Glad you put the Kashyyyk map computer in. That is when I figured out the twist, and Kashyyyk was my planet after Dantooine. Still a dang good twist. Part of me figuring it out at age 13 was the fact that me and my friend Jered would take turns. He was Dark Side, I was Light. He did Kashyyyk after me, and the dialogue changes slightly as I recall, and you can feed the computer monstrous choices and it tells you that your neural ways are the same. For Light it chides you and tells you you're almost unrecognizable. I suspected it after my experience, and then watching his confirmed it for me. I like the lead up to when the twist actually occurs. Saul Karath knows, and he tells Carth, and Carth's whole demeanor changes. Starts screaming to Bastila about how she knew, and she's like, "Not here Carth, not now. I can explain." It was like, they not only dripped us clues all along, some far stronger than others, but the intensity of the clues generally increased the closer it got to twist time. They wanted people to figure it out, but no clue by itself is a dead give away. I liked the second game a bit better, storywise. It doesn't have a big, definitive twist like the first. Instead it has many small twists, almost all related to your traveling companions. For Clan Ordo!
that, and the sith academy in korriban. I remember in the sidequests how i thought lot of them would make more sense if the player character was actually revan, not some rando chosen one. Kashyyk kinda made it start to sink in.
Yeah, that's when I figured it out too. Dantooine was weird, like why did it recognize me. But then when the same thing happened on Kashyyyk and it was a psych-eval, I was like oh this is probably another hero with amnesia story. I felt kind of robbed of the moment because a lot of people I knew were blown away by the plot twist. I still enjoyed it though.
Bastila: The Jedi do not believe in killing their prisoners. Nobody deserves execution, no matter what their crimes. Mace Windu: Yes they deserved to die and I hope they burn in hell!
What truly amazes me is how BioWare and then Obsidian managed to give Revan a personality while still leaving player agency. I mean, think about all we learn about this dude we don’t even remember being just through other characters and the way they talk about him: 1. He’s got a sarcastic sense of humor (HK is the literal manifestation of this) 2. He’s amazingly charismatic, a “Force” of personality and presence (KotOR 2 in particular hammers this home, but we can also hear in Malak’s voice almost a reverence for his old friend and master) 3. He’s a tinkerer with an affinity for droids (HK again, but also T3 in KotOR 2) 4. A ruthless streak strengthened and tempered by a powerful sense of self-determination (defying the Jedi Council and then utterly destroying the Mandalorians is the best example)
The developers were genius to realize that after the first time, it becomes a chore, and so they allow you to skip it all together, even if you accidentally initiate the dialogue.
Idk why, but the detective bit on dantooine was my favorite bit as a child. Becoming a Jedi was a dream come true for me at the ripe age of 12. And going out to do the councils bidding was just so fun to me
the detective work on most planets was one of my most faves, though CSI: Dantooine case of killed farmer and case of feuding families CSI: Kashyyk case of killed Wookie hunter, and case of damaged droid head CSI: Manaan case of Sunry CSI: Tatooine case of sabotaged droids
I remember my brother spoiled the twist to me when driving me home from some hangout or another. I've never cared much about being spoiled, but it's definitely one of those situations I'll never forget. A few years later I would finally beat the game, which I now have probably five or six times. Definitely a top-5 favorite game for me, even if I like the sequel's crafting better.
The whole entire "Mysterious Stranger" name in the Taris arena basically gave it away, yet I it still surprised me. "...it makes it seem like you have some big dark secret."
As Drew Karpyshyn was the lead writer on this game, I would not be surprised if this was all due to his influence. He also wrote the Darth Bane trilogy and was in charge for the original Mass Effect story. Great guy. I remember like 12 years or so ago I exchanged a few emails with him. Really down to earth guy who never needed to respond to me in the first place, but he did. He also was involved in the main story for the Jedi Knight class in SWTOR. If you loved the story of KOTOR you would probably also like his other work. Check it out.
I still tell people to avoid the internet about the story if they somehow haven't heard the plot. I tell them save yourself a great story experience and go play it and ignore information about it.
