This is a very informative video. I have a 2019 Roadster and part of the decision for me is ease of maintenance. Not having to lube every 500 miles, spraying oil on the bike, and adjusting the tension as the chain stretches. Keep up the great content and Happy New Year! Eric
Thanks man! It's nice to hear from you. It's also nice that Sportster owners have the options of kits to easily change their final drive type if they want to. One of the advantages of having a very popular motorcycle.
@@YouMotorcycle Really very and very technically appropriate to the matter. The strap serves very well to go to the wedding of well-known motorcyclists, with the motorcycle. Heavy machines with not very effective power are better left with the chain, even though the belt is older than the usual spit on the ground. It was made all spliced from pieces of treated leather and the splices riveted. She worked inside stamped iron channels, flat on the rim. It skated but didn't consume much power from the weak engines of those early days of motorcycling.
I know this is an older video, but thought it would be worth mentioning a HUGE advantage to chain over belt. the ability to easily change to custom lengths. if you install a hard tail, or a custom made long springarm, it is far easier to just order a longer chain, than it is to find a belt that fits that specific application.
Good point! On a belt you'd have to mess around with pulley sizes to make up for the lack of variety in belt sizes compared to a chain you can cut to length.
Yup. For the marginal performance gain, I'd rather have less maintenance. Currently on a cross country trip right now and if I didn't have to maintain a chain I could bring less tools and no chain lube and save some space and weight on my trip
@@Cheeks9669 It might be simple but i don't like doing it. I use my bike to go to work and back and do quite a bit of kilometres. I don't feel spending time on cleaning a chain every Saturday. The oil in my shaft I check when doing engine oil change and that's it. And done for another 3 to 4 months
Really good video man. I feel like it’s important to note though, modern day lube and cleaners are super clean compared to old ones. I personally use muc off to clean and maxima to line. It cleans super easy and I’ve never had any lube spin off at all.
If your person that does not like to work on a bike then keep your belt! What a chain is way better! Speaking from experience and I take pleasure in cleaning my bike even the chain😮
If you don't mind the extra maintenance, yes. A lot of people barely have time to ride as much as they would like to, so having one less thing to worry about would be a big help to them
I learned the hard way my sportster(86) came with a chain and once I hopped up the motor was going through two(most expensive) sets of chain and sprockets a year. Mostly due to that no hd I know of has a Cush drive to soften the power pulses killing the hardened steel rollers on the chain. So I switched to an aftermarket belt drive no more problems
That was a very interesting comparison. Being a Spyder rider and therefore part of the belt drive world I did not know about the differences both pro and con of chain drive. Good video, short snappy and to the point. 👍
I'm with you. As much as I understand the benefits of chain drive... at this point, if I have one less maintenance thing to think about in my life, all the better.
In the bicycle world I’ve heard that belts are more efficient then chains (less drive train losses) the only reasons they’re not popular in bicycles is cause they need a gear box which has complications
In the plain chain years, lube every 500 miles replace at 20k. You can more than double those numbers with sealed chains and modern lubes are hardly messy. Maintaining a chain on a track or centre stand is a breeze. Since the 60s, I've yet to break a chain ..
When a chain breaks, it usually wraps itself around the front sprocket and leaves bits of your engine on the road.. built if a chain link in your pocket will fix that, then no argument.
That's a fair point. I've seen a few people get lucky and simply have their chain fall off or break off without causing too much chaos, but I've probably seen more people with what you described, you're right.
Good point! You're right. I misspoke. Gonna have to lose more than 5 pounds at the gym for the same performance gain, but you get my point: for many riders the improvement probably isn't going to be too crazy, and if they really do want to max out on performance, they can start by looking at the guy in the mirror. At least losing five pounds would also help with braking right? lol
This is what I was busy shooting yesterday (sorry again) haha. I love shaft drive for simplicity, ease of use/maintenance. There's a drain hole, and a fill hole, that's largely it. There isn't even a filter, and it usually takes less than a liter of fluid. BUT, if you're the tinkering type you can't really change your final drive ratio on a shaft drive motorcycle. I really liked the Suzuki Boulevard M50. I had two of them! Shaft drive, but on the highway I always felt like if I could play with the gearing I might have been able to get it better for touring, and that was never an option. Pros and cons to everything. I think belt is a good compromise between low maintenance and still having some level of customization. Most riders will never play with gear ratios though.
