Eating Artwork (The Jimquisition)
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- Опубліковано 16 кві 2023
- / jimquisition
/ jimsterling
www.thejimporium.com
American McGee tried to make a new Alice game, Alice: Asylum. However, despite having his name on the box, Electronic Arts owns the series, and they won't let him make it. Let's talk about licenses, intellectual property, and what I like to call "IP hoarding."
#Alice #americanmcgeesalice #ElectronicArts #MetalArms #Activision #IntellectualProperty #IPHoarding #JimSterling #Jimquisition #JamesStephanieSterling #Games #Gaming #Videogames - Ігри
I love how Intellectual Property is usually never the property of the intellect that created it.
'Greedy bastard that begged, borrowed, stole or bought it' not as catchy I guess 😛
Welcome to capitalism where the rules are made up and the publishers get all the points.
Reminds me of what (IIRC) happened with insulin. Person who made it wanted it to be cheap and easy to get, and then in the US, corpos somehow got ahold of production/distribution control over it and did major markup, so it's nightmarishly expensive here, even though it's cheap to make.
Here's what I would do... Let corporations have much longer control over their intellectual property, BUT ONLY IF THEY ARE USING IT! Go a decade without creating something new with the IP, then it become public domain.
This would also solve problems when multiple companies may or may not own an IP individually or collectively. If they can't get it worked out in a decade, then none of them own it.
@@BrotherAlpha i do not think your proposal would change anything.
the contract between Alan Moore and DC comics stated something similar.
If the Watchmen Comics ever went out of print, the rights would go back to Alan Moore.
What happened? DC never stopped printing The Watchmen.
With your proposal companies would just put out a cheap mobile game every few Years, to not let the license expire.
I should say: that pitch that he released was way more than you let on; it contained a detailed description of its story with scenes, dialogue etc. written out, detailed information of the combat systems and lots and lots of finished concept artwork. The Patreons did get something, a detailed visual and narrative overview of what the game would have been like. It’s honestly pretty incredible. It’s now available for free. EA just casually said no to a proposition that had tons of pre-production work already put in it.
The patrons also got physical art prints and merch above a certain threshold, so there's that
that's cool
Didn't _Alice In Otherworlds_ get released as a video project, too?
@@sluttyMapleSyrup yep, three or four animation shorts. I think they're in American McGee's channel
EA: We don't think it will sell!
Also EA: You can't make it because you'll make money and we won't.
I find the "they want all of the money" tagline useful with attitudes like this:
* We don't think it will make all of the money.
* If it made money, we would want all of that money.
Get over it
@@LunaticGin You get over it.
@@LunaticGin no, fuck that. killing dragons is heroic.
This whole situation with Alice is just heartbreaking and no wonder it made American McGee give up on the game development altogether.
Make a deal with the devil and pay the price. Boohoo. What has he done lately? Nothing good? Go cry about your childhood somewhere else.
This whole thing reminds me of Very Important House. At least Alice got one game made before it got locked in the vault, VIH spent 4 years in production hell on a pilot that Disney bought, then canned, vaulted, and offered to sell it back to its creator for something like 20x what they'd just paid for it.
@@MediaMunkee Ok, I just read about the situation you mention and holy smokes, that's just awful. Disney company practices are just disgusting
I’m reminded of Poe’s recording career
Altogether is like alright: it's alwrong.
reading what happened with alice: asylum is nothing short of gutting. American wasn't making just a notebook or a couple of sketches, the asylum pitch is a 3 year long effort 400 page behemoth of concept art, fully fleshed out level design and mechanics with all character, environment art and story beats in place. literally everything was ready to go and all they needed was the green light from EA. I was a casual spectator watching this thing get made and it is absolutely mindblowing how much passion and detail was put into this by only a handful of people. The full pitch bible is readily available to the public and it's astonishing.
most of all i'm just pissed because I've wanted a third alice for ages and this one looked real good and EA continue to refuse to do anything other than the safest possible option even when the whole damn game is basically made for them
These are the stories that depress me the most. When the creator of an IP gets locked out of their own creation and can't do anything about it.
you mean like J.K Rowling?
@@morgannyan2738 good try troll
@@morgannyan2738 I know I'm feeding the troll but your "example" is ludicrously fallacious. JKR still has full and absolute control over the Wizarding World. She hasn't been locked out of anything. That's why people don't want to engage with it, because she's an asshole transphobe.