I played Kotor 2 before the first. I spent an entire summer with my cousin building a timeline with all the events narrated into dialogues and descriptions. At that point I knew all about Revan and its role in the story so THAT moment in Kotor 1 was literally a nuke in my mind. Play K2 before K1 was truly a blessing
When I first experienced the game, it was at my brother in law's house when the game launched in 2003. Bro in law is a lifelong SW fan (his and my sister's first date was TPM) and they're both librarians. So we're talking Jedi archivists. And he invited about a dozen buddies, with SW knowledge ranging from "saw the films" to "Leads the Star Wars Trivia contest at local sci fi cons" over to watch him play through the story. And no one got the twist. That was the good news. The bad news is part of the reason we didn't. My brother in law made the choice to play a *female* Revan, and an Asian female Revan on top of it. (Brother in law likes playing female when he gets a chance to do so, as many games don't even offer that opportunity) Remember, this was 2003 - Revenge of the Sith wasn't a thing. Ahsoka and Rey hadn't been invented yet. Jaina Solo was JUST starting out. Sure, we had a lot of great female secondary characters (hell, this game contains a truckload), but the "Savior, conqueror, hero, villain" that everyone spoke of with awe? Yeah, we assumed Revan had to be some big, buff white dude because That's How Things Worked. And it fucking sucked, but we just had to deal with being secondary characters if we weren't the big buff white dude. (Hell, for the amount of appropriation/appreciation Lucas had for Japanese. Chinese, and Indian aesthetics in his worldbuilding, we're pretty much limited to Jan Ors and Rose Tico as far as Asian characters) Hell, if you play female? You can even play as bisexual or lesbian because Bioware managed to sneak Juhani past radar (My own first playthrough? Yup. Juhani and my PC were riding into the sunset - Sorry, Carth) We guessed that the Player Character was a bastard child (because of ESB and Baldur's Gate) or secret apprentice at most. Because we all figured Player Character had some connection to Revan. So when the mask comes off and we see that the "Savior, conqueror, hero, villain" is this Leia-sized, Zhang Ziyi look alike? HOLY SHIT! Room full of hardcore fanboys goes to dead silence for several seconds...followed by the kind of cheering you would usually associate with a fourth quarter, buzzer beating, game winning touchdown for your team in the Super Bowl. Whole room of GFFA fanboys going absolutely NUTS with delight. That's why I was disappointed big time when Leland Chee whipped out his rubber stamp of "Light sided, human, cisgender, heterosexual, white male" that he put on every other customizable or vaguely defined character and applied it to Revan. It felt like a huge step back. But in my own playthroughs? Hell, yes. One five foot nothing Zhang Ziyi expy taking on the galaxy with her badass crew.
Awesome analysis! KOTOR's plot twist really was an incredible WOW moments for those who played that game. If you plan on making a series out of this you probably also need to visit Bioshock. :)
I've played through this game more than 20 times, most of those runs back when the game first came out on PC. Man I was obsessed with this game. I don't think I can ever objectively talk about this game, but I'm going to say it anyway: Best RPG ever made bar none.
So have I. Even played as a dual Mandalorian blaster pistol wielding scoundrel once without ever using the Force. Funnily the battle against Malak was never easier than in this playthrough. Wiped him out in no time with my guns. Per default, I'm a consular - which, by far, is the most difficult route you can take.
Honestly, this was a good plot twist for a video game. I had NO IDEA I was playing as Revan, maybe because I was a naive kid playing the game, but it was still Khuul. Lol
I played kotor relativ recently, but managed to play through it somewhat unspoiled. I had played swtor before so I thought I knew Revan already. Playing through kotor I knew Revan was still alive, but I thought it was one of my companions. I was completely shook when I reached the twist.
I really love kotor, I’ve never even seen any of the star wars movies but the game so perfectly makes its own story being it based in a time before the actual series. It has its own independent plot that’s easy to follow enough to the point someone like me, an avid star wars hater (jokes) has come to make it one of my absolute favorite games.
What really shock me back then isn't the fact that you're secretly Revan, but that Bastilla is in on it and never said anything. She isn't really my favorite character even there, Carth and Canderous are, but I guess I got caught off guard
And also!! A villainpedia on at LEAST kreia and nihilus. Maybe actually also a comparison video of the two games? Kotor might be the more polished experience but kotor 2 has a lot of stuff I think it does better.
I really like the way you broke down how the twist worked and all of those breadcrumbs/hindsight hints came together to make it what it was. Definitely a cool second + play through. Also the quote from James Ohlen is spot on and genius. I'm looking at movies I love that contain twists and it's very true in pretty much every case. Great video.
This was spoiled for me because I briefly looked on a wiki article about the mysterious box and the kept saying Reven gets trapped in the box, Revan talks to the alien, Revan blah blah blah... I was more than a little miffed. I had spent like 20 years not sitting down to play but still avoiding spoilers...
I'm not always the greatest at picking out twists before the reveal. But I got this one. I felt like in this case they beat you over the head with the clues. So imagine how shocking it was when a lot of people online said they didn't see it coming. As a story beat it's fantastic one of the best of that era of games I would say. But as a twist when you take into account star wars at its core is a tale of redemption it's not shocking
Ghostcharm, it's a shame your video hasn't gotten the views it deserves. This video is masterfully made and covers both a classic close to my heart and is super educational on how to write compelling twists. Please don't give up making videos, man. I have a feeling once you get the recognition you deserve (hopefully with the new remake that's coming out) your videos will definitely explode.
Been looking forward to this one! A brilliant game, introduced many of us to how good a story in a video game can actually be. EDIT: Just finished, great video once again man!
