As science has progressed ABA has remained in the early 20th century it's being proven so many human behaviours are biological responses to what's happening on the inside, how a person is responding to their thoughts and not the environment. The longer ABA continues refusing to come up to date with the rest of science, they're just going to continue living as their own culture. As long as they remain regardless of everything happening beneath the surface they will remain unethical, harmful and out of date. Each time ABA overstimulates a person tension develops in the muscles. Sustaining tension in muscles causes chronic pain, then when they teach them to keep overstimulating themselves they take the risk of developing chronic pain disorders. Not good! Fight or flight produces adrenaline, producing too much adrenaline and cortisol causes hormonal imbalances. With hormones and neurons interacting with the body organs hormonal imbalances damage the body organs. Anxiety in general increases the heart rate and effects blood pressure levels. Once again, not good! The nervous system is directly connected to the brain through the spinal cord, scientists who are actually up to date claim there's approximately 200,000,000 neurons in the nervous system that they're describing it as a second brain and is the size of a cat or dog's brain. As ABA practices damage the immune system the children become more susceptible to sicknesses and diseases, especially associated with age. Again, not good! Due to variation in the hippocampus autistic people are more vulnerable to depression. When people are in depression there is a reduction to metabolism resulting in food being turned into fat instead of energy which is why depressed people snack more (because the food did not turn into energy) and increases fat storage. The body will feed off of sugary cells before calories which while increasing fat storage pushes children in the direction of developing type 2 diabetes later in life, especially when they use sugary foods as positive reinforcement. Not good once again! I and any other up to date scientists can provide countless damages that are happening beneath the children's skin, as long as ABA continues being regardless of the harm it's doing beneath the surface I will not support it. Doing all of this to children as young as 2 years old, how much of an impact do you think this has on human development? ABA has not done a single longitudinal study of its methods and is entirely ignorant of the results we see later in life. Universities have investigated the results and suspicions of today's ABA, they tested lots of autistic people, results showed that those who were subjected to ABA are still 86% more likely to meet the criteria of PTSD and nearly 50% of the people they tested are actually diagnosed with PTSD. Those tested who were not subjected to ABA were found PTSD symptom free. That doesn't look good to me! Where they claim they're evidence based, they're actually not. Each one of their cases is individualized, individualising every case using diverse techniques is both against the rules of science and subjective making ABA lose scientific credibility. Behaviourism which is actually out of date and proven scientifically false, like it's claims; • All behaviours are learned by experiences (I never learned how to have a meltdown) • Genes have no influences on our behaviour (Autism is primarily genetic, behaviours to do with autism are biological) I believe more funding should go towards neuroscience to understand autistic behaviours biologically, by doing so they may come to find biological solutions.
A slight tangent off of the mention of behaviorism, religious and political writer Noam Chomsky, rotary review of BF Skinner back in like the 1950s. Some parts of a human behavior are coded in like the ability to utilize language if not a specific one. So that makes sense in that, some things are encoded, some things are learned culturally, and of course there's interpllay between those
I personally believe things like diet and other aspects of modern culture do turn what genetically is just a normal way to be human into the disabilities people experience that can garner them in autism diagnosis.
Hi@@gorgebateyes7014 Most 'disorders' were not seen as 'disorders' until the 19th century. The only common denominator among 'disorders' is 'social deviation'. Anyone who deviates from the social norm psychiatry automatically classifies as a 'disorder', like until 1974 homosexuality was seen as a disorder, left-handedness was seen as a disorder, protesting against slavery was a disorder called 'drapetomania'. They all deviated from the social norm, as soon as the social norm changed disorders changed to not disorders. It's the results of the racist eugenics movement, no one believed in normal people until Francis Galton started the eugenics movement.
Thank you for your video. My son is in ABA. I was trying to wean him off of it so I looked up high regarded speech and play therapists in our city. Both therapists dropped him suddenly and with no warning stating: your child needs more ABA and will not benefit from our programs until that has been done. My son only goes 6 hrs a week. He goes to a small clinic. The only reason I haven't switched him is because it is at a center and the RBT turnover rate is significantly low at this clinic. Currently trying to look up ways to get him to best utilize the AAC device we got him. We are not a wealthy family. I am the only person working in the household as dad stays home with kids. It is definitely a struggle but we make sure to play with him, give him enjoyable sensory experiences, and teach him about safety daily. Right now we are working on safety around water and crossing the street. My little one did not ask for the struggles he has. We do not advocate for suppression of stimmimg and we understand that breaks are a must with our boy.
