much money if they had just done it from a place of love, rather than dollar signs that miss the mark and a snubbing of the nose. Did they make a lot of money? Yes. Could they have made significantly more? Also yes. So much so I'm starting to wonder if they're laundering money for the ones that actually flop and staying afloat from the combination of that and the ones that mysteriously bank, though not as much as they should have. Oh that's just two examples of how poor their marketing has gotten.
What really upset me as a Tolkien fan is all the hype I heard a head of time - this was going to be great...I was looking forward, excited for, the prospect of more LEGO LotR sets. Not a proud moment, when I was in Jr high school I took the Silmarillion ( a nice hard bound edition) from the Library because I wanted it so bad. I did return it years later, but can not wonder to think I may have caused someone to not be exposed to Tolkien's world. Trash Rings of Power and start over while it can...Amazon please learn from HBO Game of Thrones season 8. Do not let the writers/produces ruin what can be a great thing. If they do not like the source material then create something new! Netfilx do not let your writers ruin the Witcher.
Basically what Disney seems to be trying to do with the live action remake. All perfectly timed so that the people who grew up with film X can take their kids to live action film X.
@@birdrun4246 And it would be a great success if they would keep in mind that they have to at least maintain the significance of the original story that made it successful for the older generation to remain connected.
Michael Keaton is my batman and Heath Ledger is joker. The major complaint I keep hearing about this and other fantasy shows is that they are run by people who actively disregard or dislike the source material and fan base, and refuse to put out a decent product because they believe that somebody will watch it if they make a weak attempt to cater to them. How many failures does it take for investors/production companies to take this a bit more serious?
Michael Keaton is best Batman indeed. I like Heath Ledger performance, but I think best Joker is Mark Hamill (or Jack Nicholson if voice actors are not allowed). For me Heath Ledger version is awesome villain, but not exactly what I like in Joker specifically.
@@Dorrovian If we're including animated series Kevin Conroy is my Batman. I grew up watching Batman, Justice League, Batman Beyond and i still hear his voice when i think of the character. I normally consider animated and live action as different because the skills to bring the characters to life are very different.
I don't think anyone even considers Affleck's Batman haha. For me Christian Bale was my favourite Batman. I found the previous Batmans a little too campy, although I will say Jack Nicholson's Joker was excelent.
My aunt likes this show, barely knows anything about Tolkien. Even so she was, she shared ALL of the criticisms real fans had and thought the Halbrand twist was predictable, and she felt insulted that the show runners thought they were fooling her.
@@TheSwauzz Oh I know that, but thank you for your clarification. What I am trying to state is that if she likes the quality of this show as it is at this very moment, she'll definitely love the books and be introduced to The Legendarium at large.
That is more proof that the problems with the series are not limited to the adaptation part, but to the way the story is written, acted and directed. Kudos to your aunt.
I love how Amazon has said next to nothing about Rings of Power in their last quarterly earnings report to their investors. If this show did well they would trumpet that from the highest rooftops, The silence is deafening.
I’ve seen so many deep dives into this billion dollar failure recently, but seeing a video come from you once again makes me so happy. You seem to analyse this stuff so well, and articulate it in the best way.
You’re spot on with Legend of the Seeker. I re-watched the pilot of that show while ROP was airing and had such a good time. Yes, the cgi was a little janky and some dialogue was cheesy, but the costuming, environments, and plot was way better than that garbage from Amazon. Edit to add: and LotS came out 12 years ago!! Amazon, get your crap together!
I am so happy I spent my time watching your takes on this show rather than finish watching the show itself Edited to add: I watched the first two episodes and could watch no longer.
I watched the first episode and something just felt super off when compared to GoT:HotD. After another episode of HotD I was really intrigued with what was going to happen, figuring out characters and their arcs (My fav has been Daemon). But I got none of that in the episode of RoP. If anything I got a sense of things being rushed (from place to place) and no character build up at all.
I think I've spent an unhealthy amount of time watching videos about the show without so much as visiting the Prime Video Page. I feel like I've seen the show now.
I'm personally enjoying watching literally dozens (maybe even hundreds) of hours of Tolkein experts tearing this show apart in ways that would make Shadow of War and the Third Age RPG look faithful to the lore.
In fanfiction's defense, facfiction writers usually do what they do out of love. There is no other way to operate because writing a "hatefic" will never get you any kudos or real attention from the community. RoP is a hatefic - it might get you some backlash or some disgust/curious views, but it will never get you a top slot in recommended. Even the fics I read back in high school (specifically, Lord of the Rings FanFics) that had fan writers doing "toss my friends into Middle Earth" loved the lore 100% more than the writers of RoP. Sometimes, being that mostly women write fanfics, one of the less knowledgeable girls would be trying to pair up with Boromir which leaves the more knowledgeable ones in limbo if they're keeping true to the "can't deviate from the fated path" storyline for themselves - so, when do they tell her he's going to die? Should they? What happens when it does? To me fanfiction is in the same category as parody - it comes from a place of love and respect, where you want to have fun with something you hold dear. Modern satire and these new "subversive" writers come from a place of mockery at best, blind entitlement at worst. I've read comfy fan _novels_ about Undertale and all it's AUs, non-canon relationships for 20+ year old animes that are 25 - 40K words apiece, OCs exploring worlds in MMOs watching as canon heroes take down large threats while they deal with their own personal demons (literally and figuratively). Fanfiction is wonderful and the writers of a lot of modern shows wish they could have a crumb of talent hobbyists do, in my opinion.
I was wary when I first heard of the show, but thought if they really put ONE BILLION dollars into it, it couldn't be THAT bad. I've never been so wrong in my life. I really want to know how they've spend the money, because it obviously didn't went into writing, costumes or even basic research.
Probably went towards overpaid interns fetching the most expensive starbucks in human history, alongside numerous staffers who were slacking off at their jobs. Someone on that crew had to know this was shit, and they all just shut up and put up. It's a freaking tragedy in that regard.
3:34 "Rings of Power is the newest transition from a prior normative acceptance of what the property is, or was, and that transition has been painful." That's a funny way of staying 'was murdered to be made into a skinsuit'.
To be fair to the seeker show, it’s not much like the books. By cutting out the esoterica and focusing on the characters, it feels very “cheesy” and saccharine. It’s too different to be the same thing. If you didn’t know the books, it would still be weird. The plot is janky because there’s a series of characters that were cut out. Events and plot contrivances that give Richard power that has been granted by others, sic. Is skipped. But that also makes everyone look like Mary sue character’s at times. And the focus is jarring because the book series is often not about the romance, it’s about a series of escalating contrived (and intentionally grim/gruesome events), that don’t make much sense in a wide context. Or the broken/unexplored magic system’s ie Dream magic, pain & life (sic), confessors, spirit and prophecy, and dominion / blood magic with the rahl’s. But, the “emo”, “grim”, “edgy” and romantic elements are also crowded by tropes and a backstory that doesn’t seem to go anywhere in the books. I don’t know if the books were planned, but the plot events are disconnected, and skipping them from the show also feels weird because of the lost time and lost context.
@@Toliman. Terry Goodkind isn't a fantasy writer. He's a grade school philosopher who thinks he's on an ivy leaguers level and likes the smell of his own farts. Seriously, go listen to interviews with him, he talks about fantasy just happened to be the best vehicle for his philosophical ideas... dude thinks he's Ayn Rand...its hilarious...and that used to be my favorite books series, so I'm not speaking from hate...dude just has no subtlety...and his prose is like a nithgraders
@@Toliman. I'll have to look into the books then. I did start reading the first book at one point but never finished the first 1/3 probably just because I was awfully busy and it was a borrow from the library.
You should read "The sword of Truth" series then, by Terry Goodkind. Once you do, you'll start hating the TV series deeply for literally bastardising the great fantasy.
The saving grace is that we have the Lord of the Ring. When i was a kid Star Wars was already old but i loved it when my mom showed it to me on VHS. So i hope that the younger generation will still see and love the Lord of the Rings, like Star Wars was for me.
true, thats the only good thing coming out of ROP, it could potentially (and has) made people interested enough to watch LOTR or read the books, and get a TRUE understanding of what lotr is and properly capture the magic of tolkein. everything else about ROP can burn in a dumpster fire of warg droppings.
Its interesting because if you look in youtube and see younger people reacting to older films like terminator 1 or 2 and other classic films they openly admit the olders are better.