My '95fxdl has a 130 rear. I think cause less rolling resistance for highway, also "lighter" for less unsprung weight, and also lighter wheel/tire can accelerate and decelerate faster.
Yup. I have a video coming up in two weeks about the effects of lighter (forged) wheels over cast ones, basically all of the science behind what you're talking about. Stay tuned!
Ive had both, prefer belt just tired of messing with the chain. Do they make aftermarket pulleys for belt drive that increase top speed for the sporty?
Typically when a chain requires tightening on a chain drive motorcycle you loosen the axle from the axle nut, and then you adjust the chain adjustment nuts equally on both sides of the wheel until you have the right amount of slack. Doing it equally is important, it's how you keep the wheel straight. Then you tighten everything back up again.
Thanks. This was super informative. I ride a maxi-scooter with a CVT belt drive, so it's good to know how the other half lives. Knew there was more maintenance involved with chain drives, but I didn't realize how much. I think the belt drive has spoiled me. Great video and thanks again.
@@YouMotorcycle Mine was recently changed after about 25K miles on it. Based on your assessment I may have been premature on that, but my bike was having issues at the time that were found later to be related to the electrical system.
@@ScooterwolfsMotovlog Scooter belts last nowhere near as long as big cruiser belts do. Very different. Scooter belts aren't meant to take anywhere near as much torque.
Well I think the lack of maintenance and constant cleaning makes a belt about ten times better than a chain for the final drive. Chains may be slightly more efficient but taking all things into consideration then belts are better - of course it'll depend on the amount of mileage you do and personal choice but longevity of belts compared to chains.... it's something that'd make me refuse to ride let alone own a bike with a chain. My hundred plus bhp Sporty and 130+ Dyna would just eat chains but belts are so much more convenient .
Cheers bro im here for the long run with you, subscribed. Is there any comparable modification for belt drive to the chains ability to have bigger or smaller sprockets? I heard you mention the pulley, and it got me wondering If there was a way to keep my belt but also increase my top speed while lowering the rpm at those speeds? All I really want, is a way to cruise at 90 or 100 and not be riding it at 4500+rpm.
Yup you can change your gear ratio by getting bigger or smaller pulleys just like you could get bigger or smaller sprockets. Sprockets are just easier to come by as they are more common. Talk to your local dealer's parts desk or ask on xlforum. Thanks by the way!
Also to be clear, I don't really want or need a highr top speed, I just want my 5th gear to be able to cruise at 100 more around 3500 instead of 4500+. Ive been weighing the benefit vs cost of getting one of those 6 speed xl1200 trannies but they are a few thousand dollars and I just don't know if I can ever convince myself it's worth it. To anyone that may tell me to get a bigger bike, I would if I could but my credit is bad and ive decided to make my sporty a bad ass machine
I would never switch to chain for the maintenance reasons and the mess even though some think they are cooler looking. I have a 2003 Harley Ultra Classic with the same belt that came on it. A chain would never last that long. With that being said, if they belt breaks on the road I will be wishing I had a chain so I could fix it and get going again. Ha. Ha.
I want a chain on my Sportster because adjusting the belt properly, and getting the rear wheel aligned perfectly is a real PITA. It takes forever to get both the belt properly adjusted and the wheel aligned PERFECTLY. Chains are much narrower, and have some sideways flex. You can get away with the rear wheel being 1/16 out of alignment with a chain. But with that super wide belt, there is absolutely no room for error in rear wheel alignment. Chains also have a much wider range of adjustment than what H-D specifies for the belt. My local independent Harley shop uses TWO people to adjust the belt and align the rear wheel at the same time. With a chain, one person can do it easily. Modern O and X ring chains do not require anywhere near as much maintenance as chains used to. I have gotten 20K miles out of street bike chains by lubing them every 1000 miles, and never cleaning them. Obviously dirt bike chains require more maintenance.
