my guy is meant to be the smartest in crafting besides Sauron yet he needed alloys explained to him when at that point he was already quite old and had a reputation apparently.
he didn't think about alloys or different techniques on how to achieve his goals...and is surprised when breakthroughs the level of primates discovering fire are made...yet we're supposed to believe he can enchant powerful items? My man can barely work a forge...
@@lordsathariel4384 He was born in Aman, so yes. He's one of the oldest Elves still around in Middle-Earth. Though there may be some unnamed Noldorin Elves in Lindon and Eregion that are older given that he's Feanors grandkid and wouldn't have been born in Aman for a decent amount of years after the Noldor arrived there.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
Shadow of Mordor/War is a perfect example of how "fanfiction" aka not lore accurate story, can still win the hearts of many and not completely piss off every Tolkien lover. Amazon could learn much from what fans LOVE and not force their own ideals onto its viewers.
When the first game came out, it was received fairy well by tolkienheads but for second one, oh boy. It was shitted on in every corner of the internet. Memes of sexy Shellob were everywhere. There was a consensus that the game's lore is trash, the gameplay was that of an AC clone and the only saving grace was the nemesis system. You are watching this through rose tinted glasses because the franchise is now at a lower point that it was back in 2017.
@@methexis9934 not everything is going to be loved by everyone. People hate the movies. But the fast majority loved them just like the fast majority loved Shadow of Mordor/War. Amazon have not reached that level of love and enjoyment
@@CaptainMyron Majority of fans still loved the game, it was super successful and very enjoyable. Yes it was not lore accurate, yes some people didnt enjoy that aspect and yes there was memes. But it did not ruin the success of the game because the game as a whole was very good. Amazon did not accomplish that so RoP failed in terms of success, this is the point being made here.
@@morgomirwd You talk like a seller. Your commentary is not based on anything related to the quality of the game, the popularity is everything but an argument. There is plenty of masterpiece hated by people. Your so-loved game is full of crapy ideas litteraly insulting the memory of the original Lord of the Rings - and juste because it has been a near-average good game (by copying the gameplay of real goods games), it magically became itself a masterpiece in the eye of the layman.
Acts like it too. Compare that to how the elves in Lotr behave and compose themselves, and the difference becomes clear. They just don't feel like ethereal elves really
@@tototats001 With good writing, multiple viewings/readings reveal more details that make it even better and deeper. With RoP, it's stupid on first viewing, and if you actually think about it, you keep discovering new layers of stupidity, deeper than the roots of the mountains.
as someone who for quite a few years has been learning casting silversmithing and many other forms of metalwork this celebrimbor made me upset on a deeply emotional level on how stupid he sounds for who he is meant to be.@@bambostarla6259
@@arieljuarez963 Still, part of being an elven master mettalurgist and smith is the knowledge. Even if the elves didnn't need to use alloys, you can be damn sure they knew about the technique.
Tbh your interpretation of the scene is bad.... He knows what alloys are but had not considered the possibility of it being better for his goal. He states plainly that the alloying would make it weaker showing his blind sightedness is my guess. But i agree much better if Sauron had only helped with the idea on not applying as much force rather then suggest alloys can be good too.
Shadow of Mordor series: Celebrimbor is a damn force of nature, consumed by a lust for revenge that only Talion understands, as both are forced to endure when they were murdered alongside their families. Not only is he formidable in raw power and fighting skill, his intellect remains a powerful weapon, as he uses it to manipulate his foes and allies alike. Additionally, his sheer willpower and insight into ring-lore allowed him to draw more power from the One Ring when he briefly wielded it than any other ringbearer save Sauron himself. Fought on the front line of the war and tried to 1v1 Sauron himself to save his family, and was only stopped because he did not realise the One Ring, unlike the others, had a will of its own and could abandon its bearer, which it proceeded to do mid-fight. Upon foiling Sauron's trap to bind his soul to his will and become a servant similar to a Ringwraith, Celebrimbor on Talion's suggestion, decided to remain in Middle Earth of his own accord, and not pass on to Valinor, remaining in his unkillable wraith form in order to combat Sauron on his home turf, buying the rest of Middle Earth decades of needed time to prepare their defences. He forges another ring of power using his knowledge from forging the others, and like the elven rings this one is not bound to the power of the One. But unfortunately begun to lose touch with himself as the New Ring begun to dominate him, not the other way around. This was likely because while the New Ring was not bound to Sauron, Celebrimbor attempting to make a discount version of the One Ring, attempting to replicate Sauron's methods, caused it to have powers he did not understand. Thus even should Talion and Celebrimbor, the Gravewalker, manage to subdue Sauron, Celebrimbor will simply try to replace him, proclaiming himself the Bright Lord and seeking dominion over all of Middle Earth, leaving it to his last true friend to desperately find a way to stop him. Rings of Power: A near senile stuttering old man dressed like a grandma, who barely even knows the basics of metalwork.
@@elimgarak1127 "He has no fighting skill".... Bro Celebrimbor is inhabiting the body of a Captain of the Watch of Gondor. That's where the fighting skill comes from... This is explained within the first 3 minutes of playing the game. Keep up.
Celebrimbor in the games is an example of how there can be deviations to the lore of Middle Earth that are still cool and interesting deviations, the show on the other hand is a masterclass in character assassination
Can we talk about the VO for Celebrimbor in the game? He had such a noble and arrogant quality. The character just oozed hubris and you could see how even the elves could be tempted by power.
And this is the thing....his looks the actor's would make him more suited to play an aged Man or Hobbit...but as an elf....the only solution for him playing the Elf would be to cast him as Cirdan Shipwright....THE OLDEST elf alive so already appearing kind of aged, and even then....with this design it wouldn't work....they would need to make properly him look more ethereal, give longer silver hair, this aura of power and ancient wisdom and beautify him a little, make him look like badass, old but spry and strong sailor type instead of......this pathetic thing he is in the amazon show!
@@Madi_Ernar with the beart he would look somewhat aged :). "Very tall he was, and his beard was long, and he was grey and old, save that his eyes were keen as stars, and he looked at them and bowed, and said: 'All is now ready.' " Book 6, Ch 9, The Grey havens, RotK, LotR
1:34 As someone who just recently watched the Jackson Trilogy and who loves Tolkiens Dwarves very much I paused here to read the inscriptions. In the Fellowship of the Ring I was perfectly able to read the texts in Moria for example and despite the Dwarven language not really being complete enough to write a proper letter it was always clear that those were actual words and with a little effort it was possible to work yourself through what the creators tried to write. On this Amazon door here all we can read is total obvious gibberish. They weren't unable to pay for a nerd to do it properly. They just didn't care.
It becomes even worse when you realize they HAD a Tolkien loremaster advising them on the show...and then they fired him for complaining about how much they were doing wrong and refusing to listen to him. Pure hubris on Amazon's part, thinking they could "fix" something as beloved as LotR.
When Shadow of Mordor/War were coming out people were saying that those games were skrewing the lore, but Amazon proved that there are depths to be reached
Yup. Maybe if SOW had been a Warhammer 40K game instead, people wouldn't be so scornful of its story and could fully appreciate its gameplay. Meanwhile, Ring of Power is a failure at the core, one that no change of window dressing can fix.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@thescruffinator8830 40K is only cartoonish if your only knowledge of the franchise is the memes and other community-made content. The setting has room for everything from depressingly dark psychological horror to young-adult action and even bits of comic relief. Great authors know how to weave in bits of light and hope into a story to make the darkness that much darker by contrast, and there's plenty of that among the hundreds of novels set in the universe.
I get that the Shadow of Mordor/Shadow of War versions aren't canonical, but it was clear that the depictions were indeed interesting, telling of his character and even making him stand out as a legitimate cautionary tale, one you can believe, feel sympathy and terror for.
Like the Elves are no longer cast as the fairest race it’s like they just hire anyone they find off the streets these days, like the Elves just don’t look like some of the fairest individuals in RoP
@@PalpatineIsAJew They look so old. Some of the actors themeselves are old, but you could fix that with makeup and good lighting. Instead, they look older than they do irl. It just blows my mind how Peter Jackson could do that 25 years ago and Amazon somehow can't.
If it was just miscasting I could abide the changes, but nothing about ROP had the feel of anything from either the books or the previous movies. It played out like bad fan fiction. Like someone wanted to tell a generic fantasy story but needed to mask it under a recognizable IP to get it greenlit.
He knew about alloys. Halbrand only said that a special alloy could be tried to strengthen the mithril, but Celebrymbor thought it would weaken the qualities of the metal. In the end, Sauron probably changed something in the mithril with his magic and thus the alloy turned out just right.
@@Walond-pac He knew. He said alloy was not suitable for this ore. He said he thought about alloys, but he thought alloying would diminish the unique properties of the mithril. To which Sauron replied that a special alloy was needed and they went in search of it.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
They turned an internationally loved franchise into a joke. Honestly I don’t normally say this but this show deserves to be canceled and its writers and directors barred from ever working in the film industry. Hell I don’t even think the “actors” are ever going to find work after this abomination again. Their careers are dead before they even began.
It's funny how this much-panned video game full of random extraneous fanfiction (looking at you, Shelob) treated Celebrimbor with so much more respect than Amazon treated the entirety of Tolkien's work. You really felt that this guy was Feanor's heir, in every way.
The Shelob thing isn’t even that “random”. Ungolant, her mother, could shapeshift, so the writers decided to extend that ability to Shelob as well do that she could feature in a story as more of a character and less as a monster.
@@DovahFett It is random. And nowhere can I find where Ungoliant can shapeshift? It says she takes the shape of a spider, but nowhere does it say that Ungoliant can take any other shape than that either.
@@DovahFett No, it is random. Ungoliant is a corrupted maiar that takes the form of a shadowy spider. Shelob is her daughter, but is never described as a spiritual being at all. She is described and depicted as a spider. She may be old and powerful, but she is nowhere even close to the levels of Ungoliant, or else Sam wouldn’t have stood a chance. Just consider your logic. If Shelob can shapeshift, why can’t her offspring? What’s stopping them?
