BMW M3 and M4: car designer reacts to grille design of the new 3-series! | Niels van Roij Design
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- Опубліковано 23 сер 2024
- #BMW #M3 #M4 #cardesignreview
What do you think of the BMW M4 and M3? Let us know in the comments below!
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What do you think of the video and the BMW M4 and M3? Let us know in the comments below!
Thank you Neils for echoing my opinion... thank you So very much. For your critique. Wtf is BMW thinking these days?? You’re exactly right! Such ‘HARSH SURFACE TREATMENTS’. ‘CHAOS IN THE NOSE’. I keep hearing all BMW Chief designers in interviews saying “Bold Design”. Well it’s a piece of shit is what it is. I’m an E46 M3 owner and it was my aspiration to build & collect M3 garage from every era. And it pains my heart to see this ugliness from a brand I USED TO admire.
@@TheAwareHuman Thank you for getting in touch. Hard to tell what BMW is thinking these days... BMW has made some quite bold design choices in the past, rightfully so. This is indeed, bol, but not very well executed... There is not much else than to enjoy your lovely E46 M3 for a bit longer and perhaps limit the collection of M3's in your garage up to a certain model...
I agree. But I like the lights and the colour. Other than that the front end is a fail
@@avishkarsingh744 As a stand alone item they are not bad. As BMW headlights they fail, however. That's the issue with many elements on this car.
before i watch this video, i love the overall design and the grille is a big reason for why i love these cars. great job!
It looks like the chief designer didn't want anyone to feel left out so put in everyone's ideas.
😆
Just like a camel is a horse designed by a committee!
Because it might be homophobic 🤣 (refering on there actions in the past month)
Exactly!!!!!
After seeing this new M3, I really think that the last gen M3 is going to hold its value even longer.
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts on the M3. You might be right there. It truly is a well executed proper BMW.
After the g8x and f8x I think tbe e9x will hold value even better then these two. After the e9x BMW was losing there vision.
Lol… a BMW holding value…
They need to fire their design group 😂
Haha. Well, in all fairness it usually is the board and Chief Designer how is to blame for the lack of strategy and the weak execution of it, as seen here...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign I honestly think that they somehow might go back to their past design DNA at some point so we could see the small grille back in some sort, idk just my opinion
@@allanb4680 Well, it would certainly be good if they would pick up the important BMW DNA cues again!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign (it usually is the board and Chief Designer how is to blame for the lack of strategy and the weak execution of it) ... that's what happened to most of products across different industries.... look at all those lines and shapes starting from nowhere and ends abruptly, compared to previous gen, I am glad I have the previous, thank you for your explicit review, well done, props to you!
@@kazeforce Glad you enjoyed it. Another one tomorrow! 👍
We are expecting a BMW recall, the reason is aesthetic defects.
😁 Would be quite the blessing!
Recall: return the whole car
Finally a clearly expressed professional point of view that somewhat comforting, nevertheless doesn't ease the pain of looking at this apogee of ugliness
It doesn't ease the pain of looking at the M3/M4 indeed. A vast shame - no excuses for something like this.
Great job, Niels. Despite the "beaver teeth" I thought there's something generally wrong with the design of the new M3 / M4 but couldn't name it. Now I clearly understand what's going on here.
Glad you enjoyed the video! The focus by journalists and many car lovers on the grille is understandable, as it is the face of the car. But the entire body is off... Rather, sad it has come to this, isn't it?
@@NielsvanRoijDesign fortunatelly the price difference between M3 and M5 is not that big so I guess M5 sales will skyrocket ;)
@@mexykpietrov Another good reason to buy the 5 over the 4 indeed!
i can't believe bmw did this to their volume seller cars
Thanks for getting in touch, hope you enjoyed the video!
Nobody can believe BMW did this to their volume seller cars... Incredible right?
This will be remembered as the car that brought BMW to its knees....Their Marie Antoinette statement..
@@dinopappous6639 "Their Marie Antoinette statement." 😆
@@NielsvanRoijDesign Thank you Niels...many have referred to me as a "Philosopher"
@@dinopappous6639 That is a true understatement.
Thanks Niels, this review is great! It's horrific to see the legacy of the 3 series thrown to bits with this new cheap design.
Glad you like the video, thanks for tuning in. It is a true shame indeed, many, many years of hard work and an excellent brand DNA is being ruined... More videos like this on the channel, if you're enjoying this one!
FORZA ALFA BABY
@@dinopappous6639 Sadly that force is not as strong as it used to be anymore - not even that long ago - when it started pushing BMW, Merc and Audi away with the 156!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign ... 3 years later the Giulia Quadrifoglio is still Best in
Class.... Stelvio Quadrifoglio also Best in Class ...God bless the late great Sergio Marchione...
FORZA ALFA BABY...!!!
THE KING 👑 IS BACK !!!
@@dinopappous6639 Eh, well, we love your enthousiasm, because the brand has a truly great heritage and pedigree - but with all due respect for the Alfa Romeo brand, best in class according to who...?
As a lay person its really interesting to hear a designers explanation of things that I see when I look at the car but don't necessarily recognise. Its also quite incredible how good the previous shape looked from the front.
Thanks for getting in touch, glad you enjoyed the video and that it makes you look differently at cars. That was the goal! And, indeed, the previous gen now looks even better...
Hello Niels, what a clear and definite review of the BMW M3 according to their predecessors. I really enjoy your way of looking at the design of it. It isn’t fuzzy at all: “this car is a chaos” is the shortest abbreviation of the design of the BMW M3. Thanks for sharing your design-knowledge 👌
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts, much appreciated - much more to see on the channel, if you're interested in similar material!
It is a total mess. Thank you for the video :)
Thanks for getting in touch, hope you enjoyed the video!
It is quite the mess indeed!
Blimey, That was brutal, but puts into words what most can only feel when they look at it!
Thank you for tuning in and for sharing your thoughts. Indeed, rather brutal! Because this is a big mis for the core product of the BMW range. And such a shame of what it does to the brand.