@@NakuNaito guess ip ownership only goes one way huh
@@morgannyan2738 J.K. Rowling still has full control of her IP. She licensed it to WB, but she is still the owner of the IP and can still have a say in it. If WB doesn't want to do anything with HP, she can license it to someone else who can.
He did "keychains and shit", the patrons received monthly art prints and merch for their pledges. And the pitch book doubles as an artbook of sorts, so there's some actual merit to it.
Also, he has said before that the adding his name to the first game's title was EAs idea and he wasn't very confortable with it, although that doesn't explain why he used it for American McGee's Grimm when that was his own company. I guees at that point, it was a matter of brand recognition. Madness Returns doesn't have his name in the title, for what it's worth.
14:46 Like how Disney was surprised that The Owl House was popular while releasing the downsized _third season_ (which was a three-part special that together could have been a feature-length movie at roughly two and half hours long) that the show's lawyers had to fight for to even exist on UA-cam. There's really no excuse for that level of incompetence.
American McGee is a legend for going the length and effort and years of work with trying to get the Alice game made
It really hurts to see such a game screaming to be made just flushed down the drain with any hope of ever being made.
Yeah but let's be honest, the second game was super flawed. And they're also way old. The idea is still pretty cool, but I basically want a "good" company to pick up the idea and idea only. The first game was damn cool but of course nowadays outdated. The second was disappointing but with some interesting individual ideas and moments in there.
Still don't make me forgive him for making the doom 2 levels. At least he isn't Sandy Petersen where he shoehorn's a fucking gimmick in a level that at best, is sparsely used (looking at you Citadel with your secret door when taking the left door)
@@Carighan It was super flawed because of EA, not American McGee. The stories and music of both games are still excellent.
@@Carighan It had some flaws but I still thoroughly enjoyed and replay it from time to time
@@Carighan Do you have any critiques besides "they're old"? Because there are a lot of series that are old that are still getting modern games, and we don't hold their age against the newer releases, yeah?
American McGee isn't a stage name, his shitty parents actually named him American, starting a long line of trauma that caused American to make Alice in the first place.
reading about American McGees childhood feels like looking up the plot of some deranged kult musical.
Thing is, Copyright Law was originally meant to expire after 20 years so that artists would be incentivized to keep creating artwork if they wanted more royalties but, coincidence of coincidences, every time Mickey Mouse reaches the age where it would become public domain, US law extends for how long copyright holds.
Funny how that keeps happening, innit?
To be fair I think it was 40 or 50 years before 1976, when the copyright fuckery began but you're right. In 1791 copyright was only 14 years with an optional 14 year extention and derivative works were only direct adaptations of the work, if that. In America at least.
I thought mickey mouse had entered the PD already?
from what i'm hearing he is set to enter the PD in 2024.
@@darkbright2100 Only a specific portrayal of Mickey Mouse, the steamboat version.
Companies should need to ashcan an I. P. to keep it at very least...
"Use or lose, use or lose."
If they can't profit off Alice, then they should have to either give it up or take the losses needed to keep it.
And if they *can* profit off it, you'd think they would...
If a Company can't even be bothered to ashcan, then how can they claim any right to the I. P.?
Ashcan or freaking liquidate.
Ah, but that wouldn't benefit them so why would they make it the law? De facto corporate control of government means that's the biggest concern.
That could be cool but also... I can see a lot of phone games that are complete money grabs and only made to make *some* money and keep the IP so they can sell it off
Edit: Also how would this work for "live service" games, and as much as I don't like most of them, that could kill some alright multiplayer games.
@@corbiecrow9738 At least then they'd be made to do *something at all* with the I. P.s. And, then we could tackle moneygrab phone games as a sub-issue of sorts.
Then you get ash can projects.
@@keiyakins We could always threaten corporations in ways that DON'T play by their rigged rules. They could be terrified into doing the right thing for once, and not just what the "law" permits them to do.
I will say American McGee hated that the put his name on games since more people than him worked on the games
Just like Tom Clancy
I want to see a parody game, "Tom Clancy's American McGee's [TITLE] by Clive Barker" with no influence from any of them and not resembling any of their games.
@@HonestMagpie So basically a game, that was supposed to be made by Clive Barker and is owned by American McGee, who is owned by Tom Clancy?
and don't ask him about Doom!
