Thank y’all so much for the support! Originally made this video just to send to a couple friends and didn’t imagine over 10K viewing it. If y’all want more, the only other video I have is one I made on Vader a while ago. Check it out here! ua-cam.com/video/M1ailSucEq4/v-deo.htmlfeature=shared
what fascinated me about Thrawn was that he was a professional that didn't sacrifice his men on a whim,owned up his own mistakes,didn't give insane orders,promoted merit among his crew,and when someone failed,he always gave them a reasonable chance to redeem themselves,and offered advice to anyone who had the half a brain to follow his meaning. Most people under his commands follwed him out of admiration and respect because they knew he wasn't a egomaniac going on a power trip.
I mean, he would also structure the classes in such a way to get maximum effort from as large of a group as possible. Hell, with his fucking skillset he could likely organise rough drafts for most of the strugglers to rise to the occasion.
I like how Thrawn was not defeated by the cunningness of his enemies or by any foolish actions. Rather he was defeated by a force unknown to the Empire and himself. He was defeated by something supernatural and not of the natural world, something he had no way of knowing how to defeat. I like how his failure was not of his own doing but because the universe is so vast that not even he could have conceived of those animals attacking his ship
Aye. I don't think anyone in Thrawn's position during the Battle of Lothal would've or could've seen something as out of left field as a heard of Star Whales abducting him and his fleet like they did.
Thrawn has never been evil, and he was never really loyal to the empire, he's loyal to the Chiss ascendancy and working towards the empire's benefit, works towards the ascendancy's benefit, he's not evil he's just doing his job
Which is why Thrawn is so popular with older Star Wars fans. You reach a certain age and the idea of Pure Evil and Pure Good seem less plausible, so we become attracted to characters or factions in fiction that are more grey. Thrawn served the Empire, the out and out villains of Star Wars, but he was not a villain and we saw in him what the Empire COULD have been and really SHOULD have been, without the literal cackling evil space wizard at its head.
@@mickelwarren2598 apart from the fact that star wars is fantasy and that no-one mentioned the nazis, the only kind of people who are going to comment stuff like what you have just commented are people shit stirring or people who just want likes and attention, but thank you for your opinion.
Disagree completely. At least the Thrawn from the novels. Nightswan was a clear enemy of Thrawn and he promised to preserve the lives of Nightswan and his army, including combatants, to the best of his ability. Not something a “cold blooded” character would do.
@@chrissgreene1he is only cold blooded to them when he sees no point in reasoning with them like with the rebels on attalon in rebels s3. However he would try to make a compromise most of the time and wouldn’t waste the lives of his men or civilians unnecessarily. Hence my only problem with Disney Thrawn is when he fired at civilians on lothal. But maybe that was super important to him and super urgent since palpatine was there so he couldn’t risk Ezra getting away by any chance. What are your comments on rebels Thrawn? I generally like the depiction but I agree he’s a bit too villainous. What surprised me is that he still seems really cool despite the inaccuracy.
@@bryannig9 as usual, Disney sucks at anything Star Wars. lol Rebels Thrawn was the typical Disney "need", to have an obvious Good guy (team) vs Bad guy (team) and they will throw out any and all other content like, novel accuracies, to achieve their goal. Disney does not care about any prior details.
When he does anything reasonably possible to reduce waste of life and resources that automatically makes him 90% better then the rest of the Galactic Empire military.
10,000 dead stormtroopers and only 3 million dead infantry are acceptable losses, good sir. An outstanding success, I will report to Lord Vader for your lack of faith in the Imperial doctrine.
@@SeraphimRoad "if the empire had listened to me, we would've have lost at most a few tie defenders and some smaller ships to the much weaker rebel alliance. instead you allowed massive resources and personnel waste and loss with the death star project, which legitimized the Rebel Alliance as a worthy cause and turned them from a nuisance into a existential threat"
He's about the only Star Wars character that I have any respect for. I actually wish I could have had a mentor like him in my life. He saw the potential in his subordinates, even if they were unique, and nurtured and supported them. It's a very rare trait these days
There’s a sea shanty written about Thrawn from the Chimera’s crew with the common refrain “Let’s make the Old Man proud,” and I think that’s an important facet of his character. His men want to do good because of how he treats them, they want to make him proud.
If I had to, I would be unyieldingly loyal to his command, not Vader or Sidious. Especially to learn from his example, not whatever jargon the Empire spews out because, just like him I want results, not perfection.
@@prome3439Nah you'd probably be fine. Thrawn would most likely aknowledge you were at least trying your best, even better if you also aknowledge your own mistakes and try to make up for It Which is a lot better compared to just being force choked by Vader lol
"You served too long under Lord Vader, Captain. I Have no qualms about accepting a useful idea merely because it wasn't my own. My position and ego are not at stake here" . - Thrawn.
Optimistic, compassionate, empathetic, humble, stoic. This is an idol to emulate. Not only that, these are the reasons his victories and insight were almost supernatural; the Force was with him, it does not choose sides except individuals. Ironically, he lives the virtues of the jedi better than the jedi did.
Not compassionate, most certainly not empathetic and not very humble I'm afraid. Thrawn was VERY cold-blodded, and his only goal was victory. Perfect as a Imperial military officer, but not the way you describe him.
@manuelojanguren661 Well, I've just heard segments of stories that prove otherwise. So it's going to take a lot more than a "trust me, bro" response that tells me otherwise. Besides, these traits aren't feelings. They are actions. When Thrawn saved alien lives over imperial resources despite going against orders to the opposite, that was compassionate. When Thrawn sees a victory where others see defeat, that shows he either takes pride in few things or seldom any at all. This is being humble. And earning loyalty and being kind to those to the point where they would do anything for him, trust him completely for his support. You can't do this unless you understand their thoughts and feelings, so that's very empathetic. He's not doing this in the same way psychopaths do. When psychopaths manipulate, it is because they want something. Now, you could argue that he is manipulating military politics to rise through the ranks to become Grand Admiral, but that's not the same thing. He maintains that victory is the highest priority, but good actions towards that victory are also a priority if they can be done. Cold logic is not anathema to kind hearts and empathy. Coldness is a mindset anyone can embrace when needed, but on more than one occasion, and more times than shown in this video, he has shown consideration for others the best way he can without sacrificing his loyalty or mission. Hera's Kalikori is a good example. Despite her resistance and protest, Thrawn decided on keeping it in a place of honour (keep in mind, he assumed the line of Syndulla was going to end with her execution and eventual death of her father. This was really the best way, from his perspective, to respect her family, history, and culture)
@@Billmaster115 Thrawn once sacrificed 2 tie interceptors and their pilots to test the capabilities of the Tie Defender, absolutely no remorse for the pilots on his part Thrawn bombarded the city of Lothal to make the rebels surrender
@@Billmaster115 Just think of how he disposes Morgan Elsbeth, the one woman that had let him out of exile and fought for him so devotely. In the end, no remorse whatsoever for his dead. Because everything and everybody are tools for his greater goal: victory. (Quote of him from the books). Is that more than trust me bro?
@@manuelojangurenI literally cannot find a quote like that anywhere, but here's an actual quote of him saying this. "All lives are important, and I resist the thought of standing by and watching two hundred possibly needless deaths." ―Senior Captain Thrawn to Senior Captain Lakinda and Mid Captain Samakro Throughout all of the comics, Thrawn demonstrates a consistent respect for life that are just not consistent with your presentation of him. You appeal to his lack of expression or hesitation in asking others to sacrifice for their goals, but this is simply how Stoics behave: they are not overwhelmed by emotions or moral conundrums because they have learned to dissociate their emotions from their critical thinking and have often thought out their own moral positions long before ever having to make them. Both Thrawn and Morgan Elsbeth had a mission they were passionate about, and Elsbeth willingly chose to stay and sacrifice her life so that Thrawn could escape. His ability to stay calm as he asks her to make that sacrifice is just an example of his stoicism, not a lack of gratefulness or compassion. Military leaders have to do this all the time, people who are trained to look at the bigger picture and ask young men and women to potentially lose their lives in pursuit of their goal, including close friends. What you're doing is confusing his composure for a lack of compassion. The reality is that Thrawn is likely used to this by now, everyone who serves the Empire is expected to give their lives for it, Morgan Elsbeth and Thrawn both knew this and behave accordingly. Not once has Thrawn needlessly thrown away lives intentionally nor without realising the weight of that sacrifice. Another example of his empathy is when he asked the Night Mothers if the Night Troopers were informed of what was going to happen to them. I was not surprised when he showed this level of consideration for his soldiers, this is how he is as a person.