Don't know if you've touched Dragon Age, and he's got more stuff to come if they can actually make another DA game, but even just in Inquisition Solas is an incredible "villain" worthy of getting somewhere on your list
Holy shit that opening theme gave me goosebumps. I need to rewatch the OGs. And I need to replay Kotor, just a masterful game all around Also HK-47 is the best ever
I accidentally spoiled the twist to my brother without even knowing. My brother wanted to kill the kraid dragon, i watched a fact video about Darth Revan, one of the facts were that used Banthas too lure a kriad dragon into some bombs. He did it that way, and we concluded that the protagonist must be Revan.
Do you think you could do a video about Pieter van Eckhardt from Tomb Raider the Angel of Darkness? His background story is huge and the guy who wrote the storyline released his design docs so I think it would translate extremely well into a video. Also the guy's cool.
It shook me to my core. Not to stroke my ego but I was arguably the ideal Type of Star Wars fan for this Game. I never once would have thought the jedi would have done something like that. I thought Bastilla was to high strung or morally good to do something like that all the while I was thinking how much this Revan guy must sucked and was a monster. Then Boom big reveal, I was in utter shock I Rember being legitimately mad and felt betrayed by Bastilla. Carth being mas at me hurt God I love this game.
Dang, I was already on board with the From software videos, THEN YOU HAVE KOTOR AS YOUR FAVORITE GAME? Bravo, magnificent even, cannot wait to see more and more videos as your channel grows to be one of my favorites
I bought KOTOR in 03 for the PC and it barely ran but I got it to work. I loved it, loved everything about it. The twist shocked me so much. But I stayed on the light side, of course.
I don't expect everyone to agree, but to me, KotoR is by far the best star wars story, miles ahead of it's source material. The source is very imaginative, but the story of every other star wars I have experienced is just ok. KOTOR took the material and made it a lot more fleshed out, nuanced and interesting. I don't really expect another star wars story will ever be like this again, unfortunately... they are just too stuck on trying to rehash nostalgia from the first movies, when they could be striving to be a lot more.
This was literally a twist to last millenia I was quite suspicious of the whole Jedi council plan, especially recruiting older person than normally and sending him/her on extremely important mission without any higher ranking Jedi with just rookies like Bastila and Juhani. I was quite onboard with Carth that something was fishy, but not sure what exactly, until reveal hit me like a truck. Since then, I was most onboard with Jolees philosophy of shades of gray side. Yup, Jedi used me and I dont like it, but hell, Malak must be stopped before another Taris happens. THEN I'll have a few choice words with them. Especially if I didnt invest enough in persuade with bad results for Bastila...
I’m currently reading the Game of Thrones series and George sprinkle these hints, Jon’s identity just to mention one, like a master. So I would highly recommend anyone reading the books even if you’ve seen the tv show. It’s just like you said about Fight Club; you gotta watch it a second time to really appriciate the craft… Cheers!
I remember piecing together all the breadcrumbs and figuring out the twist before it was revealed. I was SO excited to be right! I think I was 13/14 at the time.
Ah good times. Back when star wars games and movies were still great. Kotor is definitely on the list of my all time favorites. I kinda knew that revan wasn't actually dead, but i fully expected him to be the actual endboss. The reveal caught me by surprise. One of the best story games ever.
So i have been plahing this game and playing as i would as a kid im a jedi learning to fight as the jedi. So learning everything is making appriceate it more
Another incredible video entry man. I binged all your vids when I discovered the channel. I would like to suggest a personal favorite of mine, Raziel from Soul Reaver. If not, I fully believe Kain well deserves his own Villainpedia entry!
So very well said! From now on, if anyone asks me why kotor was the best game of all times, imma refer them to this video (after telling them to play it themselves, obviously) It was great to know what was the background and contributed to making the game and specifically that twist. My God! After all these years, I still relish the first time I saw the reveal😲😶🤯🤡. Perfection!!!
My buddy from high school had the twist ruined the first time he ever saw Revan in the game. All of the trailers had Revan shown as a male. He happened to play as a female in every game, so once he saw Revan was now magically a lady he knew what must be true. And every hint they dropped just cemented his suspicions. Poor chap
Goddam I love this channel and it’s analysis. Channel will blow up I have no doubt. Great to honestly doze off too. Screenshotting this for the future. Keep it up!
ghost, i would love a video on revan. It could be your first both hero and villainpedia in the same video, would open up your channel to one of the most vast and lucrative fanbases on the planet, and you would crush it. Just a thought.
'Chef's Kiss' another Ghostcharm vid, and on one of my favourite games! I love that you aren't restricted to any one franchise, means you'll never run out of content baby!
You know. I was pretty sure I was ready to be spoiled for this game. I'd read up on a number of characters before. But I honestly wasn't expecting that.
What about your allies’ quest lines if complete them ,before Malak pulls you in? Excluding, Bastila’s and Carth’s. When you complete them they will refer to Revan ,when you complete their side quests!
