I was a Seabee, never been on a ship. But I have seen NJP, we called it restriction, half rats half pay for up to 30 days. Yeah, they got to wear red helmets and didn't sleep in their own rack, had guards with them when they went to chow.
Seems,to,me that we were seldom punished for screwups or goof offs because they only laid on more watches,drills,field days and general quarters. If you got time to,get in trouble they aren’t using your talents To everyone’s advantage. No joke.
I was a Master at Arms (United States Navy Security Forces) aboard the USS Nimitz (CVN 68) and got out SEP182022 as an E-5 (MA2). We have a fully functional brig for sailors. Eventually, there would be at least 50 plus sailors on restriction, in which we had to move them into a different berthing. Usually most are confined for at least maximum punishment when it comes to time on the Nimitz. (Nimitz does not play around). 60 days no pay, 60 days restriction, reduction in rank/pay grade, and separation from the Navy. The prisoners eventually started breaking rules and breaking out on port visits and running fast for the pier to get outside of the gate. After death threats from sailors, We had to start maximizing efforts, and therefore we had 24/7 watch changing between two shifts all day, every day. Going to the head? MA is with you. Going to chow? MA is with you. Going to shower? MA is with you outside of your shower. Everything is watched. Someone is suspected of a violation while restricted? Bring the SRF-A team (MA SWAT) and we are flipping that berthing upside down to find what contraband we are looking for and you are going straight up to Mast with the captain all over again for a harsher sentence. From being on the SRF-A team, I was also the main Bailiff for the Nimitz. There are 3 Phases of the NJP aboard the Nimitz. Master chief review board, XOI (Interview with the XO) and Captains Mast (Final decision making process for NJP). I am telling you, MA's don't play around when it comes to this, they are expected to do the best job for the Captain, Admiral, and his ship. Everything is critiqued. Everything is watched. It does get fun to get hands on with a sailor with an NJP in front of the captain. I miss the Navy, but the Military has gotten way too soft, liberal, woke and too much "Safety standards" for my taste. Bring it back to the old days. PLUS I HATE THE CORRUPT CHIEFS MESS.
I received drb for minor infraction. DRB- disciplinary review board. It was basically a slap on the wrist. I had to wear full dress uniform for two weeks when going on liberty.
My father was a Marine during WWII. They didn't have the UCMJ then, instead the Rocks and Shoals (Navy Regulations). Dad was sentenced to seven days in the brig on bread and water (piss and punk) for being over leave by seven days from the Naval Hospital he was in. Passenger train service was very unreliable then as most train traffic was used for military supplies or transporting full units of troops. My dad had gotten his first leave since he enlisted (and had made two beach landings and battles in the meantime) and had a tough time getting trains coming back, although he had letters from the station masters verifying he was on time to catch trains, but the trains were not on time. He would have gotten 30 days in the brig if it wasn't for those letters. He said they got a full loaf of bread each morning and could drink all of the water they wanted. One other funny thing was they had to get him out of the brig, have him change into his service greens, and attend an award ceremony where he got a Bronze Star for an action on Saipan. Then back to change into dungarees and off to the brig for the rest of his time. I have a photo of his award ceremony and his brig chaser (guard) was standing next to him in the photo.
Missing ships movement was a really big deal. Ships had no extra personnel. Each has an assigned job. The punishment was so very harsh. You were likely going to a shore jail them bad conduct discharge. Everyone knew this. We had one guy that missed the ramp being pulled up. He grabbed one of the morning lines to get on the ship as they were being dropped from the pier. He made it, but was given an immediate captains mast.
@@thatguy8005 poor guy. Are u serious? And me I got bread and water punishment but they lied! It was lettuce and water. Just one meazley plate of wilted lettuce only 3times a day. It was not bread and water
@@victorponce7238 yes, serious. He came is dripping wet to the birthing compartment. I think he was an air traffic controller or OS. He was called to the captains quarters while he was changing. I thing he just was put on restriction and lost some pay.
I was on two aircraft carriers during the Vietnam War. Most if the time we were to tired to get into much trouble. The military is not a democracy. Do your job and you'll be treated well by all hands.
@@teecee1567 Not the odd exception...that is why Frank was a stereotype in the series...There was always that guy who who lived to catch someone without a hat or shoes not laced correctly...Or our misfit Department head that broke down and cried...because we didn't love him... and then wrote someone up for disrespect...
On my ship in 2014 we had 2 sailors (Petty Officer 2nd Class) pop on a drug test for Meth. I was in security and in charge of the Restricted Division. I was considered the cool RPO (Restriction Petty Officer) because I treated everyone like a human. So the 2 sailor that popped for meth were both dropped in rank, 45 days Restriction, 45 days extra duty, half months pay x2, and separation from the navy. One sailor took his punishment in stride and kept cool. I respect how he acted. However the other one, Mitchell, during his Captains Mass was disrespectful, unrepentant, joyful, and excited to leave the navy. I was in shock to watch this go on. Clearly, the Captain was insulted. I very much respect my Captain. After the punishment, I took him down to eat chow before sending him to get his things for being moved to the Restriction quarters. At this point, he was allowed to be on his own. I returned to SEC and was ordered to go get Mitchell. The captain wanted to see him again. I found him in his shop bullshiting and breaking the terms of his Restriction. I bring him back up with my Seinor Chief where the Captain busted him for insubordination, took another rank from him making him an E-3 and sentencing him to 3 days of bread and water. We had him shackled and took him down. There are a few other details that I'll not say what happened between the the sentence and the brig but no we never physically injured him. But he made it hell for everyone once he was out of the brig. Where ever you are Mitchell. Fuck you
It sounds like he wanted to be caught so he could be thrown out. I saw this happen several times. I was in the Marines many years ago. At MCT (Marine Combat Training, the course taken after graduating from recruit training) a Marine who was in my platoon at Parris Island was in my squad. When he all arrived, it was like a class reunion with every excited to see each other. I asked him how he was doing and I, like almost everyone else, were looking forward to this new training phase. He said he had made a big mistake in joining the Marines, so he took every kind of drug a day before arriving,knowing that there was a mandatory drug test. I was in shock. The drug testing is so backlogged that it takes a few weeks to process the sheer volume of drug test samples. Sure enough, one day he gets told to pack his things and he was escorted by the MPs and an angry looking group of officers and senior staff NCOs.
My now 95 year-old dad retired after 20 years in the Navy. He told us recently of his 10-day bread and water brig confinement experience early on when he was a lowly E-3 back in 1948 at Naval Station Pearl Harbor. He received this non-judicial punishment for disobeying a direct order from an NCO who assigned watch duty to the guys in my dad's section. Apparently, dad had already finished his 4-hour watch but the Sailor who was supposed to relieve him, didn't show up, so Dad was asked to take that watch. When dad questioned why, he was reported and appeared before Captain's Mast and summarily punished. He learned an early lesson in obeying orders. Ironically, he was still awarded a Good Conduct medal during that hitch. LOL!
UCMJ the law book for the us military says that you can only receive three days bread and water, you will have to correct your story if you are going to tell that crap to others, because it makes you look uneducated.@@carlv8168
One of these facts are not correct. If he had a NJP on his record he would not qualify for the good conduct award. Additionally a ship’s captain was limited by law to administer no more than 3 days bread and water. Perhaps your father just misremembered his history. 3 days on bread and water certainly can seem like 10 days. No offense intended here. But these facts don’t line up.
Been on two Carriers. You have to be a real F*** Up to be seriously punished. The rest of us were working too hard to get into trouble. Petty Officers do not go to the brig. You lose your rank first.
In the Navy, non judicial punishment is called “Captain’s Mast”, for the reasons outlined in the video. As a Navy vet myself, I unfortunately had the unpleasant experience due to an accusation of cheating on an exam during my advanced training. At 18 years old, I was able to get witnesses lined up including some high ranking officers who believed me, as well as other students who backed me up. But the instructors were doing whatever they could to get me thrown out of school, busted to E1 and sent directly to the fleet. Luckily, and to my absolute surprise, the Captain/Commanding Officer believed my version of the events, publicly chastised my instructors, and wished me success in the completion of my extremely difficult training. I passed with flying colors…out of a class that started with close to 40 people, 17 graduated including me. Will be a memory I unfortunately will have for a long time. The CO had a reputation of always taking the charging party’s version of events, so I count myself lucky that I survived the NJP.
USN 20 years. I was on a cruiser 88-92, I appreciate this being about aircraft carriers and thank you for allowing me to share. One of our young sailors went UA for a few days shy of three months. Upon return he went to see the Captain and told him his young girlfriend was now 8 months pregnant and that he had freaked out, left the ship to take care of her and then realized best bet would have been to stay in the Navy to have medical benefits and a steady income. Our Captain was a very compassionate leader who gave the sailor 15 days restriction. That's it, no extra duty, reduction in rank, or loss of pay for almost three months of UA. I wish the story ended with a some what happy ending. Two days later the results of the mandatory urinalysis for returning deserters came back and this young sailor tested positive for cocaine. With the urinalysis results documented and zero tolerance policy for drug usage the Captain had no choice but to start processing for a dishonorable discharge. Much of the crew, including myself felt bad for the Captain, he had given this young man every possible chance. I believe Navy justice can be harsh but most leaders do what they can to help turn around substandard sailors, unfortunately there is a small percentage that are beyond redemption.
John you might like this story about a navy kid who went AWOL. I was in the Air Force ans a JAG Officer stationed at Lackland AFB when I got a call one night from a teacher of the school where my mother worked before we moved to Texas. He said that his son was in the Navy and went AWOL from California and is in Dallas afraid to turn himself in. He rode to Dallas on a motorcycle and has been gone about two weeks. I told the principal that if he was gone 30 days it could be charged as desertion. The best thing to do if he is scared is to come here and turn himself into me and I will arrange his surrender to the Navy. Tell him also not to break any traffic laws because the poice will check not only warrants but service AWOLS. Mike made it to my house and I told him that he was now in my custody and under house arrest as I took his keys to the bike. Since it was late Friday I called the nearest Navy facility in San Antonio and gave them my name and rank and said that the boy had surrendered to me and i asked that since it was late if I could turn him in on Monday morning I also asked that they twix the Navy at his base to know that he came into my custody at 14:35 hours this date. To my surprise I was met with "Yes sir , Immediately Sir, We will note he is in your custody and notify his base of same". Boy, talk about efficient.! Well when I went to turn him in, I went in because I was on leave that week. So we walked in and the sailor said "Are you the officer, who has the AWOL sailor?" And I said that I was, and introduced Mike who then left with some other sailors to another room after we said our good byes. The young sailor then turned to me and said "Excuse me sir, but you sure look young to be a Captain in the Navy:." I looked a him and suddenly realized why he was so spit and polished on the phone. I said "No son, I'm a Captain in the Air Force. Haven't you notiiced the four bases here in San Antonio?" The kid's jaw just dropped and I walked out smiling at my and Mike's luck. Now I didn't intend to misrepresent myself, I merely ID'ed myself as I usually did, not thinking about the difference. I'd rather like to think of it as "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" before it became the policy for another reason. Several months passed before I saw Mike again. He came to pick up his bike and assured me that everything was OK thanks to me . He got NJP and a kick in the pants but was not discharged. Not only that but his complaints for mistreatment were investigated and found to be credible after talking to other sailors.He stayed in the Navy and I beleive he even reupped
I wasn't in the Navy, but the Air Force and I got in a little trouble back in the 70's and had to take a court martial, I was convicted and caught 30 days at hard labor, and a fine of $100 which was almost a months pay, at my sentencing the Judge asked if I had anything to say for myself, well, yes I did, I apologized for the trouble, and for the shame I caused and for all the grief I brought on myself, the officers and the squadron, after that he ruled 20 days suspended with 10 to serve in CC. Anyway they were not kidding about the hard labor, it was 12 hours a day filling sandbags, hand digging post holes, setting the poles and stringing concertina wire along with weed chopping. The worst part? Being marched to chow in the morning and evening so everyone could see you and make comments, LOL. My charges were drunk on station, destruction of government property, ( I wasn't driving but was in a truck that someone had taken and we crashed in a ditch ), fighting with the Air Police, out of uniform, failure to repair which was a catch-all charge, that could have been handled with NJP like an Article 15, but what sank my boat was telling the Lieutenant of the Air Police, the OOD to take a flying f**k. That's where they drew the line. I realize now that I was immature, but at 19 one doesn't make the best choices after a few drinks. Long story short, I did my ten but as I had "bad time" I had to make it up which added an extra two months to my enlistment. I did receive an Honorable Discharge, but I never pulled that stunt again.
Thanks Dickhead! Guys like you were the reason we couldn't even have one beer when we deployed in Afghanistan or Iraq. The generals remembered discipline problems from Viet Nam.
All active duty military branches give you the keys to a successful career in the first year. They tell you what will happen if you do things(outside your work hours) and get in trouble. Get drunk and act a fool, expect to deal with whatever happens in civilian courts, but don’t forget you are in the military 24/7 and that means you have to answer for your crimes through your branch as well. It could be loss of rank, or a few months pay, restricted to base, extra duty, I’ve even seen guys get pulled off their assigned jobs and put in work parties to do manual labor for 12hrs a day 7 days a week. One day they had them moving a couple pallets of blocks 200 feet away and when they finally got it done after a couple days they had to move them all right back. When you act like an idiot out drinking and do something bad enough to get arrested, you are making yourself look bad, but also your local base and service branch to the community. There’s more to it than they just want to throw punishments around on people who already got punished on the civilian side. When you screw up, it’s on both sides. Own it, apologize, pay the price and make the needed changes so it can never happen again.
i was usaf from '82-'89. at the beginning i was stationed at the defense language institute, which is run by the army. just out the back gate there was a small convenience store/grocery, operated by an old german woman. she would accept checks from usaf, but not from army. never asked about the jarheads or squids though. i usually wrote a check, none of which were a problem of course. she knew it would be a big deal in the air force, so she trusted us.
@@skip123davis thanks for your service. I was USAF 02-12 and medically retired..(I hate that it was just 10 years. It should have been Retired, without the medical permanently attached in front of it.) I was good at the military part of my time served, and about average with my assigned career field. I turned out to be really good at the jobs you put in charge of that aren’t really known about. Even after I got hurt my Commander told me that as long as I continued to fill those positions that I would always have a place in our Squadron. Even the Base Commander knew me by name after a couple things I got recognized for(good stuff). That’s all good, until they rotate out after there 2 years. I did my best to recover after my surgeries, all I did was end up in worse condition physically and mentally when they sent me on my way. Still. I would do it all over again if I could. I miss it.
Officer misconduct, on the other hand, is "hidden" from the crew by immediately moving the offender off the ship to serve his/her punishment away from his/her former chain of command. Can't have junior Sailors calling out the wardroom for being just as "human" as they are, can we?
@@jamessephar9458 In some cases it should. Discipline should NEVER be one of those cases. If you're higher in rank, the standards for conduct should be higher because 1) you've been around long enough to "know better;" and 2) as a leader you're expected to "lead by example." Therefore, the punishment for senior enlisted and officers should be much worse than they are for junior enlisteds for the same infractions, because you've violated the TRUST and are no longer worthy of the RESPECT of those you're supposed to lead.
Officers were punished a lot different than enlisted of course. That doesn't mean they get an easier sentence. Usually they are held to a higher standard because they are expected to lead by example. Discipline of a leader in front of his men in front of them by superiors degrades that leaders ability to lead in his mens eyes. NCO's get harsher punishment because they as well are to lead by example. Is the system perfect? By no means. Does it work most times? Yes.