I vote The Bad Batch, Kenobi, Andor, The Mandalorian, Book Of Boba Fett, and Ahsoka seasons 1-2-3-4 of Grand Admirals Thrawn, Gilad Pellaeon, Nial Declann and Rae Sloane
His pragmatism and sense of honor and duty would have made him a far better leader for the Empire than Vader or Palpatine ever could be. Vader was too emotionally unstable, and of course Palpatine was pure evil incarnate. Thrawn is neither of those things.
@@Anders_Lund All the characters in-universe seem to miss the point: He's not bad at politics, he just…. doesn't really need them. He told Eli, when they began the Academy, that he'd learn the strategies of the political battlefield, just like any other.May 21, 2024 i looked up thrawn bad at politcs and being a good general would difetly help with skills of being a polition to
@@LeoLau-ip9bv Really? Even Thrawn himself says that he doesn't understand politics and while he says to both Eli and Ar'alani that he will try to learn the tactics of politics, he doesn't seem to grasp it. And is it really a big deal that there is something Thrawn doesn't understand? He is a tactical and strategic mastermind when it comes to military matters. On the matter that he doesn't need to understand politics, that I would say is wrong. He definitely needed that while he was in the Expansionary Defence Force as Family politics were part of the fleet, even if it shouldn't be. The same goes for the Empire. If Thrawn had some political sense, he would have understood why Eli wasn't getting a promotion until Pryce and Tarkin arranged for Moff Ghadi to get arrested as it was Ghadi and his Core world friends who opposed the blue skinned alien, as they saw Thrawn, and slowed down the repair on Thrawn's ship and stopped Eli from moving up from the rank of ensign
Thrawn is a fascinating character that actually has good philosophies as Timothy Zahn wrote him. Even good wisdom that can be applied to real life like: “It is said that one should keep one's allies within view, and one's enemies within reach. A valid statement. One must be able to read an ally's strengths, so as to determine how to best use them. One must similarly be able to read his enemy's weaknesses, so as to determine how to best defeat him. But what of friends? There is no accepted answer, perhaps true friendship is so exceedingly rare. But I had formulated my own. A friend need not be kept within sight or within reach. A friend must be allowed the freedom to find and follow his own path. If one is fortunate, those paths will for a time join. But if paths separate, it is comforting to know that a friend still graces the universe with his skills, and his viewpoint, and his present. For if one is remembered by a friend, one is never truly gone.” as well as some you included. I view him as a warrior philosopher trying to do what he believes is right, to protect his homeland. He's a grey area character that has a lot to say. My issue with David Filoni are many things, but I really dislike how he used Thrawn in Rebels. It's a kids cartoon. I'm not a huge fan of the kids shows, but Thrawn is a favorite character, sadly he was pushed into "evil" in Filoni's Black and White views. I believe he's doing it again in Ahsoka. With how he's pushing Thrawn as this great evil the villains are looking for. I found myself asking. "How exactly are these sort of darksiders evil for looking for Thrawn?" I also like Thrawn's voice here as opposed to Lars Mikkelsen.
@@archivist_13 It's one of my favorites and genuinely affected how I value my friends, since we are far apart. i'd love a show with this version of Thrawn at the centre, or a game. It'd make for a nice choice based strategy RPG. also noticed I wrote it wrong a bit: "Present should be presence." Sorry about that!
@@archivist_13 i'm glad it's helped you, it's why I post these quotes around a bit because we can learn lots from fiction as well as real stuff. If I may, although i'm years older than you, 32. You will find your friends again and catch up again and make new ones. The internet will help you with that too.
@@drparadox7833I'm thinking in a future season of Ahsoka or the HTTE movie, Thrawn may get a message from Eli telling him things aren't going well in the Chiss Ascendancy. Then hopefully Eli will be in the show along with Ar'alani.
@@BlueInkAlchemy I'd love for there to be a Thrawn death fake-out once the Vong/Grysk threat is taken care of. Eli and Ar'alani help Thrawn fake his death to escape the First Order turning against him. The glaaxy thinks Thrawn is dead; but he's just returned home to the Ascendancy.
Thrawn has never been defeated because of a mistake, because he doesn't make one, he was defeated because of unpredictable parameters (the Force, an overly proud and presumptuous officer, unexpected enemy reinforcements, ....)
Kinda sad that the Rebels version of Thrawn didn't quite deliver on the author's original vision for Thrawn. Thrawn consistently sacrifices lives to instill fear in the show, and if i remember correctly in the first episodes he shows up, one of the imperial officers is like "your civilian casualty counts are high" or something I think. Then Thrawn says something like "collateral damage is inevitable". At least now in the Ahsoka show it seems Thrawn is actually valuing his troops a bit more, although unfortunately he still thinks of them as a resource and sends squads of troopers to their deaths
That civilian casualty referred to in his opening rebels scene was not actually his fault. That was referenced in the book and is also apart of this video.
He only fires on civilians once in the show as an ABSOLUTE last resort. He values his troops as a valuable resource, but not one he isn't willing to spend.
thrawn is ruthless is rebels, but he's no sadist or tyrant. Hes very polite to his prisoners, opponents, and subordinates, and unless im mistaken he never threatened anyone under his command with violence and apologized the one time he got really angry and was able to beat the shit out of that one guy who called his collection of art trash, not recognizing its value. Yes he's willing to use torture and fear to achieve his goals and that still makes him a villain, but nothing like vader or the emperor.
Thrawn was done so dirty, not by writers but just the nature of the Star Wars universe. Imagine being arguably the best military strategist alive, working your ass off to master the art of war and serve your cause, consistently outsmarting every enemy in your path until you are just inches away from total victory, only to be completely destroyed at the last second by some 17 year old with space magic bullshit not once, but TWICE. Shit Thrawn’s experience is a cakewalk compared to the non-force wielders in the old republic days, where genius strategy and skill were just made obsolete at random points by some fucker in a reaper mask eating you and the entire planet you’re on. The force is fucking wild man, never wanna live in the SW universe.
Thrawn has always been my favorite. Those books made me love him. He did his best and didn't come across as evil to me. I think he was always trying to help his people and others
He really makes the Empire actually feel like a confident and competent machine which brings value, and you can see why people willingly follow him. As a soldier myself, I can really appreciate a good solid officer and it’s easy for us to willingly fall under a man like that, especially when so many officers are bad. Meanwhile almost every other Imperial Officer just seemed stereotypically evil and incompetent, and makes you wonder how so many are perfectly willing to be thrown to their deaths under their command.
Trawn couldve justified the empires existence if hed been in charge pure logic and yet some compassion and humility, thrawn also never underestimates anyone. The perfect imperial ruler
The finale of Ahsoka established that. Morgan wants to underestimate the Jedi (Ahsoka and Ezra); but Thrawn tells her that many an officer and even he did once. "Never again," is what he tells her.
I’ve heard Mark Thompson was a good Thrawn voice and now that I’m actually hearing him, I agree. He and Lars both have the same tone of voice, just Mark doesn’t have as much of an accent. I’m liking how similar they sound!
I could be wrong, but I believe Mark modified how he reads Thrawn based on Lars’ voice for him in Rebels S3. He also read Thrawn in the Heir to the Empire 20th Anniversary audiobook in 2011, and while he still did a great job, it’s weird to hear Thrawn voiced straight, without that now-iconic tone. All of his audiobooks with Thrawn post-2017 are in that voice, and I agree it’s sooooo good.
He did Thrawn pretty good in rebels, do I don't think so, it's George Lucas protoge, I think Filoni probably has the best grasp at star wars then anyone currently there
He is neither hero or villain but a realist. His methodology is deeply rooted in logic and rationality. Thrawn’s mind is his most valuable asset but is not immune to making mistakes. Or suffering from the weakness of pride.
Like others have said, Thrawn was never evil. Tactical and uses people's weaknesses against them, yes for sure. He was an extremely good commander praised those who deserved it even if they failed in the task assigned. But he was also tough on those who failed through negligence or not caring. If someone or a group was considered an enemy then he used all his skills and abilities to bring them down. Generally by using their beliefs or own tactics against them. But evil? no I do not believe so. The best book Trilogy series was the Thrawn trilogy, loved that series of books and in my opinion would have made for a great movie trilogy. Well.......... as long as not interfered with by someone who is known for stuffing up Star Wars.
Thrawn is no more evil then the greatest commander's or generals are he is never observed being cruel or overly harsh like Vader he punishes people to the extent he truly believes they need to correct their behaviour and actively teaches his officers to look bigger and wider when it comes to their work and to think ouside of the box the imperial academy's teach you to live in it really explains why his crew are one of the best in the empire because they have the advantages of a strong decisive leader like vader without the temper tantrums or mental illness
@@Sora8740 Was meaning the Heir to the Empire Trilogy. Although, they all would make awesome movies. Timothy Zahn certainly writes some awesome books. He in lots of ways the book version that Dave Faloni is to the movie versions.