I love how even though UEG is not trying to review/criticize Rings of Power......he absolutely tears it apart the first chance he gets. Goes straight for the throat and proceeds to metaphorically dismember this abomination. I love it!
Those of us on the Gen X side of 35+ also got to see the original Lord of the Rings Movies, the cartoon ones starting in 1978. So not only did I have the visualizations in my head from the books (my parents awesome, they not only read me Hardy Boys mysteries, they also read Hobbit then LOTR nightly at bedtime) then seeing them show up in the cartoons in ways i didn't expect, some better, some worse. Then Peter Jackson movies actually brought them to life . . . this show just hurts my LOTR feels.
Hey, Legend of the Seeker. My college roommate was into the books and he found a way to stream that show. It was pretty good. Kind of in the vein of the old Xena, Sinbad and Hercules series' from the 90's, but less campy. (though to be fair, there was a lot of camp. "Powerful Magic!" as a recurring line still makes me laugh) My roommate said it deviated from the books quite a bit. Mixed storylines, switched up characters and changed how the magic worked. It was also much more episodic, with some new adventure every episode, while still maintaining a loose overarching plot. I found it entertaining in a mid budget fantasy kind of way, so I was a little disappointed it didn't go on for longer.
I feel so old because I remember Legend of the Seeker! My family used to watch together it when it was on netflix because it was so bad it was good for us with an occasional episode of "Oh this is actually not bad" that kept us engaged pff
Lol, I read the books - Wizard's First Rule. I got to about 5th or 6th book and couldn't take it anymore. I figured out his cunning trick ... nothing happens for the first 3/4 of the book, and everything happens in the last 200 pages. You can happily save yourself days of reading! Magic.
Another way to look at this is: what best represents the franchise? I grew up on the Burton/Keaton Batman, but if you ask me who's Batman, I might be tempted to answer Christian Bale as well, as the Nolan films definitely raised the bar and somewhat redefined that character. I'll be thinking of Kevin Conroy too, but that's another story. But I won't EVER be thinking of Anne Hathaway as Catwoman; to me, that will forever be Michelle Pfeifer. On the other hand, if you mention Blade Runner, my mind will immediately go to Ridley Scott's film despite the fact that I ADORE what Denis Villeneuve did with 2049. Why? Because it came first and it too, in many ways, raised the bar. All this to say; the new dogshit entries in beloved properties (Star Wars, Star Trek, Ghostbusters, LOTR, etc) sure have the advantage of being more recent, and the damage they do cannot be ignored, but I'm hopeful the younger and next generations will have the opportunity to fall in love with the timeless classics people before them got to enjoy. At some point, quality MUST matter. It can't be only a matter of novelty. I know Amazon will burn all their money in publicity to boost Rings of Power in the popular opinion, but it will never erase the superior quality of Peter Jackson's trilogy AND the quality of the books themselves. Case in point, for all my life I postponed watching Godfather because in my mind it would be old and slow and I thought all the praise was just a meme. What a slap in the face when that old piece of art instantly and suddenly made it into a select list of what I consider masterpieces. Again, the quality and timelessness of something must matter. It has to. Otherwise, it's not worth creating anything anymore.
I am not sure we can blame the actors since the whole thing was handled so badly. It could be the writing, directing, or editing etc. I would hold off judging the actors until i see them in other content.
For a counterpoint, go an watch an old TV series (late 70's) called _Blakes Seven_ The acting is atrocious. But damn the story is good. Even if the entire 4th season is tacked on due to it being a big hit at the time, with a couple of quite 1-dimentional characters added in, the finale of the show is masterfully executed.
Oh hell yes I blame these actors as well. Judging from their interviews it becomes very clear that this wasn't a job for actors so much as it was for activists.
I love your Legend of the Seeker comparison. That is a good show with an ok book adaptation. ROP makes me sad inside for everything you have said. The true betrayal is that all the fans in our hearts feared this is what we would get when this was announced so long ago. There was just a sliver of hope, just enough to be bitter when our fears were justified about this trash coming out. With what they have done so far I think to course correct this dumpster fire of a season 1 and do a full reboot for the rest of the seasons. Maybe that is why shooting of season 2 was put on temp hold. I am not certain if they can take the ego hit and admit they were wrong and will probably just shit out more content like what we got already and force THEIR narrative. I really want to know where the budget went considering it was almost $1 million dollars a MINUTE per episode. Could this be an embezzlement scheme for some high ups at Amazon. No way what they shot could cost nearly that much.
Did you mean Legend of the Seeker is an OK adaptation of a good book? The books were first. That being said I'd rather watch all the Hitman movie adaptations than this series that was adapted by a wood chipper and is now infested with termites.
So Galadriel runs into Sauron makes him do things he does not want to, then he turns into the dark lord........ This seems like soap opera events to me, almost like he is gonna be a love interest after some tragic scene
If you go back to that ridiculous “superfan” panel discussion, at one point, the host literally “speculates” that Sauron will have some sort of romantic entanglement. It was 100% intentional and they knew exactly what they were doing from the beginning.
Legend of the Seeker reference - going deep! I'm not someone who has read LotR much, but I loved the films. I watched RoP and a majority of the time I felt like many of the characters were just poorly written and the only scenes I tended to like involved the dwarves. Durin and Disa felt fun, their scenes and the Durin/Elrond friendship were the only parts of this show I felt had some level of enjoyment to them. Galadriel is abysmally written. Just compare her narration and few scenes in LotR - how she is portrayed there has so much more "ok, this lady is important, wise and powerful" than anything in the show - which saddens me. I'll take the Adventures of Durin and Disa or Durin and Elrond any day over the rest of the show.
From all dramatube videos focusing on Rings of Power, this video is the best explaining what is going on. The idea of generational preferences makes sense, and its effect on the initial popularity of the show. These episodes may be preference for next generations, but the pay back period would in that case be more than Amazon planned.
But was a complete bastardisation of the source material... even though Terry Goodkind writes like a ninthgrader who just found out what libertarianism is, I think they could have done a much better job with that story for that show.
@@donkeysunited if you liked the show, I encourage you to get the books. They get a little preachy but the characters are deep and interesting and the world is awesome
We cannot allow ourselves to forget the horrors of Amazon's "Rings of Power." We must learn from our failures, to ensure another such tragedy never occurs.
@@Thanatos2k I never got into the Witcher, so I'm pretty out of the loop as far as the show goes, aside from hearing about Cavill quitting. Looking into it now, yeah, it sounds like they have just as little respect, if not outright disdain, for the source material as the RoP showrunners. I don't know why people like that keep getting these jobs. How is the show even supposed to continue without its main star?
Something everyone should remember about major movies and TV shows. There is so much money and time put into it, NOTHING is an accident on screen. Every shot, every line, ever angle, is deliberate. When they fuck up and say it was an accident, that's not true. They know they fucked up, but they don't have the integrity to admit it.
It feels like a demoralization tactic honestly. Taking a legacy that’s great and legendary, and filling it with garbage and corrupting it beyond redemption.
Ive managed to fix any plot holes for myself concerning Saurbrand and Karen by imagining that Saurbrand is actually trapped in Groundhog Day. This is something like the billionth time he has attempted his ‘plan’ before it finally worked.
In a way, you are describing one of the possible avenues they could take to "fix" the mess . Season 2 could be "nah, it did not really happen that way" and then rewind .
Dude, _please_ keep “breaking script” and putting this show in its place! Heck, give us an hour-long rant piece if you want! It’s amazingly cathartic to hear what an actual fan has to interject into that trash fire of a reboot, not to mention it makes for a great podcast while I’m at work :3 If you need justification, it certainly can’t hurt the writers to get some real input. We all want better products from the industries with the resources to make it happen, so pick their scripts apart all day, please :3
I think that the most famous example of a pyroclastic flow and its effects is easily Pompei. From my experience, I cannot think of a single person in my life who hasn't heard of it. It's just that pervasive. And then, in RoP, a village is washed over by just such a pyroclastic flow, and not only did the vast majority of the villagers survive it, the fucking wooden houses were still standing. Anyone who has ever considered themselves a writer of any sort should be able to take a single glance at RoP and see massive block letters reading "ZERO EFFORT" emblazoned across the screen. When a shitty amateur writer like myself can write a more realistic disaster scenario than those hired by a multi-billion-dollar company to write a series based on one of the most beloved fictional universes in literature, you know we live in an absolute clown world.
