Enjoyed your review thoroughly. Having owned this projector for a little over a year now I believe I can add a few insights. One of your viewers in the comment section stated they felt the price was too high for just a 2k projector, fair enough. The point of the LS12000 though is that (IMHO) there is nothing in its price class between a 1080p and a native 4k that can compare to the picture quality. I mean think about it, you have the $1000-3000 price class, then it jumps up to $10000 for the cheapest JVC native projector. And where is the LS12000 in the mix with its quad axis, not dual axis pixel shifting as its predecessors? Yup, right in the middle at $5000. Great price point. Next, I'm not sure what firmware came with your sample but Epson did issue an update that addressed this issue and by the accounts I've seen on the forums it was corrected. Surprisingly, the issue that most people were having, myself included were dead pixels. I had to return mine for a replacement and I read about and spoke to people returning as many as two or three before they finally had one without problems. That is quality control. Lastly, being an amateur calibrator with professional grade equipment I can confirm what most written and a few video calibration settings reveal about this projector. For SDR content "Natural" is by far the most accurate out of the box and takes very little through Calman software to bring it on home to spec. I personally use "Bright Cinema" for HDR content as I have found it to be the next best by software comparison as far as taming the colors and gray scale. Delta e errors are in the low 1.0 - 1.4 range which is fantastic. The last mode that some on the forums liked to use, especially with the Dolby Vision LLV hack is "Dynamic" because it can literally shut off the laser for those inky blacks that people love, however that comes at the expense of black crush. On a calibration side Dynamic was like the wild wild west, all over the place. If I brought one thing in line something else went wonky. Not very linear to me, at least not enough to be a preferred mode. I know it might seem like nit picking (see what I did with the play on words with nit), but as your commentors pointed out, it is a lot of money. Having said all that, I absolutely love this projector! I've owned at least three in the last 8 years from the Benq 1070, the Optoma UHD65, the Epson 5050 and now this one. The image is stunning and every time I use it I love it even more. Pair it with a MaDVR Envy (I built a poor man's version) and the images can go to breathtaking once you take all of the processing load off and just let it be a great projector. So, in not so short terms I hope my insight has added something to the mix. Thanks again, Hatoraid Gerald
Did you see any "Soap Opera" effect on this. I only seen it a couple times in Best Buy with a pitch black room. I think it had a great picture for an eshift. It really did stand up to the Sony. Still kind of debating between this and the more expensive Sony with lens memory.
@@hatoraidcowboy Thanks always thought that was the one downfall of the old bulb projectors. What gain screen would you go with for this one ? I thinking of a 1.8 slate SI screen. I have a lot of light in my living room and can do some light control but not a black out for sure. I am also thinking maybe going black diamond. I am at about 95 inc scope screen which is also why I want lens memory.
Some people say that since it's a bright projector, that to get better blacks, it would be better to get a screen grey screen and with less grain. I will be looking at Steward screens to find the best pairing
I would love to hear about where you landed on color mode, light output, SAG, and HDR slider for SDR and HDR content. I have a very similar black light controlled room and a LS12000. I have been pretty happy with SDR content with only 50% light output in Cinema, but for HDR I am thinking of bumping up light output I see a lot of love for Dynamic mode and 100% light output. In a light controlled room, that seems a bit much
@@hatoraidcowboy I would love to see a video on where you end up! I did some testing yesterday, and I have to say that for SDR stuff, stock "Cinema" mode but with no frame interpolation and light output bumped up to 75% was stunning enough that for me in my room it is "good enough" For HDR, I am currently testing out out of the box "Cinema Bright" mode but with light output at 100%. I think SAG is at 7 in that mode, and I set HDR slider to 4 for now.
Honestly, Jordan, I'm actually planning on upgrading to the JVC NZ7 8K e-Shift projector because there's been enough that's been said about these incredible projectors of what they can do as far as the picture quality, I mean, I've seen Epson, but it will never be on the level of a JVC. There's just nothing like it in my own personal option. But ya'll can get one if ya'll like. Thanks for the recommendation, though, Jordan.
Good video. Not sure what your seating distance is but the sharpness is less of an issue after 9 feet. I’ve done a comparison with the NZ7 and the color, sharpness, and motion was better on the 12000. Black levels and contrast were a little better on the JVC but not enough to justify the price difference.
Thank you! I’m right around 11 ft away from my screen in my main listening position. That’s interesting you felt it beat out the NZ7. But yea at this price point the LS12000 is hard to beat. I’ll see how the Sony stacks up!