Aba therapy is effective in the same way that narcissistic abuse is effective at subduing partners to the will of an abuser. Why does aba have the strategies of a domestic abuse relationship. Partnering is the same as love bombing to gain attachment and for victims to associate love and dopamine with their partners. Then the therapists take away the toys like abusers take the love away and are abusive and the victims tries everything to get it back, thinking what did I do wrong, and then the partner shows love again, and the victim thinks everything is fine now, I won’t do that again, I just need to do this and then he will love me. And the cycle continues
Hi. Aba BT here. Every session I do I start with and end with pairing as well as always follow the childs interest during session. We also DO look at function of behavior. Most behavior IS communication. I might avoid attention to some things but if a child For example, is screaming I may ask "what do you need. " or teach them to point to things. Sign language. A Pecs program may include a child handing an adult a picture of a toy or food if they are nonverbal. I have taught deep breathes, and counting to three fo clients to upset to communicate. Sometimes if they can calm down for a second they can use a sign or simple word as apposed to screaming. I teach them to say no. To say help. More. Break. All done. I offer sign language while doing so in case they can't get the words out. Nonverbal kids need help communicating because the world is abelist. This is reality. If that child grows up without ever having support in learning to communicate they will be excluded from society. I've seen it. A school, a library a sports team. They don't know how to deal with a child who is screaming and biting so they tell the parents their kid can't come back.i sometimes it upsets other kids or puts the child with autism in danger themselves. They may even hit or bite themselves or other kids. I know that is abelist but it is reality. I can't overnight change the entire ableist society we live in. I can help a kid navigate it. I might be wrong. I'm just a behavuor tech and an undergrad student. But alot of info online about aba is simply untrue or outdated.
@@celestitenight8425 Most information about ABA is true as clinics don't follow the same rules as each other, nor do clinics have the same goal. Some people are sent to abusive ABA, while some are sent to clinics with the more recent changes. Until ABA stops the abusive ABA clinics, ABA will still be accountable for abuse.
Thank you for providing this balanced view. I know it doesn't change how you feel about ABA at it's core, but it is good that you did take into account different views. I have been searching all over for some balanced perspective. It is a bit hard to find on here. I mainly wanted to get the Black or POC perspective on ABA but haven't been able to pin it down. I will look into the resources you provided.
Oh my God, not to be totally off topic but I didn't realize that you were sitting in front of a mirror at first... The little hand randomly popping out of your shoulder was really messing with my head😂
While I'm not familiar with the literature, I wonder if this is one where instead of targetting the general public with messaging targetting doctors and service providers directly might work. One of the issues with medical fields is that doctors tend to be both busy and sort of cloistered away in the medical journals, which have quite a lot of issues on their own. it doesn't help that the hierarchical set up of education leads to a sort of expert invulnerability, where teaching circulates received wisdom which then isn't challenged because the assumed expertise of the professional insulates them from challenges from outside their bubble. I suppose what I'm gesturing towards is as well as changing the public knowledge it might be useful to aim at the editorial sections of places like the BMJ and Lancet (though I'm sure people already are) since they have circulation and weight amongst the groups that actually perpetuate these systems. Sorry, probably being redundant here but I've been reading on attachment theories and they have a similar issue of proven ineffective/harmful notions continuing in the system because of a lack of suggested options and the part where you talked about clinics changing got me thinking.
Yes, ABA is abuse, as is expecting masking behaviors. Thankfully I don't recall my parents ever placing me in ABA. The goal of ABA claims to be about promoting independence, and learning how to get along in society, but those of us on the Autism spectrum, or with other additional needs all know that the real goal of ABA and similar therapies is to make us appear nearly indistinguishable from neurotypicals.