You don't have to know anything about vulcanism, Pompeii, nor words like 'pyroclastic', to recognize the problem with the story here. The show portrayed a Big Ball Of Fire And Ash And Smoke roaring towards the village. The show portrayed this fireball as instantly incinerating buildings, blowing some structures away. And the show presented the audience with a big dramatic 'cliffhanger' moment as this fireball engulfed the village and the main character herself. A grammar school child who knows almost nothing of volcanoes must recognize that there is Imminent Peril for everyone concerned, especially the main character. And in the next episode, everyone is fine, except for a horse who caught fire. Literally not an eyebrow singed, while structures nearby were burning (the structures themselves were the main peril, it seems). And not just Galadriel, but all the villagers. Even in the 1940s movie serials, they did more work than this to resolve cliffhangers. It was absurd, and the moment when I threw up my hands and acknowledged that these people do not care in the slightest for the most basic principles of storytelling.
Wow, Legend Of The Seeker, I almost completely forgot about that show. It was fairly entertaining and I loved watching it with my in-laws when it aired. My mother-in-law was especially into it, that was the "don't bother me unless you're going to sit down and watch too" part of the day haha.
Even ignoring the (supposed) Tolkien aspect of the show, there's multiple instances, not one but MULTIPLE instances, of one character asking a question and the next character won't answer the question before moving onto a different topic as though they were never asked a question in the first place. This happened at least two times in just the final episode. They obviously never should have been trusted with Tolkien's work if they can't even get a proper dialogue exchange out...
I have, in several comments now, referred to the way that the writing reminds me of Mark Twain's magnificent dismembering of James Fenimore Cooper's "The Deerslayer" for its many writing sins. He enumerates several rules of writing and shows how Cooper fails to obey them. In one case: 5. They [the rules] require that when the personages of a tale deal in conversation, the talk shall sound like human talk, and be talk such as human beings would be likely to talk in the given circumstances, and have a discoverable meaning, also a discoverable purpose, and a show of relevancy, and remain in the neighborhood of the subject in hand, and be interesting to the reader, and help out the tale, and stop when the people cannot think of anything more to say. But this requirement has been ignored from the beginning of the Deerslayer tale to the end of it.
Those games are respectable because they had the good sense to just say this is not canon it is just a game in the setting meant for fun and even their deviation from source material feels more respectful.
Having read the Silmarillion and The Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings, I feel like if I brushed up on my Tolkien lore a bit, I could single handedly write a better show than Amazon pooped out. I'm okay at writing, not phenomenal, but the thing about adapting a pre-existing work is you don't have to come up with original ideas for a whole story, just use the actually good preexisting story that an amazing man spent a lifetime creating. This is what happens when you pick the people who hate everything Tolkien actually stood for to adapt his work. They just try to destroy it, and try to make something "better" in its stead.
@William Hall yeah, not buying the rights to adapt the Silmarillion was probably one of the biggest mistakes they made, if only because they seemed to think it gave them an excuse to do whatever they wanted
I can't express in words how baffling it is a company can give $1b to a couple of showrunners who's only credits are, quite literally, 3 writers credits COMBINED. McKay? Yeah he LITERALLY HAS ZERO CREDITS. Let that sink in. Amazon handed ONE BILLION DOLLARS to 2 people who have written for 3 properties. Again, that's combined. And JD wasn't head or lead or executive writer on his credits. Just, "writer". How did anybody have any expectation other than what exactly happened?
Love the content! Have been following The Rings Of Trash since the inception, and am not surprised honestly. Just really, really sad. Disappointed I cant even really watch it as a ‘so bad its good’, or to make fun of it. Just so bad it’s revolting.
You missed the third group: People who knew it was a pig to begin with, those who didn't bother watching because of, well, the devastation inflicted on EVERY OTHER FRANCHISE.
Hiring people who care more about 'modern audiences' with zero experience and talent, no one is surprised just how bad this series was in every aspect and makes it worse is the insane budget they were given.
You said you could talk about the problems of the show for hours. If you do, I'll listen! I can't take another disappointment in my life so I haven't watched any rop
imagine being so soft, spoiled and well off that your biggest problem is something happening in the entertainment industry that you arent interested in. holy crap, eurocentric culture has literally produced an army of human shaped cancer cells
When I was young, before the movies, my Dad sat me on the sofa and read The Hobbit to me. When I was a bit older, we read LOTR together. Later we saw the movies together in theater. I'm no Tolkien expert nor do I have a strong desire for narrative purity in the show, but I'll always have a personal relationship to the books that goes beyond any damage that can be done to the property. Having said that, I fell asleep during episode 5 and haven't watched ROP since.
All the reviews I've read sum up to 3 things: 1)Positive: Admits to never having read the books, & only saw the movies once. 2)Negative: Disrespectful to the source material, everyone is out-of-character. 3)Neutral: Lackluster writing, mediocre at best, but the sets & costumes are so shiny!
Same thing that has happened to Star Wars. Because Disney messed up the canon so much I've absolutely no interest in even the good stuff they release because of that. Even my buzz for the new Jedi Fallen Order is gone. Judging by the low viewership of Andor which is meant to be a good show, I'm one of many who feel this complete apathy. I feel for Tolkein fans because as a Star Wars fan it's been a long 10 years down the road to this point and I'm sorry this is happening to them too.
I only read The Hobbit so not so steeped in the lore but I really loved all the movies (even the making of the movies videos with weta workshop and all that) and am absolutely loving this series. If you haven't seen the making of videos you should.
You forgot to mention, the next season is like 2 years out. Nobody is gonna remember this show by then, so it will lose even more of it's potential watch base just for that
I will never understand why they paid 300 million for the rights to the 3 Lord of the Rings books (and nothing else) and then made a series about the Silmarillion. Are they idiots? Why not buy the rights to the Silmarillion, then? I reckon that even would have been cheaper.
From movies, tbf, Michael Keaton is my Bruce Wayne. Tho I liked the Bale movies, nobody nailed the distinction between Wayne and the Bat better than Keaton. But I'm an Xer. Meaning I'm old. And this is really beside the point because your general point in the video is correct. This is the main reason for so many remakes and re-imaginings in this era. To wipe out memory of the past. Who controls the present controls the past, after all.
I love the lipstick pig analogy, that's so perfect. I'm of that demographic that loves the original movies very much so, who won't lay a finger anywhere near this crap. The marketing alone, the name calling to original fans, and the visuals alone are a hell no for me. It doesn't look anything like LotR as I know it, it ironically looks like a cheap knock off that somehow ended up being the most expensive show in history!? 🤔 Bro, Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul is LEAGUES better than this show and they are nowhere near the budget. That's really sad actually
Published title: "Now it's over, let's come out and say it: The Rings of Power was a stinker" Actual title: "Now that we are no longer being paid for positive reviews, let's publish some real opinions"
Man I understand your anger, as a 15 year old who just recently has read the books and watched the movies and loved them thinks that this show is garbage. I couldn’t watch past episode four. You hope that someone smart takes the wheel and brings the show back but I hope that they cancel season two through five and Amazon gets rid of the lord of the rings rights as unlikely as that is to happen. Also I do hate that your right and this show is what the new generation has to watch and may stop anything good that is lord of the rings from coming out in a while because the show sucked.
From someone who read the whole Sword of Truth serie and watched the LotS show, you’ve made my day, ‘cause this is insanely accurate! RoP lost me at the first episode and I did not watch the rest of the season feels great knowing that I haven’t lost my time!
I just have to say we've been watching Merlin for a while now with my spouse. It clearly does not have the budget it deserves, but oh dear is the writing the best I've seen in a while in any fantasy series. It really is odd how so much money was spent on RoP, and yet they failed to find competent writers who could coordinate well together, with a focus of crafting an amazing Lord of the Rings-story.
The funny thing for me is that when you were saying your "Spider-man" is Maguire and your "Batman and Joker" are Bale and Ledger, my thought was that mine are Christopher Daniel Barnes, Kevin Conroy and Mark Hamill. Further proof of your point I think.
You need to remember, when we talk about the Tolkien Estate we are talking about 2 iterations of it. One under Christopher and the other under whoever took over from him. Yes, Christopher wasn’t a fan of Jackson’s efforts, but the ‘New’ estate loves Rings of Power, and the media uses those two facts simultaneously, without clarifying the change. So they proceed to (in the Estates name) tear down Jackson and Praise Rings of Power in the same breath all claiming it was the Estate.