That's right. And there's plenty of cruelty in the way they go about things as well. Don't forget it was the cruelty of the terminal janitor reclassification, that made the command imagine an innocent guy had torched his own ship.
I did brig duty on the USS Constellation in 1998-2000. We had a few guys get 3 days bread and water. Mostly for minor offenses. More serious offenses would get 30 days or transfer to the Miramar Brig. We had one drug addict nutcase (assault risk), a pedophile, two guys who just wanted out of the Navy, a total creep who wanted to get an OTH discharge and go to civvy prison to be with the "cool people", and a bunch of guys who stayed behind in Sydney Australia after we left. Most of these guys were bad attitudes, the criminal element, or mentally ill. They thought the brig would be sleeping 24 hours a day. Every second of their time is planned and they spend most of the day cleaning the brig or watching motivational videos. We would break an attitude problem by keeping them in their cell 24 hours a day without smoking privileges. They usually broke in 24 hours. The worst lasted 72 hours. We had some SEALs onboard and we gave them a tour. They were shocked that just sitting in a cell would break someone! They thought the prisoners were pretty weak! We had one guy that wanted to start a prison riot. He got the treatment and he lasted 24 hours. The plan to handle a prison riot was to evacuate and throw tear gas grenades down the hatches into the brig and let them marinate for a couple of hours. Then we would go in and beat the hell out of anybody giving us trouble. One of them sucker punched me, and he was already getting an OTH, so we waited until we pulled into San Francisco and sent him down the brow first with some other OTHs. The security division officer made arrangements with the San Francisco Police Department to have the SFPD welcome wagon at the other end of the brow! They all were promptly arrested for vagrancy!
I remember getting busted for eating an apple while in uniform. Was a base MP. Typical bad attitude. "we" found him in civvies later on downtown and "neutralized" him outside of a bar until he could no longer see out of both eyes due to the swelling. He was too drunk to know what was "neutralizing" him. MPs with gung ho attitudes can get "fixed" as well. We never had a problem with that MP again. In fact, the MP must have transferred because we never actually saw him again. You might be hot stuff on a ship, but once we hit port, you are fair game...
I was on the USS Constellation CV-64 1980 - 1984 and had to serve as a shipboard Master at Arms and did occasionally work in the brig taking care of the prisoners there. Sounds to me like you enjoyed doing a lot more to make their lives worse than they were already going through, as if you get off on adding a little extra abuse because you're that kind of person. Oh the glee and glory you would have had in abusing people by gassing them and then beating them afterwards. People are human beings and when they are in your care always treat them with respect and dignity.
All valid reasons to encourage young people not to join. Thank you! I’ve talked so many kids out of wasting their lives on the military. I use stories like these to accomplish that.
I was in the US Navy for 9 years. I remember a couple guys who were restricted to the Ship for I think 3 months. The worst part about it was we went overseas at this time of their restriction. Those guys weren’t allowed to go ashore at 5 liberty ports. Then we went on a 2 month long at sea Operation with no liberty. So in affect they got 5 months restriction on the Ship
There is still a level of inconvenience while the ship is underway in that restricted personnel still had to muster multiple times a day in addition to their normal duties. Missing out on port visits can be depressing. There used to be a program for problematic individuals called "liberty risk" where people who had issues with bad behaviour would have to be back to the ship before dark, and couldn't be out alone.
I seem to remember that Commanding Officer's with a rank of O-6 could award 90 days restriction. The majority of the ships I served in were commanded by O-5 who could award 60 days restriction.
When I was on the aircraft carrier Hornet in 1968-69 there was no "extreme punishment" unless you want to include time in the bilges of a fireroom or engine room. The unlucky sailors sentenced to the brig and hard labor typically were taken by their Marine chaser to whatever department requested laborers. My shop even had them for a day which was easy work, cleaning vents. But bilge cleaning in a fireroom or engine room was a different hot and greasy matter! I'll tell you what, the brig on the Hornet was a dark and depressing hole I would rather be in the bilges.
I’ve toured the Hornet and can’t believe I’ve never asked about the Brig. I don’t think they even have it open to the public. Next time, I’ll have to ask about it.
Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson 1973 movie entitled, "The Last Detail." The story in the movie is about two sailors charged with taking ("chasing") a convicted sailor to the Portsmouth Naval Prison in NH. Oddly enough, I saw the outside of this grim naval prison a decade after it was permanently closed. NOT an inviting structure perched on the Atlantic Coast. It would have been a very nasty place in New England winters!
I was in the Navy for 7 years. The problem that I had was completely different punishments for different ranks. If you went into a business and a employee stole your money and you call the police and it’s proven that is what happened; the employee might be arrested and go to jail. If the manager does the same thing, then it’s a warning. What kind of sense does that make ? I never got into any trouble myself which is why I had a Good Conduct Ribbon I only saw one person sent to the brig ( jail ) and given only bread and water but he had to be let out for work and was being given real food during that time.
The shame is punishment enough for the any person of refinement is a well established pillar of British law much of which has travelled across the ocean to the opposite shores. The people who create the laws are hardly likely to allow themselves to be inconvenienced by it in any way.
If you do your job, follow orders, and have any common sense and maturity it is not difficult to stay out of trouble. Most instances are alcohol related after being at sea for months. Unfortunately some people could not figure it out.
@@ZadieBear it is an acquired skill. You were conditioned to follow orders in boot camp or you were punished with a marching party or some other form of physical torture. It maybe different now. Nothing better than doing exercises all day slinging a rifle in the hot sun.
True...a lot of it is alcohol related. That's why during liberty, or port of call, I usually go out by myself cause sailors in my squadron couldn't handle their booze and getting in trouble.
For minor stuff the Chief will assign you a very unpleasant task like latrine duty or worse. I endured a month of everybody hating me and bitching about no toilet paper but they only allotted me a few rolls per day. I kept it clean enough otherwise. Not my fault, man. I never found out what I was being punished for either. It was one of several possibilities. Evil grin.
I was on my first ship, LST 1189 when we had a dress blue inspection by an admiral. Well I missed getting my blues into the cleaner but did the best I could, washed them in the ships laundry, ironed and pressed them. When my NCO saw my uniform he damn near passed out telling me I cannot go up there like that. I tried to get him to send me to sick bay and other things to get me out of inspection but he refused. So standing there in formation the admiral makes his speech from the podium then starts his inspection going from one division to another. He then gets to my division and goes down the front line, turns and heads down my line. Stops in front of me, looks up and down and asked what happened to me " I missed the dry cleaners sir!" I replied and he walks off. He finishes the inspection and gets back up to the podium and says " Overall you all look squared away. But one of you should have stayed home." I mumbled under my breathe to my NCO next to me " One of us tried to stay home." Yep, that turned into a 12 hour work day. LOL
There are heads in the navy. Not latrines. Cleaning is not a punishment. 12 to 200 men in one berthing compartment requires continuous efforts to maintain habitability.
I was on the USS Coral Sea from 77-80 assigned to the Marine Detachment. One of our additional duties, and usually performed by a Marine waiting for his security clearance to get approved worked in Correctional Custody or the ‘Red Line” Brig. Was not a good place for sailors to end up but we had a very high successful rate of sailors returning back to their division and do their job. Red Line brig went away while we were in the yards at Bremerton in 78 leaving CC the only additional duty for us.
I was on the Midway 1976. They did away with Marine Security Detachments on ships and Marine Barracks on Navy bases in the late 90's. MA's handle all that now.
When I was on the Oriskany in 1966. We were tied up in Subi bay, At that time all they had was the gedunk at the carrier pier, It was night time and one of the marine who worked the brig come stumbling back into the light, somebody had just beat the hell out of him. I guess it was just payback for a hard time he gave somebody.
You mofo.{ LOL } I was in the brig aboard the USS Enterprise in Bremerton. The guards were Marines and Navy , mixed . The Marines were strict Aholes but also fun . We could have a cigarette break IF we could ride on a 20 gallon paint shaker for one full minute . Not easy to do. I had 30 days with 3 off for good behavior. Good memories . And YES I didnt want to go back to the brigg ever again.
I was on the Nimitz 2001-2006( the carrier at beginning of this video , Cvn 68) . The bread and water punishment does not exceed 3 days but they can be kept in the brig for up to 60 days.
Did you witness or know about the famous Incident in 2004, off the coast of Florida? The 46ft tik tac object that defied the laws of ohysic and even appeared in a pilots cap point?
I served on a carrier during Viet Nam. We mustered and reported to our work stations just as civilians used to report to their respective work places. We did our jobs, and at days end we laid back just as civilians did. If it was necessary to stay on duty, we did, just as civilians are sometimes required to do depending on their responsibilities. The level of stress and responsibility lays with the job, the flight deck personnel be an example of that. I did my job as ship's company, followed the rules, made friends, was respected by my superiors and experienced no hardship on the carrier. As in civilian life you make your own bed. If you make trouble, give trouble or seek it, you will find it and suffer the consequences, and it will not be the ship's fault, the Navy's fault or fault of the command.
I spent my at-sea time on submarines, other than 2 years on a submarine tender. In 1978 I was assigned to Shore Patrol, the Navy's version of MPs. During the 6 months I spent with SP I know of several sailors that were transported to their pre-confinement physicals and detention on bread and water. I was shocked to learn that it was still allowed.
I only did Shore Patrol on duty days when we were in port at Subic. I just walked through the bars in Olongapo and talked to the girls. Finished at midnight, right before the girls get off work and didn't have to be back until the next morning.
I was in the Navy from 1972-1976 as a Corpsman. I was on two carriers (the Coral Sea and the Ranger) for a total sea duty time of thirty days. I remember the persons who were in the brig - they were marched through the corridors in a lock step. That is to say each man put his hand the shoulder of the man marching in front of him and the group marched grunting "gangway, prisoners!" and digging their right boot into the deck. It sounded like "gangway, prisoners (crump, crump). But I still wonder what people did to get into the brig - do your job and everything flows fine.
@@43coralsea I was on it for two weeks in September 1974. I was in VF-101 in Virginia Beach VA whose sole purpose was to train pilots to land on carriers. When were you on the Coral Sea?
@@Swede9418 I was on the Coral Maru "San Francisco's own" from 84-88 and she had just finished a yard period and came out in the Coral Sea configuration with CVW-13 and VFA's flying a mix of 2 Marine and 2 Navy F-18 squadrons and a VA flying the A-6 no F-4's no F-14's
I believe that I was on it during September 1974. I reported to VF-101 in July 1974 and I was actually working in the base dispensary. I was rather disappointed to find out that VF-101 was a training squadron (training pilots how to land on a carrier) rather than a regular combat squadron. CDR Fortenberry was the CO, right? For that matter what rate were you?
I was in the service from 83 to 2004 & in different fleets, while my dad served in the submarine fleet back in the 60’s. I have witnessed the bread & water confinement along with EMI or extra military instruction. They were very cruel but necessary cuz at that time we were still taking juvenile convicts for naval service & some are really in need of discipline, specially the ones that wasn’t combed at RTC. Real knuckleheads!
@@MRblazedBEANS You have no idea what the military is about. The last thing we want in the military is violent uncontrollable people. People like that are more of a danger to our own side than they are to any enemy. They rarely if ever make it past Bootcamp. Kind of like you. I smell an ELS in here.
@@MRblazedBEANS Most naval missions are for patrol and support. On a ship you can have unruly types of people in tight quarters around very expensive and dangerous equipment. Lack of discipline can lead to hostility between crew members which often leads to harassment and violence. Lack of discipline can endanger an entire crew or even other ships and people. It may seem harsh but it is necessary to misbehavior dead seriously and instill professionalism when you have teenagers and 20-something year olds operating a 100,000 ton multi-billion dollar vessel full of deadly explosives.
I spent 22 yrs. in the USAF. Several over seas assignments as well as stateside. I never got into trouble. Did my job. Minded my own business. Crazy talk, I know.
I got a field grade article 15 while I was serving in the Army. I got 45 days restriction to post, extra duty, and reduction of pay. Reduced from E-3 to E-1. It sucked, but they got their point across. I didn't mess up again.
I got the same thing for going AWOL in the National Guard. Only thing was they forgot to actually take my rank so after a year of not wearing it my 1SGT told me to just put it back on my uniform if they didn’t follow through on officially stripping me of it.
There's a joke that the Good Conduct Medal is only given to those who have not been caught in the act in four years. Seriously, getting NJP or Captain's Mast is dependent upon how well your department has your back. Our Chief Petty Officers will always tell the junior NCO's to anticipate and solve problems before getting out of hand and sent to the skipper. As a result we took care of things at the lowest level. My department always had an NCO assigned to the Quarter Deck to intercept and slip the drunk sailors or those who got into fights back into berthing vs. the brig. Thus avoiding NJP. Other departments with a weak leadership culture were more prone to NJP and Captains Mast.
I got 6 of them, when I would stand watch as OOD inport at night overseas when drunks came back to the ship my first choice was to get someone from their division to come up and take care of them.
@@mikegracie3212 My ship did the same thing. Most of our divisions had assigned drunk watch personnel. One night in Korea during Westpac i was on duty and I/we had to get some of "our" drunks in our dept(AIR) and bring them back to the berthing.
I was on the USS Coral Sea from 1986 to decom in 1990. Never knew anyone in my department (weapons) who went to the brig for petty items or serious one for that matter. The only way you would wind up there were for serious items like theft,fighting,drunk on duty and the like.
I served aboard the USS Kitty Hawk for two years and read the weekly NJP lists. Only one occasion have I seen bread & water as punishment, and it was for only three days. Our CO was nicknamed "the Terminator" because he would regularly hand out maximum punishment during Captain's Mast, which typically was 30 days extra/restricted duty, and reduction in paygrade.
CV-63 from 1985-88...had to be Capt.Hoffman. Were you aboard when he actually had a captain's mast televised when we went out on workups prior to the '87 world cruise?
@@vitameat I got onboard just as the Hawk finished the cruise and headed for SLEP. Was that a pain in the ass. That was my 2nd command......boy they know how to stick it to people. lol
@@sw417 So you got Capt. Tillotson then. Had the change of command before going up the Suez Canal...not nice to piss off certain admiral types The atmosphere changed immediately on board when Hoffman was relieved and reassigned (Pearl Harbor?)
I I served on a carrier for just shy of 4 years in the 50s. I never got into trouble, but knew of shipmates who worked in te boilerroom with me who thought the brig would be an improvement over where we worked! It was a pretty awful life!
@@mikem9892 that fucking engine room is a hot son of a bitch on the kitty hawk, I don’t know how people worked there, when I had to go down there to do electrical repairs they only let you work 15 minutes and then you had to leave and cool down and then go back in again because it was unbearable, hot, I asked the BT(boiler tech) And he said oh, you get used to it, was way hotter than Saudi Arabia in that fucking space
I was a U.S. Marine attached to the USS Hermitage LSD 34 on a Med Cruise in 1973 - 1974 .... A sailor was thrown in the Brig for 3 days / Bread & Water .... I was his guard for 6 hrs every day of his sentence ..... I think I suffered more than him .... I snuck a few sandwiches from the mess deck for him in the evening post ..... I did not like how he was being treated ..... I Know it was wrong, but I'm glad I did it !!! ..... U.S. Marine 1972 -1978
You should have been in there with him for failing to carry out your duty. That sort of lack of discipline is shocking coming from a Marine, you should be ashamed of yourself. You violated the 3rd and 6th general order.
@@Bellthorian Apparently you did not see "A few good men" where two marines were charged with causing the death of fellow marine, but they were just following a code red" order! Not a legitimate order but being marines did not question and followed their Colonel's order and the marine died! That Sailor could been a diabetic or whatever so his life may have saved by those sandwiches. So least Woody can sleep with a clear conscience!