@@NielsvanRoijDesignAbsolutely. I feel that BMWs needed a refresh, as Mercedes and Audis, whilst samey across their saloon range, tend to be quite good looking now, and BMW was lagging. But this is a big missed opportunity to try something new, but also do it right!
@@adamsmith6692 Spot on. Such a shame of the brand. This could be a bold, interesting and well executed piece of modern BMW design. Now is it s weird, generic coupe with some vague BMW cues...
You‘re absolutely right in your critics!!!
I prefer my old E46! A timeless piece like a Swiss watch! 😇
A true shame, isn't it? Character and modernisation is needed for any brand. However, alienating people and ones own brand DNA completely isn't...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign : It's always a desaster. Look at Alfa or Rover or now Jaguar or even Volkswagen-Bentley... The brands are dead or will be dead soon, because they didn't care about the DNA...
@ Ha, well, these are indeed a selection of excellent examples of how to NOT do it... Fortunately there is still hope in the world for/with/due to other brands!
E46M3....
@@johnl2613 Do you prefer that over the current car?
Thanks for the video. I always thought that in the front, the grille was actually the least of the car's issues. And integrating that radar into the grille - which literally blocks cooling for the auto trans - is absolutely criminal.
Thanks for tuning in to the video. Indeed, the front and the grille as a concept (being large and provocative) are actually the least of the car's issues. It is the way the entire car has been executed that is the issue. Integrating that radar into the grille -well, actually they did the oppositve of an integration...- is horrible and the fact they ditched the entire BMW DNA in the process rather incredible.
Provocative (BMW) car design is great. There is a good example of that in their past:
ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
8:56 “The car is a chaos.”
You are correct in your assessment.
Thank you for tuning in to this video! Glad you like the video - the BMW not so much, haha! More similar design review videos on the channel you might like too, also on BMW.
I’ve owned a e46 M3 for 18 years. All the M3/M4s have been very nice, even if a little bloated for my taste, until this new one with the pig 🐽 snout, I almost wanted to cry. If I was given one, I would remove the whole front bumper to protest. It would be an improvement
Thanks for tuning in. Could not agree more with your statement. But that was pretty clear from viewing the video, I hope! More BMW videos on this channel, if you enjoyed this one!
This is exactly how I expected a car designer to look like
Haha. That’s good to know. Hope you enjoyed the review too! 😄
@@NielsvanRoijDesign For sure!
@@ThePilotsLife Glad you enjoyed the video, thanks for getting in touch. We have about 100 videos on our own design work and that of others on this channel. Hope you'll enjoy these too!
The Chef of the M GmbH said that they doesn’t care about opinions at social media. But maybe they are the buyers. The front seems to be so High and the car so short.
Well, they do not only seem to not are about opinions on social media... There is plenty wrong with this latest 4/3-series iteration, sadly.
Well, they should. Part of the reason why people choose to buy a car is brand recognition. If enough people have a negative perception of a brand its going to hurt sales. Most people don't want to drive a car that is considered ugly by others.
Great review. Totally agree with most of your arguments. The grill is definitely a problem. The face looks jacked and there is no way to avoid looking at that Buggs Bunny grill. Your eye goes from to the grill, to the hood, and then nothing, maybe back to the grill again. Nothing else ties back to that grill. Your eyes get stuck there with nowhere to go and it's just a weird shape to look at.
Hi there, thanks fo sharing your thoughts. Glad you liked the review. The grill is definitely a problem, indeed. Unresolved and very crude. Nothing else ties back to that grill, as per your remark. In the video this issue is also pointed out: way too many "seperate" design features, rather than a consistent and homogeneous piece of design. Such a shame of the BMW brand - isn't it?
I wish to see much more such videos like this, with visual explenations and comparison! Best luck.
Many thanks indeed. Glad you enjoyed this video on the BMW 3 series/M3! If you wish to see more similar videos: we have about 120 on our channel alone and have one new video per week!
A similar one on the new C-class here:
ua-cam.com/video/7Eulyz1zj8s/v-deo.html
I think BMW created their best designs in the 80s, 90s and early 2000s. BMW E38 and E39 were a masterclass mix of elegance and dynamism that is completely lacking in the current range. I think BMW are over-styling cars these days because customers demand more imposing cars and characterful cars with big grills (i.e Chinese market). It's a shame because the BMW brand I knew and use to love throughout my childhood is not the BMW brand i know today. I enjoyed the video and i'd like to see more design/brand analysis in the near future but perhaps on another brand.
Thanks for getting in touch, glad you enjoyed the video! The BMW E38 and E39 were lovely cars indeed, they presented a big problem unfortunately with regards to the lack of differentiation between the 3, 5 and 7. This was an issue for the brand as clients had problems seeing the differences between the cars. Bangle came in to change that and did a great job not just making the models into brands on their own, but also developing the brand into somehting linking stronger to the Freude am Fahren slogan of the brand. The E38 and E39 are gorgeous cars nevertheless, but things had to change to stay relevant.
Thanks for tuning in and watching the video. Please find many, more design/brand analysis videos on our channel - and watch this space for the new videos in the near future!
Absolutely right! I prefer my E46 and will drive it as long as possible. Now 300‘000kms and still perfect in every sense!
But the same mess with Mercedes too!
I don’t know the brand anymore...
@ On the topic of Mercedes-Benz: you might want to watch this space...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign : Which space?
@ This UA-cam channel.
Thank you, Niels. I've thoroughly enjoyed your roast of the G80 M3. I'm sharing this video to those who disagreed with me. I was telling them it's a Lexus trying to imitate a BMW. With your explanation I don't have to do it myself.
Excellent, thanks for sharing the vid! One could argue the Lexus is both a lot better executed technically (the surfacing and its transitions) and more relevant (the car looks incredibly Japanese)
are you kidding? look at the LC500. Lexus dances around BWW in terms of design. The design on the LC looks 5x as expensive as this
@@hazardeur It’s also 40% more money as well. Compare the 8 series to the LC and now you are in the game. I do like the LC500 and the 8 series a lot.
