Shooting Shot from a 50 Cal BP Rifle
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- Опубліковано 3 лип 2024
- www.thepathfinderstore.com
Dave Canterbury, David Canterbury, The Pathfinder School,Bush Craft ,Survival skills, Historical Lore, Primitive Skills, Archery, Hunting, Trapping, Fishing, Navigation, Knives, Axes, Fire, Water, Shelter, Search and Rescue
I obtained a badly rusted barrel for my T/C Renegade and had it bored out to a .62 caliber (20 gauge) smoothbore. It shoots a patched round ball well out to 75 yards and also does well with shot.
my biggest fear is if i die before my wife she will sell my guns at what i told her i payed for them.
I think for overall ease to someone new a Cap Lock is better, but the traditionalism of Flint is hard to beat and it is a very satisfying gun to shoot. BP has a lot of advantages and if you want to to try them out, I am trying to get some stock that will be affordable and good enough quality to help you out, I suggest buying simple to begin with and elevating as you go like any other gear, don't buy the Porsche before you learn to drive-
Dave, are you going to have a video up on that new shoulder bag you've guys got in the store? I'm trying to size up how it'll work (to wear, to fit things in, to move around with, etc...). Maybe you can compare it to the other two haversacks- at least in the size of the main pocket. I'm a little suprised you guys don't have a lumbar pack out yet. One with suspenders that a guy with a 34'' waist can wear without it sliding around that could be converted to a haversack would be interesting.
Atkrdu I think Jamie Burliegh will be handling that video for SRO.
Good video! I've never thought to try shooting shot out of my rifle. I agree that a cap lock is likely the best way for a shooter to get started in muzzleloading, and it can be equally traditional to a flintlock. I love flintlocks, but one of the most popular periods in history, and certainly one of the most popular styles of traditional muzzleloading rifles, was the period of the early 1800's when the Mountain Men went west into the Rockies. The most popular style of rifle for that period was the half-stocked St. Louis Hawken's rifle or 'plains rifle' similar to the one you're using in the video, and the majority of the Hawken's rifles were actually caplocks, not all, but most.
For someone wanting to get into hunting with traditional muzzleloaders for the first time a Hawken's style caplock rifle is a good way to do it. They're relatively inexpensive and easy to use. One can always step up to a flintlock long rifle and/or a flintlock fowler later on. Personally, I've always wanted a Jaeger rifle myself!
you just cant beat them black powder guns for versatility in the woods
I believe the drawing was actually a rendition of the rare Ohio Moose Squirrel. Thank you for showing the rest of us that accurate depiction of an unique animal........
I use a Pedersoli Brown Bess as my woods gun. I love the versatility of the smoothbore musket. I can fire patched round ball, buckshot, shot.
I've been in the woods with the intent to hunt deer, only to not even see a deer, but squirrels were in abundance. I didn't bring any shot though, just .735 balls. So I take my tomahawk and hammer a couple balls to the thickness I like, then cut "cubed" shot...like they did in New England in the 18th Century. It works, gotta get a tad closer, but it works.
Cleaning the smoothbore is a snap. That lock will spark a piece of charcloth well too.
I started watching this channel 3 yrs ago I am so thankful for all you have taught me. God bless you.
209 adapter for Percussion Arms ua-cam.com/video/q7ehUuoLfa4/v-deo.html
Good to have you back Dave, hope you had a good break!
Been wondering about the possibility of shooting shot from a rifle, questions answered. Thanks for sharing.
The amount of information you put out is staggering.. you, and your channel have really evolved into something pretty unheard of. I can't really think of many other channels/people that put out as much valid information on given lifestyles as yours does. Love it as always please keep doing what your doing man.
As always, great video! All the best, Dave.
Good having you back making videos
Dave,
Have you investigated the Track of the Wolf guns, Dixie Gun Works, for kits. These are all made of parts from the US. The Italian guns are good. all CNC manufactured and there is even a guy on you tube that does a tour through the plant showing you everything from wood treatment to final assemble.
But my favorite and the reason, all parts are made by him and they are all USA manufactured parts. This is " North Star West Guns. they make smoothbore northwest trade guns in a assortment of cal.. Barrels from 41" to 20". you might want to check these companies too since they are American made.
I checked a couple BP sites that sell barrels. You could exchange your rifled Hawken (Generic) style barrel to a smooth bore barrel for about $180 and still be able to shoot chewed balls through the smooth bore for larger game. For small caliber, you can also buy reducing sabot wads that will hold a .32 or .30 cal bullet and still retain fairly good accuracy. So, there are solutions if you want to go BP route.
