Calling an atheist out for putting words in Turek's mouth and then saying "because this college student said this, therefore all atheists are dumb" is such a theist move. (And yes, I'm aware of the irony in that statement)
Ah another straw man argument. Something he said at the start of the video (0:19) atheists resort to. The fact that he uses one anecdotal example to illustrate is not him claiming "because of this one incident therefore this means all are dumb." You misrepresent his point in this way as well as saying he said "all atheists are dumb" when he said "most." The truth is, his claim is based on repeated, indeed constant examples of atheists doing this. The example in the video is just one of many. A very cursory look at the comments on this video alone bear this out with example after example of straw man arguments (yours among them).
@@G4nda1f Excuse my colloquial usage of language, but mind you, though, Andrew does straight up say "atheists are dumb" in this video (8:58) which I think is just the same as saying "all atheists". Even still, if it were just "most atheists" it wouldn't make much of a difference. The meaning would still essentially be the same. Either way it's a huge claim to say that a group of people who don't believe the same thing as you are all or most dumb. He must have extraordinary evidence for this. No, he just shows this one video of Turek with a college student. If there's many examples then show those examples or name them at least. The implication in this video specifically is that it shows "Why Atheists Are Often Dumb: A Christian Response" and yet it's only a commentary on Turek at a college. Just because he doesn't say it directly does not mean it's a straw man. I believe that what you call a straw man is what he's implying with the video's title, its contents and his commentary.
hey andrew clearly you lack a different perspective. an atheist is a more moral person than any religious person because he chooses to be a good human out of his pure intentions where as a religious guy would do it for his bribe of heaven. and you saying they clearly dont want to accept the consequences of their action by believing in god is a stupid argument. saying atheist cant justify moral codes existence is being purely and utterly dumb the reason why ppl dont go around choosing to kill anyone they see or to get what they want is not bcz of existence of god they choose not to bcz thats biologically fit into us to protect our species and remain close. yes i believe there had to be a creator but doesnt prove the point that there is a entity who is all good. and to prove existence of universe we assume he created everything but that contradicts the point of everything has a creator then who would have created god. if god was all good nothing bad on the scale of holocaust would have never happened natural disasters wont happen kids getting cancer is the fact that god is not all powerful or all good its funny that you say you are confined to hell that right there is the proof that you you just believe in god bcz of your ticket to heaven whereas an atheist chooses to be a good human out of pure will.
The guy was not saying that it all happened by accident......he was saying that to attribute the existence of the universe to a god is no more relevant than attributing the existing universe to some other unknown circumstance.....get it?
You really did nothing up around the 3 minute mark. Trying to claim a theistic grounding for morality. Then saying that it couldn't occur via evolution ( which is called evolutionary morality in psychology, because it exists ). But then trying to say that an isolated pocket of humans ( who evolved from the same evolutionary lines as all humans), couldn't have a evolutionary morality because of socio-geographical circumstances. That is literally show casing why it makes sense that it is evolutionary and not thiestic.
Can you explain the reason why you believe in God when you can't even justify the claim that a deity existing is possible? That is an irrational position to hold.
Religious people calling atheists dumb and atheists calling religious people dumb are both dumb in my views. Just love each other and accept each other and debate each other with respect. Just be true friends. Even if you have different views, it's not a big deal.
This statement is completely false! Being an atheist simply means that existing belief systems are not convincing! My idea of God surpasses even the known religions: The most merciful God would not send anyone to hell, eternal damnation and torment. Morality actually plays almost no role in this religion. I can be the worst person in the world, I can only bring misery to others, say the password and you're in! I can be the most moral person, I don't say the password and infinite suffering awaits me! That's the highest level of morality? Why? You don't like science? That's why I respect the Amish! At least they're not hypocrites!
"every single thing in the universe is so fine tuned" - You mean the universe, of which most of it kills us very quickly. If that really were fine tuned, it wasn't done for our benefit... the universe could tuned much better for life than what it is.
Who is more moral? Someone who chooses to do good because they want to? Or someone who does "good" because they are threatened with eternal torment if they don't do it?
@@Diviance Another straw man argument, because once again (bearing out one of the main points of the video) your depiction of our position is a laughable misrepresentation.
Speaking of morals. Why does god allow kids to be born with cancer? Also the laws we have are more self serving then because we are going to meet judgment… murder is illegal cause I don’t want to be murdered? Stealing is illegal cause I don’t want my property taken? Laws were written way before the council of Nicaea
"explain how unreached tribes adhere to these standards" - Really it's not the difficult. People don't want to be killed. They don't want that to happen to their friends and family. They don't want to live in community where that happens. It's not that complicated. No god required. Different tribes don't have the same morality as us by the way which undoes your argument.