16:40 YES, my thoughts exactly! (Season 2 sucked though...😏) 😎 You can, however, go even further back with episodes from Hercules and Xena shows that were far superior then, with but a tiny fraction of the money.....
When it comes to Batman, I have to separate them into the comedy (Michael Keaton/George Clooney/Val Kilmer) and the dark (Bale). Each have their own high points but that's how I associate Batmans.
Haha, I'm 38 and it's Keaton for me. Mainly because I was obsessed with it as a kid (grandma sewed me a costume and everything). Watched it again for the first time as an adult recently. It actually held up.
@@matthewj6154 Not quite that old but that combination of casts will always be good to me for a quick laugh, each batman brought their own style to the suit and thats what made them good in their own ways.
I wrote a book when I was 19 ... read it, tore it to pieces burned the ashes, then flushed those ashes down the toilet... that work of literary trash was closer to Tolkien than this show lol.
Oh that old chestnut lol. You guys are so predictable. Cant you come up an original strawman argument? Is Justsomeguy racist? Young Rippa? Your justifications are devoid of any logic and completely rely on baseless ad hominem attacks. But hey, keep at it. At least you guys are consistent.
Legend of the Seeker was a 2 Season Classic... Yes, I'll die on that hill alongside you. 😎🥃 Granted, I never read any of the Seeker books but the show still retained a largely cohesive plot that kept me invested from start to finish. Far better than RoP could barely manage in 1 episode. Rangz of Powah needs no discussion or reflection. Simply a TV about polishing a turd. The less said about it, the better.. 💁😅
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Upper can you send me a safe link where i can still but LotR battle for middle earth 1 & 2 for pc? I want to play with them so bad.
Legit, I have seen real Tolkein "super fans" making critical videos of this show that (put together) would last several times as long as the first season itself. Films are rarely ever so bad and far from the source material.
There are no fans any longer except for fans of ROP bashing videos like yours....which is more truth telling than bashing.
Would you like to make a comparisson between "House of the Dragon" and "The Rings of Power"? I think it would be very interesting to see the ways they approached their story and especialy the depiction of a medival fantas world.
@@oliverebbing6637 i actually didnt like house of the dragons either,there is something off for me with this 4k ,super models,makeup ,perfect hair and clothes look brand new,i need to see the dirtyness of medieval life,i cant get into tv shows now a days because of the perfect styel everything is
No no no, calling it fan fiction is insulting to the fans. Because while they may not always be able to produce something of extreme quality, at least there will be a passion and love behind what they write that these people writing the show have never know and will never know. Evil cannot create, only corrupt. And we are seeing that in its fullness here with LotR.
I bet most fanfiction will try at least respect the freaking timeline.
Fanfic requires a fan to write it
yeah bezos and his goons are corrupting the lore Melkor style, it even seems as an intentional mockery, who knows, maybe they went meta as fuck
Indeed.
True fans love Tolkien and the books. They would never, EVER, write such horrible fiction.
Calling it fan fiction is just about the most insulting thing to this sl disaster of a series, and i do it often
I loved Toby Mcguire as spiderman. They are a bit cheesy, but that's the charm to them. Makes it feel more like a comic.
That and currently he was only the Spider-Man to adapt the stories where Peter was an adult. One of my big issues with the other remakes (less so with Tom Holland where they at least built him a supporting cast for his high school) was they kept putting back in High School as a teenager which wasn't that long of the period in the comics and the most popular storylines occurred when he is in college or an adult. I never understood why he bring him back to the high school days.
RoP was mysteriously bad. It's hard to believe it wasn't intentional. The dialog, costumes, acting, plot, action, marketing, every aspect was a disaster. I cannot wrap my mind around it.
I agree, "mysteriously bad." As if failure itself was the goal. But to what end I can't yet fathom.
When we look at amazon's output with videogames, it makes me think that it must be the producers and management who are in their positions for reasons that are not based on merit or ability. Amazon projects have similar issues throughout genres and now seemingly even types of media.
Someone wrote all of that, so it was intentional.
They also saw it and decided to keep going and in the end decided to release.
They also decided to atack fans.
The answer you're looking for can be found in two words: money laundering.
I don't get how you give 1 billion dollar production to writers that didn't do ANYTHING significant in their career. Like how. Why. Who does that
It feels like the definition of "if it's not good enough, hit it with more money untill it become good".
Amazon did the same with their mmo and failed there too.
Yeah, Amazon doesnt understand that throwing money at a problem won't automatically solve it. They could throw 10 bln. at the show and it still wouldnt help if the writing remains that bad. One can only polish a turd so much after all..
Just like with public education it never works
You mean the exact opposite of the definition ? Cause no amount of money can save this show, you cannot buy miracles
@@fulgurobaboon1321 I think that's the point he's trying to make
I think that was a potential fear among Tolkien fans during the show's run-up: That people, generally, would internalize Rings of Power as being indicative of Tolkien's work, or even as a prevailing expression of Tolkien's work.
Fortunately, the show turned out so crap that such fears may have been a bit overblown.
Yeah, i was scared it would be SUPER "MEH" then people would see it, go "people who like LOTR have shit taste" and never touch it again.
Thankfully it was utter garbage.
Actually, I think Tolkien fans (I play LOTR MMORPG) were really looking forward to seeing a Second Age adaptation especially when Amazon was announcing how much 💰 thy were going to put into the project. The rumor of it started so long before it came out and then we got this steaming pile of 🐂💩
And yet I watch positive 'reaction' videos saying things like 'It's so cool to get this back story about Galadriel' 'Oh, this explains why Gandalf likes hobbits' etc etc. A whole generation of people who think Sauron was just misunderstood, and even if Tolkien didn't say anything like that, think that this Sauron is a 'richer' and 'more complex' version than Tolkien's, and so a superior creation.
The irony is that Tolkien wrote the things he wrote as a reaction against the post-WW1 modernism-and that this production is an example of that sort of modernism. Of _course_ Tolkien's work is 'old fashioned': that was a deliberate choice on his part. If you don't like it, adapt something else.
Nah enjoy it we are getting season 2 so people can stick to their books it was slow some parts meh but loved it
I really think it is. I’m not part of the fandom (yet) and even I know that Rings of Power shouldn’t be considered a representation of LOTR. I think anyone who knows how a fandom works is willing to watch the “right” versions, e.g. Fullmetal Alchemist.
I was feeling bad for Sauron by the end. At this point I'm feeling he is justified to wipe them all out.
But at the same time if someone wants me to believe they are the same in the movies ant in the show I can't help but not take him seriously.
Luckily, in like 10years, none will remember that RoP even existed
one can only hope
No, someone else will get the license, and probably make it even worse.
@@bria243 not possible
@@samgoff5289 I hate to say it, but, it’s possible.
Bro I don’t even want to know what content 10 years from now is going to look like.
You raise so many good points here, but what hit me the hardest was when you talked about "the passing of the torch". You are *absolutely right* about that point - this was the *perfect* opportunity, *from a marketing perspective* , to allow this IP to be introduced to a younger generation. This is me speaking as a person who has been working in Marketing for over a decade. This was an *unforgivingly massive* blunder and missed opportunity to capture both an existing audience and simultaneously bring in an entirely new generation who could have been hooked FOR LIFE. Massive...massive missed opportunity.
Only flipside is that it brought a lot of people back to the books, seen so many say in comment sections that they (re)read the books, especially the Silmarilion
(mostly the groups from his pig in lipsticks analogy)
I feel this way about much of Hollywood these days. They have targeted, rather than utilized reactors for the most part (possibly for the best as what I'm seeing them attempt is pretty dark), and then went out of their way on many properties that could have made them 10 if not 20 times as much money if they had just done it from a place of love, rather than dollar signs that miss the mark and a snubbing of the nose. Did they make a lot of money? Yes. Could they have made significantly more? Also yes. So much so I'm starting to wonder if they're laundering money for the ones that actually flop and staying afloat from the combination of that and the ones that mysteriously bank, though not as much as they should have. Oh that's just two examples of how poor their marketing has gotten.
What really upset me as a Tolkien fan is all the hype I heard a head of time - this was going to be great...I was looking forward, excited for, the prospect of more LEGO LotR sets. Not a proud moment, when I was in Jr high school I took the Silmarillion ( a nice hard bound edition) from the Library because I wanted it so bad. I did return it years later, but can not wonder to think I may have caused someone to not be exposed to Tolkien's world. Trash Rings of Power and start over while it can...Amazon please learn from HBO Game of Thrones season 8. Do not let the writers/produces ruin what can be a great thing. If they do not like the source material then create something new! Netfilx do not let your writers ruin the Witcher.
