Award-winning author here. That is CORRECT. Every scene needs stakes, and a B, M, and E. That's why exemplary scenes can be uploaded and they can nearly stand all on there own as a "tiny story". NEED AN EXAMPLE? No problem. Look up the "They're Not Ready" scene from Ed Zwick's masterpiece of "The Last Samurai". You could also compare it to a similar scene in "Glory", where Broderick's character chants "Teach them... properly, Major. (also Zwick's work here). You could ALSO also try some of my own... 🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨ "Before I start, I must see my end. Destination known, my mind's journey now begins. Upon my chariot, heart and soul's fate revealed. In time, all points converge; hope's strength, resteeled. But to earn final peace at the universe's endless refrain, we must see all in nothingness... before we start again." 🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨ --Diamond Dragons (series)
@@guilhermeteodosio40 The purpose of the scene might be to reveal something about the character. The stakes are why we, the audience care about the conflict. The consequences are how the story is propelled forward by the results.
This is actually genius. Most people just say good fights come down to ‘subtext’ and ‘symbolism’ and don’t really expand on it. I love the depth this video goes into
@@datboi1861 Fr. A fight can have as much subtext or additional meaning you want, but if the stakes aren’t there (plus all the stuff mentioned in the video) it’s a bad fight
I fucking hate symbolism, it is the laziest writing technique. It is completely uninteresting, the characters don’t even do anything about it. It’s just a reflection of the story rather than an advancement of it. It’s a stupid thing. Subtext is necessary but can be overdone and made cringy and annoying.
I really like how you include shows of different mediums! A lot of videos will either just show western media (live action +arcane) or just show anime.
To be fair, anime in general has mastered the art of animated fights (most western animated fights never even come close) and live action goes to the east for their kung fu and wuxia films while the west has firearms based "combat" in a tight stranglehold and for good reason. Nobody does explosions and guns and war films both real and sci-fi as good as the west
15:34 I almost didn't believe you when you said it was your first video ever, but after I checked your channel and saw that you were telling the truth, I subscribed. Apparently I've serious trust issues.
In the fight between Obi Wan and Anakin on Mustafar I always interpreted Anakin losing as a result of his uncontrolled rage from joining the dark side which caused him to lunge at Obi Wan without properly judging that he was at a disadvantage at that point on the duel
I subscribe to the idea, that Obi Wan won, cause he has analyzed this scenario thoroughly before. In Episode 1 Obi Wan won against Maul in a similar situation, so the idea would be Obi Wan going through all the possible ways to not lose, if he was Maul. And in Episode 3 you get the result out of all his thinking. Of course Anakin's rage and being drunk on dark side juice is part of it, which creates the opportunity for Obi Wan. But making use of that situation came from training.
Yes, but there's more to it than that. What draws Force users to the Dark Side is power, but I remember from my time playing KotOR that what's important isn't so much power as it is control. This holds true for both sides of the Force. Just as a Jedi who doesn't truly believe in justice and compassion will not be a good Jedi, a Sith who doesn't know how to control their anger and hatred will end up being controlled by them, becoming a slave to their passions rather than drawing strength from them. True power comes not from the Force but from knowledge and acceptance of the self, and at that moment Anakin was so caught up in his self-hatred that he was bound to lose to Obi Wan. Say what you like about Obi Wan, but despite his mistakes and losses he never loses sight of who he is or what's important to him, which is perhaps why he's the strongest defensive duellist in all of Star Wars: an immoveable rock against which others clash their (usually weaker) convictions.
Kung fu panda has my favorite fight scenes of all time. Tai lung's break out of prison is a perfect fly swatting scene, showing just how powerful/ruthless/badass he is. Furious five against him is similar to show again just how powerful he is and how futile even 5 masters working together against him is. All setting up for the final fight/two fights with Tai lung vs shi fu showing the dynamic between the characters. How shi fu fails to stop his son and how Tai Lung is ruthless past the point of caring about his master. Then immediately into Po using Tai Lung's tunnel vision on power/the scroll against him as well as driving home the theme of self-acceptance, using his own fighting style to defeat Tai Lung
Also consider that it underpins the greater thematic conflict between Shifu and Oogway. Shifu and Tai Lung bth saw Po as a fat and easily distracted jokester. However, when Shifu finally gave in and took Oogway's advice, those same traits turned Po into a well-armoured, highly creative, and level-headed warrior. Immunity to Tai Lung's strikes? Natural fat. Immunity to taunts? He's THE big fat panda, he has no illusions about what he is. Wuxi finger hold? He figured that one out himself, just because it's awesome. Skadoosh! Why is the fight so much longer than it could've been? So that all of this has room to play out perfectly.
I feel like a counterargument as to why a fly swatting fight should be short and as you described with omni man vs the guardians, is ironically, mark vs omni man. That is a perfect example of how the villain "playing with his food" in a long drawn out fight can be some of the most gripping drama in television history. Also as first vids go, you knocked it out of the park:)
I think it's important to note however, that there are really two fights going on in that scene. The one sided brutal physical smackdown that Omni man is giving mark. And the philosophical debate about the inherent value of human life Vs space fascism. While we watch mark get absolutely swatted by his dad, he refuses to give in mentally and in the end, that is why omni man still loses the fight.
@@ragabutler89 To add on to what you wrote, because of the fact that it's actually two fights it manages to simultaneously fall into both the fly-swatting category and David vs Goliath. Omniman wins physically, but Mark wins psychologically.
@@Squampopulous Couldnt that flt into an entirelty new category called "The Beatdown" Its like fly swatting but has the express purpose of beating a charater down to build them up again.
I think that one thing to remember is that a lack of strategy isn't nothing. IF a fight scene lacks strategy from a party (e.g. Ozai in the ATLA fight), that doesn't make it a bad point. I think that his lack of strategy was purposeful and shows a lot of characterization of Ozai and the brute that he is. While pure slugging can be borish, characters with no strategy shouldn't automatically serve as a point for a bad fight scene as it does display the type of character we get.
You could say his strategy was to constantly attack Aang and give him no time to breathe. Even when Aang redirects his lightning and catches him off guard, Ozai immediately attacks him right after that and even knocks him out for a few seconds. Tbh i loved Ozai's highly aggressive fighting style. It made it the most dynamic fight in the entire show.
Outstanding video! Enjoyed it immensely. One note on the Dune 2 fight scene - the way Paul wins is a callback to the his training with Gurney in the first movie where Paul thinks he wins and Gurney quips, “You would have joined me in death.” Revealing the knife that had been ‘stabbed’ into Paul’s belly during his aggression. This is the culmination of both characters’ arcs because Paul has learned and matured into a brave and cunning warrior where he once would have lost. In contrast, his opponent fell victim to the tunnel vision of aggression in the same manner young Paul had. Best of luck on future videos!
Paul's fight is actually decided by his ability to see into the future. In the book, it’s explained that winning against Feyd-Rautha required Paul to rely heavily on his prescient abilities, not just his skill as a fighter. For the first time, Paul fully embraces his role as the Kwisatz Haderach in a life-and-death situation, seeing many possible futures and navigating the one path to victory. This duel marks a turning point where he transcends his physical limits and begins to rely on his prescience to an almost supernatural degree. I'd say they mishandled this fight in Dune: Part Two. Even as someone familiar with the book, the fight felt underwhelming. Unlike Paul’s duel with Jamis in Part One, where we see flashes of his prescience informing his actions, the Feyd fight lacks any indication of Paul foreseeing the battle. This omission leaves the audience without the crucial understanding of why the fight plays out as it does. We should have seen several flashes where he messes up and dies, it would have made it clear what's at stake why he choses the path he choses. In the book, Paul not only sees the future but is willing to sacrifice himself-literally and figuratively-for his vision. This fight is where he truly places his full trust in what he has foreseen, knowing that without it, he would lose. It’s a major moment of character growth, testing his ascendance and cementing his god-like awakening. The duel represents Paul’s transformation into a figure who is no longer bound by physical abilities alone, becoming essentially undefeatable. This profound development is entirely missing in the movie, reducing the fight to a quick and unsatisfying resolution that lacks the weight it deserves. I'd argue that it would not only make the fight scene better but later his "betrayal" of Chani, where the audience would UNDERSTAND that he simply chooses a path he sees most fit to achieve his goals. (This is just such a painful thing for me as much of the second book's theme revolves around Paul being essentially obsessed with finding the right path, nearly losing his whole humanity in the process)
@@another7674it’s wrong tho. In the book, he actually cannot see the fight at all. It’s a huge black hole in his vision. Going in he’s actually thrilled to experience a fight wear he doesn’t no the outcome. The future he sees doesn’t require him to be alive because he knows he becomes either a spiritual figurehead or a martyr but either way the jihad happens
Shoutout to the final battle of Everything Everywhere All At Once: when Evelyn decides to “fight with love”, which could have been an empty platitude in a lesser movie, she uses her knowledge of the entire multiverse to find ways for each of the opponents to be happy, incapacitating them in perhaps one of the quickest ways possible, and leading her to save Joy. It’s a great blend of character meeting strategy, and it’s all to serve the message of the story
@@Seinsmelled oh, so you weren’t even watching the movie. That’s your fault, not the movie’s. Also it’s kinda funny that you were that disgusted by a gag about hot dog fingers
@@Squampopulous Yeah, it showed the difference between their personality. I think that's partly what made Ozai attack Aang in such straight forward aggression. He thought Aang was a weak minded pacifist who wouldn't fight back. (it's not like Ozai was wrong). Imagine Ozai facing Kyoshi in same situation. It would have been a bloodbath.
I love this. It shows that the choice to have Aang let Ozai live was actually a good one: Throughout the entire show, Aang struggled to balance his principles with his great power. By the end, after all the grief, after overcoming fear and reluctance, he finally learns to control the Avatar state for real. His unwillingness to kill Ozai and break his principles is what made him unbendable in the end, which is not technically who he was in the show's beginning.
@@gianni206And if anything, its a practical decision too. Ozai's death would make him a martyr to any of his would be or aspiring loyalists out there. Him utterly left powerless gave him a fate worse than death and ensured no catastrophic retaliation. I added the previous part to emphasize Aang never forgave Ozai as much as Katara never forgave her mother's killer.
Paul wins because he was more human. "You’ve heard of animals chewing off a leg to escape a trap? There’s an animal kind of trick. A human would remain in the trap, endure the pain, feigning death that he might kill the trapper and remove a threat to his kind." Its a direct reference to Paul's first meeting with the Reverend Mother, his benegesserit training, and the very beginning of his story. He won by turning back to the lessons from the beginning
I think this is good analysis but if anything it shows how at this point paul is even more inhumane, the benegesserit are very archaeic and plan thing out in an inhuman timescale and paul now able to see the future discards his humanity and wins because he's competent and knows by seeing the future he will win. The fight is honestly just a formality in the lore of the movie it seems like a dramatic moment but he languishes in the drama to assert himself as a powerful leader
Don't forget the other massive payoff: Paul finishes Feyd the exact way he himself was defeated by Thanos during a training session at the start of the first movie. Both times, the fighter on the offense realizes he's "winning", gets excited, and rushes to finish the job, allowing the defending fighter to exploit a gap in the attacker's attention and land a surprise stab. Even the mock "final blow" was also off screen in the first movie, we only see it once Thanos points it out. But of course this also fits the "more human" mould that Mother Mohiam outlined.
@@BAMGM Didn't paul dream this? like they had two frames of that closeup shot where he stabs feyd. To be fair thats not something you realize on first or even second watching.
That's also a way of House Atreides. Show your brave face to others, let them see your courage in the face of death, but if you can, shuffle things behind the curtain to your liking to come on top when everybody expects it the least. Deploy shady tactics if necessary.
One of my new favorite creators. To-the-point, subtly funny, and informative. No excessive derailing to pitch subscribing to your channel, frequent use of examples to sell your points. Perfection.
I actually like the fight from the boys. The fact it's set up with a good strategy then devolved into mayhem fits the theme of the show and as well was interesting to watch. The characterization is that despite these people trying to work together, their own conflicting agendas override your dedication to their initial plan which would have worked it ends up going poorly for them in the end.
I agree, and I would argue that this is actually a good fight. This fight showcases the characterization of everyone involved by showing us that they are all flawed. They have a strategy going in, but as soon as the fighting breaks out their plans all fall away and they end up in chaos due to their own lack of coordination and cooperation. Each character allows their selfish impulses to take over and as a result the plan falls apart and the fight ends up being a loss. We're reminded that this world is a gritty one. Our heroes are going to need more than just confidence, determination, and the power of friendship to win here. This isn't a story where the "good guys" win simply because they're the good guys. This fight functions a lot like the second act in a trilogy. Our main characters had some successes up until now, and it looked like they were on their way to victory. Only for them to get knocked down to their lowest points. We're shown just how flawed they are, and just how stacked the odds are against them. The point is driven home that they have a lot more work to do if they want to have any hope of succeeding.
True! While he was technically right the intent of the fight was that their initial plan of playing the soldier boy trump card failed and so did everything else almost like a domino effect. The consequence of the fight was that their chance of using soldier boy vs homelander again failed once and for all and that queen maeve basically cant be active anymore, probably for her best
It also tied with the themes of family, with Butcher throwing his revenge out of the window and even briefly joining with Homelander against Soldier Boy to save Ryan. The whole season is about family and generational trauma and the fight brought all of that to it's climax.
I agree. It showcased how, despite their seemingly united front in killing Homelander, there are too many conflicting priorities and circumstances. Had Homelander not gone to retrieve Ryan, there would be nothing to stop Butcher from staying on-point and killing Homelander. He'd have gladly taken the full brunt of SB's blast if he thought it meant killing or de-powering Homelander. However, Ryan is the *one* priority Butcher has that supersedes his desire to kill Homelander. By contrast, SB wants to kill Homelander because of his deal with Butcher, and because he sees Homelander as an unworthy successor to his mantle as the world's best hero, fulfilling the cycle of abuse that began with his own father. In this, we can see that SB is just as monstrous as Homelander, and we, the audience, can agree that SB is at least almost as bad as Homelander, and we are meant to understand/agree with Butcher's decision to prioritize Ryan at the moment. Then we have Maeve who, unlike Butcher, has no lines she will not cross to see Homelander dead. And while Squampopulous criticizes Maeve for having 'no strategy', we spend much of the season watching Maeve train like a madwoman for the fight she knows is coming, and it *shows* in that fight. Homelander is so laughably inexperienced that when someone that can actually hurt him comes at him for real, it's not difficult to out-fight him, it's just difficult to maintain that advantage because he's stronger and faster and much harder to meaningfully harm. Maeve throws everything she has at Homelander until he gouges out one of her eyes and then it becomes clear SB is about to take out the entire floor, and Maeve decides she does have ONE line she won't cross; letting a bunch of innocent people die along the way. In the end, Maeve decides to *truly* be a hero, believing it would cost her her life. That's great characterization, even if it comes at the cost of strategy, but I can understand the frustration; if everyone would just swallow their qualms about SB, they could have Homelander dead, which is *the entire goal* of the team, but they all have costs they're not willing to pay to have that happen. Butcher has Ryan. Hughie has Butcher and Annie. MM has his own beef with SB that he maybe feels will go unresolved if SB wins, because he'd either disappear or return as Vought's new flagship hero. Annie has Hughie and an innate desire to be a hero and avoid collateral damage. And then Maeve decides she would rather be a hero than kill the villain. As we gear up for the last season, I have to wonder what lines the Boys will have to agree to cross if it means bringing down Homelander for good.
Quick correction about the Aang vs Ozai fight. A solar eclipse disables all firebending, Ozai was more powerful because of Sozin's comet, hence the final 4 episodes are titled Sozin's comet part 1-4. Ozai is characterized throughout the show as being brutal, aggressive, and valuing power over everything; he's a classic bully who's only strategy is being bigger and stronger than his opponents. It's why his grand plan for winning the war is simply to wait for the comet to come back and give them more power.
