2 Premiums, One Playstyle: MiG-21 SPS-K & MiG-21S (War Thunder)
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- Опубліковано 13 січ 2022
- Airfield AAA Discussion video: • A Solution To The Long...
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Thanks for all the support. It means more than you know :) - Ігри
Thanks for the support over the last few months. I'll try to be more consistent with videos. Speaking of there are some corrections because I make errors sometimes and need to address them:
-MiG-21 SPS-K is 10.0 but that changes little as the majority of your matches will be 9.3-10.7
-MiG-21S has more thrust (which it shouldn't, that's from the MiG-21SM) but during my flyouts I could not see much of a difference.
If the MiG-21S had R-13Ms, which are *roughly* equivalent to AIM-9Ds, the MiG-21S would be a VERY compelling option. I am unsure whether you could run R-13Ms with R-3Rs. If so, that would make it imo, on par with the SPS-K. I am also told the SPS-k. Provided that the MiG-21S is upgraded to the SM standard, it would have an integrated 23mm Gsh-23-2 and would therefore be able to carry the ECM pod that the SMT, MF and Bis could carry. That would make it on par with the SPS-K absolutely.
please let the snail give us the r-13M and ECM pod, or at least just one. I hate using AIM-9B at 9.7, and a new top-end missile would immensely help my suffering.
or they could add a purchasable with GE or research able with normal RP to upgrade it to the SM standard
Bought this plane recently, the lack of countermeasures now that it faces aim 9ls makes horribly painful
For real
Heres how to survive, go high from the start and then once you are over the combat area deploy airbrakes and point down full burner, always stay behind the harriers warthogs and intruders and use r9rs, alternately stay high and keep the enemy from climbing out of danger
@@abdelkadersenouci3108 early radars dont work well when pointed down, especially when u wanna target enemy way down below (which is beyond its range too)
MiG-21S has 21MF's engine, which has ~1000kgf more thrust than one on the SPS-K, so flight performance-wise 21S is much better
That being said they fly functionally the same. I couldn’t notice the difference in engine power, only weapons
@@Spitflyer Odd. For me I can really feel the engine difference between the two. The engine on the S is why I prefer it over the SPS-K.
I knew I wasn't crazy. The S felt like it accelerated very similarly to the MF
Although I’d rather take the r60s
It isn't significantly better. The Mig21S is similar to the SMT and as such is much heavier than the PFM, so in my experience they are almost dead equal anyways.
I think these 2 planes are the honest to god highlight of how far compression has progressed in this game.
F86F vs Supersonics Mig21
@@td9302 right, and no AIMs even though Taiwanese ones were equipped (Thats how Russia got the r3r's, AIM9 dud caught in a Chinese MiG).
Just for a few examples, supersonics like the F11 and Sambad, and the Mig21s even sit at 9.0-9.3
The Sea Vixen with all aspect radar slaving missiles sits at 8.7, with the transonic Scimitar
Meanwhile the Swift F1, F86, Mig15 ect barely break mach 0.85 and have no missiles yet face planes 2x as fast
What is the point of introducing 11.3 if 8.0-10.0 is inherently broken?
@@thomasmacdonough288 money
Actually yeah I suppose so
The AV-8A has been moved up to 9.7 a few months ago. In the same patch where it got the flares
They're not the same planes though and they don't really fly the same either because of the BR and weapon systems that both give quite the different experience ._.
That's what i was thinking.
@DEFYN do u use vertical on any GSH guns ? - i do watch most of your tutorials (as i did subscribe to you ;) ) but i couldn't find answer to my question
@@Cichostepski
Look the description of his videos on the mig 21 he always says it. If "vertical targeting" is not written that means he doesn't use it.
But do how you feel is better for you (me I use it for example, 600m).
@@vedeved5246 Ye I know but more planes have GSH type guns - Im just wandering if he used it at any of those :D
@@Cichostepski
Check his video on the 23M/MLD/MF maybe ?