Then on to how amazing our consciousness is. We get things wrong all the time. We have to be trained how to think and reason. We have cognitive biases and all sorts of other problems with our mind. If we popped out with a perfect brain, well that would be impressive. But if our mind was designed, the person who did it could have done a much better job.
if you believe that means that you don't know, but then you take these things which you don't know and make conclusions which stand on nothing and if they do than only out of luck and not because you knew anything to begin with, but those conclusions are a big problem, because now you put a lot of thought into a theory that has no solid foundation but says a lot about how to behave or treat others or what ever...the more you have to assume the less likely your theory will be...that is always true, but with god you seem to forget it...and the proof is always "and it is written..."
Evolution better accounts for moral behavior. We are a social species and naturally have moral behavioral traits that we share with other social animals such as other great apes, wolves, and prairie voles. These behavioral traits are rather vague just as would be expected from a natural cause. If a law was written in our hearts (minds) by a perfect creator you would expect the instructions to be much more precise and not differ between almost every culture or subculture in existence and become more refined as time progresses century after century.
I mean, for us to exist the way we are in our world, the universe has to be this precise. And if the universe have to be as precise as it is and all the different constants being the value that they are is cant have been an accident. The question about the precise nature about the universe can only be asked if the universe exists and it can only exist the way it is. There for saying that the chance of it existing is quite frankly stupid since it has to exist. This does not mean that a god created it, it would instead mean that it would create itself this precise cuz otherwise it cannot exist the way it is proven to be.
1:18 - "And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil." John 3:15-19
Hey. I think it is ignorant for you to call atheists dumb. And I also think its ignorant for atheists to call christians dumb. You should understand an atheists perspective because, lets say that God is real, and he exists in a higher dimension. Obviously idea of a God IS incomprehensible to the mind of a human, because he is literally in a higher dimension to ours, we dont understand how that dimension works, and it is COMPLETLEY rational to reject the idea of God, because we are humans, and humans in this 3D dimension cannot even begin to comprehend higher dimensions. In a way, it puts us in our place, we were never meant to understand God, and we don't have to worship "it", why would we worship something we don't fully understand, or aren't even fully aware of? But thats where it gets interesting. You can't think its ignorant for atheists to call christians dumb for accepting this bizzare idea, because if God is BEYOND human comprehension, and BENYOND understanding, worshipping him is is IRRATIONAL right? But that is the point. the entire point/beleif of God is almost absurd to the human mind, GOD IS ABSURD, he is not comprehensible, and to worship him reflects that incomprehensiblity, that absurdity. Doing something that seems absurd and goes against all logic is LITERALLY doing something "Godly", something that goes beyond logic, and you know what goes beyond logic? LOVE. Love goes beyond all logic honestly, forgivness is completely illogical if you think about it, for example, why would you forgive someone that murdered your son? logically now, you have a lifetime of grief and suffering you have to endure and the killer isn't even remorseful, why even try to forgive? these are thoughts you have when you identify with your ego, but to forgive means dissolving that ego, that persona, and realising that this killer had his own upbringing, own struggles and he was destined to do this. its going BEYOND yourself. BEYOND "logic" and hurt. love is understanding. So, LOVING and WORSHIPPING something that you have never met is absurd, but in that sense, you are going beyond logic to a higher place. Just like God. personally, i find that a lot of eastern religions such hinduism and budhism have a deeper understanding of "god" and christianity explains it in simple terms. I've been on both sides, the atheist POV and the theist POV, and both seem completely logical but also illogical to me at the same time. its all just a matter of understanding and mutual love.
Also, I think that morals come from the need to self preservate, not because God created it. I mean in a way, he did create morals by creating us and so we follow universal morals because universally we all have the same needs, which is food, shelter, water, love, social acceptance n all that. And morals just reflect those needs as humans, not because they are beyond us and God told us to do them, just for self preservation and comfort, you dont need a God to know it is wrong to steal because we already have empathy. we dont need stone tablets for that.
0:19 - Yes. They foist a straw man argument on us, all while maintaining a facade of intelligence with an arrogant, superior attitude. An attitude with such little reason to justify it.