Which is why really its a terrible fight, and nearing one of the worst fights in ATLA. It actually attacks the shows own themes, and essentially makes the whole thing pointless. Aang did nothing to win the fight and won by default, and unless you think 'divine right means I deserve it more than you' is a good theme, Aang does nothing to upset the source of Ozai's characterization, and Aang wins by invalidating his own character struggle of the finale arc. And strategy wise its a fly swatting fight both ways. It's really a shame just how bad the final episode of Avatar is. The shows really good up to that point, and by comparison, Katara and Zuko vs Azula is a much better finale fight. Its Azula losing more than it is Katara winning, ending her themes of being an alternate for Zuko. Zuko loses because he sacrifices himself for what he believes in rather than taking the win, Azula loses because she is single minded and gets trapped by it. Both fit the characterization themes really well, ie its just a big allegory for Zuko's arc. It's a pretty meaningless fight for Katara, but the fight isn't really setup as a Katara fight to begin with, she kinda intrudes on it at the end. The problem with the finale of Avatar is that the character arc Aang shows at the end cant be resolved, especially in a kids show. Aang does not want to kill the firelord. The problem is, if you want a fight to be real, especially between one murderous character who's the top of the food chain, 'defeating the character' and 'killing the character' have to be treated as basically synonyms. If Aang just like, knocked out and arrested the Fire Lord, or if that was even treated as something he could do, Aang's entire arc is just stupid. 'Well then don't kill him, its not that hard'. So 'defeat the Fire Lord' must mean 'kill the Fire Lord'. Thus the fight DOES treat it that way. Aang loses the entire fight because he wont fully try. But by giving him an automatic win anyway, and then a get out of jail free card at the end, it raises the question 'what was the point of this stupid arc?'. So the whole thing is totally meaningless and a waste of the viewers time.
@@fearedjamesit's perfectly valid characterization for Aang to be pressured into betraying his own values by everyone, then in the end deciding to stick to his guns by finding his own way.
@@appended1 Except he did not do that, he was given a free out. Furthermore, he only has this decision after the fight that he one sidedly lost, and then was given a free out of. Basically, the ending sabotages his entire show arc.
@@fearedjames But that was the point, no? Struggling with what he has to do(killing the firelord) vs what he wants to do(end the war without killing) is his main conflict. He wasn't losing the fight before the "automatic win" either, he had a chance to kill Ozai with Lightning Redirection, and was stronger as a bender in general. Its good BECAUSE despite that opening, despite all his power, he never compromises on his unshakable values and finds a way to finish it on terms he agrees with. That was what the the whole lion-turtle arc was all about. Aang desperately seeking validation from friends and previous avatars, hoping one of them would agree that killing Ozai was not the answer. After exhausting everything, the literal creators of bending gave him an answer he was looking for, but not shown until the actual fight, so we dont go into it thinking "ah, he already has a trump card, why watch this fight?". The fight was not perfect, but it was leagues better than a fly-swatting avatar state yipyip floor wipe. We've seen this throughout the show multiple times. And while he is not infallible during the avatar state(donut time), he definitely always wins when the stakes are too important to the story(his loss to azula drove the story, we KNOW he's not gonna lose to Ozai during the finale). If Aang finally accepted that he HAS to kill Ozai, that is undoubtedly horrible character writing. it would be the fattest stinker to have him go against how he was built up since Book One, only to fall under the pressure and just go "fuck it".
@@fearedjames That's a lot of text just to say you didn't get the point. The "free out" Aang gets isn't free, it's characterization, because it's made very clear that the only reason he was able to do it is because he chose to commit to his beliefs instead of using his all-powerful godmode to smoke Ozai. It's characterization because it could've been a fly-swatting but Aang didn't want it to be.
That's also the whole reason why he becomes an instantly accomplished sorcerer in future movies. He spent years looping and using Dormammu as practice.
@@rs5922 while I usually hate stuff like that, I actually really liked that for doctor strange. He had to endure God knows how many years worth of deaths, fucking with this ancient entity to basically annoy it into leaving him alone
First video essay? I've seen videos from people who've been posting essays for years that are not nearly as concise clear and clever as this great job man
“Fly swatting” fights can also be good for the loser. Like them going up against someone they CAN’T beat. Not a david vs goliath where they “can’t” beat them. But end up winning anyway. A fly swat could show a characters bravery, their final stand. Or maybe their hubris or pride.
"If I can't win, I'll at least make sure these fuckers never forget my name" is a story element I love but see far too rarely, so I'm 100% with you on this.
I think its important to note how Pyrrhic Victories interact with your chart, particularly when there is a sizeable power imbalance. Take the ending of Rogue One, where Vader pops in long enough to be absolutely horrifying. It *seems* like classic fly-swatting on the surface, he's just tearing through everyone he comes across, there's not a chance of a conventional victory for the Rebels... ...but the Rebels do win, in a sense. They're nearly all slaughtered, but the whole point of the fight is for the Death Star Plans data, which the nameless rebels do manage to get to safety. Their only real strategy is running away and passing along the data, but it does work. Its something that's always important to keep in mind, not all victories or defeats are alike, sometimes the guys that look like they lost actually pulled off the strategic win they needed, and sometimes the omnipotent badass still can't achieve whatever he's hoping for.
yeah this would be somewhat of a david vs goliath. in the video i said that the fight is not always about defeating your opponent, but achieving your goal. their goal was to get the data to leia and they did. their strategy was just immense sacrifice
Yea the AoT Beat Titan fight it this exactly. It's a perfect phyrric moment with dozens of soldiers giving their lives for a chance at victory through tactics and bravery.
There should be a 5th category including Erwin vs Beast Titan, Rebels vs Vader, Aragorn at the Black Gate Of Mordor. To use a chess meme, "He sacrifices THE ROOK!" Sometimes the heroic side has to make a hopeless stand and suffer crushing losses in order to give themselves a shot at victory. This is neither exactly a David/Goliath (as there is no chance of direct victory) nor a Flyswatting (since the "losing" side actually wins).
@@InternetflamingIt's not fun. At all. It was a cool gimmick the first time. But the millionth time having seen power scaling so involved is super annoying and not fun at all.
Holy crap, this is probably one of the better videos i found regarding fights and powerscaling, especially when it comes to the different win "conditions" that come with each one for it to be a properly good fight. Great job on the video, pretty good!
One thing I like about David vs Goliath type fights is that sometimes, all that is needed is pure tenacity. Also exemplified by Doctor Strange's "fight" with Dormammu. Dormammu tells Strange that he will never win, and strange retorts "No... But I can lose. Again, and again, and again, and again forever. And that makes you my prisoner." Outside of fights where the power differential is THIS huge, that same tenacity is sometimes all that is needed. Trying again and again, just waiting for the one attempt where the enemy will make a mistake.
I can see what you mean, but the dormammu "fight" is kinda a bs fight as its neither fly-swatting or david vs goliath, arguably it could be a world cup, cuz both sides of the party are referred as the strongest amongst all others
I know it's a small detail, but the Sherlock fight has a lot more characterisation than just 'Sherlock smart and fight good'. The context of the fight: he glimpses his old love Irene Adler in the crowd (who leaves the handkerchief behind as a calling card of sorts) and is momentarily distracted. His opponent takes advantage of his distraction to spit on the back of Sherlock's head, insulting him and making him look bad in front of Adler. His fight analysis has two very specific focuses: 1. The very first line is 'This must not register on an emotional level.' Sherlock has just seen an old flame of his and is obviously shook, but IMMEDIATELY stops himself from feeling anything further. The fact that he so quickly rejects his emotions is highly indicative of Sherlock's view of emotion as a weakness, so of course he falls back on the old reliable: logical analysis. The way he leaves the fight is also very telling: after he wins he doesn't celebrate or rub it in his opponent's face, he just calmly and casually walks away, takes his winnings and grabs a bottle of drink as though nothing remarkable happened. Again, he's not letting what happened register on an emotional level: cool, calm, controlled, even though he was upset just a moment ago. 2. Every move Sherlock uses in that fight is specifically targeted to break or injure a part of his opponent's body that is involved in the process of either spitting or insulting, specifically his jaw, ribs and diaphragm. We learn from this that Sherlock is capable of being EXTREMELY vindictive when he wants to be: presumably up until that point he was fighting just because he enjoyed it, but as soon as his anger switch is flipped he becomes a completely different person. For Sherlock in this moment, hiding from his anger and vulnerability, it isn't enough to just win the fight: he has to win in a way that proves his complete superiority and also disables the man from spitting on him ever again. It's a very cold and calculated form of revenge, which, for a very brief moment, paints Sherlock in an almost villainous light, much like how Gojo completely and mercilessly destroys Hanami. So, yes: the fight is not so much about Sherlock's superpower of analysis, because as you say we already know about that. The fight introduces Sherlock's ex, shows us how Sherlock feels about his own emotions, how he reacts to being insulted while vulnerable, and the way he reacts to and expresses his anger. It sets up events that happen later in relation to Adler, which I will not spoil, and presents Sherlock as a character who uses logic and cold revenge as a mask for his anger, which both compares him to the villain Moriarty and gives Sherlock a chance to change for the better later in the story.
@@InternetAddict069 Just watched it then and I honestly think it's a fly swatting. It looked like a toss-up because Sherlock wasn't fighting at his best, he was putting on a show for the crowd. It wasn't really a fight scene, it was pure exposition. Then his priorities changed and it become purely fly-swatting as described by this video and a good one at that. Fast, to the point, full of characterisation.
The move Paul pulled wasn’t what you made it out to be at all, the grab was to buy time to use the very first move Gurney Taught him in Dune 1, to “make his opponent join him in death.” A strategy developed by Gurney Hallick, a man well versed in opposing the Harkonnens.
@@gahrzerkire1193 the staging of the fight de-emphasizes Paul's prescience on purpose : Feyd is presented as an equal opposite to Paul. if Paul was shown to "see the code" of the fight, we lose that balance. I choose to see it as a fight against a relatively unpredictable enemy against whom Paul can't predict every moves like he did on the large scale battle - however he does know Feyd's sadism, and he has leaned from gurney to strike where the enemy doesn't see him coming, as well as knowing to endure pain to avoid death. that said that emphasis on Paul's good quality kind of gets lost in the tragedy of Paul becoming the scourge of the galaxy.
I wish he had broken down the fight scene from the book too because that would've cleared up his problems in a way probably more effective than the fight that he proposed
Very entertaining thank you. Only suggestion is to add a 'spoiler incoming' note or something for X show before going into details. Good luck with the channel!
A misinterpretation you made was that in Dune 2 the characterization of Paul isn't a person who is "tough" and "determined". But he starts that way and over the course of the series becomes more politically versed in the ways of deception which is exactly why it's a knife fight, it resembles classic court-like antics. Paul starts off being this typical "good natured optimist". Once he learns what they future has in store and he gets his visions he becomes a determinist thinking that there's only one possible way to the future that he wants. In a way the Dune 2 fight was actually a perfectly characterized his arch. He's not this optimistic hero resembling a religious figure anymore but a man who wants to do sneaky stuff in political games, which is exactly why the knife was off camera. To be fair a lot of people make this mistake and see him as this charismatic hero, which is the entire point of the dune series, when in fact he's putting on a facade to start a war.
Nah, I think he's right. The Dune series is too pretentious, and it's dialogue is nonsensical. It tries too hard to sound smart, where it forgets to think about audience because it's more bothered about showing off. Think this fight scene analysis shows it... It tries to surprise the audience instead of build any character, or suspense.
No, sorry, but it is you who are completely misinterpreting it. First of all, Paul never "starts off" as a good natured optimist, not in the book, not in the movie. The character is shown as very much grounded, realist and pragmatist. Yes there is some playfulness here and there, but he is far from being an optimist. But most importantly, what do you mean by "he's not resembling a religious figure anymore"??? What? The Atreides house was never religious in the first place. After drinking the "water of life" Paul embraced his prophecy and literally wages a holy war on the whole known universe killing everyone who refuses to adhere to his religion, and his son literally became the God Emperor. The fight at the end was not some metaphor for a political game, it was to show the fremen how much he is willing to sacrifice for them, so that their faith strengthen in him. He used psychology of religion to benefit him because he saw that this sequence of events would benefit him the most. It's not about politics, it's about the harmful nature of religious faith and the misplaced trust in charismatic figures.
@@magicbuns4868 Have you considered that maybe you just don't understand it? Because I, and many others, don't have the same problems as you. I've read the books and seen the movies and I never felt that it was pretentious or that the dialogue is nonsensical. Yes Frank Herbert had some weird ideas, especially in the later books, but overall he always held to the main ideas, philosophies and concepts of the Dune series. Yes it's complex and it might require some research to really understand some of his points (especially in God Emperor of Dune, which is very philosophy heavy), but I think I would rather ponder and think about his books than to have it spoon fed to me in a dumbed down way.
@@magicbuns4868 i think this is a case of "i didn't get it, so other people must not have as well" because dune would not have been successful enough to be a constant staple in sci-fi for nearly 60 years if the audience couldn't understand it.
Paul wins the fight because he’s mastered pain and prescience, using the wound in his hand to both slow Feyd’s attack and mask the pain of pulling his own knife from his own ribs. Whereas Feyd is a sadist who hyperfixates on pain because he loves it (which causes him to focus on Paul’s face, and fall for Paul’s trap). And we DO see the final knife move onscreen, but it happens earlier in the movie. Watch the shot of Paul’s hand when he explains the narrow path to victory right after becoming truly prescient. That fight was an improvement over the book’s incredible fight. It didn’t just show solid human biomechanics in martial arts, or the psychology and eye patterns of elite fighters, it *also* showed a specific way Paul’s prescience mattered to victory. It was in that moment I knew Denis fully comprehended and showed how Paul became more terrifying and inhuman than Feyd-Rautha. Ironic, considering that mastery of pain is what the Bene Jezzerit believe is the mark of true humanity… Which also makes this fight scene a thesis moment for Denis’ two Dune films. We agree on the rest of the video, but you missed the point of the Dune II finale. And I think you missed it by focusing too much on theory and tropes here. Otherwise, thumbs up. 👍 EDIT: I forgot to mention that Gurney uses the same winning move in the shield sparring sequence at the start of the first movie. Excellent foreshadowing.
I also think it shows the characters of both fighters. Paul is ruthlessly efficient, focused on the outcome 'by any means necessary', including looking weak in the eyes of your opponent ('oh no, I got stabbed, yeah you got me bad') - not something Fayd would ever do. In contrast, Fayd tends to show off, play with his opponents (to him each fight is a fly swat). This is foreshadowed in his earlier fight with the non-drugged Atreidis captive, whom he also doesn't kill straightaway.
Yeh he completely misses the point of the fight. First of all it was foreshadowed in Paul's vision and secondly Paul wins because he's willing to do what it takes to win. Unlike Feyd, by now Paul has faced death many times and he's got nothing to lose. While Feyd impressive as he is as a fighter he's never had to worry about losing nor has he fought an energised non-drugged and battle hardened opponent willing to endure significant physical pain to survive. This not withstanding Paul's Bene Gessirit training which allows has taught him techniques to ignore physical pain. Feyd is technically better than Paul but he doesn't have that true warrior I've got nothing to lose attitude. He thinks its a done deal when he stabs Paul and his mind is already shifting to thoughts of him being the Emperor. It doesn't occur to him that his opponent is desperate enough to pull a knife out of his body and blindside him. As for strategy, Paul has seen it in his visions and while he doesn't know exactly how the fight would play out he knows what he needs to do to win. Seems like this guy missed a lot of subtext in Dune Part 2.
