I just love how they embrace at the start and finish. Nothing moves me more than two people who still care for each other deeply despite having differing opinions. This is how civil discourse should be done.
@@tommedia7742I think his point is that these debates aren’t meant to be for entertainment. It’s not a show. I agree that the clapping should be held at the end
@Von.NorthEnd claping on the end for both speakers will never show who get more support from the audience. Even the time of claping to favor one of them, will no prove that person was right or with better arguments.
@@Shaliaj7 The point is that its not important to know who convinced the audience there. The debate is not a democratic process thats decided by the non-random set of people attending.
The obnoxious clapping when each side thinks their team has scored a point is annoying and a sign of the times. I’d be curious to know how many people in the crowd were actually open to having their mind changed that day or if they were there just to confirm their bias.
@@JuntusOrothonjust because you are the same, doesn't mean anyone else is! We're not all sheep! The sad thing is, Dawkins may have convinced her to leave Christianity in a months time and as she admitted it was the only thing that saved her life, will he, you and the other atheists be happy if she kills herself. Pathetic
As an Atheist, I don't want to be critical of Ayaan and her choices. I can't imagine her situation coming from a radical Islam family and embracing Christianity. I wish her all the best.
Thanks so much for organizing this conversation. And also big thanks to the man in the middle. Great questions. Exactly what I needed clarification on.
The way she's saying she chooses to belive the further-fetched rational points of christianity, rather than saying they are a baseline truth for everyone on Earth is a slight tell. I speculate that since it picked her up out of deep depression, her brain has bonded with the connecton and is using it as a comforting factor in healing. Many people will find something that rips them away from dark depression and swear by it, be it cycling, running, writing.. all sorts of things and they truly make a huge bond with it, but religion has some much lore/backstory that comes with it, the brain probably sees it with rose tinted glasses after having a personal epiphany, even if it's true or not. I'm just glad she's out of her depression. :)
It's conceited for humans to believe our views of life are the pinnacle of understanding. We may simply not have the capability to understand it completely. A seagull will see a nuclear power station and happily build a nest there. But it will never have the capacity to appreciate what's going on around it.
@@TonyEnglandUK Precisely. That's the atheist position. That's the basis of science. You may have meant it that way, but those words often point to a "so there's something greater than us ... therefore God".
yeah its hard to reason with someone who has had a trumatic experience and their religion saved them reguardless if the religion is actaully true or not, its true to them. Imo theres was no point in her coming on a pannel with dawkins as it was a personal experience and she litterally says to the audience its all subjective. im not taking away from her story she deserves a platform just not this one
No, she is a political/social/psychological Christian. She joined Christianity because of her hour of weakness and because she is afraid of wokeness/Islam/China. It's the same as man joining Christianity on his deathbed.
i felt soo too but her spirituality also comes from recognising the spiritual quality from the moral foundation with which christianity has civilised the west. to lose this quality would create a spiritual void of the west, thereby causing a rise in Islam which from her experience is quite revolting. If christianity produces this quality, then Christ who embodies it is who she has decided to look up to, indeed looks like she has found her cross and will follow the Christ.
Of course when you first become a Christian it is purely a spiritual experience and then become theological and doctrinal as you mature. She’s accepted God spiritually and she’s been living a life of an atheist, science, and naturalism. Now there’s no doubt that God exist and she will discover God on a personal level and God will guide her in her theology and doctrine.
You mean she has no reason to believe what she believes. She does because it's expedient for her (makes her feel better) or she thinks it's expedient for western civilisation. Whether it is actually true or not doesn't seem to have much interest for her. In my opinion that's a dishonest intelectual stance.
The test of a 'Christian' is not so much a theological or even a Christological assertion that can fit into a neat 'orthodoxy' , but that they can convey , somehow , the living Christ to another person , and this woman does that for me in an extraordinary and real way .
You clearly have some portion of conscience telling you how unintelligible and illogical are your assertions about the man god who can be crucified. I am baffled how humans can buy the most illogical thing to 'save himself' even if it's a false salvation. You're following Paul, not Jesus. Jesus taught that the highest command is Shema, i.e. Oneness of God and Jesus fell on his face to worship the Father in heaven just like Muslims do. Jesus gave the criteria for the true prophet as teachings about the God (Oneness and the Law of God) and he also said the true prophet will recognise Jesus as the Messiah. Now let's examine Paul's teachings. Yes, he claimed Jesus to be the Messiah but Paul out of nowhere claimed that the Law is abolished. Wasn't Jesus circumsized? Wasn't he doing sabbath? Wasn't Jesus avoiding pork? What about Paul? All the opposites! Now examine Islam. Islam recognises Jesus as the Messiah. Islam confirmed sabbath for the Jews and also introduced light version of prohibitive Laws for the whole mankind.
The "test" of a christian is that they believe in christianity and its foundational documents (the bible). Modify that to being a nice person as you seem to, then there is no need or justification for the religion itself.
🎯 Key points for quick navigation: 00:01 *🌟 Introduction to Speakers and Background* - Ayaan Hirsi Ali's journey from Somalia to the Netherlands and her shift from Islam to atheism and then Christianity, - Richard Dawkins' prominence as an atheist and his public response to Hirsi Ali's conversion. 03:43 *😔 Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Personal Crisis and Conversion* - Hirsi Ali's struggle with depression and self-loathing leading to a turning point through prayer, - Her newfound faith in Christianity and the sense of connection and humility it brought. 06:53 *🤔 The Nature of Belief: Dawkins and Hirsi Ali* - Dawkins questions the literal belief in Christian doctrines such as the resurrection and virgin birth, - Hirsi Ali's perspective on faith as a choice and the wisdom she finds in Christianity's teachings. 12:02 *🌍 Christianity, Islam, and Western Civilization* - Hirsi Ali discusses Christianity's role in countering Islam and supporting Western values, - The difference between personal belief and societal impact of Christianity. 18:18 *🏛️ The Cultural and Moral Debate* - The consequences of secularizing society and the vacuum it creates, - Dawkins and Hirsi Ali explore the coexistence of reason and faith. 29:10 *🎻 The Role of Faith and Reason* - The discussion on how faith and reason can coexist and complement each other, - The impact of faith on human connection and civilization, and Dawkins' perspective on atheism's role. 31:17 *🌱 The Nature of Faith and Truth* - Discussion on the difference between comfort from faith and the truth of existential claims, - The debate on whether the comforting aspects of religion make its existential claims true. 33:46 *💭 Life After Death and Cultural Christianity* - Exploration of beliefs about life after death and the concept of a soul, - Dawkins' stance as a cultural Christian and the discussion on the utility of religion in society. 37:26 *⚖️ Islam, Christianity, and Societal Influence* - Hirsi Ali and Dawkins discuss the societal impact of Christianity and Islam, - Concerns about the influence of Islam in Western societies and the perceived decline of Christian influence. 42:08 *📜 Enlightenment and Secular Humanism* - Debate on the origins of secular humanism and its relationship with Christianity, - Discussion on the moral framework provided by religions versus secular humanism. 50:15 *🔍 Comparing Holy Books and Moral Teachings* - Comparison of the teachings of the Bible and the Quran, especially concerning morality, - Discussion on the unique characteristics of Jesus and Muhammad in their respective religions. 56:48 *🚨 Concerns About Radical Islam and Wokeism* - Shared concerns about the spread of radical Islamist ideologies in the West, - Discussion on the impact of these ideologies on university campuses and the response to global events. 01:00:22 *🌐 Clash of Civilizations* - Discussion on the idea of a clash of civilizations and the lack of a counter-message from secular or atheist humanism, - Concerns about the denial of cultural conflict and the rise of Islamist ideologies in Western societies. 01:02:47 *🛑 Muslim Rebellion and Reform* - Ayaan Hirsi Ali's outreach to Muslims and ex-Muslims, encouraging awareness of the dangers of Islamist ideologies, - Emphasis on the need to oppose totalitarian ideologies that exploit freedoms to promote their agendas. 01:05:19 *🚨 Warning Against Islamist Threats* - Ali's warnings about the potential consequences of Islamist ideologies gaining power, referencing groups like Al Qaeda, ISIS, and Hamas, - A call to recognize and combat these threats to prevent the spread of barbaric practices. 01:06:21 *💉 Vaccination Metaphor for Ideological Combat* - Dawkins' metaphor of combating harmful ideologies with a "mild form of the virus" versus advocating for rationality and enlightenment, - The conversation concludes with this analogy, highlighting different approaches to addressing ideological threats. Made with HARPA AI
Ayaan received faith by humility. It’s impossible to have faith with a heart of pride and arrogance but rather by a heart which is “clothed” with humility: “for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble”.
I went through the same journey like Ayaan, it’s a spiritual rebirth, humbling experience where like God introduced himself to me, just like how israelites saw God’s work by parting the red sea.
These two are great friends so it is touching to see them relate. I don't know who could play the role of Theological expert here, but it would be good to have a third person, since Ayaan is "new" to Christianity, and may not yet have theological Christian points addressed.
She became a right wing politician, and generally in European right wing politics it's good to pretend to be a Christian, because Christians are more likely to vote for other Christians without actually thinking about it. It gets you votes.
I can see how it could lead to depression and despair if a religion was your identity growing up and then suddenly you threw it all away without having something equivalent to take its place. That’s losing a big part of yourself.
I’m a former atheist that was raised secular without basically any religious background. I firmly believe that everyone has a God-sized emptiness inside their hearts that only He can fill. We don’t always tune into this - we’re busy with our everyday lives! But if you ever take a moment to really think about it, I think you will find the longing.
Love Ayaan’s point of view on how lost our young people are. Rational humanism. It van also be called a moral vacuum. If there is a vacuum in my soul, I can invite God in, or leave it to my own devices, and unwittingly I’m letting the devil in. As Ayaan says, it’s a choice. Yes Ayaan. I am a Christian. I will continue to pray for you, as you rely on your Savour to walk with you on this journey we call life: all the ups and downs and everything in between, and that God will use your talents and giftedness for His honour and glory. Amen.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali, may God keep you strong in your faith. (2 Corinthians 4:4) The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. (1 Corinthians 2:14) But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. David Jeremiah is an excellent Pastor to listen to and learn your bible in a deeper way. I will be praying for you. You are amazing 🙏🏼🕊️
Oh I see the light alright. It's just a different light. It's the light of science and all the knowledge we have gathered throughout the ages. This light has shown me that God, as depicted in religions, can't exist. I've found scientific proof of this. That is more than even most atheists can say.
How filled with 'humility' is Ayaan, & how blessed with 'Godly Grace'....this is where 'finding the Truth of God' begins !. Clearly the requirements to understanding the teachings of Jesus Christ! No pride , no arrogance! Give Ayann a 'medal for bravery'! If Dawkins is 'unaware' that society has been 'declining morally' over the past few decades, he really is 'blind' in his own beliefs!.
Anyone who thinks Christianity 's central message is love isn't aware of the history of Christianity which is soaked in blood as are all abrahamic religions. And the success of the western world is built upon the exploitation and conquer and torture done by white people over others fully enabled by their faith
"Morality declining over the past few decades " is because of propaganda. It's about money. Religion does that too. Mlns of money rotate in hagj or church, yet there are mlns of ppl homeless, starving. The stick has two ends
But you dont know abut islam. Without lies islam dies. The real islam teaching is in quran. The real islam make muslim being radical. Islam spread by violance and genocide to christian, jews, even pagans since muhammad, islamnlike kilafat. if you are not radical, it means you are not islam radical muslim is a snake, moderate muslim is grass who hide snakes.
@@cathyaldridge4550 The stretch is calling genocide Israel response to Hamas attacks. Shows you were never targeted for elimination for just who you are like what was done to Jews, Armenians, Herero, Tutsi, Amerindians. Show you don’t even know the founding documents of Hamas.
"Come to me all who are weary and heavy burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn of me for I am gentle and humble in heart and you shall find rest for your soul." --Jesus Matthew 11:28-29
I totally understand Ayaan. There has to be a good balance of faith and reason. Apply reason to faith such that it doesn’t make you act like a virus but rather use the faith to enhance your inner being and to be a good force for others .
Ayaan has been touched and saved by Jesus Christ and now she realizes how wrong she was about God and also how far she was from her Creator now she is back home with the King of kings and Lord of lords
You can't debate one's testimony. Ayan who had lost hope is now full of hope and life, how do you challenge that. I praise God for setting Ayan free. Hallelujah.
Aayan has come to truth. Christianity is not completely understandable as much of it is based on "mystery" which is deep divine truth that escapes understanding. God bless you Aayan!