As far as I know it was actually EA who insisted to include his name in the title. So that it can be copyrighted. And so American ended up not being able to own something because it has his name on it.
To add a bit of irony: it was EA who insisted that the first game's title should include American McGee's name so it can be more easily copyrighted. So American basically can't have it because it has his name on it.
Which Again. It like dude that is his name.
.....THE FUCK??
American McGee's Alice is one of my favourite games of all time, and it's terrible that EA is being a dog in the manger about the IP. It's absolutely vile of EA and it doesn't even benefit them to keep it if they have no plans to use the IP themselves. It's just a, "if I can't use it, no one can" mentality. I got to read through McGee's pitch design bible of Alice 3 (it's available as a pdf for anyone who wants to read it), and it looked so promising. It was really disappointing to hear that it's no longer a plan that's happening.
We need someone to infiltrate EA and steal the fucking rights and gove it to him. Then tell EA, "Get bent. You ain't doing shit with it. So what's the point.".
Maybe that might even unlock us a 10/10 game and ea will come begging for the rights to publish it, but all the IP stays with McGee.
To this day, I can't get over how gorgeous the hair physics in Madness Returns were. How everyone didn't try to copy that and 12 ears later we are *still* getting AAA games with playmobil wigs will forever elude me.
EA had suggested they were interested in the project early on; he was crowdfunding pre-production as proof that it could be done and he could work with flexible funding models, if not outright crowdfunding the whole game, further trying to incentivise EA by essentially making a game for them with EA basically having to spend nothing on the project; design bibles are pretty common as documents and it’s nice to have a window into what could have been, plus backers also got prints and collectables and all the standard Patreon stuff; printing the design bible is probably going to run up against legal issues but the PDF is free and beautiful; there was also music and other things produced too, and between livestreams and community interaction, in a lot of ways it was like funding any other UA-camr or creator. It was stupid: it was a last ditch Hail Mary to make something he loved, for a dedicated fanbase, with potential broader appeal, a strong proof of concept, and a strategy EA had very little to lose from. There’s a few other things but the way you’ve presented a lot about this situation is, if not disingenuous or incorrect, borderline cruel: and it saddens me - having been watching your content in one form or another since 2013 or so - but with how mean spirited, uh empathetic, and broadly kind of poorly researched as this was, this was the video that finally convinced me to move on.
Well said, agreed on everything.
EA: "The license is too valuable to hand out, but not valuable enough to do anything with."
The budget for Alice: Madness Returns was around $9 million and that game suffered from EA not giving Spicy Horse enough time to polish it and, possibly, address the pacing issues with the narrative. There was also a lot of executive interference with Madness Returns, including with the name and box art, which Spicy Horse was frustrated by.
American was asking for a budget of $50 million to develop Asylum along with a potential collaboration with Virtuos to develop the game (which was in the early discussion stage). I honestly believe that EA execs weren't willing to foot that bill, at least at the amount asked, without the same kind of strong-arming they were able to do with Madness Returns. Not to mention that EA probably don't want to admit that their interference may have contributed to Madness Returns not reaching sales expectations.
nope EA were never gonna pay a thing, they actually had all the money ready from people in china i think maybe netease or tencent like the thing was ready to go all EA needed to do was say yes and they got free money either way,
this is them saying no out of pure Spite and malice all i can say is screw EA, no one should ever work with them period
It still amazes me that such... 'quirky' personalities like American McGee, John Romero, and John Carmack, managed to stay together long enough to produce Doom and Quake without their opposing personalities self-detonating. I mean they *still* self-detonated and all went their own ways, but they stuck together long enough to basically set the standard for FPS games for decades to come and that's pretty amazing.
Although a super hard journey, it’s still good for them to mend their differences.
Carmack and Romero, I will say, probably needed each other. Carmack is a phenomenal programmer and a legend but by himself he usually produces very impressive and intricate tech demos. Romero by himself... Well, Daikatana.
The funniest part of this is....... McGee was one of the map editors for Doom 2 and Thy Flesh Consumed....... he's a Doom Patron Saint along with Romero and Carmack..... so..... it's strangely comforting and warming that the original team of the originator of the FPS have weathered the storms of time and are still doing very rock solid stuff and are also really chill down to earth guys
I was not ready for that spooky intro change Steph. It's not even Halloween
I know. Those ears are terrifying.