On the Paul Feyd fight: at least in the book the fight is in a sense intentionally anticlimactic. The author has talked about how he was trying to end the book so weirdly and abruptly that the reader is "ejected from the book" and forced to think of the themes of the book without getting a proper ending. Also: the message of the fight is at least partially Paul knowing ahead of time that he will win the fight but get wounded in it, which will cement his mythos. The whole fight is... Predetermined, both in diagetic and nondiagetic ways. But still... I agree, the fight could have been done better.
If that was the author's intention I would've loved to see the movie fight handled the same way. Having everything in the climax suddenly stop and rushing the audience to the falling action would've been a brilliant twist if done right.
@@johnnyjoseph3679 I believe they did manage to do this in the siege. The bombs are used, worms ride into battle, we see maybe 20 seconds of hand to hand combat, and then they enter the "palace" and take everyone prisoner etc.
What the movie did succeed in doing was raise stakes for people, Paul knew he'd get stabbed and still win so he just went along because why make a show of it? His personality is evolving to be pragmatic and cunning not hust tough or violent in the way the video describes. The toughness comes from the fact he saw himself get stabbed and decide to go along woth it, not because he is the type of person to do more than a simple stab or cut (literally all he does is simple stabs and cuts because that is what works) @@basileusbasil4041
I like Slime's Megido scene as a wonderful example of fly squatting, showing a major depature of Rimuru's original humanity and his turn into a being beyond that in power. Fern vs Lugner is a wonderful example of a Toss-Up presented to be David vs Goliath and a showing how paper beats rock (Fern is inferior in skill and overall ressources, but her casting speed and specific magic is a horrible match-up for Lugner, on top her 2 hidden strategy). It's probably my favorite fight in the series, even if Frieren and Fern vs Frieren's clone is a spectacle. Anyway absolutely wonderful work of a video super high quality, very excited to see the rest you have brought out!
The Paul and Feyd fight Is more about how similar they are, Feyd and Paul are both heir's to potentially the most powerful planet In the universe (Also both harkonnens). So them both getting stabbed in the gut but only Feyd's being lethal Is just an extension of that, Feyd got so close but just wasn't enough. You can also argue that the stab off screen is kinda symbolic of how much of the fight was already decided off screen due to Paul's visions. Paul saw this In the split second vision during the water of life scene. So that's how he likely why he lets himself get stabbed yadda yadda "There's a narrow way through".
Great points & I also only caught the glimpse of Paul seeing the killing blow in his vision on my 2nd watch. So I guess you could say this was a fight won through both characterization & strategy because Paul chose to drink the Water of Life which showed him the narrow way through & he acted accordingly to fulfill the vision of his ascension. Another source of tension while I watch the fight is that while Paul does have the advantage as far as seeing all the possible futures, he does nearly lose the fight. Feyd had only relatively recently begun his journey into Bene Gesserit teachings & tests. In that field, Feyd is a rookie as opposed to a fairly experienced Paul. Had Feyd been exposed to the Bene Gesserit ways a bit sooner he may have won. Had Paul not been resurrected by Desert Spring tears then he would've certainly lost.
@@Squampopulous Absolutely! Your cadence is great, I'm like 80% sure you wrote a script for this video, and you don't meander very much. Keep it up and keep improving. (And when you get famous, I can tell people I was your 8th subscriber XD)
I’m working on a story rn and these videos have helped me so much with the fights. Thanks for everything you’ve done and I hope you continue doing these great videos
I would argue that there is a fifth category on the fight spectrum where both parties are weak. They are so weak that any damage done to the opponent is either trivial or accidental. I cannot think of any examples of this, but I think this kind of fight mostly shows up in comedies for their humorous potential or in serious dramas where the fight is used to highlight the sorry state of the characters. For example, two drunk friends have a falling out and start fighting, but due to their inebriation neither is able to land an effective blow. This scene can be hilarious or really sad depending on the tone and circumstances of the scene.
- The pikachu vs pikachu slap-fight in the first Pokemon movie (all the pokemon fighting by that point are too tired to go on and it's very sad) - The last stretch of the final Sasuke vs Naruto fight in Naruto (to show how determined both are to go almost to the very end - that 'almost' setting up the ending)
arguably, this doesn't fit into the framework of what makes a fight there's no stakes and no consequences it's there for comedic relief instead of anything that a fight really is I'd argue this kind of fight isn't really a conflict and can easily be replaced with any other physical comedy bit
This can easily be made sad and tragic. Two characters nearing the end of a long-drawn tossup, both battered and bleeding on the ground, barely able to throw punches and feeble grabs at each other. One eventually gets the upper hand and very slowly beats the other to death with weak punches before having a physical/mental breakdown. You can make this more desperate by making them start fighting each other with rocks and rubble or having one of the characters slowly bleeding to death.
@fortcolors9887 Nah, there can be stakes and consequences. Let's say the two fighters have been poisoned. And there is only one dose of antidote left. But both fighters are so weakened by the poison that they are unable to incapacitate their opponent for long enough to grab the antidote for themselves. Now there are stakes.
The move that Paul executed was taught to him by Gunrney in the first film, so it was foreshadowed that he was going to use it in the second one. As for the playing with your food trope, I think that in itself is also an element of fly swatting and characterization, that a character is so powerful that they can sit back and just taunt their foe before viciously executing them. It's sorta a way of characterizing your villain as being sadistic, but great video regardless and being that it was your first is impressive!
What the Avengers did to win was *not* sacrifice Tony Stark. This let Tony invent time travel in Endgame so they could go back and win. Seeing that possibility is what made Strange change his mind. He gave up the time stone to protect Tony even though he had warned Tony earlier that he would make the opposite choice. Captain America also said something like, "we don't trade lives" in an earlier scene to further foreshadow the solution.
More specifically, Tony Stark had to narrowly survive the first encounter with Thanos, see Dr. Strange give up the Time stone for this ONE future, and have an entire 5 years that were his best and most peaceful years of his life where he finally builds a stable relationship with Pepper and has a daughter. Only after all of that is his character arc complete where he's willing to make a sacrificial play to save everyone else's families. He has to be reminded later by Strange that this is the only future where Thanos is defeated, and that's the moment where Tony Stark is ready to do the snap. If anything played out differently, Tony Stark wouldn't be so desperate and prepared to beat Thanos. If he didn't fight Thanos a first time, he wouldn't have learned anything (such as his idea of stealing the stones) to help him win the second fight. If he didn't survive, yeah he wouldn't invent time travel. If he didn't have 5 years with Pepper, he would probably still be paralyzed with anxiety over Thanos and not be ready to give it his all to face that. If he didn't see Strange's reminder that this was the only one way, then he would've tried to win without any sacrifices so he could go back to his peaceful life with Pepper. Plus, this characterizes Thanos as a super powerful, cunning being who couldn't be stopped by any other means. Simply appealing to Wanda or Captain Marvel wasn't good enough, because they would try to overpower Thanos and that didn't work out. It took Stark's adaptation to steal the stones, nobody else could've done that like he did.
To be honest, I thought it was the rat. Remember? It was a rat that free'd Ant Man from the Micro-world (I forgot the name), I thought it made sense since if the rat moved in any other way or was snapped then Ant Man wouldn't have been free'd and introduce the idea of time-travel.
@@vshatriya5254 That's kinda absurd. If Dr. Strange's actions could somehow affect the rat, then I'm sure his actions also affected the snap (who was chosen and who wasn't). If that's the case, then it seems entirely impossible that he could behave so precisely to cause the exact correct people to get snapped that causes the right conditions for that rat to do that. That'd be like Dr. Strange realizing the only way to win is by him rolling a dice in a specific way to get a 20. Even if he watched and memorized the hand motion used to roll that 20, you can't simply replicate it, so the result is still random.
@@Pehz63 Yeah, I thought that was why Dr. Strange only saw one way to win out of 14 million timelines. Had Ant Man not been freed by the rat then the Quantum Time Travel device wouldn't have been used. Since you can't predict what a rat would do then it becomes random, like 1 out of 14 million timelines random. In short I'm saying is that Dr. Strange took a gamble.
@@vshatriya5254 I think that's a dumb theory. I think it makes much more sense from an in-universe perspective, writing perspective, and viewing perspective if you assume the "one way" had to do with Dr Strange giving Tony Stark and the rest of the Avengers a loss that lasted 5 years to show them exactly what they're fighting for and give them time to mentally/emotionally prepare. It makes less sense from an in-universe perspective and especially a writing perspective and viewing perspective to assume this was just because he was hoping to randomly stumble upon the timeline in which a rat randomly walked over the button. I think that rat was more of an inevitability given Scott was left in the quantum realm alone.
As the film shows it, you're 100% right about Paul and Feyd's fight. All we can see is the physical struggle and some taunts. The book adds a whole other mental layer to the fight, and tbh my memory is a little fuzzy at this point, but from what I remember Paul basically convinces Feyd that he wants to lose. It was decided by intellect more than toughness. Feyd is the one with a fetish for pain and humiliation, and the film does touch on that, but doesn't explicitly work it into the fight like the book. But seeing it in the theater and having that context... I thought the fight (and the film) was excellent.
I think the idea of Paul winning through secrecy enforces the idea of him embracing his mother (being part of the bene gesserit) and the idea of exploiting the prophecy rather than his father (being for tuned more for honor). I don’t think the fight has Paul change in any way but more his development through the film
In the book, Feyd tried to win using secrecy (he had a nearly invisible poison needle extending from his knee), something that inherently fits the character of a Harkonnen very well. Paul's able to notice it from almost imperceptible aberrations in Feyd's movements (something Paul was only able because of his years of training as a Mentat, Warrior, and recently becoming prescient) and that's how he wins the battle. Characterization/strategy for both fighters. The thing is, it's impossible to put this on screen without making the fight super slow and having it zoom in a bunch of times, or adding anime-like internal dialogue throughout the whole thing. That's a major problem why barely any scenes from Dune movies/shows hold up to the books, it'd just be so weird and boring if they tried to get it one-for-one.
@@callmefleet For me, the fight in the book isn't the climax. The climax was the battle. And I think this is pretty normal for Dune: The fights must be played out to complete the story - but the meat of the story isn't in the fight. The fight scene in the book was a good expression of who Paul had become and what needed to happen. I think Denis wanted the fight scene to be the climax. So, he had to make it feel like the stakes were higher. Denis made Paul's sacrifices to follow his path a focal point of the movie. One was Chany (which was an awful choice IMO). Another is that he must go into this fight with full intention and commitment knowing he will get stabbed twice. It's a decently good theme to show. But it wasn't what the book was about.
@@callmefleet Just a tiny correction; the poison needle was on Feyd-Rauthas hip, not the knee. It was on a "fighting girdle" or something along those lines.
Obi-Wan didn't win. For Obi-Wan victory was that Anakin would turn back to the light side and repent. For the Jedi that Obi-Wan represented Anakin had to be killed or brought to justice, as the Jedi would have done in all other situations like this. Anakin also didn't win. He clearly just straight up lost. The only person who won in that fight was the one you didn't see but was present to the entire time. Palpatine won. Darth sidious won. Obi-Wan was in a mental fight against sidious, and he lost because he didn't even realize that he was fighting, but had he been a stronger force user he would have felt it and responded.
And that's part of the brilliance - the battle on Mustafar sets up the true victory for Obi-Wan in New Hope. He may be physically defeated, but preserving Luke's ability to turn to the light and indeed push him along that path would lead to the Emperor's defeat and Vader's redemption. Book-ending the story in reverse 20 years later is a pretty decent feat.
One of my favourite fights happens to also be from ATLA, being the climactic Zuko v Azula. I think its an excellent display of characterisation, for reasons I don't want to yap about tbh.
This was your *first* video? You did a damn good job. You're better than people who have been doing this for years, and I hope you continue to enjoy doing this, because I enjoyed this video!
Great vid! I'd like to add one more point to the Obi-Wan vs Anakin fight that actually fleshes out both characterization and strategy. Obi-Wan's final attack is a specific move called Mou Kei that is designed to dismember. The reason it works particularly well here is because it's a Sith tactic so Anakin would have never expected his own mentor to use it.
Great video! I'm glad YT algorithm made me stumble on your videos. A few good fight scenes that come to mind are from Hero, but there the aesthetics play a huge role. However, I especially liked the first one, where the two size up each other in silence, while we see in black and white flashes of how they imagine the fight will unfold until it's inevitable conclusion. Of course there are also all the fight scenes from The Princess Bride. P. S. I don't think you explained why scaling is stupid. However, I remember that I never liked these arguments about who would win in a fight between x and y. Keep it up!
@@GiantDwarf2718 appreciate the kind words! In the strategy section I talk about how rock paper scissors debunks power scaling. But you’re right I didn’t go too in depth.
Great video! Certainly helps me out as an aspiring writer. A personal favorite of mine is in Iron Man when he suits up in the Mark III for the first time. It's got great characterization as Tony takes control of the situation. Prior to that, the Ten Rings were still terrorizing. They even got the Jericho missile, which was the one thing they tried to force Tony into building. But once he realized that he made no significant changes, he went to town! Some of the most satisfying fly swatting I've ever seen!
I think "power of friendship" if done well can tick the boxes of either charactrization or strategy. For characterization a fight can tell us something about the relationship between several characters or at least how one character relates to someone else. For strategy, teamwork is a pretty powerful thing, there are things you can pull off as a group that are impossible alone.
Amazingly coherent breakdown of how to dissect a fight scene. I'd love dissections for more types of scenes like dialogue, travel maybe? Not sure what other types of scenes there are
When you said this was your first video and you had 0 subs I thought it was a joke, little did i know 💀 this vid is remarkably comprehensive & well put together and ending it with AOT was a big pleasant surprise. I'll be thinking more deeply about the structure of fight scenes from now on
This is immaculate for a "first video", had to check your channel because I straight up couldn't even believe it, especially when seeing the view count and the subscribers despite the video only being four weeks old. Cheers!
That "headbutt, take out the knife and neck stab the opponent" idea is used in the finale of the game Dying Light, and lemme tell ya even if that finale is just a bunch of QTE’s, that move hits hard and it hits right. Great video, very helpful!
Fun fact: even in vi vs servika fight they still give jayce characterisation the gauntlet is meant to be for mining so the sheild makes Sense (to protect from mining collapsed) and showing jayce thoughtfulness at least to his design.
Great video, I was surprised when you said it was your first because it's so well done. That said, I want to point out that at 20:32 in giving context for the Aang vs. Ozai fight you said Ozai was boosted by a Solar Eclipse. It's actually Sozin's Comet doing this, which is the same powerup that Sozin himself used to wipe out the Air temples 100 years before the events of the show. There was a solar eclipse earlier in the series though, known as the Day of Black Sun, that rendered all the firebenders powerless. This created an opportunity seized by Team Avatar to attempt to kill/capture Firelord Ozai but was thwarted by Azula, who was there in his place. Despite being powerless (relatively, she still has excellent pure martial arts) she taunts, lies, and uses some great strategy to succeed in her objective.