Basically what Disney seems to be trying to do with the live action remake. All perfectly timed so that the people who grew up with film X can take their kids to live action film X.
@@birdrun4246 And it would be a great success if they would keep in mind that they have to at least maintain the significance of the original story that made it successful for the older generation to remain connected.
When Galadriel rejected the white guy because he didn't check his privilege I cried tears of empowerment
Bitter and salt, the woke tears.
Dude bro me too, I think I also came in my trousers because the justice boner was too much on my MLP panties
Celeborn will be a black guy
Jeez spoilers
@Seph #HorsesToo
Michael Keaton is my batman and Heath Ledger is joker.
The major complaint I keep hearing about this and other fantasy shows is that they are run by people who actively disregard or dislike the source material and fan base, and refuse to put out a decent product because they believe that somebody will watch it if they make a weak attempt to cater to them. How many failures does it take for investors/production companies to take this a bit more serious?
Michael Keaton is best Batman indeed. I like Heath Ledger performance, but I think best Joker is Mark Hamill (or Jack Nicholson if voice actors are not allowed). For me Heath Ledger version is awesome villain, but not exactly what I like in Joker specifically.
@@Dorrovian If we're including animated series Kevin Conroy is my Batman. I grew up watching Batman, Justice League, Batman Beyond and i still hear his voice when i think of the character. I normally consider animated and live action as different because the skills to bring the characters to life are very different.
@@InsomniaticVampire He is indeed awesome.
I don't think anyone even considers Affleck's Batman haha. For me Christian Bale was my favourite Batman. I found the previous Batmans a little too campy, although I will say Jack Nicholson's Joker was excelent.
I think it's more a case of
"Are you sure this will help us sell more burgers?"
If you get the reference
My aunt likes this show, barely knows anything about Tolkien. Even so she was, she shared ALL of the criticisms real fans had and thought the Halbrand twist was predictable, and she felt insulted that the show runners thought they were fooling her.
If she likes this show, tell her to read the books
@@micahp.4356 But the show isn't from the books.
@@TheSwauzz Oh I know that, but thank you for your clarification. What I am trying to state is that if she likes the quality of this show as it is at this very moment, she'll definitely love the books and be introduced to The Legendarium at large.
@@micahp.4356 but then she can't enjoy the rest of the show, she will see how much better Tolkien's writing is 😂
That is more proof that the problems with the series are not limited to the adaptation part, but to the way the story is written, acted and directed.
Kudos to your aunt.
I love how Amazon has said next to nothing about Rings of Power in their last quarterly earnings report to their investors. If this show did well they would trumpet that from the highest rooftops, The silence is deafening.
How can you even get away with not mentioning something you spent a billion bucks on to the investors?
I’ve seen so many deep dives into this billion dollar failure recently, but seeing a video come from you once again makes me so happy. You seem to analyse this stuff so well, and articulate it in the best way.
You’re spot on with Legend of the Seeker. I re-watched the pilot of that show while ROP was airing and had such a good time. Yes, the cgi was a little janky and some dialogue was cheesy, but the costuming, environments, and plot was way better than that garbage from Amazon.
Edit to add: and LotS came out 12 years ago!! Amazon, get your crap together!
I am so happy I spent my time watching your takes on this show rather than finish watching the show itself Edited to add: I watched the first two episodes and could watch no longer.
I watched the first episode and something just felt super off when compared to GoT:HotD. After another episode of HotD I was really intrigued with what was going to happen, figuring out characters and their arcs (My fav has been Daemon). But I got none of that in the episode of RoP. If anything I got a sense of things being rushed (from place to place) and no character build up at all.
I learned my lesson with The Force Awakens & TWoT.
I think I've spent an unhealthy amount of time watching videos about the show without so much as visiting the Prime Video Page. I feel like I've seen the show now.
I'm personally enjoying watching literally dozens (maybe even hundreds) of hours of Tolkein experts tearing this show apart in ways that would make Shadow of War and the Third Age RPG look faithful to the lore.
so rather then formulating your own opinion on the show you adopt someone else's LOL that literally goes against everything this channel stood for
In fanfiction's defense, facfiction writers usually do what they do out of love. There is no other way to operate because writing a "hatefic" will never get you any kudos or real attention from the community. RoP is a hatefic - it might get you some backlash or some disgust/curious views, but it will never get you a top slot in recommended. Even the fics I read back in high school (specifically, Lord of the Rings FanFics) that had fan writers doing "toss my friends into Middle Earth" loved the lore 100% more than the writers of RoP. Sometimes, being that mostly women write fanfics, one of the less knowledgeable girls would be trying to pair up with Boromir which leaves the more knowledgeable ones in limbo if they're keeping true to the "can't deviate from the fated path" storyline for themselves - so, when do they tell her he's going to die? Should they? What happens when it does?
To me fanfiction is in the same category as parody - it comes from a place of love and respect, where you want to have fun with something you hold dear. Modern satire and these new "subversive" writers come from a place of mockery at best, blind entitlement at worst.
I've read comfy fan _novels_ about Undertale and all it's AUs, non-canon relationships for 20+ year old animes that are 25 - 40K words apiece, OCs exploring worlds in MMOs watching as canon heroes take down large threats while they deal with their own personal demons (literally and figuratively).
Fanfiction is wonderful and the writers of a lot of modern shows wish they could have a crumb of talent hobbyists do, in my opinion.
That sounds about right. I mean... Why are there so many Fanfics to begin with? You Think People would at least think why they exist.
Def would call this a hate-fic or crack-fic. Also this wasn't made by fans therefore not a fanfic.
@@thelovelyredbones6364 More like a...Corpo Made Product. And not the good kind either. Even Corpo Made Products can be good and made out of Love.
This IS rock bottom for any production not deliberately sabotaging what came before. It's Disney Star Wars all over again.
It way worse then disney star wars bro. Come on
@@wKFaded You're probably right tbh
I was wary when I first heard of the show, but thought if they really put ONE BILLION dollars into it, it couldn't be THAT bad. I've never been so wrong in my life. I really want to know how they've spend the money, because it obviously didn't went into writing, costumes or even basic research.
The money went straight into someone's pocketses.
Probably went towards overpaid interns fetching the most expensive starbucks in human history, alongside numerous staffers who were slacking off at their jobs. Someone on that crew had to know this was shit, and they all just shut up and put up.
It's a freaking tragedy in that regard.
Maybe Bezos has a bet with someone that he wouldn't dare light $1 billion dollars on fire for no damn reason.
3:34 "Rings of Power is the newest transition from a prior normative acceptance of what the property is, or was, and that transition has been painful."
That's a funny way of staying 'was murdered to be made into a skinsuit'.
Top Comment.
I also really liked Legend of the Seeker. When it was on netflix in like 2010ish i watched the whole thing. It has its charm for sure.
To be fair to the seeker show, it’s not much like the books. By cutting out the esoterica and focusing on the characters, it feels very “cheesy” and saccharine. It’s too different to be the same thing.
If you didn’t know the books, it would still be weird. The plot is janky because there’s a series of characters that were cut out. Events and plot contrivances that give Richard power that has been granted by others, sic. Is skipped. But that also makes everyone look like Mary sue character’s at times.
And the focus is jarring because the book series is often not about the romance, it’s about a series of escalating contrived (and intentionally grim/gruesome events), that don’t make much sense in a wide context. Or the broken/unexplored magic system’s ie Dream magic, pain & life (sic), confessors, spirit and prophecy, and dominion / blood magic with the rahl’s.
But, the “emo”, “grim”, “edgy” and romantic elements are also crowded by tropes and a backstory that doesn’t seem to go anywhere in the books. I don’t know if the books were planned, but the plot events are disconnected, and skipping them from the show also feels weird because of the lost time and lost context.
@@Toliman. Terry Goodkind isn't a fantasy writer. He's a grade school philosopher who thinks he's on an ivy leaguers level and likes the smell of his own farts. Seriously, go listen to interviews with him, he talks about fantasy just happened to be the best vehicle for his philosophical ideas... dude thinks he's Ayn Rand...its hilarious...and that used to be my favorite books series, so I'm not speaking from hate...dude just has no subtlety...and his prose is like a nithgraders
@@Toliman. I'll have to look into the books then. I did start reading the first book at one point but never finished the first 1/3 probably just because I was awfully busy and it was a borrow from the library.