@@atomiicpunk Given that Ungoliant is a spirit, it’s assumed that at one time she could change shape, as all the spirits do. It is believed that the most likely reason she never did is because after her complete and total corruption due to her gluttony and greed, she lost the ability to change. She basically took on the form of her corruption permanently, spreading her corruption to her corporeal offspring as well. Shelob can’t shapeshift for obvious reasons. She’s purely flesh and blood!
What can't understand is why in Peter Jackson's movies the elfs have long flowing hair but in the Amazon production they look like late TV show host 🤷 And why is Amazon's Celebrimbor looking like a 60 year old human? Elfs never got old looking!
Well, it is because authors doesn't have a clue about contents of Tolkien's work. They didn't read it, they didn't watched adaptations and despite they also hate it.
As far as I know, they only Elf that should even look remotely older than the others would be Cirdan the Shipwright. I think he's the only Elf with a beard in the sources. That would be a pretty distinct feature. They should have went with what PJ and the crew did on LotR for Galadriel and to give a sense of age through their words, motion and eyes.
In the game, Celebrimbor is portrayed with much more dignity, as the true absolute king of Eregion, the creator of the rings and Sauron's counterpart, who is deceived and betrayed, who sees everyone he loves die and who is too proud to accept what Sauron did, so he stood up to Sauron and even in death, his thirst for revenge against Sauron was such that he became a specter to fulfill that goal until he could find someone with a similar fate so he could use that bond and return to a body. In the series "The Rings of Power".... we can only ask for forgiveness "I'm sorry, Tolkien!"
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfin lore there is no mention of Celebrimbor being devoid of fighting skill or anything of the sort...in fact most often the Noldor princes would be highly skilled warriors along with being craftsmen and artists, sicentists, philosophers etc., the Noldor, High Elves were folk of many talents....in the lore Celebrimbor is mentioned to face Sauron himself during the attack on Eregion, though he loses: "Celebrimbor, desperate, himself withstood Sauron on the steps of the great door of the Mírdain; but he was grappled and taken captive, and the House was ransacked." (The History of Galadriel and Celeborn, The Unfinished Tales) But seriously losing to Sauron in direct confrontation is nothing to be ashamed of....Sauron is a powerful being and there were instances when the weaker entity can oppose him but even the possibly one of the greatest elven warriors of his day...king Gil-galad eventually fell to Sauron's hand in combat (more precisel was burned alive by his hand :)). Celebrimbor fought in the battles of Dagor-nuin-Giliath and Dagor Aglareb and many others in the First Age. I doubt there are any elven princes who cannot fight, especially those related to Fëanor.
@@TheGandralf Because Celebrimbor is from Valinor/Aman where there is mithril to be found. No doubt in the Years of the Trees Celebrimbor should have messed with mithril before ever arriving in Middle-Earth and made alloys of the material.
@@paddynkorn2109Yes, they have taken a license with some of the lore, in some aspects a horrible choice like the Isildur one. But they are fun and in some ways are very accurate, more so than the movies.
You can’t tell me whoever plays Celebrimbor didn’t practice his best Ian Holm’s Bilbo impression (stuttering, flustered, usually out-of-sorts without his handkerchief, pipe, & armchair) when preparing for this role as a lauded, ancient high elf who’s seen and lived in literal heaven.
Tolkien's work turned into movies directed by Peter Jackson were like Mairon, Admirable One. But then after Amazon came and corrupted them, they turned into Sauron, Abhorrent One. Frodo didn't walk into Mordor for this.
@@wendigo7176 I had some of my hopes return to me when I learnt who they cast as Elendil. Then I learnt that Amandil wasn't even in the show and where they would take the story and I nearly had a heart attack.
@@wendigo7176 I really, really liked the guy who played Durin. It's just tragic he was put in a show with writing this horrendous. He would've been a great dwarf in a better show.
his way of talking and his pauses is very similar to how Martin Freeman acted in the Hobbit, not to mention his facial resemblance to Ian Holms ver, he's like him but combed his hair. It makes sense for Bilbo to act like that, a very introverted man in a different world far bigger than his village, but Celebrimbor a wise elf who's an expert of smithing?
Ring of Power Celebrimbor: has 3 cells left in his senile brain Shadow of Mordor Celebrimbor: “I’m not locked in here with you, you’re locked in here with me.”
Literally. Bro was like a mad dog focused on ripping sauron's head off. "... The dark lord offers mercy. Gaze now upon the bright lord -- I make no such offers!"
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfSo basically it boils down to: Because Dwarves and Elves rarely join forces(mostly thanks to hatred and racism) Celebrimbor, the greatest Blacksmith and Metallurgist of the time, didn’t know how metals work.
they unironically copied Ian Holm's look but instead combed his hair, then copied Martin Freeman's mannerism in the Hobbit with his awkward pauses and hesitations during talking. In Martin's case it makes sense since Bilbo is introverted and is way out of his comfort zone being miles away from the Shire, but you'd expect an air of confidence and superiority for a wise old elf and a master smith, just like how Hugo Weaving's Elrond talks. The man looks like he's an intern given a major project.
Celebrimbor was the son of Curufin, fifth son of Fëanor and Nerdanel, and Fëanor's only known grandchild. Fëanor was the most skilful craftsman of the First Age, forging the three Silmarils to capture some of the light of the Two Trees of Valinor.
@@maglor2414 Yeah, but, you see, clearly Celebrimbor didn't take after his father and also... well I mean blond hair happens sometimes I guess? And all the stress or something must have aged him. I don't know. Also 3rd age elves clearly invented some prime wrinkle remover. /s.
@@maglor2414Celebrimbor was an adopted hobbit in Amazon new superior, more inclusive lore. I'm sure every Hobbit feels so great that he's now represented amongst the Elves
@@maglor2414 fr, celebrimbor looks like an old ass man, and Galadrial, who will be the oldest elf in any room no matter where she goes in the second age, looks like a petulant teenager
Ahh, the mastermind evil act of teaching the best smiths of the world what ALLOYS are! Truely an action of a dark lord... what a genious manipulation... truely you see his dark magical influences: ALLOYS..
Half of what Dwarves knew, they learned from the Noldor. And they NEVER outdid them. They just mass produced it. Celebrimbor had THOUSANDS of years to master what he learned from masters who had thousands of years of experience at their craft. Plus he spent a LONG time making rings. The Three and the ONE were just the very last. Sauron learned most of what he knew from the Noldor.
@@xhagast I don't agree with a few points here. 1. Dwarves and elves had different specialities in crafting, Tolkien did not just put Elves simply higher than dwarves (especially since he hated the demeaning tone dwarves were usually represented in in other lore and media). It was Thingol, who ordered the dwarves work the Silmaril into a necklace and all other kinds of works over his elves. I would also count Telchar as one of the great crafters. But I can understand your view as many of the tales/books are written in a pretty elf-centric personal perspective. 2. The last sentence, since Sauron (Mairon) was pupil of Aulë, Sauron may have learned quite a bit from the Noldor, but most of Aulë himself, you know the Vala of Smithing. Also the art of ringcrafting, Sauron learned from Melkor/Morgoth. I don't understand the reasoning of this comment on just a joke about Amazon's shitshow.
@@lmr4403 My first Tolkien book was the Silmarillion and the Noldor were my favorite Elves. The Dwarves were good but Feanor and later Celebrimbor outdid them. The Nauglamir, the greatest creation of Dwarven craft, had no one maker and was made for an Elf(Finrod)with Elven gems. Thingol was a Sindar and his people but for Eol were not as good as the Noldor at anything. And even Sauron needed the arts of Feanor's grandson to make rings. This stupid series makes a mockery of everything. The Dwarves barely made it out in one piece.
@@xhagast I do agree that obviously Celebrimbor and Feanor are the big guns, that later people of any race cannot compare to. Though those are 2 individuals in a story with already elven perspective (remember most is written in personal perspective form; so purposefully biased and flawed perspective). It is fine that you have favorites (characters, races, groups etc.), but your argumentation is overgeneralizing A LOT.
@@xhagast As creations of Aulë, they were attracted to the substances of Arda and crafts. They mined and worked precious metals throughout the mountains of Middle-earth. They were considered unrivalled in arts such as smithing, crafting, metalworking, and masonry, even by the Noldor. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of Aulë and Yavanna" In the tempering of steel alone of all crafts the Dwarves were never outmatched even by the Noldor, and in the making of mail of linked rings, which was first contrived by the smiths of Belegost, their work had no rival. During the third age of the captivity of Melkor, the Dwarves smithied for Thingol; for they were greatly skilled in such work, though none among them surpassed the craftsmen of Nogrod, of whom Telchar the smith was greatest in renown. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Sindar" They were also capable masons and smiths - Dwarven smithing skills were said to be unrivalled, and their masonry creations were bested by none. The crafting skills of the Dwarves were unmatched; they crafted objects of great beauty out of gems and metals. They crafted many famed weapons, armours, and items of art and beauty, among them Narsil, the sword of Elendil, the Dragon-helm of Dor-lómin and the necklace Nauglamír, the most prized treasure in Nargothrond and the most famed Dwarven work of the Elder Days. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Ruin of Doriath" Just some stuff to back up my claims.
Dude I’m so glad I never watched past the first episode. Celebrimbor is one of THE most complex and interestingly written characters I’ve ever seen. He’s not evil per se but he’s not moral, and he’s so serious that he can be unintentionally funny at times, but never even cracks a smile. WTF did the show do to him
Haven't seen Rings of Power, only bits and scenes. But I don't think anyone can play Celebrimbor quite how Alastair Duncan did. The sheer power, wrath, pride and arrogance. One of my favorite performances in any game, and always the first version of Celebrimbor I think of when I see him mentioned anywhere.
Name one good line SoM and SoW had: The Arena Speech Celebrimbors badass lines Almost every single sentence Celembrimbors "pissed" lines The Bright Lord fast travel dialouge The Line after retaking the Nurnen fort from Brüz Name one good celebrimbor line in The Rings of Power:
@kolbywilliams7234 the middle earth games aren't canon to the Tolkien books, only the major elements are from Tolkien, obviously, everything else was Monolith
The option to cast only goofy, weird, old looking people as immortal elves known for their beauty was certainly an odd one. I will probably never watch this show, despite being a major LotR fan (the kind that read unfinished tales).