What's the shops name? 2 dudes?! I can understand if you can't do it. But if they can't that's hilarious to me. I'm a Harley tech and was taught how, they should know too
People worry about power to weight ratios and spend heaps sorting a bike out, forgetting that that burger, beer soaked arse will mess up your calculations.
Rotating mass equals horsepower loss due to the added drag, a chain has rollers on every sprocket contact surface which drastically reduces drive train friction, I went through four belts in 35,000 miles, that's two good RK chains on my old Evo that spit three belts in three months, cussed a blue Streak
A chain has so much more rotating mass, it's pretty obvious when you hold the belt in one hand and the chain in the other. With newer belt materials you can make a belt as strong as you want. A chain also expands when it heats up and trust me, an o-ring chain heats up and the heat had to have been converted from power to heat rather than power to the rear wheel. It's the opposite of what you claim. Belts have practically no friction, an o-ring chain has quite a bit of friction or they wouldn't get so hot. I ride a ZX14R with a 530 o-ring chain and even after a short ride the chain is very warm. A chain inside of an engine which is constantly in a state of lube has low friction but still plenty of rotating mass. With today's materials and analysis there is no reason why a belt would have to be really wide and couldn't handle a lot of horsepower. I've ridden Buells before and I love the final drive system more than any other. I resent the fact that I am supposed to lube my chain every 300 too 600 miles, possibly every other tank of gas. I've been studying these things for a long time, a belt has the benefits of a shaft drive(smoothness, low maintenance) and a chain drive (sport bike handling but less rotating mass and unsprung weight).
@@YouMotorcycle it is written "Thou shalt not take the name the the Lord thy God lightly on thy lips; if a man uses that name lightly, the Lord will not aquit him of sin." Exodus 20:7
This is a very informative video. I have a 2019 Roadster and part of the decision for me is ease of maintenance. Not having to lube every 500 miles, spraying oil on the bike, and adjusting the tension as the chain stretches. Keep up the great content and Happy New Year! Eric
Thanks! Good choice! Unless you're taking that thing off-road, no reason to go to chain.
The matter discussed by you is very important. It was really worth knowing these perspectives. Grateful!
Thanks man! It's nice to hear from you. It's also nice that Sportster owners have the options of kits to easily change their final drive type if they want to. One of the advantages of having a very popular motorcycle.
@@YouMotorcycle Really very and very technically appropriate to the matter. The strap serves very well to go to the wedding of well-known motorcyclists, with the motorcycle. Heavy machines with not very effective power are better left with the chain, even though the belt is older than the usual spit on the ground. It was made all spliced from pieces of treated leather and the splices riveted. She worked inside stamped iron channels, flat on the rim. It skated but didn't consume much power from the weak engines of those early days of motorcycling.
I know this is an older video, but thought it would be worth mentioning a HUGE advantage to chain over belt. the ability to easily change to custom lengths.
if you install a hard tail, or a custom made long springarm, it is far easier to just order a longer chain, than it is to find a belt that fits that specific application.
Good point! On a belt you'd have to mess around with pulley sizes to make up for the lack of variety in belt sizes compared to a chain you can cut to length.
All the pro's for a chain just disappear once you mention maintenance and cleaning....
Yup. For the marginal performance gain, I'd rather have less maintenance. Currently on a cross country trip right now and if I didn't have to maintain a chain I could bring less tools and no chain lube and save some space and weight on my trip
If you carry tools are doing maintenance take the chain off clean it lube throw back on pretty simple
No one said it was hard, but just because something is easy, doesn't mean it doesn't time.