I think a perfect example of a world cup fight is also the last animated fight in "frieren, beyond journeys end", it has a great strategy revolved around the character of frieren and by that checking both criteria. Anyways very nice first video
i feel like a good example of a David and Goliath fight is the White Whale fight in Re:ZERO. Subaru uses his knowledge of when the White Whale will come to develop a strategy where he can gather an army of people to counter the white whale. They also have to use strategy to take it down, because it isn't as simple as stab and kill
Interesting video, I quite enjoyed your style. But I do disagree on a couple points. The first thing that caught my attention is Dune, Paul is a sneaky underhanded guy. That's kind of the point of the story, isn't it? He is purposely manipulating the fremen to get what he wants from them. The prophecy was crafted by the Bene Gesserit and he is using it for his advancement. He is, at his heart, a liar, a trickster. Having the final fight be a demonstration that he wins through being trickier than his opponent is good characterization. Now that said, I don't think the fight framed it well. I'm not even certain if that's the point the director was trying to make in the fight. The other part is, while I agree that the Boys 3 fight went too long, I do think that demonstrating that having the good strategy ultimately fail because of revealing personal motivations actually does fit your criteria. You asked what happened to the original plan. The characterization proved more important to Butcher than the plan. I think that's good. It weighs up protecting Ryan vs defeating Homelander for Butcher's characterization, one of the most important dichotomies of the character, and he chooses saving Ryan. Brilliant stuff. And I think seeing how that decision makes all the planning irrelevant good. Aggravating for the watcher who want to see Homelander get his comeuppance and wishing that all the characters were perfectly rational little drones. But that doesn't make it bad storytelling. Now, the reason I have a caveat on this, is because, after that point I basically agree with you. It went on too long, spent too much time wasted on stuff we already knew wasn't going to work. And the one real important change to the status quo: That Soldier Boy is off the table and so Homelander now in no regards can be engaged on an equal footing ever again, gets removed at the end of season 4. And, since this possibility was only really set up at the start of that season, it makes it being a change in status quo feel more like a return to the old status quo. Which kinda makes the season feel like it just spun its wheels. Somewhat amusingly I think both of the two above fights actual reveal another somewhat minor aspect of getting fight scenes right. Unless you have a legitimate purpose for doing otherwise, the ending of the fight should be a real climax and punctuate the purpose of the fight. The closer the Important Moment happens to the climax, the better more memorable it is. Butcher's characterization reveal happened in the first 5 seconds of the fight. That should have been the end. Assuming the Dune fight was supposed to showcase that deep down, when everything else is torn away, Paul truly is a liar, then that note should have been hit hard. And it's something that the Attack on Titan fight demonstrated very well. I really like your framework of the fight spectrum. And it helps put some ideas I have in perspective. Thank you for making this video, it was very enlightening.
A fantastic exaple of David vs. Goliath is the fight between Luffy and Usopp in One Piece. Usopp uses all these strategies, but still loses because his captain is just built different. It really brings out the hopelessness of his situation, emphasizing the stakes even more
And the characterization in that fight is top notch. All that pent up emotion in each character really comes to a head here. It’s here where we see the end of Luffy’s seemingly never-ending trust in people and especially his friends. Yet, it’s obvious that neither character wants to do this, but they feel they have to to prove something to themselves and each other. That’s what makes it so compelling. The fight *breaks* both characters. And us. It makes their eventual reconciliation even more impactful, because neither character truly ever wanted to leave each other, not really.
@@gabrielleite32 oh yeah. I didn’t cry at this part - that happened later with Robin’s “I want to live” - but I was _not_ emotionally ok while I was reading it. It hit extra hard because I recently witnessed, and was apart of, a pretty bad split between two friends I really cared about.
@@corbanbausch9049 oh, yeah, that Robin part. I can't even see the panel without my eyes tearing. That and many other ones now. And I'm sorry that happened with your friends
@@gabrielleite32 thanks. It’s getting better now. I have that panel screenshotted and saved to my phone because of just how powerful it is. It really took me from “I really like this story” to “I _love_ this story and these characters”
I actually think Brandon's best flyswatting scene is Kaladin at the climax of Rhythm of War. That sudden inversion of the villains going from dominant to fleeing in terror at a fully fledged Surgebinder is just peak, and both sets the tone for the future while wrapping up a power escalation we've been waiting two whole books to see.
Id say that Ozai not having a strategy on the final fight is part of his characterization, as he is the most powerful he has ever been and wouldn’t pay enough mind to Aang to actually make a strategy
Actually, Ozai DOES bring in strategy. It's a subtle thing, but Ozai only used fire at the beginning. Then he switch to spamming lightning for a while after the initial fire proves to not end the fight quickly, which would absolutely kill Aang (it actually did in the Season 2 Finale). Then Aang redirects the lightning, and Ozai is SHOOK. He saw Lightning Redirection once from Zuko during the Day of Black Sun, so he knows what he's looking at. But Aang fires it away from Ozai. Though Ozai is smug about Aang's restraint, HE DOES NOT USE LIGHTNING GENERATION FOR THE REST OF THE FIGHT. As confidant and powerful as Ozai is, he's also smart enough to not give his enemy a way to immediately win, even if he knows that Aang would not take full advantage of such power. That is some of the most blink-and-you-miss-it strategy from Ozai.
Good video. Fun watch. Also. Not bullshit exactly @6:24 as Doctor Strange gave up the time stone, something that up until THAT point in the story he said he wouldn't going so far to say he'd sacrifice the others to protect. A plot revisited when Banner Hulk goes back in time to retrieve said time stone. Other than that. Well done.
I had a biiger comment but my battery died so im just going to say that Spectacle fights have its place on a good fight IMO... like a Jacky Chan fight VS random people can be good to watch by itself, thanks to humor and good hands. Good video keep up the good work
A scene that has been living rent-free in my head the last few days is a shot from the Borderlands movie where Kevin Hart is sliding down a rope while his gun spits out a few CGI blasts with zero recoil or effect on anything (it should at least make the rope wobble, right?) and then it cuts to Edgar Ramirez with his CGI shield blocking the bullets. Since both effects cancel out, it just feels so pointless to me, like the way kids play pretend. "I shoot you with my laser gun!" "Nuh-uh! It doesn't hurt because I have a laser shield!!!"
anakin vs obiwan is all about characterisation. When obi and quingon get trapped in the laser doors vs maul, quingon sits down to calm down and connect with the force. Obi takes these lessons to heart. When obi is hanging in the vent hole, does the same, and from a disadvantaged position, overpowers maul. Anakin on the other hand is very impatient. And when he decides to use the dark side, throws away all theese teachings, even when obi is telling him, he decides to dissmiss him and brute force it.
That Vi vs Sevika fight was awesome. Defense was previously set up as Vi's weakness. Ekko says as much: "you still block with your face". So it's very proper that using a block is what made Vi win this fight.
You might have somewhat missed the point of The Boys S3 finale. The whole point is that the characterization trumps the strategy. Yes, it turns into a complete mess, but that's intentional. Butcher makes the choice to spare Ryan, and that totally screws their entire plan to take out Homelander. I think the problem is that you're looking at it as the "Homelander vs. everyone else" fight scene and then saying it fails as that, which it does. But in reality it's the "everything goes to shit because Butcher is still human" fight scene, and viewed through that lens you can more easily see why these choices were made. As for consequences, they lose Soldier Boy, they lose Ryan, they even kind of lose Queen Maeve. Just because the consequences are negative and none of the main cast dies doesn't mean the fight didn't matter. Your framework is interesting, but it really only works when applied to fight scenes that are played straight. If a fight "goes wrong," as it does here, I don't think you can reasonably apply all the same standards to it.
Yeah, the fight was devoid of strategy and pretty light on the consequences but it most certainly had characterization and definitely played to the story's themes. It's not the best fight but it most certainly did what it meant to do.
The problem is, we ended almost where we started. Homelander is alive and Ryan stayed with him, Soldier Boy got back to the lab, Butcher showed that he is ready to save Becca's son again (like in season 2). Stakes were there, but nothing actually was lost or obtained.
This is also a reoccuring theme of the boys. They go in with a great strategy, but due to their characterizations (they're all egotistical assholes,) everything quickly goes to shit
You’ll use them to compliment something else, take bolognese or pizza, a burger or a taco, but as its own thing, it’s just meh. Nobody ever goes and takes a bite out of just a tomato.
@@Squampopulous Mandalorian knida tries doing it too, pretty often, and I think their results are pretty decent. I used to kinda be eh on fly swatting action but i think it has actual merit since it's a really handy environment to just show competence and skill of the main character, as well as add some violence, it's just that a lot of shows nowadays don't have very good choreography, so fly swatting becomes boring, but stuff like Madness Combat is mostly fly swattting but it continues to be entertaining
2:06 you almost lost me when you started talking about powerscaling. Then you won me completely with that statement. FINALLY, someone thinks the same as I do
Maybe it's just me, but I never thought about Aang being connected again with the avatar state being sheer luck. When the world needs him, when the balance is threatened, the avatar shows up and saves the day, making him a living deus ex (in?) machina. The fight versus Ozai is the climax of the story. If nothing is done, the balance of the world will be destroyed forever. The universe will fight back through the Avatar, and so he appears to save us like the deus ex machina he is. Seems pretty coherent to me.
Absolutely excellent video regardless of experience. But, to be a *first video*? Damn impressive. Amazing work, man. Compelling insight. Perfect communication of your ideas. And, most importantly, super entertaining. I hope you spent a loooong time writing, compiling, and editing this. Like... months. Otherwise, I'll feel like lazy, talentless garbage. Keep up the fantastic work. You have a real skill here.
You make some very good points here, and convey them expertly. I will probably refer back to this video when writing fight scenes because it creates a fundamental layer that I didn't know I needed. Great stuff. Here are some thoughts I had or things I noticed while watching: 20:35 He's boosted by a comet. The solar eclipse _weakens_ Fire Benders. 5:33 David vs Goliath starts here, but its youtube chapter starts at 6:08. Likewise, most other chapters also do not match with when the video itself present them, with the chapter timestamps being later than the video's actual segments. Also, the Conclusion chapter doesn't work, since its timestamp is after the video ends.
I can't believe I'm about to defend the MCU. I hate it lmao. The reason endgame had the "one way to win" was because the only way to win was for Iron man to Sacrifice himself. That's why he looks at Strange and he holds up the 1 finger.
Yuuuuup I hpnestly have no idea how he was so wrong about that. It isnt perfect, but Strange's "one way we win" isnt to punch harder, he saw that he needed to give up the time stone, so Tony wouldnt die on Titan, so he could get another shot at Thanos later. He signals to Tony in Endgame that his "one way to win" moment was upon them, and Tony realizes the "one way" is a sacrifice play, taking and using the stones himself even though he knew it would be deadly. This is basically one big extended fight. It has amazing characterization, and great strategy. I do not love the MCU now, and I think Endgame made a lot of weird narative decisions that didnt work as well as something else could have, but the Strange and Tony sacrifice thing was really really good.
Captain America says in The Avengers that Tony isn't the guy to make the sacrifice play. The fact that he does in the end makes me wonder if that was just nice set up or if 14 million instances of Tony were all like "So I die, but I save all humanity? ... NAH. Blueberry?"
One thing I’d love to see is video game fights. Not just cutscenes, but how actual combat against enemies is presented. Example 1, Destiny’s Raid Bosses: Destiny has a boatload of content, but I think all can agree that the final bosses of raids are the peak experience that everyone strides towards. They more often than not are the definition of “David vs Goliath”. We defeat Oryx by detonating the Light he has gathered, the release weakening his powers, it’s strategy. We defeat Atheon by defying the fate-defining Oracles and, through a character moment of “guardians make their own fate”, we reveal that the power disparity is nowhere near as large. We defeat Riven, and she wins her Fly Swatting, gorging herself on our triumph - characterising her as a person who’d trade her life for more power, but also a cunning dragon that outsmarted us all. Example 2, Metal Gear Rising: Revengence: There’s less to say here. Most bosses are set up as toss-ups. The first fight against Metal Gear Ray is presented as a David vs Goliath, but turns out to be a Fly Swatting, as the lyrics of the accompanying song reveal to us that Ray is the pray in this dynamic. Then we get the inverse, after defeating Metal Geae Excelcius, we’d expect Armstrong to be of similar durability. Instead, he goes from a Toss-Up to a David vs Goliath, and Raiden wins by building on the lessons he re-learned over the course of the game - be ruthless or die.
genuine shock when you said this was your first video honestly, good job man 10/10 on quality
thanks you!
Same, I would have assumed that he had years of experience making content
So true right!!! What are these channels popping out of the abyss with 5 to 7 bangers already locked in!
Yeah I was like "hahaha good joke-- wait, what?"
@@Squampopuloussoon as you mention you hated tomato’s I subscribed
Stakes, consequences, and purpose is brilliant. This not only applies to fights but should be applied to almost every scene of a dramatic story.
@@pixxelwizzard you get it!
Award-winning author here. That is CORRECT. Every scene needs stakes, and a B, M, and E. That's why exemplary scenes can be uploaded and they can nearly stand all on there own as a "tiny story". NEED AN EXAMPLE? No problem. Look up the "They're Not Ready" scene from Ed Zwick's masterpiece of "The Last Samurai". You could also compare it to a similar scene in "Glory", where Broderick's character chants "Teach them... properly, Major. (also Zwick's work here).
You could ALSO also try some of my own...
🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨
"Before I start, I must see my end. Destination known, my mind's journey now begins. Upon my chariot, heart and soul's fate revealed. In time, all points converge; hope's strength, resteeled. But to earn final peace at the universe's endless refrain, we must see all in nothingness... before we start again."
🐲✨🐲✨🐲✨
--Diamond Dragons (series)
I'd argue those three are the same thing, cus usually the purpose is stopping the consequences from happening so the fight has stakes
@@guilhermeteodosio40 The purpose of the scene might be to reveal something about the character. The stakes are why we, the audience care about the conflict. The consequences are how the story is propelled forward by the results.
@@pixxelwizzard true, thanks
This is actually genius. Most people just say good fights come down to ‘subtext’ and ‘symbolism’ and don’t really expand on it. I love the depth this video goes into
thanks! Maybe i will make some more videos about each type of fight
I'm tired of hearing the word 'subtext'. I think I've heard it too many times lmao.
@@datboi1861 Fr. A fight can have as much subtext or additional meaning you want, but if the stakes aren’t there (plus all the stuff mentioned in the video) it’s a bad fight
I fucking hate symbolism, it is the laziest writing technique. It is completely uninteresting, the characters don’t even do anything about it. It’s just a reflection of the story rather than an advancement of it. It’s a stupid thing.
Subtext is necessary but can be overdone and made cringy and annoying.
@@wooblydooblygod3857 It's an ingredient you use, not the whole dish. Any trope can either be done lazily or extremely well.
I really like how you include shows of different mediums! A lot of videos will either just show western media (live action +arcane) or just show anime.
Glad you enjoy 😊
To be fair, anime in general has mastered the art of animated fights (most western animated fights never even come close) and live action goes to the east for their kung fu and wuxia films while the west has firearms based "combat" in a tight stranglehold and for good reason. Nobody does explosions and guns and war films both real and sci-fi as good as the west
Nah western cartoons clear in terms of fights, and most things really @@dretchlord873
Live action and Arcane. That's a very honest and accurte way of describing it.
15:34 I almost didn't believe you when you said it was your first video ever, but after I checked your channel and saw that you were telling the truth, I subscribed. Apparently I've serious trust issues.
Tbf, it's a well made video. I thought the same
In the fight between Obi Wan and Anakin on Mustafar I always interpreted Anakin losing as a result of his uncontrolled rage from joining the dark side which caused him to lunge at Obi Wan without properly judging that he was at a disadvantage at that point on the duel
Chances are it's true alongside Obi Wan's characterization. Really helps to seal in how great that characterization was for that fight.
I subscribe to the idea, that Obi Wan won, cause he has analyzed this scenario thoroughly before. In Episode 1 Obi Wan won against Maul in a similar situation, so the idea would be Obi Wan going through all the possible ways to not lose, if he was Maul. And in Episode 3 you get the result out of all his thinking.
Of course Anakin's rage and being drunk on dark side juice is part of it, which creates the opportunity for Obi Wan. But making use of that situation came from training.
Or maybe cus he wasn't a master... 👀
@@namelessscarf Are you saying the darkside has cookies AND juice!?
Yes, but there's more to it than that. What draws Force users to the Dark Side is power, but I remember from my time playing KotOR that what's important isn't so much power as it is control. This holds true for both sides of the Force.
Just as a Jedi who doesn't truly believe in justice and compassion will not be a good Jedi, a Sith who doesn't know how to control their anger and hatred will end up being controlled by them, becoming a slave to their passions rather than drawing strength from them.