God is not a Trinity for sure as not one of the Jewish prophets in the OT ( and Jesus Christ ( pbuh ) in the NT including ) taught such a contradictory idea that even my 5 year old thought was laughable. The real problem with all Christians is ( as most Christian biblical scholars agree ) is that its primary sources ( both OT and NT ) are not reliable / authentic. Present day Christians are reading ( in any major language ) a translation of a translation ( from Latin ) of a translation (Greek Septuagint ) of a translation ( Aramaic ) the original document of which is absent from the world. We also know that Jesus ( pbuh ) spoke in parables. Imagine trying to understand a parable translated x 4 from its original. Since JC ( in his own words ) was sent for the lost sheep of Israel alone, God even made his mother tongue extinct as his message was limited in time and space. Compare it to Muhammad 's ( pbuh ) message to the whole world ( Brilliant Quran ) original manuscripts of which ( Birmingham and Tubingen manuscripts ) in its original tongue, dating back to the time He lived, can be seen by " people who think " ( a frequent Quranic refrain ).
@@MiladaKaiser Not anymore gods. Her journey has ended with the One True God. ❤ God Loves you Personally ❤️ Give him a chance you will see ❤ God Bless you 🙏
@@paulweikert4285I hope she checks out Hinduism. She can find out 1000s of god in a single religion 😂😂. Then she will come to the understanding that all gods are fake
atheist abdoooools do not debate. They're like muslim abdooools lie all the time. It's not possible to debate a liar. And taqqyya is an intergal part of pdf file atheist religion as it is in islame. Actually, there's no obvious difference between atheist religion and islame. Mupedohammad or mao. No difference.
@@Shaliaj7 I was surprised that Dawkins put up with monologue! Christians seems to do the same thing under nonsensical discourse: evangelize. This is what Ayaan did. Wasted my time.
@OnceTheyNamedMeiWasnt but we’re talking about personal morals and their relation to what’s good/evil. Objective morality is something different which wasn’t the subject of my question. You can believe something is good and another evil, and base your morals around a personal opinion, but it doesn’t mean everybody will agree though. So I ask the question again : How can someone believe in morals, but doesn’t have a personal opinion on what’s good/evil ?
So she chose to believe... belief is not voluntary, unless you're willingly trying to deceive yourself because it feels good and it's comforting. Better to accept a harsh truth than a reassuring tale.
You can choose to believe especially events of the past. I choose to believe dinosaurs existed, I have never examined the evidence myself. If I'm sick I can choose to believe I will get better in spite of the evidence. Etc etc
when you are that depressed and something uplifts you, it can really put rose tinted glasses on you. Many years ago I was on the edge of ending it and while driving, put a drum and bass podcast on which unexpectedly truly did make me turn the car around that day. I have a deep love from drum and bass now and especially that record label that was hosting the podcast. So I sort of understand how the brain connects and bonds with something that saves it and how it is possible to delude yourself to give yourself comfort.
You can choose to believe things by choosing to trust things. I haven't conducted a scientific experiment in defence of the claim that the earth is round, but I choose to believe that the earth is round because I have another type of evidence: the accumulation of dozens of people showing me the experiments that other people have done and taking other people's word for it; I trust them. Similarly, you can choose to believe that Jesus Christ was resurrected from the dead without having looked through all the archeological evidence that is for and against the event (a lot of that evidence being destroyed). If you trust that the people who wrote the gospels and the epistles aren't lying to you, or if you choose to trust that the prophecies written in the Old Testament (such as Isaiah 53) hundreds of years prior to the life of Jesus are about Jesus, then you can choose to believe that Christ was resurrected from the dead.
How does a sighted person describe color spectrum to a blind person? How can you explain to an atheist the depth of rationality to Christianity? The Holy Spirit must lead the way.
I’m not a Christian, but I understand the teachings of Christianity and I respect it. I see parallels with all religions. I used to be an atheist, and came to my own belief in god after my own “rock bottom”. I do not see atheists as lesser than at all. I see them as brave to be able to venture through life without a torch. I myself, needed that “helping hand” from the Holy Spirit or whatever you want to call it. We need scepticism, and what atheists do is challenge the aspects of religion that have become corrupt. They are very much needed for our soul growth. Jesus never judged anyone. He would break bread with everyone. He described us all as children of god. The kingdom of heaven is not a private club where you need a special membership to get in; it’s there for you, if you need it or not. Just like how a truly loving mother is there for you, only in moments where you truly need her. I needed god, but many others don’t, and I respect them as well.
@@janicedobis6490 I believe children should choose their way - to be or not to be atheists. I never told my kids that god does not exist. I teach them what is right and wrong , good or bad according to common sense and the well-being of society. If you claim that only religion/God can provide morality to society, you are wrong, and here is why - since there are many religions contradicting each other, humanity has come to national legislations, suitable for all citizens . I dont see life in grey or black - imagination and creativity bring colors to our lives
Freddy thank you for bringing this to it. Very refreshing to listen to an intelligent and passionate conversation. You did a superb job of facilitating this. I do agree that we can be spiritual bankrupt, I lean more to eastern experience to follow myself. Both individuals are tempting me to read their books! love those red chairs
Yep. I didn't know anything of her when she was an atheist, but the depression and the therapist's remedy - try praying - was when the mind virus got in, and it's eaten all the critical thinking parts of her brain. What does "I choose to believe" mean, other than, "I've decided to embrace blind faith"? ... I think she'll do the atheist cause a world of good by this sad example, but I'm sorry for her loss. And I think it's her early upbringing that's come back to haunt her. She now thinks "choosing to believe" is "humility," just as Islam taught her. She's forgotten humility is admitting you don't know (e.g. where all this came from), and it comes with the simple courage to say so.
If he doesn't believe in God, why does he think he gets to define it for us. Calling it nonsensical? He is full of contradiction. He uses words such as that's evil. He does not believe in God but in evil?
@Benno7844 I know you didn't ask me, but I will give you my reasons for having faith in Jehovah God & his son Jesus. 1) the scriptures have accurate history, as far as we have historically reliable accounts and archeological evidence to verify. 2) all the prophecies which had a specific time to be fulfilled (which is now in the past), has proven to be accurate 100% of the time. 3) I have had personal experiences which are best explained by the Christian/Biblical perspective. 4) same with the many people I know in real life with similar experiences. 5) I could write a whole essay on this, but I'm out of time.
@@Benno7844without a creator we only have materialism. Materialism demands we see ourselves as machines with no control over our actions or path in life. That leaves us as observers into a life we cannot change. We're trapped, cursed to observe our life without ability to intervene. I feel this to be wrong to the very core of my being. I really lack the ability to perceive this to be true, so this, among other reasons, requires I put faith in a higher creative consciousness. Must it be God? I don't know. But I know there's more to me than material. What alternative do you have to offer me?
The way she answers so passionately yet so subtle not to hurt Dawkins ignorance, is amazing. That's the real mark of a true Christian,lack of such Love is the reason why still many don't come to Christianity even after knowing the things in which they believe has no rationality. May God bless her and her dear ones. May God open the eyes of Dawkins and likes, to see the Love of God for the entire humanity through the Sacrifice of Jesus, His passion, death and resurrection, through people like Ayaan and likes.
Being fair and truthful does not always involve being kind....and Ive seen MANY Christians being EXTREMELY unkind if not downright vile in their fight against reason. shes being very manipulative in fact, taking this false moral high ground. The reason being that SHE knows she doesnt have a leg to stand on. This is a political move by her. She needs support in her fight against Islam and Christians are a ready made army for her. I dont blame her in a way....but I believe this is a phase caused by the trauma she has suffered.
Nope. Christians claim logic and reason but can't answer simple questions about the free will they claim God gave us. Except for Calvinists, I guess. I dunno. Maybe you can. Maybe SOME theist can. But I've gone through about 50 to 60 Christians who have the absurd idea that they couldn't possibly be wrong about Christianity.
I've heard many Christian apologists and modern intellectuals speak about Richard Dawkins, but this was my first time actually listening to him. What struck me is that Dawkins seems to have a deeper understanding of the significance of God than many Christians. He even said it himself-if it were true, it would change everything. (22:30) If more Christians held such a profound view of God, the world would likely be a better place. May the Holy Spirit open Richard Dawkins' mind to the reality of God.
I live in Sweden. Known to be one of the world's most secular countries. Sweden's society from preschool to top political debates teach and talk about moral all the time. I am sure it is the same with the rest of the secular world. There is no gap in moral teachings and discussions in a secular world. It is the spiritual gap that is more liberal to fill in whatever you like, from birdwatching to catholicism.
I hope that's true. I don't know much about what they teach at school these days. But I do see a lot of evidence of mind virus infections, and "morality" seems to come in the distorted ignorant form of "be kind" (which is ignorant because it's not about critical thinking, it's about letting everyone get whatever they want, not objecting, not offending anyone, and also expecting everyone else to indulge you). It's the woke mind virus. And I work alongside young people just out of school, and I've yet to meet any of them that have the first clue about critical thinking.
Ayan said that modern secular rationalist society is itself a product of Christianity because it appear in the West and not anywhere else, this is itself a false Christian narrative. Most eastern religions including Confucianism in China, Japan are more modern and secular and arose far before western society get out of dark age at the least. In India Hinduism may have many issues today but the core philosophies have many atheistic rationalist secular philosophies, like Buddhism where enlightenment itself means the existence of God is not important at all for humanity. Similarly there are Hindu charvaka philosophy that denies there's any god or afterlife and lay importance on making present life better for everybody. There are a few more Hindu sects which are essentially atheistic, all of them before Christianity ever left Europe. I'm not saying this as a Hindu atheist tired of western narrative of inventing everything by renaming it in English, but as a secular rationalist who genuinely believes that religions has hijacked moral values ingrained in the human psyche, twisting and reselling them to us again... Just like Christianity has stolen pagan culture like Christmas. So people being "cultural Christian" is more like being cultural pagan. Also since Ayaan seems so impressed by Christianity I must throw some more light on its effect in India. India doesn't have any shortage of its own problem from casteism to perpetual poverty, but Christian missionaries (including "Mother" Teresa) taking people money collected for charity and sending it to Vatican all the while torturing sick and helpless to promote suffering - that's what Christianity brings to India. So are bishops sexually assaulting children and nuns and getting away with it with the influence of the pope. Also the few Christian majority states of India are markedly more religious extremists than non-Christian states... So much for Christian secularism. Since Ayaan has become such a proponent for Christianity missionaries over rationality she's also inadvertently responsible for this...
I didn't hear a point. Just obsfucation and avoiding answering the question. To say she "chooses to believe" the resurrection myth is unhelpful when steel-manning a belief in God. It's too subjective and a bit rude to the questioner
This is a clear joke👎Ayaan cleverly avoided every steps by Richard to go into anything about fundamental beliefs of the Christians and Richard accepted that for her🙆♀️That is a friendly nonsense👎He wouldn't have accepted that if not for friendship sake 👎Just like a building with questionable foundation, but you are telling me to let's discuss about it's beauty and not about it foundation🤣Ayaan eventually dragged him into blaming Islam that has no representation for everything🙆♀️ This is a kind of joke👎👎👎👎👎
I don't see why Dawkins's and Ali's perspectives aren't compatible. We keep our scientific/rationality perspective when it comes to addressing factual matters about the world, and we can take the moral/spiritual (call it what-you-will) wisdom from religions and other fictions. The major mistake religions made was their attempt at trying to make people believe their irrational, unscientific claims about reality were literally true as opposed to mythological, symbolic and allegorical. There's a lot of allegorical/symbolic interest in the mythology of Genesis, but anyone who takes it as literally true is a fool. What people need to learn is that just because there's a great deal that's outdated in religions that doesn't mean there isn't also a great deal of value and worth. The problem is that most people aren't intelligent and want to simplify everything to "durrr, either it's literally true and I have to accept it all or it's literally false and I have to reject it all." Once you get past that it's clear the only sensible thing to do is to separate the wheat from the chaff. Ali and Dawkins are essentially the same; both are cultural Christians, it's merely that Ali wants to embrace more of the "Christian" side and Dawkins wants to embrace more of the "culture" side. It's not day and night, and it's day and later that day.
Yet, by endorsing Christianity, a lot of the ignorant parts unfortunately piggyback with the good part and Ali is unable to filter those by promoting the whole package.
@@frankxu4795 The "ignorant parts" can only "piggyback with the good parts" if people let them. That's what the "separating the wheat from the chaff" part of my post addressed. Is Ali "promoting the whole package?" I've yet to hear her comment on, say, any of the laws of the OT.
@@twntwrs First, science and reason have nothing to say about morality. Science can tell you how things are, not how they should be; reason can only insure that your moral systems are consistent, not that they're good. Second, science and reason don't create stories that mimic the patterns and resonate with the experiences of people's lives. People do not live by fact and reason alone, they live by values and metaphors and emotions/feelings and, yes, fictions; "manifold illusions" as Yeats called them, and we can't live without them. Without them all is nihilism.