@@Cheeks9669 It might be simple but i don't like doing it. I use my bike to go to work and back and do quite a bit of kilometres. I don't feel spending time on cleaning a chain every Saturday. The oil in my shaft I check when doing engine oil change and that's it. And done for another 3 to 4 months
So you do a bunch of miles and only change the fluids lol that bike is for sure clapped.
The cleaning and maintenance alone makes it seem like a no brainer to me. Best of days to ya Adrian !
Really good video man. I feel like it’s important to note though, modern day lube and cleaners are super clean compared to old ones. I personally use muc off to clean and maxima to line. It cleans super easy and I’ve never had any lube spin off at all.
Thanks! Wish I could say the same about no lube flicking off. I'll try the Maxima stuff, thanks!
196k miles on my belt, picked up a rock at 30k miles so, 166k miles with a hole in the center of it.
Dude, that's crazy! lol
If your person that does not like to work on a bike then keep your belt! What a chain is way better! Speaking from experience and I take pleasure in cleaning my bike even the chain😮
If you don't mind the extra maintenance, yes. A lot of people barely have time to ride as much as they would like to, so having one less thing to worry about would be a big help to them
Rotational weight savings of 5lbs is far greater than you losing 5lbs in the gym and removing that from the sprung weight of the bike
Yep, you're right! I misspoke.
I learned the hard way my sportster(86) came with a chain and once I hopped up the motor was going through two(most expensive) sets of chain and sprockets a year. Mostly due to that no hd I know of has a Cush drive to soften the power pulses killing the hardened steel rollers on the chain. So I switched to an aftermarket belt drive no more problems
That was a very interesting comparison. Being a Spyder rider and therefore part of the belt drive world I did not know about the differences both pro and con of chain drive. Good video, short snappy and to the point. 👍
Thanks!
Im keeping my belt iv own chain drive over 35 years belt to me last longer
I'm with you. As much as I understand the benefits of chain drive... at this point, if I have one less maintenance thing to think about in my life, all the better.
In the bicycle world I’ve heard that belts are more efficient then chains (less drive train losses) the only reasons they’re not popular in bicycles is cause they need a gear box which has complications
In the plain chain years, lube every 500 miles replace at 20k. You can more than double those numbers with sealed chains and modern lubes are hardly messy. Maintaining a chain on a track or centre stand is a breeze.
Since the 60s, I've yet to break a chain ..
I'll let you know if I ever get 40,000 miles out of a chain 😂
Only con I’ve had is breaking the axle adjusters on the newer 04 plus round swing arm style ,
When a chain breaks, it usually wraps itself around the front sprocket and leaves bits of your engine on the road.. built if a chain link in your pocket will fix that, then no argument.
That's a fair point. I've seen a few people get lucky and simply have their chain fall off or break off without causing too much chaos, but I've probably seen more people with what you described, you're right.
3:55 reciprocating mass weight and a riders weight are WAAAAAAAAAY different for power delivery.
Good point! You're right. I misspoke. Gonna have to lose more than 5 pounds at the gym for the same performance gain, but you get my point: for many riders the improvement probably isn't going to be too crazy, and if they really do want to max out on performance, they can start by looking at the guy in the mirror. At least losing five pounds would also help with braking right? lol
What do you think about final drive shafts on bikes?
This is what I was busy shooting yesterday (sorry again) haha. I love shaft drive for simplicity, ease of use/maintenance. There's a drain hole, and a fill hole, that's largely it. There isn't even a filter, and it usually takes less than a liter of fluid. BUT, if you're the tinkering type you can't really change your final drive ratio on a shaft drive motorcycle. I really liked the Suzuki Boulevard M50. I had two of them! Shaft drive, but on the highway I always felt like if I could play with the gearing I might have been able to get it better for touring, and that was never an option. Pros and cons to everything. I think belt is a good compromise between low maintenance and still having some level of customization. Most riders will never play with gear ratios though.