@@GoodBrotherGrimm How can you expect to be taken seriously with such laughably ridiculous statements (all while embodying exactly what I described in the original statement)? I am contemptuous of people arrogantly posing as intellectual and superior while they prove themselves to be stupid by the fact that they, in the very act of pretending to be smart, make fallacious logical arguments. You're not smart if your argument cannot comply with the legitimate rules of logic. In the case of a straw man argument, misrepresenting the opposing position then discrediting this misrepresentation is simply moronic, proves nothing (other than your own stupidity and ignorance), and is no accomplishment at all. From just a cursory glance at the comments on this video, example after example of straw man arguments are depicted. Providing yet more evidence backing the main point in this video (and its title). It's one thing to make mistakes. That happens, we all can't help but do it on occasion. But this is not a mistake when it is perpetual (again, as evidenced by a number of the comments on this video).
@@Agoodtree You're making something so simple into something complicated. I sincerely don't understand. Let me try this. God is ultimately responsible for everything. Including the things he doesn't like. Atheists.
![Does God Exist? William Lane Craig vs. Christopher Hitchens - Full Debate [HD]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/0tYm41hb48o/mqdefault.jpg)
Calling an atheist out for putting words in Turek's mouth and then saying "because this college student said this, therefore all atheists are dumb" is such a theist move. (And yes, I'm aware of the irony in that statement)
Ah another straw man argument. Something he said at the start of the video (0:19) atheists resort to. The fact that he uses one anecdotal example to illustrate is not him claiming "because of this one incident therefore this means all are dumb." You misrepresent his point in this way as well as saying he said "all atheists are dumb" when he said "most."
The truth is, his claim is based on repeated, indeed constant examples of atheists doing this. The example in the video is just one of many. A very cursory look at the comments on this video alone bear this out with example after example of straw man arguments (yours among them).
@@G4nda1f Excuse my colloquial usage of language, but mind you, though, Andrew does straight up say "atheists are dumb" in this video (8:58) which I think is just the same as saying "all atheists". Even still, if it were just "most atheists" it wouldn't make much of a difference. The meaning would still essentially be the same.
Either way it's a huge claim to say that a group of people who don't believe the same thing as you are all or most dumb. He must have extraordinary evidence for this. No, he just shows this one video of Turek with a college student. If there's many examples then show those examples or name them at least. The implication in this video specifically is that it shows "Why Atheists Are Often Dumb: A Christian Response" and yet it's only a commentary on Turek at a college. Just because he doesn't say it directly does not mean it's a straw man. I believe that what you call a straw man is what he's implying with the video's title, its contents and his commentary.
hey andrew clearly you lack a different perspective. an atheist is a more moral person than any religious person because he chooses to be a good human out of his pure intentions where as a religious guy would do it for his bribe of heaven. and you saying they clearly dont want to accept the consequences of their action by believing in god is a stupid argument. saying atheist cant justify moral codes existence is being purely and utterly dumb the reason why ppl dont go around choosing to kill anyone they see or to get what they want is not bcz of existence of god they choose not to bcz thats biologically fit into us to protect our species and remain close. yes i believe there had to be a creator but doesnt prove the point that there is a entity who is all good. and to prove existence of universe we assume he created everything but that contradicts the point of everything has a creator then who would have created god. if god was all good nothing bad on the scale of holocaust would have never happened natural disasters wont happen kids getting cancer is the fact that god is not all powerful or all good its funny that you say you are confined to hell that right there is the proof that you you just believe in god bcz of your ticket to heaven whereas an atheist chooses to be a good human out of pure will.
Exactly! Choosing to be good, without fear of coercion or threat of punishment, is the most honest form of morality!
The guy was not saying that it all happened by accident......he was saying that to attribute the existence of the universe to a god is no more relevant than attributing the existing universe to some other unknown circumstance.....get it?
You really did nothing up around the 3 minute mark. Trying to claim a theistic grounding for morality. Then saying that it couldn't occur via evolution ( which is called evolutionary morality in psychology, because it exists ). But then trying to say that an isolated pocket of humans ( who evolved from the same evolutionary lines as all humans), couldn't have a evolutionary morality because of socio-geographical circumstances. That is literally show casing why it makes sense that it is evolutionary and not thiestic.
The question is why one should assume that whatever was the trigger for the universe in its current form can be served at all.
Genesis 2:17 "But of the tree of knowledge...thou shalt not eat" [Hard Stop].
Yea, it is a great sign of confidence in your facts when you call the people that challenge you for proof, dumb people.
Can you explain the reason why you believe in God when you can't even justify the claim that a deity existing is possible?
That is an irrational position to hold.
Religious people calling atheists dumb and atheists calling religious people dumb are both dumb in my views. Just love each other and accept each other and debate each other with respect. Just be true friends. Even if you have different views, it's not a big deal.