Airfield AA at this BR is very hit or miss, the Rolands burn for a long time so you can react to them pretty "easily" and the M247s either do fuck all or they clip your wing without warning
I mean its pretty easy to make em miss 100% of the time
It’s literal horseshit at the low tiers
It’s so annoying, I’ve flown near enemy airfield AA for 8-10 mins some games and others I fly near them and get 1 shot “pilot knocked out” by the M247 from 3 km away
they are also placed in very poor places like one side is up against a cliff and the other is on a defilade
and then AA at bottom tier basicly snipes you from 3 km away and even point blank
The 21S ingame is kind of a amalgamation of the 21S and the 21SM. As far as i understand it the 21S should have a weaker engine, or be upgraded to SM standard with the current engine and also get a internal gun instead of the gunpod, aswell as r13m's
Guys on the forum have made a report as the 21S was just release, asking of either fix the engine designation (originally was as on PFM), or fix the output. Gaijin chose 1st option. I think they’re going to watch the stats of the playerbase, if winrate will be low, the’ll give R13 and rename the plane as SM. If winrate will be good, no changes further
@@dimitar330 i think its perfect how it is. Its a great grinder as it almost never sees uptiers. And the r3s, while a bad missile, is more about patience ..the f 105 is a problem
@@Christph-vb1gn on 9.7 and below? Yes, sure.
But for downtiers 21S becomes a gun-only platform, with ~40% chance to hit someone with R3R. But for gun-only - not much ammo, quite specific ballistics. And we dont have flares, so we’re not allowed to dogfight, only hit and run.
I definitely have plenty of fun with this plane, but 15G missiles with reasonable range could make it a bit more comfortable without transforming 21S into no-brain imbalance craft.
Even fixing R3S to AIM9B current state could make life more comfortable, because Sidewinder is better now.
Yes, the MiG-21S did have a variant that used R60's and R13's, it's called the MiG-21bis, no i'm serious.
The S really looks like the bis and it's mostly why they used the body of the aircraft.
As always I love your gameplay Spit, keep it up :)
0:19 the MiG-21S is 9.7, and the MiG-21 SPS K is 10.0
Jfc I swear they were both 9.7. Mandela effect I guess
The sps was 9.7 in the dev server, but they added r60 and put it at 10.0 instead
@@stormjet814 IK
In the first game, they were camping your airfield. The 2 ways to defeat airfield aa is to dive at 90* straight down at max speed and strafe, then full burner away. Or come in treetop level and buzz the field, which is a lot riskier.
Playing Black Sabbath increases the success rate of the tree top level route
Edit: success rate increases even further if flying a century series aircraft
The M247s seem to be more capable of shooting down the 90* strafers now, and the treetop level one is possible as long as you can maneuver enough to dodge the SAMs, and jink a little to avoid the cannon fire whilst keeping as much speed as possible.
Honestly, it doesnt take that much effort anymore. So long as you arent flying in a perfectly straight line the missiles wont hit you most of the time ever since the update to ground aa missiles.
@@ovrwrldkiler Iirc, the Roland missiles weren’t supposed to be affected much by the change other than a little bit of a nerf to their maneuverability, but it seems that the AI have been steering the missiles too hard and then they lose tracking of the missile. The M247s seem to be much more deadly now than they were an update ago.
Hi spit hope you are well
5:48 if you go to about 6k meters and dive directly top down above the airfield, the saams wont track and whoever is on the runway is completely defenseless. plus if you are going super sonic the missiles will never catch you when you pull out of the dive after strafing the airfield
No need to go all the way to 6km. Works for me at 4km height.
You should fly the f104 g for German
What a really nice gameplay, everything is here
Nice video 👍
Thanks mate!
"OMEGALUL ANOTHER ONE" yeah sum' up my little holiday in top tier ari RB lmao
For runway kills, most of the work is using land cover to avoid the AAAs until you get the kill. Then pray you can make it back to cover after the kill. I usually fly like 50m off ground there and back if possible, or hide behind hills.
Now that you can take a custom setup, I've found that taking gun, R-13M1, and 2 R-3Rs have been the way to go. If I'm feeling more dogfighty, I'll take an r-60 instead of the 13 or 1 r-60, 1 R-3R, and 1 R-3S
First off love your videos second I don't know if this is all UA-camrs or sending you can choose but I really like that I can shorten your videos like make the screen smaller why doing other stuff on my phone like my calculator to do math for my work and it's really nice to be able to listen to something while I'm doing that and not all videos allow you to do that
SPS-K now got R-13M1 and I picked it up on sale to grind F-4F (for my ground lineup) and performs well.
I don't run flares and R-60s but just guns and then sneak up a long range shot with R-13M1s.
The biggest problem is that sometimes an enemy get killed before my missile hits (because teammate was near him and I am 4 km out) and so I wasted a missile.
But the 250 rounds of 23s seems to be ok for this BR and I think they do even more damage then vulcans, hit per hit.
I would like n updated review.