War itself is evil. To justify Thrawn is to justify evil actions no matter how harmless or justified they may seem. There's a reason Luke Skywalker chooses not to fight his own father or the emperor in Return of the Jedi. Saw Gerrera is another example of a character who seemingly isn't evil who performs evil actions. It's important to distinguish this. Thrawn is an impressive leader, yes. However, he is Evil.
People just forget he gains knowledge to progress his race. His loyalty is to his race. Joining the Empire is just a means to gain knowledge. I hate how the Ahsoka show is making it seem likes he's a big bad demon trying to become the next Sidious because he is not.
I disagree, I don’t think Ahsoka is painting him as evil, just as a threat. The heroes correctly assume that if Thrawn were to return, he could unite the remnants of the empire which would lead to another war. Thrawn assuming command of the remnants would definitely be a viable way for him to progress his race, so it’s not out of character.
My personal favourite outcome of the Ahsoka series would be that Thrawn invades the New republic, besieges its capital, forces a peace treaty, and then takes some of the galaxy near the Chiss Ascendancy and sets about creating the empire of the hand from legends, canon remains intact with the republic holding most of the known galaxy and thus the first order war goes ahead, we know that Thrawn will not vanquish the new republic because it is the dominant galactic government at the start of movie 7, but that doesn't mean that he can't create a small, well controlled and efficient nation near the Ascendancy to function as a shield for it, He is going to be angry when he hears that the death star, supposedly purely a weapon of terror, was used on a civilian world, he will be even more enraged when he hears about starkiller base, on the whole I can easily imagine him not taking sides in the first order war and simply waiting it out, this leaves the canon timeline intact and allows for Thrawn to be victorious, achieve his true goal, remaining true to the character and creates a new faction that will allow for more TV series and movies in the future, while also satisfying the numerous Thrawn fans, I see no reason for Disney not to do this.
Thank you for this post. The Star Wars Rebels portrayal is the Lucas 2-dimensional character template. The novels give Thrawn (and even Tarkin) a more 3-dimensional point of view, not the cartoonish 2-D Lucas stuff. Everyone is the hero of the story in their own mind, usually acting on what they think is the right thing to do. The tragedy is when someone who is trying to do what's right actually does something horribly wrong or is forced to compromised.
Nearly all the Thrawn-related audiobooks have Marc Thompson as the narrator (I think the only one I've found that DOESN'T is Outbound Flight). You'll find he uses a different style in the older Heir to the Empire books than the new ones that came after Rebels came out.
He expects you to do your best and won't fault you for things out of your control, kinda person who has such a aura of competence that you admire and wish to be like him, in every sense of the word he is a professional and an artist of war.
Its a damn shame that this Thrawn was not in Ahsoka. Instead we got a Thrawn who willingly sacrifices men who served him in isolation for a decade for no reason at all.
Thrawn is a professional military officer. That can be put in a positive light, or a negative light. Though, that is what Thrawn is. That being said. Thrawn does not suffer for fools and he takes a very pragmatic, long term view on his goals. That is what explains most of his decisions.
I bought and read the Thrawn Trilogy. It's excellent. A Thrawn empire would certainly be better then the new republic. The man isn't evil, he's a genius who only wishes good and security for everyone. In the books, he wished well to even his cunning none evil enemies.
He isn’t evil, but he’s ruthless. He lost the naivette of his yourh, gave up on understanding others as people. Now he sees nearly all as assets, his quote about allies and friends is the perfect example.
Still thinking about when he had to wear a disguise and his choice was the most ridiculous funky sunglasses he could find. I want him to wear his shades in live action SO BAD
Thrawn, at least in legends, is a pragmatist. Yes, he is a good person to his men and he is one of the few imperials who won’t execute them (most of the time). But at the same time, he’s someone who wouldn’t hesitate to raze an entire city to get what he wants
while he has committed acts in rebels and in the old legends books that definitely could be considered an evil act even those acts were use minimally as they were only used just enough to achieve mission success. He never did them because he is bad guy i must do bad things. He did them because it was the only logical path to success. And all things considered it only happened a few times between legends and rebels. He always tried to preform acts with the minimum possible casualties and the best efficency.
The current cannon Thrawn trilogy (two trilogies really) are amazing and I really enjoy the audible. They should have stuck to the heir to the empire's idea of having thrawn be the leader of the empire post ROTJ, Would have made for better sequel films
Thrawn is such a different kind of antagonist in the Star Wars series, I can't hate him even though he is part of an explicitly totalitarian Empire lead by an Evil Wizard
Thrawn is the single deadliest asset of the Empire... ...because he gives a damn. Men like him make the massive, hulking, inefficient imperial machine... actually work. May there never be more of them.
There’s a lot to be said about how well written Thawne is, he legitimately makes siding with the empire seem like it’s the right choice just by how he carries himself
One time my brother was talking about thrawn and my mum was listening and asked who we were talking about. My brother said, "Grand Admirlal Thrawn" to which my mum reaponded, "grandad what?" Ever since, i cant unhear Grandad Miral Thrawn.
i’m always just torn on wether or not the empire and thrawn are in the wrong. knowing they’re doing what they’re doing to defend the galaxy from the yuuzong vong
Might be the Grysks in new canon, but the point still stands. That’s what I love about the Thrawn books. Like yes the Empire under Palpatine is evil, but ya honestly think the New Republic is gonna stand up to the likes of the Vong/Grysks?? Really makes us reconsider a bit in light of a larger threat…
In the long run under Palpatine, yes. The Empire was a mess under him and it wasn't going to be in any shape to face the YV unless the rebellion was *magically* snuffed out in its infancy and Palpatine actually had Thrawn in charge and not way out in the middle of butt-end nowhere.
As much as I love the Thrawn in the books, I also have to accept that Filoni wants a Thrawn more akin to his original appearance in Heir to the Empire so that’s what we’re going to get.
Aside from not being true to Thrawn’s character, I’m just not sure if Filoni knows how to handle him - how to let the main characters have little “wins” here and there while ultimately preserving the fact that Thrawn is very hard to win against. In Rebels they defeat Thrawn twice using force creatures, first Bendu then the Purgill, like they don’t know how to challenge Thrawn without a Deus ex Machina. Literally in Treason we see Thrawn fight two battles simultaneously in one of the most epic space battles I’ve ever read about, only for him to return to Rebels S4 and get immediately yeeted by a space whale LMFAO
@@eclypticwraith6283 its because writing AGAINST Thrawn is damn near impossible, the Rebellion doesnt have nearly as much assets as Thrawn, they do not have nearly as much leeway to act on their own without potentially losing crucial support and even then Thrawn can regain them from another source with ease. Considering the Rebels are a galactic scale group they have to travel through differant planet else be isolated from one another and too weak to stand by themselves in an organised manner within the totalitarian regime of the Empire, except that plays into Thrawn who is a master at dividing and conquering his foes. The only thing Thrawn cant deal with is force related issue because while somewhat familiar with the concept unlike most he cannot fathom all it encompass. And unexpected surprise from assests he believes are garanteed to follow his plan but doesnt last second. You cant overwhelm him with strenght since he is the one to pack the heat and if he doesnt it means hed have an ace up his sleeve else he wouldnt needlessly risk his meager forces. You cant outmanoeuver him for long because even if surprised hed adapt his plans on the spot. Heroes foolish as they can be ends up winning because they triomph in a contest of wits, or strenght or really any face to face, and in order to be heroes they need to win else they wouldnt be heroes but martyrs. Except with Thrawn his own writing means he wouldnt be outsmarted by the Heroes wits, or outpowered by the heroes strenght and determination etc... because he already expects this outcome and thus piled all odds on his side to win. Thats why its hard to write Thrawn as the villain, because he is made to not be bested by heroes
But at least they didn’t degenerate his character, he is still what we recognize as thrawn, almost 3 steps ahead of everybody around him, even the heroes with plot armor
Eh, tbh I was a little unimpressed with Thrawn’s tactical abilities in Rebels when compared to the books. Definitely doesn’t feel as in control as he does in the books. Immediate scene that comes to mind is Ezra and Sabine stealing his tie defender with him present
@@chrissgreene1 Yes agree, Thrawn was an anti-hero in his core with the books. Rebels was a cartoon for 8 yr olds. They couldn't get that deep into his character. Think they used him as bait.