Yeah, me too. Such a disappointment, really. I wanted these series to be good, but they are completely unwatchable. Thank God, Amazon has no rights to Silmarillion.
Don’t watch it it will make you want to Stab out your eyes it’s that bad. It’s horribly miscast and the writing is pure vomit. I made the mistake of giving it a try thinking “ it probably isn’t as bad as people say” but boy was I wrong.
@ijustbevibin0425 how brain dead are you that you don't understand how ageless perfectly fair beings shouldn't look the way they do in this show? It's not Even close to the singular reason though, but with people like you it seems like they can churn out empty garbage and propaganda with no consequence to them.
I wish Peter Jackson would do a trilogy of movies set in the 2nd age or even the first age. He's the only one that gives Middle Earth the love it deserves.
@@stevenbils talion is gone and while they hinted at a possible third game with the main character being eltariel, i would have to be dead before i play as that traitorous elf
What’s especially funny is that Shadow of Mordor/War are equally as lorebreaking with Middle-Earth as Rings of Power, but their story is still superior.
@@Peremptor I dunno how much of that I agree with. Yes gameplay must take priority but when you’re game involves handling a pre established IP, I think you should handle it with care
@@thenethralking6032 We don't seem to live in a world that cares too much about individual's rights... let alone fictitious ones' right to be themselves haha.
Halbrand/Sauron: Couldn't you think of using alloys? Celebrimbor: You know, working at Amazon changes people. Halbrand/Sauron: And how? Celebrimbor: I used to be an elf. Halbrand/Sauron: 😳
Sauron : What about heating metal ore so that it starts flowing like lava .... Celebrimbor : What an intriguing suggestion ... Gil Galad : All hail Celebrimbor who just invented ore smelting !
Taurduin Studios with _Rings of Power_ and Mickey Hawkchow with _Star Wars_ seem to have been operating under the same mistaken assumption, once summarized by JoshScorcher as "Popular thing is popular! Therefore, easy money!"
It varies. Cirdan does look elderly but he's also absurdly ancient and is the only elf to grow a beard. The thing about elves is they look both young and old at the same time with an ageless ethereal grace to them. Real people can't do that so when Jackson was casting he intentionally aimed to get a consistent vibe with all the elves. Rings of Power elves aren't aesthetically consistent though, so the issue makes itself rather annoyingly present.
@@bokoblinlogic1619 they most likely have wrinkles imo books say that even galadriel looks aged even though she is not considered old. cirdan, gwindor and thingol might have wrinkles. they probably look like 60 yo old person. actor ben daniel looks exactly like cirdan imo. . not to mention , if they dont have wrinkles , how can you tell they are old you tell human is old because he she has wrinkles.
Wow sjukt rolig jämförelse. Får mig att inse ännu mer vilket skämt Rings of Power var. Those cinematics are so amazing! Almost makes me want to play the game!
I take this as proof that they did not even bother reading the material. Celebrimbor led a desperate resistance against Sauron's army sieging his seat of Ost-in-Edhil, pissing Sauron off so much that the Dark Lord desecrated his corpse and used it as a banner. Can you imagine this actor playing such a character?
They didn't make steel yet, but that's more due to the fact that steel requires extreme temperatures (like you find in a blast furnace). Dude would 100% be creating alloy. All that silver, gold, etc on the armor they wear is alloyed against wear.
@@AuspexAO You don't need a blast furnace to make steel. Those sorts of things are for making larger pieces or for getting a very exact consistency. All you need to make steel is iron, coal, and a small bellows to stoke the fire up to the right temperature.
@@lokenontherange Sure…kind of. Making steel is like making a souffle, any idiot can do it, but it probably won't be great. Early steel like Wootz/Damascus steel has proven very hard for modern scientists to replicate. Many think that they got lucky with a naturally favorable ore vein (with a composition favorable to steel production) and others say they replicate later crucible furnaces with their high monsoon winds. Either way, it was hard for ancient man to create a high quantity of reliable, edge-maintaining steel. Sure, you don't need the bessemer process and big coke furnaces to make steel, but that's when steel weapons became more common.
Remember how rob stark lit the entire continent on fire but the actual king ended up being the mentally unstable cripple? Well Amazon saw that and said, "I hear that subversion of expectation is very smart, let's do that."
Shadow of Mordor and its Bright Lord DLC did justice to Celebrimbor. They made him an elven badass and nearly made his combat skills almost on par with the elves of the first age.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior. Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned. Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria). The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal. If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfin lore there is no mention of Celebrimbor being devoid of fighting skill or anything of the sort...in fact most often the Noldor princes would be highly skilled warriors along with being craftsmen and artists, sicentists, philosophers etc., the Noldor, High Elves were folk of many talents....in the lore Celebrimbor is mentioned to face Sauron himself during the attack on Eregion, though he loses: "Celebrimbor, desperate, himself withstood Sauron on the steps of the great door of the Mírdain; but he was grappled and taken captive, and the House was ransacked." (The History of Galadriel and Celeborn, The Unfinished Tales) But seriously losing to Sauron in direct confrontation is nothing to be ashamed of....Sauron is a powerful being and there were instances when the weaker entity can oppose him but even the possibly one of the greatest elven warriors of his day...king Gil-galad eventually fell to Sauron's hand in combat (more precisel was burned alive by his hand :)). Celebrimbor fought in the battles of Dagor-nuin-Giliath and Dagor Aglareb and many others in the First Age. I doubt there are any elven princes who cannot fight, especially those related to Fëanor.
@@IvanZaguzin-b2b Yes, any Noldor elf of the first age would be terrifying to orcs, far more dangerous than a human warrior. This is clear in the Lord of the Rings when Frodo asks what the white light was at the fords of Rivendell after being chased by the black riders.
Did anyone involved with the RoP even attempt to look up any of the lore of the LOTR? Like it’s not as if there wasn’t an infinite source of material but instead they decided to go rogue, drop trousers and just crap on a script and submit it
@@lucasmuniz5263 well for who isnt a tolkien nerd book lore person the game is really good doing lots of shit and gags and fun to play and the stand alone lore of the game is quite fine and its understandable wehn LOTR nerds are not into it
They made Celebrimbor old british gramma, because the hero role was reserved for strong female fighting character, namely Guyladriel. The game adaptation was not accurate but they captured the essence of Tolkien world, where the Rings of power created some soap opera bullshit with Tolkien characters for billions of $.
To say they “captured the essence” is a big stretch. I think I pulled something trying to make that fit. Kidding aside, the games are just as bad as the show in terms of how it depicts the characters and events. It just doesn’t matter as much because it’s a good game, and at the end of the day, a game will be judged by how good of a game it is. Not based on how good of a story it has. A show on the other hand has to be a great story, or it has no reason to exist.
@@kolbywilliams7234 Well I had to be more specific. I meant the design of Celebrimbor, Annatar version of Sauron and their interaction. The story of the game was pure fan fiction, but there was a charm in it. Rings of power was just fiction, there was no love or knowledge in this production.
@@dododimitrov9657 I can see where you are coming from, I think I just disagree with the perspective that a lot of love was put into the games. From my perspective, it was a cynical appropriation of Tolkien’s world that was only saved because it had genuinely good game design and the fact a lot of people haven’t read the books. I don’t consider it fan fiction because a fan of LOTR wouldn’t intentionally get so much wrong. Sexy Shelob, her being Sauron’s scorned lover, all the girl-bosses, the over-the-top silly orcs, it all stinks of post-marvel copycatting and corporate pandering that is on the same level of “hello, fellow kids.” If the gameplay wasn’t so good, I don’t think I could have finished it because I certainly couldn’t take it seriously. It is just as bad as the show in terms of story.
Sow version of celebrimbor was the most lore accurate version of him to date. Even tho ppl saying its not canon they did him very good. Line of Finwe had long black hair, bright blue eyes and commanding voice to top that they were really arrogant. And take a look at Sow series and tell me they didnt do him greatly.
It’s nice that every land in this show has the average New York City diversity. Makes it really feel real and like the real world! Really appeals to modern audiences!
I remember when I tried watching RoP with family. I was super excited to see Celebrimbor more than anyone else because of SoW. Even though I knew it was lore inaccurate, I was stoked to see if he would be even remotely close to that badass, cool, stoic, wrathful being that terrorized mordor. When Grandpa Celery showed up every last hope I had for the show was immediately snuffed out just like poor Celebrimbor was.
@@maxi1ification true, but he still rules a kingdom I believe. Usually elven kings are super skilled warriors. Or at least on par with really well trained elven swords man like Haldir. At least I think he was good as he lasted pretty long.
When I was still young and silly and Shadow of Mordor came out, I was playing the game from sun up to sun down. Then I played SoW and thought it was also pretty lit. Celebrimbor’s ruthlessness towards orc-kind was amazing. RoP turned Celebrimbor into this silly grandpa who seems to wilt down a lot unlike his SoM counterpart.
@@juliuscaesar810 I think they accidentally gave us Keebler elves.. celebrimbor was the worst tho. What part of eternal youth and beauty did they not understand? With all that money I was hoping for a digitally recreated Jean Binet Ramsey to play young Galadriel
@@live10yearsinthejointreact80Usually you'd have a point. But not in this case. This one fits the criteria. The story was already there. They modified it for "inclusivity". They said so, in interviews and such. And you saw it in the show.
Lobelia and her stolen spoons are a greater threat than Commander Galadriel 😂 I like her ending in LoTR, even if her son dies at the end Barliman identifies as a numenorean, and there's nothing you can do about it bigot 😂
I loved Shadow of Mordor / War and the story branches they made. It was clearly fanfic, but great fanfic that we could all enjoy. A wonderful "What if?" of sorts. Then Amazon makes this dribblepiss.
If I may add: If the Shadow games weren't canon, it didn't matter that much. There would be fewer gamers than movie viewers, and it would most likely be Tolkien nerds who knew the real story buying the game. But Rings of Power, on one of the most accessible streaming services of the time and in the easily-consumed format of TV, polluted the story for the vast majority of the fanbase AND the casual viewers. The games gave an optional sandbox for nerds; the show was almost insidious in its insinuation into the "canon."