You should read "The sword of Truth" series then, by Terry Goodkind. Once you do, you'll start hating the TV series deeply for literally bastardising the great fantasy.
They ghosted Peter Jackson when he asked to see a script before getting involved, they knew they made poop.
The legacy wasn't destroyed, no one will remember this show a year from now while Tolkien's work will live forever
Which is another problem for the show, since the next season doesn't premier for another year after that.
arrogance is the easier way to lose to enemy you would never have lost to if you took it seriously
Exactly, this rant was so weird
It’s going to be a continuous thing for a decade. You’re acting like they aren’t making 6 seasons…
Star Wars is still massively tainted. It doesn't go away that easily
The saving grace is that we have the Lord of the Ring. When i was a kid Star Wars was already old but i loved it when my mom showed it to me on VHS. So i hope that the younger generation will still see and love the Lord of the Rings, like Star Wars was for me.
true, thats the only good thing coming out of ROP, it could potentially (and has) made people interested enough to watch LOTR or read the books, and get a TRUE understanding of what lotr is and properly capture the magic of tolkein.
everything else about ROP can burn in a dumpster fire of warg droppings.
Its interesting because if you look in youtube and see younger people reacting to older films like terminator 1 or 2 and other classic films they openly admit the olders are better.
I love how even though UEG is not trying to review/criticize Rings of Power......he absolutely tears it apart the first chance he gets. Goes straight for the throat and proceeds to metaphorically dismember this abomination. I love it!
Those of us on the Gen X side of 35+ also got to see the original Lord of the Rings Movies, the cartoon ones starting in 1978. So not only did I have the visualizations in my head from the books (my parents awesome, they not only read me Hardy Boys mysteries, they also read Hobbit then LOTR nightly at bedtime) then seeing them show up in the cartoons in ways i didn't expect, some better, some worse. Then Peter Jackson movies actually brought them to life . . . this show just hurts my LOTR feels.
It isn't an Anglo-Saxon mythology anymore...
No, this isn't Lord of the Rings, this is shit wrapped in a Lord of the Rings wrapper.
Hey, Legend of the Seeker. My college roommate was into the books and he found a way to stream that show.
It was pretty good. Kind of in the vein of the old Xena, Sinbad and Hercules series' from the 90's, but less campy. (though to be fair, there was a lot of camp. "Powerful Magic!" as a recurring line still makes me laugh)
My roommate said it deviated from the books quite a bit. Mixed storylines, switched up characters and changed how the magic worked. It was also much more episodic, with some new adventure every episode, while still maintaining a loose overarching plot.
I found it entertaining in a mid budget fantasy kind of way, so I was a little disappointed it didn't go on for longer.
I feel so old because I remember Legend of the Seeker! My family used to watch together it when it was on netflix because it was so bad it was good for us with an occasional episode of "Oh this is actually not bad" that kept us engaged pff
Lol, I read the books - Wizard's First Rule.
I got to about 5th or 6th book and couldn't take it anymore.
I figured out his cunning trick
... nothing happens for the first 3/4 of the book,
and everything happens in the last 200 pages.
You can happily save yourself days of reading! Magic.
Another way to look at this is: what best represents the franchise?
I grew up on the Burton/Keaton Batman, but if you ask me who's Batman, I might be tempted to answer Christian Bale as well, as the Nolan films definitely raised the bar and somewhat redefined that character. I'll be thinking of Kevin Conroy too, but that's another story. But I won't EVER be thinking of Anne Hathaway as Catwoman; to me, that will forever be Michelle Pfeifer.
On the other hand, if you mention Blade Runner, my mind will immediately go to Ridley Scott's film despite the fact that I ADORE what Denis Villeneuve did with 2049. Why? Because it came first and it too, in many ways, raised the bar.
All this to say; the new dogshit entries in beloved properties (Star Wars, Star Trek, Ghostbusters, LOTR, etc) sure have the advantage of being more recent, and the damage they do cannot be ignored, but I'm hopeful the younger and next generations will have the opportunity to fall in love with the timeless classics people before them got to enjoy. At some point, quality MUST matter. It can't be only a matter of novelty. I know Amazon will burn all their money in publicity to boost Rings of Power in the popular opinion, but it will never erase the superior quality of Peter Jackson's trilogy AND the quality of the books themselves.
Case in point, for all my life I postponed watching Godfather because in my mind it would be old and slow and I thought all the praise was just a meme. What a slap in the face when that old piece of art instantly and suddenly made it into a select list of what I consider masterpieces.
Again, the quality and timelessness of something must matter. It has to. Otherwise, it's not worth creating anything anymore.
I am not sure we can blame the actors since the whole thing was handled so badly. It could be the writing, directing, or editing etc. I would hold off judging the actors until i see them in other content.
There was an article were the actress portraying galadriel mention needing a psychiatrist or something similar because of the role.
Edit: spelling
For a counterpoint, go an watch an old TV series (late 70's) called _Blakes Seven_
The acting is atrocious. But damn the story is good. Even if the entire 4th season is tacked on due to it being a big hit at the time, with a couple of quite 1-dimentional characters added in, the finale of the show is masterfully executed.
Oh hell yes I blame these actors as well. Judging from their interviews it becomes very clear that this wasn't a job for actors so much as it was for activists.
i can blame the actors, if they had even a smidge of sense they would see the script , then hand in their resignation but they did it anyway
@@nathanperquin9910 But paychex!
I love your Legend of the Seeker comparison. That is a good show with an ok book adaptation. ROP makes me sad inside for everything you have said. The true betrayal is that all the fans in our hearts feared this is what we would get when this was announced so long ago. There was just a sliver of hope, just enough to be bitter when our fears were justified about this trash coming out. With what they have done so far I think to course correct this dumpster fire of a season 1 and do a full reboot for the rest of the seasons. Maybe that is why shooting of season 2 was put on temp hold. I am not certain if they can take the ego hit and admit they were wrong and will probably just shit out more content like what we got already and force THEIR narrative. I really want to know where the budget went considering it was almost $1 million dollars a MINUTE per episode. Could this be an embezzlement scheme for some high ups at Amazon. No way what they shot could cost nearly that much.
There was nothing at all similar other than names between the characters from the lots and the books. It was a giant Fu to the book fans.
Did you mean Legend of the Seeker is an OK adaptation of a good book? The books were first.
That being said I'd rather watch all the Hitman movie adaptations than this series that was adapted by a wood chipper and is now infested with termites.
Legend of the Seeker is just as bad as Rings of Power, if not worse. They did manage to ruin it in just 5 minutes, though, so they beat RoP there.
So Galadriel runs into Sauron makes him do things he does not want to, then he turns into the dark lord........ This seems like soap opera events to me, almost like he is gonna be a love interest after some tragic scene
If you go back to that ridiculous “superfan” panel discussion, at one point, the host literally “speculates” that Sauron will have some sort of romantic entanglement. It was 100% intentional and they knew exactly what they were doing from the beginning.
"He needs Elvis healing. That means they have to go see Arwen's dad who is Steven Tyler" A quote from the writer's room.
Legend of the Seeker reference - going deep! I'm not someone who has read LotR much, but I loved the films. I watched RoP and a majority of the time I felt like many of the characters were just poorly written and the only scenes I tended to like involved the dwarves. Durin and Disa felt fun, their scenes and the Durin/Elrond friendship were the only parts of this show I felt had some level of enjoyment to them. Galadriel is abysmally written. Just compare her narration and few scenes in LotR - how she is portrayed there has so much more "ok, this lady is important, wise and powerful" than anything in the show - which saddens me. I'll take the Adventures of Durin and Disa or Durin and Elrond any day over the rest of the show.
Evil can’t create but only corrupt
From all dramatube videos focusing on Rings of Power, this video is the best explaining what is going on. The idea of generational preferences makes sense, and its effect on the initial popularity of the show.
These episodes may be preference for next generations, but the pay back period would in that case be more than Amazon planned.
Good to see LotS getting a mention. It dragged a bit in the second season but had good actors and good characters.
But was a complete bastardisation of the source material... even though Terry Goodkind writes like a ninthgrader who just found out what libertarianism is, I think they could have done a much better job with that story for that show.
LotS took my favorite story and literally gutted every good thing about it.
@@markp1634 So here I am, literally proving UE's point 😄 I knew nothing of the book and thought the TV show was all there was. Well, damn.