Thrawn has always been a necessity of a villain. Not because he must be. But because he needs to be. In the EU he was set against a foe he believed he could deal with. Sure he could have told the Rebellion but they had small views and tunnel vision. Palpatine on the other had resources, once told of a threat he gave Thrawn what he needed, still tossed him.adude but he had what he needed: A foot in the door. When Palpatine died he saw his opening, he strikef fast and hard and knew what to do. Understand, he died annoyed. Not angry, not confusingly. He died annoyed because he was betrayed on the cusp of his triumph. He wanted to prepare the galaxy against the Vong. While he died, he ultimately proved his point. The Rebellion and by extension the Republic would fail to stop and prevent the extragalactic Invasion. But the Imperial Remnants were more than ready to go toe to toe. Had Thrawn lived, he'd have stopped them, if he couldn't, he would have one in the long run. I fail to see him as evil. I only see him as necessary.
Honestly, I can't see Thrawn as Evil, not like Tarken or how the other Imperial officer typically were I can really only see him as the Exceptional Military Officer, one who will get the job done
It seems that all characters depicted as not entirely evil have the same weakness : believing that the end justifies the means. But believing this twists yourself, and at the end, you'll become yourself an opponent to that end. I see no example (in my real life experience) of someone justifying the means by the end and who has not been twisted by that. I being no exception.
Thrawn in the old books got rebels to join his secret empire of the hand. I honestly think he would make the perfect emperor or at least the best you could get. He would be purely meritocratic. Surrounding himself with loyal but component advisors, and i also believe he would work to bring more aliens into the military, its illogical to limit the recruitment pool so heavily and he knows having only one way of thinking limits effectiveness. Not saying it would be utopia, far from it, it is still the empire but that seems better than what the new republic became
Thrawn has Never been evil. Is he pragmatic, highly competent and calculating? yes. Does he also try to avoid death and value the skill of literally anyone he meets including his adversaries? (See his recruitment attempt of Nightswan) also yes. His overarching goal is to protect the galaxy and he does this by teaming with the ultimate power in the galaxy which happens to be the empire. In addition when he is forced to enact needless loss of life by events outside of his control (normally the incompetence of others) he shows genuine remorse and sadness. Again not evil just Logical (I don’t entirely count his “bads” in rebels because those are strictly story driven and the show needed a big bad)
Thrawn is a politically inept military genius. He has shown multiple times that he will defy direct orders in order to get the best outcome for everyone that calls themselves his ally. He is not evil, and he does things because he believes it will benefit The Chiss Ascendancy, The Empire, and The Galaxy. One of his goals is stopping The Grysk, not only does he believe they are a threat to The Ascendancy, he believes they are a threat to the entire galaxy. If Disney is going to change his core character, they need to give a reason, and make it a damn good one. I predict they won't. Thrawn will be the hill that Filoni dies on.
@@stefdelev Timothy Zahn himself confirmed that he wasn't consulted and Dave Filoni lied about it during celebration because after Tim's interview, they faced a lot of criticism from fans. However, I read somewhere that they did call him after the incident and briefly mentioned something about season 2. So this has already happened twice. Once during Rebels and now for Ahsoka season 1. Dave Filoni doesn't see Thrawn as his original author and creator Zahn does. To him he is an evil, one dimensional villain whom he thinks of as a psychopath. I will be honest, Dave is not capable of showing such a nuanced and brilliant anti hero. Unlike George Lucas he thinks too much in black and white.
If Thrawn had been the main antagonist of the Sequel Trilogy, with no meddling by Disney or Kennedy of his character… how different do you think things would be?
The wanton disregard for the life of their fellow man, in chasing the credits rather than daving the lives of soldiers and crewmen who could go on to do great things - is why i think the empire is... Less than worthwhile. Yet Thrawn, as ever - proves his... Horrific levels of competence, by saving lives instead of the gas. Its hard to respect the faction in most rights. Yularen and Thrawn are two wonderful reasons to believe in them.
It sucks Yularen got blown up with the death star. Star Wars writers need to really rethink their concept of heroism/villainy, because their stories involve a bunch of despicable idiots who are winning every time. The empire brings order and prace.
Thank y’all so much for the support! Originally made this video just to send to a couple friends and didn’t imagine over 10K viewing it. If y’all want more, the only other video I have is one I made on Vader a while ago. Check it out here!
ua-cam.com/video/M1ailSucEq4/v-deo.htmlfeature=shared
now it's over 24 :)
Are the full audiobooks you sampled for this available on UA-cam? They did his voice really well
@@Mizzle420420No, they need to be purchased. I got mine on Audible
what fascinated me about Thrawn was that he was a professional that didn't sacrifice his men on a whim,owned up his own mistakes,didn't give insane orders,promoted merit among his crew,and when someone failed,he always gave them a reasonable chance to redeem themselves,and offered advice to anyone who had the half a brain to follow his meaning.
Most people under his commands follwed him out of admiration and respect because they knew he wasn't a egomaniac going on a power trip.
If Thrawn was a college professor i would never miss his lessons and take notes
Bruh facts
I mean, he would also structure the classes in such a way to get maximum effort from as large of a group as possible. Hell, with his fucking skillset he could likely organise rough drafts for most of the strugglers to rise to the occasion.
@@Elmithian true
No matter if its rains, or snow falls, or if its end of the world i would not miss one single lessons from Thrawn. Best villain, best character ever!
FACTS!!!@@Zagoreni02A
I like how Thrawn was not defeated by the cunningness of his enemies or by any foolish actions. Rather he was defeated by a force unknown to the Empire and himself. He was defeated by something supernatural and not of the natural world, something he had no way of knowing how to defeat. I like how his failure was not of his own doing but because the universe is so vast that not even he could have conceived of those animals attacking his ship
Aye. I don't think anyone in Thrawn's position during the Battle of Lothal would've or could've seen something as out of left field as a heard of Star Whales abducting him and his fleet like they did.
If the force wasn’t a thing the empire would’ve controlled the galaxy for centuries
I mean how would you stop that anyway?
Or because of the writers pushing themselves into a wall
deux ex machina go brrrr
Thrawn has never been evil, and he was never really loyal to the empire, he's loyal to the Chiss ascendancy and working towards the empire's benefit, works towards the ascendancy's benefit, he's not evil he's just doing his job
Which is why Thrawn is so popular with older Star Wars fans. You reach a certain age and the idea of Pure Evil and Pure Good seem less plausible, so we become attracted to characters or factions in fiction that are more grey. Thrawn served the Empire, the out and out villains of Star Wars, but he was not a villain and we saw in him what the Empire COULD have been and really SHOULD have been, without the literal cackling evil space wizard at its head.
He is evil
Yep hear that guys those Nazis were just doing their jobs they were never evil
@@mickelwarren2598 apart from the fact that star wars is fantasy and that no-one mentioned the nazis, the only kind of people who are going to comment stuff like what you have just commented are people shit stirring or people who just want likes and attention, but thank you for your opinion.
@@weldonwin he was very much loyal to Palpatine lil bro he served under the imperial navy longer than the Ascendency
Thrawn is cold blooded towards those he considers enemies, but is loyal to his crew and those he cares about.
Disagree completely. At least the Thrawn from the novels. Nightswan was a clear enemy of Thrawn and he promised to preserve the lives of Nightswan and his army, including combatants, to the best of his ability. Not something a “cold blooded” character would do.
@@chrissgreene1he is only cold blooded to them when he sees no point in reasoning with them like with the rebels on attalon in rebels s3. However he would try to make a compromise most of the time and wouldn’t waste the lives of his men or civilians unnecessarily. Hence my only problem with Disney Thrawn is when he fired at civilians on lothal. But maybe that was super important to him and super urgent since palpatine was there so he couldn’t risk Ezra getting away by any chance. What are your comments on rebels Thrawn? I generally like the depiction but I agree he’s a bit too villainous. What surprised me is that he still seems really cool despite the inaccuracy.
@@bryannig9 as usual, Disney sucks at anything Star Wars. lol Rebels Thrawn was the typical Disney "need", to have an obvious Good guy (team) vs Bad guy (team) and they will throw out any and all other content like, novel accuracies, to achieve their goal. Disney does not care about any prior details.
@@Rakkasan11b I don’t remember asking for your thoughts
@@bryannig9 You got it anyway and no one asked for yours either, so here we are...your thoughts and my thoughts.
When he does anything reasonably possible to reduce waste of life and resources that automatically makes him 90% better then the rest of the Galactic Empire military.
Yeah...if I was in the empire's military I'd definitely be hoping to be assigned to Thrawn... probably best hope for seeing retirement y'know 😂
10,000 dead stormtroopers and only 3 million dead infantry are acceptable losses, good sir. An outstanding success, I will report to Lord Vader for your lack of faith in the Imperial doctrine.