I don’t even care for Lotr or rather am not a huge fan but I played both games SOM and SOW Talion and Calibrimbors story was a fascinating experience he was everything I would expect from a guy who was one of the greatest warriors and smiths to ever walked middle earth strong, graceful, resilient, and awesome he hooked me into the lore of a series I have never watched or read. Then I watched ROP explained in 15 minutes or less and when Calibrimbor was revealed I was like “who da fu#k is this shy, skittish, goofy lookin uncle character” to say the least it was a sad day when I realized that the man I watched throw hands with Sauron like he was Muhammad Ali in his prime and only lost because the one ring betrayed him for it’s true master was reduced to this… truly a missed opportunity as even tho the games aren’t canon he was just so amazing in them.
I recommend reading/watching the Lord of the Rings and Hobbit. ROP is really crappy fanfiction and doesn't follow lore in the slightest. SOM and SOW are highly lore inaccurate as well but they are still much closer to the actual lore and better written that ROP.
Also for some reason forgets he's a king who claims who views himself as superior to Gil-Galad and who also has a legitimate argument to be the High King himself.
@@an6153 His whole dea and the reason why his kingdom is separated is that he thinks he should be the High King. Gil-Galad is the descendant of a lesser son.
Really wrecked me seeing how they casted Celebrimbor! I mean I know we weren’t gonna get the exact same version form the game but damn it’s definitely a great blueprint to start with
Shadow of Mordor and War twisted the canon, but still had some resemblance or respect for Tolkien’s works. But RoP is like digging up Tolkien’s grave and taking a dump right on his face before doing the same to Christopher.
An actor who was clearly born to play a hobbit cast as one of the most important elves of all time.
nahh bro you did him dirty💀
Oof that one hits hard🤣
Right! He gives off more old bilbo vibes than any elves ever lived
the forehead elves, rop celebrimbor looks like the older version of rop elrond.
That's actually a good point he would have done better as a hobbit. I could literally envision that what a miss.
The Boss: when you fight him.
vs
When you play him as an unlocked character.
Ironic because we actually get to play with Celebrimbor and he’s pretty op
One instance where unplayable version is more pathetic than playable version
@@laszlofedor3463 this is the comment, I've gone back to play shadow of war just to clear my mind of vulcan celebrimbor from star trek of the rings
Omg this is soo real XD
The last prophet promises
VS
Reality😂
"Elves are beyond beautiful" *casts an ACTUAL hobbit*
Celebrimbor baggins
In LOTR they did it too.
Keebler elf daddy.
@@physicallyqiqi Celebrobo
@@ulissesfreitas6835who?
I refuse to believe this is the greatest smith since Feanor. He comes across as a novice, not one almost equal to Sauron.
Exactly...
my guy is meant to be the smartest in crafting besides Sauron yet he needed alloys explained to him when at that point he was already quite old and had a reputation apparently.
he didn't think about alloys or different techniques on how to achieve his goals...and is surprised when breakthroughs the level of primates discovering fire are made...yet we're supposed to believe he can enchant powerful items? My man can barely work a forge...
They would turn Feanor into a Woke pus%y
@@lordsathariel4384 He was born in Aman, so yes. He's one of the oldest Elves still around in Middle-Earth. Though there may be some unnamed Noldorin Elves in Lindon and Eregion that are older given that he's Feanors grandkid and wouldn't have been born in Aman for a decent amount of years after the Noldor arrived there.
New season - Celebrimbor finds out what a hammer is
You can use a Tool to craft??? That's crazy. What's next? Heating the iron to make it flexible?
@@ramonserna8089 DIVINE KNOWLEDGE OF THE VALAR!11!!!1!!!
And you were right, he found out what a hammer was
Maybe in the next season he'll remember what an anvil is
@Megusta508 😂💀
Celebrimbor not knowing what an alloy is, that is simply criminal writing.
They are somehow in the medieval times but never got past the bronze age. 🤔
@@gabrielgarcia7554they never even *hit* the Bronze Age. Because bronze is an alloy
Is fantasy novel. It never mean to be realistic. You can absolutely make it exist.
@@PikachuLittle The problem stems more from the fact the Celebrimbor is meant to be the man responsible for forging THE FUCKING RINGS.
Centuries old metallurgist
No idea that you can create alloys
Damn, I didn’t know he was allergic to metal :/
Centuries?? He was born in Valinor... he probably saw Feanor himself working.
Several Thousand years old.
@@Bayard1503 He was Feanor's grandson LOL
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
Shadow of Mordor/War is a perfect example of how "fanfiction" aka not lore accurate story, can still win the hearts of many and not completely piss off every Tolkien lover. Amazon could learn much from what fans LOVE and not force their own ideals onto its viewers.
Isildur a Nazgul ? Yes, the readers of the books love it (nope)
When the first game came out, it was received fairy well by tolkienheads but for second one, oh boy. It was shitted on in every corner of the internet. Memes of sexy Shellob were everywhere. There was a consensus that the game's lore is trash, the gameplay was that of an AC clone and the only saving grace was the nemesis system. You are watching this through rose tinted glasses because the franchise is now at a lower point that it was back in 2017.
@@methexis9934 not everything is going to be loved by everyone. People hate the movies. But the fast majority loved them just like the fast majority loved Shadow of Mordor/War. Amazon have not reached that level of love and enjoyment
@@CaptainMyron Majority of fans still loved the game, it was super successful and very enjoyable. Yes it was not lore accurate, yes some people didnt enjoy that aspect and yes there was memes. But it did not ruin the success of the game because the game as a whole was very good. Amazon did not accomplish that so RoP failed in terms of success, this is the point being made here.
@@morgomirwd You talk like a seller. Your commentary is not based on anything related to the quality of the game, the popularity is everything but an argument. There is plenty of masterpiece hated by people. Your so-loved game is full of crapy ideas litteraly insulting the memory of the original Lord of the Rings - and juste because it has been a near-average good game (by copying the gameplay of real goods games), it magically became itself a masterpiece in the eye of the layman.
4:18 “You know I’m something of a Celebrimbor myself”
😂 This had me laughing
LMAO, mtfkr
LOL
Had me rolling
LMAO 😂😂
Celebrimbor in RoP looks like a Hobbit to me. That was my first impression, started to think about Bilbo.
Acts like it too. Compare that to how the elves in Lotr behave and compose themselves, and the difference becomes clear.
They just don't feel like ethereal elves really
The whole behavior is like Bilbo, the way he carries him selfe the way he talks its pretty much the same.
Seems like they did a huge miscast for the actor
@@delta9915 the actor himself is fine not for this role but in general it is the script writers at fault here and the token hires.
@@tatfly5779 yeah
A master blacksmith didn't think of mixing ores, ARE YOU INSANELY KIDDING ME?
What kind of smith wouldn't mix metals in their craft? This is stupid.
Characters are only as smart as the writers, and the ROP writers are stupidly incompetent.
@@tototats001 With good writing, multiple viewings/readings reveal more details that make it even better and deeper. With RoP, it's stupid on first viewing, and if you actually think about it, you keep discovering new layers of stupidity, deeper than the roots of the mountains.
Not only A master blacksmith, but the best blacksmith since feanor. And we all know how feanor was the best in everything he did.
indeed it does get stupider the more viewings you do.@@partyboi8773
as someone who for quite a few years has been learning casting silversmithing and many other forms of metalwork this celebrimbor made me upset on a deeply emotional level on how stupid he sounds for who he is meant to be.@@bambostarla6259
the fact that the greatest elven smith of all time second only to faenor didnt know what an alloy was is WILD
Thats something only humans do, because Elves have unlimited resources and magic to use just one material
@@arieljuarez963 Still, part of being an elven master mettalurgist and smith is the knowledge. Even if the elves didnn't need to use alloys, you can be damn sure they knew about the technique.
They clearly had very low bars, those "Elves". Now Dwarf Smiths! That is where it is at.
He didn't say it was unknown, simply thatbit was an uncommon suggestion. There's a difference in approach. @heyho5940
Tbh your interpretation of the scene is bad.... He knows what alloys are but had not considered the possibility of it being better for his goal. He states plainly that the alloying would make it weaker showing his blind sightedness is my guess. But i agree much better if Sauron had only helped with the idea on not applying as much force rather then suggest alloys can be good too.
Shadow of Mordor series:
Celebrimbor is a damn force of nature, consumed by a lust for revenge that only Talion understands, as both are forced to endure when they were murdered alongside their families. Not only is he formidable in raw power and fighting skill, his intellect remains a powerful weapon, as he uses it to manipulate his foes and allies alike. Additionally, his sheer willpower and insight into ring-lore allowed him to draw more power from the One Ring when he briefly wielded it than any other ringbearer save Sauron himself. Fought on the front line of the war and tried to 1v1 Sauron himself to save his family, and was only stopped because he did not realise the One Ring, unlike the others, had a will of its own and could abandon its bearer, which it proceeded to do mid-fight.
Upon foiling Sauron's trap to bind his soul to his will and become a servant similar to a Ringwraith, Celebrimbor on Talion's suggestion, decided to remain in Middle Earth of his own accord, and not pass on to Valinor, remaining in his unkillable wraith form in order to combat Sauron on his home turf, buying the rest of Middle Earth decades of needed time to prepare their defences. He forges another ring of power using his knowledge from forging the others, and like the elven rings this one is not bound to the power of the One. But unfortunately begun to lose touch with himself as the New Ring begun to dominate him, not the other way around. This was likely because while the New Ring was not bound to Sauron, Celebrimbor attempting to make a discount version of the One Ring, attempting to replicate Sauron's methods, caused it to have powers he did not understand. Thus even should Talion and Celebrimbor, the Gravewalker, manage to subdue Sauron, Celebrimbor will simply try to replace him, proclaiming himself the Bright Lord and seeking dominion over all of Middle Earth, leaving it to his last true friend to desperately find a way to stop him.