The AAA on airfield do Something yes. But when you fly so low the missiles dont Connect because trees or you flying under Radar. I Hope that can answer your question
bro I always get dunked by roland SAMs while trying to raid Phantoms from behind always staying low, ground clutter is my best friend
@@kingghidorah8106 u can also go to 5k meters then dive down u will kill the camper and be flying away before the first Missile is launched
hey spit you should do a video on the MiG19 with the new ammo belts, you'll see how fun it is to see that you need to push your plane til break overloads because the shells went from 860m/s to 750 and increased drag... oh and the armored belts have 50 percent solid shells with no explosive filler so there's literally 50 percent chance you can't kill or critically damage on one pass
To dodge the AF sams either weave back and forth, they aren't good with movement, or get above 15k feet before you get within their max range and they'll never see or shoot you even when diving from above until you're well on the way out, the SAMs are easier to dodge than the old AA, the new AA only works when flying straight at low alt or turning very slowly right overhead, and thats when the m247s get you instead.
Planemcshoot was my friend xD
Didn't think I'd see him in a video
@Spit_flyer try setting vertical targeting to ON, and distance to 400m with MiG-21. It will help bring the shots in line with the nose instead of the belly and helps massively with aiming this beast. I promise you will not be disappointed.
Does this make it better past 400m or only better up to 400m
@@conordwyer1553basically convergence doesnt matter when u have mid plane placed guns - vertical allows u to aim it similar to NATO guns - still it is 23mm so kinda slow projectile -i dont think u should be shooting over 500m with it - but still luck shots at 1200m happens ; to sum up GSH family of guns -> get as close as u can
@@Cichostepski what about the nr familys?
@@conordwyer1553 It is a bit hard to explain without a picture. But it aims the gun up slightly so it meets your crosshair at 400m distance. I find with the gun placement and velocity of the Mig-21/23 this puts the guns in line more with the nose of the aircraft and helps at all ranges. With low velocity guns you can make the distance higher than 400m to make them arc even further up, this makes deflection shots easier but straight shots harder. After hours of testing I find 400m is the perfect spot. Feel free to try 300, 400, or 500m and find what is right for you.
@@maperdiole This works very well for Mig-15/17, and mig 19 also. I use vertical targeting almost always, and my general rule is: The higher the gun velocity, the further you can push the distance out. EX: Mig-15 with 600m/s is good with 300m, Mig-21 with 700m/s is good with 400m, mig-19 with ~800m/s is good with 500m, NATO guns with higher velocity (Vulcan) feels good at 600-700m
correct me if im wrong but i dont think the r-60mk is an export variant of the r-60m, iirc it was an upgrade of the r-60m that replaced the optical fuse with a radar fuse, still infrared guidance. Not sure how that affects it's performance in game or if it is even modelled though
there is a way where you can get so a certain altitude above the airfield and you can dive down kill the person and use your energy to zoom out
that f-100 was runing his brakes.
Thank you for the vid, i have 51 GJN from selling the MIG 23MF and AGS and thinking about to get some premium jets
Could you do a video on your control setup
I love your ironic humour mate
Here we go!
Nice vid
MiG-21S late, R-13M.
5:46. It was after the MCLOS/SACLOS Missile nerf that this became super viable. Had a MiG-21MF come in from nowhere and AF strafe 4 of my team(including me) before finally dying to a Roland. A Su-7BMK came in later and strafed a F-4E, and M247s only started firing at him 4km after he had finished his run. Thankfully he tried to finish me off(I wouldn't have given him a reward so lol) and missed 2 times and finally got killed by a Roland on his third run because he was slow. Also the SPS-K and the S should basically preform the same as the S is basically a modified PFM and the SPS is the German designation for the PFM because they had named another MiF-21PF variant PFM. the PFM in game right now is missing a lot of thrust and I believe the SPS-K too. As for R-60s, iirc, only Polish PFMs carried R-60s so the SPS-K shouldn't actually have R-60s. The SPS-K in game right now visually and what it has is a mash-up of like 3 PFMs.
i have the mig 21 sps k it's pretty neat.
In the air-to-air role the MiG-21R could carry two RS-2US or R-3S air-to-air missiles.
hey spit, could you tell me some tips for playing the g91 ys because in my opinion it just doesn't seem good. It could be because mine is stock, or it could be that I'm just not a good enough pilot, but it just seems to be food for other planes.
3:59 How do you turn this on? i have been trying to for an hour or so but i cant seem to use the r3r's at all any help?