@@SeraphimRoadlol
@@cptsteele91 Thrawn, Veers, or similarly capable leaders intent on doing their job capably.
@@SeraphimRoad "if the empire had listened to me, we would've have lost at most a few tie defenders and some smaller ships to the much weaker rebel alliance. instead you allowed massive resources and personnel waste and loss with the death star project, which legitimized the Rebel Alliance as a worthy cause and turned them from a nuisance into a existential threat"
He's about the only Star Wars character that I have any respect for. I actually wish I could have had a mentor like him in my life. He saw the potential in his subordinates, even if they were unique, and nurtured and supported them. It's a very rare trait these days
what about Plo Koon?
There’s a sea shanty written about Thrawn from the Chimera’s crew with the common refrain “Let’s make the Old Man proud,” and I think that’s an important facet of his character. His men want to do good because of how he treats them, they want to make him proud.
Where can I find this shanty, I must know
@@JoshBeck-z5m ua-cam.com/video/7Wlh0e3XMeQ/v-deo.htmlsi=XY2RE_h4wB5k2eD7
@@JoshBeck-z5m ua-cam.com/video/7Wlh0e3XMeQ/v-deo.html
@@JoshBeck-z5mua-cam.com/video/7Wlh0e3XMeQ/v-deo.htmlsi=yD_B3-pucnpFF7-E
@@JoshBeck-z5m ua-cam.com/video/7Wlh0e3XMeQ/v-deo.html
If you were to ever join the empire. Be sure to be under the command of thrawn. You will be surrounded efficient and agreeable company
Id actually be terrified of failing him. He seems like a person who id give everything for but would make you question if that is enough.
If I had to, I would be unyieldingly loyal to his command, not Vader or Sidious.
Especially to learn from his example, not whatever jargon the Empire spews out because, just like him I want results, not perfection.
@@prome3439Nah you'd probably be fine. Thrawn would most likely aknowledge you were at least trying your best, even better if you also aknowledge your own mistakes and try to make up for It
Which is a lot better compared to just being force choked by Vader lol
@@Cappuccino_Rabbit "harder daddy~" *disturbed Vader noises*
@ElEliteRojo25or laziness; The Force help the Moff who makes others be his personal servants.
"You served too long under Lord Vader, Captain. I Have no qualms about accepting a useful idea merely because it wasn't my own. My position and ego are not at stake here" . - Thrawn.
I love how Vanto's "wild space accent" just means he has a Southern accent 😂
"all life is valuable and I resist the thought of standing by and watching 200 possibly needless deaths" I am surprised this isn't here.
Optimistic, compassionate, empathetic, humble, stoic. This is an idol to emulate. Not only that, these are the reasons his victories and insight were almost supernatural; the Force was with him, it does not choose sides except individuals. Ironically, he lives the virtues of the jedi better than the jedi did.
Not compassionate, most certainly not empathetic and not very humble I'm afraid. Thrawn was VERY cold-blodded, and his only goal was victory. Perfect as a Imperial military officer, but not the way you describe him.
@manuelojanguren661 Well, I've just heard segments of stories that prove otherwise. So it's going to take a lot more than a "trust me, bro" response that tells me otherwise. Besides, these traits aren't feelings. They are actions.
When Thrawn saved alien lives over imperial resources despite going against orders to the opposite, that was compassionate. When Thrawn sees a victory where others see defeat, that shows he either takes pride in few things or seldom any at all. This is being humble. And earning loyalty and being kind to those to the point where they would do anything for him, trust him completely for his support. You can't do this unless you understand their thoughts and feelings, so that's very empathetic.
He's not doing this in the same way psychopaths do. When psychopaths manipulate, it is because they want something. Now, you could argue that he is manipulating military politics to rise through the ranks to become Grand Admiral, but that's not the same thing. He maintains that victory is the highest priority, but good actions towards that victory are also a priority if they can be done.
Cold logic is not anathema to kind hearts and empathy. Coldness is a mindset anyone can embrace when needed, but on more than one occasion, and more times than shown in this video, he has shown consideration for others the best way he can without sacrificing his loyalty or mission.
Hera's Kalikori is a good example. Despite her resistance and protest, Thrawn decided on keeping it in a place of honour (keep in mind, he assumed the line of Syndulla was going to end with her execution and eventual death of her father. This was really the best way, from his perspective, to respect her family, history, and culture)
@@Billmaster115 Thrawn once sacrificed 2 tie interceptors and their pilots to test the capabilities of the Tie Defender, absolutely no remorse for the pilots on his part
Thrawn bombarded the city of Lothal to make the rebels surrender
@@Billmaster115 Just think of how he disposes Morgan Elsbeth, the one woman that had let him out of exile and fought for him so devotely. In the end, no remorse whatsoever for his dead. Because everything and everybody are tools for his greater goal: victory. (Quote of him from the books). Is that more than trust me bro?
@@manuelojangurenI literally cannot find a quote like that anywhere, but here's an actual quote of him saying this.
"All lives are important, and I resist the thought of standing by and watching two hundred possibly needless deaths."
―Senior Captain Thrawn to Senior Captain Lakinda and Mid Captain Samakro
Throughout all of the comics, Thrawn demonstrates a consistent respect for life that are just not consistent with your presentation of him. You appeal to his lack of expression or hesitation in asking others to sacrifice for their goals, but this is simply how Stoics behave: they are not overwhelmed by emotions or moral conundrums because they have learned to dissociate their emotions from their critical thinking and have often thought out their own moral positions long before ever having to make them. Both Thrawn and Morgan Elsbeth had a mission they were passionate about, and Elsbeth willingly chose to stay and sacrifice her life so that Thrawn could escape.
His ability to stay calm as he asks her to make that sacrifice is just an example of his stoicism, not a lack of gratefulness or compassion. Military leaders have to do this all the time, people who are trained to look at the bigger picture and ask young men and women to potentially lose their lives in pursuit of their goal, including close friends.
What you're doing is confusing his composure for a lack of compassion. The reality is that Thrawn is likely used to this by now, everyone who serves the Empire is expected to give their lives for it, Morgan Elsbeth and Thrawn both knew this and behave accordingly. Not once has Thrawn needlessly thrown away lives intentionally nor without realising the weight of that sacrifice.
Another example of his empathy is when he asked the Night Mothers if the Night Troopers were informed of what was going to happen to them. I was not surprised when he showed this level of consideration for his soldiers, this is how he is as a person.
The Thrawn Trilogy was amazing!
That it was, indeed.
I vote The Bad Batch, Kenobi, Andor, The Mandalorian, Book Of Boba Fett, and Ahsoka seasons 1-2-3-4 of Grand Admirals Thrawn, Gilad Pellaeon, Nial Declann and Rae Sloane
1000 times better than the current trash
Both Thrawn trilogies. (Not too keen on the third one though)
@@officialmonarchmusic True
This is why Thrawn is my favourite character.
It's nice to see a comment section full of thrawn loyalists
His pragmatism and sense of honor and duty would have made him a far better leader for the Empire than Vader or Palpatine ever could be. Vader was too emotionally unstable, and of course Palpatine was pure evil incarnate. Thrawn is neither of those things.
The only problem would be that Thrawn is from the Unknown Regions and that he is hopeless when it comes to politics. Other than that, I agree
@@Anders_Lund You dont need to be good at politics if you're Emperor.
@@Anders_Lund All the characters in-universe seem to miss the point: He's not bad at politics, he just…. doesn't really need them. He told Eli, when they began the Academy, that he'd learn the strategies of the political battlefield, just like any other.May 21, 2024 i looked up thrawn bad at politcs and being a good general would difetly help with skills of being a polition to
@@LeoLau-ip9bv Really? Even Thrawn himself says that he doesn't understand politics and while he says to both Eli and Ar'alani that he will try to learn the tactics of politics, he doesn't seem to grasp it. And is it really a big deal that there is something Thrawn doesn't understand? He is a tactical and strategic mastermind when it comes to military matters.
On the matter that he doesn't need to understand politics, that I would say is wrong. He definitely needed that while he was in the Expansionary Defence Force as Family politics were part of the fleet, even if it shouldn't be.
The same goes for the Empire. If Thrawn had some political sense, he would have understood why Eli wasn't getting a promotion until Pryce and Tarkin arranged for Moff Ghadi to get arrested as it was Ghadi and his Core world friends who opposed the blue skinned alien, as they saw Thrawn, and slowed down the repair on Thrawn's ship and stopped Eli from moving up from the rank of ensign
Thrawn is a fascinating character that actually has good philosophies as Timothy Zahn wrote him. Even good wisdom that can be applied to real life like:
“It is said that one should keep one's allies within view, and one's enemies within reach.