True power comes not from the Force but from knowledge and acceptance of the self, and at that moment Anakin was so caught up in his self-hatred that he was bound to lose to Obi Wan. Say what you like about Obi Wan, but despite his mistakes and losses he never loses sight of who he is or what's important to him, which is perhaps why he's the strongest defensive duellist in all of Star Wars: an immoveable rock against which others clash their (usually weaker) convictions.
Kung fu panda has my favorite fight scenes of all time. Tai lung's break out of prison is a perfect fly swatting scene, showing just how powerful/ruthless/badass he is. Furious five against him is similar to show again just how powerful he is and how futile even 5 masters working together against him is. All setting up for the final fight/two fights with Tai lung vs shi fu showing the dynamic between the characters. How shi fu fails to stop his son and how Tai Lung is ruthless past the point of caring about his master. Then immediately into Po using Tai Lung's tunnel vision on power/the scroll against him as well as driving home the theme of self-acceptance, using his own fighting style to defeat Tai Lung
i definitely considered including Kung Fu panda
Also consider that it underpins the greater thematic conflict between Shifu and Oogway.
Shifu and Tai Lung bth saw Po as a fat and easily distracted jokester. However, when Shifu finally gave in and took Oogway's advice, those same traits turned Po into a well-armoured, highly creative, and level-headed warrior.
Immunity to Tai Lung's strikes? Natural fat.
Immunity to taunts? He's THE big fat panda, he has no illusions about what he is.
Wuxi finger hold? He figured that one out himself, just because it's awesome. Skadoosh!
Why is the fight so much longer than it could've been? So that all of this has room to play out perfectly.
I feel like a counterargument as to why a fly swatting fight should be short and as you described with omni man vs the guardians, is ironically, mark vs omni man. That is a perfect example of how the villain "playing with his food" in a long drawn out fight can be some of the most gripping drama in television history.
Also as first vids go, you knocked it out of the park:)
I think it's important to note however, that there are really two fights going on in that scene. The one sided brutal physical smackdown that Omni man is giving mark. And the philosophical debate about the inherent value of human life Vs space fascism. While we watch mark get absolutely swatted by his dad, he refuses to give in mentally and in the end, that is why omni man still loses the fight.
yea, that fight served such important characterization
The internal struggle in Omni-man was the real fight.
@@ragabutler89 To add on to what you wrote, because of the fact that it's actually two fights it manages to simultaneously fall into both the fly-swatting category and David vs Goliath. Omniman wins physically, but Mark wins psychologically.
@@Squampopulous Couldnt that flt into an entirelty new category called "The Beatdown" Its like fly swatting but has the express purpose of beating a charater down to build them up again.
I think that one thing to remember is that a lack of strategy isn't nothing. IF a fight scene lacks strategy from a party (e.g. Ozai in the ATLA fight), that doesn't make it a bad point. I think that his lack of strategy was purposeful and shows a lot of characterization of Ozai and the brute that he is. While pure slugging can be borish, characters with no strategy shouldn't automatically serve as a point for a bad fight scene as it does display the type of character we get.
You could say his strategy was to constantly attack Aang and give him no time to breathe. Even when Aang redirects his lightning and catches him off guard, Ozai immediately attacks him right after that and even knocks him out for a few seconds.
Tbh i loved Ozai's highly aggressive fighting style. It made it the most dynamic fight in the entire show.
Outstanding video! Enjoyed it immensely.
One note on the Dune 2 fight scene - the way Paul wins is a callback to the his training with Gurney in the first movie where Paul thinks he wins and Gurney quips, “You would have joined me in death.” Revealing the knife that had been ‘stabbed’ into Paul’s belly during his aggression.
This is the culmination of both characters’ arcs because Paul has learned and matured into a brave and cunning warrior where he once would have lost. In contrast, his opponent fell victim to the tunnel vision of aggression in the same manner young Paul had.
Best of luck on future videos!
Paul's fight is actually decided by his ability to see into the future. In the book, it’s explained that winning against Feyd-Rautha required Paul to rely heavily on his prescient abilities, not just his skill as a fighter. For the first time, Paul fully embraces his role as the Kwisatz Haderach in a life-and-death situation, seeing many possible futures and navigating the one path to victory. This duel marks a turning point where he transcends his physical limits and begins to rely on his prescience to an almost supernatural degree.
I'd say they mishandled this fight in Dune: Part Two. Even as someone familiar with the book, the fight felt underwhelming. Unlike Paul’s duel with Jamis in Part One, where we see flashes of his prescience informing his actions, the Feyd fight lacks any indication of Paul foreseeing the battle. This omission leaves the audience without the crucial understanding of why the fight plays out as it does. We should have seen several flashes where he messes up and dies, it would have made it clear what's at stake why he choses the path he choses.
In the book, Paul not only sees the future but is willing to sacrifice himself-literally and figuratively-for his vision. This fight is where he truly places his full trust in what he has foreseen, knowing that without it, he would lose. It’s a major moment of character growth, testing his ascendance and cementing his god-like awakening. The duel represents Paul’s transformation into a figure who is no longer bound by physical abilities alone, becoming essentially undefeatable. This profound development is entirely missing in the movie, reducing the fight to a quick and unsatisfying resolution that lacks the weight it deserves.
I'd argue that it would not only make the fight scene better but later his "betrayal" of Chani, where the audience would UNDERSTAND that he simply chooses a path he sees most fit to achieve his goals. (This is just such a painful thing for me as much of the second book's theme revolves around Paul being essentially obsessed with finding the right path, nearly losing his whole humanity in the process)
Oh that makes this fight much better.
@@another7674it’s wrong tho. In the book, he actually cannot see the fight at all. It’s a huge black hole in his vision. Going in he’s actually thrilled to experience a fight wear he doesn’t no the outcome. The future he sees doesn’t require him to be alive because he knows he becomes either a spiritual figurehead or a martyr but either way the jihad happens
Shoutout to the final battle of Everything Everywhere All At Once: when Evelyn decides to “fight with love”, which could have been an empty platitude in a lesser movie, she uses her knowledge of the entire multiverse to find ways for each of the opponents to be happy, incapacitating them in perhaps one of the quickest ways possible, and leading her to save Joy. It’s a great blend of character meeting strategy, and it’s all to serve the message of the story
i have to rewatch that movie it was great
that movie was so boring
@@Seinsmelled there’s a lot of things you could call that movie, boring is certainly not one of them
@@brandonm1708 i was on my phone for 95% of it and almost vomited when that hot dog finger scene was shown
@@Seinsmelled oh, so you weren’t even watching the movie. That’s your fault, not the movie’s.
Also it’s kinda funny that you were that disgusted by a gag about hot dog fingers
Aang would have won against Ozai without Avatar-state with his lightning redirection, but he was too good guy to do that and missed on purpose.
@@VarjoFilosofi yup, more characterization
@@Squampopulous Yeah, it showed the difference between their personality. I think that's partly what made Ozai attack Aang in such straight forward aggression. He thought Aang was a weak minded pacifist who wouldn't fight back. (it's not like Ozai was wrong). Imagine Ozai facing Kyoshi in same situation. It would have been a bloodbath.
I love this. It shows that the choice to have Aang let Ozai live was actually a good one:
Throughout the entire show, Aang struggled to balance his principles with his great power. By the end, after all the grief, after overcoming fear and reluctance, he finally learns to control the Avatar state for real. His unwillingness to kill Ozai and break his principles is what made him unbendable in the end, which is not technically who he was in the show's beginning.
So, he would lose
@@gianni206And if anything, its a practical decision too. Ozai's death would make him a martyr to any of his would be or aspiring loyalists out there.
Him utterly left powerless gave him a fate worse than death and ensured no catastrophic retaliation.
I added the previous part to emphasize Aang never forgave Ozai as much as Katara never forgave her mother's killer.
Paul wins because he was more human. "You’ve heard of animals chewing off a leg to escape a trap? There’s an animal kind of trick. A human would remain in the trap, endure the pain, feigning death that he might kill the trapper and remove a threat to his kind."
Its a direct reference to Paul's first meeting with the Reverend Mother, his benegesserit training, and the very beginning of his story. He won by turning back to the lessons from the beginning
nice analysis!
I think this is good analysis but if anything it shows how at this point paul is even more inhumane, the benegesserit are very archaeic and plan thing out in an inhuman timescale and paul now able to see the future discards his humanity and wins because he's competent and knows by seeing the future he will win. The fight is honestly just a formality in the lore of the movie it seems like a dramatic moment but he languishes in the drama to assert himself as a powerful leader
Don't forget the other massive payoff: Paul finishes Feyd the exact way he himself was defeated by Thanos during a training session at the start of the first movie. Both times, the fighter on the offense realizes he's "winning", gets excited, and rushes to finish the job, allowing the defending fighter to exploit a gap in the attacker's attention and land a surprise stab. Even the mock "final blow" was also off screen in the first movie, we only see it once Thanos points it out. But of course this also fits the "more human" mould that Mother Mohiam outlined.
@@BAMGM Didn't paul dream this? like they had two frames of that closeup shot where he stabs feyd. To be fair thats not something you realize on first or even second watching.
That's also a way of House Atreides. Show your brave face to others, let them see your courage in the face of death, but if you can, shuffle things behind the curtain to your liking to come on top when everybody expects it the least. Deploy shady tactics if necessary.
One of my new favorite creators. To-the-point, subtly funny, and informative. No excessive derailing to pitch subscribing to your channel, frequent use of examples to sell your points. Perfection.
I actually like the fight from the boys. The fact it's set up with a good strategy then devolved into mayhem fits the theme of the show and as well was interesting to watch.
The characterization is that despite these people trying to work together, their own conflicting agendas override your dedication to their initial plan which would have worked it ends up going poorly for them in the end.
I agree, and I would argue that this is actually a good fight. This fight showcases the characterization of everyone involved by showing us that they are all flawed. They have a strategy going in, but as soon as the fighting breaks out their plans all fall away and they end up in chaos due to their own lack of coordination and cooperation. Each character allows their selfish impulses to take over and as a result the plan falls apart and the fight ends up being a loss. We're reminded that this world is a gritty one. Our heroes are going to need more than just confidence, determination, and the power of friendship to win here. This isn't a story where the "good guys" win simply because they're the good guys.
This fight functions a lot like the second act in a trilogy. Our main characters had some successes up until now, and it looked like they were on their way to victory. Only for them to get knocked down to their lowest points. We're shown just how flawed they are, and just how stacked the odds are against them. The point is driven home that they have a lot more work to do if they want to have any hope of succeeding.
Same - also, it DID have consequences. Queen Maeve depowered, and they lost Soldier Boy as an asset.
True! While he was technically right the intent of the fight was that their initial plan of playing the soldier boy trump card failed and so did everything else almost like a domino effect. The consequence of the fight was that their chance of using soldier boy vs homelander again failed once and for all and that queen maeve basically cant be active anymore, probably for her best
It also tied with the themes of family, with Butcher throwing his revenge out of the window and even briefly joining with Homelander against Soldier Boy to save Ryan. The whole season is about family and generational trauma and the fight brought all of that to it's climax.
I agree. It showcased how, despite their seemingly united front in killing Homelander, there are too many conflicting priorities and circumstances.
Had Homelander not gone to retrieve Ryan, there would be nothing to stop Butcher from staying on-point and killing Homelander. He'd have gladly taken the full brunt of SB's blast if he thought it meant killing or de-powering Homelander. However, Ryan is the *one* priority Butcher has that supersedes his desire to kill Homelander.
By contrast, SB wants to kill Homelander because of his deal with Butcher, and because he sees Homelander as an unworthy successor to his mantle as the world's best hero, fulfilling the cycle of abuse that began with his own father. In this, we can see that SB is just as monstrous as Homelander, and we, the audience, can agree that SB is at least almost as bad as Homelander, and we are meant to understand/agree with Butcher's decision to prioritize Ryan at the moment.
Then we have Maeve who, unlike Butcher, has no lines she will not cross to see Homelander dead. And while Squampopulous criticizes Maeve for having 'no strategy', we spend much of the season watching Maeve train like a madwoman for the fight she knows is coming, and it *shows* in that fight. Homelander is so laughably inexperienced that when someone that can actually hurt him comes at him for real, it's not difficult to out-fight him, it's just difficult to maintain that advantage because he's stronger and faster and much harder to meaningfully harm. Maeve throws everything she has at Homelander until he gouges out one of her eyes and then it becomes clear SB is about to take out the entire floor, and Maeve decides she does have ONE line she won't cross; letting a bunch of innocent people die along the way.
In the end, Maeve decides to *truly* be a hero, believing it would cost her her life. That's great characterization, even if it comes at the cost of strategy, but I can understand the frustration; if everyone would just swallow their qualms about SB, they could have Homelander dead, which is *the entire goal* of the team, but they all have costs they're not willing to pay to have that happen.
Butcher has Ryan.
Hughie has Butcher and Annie.
MM has his own beef with SB that he maybe feels will go unresolved if SB wins, because he'd either disappear or return as Vought's new flagship hero.
Annie has Hughie and an innate desire to be a hero and avoid collateral damage.
And then Maeve decides she would rather be a hero than kill the villain.
As we gear up for the last season, I have to wonder what lines the Boys will have to agree to cross if it means bringing down Homelander for good.
watched the video for the arcane thumnail, stayed for the great analysis, subscribed for the aot praise
Glad you enjoyed!
AoT praise and Arcane praise in one video? Perfect.
edgerunners pfp 🙏🏿
Quick correction about the Aang vs Ozai fight.
A solar eclipse disables all firebending, Ozai was more powerful because of Sozin's comet, hence the final 4 episodes are titled Sozin's comet part 1-4.
Ozai is characterized throughout the show as being brutal, aggressive, and valuing power over everything; he's a classic bully who's only strategy is being bigger and stronger than his opponents.
It's why his grand plan for winning the war is simply to wait for the comet to come back and give them more power.
Which is why really its a terrible fight, and nearing one of the worst fights in ATLA. It actually attacks the shows own themes, and essentially makes the whole thing pointless. Aang did nothing to win the fight and won by default, and unless you think 'divine right means I deserve it more than you' is a good theme, Aang does nothing to upset the source of Ozai's characterization, and Aang wins by invalidating his own character struggle of the finale arc. And strategy wise its a fly swatting fight both ways.
It's really a shame just how bad the final episode of Avatar is. The shows really good up to that point, and by comparison, Katara and Zuko vs Azula is a much better finale fight. Its Azula losing more than it is Katara winning, ending her themes of being an alternate for Zuko. Zuko loses because he sacrifices himself for what he believes in rather than taking the win, Azula loses because she is single minded and gets trapped by it. Both fit the characterization themes really well, ie its just a big allegory for Zuko's arc. It's a pretty meaningless fight for Katara, but the fight isn't really setup as a Katara fight to begin with, she kinda intrudes on it at the end.
The problem with the finale of Avatar is that the character arc Aang shows at the end cant be resolved, especially in a kids show. Aang does not want to kill the firelord. The problem is, if you want a fight to be real, especially between one murderous character who's the top of the food chain, 'defeating the character' and 'killing the character' have to be treated as basically synonyms.
If Aang just like, knocked out and arrested the Fire Lord, or if that was even treated as something he could do, Aang's entire arc is just stupid. 'Well then don't kill him, its not that hard'. So 'defeat the Fire Lord' must mean 'kill the Fire Lord'. Thus the fight DOES treat it that way. Aang loses the entire fight because he wont fully try. But by giving him an automatic win anyway, and then a get out of jail free card at the end, it raises the question 'what was the point of this stupid arc?'. So the whole thing is totally meaningless and a waste of the viewers time.
@@fearedjamesit's perfectly valid characterization for Aang to be pressured into betraying his own values by everyone, then in the end deciding to stick to his guns by finding his own way.