@@hatoraidcowboy Other than the inky black scenes it was difficult for me to tell the difference with normal content. The JVC is probably better for movies marginally. Gaming and anything involving a lot of motion goes to the Epson.
it a little to pricey for me but i might get it if it does 3d if not ill just stick to my 4010 its much cheaper and bulb is only around 100 i would have to buy a lot of bulbs to make it cost as much as the 12000 and by that time some else wold be wrong with it anyway projectors dont last too long either way to make it worth the extra cost with no 3d
Trust me I only replaced the bulb once on my Epson 5040UB, and I’m looking forward to never doing that again. Not to mention they can get stupid expensive
@@hatoraidcowboy Honestly, HDR 10 looks ok on a projector/screen to me even if the content is in dolby vision. I have an LG CX with almost 10,000 hrs on it now that, accepts dolby vision. When I compare my current projector that only Has
Awesome, congrats! Its actually pretty plug n play. Just log into the WebGUI and go to the EDID tab and play around with any of the LLDV settings. If you have time I’m doing a livestream tomorrow. Tune in and ask any questions and I’ll try to answer them live
@@hatoraidcowboy cool, I'll try to get on your live tomorrow. Do you also have any recommended calibration settings? I am looking to fire it up this weekend.
@percybedford6266 I’ve only ever used the presets under EDID Tab. But you can do some advanced stuff, I just dont know how to use it. I keep inviting HDFury on the channel to show us and talk about but they keep refusing
@@hatoraidcowboy well I referring more to the calibration setting out of the box for the projector. As for the EDID, I plan to use the presets of the HD Fury.
sorry but got to call you out on this(and not about that tiny storefront you called largest :)). I have 5040ub as well as 5050ub and grabbed 12000 as soon as ive heard of Epson coming out with their flagship replacement. While there is a small picture quality difference between 40 and 50 - there is also a very small difference going from 50 to 12k. Its unnoticable unless you specifically looking for it or getting payed to notice:) But what is noticable are worse black levels and loss of brightness and while again its not huge and i could learn to live with it - its missing 3D now? I think Epson have forgotten what upgrade is and this is a sidegrade at best and downgrade at worst. They raised a price by a couple of grand(or whatever it was dont remember price on 50 but it was at least a grand cheaper) put a death clock countdown on it with 20k hours limit before it becomes an expensive paperweight (at my place sometimes PJs dont turn off for weeks and i just counted my used 5050 bulbs and it went through 11 bulbs so well over 30k hours and still going strong) and removed 3D, not to mention as i found out later tone mapping and iris - all gone in this so called upgrade. 12k went back to the dealer since i dont want to encourage Epson to treat their customers this way. Perhaps i should listen to my neighbour and take another look at new JVC line he swears is a sliced bread equivalent
The LS12000 has more light out put and contrast levels smoke the 5050ub LOL Yes no 3D on the LS12000B but I’m ok with that. Some might not be. Its personal preference. I have the 5040ub and the LS12000B is a massive upgrade for ME. Not to mention LS12000 has hdmi 2.1
I only have a 100” screen so I cant comment on that. How big is your screen? As long as you arent going bigger than the recommended image you’ll be fine
I think the price is too high for just a 2k projector. A 4k DLP looks far superior. Let's be realistic, at this price the Sony would be a way better choice! This Epson is the same as the older models with a laser light source. It's a great projector just no where near the price they are asking.
Totally understandable that you feel that way. Image looks REALLY good though over its predecessors. You have to see it in person. If you saw it I dont think you’d go back. Its a huge improvement. No sugar coating it tho, it’s expensive.
@@percybedford6266 LG hu810p laser projector. I have compared in house this Epson that a friend has that is professional calibrated and my LG is almost 2 times sharper. Now I'm not saying that the picture on this Epson is garbage, it's just not for that price. The LG is $2,500 and the newest BenQ is even sharper and better than my LG at an even lower price.
@@hatoraidcowboy it has 2,700 lumens. And after full calibration and reduced settings it comes down to about 1,800. No 3d but never cared since content is not a factor.
Get your Epson LS12000B today at www.gridhifi.com or call 713-218-8120. Let them know Hatoraid Cowboy referred you.
Why not mention one of the biggest selling points? The lens memory zoom feature? This can allow you to watch cinemascope content. 2.35:1
Enjoyed your review thoroughly. Having owned this projector for a little over a year now I believe I can add a few insights. One of your viewers in the comment section stated they felt the price was too high for just a 2k projector, fair enough. The point of the LS12000 though is that (IMHO) there is nothing in its price class between a 1080p and a native 4k that can compare to the picture quality. I mean think about it, you have the $1000-3000 price class, then it jumps up to $10000 for the cheapest JVC native projector. And where is the LS12000 in the mix with its quad axis, not dual axis pixel shifting as its predecessors? Yup, right in the middle at $5000. Great price point.