@@MrBobm001 If the sailor had a medical condition it would have been noted in his medical record and his punishment would have been tailored for it. If he was a diabetic he would not have been in the military. Being in the brig on bread and water is a pretty serious punishment......he did something very bad to get that sentence. Woody did a bad thing...period.
Probably lucky to not get busted down and given piss and punk for it. My dad as SOG in the brig somewhere, I forget where, but gave a cigarette to a friend who was under his charge. He was caught, busted down and put on piss n punk for awhile. Dad HATED the Corps till he got old in his 90's when he forgot all about everything he hated.
In the early 1980s, a sailor was sentenced to bread and water for three days. The Master at arms got sick of the sailor sitting there doing nothing and ordered him to do push ups. the sailor died. The captain lost his command and the brig was closed for six months.
It was on the USS Ranger. He was in correctional custody and given PT on the flight deck. He was abused by the MAA, suffered a heat stroke and died. His name was Paul Terice. MAA went to jail. Captain stayed. XO went.
@@radsdad1 It's sad that more MAAs were not made aware of the Stanford Prison Experiment and trained on how to prevent it, especially considering that this was only a decade prior and received so much attention.
Airman Recruit Paul A. Trerice, of Algonac, Mich., a husky 21-year-old who was frequently in trouble with his superiors aboard ship, died suddenly on April 14 after a short time in the Ranger's brig on bread and water. The Navy listed the cause of death as heat stroke. The sailor's organs and brain were removed during the Navy autopsy. While the Navy described their removal as a routine procedure, Dr. Werner Spitz, the Wayne County, Mich., medical examiner, said the missing organs handicapped the autopsy he did for the family. But Spitz said some physicans remove the organs and thus he attached no special significance to the Navy action. Trerice became abusive in the Ranger's correctional custody unit and had to be subdued in a struggle shortly before his death. Spitz said the bruises and cuts on Trerice's body indicated "a substantial struggle" had taken place but not a beating. The Navy said Trerice had taken a shower shortly before the struggle, complained he was not feeling well and was getting ready to go to the sick bay when he suddenly became abusive and had to be subdued. He collapsed during the struggle and was pronounced dead at the hospital in Subic Bay, the Philippines, where the Ranger was docked at the time. In addition; The buying and selling of marijuana on the Ranger reached the point that a Navy investigator wsa able to arrange and observe a purchase (called a controlled buy) and arrest two of the sailors involved. At least one Marine was punished for beating a prisoner under his control in the ship's brig. Cdr. Michael Sherman, the Navy's designated spokesman for questions about the Ranger, and Capt. William J. Legg, judge advocate for the commander of naval air forces in the Pacific, confirmed those incidents in response to queries. Legg disputed, however, accounts by two other sailors who say they were beaten in the Rangerhs brig. Legg said the claims of sailors Gregory J. Girard and Raymond R. Ramsey had been investigated and found to be "unsubstantiated." But the sailors' civilian lawyer, William G. Blasdel Jr. of Philadelphia, has offered to have his clients take polygraph tests. In a sworn statement Blasdel furnished The Washington Post, Girard, who has been arrested on drug charges, said this is what happened to him at the hands of two Marines right after he was taken to the ship's brig on Dec. 28: "I was assaulted by [names deleted by The Post] upon arrival. I was kicked by [name deleted] on the right side of the hip which left a scruffed burn. I was kicked through hatches. I was punched four times in the stomach and four times in the kidneys. I threw up blood later that night. Lance Corporal [name deleted] placed two hands on my throat and applied pressure so that I could not speak." In another sworn statement supplied by Blasdel, Ramsay, also arrested on drug charges, said this is what a Marine did to him right after he was put in the Ranger's brig: "I was thrown against the wall and, you may say, tested. He was slapping my face and telling me to go ahead and raise my hands above my waist so he could beat the s--- out of me. I was taken back to cell four and thrown against the wall, and he grabbed me around my throat and called me a pussy and a faggot and to go ahead and raise my hands so he could beat the s--- out of me. I said, 'No, lance corporal.' Then he hit me three times in the stomach and called me a pussy. "He then told me to get up against the wall. And my toes weren't touching so he stepped on them and told me to move them while he left his foot on them." A third sailor, Neil Wayne Hodgson Jr. of Grosse Point Farms, Mich., wrote Blasdel that "my ear drum is ruptured as a result of being physically abused in the brig on the Ranger. I would like to attend a court of law and testify [about] what has taken place in the brig on the USS Ranger . . . ." Navy legal officer, Legg, when asked about Hodgson's allegations, said that the Marine involved had been punished. Navy officers not involved with the Ranger case said that the long deployments to the Persian Gulf of undermanned and overworked ships and crews have aggravated discipline problems.
My last cruise on the Independence I put one of my plane captains on report. At Captains Mast the Skipper put the guy in the brig and part of that punishment was bread and water. Later on after he got out of the brig I found out that that portion of the punishment was given one meal per day, usually at lunch!
This is depressing. I enlisted in the Navy in 1987...DEP...I had a recruiter who I found out later on was a high school dropout, could barely read and write and had just been convicted of a DUI. I developed knee problems while awaiting shipping out to boot camp at Great Lakes RTC. When I told my recruiter about it, things went downhill fast. It was handled unprofessionally. To this day that experience bothers me a little. Had I to do it over again, I would have contacted my U.S. Senator and/or Congressman for help. Had I to do it all over again, I think I would have joined the Air Force or Army instead...or joined nothing. It was miserable and in my experience the Navy treats many people badly. I graduated from high school, was an Eagle Scout and came from a solid middle class family. I never did any recreational drugs, had no run ins with the law.. I enlisted into a group that was filled up with high school drop outs who had gotten their GED, many had booze problems and most were using the Navy as a form of welfare...just waiting for their twenty years to hit so they could get their federal pension with federal benefits.
@@PyrrhoX holding down fatass recruiter duty? My recruiter was just putting in his twenty so he would not have to load trucks. He sat in the Navy Recruiting station and told me that straight to my face. When he told me that I lost all respect for him because it told me he DID NOT WANT TO WORK.
I served as ships company on the USS Independence CVA-62 from 1964to 1968. While we were on station in the Gulf of Tonkin Vietnam we worked 12 hour shifts 7 days a week. We spent 13 months of 45 to 50 days at sea and we were too tired to get into trouble. We got two days off for every 45 days at sea. We might hit a neutral port and get one day off the ship or just float around in the ocean and try to relax. The Navy was very different then from today’s Navy.
My uncle was on an aircraft carrier during the Korean war. He told me that the really bad trouble makers or ones that didn't fit in would sometimes disappear from the ship while in the middle of the sea. I took this as they were helped overboard.
And these are the people you fight for, who will kill you if you make a mistake, sounds pretty sadistic and demonic to me. I guess legalized killers have no heart or compassion or no one to answer to.
I seriously doubt that. If a sailor or any other person is missing or unaccounted for, there is a big search and a massive report would have to be submitted by the ship's commander to his superiors. If a ship commander buit a reputation of inexplicably losing his men while at sea, he'd be removed pretty quickly and possibly face a court marital for failure of duty.
I was a Master-at-Arms on the Coral Sea from 80-81. I was went up to non judicial punishment every week. While there I saw two people get 3 Days Bread and Water at different times. They got as much bread and water as they wanted 3 times a day. It was very rarely given out and usually as a last resort to punish someone who they thought could be rehabilitated. I also saw sailors thrown in the brig for a time. They were never left alone as we had to sit with them while they were in there. Non judicial punishment was cleared from your record when you got out. A court marshal conviction says with you forever and usually involves jail time when the ship got back to port.
Coral Sea CV-43 from 84-89 and I concur I saw 2 sailors get 3 days bread and water and those cases it seems to make a marked difference in there attitude and military bearing
I was the LPO deck department on Carl Vinson. People that the captain would send to you the brig for 3 Days bread and water or 30 days confinement. Deserved every minute of it. They were substandard sailors that just could not follow any rules. I'd have to always go down and do health and welfare checks on them.
I was a carrier sailor and destroyer sailor as well out of Long Beach CA. The destroyer (yeah I'm old) in 1958. The base had the Red Line brig, active. Marines at the naval station gate. I don't know the temperature of Navy and Marine relationships these days, but in those days it was pure hatred between the two. Here was one of the expressions describing a Marine "I would rather have a sister in a whore house then a brother that's a Marine"
I was station with "Operation Deep Freeze" out of Port Hueneme, CA. in 1990-92 and we had one of our Radioman placed in the brig at Long Beach, CA. He was on Bread and Water for three days. Our LCPO was required to visit him weekly.
@@lorenzolopez7434 Piss and punk (bread and water) was not more than 3 days. The Red line Brigs as I understand them had a series of lines painted on the deck of the brig. To cross a line, you must ask permission of the Marine guard that you were under his charge. For instance, if you needed to use the "head" you had to cross a line, you may ask "request to cross one yellow line sir" the Marine may take his time to grant permission. The topic is punishment on a carrier, you may be in the ships brig until the ship entered port, then be transferred to the Red Line, but that was then, I don't believe anymore.
I’m glad they finally changed the bread and water punishment. I received that punishment 3 days bread and water in 1988. Horrible. The irony is I worked for the department of corrections when I finished my navy career and had some compassion for guys we put in solitary confinement
Ever notice how the ones who cry about discipline Are the ones who lack it Anarchy on board a ship is not an option If you can't do the time Don't do the crime
I was part of a sailing crew last year, and although I'm not much of a troublemaker, some other crew members could be rowdy at times. From the second we got on the boat, the captain made it very clear that his word was essentially law and that there wouldn't be trouble on his boat. No problems the entire time we were on the water. The combination of the right captain and a crew that wants to be there can make all the difference.
I was a brig staff member on cvn70. We had a couple sailors come down for bread and water. The only way that was ever used was under very close supervision. They ate at the same times as the other prisoners, had the same time limit of 20 min, where they could eat as much as they wanted. After the 3 days was up, they were let lose back to your division.
Yeah, I had 3 days bread and water at NAS Jax when my ship USS Forrestal CV-59 pulled in. You had to really work to get B & W. I was UA a few times - then I missed a bunch of Restricted Musters. I deserved it. Mine was Solitary with red Bug Juice Cup full of Water and a Loaf of Bread - 3X per day. Oh and quite the Guffaw from the Marines each meal time . I was visited 1 - 2X a day by Medical. It was all good. I learned my lesson went back to 4.0 Evals and ended up getting paid for E-5 for a couple months before I got out in 4 years........ and 3 days, lol. Brig Time is Bad Time and has to be made up.
Excellent episode . The way things are going , it won't be long before it will be illegal to put anyone in jail etc . There are rules and there are punishments . Discipline in the service is essential and needs to be there and also needs to be tuff , it needs to be a deterrent . As ex military , I had a boss that punished Married soldiers with loss of pay , that hurt them ..Single soldiers , confined to barracks , that hurt them . He was a very smart officer . this punishment worked . The old adage , if you don't like the heat , get out of the kitchen . Too many people sign up , only for the money , & at a guess , they would be the main people to complain .
As a retired USAF officer, it is interesting that "different spanks for different ranks" is still a thing. A lot of officers do a lot of stuff and get a slap on the wrist while an enlisted person is severely punished for small infractions.
@@Coinz8 I think not, since flogging was employed in the US Navy for 100 years. Surely if it was unconstitutional, it would have been seen as such by those who exercised it much closer to the writing of the 8th Amendment.
When i was aboard the USS Coral Sea in 87/88 med cruise with my f-18 squadron on the flight deck we didnt want or have time to get into trouble believe me , Most the time some of the guys on liberty in foriegn ports got into a little mischief and hit the brig for a few days thats about it .
I was on Coral Sea from 84-89 and I was ships company G-4, we all served in CVW-13 and our commanding officer Capt. Robert Ferguson infrequently used bread and water as a punishment but it was used and got the message he was sending across nice to hear from you shipment were you in a VFA or VA squadron?
@@kellywilson8440 Bravo Zulu Kelly at the time I was G-4 vertical lift ships company I was a GMT and I remember VFA-131 and her sister squadron VFA-132 as well as VMFA 314 the Black nights and VMFA -323 the Death Rattlers maybe we can swap seas stories and talk about the Coral Maru we moved your bombs and missiles to the roof
@@43coralsea Thanks for your service Rick as well , Thats correct on the A/C squadrons for the 85/86 med cruise , I did the 87/88 med with VFA-136 , VFA-137 , and of course my squadron VFA-131 f-18"s , Seemed like we were in port more then at sea but was a good cruise until we lost one of our hornets and pilot 111 triple sticks in october 87 . If you like im on facebook its the profile with the f-18 on it hit me up brother will stay in touch . Got to get back to work for now .
@@kellywilson8440 Stay safe and have a great day at work I made both of those cruises and I belief the crew from HS-17 recovered that pilot if I remember correctly I will hit you up on FB again thanks brother!
Surprising the military has not adapted the "nutraloaf" to replace bread and water. A day's meal is run through a blender, then baked into a loaf an served (with water) to the inmate. This is still used in some correctional facilities.
The sailors that I personally knew of that went to the brig were dirt bags and deserved it. They each were given MANY occasions to clean up their act, much to the suffering of their shipmates. Yeah, screw those guys. They made everyone elses’ life at sea more difficult. Just another mouth to feed.
I was in the Navy for four years ('85-'89), two carriers ( America and the Roosevelt), and 80% of the Navy's traditions are about being miserable. Not necessarily punishments, just its culture and lifestyle. In fact, the first statements my CCs made to us upon introducing themselves to us were:" You're here because you really fu*ked up. No one forced you to be here. You're all about to spend the next four to six years regretting your decision." And,it turned out that wasn't boot camp hyperbole. They were absolutely right.
When one fears the consequences , they will behave. When consequences are not feared, behavior becomes unruly. Punishment is meant to be feared. I don't know how some people cannot understand this concept.
I was in the Navy from 1970-74 and I heard of some sailors being tossed into the Brig but I never heard of any of that bread and water business. The time there was hard because JarHeads were in charge of these guys but most NJP resulted in restrictions on liberty and reduction in rank, i.e., reduction of pay.
Kitty Hawk from '72 to '74 used bread and water for 3 days as an alternative to 30 days hard labor. I fortunately avoided any problems but 3 days bread and water was preferable to 30 days hard labor. Just don't eat the bread. Drink water only. Bread swells up in your gut and when you have to use the toilet it isn't a pleasant experience.
@@azbdizzy4176 We would have prob been buds! I was a Personnelman with VF-41 and worked with a lot of good sailors, all of them gone now. I may be the last of those I worked with.
Not sure if it is true or not but i was told by the CC at Great Lakes that a guy from our company got 3 days bread and water after a melt down. It was my night on fire watch and a bit after midnight i hear a loud crash and find a guy throwing the trash can at people sleeping in their racks. He was screaming and then started fighting us. After about 8 minutes and a few broken windows later we managed to get him down and hold him until Shore Patrol came and got him. He was given 6 months in the brig and discharged without an Honorable Discharge. It was said early on the last place you wanted to be at Great Lakes was the brig. When we marched past we were ordered not to even look at it.
The brig on a carrier is meant for Captains mast cases only (NJP). Usually lower rated sailors E3 and below. It used to be used also for 3 days bread and water, which I believe they have cancelled in the new 'woke' military.
Shame. Taking away basic life sustaining requirements is best way to quickly train any person or animal. Special forces takes away sleep and food during selection training…
I was stationed on an FF from 1981 to 1985. These ships were to small to have a brig. Sailors who got in trouble were usually sent to the base brig or CCU (Corrective Custody Unit).