I believe I received ABA therapy both as a child and as an adult. I think I was in ABA when I was 9-10 years old at a school for kids with behavioral problems. I didn’t have an autism diagnosis at the time and it wasn’t called ABA at the time, but I’m pretty positive it was ABA under a different name, it certainly used ABA techniques (I tend to get imposter syndrome so I over-explain). However, I found that experience traumatic. Currently, I’m an autistic adult in ABA therapy, I’ve had a huge objective improvement in my quality of life and my hours are expected to be decreased soon. I suspect my goals in ABA differ from the goals in the studies, plus my age is a huge difference. I receive 6 hours of ABA weekly, separated into 3 different days and a monthly spouse training session. I’m not “pro ABA”, I see it as a necessity for myself, and my experience has been mixed with definite improvements. I actually think ABA for autism may not be needed if systematic changes happened in society, and if things were safe for autistic people of all races and ethnicities. I personally needed ABA as an adult because of the lack of support and the lack of others meeting me halfway. I was in a traumatic and complex situation, and ABA was the only way my insurance would pay for someone to go with me in the community setting to observe me. I could not afford out-of-pocket alternatives. I tried bringing my spouse and family members with me, I tried many things. I advocated hard to get both my autism diagnosis and years later, ABA therapy. I cannot afford ABA out-of-pocket. I believe I was the first adult over age 25 that my insurance covered ABA for and I had to fight really hard for it, with my therapist and psychiatrist helping. As an adult, my first BCBA was abrasive, dismissive, and intrusive. She said all of her clients want to quit and cry. I did cry and wanted to quit, but it isn’t expected for adults in ABA to cry or to want to quit. I’ve had two other BCBAs since then, and RBTs. I suppose I could have found that one ABA clinic you were referring to (hypothetically) but I’ve met a couple other adults (3 others so far), that had ABA at different clinics with a mostly positive experience. My experience is now much better, but it only works because my BCBA lets me choose everything we work on. I can veto anything that makes me uncomfortable. We added check-ins to see what my sleep was the night before and to check my anxiety level, my BCBA then adjusts how she interacts with me. For awhile, I had to take anti-anxiety medication before my sessions and I think it may have induced an anxiety disorder (hard to know with the high co-occurrence of anxiety in autistic people), but I like the improvements I have in my quality of life. I had to really self-advocate, with the help of my therapist to obtain the open communication I have with my current BCBA. I’m very active in my ABA therapy. I use the opportunity to teach my ABA therapists about autism and the reason for behaviors I have. My BCBA has encouraged my positive autistic identity. I truly believe my BCBA values my input. She has said she has utilized some tips I said help me, with kids. Thank you for your patience. I apologize that my post is really long, hopefully it wasn’t TMI. I decided to split it up into two posts, because of the length. Also, I love your videos!
Going by my BCBA, I think how ABA is taught in university is extremely flawed and deficit based. Before I explained them to her, my BCBA said she hadn’t even heard of monotropism, autistic burnout, shut-downs, or the double-empathy-problem, and was barely familiar with masking. The strengths-based approach works better for me. I get this will never happen, but I think teenagers (and probably pre-teens) need to have autonomy over their ABA therapy. I think kids should be allowed to have some type of say over their ABA therapy. I would prefer children have autonomy over their ABA therapy but that’s probably impossible. If a child is a non-speaker, there should be ways to know, by their behavior or other forms of communication, if a ABA goal is causing distress. I agree with you that ABA therapists should look for the reason for the meltdown or behavior. ABA shouldn’t use punitive punishments. I don’t think children should be denied any access to communication, just because they can’t speak out loud. Additionally, I think there is concern from occupational therapists that kids are dissociating during ABA therapy because they’re being told to ignore certain signals in their body. I think that concern and many others need to be addressed. I think most ABA therapists aren’t properly trained, educated, or screened. I think the hours of ABA kids receive are excessive. I believe ABA works best, in my own experience, with other interventions like speech language therapy, which I’m currently in. There are OTs and SPLs that are trained to implement ABA techniques, as well. I think there needs to be studies on autistic adults who received ABA therapy as adults, to see what techniques were used and what the goals and outcome were. I get it would likely be a small sample size. I suspect that if we find out what actually works, it might actually be a different type of therapy, there can be cognitive behavioral therapy overlaps. It’s possible the CBT-like aspects could be learned by non-ABA professionals that are covered by health insurance. Depending on study results, I also think insurance should cover executive function coaches. I can’t afford one, but my ABA therapy does target my executive function. I also think ABA doesn’t work for everyone. I think my personality is partly why it works for me (I self-advocate a lot) but even then, it hasn’t been easy. I strongly feel that ABA works best in the setting of someone who gives consent but I agree with you that for some people, it’s literally survival to mask. Lastly, while there are autistic BCBAs and RBTs, I believe my personal experience would have been better if my ABA therapy was implemented by an autistic ABA therapist, since studies suggest that autistic people tend to communicate better with each other and that’s been my personal experience.
I totally agree with all of this! I think it definitely does have benefits, and I think it definitely is the only option for some people. And there's simply not enough nuanced research because of how biased the science is... so there's a lot that is simply unknown and yet people talk about it like it is
@@disabled.autistic.lesbian I completely agree with you! I just wanted to add that I brought up this topic with my BCBA today. I haven’t fact checked it yet, but my BCBA says the curriculum for ABA already says to check for underlying causes of behavior and to discontinue a task that is causing distress. According to my BCBA, the ABA curriculum encourages independence and all ABA clients should get some kind of say in their ABA therapy. She also said the reason why kids get 40+ hours of ABA a week is to allow for lunch, snacks, group play, naps, etc. I feel like it’s hard to know what is accurate.