@@YouMotorcycle Great response. Thanks man.
My '95fxdl has a 130 rear. I think cause less rolling resistance for highway, also "lighter" for less unsprung weight, and also lighter wheel/tire can accelerate and decelerate faster.
Yup. I have a video coming up in two weeks about the effects of lighter (forged) wheels over cast ones, basically all of the science behind what you're talking about. Stay tuned!
I just wanna know if I can try wheelies on a belt drive lol
😂 good to go!
Ive had both, prefer belt just tired of messing with the chain.
Do they make aftermarket pulleys for belt drive that increase top speed for the sporty?
Probably. But Harley makes a bunch of different OEM pulley sizes that fit so you don't even have to go aftermarket if you don't want to.
I just have 1 question. How do you tighten the chain when its loose over period of time?
Typically when a chain requires tightening on a chain drive motorcycle you loosen the axle from the axle nut, and then you adjust the chain adjustment nuts equally on both sides of the wheel until you have the right amount of slack. Doing it equally is important, it's how you keep the wheel straight. Then you tighten everything back up again.
Thanks. This was super informative. I ride a maxi-scooter with a CVT belt drive, so it's good to know how the other half lives. Knew there was more maintenance involved with chain drives, but I didn't realize how much. I think the belt drive has spoiled me.
Great video and thanks again.
Thanks for the kind words! Was watching the start of your trip to Nova Scotia earlier tonight! Belt is the way to go 👌
@@YouMotorcycle Mine was recently changed after about 25K miles on it. Based on your assessment I may have been premature on that, but my bike was having issues at the time that were found later to be related to the electrical system.
@@ScooterwolfsMotovlog Scooter belts last nowhere near as long as big cruiser belts do. Very different. Scooter belts aren't meant to take anywhere near as much torque.
@@YouMotorcycle I can see that. In hindsight I think mine were rated for around 20-25 K miles.
Well I think the lack of maintenance and constant cleaning makes a belt about ten times better than a chain for the final drive. Chains may be slightly more efficient but taking all things into consideration then belts are better - of course it'll depend on the amount of mileage you do and personal choice but longevity of belts compared to chains.... it's something that'd make me refuse to ride let alone own a bike with a chain. My hundred plus bhp Sporty and 130+ Dyna would just eat chains but belts are so much more convenient .
Cheers bro im here for the long run with you, subscribed.
Is there any comparable modification for belt drive to the chains ability to have bigger or smaller sprockets? I heard you mention the pulley, and it got me wondering If there was a way to keep my belt but also increase my top speed while lowering the rpm at those speeds? All I really want, is a way to cruise at 90 or 100 and not be riding it at 4500+rpm.
Yup you can change your gear ratio by getting bigger or smaller pulleys just like you could get bigger or smaller sprockets. Sprockets are just easier to come by as they are more common. Talk to your local dealer's parts desk or ask on xlforum. Thanks by the way!
Also to be clear, I don't really want or need a highr top speed, I just want my 5th gear to be able to cruise at 100 more around 3500 instead of 4500+. Ive been weighing the benefit vs cost of getting one of those 6 speed xl1200 trannies but they are a few thousand dollars and I just don't know if I can ever convince myself it's worth it. To anyone that may tell me to get a bigger bike, I would if I could but my credit is bad and ive decided to make my sporty a bad ass machine
My rear pulley is squared off on my iron 883 not even 20k miles on it belt was too loose I couldn't find the belt tool anywhere here in Ireland
Belt with improper tension can cause premature wear.
great vid 💪
Thank you! Glad you liked it 😃
Every two tanks for chain maintenance? More like every 20.
You should be lubricating your chain wayyyyyyy more often than that
Very nice video!!
Thanks Mike!
Can they do engine braking?
Motor, transmission, gear ratio is going to effect engine braking... whether its a belt or a chain shouldn't change too much I don't think.
@1:29 that is a yamaha bolt.