@@jonathanhenderson9422 Take away all the reasons why something may be good and you would be left with something that may well be pure evil and you won't know it.
The Lady and her husband make their living by talking, talking and talking. She has choosen a topic that resonates with lots and people and its controversial.... She is not convincing to me at all. Weak arguments
Your reason can only take you so far. There are things which are unknowable and unprovable but which we must consider in our lives. The existence of God cannot be proven or disproven, you cannot be genuinely sure, so it is up to you whether you believe or do not believe. Belief, and faith, are each a choice that you are able to make. You can consciously choose or reject it. Doubt does not contradict faith. It really boils down to what kind of life and what kind of existence you want.
@@chadhogan4979 Since christianity is based on the bible, and many things in the bible are not physically possible, doesn't that call into question the whole thing?
This is what a person says when they simply don't want to keep asking important questions because it really is tiring and often overwhelming. It's a I'm gonna take a break position. Take a break from intense scrutinizing of beliefs, hopes, and big ideas. And maybe they'll resume the questions later in life or maybe never at all again.
@@chadhogan4979Some of us don't have that level of control over our minds. I'm incapable of just choosing to believe something. Either I believe it (which for me is the same as knowing it), or I don't, OR I don't know for sure. With Christianity, I don't know if it's true, but I doubt it for several reasons. Therefore, I'm unable to convince or tell my brain to ignore my lack of knowledge and the presence of doubts, and just choose to believe it.
I’m really encouraged to hear that Ayaan Hirsi Ali has embraced Christianity! She has been such an inspiring speaker for me. I truly believe she came out on top in that debate. My hope is that she is lead by the spirit of the Lord guiding her and to become a powerful voice for our Savior, Jesus Christ.
It doesn’t take much to destroy and it doesn’t take much to join a group that appear to be trending. Atheists and Islam appear to be trending in the west but both are illogical.
@@solidground338 There is nothing illogical about rationality, you are extremely confused with emotions. Of the big three religions of today, there may be a lessor evil, but it is still evil.
@@lhurst9550 You and your father Richard Dawkins lack basic sense of comprehension. Your father Richard Dawkins believes everything comes from nothing, that’s the greatest miracle yet he mock people that said someone resurrected from the dead. If nothing created everything how is it difficult to believe someone resurrected from the dead?
@@solidground338 Your false premise is everything comes from nothing, no atheist believes something came from nothing. The only people that do are the ones that think their imaginary friend poofed existance out of nothing. The fact is YOU are the ones that think something came from nothing, "magic". Every argument you can come up with boils down to you need a god of the gaps, the gaps in your knowledge, therefore must be 'god'. Science has placed your god in a tiny hole, that is all you have. Your god is a mask for your ignorance.
@@lhurst9550 funny enough majority of scientists are Christians, most of the Nobel laureates in science are Christians. Secondly denying or not making an argument on how everything came to being is why I said atheists lack basic sense of comprehension. Making an argument how billions of years something form doesn’t solve the problem of how everything came to be. Thirdly the Big Bang theory was discovered by a Catholic priest lol. Our God is mighty, is through His wisdom we were able to build western civilisation, remove Him and see everything crumble like we are experiencing now. Atheists simply destroy, like I said before it doesn’t take much to destroy. Any foolish person can destroy.
It will never cease to astonish me how very intelligent people (much more intelligent than I am) can in the stretch of a single sentence utter a blatant contradiction that I can see as clear as water whereas they seem totally unable to even suspect it's there.
And the answer to your wonderment continues to elude you? Perhaps your self appraisal is well founded. We are human. We are not automatons. Bar the human brain that has impairment to its emotional capacity, we are never purely or wholly rational. If we were truly a rational species, there is no need for indoctrination, propaganda, cajoling, national campaigns, civil activism, and the like. There is no need for advertising. Why would grownups not listen to reason, you may wonder? We don't make decisions purely by reason. There are many variables, known and unknown to us, that influence us when we make decisions. There is cognitive bias. There is motivated reasoning. So many. Do you assume that atheists are more rational than theists? It is face-palming to witness people who claim to not believe in God because of the lack of evidence but go on to get hoodwinked by pseudoscience and new age rubbish. It is very common in the UK.
@TheSpoovy When somebody says that religion is nonsense, they are really saying, as Ayan pithily emphasizes, that "there's nothing." That we come from nothing, that the entire universe comes from nothing and, therefore, there's nothing in store for us. That alone is a monumental nonsense. If you add to that that the basis for your conviction is science, you are implying that *nothing can be true unless scientifically proven.* Of course, this statement cannot be true either-unless it's scientifically proven. Henceforth, a long chain of contradictions ensues, one more bizarre than the previous.
Lovely testimony. I have listened to you as an atheist. Along with Richard and others. I love listening to John Lennox for years...love his humour in debate also. God bless you in your Christian walk now. Pray others will come to Christ .
This is the 1st debate on religion i have ever seen which was full of nothing but respect. Even the way they greeted eachother❤ i loved this, what a great watch.
I definitely prefer secular humanism to fill in the moral gap. It borrows more from greek philosophy than any religion. I'm not willing to argue that slavery and genocide can be "objectively moral."
Ayan you've put the conversation back 20 years. You think you say something new. But you just sound like all the other religious people atheists have debated with before.
and where is society now? have we achieved some moral enlightenment? Atheism, to her point, offers no solutions - only a rational critique of religion through the biases of human 'scientific' and hyper-rational understanding.
Man, well done to the Christians who have met Dawkins and treated him with so much love and respect that he said, ' I've never met a vicar that I didn't like. They're always very, very nice people.' 16:50
Is Christianity really about love? Is it love for only believers or for everyone else? What we see is mostly hypocrisy, bigotry, racism, holier than thou attitudes, massacre in the name of God, killing with one hand and proselytizing with the other hand. People don't need religion for them to experience love, unconditional love
Yes, it is.The way of man/the world is a sharp departure from God's nature and not reflective of it. When we say Christianity/God is 'about love'; we mean that Love in its very essence is God, paradigmatically. We experience only flickers of that greater good from which all good comes. eg Christian neoplatonism
You should compare the values of pre-christian societies to post-christian ones. An quick example is that women in pre-christian societies were considered mere property of their husbands, while christianity gave then equal value.
If you study the matter thoroughly, you do come to the point of knowing that you can neither prove nor disprove Christianity. Not in the most rigorous sense. So, we do, at that level, make a choice regarding what to believe.
Why does scientific evidence = rigor? "Rigor" would imply thoroughly examining all evidences. The scientific method excludes certain evidences because it has no means of evaluating them. I would argue the scientific method is one of the worst methods of examining reality when used alone. A person who employs the scientific method alone, neither examines the inherent presuppositions nor provides scientific evidence for those presuppositions.
When willingly and fullheartly search God with a humbling heart and mind, you will find him, but not through external means but internally, from the heart and mind.
But you can prove that many of the things in the bible are not physically possible. If even part of the bible can be disproven then you have succeeded in disproving the existence of the christian god, as the bible is supposed to be the literal word of god.
When a person is in deep distress and some object/ philosophy or person gives hope and that changes their life, logical reasoning is often lost. Faith is believing without logic. So even if all the examples Richard is giving are obviously ridiculous beliefs, it will be impossible to change the thought process of an emotionally conditioned person. This is a discussion between heart and mind and heart will always have an upper hand. That is a design defect in a Human being!!
Yes because heart know that this metaphisical experience that she had was true and profound, but unfortunately mind associate it with religion or concept of God that already know and that explain to her mind that experience. For example if she was born in country where culture is impacted by Buddhism and had the same metaphisical/spiritual experience prabably she will explain what was happened in buddhist terms and teachings/philosophy. For example that this moment of shifting from great suffering from depression to peace/light was caused by bringing surrender (from ego resistance) and acceptance to what she felt at this moment and in consequence she can root more deeply to her deeper self so ego/mind self for that moment cannot resist and allowed to transformation happend.
Very fragile belief. She startled when Richard challenged her about the nonsense of God has biological son!!!! She answered that is my choice??? No logic..would intellectual smart experienced person give such answer??
@@InlaudatusProphetahe won’t believe you unless you convince him. Because believing is not a choice for him. Like the concept of choosing to love is alien to him because you don’t choose to love but you fall in love.
I love her coming to Christianity and how she expresses it. My only criticism of Hirsi Ali is how she minimizes the horrible suffering of Palestinians at the hands of Israel, which is an evil entity. Dawkins is sickening.
My most ambitious goal came about after believing for 70 years that the universe was created ... to change my system of belief to the scientific theory that in one form or another, the universe and energy always existed ... no creator ... no plan ... and to believe that suffering of all forms of life ... is natural. If people believe they can't be moral unless they have religion in their lives ... that is a sad statement about the mentality of humans in general. It's as though you are saying ... "I can't be moral unless I fear that a god is going to punish me if I'm not moral." I am almost 85 years of age now ... and I believe that if I treat each situation with as much kindness as it deserves ... I can't DO better than my best ... and "let the chips fall where they may."
You now believe that the universe did not begin, but always was? Is there any science pointing to that conclusion rather than it having a beginning? If suffering is natural why seek to remedy it or restrict it? Who decides what is and is not moral? What if I disagree with you? What authority do you have to tell me I'm wrong when we are each equally the creations of a random process of chance in the context of meaningless chaos all around since always? If there is bad and good, then there is God, because God is, by definition, the highest good. If there is no good and no bad, how do you even know what kindness is? How do you make a moral judgement on your conduct? Relative to what?
@@chadhogan4979 There isn't any "remedy" for suffering on planet earth ... and according to those in religions ... suffering in the hereafter continues for wicked, EVIL souls for eternity. As an Atheist, I believe that suffering ends when the bodies die, as it does for all forms of life when their bodies die. Personally ... world over ... each one of us decides what is and what is not moral ... and it's plain that because we are selfish beings ...we all break our own and other people's concepts of moral codes. As an Atheist I don't have any authority to tell you that you are wrong ... I just have the freedom to debate with you that I believe your system of belief is wrong ... from my personal point of view. I suggest that you try leaving your religious cult to join a different religious cult and see how fast you are shunned by the people who now think you are evil and of the devil. Those in religions are not kind, if you try to leave them and their theology behind. They might even kill you ... while reminding you that you should not have insulted "GOD" by leaving HOLY TRUTH for EVIL LIES. When it pertains to the age-old theories of whether the universe was created or whether it always existed ... that can't be known by scientists or by those in religion. All we have is faith in our own theories ... and I went from investing my faith in the theory that a god created the universe ... to the scientific theory that the universe always existed. We can also put our faith in the theory that the universe started with a BIG BANG ... but no matter which theory we choose ... it's all theory and nothing other THAN theory. Thanks for the chance to converse with you, and I wish you the best no matter which theory you choose to believe.
@@junevandermark952I found your interactions more interesting than this video discussion, it's nice to know there are others that can deal with sometimes uncomfortable truths
One thing I know for sure, Ayaan is trying to switch off her inquisitive critical mind to overcome her depression. However, once the infatuation is fade, eventually she will figure out the true spirituality.
@@TonyEnglandUK and if it is, how is it thag material science, rationality, medication, psychiatrists, everything didn't work? Didn't save her will to live? Give her meaning? Maybe, just maybe, there's something more than having some intellectual high ground to boost you ego.
I'm a lifelong atheist. Nothing can change that. I felt as Ayaan has and went to Buddhism. I desperately needed the talk about kindness, softness, compassion. It was salve on my wounds.It was spoken slowly and meaningfully. It really helped me and gave me something I desperately needed. I never went all the way with it though. I took the best and left the rest as far as I'm concerned. I still bob along once in a blue moon to do some meditation, but im never going to swallow the whole message and commitment. Richard is a lot older than Ayaan. So am I. I adore Ayaan. Followed her career from Netherlands and have her books. Christians offer emotional nourishment too but there is a price to pay that denies some aspects of human nature. I think I've found a balance between all the meanness in the world from humans and not excluding myself at a certain level, and nature and accepting the cruelty of life. Ive found other ways of dealing with things. There is a naivety that comes with Christianity that i have seen played out all over the world with evangalism that has fed into the non Christian young people in the west. Naivety is a problem. I know i will find kind people in churches and go into them for one reason or another at times, but I always leave knowing it is not the answer.