@@Tortuga6able it's more expensive but the new M doesn't need to be the most beautiful car in the whole world. However, for 100k+ I still do expect an excellent, EXCELLENT design nonetheless
@@hazardeur Oh I whole heartedly agree. Cars in general are ridiculously expensive. I have a 435i and it has beautiful lines. I would not buy a new BMW at this moment. I have two rules on cars; Looks good, Sounds good. I am eyeing the LC500 Toyota did well on that car. It should be called a Supra.
This has been a marketing win for BMW - any news is better than no news - and they've achieved that with this grille! Personally I absolutely LOVE it and I really don't see what all this fuss is about! So well done both the Design and Marketing departments at BMW! They will sell as many cars with or without this grille, I am positive!
This has been a marketing fail for BMW - much news indeed, all negative. It has been a PR sh*tshow both online and in printed media... A New 3 or 4 series always is reason for loads of coverage, so by pushing out poorly resolved cars that get a large negative reception is not ideal.
You might personally like the grille, in the video it is explained in detail why this design as a whole is bad and why the grille is not the problem.
@@NielsvanRoijDesign just ask how many would go for the Audi A5 instead because of the new “ugly” B 4 - I am sure the % would remain the same as before!
@@ManlyHK1 That's a question nobody can answer with honesty. In the end the aim always has to be longevity of the brand, through design and sales. Temporary peaks are bad for that, no matter if they are positive or negative peaks.
@@NielsvanRoijDesign Remember how bad the response was when Apple first launched its AirPods? They were widely mocked and trashed. But that doesn't stop them from becoming the Top 3 Headphone Brand in the World, with many copycats from China. I think there is a lot to be loved in the new 4's grille design, you just need to keep an open mind (and eye)!
@@ManlyHK1 With all due respect, but you seem to miss the point of the video slightly. Just to be 100% clear and prevent confusion: it is stated the grille is not the problem. 😉
Once you see it, you can‘t unsee it
Indeed! 😖
Thank you, I really enjoyed your design review. It was interesting to hear a much more informed explanation of my own opinion that the design looks "a bit busy"
Thanks for getting in touch, glad you enjoyed the video! Many more on this channel on our projects and other, production cars.
Good video. Great to see others feel similar. I was going to buy a new M3, but the new design is a killer for me, especially that beaver teeth grill. Too bad, they have ruined that car. The E46 was the best design to date and is still somehow classy after all these years if even a bit dated.
Thanks for tuning in. A true shame indeed BMW is completely pushing away excisting and new clients interested in their products. They will surely drive great - but they also definitely look terrible now and lost all BMW soul.
Please please please do this for the new M2 compared to the previous m2 competition. Love this
Thanks for tuning in and for sharing your thoughts. Glad you enjoyed it! We've got a selection of other BMW videos on this channel, hope you'll enjoy these too!
I'm a designer myself, not even close to a car designer, but you are basically pointing out my issues with this car!!
The grill is cool, worked on other muscles cars but, it has its own styling and does not show up anywhere on the rest of the body.
Thanks for tuning in to the vid and sharing your thoughts on the subject. The grill is one of the obvious issues, but unfortunately many remain. The complate lack of regard for the BMW DNA is rather shocking and a mystery.
Just saw this video today, and subscribed! I love the way you have so clearly analyzed and gently articulated what many of us have felt, by explaining just what is wrong with the design. I will admit I just saw that grille, thought it was crass and repulsive, and ignored the car on the basis of that alone, I hadn't even looked at the rest of the design. I have to wonder at BMW's management approving such a dog's breakfast of a design.
Thanks for tuning in to this video today, and for subscribing! Glad you liked the analyzing in this vid. Very understanable that the grille stood out most. Unfortunately, the deeper layer of car design is hardly ever discussed in car magazines or videos of regular magazines, hence this series! We have a selection of other videos on both others and our car design, which you might like.
We, indeed, all wonder at BMW's management approving such a dog's breakfast of a design... Such a shame, isn't it?!
I really enjoyed this! Makes you look differently to cars.
Thanks for getting in touch, glad you enjoyed the video and that it makes you look differently at cars. That was the goal! We have a selection of other videos you might enjoy to, looking at other motorcars and our own coachbuilding work in more detail!
The side profile of the M4 is what bothers me most. I will get used to the big grille but the side profile is triggering... especially the rear 3/4. It’s like they threw away everything from its predecessors. Sure I can be nostalgic, but this just doesnt make any sense. There is a lot “wrong” with this car
Thanks for tuning in! It is the sum of the parts. Indeed the side profile, but also the big grille. Not the fact it is big is the issue, but the way it has been designed and how the solutions are presented. You point it out quite well: they threw away everything from predecessors and their DNA. About 100 years down the drain. Being nostalgic is bad, as pointed out in the Jaguar XJ video, but too much innovation and alienatingpeople and the brand DNA doesn't make any sense either, indeed. There is indeed a lot wrong with the M3 and M4!
You are absolutely right with the headlights. The G30 LCI for example has the same L shape like a Skoda Octavia or a Golf 7. It is ridiculous.
One remark only. The Hofmeister Kink was actually abandoned from the e34 Touring. So it is not EVERY BMW ever produced since its first appearance.
Thanks for pointing that out! We stand corrected, indeed, the E34 Touring did not have it. It surely would have looked better with it though...
Regardless, ditching it for one version (of course the sedan still had it) could be forgiven. Completely forgetting The Hofmeister Kink is a sin.
TBH, having driven one and seen plenty of them in person, it works and looks very aggressive. Not sure if it WAS BMW, but now it is! And I really like it for making a statement from several angles and the road presence it has compared to the last gen
.
Hi there! Many thanks for sharing your thoughts. There is no doubt that BMW will have completely sorted out the driving, they have always been the best driving sport sedans out there.