A valid statement. One must be able to read an ally's strengths, so as to determine how to best use them. One must similarly be able to read his enemy's weaknesses, so as to determine how to best defeat him.
But what of friends?
There is no accepted answer, perhaps true friendship is so exceedingly rare. But I had formulated my own.
A friend need not be kept within sight or within reach. A friend must be allowed the freedom to find and follow his own path. If one is fortunate, those paths will for a time join. But if paths separate, it is comforting to know that a friend still graces the universe with his skills, and his viewpoint, and his present. For if one is remembered by a friend, one is never truly gone.”
as well as some you included. I view him as a warrior philosopher trying to do what he believes is right, to protect his homeland. He's a grey area character that has a lot to say. My issue with David Filoni are many things, but I really dislike how he used Thrawn in Rebels. It's a kids cartoon. I'm not a huge fan of the kids shows, but Thrawn is a favorite character, sadly he was pushed into "evil" in Filoni's Black and White views. I believe he's doing it again in Ahsoka. With how he's pushing Thrawn as this great evil the villains are looking for. I found myself asking.
"How exactly are these sort of darksiders evil for looking for Thrawn?"
I also like Thrawn's voice here as opposed to Lars Mikkelsen.
That's an incredible quote, I love it
@@archivist_13
It's one of my favorites and genuinely affected how I value my friends, since we are far apart.
i'd love a show with this version of Thrawn at the centre, or a game. It'd make for a nice choice based strategy RPG.
also noticed I wrote it wrong a bit: "Present should be presence." Sorry about that!
@@ArgentWolf95 as someone who desperately wishes to keep their friends close as I go to university, it's given me a sense of peace in all honesty
@@archivist_13 i'm glad it's helped you, it's why I post these quotes around a bit because we can learn lots from fiction as well as real stuff.
If I may, although i'm years older than you, 32. You will find your friends again and catch up again and make new ones.
The internet will help you with that too.
@@ArgentWolf95 thank you, I really appreciate that.
Eli Vanto is one of my favorite starwars characters, i so wish we got/get to see him side by side with thrawn in live action
Me too Thrawn Treason ended his story on a MASSIVE cliffhanger for me so seeing Eli again will be lit.
@@drparadox7833I'm thinking in a future season of Ahsoka or the HTTE movie, Thrawn may get a message from Eli telling him things aren't going well in the Chiss Ascendancy. Then hopefully Eli will be in the show along with Ar'alani.
@@mish375 It's a good way to remove Thrawn from canon before The Force Awakens without killing him off.
@@BlueInkAlchemy I'd love for there to be a Thrawn death fake-out once the Vong/Grysk threat is taken care of. Eli and Ar'alani help Thrawn fake his death to escape the First Order turning against him. The glaaxy thinks Thrawn is dead; but he's just returned home to the Ascendancy.
80th like
Thrawn has never been defeated because of a mistake, because he doesn't make one, he was defeated because of unpredictable parameters (the Force, an overly proud and presumptuous officer, unexpected enemy reinforcements, ....)
My parents were asking me about Thrawn. I told them that the thing that makes him stand out is that he’s a reasonable man.
Kinda sad that the Rebels version of Thrawn didn't quite deliver on the author's original vision for Thrawn. Thrawn consistently sacrifices lives to instill fear in the show, and if i remember correctly in the first episodes he shows up, one of the imperial officers is like "your civilian casualty counts are high" or something I think. Then Thrawn says something like "collateral damage is inevitable".
At least now in the Ahsoka show it seems Thrawn is actually valuing his troops a bit more, although unfortunately he still thinks of them as a resource and sends squads of troopers to their deaths
That civilian casualty referred to in his opening rebels scene was not actually his fault. That was referenced in the book and is also apart of this video.
To be fair, he does have limited resources now
He only fires on civilians once in the show as an ABSOLUTE last resort. He values his troops as a valuable resource, but not one he isn't willing to spend.
thrawn is ruthless is rebels, but he's no sadist or tyrant. Hes very polite to his prisoners, opponents, and subordinates, and unless im mistaken he never threatened anyone under his command with violence and apologized the one time he got really angry and was able to beat the shit out of that one guy who called his collection of art trash, not recognizing its value. Yes he's willing to use torture and fear to achieve his goals and that still makes him a villain, but nothing like vader or the emperor.
@@LakesideTrey uh he was very willing to spend those 2 tie interceptors to test out his new Tie Defender!
Thrawn was done so dirty, not by writers but just the nature of the Star Wars universe. Imagine being arguably the best military strategist alive, working your ass off to master the art of war and serve your cause, consistently outsmarting every enemy in your path until you are just inches away from total victory, only to be completely destroyed at the last second by some 17 year old with space magic bullshit not once, but TWICE. Shit Thrawn’s experience is a cakewalk compared to the non-force wielders in the old republic days, where genius strategy and skill were just made obsolete at random points by some fucker in a reaper mask eating you and the entire planet you’re on. The force is fucking wild man, never wanna live in the SW universe.
Dave Filoni should be forced to watch this at least five times.
shall we have a meet up at daves office?
The use of Thrawn’s theme makes this too good.
lol I’m glad you like it bc some people earlier were flaming me for it
Man I really wished for the Thrawn theme to be part of the audiobooks, it would make such a nice ambiance.
I love the thrawn theme music
Thrawn has always been my favorite. Those books made me love him. He did his best and didn't come across as evil to me. I think he was always trying to help his people and others
Thrawn is my favorite starwars character. the calculating and scheming and genius is phenomenal./
He really makes the Empire actually feel like a confident and competent machine which brings value, and you can see why people willingly follow him. As a soldier myself, I can really appreciate a good solid officer and it’s easy for us to willingly fall under a man like that, especially when so many officers are bad.
Meanwhile almost every other Imperial Officer just seemed stereotypically evil and incompetent, and makes you wonder how so many are perfectly willing to be thrown to their deaths under their command.
Trawn couldve justified the empires existence if hed been in charge pure logic and yet some compassion and humility, thrawn also never underestimates anyone. The perfect imperial ruler
The finale of Ahsoka established that. Morgan wants to underestimate the Jedi (Ahsoka and Ezra); but Thrawn tells her that many an officer and even he did once. "Never again," is what he tells her.
I would to see Thrawn defeat the Republic and then see and epic conflict between him and a returning Sidious.
Thrown is possibly my favorite character in all of fiction
Definition of what an actual naval officer should strive to be.
So many people mislabel Thrawn as a villain. I would say that Thrawn is within the grayest of gray areas, in between an antihero and antivillain.
I’ve heard Mark Thompson was a good Thrawn voice and now that I’m actually hearing him, I agree. He and Lars both have the same tone of voice, just Mark doesn’t have as much of an accent. I’m liking how similar they sound!
I could be wrong, but I believe Mark modified how he reads Thrawn based on Lars’ voice for him in Rebels S3. He also read Thrawn in the Heir to the Empire 20th Anniversary audiobook in 2011, and while he still did a great job, it’s weird to hear Thrawn voiced straight, without that now-iconic tone. All of his audiobooks with Thrawn post-2017 are in that voice, and I agree it’s sooooo good.
13:26 Oh damn, this whole excerpt was very relevant to me. As a man plagued by regrets and what-ifs, I'm glad to have heard it.
I just fear Filoni will misinterpret Thrawn for his own gain
Welcome to PC culture “creative” content.
He did Thrawn pretty good in rebels, do I don't think so, it's George Lucas protoge, I think Filoni probably has the best grasp at star wars then anyone currently there
@@orionriftclan2727no
He is neither hero or villain but a realist. His methodology is deeply rooted in logic and rationality. Thrawn’s mind is his most valuable asset but is not immune to making mistakes. Or suffering from the weakness of pride.
Thrawn and Sun Tzu would have been best friends.
“Thrawn does study the art of war he works to perfect it” in rebels he actually said that
Like others have said, Thrawn was never evil. Tactical and uses people's weaknesses against them, yes for sure. He was an extremely good commander praised those who deserved it even if they failed in the task assigned. But he was also tough on those who failed through negligence or not caring. If someone or a group was considered an enemy then he used all his skills and abilities to bring them down. Generally by using their beliefs or own tactics against them. But evil? no I do not believe so. The best book Trilogy series was the Thrawn trilogy, loved that series of books and in my opinion would have made for a great movie trilogy. Well.......... as long as not interfered with by someone who is known for stuffing up Star Wars.