This statement is completely false! Being an atheist simply means that existing belief systems are not convincing! My idea of God surpasses even the known religions: The most merciful God would not send anyone to hell, eternal damnation and torment.
Morality actually plays almost no role in this religion. I can be the worst person in the world, I can only bring misery to others, say the password and you're in!
I can be the most moral person, I don't say the password and infinite suffering awaits me!
That's the highest level of morality? Why?
You don't like science? That's why I respect the Amish! At least they're not hypocrites!
Sorry, wrong comment! I meant to reply to alphabeta1337! 😂😂😂👍🏼
If the theists didn't spend inordinate amounts of money in trying to force everyone to be a theist or face jail or death, maybe we could respect them.
This happened not by coincidence but rather because that tribe could better survive and thrive with these dogmas....
Boils down to what you choose to believe.
Dogs will make you warm and fuzzy inside.....and not nearly so harmful....
"every single thing in the universe is so fine tuned" - You mean the universe, of which most of it kills us very quickly. If that really were fine tuned, it wasn't done for our benefit... the universe could tuned much better for life than what it is.
😂😂😂 Thanks for the laugh big guy.
Why do you have to Justify morality if 1. it is written on our hearts, and 2. other sentient creatures have complex moral codes?
For everyone that doth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. They are willingly ignorant.
Who is more moral?
Someone who chooses to do good because they want to?
Or someone who does "good" because they are threatened with eternal torment if they don't do it?
"Willingly ignorant" is probably the best characterization possible.
@@G4nda1f
And you guys are willingly ignorant of reality, since you live in a fantasy world where sky wizards exist.
@@Diviance Another straw man argument, because once again (bearing out one of the main points of the video) your depiction of our position is a laughable misrepresentation.
@@G4nda1f
I didn't misrepresent anything.
You worship a being who lives in the sky who casts magic. That is a sky wizard.
Speaking of morals. Why does god allow kids to be born with cancer? Also the laws we have are more self serving then because we are going to meet judgment… murder is illegal cause I don’t want to be murdered? Stealing is illegal cause I don’t want my property taken? Laws were written way before the council of Nicaea
"explain how unreached tribes adhere to these standards" - Really it's not the difficult. People don't want to be killed. They don't want that to happen to their friends and family. They don't want to live in community where that happens. It's not that complicated. No god required.
Different tribes don't have the same morality as us by the way which undoes your argument.
Keep doing God’s work. The demons in your comments will fail, and they know it.
does not take much intelligence to know a character is fictional. why have you never learned how to know a character is fictional?
Excellent stand up😂
Then on to how amazing our consciousness is. We get things wrong all the time. We have to be trained how to think and reason. We have cognitive biases and all sorts of other problems with our mind. If we popped out with a perfect brain, well that would be impressive. But if our mind was designed, the person who did it could have done a much better job.
if you believe that means that you don't know, but then you take these things which you don't know and make conclusions which stand on nothing and if they do than only out of luck and not because you knew anything to begin with, but those conclusions are a big problem, because now you put a lot of thought into a theory that has no solid foundation but says a lot about how to behave or treat others or what ever...the more you have to assume the less likely your theory will be...that is always true, but with god you seem to forget it...and the proof is always "and it is written..."
Evolution better accounts for moral behavior. We are a social species and naturally have moral behavioral traits that we share with other social animals such as other great apes, wolves, and prairie voles. These behavioral traits are rather vague just as would be expected from a natural cause. If a law was written in our hearts (minds) by a perfect creator you would expect the instructions to be much more precise and not differ between almost every culture or subculture in existence and become more refined as time progresses century after century.
I mean, for us to exist the way we are in our world, the universe has to be this precise. And if the universe have to be as precise as it is and all the different constants being the value that they are is cant have been an accident. The question about the precise nature about the universe can only be asked if the universe exists and it can only exist the way it is. There for saying that the chance of it existing is quite frankly stupid since it has to exist. This does not mean that a god created it, it would instead mean that it would create itself this precise cuz otherwise it cannot exist the way it is proven to be.
this was probably the worst video about atheism ive ever seen
1:18 - "And this is the condemnation, that light is come into the world, and men loved darkness rather than light, because their deeds were evil." John 3:15-19
Reasons? Reality?