@@donkeysunited if you liked the show, I encourage you to get the books. They get a little preachy but the characters are deep and interesting and the world is awesome
WOOOOOOW. You dug deep to bring up Legend of the Seeker!!!!!!!! I did NOT expect that comparison! THAT is a scathing indictment if I ever heard one!
We cannot allow ourselves to forget the horrors of Amazon's "Rings of Power." We must learn from our failures, to ensure another such tragedy never occurs.
.....and how are you going to stop the next season of The Witcher?
@@Thanatos2k I never got into the Witcher, so I'm pretty out of the loop as far as the show goes, aside from hearing about Cavill quitting. Looking into it now, yeah, it sounds like they have just as little respect, if not outright disdain, for the source material as the RoP showrunners. I don't know why people like that keep getting these jobs.
How is the show even supposed to continue without its main star?
Something everyone should remember about major movies and TV shows. There is so much money and time put into it, NOTHING is an accident on screen. Every shot, every line, ever angle, is deliberate. When they fuck up and say it was an accident, that's not true. They know they fucked up, but they don't have the integrity to admit it.
You said it!
It feels like a demoralization tactic honestly. Taking a legacy that’s great and legendary, and filling it with garbage and corrupting it beyond redemption.
How if noone cares?
@Average whiteguy yes and they will stop withing weeks...are you like 12 and this is your first time seeing this kind of interest cycle unfold?
@Average whiteguy "No one cares" is a personal demoralization tactic used to shut you up
Someone gets it. This was purposefully done.
@@kalinmir the massive backlash this show continuously received should tell you a massive number of people care very much.
Ive managed to fix any plot holes for myself concerning Saurbrand and Karen by imagining that Saurbrand is actually trapped in Groundhog Day. This is something like the billionth time he has attempted his ‘plan’ before it finally worked.
In a way, you are describing one of the possible avenues they could take to "fix" the mess . Season 2 could be "nah, it did not really happen that way" and then rewind .
Dude, _please_ keep “breaking script” and putting this show in its place! Heck, give us an hour-long rant piece if you want! It’s amazingly cathartic to hear what an actual fan has to interject into that trash fire of a reboot, not to mention it makes for a great podcast while I’m at work :3
If you need justification, it certainly can’t hurt the writers to get some real input. We all want better products from the industries with the resources to make it happen, so pick their scripts apart all day, please :3
I think that the most famous example of a pyroclastic flow and its effects is easily Pompei. From my experience, I cannot think of a single person in my life who hasn't heard of it. It's just that pervasive.
And then, in RoP, a village is washed over by just such a pyroclastic flow, and not only did the vast majority of the villagers survive it, the fucking wooden houses were still standing. Anyone who has ever considered themselves a writer of any sort should be able to take a single glance at RoP and see massive block letters reading "ZERO EFFORT" emblazoned across the screen. When a shitty amateur writer like myself can write a more realistic disaster scenario than those hired by a multi-billion-dollar company to write a series based on one of the most beloved fictional universes in literature, you know we live in an absolute clown world.
You don't have to know anything about vulcanism, Pompeii, nor words like 'pyroclastic', to recognize the problem with the story here. The show portrayed a Big Ball Of Fire And Ash And Smoke roaring towards the village. The show portrayed this fireball as instantly incinerating buildings, blowing some structures away. And the show presented the audience with a big dramatic 'cliffhanger' moment as this fireball engulfed the village and the main character herself. A grammar school child who knows almost nothing of volcanoes must recognize that there is Imminent Peril for everyone concerned, especially the main character.
And in the next episode, everyone is fine, except for a horse who caught fire. Literally not an eyebrow singed, while structures nearby were burning (the structures themselves were the main peril, it seems). And not just Galadriel, but all the villagers. Even in the 1940s movie serials, they did more work than this to resolve cliffhangers. It was absurd, and the moment when I threw up my hands and acknowledged that these people do not care in the slightest for the most basic principles of storytelling.
It's not about the money or making something they want to watch, it's about sending "THE MESSAGE".
The "Pig with Lipstick" analogy was hilarious. Great video by the way!
I would love for a Confessor to use their power on the script writers and ask "just what were you thinking with LOTR?"
Wow, Legend Of The Seeker, I almost completely forgot about that show. It was fairly entertaining and I loved watching it with my in-laws when it aired. My mother-in-law was especially into it, that was the "don't bother me unless you're going to sit down and watch too" part of the day haha.
Rangz of Powah: Hood Edition
We waz rangz
Even ignoring the (supposed) Tolkien aspect of the show, there's multiple instances, not one but MULTIPLE instances, of one character asking a question and the next character won't answer the question before moving onto a different topic as though they were never asked a question in the first place. This happened at least two times in just the final episode. They obviously never should have been trusted with Tolkien's work if they can't even get a proper dialogue exchange out...
I have, in several comments now, referred to the way that the writing reminds me of Mark Twain's magnificent dismembering of James Fenimore Cooper's "The Deerslayer" for its many writing sins. He enumerates several rules of writing and shows how Cooper fails to obey them. In one case:
5. They [the rules] require that when the personages of a tale deal in conversation, the talk shall sound like human talk, and be talk such as human beings would be likely to talk in the given circumstances, and have a discoverable meaning, also a discoverable purpose, and a show of relevancy, and remain in the neighborhood of the subject in hand, and be interesting to the reader, and help out the tale, and stop when the people cannot think of anything more to say. But this requirement has been ignored from the beginning of the Deerslayer tale to the end of it.
I don’t know if you’ve played shadow of war and shadow of Mordor, I think the story, though not canon, is absolutely amazing
Much cooler interpretation of Celebrimbor too.
Sexy Shelob tho...
Those games are respectable because they had the good sense to just say this is not canon it is just a game in the setting meant for fun and even their deviation from source material feels more respectful.
Bruh, you killed me with the Legend of the Seeker. Why did they do that to my boy Richard?
The only good thing in this show was Kahlan. Perfect cast. The rest is terrible.
This has the be the most expensive failures and waste of time in the history of well ever
Having read the Silmarillion and The Hobbit and the Lord of the Rings, I feel like if I brushed up on my Tolkien lore a bit, I could single handedly write a better show than Amazon pooped out. I'm okay at writing, not phenomenal, but the thing about adapting a pre-existing work is you don't have to come up with original ideas for a whole story, just use the actually good preexisting story that an amazing man spent a lifetime creating.
This is what happens when you pick the people who hate everything Tolkien actually stood for to adapt his work. They just try to destroy it, and try to make something "better" in its stead.
@William Hall yeah, not buying the rights to adapt the Silmarillion was probably one of the biggest mistakes they made, if only because they seemed to think it gave them an excuse to do whatever they wanted
Great way to break this down ! Just as Pierce Brosnan will always be who I see as James Bond.
Sean Connery
@@harlequincat I'm going to piss you both off and say Roger Moore.
I can't express in words how baffling it is a company can give $1b to a couple of showrunners who's only credits are, quite literally, 3 writers credits COMBINED. McKay? Yeah he LITERALLY HAS ZERO CREDITS. Let that sink in. Amazon handed ONE BILLION DOLLARS to 2 people who have written for 3 properties. Again, that's combined. And JD wasn't head or lead or executive writer on his credits. Just, "writer".
How did anybody have any expectation other than what exactly happened?
Just because they have a lot of money doesn't make them smart, apparently.
Love the content! Have been following The Rings Of Trash since the inception, and am not surprised honestly. Just really, really sad. Disappointed I cant even really watch it as a ‘so bad its good’, or to make fun of it. Just so bad it’s revolting.
You missed the third group: People who knew it was a pig to begin with, those who didn't bother watching because of, well, the devastation inflicted on EVERY OTHER FRANCHISE.
Hiring people who care more about 'modern audiences' with zero experience and talent, no one is surprised just how
bad this series was in every aspect and makes it worse is the insane budget they were given.
"It's a paradox. You have to know the [subject] to know what's going on, but if you know what's going on... you will _hate_ this!"
You said you could talk about the problems of the show for hours. If you do, I'll listen! I can't take another disappointment in my life so I haven't watched any rop
I watched one episode with my family and when I tried asking them plot questions they were just as confused as I was lol
Watch it so you can get the full understanding of how bad it is and why most are not happy. It's like a car accident you can't look away from lol
imagine being so soft, spoiled and well off that your biggest problem is something happening in the entertainment industry that you arent interested in. holy crap, eurocentric culture has literally produced an army of human shaped cancer cells
That Legend of the Seeker reference brought a tear to my eyes.