Next, I'm not sure what firmware came with your sample but Epson did issue an update that addressed this issue and by the accounts I've seen on the forums it was corrected. Surprisingly, the issue that most people were having, myself included were dead pixels. I had to return mine for a replacement and I read about and spoke to people returning as many as two or three before they finally had one without problems. That is quality control.
Lastly, being an amateur calibrator with professional grade equipment I can confirm what most written and a few video calibration settings reveal about this projector. For SDR content "Natural" is by far the most accurate out of the box and takes very little through Calman software to bring it on home to spec. I personally use "Bright Cinema" for HDR content as I have found it to be the next best by software comparison as far as taming the colors and gray scale. Delta e errors are in the low 1.0 - 1.4 range which is fantastic. The last mode that some on the forums liked to use, especially with the Dolby Vision LLV hack is "Dynamic" because it can literally shut off the laser for those inky blacks that people love, however that comes at the expense of black crush. On a calibration side Dynamic was like the wild wild west, all over the place. If I brought one thing in line something else went wonky. Not very linear to me, at least not enough to be a preferred mode.
I know it might seem like nit picking (see what I did with the play on words with nit), but as your commentors pointed out, it is a lot of money. Having said all that, I absolutely love this projector! I've owned at least three in the last 8 years from the Benq 1070, the Optoma UHD65, the Epson 5050 and now this one.
The image is stunning and every time I use it I love it even more. Pair it with a MaDVR Envy (I built a poor man's version) and the images can go to breathtaking once you take all of the processing load off and just let it be a great projector. So, in not so short terms I hope my insight has added something to the mix. Thanks again, Hatoraid
Gerald
Thank you Gerald for your input and insight!
Madvr envy poor man's version? How did you do that?
Yeah... let's hear what a poor man's MADVR is and how it's done
Did bro ever reply on that poor man MadVR
Good projector for sure! Got the ub6050 which sadly even has better blacks than the ls12000. So I wish they could improve that with next gen aswell 😊
The blacks are pretty darn good on the LS12000
the iris is the reason for improved black levels on the 6050 vs ls12000
@@aaromon43 Well isn't (manual) iris on ub6050=percentage of light output in the ls11000/12000? And adaptive iris = laserdimming.
Yes Cinema is the Best for me too Bro. And Dynamic.
Nice Video.
Thank You.
Thanks!
You re welcome, young Padawan@@hatoraidcowboy
I think the missing of 3D support is a big let down 😢
I got a lot of 3D blu-ray’s. And like to watch them from time to time.
That is a bummer especially if you have a large 3d collection.
@@hatoraidcowboy And even TVs are dropping 3D support. I only have a few 3D movies still kind of a bummer I can't watch them.
@scotttild Yea sad that 3D never took off
Oooh. Got them right in the sharpness.
I’m expecting the Sony to outshine 🙌
@@hatoraidcowboy which Sony?
5000ES
@@hatoraidcowboy nice one, if only it had Dolby Vision!
You can get LLDV with an HDFury 🙂
Did you see any "Soap Opera" effect on this. I only seen it a couple times in Best Buy with a pitch black room. I think it had a great picture for an eshift. It really did stand up to the Sony. Still kind of debating between this and the more expensive Sony with lens memory.
If you have the setting on high you can notice some soap opera effect but its much better on the lower settings
@@hatoraidcowboy Thanks always thought that was the one downfall of the old bulb projectors. What gain screen would you go with for this one ? I thinking of a 1.8 slate SI screen. I have a lot of light in my living room and can do some light control but not a black out for sure. I am also thinking maybe going black diamond. I am at about 95 inc scope screen which is also why I want lens memory.
@scotttild 1.8…😮 But if you have a lot of ambient light that sounds about right. Those Black Diamond SI screens are 👌
@@hatoraidcowboy Is it worth paying the extra for the black diamond over the slate ?
@scotttild What’s the lighting condition in your room like?
I’m going to wait for the results of the shootout
No 3D 😭
Some people say that since it's a bright projector, that to get better blacks, it would be better to get a screen grey screen and with less grain. I will be looking at Steward screens to find the best pairing
Good choice!
and I meant less Gain LOL not less grain
@@hatoraidcowboy
@@marcfrenette1599 LOL I got it.