You are funny bro😂😂😂
Hey. I think it is ignorant for you to call atheists dumb. And I also think its ignorant for atheists to call christians dumb. You should understand an atheists perspective because, lets say that God is real, and he exists in a higher dimension. Obviously idea of a God IS incomprehensible to the mind of a human, because he is literally in a higher dimension to ours, we dont understand how that dimension works, and it is COMPLETLEY rational to reject the idea of God, because we are humans, and humans in this 3D dimension cannot even begin to comprehend higher dimensions. In a way, it puts us in our place, we were never meant to understand God, and we don't have to worship "it", why would we worship something we don't fully understand, or aren't even fully aware of? But thats where it gets interesting.
You can't think its ignorant for atheists to call christians dumb for accepting this bizzare idea, because if God is BEYOND human comprehension, and BENYOND understanding, worshipping him is is IRRATIONAL right? But that is the point. the entire point/beleif of God is almost absurd to the human mind, GOD IS ABSURD, he is not comprehensible, and to worship him reflects that incomprehensiblity, that absurdity. Doing something that seems absurd and goes against all logic is LITERALLY doing something "Godly", something that goes beyond logic, and you know what goes beyond logic? LOVE.
Love goes beyond all logic honestly, forgivness is completely illogical if you think about it, for example, why would you forgive someone that murdered your son? logically now, you have a lifetime of grief and suffering you have to endure and the killer isn't even remorseful, why even try to forgive? these are thoughts you have when you identify with your ego, but to forgive means dissolving that ego, that persona, and realising that this killer had his own upbringing, own struggles and he was destined to do this. its going BEYOND yourself. BEYOND "logic" and hurt. love is understanding.
So, LOVING and WORSHIPPING something that you have never met is absurd, but in that sense, you are going beyond logic to a higher place. Just like God.
personally, i find that a lot of eastern religions such hinduism and budhism have a deeper understanding of "god" and christianity explains it in simple terms. I've been on both sides, the atheist POV and the theist POV, and both seem completely logical but also illogical to me at the same time. its all just a matter of understanding and mutual love.
Also, I think that morals come from the need to self preservate, not because God created it. I mean in a way, he did create morals by creating us and so we follow universal morals because universally we all have the same needs, which is food, shelter, water, love, social acceptance n all that. And morals just reflect those needs as humans, not because they are beyond us and God told us to do them, just for self preservation and comfort, you dont need a God to know it is wrong to steal because we already have empathy. we dont need stone tablets for that.
Ok that's enough. Very poor arguments and nothing new here. But it was to be expected with a title like that.
0:19 - Yes. They foist a straw man argument on us, all while maintaining a facade of intelligence with an arrogant, superior attitude. An attitude with such little reason to justify it.
So you're just mad because you got your feelings hurt?
@@GoodBrotherGrimm How can you expect to be taken seriously with such laughably ridiculous statements (all while embodying exactly what I described in the original statement)?
I am contemptuous of people arrogantly posing as intellectual and superior while they prove themselves to be stupid by the fact that they, in the very act of pretending to be smart, make fallacious logical arguments. You're not smart if your argument cannot comply with the legitimate rules of logic. In the case of a straw man argument, misrepresenting the opposing position then discrediting this misrepresentation is simply moronic, proves nothing (other than your own stupidity and ignorance), and is no accomplishment at all.
From just a cursory glance at the comments on this video, example after example of straw man arguments are depicted. Providing yet more evidence backing the main point in this video (and its title). It's one thing to make mistakes. That happens, we all can't help but do it on occasion. But this is not a mistake when it is perpetual (again, as evidenced by a number of the comments on this video).
@G4nda1f Oh the irony 🤣 Thanks for the chuckle, cultist.
@@GoodBrotherGrimm Thanks for adding yet another example to the stack of evidence proving the very point of the video.
@@G4nda1f You're welcome. Thanks for providing zero evidence for your wacky nonsense as always.
7:16 - What they believe definitely requires more faith. And yet they are so universally oblivious to this.
You have to realize God is more responsible for the creation of ⚛️ atheists than the atheists themselves. Isaiah 45. 😜.
@@Agoodtree You're making something so simple into something complicated. I sincerely don't understand. Let me try this. God is ultimately responsible for everything. Including the things he doesn't like. Atheists.
@@Agoodtree The relevance of Isaiah 45. is that God created Good and Evil. And that would include the "evil" atheists. 😁.
@@Agoodtree As D. James Kennedy once said. "God doesn't 😅 sweat the small stuff. What's small stuff? Everything is small stuff"
@@Agoodtree God doesn't stress over "human, temporary, beliefs" 😁.
You are such a puppy
Considering everything they believe, "science falsely so called" always springs to my mind as an apt description.
And again