@@shineluckypenny I feel like these things are so highly individualized that it's impossible to get a really solid picture of what ABA looks like across the board, so that being in the curriculum now doesn't mean a whole lot for those who were trained a while ago. Similar, though differently shaped, problems exist with therapy as a whole. Plus, when many BCBAs don't even know about things like masking like you mentioned, they may not even be able to tell which tasks are actually causing distress. I can only only speak for my experiences, but when I've been asked to do a task that's distressing to me, it is often not visible just how distressing it feels to me, and often only other neurodivergent people have been able to pick up on it unless I manage to take the steps to be able to vocalize it. (note: as far as I'm aware I have ADHD and not autism. Figured I should note that)
@@samkadel8185 I agree and you make some really good points. Although, hopefully BCBAs are required to get re-certified regularly. I don’t like giving an incomplete picture so I was passing on what my BCBA said, but it wasn’t meant to negate what I had already said. I felt it was important to clarify, since my initial comment suggested that autonomy isn’t in the current curriculum. To clarify, my comment was just saying what my BCBA said, it isn’t me agreeing with them. I still agree with my initial comments.
My daughter was offered a small version of ABA and tried it and also responded to it but last week I decided to stop it and search for other options. I think saying no to aba i not saying that you don't need help, its just saying you want help another way. What do you all think?
I'm going to use some blunt and harsh terms here. So I can see how people who want to use Abba to help children that they see having deficits and functioning in a harsh world is an alternative to literally beating them the way some parents think is like a way to keep throwing from getting lynched or otherwise murdered for being you know seen as a minority who does not have the latitude to behave in ways that other kids might get away with. I'm not saying it's ideal. So I went between substance abuse issues and abusive relationships after dropping out of high school. I finally got diagnosed with you know how the DSM turned it Asperger's at age 32, in 2019. I think I might actually have some cognitive deficits and definitely suffer from insomnia partly from medications I've agreed to take over the years and then polysubstance abuse that occurred alongside those it was a nightmare. Play behavioral analysis like teaching someone behavioral parameters might really be seen as necessary for their well-being given what is a society they're expected to live in is going to be like.
After watching a parent emotionally eat and being an obese kid especially starting in 3rd grade, adulterers developed a restrictive eating disorder as a special interest, around age 14. That seems to fit in with this subject somewhere
According to psychology, it is no better, and no matter what changes they make it will remain a problem because the very core principles of this theory are the problems. Make them trauma informed, the problems are still there at the core of the theory. Even the basis of rewards only is deeply problematic, ABA is actively counter-productive in the long run proven by other scientists. This is further supported by the results we see in adulthood, the autistic children who remain living with their parents all went through ABA, the independent ones like myself have parents who took us out of ABA and found their own realistic way which did not involve manipulative techniques. Neuroscientist Elizabeth B. Torres, director of the New Jersey Autism Centre of Excellence wrote: "Autism is at an inflection point today. We are poised for a paradigm shift in autism research, education, and therapies; this book inniates that shift, and does so superbly. In The Autism Industrial Complex: How Branding, Marketing, and Capital Investment Turned Autism into Big Business, we learn about the history and evolution of this multi-billion dollar/year operation. Thanks to this history, we will remember Lovaas, ABA, and behaviourism in general not as a science, but as a branding, rhetoric, and marketing plot that transiently misguided many well-intended parents and professionals, and that in so doing profited with greed, by preying on our human hopes, our trust in science, and our fears." Close quote. ABA is now a financial model in dealership with private equities and other stakeholders, and attend the autism investor summit every April.
![Can We Stop Calling People Narcissists? (And Other Ableist Terms You Didn’t Know About) [CC]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/_Pb9G4WfCCA/mqdefault.jpg)
![Can We Stop Calling People Narcissists? (And Other Ableist Terms You Didn’t Know About) [CC]](/img/tr.png)
![Do Autistic People Feel Empathy? [CC]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/PQK8yMsOM-Q/mqdefault.jpg)
![Autistic Speech Patterns [CC]](/img/n.gif)
As science has progressed ABA has remained in the early 20th century it's being proven so many human behaviours are biological responses to what's happening on the inside, how a person is responding to their thoughts and not the environment.