Have done the same thing using my Thompson Encore 45/410 rifled barrel and the Short Lane Arms BP adapter. Shot pattern is somewhat erratic, as yours was, but effective none the less. Can also fire round ball etc through it as well as well as 45 long colt and factory shot shells, slugs, etc. The Thompson Encore is a very sturdy frame and can handle a variety of loads. Since purchasing my 209 adapter I have used mostly BP when hunting small game with better results (and less costly) than factory shells. No side lock system of course so not traditional but it gets the job done without the purchase of additional firearms.
And yet no kill shot on that carrot in the second rabbits hand. Nicely done! No vegetable hostages were harmed. lol
I have a 20 gauge double bp it does just fine for the squirrels and rabbts thanks for the vid I am 55 and picked it up when I was 17 glad I did made a lot of good moves when I was a kid even though I didn't know it at the time
Thanks for the video Dave. I'm considering getting into BP rifles and so it's still all new to me. I've got plenty experience with modern firearms, but little to none with BP arms. Thanks again...keep up the good work...much appreciated. :)
Love this video and enjoy seeing how to use these older rifles and which ones are easier and what not.
Just a heads up... a 50gr powder charge behind a patched .490" swaged lead round ball will only develope about 1100-1200fps out of 28" Hawken Barrel... This load will destroy little if any edible meat on small game such as rabbits and squirrel at close to medium range..And if your hunting them on tree's these big round balls are really effective at Barking them right off of trunks and limbs... an 75 / 75 load of #4 shot would make a real good self defense / camp load to keep in your smoke pole ...
Great video Dave. Thanks for the tip!
Awesome. Going grouse hunting now in the mountains with my .50 cal flintlock! Thanks for the good info David.
Good video Dave. thanks for the info.
Thanks for the informative video!
Thanks for the very useful video. I am in exactly the situation you describe. I have a .45 caliber Traditions Hawken style percussion cap rifle. Too hard to hit rabbits with that .45 cal ball so I wanted to get a smooth bore musket but, just as you say, they are somewhat pricey. I'll give this a try. Thanks!
I've fired shot through my lyman .54. I just used .54 sabots and filled them with shot with an overwad. I like the idea of a paper cartridge though and how it would help reduce the affect of the rifling on the shot. Also, full caliber round balls don't cause too much damage on small game. I've taken squirrels and rabbits with my .54 and it just punches a hole through them. Much less damage than a 17hmr or similar. Shot would be more useful on squirrels that are up in trees so you're not shooting round balls up in the air.
Good stuff Dave. I think I'll stick with one of your earlier go to ideas tho. My 12 ga. Bird-shot, buck and slug all from the same platform. Mine's a pump so no adapter option, but I can live with that as a survival load out.
I do have other choices for a SHTF scenario. Side arm, MBR and shotty.
Thanks for sharing the info
I hope your stay in Vegas was nice. I've been stationed here for 4 yrs. I hope to make it back to Pennsylvania soon.
Dave,
You can also shoot sub caliber rounds with sabots. I used to do that using the same load for both 50 cal and the 32 cal sabots that I used for small game.
Geoff
great video and advice thanks
thanks Dave. I have had to pass on small game as I have had my 45 Kentucky pre loaded with ball. I think I might re think that. thanks
Up until very recently I had a .50 cal cap lock I bought for 60 bucks at a pawn shop, loved that gun. Never thought about shooting shot from it. I alway thought it would be too inaccurate to be any use. Unfortunately our home was burglarized recently and it got stolen. Great video :)
Glad your back. I'm jealous, would love to go to shot show. I wonder if you could take a cheaper BP rifle and lathe out the rifling. Smooth bores are thinner anyways. I bet you could get a machinist to do it for less than 100 bucks each. There's some pretty cheap rifle kits out there
For me, this is your best video yet. I cannot wait to try this with my Traditions .50 cal.
Nice shooting Dave.
Love the concept. Yes the shot pattern spreads out more than a smoothie would, but do you really want 30 pellets shredding the meat? Just a few will do the job quite nicely. Great starter concept to intro into BP. I am already hooked. My buddies think I am nuts for wanting to "Slow down" my gun style. I love the history of it too.
I got lucky a few years back and picked up a Thompson Center Arms 12ga NewEnglander shotgun at a pawnshop for 90.00 dollars it's tough to get a super tight pattern but still working on it. Was offered 300.00 for it but it's not for sale . Wanting to get a ball mode in 71 cal.But I also have a 36 cal TC Hawken /Sharon barrel.love my bps.