Is there a way to hide the ticket bar at the top of the screen While in the cockpit or at least make it smaller
So would you recommend buying the SPS-K or S
The same thing happened to me while I was on airfield rearming a mig-19 just flew over and slapped me while I couldn’t do anything about it. Not a single missile launch from the AAA…
Quick correction: the mig21 S has a more powerfull engine (same power as the mig21 MF´s engine)
I wanna getthe mirage 2000C from airmodels but it's out of stock, do you have any idea if it's gonna be back in stock? figured since you're sponsored maybe you know. thanks.
No sportsmanship, I always get straffed on the runway while landing or take off.
How can you change the way your radar looks the one on the right side
How do you switch between radar missiles and inferred if you have both in the same pay load?
When did the mig-21s lose the split missles? I can only equip 4R's or 4S's...
Title sounds familiar huh 💀
👀
100% do an AV8 video, they are so good with the broken 9Gs
you get no countermeasures and often get up br and get to play with all the nasty phantom bois, radar lock really fast and missile lock when looking up
put the aa discussion video in description
Hey spit not sure if your gonna see this but thought I'd give it a shot ☺️ was wondering if you could make a video on your control and settings for air RB if you haven't already, I love watching your vids and keep up the good work
I’m working on it
how do u counter the "Gs" without moving the crosshair like on 7:03 ?
See the A5C is in the Chinese tech tree, so therefore so is the AA and all I can say is 1980-1990 Chinese products didn’t have the strictest quality control
which should i buy ? the german version or the russian version , or should i buy the f5c?
Idk why but i dont have the thing on the left in any Type of games but i want it how can i activate it?
hey any good planes to talisman for grinding USA toptier?
on the spsk i always take flares because i always see the mirageIIC so matra r550s are a real threat so flares for me are better than guns
R13 is an improved version of R3, so 21S should be able to carry it. On the other side, we have no planes in USSR/German tech tree, where R13 is top missile, so 21S can become one. I really would like to see it on the 21S, I do believe that this should not affect balance too much, but IR missile launches should become a bit more comfortable.
As a suggestion, 2 R13 + 2R3R should be a quite balanced decision.
I've seen people have dogfights at stall speeds over an airfield with AAA doing nothing yet I go near enemy AF and the guns one shot me on a Phantom
He listens to us:)
How to kill aircraft on runway: go straight up(minimum 5k alt) then dive down, not a single thing can touch you.
How to get this thick weapon lock circle?
Is there any other skins for the German mig-21 I'm not a huge fan of that one
How do you change missile type
The Mig21S should get the R-13M’s, in historical terms, I’m pretty sure lol
To give you my opinion on the 21S, it would be OK at 9.7 if it only had 200 rounds of GSh-23. At 9.7 with its radar, 4 missiles, and 21MF performance... it's pretty OP for the BR.
Dont forget it has R3's they're awful
this is still a viable strategy and works very well
wish i have this thumbnail in good quality
I really like your content. Watching your videos has helped me get much much better at top tier and I finally reached level 100. Idk if you’ll see this comment but S tier UA-camr
Thanks mate :)
f4 behind me was chasing for a min, didn't shoot any missiles, my eyes are on him right.. and then boom i explode, it said he shot a aim9 at me but i did not see anything at all, in my eyes absolutely nothing was shot at me i 1million % would see that happen, then after i died i saw on his jet he was missing a missile so he did shoot it but it was completely not visible
Sadly its pretty easy for you to counter the rolands, you can just go to 4k meters and dive in 90 degrees
At this point they might as well just do away with battle ratings and have a big free for all lol
I despise the 21S. Mainly because not having R60’s. I’m not good with the GsH23 so maybe thats why. Otherwise I like that it’s super fast and can turn really good. I’ve had terrible luck with the AAM’s
Love the plane I usually average 1-3 kills a game in it. You get to literally pick every engagement and can almost outran anything at the br. You just have to have good aim with it
Use the R3R missiles for head-ons or from the side with nose lead. I usually hit my target 70% of the time.
It's best used when your target is preoccupied with one of your friendlies or just isn't paying attention. I typically launch them at 3km to 1.50km and make sure your speed is at least above 500-600kmh before firing.....boom n zoom.
If you play it smartly you'll typically bring in 5-7 kills every game
The MiG-21S probably did get R-13s/R-60s with later upgrades but this one is meant to be in a 1968 configuration so the limited missiles are accurate. The SPS-K is the one with inaccurate loadouts; it should carry four R-60s and as far as I know the double mounts are not compatible with R-3s, as they were designed specifically for the smaller R-60, so it should only be able to carry two R-3s. I don't understand why Gaijin won't just give it the correct loadout and bump it up to 10.3, I'd consider buying it if they did.