The longer ABA continues refusing to come up to date with the rest of science, they're just going to continue living as their own culture. As long as they remain regardless of everything happening beneath the surface they will remain unethical, harmful and out of date.
Each time ABA overstimulates a person tension develops in the muscles. Sustaining tension in muscles causes chronic pain, then when they teach them to keep overstimulating themselves they take the risk of developing chronic pain disorders.
Not good!
Fight or flight produces adrenaline, producing too much adrenaline and cortisol causes hormonal imbalances. With hormones and neurons interacting with the body organs hormonal imbalances damage the body organs. Anxiety in general increases the heart rate and effects blood pressure levels.
Once again, not good!
The nervous system is directly connected to the brain through the spinal cord, scientists who are actually up to date claim there's approximately 200,000,000 neurons in the nervous system that they're describing it as a second brain and is the size of a cat or dog's brain. As ABA practices damage the immune system the children become more susceptible to sicknesses and diseases, especially associated with age.
Again, not good!
Due to variation in the hippocampus autistic people are more vulnerable to depression. When people are in depression there is a reduction to metabolism resulting in food being turned into fat instead of energy which is why depressed people snack more (because the food did not turn into energy) and increases fat storage. The body will feed off of sugary cells before calories which while increasing fat storage pushes children in the direction of developing type 2 diabetes later in life, especially when they use sugary foods as positive reinforcement.
Not good once again!
I and any other up to date scientists can provide countless damages that are happening beneath the children's skin, as long as ABA continues being regardless of the harm it's doing beneath the surface I will not support it. Doing all of this to children as young as 2 years old, how much of an impact do you think this has on human development?
ABA has not done a single longitudinal study of its methods and is entirely ignorant of the results we see later in life. Universities have investigated the results and suspicions of today's ABA, they tested lots of autistic people, results showed that those who were subjected to ABA are still 86% more likely to meet the criteria of PTSD and nearly 50% of the people they tested are actually diagnosed with PTSD.
Those tested who were not subjected to ABA were found PTSD symptom free.
That doesn't look good to me!
Where they claim they're evidence based, they're actually not. Each one of their cases is individualized, individualising every case using diverse techniques is both against the rules of science and subjective making ABA lose scientific credibility.
Behaviourism which is actually out of date and proven scientifically false, like it's claims;
• All behaviours are learned by experiences (I never learned how to have a meltdown)
• Genes have no influences on our behaviour (Autism is primarily genetic, behaviours to do with autism are biological)
I believe more funding should go towards neuroscience to understand autistic behaviours biologically, by doing so they may come to find biological solutions.
yes yes yes! I cannot agree more to all of this
Very informative comment, thank you
A slight tangent off of the mention of behaviorism, religious and political writer Noam Chomsky, rotary review of BF Skinner back in like the 1950s. Some parts of a human behavior are coded in like the ability to utilize language if not a specific one. So that makes sense in that, some things are encoded, some things are learned culturally, and of course there's interpllay between those
I personally believe things like diet and other aspects of modern culture do turn what genetically is just a normal way to be human into the disabilities people experience that can garner them in autism diagnosis.
Hi@@gorgebateyes7014
Most 'disorders' were not seen as 'disorders' until the 19th century.
The only common denominator among 'disorders' is 'social deviation'.
Anyone who deviates from the social norm psychiatry automatically classifies as a 'disorder', like until 1974 homosexuality was seen as a disorder, left-handedness was seen as a disorder, protesting against slavery was a disorder called 'drapetomania'. They all deviated from the social norm, as soon as the social norm changed disorders changed to not disorders.
It's the results of the racist eugenics movement, no one believed in normal people until Francis Galton started the eugenics movement.
Thank you for your video. My son is in ABA. I was trying to wean him off of it so I looked up high regarded speech and play therapists in our city. Both therapists dropped him suddenly and with no warning stating: your child needs more ABA and will not benefit from our programs until that has been done. My son only goes 6 hrs a week. He goes to a small clinic. The only reason I haven't switched him is because it is at a center and the RBT turnover rate is significantly low at this clinic. Currently trying to look up ways to get him to best utilize the AAC device we got him. We are not a wealthy family. I am the only person working in the household as dad stays home with kids. It is definitely a struggle but we make sure to play with him, give him enjoyable sensory experiences, and teach him about safety daily. Right now we are working on safety around water and crossing the street. My little one did not ask for the struggles he has. We do not advocate for suppression of stimmimg and we understand that breaks are a must with our boy.