Thrawn is no more evil then the greatest commander's or generals are he is never observed being cruel or overly harsh like Vader he punishes people to the extent he truly believes they need to correct their behaviour and actively teaches his officers to look bigger and wider when it comes to their work and to think ouside of the box the imperial academy's teach you to live in it really explains why his crew are one of the best in the empire because they have the advantages of a strong decisive leader like vader without the temper tantrums or mental illness
Which Thrawn trilogy? There's three of them now, all written by the same guy, and all of them are fantastic.
@@Sora8740 Was meaning the Heir to the Empire Trilogy. Although, they all would make awesome movies. Timothy Zahn certainly writes some awesome books. He in lots of ways the book version that Dave Faloni is to the movie versions.
@@nzcyclone DarthAngelus is making a fan-movie for Heir to the Empire: ua-cam.com/video/CC9fYUDQ6CM/v-deo.html
War itself is evil. To justify Thrawn is to justify evil actions no matter how harmless or justified they may seem. There's a reason Luke Skywalker chooses not to fight his own father or the emperor in Return of the Jedi. Saw Gerrera is another example of a character who seemingly isn't evil who performs evil actions. It's important to distinguish this. Thrawn is an impressive leader, yes. However, he is Evil.
Ive listened to these books 3 times and love them more each time I listen. Good work putting these together
People just forget he gains knowledge to progress his race. His loyalty is to his race. Joining the Empire is just a means to gain knowledge. I hate how the Ahsoka show is making it seem likes he's a big bad demon trying to become the next Sidious because he is not.
I disagree, I don’t think Ahsoka is painting him as evil, just as a threat. The heroes correctly assume that if Thrawn were to return, he could unite the remnants of the empire which would lead to another war. Thrawn assuming command of the remnants would definitely be a viable way for him to progress his race, so it’s not out of character.
@bob440 though they must make it clear that these novels are canon because i don't think they have really made it clear so far if they are.
this and this alone........is the reason why i love Thrawn
My personal favourite outcome of the Ahsoka series would be that Thrawn invades the New republic, besieges its capital, forces a peace treaty, and then takes some of the galaxy near the Chiss Ascendancy and sets about creating the empire of the hand from legends, canon remains intact with the republic holding most of the known galaxy and thus the first order war goes ahead, we know that Thrawn will not vanquish the new republic because it is the dominant galactic government at the start of movie 7, but that doesn't mean that he can't create a small, well controlled and efficient nation near the Ascendancy to function as a shield for it, He is going to be angry when he hears that the death star, supposedly purely a weapon of terror, was used on a civilian world, he will be even more enraged when he hears about starkiller base, on the whole I can easily imagine him not taking sides in the first order war and simply waiting it out, this leaves the canon timeline intact and allows for Thrawn to be victorious, achieve his true goal, remaining true to the character and creates a new faction that will allow for more TV series and movies in the future, while also satisfying the numerous Thrawn fans, I see no reason for Disney not to do this.
dont give me hope for a team up of imp and reb......
@@brittanyjtaylor2638 sorry.
@@Feanor6450 because we know dave prob wont do that...
Thank you for this post. The Star Wars Rebels portrayal is the Lucas 2-dimensional character template. The novels give Thrawn (and even Tarkin) a more 3-dimensional point of view, not the cartoonish 2-D Lucas stuff. Everyone is the hero of the story in their own mind, usually acting on what they think is the right thing to do. The tragedy is when someone who is trying to do what's right actually does something horribly wrong or is forced to compromised.
I need whatever audiobook these excerpts are from. I've read the books, of course, but that reading is amazing.
Mark Thompson is the narrator
Nearly all the Thrawn-related audiobooks have Marc Thompson as the narrator (I think the only one I've found that DOESN'T is Outbound Flight). You'll find he uses a different style in the older Heir to the Empire books than the new ones that came after Rebels came out.
I swear if Thrawn was a Businessman, He'd simply dominate the entire world.
What happens when you give a business man an army?
Advanced Warfare Atlas happens
Well now he looks like blue Elon Musk on live action lmaoo
@@SN00PICUS Trump or Elon Musk in 2032 happens
@@YoRHaUnit2BabeDon’t disrespect Thrawn like that. He is way way superior to those two.
That's good stuff. I was surprised how little Thrawn (the real one from the books) was discussed, and how misrepresented he was in Ashoka
He expects you to do your best and won't fault you for things out of your control, kinda person who has such a aura of competence that you admire and wish to be like him, in every sense of the word he is a professional and an artist of war.
Its a damn shame that this Thrawn was not in Ahsoka. Instead we got a Thrawn who willingly sacrifices men who served him in isolation for a decade for no reason at all.
i hope dave knows that if he forgets the grysk it'll be a BIG lost opportunity and a large part of thrawns story...
Thrawn is a professional military officer. That can be put in a positive light, or a negative light. Though, that is what Thrawn is.
That being said. Thrawn does not suffer for fools and he takes a very pragmatic, long term view on his goals. That is what explains most of his decisions.
Man I'd love to see this type of video with lines from the heir to the empire series
Might have to give them a re-listen to pull them all out🤔
this very video convinced me to buy the thrawn novel within 5 minutes.
Thrawn is one of those villains who avoids typical villain mistakes like the plague.
I bought and read the Thrawn Trilogy. It's excellent. A Thrawn empire would certainly be better then the new republic. The man isn't evil, he's a genius who only wishes good and security for everyone. In the books, he wished well to even his cunning none evil enemies.
Thrawn doesn’t think in terms of good or evil-He thinks pragmatic versus not.
I always saw Thrawn as a Sherlock Holmes like character.
It's like revising the whole syllabus one night before the finals
He isn’t evil, but he’s ruthless. He lost the naivette of his yourh, gave up on understanding others as people. Now he sees nearly all as assets, his quote about allies and friends is the perfect example.
Still thinking about when he had to wear a disguise and his choice was the most ridiculous funky sunglasses he could find. I want him to wear his shades in live action SO BAD
Thrawn was a mastermind for war. he wanted to know his enemy before fighting them and he cared about his troopers, not even wasting cannon fodders.
Impressive compilation!
Thanks!
Marc Thompson is such a legend.
Thrawn, at least in legends, is a pragmatist. Yes, he is a good person to his men and he is one of the few imperials who won’t execute them (most of the time).
But at the same time, he’s someone who wouldn’t hesitate to raze an entire city to get what he wants
while he has committed acts in rebels and in the old legends books that definitely could be considered an evil act even those acts were use minimally as they were only used just enough to achieve mission success. He never did them because he is bad guy i must do bad things. He did them because it was the only logical path to success. And all things considered it only happened a few times between legends and rebels. He always tried to preform acts with the minimum possible casualties and the best efficency.
Thanks for this info which I had not known as zi had not heard of the books. Fascinating.
The current cannon Thrawn trilogy (two trilogies really) are amazing and I really enjoy the audible. They should have stuck to the heir to the empire's idea of having thrawn be the leader of the empire post ROTJ, Would have made for better sequel films
And he's great with kids.
dave better do him justice!
Ohh, don’t let his gentle voice and calm demeanor fool you; the man will think strategic circles around you if you’re not on your toes! 😲
Vanto having the thickest country accent ive ever heard had me rolling. Fucking Brilliant lol
Thrawn is such a different kind of antagonist in the Star Wars series, I can't hate him even though he is part of an explicitly totalitarian Empire lead by an Evil Wizard
When thrawn finally escapes the world i forgot its name he is going to publish a book about how to be good at military stuff
can someone give us some hope?
Thrawn is the single deadliest asset of the Empire...
...because he gives a damn.
Men like him make the massive, hulking, inefficient imperial machine... actually work. May there never be more of them.
There’s a lot to be said about how well written Thawne is, he legitimately makes siding with the empire seem like it’s the right choice just by how he carries himself
Hot take this Thrawn is better than legends Thrawn.
True because Zahn got better at writing
@@shadowwolf8496 i noticed that....
One time my brother was talking about thrawn and my mum was listening and asked who we were talking about. My brother said, "Grand Admirlal Thrawn" to which my mum reaponded, "grandad what?"
Ever since, i cant unhear Grandad Miral Thrawn.
Thrawn is not good, or evil. Thrawn is thrawn.
i’m always just torn on wether or not the empire and thrawn are in the wrong. knowing they’re doing what they’re doing to defend the galaxy from the yuuzong vong
Might be the Grysks in new canon, but the point still stands. That’s what I love about the Thrawn books. Like yes the Empire under Palpatine is evil, but ya honestly think the New Republic is gonna stand up to the likes of the Vong/Grysks?? Really makes us reconsider a bit in light of a larger threat…
In the long run under Palpatine, yes. The Empire was a mess under him and it wasn't going to be in any shape to face the YV unless the rebellion was *magically* snuffed out in its infancy and Palpatine actually had Thrawn in charge and not way out in the middle of butt-end nowhere.