“But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.” 1 Corinthians 2:14
I admire Ayaan Hirsi Ali and I'm very glad that her conversion to Christianity has brought her happiness and peace. But some of what she says here makes no sense at all. For example ---- she says that just as we celebrate the separation between Church & State, we should also have a separation between what is scientific and what is spiritual or immaterial. Huh? The reason we have a "separation" between church and state is to protect individual rights and freedom of conscience. What does that have to do with "separating" science and "spirit" -- a conversation that is not about rights, but about the methods we use for understanding reality. It doesn't make an ounce of sense
I think John Lennox is someone you should listen to as he deals with this very issue. Science is a system used to answer questions about the material world. Faith and religion deal with the supernatural. Trying to use science to prove or disprove faith is to try and use it for something it is not designed for. Think about this (adapted from John Lennox), if I bake a cake and place it on a table. Science can answer questions about the molecular nature of the cake, the color, the shape, the taste. But science cannot answer the simple question: why did I bake the cake? The only way to get that answer is to ask the cake maker, ask me. It is the same with trying to use science to answer the purpose of the universe, any attempt at an answer will be completely false.
@@mikeman3770 Thanks for that. But even Richard Dawkins would not dispute the fact that science can't answer all questions. But what's the basis for concluding that there even IS a super natural dimension? In any event, many religious claims ARE claims about the material world. Claiming that a man can be resurrected from the dead, or that the Universe was created Ex Nihlo, or that biological evolution is directed by "intelligence" --- these are claims about the natural world and certainly within the purview of science. Also, in your example of the cake, I'm not sure that's a good analogy. We know the cake was baked by an individual and we could therefore inquire as to his/her "purpose" for baking the cake. (Assuming the baker can know her own motives). On the other hand, we have no reason for assuming the Universe HAS a purpose.
@@mikeman3770 religion as a human endevour is perfectly fine. There is a subjective aspect to being human. The problem arises when religion is considered to give the answers and explnations to natural phenomena. The church did wrong to the likes of Bruno, Galileo and many others by putting itself as the "know all" authority. Picasso or Messi cannot explain natural phenomena, nor can the Bible or the pope. They can give many a personal experience of joy and fulfillment though!
@@a6hiji7 i agree that there have been those that have used religion as a means to subjugate free thought and expression of ideas. Which is actually crazy considering that science was founded under a religious back-drop. I think Newton and the earlier scientist saw that it was never science or religion, but rather that they both are able to coexist when one understands their purpose. Religion, for me, is every bit as viable and necessary as science. Though subjective in nature, there are effects that are objectively seen.
This man is loved dearly by our Lord Jesus Christ. May the holy spirit open his blind eyes. In Jesus mighty name alone. Ayaan is a brave ambassador for the kingdom of God. Psalm 91 over her. Amen
Yes, thank you, we keep this brave and wise young woman in our prayers, we plead every protection under Psalm 91 over her. God bless her ministry and continued to guide her forward. ❤🙏🏻
The last statement from Dawkins was worth the whole feed but could not have been reached without the whole discussion. So funny, and provoking if you’re still open to having that kind of mind exercise. What is created by man, what works, tradeoffs, planted seeds… and Ayaan is just one of my favorite people to hear conceptualize our emerging challenges we must face sooner or later. Great video!
Dawkins shows 1)Christianity becomes nobler than Islam because of the contribution and the acceptance of science 2) Political Christians are as deadlier as the Islam… Ayaan shows 1) Religion is a choice of medicine for the problems of civilization (depression) 2) Christianity is a subjective hallucination that can improve the quality of life. Fascinating….
@@kerhabplays never did she utter the word indeed but it seems she has a divine solution for a political problem like hallucination though known as biological abnormality
@@kerhabplays A person made that up. Maybe they had a dream...or maybe they just imagined it. whatever. It was effective propaganda for primitive people....and still is apparently.
Ayan is out of her depth. As a new Christian she shouldn’t be engaging in these discussions because she can’t ground her belief in doctrine. I don’t think she’s even read the bible.
She actually admits that she is young in the faith...let her bear witness...remember the samaritan woman after meeting with Jesus? She could not help but testify of this Man who had told her all she had ever done( immediately) ...Maybe there is an audience God will reach here.
@@jonmartin3220 I’m not saying you need to be an expert in the bible, or even have read the entire thing to be a Christian. But if you are an intellectual engaging in Christian apologetics, that’s literally the bare minimum.
13 mins - Dawkins says that “Mary had to free of sin” and that is why the conception of Jesus had to be immaculate. Please note that Mary was fully human and was absolutely not without sin.
That's actually even more to the point of religion being man made. Men in this era would believe a superior being would never arrive through female reproductive parts. And as others have pointed out, Jesus is one of several religious figures born of a virgin. This is more evidence of the man made nature of Christianity
Are these things fundamental to Christian or Catholic belief?...I don't think so. To me, one can be a good Christian even without believing in the immaculate conception, virgin birth and even resurrection. The core of Christianity is Jesus and the love and compassion as personified in him.
I am an atheist, but that doesn't mean I believe in nothing. I believe in humanity, I believe in love, I believe in the beauty of the natural world. I don't need a god to explain things to me. The meaning of life is simple... Try to enjoy life as much as possible while making decisions that promote wellbeing and minimise harm - and learn from our mistakes. Easy. I won't care that I won't be around in 300 years time any more than I cared that I wasn't around 300 years ago. I embraced being an atheist 10-15 years ago. The happiest 10-15 years of my life 🙂
Fun fact: if there's life after death and God exists, Ayaan will be able to tell Richard: you see? I told you so. But, if it is the other way around, Richard won't be able to say: I told you it was BS
@@stevemarkcadavona imagine wasting ur entire life which u get once, to waste on a badly written story by some 2nd to 3rd century illiterate which used it to grab power. You will be like a clown who wasted his opportunity to be happy and enjoy maximum in life. If I wholeheartedly believe that Flying spaghetti monster is real creator and we all go to him, it doesn't make sense. I would rather study Universe than waste 1 minute praying to ur god.
It is true what the Lord say John 12:40 Jesus said, "He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so they can neither see with their eyes, nor understand with their hearts John 9:39 Jesus said, "I came into this world for judgment, in order that those who do not see will see and those who do see will become blind". This verse may mean that those who are arrogant and think they already know will be blinded by their own prejudices I tell you now, if God exist the Devil exist as well. Enjoy your life span of 100 years
What is she talking about ?? . .. "I choose to believe" ... we dont choose to believe in anything . Belief isnt a choice . We humans are either convinced of something , or we aren't. Thats it .
Why debate a fool? Psalm 14:1 KJV - To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
The islamist said there IS God and slept with a child, Aisha (9) . Mlns of his followers also said there IS God and defend that. So, "the corrupt" lies in religion too. They also can kill you for not joining them, and sleep with your wife and make her slave. Because NOTE: they DO believe in god
She says the protesters are unwittingly accepting the framework of Islamism and promoting it (while still being atheists, perhaps wilfully blindly so).
Not everyone operates in a cerebral manner, so Ayaan's message will resonate with others like her. It's not as if cerebral athiests give much heed to the cerebral arguments anyways.
Richard said "God couldnt think of a better idea to forgive the Sins of humanity then to have his OWN Son Crucified. That is a disgusting Idea" First i want to know why is it a disgusting Idea? N second To me that idea just Shows me that He Does Care an LOVE his creation. Theres a price that has to be paid for our sin. And God paid that Price. Which one of you would sacrifice your self to save the Whole world.
I just love how they embrace at the start and finish. Nothing moves me more than two people who still care for each other deeply despite having differing opinions. This is how civil discourse should be done.
So true. Brought me to tears.
Yes ❤
Yeah
Soy
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people in debates like this should be banned from clapping and cheering
That is something called freedom of expression , the only way to express yourself in a very structured debate as audience.
@@tommedia7742I think his point is that these debates aren’t meant to be for entertainment. It’s not a show. I agree that the clapping should be held at the end
@Von.NorthEnd claping on the end for both speakers will never show who get more support from the audience. Even the time of claping to favor one of them, will no prove that person was right or with better arguments.
In your use of the injunction "should" reveals you are an extremist just like all followers of religion!
@@Shaliaj7 The point is that its not important to know who convinced the audience there. The debate is not a democratic process thats decided by the non-random set of people attending.
The obnoxious clapping when each side thinks their team has scored a point is annoying and a sign of the times. I’d be curious to know how many people in the crowd were actually open to having their mind changed that day or if they were there just to confirm their bias.
You're exactly the same. Don't pretend you aren't 🙄
They also both had hilarious WWE intro music, guess it was just that kind of debate
@@JuntusOrothonjust because you are the same, doesn't mean anyone else is! We're not all sheep!
The sad thing is, Dawkins may have convinced her to leave Christianity in a months time and as she admitted it was the only thing that saved her life, will he, you and the other atheists be happy if she kills herself.
Pathetic
Well that's what happens when raised in a SuperBowl frenzy culture
@@wesleytilley I stand corrected 👍🏼
As an Atheist, I don't want to be critical of Ayaan and her choices. I can't imagine her situation coming from a radical Islam family and embracing Christianity. I wish her all the best.
She lied a lot when she was in the Netherlands
How can you be critical when your position is one of disbelief? You can only share your assumptions.
@@sampreece That's a little petty. I'm sure you don't believe in other religions but you're entitlted to be critical of them.
@fabak oh, yes, we all believe your unsupported sniper attack.
She's just lost in religions seeking woman, we must pity this lost seeking stupid soul 🎉
Thanks so much for organizing this conversation. And also big thanks to the man in the middle. Great questions. Exactly what I needed clarification on.
The way she's saying she chooses to belive the further-fetched rational points of christianity, rather than saying they are a baseline truth for everyone on Earth is a slight tell. I speculate that since it picked her up out of deep depression, her brain has bonded with the connecton and is using it as a comforting factor in healing. Many people will find something that rips them away from dark depression and swear by it, be it cycling, running, writing.. all sorts of things and they truly make a huge bond with it, but religion has some much lore/backstory that comes with it, the brain probably sees it with rose tinted glasses after having a personal epiphany, even if it's true or not. I'm just glad she's out of her depression. :)
Q
Very true
This!!...
It's conceited for humans to believe our views of life are the pinnacle of understanding. We may simply not have the capability to understand it completely. A seagull will see a nuclear power station and happily build a nest there. But it will never have the capacity to appreciate what's going on around it.
@@TonyEnglandUK Precisely. That's the atheist position. That's the basis of science. You may have meant it that way, but those words often point to a "so there's something greater than us ... therefore God".
This isn't a debate about "God".... Or Christianity, or religion really whatsoever
😊
Good to know. Wont be watching it
It was at first but at end of debate it turned israeli lobby propaganda
Are You on the wrong video? You must be!
yeah its hard to reason with someone who has had a trumatic experience and their religion saved them reguardless if the religion is actaully true or not, its true to them. Imo theres was no point in her coming on a pannel with dawkins as it was a personal experience and she litterally says to the audience its all subjective.
im not taking away from her story she deserves a platform just not this one
This Lady has renewed my Spirit. Thank you Ayaan GOD Bless you.
Thanks Freddy.
What a respectful & pleasant discussion between 2 great thinkers with such opposing views.
I wouldn't be surprised one day Richard Dawkins can become a Christian. It would shock the whole world.
It seems like to me that she’s more of a “spiritual christian” than a “theological/doctrinal christian”.
No, she is a political/social/psychological Christian. She joined Christianity because of her hour of weakness and because she is afraid of wokeness/Islam/China. It's the same as man joining Christianity on his deathbed.
i felt soo too but her spirituality also comes from recognising the spiritual quality from the moral foundation with which christianity has civilised the west.
to lose this quality would create a spiritual void of the west, thereby causing a rise in Islam which from her experience is quite revolting.
If christianity produces this quality, then Christ who embodies it is who she has decided to look up to, indeed looks like she has found her cross and will follow the Christ.
Yes.
Of course when you first become a Christian it is purely a spiritual experience and then become theological and doctrinal as you mature. She’s accepted God spiritually and she’s been living a life of an atheist, science, and naturalism. Now there’s no doubt that God exist and she will discover God on a personal level and God will guide her in her theology and doctrine.
You mean she has no reason to believe what she believes. She does because it's expedient for her (makes her feel better) or she thinks it's expedient for western civilisation. Whether it is actually true or not doesn't seem to have much interest for her. In my opinion that's a dishonest intelectual stance.
The test of a 'Christian' is not so much a theological or even a Christological assertion that can fit into a neat 'orthodoxy' , but that they can convey , somehow , the living Christ to another person , and this woman does that for me in an extraordinary and real way .
Correct. The cerebral athiest has little capacity for appreciating another way of experiencing world.
You clearly have some portion of conscience telling you how unintelligible and illogical are your assertions about the man god who can be crucified. I am baffled how humans can buy the most illogical thing to 'save himself' even if it's a false salvation.
You're following Paul, not Jesus. Jesus taught that the highest command is Shema, i.e. Oneness of God and Jesus fell on his face to worship the Father in heaven just like Muslims do. Jesus gave the criteria for the true prophet as teachings about the God (Oneness and the Law of God) and he also said the true prophet will recognise Jesus as the Messiah. Now let's examine Paul's teachings. Yes, he claimed Jesus to be the Messiah but Paul out of nowhere claimed that the Law is abolished. Wasn't Jesus circumsized? Wasn't he doing sabbath? Wasn't Jesus avoiding pork? What about Paul? All the opposites!