The time I first saw the cutscene and the twist drop and I remember being thoroughly confused and zoned out a bit I wasn't a fan of paying attention then but I still love Morrowind and Kotor till this day and revisit them constantly
What's your take on the Morrowind main quest plot twist? I was a teenager when I first played it and it blew my mind. To this day I think it's probably the best way to do a story where the main character is essentially a superhero - (1) you must start out as a nobody and (2) the threat to the world that only you can solve must not be immediate. Otherwise, the character abandoning the main story to do side quests for in-game months and years just don't make sense (wink Oblivion/Skyrim wink)
You are a gem! An amazing find! Keep up the great content, can't wait to take more notes on your videos, because this is a gold mine for any aspiring writer.
Yes, I was just watching your channel before you posted lol take that 😋 I'm one of the few that doesn't like the prequels or the sequels but of the movies I only like the classic trilogy and rogue one.
Yeah masterful plot. Just now replayed it on Steam Deck and it was a blast. Some of the dialogue is a little dated but overall it was a treat. HK-47 is the best droid character in the whole series, too. (#opinion.) This game and Morrowind came out around the same time, and those are two of my favorite games of all time.
Raven is prob one of the best character in all the Star Wars lore.One of the very few force users that at the end was not a sith or a jedi.He understood the force and realized that both siths and jedis didn`t trully understand the force. To bad Disney took a dump in the expanded universe..since its a billion time better than what is consided canon ! Bioware used to be such a great company. U should make a video on DA:Origins.I think it`s the last good game Bioware made. p.s.: we all know the jedi are the bad guys :D
I've played this game every way you can yet I still keep coming across new stuff and ways to play. My favorite way to play narratively is to play along until the reveal. Up to that point I'll be light/grey. After the reveal I start slowly going back to the dark side to reclaim Revan's identity but I do so slowly and manipulatively. Sometimes I join Bastilla but I usually kill her for obvious reasons. She had been using you from the start so it makes sense as a renewed Revan to say fuck apprentices, bunch of traitors. My party pretty much gets the Berserk treatment. Oh yeah, and I save Korriban for last now. I use it as a natural stepping stone for Revan to relearn the dark side. You're usually powerful enough by this time to solo it, so I go alone so Revan can let out his anger at being deceived in private. Tell everyone you're Revan at every opportunity and then back it up by killing anyone and everyone in the academy.
This twist is so masterfully done yet in retrospective it is so obvious. This is how you do it. Despite that I still consider the sequel has a even better narrative if that's even possible.
I played the MMO first, and in that MMO Revan is a man. When I first played KOTOR I made a female character and I think that if I didn’t already associate Revan as being a guy I would have been able to predict that twist.
Yea there was a Samus effect for me bc I played as a Woman the first time through & they kept saying Lord Revan so I assumed Revan was male. How sexist of me 😅
This twist blew my mind when I was a kid. I look back at it now, 32 years old, and view it as easily the best moment out of any game I've ever played.
Drew Karpyshyn was the lead writer on kotor, same guy who wrote the Darth Bane novels, also lead writer of mass effect 1 and 2. Great talent!
Glad you put the Kashyyyk map computer in. That is when I figured out the twist, and Kashyyyk was my planet after Dantooine. Still a dang good twist. Part of me figuring it out at age 13 was the fact that me and my friend Jered would take turns. He was Dark Side, I was Light. He did Kashyyyk after me, and the dialogue changes slightly as I recall, and you can feed the computer monstrous choices and it tells you that your neural ways are the same. For Light it chides you and tells you you're almost unrecognizable. I suspected it after my experience, and then watching his confirmed it for me.
I like the lead up to when the twist actually occurs. Saul Karath knows, and he tells Carth, and Carth's whole demeanor changes. Starts screaming to Bastila about how she knew, and she's like, "Not here Carth, not now. I can explain." It was like, they not only dripped us clues all along, some far stronger than others, but the intensity of the clues generally increased the closer it got to twist time. They wanted people to figure it out, but no clue by itself is a dead give away.
I liked the second game a bit better, storywise. It doesn't have a big, definitive twist like the first. Instead it has many small twists, almost all related to your traveling companions.
For Clan Ordo!
that, and the sith academy in korriban. I remember in the sidequests how i thought lot of them would make more sense if the player character was actually revan, not some rando chosen one. Kashyyk kinda made it start to sink in.
@@sanghelian The best is when you are Revan and the Sith on Manaan challenge you. _"B- But, I am Revan!"_
Funniest line lmao
Yeah, that's when I figured it out too. Dantooine was weird, like why did it recognize me. But then when the same thing happened on Kashyyyk and it was a psych-eval, I was like oh this is probably another hero with amnesia story. I felt kind of robbed of the moment because a lot of people I knew were blown away by the plot twist. I still enjoyed it though.
Yeah that’s what let me know, too. Loved it.
I got goosebumps at 5:09 when Kreia came up because I realized that you'll eventually make a -pedia entry on her. Hype.
Bastila: The Jedi do not believe in killing their prisoners. Nobody deserves execution, no matter what their crimes.