It's always Halloween. What are you talking about?
knowing EA, a physical Alice book would have had McGee sued for copyright
I remember that I lost the little lore book that came with the first Alice game & the only way I could replace it was to spend $30 for the only one on eBay. I actually bought it & still have it.
Darn, I thought Lewis Carroll's books were in public domain by now
@@LikaLaruku lucky
@@BagOfMagicFood Lewis Carroll's books are public domain, but the specific interpretation of it that EA and American McGee made is copyrighted. Just like how Winnie the Pooh is in public domain, but Disney's interpretation is still copyrighted.
@@alienguardian What's more, EA had American sign a contract that forbids him from ever doing anything related to Alice in Wonderland on his own
Wow EA went full on Konami with this. Can't wait for the 'Alice Pachinko' machines to crop up
Reeled in by your thumbnail's inclusion of American McGee's Alice *Gratified to see it's an accurate representation of this video's subject matter!
Ahhh, I appreciate an update on American McGee state of Alice. I still hold a great love for this series. Real damn shame, the whole IP clustertruck :C
In a perfect world, publishers are patrons who trust in a developer's artistic integrity and allowed a video game to succeed or fail on their own merits, market research and focus groups be damned.
Throughout this video, I was constantly in awe of how the bunny ears never popped off the hat, despite the movements. That's some quality product!
American Mcgee makes some really cute crowd designed mental health themed plushies!
Yeah! Their store also sells bunnies themed off of the Zodiac and mental illnesses.
Yeah! I forgot he did that too. Been wanting to get one
FR~ I'm totally getting that Autism plushie when I can afford it~
I will never understand IP hoarding, these corpos don't think a new entry will make them enough money, yet they refuse to let someone else make the thing and then they're the ones who fail. My interpretation of this is that their mindset is "if we can't make money off of it, you can't have it."
the fact that publishers, hollywood studios, and the like can just refuse to keep going with an IP and that's it, even though the creator is still willing to go with it is absurd. if the studio won't keep going then the IP should automatically revert to the creator so they can shop around for another publisher/studio/etc who might take the project (or go full independent if they can manage it). but hey, if the copyright system existed to protect artists, we'd know by now
I very very much hate the current implementation copyright and IP law in that it can be hoarded for what might as well be forever
it sucks that a company can say "no more of this art will be made"
Suits being necessary for any big bit of art to be made is depressing because they seem to hate it the most
Also, I still think it's funny that American McGee is the person who was responsible for both the Alice games and also the gender dysphoria rabbit plush
The same thing happened with Eternal Darkness: Sanity's Requiem
Nintendo patented the rights to the sanity system, and refuse to let people use it, so the amazing system they came up with in that game can't be used
It sucks bc ET:SR was a great game and the "sanity effects" gameplay has so much potential to grow
Nintendo and patenting whole game mechanics to never use them again is a personal frustration of mine. For example, the original Splatoon had a little jumping squid mini-game on the loading screen. Nintendo decided they needed to patent that (even though they weren't the first to do a loading screen mini-game), so now, NOBODY can put mini-games on the loading screen. And in the intervening years since then, Nintendo has done NOTHING with that patent.
I still find it kind of insane that you can copyright something like that
@@druidOcelot funny thing is Nintendo weren't even the ones to originally use that mini-game-on-the-loading-screen concept, there was another game in the PS1 era(forget which one but Jim did a video on it)where you could play a game of Galaga on the loading screen and the company(I think it was Konami or SEGA?)patented it and just sat on it for decades so no video game dev could do mini-games on load screens as a result.
(the pun wasn't intended, btw, but now I'm wondering whether the whole situation is not actually just another low sanity effect)
By my understanding, I am unclear on how it is Patant*able* at all...
Phoenix forcing Stephanie to put on the rabbit ears is just delightful. She has the same expression my roommate gives me when I make her do something she doesn't want to do.
"this is what happens when you work with alice fans" guilty as charged i love alive and i love bunny ears n bunny stuff generally
I was a backer of American McGee's for ages and I don't regret it one bit! We got really gorgeous stuff for donating at a certain level - like collectible posters and challenge coins. For me as a huge collector-of-stuff in general as well as a longtime fan of the IP, I will absolutely treasure these little goodies I got from being a patron. I'm just really bummed that EA won't budge on letting him move on with the project to another studio. It's one thing to not give a crap about an IP - it's something else entirely to have that IP, not care about it, but also not want to let it go. EA sucks. xp
I loved “Metal Arms: Glitch in the System”. It was the only non Star Wars game I got and I loved it! Thank you for sharing the plot on the sequels😊.