Rings of Power: A near senile stuttering old man dressed like a grandma, who barely even knows the basics of metalwork.
What a beautiful comment
Yeah I loved his character in game, such a badass.
@@runek100 Being voiced by Senator Armstrong was an added bonus too. I forever love his delievery of "Suffer me NOW!"
He has no fighting skill. That's what makes those games suck. They basically re-wrote the character minus the woke garbage. It's still bad writing.
@@elimgarak1127 "He has no fighting skill".... Bro Celebrimbor is inhabiting the body of a Captain of the Watch of Gondor. That's where the fighting skill comes from...
This is explained within the first 3 minutes of playing the game. Keep up.
I cant imagine an elven saying
"we don't have time" lmao
you must have not seen what i have seen
Kimberly "Sweet Brown" Wilkins elf's new hit single
"aint no body got time for that!"
I can just imagine a whole city of elves laughing at that.
to be fair in the series their deadline was 3 months if I remember correctly. That must feel for an elve like 5 seconds.
wait until you hear what Gandalf said.... clown.
I know right? They're nearly as bad as the Ents when it comes to "this will probably fix itself if we ignore it" mantra
Celebrimbor in the games is an example of how there can be deviations to the lore of Middle Earth that are still cool and interesting deviations, the show on the other hand is a masterclass in character assassination
Can we talk about the VO for Celebrimbor in the game? He had such a noble and arrogant quality. The character just oozed hubris and you could see how even the elves could be tempted by power.
Yea but also arrogance if he didn't betray talion at barad dur he would have dominated salron
He’s the only elf who is old in the show , despite Galadriel being older than him.. -.-
The thing is ... Amazon Show writters didn't know that
@@JD-bk4zi the thing is they should ;)
And this is the thing....his looks the actor's would make him more suited to play an aged Man or Hobbit...but as an elf....the only solution for him playing the Elf would be to cast him as Cirdan Shipwright....THE OLDEST elf alive so already appearing kind of aged, and even then....with this design it wouldn't work....they would need to make properly him look more ethereal, give longer silver hair, this aura of power and ancient wisdom and beautify him a little, make him look like badass, old but spry and strong sailor type instead of......this pathetic thing he is in the amazon show!
@@fantasywind3923 nah, he wasn't aged. He looked like a regular elf but with a beard.
@@Madi_Ernar with the beart he would look somewhat aged :).
"Very tall he was, and his beard was long, and he was grey and old, save that his eyes were keen as stars, and he looked at them and bowed, and said: 'All is now ready.' "
Book 6, Ch 9, The Grey havens, RotK, LotR
Every time I watch the show Celebrimbor speak I get Bilbo Baggins vibes. It's as if Bilbo Baggins is speaking.
"Every time"? You watched it MULTIPLE times? I do not know why would you, but still i take my hat off to your sheer force of will.
1:34 As someone who just recently watched the Jackson Trilogy and who loves Tolkiens Dwarves very much I paused here to read the inscriptions.
In the Fellowship of the Ring I was perfectly able to read the texts in Moria for example and despite the Dwarven language not really being complete enough to write a proper letter it was always clear that those were actual words and with a little effort it was possible to work yourself through what the creators tried to write.
On this Amazon door here all we can read is total obvious gibberish. They weren't unable to pay for a nerd to do it properly. They just didn't care.
It becomes even worse when you realize they HAD a Tolkien loremaster advising them on the show...and then they fired him for complaining about how much they were doing wrong and refusing to listen to him. Pure hubris on Amazon's part, thinking they could "fix" something as beloved as LotR.
@@keiichi8191There is absolutely no proof of that though.
@@keiichi8191 lol they hired this guy cause they wanted him to stand around in silence nodding in approval at their genius
@@keiichi8191Madness. Madness and stupidity!
Yeah, but the hobbit movies by Jackson were truly awful. And there was a great deal to enjoy and love in the rings of power.
When Shadow of Mordor/War were coming out people were saying that those games were skrewing the lore, but Amazon proved that there are depths to be reached
Yup. Maybe if SOW had been a Warhammer 40K game instead, people wouldn't be so scornful of its story and could fully appreciate its gameplay. Meanwhile, Ring of Power is a failure at the core, one that no change of window dressing can fix.
@@anthonyrousseau805040k is super cartoonish though, wouldn't have worked nearly as well
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
games are easier to seperate from canon and the games are at least fun
@@thescruffinator8830 40K is only cartoonish if your only knowledge of the franchise is the memes and other community-made content. The setting has room for everything from depressingly dark psychological horror to young-adult action and even bits of comic relief. Great authors know how to weave in bits of light and hope into a story to make the darkness that much darker by contrast, and there's plenty of that among the hundreds of novels set in the universe.
I get that the Shadow of Mordor/Shadow of War versions aren't canonical, but it was clear that the depictions were indeed interesting, telling of his character and even making him stand out as a legitimate cautionary tale, one you can believe, feel sympathy and terror for.
Like the Elves are no longer cast as the fairest race it’s like they just hire anyone they find off the streets these days, like the Elves just don’t look like some of the fairest individuals in RoP
@@PalpatineIsAJew They look so old. Some of the actors themeselves are old, but you could fix that with makeup and good lighting. Instead, they look older than they do irl. It just blows my mind how Peter Jackson could do that 25 years ago and Amazon somehow can't.
Cerebrimbo Baggins
*celebilbo
@@bojangles4398*Celedildo
@@bojangles4398 celedildo
@@cmja09 🤣
Great job, everyone. No notes. Take the rest of the day off.
Celebrimbor, Galadriel, Isildur and Elrond are totally miscast
They are indeed
If it was just miscasting I could abide the changes, but nothing about ROP had the feel of anything from either the books or the previous movies. It played out like bad fan fiction. Like someone wanted to tell a generic fantasy story but needed to mask it under a recognizable IP to get it greenlit.
THE CAST IS ALWAYS RIGHT!!
They're not miscast so much as poorly written, although there's no reason Celebrimbor should look like everyone's grandpa.
And also black people Dont match in lord of the ring universe
In Spain we call the Amazon character "Josefina".
He's like the old granma of your hometown, waiting for you to feed and take care of you.
The greatest smith in the world, second only to Feanor, didn’t know what alloys are.
He knew about alloys. Halbrand only said that a special alloy could be tried to strengthen the mithril, but Celebrymbor thought it would weaken the qualities of the metal. In the end, Sauron probably changed something in the mithril with his magic and thus the alloy turned out just right.
@@director5193 No, he clearly didn't know.
@@Walond-pac He knew. He said alloy was not suitable for this ore. He said he thought about alloys, but he thought alloying would diminish the unique properties of the mithril. To which Sauron replied that a special alloy was needed and they went in search of it.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
FEANORS GRANDCHILD LOOKS LIKE THIS!?
They turned elves into hobbits
They turned an internationally loved franchise into a joke.
Honestly I don’t normally say this but this show deserves to be canceled and its writers and directors barred from ever working in the film industry. Hell I don’t even think the “actors” are ever going to find work after this abomination again. Their careers are dead before they even began.
@@steakinbacon8593I only care for Durin’s and Elrond’s scenes don’t care about any others
They have taken the Hobbits to Elvenguard !
Maybe they got confused and gave us Keebler elves
@@Logan20079 Elrond has the most punchable face in the middle earth
"Jackson was too faithful to the sources," said the great Simon, a man who was not worthy of carrying Tolkien's name.
Did he really say that?💀 His father literally said the opposite
It's funny how this much-panned video game full of random extraneous fanfiction (looking at you, Shelob) treated Celebrimbor with so much more respect than Amazon treated the entirety of Tolkien's work. You really felt that this guy was Feanor's heir, in every way.
... Especially the violent ones...
The Shelob thing isn’t even that “random”. Ungolant, her mother, could shapeshift, so the writers decided to extend that ability to Shelob as well do that she could feature in a story as more of a character and less as a monster.
@@DovahFett It is random. And nowhere can I find where Ungoliant can shapeshift? It says she takes the shape of a spider, but nowhere does it say that Ungoliant can take any other shape than that either.
@@DovahFett
No, it is random. Ungoliant is a corrupted maiar that takes the form of a shadowy spider.
Shelob is her daughter, but is never described as a spiritual being at all. She is described and depicted as a spider. She may be old and powerful, but she is nowhere even close to the levels of Ungoliant, or else Sam wouldn’t have stood a chance.
Just consider your logic. If Shelob can shapeshift, why can’t her offspring? What’s stopping them?
@@atomiicpunk
Given that Ungoliant is a spirit, it’s assumed that at one time she could change shape, as all the spirits do. It is believed that the most likely reason she never did is because after her complete and total corruption due to her gluttony and greed, she lost the ability to change. She basically took on the form of her corruption permanently, spreading her corruption to her corporeal offspring as well. Shelob can’t shapeshift for obvious reasons. She’s purely flesh and blood!
What can't understand is why in Peter Jackson's movies the elfs have long flowing hair but in the Amazon production they look like late TV show host 🤷 And why is Amazon's Celebrimbor looking like a 60 year old human? Elfs never got old looking!
Well, it is because authors doesn't have a clue about contents of Tolkien's work. They didn't read it, they didn't watched adaptations and despite they also hate it.
@@ХузинТимур 😟
As far as I know, they only Elf that should even look remotely older than the others would be Cirdan the Shipwright. I think he's the only Elf with a beard in the sources. That would be a pretty distinct feature.
They should have went with what PJ and the crew did on LotR for Galadriel and to give a sense of age through their words, motion and eyes.
@@Wulfrygg yep... Cirdan the only elf in middle earth made and not born.
@@alexiachimciuc3199 What's that gotta be? Like 13.000/14.000 years or smth?
In the game, Celebrimbor is portrayed with much more dignity, as the true absolute king of Eregion, the creator of the rings and Sauron's counterpart, who is deceived and betrayed, who sees everyone he loves die and who is too proud to accept what Sauron did, so he stood up to Sauron and even in death, his thirst for revenge against Sauron was such that he became a specter to fulfill that goal until he could find someone with a similar fate so he could use that bond and return to a body. In the series "The Rings of Power".... we can only ask for forgiveness "I'm sorry, Tolkien!"