Now examine Islam. Islam recognises Jesus as the Messiah. Islam confirmed sabbath for the Jews and also introduced light version of prohibitive Laws for the whole mankind.
@@alisterrebelo9013 Perfectly put!
The "test" of a christian is that they believe in christianity and its foundational documents (the bible). Modify that to being a nice person as you seem to, then there is no need or justification for the religion itself.
@@alisterrebelo9013 Typical religious nonsense trying to criticize knowledge and critical thinking.
🎯 Key points for quick navigation:
00:01 *🌟 Introduction to Speakers and Background*
- Ayaan Hirsi Ali's journey from Somalia to the Netherlands and her shift from Islam to atheism and then Christianity,
- Richard Dawkins' prominence as an atheist and his public response to Hirsi Ali's conversion.
03:43 *😔 Ayaan Hirsi Ali's Personal Crisis and Conversion*
- Hirsi Ali's struggle with depression and self-loathing leading to a turning point through prayer,
- Her newfound faith in Christianity and the sense of connection and humility it brought.
06:53 *🤔 The Nature of Belief: Dawkins and Hirsi Ali*
- Dawkins questions the literal belief in Christian doctrines such as the resurrection and virgin birth,
- Hirsi Ali's perspective on faith as a choice and the wisdom she finds in Christianity's teachings.
12:02 *🌍 Christianity, Islam, and Western Civilization*
- Hirsi Ali discusses Christianity's role in countering Islam and supporting Western values,
- The difference between personal belief and societal impact of Christianity.
18:18 *🏛️ The Cultural and Moral Debate*
- The consequences of secularizing society and the vacuum it creates,
- Dawkins and Hirsi Ali explore the coexistence of reason and faith.
29:10 *🎻 The Role of Faith and Reason*
- The discussion on how faith and reason can coexist and complement each other,
- The impact of faith on human connection and civilization, and Dawkins' perspective on atheism's role.
31:17 *🌱 The Nature of Faith and Truth*
- Discussion on the difference between comfort from faith and the truth of existential claims,
- The debate on whether the comforting aspects of religion make its existential claims true.
33:46 *💭 Life After Death and Cultural Christianity*
- Exploration of beliefs about life after death and the concept of a soul,
- Dawkins' stance as a cultural Christian and the discussion on the utility of religion in society.
37:26 *⚖️ Islam, Christianity, and Societal Influence*
- Hirsi Ali and Dawkins discuss the societal impact of Christianity and Islam,
- Concerns about the influence of Islam in Western societies and the perceived decline of Christian influence.
42:08 *📜 Enlightenment and Secular Humanism*
- Debate on the origins of secular humanism and its relationship with Christianity,
- Discussion on the moral framework provided by religions versus secular humanism.
50:15 *🔍 Comparing Holy Books and Moral Teachings*
- Comparison of the teachings of the Bible and the Quran, especially concerning morality,
- Discussion on the unique characteristics of Jesus and Muhammad in their respective religions.
56:48 *🚨 Concerns About Radical Islam and Wokeism*
- Shared concerns about the spread of radical Islamist ideologies in the West,
- Discussion on the impact of these ideologies on university campuses and the response to global events.
01:00:22 *🌐 Clash of Civilizations*
- Discussion on the idea of a clash of civilizations and the lack of a counter-message from secular or atheist humanism,
- Concerns about the denial of cultural conflict and the rise of Islamist ideologies in Western societies.
01:02:47 *🛑 Muslim Rebellion and Reform*
- Ayaan Hirsi Ali's outreach to Muslims and ex-Muslims, encouraging awareness of the dangers of Islamist ideologies,
- Emphasis on the need to oppose totalitarian ideologies that exploit freedoms to promote their agendas.
01:05:19 *🚨 Warning Against Islamist Threats*
- Ali's warnings about the potential consequences of Islamist ideologies gaining power, referencing groups like Al Qaeda, ISIS, and Hamas,
- A call to recognize and combat these threats to prevent the spread of barbaric practices.
01:06:21 *💉 Vaccination Metaphor for Ideological Combat*
- Dawkins' metaphor of combating harmful ideologies with a "mild form of the virus" versus advocating for rationality and enlightenment,
- The conversation concludes with this analogy, highlighting different approaches to addressing ideological threats.
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Ayaan received faith by humility. It’s impossible to have faith with a heart of pride and arrogance but rather
by a heart which is
“clothed” with humility: “for God resisteth the proud, and giveth grace to the humble”.
And all those 'humble' inquisition enablers then? Learn your history!
I went through the same journey like Ayaan, it’s a spiritual rebirth, humbling experience where like God introduced himself to me, just like how israelites saw God’s work by parting the red sea.
Even wounded animals seek out their enemies for help.
This only shows that faith is born from an egocentric will to live.
These two are great friends so it is touching to see them relate. I don't know who could play the role of Theological expert here, but it would be good to have a third person, since Ayaan is "new" to Christianity, and may not yet have theological Christian points addressed.
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She became a right wing politician, and generally in European right wing politics it's good to pretend to be a Christian, because Christians are more likely to vote for other Christians without actually thinking about it. It gets you votes.
I can see how it could lead to depression and despair if a religion was your identity growing up and then suddenly you threw it all away without having something equivalent to take its place. That’s losing a big part of yourself.
I think it was much later when the depression came, not when she i initially lost her Muslim faith.
I’m a former atheist that was raised secular without basically any religious background. I firmly believe that everyone has a God-sized emptiness inside their hearts that only He can fill. We don’t always tune into this - we’re busy with our everyday lives! But if you ever take a moment to really think about it, I think you will find the longing.
I think that it specifically was while she was an atheist.
@@mrscharmless
How can you claim everyone
has a God sized emptiness
when no one knows the size
of any of the Gods.
@@FoursWithin God is eternal.
Love Ayaan’s point of view on how lost our young people are. Rational humanism. It van also be called a moral vacuum. If there is a vacuum in my soul, I can invite God in, or leave it to my own devices, and unwittingly I’m letting the devil in. As Ayaan says, it’s a choice. Yes Ayaan. I am a Christian. I will continue to pray for you, as you rely on your Savour to walk with you on this journey we call life: all the ups and downs and everything in between, and that God will use your talents and giftedness for His honour and glory. Amen.
Ayaan Hirsi Ali, may God keep you strong in your faith. (2 Corinthians 4:4) The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel that displays the glory of Christ, who is the image of God. (1 Corinthians 2:14) But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. David Jeremiah is an excellent Pastor to listen to and learn your bible in a deeper way. I will be praying for you. You are amazing 🙏🏼🕊️
Oh I see the light alright. It's just a different light. It's the light of science and all the knowledge we have gathered throughout the ages.
This light has shown me that God, as depicted in religions, can't exist. I've found scientific proof of this. That is more than even most atheists can say.
Wow what a woman with such brilliance and humility!! Great debate!
It’s not a debate just a conversation.
What's the difference?
How filled with 'humility' is Ayaan, & how blessed with 'Godly Grace'....this is where 'finding the Truth of God' begins !. Clearly the requirements to understanding the teachings of Jesus Christ! No pride , no arrogance! Give Ayann a 'medal for bravery'!
If Dawkins is 'unaware' that society has been 'declining morally' over the past few decades, he really is 'blind' in his own beliefs!.
Bingo
Anyone who thinks Christianity 's central message is love isn't aware of the history of Christianity which is soaked in blood as are all abrahamic religions. And the success of the western world is built upon the exploitation and conquer and torture done by white people over others fully enabled by their faith
She is very confused.
confused
"Morality declining over the past few decades " is because of propaganda. It's about money. Religion does that too. Mlns of money rotate in hagj or church, yet there are mlns of ppl homeless, starving. The stick has two ends
Being anti genocide, Ayaan, does not mean you're pro Islam. What a stretch that is.
But you dont know abut islam. Without lies islam dies. The real islam teaching is in quran. The real islam make muslim being radical. Islam spread by violance and genocide to christian, jews, even pagans since muhammad, islamnlike kilafat. if you are not radical, it means you are not islam radical muslim is a snake, moderate muslim is grass who hide snakes.
Indeed, nor does it mean that you're an antisemite.
@@lettersquashnor does it mean you're islamophobic
Abortion is also not allowed in Islam. It’s strictly prohibited 🚫
@@cathyaldridge4550 The stretch is calling genocide Israel response to Hamas attacks. Shows you were never targeted for elimination for just who you are like what was done to Jews, Armenians, Herero, Tutsi, Amerindians. Show you don’t even know the founding documents of Hamas.
"Come to me all who are weary and heavy burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn of me for I am gentle and humble in heart and you shall find rest for your soul."
--Jesus
Matthew 11:28-29
God doesn't exist. The Bible is a lie.
- me
I totally understand Ayaan. There has to be a good balance of faith and reason. Apply reason to faith such that it doesn’t make you act like a virus but rather use the faith to enhance your inner being and to be a good force for others .
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Faith in god and reason are not compatible.
That's makes absolutely no sense.
Ayaan has been touched and saved by Jesus Christ and now she realizes how wrong she was about God and also how far she was from her Creator now she is back home with the King of kings and Lord of lords
It wouldn't change "everything that we know" it would change everything that HE knew.
sorry....you have an ignorant definition of "know" it it includes subjective personal feelings.
You can't debate one's testimony. Ayan who had lost hope is now full of hope and life, how do you challenge that. I praise God for setting Ayan free. Hallelujah.
No one is debating her testimony, in the sense in which you've described it.
i’m so tired of how obviously you people are branwashed, i’m not even trying to offend anyone by the way
i hope you praise the same god for not setting million of peoples free. may be he is very picky.
This was an awesome conversation between 2 friends. I wish we could get more of these types of debates
@@thomaswashington2127 Check out Alex O’Connor for more content like this.
Aayan has come to truth. Christianity is not completely understandable as much of it is based on "mystery" which is deep divine truth that escapes understanding. God bless you Aayan!
She went through 2 gods which people created. She still has several thousands to go. From Amon and Aton to Zeus.
God is not a Trinity for sure as not one of the Jewish prophets in the OT ( and Jesus Christ ( pbuh ) in the NT including ) taught such a contradictory idea that even my 5 year old thought was laughable. The real problem with all Christians is ( as most Christian biblical scholars agree ) is that its primary sources ( both OT and NT ) are not reliable / authentic. Present day Christians are reading ( in any major language ) a translation of a translation ( from Latin ) of a translation (Greek Septuagint ) of a translation ( Aramaic ) the original document of which is absent from the world. We also know that Jesus ( pbuh ) spoke in parables. Imagine trying to understand a parable translated x 4 from its original. Since JC ( in his own words ) was sent for the lost sheep of Israel alone, God even made his mother tongue extinct as his message was limited in time and space. Compare it to Muhammad 's ( pbuh ) message to the whole world ( Brilliant Quran ) original manuscripts of which ( Birmingham and Tubingen manuscripts ) in its original tongue, dating back to the time He lived, can be seen by " people who think " ( a frequent Quranic refrain ).
@@MiladaKaiser Not anymore gods. Her journey has ended with the One True God. ❤ God Loves you Personally ❤️ Give him a chance you will see ❤ God Bless you 🙏
@ellenadams7354 how are you sure? I'm a bit overwhelmed with the options.
@@paulweikert4285I hope she checks out Hinduism. She can find out 1000s of god in a single religion 😂😂. Then she will come to the understanding that all gods are fake
This was more of an emotional monologue than debate.
Emotional from Dawkins?
atheist abdoooools do not debate. They're like muslim abdooools lie all the time. It's not possible to debate a liar. And taqqyya is an intergal part of pdf file atheist religion as it is in islame. Actually, there's no obvious difference between atheist religion and islame. Mupedohammad or mao. No difference.
@@Shaliaj7 I was surprised that Dawkins put up with monologue! Christians seems to do the same thing under nonsensical discourse: evangelize. This is what Ayaan did. Wasted my time.
@OnceTheyNamedMeiWasntquick question, how does one can believe in morals but not in good/evil ? Isn’t morality defined by what’s good and bad ?
@OnceTheyNamedMeiWasnt but we’re talking about personal morals and their relation to what’s good/evil. Objective morality is something different which wasn’t the subject of my question. You can believe something is good and another evil, and base your morals around a personal opinion, but it doesn’t mean everybody will agree though.
So I ask the question again : How can someone believe in morals, but doesn’t have a personal opinion on what’s good/evil ?
So she chose to believe... belief is not voluntary, unless you're willingly trying to deceive yourself because it feels good and it's comforting.
Better to accept a harsh truth than a reassuring tale.