However, that doesn't mean what they did design wise works for the brand and that it was the correct strategy. Making a statement is good, but it is important one makes the correct statement. That sadly, as outlined in this video, is what the brand did not do.
I believe that any new design elements on a car take time to get used to, especially one which has such a rich heritage of classic looks. Unfortunately there are some instances where this is not true, and the new 3 series design is one of those.
Thank you Niels, for putting into words what most of us can only feel.
Thanks for tuning in. And you are correct: any big new design elements and changes on a car take time to get used to, especially one which has such a rich heritage of classic looks. And sometimes big chnage is needed. See the video on the XJ:
ua-cam.com/video/aGLTWwc8oak/v-deo.html
Or the BMW 7 designed under Bangle:
ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
Unfortunately this is the case in point where the change was missed its goal: this BMW lacks definitive BMW DNA. A car design sin.
BMW is a great brand with rich history. I hope they will listen to these opinions and give us a futuristic winning design in both exterior and interior.
Thanks for tuning in. Much appreciated! For the love of the BMW brand, everybody hope they will... and Mercedes-Benz we'll wish the same:
ua-cam.com/video/sLnyal_cqL4/v-deo.html
I want to see you redesign the new 3 series from your perspective
Thanks for tuning in. For now we're focussing on the projects ahead - but who knows what the future brings!
Hideous front grille! 🤮
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and for tuning in! Yes. And not just the grille…
I am so impressed by this video. Thank you!
Thank you for tuning in! Glad you enjoyed it. We have a selection of videos on BMW and other cars on the channel, hope you'll enjoy these too!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign Will check them ouit! Thanks again for sharing your expertise.
@@danielplasencia7271 And thank you for tuning in!
Great take on this. Ever since I saw the car something was bothering me. I didn't think the grille would have been an issue when I saw it on the 3.0 CSL homage they did a few years back. I actually loved it. But that was because the lines of the car made sense. The new lines do not make sense. I appreciate your thoughts on this.
Thanks for sharing your views on this video. As per the film, indeed, the grille is not an issue. The execution is. The 3.0 CSL hommage they did a few years back was pretty good indeed. Indeed, the lines of the car made sense. Thanks for tuning in. About 100 more video on this channel and one new one each week!
Nice video, but i really like the new design. It is based on some of the old BMW cars (concerning the grill). The BMW design language of the last decade was dull and uninspiring. I really applaud BMW for such a courageous design. The human brain doesn't like change, thus it's understandable that the new design is the centre of so much criticism. Anyways, taste is subjective, so i'll leave you a thumbs up!
Thanks for tuning in. To each his own. This is definately courageous design. Albeit without much strategy. Talking about courageous design: Bangle did a far better job in that regards, which can be refered to as much, bar dull and uninspiring.
Thank you, I love the new design too, reminds me of a mini Bugatti. (Grill vise)
@@alizierny Thanks for tuning in and for sharing your thoughs! The point you mention in itself is a problem though, speaking from a design strategic point of view. It is very important a BMW does remind you of a BMW and nothing else.
@@NielsvanRoijDesign well noone complaints when kia or Hyundai has some lexus or audi elements. Similar thing here, the front end of the new 4 series to me looks like a Bugatti, there is not one person in the world who will say that its a unworthy car to look up to. I understand that bmw must maintain its identity and must not look like MB or an Audi. However the new design in itself is extremely fresh and unique, yes it remind ME of a Bugatti, it could be just me, but it definitely looks classy and high end, not cheap, therefore awesome. Most people who hate it will never afford one
@@alizierny Sadly, you are wrong on many levels. Kia and Hyundai both have excellent design teams, which haven't borrowed from other brands in ages. For years under Mr Schreyer they have produced highly original designs. If they had stolen anything, the statement would have been made here too (for a more in-depth discussion on this - please do have a look at the Kia Opirus and Kia Stinger GT video on this channel too) Both brands did not and do not have any Lexus or Audi design elements integrated in their DNA. The point is not if Bugatti is a unworthy brand to look up to. The point is that a brand has to stand behind its own heritage when reinventing its brand DNA.
I personally love controversial designs like this. I have seen one on the road the other day and it definitely made me turn my head. Perhaps that was BMW's real intentions?
Hi there! Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this BMW!
We also like controversial designs (ee our recently introduced Breadvan Hommage!) like this car people have strong opinions about it. The difference between this, and for instance the Bangle area cars, is that this is technically poorly executed and conceptually weak. It will have surely made you turn your head, but in this case not for the right reasons... If turning heads was BMW's real intention, they could and should have done it as per the Bangle recipe. Bold but well executed. W did a vid on that too. Enjoy!:
ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
The grill isn’t a problem? It looks like industrial air intakes on a factory. It makes “The Bangle Butt” look beautiful.
Feel free to watch the entire film to understand how that quote is linked to the design of the car. 😉
the problem is that I cannot "un-see" the things you have shown me! But your analysis can't be ignored. The question is, "Why did they do this to their most important vehicle?"
Thanks for tuning in to the vid and tsharing your thoughts. One your question: Why did they do this to their most important vehicle? Nobody I know in car design has the answer. Truly nobody has a clue what happened. A shame of the BMW brand, isn't it?!
True the grille isn't the problem, it's only a part of the problem that is, the whole entire design of the car 🤣 it's awful, just awful
Thanks for tuning in! And: yes, that is basically the essence of the video. The entire thing is just a mess. Proportionally not as good as it could have been, bad surfacing and poor jewllery... Such a shame, isn't it?!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign looks like it was designed in different sections by different teams, probably some bad executive philosophy, and no one has the job security to say it's awful, so they let it rest in the hand of customers, unfortunately most BMW owners are on the insecure side of life, and as long as it's new and a BMW they'll probably buy it anyway and then call everyone else broke for not getting it, a lot of denial across the whole spectrum...