When fanfiction feels more true to the source material then an actual attempt at adaptation you know you got a problem
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfin lore there is no mention of Celebrimbor being devoid of fighting skill or anything of the sort...in fact most often the Noldor princes would be highly skilled warriors along with being craftsmen and artists, sicentists, philosophers etc., the Noldor, High Elves were folk of many talents....in the lore Celebrimbor is mentioned to face Sauron himself during the attack on Eregion, though he loses:
"Celebrimbor, desperate, himself withstood Sauron on the steps of the great door of the Mírdain; but he was grappled and taken captive, and the House was ransacked." (The History of Galadriel and Celeborn, The Unfinished Tales)
But seriously losing to Sauron in direct confrontation is nothing to be ashamed of....Sauron is a powerful being and there were instances when the weaker entity can oppose him but even the possibly one of the greatest elven warriors of his day...king Gil-galad eventually fell to Sauron's hand in combat (more precisel was burned alive by his hand :)).
Celebrimbor fought in the battles of Dagor-nuin-Giliath and Dagor Aglareb and many others in the First Age. I doubt there are any elven princes who cannot fight, especially those related to Fëanor.
@@TheGandralf Because Celebrimbor is from Valinor/Aman where there is mithril to be found. No doubt in the Years of the Trees Celebrimbor should have messed with mithril before ever arriving in Middle-Earth and made alloys of the material.
No, the Shadow Games are anti-tolkien per se. But if you cant see that, then obviously dont get Tolkien
@@paddynkorn2109Yes, they have taken a license with some of the lore, in some aspects a horrible choice like the Isildur one. But they are fun and in some ways are very accurate, more so than the movies.
Celebrimbor in the power rings looks like my grandmother
xD
HAHAHAHA
The fact that you said grandmother instead of grandfather, bruh I can't 💀😭
Well, he is wearing a moo moo
You can’t tell me whoever plays Celebrimbor didn’t practice his best Ian Holm’s Bilbo impression (stuttering, flustered, usually out-of-sorts without his handkerchief, pipe, & armchair) when preparing for this role as a lauded, ancient high elf who’s seen and lived in literal heaven.
Tolkien's work turned into movies directed by Peter Jackson were like Mairon, Admirable One. But then after Amazon came and corrupted them, they turned into Sauron, Abhorrent One. Frodo didn't walk into Mordor for this.
You cant think of an actor that would play a character better in LOTR, in this massive letdown you cant stop listing actors who would fit better
@@wendigo7176 I had some of my hopes return to me when I learnt who they cast as Elendil. Then I learnt that Amandil wasn't even in the show and where they would take the story and I nearly had a heart attack.
well maybe nick cage as Aragorn?@@wendigo7176
@@wendigo7176 I really, really liked the guy who played Durin. It's just tragic he was put in a show with writing this horrendous. He would've been a great dwarf in a better show.
Compared to the psychotic Galadriel, Sauron looks like God's dandelion. Frodo definitely destroyed the ring in vain.
He reminds me more of Bilbo than of any elf I can imagine.
both of them the elves to human/hobbit
Celebilbo
his way of talking and his pauses is very similar to how Martin Freeman acted in the Hobbit, not to mention his facial resemblance to Ian Holms ver, he's like him but combed his hair.
It makes sense for Bilbo to act like that, a very introverted man in a different world far bigger than his village, but Celebrimbor a wise elf who's an expert of smithing?
Rings of power of truly one of those projects that should've never happened
Ring of Power Celebrimbor: has 3 cells left in his senile brain
Shadow of Mordor Celebrimbor: “I’m not locked in here with you, you’re locked in here with me.”
I watched celebrimbor after this video and man he is a madlad . Mess with sauron and gave him so much trouble
Literally. Bro was like a mad dog focused on ripping sauron's head off.
"... The dark lord offers mercy. Gaze now upon the bright lord -- I make no such offers!"
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfSo basically it boils down to: Because Dwarves and Elves rarely join forces(mostly thanks to hatred and racism) Celebrimbor, the greatest Blacksmith and Metallurgist of the time, didn’t know how metals work.
@@MatthewTeachout-xj4yy the fact Gandalf the wise is making such a argument for the show,I think end times are here.
Why is he looking like a hobbit in this series lol?
good question 😅
his stutters feels like bilbo, don't you think? 😅
@@tama_ochi just one more of a countless number of memberberries that the show has.
Nailed it. He has far more resemblance to a Hobbit than an Elf. In fact he would have made a great Bilbo. So ridiculous.
they unironically copied Ian Holm's look but instead combed his hair, then copied Martin Freeman's mannerism in the Hobbit with his awkward pauses and hesitations during talking.
In Martin's case it makes sense since Bilbo is introverted and is way out of his comfort zone being miles away from the Shire, but you'd expect an air of confidence and superiority for a wise old elf and a master smith, just like how Hugo Weaving's Elrond talks. The man looks like he's an intern given a major project.
just watching season 2 and the perfect person to play Celebrimbor was cast as Adar...
Celebrimbor was the son of Curufin, fifth son of Fëanor and Nerdanel, and Fëanor's only known grandchild. Fëanor was the most skilful craftsman of the First Age, forging the three Silmarils to capture some of the light of the Two Trees of Valinor.
Also, Feanor was the most beautiful male elf and Curufin looked exactly like his copy appearance wise.
@@maglor2414 Yeah, but, you see, clearly Celebrimbor didn't take after his father and also... well I mean blond hair happens sometimes I guess?
And all the stress or something must have aged him. I don't know. Also 3rd age elves clearly invented some prime wrinkle remover.
/s.
@@maglor2414Celebrimbor was an adopted hobbit in Amazon new superior, more inclusive lore. I'm sure every Hobbit feels so great that he's now represented amongst the Elves
@@vincentadultman6226 I think Hobbits and dwarves fit right fine among the Amazon elves, I can barely see any difference
@@maglor2414 fr, celebrimbor looks like an old ass man, and Galadrial, who will be the oldest elf in any room no matter where she goes in the second age, looks like a petulant teenager
Ahh, the mastermind evil act of teaching the best smiths of the world what ALLOYS are!
Truely an action of a dark lord... what a genious manipulation... truely you see his dark magical influences: ALLOYS..
Half of what Dwarves knew, they learned from the Noldor. And they NEVER outdid them. They just mass produced it. Celebrimbor had THOUSANDS of years to master what he learned from masters who had thousands of years of experience at their craft. Plus he spent a LONG time making rings. The Three and the ONE were just the very last. Sauron learned most of what he knew from the Noldor.
@@xhagast I don't agree with a few points here.
1. Dwarves and elves had different specialities in crafting, Tolkien did not just put Elves simply higher than dwarves (especially since he hated the demeaning tone dwarves were usually represented in in other lore and media). It was Thingol, who ordered the dwarves work the Silmaril into a necklace and all other kinds of works over his elves. I would also count Telchar as one of the great crafters.
But I can understand your view as many of the tales/books are written in a pretty elf-centric personal perspective.
2. The last sentence, since Sauron (Mairon) was pupil of Aulë, Sauron may have learned quite a bit from the Noldor, but most of Aulë himself, you know the Vala of Smithing. Also the art of ringcrafting, Sauron learned from Melkor/Morgoth.
I don't understand the reasoning of this comment on just a joke about Amazon's shitshow.
@@lmr4403 My first Tolkien book was the Silmarillion and the Noldor were my favorite Elves. The Dwarves were good but Feanor and later Celebrimbor outdid them. The Nauglamir, the greatest creation of Dwarven craft, had no one maker and was made for an Elf(Finrod)with Elven gems. Thingol was a Sindar and his people but for Eol were not as good as the Noldor at anything. And even Sauron needed the arts of Feanor's grandson to make rings.
This stupid series makes a mockery of everything. The Dwarves barely made it out in one piece.
@@xhagast I do agree that obviously Celebrimbor and Feanor are the big guns, that later people of any race cannot compare to. Though those are 2 individuals in a story with already elven perspective (remember most is written in personal perspective form; so purposefully biased and flawed perspective). It is fine that you have favorites (characters, races, groups etc.), but your argumentation is overgeneralizing A LOT.
@@xhagast
As creations of Aulë, they were attracted to the substances of Arda and crafts. They mined and worked precious metals throughout the mountains of Middle-earth. They were considered unrivalled in arts such as smithing, crafting, metalworking, and masonry, even by the Noldor. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of Aulë and Yavanna"
In the tempering of steel alone of all crafts the Dwarves were never outmatched even by the Noldor, and in the making of mail of linked rings, which was first contrived by the smiths of Belegost, their work had no rival. During the third age of the captivity of Melkor, the Dwarves smithied for Thingol; for they were greatly skilled in such work, though none among them surpassed the craftsmen of Nogrod, of whom Telchar the smith was greatest in renown. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Sindar"
They were also capable masons and smiths - Dwarven smithing skills were said to be unrivalled, and their masonry creations were bested by none. The crafting skills of the Dwarves were unmatched; they crafted objects of great beauty out of gems and metals. They crafted many famed weapons, armours, and items of art and beauty, among them Narsil, the sword of Elendil, the Dragon-helm of Dor-lómin and the necklace Nauglamír, the most prized treasure in Nargothrond and the most famed Dwarven work of the Elder Days. - J.R.R. Tolkien, Christopher Tolkien (ed.), The Silmarillion, "Quenta Silmarillion: Of the Ruin of Doriath"
Just some stuff to back up my claims.
Dude I’m so glad I never watched past the first episode. Celebrimbor is one of THE most complex and interestingly written characters I’ve ever seen. He’s not evil per se but he’s not moral, and he’s so serious that he can be unintentionally funny at times, but never even cracks a smile. WTF did the show do to him
Haven't seen Rings of Power, only bits and scenes. But I don't think anyone can play Celebrimbor quite how Alastair Duncan did. The sheer power, wrath, pride and arrogance. One of my favorite performances in any game, and always the first version of Celebrimbor I think of when I see him mentioned anywhere.