At first I thought I either misheard the statement of bread and water punishment, or you were pulling my leg. Shocked to hear it was still available up until 2019. Never heard of it during my service days from 1978 to 1988, but then I only heard of a few Captains Mast and those were mostly docked pay.
I was in 74 - 78. During 75 at LBNSY, during my MS on base, I was the "cook" who served the food to the prisoners in the brig. There was at least always one on B&W. They got a half loaf of sliced wonder bread. Each cell had besides a toilet, a sink with a spigot.
The jail on board a ship is called the brig. And almost most major ships still have them on board all though they do not always have prisoners located there. There is also NJP with is a punishment in front of the Captain but no jail time and can include things like loss of pay, loss of rank, restricted to living area for a certain amount of days unless on duty.
Enlistees usually have no practical understanding of the hard discipline required for extended service afloat. Terminating upcoming liberty was always an effective discipline enhancer. For instance, instead of days in San Juan, Naples, Hong Kong and Tokyo, offenders instead are treated to the ship's janitorial science experience.
I was MA3 onboard CVN-70. I remember bread & water were always 3 days of confinement with regular check-ups by medical personnel and the chief. We had one who ran into the bulkhead with his head while in the brig and he was removed but I can't remember where he went. I only remember it being used while underway at sea and very rare. In 2 years it was used maybe twice.
For the most parts, punishments were handed out to people that committed numerous offences. The only time B/W was given to a first timer, it was something very serious.
I mean, people are pretty soft today. And we aren't talking about the crimes this is being applied to. I'd rather spend a few days on bread and water than get paperwork in my file.
My offense was not punishable by confinement but a Captains mast was convened and the anticipation of possible punishment assured I never committed another offense during my time in the service. Carrier life is sometimes very scary.
@@mikegracie3212 Yes it is. One of my squadron fell off the FD during night ops. On the way down he had the presents of mind to reach for the flashlight kept on his belt. Instead of hitting the water as he expected, he hit a sponson and spent a lot of time in sick bay recovering from the fall. Seemingly better out come than drowning in the ocean but it is kind of a tossup. FD pay really doesn't cover al the danger.
@@morrisyarnell6083 I remember a final checker on an A-6 that had just gone into tension when an A-7 being taxied blew him into the exhaust of the A-6, he was blown up over the JBD and into the water. I am so thankful that my job didn't require my presence on the flight Deck. I flew off the ship once on the COD and I made darn sure to follow the directions of the Flight Deck personnel. In the 3 an 1/ deployments I served on the carrier we only had 3 aviation mishaps, it was a safety record to be proud of.
I was Brig Supervisor on board Indy cv62, in the 90s, We ran bread and water.3 days on this punishment. The Opnav1640A, at the time prescribed strict procedures for this. Prescribed Doctor physical, prior to confinement. It was NOT red line Brig. It was adhered to within the rules. The confined is given a box of bread baked in the ships bakery and issued on loaf each meal. The water was a paper cup with water drawn from a water spigot within the individual cell. They were not allowed to sleep during the day, only at taps. At reveille out of the bunk and sit a metal chair all day. It's effects by the third day was profound. The Bread contains no nutrients. It's like restaurant white bread.
In the seabees we didnt technically have a brig. In homeport if someone got a DUI or other alcohol related incident they would get 45days restriction 45 days extra duty and half months pay x2 and reduction in rank. For the most part that was the punishment dealt. One person popped for drugs on a piss test she served that time prior to being separated. She was in a few days of limbo after the 45 and just before being separated she got caught shoplifting. She got sentenced to hard labor and had to dig holes and fill them back in 12 hours a day for 2 weeks. And a buddy got caught up and thrown under the bus by the unlawful actions of another seabee and had to go to the disciplinary barracks in Pensacola. Over there its Very strict. My suggestions to stay out of trouble is drink alcohol responsibly. The navy was going hard against the drunken sailor image when i was in mid 2000s. Choose your buddies right. Steer clear of the shit bags
I never heard of this punishment when I was in during the 70s. I heard of sailors going to Captain's Mast and being downgraded in rank or fined pay. We did have a Master at Arms office and a brig but never heard of anyone being put in the brig. Since it was still during the Vietnam War there didn't seem to be a thing to get rid of people. Many drug users were overlooked on my ship. I heard that after I left (76) they did a housecleaning. Got rid of the druggies and refused to reinlist some sailors with questonable behavior including 1st class petty officers
I was in the Navy from 1982- 2012. I had to do 3 days bread and water in 1983. But after that I learned my lesson and finish my career doing 30 years. I tell people if you want to lose weight very fast. Eat bread and water for 3 days. I know that works for a Fact.
Swede Boy: I was in VA-42 (Intruder training squadron) NAS Oceana too. From April 20,1972 to August 15,1975. I was a plane captain & went on carrier quals on the Independence, Lexington 3 times & FDR. Also went to Fallon & Yuma on bombing detachments several times.
This is a rather delayed response. Yes, I remember VA-42 very well. The A-6 planes would fly over the base and practice peeling off one by one which I thought was cool. I went on carrier quals on the Ranger and the Coral Sea (a real crate of a boat). I also went to NAS Fallon for three weeks once. It may have been in 1974. On that trip to Fallon - there was one night I got off at 10:00PM from the hanger (I stayed in the sick bay there since I was a Corpsman). I walked down the path back to the barracks building where my squadron VF-101 was billeted. I was looking down at the ground the whole time and when I finally looked up, I saw that the whole two stories of the building were lit up and there was a roar of men's voices coming from the building. When I went inside all the guys from VF-101 were in a crowd in the lobby. Reportedly what happened - there was an altercation in the pool hall where a Corpsman from VA-97 (Le Moore CA) struck a VF-101 guy with a cue stick. The VF101 guys were talking about it real loud and then start roaring together like at a football game. Real funny! I heard that the XO of the base had to come out that night to cool things down. I sure wish I had a camera with me!
Now I’m curious if a ship’s captain in the modern day would get away with ordering a flogging on a crazy sailor who violated a female crew member. The reason I think of that particular crime is it’s something severe. And everyone would want a punishment that reflects the severity. Of all the navy ships one idiot is bound to not be right in the head yet still go to sea. I wonder how the reaction from higher command and the average person hearing about the punishment to the crazy sailor would be.
I think instead of a cut in pay, being banned from the Star Bucks and the Commissary for 2-3 weeks is a better punishment. It would encourage them to listen to their Superiors, so they won't lose their coffee.
Interesting. I used to work on a Submarine and I don't think we had anything like it (a jail or bread and water..). There was one guy one time that lost his shit because he couldn't stand being locked in for so long. There was a small room he stayed in, which close watch by the Doc. We eventually were able to surface and he was taken off via helicopter.
Before anyone goes to Captains Mast a Preliminary Inquiry Officer (PIO) gathers all the facts and details interviews all concerned. He then gives the report to the Executive Officer who reviews everything, including interviewing the offender. If the XO thinks it merits going to Captain’s Mast the sailor will stand tall in front of the CO for punishment. There is nothing casual or arbitrary about the process.
I was an Army company commander in the mid-90s at Ft Eustis, Va. On the day of my change of command, I had to deal with a soldier who was habitually drinking with a civilian BF and showing up late to formation. My predecessor let it slide. It was going to be a field grade action by the Battalion commander. I wanted to set a tone for my command and did some research. She admitted her guilt, and I recommended a 4-week program called "School of soldier/sailor" at the Norfolk Naval brig. One of the intake Petty Officers actually asked, "Do you want to put her on bread and water for the first part of the confinement?" I said no as it was not an Army tradition, and I knew as an enlisted man that the 3 things that motivate a soldier are correct pay, mail from home, and decent chow. I or my 1SG made visits to ensure health and welfare, providing hygiene necessities. After 3 weeks, the Petty Officer said that she was doing well and could be let out early. I spoke to my Battalion Commander, whom I'd been giving regular updates, and he agreed. I told her afterward that she had a "clean slate," and if she did as the NCOs directed for her last 6 months, she would leave with an honorable discharge. I didn't have trouble with her or the rest of the company once the soldiers knew the Norfolk brig was a potential punishment. 3 weeks after her honorable discharge, I got a call from her mother. I was saying "Allright her comes the screaming. " However, the mother thanked me for getting her daughter away from an abusive boyfriend and giving her a second chance to do well in the Army. UCMJ may seem harsh to civilians, but it's fair. There has to be an element of harshness in what the military does because officers and NCOs have to instill a sense of honor, duty, and esprit de corps in young soldiers that might be asked to give the ultimate sacrifice for their comrades and their country. Finally, taking UCMJ authority away from commanders and giving it to a 3rd party is a horrible idea. There are appeals and checks and balances in the current system.
You sound like a piece of shit. Congratulations for being proud of it...100$ says you have no idea where the person is these days. Ill take it back if you do.
@Peter The great Peter they usually get smoked harder than enlisted soldiers. Many enlisted soldiers come in to get college money or for training. Most officers want to make a career out of their service. Officers are held to a higher standard than enlisted, and I've seen many careers ruined over small issues that get blown out of proportion.
Not on a carrier, but I had the pleasure of a three week stay at a floating Marine Red Line brig. They LOVED having Sailors as guests. They alternated bread and water days. Every other day water only for a week.
I was a Marine in security aboard an aircraft carrier in the late 60's while serving in Vietnam. While on brig duty, prisoners were taken through the chow line for all three meals while in the brig. They ate just like everyone else, no bread and water at all. The advantage they had was we took them to the front of the line so they did not have to wait to get fed. Flew a prisoner to Subic Bay when he cold-cocked an officer one time.
I was in the US navy from 1977 to 1981. I was given minor punishment for a minor offense. Restricted to the ship and extra duty. I was a few minutes late on 3 occasions mustering for extra duty. I was given 3 days bread and water. I became weak and listless. In the past this punishment was used to take the violence and hot headedness out of a person.Warm water and stale non nutritious white bread. After my honorable discharge, Years later I was diagnosed with A.D.D. At the time I did not know that this punishment what's still used. I thought What's next? Walking the plank?
I knew a person who was in a Fleet Marine Force in the South Pacific. He got placed in the brig on a carrier. He was allowed to walk on the deck handcuffed being escorted. The SP tried acting tough and him, "Don't you go anywhere." He just laughed at the SP and responded, "Where in the middle of the ocean. Where am I going? "
I'm of the old navy,before the whiners and cry babies came onboard. I'm of the navy with redline brigs, and "Piss and Punk" That was a term for bread and water, more bread than water. Yes the CO could sentence you up to 3 days of bread and water. You were issued liberty cards for the those going ashore, and after passing a mini inspection on the quarterdeck, and finally getting to the main gate of a shore station, have a Marine at the gate find a reason to yank your liberty card and send you back to your ship. This was 1959-60.
@@bhall4996 I know what I speak of. Believe it or not I was out of the navy for 14 years, found I was eligible to re-up (long story) which I did at the age of 42. So, I experienced both new and old navy, what a shock! Not to get to the part about women aboard ship, that's a whole different subject!
What is your experience as a sailor with being punished on an aircraft carrier? Please let me know in the comments! 💙
I was a Seabee, never been on a ship. But I have seen NJP, we called it restriction, half rats half pay for up to 30 days. Yeah, they got to wear red helmets and didn't sleep in their own rack, had guards with them when they went to chow.
I left the Navy in 1987 and it was still used, and I was on a knox class ff.
Seems,to,me that we were seldom punished for screwups or goof offs because they only laid on more watches,drills,field days and general quarters. If you got time to,get in trouble they aren’t using your talents To everyone’s advantage. No joke.
I was a Master at Arms (United States Navy Security Forces) aboard the USS Nimitz (CVN 68) and got out SEP182022 as an E-5 (MA2). We have a fully functional brig for sailors. Eventually, there would be at least 50 plus sailors on restriction, in which we had to move them into a different berthing. Usually most are confined for at least maximum punishment when it comes to time on the Nimitz. (Nimitz does not play around). 60 days no pay, 60 days restriction, reduction in rank/pay grade, and separation from the Navy. The prisoners eventually started breaking rules and breaking out on port visits and running fast for the pier to get outside of the gate. After death threats from sailors, We had to start maximizing efforts, and therefore we had 24/7 watch changing between two shifts all day, every day. Going to the head? MA is with you. Going to chow? MA is with you. Going to shower? MA is with you outside of your shower. Everything is watched. Someone is suspected of a violation while restricted? Bring the SRF-A team (MA SWAT) and we are flipping that berthing upside down to find what contraband we are looking for and you are going straight up to Mast with the captain all over again for a harsher sentence. From being on the SRF-A team, I was also the main Bailiff for the Nimitz. There are 3 Phases of the NJP aboard the Nimitz. Master chief review board, XOI (Interview with the XO) and Captains Mast (Final decision making process for NJP). I am telling you, MA's don't play around when it comes to this, they are expected to do the best job for the Captain, Admiral, and his ship. Everything is critiqued. Everything is watched. It does get fun to get hands on with a sailor with an NJP in front of the captain. I miss the Navy, but the Military has gotten way too soft, liberal, woke and too much "Safety standards" for my taste. Bring it back to the old days. PLUS I HATE THE CORRUPT CHIEFS MESS.
I received drb for minor infraction.
DRB- disciplinary review board. It was basically a slap on the wrist.
I had to wear full dress uniform for two weeks when going on liberty.
My father was a Marine during WWII. They didn't have the UCMJ then, instead the Rocks and Shoals (Navy Regulations). Dad was sentenced to seven days in the brig on bread and water (piss and punk) for being over leave by seven days from the Naval Hospital he was in. Passenger train service was very unreliable then as most train traffic was used for military supplies or transporting full units of troops. My dad had gotten his first leave since he enlisted (and had made two beach landings and battles in the meantime) and had a tough time getting trains coming back, although he had letters from the station masters verifying he was on time to catch trains, but the trains were not on time. He would have gotten 30 days in the brig if it wasn't for those letters. He said they got a full loaf of bread each morning and could drink all of the water they wanted. One other funny thing was they had to get him out of the brig, have him change into his service greens, and attend an award ceremony where he got a Bronze Star for an action on Saipan. Then back to change into dungarees and off to the brig for the rest of his time. I have a photo of his award ceremony and his brig chaser (guard) was standing next to him in the photo.
Missing ships movement was a really big deal. Ships had no extra personnel. Each has an assigned job.
The punishment was so very harsh. You were likely going to a shore jail them bad conduct discharge.
Everyone knew this. We had one guy that missed the ramp being pulled up. He grabbed one of the morning lines to get on the ship as they were being dropped from the pier. He made it, but was given an immediate captains mast.
@@thatguy8005 poor guy. Are u serious? And me I got bread and water punishment but they lied! It was lettuce and water. Just one meazley plate of wilted lettuce only 3times a day. It was not bread and water
No excuse. Your father was a degenerate and punished accordingly. 😀
@@thatguy8005 What?! He should have been cut slack, since that showed dertimination to not be in derelict of duty.
@@victorponce7238 yes, serious. He came is dripping wet to the birthing compartment. I think he was an air traffic controller or OS. He was called to the captains quarters while he was changing. I thing he just was put on restriction and lost some pay.
I was on two aircraft carriers during the Vietnam War. Most if the time we were to tired to get into much trouble. The military is not a democracy. Do your job and you'll be treated well by all hands.
Because in your fantasy there is never anyone like the Major Frank Burns depicted in the MASH series...
@@stevebell4906 There's ALWAYS the odd exception....
Exactly. Being a member of the armed forces isn't just a job, it's a way of life.