Mace Windu: Yes they deserved to die and I hope they burn in hell!
Lmao I’m imagining Bastila saying that line as Mace Windu is poking his lightsaber in Palps face 😂
I know this game is your favorite but I'd love to hear you discuss kotor 2, with all of its flawed brilliance.
What truly amazes me is how BioWare and then Obsidian managed to give Revan a personality while still leaving player agency. I mean, think about all we learn about this dude we don’t even remember being just through other characters and the way they talk about him:
1. He’s got a sarcastic sense of humor (HK is the literal manifestation of this)
2. He’s amazingly charismatic, a “Force” of personality and presence (KotOR 2 in particular hammers this home, but we can also hear in Malak’s voice almost a reverence for his old friend and master)
3. He’s a tinkerer with an affinity for droids (HK again, but also T3 in KotOR 2)
4. A ruthless streak strengthened and tempered by a powerful sense of self-determination (defying the Jedi Council and then utterly destroying the Mandalorians is the best example)
The twist instantly became one of the most epic moments in my gaming history.
Hated the detective work on Dantooine though LOL.
The developers were genius to realize that after the first time, it becomes a chore, and so they allow you to skip it all together, even if you accidentally initiate the dialogue.
Idk why, but the detective bit on dantooine was my favorite bit as a child. Becoming a Jedi was a dream come true for me at the ripe age of 12. And going out to do the councils bidding was just so fun to me
the detective work on most planets was one of my most faves, though
CSI: Dantooine case of killed farmer and case of feuding families
CSI: Kashyyk case of killed Wookie hunter, and case of damaged droid head
CSI: Manaan case of Sunry
CSI: Tatooine case of sabotaged droids
I remember my brother spoiled the twist to me when driving me home from some hangout or another. I've never cared much about being spoiled, but it's definitely one of those situations I'll never forget. A few years later I would finally beat the game, which I now have probably five or six times. Definitely a top-5 favorite game for me, even if I like the sequel's crafting better.
The whole entire "Mysterious Stranger" name in the Taris arena basically gave it away, yet I it still surprised me. "...it makes it seem like you have some big dark secret."
You should review Jade Empire, a game that has similar plot twist as KOTOR, and its battle gameplay now moved to being a real time combat
I never played this game, nor do I have any idea what star wars is, but I totally saw this twist coming.
As Drew Karpyshyn was the lead writer on this game, I would not be surprised if this was all due to his influence. He also wrote the Darth Bane trilogy and was in charge for the original Mass Effect story. Great guy. I remember like 12 years or so ago I exchanged a few emails with him. Really down to earth guy who never needed to respond to me in the first place, but he did. He also was involved in the main story for the Jedi Knight class in SWTOR. If you loved the story of KOTOR you would probably also like his other work. Check it out.
I still tell people to avoid the internet about the story if they somehow haven't heard the plot. I tell them save yourself a great story experience and go play it and ignore information about it.
I played Kotor 2 before the first. I spent an entire summer with my cousin building a timeline with all the events narrated into dialogues and descriptions. At that point I knew all about Revan and its role in the story so THAT moment in Kotor 1 was literally a nuke in my mind. Play K2 before K1 was truly a blessing
When I first experienced the game, it was at my brother in law's house when the game launched in 2003. Bro in law is a lifelong SW fan (his and my sister's first date was TPM) and they're both librarians. So we're talking Jedi archivists. And he invited about a dozen buddies, with SW knowledge ranging from "saw the films" to "Leads the Star Wars Trivia contest at local sci fi cons" over to watch him play through the story.
And no one got the twist. That was the good news. The bad news is part of the reason we didn't. My brother in law made the choice to play a *female* Revan, and an Asian female Revan on top of it. (Brother in law likes playing female when he gets a chance to do so, as many games don't even offer that opportunity) Remember, this was 2003 - Revenge of the Sith wasn't a thing. Ahsoka and Rey hadn't been invented yet. Jaina Solo was JUST starting out. Sure, we had a lot of great female secondary characters (hell, this game contains a truckload), but the "Savior, conqueror, hero, villain" that everyone spoke of with awe? Yeah, we assumed Revan had to be some big, buff white dude because That's How Things Worked. And it fucking sucked, but we just had to deal with being secondary characters if we weren't the big buff white dude. (Hell, for the amount of appropriation/appreciation Lucas had for Japanese. Chinese, and Indian aesthetics in his worldbuilding, we're pretty much limited to Jan Ors and Rose Tico as far as Asian characters) Hell, if you play female? You can even play as bisexual or lesbian because Bioware managed to sneak Juhani past radar (My own first playthrough? Yup. Juhani and my PC were riding into the sunset - Sorry, Carth)
We guessed that the Player Character was a bastard child (because of ESB and Baldur's Gate) or secret apprentice at most. Because we all figured Player Character had some connection to Revan. So when the mask comes off and we see that the "Savior, conqueror, hero, villain" is this Leia-sized, Zhang Ziyi look alike? HOLY SHIT! Room full of hardcore fanboys goes to dead silence for several seconds...followed by the kind of cheering you would usually associate with a fourth quarter, buzzer beating, game winning touchdown for your team in the Super Bowl. Whole room of GFFA fanboys going absolutely NUTS with delight.