Reasons why if I ever published a book, I intend to go through whatever legal mechanism is necessary to put my IP permanently in the public domain once I've finished the series.
I don't want any fucking corpo laying claim to what I made to squeeze joy out of people until it turns into profit and blood. I refuse. I will personally say "this belongs to everyone, go nuts" either before I die or as part of my last will and testament. No estate management, no legal battles over bullshit likeness claims, no goddamn cease and desist letters for fanworks.
Let people be inspired and share it on all avenues without impediment
I really like that Dmitry Glukhovsky allows people to send in their stories, and if he likes them you get his okay to officially advertise it as "a Metro 2033 story" (or something to that effect).
That's what Tom Lehrer did last year with all his music. He was like "I'm 94, I don't really need the residuals anymore, here's my stuff, have fun with it."
We need more Tom Lehrers in the world today, though the pigeons in the park may disagree.
Copyleft: All Rights Reversed.
Unfortunately that wouldn't help in a situation like this. The Alice in Wonderland & Through the Looking-Glass novels _are_ public domain - everyone is free to make video games based on or inspired by them. The issue here is that everything in the Alice games that isn't directly from the books gets fresh copyright, so you can't make a sequel to them without EA's permission.
If you do write a book you might want to check out the Creative Commons ShareAlike license - it means anyone can build on your work but their new work has to have the same license (basically allows anyone to use it but prevents stuff like this - at least until the copyright expires).
@@kaspianepps7946 Yeah, but if copyright went back to 25 years after publication, we'd only have to wait - checks MobyGames - 13 more years until he can make the sequel he wants. Unless EA decides to shit one out themselves in the meantime. But at least they'd have to instead of being able to sit on the IP basically forever.
The worst part is that Alice in Wonderland is a public domain property, but because of the unique spin on it (That American McGee put on it), EA can claim copyright in the same way that Disney can claim that their "Version" of Alice in Wonderland is "Their" IP. You can make your own work based off a public domain, but as soon as a company gets their mitts on it it's "Theirs". Fuck Copyright law.
Yeah to be fair ea own the right there version.
Fight it if you wish, but even the great one's know...
We all bow to the bunny ear request of our dearly loved ones.
I watched a video about Kaga, the creator of Fire Emblem some times ago.
He tried to leave Nintendo and continue his stories on the PlayStation in an admittedly scummy way, and ended having his name erased for all the official records (being only refered as "Director"), and have the thing he created being used by the company in any way they see fit.
It's a pretty complex situation, with no real good guys, and he's apparently doing well, working on his own little project. But that left me with a weird taste.
Ah yes, TearRing.
It is genuinely crazy that, despite Alice in Wonderland being public works, American McGee can't make a game about it, because... EA owns the concept of American McGee making an Alice in Wonderland video game??
To be fair, ok Alice in wonderland is public domain. But Alice as in American mcgee Alice is not public domain.
I have been convinced for some time that the proverb of selling one’s soul was just a metaphor for selling one’s art to a property hoarder.
Game publishers: no no we can't make that game, it'll never make any money.
Also game publishers: oh we couldn't possibly part with that IP, it's far too valuable.
About American Mcgee putting his name on the game, as far as I've seen, he didn't. He actually opposed the idea of his name being in the front, presumably because the game was made by a whole team of talented people, but some people above him in the EA hierarchy thought it would be good for marketing, because he was a recognizable game from iD software, one of the guys who helped work on Doom. So they put his name on the cover anyway.
"Can't you just leave us alone? And also no to the things you asked for." -EA
To be fair to American McGee's perceived ego, I believe he originally *didn't* want his name to be in the title of Alice. But as one of the recognizable names that worked on id Software titles like Doom 2 and the first couple Quake games, his name was predicted to help move units.
Alice being a cult hit just kinda turned it into a brand.
Came for the ringing condemnation of copyright laws, stayed for the juicy Metal Arms lore.
American McGee's doing plushies. Specifically, the "Plushie Dreadfuls" Line, which includes some adorable little pride flag bunnies. My lil tye-dye pan bunny is very huggable.
American McGee could just make his 3rd Alice game and call it "Malice" and have the boxart be a giant middle finger pointed at EA offices.
Malice: EA Returns...