@@teecee1567 Not the odd exception...that is why Frank was a stereotype in the series...There was always that guy who who lived to catch someone without a hat or shoes not laced correctly...Or our misfit Department head that broke down and cried...because we didn't love him... and then wrote someone up for disrespect...
@@stevebell4906 did you have a Frank do you dirty?
On my ship in 2014 we had 2 sailors (Petty Officer 2nd Class) pop on a drug test for Meth. I was in security and in charge of the Restricted Division. I was considered the cool RPO (Restriction Petty Officer) because I treated everyone like a human. So the 2 sailor that popped for meth were both dropped in rank, 45 days Restriction, 45 days extra duty, half months pay x2, and separation from the navy. One sailor took his punishment in stride and kept cool. I respect how he acted. However the other one, Mitchell, during his Captains Mass was disrespectful, unrepentant, joyful, and excited to leave the navy. I was in shock to watch this go on. Clearly, the Captain was insulted. I very much respect my Captain. After the punishment, I took him down to eat chow before sending him to get his things for being moved to the Restriction quarters. At this point, he was allowed to be on his own. I returned to SEC and was ordered to go get Mitchell. The captain wanted to see him again. I found him in his shop bullshiting and breaking the terms of his Restriction. I bring him back up with my Seinor Chief where the Captain busted him for insubordination, took another rank from him making him an E-3 and sentencing him to 3 days of bread and water. We had him shackled and took him down. There are a few other details that I'll not say what happened between the the sentence and the brig but no we never physically injured him. But he made it hell for everyone once he was out of the brig. Where ever you are Mitchell. Fuck you
How did he make E5 as such a screw up?
@@ericawollmuth5055 easy, "watch my back, I'll watch yours", "do the necessary, skate the real developmental things".
🤣🤣🤣🤣 love this story
Mitchell was an outstanding actor, fooling MEPS! He earned an Oscar or deserved
It sounds like he wanted to be caught so he could be thrown out. I saw this happen several times.
I was in the Marines many years ago. At MCT (Marine Combat Training, the course taken after graduating from recruit training) a Marine who was in my platoon at Parris Island was in my squad. When he all arrived, it was like a class reunion with every excited to see each other. I asked him how he was doing and I, like almost everyone else, were looking forward to this new training phase.
He said he had made a big mistake in joining the Marines, so he took every kind of drug a day before arriving,knowing that there was a mandatory drug test. I was in shock. The drug testing is so backlogged that it takes a few weeks to process the sheer volume of drug test samples. Sure enough, one day he gets told to pack his things and he was escorted by the MPs and an angry looking group of officers and senior staff NCOs.
My now 95 year-old dad retired after 20 years in the Navy. He told us recently of his 10-day bread and water brig confinement experience early on when he was a lowly E-3 back in 1948 at Naval Station Pearl Harbor. He received this non-judicial punishment for disobeying a direct order from an NCO who assigned watch duty to the guys in my dad's section. Apparently, dad had already finished his 4-hour watch but the Sailor who was supposed to relieve him, didn't show up, so Dad was asked to take that watch. When dad questioned why, he was reported and appeared before Captain's Mast and summarily punished. He learned an early lesson in obeying orders. Ironically, he was still awarded a Good Conduct medal during that hitch. LOL!
that is a lie, bread and water was three days in length. and only used for severe subordination problems.
@@williamfowler616 Maybe in your experience, but not my dad's. He wouldn't lie or embellish about that.
UCMJ the law book for the us military says that you can only receive three days bread and water, you will have to correct your story if you are going to tell that crap to others, because it makes you look uneducated.@@carlv8168
That’s cruel and messed up
One of these facts are not correct. If he had a NJP on his record he would not qualify for the good conduct award. Additionally a ship’s captain was limited by law to administer no more than 3 days bread and water. Perhaps your father just misremembered his history. 3 days on bread and water certainly can seem like 10 days. No offense intended here. But these facts don’t line up.
Been on two Carriers. You have to be a real F*** Up to be seriously punished. The rest of us were working too hard to get into trouble. Petty Officers do not go to the brig. You lose your rank first.
In the Navy, non judicial punishment is called “Captain’s Mast”, for the reasons outlined in the video. As a Navy vet myself, I unfortunately had the unpleasant experience due to an accusation of cheating on an exam during my advanced training. At 18 years old, I was able to get witnesses lined up including some high ranking officers who believed me, as well as other students who backed me up. But the instructors were doing whatever they could to get me thrown out of school, busted to E1 and sent directly to the fleet. Luckily, and to my absolute surprise, the Captain/Commanding Officer believed my version of the events, publicly chastised my instructors, and wished me success in the completion of my extremely difficult training. I passed with flying colors…out of a class that started with close to 40 people, 17 graduated including me. Will be a memory I unfortunately will have for a long time. The CO had a reputation of always taking the charging party’s version of events, so I count myself lucky that I survived the NJP.
USN 20 years. I was on a cruiser 88-92, I appreciate this being about aircraft carriers and thank you for allowing me to share. One of our young sailors went UA for a few days shy of three months. Upon return he went to see the Captain and told him his young girlfriend was now 8 months pregnant and that he had freaked out, left the ship to take care of her and then realized best bet would have been to stay in the Navy to have medical benefits and a steady income. Our Captain was a very compassionate leader who gave the sailor 15 days restriction. That's it, no extra duty, reduction in rank, or loss of pay for almost three months of UA. I wish the story ended with a some what happy ending. Two days later the results of the mandatory urinalysis for returning deserters came back and this young sailor tested positive for cocaine. With the urinalysis results documented and zero tolerance policy for drug usage the Captain had no choice but to start processing for a dishonorable discharge. Much of the crew, including myself felt bad for the Captain, he had given this young man every possible chance. I believe Navy justice can be harsh but most leaders do what they can to help turn around substandard sailors, unfortunately there is a small percentage that are beyond redemption.
John you might like this story about a navy kid who went AWOL. I was in the Air Force ans a JAG Officer stationed at Lackland AFB when I got a call one night from a teacher of the school where my mother worked before we moved to Texas. He said that his son was in the Navy and went AWOL from California and is in Dallas afraid to turn himself in. He rode to Dallas on a motorcycle and has been gone about two weeks. I told the principal that if he was gone 30 days it could be charged as desertion. The best thing to do if he is scared is to come here and turn himself into me and I will arrange his surrender to the Navy. Tell him also not to break any traffic laws because the poice will check not only warrants but service AWOLS.
Mike made it to my house and I told him that he was now in my custody and under house arrest as I took his keys to the bike. Since it was late Friday I called the nearest Navy facility in San Antonio and gave them my name and rank and said that the boy had surrendered to me and i asked that since it was late if I could turn him in on Monday morning I also asked that they twix the Navy at his base to know that he came into my custody at 14:35 hours this date. To my surprise I was met with "Yes sir , Immediately Sir, We will note he is in your custody and notify his base of same". Boy, talk about efficient.!
Well when I went to turn him in, I went in because I was on leave that week. So we walked in and the sailor said "Are you the officer, who has the AWOL sailor?" And I said that I was, and introduced Mike who then left with some other sailors to another room after we said our good byes. The young sailor then turned to me and said "Excuse me sir, but you sure look young to be a Captain in the Navy:." I looked a him and suddenly realized why he was so spit and polished on the phone. I said "No son, I'm a Captain in the Air Force. Haven't you notiiced the four bases here in San Antonio?" The kid's jaw just dropped and I walked out smiling at my and Mike's luck. Now I didn't intend to misrepresent myself, I merely ID'ed myself as I usually did, not thinking about the difference. I'd rather like to think of it as "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" before it became the policy for another reason.
Several months passed before I saw Mike again. He came to pick up his bike and assured me that everything was OK thanks to me . He got NJP and a kick in the pants but was not discharged. Not only that but his complaints for mistreatment were investigated and found to be credible after talking to other sailors.He stayed in the Navy and I beleive he even reupped
I had a 2 boss in the oilfield that'd been kicked out of the military for coke. One army, one navy. It might been him.
I wasn't in the Navy, but the Air Force and I got in a little trouble back in the 70's and had to take a court martial, I was convicted and caught 30 days at hard labor, and a fine of $100 which was almost a months pay, at my sentencing the Judge asked if I had anything to say for myself, well, yes I did, I apologized for the trouble, and for the shame I caused and for all the grief I brought on myself, the officers and the squadron, after that he ruled 20 days suspended with 10 to serve in CC. Anyway they were not kidding about the hard labor, it was 12 hours a day filling sandbags, hand digging post holes, setting the poles and stringing concertina wire along with weed chopping. The worst part? Being marched to chow in the morning and evening so everyone could see you and make comments, LOL. My charges were drunk on station, destruction of government property, ( I wasn't driving but was in a truck that someone had taken and we crashed in a ditch ), fighting with the Air Police, out of uniform, failure to repair which was a catch-all charge, that could have been handled with NJP like an Article 15, but what sank my boat was telling the Lieutenant of the Air Police, the OOD to take a flying f**k. That's where they drew the line. I realize now that I was immature, but at 19 one doesn't make the best choices after a few drinks. Long story short, I did my ten but as I had "bad time" I had to make it up which added an extra two months to my enlistment. I did receive an Honorable Discharge, but I never pulled that stunt again.
grunt work is hard labor? Digging holes? I once had to move a 3 foot wide ,6 foot long and three foot deep hole for 5 straight hours.
@@davidwadsworth8982 LOL, it was the Air Force, we usually hired that kind of work done.
We all make mistakes and do things we shouldn't at any age,at least you got an honorable discharge.
Thanks Dickhead! Guys like you were the reason we couldn't even have one beer when we deployed in Afghanistan or Iraq. The generals remembered discipline problems from Viet Nam.
We all screw-up. Sounds like you took it as a man. I bet you're proud of that honorable discharge. Thanks for your service!
All active duty military branches give you the keys to a successful career in the first year. They tell you what will happen if you do things(outside your work hours) and get in trouble. Get drunk and act a fool, expect to deal with whatever happens in civilian courts, but don’t forget you are in the military 24/7 and that means you have to answer for your crimes through your branch as well. It could be loss of rank, or a few months pay, restricted to base, extra duty, I’ve even seen guys get pulled off their assigned jobs and put in work parties to do manual labor for 12hrs a day 7 days a week. One day they had them moving a couple pallets of blocks 200 feet away and when they finally got it done after a couple days they had to move them all right back. When you act like an idiot out drinking and do something bad enough to get arrested, you are making yourself look bad, but also your local base and service branch to the community. There’s more to it than they just want to throw punishments around on people who already got punished on the civilian side. When you screw up, it’s on both sides. Own it, apologize, pay the price and make the needed changes so it can never happen again.
i was usaf from '82-'89. at the beginning i was stationed at the defense language institute, which is run by the army. just out the back gate there was a small convenience store/grocery, operated by an old german woman. she would accept checks from usaf, but not from army. never asked about the jarheads or squids though. i usually wrote a check, none of which were a problem of course.
she knew it would be a big deal in the air force, so she trusted us.
That was common during my time with the Navy....bunch of drunk n disorderly sailors.
@@skip123davis thanks for your service. I was USAF 02-12 and medically retired..(I hate that it was just 10 years. It should have been Retired, without the medical permanently attached in front of it.) I was good at the military part of my time served, and about average with my assigned career field. I turned out to be really good at the jobs you put in charge of that aren’t really known about. Even after I got hurt my Commander told me that as long as I continued to fill those positions that I would always have a place in our Squadron. Even the Base Commander knew me by name after a couple things I got recognized for(good stuff). That’s all good, until they rotate out after there 2 years. I did my best to recover after my surgeries, all I did was end up in worse condition physically and mentally when they sent me on my way. Still. I would do it all over again if I could. I miss it.
Officer misconduct, on the other hand, is "hidden" from the crew by immediately moving the offender off the ship to serve his/her punishment away from his/her former chain of command. Can't have junior Sailors calling out the wardroom for being just as "human" as they are, can we?
RHIP.
@@jamessephar9458 In some cases it should. Discipline should NEVER be one of those cases. If you're higher in rank, the standards for conduct should be higher because 1) you've been around long enough to "know better;" and 2) as a leader you're expected to "lead by example." Therefore, the punishment for senior enlisted and officers should be much worse than they are for junior enlisteds for the same infractions, because you've violated the TRUST and are no longer worthy of the RESPECT of those you're supposed to lead.
Officers were punished a lot different than enlisted of course. That doesn't mean they get an easier sentence. Usually they are held to a higher standard because they are expected to lead by example. Discipline of a leader in front of his men in front of them by superiors degrades that leaders ability to lead in his mens eyes. NCO's get harsher punishment because they as well are to lead by example. Is the system perfect? By no means. Does it work most times? Yes.
@@darylcarr8283 And it is a higher standard as it should be.
That's right. And there's plenty of cruelty in the way they go about things as well. Don't forget it was the cruelty of the terminal janitor reclassification, that made the command imagine an innocent guy had torched his own ship.
I did brig duty on the USS Constellation in 1998-2000. We had a few guys get 3 days bread and water. Mostly for minor offenses. More serious offenses would get 30 days or transfer to the Miramar Brig. We had one drug addict nutcase (assault risk), a pedophile, two guys who just wanted out of the Navy, a total creep who wanted to get an OTH discharge and go to civvy prison to be with the "cool people", and a bunch of guys who stayed behind in Sydney Australia after we left. Most of these guys were bad attitudes, the criminal element, or mentally ill. They thought the brig would be sleeping 24 hours a day. Every second of their time is planned and they spend most of the day cleaning the brig or watching motivational videos. We would break an attitude problem by keeping them in their cell 24 hours a day without smoking privileges. They usually broke in 24 hours. The worst lasted 72 hours. We had some SEALs onboard and we gave them a tour. They were shocked that just sitting in a cell would break someone! They thought the prisoners were pretty weak! We had one guy that wanted to start a prison riot. He got the treatment and he lasted 24 hours. The plan to handle a prison riot was to evacuate and throw tear gas grenades down the hatches into the brig and let them marinate for a couple of hours. Then we would go in and beat the hell out of anybody giving us trouble.
One of them sucker punched me, and he was already getting an OTH, so we waited until we pulled into San Francisco and sent him down the brow first with some other OTHs. The security division officer made arrangements with the San Francisco Police Department to have the SFPD welcome wagon at the other end of the brow! They all were promptly arrested for vagrancy!
I remember getting busted for eating an apple while in uniform. Was a base MP. Typical bad attitude. "we" found him in civvies later on downtown and "neutralized" him outside of a bar until he could no longer see out of both eyes due to the swelling. He was too drunk to know what was "neutralizing" him. MPs with gung ho attitudes can get "fixed" as well. We never had a problem with that MP again. In fact, the MP must have transferred because we never actually saw him again. You might be hot stuff on a ship, but once we hit port, you are fair game...
I was on the USS Constellation CV-64 1980 - 1984 and had to serve as a shipboard Master at Arms and did occasionally work in the brig taking care of the prisoners there. Sounds to me like you enjoyed doing a lot more to make their lives worse than they were already going through, as if you get off on adding a little extra abuse because you're that kind of person. Oh the glee and glory you would have had in abusing people by gassing them and then beating them afterwards. People are human beings and when they are in your care always treat them with respect and dignity.
All valid reasons to encourage young people not to join. Thank you! I’ve talked so many kids out of wasting their lives on the military. I use stories like these to accomplish that.