I would love to hear about where you landed on color mode, light output, SAG, and HDR slider for SDR and HDR content.
I have a very similar black light controlled room and a LS12000. I have been pretty happy with SDR content with only 50% light output in Cinema, but for HDR I am thinking of bumping up light output
I see a lot of love for Dynamic mode and 100% light output. In a light controlled room, that seems a bit much
Right now I’m trying out these settings
simplehomecinema.com/2022/06/15/epson-ls12000-quick-dynamic-calibration/
@@hatoraidcowboy I would love to see a video on where you end up!
I did some testing yesterday, and I have to say that for SDR stuff, stock "Cinema" mode but with no frame interpolation and light output bumped up to 75% was stunning enough that for me in my room it is "good enough"
For HDR, I am currently testing out out of the box "Cinema Bright" mode but with light output at 100%. I think SAG is at 7 in that mode, and I set HDR slider to 4 for now.
Also 100% on Dynamic works just great for me LOL
Honestly, Jordan, I'm actually planning on upgrading to the JVC NZ7 8K e-Shift projector because there's been enough that's been said about these incredible projectors of what they can do as far as the picture quality, I mean, I've seen Epson, but it will never be on the level of a JVC. There's just nothing like it in my own personal option. But ya'll can get one if ya'll like. Thanks for the recommendation, though, Jordan.
You’re welcome! Just trying to help everyone make an informed decision with first hand experience. Ultimately you gotta go with what you like best 😁
Good review. Looking forward to the Sony.
Thanks man!
@@hatoraidcowboy no problem
Good video. Not sure what your seating distance is but the sharpness is less of an issue after 9 feet. I’ve done a comparison with the NZ7 and the color, sharpness, and motion was better on the 12000. Black levels and contrast were a little better on the JVC but not enough to justify the price difference.
Thank you! I’m right around 11 ft away from my screen in my main listening position. That’s interesting you felt it beat out the NZ7. But yea at this price point the LS12000 is hard to beat. I’ll see how the Sony stacks up!
@@hatoraidcowboy Other than the inky black scenes it was difficult for me to tell the difference with normal content. The JVC is probably better for movies marginally. Gaming and anything involving a lot of motion goes to the Epson.
@@jrep88 Yea the Epson has really good motion especially with the interpolation. The interpolation is top notch. I was very impressed by it.
So do you own both projectors?
What is the difference between the LS12000 and the LS12000B?
Appreciate your review and can't wait for the Sony. Any plans on testing the JVC NP5 as well?
Thank you!! Not sure on the JVC. There’s talks about maybe getting a JVC but not sure. But I will def let ya’ll know if I get one!
I would love to see a comparison with a JVC np five as well
The only thing is I think the NP5’s are bigger than my hush box.
@@hatoraidcowboy it’s definitely a big boy!
Is the NP5 that much better then a NX5?
Lindo projetor 3 LCD nativo 1980x1080p 4k virtual👀
I can't get that HD Fury to work correctly. It's a pain, I have a JVC RS790 Projector. It shows it's in LLDV, but looks like it does nothing.
When you say it does nothing what do you mean? You cant tell a difference or its not performing correctly?
it a little to pricey for me but i might get it if it does 3d if not ill just stick to my 4010 its much cheaper and bulb is only around 100 i would have to buy a lot of bulbs to make it cost as much as the 12000 and by that time some else wold be wrong with it anyway projectors dont last too long either way to make it worth the extra cost with no 3d
No 3D on this one. Kind of a bummer but the LS12000B is so much better over any of the previous versions. I love mine
Great picture. 👍 I'm still not sure if I want bulb or laser.
Really good picture. I’d recommend laser all the way 😉
Trust me I only replaced the bulb once on my Epson 5040UB, and I’m looking forward to never doing that again. Not to mention they can get stupid expensive
Good video and I hope you do the epson vs sony vpl-xw5000es comparison👍
Thank you! I def will. It will just take a little longer so please be patient with me 😃
Can you demo how you get Dolby Vision on the LS12000?
You can get Dolby Vision on any projector 😁 I have s tutorial in my channel
HD FURY 4K DIVA 6 MONTH REVIEW!! BEST way to get Dolby Vision on ANY projector!!
ua-cam.com/video/h4drhkbGcqE/v-deo.html
My DOLBY VISION HD FURY 4K DIVA settings + SETUP!
ua-cam.com/video/iKUnvoGyhC0/v-deo.html
@@hatoraidcowboy Honestly, HDR 10 looks ok on a projector/screen to me even if the content is in dolby vision. I have an LG CX with almost 10,000 hrs on it now that, accepts dolby vision. When I compare my current projector that only Has
. . . that only has hdr 10, its not noticeable to me, but that is using old tech. Maybe I will need a reboot on that idea too?