Aba therapy is effective in the same way that narcissistic abuse is effective at subduing partners to the will of an abuser. Why does aba have the strategies of a domestic abuse relationship. Partnering is the same as love bombing to gain attachment and for victims to associate love and dopamine with their partners. Then the therapists take away the toys like abusers take the love away and are abusive and the victims tries everything to get it back, thinking what did I do wrong, and then the partner shows love again, and the victim thinks everything is fine now, I won’t do that again, I just need to do this and then he will love me. And the cycle continues
Hi. Aba BT here. Every session I do I start with and end with pairing as well as always follow the childs interest during session. We also DO look at function of behavior. Most behavior IS communication. I might avoid attention to some things but if a child For example, is screaming I may ask "what do you need. " or teach them to point to things. Sign language. A Pecs program may include a child handing an adult a picture of a toy or food if they are nonverbal. I have taught deep breathes, and counting to three fo clients to upset to communicate. Sometimes if they can calm down for a second they can use a sign or simple word as apposed to screaming. I teach them to say no. To say help. More. Break. All done. I offer sign language while doing so in case they can't get the words out. Nonverbal kids need help communicating because the world is abelist. This is reality. If that child grows up without ever having support in learning to communicate they will be excluded from society. I've seen it. A school, a library a sports team. They don't know how to deal with a child who is screaming and biting so they tell the parents their kid can't come back.i sometimes it upsets other kids or puts the child with autism in danger themselves. They may even hit or bite themselves or other kids. I know that is abelist but it is reality. I can't overnight change the entire ableist society we live in. I can help a kid navigate it. I might be wrong. I'm just a behavuor tech and an undergrad student. But alot of info online about aba is simply untrue or outdated.
@@celestitenight8425
Most information about ABA is true as clinics don't follow the same rules as each other, nor do clinics have the same goal.
Some people are sent to abusive ABA, while some are sent to clinics with the more recent changes. Until ABA stops the abusive ABA clinics, ABA will still be accountable for abuse.
Thank you for providing this balanced view. I know it doesn't change how you feel about ABA at it's core, but it is good that you did take into account different views. I have been searching all over for some balanced perspective. It is a bit hard to find on here. I mainly wanted to get the Black or POC perspective on ABA but haven't been able to pin it down. I will look into the resources you provided.
Oh my God, not to be totally off topic but I didn't realize that you were sitting in front of a mirror at first... The little hand randomly popping out of your shoulder was really messing with my head😂
While I'm not familiar with the literature, I wonder if this is one where instead of targetting the general public with messaging targetting doctors and service providers directly might work.
One of the issues with medical fields is that doctors tend to be both busy and sort of cloistered away in the medical journals, which have quite a lot of issues on their own. it doesn't help that the hierarchical set up of education leads to a sort of expert invulnerability, where teaching circulates received wisdom which then isn't challenged because the assumed expertise of the professional insulates them from challenges from outside their bubble.
I suppose what I'm gesturing towards is as well as changing the public knowledge it might be useful to aim at the editorial sections of places like the BMJ and Lancet (though I'm sure people already are) since they have circulation and weight amongst the groups that actually perpetuate these systems.
Sorry, probably being redundant here but I've been reading on attachment theories and they have a similar issue of proven ineffective/harmful notions continuing in the system because of a lack of suggested options and the part where you talked about clinics changing got me thinking.
4:38 - literally sounds like what I was taught grooming was in primary school
Yes, ABA is abuse, as is expecting masking behaviors. Thankfully I don't recall my parents ever placing me in ABA. The goal of ABA claims to be about promoting independence, and learning how to get along in society, but those of us on the Autism spectrum, or with other additional needs all know that the real goal of ABA and similar therapies is to make us appear nearly indistinguishable from neurotypicals.