@@tommy_g35 Haha. 👍 Well, BMW did a great job before. So it is a shame they have properly destroyed great work done before...
My eyes still haven't recovered from the first time I saw this iteration!
Gott im Himmel, what a mess!
It is a bit of a mess, right?! Perhaps make your eyes relax a bit with our latest project:
ua-cam.com/video/LjuriIe2ock/v-deo.html
Love your channel. Pls create more in-depth videos like this. I always knew there was everything wrong with this car and you've explained it perfectly.
Many thanks indeed. Much appreciated! We have a new video coming up later today:
ua-cam.com/video/oBnvHs-6hzQ/v-deo.html
It's funny that you cant even finish talking about an issue because as soon as you start, you see another one and then you try to understand that new issue and it leads to another one hahaha
Awesome review! Loved the phrase "the grill is not the problem"
Haha, the video could have easily been about 1,5 hours long... so much wrong with this and it is such a shame!
Thanks for tuning in and leaving a remark, much appreciated! In case you'be enjoyed this: we have a few more videos, also on BMW, this one on the Bangle 7 series for instance:
ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
sure! I'm checking it right now!
You know, this issue of the big grill and so much black in the front is the same problem that affronted the 2020 camaro designers.. but they listened the critics and ended up cutting the huge grill. Thing that bmw should have done, but well.. at least Prior Design listened and did it haha
@@Tahio76 Excellent, hope you enjoy it!
Great critique! Very well argued. Completely agree with all.
BMW, please listen to Niels. Please amend your ways!!! From a BMW fan and past/present owner of 335i, M3, M5, X5, X7
Many thanks indeed for sharing your thoughts and getting in touch. Much appreciated. For the love of the BMW brand: this is not the way forward unfortunately.
On the topic of BMW reviews on this channel: make sure you tune in to the one on the Bangle 7 too! 👌
Well done Niels thanks for explaining all the issues, many of us thought it’s only the Grill..
I hope they engage you in designing future updates on this car and the new M2.
Thank you for getting in touch. Glad you enjoyed the vid!
And: BMW can always give us a call... 😁
You really need to do some similar analysis on some classic cars and even some whacky ones (TVR Tuscan, Cerbera).
The TVRs are fantastic indeed. The Tuscan and Cerbera absolutely unique!
Don't you think this is a Great opportunity to design a aftermarket front and rear bumper???? You could be THE STAR
😁 Thanks, that is a great idea. But for now we're (fortunately) too busy with car design for coachbuilding. Likely there are some other companies filling that market soon! 👍
I enjoyed this video, thank you! Of course I hear from bmw fans on social media all the time that the design is bad, but I've never heard this detailed of analysis. I'll say for myself.. I see and kind of understand what is "wrong" with the car, but at the same time I see with my eyes it's yet another special, handsome M3 in the lineage. To me, everything there that is off-putting or not grounded in previous BMW design says "I'm modern and special and expensive and fast" which feels on point for BMW M. Especially once I saw the concurrent M4 GT3, gorgeous race car, the street cars make sense. And to say it's drastically unsightly -- I bet that, as it's been for years now, anyone could mistake an Alfa Giulia Quadrifoglio for an M3 from a distance.. from a side profile.
I wonder if you will take a closer look at the new M2 design?
Thanks for tuning in to the video and for sharing your thoughts. Much appreciated. So far we have not yet looked at the M2, but there are a selection of BMW videos on this channel that might be of interest for your. Please find a selection of them below. This is one on the BMW 7-series E65 "the Bangle Butt": ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
The BMW XM: how bad is it!? (spoiler alert: very) exterior car design review, here: ua-cam.com/video/wrLQ1hJzONw/v-deo.html
This is a really great analysis. Very appreciated!
Many thanks for sharing your thoughts and for tuning in to the video. Very much appreciated. Glad you enjoyed it. Many more videos around here!
Great review enjoyed it more than the car's new looks for sure. Looking forward to others.
Many thanks for sharing your feedback - much appreciated! We do one new video each week! Many great ones around. Hope you will enjoy them!
I’ve had 8 BMW in a row, this 2021, went I turned in the car I’ve loved most of all a 440i with standard transmission, I was shocked at what had been done to the line. If I wasn’t going to get the car I wanted, I opted for reliability, and got a Lexus IS 350. I don’t love it, but I don’t hate it, and the dealer wasn’t an arrogant bipolar nightmare.
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts on the new BMW cars! Quite a shame it has come to this, right? The brand had - as per the video - a truly amazing line-up in their heritage portfolio... and now this!
I agree with everything you said about this car. The grille is terrible, but quite frankly, the entire car seems poorly designed. Well said sir.
Thanks for getting in touch, glad you enjoyed the video! Indeed, the entire car is of poor design. Rather ad, isn't it?
We have a selection of other videos you might enjoy too, looking at other motorcars and our own coachbuilding work in more detail!
To me looks like, the rear from Lexus and the front from Alfa Romeo except for that grille.
The "engineers must have "Maxed" it out when designing it..lol
Thanks for this video, you said everything we all wanted to say..👍
Thanks for tuning in. Much appreciated. One new video each week here!
I grew up riding around in my dad's 2011 535i and I could never quite put my finger on why I loved that car so much but after watching this video I realized the bold extended shoulder gave the car character. Not sure why they decided to try and overshadow it with new random lines... about the only improvement I see is going back to real exhaust tips from the plastic crap on the M340i my dad has now.
Thanks for getting in touch and sharing your story! The real exhaust tips (not sure if they are to be fair...) rather than fake ones on the M340i your dad has might be an improvement indeed. Although it is a true shame the rest of the car is - well - not so good...
Looks like it'd be _Aftermarket Tuner Bumper 2_ in Need For Speed Underground
😁 😆
Excellent analysis, as a designer myself I completely agree with you. Thanks for the video.
Excellent! Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts. What kind of design are you in? Many more similar ones on this channel if you enjoyed this vid!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign I m an Industrial Designer, Will check your other videos for sure
@@cosolote Excellent, great to have you on board!