@@appended1 Except he did not do that, he was given a free out. Furthermore, he only has this decision after the fight that he one sidedly lost, and then was given a free out of.
Basically, the ending sabotages his entire show arc.
@@fearedjames But that was the point, no? Struggling with what he has to do(killing the firelord) vs what he wants to do(end the war without killing) is his main conflict. He wasn't losing the fight before the "automatic win" either, he had a chance to kill Ozai with Lightning Redirection, and was stronger as a bender in general. Its good BECAUSE despite that opening, despite all his power, he never compromises on his unshakable values and finds a way to finish it on terms he agrees with.
That was what the the whole lion-turtle arc was all about. Aang desperately seeking validation from friends and previous avatars, hoping one of them would agree that killing Ozai was not the answer. After exhausting everything, the literal creators of bending gave him an answer he was looking for, but not shown until the actual fight, so we dont go into it thinking "ah, he already has a trump card, why watch this fight?".
The fight was not perfect, but it was leagues better than a fly-swatting avatar state yipyip floor wipe. We've seen this throughout the show multiple times. And while he is not infallible during the avatar state(donut time), he definitely always wins when the stakes are too important to the story(his loss to azula drove the story, we KNOW he's not gonna lose to Ozai during the finale). If Aang finally accepted that he HAS to kill Ozai, that is undoubtedly horrible character writing. it would be the fattest stinker to have him go against how he was built up since Book One, only to fall under the pressure and just go "fuck it".
@@fearedjames That's a lot of text just to say you didn't get the point. The "free out" Aang gets isn't free, it's characterization, because it's made very clear that the only reason he was able to do it is because he chose to commit to his beliefs instead of using his all-powerful godmode to smoke Ozai. It's characterization because it could've been a fly-swatting but Aang didn't want it to be.
Just a small note: Doctor Strange actually does experience and remember each of his deaths while fighting Dormammu.
He even says that he can lose and lose for eternity. We even see him fall after a reset and choose to get back up.
Yeah, he's a lot more worn down at the end than he is in the first loops.
That's also the whole reason why he becomes an instantly accomplished sorcerer in future movies. He spent years looping and using Dormammu as practice.
@@rs5922 while I usually hate stuff like that, I actually really liked that for doctor strange. He had to endure God knows how many years worth of deaths, fucking with this ancient entity to basically annoy it into leaving him alone
@@damienshue5990 Really? To me it felt like Dormammu realized he has lost after a couple dozen cycles.
First video essay? I've seen videos from people who've been posting essays for years that are not nearly as concise clear and clever as this great job man
17:52 Literally no consequences because solider boy isnt even dead
Annoyed me so much, his blast probably wouldn't even kill homelanders son, it would just take his powers away which wouldn't have been a bad thing
At all! Queen Maave should have sacrificed herself she deserves that honor
“Fly swatting” fights can also be good for the loser. Like them going up against someone they CAN’T beat. Not a david vs goliath where they “can’t” beat them. But end up winning anyway. A fly swat could show a characters bravery, their final stand. Or maybe their hubris or pride.
"If I can't win, I'll at least make sure these fuckers never forget my name" is a story element I love but see far too rarely, so I'm 100% with you on this.
one great example of this would be usopp vs luffy in one piece :)
Cinder Vs Pyrrha in RWBY
Mark vs Anissa in Invincible
Mumen Rider vs Deep Sea King.
I think its important to note how Pyrrhic Victories interact with your chart, particularly when there is a sizeable power imbalance. Take the ending of Rogue One, where Vader pops in long enough to be absolutely horrifying. It *seems* like classic fly-swatting on the surface, he's just tearing through everyone he comes across, there's not a chance of a conventional victory for the Rebels...
...but the Rebels do win, in a sense. They're nearly all slaughtered, but the whole point of the fight is for the Death Star Plans data, which the nameless rebels do manage to get to safety. Their only real strategy is running away and passing along the data, but it does work. Its something that's always important to keep in mind, not all victories or defeats are alike, sometimes the guys that look like they lost actually pulled off the strategic win they needed, and sometimes the omnipotent badass still can't achieve whatever he's hoping for.
yeah this would be somewhat of a david vs goliath. in the video i said that the fight is not always about defeating your opponent, but achieving your goal. their goal was to get the data to leia and they did. their strategy was just immense sacrifice
@@Squampopulous This is just like the scouts vs the beast titan fight
Yea the AoT Beat Titan fight it this exactly. It's a perfect phyrric moment with dozens of soldiers giving their lives for a chance at victory through tactics and bravery.
There should be a 5th category including Erwin vs Beast Titan, Rebels vs Vader, Aragorn at the Black Gate Of Mordor.
To use a chess meme, "He sacrifices THE ROOK!" Sometimes the heroic side has to make a hopeless stand and suffer crushing losses in order to give themselves a shot at victory. This is neither exactly a David/Goliath (as there is no chance of direct victory) nor a Flyswatting (since the "losing" side actually wins).
“Power scaling is stupid” I CANNOT agree more
i also cant agree more
it may be stupid but its fun
@@Internetflamingexactly
it's just for fun
@@InternetflamingIt's not fun. At all. It was a cool gimmick the first time. But the millionth time having seen power scaling so involved is super annoying and not fun at all.
Holy crap, this is probably one of the better videos i found regarding fights and powerscaling, especially when it comes to the different win "conditions" that come with each one for it to be a properly good fight. Great job on the video, pretty good!
Incredible vid cant believe this is your first. Hope you find the growth you deserve :)
One thing I like about David vs Goliath type fights is that sometimes, all that is needed is pure tenacity. Also exemplified by Doctor Strange's "fight" with Dormammu. Dormammu tells Strange that he will never win, and strange retorts "No... But I can lose. Again, and again, and again, and again forever. And that makes you my prisoner." Outside of fights where the power differential is THIS huge, that same tenacity is sometimes all that is needed. Trying again and again, just waiting for the one attempt where the enemy will make a mistake.
I can see what you mean, but the dormammu "fight" is kinda a bs fight as its neither fly-swatting or david vs goliath, arguably it could be a world cup, cuz both sides of the party are referred as the strongest amongst all others
I know it's a small detail, but the Sherlock fight has a lot more characterisation than just 'Sherlock smart and fight good'.
The context of the fight: he glimpses his old love Irene Adler in the crowd (who leaves the handkerchief behind as a calling card of sorts) and is momentarily distracted. His opponent takes advantage of his distraction to spit on the back of Sherlock's head, insulting him and making him look bad in front of Adler.
His fight analysis has two very specific focuses:
1. The very first line is 'This must not register on an emotional level.' Sherlock has just seen an old flame of his and is obviously shook, but IMMEDIATELY stops himself from feeling anything further. The fact that he so quickly rejects his emotions is highly indicative of Sherlock's view of emotion as a weakness, so of course he falls back on the old reliable: logical analysis. The way he leaves the fight is also very telling: after he wins he doesn't celebrate or rub it in his opponent's face, he just calmly and casually walks away, takes his winnings and grabs a bottle of drink as though nothing remarkable happened. Again, he's not letting what happened register on an emotional level: cool, calm, controlled, even though he was upset just a moment ago.
2. Every move Sherlock uses in that fight is specifically targeted to break or injure a part of his opponent's body that is involved in the process of either spitting or insulting, specifically his jaw, ribs and diaphragm. We learn from this that Sherlock is capable of being EXTREMELY vindictive when he wants to be: presumably up until that point he was fighting just because he enjoyed it, but as soon as his anger switch is flipped he becomes a completely different person. For Sherlock in this moment, hiding from his anger and vulnerability, it isn't enough to just win the fight: he has to win in a way that proves his complete superiority and also disables the man from spitting on him ever again. It's a very cold and calculated form of revenge, which, for a very brief moment, paints Sherlock in an almost villainous light, much like how Gojo completely and mercilessly destroys Hanami.
So, yes: the fight is not so much about Sherlock's superpower of analysis, because as you say we already know about that. The fight introduces Sherlock's ex, shows us how Sherlock feels about his own emotions, how he reacts to being insulted while vulnerable, and the way he reacts to and expresses his anger. It sets up events that happen later in relation to Adler, which I will not spoil, and presents Sherlock as a character who uses logic and cold revenge as a mask for his anger, which both compares him to the villain Moriarty and gives Sherlock a chance to change for the better later in the story.
You're looking into it too hard. Sherlock won because discombobulate
The duality of men
Well he did say it was a toss-up
That description of Sherlock is _hot_ !
@@InternetAddict069 Just watched it then and I honestly think it's a fly swatting. It looked like a toss-up because Sherlock wasn't fighting at his best, he was putting on a show for the crowd. It wasn't really a fight scene, it was pure exposition. Then his priorities changed and it become purely fly-swatting as described by this video and a good one at that. Fast, to the point, full of characterisation.
The move Paul pulled wasn’t what you made it out to be at all, the grab was to buy time to use the very first move Gurney Taught him in Dune 1, to “make his opponent join him in death.” A strategy developed by Gurney Hallick, a man well versed in opposing the Harkonnens.
Why is everyone forgetting that Paul at this point can see the future.
really weird misunderstanding in an otherwise great video lol
@@gahrzerkire1193 the staging of the fight de-emphasizes Paul's prescience on purpose : Feyd is presented as an equal opposite to Paul. if Paul was shown to "see the code" of the fight, we lose that balance.
I choose to see it as a fight against a relatively unpredictable enemy against whom Paul can't predict every moves like he did on the large scale battle - however he does know Feyd's sadism, and he has leaned from gurney to strike where the enemy doesn't see him coming, as well as knowing to endure pain to avoid death.
that said that emphasis on Paul's good quality kind of gets lost in the tragedy of Paul becoming the scourge of the galaxy.
I wish he had broken down the fight scene from the book too because that would've cleared up his problems in a way probably more effective than the fight that he proposed
@@gahrzerkire1193Exactly. Paul is on the golden path. He knew what sacrifice a win would require but the win wasn’t in question.
Very entertaining thank you. Only suggestion is to add a 'spoiler incoming' note or something for X show before going into details. Good luck with the channel!
This is a fantastic analysis of fight scenes. Thank you. :)
A misinterpretation you made was that in Dune 2 the characterization of Paul isn't a person who is "tough" and "determined". But he starts that way and over the course of the series becomes more politically versed in the ways of deception which is exactly why it's a knife fight, it resembles classic court-like antics. Paul starts off being this typical "good natured optimist". Once he learns what they future has in store and he gets his visions he becomes a determinist thinking that there's only one possible way to the future that he wants. In a way the Dune 2 fight was actually a perfectly characterized his arch. He's not this optimistic hero resembling a religious figure anymore but a man who wants to do sneaky stuff in political games, which is exactly why the knife was off camera. To be fair a lot of people make this mistake and see him as this charismatic hero, which is the entire point of the dune series, when in fact he's putting on a facade to start a war.
Nah, I think he's right. The Dune series is too pretentious, and it's dialogue is nonsensical. It tries too hard to sound smart, where it forgets to think about audience because it's more bothered about showing off. Think this fight scene analysis shows it... It tries to surprise the audience instead of build any character, or suspense.
No, sorry, but it is you who are completely misinterpreting it. First of all, Paul never "starts off" as a good natured optimist, not in the book, not in the movie. The character is shown as very much grounded, realist and pragmatist. Yes there is some playfulness here and there, but he is far from being an optimist. But most importantly, what do you mean by "he's not resembling a religious figure anymore"??? What? The Atreides house was never religious in the first place. After drinking the "water of life" Paul embraced his prophecy and literally wages a holy war on the whole known universe killing everyone who refuses to adhere to his religion, and his son literally became the God Emperor. The fight at the end was not some metaphor for a political game, it was to show the fremen how much he is willing to sacrifice for them, so that their faith strengthen in him. He used psychology of religion to benefit him because he saw that this sequence of events would benefit him the most. It's not about politics, it's about the harmful nature of religious faith and the misplaced trust in charismatic figures.
@@magicbuns4868 Have you considered that maybe you just don't understand it? Because I, and many others, don't have the same problems as you. I've read the books and seen the movies and I never felt that it was pretentious or that the dialogue is nonsensical. Yes Frank Herbert had some weird ideas, especially in the later books, but overall he always held to the main ideas, philosophies and concepts of the Dune series. Yes it's complex and it might require some research to really understand some of his points (especially in God Emperor of Dune, which is very philosophy heavy), but I think I would rather ponder and think about his books than to have it spoon fed to me in a dumbed down way.
@@magicbuns4868 I think you're just not smart mate
@@magicbuns4868 i think this is a case of "i didn't get it, so other people must not have as well" because dune would not have been successful enough to be a constant staple in sci-fi for nearly 60 years if the audience couldn't understand it.
Paul wins the fight because he’s mastered pain and prescience, using the wound in his hand to both slow Feyd’s attack and mask the pain of pulling his own knife from his own ribs. Whereas Feyd is a sadist who hyperfixates on pain because he loves it (which causes him to focus on Paul’s face, and fall for Paul’s trap).
And we DO see the final knife move onscreen, but it happens earlier in the movie. Watch the shot of Paul’s hand when he explains the narrow path to victory right after becoming truly prescient.
That fight was an improvement over the book’s incredible fight. It didn’t just show solid human biomechanics in martial arts, or the psychology and eye patterns of elite fighters, it *also* showed a specific way Paul’s prescience mattered to victory.
It was in that moment I knew Denis fully comprehended and showed how Paul became more terrifying and inhuman than Feyd-Rautha. Ironic, considering that mastery of pain is what the Bene Jezzerit believe is the mark of true humanity… Which also makes this fight scene a thesis moment for Denis’ two Dune films.
We agree on the rest of the video, but you missed the point of the Dune II finale. And I think you missed it by focusing too much on theory and tropes here. Otherwise, thumbs up. 👍
EDIT: I forgot to mention that Gurney uses the same winning move in the shield sparring sequence at the start of the first movie. Excellent foreshadowing.
Yeah the novel set this the fuck up and then some, don't know if the movies did quite as well.
Everything was already pre-determined, its both Strategy and Characteristic that won Paul that fight, simply becase he had the gift of foresight.
I came here to add that it was a call back to the 1st movies sparring session
I also think it shows the characters of both fighters. Paul is ruthlessly efficient, focused on the outcome 'by any means necessary', including looking weak in the eyes of your opponent ('oh no, I got stabbed, yeah you got me bad') - not something Fayd would ever do. In contrast, Fayd tends to show off, play with his opponents (to him each fight is a fly swat). This is foreshadowed in his earlier fight with the non-drugged Atreidis captive, whom he also doesn't kill straightaway.
Yeh he completely misses the point of the fight. First of all it was foreshadowed in Paul's vision and secondly Paul wins because he's willing to do what it takes to win. Unlike Feyd, by now Paul has faced death many times and he's got nothing to lose. While Feyd impressive as he is as a fighter he's never had to worry about losing nor has he fought an energised non-drugged and battle hardened opponent willing to endure significant physical pain to survive. This not withstanding Paul's Bene Gessirit training which allows has taught him techniques to ignore physical pain. Feyd is technically better than Paul but he doesn't have that true warrior I've got nothing to lose attitude. He thinks its a done deal when he stabs Paul and his mind is already shifting to thoughts of him being the Emperor. It doesn't occur to him that his opponent is desperate enough to pull a knife out of his body and blindside him.
As for strategy, Paul has seen it in his visions and while he doesn't know exactly how the fight would play out he knows what he needs to do to win. Seems like this guy missed a lot of subtext in Dune Part 2.
On the Paul Feyd fight: at least in the book the fight is in a sense intentionally anticlimactic. The author has talked about how he was trying to end the book so weirdly and abruptly that the reader is "ejected from the book" and forced to think of the themes of the book without getting a proper ending.