I grew up to that until I learned it got cancelled.
When I was young, before the movies, my Dad sat me on the sofa and read The Hobbit to me. When I was a bit older, we read LOTR together. Later we saw the movies together in theater. I'm no Tolkien expert nor do I have a strong desire for narrative purity in the show, but I'll always have a personal relationship to the books that goes beyond any damage that can be done to the property. Having said that, I fell asleep during episode 5 and haven't watched ROP since.
All the reviews I've read sum up to 3 things:
1)Positive: Admits to never having read the books, & only saw the movies once.
2)Negative: Disrespectful to the source material, everyone is out-of-character.
3)Neutral: Lackluster writing, mediocre at best, but the sets & costumes are so shiny!
Same thing that has happened to Star Wars. Because Disney messed up the canon so much I've absolutely no interest in even the good stuff they release because of that. Even my buzz for the new Jedi Fallen Order is gone. Judging by the low viewership of Andor which is meant to be a good show, I'm one of many who feel this complete apathy.
I feel for Tolkein fans because as a Star Wars fan it's been a long 10 years down the road to this point and I'm sorry this is happening to them too.
I love how Sauron was basically just a nerd wanting to play with this nerdy things and then Galadriel nagged him until he snapped.
Correction: Michael Keaton is batman. Jack is the joker.
False 😎
Hee hee hee, true.
Mark Hamill is the one true Joker.
Jack was good but Heath Ledger took it to the next level.
Agreed on jack and Michael
I only read The Hobbit so not so steeped in the lore but I really loved all the movies (even the making of the movies videos with weta workshop and all that) and am absolutely loving this series. If you haven't seen the making of videos you should.
The real Batman was Adam West :)
You forgot to mention, the next season is like 2 years out. Nobody is gonna remember this show by then, so it will lose even more of it's potential watch base just for that
Seriously, they're trying to tell the Silmarillion with no rights over the Silmarillion, is this enough of a spoiler?!
I will never understand why they paid 300 million for the rights to the 3 Lord of the Rings books (and nothing else) and then made a series about the Silmarillion. Are they idiots? Why not buy the rights to the Silmarillion, then? I reckon that even would have been cheaper.
From movies, tbf, Michael Keaton is my Bruce Wayne. Tho I liked the Bale movies, nobody nailed the distinction between Wayne and the Bat better than Keaton.
But I'm an Xer. Meaning I'm old. And this is really beside the point because your general point in the video is correct. This is the main reason for so many remakes and re-imaginings in this era. To wipe out memory of the past.
Who controls the present controls the past, after all.
I love the lipstick pig analogy, that's so perfect. I'm of that demographic that loves the original movies very much so, who won't lay a finger anywhere near this crap. The marketing alone, the name calling to original fans, and the visuals alone are a hell no for me. It doesn't look anything like LotR as I know it, it ironically looks like a cheap knock off that somehow ended up being the most expensive show in history!? 🤔
Bro, Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul is LEAGUES better than this show and they are nowhere near the budget. That's really sad actually
Published title: "Now it's over, let's come out and say it: The Rings of Power was a stinker"
Actual title: "Now that we are no longer being paid for positive reviews, let's publish some real opinions"
Man I understand your anger, as a 15 year old who just recently has read the books and watched the movies and loved them thinks that this show is garbage. I couldn’t watch past episode four. You hope that someone smart takes the wheel and brings the show back but I hope that they cancel season two through five and Amazon gets rid of the lord of the rings rights as unlikely as that is to happen. Also I do hate that your right and this show is what the new generation has to watch and may stop anything good that is lord of the rings from coming out in a while because the show sucked.
Legend of the Seeker, that takes me back. I agree, way better than RoP. Was not expecting that reference lmao, glad to see another man of culture!
Star Wars Legends fan here to say "first time?"
You nailed it again bro. I lasted till mid 3rd episode decades long Lord of the Rings Fan here just couldn't do it anymore
Legend of the Seeker followed its lore better than the Rings of Power did, and that is saying something.
From someone who read the whole Sword of Truth serie and watched the LotS show, you’ve made my day, ‘cause this is insanely accurate!
RoP lost me at the first episode and I did not watch the rest of the season feels great knowing that I haven’t lost my time!
My introduction to LOTR was Ralph Bakshi's animated version from 1978. I love it.
I just have to say we've been watching Merlin for a while now with my spouse.
It clearly does not have the budget it deserves, but oh dear is the writing the best I've seen in a while in any fantasy series.
It really is odd how so much money was spent on RoP, and yet they failed to find competent writers who could coordinate well together, with a focus of crafting an amazing Lord of the Rings-story.
They even had a Tolkien scholar but fired him which can be seen in the show
The funny thing for me is that when you were saying your "Spider-man" is Maguire and your "Batman and Joker" are Bale and Ledger, my thought was that mine are Christopher Daniel Barnes, Kevin Conroy and Mark Hamill. Further proof of your point I think.
You need to remember, when we talk about the Tolkien Estate we are talking about 2 iterations of it. One under Christopher and the other under whoever took over from him. Yes, Christopher wasn’t a fan of Jackson’s efforts, but the ‘New’ estate loves Rings of Power, and the media uses those two facts simultaneously, without clarifying the change. So they proceed to (in the Estates name) tear down Jackson and Praise Rings of Power in the same breath all claiming it was the Estate.
*_"Everything woke turns to shit."_*
this was one of your funniest reviews. the live and unedited exasperation lol i hear ya, man, i hear ya.
16:40 YES, my thoughts exactly! (Season 2 sucked though...😏) 😎
You can, however, go even further back with episodes from Hercules and Xena shows that were far superior then, with but a tiny fraction of the money.....
Man. This the most passion I've ever seen out of you
When it comes to Batman, I have to separate them into the comedy (Michael Keaton/George Clooney/Val Kilmer) and the dark (Bale). Each have their own high points but that's how I associate Batmans.
spot the old fella ☝️😅
Haha, I'm 38 and it's Keaton for me. Mainly because I was obsessed with it as a kid (grandma sewed me a costume and everything). Watched it again for the first time as an adult recently. It actually held up.
@@matthewj6154 Not quite that old but that combination of casts will always be good to me for a quick laugh, each batman brought their own style to the suit and thats what made them good in their own ways.
@@Lithic_Goose Not Clooney his suit was stupid and even Clooney admitted it.
@@emberfist8347 Not the suit literally, their style.
It's not about giving the customers what they want, it's about "educating" on what they should like.
I think this show deeply reflects amazon company culture.
Not just amazon, hollywood and entertainment as a whole. Gaming included.
Like a wise Welsh once said: "It's a torching of the past, rather than a passing of the torch."
Actually enjoyed Legend of the Seeker. Fun stuff with good actors.
Batman is Michael fuckin Keaton and Joker is Heath Ledger
Does it matter that RoP isn’t even an adaptation though? I certainly hope so!
I wrote a book when I was 19 ... read it, tore it to pieces burned the ashes, then flushed those ashes down the toilet... that work of literary trash was closer to Tolkien than this show lol.
Upper Echelon - nerdrotic crossover.....do it! The peasants demand it!!
Anyone who watches nerdrotic is brain dead. Seriously. Most click-bait videos ever.
Your right! What have I been doing with my life...I should start watching collider and Hassan twitch streams.
@@Freddyrugger27 Yikes, scared of black actors are we?
Oh that old chestnut lol. You guys are so predictable. Cant you come up an original strawman argument? Is Justsomeguy racist? Young Rippa? Your justifications are devoid of any logic and completely rely on baseless ad hominem attacks. But hey, keep at it. At least you guys are consistent.
@@Freddyrugger27 Shear fact that your initial response was "Shall I watch left-leaning streamers instead?" indicated exactly what you meant :)
Very goo video, love your channel, but I couldn't to get distracted and resist to crack a little after the ads on 15:00
The real joker for me will always be mark hamill thanks to the animated series
Legend of the Seeker was a 2 Season Classic...
Yes, I'll die on that hill alongside you. 😎🥃
Granted, I never read any of the Seeker books but the show still retained a largely cohesive plot that kept me invested from start to finish. Far better than RoP could barely manage in 1 episode.
Rangz of Powah needs no discussion or reflection. Simply a TV about polishing a turd. The less said about it, the better.. 💁😅