Thanks Niels... quite insightful. Until now, I was focused on the overall silhouette of the G80 and how it appears close to the F80, which is a good thing. I’ve been much more disappointed with the weird rear diffuser and front splitter than the big new grille. However, you have unpacked some other design elements which are concerning. This tells me that aftermarket diffusers and splitters may not necessarily rectify the styling.
Thanks for watching the video and getting in touch. There is quite a lot wrong with the car indeed, which won't be solved by new bumpers - already presented recently, including smaller grilles. I basically needs a complete make over of the entire body to come close to anything decent.
And then you hear people say Porsche 911 is expensive car.
In current lineup of BMW I see only 5 series as "conservative" good looking, especially the redesigned M5 Competition . But that's me. People love all kinds of stuff and it is great to live in times like these. So many things to choose from.
Thx for video,lot to learn from 🙏✌️
Thanks for tuning in.
Indeed, in the current lineup of BMW only the 5-series is conservative - but that a a facelifted car and will, much like the 7-series, be replaced soon...
Rather sad the brand seems to be so lost...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign ,yes and I understand that push to catch new markets and different buyers. But you do that with "wholesale" models. These ones like the M3,M5 or RS from Audi,you simply can't afford to make mistake. I'll refer to 911 again,every new model, they find something from the past to incorporate it into new. And buyers like it. Btw I'm out of automotive industry since 2006 but before that I was in Volvo. Having opportunities to see and work in finalization of cars like S60R,XC90... testing and things like that 😁. Met many designers with various brainstorming levels,but as you said in video,board didn't want to lose heads over futuristic design before time.
@@greenlightning6971 No car designer or industry expert I know understands what has happened at BMW... This is just poor work, full stop. And dangerous too, to be fair.
Nice to her you worked in the industry. We haven't discussed the XC90 nor S60/V70 yet, but did make a vid on other Volvo's.
The 262C:
ua-cam.com/video/0Vwffso0oyo/v-deo.html
And the V50 (S40, C30, C70)
ua-cam.com/video/RttFfDhH__U/v-deo.html
Enjoy!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign Ty, oh yes please ,XC90. Would like to hear your thoughts on this model.
We had few issues with preproduction models on testing and all was sorted out in no time. We had headlights calibration issues because of specific positioning and unique way of getting them fixed on to frame. It was the first car where you didn't needed to strip half of the front end to get to light bulbs 😁.
And second issue was with parking brake. They made it like Mercedes used to do,left foot parking brake and release for it under headlights switch. It wasn't releasing. Spreading mechanism that was below central armrest needed to be located different. Because the interior designer made something no one made before. You could take out central armrest totally out of the place with just one move and bring forth the child middle seat from rear bench forward on rails. With it's own belt. This was just one small piece of thinking process Incorporated in final design. So many things are made for this car,it was built like a tank.
New one,omg even more beautiful.
@@greenlightning6971 Thanks for sharing all that. Very interesting insights. Remember driving these too! In The Netherlands the D5 an 2.5T were most popular... some daring clients took the V8! The first gen XC90 was a great car for Volvo in many ways.
Understood from people within the industry the XC90 in itself was cancelled a few times before the first gen car was finally pushed through and made it to production. Is that correct?
I'm wondering why the headlights aren't twin round whereas the exhausts are, why not mess with the tail pipes too
Haha, indeed. So. Many. Questions.
The grille isn't the only problem, but it's definitely a problem. It takes up too much vertical space on the front of the car. It shouldn't extend down past bumper level as 1 piece on each side.
Thanks for tuning in! 👍 It absolutely is a massive issue, indeed. The real problem however lies not in the size of the grille but the ideas behind the design language, which led to this grille and to the rest of the car. That's the essence of what the video is about.
Very cool video. I'm amazed that the newest 340i looks so good yet they messed up the M3 so badly.
Thanks for tuning in to the vid and sharing your thoughts. One could argue the cars share the same base, so many of the issues remain in the regular 3 and 4 too... A shame of the BMW brand, isn't it?
@@NielsvanRoijDesign I totally agree. I understand wanting to push boundaries and that means sometimes people are not going to be in love with specific changes right away. But in this case, they seems like they have ignored some basic automotive design principles. I really like other aspects of the car (interior, performance) but I'm hoping the exterior design can be refined for the mid-cycle refresh. Keep up the great content!
@@amiller2121 To push boundaries is very BMW. And rightfully so. And that means sometimes people are not going to be liking what the brand does, indeed. The Bangle area cars for instance also got sharp critique. The changes here however are very different from those Bangle initiated:
ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
As per your message: they have ignored some basic automotive design principles...
Great commentary! Personally I think the introduction of the hexagonal design concept is the worst mistake!
Many thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts - much appreciated.
Indeed, the ideas are rather terrible. Such a missed opportunity - isn't it?!
So eloquently said. I’ve looked at it for a while and couldn’t work out why I hated it. Your explanation provides the answers.
Many thanks for tuning in! And for sharing your thoughts: very much appreciated.
👍
Glad the explanation provided the answers! More similar vids here - hope you enjoy them:
ua-cam.com/video/7Eulyz1zj8s/v-deo.html
Hopefully they can fix it with the LCI like they did with the E90.
Who knows... would be good! And needed...
Different subject but interesting nevertheless: make sure you get notified of the launch of our BReadvan Hommage - today in only a few hours!
After watching, I think I like it more
Thank you for tuning in! Well, to each his own... ;-)
My main problem with the new one is the side profile more than the nose. It's predecessor was much more cohesive and elegant. I think the nose has potential but the lumpy side? No.
As per the conclusion of the film: the grille is not the problem, indeed. They truly lost the plot in surfacing (shoulder, horizontal orientation!) and and graphics (Hofmeister!) and the entire car is just a poorly executed piece of generic car design - not an evolution of BMW DNA...
Can't wait for your opinion!