Beautifuly said
Jesus Is the TRUTH
You can choose to believe especially events of the past. I choose to believe dinosaurs existed, I have never examined the evidence myself. If I'm sick I can choose to believe I will get better in spite of the evidence. Etc etc
when you are that depressed and something uplifts you, it can really put rose tinted glasses on you. Many years ago I was on the edge of ending it and while driving, put a drum and bass podcast on which unexpectedly truly did make me turn the car around that day. I have a deep love from drum and bass now and especially that record label that was hosting the podcast. So I sort of understand how the brain connects and bonds with something that saves it and how it is possible to delude yourself to give yourself comfort.
You can choose to believe things by choosing to trust things. I haven't conducted a scientific experiment in defence of the claim that the earth is round, but I choose to believe that the earth is round because I have another type of evidence: the accumulation of dozens of people showing me the experiments that other people have done and taking other people's word for it; I trust them. Similarly, you can choose to believe that Jesus Christ was resurrected from the dead without having looked through all the archeological evidence that is for and against the event (a lot of that evidence being destroyed). If you trust that the people who wrote the gospels and the epistles aren't lying to you, or if you choose to trust that the prophecies written in the Old Testament (such as Isaiah 53) hundreds of years prior to the life of Jesus are about Jesus, then you can choose to believe that Christ was resurrected from the dead.
Love and respect Ayaan, please stay safe, please stay strong.
How does a sighted person describe color spectrum to a blind person? How can you explain to an atheist the depth of rationality to Christianity? The Holy Spirit must lead the way.
It's vice versa. You get blind when you are told what to believe in.
You believe stuff you were indoctrinated to believe, it truly is a disease when you cant question your own beliefs :) atheism wins!
I’m not a Christian, but I understand the teachings of Christianity and I respect it. I see parallels with all religions. I used to be an atheist, and came to my own belief in god after my own “rock bottom”.
I do not see atheists as lesser than at all. I see them as brave to be able to venture through life without a torch. I myself, needed that “helping hand” from the Holy Spirit or whatever you want to call it. We need scepticism, and what atheists do is challenge the aspects of religion that have become corrupt. They are very much needed for our soul growth.
Jesus never judged anyone. He would break bread with everyone. He described us all as children of god. The kingdom of heaven is not a private club where you need a special membership to get in; it’s there for you, if you need it or not. Just like how a truly loving mother is there for you, only in moments where you truly need her. I needed god, but many others don’t, and I respect them as well.
@@user-victoriouscenturion I would that be true for the child raised to be an atheist?
@@janicedobis6490 I believe children should choose their way - to be or not to be atheists. I never told my kids that god does not exist. I teach them what is right and wrong , good or bad according to common sense and the well-being of society. If you claim that only religion/God can provide morality to society, you are wrong, and here is why - since there are many religions contradicting each other, humanity has come to national legislations, suitable for all citizens . I dont see life in grey or black - imagination and creativity bring colors to our lives
Freddy thank you for bringing this to it. Very refreshing to listen to an intelligent and passionate conversation. You did a superb job of facilitating this. I do agree that we can be spiritual bankrupt, I lean more to eastern experience to follow myself. Both individuals are tempting me to read their books! love those red chairs
Dawkins is so right when he said Christianity has moved from total blind faith which Islam is not able to do!!
Because Muslims don't have blind faith..... It is purely rational sensible and experienced.....
@@muneebahmadmohsin-jj8bg how hijab is rational?? How women forced to stay un educated is rational?? These kind of things changed in Christianity
@@NageswaraRaoPerivelago educate yourself first and not what your godi media and whatsapp university taught you ✌️❤️
@@NageswaraRaoPerivelaits unnatural for your society my friend...not for Muslims
How is he right?
As always:
Dawkins: This is superstitious
Religious person: I am emotional and I like it
Aethism is the most emotional when it comes to evidence of their supposed claims
Thesis: Empiricism
Antithesis: Spirit
Synthesis: 2 spheres of existence to 1 underlying reality.
“The less theorizing you do about God, the more receptive you are to His inpouring.”
― Meister Eckhart
After embracing christianity, becoming religious again, She seems to be logically bankrupt.🤦🏼♂️
100000% agree(((. Unfortunately, all logic is gone.
Yep. I didn't know anything of her when she was an atheist, but the depression and the therapist's remedy - try praying - was when the mind virus got in, and it's eaten all the critical thinking parts of her brain. What does "I choose to believe" mean, other than, "I've decided to embrace blind faith"? ... I think she'll do the atheist cause a world of good by this sad example, but I'm sorry for her loss. And I think it's her early upbringing that's come back to haunt her. She now thinks "choosing to believe" is "humility," just as Islam taught her. She's forgotten humility is admitting you don't know (e.g. where all this came from), and it comes with the simple courage to say so.
On the contrary, she found the right focus...
@@lettersquash Exactly
I disagree, she is not only logical but has embraced the irrational.
If he doesn't believe in God, why does he think he gets to define it for us. Calling it nonsensical? He is full of contradiction.
He uses words such as that's evil. He does not believe in God but in evil?
May I ask why you believe in God?
Understanding Dawkins requires free will… understanding Ayaan requires evil of intelligence
@@ranomukherjee2630 word salad much?
@Benno7844
I know you didn't ask me, but I will give you my reasons for having faith in Jehovah God & his son Jesus.
1) the scriptures have accurate history, as far as we have historically reliable accounts and archeological evidence to verify.
2) all the prophecies which had a specific time to be fulfilled (which is now in the past), has proven to be accurate 100% of the time.
3) I have had personal experiences which are best explained by the Christian/Biblical perspective.
4) same with the many people I know in real life with similar experiences.
5) I could write a whole essay on this, but I'm out of time.
@@Benno7844without a creator we only have materialism. Materialism demands we see ourselves as machines with no control over our actions or path in life. That leaves us as observers into a life we cannot change. We're trapped, cursed to observe our life without ability to intervene. I feel this to be wrong to the very core of my being. I really lack the ability to perceive this to be true, so this, among other reasons, requires I put faith in a higher creative consciousness. Must it be God? I don't know. But I know there's more to me than material. What alternative do you have to offer me?
The way she answers so passionately yet so subtle not to hurt Dawkins ignorance, is amazing. That's the real mark of a true Christian,lack of such Love is the reason why still many don't come to Christianity even after knowing the things in which they believe has no rationality. May God bless her and her dear ones. May God open the eyes of Dawkins and likes, to see the Love of God for the entire humanity through the Sacrifice of Jesus, His passion, death and resurrection, through people like Ayaan and likes.
Being fair and truthful does not always involve being kind....and Ive seen MANY Christians being EXTREMELY unkind if not downright vile in their fight against reason. shes being very manipulative in fact, taking this false moral high ground. The reason being that SHE knows she doesnt have a leg to stand on. This is a political move by her. She needs support in her fight against Islam and Christians are a ready made army for her. I dont blame her in a way....but I believe this is a phase caused by the trauma she has suffered.
Nope. Christians claim logic and reason but can't answer simple questions about the free will they claim God gave us. Except for Calvinists, I guess. I dunno. Maybe you can. Maybe SOME theist can. But I've gone through about 50 to 60 Christians who have the absurd idea that they couldn't possibly be wrong about Christianity.
I've heard many Christian apologists and modern intellectuals speak about Richard Dawkins, but this was my first time actually listening to him. What struck me is that Dawkins seems to have a deeper understanding of the significance of God than many Christians. He even said it himself-if it were true, it would change everything. (22:30) If more Christians held such a profound view of God, the world would likely be a better place. May the Holy Spirit open Richard Dawkins' mind to the reality of God.
Many do. The problem is evil. You should know this.
I live in Sweden. Known to be one of the world's most secular countries. Sweden's society from preschool to top political debates teach and talk about moral all the time. I am sure it is the same with the rest of the secular world. There is no gap in moral teachings and discussions in a secular world.
It is the spiritual gap that is more liberal to fill in whatever you like, from birdwatching to catholicism.
I hope that's true. I don't know much about what they teach at school these days. But I do see a lot of evidence of mind virus infections, and "morality" seems to come in the distorted ignorant form of "be kind" (which is ignorant because it's not about critical thinking, it's about letting everyone get whatever they want, not objecting, not offending anyone, and also expecting everyone else to indulge you). It's the woke mind virus. And I work alongside young people just out of school, and I've yet to meet any of them that have the first clue about critical thinking.
Fantastic to see a good old debate with 2 sensible people
Ayan said that modern secular rationalist society is itself a product of Christianity because it appear in the West and not anywhere else, this is itself a false Christian narrative.
Most eastern religions including Confucianism in China, Japan are more modern and secular and arose far before western society get out of dark age at the least.
In India Hinduism may have many issues today but the core philosophies have many atheistic rationalist secular philosophies, like Buddhism where enlightenment itself means the existence of God is not important at all for humanity.
Similarly there are Hindu charvaka philosophy that denies there's any god or afterlife and lay importance on making present life better for everybody.
There are a few more Hindu sects which are essentially atheistic, all of them before Christianity ever left Europe.
I'm not saying this as a Hindu atheist tired of western narrative of inventing everything by renaming it in English, but as a secular rationalist who genuinely believes that religions has hijacked moral values ingrained in the human psyche, twisting and reselling them to us again...
Just like Christianity has stolen pagan culture like Christmas. So people being "cultural Christian" is more like being cultural pagan.
Also since Ayaan seems so impressed by Christianity I must throw some more light on its effect in India. India doesn't have any shortage of its own problem from casteism to perpetual poverty, but Christian missionaries (including "Mother" Teresa) taking people money collected for charity and sending it to Vatican all the while torturing sick and helpless to promote suffering - that's what Christianity brings to India.
So are bishops sexually assaulting children and nuns and getting away with it with the influence of the pope.
Also the few Christian majority states of India are markedly more religious extremists than non-Christian states... So much for Christian secularism.
Since Ayaan has become such a proponent for Christianity missionaries over rationality she's also inadvertently responsible for this...
I agree, Dawkins is being nice to her, Ayaan has fallen from pedestal since she believes hers only hers is the truth.
@@VikramKumar-oy8gqwhere did she say that? Your being arrogant and didn’t get the point
Confucianism is not a religion. Get your shit together or you will get Sharia Law, than your gonna get stoned or worse if unlucky
I didn't hear a point. Just obsfucation and avoiding answering the question. To say she "chooses to believe" the resurrection myth is unhelpful when steel-manning a belief in God.
It's too subjective and a bit rude to the questioner
Well said. High time Ayaan is shown the mirror abt Christianity in poorer countries. Her white man version of Christianity aint fooling no one
This is a clear joke👎Ayaan cleverly avoided every steps by Richard to go into anything about fundamental beliefs of the Christians and Richard accepted that for her🙆♀️That is a friendly nonsense👎He wouldn't have accepted that if not for friendship sake 👎Just like a building with questionable foundation, but you are telling me to let's discuss about it's beauty and not about it foundation🤣Ayaan eventually dragged him into blaming Islam that has no representation for everything🙆♀️ This is a kind of joke👎👎👎👎👎
Ayaan: “there might be something and that something is Christianity.”
What a BS argument
Rich coming from a person who loves the country with many terrorist
I don't see why Dawkins's and Ali's perspectives aren't compatible. We keep our scientific/rationality perspective when it comes to addressing factual matters about the world, and we can take the moral/spiritual (call it what-you-will) wisdom from religions and other fictions. The major mistake religions made was their attempt at trying to make people believe their irrational, unscientific claims about reality were literally true as opposed to mythological, symbolic and allegorical. There's a lot of allegorical/symbolic interest in the mythology of Genesis, but anyone who takes it as literally true is a fool.
What people need to learn is that just because there's a great deal that's outdated in religions that doesn't mean there isn't also a great deal of value and worth. The problem is that most people aren't intelligent and want to simplify everything to "durrr, either it's literally true and I have to accept it all or it's literally false and I have to reject it all." Once you get past that it's clear the only sensible thing to do is to separate the wheat from the chaff. Ali and Dawkins are essentially the same; both are cultural Christians, it's merely that Ali wants to embrace more of the "Christian" side and Dawkins wants to embrace more of the "culture" side. It's not day and night, and it's day and later that day.
Yet, by endorsing Christianity, a lot of the ignorant parts unfortunately piggyback with the good part and Ali is unable to filter those by promoting the whole package.
What is there of "value and worth" in religion that cannot be gained from reason and the scientific method?
@@frankxu4795 The "ignorant parts" can only "piggyback with the good parts" if people let them. That's what the "separating the wheat from the chaff" part of my post addressed. Is Ali "promoting the whole package?" I've yet to hear her comment on, say, any of the laws of the OT.