Been shooting Black Powder for many years. However I had never considered loading shot in a Rifle. Thank you for showing me how......
Well done and thanks. I often wondered if it would be feasible to use my 50cal BP rifle for an impromptu shot gun.
Good as smooth-bore . The .50 cal rifling probably doesn't have much spin effect on lead shot and wool wad as opposed to forcing a lead ball or sabot through the rifling.
Excellent!
You were at SHOT Show?!! So bummed I missed seeing you there.
great vid dave my father in law used to use shot in his double 50 cap Kodiak but he used to put a patch as it were loaded with shot making a cup out of it for the shot I guess it would be the same as the paper shot wrap you sad just wondering if it would make a difference?
So I know that this comment is seven years behind the eight ball. However here it goes... yes you can successfully use a good smoke pole to fire shot. The best results are obtained with a true round ball rifle with a rate of twist of 1 in 60" - 1 in 72". The effective range, and pattern will be increased. I Also add even though I'm an old school kinda guy, but I am not afraid of stepping out of the box for efficiency. I would offer this tip use the cva ,Thompson center, or butler creek style speed loaders. Powder than paper wad shot shot combo. These speed loaders have the means for a cap attachment. Preload as many as you desire before the day in the woods.
Thank you! I have been wanting a smoothbore but they are all pretty pricey. However I have 3 b.p. rifles, 2 caplock and one flint. Quick question though - the shot won't damage the rifling will it?
sorry if its a foolish question but I've only ever fired patched round ball out of them.
Does the shot do any damage to the rifling over time, more then the usual wear?
Dave this is a little backwards, though it will work.. If I want to shoot small and big game, I like, like so many during the 17th and 18th century, would use a smoothbore to do both. I shoot #4 and #7.5 shot out of my 62 cal. (20ga.) at 25 years, you get a outstanding pattern. Plus at 25 yards I get a 3" group with my .600 ball. Then for shooting shot, I use the same FFg powder, paper wad then felt shock wad then same amount of shot to powder, then a paper wad. If the only gun I could use as a hunting gun it would be a smoothbore.
I got an old 50 call that had been neglected and the bore was ruined for 40 bucks at my local flea market. I then took the barrel to my gunsmith and had him open the bore up on his lathe. I now have a smooth bore shotgun for under 200 dollars. After a bit of load work up I found my best pattern at 70grn of powder with an empty sabot with 50 grain of #6 shot topped with cardboard plugs I make out of cardboard at least 3/16 thick.
The twist rate on most of these black powder guns is 1 in 48 to 1 in 64 inches so all the worry about the rifling issues are mostly unfounded, I have used shot in all sorts of black powder guns including .44 revolvers and big bore air rifles. #4 shot is my personal choice.
I can't speak to all regions, but I know that here in Houston, musket caps are pretty hard to come buy. People are frequently coming into the gun/reloading shop where I work looking for them, but all we can get are 10s and 11s right now.
Any reason why these same principles couldn't be applied to inlines, or would a side lock converted to take 209s (much more available here) be preferred?
I had asked several knowledgeable people about shooting shot through my rifle and was told it isn't accurate or powerful enough to be effective and it will damage my bore. So, now that's debunked is that just raw wool you are using or is it treated? I'm ready to set mine up for next season. Thanks for the video, very informative.
Hey Dave, Great vid! I was curious about this myself since I've wanted a shotgun but can never seem to find one reasonably priced. I assume it would work equally as well with a flintlock? Have you tried it with a modern inline that takes a 209 primer?
very cool, and using the sheeps wool sounds historical. im thinking about using this method in my current TC hawken. you mention equal shot to grain ratio. what volume do you find works best? id assume you can get accurate results from a lesser powder charge this way, more 30-45 grain pyrodex P, versus my normal ball/minnie load of around 60 grains.
Just wondering when are you going to have black powder guns on your website
What are the advantages of shooting bp rifles?
Will you be selling black powder supplies (powder, shot, caps, ect) or just the black powder guns?
I love my pedersoli traditional hawken rifle. Would love a fowler that I could use for both deer and squirrel. PA does not have any rifle caliber overlap for the deer and squirrel seasons like other states do.
Hey Dave, random question here. I was wondering if you owned any modern firearms,and if so, what kind. Thanks for these videos. God bless
So, would loading up a 12 gauge shotgun be similar? About 70 grains of powder, plus equal volume of shot?
would the shot impart any damage on the rifling?
great vid . i like the idea of these even if i have to make from a kit,
so Dave how you gonna get to california with our commy archaic laws..
it's always been a issue with firearms and manufactures dont ship to cali or ammo to here either
just curious how you plan to get around the laws here ???