Avoid RoP, it is poison. The game is VERY acceptable. At least, the Elves LOOK like the Elves we know. And they act like them.
celebrimbor a master smither and crasftman , in rings of power he doesnt even know what an alloy is, you can guess if the character it is accurate
To be fair, the game doesn’t really show Celebrimbor definitively either. The timeline in Tolkiens stories really makes everything he did impossible.
Name one good line SoM and SoW had:
The Arena Speech
Celebrimbors badass lines
Almost every single sentence
Celembrimbors "pissed" lines
The Bright Lord fast travel dialouge
The Line after retaking the Nurnen fort from Brüz
Name one good celebrimbor line in The Rings of Power:
@kolbywilliams7234 the middle earth games aren't canon to the Tolkien books, only the major elements are from Tolkien, obviously, everything else was Monolith
Rings of Power is an abomination.
It is indeeed
couldn't have said it better myself
Agreed
Agreed
I hope they would change everything in S2 , Especially how they act in a boring cold ass way….
The power of rings dude looks like gordon ramsay as an elf.
Shadow of war/mordor cuscenes had me glued to the screen.
Rings of power kept playing after i fell asleep and never again after ep4.
Of course Jackson fans don’t care about the lore
@@reek4062woke rings of power fanboy.
They looked as amateur theater group, who dig their costumes from a charity container.
You're out of your mind if you think those costumes look cheap. Probably where a huge part of the budget went to.
The game is one of the only things to actually show how deadly elves where in the books
Hey Celebrimbor after centuries of forging metals, have you ever thought about making alloys?
Celebrimbor: 😮
The option to cast only goofy, weird, old looking people as immortal elves known for their beauty was certainly an odd one. I will probably never watch this show, despite being a major LotR fan (the kind that read unfinished tales).
Yeah, me too. Such a disappointment, really. I wanted these series to be good, but they are completely unwatchable.
Thank God, Amazon has no rights to Silmarillion.
Don’t watch it it will make you want to Stab out your eyes it’s that bad. It’s horribly miscast and the writing is pure vomit.
I made the mistake of giving it a try thinking “ it probably isn’t as bad as people say” but boy was I wrong.
That’s literally the dumbest reason to not like this show tf😅
@ijustbevibin0425 how brain dead are you that you don't understand how ageless perfectly fair beings shouldn't look the way they do in this show? It's not Even close to the singular reason though, but with people like you it seems like they can churn out empty garbage and propaganda with no consequence to them.
@@ijustbevibin0425 Looks matter, it doesn't feel like lord of the rings seeing celebrimbor as a senile old man
I wish Peter Jackson would do a trilogy of movies set in the 2nd age or even the first age. He's the only one that gives Middle Earth the love it deserves.
Neither are canon, but I know which one I like more ;)
Yeah I love shadow of Mordor and war games
Would love a third shadow of game
@@stevenbils talion is gone and while they hinted at a possible third game with the main character being eltariel, i would have to be dead before i play as that traitorous elf
Celebrimbor in ROP 'Grandma is kind of losing her marbles'.
damn what the hell. He was so badass in that game The creators didnt atleast get some notes of how great he was portrayed in that game
In the games celembrimbor really shows his feanorian heritage
With all that that implies... unfortunately for him
What’s especially funny is that Shadow of Mordor/War are equally as lorebreaking with Middle-Earth as Rings of Power, but their story is still superior.
They respect the books and is self admittedly non canon but rings of power on the other hand.
It just has to be well written
Also it's a game... story and lore accuracy is nowhere near as important as putting the gameplay elements first and foremost.
@@Peremptor I dunno how much of that I agree with. Yes gameplay must take priority but when you’re game involves handling a pre established IP, I think you should handle it with care
@@thenethralking6032 We don't seem to live in a world that cares too much about individual's rights... let alone fictitious ones' right to be themselves haha.
It's so tragic, I can't understand how it's even possible with the budget the had..
What do you expect Amazon to do with Fëanor’s grandson? Make him seem like a great elflord?
Guess it was too much to ask.
No , a lesbian politician😊
@@Hanzo2024I mean, kings are kinda politians, so he IS technically a politician
Halbrand/Sauron: Couldn't you think of using alloys?
Celebrimbor: You know, working at Amazon changes people.
Halbrand/Sauron: And how?
Celebrimbor: I used to be an elf.
Halbrand/Sauron: 😳
These actors look like random dudes that enter the wrong set, they just remind us the master piece of Peter Jackson
Why is he an old man hes supposed to look young like in shadows of Mordor
Shadows still gets him wrong but it doesn't do so as badly.
@@lokenontherange*gets him wrong but still respects the character
Sauron : What about heating metal ore so that it starts flowing like lava ....
Celebrimbor : What an intriguing suggestion ...
Gil Galad : All hail Celebrimbor who just invented ore smelting !
Them choosing to have him of all people not know what alloy is makes me crack up to this day haha
Caricatures.... even their ears looks laughable. 1 billion for this????
Probably wasted 60% of the budget on CGI shots and told the people who worked on practical effects and costume/ armor designs to f*ck off.
Taurduin Studios with _Rings of Power_ and Mickey Hawkchow with _Star Wars_ seem to have been operating under the same mistaken assumption, once summarized by JoshScorcher as "Popular thing is popular! Therefore, easy money!"
It's Amazon, probably tax evasion, money laundering
I am throughly convinced this is some sort of money laundering scheme
Ring of Power also kind of forgot that elves don't really age. Not sure what the point they don't age in looks, perhaps around thrid years of age.
They don't age physically, they just fade away when there's no magic left in Middle Earth
It varies. Cirdan does look elderly but he's also absurdly ancient and is the only elf to grow a beard. The thing about elves is they look both young and old at the same time with an ageless ethereal grace to them. Real people can't do that so when Jackson was casting he intentionally aimed to get a consistent vibe with all the elves. Rings of Power elves aren't aesthetically consistent though, so the issue makes itself rather annoyingly present.
they age
thingol, gwindor, cirdan, galadriel...
@@mar2506yeah they do, but never enough to have wrinkles
@@bokoblinlogic1619
they most likely have wrinkles imo
books say that even galadriel looks aged even though she is not considered old.
cirdan, gwindor and thingol might have wrinkles.
they probably look like 60 yo old person.
actor ben daniel looks exactly like cirdan imo.
.
not to mention , if they dont have wrinkles , how can you tell they are old
you tell human is old because he she has wrinkles.
Wow sjukt rolig jämförelse. Får mig att inse ännu mer vilket skämt Rings of Power var.
Those cinematics are so amazing! Almost makes me want to play the game!
I like how ageless elves all age visibly, and all beardless numenoreans all have bears. That's sarcasm
I take this as proof that they did not even bother reading the material. Celebrimbor led a desperate resistance against Sauron's army sieging his seat of Ost-in-Edhil, pissing Sauron off so much that the Dark Lord desecrated his corpse and used it as a banner. Can you imagine this actor playing such a character?
I mean the drapes he's wearing would do as a banner in a pinch?
Sauron used Celebrimbor’s corpse as a banner because Celebrimbor wouldn’t reveal where he hid the Three.
@@Olivia-W underrated comment
Lookin like the cast of Big Bang Theory just slapped on big ass ears n cosplayed as elves
"One Elven archer is worth three Gondorian archers"
really? only three?
@@RandomKritMagnet one would think by playing the games that celebrinbor would praise the elves even more in comparison to other races
noice quote ha
Mixing ores? You wot?
>how many kilos of steel is in that workshop
Guess elves didn’t even have bronze weapons and just went to iron.
They didn't make steel yet, but that's more due to the fact that steel requires extreme temperatures (like you find in a blast furnace). Dude would 100% be creating alloy. All that silver, gold, etc on the armor they wear is alloyed against wear.
@@AuspexAO You don't need a blast furnace to make steel. Those sorts of things are for making larger pieces or for getting a very exact consistency. All you need to make steel is iron, coal, and a small bellows to stoke the fire up to the right temperature.
@@lokenontherange Sure…kind of. Making steel is like making a souffle, any idiot can do it, but it probably won't be great. Early steel like Wootz/Damascus steel has proven very hard for modern scientists to replicate. Many think that they got lucky with a naturally favorable ore vein (with a composition favorable to steel production) and others say they replicate later crucible furnaces with their high monsoon winds. Either way, it was hard for ancient man to create a high quantity of reliable, edge-maintaining steel. Sure, you don't need the bessemer process and big coke furnaces to make steel, but that's when steel weapons became more common.
Remember how rob stark lit the entire continent on fire but the actual king ended up being the mentally unstable cripple? Well Amazon saw that and said, "I hear that subversion of expectation is very smart, let's do that."
I saw the meme a year ago and the first thing that came to mind was "look at how they murdered my boi"😢
Shadow of Mordor and its Bright Lord DLC did justice to Celebrimbor. They made him an elven badass and nearly made his combat skills almost on par with the elves of the first age.
In J.R.R. Tolkien's legendarium, Celebrimbor is depicted more as an intellectual and a master craftsman than a grim warrior.
Nenya, the Ring of Water: This ring is made of mithril, a precious and incredibly light and durable silvery metal. The material of the other two elven rings is not explicitly mentioned.
Mithril is extremely rare, found only in a few places in Middle-earth, most notably in the mines of Khazad-dûm (later known as Moria).
The Dwarves of Khazad-dûm were the primary miners and smiths of mithril, becoming very wealthy due to their monopoly on this precious metal.
If you combine these facts, how should Celebrimbor have known of the alloy, if the dwarves discovered it first???
@@TheGandralfin lore there is no mention of Celebrimbor being devoid of fighting skill or anything of the sort...in fact most often the Noldor princes would be highly skilled warriors along with being craftsmen and artists, sicentists, philosophers etc., the Noldor, High Elves were folk of many talents....in the lore Celebrimbor is mentioned to face Sauron himself during the attack on Eregion, though he loses:
"Celebrimbor, desperate, himself withstood Sauron on the steps of the great door of the Mírdain; but he was grappled and taken captive, and the House was ransacked." (The History of Galadriel and Celeborn, The Unfinished Tales)
But seriously losing to Sauron in direct confrontation is nothing to be ashamed of....Sauron is a powerful being and there were instances when the weaker entity can oppose him but even the possibly one of the greatest elven warriors of his day...king Gil-galad eventually fell to Sauron's hand in combat (more precisel was burned alive by his hand :)).