@@twntwrs First, science and reason have nothing to say about morality. Science can tell you how things are, not how they should be; reason can only insure that your moral systems are consistent, not that they're good.
Second, science and reason don't create stories that mimic the patterns and resonate with the experiences of people's lives. People do not live by fact and reason alone, they live by values and metaphors and emotions/feelings and, yes, fictions; "manifold illusions" as Yeats called them, and we can't live without them. Without them all is nihilism.
@@jonathanhenderson9422 Take away all the reasons why something may be good and you would be left with something that may well be pure evil and you won't know it.
Fantastic moderation of the discussion, wow
One word debunks all spiritual religions. Even the Vatican acknowledges that it's fact.
EVOLUTION !
It is still just a theory.
The Lady and her husband make their living by talking, talking and talking. She has choosen a topic that resonates with lots and people and its controversial.... She is not convincing to me at all. Weak arguments
Her husband has worked to open the Uni of Austen, Texas.
Yes, ‘weak’ was the word i thought of during the whole conversation.
A person who's definition of evidence is defined in a materialist, scientific sense, will view anything outside that definition as "weak".
And what have achieved in life ? You sound like bitter jealous human .
Her “talk “has empowered millions and what have you done to compare ?
:) This lady is more of anti Islam than is faithful about christianity.
' I choose to believe...' What the hell does that even mean?!?!
Your reason can only take you so far. There are things which are unknowable and unprovable but which we must consider in our lives.
The existence of God cannot be proven or disproven, you cannot be genuinely sure, so it is up to you whether you believe or do not believe. Belief, and faith, are each a choice that you are able to make. You can consciously choose or reject it. Doubt does not contradict faith. It really boils down to what kind of life and what kind of existence you want.
That truth is irrelevant for her.
@@chadhogan4979 Since christianity is based on the bible, and many things in the bible are not physically possible, doesn't that call into question the whole thing?
This is what a person says when they simply don't want to keep asking important questions because it really is tiring and often overwhelming.
It's a I'm gonna take a break position. Take a break from intense scrutinizing of beliefs, hopes, and big ideas.
And maybe they'll resume the questions later in life or maybe never at all again.
@@chadhogan4979Some of us don't have that level of control over our minds. I'm incapable of just choosing to believe something. Either I believe it (which for me is the same as knowing it), or I don't, OR I don't know for sure. With Christianity, I don't know if it's true, but I doubt it for several reasons. Therefore, I'm unable to convince or tell my brain to ignore my lack of knowledge and the presence of doubts, and just choose to believe it.
Kudos Ayaan, Jesus Christ will protect you, Amen
I’m really encouraged to hear that Ayaan Hirsi Ali has embraced Christianity! She has been such an inspiring speaker for me. I truly believe she came out on top in that debate. My hope is that she is lead by the spirit of the Lord guiding her and to become a powerful voice for our Savior, Jesus Christ.
People do need something, but the way forward is not a LIE. No matter how pretty you think the lie is.
It doesn’t take much to destroy and it doesn’t take much to join a group that appear to be trending. Atheists and Islam appear to be trending in the west but both are illogical.
@@solidground338 There is nothing illogical about rationality, you are extremely confused with emotions. Of the big three religions of today, there may be a lessor evil, but it is still evil.
@@lhurst9550 You and your father Richard Dawkins lack basic sense of comprehension. Your father Richard Dawkins believes everything comes from nothing, that’s the greatest miracle yet he mock people that said someone resurrected from the dead. If nothing created everything how is it difficult to believe someone resurrected from the dead?
@@solidground338 Your false premise is everything comes from nothing, no atheist believes something came from nothing. The only people that do are the ones that think their imaginary friend poofed existance out of nothing. The fact is YOU are the ones that think something came from nothing, "magic". Every argument you can come up with boils down to you need a god of the gaps, the gaps in your knowledge, therefore must be 'god'. Science has placed your god in a tiny hole, that is all you have. Your god is a mask for your ignorance.
@@lhurst9550 funny enough majority of scientists are Christians, most of the Nobel laureates in science are Christians. Secondly denying or not making an argument on how everything came to being is why I said atheists lack basic sense of comprehension. Making an argument how billions of years something form doesn’t solve the problem of how everything came to be. Thirdly the Big Bang theory was discovered by a Catholic priest lol. Our God is mighty, is through His wisdom we were able to build western civilisation, remove Him and see everything crumble like we are experiencing now. Atheists simply destroy, like I said before it doesn’t take much to destroy. Any foolish person can destroy.
It will never cease to astonish me how very intelligent people (much more intelligent than I am) can in the stretch of a single sentence utter a blatant contradiction that I can see as clear as water whereas they seem totally unable to even suspect it's there.
And the answer to your wonderment continues to elude you? Perhaps your self appraisal is well founded.
We are human. We are not automatons. Bar the human brain that has impairment to its emotional capacity, we are never purely or wholly rational.
If we were truly a rational species, there is no need for indoctrination, propaganda, cajoling, national campaigns, civil activism, and the like. There is no need for advertising.
Why would grownups not listen to reason, you may wonder?
We don't make decisions purely by reason. There are many variables, known and unknown to us, that influence us when we make decisions. There is cognitive bias. There is motivated reasoning. So many.
Do you assume that atheists are more rational than theists? It is face-palming to witness people who claim to not believe in God because of the lack of evidence but go on to get hoodwinked by pseudoscience and new age rubbish. It is very common in the UK.
0uu88888hgg😊
0:24
Example?
@TheSpoovy When somebody says that religion is nonsense, they are really saying, as Ayan pithily emphasizes, that "there's nothing." That we come from nothing, that the entire universe comes from nothing and, therefore, there's nothing in store for us. That alone is a monumental nonsense. If you add to that that the basis for your conviction is science, you are implying that *nothing can be true unless scientifically proven.* Of course, this statement cannot be true either-unless it's scientifically proven. Henceforth, a long chain of contradictions ensues, one more bizarre than the previous.
Ayaan, you are so brave as a new Christian taking such ridicule.
👏👏👏👏👏
Lovely testimony. I have listened to you as an atheist. Along with Richard and others. I love listening to John Lennox for years...love his humour in debate also. God bless you in your Christian walk now. Pray others will come to Christ .
Atheists claims are the only truth. Belittling Christianity. We all will face Jesus. And we are all be judge. Till then, brothers and sisters. ✝️🙏✌💞
God bless you🙏✝️
Amazing grace how sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me. I was once lost but now I'm found... Was blind but now I see♥️
Ayaan, May God keep you and increase you in Christ knowledge and wisdom.
Loved the moderation. Good tracking and asking point blank questions while not missing out on the context.
This is the 1st debate on religion i have ever seen which was full of nothing but respect.
Even the way they greeted eachother❤ i loved this, what a great watch.
This lady was once an atheist, being a new convert, she understands how their thoughts work.
I definitely prefer secular humanism to fill in the moral gap. It borrows more from greek philosophy than any religion. I'm not willing to argue that slavery and genocide can be "objectively moral."
Ayan you've put the conversation back 20 years. You think you say something new. But you just sound like all the other religious people atheists have debated with before.
and where is society now? have we achieved some moral enlightenment? Atheism, to her point, offers no solutions - only a rational critique of religion through the biases of human 'scientific' and hyper-rational understanding.
Man, well done to the Christians who have met Dawkins and treated him with so much love and respect that he said, ' I've never met a vicar that I didn't like. They're always very, very nice people.' 16:50
Can someone please timestamp when the debate begins.
Unfortunately, it never does. I'm off to watch some classic Hitchslaps.
Is Christianity really about love? Is it love for only believers or for everyone else? What we see is mostly hypocrisy, bigotry, racism, holier than thou attitudes, massacre in the name of God, killing with one hand and proselytizing with the other hand. People don't need religion for them to experience love, unconditional love
Yes, it is.The way of man/the world is a sharp departure from God's nature and not reflective of it. When we say Christianity/God is 'about love'; we mean that Love in its very essence is God, paradigmatically. We experience only flickers of that greater good from which all good comes. eg Christian neoplatonism
As a Christian, I agree with that last sentence. And yes buddy, Christianity is about love. Love for the world.
You should compare the values of pre-christian societies to post-christian ones. An quick example is that women in pre-christian societies were considered mere property of their husbands, while christianity gave then equal value.
I love you Wilfred. It's all about the love.
If you study the matter thoroughly, you do come to the point of knowing that you can neither prove nor disprove Christianity. Not in the most rigorous sense. So, we do, at that level, make a choice regarding what to believe.
Why does scientific evidence = rigor? "Rigor" would imply thoroughly examining all evidences. The scientific method excludes certain evidences because it has no means of evaluating them.
I would argue the scientific method is one of the worst methods of examining reality when used alone. A person who employs the scientific method alone, neither examines the inherent presuppositions nor provides scientific evidence for those presuppositions.
We can disprove that the bible isn't the product of either omniscience &/or omnibenevolence, likewise the earth wasn't created in 6 days & so forth.
You can neither prove nor disprove the iliads, rig vedas, book of the dead...heck you can neither prove or disprove harry potter either.
When willingly and fullheartly search God with a humbling heart and mind, you will find him, but not through external means but internally, from the heart and mind.
But you can prove that many of the things in the bible are not physically possible. If even part of the bible can be disproven then you have succeeded in disproving the existence of the christian god, as the bible is supposed to be the literal word of god.
Kudos to the exemplary moderator! An exemplary debate! Thank you!
When a person is in deep distress and some object/ philosophy or person gives hope and that changes their life, logical reasoning is often lost. Faith is believing without logic. So even if all the examples Richard is giving are obviously ridiculous beliefs, it will be impossible to change the thought process of an emotionally conditioned person.
This is a discussion between heart and mind and heart will always have an upper hand. That is a design defect in a Human being!!
Yes because heart know that this metaphisical experience that she had was true and profound, but unfortunately mind associate it with religion or concept of God that already know and that explain to her mind that experience. For example if she was born in country where culture is impacted by Buddhism and had the same metaphisical/spiritual experience prabably she will explain what was happened in buddhist terms and teachings/philosophy. For example that this moment of shifting from great suffering from depression to peace/light was caused by bringing surrender (from ego resistance) and acceptance to what she felt at this moment and in consequence she can root more deeply to her deeper self so ego/mind self for that moment cannot resist and allowed to transformation happend.
We all possess both heart and mind. Why bother having both if the rational mind is so obviously superior?
Very fragile belief. She startled when Richard challenged her about the nonsense of God has biological son!!!! She answered that is my choice??? No logic..would intellectual smart experienced person give such answer??
Logic Is of course very valuable. It is, however, not always the correct tool.
She said choose to belive. Nobody choose to believe. People gets convinced . To believe is not a choose
Believing in something can be a choice bro what are you even talking about
@@InlaudatusProphetahe won’t believe you unless you convince him. Because believing is not a choice for him. Like the concept of choosing to love is alien to him because you don’t choose to love but you fall in love.
@@HikeySus nicely described 👌
So to disbelieve is also not a choice?
@@matthewmorrison9255yes
I love her coming to Christianity and how she expresses it. My only criticism of Hirsi Ali is how she minimizes the horrible suffering of Palestinians at the hands of Israel, which is an evil entity.
Dawkins is sickening.
My most ambitious goal came about after believing for 70 years that the universe was created ... to change my system of belief to the scientific theory that in one form or another, the universe and energy always existed ... no creator ... no plan ... and to believe that suffering of all forms of life ... is natural.
If people believe they can't be moral unless they have religion in their lives ... that is a sad statement about the mentality of humans in general. It's as though you are saying ... "I can't be moral unless I fear that a god is going to punish me if I'm not moral."
I am almost 85 years of age now ... and I believe that if I treat each situation with as much kindness as it deserves ... I can't DO better than my best ... and "let the chips fall where they may."
You now believe that the universe did not begin, but always was? Is there any science pointing to that conclusion rather than it having a beginning?
If suffering is natural why seek to remedy it or restrict it? Who decides what is and is not moral? What if I disagree with you? What authority do you have to tell me I'm wrong when we are each equally the creations of a random process of chance in the context of meaningless chaos all around since always?
If there is bad and good, then there is God, because God is, by definition, the highest good.
If there is no good and no bad, how do you even know what kindness is? How do you make a moral judgement on your conduct? Relative to what?
@@chadhogan4979 There isn't any "remedy" for suffering on planet earth ... and according to those in religions ... suffering in the hereafter continues for wicked, EVIL souls for eternity.
As an Atheist, I believe that suffering ends when the bodies die, as it does for all forms of life when their bodies die.
Personally ... world over ... each one of us decides what is and what is not moral ... and it's plain that because we are selfish beings ...we all break our own and other people's concepts of moral codes.
As an Atheist I don't have any authority to tell you that you are wrong ... I just have the freedom to debate with you that I believe your system of belief is wrong ... from my personal point of view.