Reloaded...?
Revolved...?
Recycled...?
It's a work in progress.
@@bluehero-96 Malice, the Revenge
@@bluehero-96Malice: Electronic Asylum
American McGee basically wants to be Tim Burton. Tim Burton is almost exactly Disney but a little more wicked (in the context he meant it).
There needs to be some law where if an individual or company isn't actively using a copyright it automatically gets moved to the public domain.
The fact companies can just own work they didn't make and not allow the creator to do anything with it, even if they don't want to do anything with it, is completely fucked.
Phoenix's gremlin energy in the intros/outros have been a delight. I love it so much.
Saw Metal Arms, clicked immediately. Glad to find someone who also anguishes over the fact that it's squished under the Blizzard IP pile. I feel like we need a fanclub or something...
I remember Fan4stic was made just to hoard the Fantastic 4 movie rights. Now Disney owns the studio who owned those movie rights.
Writer Guy: "Whoops!"
Director Guy: "Whoopsie!"
Impressive that they have trademarks / copyright over something where the source material is public domain...
That 2nd Alice game was one of the best action platformers I've played. A third game would be great.
“Whining sometimes works”
that line tickled me steph hah
The fact that he got the support needed to crowd-fund the proposal, proves that there is enough public interest to be worth selling the game.
EA couldn't take a hint if it was printed in foot-high glowlights and smacked through their management's collective empty skulls.
Steph: "This is my Alice OC, the Mad Bunny Ear Headbander. She's the daughter of the Mad Hatter and March Hare's mpreg love affair, seen in my earlier fic, 'Late For a Very Important Due Date' "
God I wanted a sequel to Metal Arms so much. Shit is so sad
Didn't McGee originally fight against having his name center-stage on the first Alice game like that? I vaguely recall hearing a story about how he didn't want to make it all about him and steal the thunder of everyone else that worked on the title, but the publisher wouldn't budge on it.
"whining sometimes works"
It actually does, surprisingly enough.
Such a shame, i remember checking McGee's livestream where he was talking about it and it just blew my mind how deep these things go as well as how little power developers have over their own creation... it is unfair on so many levels.
That's a real bummer, American McGee's story before Doom is super sad (seriously, don't look it up, I don't think I would have made it if I had been in his place), I enjoyed the Alice games and was rooting for him. Good luck for him in whatever he does next.
Unicronic Arts strikes again...not even giving them a CHANCE to fail.
Loved Metal Arms glitch and the System. Thanks Jim for stirring up those memories.
The animations of panicing exploding robot people. I can still hear their screams.
Its a cartoon platformer that had to have all the features of a Halo game to appeal to teens.
Definitely would have owned the trilogy. We would probably have a HD re release of it by now on an alternate timeline.
Publishers don't know what won't sell. They just want to follow trends, and the trends right now are bleak and exploitative of everyone.
I genuinely love your fun interactions at the beginning of your videos.
Hearing the words metal arms glitch in the system hurts me because I know it’s never coming back
Back when I was playing Dead by Daylight consistently, it had me curious as to why certain copyrighted characters lacked cosmetics vs others and I came to find out that
The “Halloween” movie franchise, The character of “Michael Myers” and several of the movies are each owned by entirely separate companies, meaning to get cosmetics for Michael means having to get in touch with 3 separate legal teams and get consent from all of them in unison in order to get anywhere.
Funnily enough, the character of “Ghost Face” is actually fucking owned by the company who produces the Halloween masks that originally sparked the character idea, meaning they can make as many alternative Ghost Face costumes as they want because the company considers it free advertising.
Property rights are fucking insane
It's a shame. I've never played this game, but I'm familiar with its story of "Alice. Madness Returns" and it was very impressive. I mean, it had a deep and serious theme, while at the same time maintaining Alice in Wonderland's crazy world spirit. I was actually interested in playing a new game from the series. And I'm saying this as someone who normally wouldn't play this sort of game, but I would have made an exception, because that's how impressed I was with the story of Madness Returns.
Always get a good lawyer when it comes to IP. Very good video. Keep up the good work.
Metal Arms is an amazing game! It definitely deserved a trilogy.
Good video overall and I super agree with the ideas about copyright and intellectual property.
But also; Idk I feel you're being a little hard on American McGee here just cause of how he was seeking funding for his pitch.