That's why I was disappointed big time when Leland Chee whipped out his rubber stamp of "Light sided, human, cisgender, heterosexual, white male" that he put on every other customizable or vaguely defined character and applied it to Revan. It felt like a huge step back. But in my own playthroughs? Hell, yes. One five foot nothing Zhang Ziyi expy taking on the galaxy with her badass crew.
Awesome analysis! KOTOR's plot twist really was an incredible WOW moments for those who played that game.
If you plan on making a series out of this you probably also need to visit Bioshock. :)
I've played through this game more than 20 times, most of those runs back when the game first came out on PC. Man I was obsessed with this game. I don't think I can ever objectively talk about this game, but I'm going to say it anyway: Best RPG ever made bar none.
So have I. Even played as a dual Mandalorian blaster pistol wielding scoundrel once without ever using the Force. Funnily the battle against Malak was never easier than in this playthrough. Wiped him out in no time with my guns. Per default, I'm a consular - which, by far, is the most difficult route you can take.
Honestly, this was a good plot twist for a video game. I had NO IDEA I was playing as Revan, maybe because I was a naive kid playing the game, but it was still Khuul. Lol
And yeah, second play through I called myself a dumbass lol it’s fun when games give you this much replay-ability.
I played kotor relativ recently, but managed to play through it somewhat unspoiled. I had played swtor before so I thought I knew Revan already. Playing through kotor I knew Revan was still alive, but I thought it was one of my companions. I was completely shook when I reached the twist.
I really love kotor, I’ve never even seen any of the star wars movies but the game so perfectly makes its own story being it based in a time before the actual series. It has its own independent plot that’s easy to follow enough to the point someone like me, an avid star wars hater (jokes) has come to make it one of my absolute favorite games.
What really shock me back then isn't the fact that you're secretly Revan, but that Bastilla is in on it and never said anything.
She isn't really my favorite character even there, Carth and Canderous are, but I guess I got caught off guard
PLEASE do a followup for kotor 2. An absolute masterpiece in its own right, the writing is just....MWAH
And also!! A villainpedia on at LEAST kreia and nihilus. Maybe actually also a comparison video of the two games? Kotor might be the more polished experience but kotor 2 has a lot of stuff I think it does better.
@11:24 that's a great point! I didn't realize that in my only playthrough recently of KOTOR 1 :)
Hero and villianipedia for Revan when? If you tied in books/comics and other lore tidbits that would probably be one of your best pieces yet.
I really like the way you broke down how the twist worked and all of those breadcrumbs/hindsight hints came together to make it what it was. Definitely a cool second + play through. Also the quote from James Ohlen is spot on and genius. I'm looking at movies I love that contain twists and it's very true in pretty much every case. Great video.
13:16 this is true and we need a live action HK-47 !!!!
This was spoiled for me because I briefly looked on a wiki article about the mysterious box and the kept saying Reven gets trapped in the box, Revan talks to the alien, Revan blah blah blah... I was more than a little miffed. I had spent like 20 years not sitting down to play but still avoiding spoilers...
I'm not always the greatest at picking out twists before the reveal. But I got this one. I felt like in this case they beat you over the head with the clues.
So imagine how shocking it was when a lot of people online said they didn't see it coming.
As a story beat it's fantastic one of the best of that era of games I would say.
But as a twist when you take into account star wars at its core is a tale of redemption it's not shocking
Ghostcharm, it's a shame your video hasn't gotten the views it deserves. This video is masterfully made and covers both a classic close to my heart and is super educational on how to write compelling twists. Please don't give up making videos, man. I have a feeling once you get the recognition you deserve (hopefully with the new remake that's coming out) your videos will definitely explode.
Been looking forward to this one!
A brilliant game, introduced many of us to how good a story in a video game can actually be.
EDIT: Just finished, great video once again man!
Don't know if you've touched Dragon Age, and he's got more stuff to come if they can actually make another DA game, but even just in Inquisition Solas is an incredible "villain" worthy of getting somewhere on your list
This. I'm sad that most people have only played Inquisition but not the last DLC, it's spectacular. And the reveal is handled just great.
Holy shit that opening theme gave me goosebumps. I need to rewatch the OGs. And I need to replay Kotor, just a masterful game all around
Also HK-47 is the best ever
KOTOR 1 is the best Star Wars story told.
KOTOR 2 is the best sci fi story told in Star Wars.