You'll find it out tomorrow... Watch this space!
The side view rear quarter area appears as if it has been in a collision.
Thanks for tuning in, hope you enjoyed the video. There is a whole lot wrong with this gen M3/M4 indeed!
Absolutely Awesome review!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it. We have about 100 other videos, both review on other car design work, as well as videos talking you through the work we did on our coachbuilt cars.
Like I said before this is the Frankenstein of Cars
Thanks for tuning in and for sharing your thoughts. It is a shame, isn't it?!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign it is BMW designers were true artists until the one who designed this one like I say this BMW has a front end only it's designer could love 😂
@@dor1tomcswagger69 😂
This is my favourite video! Every word is so true. I am a big BMW design fan but lately all their flaws in design are outrageous. Yes it is a MESS! To me it seems the (bmw) car designers have way to much time up their sleeves. Secondly every part of the front, back or side seems to be designed by a different designer. And obviously, the never ever met! All their parts are just thrown on without them fitting together. There is so much going on and it just doen't fit together. Where are the days where cars had shapes. Talking about unseeing things like withe the smiley S Class Steering Wheel: The normal three serie has got two Ice Scrapers in the each bumper, now that is very practical!. But they aren't ice schrapers unfortunately, it's another design flaw. Sorry for telling you this but is so funny, and every time you see one, you see it.... But don't tell the owner about this or this video... It is just so sad... If you find the time please review the BMW Z3 Coupe please!
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts on another video!
We're big BMW design fan's here too (see video on the 7 series!) but, indeed, lately their flaws in design are outrageous.
There is so much going on indeed, all a matter of poor design leadship, to be frank. No nice way around it.
I'm not a fan of this aggressive fad that designers seem to favour nowadays. They will sell lots of them them claim its what the market wants so the next model will be even more extreme. What happened to understated? Too difficult to pull off? Another enjoyable video, your efforts are much appreciated.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! Great to hear you liked the break down of this car! This aggressive stuff is A) not ideal, nor needed and in this case B) badly executed. Might be to blame on the marketing team or the board of directors, very hard to pin point who made the brief. Designers executed it though... Thanks for being on board!
BMW just kill their legends… I’m a BMW e39 owner and I’m so sad to see that they went from this beautiful design to this...
They did. Very much. Incredible work but not in the good way. Thanks for sharing your thoughts and for tuning in!
Hi there,
here is a German living in Germany:
It’s NOT called ‚Hofmeister Kink‘! It’s called Hofmeister Knick!
By the way: good Content!
Kind regards
Hi there, yes, you are correct. But it depends on where one is coming from. In English Knick is Kink, and as most people watching here are not German, hence the translation of Hofmeister Knick to Hofmeister Kink! 😁 Cheers! 👍
@@NielsvanRoijDesign oh Thank you!! I didn‘t know this translation (Knick = Kink).
Have a nice day!
😃
@@Furor_Teutonicus14 Thank you for reaching out too! Many more similar vids on this channel on either OEM cars or our own work.
I agree Neils, I do not like the lines on the new m3, to me they are not symmetric and all kinds of lines and shapes are incorporated into the new design. I've had the e46 and im driving a f80 right now. I love my f80 and I just can't convince myself to upgrade it. I understand innovation, but they should have stuck to one semtric line and designed it from there instead of multiple ones and hoping they fit.
Thanks for getting in touch, hope you enjoyed the video!
Within the car design community nobody can relly understand BMW did this to their volume seller cars... Rather incredible right?
And yet people are buying the new BMW 3 and 4 series comp, people who thought the design was ugly are now swallowing their words because indeed the new 3 and 4 series are the best and are definitely a step up from the previous gen. Come back at the end of the year and compare the BMW 3 series and the Alfa sale figures...Sometimes you just have to embrace the change.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts, but, with respect, the video outlines why your statements are missing the point. Change is not the issue. Relevant change is, as these type of informed changes are completely lacking in this design. The video does not speak about ugly or beauty, but about the lack of relevance for the BMW brand. So, in that regard - its relevance- AND the way the briefing has been executed - see mistakes pointed out in the video- this definitely a step down from the previous gen.
I agree 100% with everything you said. BMW had definitely departed from their design language and has followed a trend of the massive grill instead of being honest to its own DNA.
It is quite a shame of the BMW brand to go into this direction, right?
I think it's a love it or hate it thing with the grill. Just like the edsel
Thanks for tuning in! Well, it is not just the grille that was the issue with the Edsel - neither is it with this car!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign not solely the issue. But there's a reason it was called the toilet bowl, among other nicknamed. .. but I happen to like the grill of the edsel. I just think if the front end were shaped differently, it would have worked better.. that's aside from the fact that the body was busy and lacked continuity. Plus reliability issues.
@@yourallbrainwashed The Edsel might not deserve what it is getting. In its time equally bad (or worse) designs were turned out. Once a car is collectively disliked, many will follow that path. The Fiat Multpla (we did a video on that car too, actually) is a good case in point. However, the 3/4 M3/M4 is a modern piece of car design, with modern budgets and talented people working in the teams. There is no excuse for this...
E46 is going to go up in value even more because of the G80 design.
Well, indeed, and the big issue for BMW is that the value of the brand is going down...
What isa door skin?
The skin, so the metal, on the body. The door skin is the metal on the door, the fender skin the shapes on the fender. 👍
Funny too look at this video.
You are a smart designer for shure 👍
👍 Thanks for tuning in!
Thank you. Gives me more reason to keep the old M3 F80. This video gives me insight into why I would stare at the F80 and tell myself wow it's so nice. It's all about the design strategy, shapes, relationships with the rest of the cars designs. Now when I saw the g80, immediately it was a I don't love it, why? It couldn't just be the grill, which is what people are vocal about. This video explains why from a designers point of view. The design is supposed to spark emotion and joy. This does not. Does anyone have Marie Kondo's contact?