Celebrimbor fought in the battles of Dagor-nuin-Giliath and Dagor Aglareb and many others in the First Age. I doubt there are any elven princes who cannot fight, especially those related to Fëanor.
He WAS en elf of the first age))))
Feanors grandson, Finve's blood.
He lived in Nargotrond, if i remember it correctly
@@IvanZaguzin-b2b Yes, any Noldor elf of the first age would be terrifying to orcs, far more dangerous than a human warrior. This is clear in the Lord of the Rings when Frodo asks what the white light was at the fords of Rivendell after being chased by the black riders.
Somehow him looking like my late grandpa doesn't sell it well
Did anyone involved with the RoP even attempt to look up any of the lore of the LOTR?
Like it’s not as if there wasn’t an infinite source of material but instead they decided to go rogue, drop trousers and just crap on a script and submit it
The same can be said about the developers of this game.
@@lucasmuniz5263 well for who isnt a tolkien nerd book lore person the game is really good doing lots of shit and gags and fun to play and the stand alone lore of the game is quite fine and its understandable wehn LOTR nerds are not into it
The developers of the game and Peter Jackson did not care about the lore either.
They made Celebrimbor old british gramma, because the hero role was reserved for strong female fighting character, namely Guyladriel. The game adaptation was not accurate but they captured the essence of Tolkien world, where the Rings of power created some soap opera bullshit with Tolkien characters for billions of $.
To say they “captured the essence” is a big stretch. I think I pulled something trying to make that fit.
Kidding aside, the games are just as bad as the show in terms of how it depicts the characters and events. It just doesn’t matter as much because it’s a good game, and at the end of the day, a game will be judged by how good of a game it is. Not based on how good of a story it has. A show on the other hand has to be a great story, or it has no reason to exist.
@@kolbywilliams7234 Well I had to be more specific. I meant the design of Celebrimbor, Annatar version of Sauron and their interaction. The story of the game was pure fan fiction, but there was a charm in it. Rings of power was just fiction, there was no love or knowledge in this production.
@@dododimitrov9657
I can see where you are coming from, I think I just disagree with the perspective that a lot of love was put into the games. From my perspective, it was a cynical appropriation of Tolkien’s world that was only saved because it had genuinely good game design and the fact a lot of people haven’t read the books. I don’t consider it fan fiction because a fan of LOTR wouldn’t intentionally get so much wrong. Sexy Shelob, her being Sauron’s scorned lover, all the girl-bosses, the over-the-top silly orcs, it all stinks of post-marvel copycatting and corporate pandering that is on the same level of “hello, fellow kids.”
If the gameplay wasn’t so good, I don’t think I could have finished it because I certainly couldn’t take it seriously. It is just as bad as the show in terms of story.
you are under any comment, shitting on the game lmao
Go shit on movies.
SOW can be a parallel reality. What IF. @@kolbywilliams7234
The over the top orcs was one of the most fun parts of the game...
@@kolbywilliams7234
Having Celebrimbor not knowing what an alloy is is like making a story about William Shakespeare and having him not know what punctuation is.
There wasn’t a single elf in the rings of power. Just humans with pointy ears.
Sow version of celebrimbor was the most lore accurate version of him to date. Even tho ppl saying its not canon they did him very good. Line of Finwe had long black hair, bright blue eyes and commanding voice to top that they were really arrogant. And take a look at Sow series and tell me they didnt do him greatly.
And they were all very great Warriors. Celebrimbor was known as the greatest Fighter of the Noldor in the second Age
He slayed 5 Balrogs in the War of Wrath
@@aranha6285 He was the greatest warrior, such a great archer and also the greatest smith? Was he omnipotent or something?
@@adviththegreat5610 compared to everyone else most elves are, some are even on per with the maiar like Glorfindel
Soo you're saying Henry Cavill would be a good cast bodywise??
It’s nice that every land in this show has the average New York City diversity. Makes it really feel real and like the real world! Really appeals to modern audiences!
I remember when I tried watching RoP with family. I was super excited to see Celebrimbor more than anyone else because of SoW. Even though I knew it was lore inaccurate, I was stoked to see if he would be even remotely close to that badass, cool, stoic, wrathful being that terrorized mordor. When Grandpa Celery showed up every last hope I had for the show was immediately snuffed out just like poor Celebrimbor was.
To be fair, in the source material Celebrimbor was never known to be a warrior. Shadow took a big degree of artistic license with that
No this was utterly unfair. They got Tolkien elves confused with Keebler elves and celebrimbor was definitely the worst
@@maxi1ification true, but he still rules a kingdom I believe. Usually elven kings are super skilled warriors. Or at least on par with really well trained elven swords man like Haldir. At least I think he was good as he lasted pretty long.
When I was still young and silly and Shadow of Mordor came out, I was playing the game from sun up to sun down. Then I played SoW and thought it was also pretty lit. Celebrimbor’s ruthlessness towards orc-kind was amazing. RoP turned Celebrimbor into this silly grandpa who seems to wilt down a lot unlike his SoM counterpart.
@@juliuscaesar810 I think they accidentally gave us Keebler elves.. celebrimbor was the worst tho. What part of eternal youth and beauty did they not understand? With all that money I was hoping for a digitally recreated Jean Binet Ramsey to play young Galadriel
When a video games owns your ass 10 times 😂
And the game is still something like 10 miles away from being remotely lore accurate.
Goes to show just how badly RoP did.
@@panther-nk2hn yeah but it's a freaking good game, and not some woke bad show!
@@PKandME just because a show is bad doesn't mean it's woke just means the writing is ASS
@@live10yearsinthejointreact80Usually you'd have a point. But not in this case. This one fits the criteria. The story was already there. They modified it for "inclusivity". They said so, in interviews and such. And you saw it in the show.
Badass celebrimbor makes me fear Sauron even more. Imagine how he was deceived, must have been wild or genius. lol
If this is the grandson of Feanor then Barliman Butterbur is a numenorean and Lobelia Sacksville is a Balrog
hey dont disrespect butterbur
I love everything about this. 😂
Lobelia and her stolen spoons are a greater threat than Commander Galadriel 😂 I like her ending in LoTR, even if her son dies at the end
Barliman identifies as a numenorean, and there's nothing you can do about it bigot 😂
I loved Shadow of Mordor / War and the story branches they made. It was clearly fanfic, but great fanfic that we could all enjoy. A wonderful "What if?" of sorts.
Then Amazon makes this dribblepiss.
If I may add:
If the Shadow games weren't canon, it didn't matter that much. There would be fewer gamers than movie viewers, and it would most likely be Tolkien nerds who knew the real story buying the game. But Rings of Power, on one of the most accessible streaming services of the time and in the easily-consumed format of TV, polluted the story for the vast majority of the fanbase AND the casual viewers. The games gave an optional sandbox for nerds; the show was almost insidious in its insinuation into the "canon."
I was under the impression that Celebrimbor was also a fighter
"Isn't that odd?" said just as Bilbo did regarding the ring. yea he should have played a hobbit LUL
He would have made an AMAZING hobbit
0:35 for a second i thought they are hobbits, lmao Elves don't look, don't talk, don't behave like this xD
Respect and quality in filmmaking is expectations theses days
For real. Shadow series really did good on Celebrimbor IMO.
I don’t even care for Lotr or rather am not a huge fan but I played both games SOM and SOW Talion and Calibrimbors story was a fascinating experience he was everything I would expect from a guy who was one of the greatest warriors and smiths to ever walked middle earth strong, graceful, resilient, and awesome he hooked me into the lore of a series I have never watched or read. Then I watched ROP explained in 15 minutes or less and when Calibrimbor was revealed I was like “who da fu#k is this shy, skittish, goofy lookin uncle character” to say the least it was a sad day when I realized that the man I watched throw hands with Sauron like he was Muhammad Ali in his prime and only lost because the one ring betrayed him for it’s true master was reduced to this… truly a missed opportunity as even tho the games aren’t canon he was just so amazing in them.
I recommend reading/watching the Lord of the Rings and Hobbit. ROP is really crappy fanfiction and doesn't follow lore in the slightest. SOM and SOW are highly lore inaccurate as well but they are still much closer to the actual lore and better written that ROP.
Pretty much nothing in those games is lore accurate. Including Celebrimbor's story.
@@sisyphus349 correct, I myself literally pointed that out
Amazon forgot that elves do not look like old men.
Celebrimbor, grandson of the greatest of the Noldor, and he's portrayed as some old dude who seems to be unsure of what he should be capable of.
Also for some reason forgets he's a king who claims who views himself as superior to Gil-Galad and who also has a legitimate argument to be the High King himself.
@@lokenontherange when and where he view himself as superior to Gil-Galad.
@@an6153 His whole dea and the reason why his kingdom is separated is that he thinks he should be the High King. Gil-Galad is the descendant of a lesser son.
The games make Rings of Power look like a 15 years old tumblr girl self insert fanfic
perfect actor! I unironically liked him in that role. People should acknowledge, that the greatest smith is more of a scientist then a fighter.
You should acknowledge that you have zero knowledge about Celebrimbor
Really wrecked me seeing how they casted Celebrimbor! I mean I know we weren’t gonna get the exact same version form the game but damn it’s definitely a great blueprint to start with
Shadow of Mordor and War twisted the canon, but still had some resemblance or respect for Tolkien’s works. But RoP is like digging up Tolkien’s grave and taking a dump right on his face before doing the same to Christopher.
Turning Isildur into a Nazgûl is not respectful, at all.
And Peter Jackson “eviscerated” the book according to Christopher Tolkien.
@@reek4062 There's a lot to dislike about the PJ interpretation, but it is positively respectful compared to this Amazon version.
celebrimbor Tolkien: King of Eregion, master smith
celebrimbor ROP: elf granny in a lady's dress
Its actually painful thats we had a billion dollar LOTR show and THIS is what we got. Imagine what it could have been.