I was in the US Navy for 9 years. I remember a couple guys who were restricted to the Ship for I think 3 months. The worst part about it was we went overseas at this time of their restriction. Those guys weren’t allowed to go ashore at 5 liberty ports. Then we went on a 2 month long at sea Operation with no liberty. So in affect they got 5 months restriction on the Ship
There is still a level of inconvenience while the ship is underway in that restricted personnel still had to muster multiple times a day in addition to their normal duties. Missing out on port visits can be depressing. There used to be a program for problematic individuals called "liberty risk" where people who had issues with bad behaviour would have to be back to the ship before dark, and couldn't be out alone.
I seem to remember that Commanding Officer's with a rank of O-6 could award 90 days restriction. The majority of the ships I served in were commanded by O-5 who could award 60 days restriction.
Thank you for your service.
Thanks for your service, also when people play stupid games they win stupid prizes
@@mikegracie3212 That is still a thing actually we had it when I was deployed 4 months ago. 😂
When I was on the aircraft carrier Hornet in 1968-69 there was no "extreme punishment" unless you want to include time in the bilges of a fireroom or engine room. The unlucky sailors sentenced to the brig and hard labor typically were taken by their Marine chaser to whatever department requested laborers. My shop even had them for a day which was easy work, cleaning vents. But bilge cleaning in a fireroom or engine room was a different hot and greasy matter! I'll tell you what, the brig on the Hornet was a dark and depressing hole
I would rather be in the bilges.
Cleaning arresting gear engines could be pretty unpleasant as well
I’ve toured the Hornet and can’t believe I’ve never asked about the Brig. I don’t think they even have it open to the public. Next time, I’ll have to ask about it.
@@tradfire Yep it's forward one or two decks down as I recall.
@@frankoverton1914 I have to of seen it. I think it’s after third deck where you’re not allowed to go.
Reminds me of the Jack Nicholson 1973 movie entitled, "The Last Detail." The story in the movie is about two sailors charged with taking ("chasing") a convicted sailor to the Portsmouth Naval Prison in NH. Oddly enough, I saw the outside of this grim naval prison a decade after it was permanently closed. NOT an inviting structure perched on the Atlantic Coast. It would have been a very nasty place in New England winters!
I was in the Navy for 7 years. The problem that I had was completely different punishments for different ranks.
If you went into a business and a employee stole your money and you call the police and it’s proven that is what happened; the employee might be arrested and go to jail. If the manager does the same thing, then it’s a warning. What kind of sense does that make ? I never got into any trouble myself which is why I had a Good Conduct Ribbon
I only saw one person sent to the brig ( jail ) and given only bread and water but he had to be let out for work and was being given real food during that time.
The shame is punishment enough for the any person of refinement is a well established pillar of British law much of which has travelled across the ocean to the opposite shores. The people who create the laws are hardly likely to allow themselves to be inconvenienced by it in any way.
During Bread and water you are (were) kept confined the whol 72 hours. So he wasn't given bread and water.
@@jamessephar9458 this guy wasn’t. He had to go back at the end of the workday , and during lunch.
If you do your job, follow orders, and have any common sense and maturity it is not difficult to stay out of trouble. Most instances are alcohol related after being at sea for months. Unfortunately some people could not figure it out.
Yeah, I am too headstrong and not good at following orders. Makes sense why I was never in the military......
@@ZadieBear it is an acquired skill. You were conditioned to follow orders in boot camp or you were punished with a marching party or some other form of physical torture. It maybe different now. Nothing better than doing exercises all day slinging a rifle in the hot sun.
I needed the Navy to straighten me out. Civilian life was too easy and I needed a boot in the butt to learn how to be a man.
True...a lot of it is alcohol related. That's why during liberty, or port of call, I usually go out by myself cause sailors in my squadron couldn't handle their booze and getting in trouble.
Squids 🦑
We drink too much! Lol
For minor stuff the Chief will assign you a very unpleasant task like latrine duty or worse. I endured a month of everybody hating me and bitching about no toilet paper but they only allotted me a few rolls per day. I kept it clean enough otherwise. Not my fault, man. I never found out what I was being punished for either. It was one of several possibilities. Evil grin.
You're not fooling anyone, you know what you did
I was on my first ship, LST 1189 when we had a dress blue inspection by an admiral. Well I missed getting my blues into the cleaner but did the best I could, washed them in the ships laundry, ironed and pressed them. When my NCO saw my uniform he damn near passed out telling me I cannot go up there like that. I tried to get him to send me to sick bay and other things to get me out of inspection but he refused.
So standing there in formation the admiral makes his speech from the podium then starts his inspection going from one division to another. He then gets to my division and goes down the front line, turns and heads down my line. Stops in front of me, looks up and down and asked what happened to me " I missed the dry cleaners sir!" I replied and he walks off. He finishes the inspection and gets back up to the podium and says " Overall you all look squared away. But one of you should have stayed home."
I mumbled under my breathe to my NCO next to me " One of us tried to stay home." Yep, that turned into a 12 hour work day. LOL
There are heads in the navy. Not latrines. Cleaning is not a punishment. 12 to 200 men in one berthing compartment requires continuous efforts to maintain habitability.
I was on the USS Coral Sea from 77-80 assigned to the Marine Detachment. One of our additional duties, and usually performed by a Marine waiting for his security clearance to get approved worked in Correctional Custody or the ‘Red Line” Brig. Was not a good place for sailors to end up but we had a very high successful rate of sailors returning back to their division and do their job. Red Line brig went away while we were in the yards at Bremerton in 78 leaving CC the only additional duty for us.
I was on the Midway 1976. They did away with Marine Security Detachments on ships and Marine Barracks on Navy bases in the late 90's. MA's handle all that now.
they shut the brig down, cause a polititions kin was hurt in there. yes there was still bread and water in Navy regs.
When I was on the Oriskany in 1966. We were tied up in Subi bay, At that time all they had was the gedunk at the carrier pier, It was night time and one of the marine who worked the brig come stumbling back into the light, somebody had just beat the hell out of him. I guess it was just payback for a hard time he gave somebody.
I was on the Constellation CV64 in summer/fall 1977 - The Coral Sea replaced us in Subic Bay (Olongapo) while we went to Korea and Yokosuka, Japan
You mofo.{ LOL } I was in the brig aboard the USS Enterprise in Bremerton. The guards were Marines and Navy , mixed . The Marines were strict Aholes but also fun . We could have a cigarette break IF we could ride on a 20 gallon paint shaker for one full minute . Not easy to do. I had 30 days with 3 off for good behavior. Good memories . And YES I didnt want to go back to the brigg ever again.
I was on the Nimitz 2001-2006( the carrier at beginning of this video , Cvn 68) . The bread and water punishment does not exceed 3 days but they can be kept in the brig for up to 60 days.
Did you witness or know about the famous Incident in 2004, off the coast of Florida? The 46ft tik tac object that defied the laws of ohysic and even appeared in a pilots cap point?
I served on a carrier during Viet Nam. We mustered and reported to our work stations just as civilians used to report to their respective work places. We did our jobs, and at days end we laid back just as civilians did. If it was necessary to stay on duty, we did, just as civilians are sometimes required to do depending on their responsibilities. The level of stress and responsibility lays with the job, the flight deck personnel be an example of that. I did my job as ship's company, followed the rules, made friends, was respected by my superiors and experienced no hardship on the carrier.
As in civilian life you make your own bed. If you make trouble, give trouble or seek it, you will find it and suffer the consequences, and it will not be the ship's fault, the Navy's fault or fault of the command.
I spent my at-sea time on submarines, other than 2 years on a submarine tender. In 1978 I was assigned to Shore Patrol, the Navy's version of MPs. During the 6 months I spent with SP I know of several sailors that were transported to their pre-confinement physicals and detention on bread and water. I was shocked to learn that it was still allowed.
I only did Shore Patrol on duty days when we were in port at Subic. I just walked through the bars in Olongapo and talked to the girls. Finished at midnight, right before the girls get off work and didn't have to be back until the next morning.
Same in the early 80s aboard CV62
I was in the Navy from 1972-1976 as a Corpsman. I was on two carriers (the Coral Sea and the Ranger) for a total sea duty time of thirty days. I remember the persons who were in the brig - they were marched through the corridors in a lock step. That is to say each man put his hand the shoulder of the man marching in front of him and the group marched grunting "gangway, prisoners!" and digging their right boot into the deck. It sounded like "gangway, prisoners (crump, crump). But I still wonder what people did to get into the brig - do your job and everything flows fine.
Coral Sea sailor here shipmate
@@43coralsea I was on it for two weeks in September 1974. I was in VF-101 in Virginia Beach VA whose sole purpose was to train pilots to land on carriers. When were you on the Coral Sea?
@@Swede9418 I was on the Coral Maru "San Francisco's own" from 84-88 and she had just finished a yard period and came out in the Coral Sea configuration with CVW-13 and VFA's flying a mix of 2 Marine and 2 Navy F-18 squadrons and a VA flying the A-6 no F-4's no F-14's
I believe that I was on it during September 1974. I reported to VF-101 in July 1974 and I was actually working in the base dispensary. I was rather disappointed to find out that VF-101 was a training squadron (training pilots how to land on a carrier) rather than a regular combat squadron. CDR Fortenberry was the CO, right? For that matter what rate were you?
Gio navy 2010 veteran
I was in the service from 83 to 2004 & in different fleets, while my dad served in the submarine fleet back in the 60’s. I have witnessed the bread & water confinement along with EMI or extra military instruction. They were very cruel but necessary cuz at that time we were still taking juvenile convicts for naval service & some are really in need of discipline, specially the ones that wasn’t combed at RTC. Real knuckleheads!
87-2008 HMC (FMF) also did some blueside. Go Navy shipmate!
It doesnt make people anything bu5 more violent and ready to kill, exactly whay the miltary needs.
@@MRblazedBEANS You have no idea what the military is about. The last thing we want in the military is violent uncontrollable people. People like that are more of a danger to our own side than they are to any enemy. They rarely if ever make it past Bootcamp. Kind of like you. I smell an ELS in here.
@@MRblazedBEANS Most naval missions are for patrol and support. On a ship you can have unruly types of people in tight quarters around very expensive and dangerous equipment. Lack of discipline can lead to hostility between crew members which often leads to harassment and violence. Lack of discipline can endanger an entire crew or even other ships and people. It may seem harsh but it is necessary to misbehavior dead seriously and instill professionalism when you have teenagers and 20-something year olds operating a 100,000 ton multi-billion dollar vessel full of deadly explosives.
@@MRblazedBEANS moron moment
I spent 22 yrs. in the USAF. Several over seas assignments as well as stateside. I never got into trouble. Did my job. Minded my own business. Crazy talk, I know.
No, just common sense.
want a cookie?
I got a field grade article 15 while I was serving in the Army. I got 45 days restriction to post, extra duty, and reduction of pay. Reduced from E-3 to E-1. It sucked, but they got their point across. I didn't mess up again.
I got the same thing for going AWOL in the National Guard. Only thing was they forgot to actually take my rank so after a year of not wearing it my 1SGT told me to just put it back on my uniform if they didn’t follow through on officially stripping me of it.
There's a joke that the Good Conduct Medal is only given to those who have not been caught in the act in four years. Seriously, getting NJP or Captain's Mast is dependent upon how well your department has your back. Our Chief Petty Officers will always tell the junior NCO's to anticipate and solve problems before getting out of hand and sent to the skipper. As a result we took care of things at the lowest level. My department always had an NCO assigned to the Quarter Deck to intercept and slip the drunk sailors or those who got into fights back into berthing vs. the brig. Thus avoiding NJP. Other departments with a weak leadership culture were more prone to NJP and Captains Mast.
I got 6 of them, when I would stand watch as OOD inport at night overseas when drunks came back to the ship my first choice was to get someone from their division to come up and take care of them.
Wow! 21 years active duty in the USAF and never received a good conduct medal - for a reason.
@@mikegracie3212 My ship did the same thing. Most of our divisions had assigned drunk watch personnel. One night in Korea during Westpac i was on duty and I/we had to get some of "our" drunks in our dept(AIR) and bring them back to the berthing.
I can see that.
@@elwin38 our biggest challenge with drunks was in the Philippines.
I was on the USS Coral Sea from 1986 to decom in 1990. Never knew anyone in my department (weapons) who went to the brig for petty items or serious one for that matter.
The only way you would wind up there were for serious items like theft,fighting,drunk on duty and the like.
I served aboard the USS Kitty Hawk for two years and read the weekly NJP lists. Only one occasion have I seen bread & water as punishment, and it was for only three days. Our CO was nicknamed "the Terminator" because he would regularly hand out maximum punishment during Captain's Mast, which typically was 30 days extra/restricted duty, and reduction in paygrade.
The old man wasn't Daniel Rainey, was it?
Doug Neidermeyer.
CV-63 from 1985-88...had to be Capt.Hoffman. Were you aboard
when he actually had a captain's mast televised when we went out on workups
prior to the '87 world cruise?
@@vitameat I got onboard just as the Hawk finished the cruise and headed for SLEP. Was that a pain in the ass. That was my 2nd command......boy they know how to stick it to people. lol
@@sw417 So you got Capt. Tillotson then. Had the change of command before going up the Suez Canal...not nice to piss off certain admiral types
The atmosphere changed immediately on board when Hoffman was relieved and reassigned (Pearl Harbor?)
I I served on a carrier for just shy of 4 years in the 50s. I never got into trouble, but knew of shipmates who worked in te boilerroom with me who thought the brig would be an improvement over where we worked! It was a pretty awful life!
I hear ya brother I was a BT and I hated the engine room. Rate does not even exist anymore now it's all MMs and GT
@@mikem9892 that fucking engine room is a hot son of a bitch on the kitty hawk, I don’t know how people worked there, when I had to go down there to do electrical repairs they only let you work 15 minutes and then you had to leave and cool down and then go back in again because it was unbearable, hot, I asked the BT(boiler tech) And he said oh, you get used to it, was way hotter than Saudi Arabia in that fucking space
I was a U.S. Marine attached to the USS Hermitage LSD 34 on a Med Cruise in 1973 - 1974 .... A sailor was thrown in the Brig for 3 days / Bread & Water .... I was his guard for 6 hrs every day of his sentence ..... I think I suffered more than him .... I snuck a few sandwiches from the mess deck for him in the evening post ..... I did not like how he was being treated ..... I Know it was wrong, but I'm glad I did it !!! ..... U.S. Marine 1972 -1978
You should have been in there with him for failing to carry out your duty. That sort of lack of discipline is shocking coming from a Marine, you should be ashamed of yourself. You violated the 3rd and 6th general order.
Marine's protect those who can't protect themselves. Blindly following orders is conduct unbecoming a Marine. Good for you.
@@Bellthorian Apparently you did not see "A few good men" where two marines were charged with causing the death of fellow marine, but they were just following a code red" order! Not a legitimate order but being marines did not question and followed their Colonel's order and the marine died! That Sailor could been a diabetic or whatever so his life may have saved by those sandwiches. So least Woody can sleep with a clear conscience!
@@MrBobm001 If the sailor had a medical condition it would have been noted in his medical record and his punishment would have been tailored for it. If he was a diabetic he would not have been in the military.
Being in the brig on bread and water is a pretty serious punishment......he did something very bad to get that sentence. Woody did a bad thing...period.
Probably lucky to not get busted down and given piss and punk for it. My dad as SOG in the brig somewhere, I forget where, but gave a cigarette to a friend who was under his charge. He was caught, busted down and put on piss n punk for awhile. Dad HATED the Corps till he got old in his 90's when he forgot all about everything he hated.
In the early 1980s, a sailor was sentenced to bread and water for three days. The Master at arms got sick of the sailor sitting there doing nothing and ordered him to do push ups. the sailor died. The captain lost his command and the brig was closed for six months.