Thanks for getting in touch with yout story. Glad you enjoy your F80, a lovely motorcar indeed - and well designed too, as per the video! There is a selection of things wrong sadly with the current gen. A shame isn't it?!
The more I look at it the more it grows on me
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Much like a deformed neighbour might grow on one, it isn't an ideal sight... This is poor car design on aesthetically as well as conceptual level.
Great vid 👍
Many thanks! Glad you enjoyed it. We're doing one new video a week on our own cars or a design review like this one - hope you enjoy the channel!
I don't get how a focus group can say this looks good. Non-designers don't like it because something feels "off" about it. Designers like you can point out the exact reasons why. How did this even get approved for production? Seems like it's saying more about the corporate culture at BMW than anything... Horrible!
If any body would be able to answer all these excellent questions... they probably would earn a great deal of money!
You are partly right regarding side profile, however, the designers have to take into account aerodynamic factors for less friction, so you cannot completely consider a car as if it is an Escher painting...
Aside from some misplaced design elements, the rear section looks promising and having more modern and refreshing contours comparing the previous model but those blemishes are not very disturbing.
As you stated, the front section is not right in any way, especially the grill and the bonnet. The grill's bottom section should have ended just below the headlines as it was on the previous model and the bonnet should have had more feline lines rather than muscle car attitude.
I have no idea how the design of the front sections of these new model BMWs manage to get serial production approval from the related top management in the end.
Can they not produce a car sporting much more delicate lines as they would do in the past?
Thanks for tuning in to the videos and sharing your thoughts.
No idea how the design of actually the entire new model lineup of BMW gets green light for series production from top management...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign You are welcome and me either... By the way, thanks for the enlightment.
@@musicaldracula2017 A pleasure. If you're interested in the BMW brand and its design language over time: more videos on this channel on for instance the Bangle 7 series!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign At that time, it looked awful to me yes, but now, even those 7 series look neat comparing the current crap... :) Thank you for the info btw.
@@musicaldracula2017 😁 😆
Thank you Niels for the video 👍 I can see your frustration and I’m even more frustrated! Only designers can see all the issues you highlight in the design of the new 4 Series, but not only that! Staring from the name and cutting corners with the budget maybe you can make a video why BMW concept looks way better then the production such as the M8 Grand Coupe. I honestly think the guys at M division tried to do there best to fix this design but it’s simply unfixable, pity we have to live with this design for the coming 7 years 🤦♂️...
Thanks for tuning in and for sharing your thoughs. A true shame for the BMW brand - don't you think?
@@NielsvanRoijDesign indeed I would’ve sack all involved! BMW should hire designers who are more familiar with the brand DNA!
@@coolrelax97 It likely is the board / marketing / chief designer that pushes this type of stuff. Many stories know within the car design world of designers being forced to work on and execute specific styling briefing going against everything they know they should do...
Before the unveiling of the new M3 i still hoped up to the very last second that they would keep the front design closer related to the G20 than the G22, even though the front design of the G20 is not as sculptural as the F30 it can still be considered a evolution... they should have kept the experiments for the 4 series and left the 3 series remain an icon... The front lights become more and more diagonal, a feature more common to japanese cars. The vents that are right on the sides of the grills are suddenly stopped by those diagonal surfaces that spread towards the bottom spoiler then suddenly go towards the middle again making the car look like a whale shark that has its mouth open and yes... BMWs have been associated with sharks in the past... but not with whales...
It doesnt look sporty and it doesnt look lean.
In my opinion they could have played it safe and used the M8 as an inspiration... I dont hate the big grill but unless you do something to integrate the number plate it makes me feel like it was an after thought
"yes... BMWs have been associated with sharks in the past... but not with whales..." 😆
Indeed, it all is overdone. Trying way too hard. They did not need to reinvent the wheel. The BMW brand NDA was very strong. The kidneys, hroizontal orientation, Hoffmeister, Corona rings, you name it.
They had a lovely, round wheel - now their newly invented wheel looks very refreshing - being square...
The designers of the Pontiac Aztec thought it was good idea to go bold and futuristic too.... How did that work out? Not an even comparison though, more people liked/accepted the Aztec than these Beaver Teeth...
Well, it worked out pretty wel for Walter White! 😁
Jokes aside: thanks for tuning in. Bold and futuristic can work great, but only when relevant. This is bold and all over the place for no reason. Beaver Teeth indeed...
@@NielsvanRoijDesign .. haha...Yeah, Walter put that one thru the wringer......
@@ro952 😁 👍
Actually I like the new M3, I haven‘t experienced such disgust as most people do, but I should admit that the old one is much better than the new. About M4 - for me it‘s absolutely awful. Also, I was hoping that BMW will release touring version of M3, I have seen some renders on the Internet and it looks fantastic to me with its grills and headlights which, in my opinion, are greatly comparable to the touring shape. Anyway, thanks for the video, now I know why for me the old one looks more attractive than the new one (that the massive grills weren‘t the only problem).
Thanks for tuning in and sharing your thoughts on the M3 and M4! More similar videos around here, hope you'll enjoy these too!
Nice, thats true, the grille is not the biggest problem, but I guess they hide everything behind it. So all the people see just the grille
Indeed. Most people don’t really read surfaces either. So the big graphics up front take all...
Nice review
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it and thanks for tuning in. We have a selection other videos on different cars, as you might have seen. Here is one on the BMW 7-series: ua-cam.com/video/k4LB7thXQ0g/v-deo.html
Please review the new c-class
Thanks! Interesting one indeed. We'll add it to the list!
@@NielsvanRoijDesign Thank you very much. I can’t wait.
@@shoshKid Cheers! Make sure you hit the bell so you are notified of new vids coming up!
I know he keeps saying the grill is not the issue... but for me it is.
In that case make sure to see the video again, as *the guy* explains why the grille indeed is an issue - but that it is consistent with the design rest of the car: horrible too. 😉👍
M5 Grill is nice
Yes - not just the grille, the entire car is better.