Also: the message of the fight is at least partially Paul knowing ahead of time that he will win the fight but get wounded in it, which will cement his mythos. The whole fight is... Predetermined, both in diagetic and nondiagetic ways.
But still...
I agree, the fight could have been done better.
great analysis!
If that was the author's intention I would've loved to see the movie fight handled the same way. Having everything in the climax suddenly stop and rushing the audience to the falling action would've been a brilliant twist if done right.
@@johnnyjoseph3679 I believe they did manage to do this in the siege. The bombs are used, worms ride into battle, we see maybe 20 seconds of hand to hand combat, and then they enter the "palace" and take everyone prisoner etc.
That's within the narrative of the book, what the movie tries and fails to do is completely separate from the book.
What the movie did succeed in doing was raise stakes for people, Paul knew he'd get stabbed and still win so he just went along because why make a show of it? His personality is evolving to be pragmatic and cunning not hust tough or violent in the way the video describes.
The toughness comes from the fact he saw himself get stabbed and decide to go along woth it, not because he is the type of person to do more than a simple stab or cut (literally all he does is simple stabs and cuts because that is what works) @@basileusbasil4041
I like Slime's Megido scene as a wonderful example of fly squatting, showing a major depature of Rimuru's original humanity and his turn into a being beyond that in power.
Fern vs Lugner is a wonderful example of a Toss-Up presented to be David vs Goliath and a showing how paper beats rock (Fern is inferior in skill and overall ressources, but her casting speed and specific magic is a horrible match-up for Lugner, on top her 2 hidden strategy). It's probably my favorite fight in the series, even if Frieren and Fern vs Frieren's clone is a spectacle.
Anyway absolutely wonderful work of a video super high quality, very excited to see the rest you have brought out!
Currently writing a book. This video will be going in my “study” folder. Great video.
Really glad it was helpful!
SAME!
The Paul and Feyd fight Is more about how similar they are, Feyd and Paul are both heir's to potentially the most powerful planet In the universe (Also both harkonnens). So them both getting stabbed in the gut but only Feyd's being lethal Is just an extension of that, Feyd got so close but just wasn't enough. You can also argue that the stab off screen is kinda symbolic of how much of the fight was already decided off screen due to Paul's visions.
Paul saw this In the split second vision during the water of life scene. So that's how he likely why he lets himself get stabbed yadda yadda "There's a narrow way through".
Great point! My personal opinion is that it could have been more entertaining, but I can definitely why so many people love it.
@@Squampopulous thats fair enough, i too thought it was a strange fight on my first watch
Great points & I also only caught the glimpse of Paul seeing the killing blow in his vision on my 2nd watch. So I guess you could say this was a fight won through both characterization & strategy because Paul chose to drink the Water of Life which showed him the narrow way through & he acted accordingly to fulfill the vision of his ascension.
Another source of tension while I watch the fight is that while Paul does have the advantage as far as seeing all the possible futures, he does nearly lose the fight. Feyd had only relatively recently begun his journey into Bene Gesserit teachings & tests. In that field, Feyd is a rookie as opposed to a fairly experienced Paul. Had Feyd been exposed to the Bene Gesserit ways a bit sooner he may have won. Had Paul not been resurrected by Desert Spring tears then he would've certainly lost.
@@browniebear 100% they are such great foils to each other.
In the book their mental strategies are both on display
Dude the production quality on this is insane! How do you only have 7 subscribers? 1:40 in and I'm hooked!
Thanks man! Really appreciate the kind words
@@Squampopulous Absolutely! Your cadence is great, I'm like 80% sure you wrote a script for this video, and you don't meander very much. Keep it up and keep improving.
(And when you get famous, I can tell people I was your 8th subscriber XD)
@@Iliadic I'll be lucky to call myself the 884th :)
@@Peta813 3 weeks and he gained 800 subscribers? Well done @Squampopulous
@@Iliadiccheck again bud ;)
Great video, Brother. Loved all of your examples and clips. Can't wait to see what else you've got to share
I’m working on a story rn and these videos have helped me so much with the fights. Thanks for everything you’ve done and I hope you continue doing these great videos
I would argue that there is a fifth category on the fight spectrum where both parties are weak.
They are so weak that any damage done to the opponent is either trivial or accidental.
I cannot think of any examples of this, but I think this kind of fight mostly shows up in comedies for their humorous potential or in serious dramas where the fight is used to highlight the sorry state of the characters. For example, two drunk friends have a falling out and start fighting, but due to their inebriation neither is able to land an effective blow. This scene can be hilarious or really sad depending on the tone and circumstances of the scene.
- The pikachu vs pikachu slap-fight in the first Pokemon movie (all the pokemon fighting by that point are too tired to go on and it's very sad)
- The last stretch of the final Sasuke vs Naruto fight in Naruto (to show how determined both are to go almost to the very end - that 'almost' setting up the ending)
MGS4 perhaps? Snake vs Ocelot. Two old men battling with their fists
arguably, this doesn't fit into the framework of what makes a fight
there's no stakes and no consequences
it's there for comedic relief instead of anything that a fight really is
I'd argue this kind of fight isn't really a conflict and can easily be replaced with any other physical comedy bit
This can easily be made sad and tragic. Two characters nearing the end of a long-drawn tossup, both battered and bleeding on the ground, barely able to throw punches and feeble grabs at each other. One eventually gets the upper hand and very slowly beats the other to death with weak punches before having a physical/mental breakdown. You can make this more desperate by making them start fighting each other with rocks and rubble or having one of the characters slowly bleeding to death.
@fortcolors9887 Nah, there can be stakes and consequences.
Let's say the two fighters have been poisoned. And there is only one dose of antidote left. But both fighters are so weakened by the poison that they are unable to incapacitate their opponent for long enough to grab the antidote for themselves. Now there are stakes.
The move that Paul executed was taught to him by Gunrney in the first film, so it was foreshadowed that he was going to use it in the second one. As for the playing with your food trope, I think that in itself is also an element of fly swatting and characterization, that a character is so powerful that they can sit back and just taunt their foe before viciously executing them. It's sorta a way of characterizing your villain as being sadistic, but great video regardless and being that it was your first is impressive!
What the Avengers did to win was *not* sacrifice Tony Stark. This let Tony invent time travel in Endgame so they could go back and win. Seeing that possibility is what made Strange change his mind. He gave up the time stone to protect Tony even though he had warned Tony earlier that he would make the opposite choice. Captain America also said something like, "we don't trade lives" in an earlier scene to further foreshadow the solution.
More specifically, Tony Stark had to narrowly survive the first encounter with Thanos, see Dr. Strange give up the Time stone for this ONE future, and have an entire 5 years that were his best and most peaceful years of his life where he finally builds a stable relationship with Pepper and has a daughter. Only after all of that is his character arc complete where he's willing to make a sacrificial play to save everyone else's families. He has to be reminded later by Strange that this is the only future where Thanos is defeated, and that's the moment where Tony Stark is ready to do the snap.
If anything played out differently, Tony Stark wouldn't be so desperate and prepared to beat Thanos. If he didn't fight Thanos a first time, he wouldn't have learned anything (such as his idea of stealing the stones) to help him win the second fight. If he didn't survive, yeah he wouldn't invent time travel. If he didn't have 5 years with Pepper, he would probably still be paralyzed with anxiety over Thanos and not be ready to give it his all to face that. If he didn't see Strange's reminder that this was the only one way, then he would've tried to win without any sacrifices so he could go back to his peaceful life with Pepper.
Plus, this characterizes Thanos as a super powerful, cunning being who couldn't be stopped by any other means. Simply appealing to Wanda or Captain Marvel wasn't good enough, because they would try to overpower Thanos and that didn't work out. It took Stark's adaptation to steal the stones, nobody else could've done that like he did.
To be honest, I thought it was the rat. Remember? It was a rat that free'd Ant Man from the Micro-world (I forgot the name), I thought it made sense since if the rat moved in any other way or was snapped then Ant Man wouldn't have been free'd and introduce the idea of time-travel.
@@vshatriya5254 That's kinda absurd. If Dr. Strange's actions could somehow affect the rat, then I'm sure his actions also affected the snap (who was chosen and who wasn't). If that's the case, then it seems entirely impossible that he could behave so precisely to cause the exact correct people to get snapped that causes the right conditions for that rat to do that. That'd be like Dr. Strange realizing the only way to win is by him rolling a dice in a specific way to get a 20. Even if he watched and memorized the hand motion used to roll that 20, you can't simply replicate it, so the result is still random.
@@Pehz63 Yeah, I thought that was why Dr. Strange only saw one way to win out of 14 million timelines. Had Ant Man not been freed by the rat then the Quantum Time Travel device wouldn't have been used. Since you can't predict what a rat would do then it becomes random, like 1 out of 14 million timelines random.
In short I'm saying is that Dr. Strange took a gamble.
@@vshatriya5254 I think that's a dumb theory. I think it makes much more sense from an in-universe perspective, writing perspective, and viewing perspective if you assume the "one way" had to do with Dr Strange giving Tony Stark and the rest of the Avengers a loss that lasted 5 years to show them exactly what they're fighting for and give them time to mentally/emotionally prepare.
It makes less sense from an in-universe perspective and especially a writing perspective and viewing perspective to assume this was just because he was hoping to randomly stumble upon the timeline in which a rat randomly walked over the button. I think that rat was more of an inevitability given Scott was left in the quantum realm alone.
This is your first video? Good gods my guys you've more than earned my sub! Definitely checking out more of your content
"All you really need to know, is that power scaling is stupid"
🤣Liked the video!
As the film shows it, you're 100% right about Paul and Feyd's fight. All we can see is the physical struggle and some taunts. The book adds a whole other mental layer to the fight, and tbh my memory is a little fuzzy at this point, but from what I remember Paul basically convinces Feyd that he wants to lose. It was decided by intellect more than toughness. Feyd is the one with a fetish for pain and humiliation, and the film does touch on that, but doesn't explicitly work it into the fight like the book. But seeing it in the theater and having that context... I thought the fight (and the film) was excellent.
can't wait for the next installment
I think the idea of Paul winning through secrecy enforces the idea of him embracing his mother (being part of the bene gesserit) and the idea of exploiting the prophecy rather than his father (being for tuned more for honor). I don’t think the fight has Paul change in any way but more his development through the film
In the book, Feyd tried to win using secrecy (he had a nearly invisible poison needle extending from his knee), something that inherently fits the character of a Harkonnen very well. Paul's able to notice it from almost imperceptible aberrations in Feyd's movements (something Paul was only able because of his years of training as a Mentat, Warrior, and recently becoming prescient) and that's how he wins the battle. Characterization/strategy for both fighters.
The thing is, it's impossible to put this on screen without making the fight super slow and having it zoom in a bunch of times, or adding anime-like internal dialogue throughout the whole thing. That's a major problem why barely any scenes from Dune movies/shows hold up to the books, it'd just be so weird and boring if they tried to get it one-for-one.
@@callmefleet For me, the fight in the book isn't the climax. The climax was the battle. And I think this is pretty normal for Dune: The fights must be played out to complete the story - but the meat of the story isn't in the fight. The fight scene in the book was a good expression of who Paul had become and what needed to happen. I think Denis wanted the fight scene to be the climax. So, he had to make it feel like the stakes were higher. Denis made Paul's sacrifices to follow his path a focal point of the movie. One was Chany (which was an awful choice IMO). Another is that he must go into this fight with full intention and commitment knowing he will get stabbed twice. It's a decently good theme to show. But it wasn't what the book was about.
@@callmefleet Just a tiny correction; the poison needle was on Feyd-Rauthas hip, not the knee. It was on a "fighting girdle" or something along those lines.
Obi-Wan didn't win. For Obi-Wan victory was that Anakin would turn back to the light side and repent. For the Jedi that Obi-Wan represented Anakin had to be killed or brought to justice, as the Jedi would have done in all other situations like this. Anakin also didn't win. He clearly just straight up lost. The only person who won in that fight was the one you didn't see but was present to the entire time. Palpatine won. Darth sidious won. Obi-Wan was in a mental fight against sidious, and he lost because he didn't even realize that he was fighting, but had he been a stronger force user he would have felt it and responded.
And that's part of the brilliance - the battle on Mustafar sets up the true victory for Obi-Wan in New Hope. He may be physically defeated, but preserving Luke's ability to turn to the light and indeed push him along that path would lead to the Emperor's defeat and Vader's redemption. Book-ending the story in reverse 20 years later is a pretty decent feat.
One of my favourite fights happens to also be from ATLA, being the climactic Zuko v Azula. I think its an excellent display of characterisation, for reasons I don't want to yap about tbh.
When he said a david and goliath could be done because of a blunder from goliath i instantly thought of this fight
Nearly 55k subs in a little over 3 months? Not bad duder, subbed and I wish you the best moving forward.
This was your *first* video? You did a damn good job. You're better than people who have been doing this for years, and I hope you continue to enjoy doing this, because I enjoyed this video!
Great vid! I'd like to add one more point to the Obi-Wan vs Anakin fight that actually fleshes out both characterization and strategy. Obi-Wan's final attack is a specific move called Mou Kei that is designed to dismember. The reason it works particularly well here is because it's a Sith tactic so Anakin would have never expected his own mentor to use it.
fascinating!
Where'd you get.this from?
Great video!
I'm glad YT algorithm made me stumble on your videos.
A few good fight scenes that come to mind are from Hero, but there the aesthetics play a huge role. However, I especially liked the first one, where the two size up each other in silence, while we see in black and white flashes of how they imagine the fight will unfold until it's inevitable conclusion.
Of course there are also all the fight scenes from The Princess Bride.
P. S. I don't think you explained why scaling is stupid.
However, I remember that I never liked these arguments about who would win in a fight between x and y.
Keep it up!
@@GiantDwarf2718 appreciate the kind words! In the strategy section I talk about how rock paper scissors debunks power scaling. But you’re right I didn’t go too in depth.
Great video! Certainly helps me out as an aspiring writer.
A personal favorite of mine is in Iron Man when he suits up in the Mark III for the first time. It's got great characterization as Tony takes control of the situation. Prior to that, the Ten Rings were still terrorizing. They even got the Jericho missile, which was the one thing they tried to force Tony into building. But once he realized that he made no significant changes, he went to town! Some of the most satisfying fly swatting I've ever seen!
glad you enjoyed!
I was so surprised when I heard "that's my first video". This is completely amazing content 🎉
Excellent video! Really opened my eyes on how to analyze fight scenes
@@winnywinnarts thank you!
I think "power of friendship" if done well can tick the boxes of either charactrization or strategy. For characterization a fight can tell us something about the relationship between several characters or at least how one character relates to someone else. For strategy, teamwork is a pretty powerful thing, there are things you can pull off as a group that are impossible alone.
The problem is that its usually not done with a team strategy, but simply the caracthers gaining moral boost and suddenly becoming stronger.
The only real "power of friendship" is a group of friends jumping a single opponent
Like Frodo and Sam making the final climb up mount doom. "I can't carry the ring, but I can carry YOU!"
Amazingly coherent breakdown of how to dissect a fight scene. I'd love dissections for more types of scenes like dialogue, travel maybe? Not sure what other types of scenes there are
have made a couple more videos since, let me know what you think!
Bro's first video ever is a full essay? With good rythm? And tons of movie analysis? Damn, that's awesome
Great analysis! I've never heard such depth to this idea of what makes quality fight scenes. It makes sense to me.
When you said this was your first video and you had 0 subs I thought it was a joke, little did i know 💀 this vid is remarkably comprehensive & well put together and ending it with AOT was a big pleasant surprise. I'll be thinking more deeply about the structure of fight scenes from now on
haha thanks, im glad you liked it!
This is immaculate for a "first video", had to check your channel because I straight up couldn't even believe it, especially when seeing the view count and the subscribers despite the video only being four weeks old. Cheers!