It was on the USS Ranger. He was in correctional custody and given PT on the flight deck. He was abused by the MAA, suffered a heat stroke and died. His name was Paul Terice. MAA went to jail. Captain stayed. XO went.
@@radsdad1 It's sad that more MAAs were not made aware of the Stanford Prison Experiment and trained on how to prevent it, especially considering that this was only a decade prior and received so much attention.
Airman Recruit Paul A. Trerice, of Algonac, Mich., a husky 21-year-old who was frequently in trouble with his superiors aboard ship, died suddenly on April 14 after a short time in the Ranger's brig on bread and water. The Navy listed the cause of death as heat stroke.
The sailor's organs and brain were removed during the Navy autopsy. While the Navy described their removal as a routine procedure, Dr. Werner Spitz, the Wayne County, Mich., medical examiner, said the missing organs handicapped the autopsy he did for the family. But Spitz said some physicans remove the organs and thus he attached no special significance to the Navy action.
Trerice became abusive in the Ranger's correctional custody unit and had to be subdued in a struggle shortly before his death.
Spitz said the bruises and cuts on Trerice's body indicated "a substantial struggle" had taken place but not a beating. The Navy said Trerice had taken a shower shortly before the struggle, complained he was not feeling well and was getting ready to go to the sick bay when he suddenly became abusive and had to be subdued. He collapsed during the struggle and was pronounced dead at the hospital in Subic Bay, the Philippines, where the Ranger was docked at the time.
In addition;
The buying and selling of marijuana on the Ranger reached the point that a Navy investigator wsa able to arrange and observe a purchase (called a controlled buy) and arrest two of the sailors involved.
At least one Marine was punished for beating a prisoner under his control in the ship's brig.
Cdr. Michael Sherman, the Navy's designated spokesman for questions about the Ranger, and Capt. William J. Legg, judge advocate for the commander of naval air forces in the Pacific, confirmed those incidents in response to queries.
Legg disputed, however, accounts by two other sailors who say they were beaten in the Rangerhs brig. Legg said the claims of sailors Gregory J. Girard and Raymond R. Ramsey had been investigated and found to be "unsubstantiated." But the sailors' civilian lawyer, William G. Blasdel Jr. of Philadelphia, has offered to have his clients take polygraph tests.
In a sworn statement Blasdel furnished The Washington Post, Girard, who has been arrested on drug charges, said this is what happened to him at the hands of two Marines right after he was taken to the ship's brig on Dec. 28:
"I was assaulted by [names deleted by The Post] upon arrival. I was kicked by [name deleted] on the right side of the hip which left a scruffed burn. I was kicked through hatches. I was punched four times in the stomach and four times in the kidneys. I threw up blood later that night. Lance Corporal [name deleted] placed two hands on my throat and applied pressure so that I could not speak."
In another sworn statement supplied by Blasdel, Ramsay, also arrested on drug charges, said this is what a Marine did to him right after he was put in the Ranger's brig:
"I was thrown against the wall and, you may say, tested. He was slapping my face and telling me to go ahead and raise my hands above my waist so he could beat the s--- out of me. I was taken back to cell four and thrown against the wall, and he grabbed me around my throat and called me a pussy and a faggot and to go ahead and raise my hands so he could beat the s--- out of me. I said, 'No, lance corporal.' Then he hit me three times in the stomach and called me a pussy.
"He then told me to get up against the wall. And my toes weren't touching so he stepped on them and told me to move them while he left his foot on them."
A third sailor, Neil Wayne Hodgson Jr. of Grosse Point Farms, Mich., wrote Blasdel that "my ear drum is ruptured as a result of being physically abused in the brig on the Ranger. I would like to attend a court of law and testify [about] what has taken place in the brig on the USS Ranger . . . ."
Navy legal officer, Legg, when asked about Hodgson's allegations, said that the Marine involved had been punished.
Navy officers not involved with the Ranger case said that the long deployments to the Persian Gulf of undermanned and overworked ships and crews have aggravated discipline problems.
I bet the mother was very upset.
My last cruise on the Independence I put one of my plane captains on report. At Captains Mast the Skipper put the guy in the brig and part of that punishment was bread and water. Later on after he got out of the brig I found out that that portion of the punishment was given one meal per day, usually at lunch!
When I was assigned to the Brig staff on Carl Vinson the rare cases where sailors were awarded Bread and Water they were fed 3 times a day.
I know a guy that was on the independence back in 86 to 90.
I did three days bread and water twice while in the US NAVY. I also went to the brigg for 30 days.
when and why?? you can't just leave us there!
This is depressing. I enlisted in the Navy in 1987...DEP...I had a recruiter who I found out later on was a high school dropout, could barely read and write and had just been convicted of a DUI. I developed knee problems while awaiting shipping out to boot camp at Great Lakes RTC. When I told my recruiter about it, things went downhill fast. It was handled unprofessionally. To this day that experience bothers me a little. Had I to do it over again, I would have contacted my U.S. Senator and/or Congressman for help. Had I to do it all over again, I think I would have joined the Air Force or Army instead...or joined nothing. It was miserable and in my experience the Navy treats many people badly. I graduated from high school, was an Eagle Scout and came from a solid middle class family. I never did any recreational drugs, had no run ins with the law.. I enlisted into a group that was filled up with high school drop outs who had gotten their GED, many had booze problems and most were using the Navy as a form of welfare...just waiting for their twenty years to hit so they could get their federal pension with federal benefits.
Yeah, because 20 years in service is totally easy and not worth a pension lmfao
@@PyrrhoX holding down fatass recruiter duty? My recruiter was just putting in his twenty so he would not have to load trucks. He sat in the Navy Recruiting station and told me that straight to my face. When he told me that I lost all respect for him because it told me he DID NOT WANT TO WORK.
@@CoolestDude38NC Craaaazy. Welcome to the real world
@@PyrrhoX what is your point?
I served as ships company on the USS Independence CVA-62 from 1964to 1968. While we were on station in the Gulf of Tonkin Vietnam we worked 12 hour shifts 7 days a week. We spent 13 months of 45 to 50 days at sea and we were too tired to get into trouble. We got two days off for every 45 days at sea. We might hit a neutral port and get one day off the ship or just float around in the ocean and try to relax. The Navy was very different then from today’s Navy.
CV62 myself. Lebanon Grenada & NATO Europe 81-87. Was on Indy 82-84
My uncle was on an aircraft carrier during the Korean war. He told me that the really bad trouble makers or ones that didn't fit in would sometimes disappear from the ship while in the middle of the sea. I took this as they were helped overboard.
And these are the people you fight for, who will kill you if you make a mistake, sounds pretty sadistic and demonic to me. I guess legalized killers have no heart or compassion or no one to answer to.
I’m pretty sure your uncle was fibbing just a bit! 😂
My father served almost thirty years in the navy. He told me the same thing.
I seriously doubt that. If a sailor or any other person is missing or unaccounted for, there is a big search and a massive report would have to be submitted by the ship's commander to his superiors. If a ship commander buit a reputation of inexplicably losing his men while at sea, he'd be removed pretty quickly and possibly face a court marital for failure of duty.
I imagine they were put on a cargo aircraft and sent shoreside, rather than being sent to Davey Jones' Locker.
Very nicely put together video and very entertaining as well. Thanks for posting this.
In today's Navy they probably just take a way their cellphone and say, "no tik-tok or twitter for 1 week".
I was a Master-at-Arms on the Coral Sea from 80-81. I was went up to non judicial punishment every week. While there I saw two people get 3 Days Bread and Water at different times. They got as much bread and water as they wanted 3 times a day. It was very rarely given out and usually as a last resort to punish someone who they thought could be rehabilitated. I also saw sailors thrown in the brig for a time. They were never left alone as we had to sit with them while they were in there. Non judicial punishment was cleared from your record when you got out. A court marshal conviction says with you forever and usually involves jail time when the ship got back to port.
I'm retired LE and I've seen NJP show up on NCIC and ENLETS inquiries.
Coral Sea CV-43 from 84-89 and I concur I saw 2 sailors get 3 days bread and water and those cases it seems to make a marked difference in there attitude and military bearing
*court martial
At the end of the video, we see a 1-Star Admiral Franchetti. Today she is now a 4-Star and Chief of Naval Operations. Amazing career progression!
Because she is female.
I was the LPO deck department on Carl Vinson. People that the captain would send to you the brig for 3 Days bread and water or 30 days confinement. Deserved every minute of it. They were substandard sailors that just could not follow any rules.
I'd have to always go down and do health and welfare checks on them.
what is "LPO deck dept?" usaf checking in here, lol!
@@skip123davis Lead Petty Officer of the Deck Dept.
The kind of people that you speak of work hard at not working, waste of space.
I was a prisoner of marriage. This looks like a vacation.
I was a carrier sailor and destroyer sailor as well out of Long Beach CA. The destroyer (yeah I'm old) in 1958. The base had the Red Line brig, active. Marines at the naval station gate. I don't know the temperature of Navy and Marine relationships these days, but in those days it was pure hatred between the two. Here was one of the expressions describing a Marine "I would rather have a sister in a whore house then a brother that's a Marine"
I was station with "Operation Deep Freeze" out of Port Hueneme, CA. in 1990-92 and we had one of our Radioman placed in the brig at Long Beach, CA. He was on Bread and Water for three days. Our LCPO was required to visit him weekly.
@@lorenzolopez7434 Piss and punk (bread and water) was not more than 3 days. The Red line Brigs as I understand them had a series of lines painted on the deck of the brig. To cross a line, you must ask permission of the Marine guard that you were under his charge. For instance, if you needed to use the "head" you had to cross a line, you may ask "request to cross one yellow line sir" the Marine may take his time to grant permission. The topic is punishment on a carrier, you may be in the ships brig until the ship entered port, then be transferred to the Red Line, but that was then, I don't believe anymore.
OUCH!! That a low jab at the Jarheads..
@@lorenzolopez7434
Did you like your time in the navy? Would you do it again?
Wats the worst part(s)?
@@sirknowsalot8000 i remember we also used to call it champagne and caviar
I’m glad they finally changed the bread and water punishment. I received that punishment 3 days bread and water in 1988. Horrible. The irony is I worked for the department of corrections when I finished my navy career and had some compassion for guys we put in solitary confinement
Back in the day 3 days bread and water was the norm for those sent to the brig. But in order to get that you really had to mess up.
Ever notice how the ones who cry about discipline
Are the ones who lack it
Anarchy on board a ship is not an option
If you can't do the time
Don't do the crime
I was part of a sailing crew last year, and although I'm not much of a troublemaker, some other crew members could be rowdy at times. From the second we got on the boat, the captain made it very clear that his word was essentially law and that there wouldn't be trouble on his boat. No problems the entire time we were on the water. The combination of the right captain and a crew that wants to be there can make all the difference.
well you know what Chesty said about that...
@@xisotopex No. What did he say?
@@gaoxiaen1
ask your DI
I was a brig staff member on cvn70. We had a couple sailors come down for bread and water. The only way that was ever used was under very close supervision. They ate at the same times as the other prisoners, had the same time limit of 20 min, where they could eat as much as they wanted. After the 3 days was up, they were let lose back to your division.
Yeah, I had 3 days bread and water at NAS Jax when my ship USS Forrestal CV-59 pulled in. You had to really work to get B & W. I was UA a few times - then I missed a bunch of Restricted Musters. I deserved it. Mine was Solitary with red Bug Juice Cup full of Water and a Loaf of Bread - 3X per day. Oh and quite the Guffaw from the Marines each meal time . I was visited 1 - 2X a day by Medical. It was all good. I learned my lesson went back to 4.0 Evals and ended up getting paid for E-5 for a couple months before I got out in 4 years........ and 3 days, lol. Brig Time is Bad Time and has to be made up.
I was stationed on Carl Vinson from 84 to 88.
Excellent episode . The way things are going , it won't be long before it will be illegal to put anyone in jail etc . There are rules and there are punishments . Discipline in the service is essential and needs to be there and also needs to be tuff , it needs to be a deterrent . As ex military , I had a boss that punished Married soldiers with loss of pay , that hurt them ..Single soldiers , confined to barracks , that hurt them . He was a very smart officer . this punishment worked . The old adage , if you don't like the heat , get out of the kitchen . Too many people sign up , only for the money , & at a guess , they would be the main people to complain .
I think flogging could be brought back in order to keep today's navy in line.
As a retired USAF officer, it is interesting that "different spanks for different ranks" is still a thing. A lot of officers do a lot of stuff and get a slap on the wrist while an enlisted person is severely punished for small infractions.
@@jonothandoeser That is against the 8th amendment.
@@Coinz8 I think not, since flogging was employed in the US Navy for 100 years. Surely if it was unconstitutional, it would have been seen as such by those who exercised it much closer to the writing of the 8th Amendment.
When i was aboard the USS Coral Sea in 87/88 med cruise with my f-18 squadron on the flight deck we didnt want or have time to get into trouble believe me , Most the time some of the guys on liberty in foriegn ports got into a little mischief and hit the brig for a few days thats about it .
I was on Coral Sea from 84-89 and I was ships company G-4, we all served in CVW-13 and our commanding officer Capt. Robert Ferguson infrequently used bread and water as a punishment but it was used and got the message he was sending across nice to hear from you shipment were you in a VFA or VA squadron?
@@43coralsea , Roger that Rick i was in VFA-131 Wildcats f-18"s AO shop .
@@kellywilson8440 Bravo Zulu Kelly at the time I was G-4 vertical lift ships company I was a GMT and I remember VFA-131 and her sister squadron VFA-132 as well as VMFA 314 the Black nights and VMFA -323 the Death Rattlers maybe we can swap seas stories and talk about the Coral Maru we moved your bombs and missiles to the roof
@@43coralsea Thanks for your service Rick as well , Thats correct on the A/C squadrons for the 85/86 med cruise , I did the 87/88 med with VFA-136 , VFA-137 , and of course my squadron VFA-131 f-18"s , Seemed like we were in port more then at sea but was a good cruise until we lost one of our hornets and pilot 111 triple sticks in october 87 . If you like im on facebook its the profile with the f-18 on it hit me up brother will stay in touch . Got to get back to work for now .
@@kellywilson8440 Stay safe and have a great day at work I made both of those cruises and I belief the crew from HS-17 recovered that pilot if I remember correctly I will hit you up on FB again thanks brother!
I was on an amphib ship. I never got b&w but know some who did. They always hit the soda machines after being released.
Surprising the military has not adapted the "nutraloaf" to replace bread and water. A day's meal is run through a blender, then baked into a loaf an served (with water) to the inmate. This is still used in some correctional facilities.
I never got in trouble once when I was in the navy. But i did spend a lot of my free time helping people stay out of trouble.
You have a good heart.
The sailors that I personally knew of that went to the brig were dirt bags and deserved it. They each were given MANY occasions to clean up their act, much to the suffering of their shipmates. Yeah, screw those guys. They made everyone elses’ life at sea more difficult. Just another mouth to feed.
I was in the Navy for four years ('85-'89), two carriers ( America and the Roosevelt), and 80% of the Navy's traditions are about being miserable. Not necessarily punishments, just its culture and lifestyle.
In fact, the first statements my CCs made to us upon introducing themselves to us were:" You're here because you really fu*ked up. No one forced you to be here. You're all about to spend the next four to six years regretting your decision."
And,it turned out that wasn't boot camp hyperbole.
They were absolutely right.
When one fears the consequences , they will behave.
When consequences are not feared, behavior becomes unruly.
Punishment is meant to be feared.
I don't know how some people cannot understand this concept.
You don't have to incarcerate someone to put them in prison!