I believe I received ABA therapy both as a child and as an adult. I think I was in ABA when I was 9-10 years old at a school for kids with behavioral problems. I didn’t have an autism diagnosis at the time and it wasn’t called ABA at the time, but I’m pretty positive it was ABA under a different name, it certainly used ABA techniques (I tend to get imposter syndrome so I over-explain). However, I found that experience traumatic. Currently, I’m an autistic adult in ABA therapy, I’ve had a huge objective improvement in my quality of life and my hours are expected to be decreased soon. I suspect my goals in ABA differ from the goals in the studies, plus my age is a huge difference. I receive 6 hours of ABA weekly, separated into 3 different days and a monthly spouse training session. I’m not “pro ABA”, I see it as a necessity for myself, and my experience has been mixed with definite improvements. I actually think ABA for autism may not be needed if systematic changes happened in society, and if things were safe for autistic people of all races and ethnicities. I personally needed ABA as an adult because of the lack of support and the lack of others meeting me halfway. I was in a traumatic and complex situation, and ABA was the only way my insurance would pay for someone to go with me in the community setting to observe me. I could not afford out-of-pocket alternatives. I tried bringing my spouse and family members with me, I tried many things. I advocated hard to get both my autism diagnosis and years later, ABA therapy. I cannot afford ABA out-of-pocket. I believe I was the first adult over age 25 that my insurance covered ABA for and I had to fight really hard for it, with my therapist and psychiatrist helping. As an adult, my first BCBA was abrasive, dismissive, and intrusive. She said all of her clients want to quit and cry. I did cry and wanted to quit, but it isn’t expected for adults in ABA to cry or to want to quit. I’ve had two other BCBAs since then, and RBTs. I suppose I could have found that one ABA clinic you were referring to (hypothetically) but I’ve met a couple other adults (3 others so far), that had ABA at different clinics with a mostly positive experience. My experience is now much better, but it only works because my BCBA lets me choose everything we work on. I can veto anything that makes me uncomfortable. We added check-ins to see what my sleep was the night before and to check my anxiety level, my BCBA then adjusts how she interacts with me. For awhile, I had to take anti-anxiety medication before my sessions and I think it may have induced an anxiety disorder (hard to know with the high co-occurrence of anxiety in autistic people), but I like the improvements I have in my quality of life. I had to really self-advocate, with the help of my therapist to obtain the open communication I have with my current BCBA. I’m very active in my ABA therapy. I use the opportunity to teach my ABA therapists about autism and the reason for behaviors I have. My BCBA has encouraged my positive autistic identity. I truly believe my BCBA values my input. She has said she has utilized some tips I said help me, with kids.
Thank you for your patience. I apologize that my post is really long, hopefully it wasn’t TMI. I decided to split it up into two posts, because of the length. Also, I love your videos!
Going by my BCBA, I think how ABA is taught in university is extremely flawed and deficit based. Before I explained them to her, my BCBA said she hadn’t even heard of monotropism, autistic burnout, shut-downs, or the double-empathy-problem, and was barely familiar with masking. The strengths-based approach works better for me.
I get this will never happen, but I think teenagers (and probably pre-teens) need to have autonomy over their ABA therapy. I think kids should be allowed to have some type of say over their ABA therapy. I would prefer children have autonomy over their ABA therapy but that’s probably impossible. If a child is a non-speaker, there should be ways to know, by their behavior or other forms of communication, if a ABA goal is causing distress. I agree with you that ABA therapists should look for the reason for the meltdown or behavior. ABA shouldn’t use punitive punishments.
I don’t think children should be denied any access to communication, just because they can’t speak out loud. Additionally, I think there is concern from occupational therapists that kids are dissociating during ABA therapy because they’re being told to ignore certain signals in their body. I think that concern and many others need to be addressed. I think most ABA therapists aren’t properly trained, educated, or screened. I think the hours of ABA kids receive are excessive. I believe ABA works best, in my own experience, with other interventions like speech language therapy, which I’m currently in. There are OTs and SPLs that are trained to implement ABA techniques, as well.
I think there needs to be studies on autistic adults who received ABA therapy as adults, to see what techniques were used and what the goals and outcome were. I get it would likely be a small sample size. I suspect that if we find out what actually works, it might actually be a different type of therapy, there can be cognitive behavioral therapy overlaps. It’s possible the CBT-like aspects could be learned by non-ABA professionals that are covered by health insurance. Depending on study results, I also think insurance should cover executive function coaches. I can’t afford one, but my ABA therapy does target my executive function. I also think ABA doesn’t work for everyone. I think my personality is partly why it works for me (I self-advocate a lot) but even then, it hasn’t been easy.
I strongly feel that ABA works best in the setting of someone who gives consent but I agree with you that for some people, it’s literally survival to mask.
Lastly, while there are autistic BCBAs and RBTs, I believe my personal experience would have been better if my ABA therapy was implemented by an autistic ABA therapist, since studies suggest that autistic people tend to communicate better with each other and that’s been my personal experience.