That "headbutt, take out the knife and neck stab the opponent" idea is used in the finale of the game Dying Light, and lemme tell ya even if that finale is just a bunch of QTE’s, that move hits hard and it hits right.
Great video, very helpful!
glad you enjoyed!
Holy moly, ur good, it sounds like you have been doing this forever
As a writer, this video is literally amazing and has helped me understand how to write fights way better. HUGE props tom you.
Fun fact: even in vi vs servika fight they still give jayce characterisation the gauntlet is meant to be for mining so the sheild makes Sense (to protect from mining collapsed) and showing jayce thoughtfulness at least to his design.
super useful for writing, and includes the best fights from across the board, awesome video
Thanks!!
Great video, I was surprised when you said it was your first because it's so well done.
That said, I want to point out that at 20:32 in giving context for the Aang vs. Ozai fight you said Ozai was boosted by a Solar Eclipse. It's actually Sozin's Comet doing this, which is the same powerup that Sozin himself used to wipe out the Air temples 100 years before the events of the show. There was a solar eclipse earlier in the series though, known as the Day of Black Sun, that rendered all the firebenders powerless. This created an opportunity seized by Team Avatar to attempt to kill/capture Firelord Ozai but was thwarted by Azula, who was there in his place. Despite being powerless (relatively, she still has excellent pure martial arts) she taunts, lies, and uses some great strategy to succeed in her objective.
Keep rolling mate, this video was awesome. Congrats!
This was really good. I like writing analysis/help videos. (I forgot the other word)
14:20 because he has something that Feyd doesn't, precognition, he already knows this will happen
I think a perfect example of a world cup fight is also the last animated fight in "frieren, beyond journeys end", it has a great strategy revolved around the character of frieren and by that checking both criteria. Anyways very nice first video
the airbender breakdown was really great, probably the best i’ve heard
had to consult with the best
15:36 whoa. I'm definitely subscribing, great first video
This blew up insane for a first video damn. Congrats you deserved it
i feel like a good example of a David and Goliath fight is the White Whale fight in Re:ZERO. Subaru uses his knowledge of when the White Whale will come to develop a strategy where he can gather an army of people to counter the white whale. They also have to use strategy to take it down, because it isn't as simple as stab and kill
Interesting video, I quite enjoyed your style. But I do disagree on a couple points. The first thing that caught my attention is Dune, Paul is a sneaky underhanded guy. That's kind of the point of the story, isn't it? He is purposely manipulating the fremen to get what he wants from them. The prophecy was crafted by the Bene Gesserit and he is using it for his advancement. He is, at his heart, a liar, a trickster. Having the final fight be a demonstration that he wins through being trickier than his opponent is good characterization. Now that said, I don't think the fight framed it well. I'm not even certain if that's the point the director was trying to make in the fight.
The other part is, while I agree that the Boys 3 fight went too long, I do think that demonstrating that having the good strategy ultimately fail because of revealing personal motivations actually does fit your criteria. You asked what happened to the original plan. The characterization proved more important to Butcher than the plan. I think that's good. It weighs up protecting Ryan vs defeating Homelander for Butcher's characterization, one of the most important dichotomies of the character, and he chooses saving Ryan. Brilliant stuff. And I think seeing how that decision makes all the planning irrelevant good. Aggravating for the watcher who want to see Homelander get his comeuppance and wishing that all the characters were perfectly rational little drones. But that doesn't make it bad storytelling. Now, the reason I have a caveat on this, is because, after that point I basically agree with you. It went on too long, spent too much time wasted on stuff we already knew wasn't going to work. And the one real important change to the status quo: That Soldier Boy is off the table and so Homelander now in no regards can be engaged on an equal footing ever again, gets removed at the end of season 4. And, since this possibility was only really set up at the start of that season, it makes it being a change in status quo feel more like a return to the old status quo. Which kinda makes the season feel like it just spun its wheels.
Somewhat amusingly I think both of the two above fights actual reveal another somewhat minor aspect of getting fight scenes right. Unless you have a legitimate purpose for doing otherwise, the ending of the fight should be a real climax and punctuate the purpose of the fight. The closer the Important Moment happens to the climax, the better more memorable it is. Butcher's characterization reveal happened in the first 5 seconds of the fight. That should have been the end. Assuming the Dune fight was supposed to showcase that deep down, when everything else is torn away, Paul truly is a liar, then that note should have been hit hard. And it's something that the Attack on Titan fight demonstrated very well.
I really like your framework of the fight spectrum. And it helps put some ideas I have in perspective. Thank you for making this video, it was very enlightening.
those are some great points, and i am glad you enjoyed the video!
A fantastic exaple of David vs. Goliath is the fight between Luffy and Usopp in One Piece. Usopp uses all these strategies, but still loses because his captain is just built different. It really brings out the hopelessness of his situation, emphasizing the stakes even more
And the characterization in that fight is top notch. All that pent up emotion in each character really comes to a head here. It’s here where we see the end of Luffy’s seemingly never-ending trust in people and especially his friends. Yet, it’s obvious that neither character wants to do this, but they feel they have to to prove something to themselves and each other. That’s what makes it so compelling. The fight *breaks* both characters. And us. It makes their eventual reconciliation even more impactful, because neither character truly ever wanted to leave each other, not really.
@@corbanbausch9049 first time i ever cried with anime was this fight. It hit HARD
@@gabrielleite32 oh yeah. I didn’t cry at this part - that happened later with Robin’s “I want to live” - but I was _not_ emotionally ok while I was reading it. It hit extra hard because I recently witnessed, and was apart of, a pretty bad split between two friends I really cared about.
@@corbanbausch9049 oh, yeah, that Robin part. I can't even see the panel without my eyes tearing. That and many other ones now.
And I'm sorry that happened with your friends
@@gabrielleite32 thanks. It’s getting better now. I have that panel screenshotted and saved to my phone because of just how powerful it is. It really took me from “I really like this story” to “I _love_ this story and these characters”
This is the best I’ve ever seen of a discription on this kind of thing I love it
This is an incredibly interesting video, massive respect for it being your first one
The "flyswatting" scene in Mistborn is a perfect example of how to do that type of "fight"
I actually think Brandon's best flyswatting scene is Kaladin at the climax of Rhythm of War. That sudden inversion of the villains going from dominant to fleeing in terror at a fully fledged Surgebinder is just peak, and both sets the tone for the future while wrapping up a power escalation we've been waiting two whole books to see.
@@brett_zesty I think the idea of this type of scene is sheer explosive displays of power, with which the Lord Ruler has Kal beat.
Id say that Ozai not having a strategy on the final fight is part of his characterization, as he is the most powerful he has ever been and wouldn’t pay enough mind to Aang to actually make a strategy
Actually, Ozai DOES bring in strategy. It's a subtle thing, but Ozai only used fire at the beginning. Then he switch to spamming lightning for a while after the initial fire proves to not end the fight quickly, which would absolutely kill Aang (it actually did in the Season 2 Finale). Then Aang redirects the lightning, and Ozai is SHOOK. He saw Lightning Redirection once from Zuko during the Day of Black Sun, so he knows what he's looking at. But Aang fires it away from Ozai. Though Ozai is smug about Aang's restraint, HE DOES NOT USE LIGHTNING GENERATION FOR THE REST OF THE FIGHT. As confidant and powerful as Ozai is, he's also smart enough to not give his enemy a way to immediately win, even if he knows that Aang would not take full advantage of such power. That is some of the most blink-and-you-miss-it strategy from Ozai.
Good video. Fun watch. Also. Not bullshit exactly @6:24 as Doctor Strange gave up the time stone, something that up until THAT point in the story he said he wouldn't going so far to say he'd sacrifice the others to protect. A plot revisited when Banner Hulk goes back in time to retrieve said time stone. Other than that. Well done.
For a first ever video, well done!
New favorite UA-camr ♥️
I had a biiger comment but my battery died so im just going to say that Spectacle fights have its place on a good fight IMO... like a Jacky Chan fight VS random people can be good to watch by itself, thanks to humor and good hands.
Good video keep up the good work
thank you!
A scene that has been living rent-free in my head the last few days is a shot from the Borderlands movie where Kevin Hart is sliding down a rope while his gun spits out a few CGI blasts with zero recoil or effect on anything (it should at least make the rope wobble, right?) and then it cuts to Edgar Ramirez with his CGI shield blocking the bullets. Since both effects cancel out, it just feels so pointless to me, like the way kids play pretend. "I shoot you with my laser gun!" "Nuh-uh! It doesn't hurt because I have a laser shield!!!"
anakin vs obiwan is all about characterisation.
When obi and quingon get trapped in the laser doors vs maul, quingon sits down to calm down and connect with the force. Obi takes these lessons to heart. When obi is hanging in the vent hole, does the same, and from a disadvantaged position, overpowers maul.
Anakin on the other hand is very impatient. And when he decides to use the dark side, throws away all theese teachings, even when obi is telling him, he decides to dissmiss him and brute force it.
That Vi vs Sevika fight was awesome. Defense was previously set up as Vi's weakness. Ekko says as much: "you still block with your face". So it's very proper that using a block is what made Vi win this fight.
Excellent first video 🎉 Take your time and enjoy making the next one!
You might have somewhat missed the point of The Boys S3 finale. The whole point is that the characterization trumps the strategy. Yes, it turns into a complete mess, but that's intentional. Butcher makes the choice to spare Ryan, and that totally screws their entire plan to take out Homelander. I think the problem is that you're looking at it as the "Homelander vs. everyone else" fight scene and then saying it fails as that, which it does. But in reality it's the "everything goes to shit because Butcher is still human" fight scene, and viewed through that lens you can more easily see why these choices were made. As for consequences, they lose Soldier Boy, they lose Ryan, they even kind of lose Queen Maeve. Just because the consequences are negative and none of the main cast dies doesn't mean the fight didn't matter. Your framework is interesting, but it really only works when applied to fight scenes that are played straight. If a fight "goes wrong," as it does here, I don't think you can reasonably apply all the same standards to it.
Yeah, the fight was devoid of strategy and pretty light on the consequences but it most certainly had characterization and definitely played to the story's themes. It's not the best fight but it most certainly did what it meant to do.
The problem is, we ended almost where we started. Homelander is alive and Ryan stayed with him, Soldier Boy got back to the lab, Butcher showed that he is ready to save Becca's son again (like in season 2).
Stakes were there, but nothing actually was lost or obtained.
This is also a reoccuring theme of the boys. They go in with a great strategy, but due to their characterizations (they're all egotistical assholes,) everything quickly goes to shit
25:34 I forgot to comment at the start of the video, probably because I wasn't super invested, but TOMATOS ARE GREAT FRUITS.
You’ll use them to compliment something else, take bolognese or pizza, a burger or a taco, but as its own thing, it’s just meh. Nobody ever goes and takes a bite out of just a tomato.
@thatbigflacotaco2657 I definitely just go and take a bite out of a tomato
I feel like the value in Fly Swatting is that if done well, it can show the skill of the character, like John Wick and Madness Combat.
absolutely
@@Squampopulous Mandalorian knida tries doing it too, pretty often, and I think their results are pretty decent.
I used to kinda be eh on fly swatting action but i think it has actual merit since it's a really handy environment to just show competence and skill of the main character, as well as add some violence, it's just that a lot of shows nowadays don't have very good choreography, so fly swatting becomes boring, but stuff like Madness Combat is mostly fly swattting but it continues to be entertaining
This was the most fun I had in a video and actually learned a lot!
LOVE that Striga made it into the video - her Day Armor scene is one of my favorite fights from the series.
2:06 you almost lost me when you started talking about powerscaling. Then you won me completely with that statement. FINALLY, someone thinks the same as I do
It isn't stupid, he just doesn't understand power scaling like a bunch of people on the Internet do nowadays
Maybe it's just me, but I never thought about Aang being connected again with the avatar state being sheer luck.
When the world needs him, when the balance is threatened, the avatar shows up and saves the day, making him a living deus ex (in?) machina. The fight versus Ozai is the climax of the story. If nothing is done, the balance of the world will be destroyed forever. The universe will fight back through the Avatar, and so he appears to save us like the deus ex machina he is. Seems pretty coherent to me.
0:13 HEY tomatoes a fricking good. Sh-shut up.
Tomatoes are the best
As a tomato fan, I’m deeply offended by this guy
Get a load of these tomato sympathizers.
@@bro-dude99 As a tomato fan, I’m deeply offended by this guy (2)
love from Brazil
No there not
Absolutely excellent video regardless of experience. But, to be a *first video*? Damn impressive. Amazing work, man. Compelling insight. Perfect communication of your ideas. And, most importantly, super entertaining. I hope you spent a loooong time writing, compiling, and editing this. Like... months. Otherwise, I'll feel like lazy, talentless garbage. Keep up the fantastic work. You have a real skill here.
You make some very good points here, and convey them expertly. I will probably refer back to this video when writing fight scenes because it creates a fundamental layer that I didn't know I needed. Great stuff.
Here are some thoughts I had or things I noticed while watching:
20:35 He's boosted by a comet. The solar eclipse _weakens_ Fire Benders.
5:33 David vs Goliath starts here, but its youtube chapter starts at 6:08. Likewise, most other chapters also do not match with when the video itself present them, with the chapter timestamps being later than the video's actual segments. Also, the Conclusion chapter doesn't work, since its timestamp is after the video ends.
I can't believe I'm about to defend the MCU. I hate it lmao. The reason endgame had the "one way to win" was because the only way to win was for Iron man to Sacrifice himself. That's why he looks at Strange and he holds up the 1 finger.
Yes this is so ridiculously obvious I am sitting here baffled and questioning everything else on the video
Imagine waffling about defending the MCU.
Have you received your Edgy Contrarian award yet?
Yuuuuup I hpnestly have no idea how he was so wrong about that.
It isnt perfect, but Strange's "one way we win" isnt to punch harder, he saw that he needed to give up the time stone, so Tony wouldnt die on Titan, so he could get another shot at Thanos later. He signals to Tony in Endgame that his "one way to win" moment was upon them, and Tony realizes the "one way" is a sacrifice play, taking and using the stones himself even though he knew it would be deadly.
This is basically one big extended fight. It has amazing characterization, and great strategy. I do not love the MCU now, and I think Endgame made a lot of weird narative decisions that didnt work as well as something else could have, but the Strange and Tony sacrifice thing was really really good.
Forshadowing can create good writing, but just because something is forshadowed, does not make it well written.
Captain America says in The Avengers that Tony isn't the guy to make the sacrifice play. The fact that he does in the end makes me wonder if that was just nice set up or if 14 million instances of Tony were all like "So I die, but I save all humanity? ... NAH. Blueberry?"
One thing I’d love to see is video game fights. Not just cutscenes, but how actual combat against enemies is presented.
Example 1, Destiny’s Raid Bosses:
Destiny has a boatload of content, but I think all can agree that the final bosses of raids are the peak experience that everyone strides towards. They more often than not are the definition of “David vs Goliath”. We defeat Oryx by detonating the Light he has gathered, the release weakening his powers, it’s strategy. We defeat Atheon by defying the fate-defining Oracles and, through a character moment of “guardians make their own fate”, we reveal that the power disparity is nowhere near as large. We defeat Riven, and she wins her Fly Swatting, gorging herself on our triumph - characterising her as a person who’d trade her life for more power, but also a cunning dragon that outsmarted us all.
Example 2, Metal Gear Rising: Revengence:
There’s less to say here. Most bosses are set up as toss-ups. The first fight against Metal Gear Ray is presented as a David vs Goliath, but turns out to be a Fly Swatting, as the lyrics of the accompanying song reveal to us that Ray is the pray in this dynamic. Then we get the inverse, after defeating Metal Geae Excelcius, we’d expect Armstrong to be of similar durability. Instead, he goes from a Toss-Up to a David vs Goliath, and Raiden wins by building on the lessons he re-learned over the course of the game - be ruthless or die.