From what I gather pitches are WAY more expensive and time consuming than we think they are, and frankly crowdfunding a pitch isn't unheard of because of this. The Goon movie and Dragon's Lair movie both need kickstarters just to fund their pitching process. They seem to be more expensive and time consuming than just "giving em a notebook with all your ideas in it" like ya said. Idk, depending on how the guy is doing, going to Patreon for some cash while he puts together a pitch might not be so insane, and he was upfront and honest about it being a pitch that might not come through. Idk, between the opening bit and the wording at 2:19 it sorta feels like you're placing some blame on him despite all he did was being upfront and honest about wanting some money and where it was going.
Astro Farm must have been hidden in my brain from years of trauma and drug abuse, but thank you to the new editor for that!
Every time I watch one of your videos I get hit in the face with a little nugget of nostalgia so nostalgic I realise how bloody old I am!
This episode needs an American McGee counter! I dont think anyone has said the words "American McGee" more than JSS has done in this one 18 minute episode!
Except for american mcgee. Probably.
Also, a combo sequel of Tiny Tank and Metal Arms combined into one game could be really fun.
They should call it American McGee's Tiny Tank with Metal Arms.
@@Bloody0range combine them into an unholy fusion of Mobile Suit Guntank, Modularity, and a mouth that would make Duke Nukem wither
13:40 Hold up. Did Predator just heal by eating a pizza that fell out of a phone?
Always happy to see Metal Arms get a shoutout from you, I loved that game and it’s such a bummer it never got more
5:05 Wait, you're a subsidiary of Creedle and Crabnuts? I'm wearing their _Crème de Pourriture_ scent right now!
I think what's worse than not allowing an Artist to create more of what they want, is forcing an Artist to make more of what they don't want.
makes me think that governments should set up arts funding to buy the copyright of things like this stuck in limbo and publish under a national broadcaster
Thank you for covering this!
*LMAO* !!!! That LOOK !!! That look you give the camera, when Phoenix starts changing the lights on you. Brilliant !
I loved metal arms so much, such an underrated classic
Since I was, sadly, already aware of most of the nonsense, my main takeaway from this video is that those Alice games look really, really cool.
American McGee's life before he got into game development was freakin' wild, man.
Also one of his earliest gigs was with ID Software, he worked on Doom 2 and Quake before he left to work on Alice.
In 1999 I wanted to make a digital version of a great board game that had not been sold since 1978 just as a hobby project without any intent of selling it. I just wanted to share it with the world, but the publishing company said no. Even to this day the game was never re-released.
This is one of those very few rare games that I was very much looking forward to. The first two Alice games were art.
Seriously... this situation was just shit. Dude wanted to make a game
The thing about Astro Farm is that it was on right before Roger and the Rottentrolls, so that's how it got the views.
THANK YOU FOR TALKING ABOUT THIS!
Just randomly re-watched Civvie's video on the first game, where American commented (about a year ago) that he's still working on the third one. This was not the follow-up news that I expected (but I'm also not surprised).
Metal arms deserved so much better
and I love every time you bring it up
extremely rad editing on the opening
That hybrid book\pitch idea is spot on!
As for AM himself, the guy felt comfortable slapping his on things 'cause he was known among Id Software fans, as he was a Designer on a bunch of Dooms and Quakes.
And McGee Mom's second choice of name would have been "Obnard" so give 'im some slack,.
It's such bullsh*t on EA's part when they say that "Alice is an important IP to them so they're unwilling to license it out", when the first game is literal abandonware, and getting it running on modern PC's is not so straightforward. Feel so sorry for AM, this was always his passion project more than anything, and Asylum looked like it was going to be truly something special. Thanks for covering this Steph ❤
I remember when Alice Madness Returns came out the same time as Duke Nukem Forever and I went to EB Games and there was like 30 people lined up; 29 for DNF and I was there for Alice. Madness Returns turned out to be a hidden gem and a game I still adore to this day, while we all know what happened with Duke 4. It's a shame really, being overshadowed by that gargling hot
mess
I actually dug DNF and thought it was pretty good.
Glad to hear you liked it! I found Madness Returns to be a step down from the original - maybe it lacked that retro jank, I also hated the combat system, but was raring to go for the third game 😭
i remember that robot game… drew fanart of the «undead» robots when i was younger. had my mind blown by them…
Why is Scrapland never mentioned when people talk about American McGee games. I'd love to see a sequel for that one as well.
He Was just a producers