I totally agree with all of this! I think it definitely does have benefits, and I think it definitely is the only option for some people. And there's simply not enough nuanced research because of how biased the science is... so there's a lot that is simply unknown and yet people talk about it like it is
@@disabled.autistic.lesbian I completely agree with you! I just wanted to add that I brought up this topic with my BCBA today. I haven’t fact checked it yet, but my BCBA says the curriculum for ABA already says to check for underlying causes of behavior and to discontinue a task that is causing distress. According to my BCBA, the ABA curriculum encourages independence and all ABA clients should get some kind of say in their ABA therapy. She also said the reason why kids get 40+ hours of ABA a week is to allow for lunch, snacks, group play, naps, etc. I feel like it’s hard to know what is accurate.
@@shineluckypenny I feel like these things are so highly individualized that it's impossible to get a really solid picture of what ABA looks like across the board, so that being in the curriculum now doesn't mean a whole lot for those who were trained a while ago. Similar, though differently shaped, problems exist with therapy as a whole. Plus, when many BCBAs don't even know about things like masking like you mentioned, they may not even be able to tell which tasks are actually causing distress. I can only only speak for my experiences, but when I've been asked to do a task that's distressing to me, it is often not visible just how distressing it feels to me, and often only other neurodivergent people have been able to pick up on it unless I manage to take the steps to be able to vocalize it. (note: as far as I'm aware I have ADHD and not autism. Figured I should note that)
@@samkadel8185 I agree and you make some really good points. Although, hopefully BCBAs are required to get re-certified regularly. I don’t like giving an incomplete picture so I was passing on what my BCBA said, but it wasn’t meant to negate what I had already said. I felt it was important to clarify, since my initial comment suggested that autonomy isn’t in the current curriculum. To clarify, my comment was just saying what my BCBA said, it isn’t me agreeing with them. I still agree with my initial comments.
Yep. Very well said 👍🏻
My daughter was offered a small version of ABA and tried it and also responded to it but last week I decided to stop it and search for other options. I think saying no to aba i not saying that you don't need help, its just saying you want help another way. What do you all think?
What s the state of the art regarding autism? Is there general agrement in ABA about it? What ìs aba offering to clients?
I really like this video. It felt like a nuanced and well rounded look at the topic.
I'm going to use some blunt and harsh terms here. So I can see how people who want to use Abba to help children that they see having deficits and functioning in a harsh world is an alternative to literally beating them the way some parents think is like a way to keep throwing from getting lynched or otherwise murdered for being you know seen as a minority who does not have the latitude to behave in ways that other kids might get away with. I'm not saying it's ideal. So I went between substance abuse issues and abusive relationships after dropping out of high school. I finally got diagnosed with you know how the DSM turned it Asperger's at age 32, in 2019. I think I might actually have some cognitive deficits and definitely suffer from insomnia partly from medications I've agreed to take over the years and then polysubstance abuse that occurred alongside those it was a nightmare. Play behavioral analysis like teaching someone behavioral parameters might really be seen as necessary for their well-being given what is a society they're expected to live in is going to be like.
After watching a parent emotionally eat and being an obese kid especially starting in 3rd grade, adulterers developed a restrictive eating disorder as a special interest, around age 14. That seems to fit in with this subject somewhere
It should called applied behavioral abuse.
Yep 😂
As a ABA victim that should be what it’s called
Exactly
Very informative, thank you!
I want to be a dog
I’m glad I don’t live in America
👍
ABA has changed alot for the better
According to psychology, it is no better, and no matter what changes they make it will remain a problem because the very core principles of this theory are the problems. Make them trauma informed, the problems are still there at the core of the theory.
Even the basis of rewards only is deeply problematic, ABA is actively counter-productive in the long run proven by other scientists. This is further supported by the results we see in adulthood, the autistic children who remain living with their parents all went through ABA, the independent ones like myself have parents who took us out of ABA and found their own realistic way which did not involve manipulative techniques.
Neuroscientist Elizabeth B. Torres, director of the New Jersey Autism Centre of Excellence wrote:
"Autism is at an inflection point today. We are poised for a paradigm shift in autism research, education, and therapies; this book inniates that shift, and does so superbly. In The Autism Industrial Complex: How Branding, Marketing, and Capital Investment Turned Autism into Big Business, we learn about the history and evolution of this multi-billion dollar/year operation. Thanks to this history, we will remember Lovaas, ABA, and behaviourism in general not as a science, but as a branding, rhetoric, and marketing plot that transiently misguided many well-intended parents and professionals, and that in so doing profited with greed, by preying on our human hopes, our trust in science, and our fears."
Close quote.
ABA is now a financial model in dealership with private equities and other stakeholders, and attend the autism investor summit every April.
No it has not.
Does it still teach eye contact or make them produce if so it’s ableist.
@@shanesorensen7878 yes.