I got the VRRoom. Do you have any tips? It would be greatly appreciated.
Awesome, congrats! Its actually pretty plug n play. Just log into the WebGUI and go to the EDID tab and play around with any of the LLDV settings. If you have time I’m doing a livestream tomorrow. Tune in and ask any questions and I’ll try to answer them live
@@hatoraidcowboy cool, I'll try to get on your live tomorrow. Do you also have any recommended calibration settings? I am looking to fire it up this weekend.
@percybedford6266 I’ve only ever used the presets under EDID Tab. But you can do some advanced stuff, I just dont know how to use it. I keep inviting HDFury on the channel to show us and talk about but they keep refusing
@@hatoraidcowboy well I referring more to the calibration setting out of the box for the projector. As for the EDID, I plan to use the presets of the HD Fury.
@percybedford6266 Oh ok. I still havent gotten a chance to “calibrate” it. Maybe when I’m off during the holidays.
sorry but got to call you out on this(and not about that tiny storefront you called largest :)). I have 5040ub as well as 5050ub and grabbed 12000 as soon as ive heard of Epson coming out with their flagship replacement. While there is a small picture quality difference between 40 and 50 - there is also a very small difference going from 50 to 12k. Its unnoticable unless you specifically looking for it or getting payed to notice:) But what is noticable are worse black levels and loss of brightness and while again its not huge and i could learn to live with it - its missing 3D now? I think Epson have forgotten what upgrade is and this is a sidegrade at best and downgrade at worst. They raised a price by a couple of grand(or whatever it was dont remember price on 50 but it was at least a grand cheaper) put a death clock countdown on it with 20k hours limit before it becomes an expensive paperweight (at my place sometimes PJs dont turn off for weeks and i just counted my used 5050 bulbs and it went through 11 bulbs so well over 30k hours and still going strong) and removed 3D, not to mention as i found out later tone mapping and iris - all gone in this so called upgrade. 12k went back to the dealer since i dont want to encourage Epson to treat their customers this way. Perhaps i should listen to my neighbour and take another look at new JVC line he swears is a sliced bread equivalent
The LS12000 has more light out put and contrast levels smoke the 5050ub LOL Yes no 3D on the LS12000B but I’m ok with that. Some might not be. Its personal preference. I have the 5040ub and the LS12000B is a massive upgrade for ME. Not to mention LS12000 has hdmi 2.1
Sir does this projector support a 185inch screen can we increase the screen size using optical zoom
Yes
Sir does using optical zoom to its fullest affect image quality or brightness i have a very dark room
I only have a 100” screen so I cant comment on that. How big is your screen? As long as you arent going bigger than the recommended image you’ll be fine
185inch screen
@@15.emanuelshaju24 Oh yea you not even close to maxing out dude lol You’ll be fine
"The Grod is the LARGEST home theater store in TEXAS"???? You must be joking after I saw the front of store.
The Grod?
@@hatoraidcowboy haha spell checker - I meant the Grid
Oh. Yea that wasnt meant as physical size store but sales.
@@hatoraidcowboy that’s AWESOME . Well done sir.
@CrochetNewsNetwork Thank you!
I think the price is too high for just a 2k projector.
A 4k DLP looks far superior.
Let's be realistic, at this price the Sony would be a way better choice! This Epson is the same as the older models with a laser light source.
It's a great projector just no where near the price they are asking.
Totally understandable that you feel that way. Image looks REALLY good though over its predecessors. You have to see it in person. If you saw it I dont think you’d go back. Its a huge improvement. No sugar coating it tho, it’s expensive.
@kman9387 what 4k DLP are you referring too? The 4k DLP projectors that will beat out this Epson will cost way more than Epson.
@@percybedford6266 LG hu810p laser projector.
I have compared in house this Epson that a friend has that is professional calibrated and my LG is almost 2 times sharper.
Now I'm not saying that the picture on this Epson is garbage, it's just not for that price.
The LG is $2,500 and the newest BenQ is even sharper and better than my LG at an even lower price.
Does the LG have more lumens than the LS12000? And what about 3d?
@@hatoraidcowboy it has 2,700 lumens.
And after full calibration and reduced settings it comes down to about 1,800.
No 3d but never cared since content is not a factor.
Looks amazing. Too rich for my blood.
"true 4k"
?