Also hearing "the MiG-21 pulls good AoA" is uuuuuhh not what I expected coming from DCS lol.
Except it's not because it's using the SM's engine
MiG-21S is missing a lot right now. Wrong radar, wrong engine, missing K-13Ms, and missing a flare pod.
Your R3R's actually work??
no airfield aa should not be a 100% guaranteed safe space where the enemy can't touch you... U need to land and the enemy doesnt, they outplayed you. end of story.
For me the wired is that this plane faces even 7.0 on AB without any rockets or flares. And it's 8.7 when im looking for a match even tho its 9.0br on arcade so thats still 2.0br difference. Playing against 7.0 is like 7.0 playing against 4.0 palnes
So I have a question…
I USE MY R-3 EXACTLY AS USED IN THE VIDEO YET I CANT GET A SINGLE FREAKING KILL
if you're going fast the AAA basically does nothing also my best kill game with the mig-21s was 5 kills 3 gun and 2 missiles in one run
So the R60s are new?
Mounting hardware prevents this mug from carrying r-60
This pops up on my feed during the summer sale, after the F-14 update. As if I’m gonna get either of them now, top tier is unplayable
Both planes don’t see top BR jets. I haven’t played them recently but you won’t fight Viggens or MLDs
@@Spitflyer you won’t right now, because all that’s up on air rb above 5.0 is America vs America
Not having a gun on the SPS-K in exchange for counter measures is quite limiting.
There’s absolutely no excuse for these being at 9.7, utterly absurd that these are at 9.7 but the Draken is at 10.7 when the ONLY difference is there missiles
The MiG-21S makes sense to be 9.7, and the SPS-K is a 10.0.
@@kommandantkillcode No no the 21s in a downtime sees fucking F86s and the stuff
How is a J35D's only difference missiles when it isnt even closely related
@@td9302 With how the current br bracket is and what is also at those brs, yes, those two brs make sense for the aircraft.
mig 21s has slightly better engine, i think adding 2 r13m's would be good
spsk with r60 or r13 and flare pod optional, mig 21 s with r13 and better engine
Just a few points to highlight; Missile launch overload is gone (thank god) and the reason you die the airfield AA is because you do it wrong. You have to either come in extremely fast and as low as physically possible; Or climb to ~6km and dive strait down, the AAA can't aim strait up, and you wont get hit flying mach 1.1 away from the airfield at deck height.
Try the Hunter FGA.9
Please play the F4U-4B.
The lightning has better acceleration and it should have better top speed, but it rips at mach 1.1 on the deck for some reason even though it can go much faster
The air is thicker at low altitude leading to a lower rip speed. It will perform better at high altitudes
@@conordwyer1553 true, it does. However most people just go right to the deck in jets so sea level rip speed is very important.
how are you getting killed by airfield SAMs? they are so easy to dodge.
The av8a is fine a 9.7since a lot of planes at 9.3 which are Russians get r60 and some other countries as well but they don’t want to give the F5c aim9j
It would only get 2 though
MiG-21 has gone up to R-27 and R-73
I been having fun taking down two versions of the most meta planes at that br range with my starfighter (that I hated to use prior to those two planes being added).
how do you stop yourself from getting an overload of G forces???
What level are you
@@CruelSun69 im level 40
The s is wayyyyy better its faster its quicker it has its speed more and yeah it just feels like a whole diff plane tbh, I own them both! Wish I only bought the S...but the first was one the sps k n I wanted a mig21....
I have yet to understand why they're 9.7 and not 10.0. They're objectively superior to 99% of the airframes around them. If something like the Mirage III CJ can be 10.0 with Aim-9Ds and a single Matra, they should be 10.0 as well.
Compare the 21s to other 9.7s and it'll make sense
F104 has two aim 9bs and is 10.0
BR system is completely broken with overpowered premiums stomping on tech tree vehicles across the board. But the whales don't care.
SPS -K is 10.0 though don't know how the reviewer got it wrong though.,
@@technicallynothing841 The only reasonable competition is the Harrier and A-5, and that is exclusively due to having decent missiles and flares. Considering that they only have 2 chances offensively against a MiG-21 that also has flares as well as SARH missiles, it's still heavily in the MiG's favor.
If the Mirage III CJ can be 10.0, they can too.
The f105 is more broken at 9.7 than any of these migs.