This twist has always been one of my favorites of all games movies books etc. But for sure agree with the person below who said do one on Bioshock too
Hopefully you'll be doing a Hero/Villainpedia for Kreia soon ;)
I accidentally spoiled the twist to my brother without even knowing. My brother wanted to kill the kraid dragon, i watched a fact video about Darth Revan, one of the facts were that used Banthas too lure a kriad dragon into some bombs. He did it that way, and we concluded that the protagonist must be Revan.
I wish that the sequel trilogy was well thought out enough to do what Knights of The Old Republic 1/2 managed to do.
Do you think you could do a video about Pieter van Eckhardt from Tomb Raider the Angel of Darkness? His background story is huge and the guy who wrote the storyline released his design docs so I think it would translate extremely well into a video. Also the guy's cool.
I was spoiled on the twist and it still blew me away
It shook me to my core. Not to stroke my ego but I was arguably the ideal Type of Star Wars fan for this Game. I never once would have thought the jedi would have done something like that. I thought Bastilla was to high strung or morally good to do something like that all the while I was thinking how much this Revan guy must sucked and was a monster. Then Boom big reveal, I was in utter shock I Rember being legitimately mad and felt betrayed by Bastilla. Carth being mas at me hurt God I love this game.
Dang, I was already on board with the From software videos, THEN YOU HAVE KOTOR AS YOUR FAVORITE GAME?
Bravo, magnificent even, cannot wait to see more and more videos as your channel grows to be one of my favorites
I bought KOTOR in 03 for the PC and it barely ran but I got it to work. I loved it, loved everything about it. The twist shocked me so much. But I stayed on the light side, of course.
I don't expect everyone to agree, but to me, KotoR is by far the best star wars story, miles ahead of it's source material. The source is very imaginative, but the story of every other star wars I have experienced is just ok. KOTOR took the material and made it a lot more fleshed out, nuanced and interesting. I don't really expect another star wars story will ever be like this again, unfortunately... they are just too stuck on trying to rehash nostalgia from the first movies, when they could be striving to be a lot more.
KOTOR & the OT are the best Star Wars has to offer
This was literally a twist to last millenia
I was quite suspicious of the whole Jedi council plan, especially recruiting older person than normally and sending him/her on extremely important mission without any higher ranking Jedi with just rookies like Bastila and Juhani. I was quite onboard with Carth that something was fishy, but not sure what exactly, until reveal hit me like a truck.
Since then, I was most onboard with Jolees philosophy of shades of gray side. Yup, Jedi used me and I dont like it, but hell, Malak must be stopped before another Taris happens. THEN I'll have a few choice words with them. Especially if I didnt invest enough in persuade with bad results for Bastila...
I always was the mullet guy!
This twist was so good the first time I played the game (quite a few years ago when I was young) I thought that the whole thing was a trick by Malak.
I’m currently reading the Game of Thrones series and George sprinkle these hints, Jon’s identity just to mention one, like a master.
So I would highly recommend anyone reading the books even if you’ve seen the tv show. It’s just like you said about Fight Club; you gotta watch it a second time to really appriciate the craft…
Cheers!
I remember piecing together all the breadcrumbs and figuring out the twist before it was revealed. I was SO excited to be right!
I think I was 13/14 at the time.
Ah good times. Back when star wars games and movies were still great.
Kotor is definitely on the list of my all time favorites.
I kinda knew that revan wasn't actually dead, but i fully expected him to be the actual endboss. The reveal caught me by surprise. One of the best story games ever.
Both kotors are some of the best written games i've ever played
This twist is so famous now, I always my character Naver Htrad when I play KOTOR.
This was the most painfully plot reveal. There was a reason they told you about the journey he took for you to recreate it.
So i have been plahing this game and playing as i would as a kid im a jedi learning to fight as the jedi. So learning everything is making appriceate it more
Another incredible video entry man. I binged all your vids when I discovered the channel. I would like to suggest a personal favorite of mine, Raziel from Soul Reaver. If not, I fully believe Kain well deserves his own Villainpedia entry!
The recent God of War delivered a similar twist as well. I hope game developers realized that story as important in a game as its gameplay.
I remember thinking it odd that Revan never spoke even when people were talking to him/her.
So very well said! From now on, if anyone asks me why kotor was the best game of all times, imma refer them to this video (after telling them to play it themselves, obviously)
It was great to know what was the background and contributed to making the game and specifically that twist. My God! After all these years, I still relish the first time I saw the reveal😲😶🤯🤡.
Perfection!!!
My buddy from high school had the twist ruined the first time he ever saw Revan in the game. All of the trailers had Revan shown as a male. He happened to play as a female in every game, so once he saw Revan was now magically a lady he knew what must be true. And every hint they dropped just cemented his suspicions. Poor chap
Goddam I love this channel and it’s analysis.
Channel will blow up I have no doubt. Great to honestly doze off too.
Screenshotting this for the future.
Keep it up!
ghost, i would love a video on revan. It could be your first both hero and villainpedia in the same video, would open up your channel to one of the most vast and lucrative fanbases on the planet, and you would crush it. Just a thought.