I suggest that you try leaving your religious cult to join a different religious cult and see how fast you are shunned by the people who now think you are evil and of the devil. Those in religions are not kind, if you try to leave them and their theology behind. They might even kill you ... while reminding you that you should not have insulted "GOD" by leaving HOLY TRUTH for EVIL LIES.
When it pertains to the age-old theories of whether the universe was created or whether it always existed ... that can't be known by scientists or by those in religion. All we have is faith in our own theories ... and I went from investing my faith in the theory that a god created the universe ... to the scientific theory that the universe always existed.
We can also put our faith in the theory that the universe started with a BIG BANG ... but no matter which theory we choose ... it's all theory and nothing other THAN theory.
Thanks for the chance to converse with you, and I wish you the best no matter which theory you choose to believe.
@@junevandermark952I found your interactions more interesting than this video discussion, it's nice to know there are others that can deal with sometimes uncomfortable truths
@@James-872 Thank you. Your support is much appreciated.
@@chadhogan4979 perfectly said!
I prophesy this Mr Richard will accept Christ Jesus before he leaves this world. I just love him.
I prophesy this Hirshi Ali will accept Reality () before she enters The Kingdom of God. I lover her. (and him too. And Him too).
So been deluded
I wish I could pin this nonsense
One thing I know for sure, Ayaan is trying to switch off her inquisitive critical mind to overcome her depression. However, once the infatuation is fade, eventually she will figure out the true spirituality.
What, in your opinion is "true" spirituality?
🦄 @@rosemaryalles6043
I'm not convinced this was a spiritual experience but a desperate and clinging response to trauma.
@@TonyEnglandUK Mr psychologist, keep waiting to be convinced. I hope she books a session with you, seems you know alot about trauma.
@@TonyEnglandUK and if it is, how is it thag material science, rationality, medication, psychiatrists, everything didn't work? Didn't save her will to live? Give her meaning?
Maybe, just maybe, there's something more than having some intellectual high ground to boost you ego.
I'm a lifelong atheist. Nothing can change that. I felt as Ayaan has and went to Buddhism. I desperately needed the talk about kindness, softness, compassion. It was salve on my wounds.It was spoken slowly and meaningfully. It really helped me and gave me something I desperately needed. I never went all the way with it though. I took the best and left the rest as far as I'm concerned. I still bob along once in a blue moon to do some meditation, but im never going to swallow the whole message and commitment.
Richard is a lot older than Ayaan. So am I. I adore Ayaan. Followed her career from Netherlands and have her books. Christians offer emotional nourishment too but there is a price to pay that denies some aspects of human nature. I think I've found a balance between all the meanness in the world from humans and not excluding myself at a certain level, and nature and accepting the cruelty of life. Ive found other ways of dealing with things. There is a naivety that comes with Christianity that i have seen played out all over the world with evangalism that has fed into the non Christian young people in the west. Naivety is a problem. I know i will find kind people in churches and go into them for one reason or another at times, but I always leave knowing it is not the answer.
Sigh. You don’t leave Islam, become Atheist only to join up another imaginary God group 🤦🏻♂️
You're so smart.
Hear hear
Yes, you do - if you realize that god is NOT just imaginary... ❤
I bet you're intelligent enough to realize that when people wholeheartedly pursue the trugh, they find it, no matter the circumstances.
“But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.” 1 Corinthians 2:14
I admire Ayaan Hirsi Ali and I'm very glad that her conversion to Christianity has brought her happiness and peace. But some of what she says here makes no sense at all. For example ---- she says that just as we celebrate the separation between Church & State, we should also have a separation between what is scientific and what is spiritual or immaterial. Huh?
The reason we have a "separation" between church and state is to protect individual rights and freedom of conscience. What does that have to do with "separating" science and "spirit" -- a conversation that is not about rights, but about the methods we use for understanding reality. It doesn't make an ounce of sense
She means you can be spiritual and do science without conflict
I think John Lennox is someone you should listen to as he deals with this very issue. Science is a system used to answer questions about the material world. Faith and religion deal with the supernatural. Trying to use science to prove or disprove faith is to try and use it for something it is not designed for.
Think about this (adapted from John Lennox), if I bake a cake and place it on a table. Science can answer questions about the molecular nature of the cake, the color, the shape, the taste. But science cannot answer the simple question: why did I bake the cake? The only way to get that answer is to ask the cake maker, ask me. It is the same with trying to use science to answer the purpose of the universe, any attempt at an answer will be completely false.
@@mikeman3770 Thanks for that. But even Richard Dawkins would not dispute the fact that science can't answer all questions. But what's the basis for concluding that there even IS a super natural dimension?
In any event, many religious claims ARE claims about the material world. Claiming that a man can be resurrected from the dead, or that the Universe was created Ex Nihlo, or that biological evolution is directed by "intelligence" --- these are claims about the natural world and certainly within the purview of science.
Also, in your example of the cake, I'm not sure that's a good analogy. We know the cake was baked by an individual and we could therefore inquire as to his/her "purpose" for baking the cake. (Assuming the baker can know her own motives). On the other hand, we have no reason for assuming the Universe HAS a purpose.
@@mikeman3770 religion as a human endevour is perfectly fine. There is a subjective aspect to being human. The problem arises when religion is considered to give the answers and explnations to natural phenomena. The church did wrong to the likes of Bruno, Galileo and many others by putting itself as the "know all" authority. Picasso or Messi cannot explain natural phenomena, nor can the Bible or the pope. They can give many a personal experience of joy and fulfillment though!
@@a6hiji7 i agree that there have been those that have used religion as a means to subjugate free thought and expression of ideas. Which is actually crazy considering that science was founded under a religious back-drop. I think Newton and the earlier scientist saw that it was never science or religion, but rather that they both are able to coexist when one understands their purpose. Religion, for me, is every bit as viable and necessary as science. Though subjective in nature, there are effects that are objectively seen.
This man is loved dearly by our Lord Jesus Christ. May the holy spirit open his blind eyes. In Jesus mighty name alone.
Ayaan is a brave ambassador for the kingdom of God. Psalm 91 over her. Amen
Yes, thank you, we keep this brave and wise young woman in our prayers, we plead every protection under Psalm 91 over her. God bless her ministry and continued to guide her forward. ❤🙏🏻
Ayyan,
What a soul-filling testimony. Thank you. God bless you. Fr noel
The last statement from Dawkins was worth the whole feed but could not have been reached without the whole discussion. So funny, and provoking if you’re still open to having that kind of mind exercise. What is created by man, what works, tradeoffs, planted seeds… and Ayaan is just one of my favorite people to hear conceptualize our emerging challenges we must face sooner or later. Great video!
Dawkins shows 1)Christianity becomes nobler than Islam because of the contribution and the acceptance of science
2) Political Christians are as deadlier as the Islam…
Ayaan shows
1) Religion is a choice of medicine for the problems of civilization (depression)
2) Christianity is a subjective hallucination that can improve the quality of life.
Fascinating….
Never heard her say it's a "Hallucination"
@@kerhabplays never did she utter the word indeed but it seems she has a divine solution for a political problem like hallucination though known as biological abnormality
I cant think of much more depressing than Christianity being real.
@@LusciousTwinkle ofc you should be. Scared of hell fire?
@@kerhabplays A person made that up. Maybe they had a dream...or maybe they just imagined it. whatever. It was effective propaganda for primitive people....and still is apparently.
Being an agnostic I do believe there might be something however I always like Richard
She is one of the bravest people I have ever seen. At every step in her life she has stayed true to what she believed despite overwhelming opposition.
She's believed in the Quran, the bible and no god. She isn't staying true to anything
@@cleggyclark6238 Staying true to your conscience is much harder than believing in holy books, even it takes a few turns.
Ayan is out of her depth. As a new Christian she shouldn’t be engaging in these discussions because she can’t ground her belief in doctrine. I don’t think she’s even read the bible.
She actually admits that she is young in the faith...let her bear witness...remember the samaritan woman after meeting with Jesus? She could not help but testify of this Man who had told her all she had ever done( immediately) ...Maybe there is an audience God will reach here.
@@jonmartin3220 I’m not saying you need to be an expert in the bible, or even have read the entire thing to be a Christian. But if you are an intellectual engaging in Christian apologetics, that’s literally the bare minimum.
13 mins - Dawkins says that “Mary had to free of sin” and that is why the conception of Jesus had to be immaculate. Please note that Mary was fully human and was absolutely not without sin.
That's actually even more to the point of religion being man made. Men in this era would believe a superior being would never arrive through female reproductive parts. And as others have pointed out, Jesus is one of several religious figures born of a virgin. This is more evidence of the man made nature of Christianity
It’s a Catholic doctrine that Mary was conceived without original sin and was free from personal sin
@@AChickandaDuckYeah the Immaculate conception was of Mary not of Jesus. Mary was conceived without son right from the get go, that’s the idea.
Are these things fundamental to Christian or Catholic belief?...I don't think so.
To me, one can be a good Christian even without believing in the immaculate conception, virgin birth and even resurrection. The core of Christianity is Jesus and the love and compassion as personified in him.
@@georgekuttygeorge8247 then you are just a good person not a faithfully adhering catholic.
I am an atheist, but that doesn't mean I believe in nothing. I believe in humanity, I believe in love, I believe in the beauty of the natural world. I don't need a god to explain things to me.
The meaning of life is simple... Try to enjoy life as much as possible while making decisions that promote wellbeing and minimise harm - and learn from our mistakes.
Easy.
I won't care that I won't be around in 300 years time any more than I cared that I wasn't around 300 years ago.
I embraced being an atheist 10-15 years ago. The happiest 10-15 years of my life 🙂
for every design there is a designer. if there's a beauty of the natural world, there is a beautifier behind it
She doesn't seem coherent or genuine. Perhaps she has an ulterior motive to sell her upcoming book.
I wonder if Ayaan Hirsi Ali has heard about what happens to houses that are built on a foundation of sand...
Of course.
Hers was.
You mean materialism?
@@cvrki7 of course.
If you are a genuine Christian rejoice because the kingdom of God belongs to you
Who certifies the "genuineness"?
Blablabla
Pray for you Ayaan.
God is be with you.
The host gave waaaaaay too much time to Ayanni.
Fun fact: if there's life after death and God exists, Ayaan will be able to tell Richard: you see? I told you so. But, if it is the other way around, Richard won't be able to say: I told you it was BS
That's BS logic.
@@ijya6413 you only sa bs logic because it is hard for you to swallow that God may exist
@@stevemarkcadavona imagine wasting ur entire life which u get once, to waste on a badly written story by some 2nd to 3rd century illiterate which used it to grab power. You will be like a clown who wasted his opportunity to be happy and enjoy maximum in life. If I wholeheartedly believe that Flying spaghetti monster is real creator and we all go to him, it doesn't make sense. I would rather study Universe than waste 1 minute praying to ur god.
It is true what the Lord say John 12:40
Jesus said, "He has blinded their eyes and hardened their hearts, so they can neither see with their eyes, nor understand with their hearts
John 9:39
Jesus said, "I came into this world for judgment, in order that those who do not see will see and those who do see will become blind". This verse may mean that those who are arrogant and think they already know will be blinded by their own prejudices
I tell you now, if God exist the Devil exist as well.
Enjoy your life span of 100 years
What is she talking about ?? . .. "I choose to believe" ... we dont choose to believe in anything . Belief isnt a choice . We humans are either convinced of something , or we aren't. Thats it .
Good for her !
Why debate a fool?
Psalm 14:1 KJV - To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David. The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
The islamist said there IS God and slept with a child, Aisha (9) . Mlns of his followers also said there IS God and defend that. So, "the corrupt" lies in religion too. They also can kill you for not joining them, and sleep with your wife and make her slave. Because NOTE: they DO believe in god
Because we were all fools before Christ opened our eyes.
@@gowsif_dnb Speak for yourself.
She just equated white western atheist Gaza protesters as being Islamist? I think I know what she’s all about now.
Yeah, she's only a 'Christian' because new atheism didn't oppose Islam enough for her.
She says the protesters are unwittingly accepting the framework of Islamism and promoting it (while still being atheists, perhaps wilfully blindly so).
An entirely emotional plea, has ZERO bearing on the truth/reality.
Not everyone operates in a cerebral manner, so Ayaan's message will resonate with others like her. It's not as if cerebral athiests give much heed to the cerebral arguments anyways.
Richard said "God couldnt think of a better idea to forgive the Sins of humanity then to have his OWN Son Crucified. That is a disgusting Idea" First i want to know why is it a disgusting Idea? N second To me that idea just Shows me that He Does Care an LOVE his creation. Theres a price that has to be paid for our sin. And God paid that Price. Which one of you would sacrifice your self to save the Whole world.
Because by definition that's satanic and mirrors many Satanic doctrines.