As much as I love the Thrawn in the books, I also have to accept that Filoni wants a Thrawn more akin to his original appearance in Heir to the Empire so that’s what we’re going to get.
bbbuuutt thats not the direction zahn wants now...... i'm not liking what dave is doing...
@@brittanyjtaylor2638 never said I did either 😭
Aside from not being true to Thrawn’s character, I’m just not sure if Filoni knows how to handle him - how to let the main characters have little “wins” here and there while ultimately preserving the fact that Thrawn is very hard to win against. In Rebels they defeat Thrawn twice using force creatures, first Bendu then the Purgill, like they don’t know how to challenge Thrawn without a Deus ex Machina. Literally in Treason we see Thrawn fight two battles simultaneously in one of the most epic space battles I’ve ever read about, only for him to return to Rebels S4 and get immediately yeeted by a space whale LMFAO
@@eclypticwraith6283 its because writing AGAINST Thrawn is damn near impossible, the Rebellion doesnt have nearly as much assets as Thrawn, they do not have nearly as much leeway to act on their own without potentially losing crucial support and even then Thrawn can regain them from another source with ease.
Considering the Rebels are a galactic scale group they have to travel through differant planet else be isolated from one another and too weak to stand by themselves in an organised manner within the totalitarian regime of the Empire, except that plays into Thrawn who is a master at dividing and conquering his foes.
The only thing Thrawn cant deal with is force related issue because while somewhat familiar with the concept unlike most he cannot fathom all it encompass.
And unexpected surprise from assests he believes are garanteed to follow his plan but doesnt last second.
You cant overwhelm him with strenght since he is the one to pack the heat and if he doesnt it means hed have an ace up his sleeve else he wouldnt needlessly risk his meager forces.
You cant outmanoeuver him for long because even if surprised hed adapt his plans on the spot.
Heroes foolish as they can be ends up winning because they triomph in a contest of wits, or strenght or really any face to face, and in order to be heroes they need to win else they wouldnt be heroes but martyrs. Except with Thrawn his own writing means he wouldnt be outsmarted by the Heroes wits, or outpowered by the heroes strenght and determination etc... because he already expects this outcome and thus piled all odds on his side to win.
Thats why its hard to write Thrawn as the villain, because he is made to not be bested by heroes
Yes he is. On rebels he’s opens fires on innocent people. It’s like Henrich Earhart.
Rebels completely misrepresented Thrawn. He is an anti hero disney just used him as another bad guy.
Agree completely
But at least they didn’t degenerate his character, he is still what we recognize as thrawn, almost 3 steps ahead of everybody around him, even the heroes with plot armor
Eh, tbh I was a little unimpressed with Thrawn’s tactical abilities in Rebels when compared to the books. Definitely doesn’t feel as in control as he does in the books. Immediate scene that comes to mind is Ezra and Sabine stealing his tie defender with him present
@@chrissgreene1 Yes agree, Thrawn was an anti-hero in his core with the books. Rebels was a cartoon for 8 yr olds. They couldn't get that deep into his character. Think they used him as bait.
@@tremontefr5617but at least he spares Syndula's art and most of people's lifes if I remember correctly
Thrawn has always been a necessity of a villain. Not because he must be. But because he needs to be.
In the EU he was set against a foe he believed he could deal with. Sure he could have told the Rebellion but they had small views and tunnel vision. Palpatine on the other had resources, once told of a threat he gave Thrawn what he needed, still tossed him.adude but he had what he needed: A foot in the door. When Palpatine died he saw his opening, he strikef fast and hard and knew what to do.
Understand, he died annoyed. Not angry, not confusingly. He died annoyed because he was betrayed on the cusp of his triumph.
He wanted to prepare the galaxy against the Vong. While he died, he ultimately proved his point. The Rebellion and by extension the Republic would fail to stop and prevent the extragalactic Invasion. But the Imperial Remnants were more than ready to go toe to toe. Had Thrawn lived, he'd have stopped them, if he couldn't, he would have one in the long run.
I fail to see him as evil. I only see him as necessary.
This dude is trying to save his poontang and son. Very typical trope for "invincible or incalculable characters".
Lessons of leadership
Honestly, I can't see Thrawn as Evil, not like Tarken or how the other Imperial officer typically were
I can really only see him as the Exceptional Military Officer, one who will get the job done
It seems that all characters depicted as not entirely evil have the same weakness : believing that the end justifies the means.
But believing this twists yourself, and at the end, you'll become yourself an opponent to that end.
I see no example (in my real life experience) of someone justifying the means by the end and who has not been twisted by that. I being no exception.
he is not evil he is just a good manager
Thrawn in the old books got rebels to join his secret empire of the hand. I honestly think he would make the perfect emperor or at least the best you could get. He would be purely meritocratic.
Surrounding himself with loyal but component advisors, and i also believe he would work to bring more aliens into the military, its illogical to limit the recruitment pool so heavily and he knows having only one way of thinking limits effectiveness.
Not saying it would be utopia, far from it, it is still the empire but that seems better than what the new republic became
If there were only ten of Mitth'raw'nuruodos sort here, this world would be so much more interesting.
With regards to the direction kennedy is takingbthe republic i kinda hope thrawn returns and reintroduces the empire
Thrawn has Never been evil. Is he pragmatic, highly competent and calculating? yes. Does he also try to avoid death and value the skill of literally anyone he meets including his adversaries? (See his recruitment attempt of Nightswan) also yes. His overarching goal is to protect the galaxy and he does this by teaming with the ultimate power in the galaxy which happens to be the empire. In addition when he is forced to enact needless loss of life by events outside of his control (normally the incompetence of others) he shows genuine remorse and sadness. Again not evil just Logical
(I don’t entirely count his “bads” in rebels because those are strictly story driven and the show needed a big bad)
Thrawn is a politically inept military genius. He has shown multiple times that he will defy direct orders in order to get the best outcome for everyone that calls themselves his ally. He is not evil, and he does things because he believes it will benefit The Chiss Ascendancy, The Empire, and The Galaxy. One of his goals is stopping The Grysk, not only does he believe they are a threat to The Ascendancy, he believes they are a threat to the entire galaxy. If Disney is going to change his core character, they need to give a reason, and make it a damn good one.
I predict they won't. Thrawn will be the hill that Filoni dies on.
we will know tuesday if alliances was ret conned dave will know our fury...
Just 1 more day till we find out
My favourite bluegger
Thrawn's plan was to wait for Palpatine to die, to eventually replace him and make the empire great.
He was the greatest problem solver and a great leader
Imagine if Thrawn met Avon...
dave must listen to zahn!!!!!! hopefully thrawn is closer to his new book self than his origonal trilogy...........
I hope so too. But I’m almost certain Thrawn in live action will be a ruthless, clear cut villain, which will be very disappointing
@@chrissgreene1 But It's Dave Filoni so I am optimistic it'll be great.
@@chrissgreene1apparently Zahn is being consulted for the show so I'm optimistic
@@stefdelev Timothy Zahn himself confirmed that he wasn't consulted and Dave Filoni lied about it during celebration because after Tim's interview, they faced a lot of criticism from fans. However, I read somewhere that they did call him after the incident and briefly mentioned something about season 2. So this has already happened twice. Once during Rebels and now for Ahsoka season 1. Dave Filoni doesn't see Thrawn as his original author and creator Zahn does. To him he is an evil, one dimensional villain whom he thinks of as a psychopath. I will be honest, Dave is not capable of showing such a nuanced and brilliant anti hero. Unlike George Lucas he thinks too much in black and white.
@@crowofjudgement4196 Oh that's interesting, thanks for letting me know. Disappointing, but I guess we'll see how this turns out
After seeing episode 6, I think they’re going to turn him into a full-blown villain.
I hope they atleast keep it clear that he isn't a truely bad person
I'd rather they keep him as is and not a full villian
If Thrawn had been the main antagonist of the Sequel Trilogy, with no meddling by Disney or Kennedy of his character… how different do you think things would be?
The wanton disregard for the life of their fellow man, in chasing the credits rather than daving the lives of soldiers and crewmen who could go on to do great things - is why i think the empire is... Less than worthwhile.
Yet Thrawn, as ever - proves his... Horrific levels of competence, by saving lives instead of the gas.
Its hard to respect the faction in most rights. Yularen and Thrawn are two wonderful reasons to believe in them.
It sucks Yularen got blown up with the death star. Star Wars writers need to really rethink their concept of heroism/villainy, because their stories involve a bunch of despicable idiots who are winning every time. The empire brings order and prace.