I know this is off the subject but what trap stakes do you use do you make the cable for the heads? Thanks ~ Endurance Channel
you could remove the rifling from any muzzleloader so it patterns shot better, and still shoot patched bullets and kill larger game.
Would it cause any harm to the gun if I used .177 BB's?
Hello Dave I have not heard from you about using #4 buckshot in .50 cal BP rifle. Can you do this
would one be able to load a round ball or conical on top of the shot incase a deer shows up , or is that dangerous
Nice. Have a Hawken 50 how do you think shot affects the rifling?
how many grains of powder would be too much for a black powder rifle like that?
Dave just wondering if you can use #4 buckshot in a 50 do rifle? Since its smaller of buckshot.
What if I put the shot in a lubricated cloth patch wad so it wouldn't spread as quick?
Could you use a sabot to house the shot,or are we talking strictly traditional ?
How do you like the Lyman carbine? It is a very well priced carbine and was wondering how effective and how far have you taken deer with it? Have you tried the Lee REAL conicals in it? They have a 250 and a 200 grain versions. I have the larger and can ship you a couple dozen if you would like to try them for free. Well, i would like to see how they perform from your carbine so I will be reimbursed with the knowledge.
Dave do you have any semi auto shotguns
why could you not use a sabot sleeve that you can get from a .50 sabot slug with a over plug ?
I can't believe you shot not one, but two Canterbury original pen and ink drawings. They could have commanded tens of nickels at auction!
Like something like the Hall breech loader..
Hi. What kind of barrel you have on the gun rifled or smooth? I have a Tracker 209 BP rifle,can i use it with shot? Thanks wait for your answer.
I really want to try black powder just not sure how to start
Sorry Brother but this is not common Man frontiering. It's great re-enactor fantasy. I always wanted to be a Mountain Man, also, but you got me hooked on using my H&R single shot with the 209 primers and the BP adapters. Ya can't beat it for simplicity. I ain't spendin money on a Hawken rifle or fowler. Besides I just picked up two more NEF's, one with rifling. I love single shots and the ability to use BP with them. Thanks for the heads up.
could you also do this with inline muzzle loaders, like cva wolf?
Thanks for the video. I would use the word "inexpensive" instead of cheep. Just a suggestion. Keep up the great work.
Dave do you own any semi auto 12 gauge's
Wow. I've only ever owned a Ruger Old Army, suddenly I want a .50 cal black powder rifle.
Are you going to have a Fussile de chasse smooth bore available? Sorry if I spelt it incorrectly .
Yes the kit will run about 700 for Walnut Stock and the Finished gun is about 1250, .62 SB Iron Mounted
i use sabot cups and wax the shot in after i pour it ino the cup.. works well.
Can you shoot a smaller caliper round ball say like 36 caliber from a 50 caliber rifle
Hay i really need to know exactly what k8nd of black powder rifle this is i want to buy one it has to be this one too.
Please advise
Wendy
Dave still have an open invite for the live show ......let me know when
Do you buy the shot or is there a way to make it. I like to make my own 44 and 50 cal bullets
Making shot wouldn't be that easy. That is one thing that makes more sense to buy.
Use a 50/54 cal gun and shoot small caliber sabot's for small game
You said a .50 I not to expensive and easy to find for beginners... what kind of cost are we looking at? I'm excited to see what firearms show up on the store site!
$300-$400 for new, $150-$300 for used in good condition. do your research before buying.
thanks brother
Check out Armslist dot com for your state. I was able to pick up a flintlock 50 cal for very cheap. If you don;t mind having an inline with a 209 shotgun primer, I've seen some used ones listed for as little as $125. Good Luck!
Great
Dave what haversack are you carrying
Deep Woods Hand Craft
G'day,
Yay Team...!
I don't shoot, but I used to do so...; and the more primitive the Weapon the more I enjoy knowing about it...
;-p
Ciao !
i saw that when you rammed the wool down the barrel... Need to clean that thing. pour some hot water down the barrel lol
:-(
I missed the instructors and friends ... ;D
I was wondering if it will damage your rifling by shooting the shot out of it. I hope this didn't sound like a stupid question. Just lack of experience in this area on my part. Thanks in advance. God bless and stay safe.
The hard steel barrel won't take any damage from the soft lead shot. It won't be a problem at all.
Michael Wheeler Thank you.
I will just stay with my 12ga single shot with the 209 black powder converter. I cannot justify or afford another new gadget gun when I already have the ability to shoot shot as well as slugs and various other things, switching to and from BP to smokeless at will.