'Chef's Kiss' another Ghostcharm vid, and on one of my favourite games! I love that you aren't restricted to any one franchise, means you'll never run out of content baby!
you're going places with this narration and editing style, man
Another banger of a video. Keep up the good work and good luck in content creation
Criminally underviewed.
Still remember where i was when i experienced this twist.
When I played it I was like huh something ain’t right here then boom it’s revealed and it still floored me
You know. I was pretty sure I was ready to be spoiled for this game. I'd read up on a number of characters before. But I honestly wasn't expecting that.
the time you put in just for this twist is really what nailed it. a cherry on top of an absolute treat of a game.
ended up watching this whole vid on the steam community thing under kotor. great vid!
I would love to see you do more deconstructing videos like this. They’re epic and I enjoy them.
What about your allies’ quest lines if complete them ,before Malak pulls you in?
Excluding, Bastila’s and Carth’s.
When you complete them they will refer to Revan ,when you complete their side quests!
Great vid, this channel needs more subs!
Beautiful
Great analysis. Have to admit I didn't see that twist coming in the game, but it was a humdinger. Bioshock was also another beauty.
Thanks to Disney, this greatness of Star Wars will never return. At least we had many years of greatness.
Thanks for the great Mandalorian melody at the end of the video :)
The time I first saw the cutscene and the twist drop and I remember being thoroughly confused and zoned out a bit I wasn't a fan of paying attention then but I still love Morrowind and Kotor till this day and revisit them constantly
Amazing video dude
Excellent video! Well written and great points. Thank you for making this! I hope to see one about KOTOR 2
What's your take on the Morrowind main quest plot twist? I was a teenager when I first played it and it blew my mind. To this day I think it's probably the best way to do a story where the main character is essentially a superhero - (1) you must start out as a nobody and (2) the threat to the world that only you can solve must not be immediate. Otherwise, the character abandoning the main story to do side quests for in-game months and years just don't make sense (wink Oblivion/Skyrim wink)
Love your work mate keep it up
You are a gem! An amazing find! Keep up the great content, can't wait to take more notes on your videos, because this is a gold mine for any aspiring writer.
Super good video, glad I found you
Just finished KOTOR for the first time. Sadly I had the twist somewhat spoiled for me, but the game was still amazing nevertheless.
Yes, KOTOR has the best twist of any Star Wars game, but KOTOR II has the best philosophical story in Star Wars.
Yes, I was just watching your channel before you posted lol take that 😋 I'm one of the few that doesn't like the prequels or the sequels but of the movies I only like the classic trilogy and rogue one.
Yeah masterful plot. Just now replayed it on Steam Deck and it was a blast. Some of the dialogue is a little dated but overall it was a treat. HK-47 is the best droid character in the whole series, too. (#opinion.) This game and Morrowind came out around the same time, and those are two of my favorite games of all time.
"From a certain point of view"
Yeah, I caught that
Raven is prob one of the best character in all the Star Wars lore.One of the very few force users that at the end was not a sith or a jedi.He understood the force and realized that both siths and jedis didn`t trully understand the force.
To bad Disney took a dump in the expanded universe..since its a billion time better than what is consided canon ! Bioware used to be such a great company.
U should make a video on DA:Origins.I think it`s the last good game Bioware made.
p.s.: we all know the jedi are the bad guys :D
Your stuff is top quality man, hope you get all the subs and ad revenue you deserve 👍
nice twist
Wonderful video :) I hope your channel grows!! You're great ^^
I've played this game every way you can yet I still keep coming across new stuff and ways to play. My favorite way to play narratively is to play along until the reveal. Up to that point I'll be light/grey. After the reveal I start slowly going back to the dark side to reclaim Revan's identity but I do so slowly and manipulatively. Sometimes I join Bastilla but I usually kill her for obvious reasons. She had been using you from the start so it makes sense as a renewed Revan to say fuck apprentices, bunch of traitors. My party pretty much gets the Berserk treatment.
Oh yeah, and I save Korriban for last now. I use it as a natural stepping stone for Revan to relearn the dark side. You're usually powerful enough by this time to solo it, so I go alone so Revan can let out his anger at being deceived in private. Tell everyone you're Revan at every opportunity and then back it up by killing anyone and everyone in the academy.
How have i just found you? Love it, love everything about it. You got yourself a sub good sir
Your videos just keep getting better and better man! Keep up the good work!
This twist is so masterfully done yet in retrospective it is so obvious. This is how you do it. Despite that I still consider the sequel has a even better narrative if that's even possible.
I realized I was Revan when I went to the council.
I played the MMO first, and in that MMO Revan is a man. When I first played KOTOR I made a female character and I think that if I didn’t already associate Revan as being a guy I would have been able to predict that twist.
Yea there was a Samus effect for me bc I played as a Woman the first time through & they kept saying Lord Revan so I assumed Revan was male. How sexist of me 😅
KOTOR REMAKE HYPE