-Mark Fuhrman
Diane Sawyer Interview
1997
I was in the Navy from 1970-74 and I heard of some sailors being tossed into the Brig but I never heard of any of that bread and water business. The time there was hard because JarHeads were in charge of these guys but most NJP resulted in restrictions on liberty and reduction in rank, i.e., reduction of pay.
Kitty Hawk from '72 to '74 used bread and water for 3 days as an alternative to 30 days hard labor. I fortunately avoided any problems but 3 days bread and water was preferable to 30 days hard labor. Just don't eat the bread. Drink water only. Bread swells up in your gut and when you have to use the toilet it isn't a pleasant experience.
@@azbdizzy4176 We would have prob been buds! I was a Personnelman with VF-41 and worked with a lot of good sailors, all of them gone now. I may be the last of those I worked with.
Oh but chipping and painting 20 hours a day isn’t punishment
Not sure if it is true or not but i was told by the CC at Great Lakes that a guy from our company got 3 days bread and water after a melt down. It was my night on fire watch and a bit after midnight i hear a loud crash and find a guy throwing the trash can at people sleeping in their racks. He was screaming and then started fighting us. After about 8 minutes and a few broken windows later we managed to get him down and hold him until Shore Patrol came and got him. He was given 6 months in the brig and discharged without an Honorable Discharge. It was said early on the last place you wanted to be at Great Lakes was the brig. When we marched past we were ordered not to even look at it.
The brig on a carrier is meant for Captains mast cases only (NJP). Usually lower rated sailors E3 and below. It used to be used also for 3 days bread and water, which I believe they have cancelled in the new 'woke' military.
Shame. Taking away basic life sustaining requirements is best way to quickly train any person or animal. Special forces takes away sleep and food during selection training…
The bread and water punishment was suspended in 2015 during the Obama admin.
@@brucefredrickson9677 of course it was... I was Army but I remember how the military started going down hill as a early as 2009...
@@roguespearsf lol
Yeah you just can't get Obama out of your head
Blame him for your shitty life
The new woke military....yep, China and Russia are loving that we are becoming soft..
I was stationed on an FF from 1981 to 1985. These ships were to small to have a brig. Sailors who got in trouble were usually sent to the base brig or CCU (Corrective Custody Unit).
At first I thought I either misheard the statement of bread and water punishment, or you were pulling my leg. Shocked to hear it was still available up until 2019. Never heard of it during my service days from 1978 to 1988, but then I only heard of a few Captains Mast and those were mostly docked pay.
I was in 74 - 78. During 75 at LBNSY, during my MS on base, I was the "cook" who served the food to the prisoners in the brig. There was at least always one on B&W. They got a half loaf of sliced wonder bread. Each cell had besides a toilet, a sink with a spigot.
The jail on board a ship is called the brig. And almost most major ships still have them on board all though they do not always have prisoners located there. There is also NJP with is a punishment in front of the Captain but no jail time and can include things like loss of pay, loss of rank, restricted to living area for a certain amount of days unless on duty.
Enlistees usually have no practical understanding of the hard discipline required for extended service afloat. Terminating upcoming liberty was always an effective discipline enhancer. For instance, instead of days in San Juan, Naples, Hong Kong and Tokyo, offenders instead are treated to the ship's janitorial science experience.
Or the Philippines, Thailand or Australia.
I was MA3 onboard CVN-70. I remember bread & water were always 3 days of confinement with regular check-ups by medical personnel and the chief. We had one who ran into the bulkhead with his head while in the brig and he was removed but I can't remember where he went. I only remember it being used while underway at sea and very rare. In 2 years it was used maybe twice.
1:27 someone who is being punished is not a 'victim' good grief
The Navy isnt allowed to use bread and water punishment anymore. People who make these videos need to do some research.
For the most parts, punishments were handed out to people that committed numerous offences. The only time B/W was given to a first timer, it was something very serious.
I mean, people are pretty soft today. And we aren't talking about the crimes this is being applied to. I'd rather spend a few days on bread and water than get paperwork in my file.
My offense was not punishable by confinement but a Captains mast was convened and the anticipation of possible punishment assured I never committed another offense during my time in the service. Carrier life is sometimes very scary.
Working on the Flight Deck is scary as heck. Unbelievable Dangerous.
@@mikegracie3212 Yes it is. One of my squadron fell off the FD during night ops. On the way down he had the presents of mind to reach for the flashlight kept on his belt. Instead of hitting the water as he expected, he hit a sponson and spent a lot of time in sick bay recovering from the fall. Seemingly better out come than drowning in the ocean but it is kind of a tossup. FD pay really doesn't cover al the danger.
@@morrisyarnell6083 I remember a final checker on an A-6 that had just gone into tension when an A-7 being taxied blew him into the exhaust of the A-6, he was blown up over the JBD and into the water. I am so thankful that my job didn't require my presence on the flight Deck. I flew off the ship once on the COD and I made darn sure to follow the directions of the Flight Deck personnel. In the 3 an 1/ deployments I served on the carrier we only had 3 aviation mishaps, it was a safety record to be proud of.
I was Brig Supervisor on board Indy cv62, in the 90s, We ran bread and water.3 days on this punishment. The Opnav1640A, at the time prescribed strict procedures for this. Prescribed Doctor physical, prior to confinement. It was NOT red line Brig. It was adhered to within the rules. The confined is given a box of bread baked in the ships bakery and issued on loaf each meal. The water was a paper cup with water drawn from a water spigot within the individual cell. They were not allowed to sleep during the day, only at taps. At reveille out of the bunk and sit a metal chair all day. It's effects by the third day was profound. The Bread contains no nutrients. It's like restaurant white bread.
In the seabees we didnt technically have a brig. In homeport if someone got a DUI or other alcohol related incident they would get 45days restriction 45 days extra duty and half months pay x2 and reduction in rank. For the most part that was the punishment dealt. One person popped for drugs on a piss test she served that time prior to being separated. She was in a few days of limbo after the 45 and just before being separated she got caught shoplifting. She got sentenced to hard labor and had to dig holes and fill them back in 12 hours a day for 2 weeks. And a buddy got caught up and thrown under the bus by the unlawful actions of another seabee and had to go to the disciplinary barracks in Pensacola. Over there its Very strict. My suggestions to stay out of trouble is drink alcohol responsibly. The navy was going hard against the drunken sailor image when i was in mid 2000s. Choose your buddies right. Steer clear of the shit bags
Imagine being keel-hauled on a carrier. Pretty sure there'd be no need for the full 3 hauls.🤣
You would not even survive the first one!
I never heard of this punishment when I was in during the 70s. I heard of sailors going to Captain's Mast and being downgraded in rank or fined pay. We did have a Master at Arms office and a brig but never heard of anyone being put in the brig. Since it was still during the Vietnam War there didn't seem to be a thing to get rid of people. Many drug users were overlooked on my ship. I heard that after I left (76) they did a housecleaning. Got rid of the druggies and refused to reinlist some sailors with questonable behavior including 1st class petty officers
My NJP 45 days restriction, 45 days extra duty Half months pay for two months and a bust in rank, I was just frocked to E-4 it took me down to E-2.
I was in the Navy from 1982- 2012. I had to do 3 days bread and water in 1983. But after that I learned my lesson and finish my career doing 30 years. I tell people if you want to lose weight very fast. Eat bread and water for 3 days. I know that works for a Fact.
You did ok and made E-9
@@KennyInSubic Thanks.
@@KennyInSubic Yes I did thanks.
why was an image of columbo used for a thumbnail?
And nowadays, we take your internet and iPad away, and no social media for 30 days.
LOL.That was FUNNY. Thanks for the laugh.
Not that's cruel and unusual punishment.
just being stuck on a aircraft carrier sounds like punishment enough
Swede Boy: I was in VA-42 (Intruder training squadron) NAS Oceana too. From April 20,1972 to August 15,1975. I was a plane captain & went on carrier quals on the Independence, Lexington 3 times & FDR. Also went to Fallon & Yuma on bombing detachments several times.
Thank you for your service
This is a rather delayed response. Yes, I remember VA-42 very well. The A-6 planes would fly over the base and practice peeling off one by one which I thought was cool. I went on carrier quals on the Ranger and the Coral Sea (a real crate of a boat). I also went to NAS Fallon for three weeks once. It may have been in 1974. On that trip to Fallon - there was one night I got off at 10:00PM from the hanger (I stayed in the sick bay there since I was a Corpsman). I walked down the path back to the barracks building where my squadron VF-101 was billeted. I was looking down at the ground the whole time and when I finally looked up, I saw that the whole two stories of the building were lit up and there was a roar of men's voices coming from the building. When I went inside all the guys from VF-101 were in a crowd in the lobby. Reportedly what happened - there was an altercation in the pool hall where a Corpsman from VA-97 (Le Moore CA) struck a VF-101 guy with a cue stick. The VF101 guys were talking about it real loud and then start roaring together like at a football game. Real funny! I heard that the XO of the base had to come out that night to cool things down. I sure wish I had a camera with me!
That small clip of vfa 137 meant a lot to me even though i dont recognize any of those sailors. Ive been in 137 for the last 4 years.
Now I’m curious if a ship’s captain in the modern day would get away with ordering a flogging on a crazy sailor who violated a female crew member.
The reason I think of that particular crime is it’s something severe. And everyone would want a punishment that reflects the severity. Of all the navy ships one idiot is bound to not be right in the head yet still go to sea.
I wonder how the reaction from higher command and the average person hearing about the punishment to the crazy sailor would be.
Hasn't been a flogging in over a century.
why do you think the punsihment changes by ship type? the ucmj isnt based on hull class
Those who complain about life in the service need to get out yall are poison to the core
I think instead of a cut in pay, being banned from the Star Bucks and the Commissary for 2-3 weeks is a better punishment. It would encourage them to listen to their Superiors, so they won't lose their coffee.
Interesting. I used to work on a Submarine and I don't think we had anything like it (a jail or bread and water..). There was one guy one time that lost his shit because he couldn't stand being locked in for so long. There was a small room he stayed in, which close watch by the Doc. We eventually were able to surface and he was taken off via helicopter.
Submarines are a whole different world. The crews are remarkable.
Submariners are special troops. Much respect to you.
I don’t think I could handle it at all, the 1st time I hear metal creaking I would crap myself
@@bswihart1 that is a good sign though
Nothing locked up in a big black vibrating mumba with seamen I. Ur face all day
"giving me bread and water is the mark of a poor leader", says the person with the mark of being a misbehaving sailor.
I’d sure hate to be falsely accused of anything and found guilty based on lies. And don’t think it doesn’t happen. It most certainly does.
Before anyone goes to Captains Mast a Preliminary Inquiry Officer (PIO) gathers all the facts and details interviews all concerned. He then gives the report to the Executive Officer who reviews everything, including interviewing the offender. If the XO thinks it merits going to Captain’s Mast the sailor will stand tall in front of the CO for punishment. There is nothing casual or arbitrary about the process.
They should teach them how to apply lipstick and how to probably walk in high heels
Only having religious material to read is the worst punishment.
True 🤣
Hahaha - beat me to it
perfect video, and exactly what I was thinking
I was an Army company commander in the mid-90s at Ft Eustis, Va. On the day of my change of command, I had to deal with a soldier who was habitually drinking with a civilian BF and showing up late to formation. My predecessor let it slide. It was going to be a field grade action by the Battalion commander. I wanted to set a tone for my command and did some research. She admitted her guilt, and I recommended a 4-week program called "School of soldier/sailor" at the Norfolk Naval brig. One of the intake Petty Officers actually asked, "Do you want to put her on bread and water for the first part of the confinement?" I said no as it was not an Army tradition, and I knew as an enlisted man that the 3 things that motivate a soldier are correct pay, mail from home, and decent chow. I or my 1SG made visits to ensure health and welfare, providing hygiene necessities. After 3 weeks, the Petty Officer said that she was doing well and could be let out early. I spoke to my Battalion Commander, whom I'd been giving regular updates, and he agreed. I told her afterward that she had a "clean slate," and if she did as the NCOs directed for her last 6 months, she would leave with an honorable discharge. I didn't have trouble with her or the rest of the company once the soldiers knew the Norfolk brig was a potential punishment. 3 weeks after her honorable discharge, I got a call from her mother. I was saying "Allright her comes the screaming. " However, the mother thanked me for getting her daughter away from an abusive boyfriend and giving her a second chance to do well in the Army. UCMJ may seem harsh to civilians, but it's fair. There has to be an element of harshness in what the military does because officers and NCOs have to instill a sense of honor, duty, and esprit de corps in young soldiers that might be asked to give the ultimate sacrifice for their comrades and their country. Finally, taking UCMJ authority away from commanders and giving it to a 3rd party is a horrible idea. There are appeals and checks and balances in the current system.
You sound like a piece of shit. Congratulations for being proud of it...100$ says you have no idea where the person is these days. Ill take it back if you do.
What happens to,officers who screw up? Anything?
@Peter The great Peter they usually get smoked harder than enlisted soldiers. Many enlisted soldiers come in to get college money or for training. Most officers want to make a career out of their service. Officers are held to a higher standard than enlisted, and I've seen many careers ruined over small issues that get blown out of proportion.
Not on a carrier, but I had the pleasure of a three week stay at a floating Marine Red Line brig. They LOVED having Sailors as guests. They alternated bread and water days. Every other day water only for a week.
Evian or Fiji water plz, and bread must be gluten-free
I was a Marine in security aboard an aircraft carrier in the late 60's while serving in Vietnam. While on brig duty, prisoners were taken through the chow line for all three meals while in the brig. They ate just like everyone else, no bread and water at all. The advantage they had was we took them to the front of the line so they did not have to wait to get fed. Flew a prisoner to Subic Bay when he cold-cocked an officer one time.
I thought they got there cheeks clapped by another sailor as punishment .
I was in the US navy from 1977 to 1981. I was given minor punishment for a minor offense. Restricted to the ship and extra duty. I was a few minutes late on 3 occasions mustering for extra duty. I was given 3 days bread and water. I became weak and listless. In the past this punishment was used to take the violence and hot headedness out of a person.Warm water and stale non nutritious white bread. After my honorable discharge, Years later I was diagnosed with A.D.D. At the time I did not know that this punishment what's still used. I thought What's next? Walking the plank?
I knew a person who was in a Fleet Marine Force in the South Pacific. He got placed in the brig on a carrier. He was allowed to walk on the deck handcuffed being escorted. The SP tried acting tough and him, "Don't you go anywhere." He just laughed at the SP and responded, "Where in the middle of the ocean. Where am I going? "
I'm of the old navy,before the whiners and cry babies came onboard. I'm of the navy with redline brigs, and "Piss and Punk" That was a term for bread and water, more bread than water. Yes the CO could sentence you up to 3 days of bread and water. You were issued liberty cards for the those going ashore, and after passing a mini inspection on the quarterdeck, and finally getting to the main gate of a shore station, have a Marine at the gate find a reason to yank your liberty card and send you back to your ship. This was 1959-60.
If you're not from this era, what qualifies you to describe how it functions? Hell, you weren't even smart enough to get past a Marine sentry.
"Mr. Overton sir, I think we have located the whiner crybaby you spoke of, he's due south of your position"
*I see wat you mean
@@bhall4996 I know what I speak of. Believe it or not I was out of the navy for 14 years, found I was eligible to re-up (long story) which I did at the age of 42. So, I experienced both new and old navy, what a shock! Not to get to the part about women aboard ship, that's a whole different subject!
That bread looked good. Did it come with butter?
Continued downgrading of standards is our downfall.
Talking downgrading of standards, the Russian Army has become a joke in the Ukraine. Stalin must be rolling over in his grave.