At a race track, yep
I would never switch to chain for the maintenance reasons and the mess even though some think they are cooler looking. I have a 2003 Harley Ultra Classic with the same belt that came on it. A chain would never last that long. With that being said, if they belt breaks on the road I will be wishing I had a chain so I could fix it and get going again. Ha. Ha.
Pros and cons to all things in life lol
GOOD🏋♀
Every 2 time u fill up gas lube your chain? 😆
Or don't and have fun replacing it more often than you need to 🤷🏻♂️
275 on an 883 oh boy I’m flying! Lmao could you imagine?
The brakes and suspension are so not ready for that 🤣
First harley was belt drive lol
Didn't know that, cool!
@@YouMotorcycle en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harley_and_the_Davidsons
Think it is four episodes. Pretty cool.
I want a chain on my Sportster because adjusting the belt properly, and getting the rear wheel aligned perfectly is a real PITA. It takes forever to get both the belt properly adjusted and the wheel aligned PERFECTLY. Chains are much narrower, and have some sideways flex. You can get away with the rear wheel being 1/16 out of alignment with a chain. But with that super wide belt, there is absolutely no room for error in rear wheel alignment. Chains also have a much wider range of adjustment than what H-D specifies for the belt. My local independent Harley shop uses TWO people to adjust the belt and align the rear wheel at the same time. With a chain, one person can do it easily. Modern O and X ring chains do not require anywhere near as much maintenance as chains used to. I have gotten 20K miles out of street bike chains by lubing them every 1000 miles, and never cleaning them. Obviously dirt bike chains require more maintenance.
How often are you having to adjust your belt though?!
What's the shops name? 2 dudes?! I can understand if you can't do it. But if they can't that's hilarious to me. I'm a Harley tech and was taught how, they should know too
People worry about power to weight ratios and spend heaps sorting a bike out, forgetting that that burger, beer soaked arse will mess up your calculations.
Lol very true. Cheapest way to take five pounds off your motorcycle is to do cardio every day for a month!
Rotating mass equals horsepower loss due to the added drag, a chain has rollers on every sprocket contact surface which drastically reduces drive train friction, I went through four belts in 35,000 miles, that's two good RK chains on my old Evo that spit three belts in three months, cussed a blue Streak
Why are you going through so many belts?! I've gone through none in as many miles on my V-Rod which I'm sure puts out as much if not much more power.
If your going through belts there is another problem, not a belt issue..
A chain has so much more rotating mass, it's pretty obvious when you hold the belt in one hand and the chain in the other. With newer belt materials you can make a belt as strong as you want. A chain also expands when it heats up and trust me, an o-ring chain heats up and the heat had to have been converted from power to heat rather than power to the rear wheel. It's the opposite of what you claim. Belts have practically no friction, an o-ring chain has quite a bit of friction or they wouldn't get so hot. I ride a ZX14R with a 530 o-ring chain and even after a short ride the chain is very warm. A chain inside of an engine which is constantly in a state of lube has low friction but still plenty of rotating mass. With today's materials and analysis there is no reason why a belt would have to be really wide and couldn't handle a lot of horsepower. I've ridden Buells before and I love the final drive system more than any other. I resent the fact that I am supposed to lube my chain every 300 too 600 miles, possibly every other tank of gas. I've been studying these things for a long time, a belt has the benefits of a shaft drive(smoothness, low maintenance) and a chain drive (sport bike handling but less rotating mass and unsprung weight).
Thumbed down for taking the Lord's name in vain
Are we talking about the same lord who teaches not to be petty? Because you seem petty AF 🫵🏻🤣
@@YouMotorcycle it is written "Thou shalt not take the name the the Lord thy God lightly on thy lips; if a man uses that name lightly, the Lord will not aquit him of sin." Exodus 20:7
Holy fuck, cry about it😂
Your face is too close to camera.
😂 new lens, still learning. Thanks for the feedback. I'm better with motorcycles than I am with UA-cam lol