Evidences of the Book of Mormon: Names
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- Опубліковано 27 сер 2024
- One of the best ways to test the Book of Mormon’s historical authenticity is to look at its names. Each of its unique names has now been looked at by scholars with linguistic training, and it turns out that a good number of them have plausible links with words or names in ancient Near Eastern languages, especially with Hebrew and Egyptian. Some of its names are even attested very close to Lehi’s day in Israel and surrounding regions. So, as a collective set, they’re entirely believable. This video explores the validity of these names and highlights additional categories of evidence which help verify their authenticity.
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As a Catholic, all these are interesting cases. I’m open to watching
Angel Gutierrez I didn’t have the will to check all of the claims here, but a simple note here. 4:32 Zedekiah doesn’t mean Lord at all. It comes from Tsedek (צדק) and the ending Yahu (יהו). It means the LORD’s (YHWY’s) Justice. Just taking that little thing will make you question everything else. Quite a stretch to claim a paralelé between Zedekiah and the Lord.
I suggest you research as much as you can and listen to both sides of the argument. I can recommend plenty of materials on the topic.
Or just read the book
@@revertrevertz5438 all these evidence videos are interesting for sure, but they are by no means doctrine. I recommend instead of wasting your time researching if these evidences for the Book of Mormon are true or not, you cut out the middle man and actually read the Book of Mormon and ask God if it's true or not.
Buttered Toast no need. I suggest you read the Bible and accept the Christian faith. “But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let them be Anathema!”
That’s the beauty of Catholicism, we begin from the premise that truth cannot contradict Truth (fides et ratio)
I pray so that you may find the true faith and hope you’d see that in the eyes of God any spiri that preaches a different Gospel is not from above
Very well researched and presented! Quite convincing and compelling evidence!
Playing semantics is neither research nor evidence!! Have you ever even been to college? Or taken a remedial college course? This presentation is directed towards an audience that will readily swallow whatever he says without question because they want to(no, have to believe) it. Just as they have with the entire Mormon belief system! (I hesitate to use the term theology, as it implies a structured, defendable, belief system)
Hello, Cory! Please forgive me for intruding on your reply. I am a believing, current, life-long member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I'm sorry you dislike the Book of Mormon so much, especially when it teaches the gospel of Jesus Christ: to believe in him, to repent of our sin and turn to Christ for his saving grace, and to care for our neighbors and the poor. It teaches us to be baptized and to have hope in the resurrection through Jesus Christ. It warns of pride and the lies of the devil. The Book of Mormon tells us that the Bible is also the word of God. It tells us to have hope in Christ.
You are not required to believe the Book of Mormon is the word of God. You do not need to believe in an unchanging God that still speaks to his prophets and apostles or a Church that meets every requirement of a faith system as found in the Bible.
But I believe in the Book of Mormon, the Bible, God the Father, his son Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost. Jesus Christ restored his Church through Joseph Smith. The truth stands whether I defend it or you attack it.
May the Grace of God attend you, Cory.❤
@@brucenorth5337did God create Jesus?
On 6/11/203@@michaelsterling2650replied, "Bruce North, did God create Jesus?"
No. God did not create Jesus, according to my understanding of the doctrine of the restored gospel, as taught by the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Short questions deserve short answers. Understanding may require more. Any who would like to know why I say this may reply to this comment.
@@brucenorth5337 is Jesus the literal son of God and his spirit wife?
It puts my doubts to rest...thank you...
I really love the way you give credit to the book of Mormon, Thank you for taking the time to shine light to the mos beautiful book besides the Bible which we use and need day by day...
There is no copy of an original text but purported translation and you are trying to compare it to the bible ?
Hi there, the Mormons do so much more than give their book of Mormon 'credit'.
Firstly the Holy Bible's authority and reliability is officially doubted and down played,( the Church's 8th Article of faith).
The book of Mormon is called the keystone of their faith, (indeed it is!.)
Joseph Smith claimed that his book of Mormon was the most correct book on earth, obviously more so than the bible, and that a man could become closer to God by reading it than any other book.
The Mormon missionaries want you to read Joseph Smith's Book Mormon, and believe it.
Joseph, and especially his book of Mormon are the foundation of the church he founded.
That's the difference and great divide that has always existed between Mormonism and Biblical Christianity.
Kind regards to you.
@@geoffnoyes520 this is hilarious how devoted y’all are into this cult bullshit honestly
@@darrenj6527 - it’s hilarious how devoted Mormons are to hijacking the Christian faith
@@geoffnoyes520 Well said I didn’t believe in the Bible much growing up only until I needed to repent did it really become important. For this to happen I needed to feel Godly sorrow, which comes only from the Father, a gift from above, not from missionaries or even from your family who no doubt loves you especially when you ask for their forgiveness. You can not fake that with God because it only comes from him! Heavenly Father excepted Christ sacrifice for all our sins which although Christ is innocent God felt sorry for Jesus I feel. So it comes from above. A mystery until it’s revealed but Jesus is proof Heavenly Father loves his children. Thanks
There's no way a farm hand with a 3rd grade education could just make this up. Even Tolkien couldn't keep his Middle Earth story consistent, and that dude created Elvish--an entire language! Even the best in the world couldn't fabricate something so on-point.
I was a detractor for over a decade. I hated The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints and wanted to crush it. I can admit that shame easily, because I was proven wrong time and time again.
It's sad how many people turn their rage from human actions against God. But hey... I did it for ten years, so I can't judge.
If you want to know the truth, ask God directly. Our brothers and sisters did not create the universe. Ask the One who did.
The truth is already in the Bible. Not a made up conglomerate of trash written by a con. He had multiple people working with him too, so it wasn’t a simple farm boy doing this.
@@jacksonrelaxin3425
Opinions are the cheapest commodity on earth!
James one verse five tells you to ask God. Have you? I have a I have an answered about the book of Mormon, is the word of God!
@@GlenLawlor how do I know it’s him talking ?
@@jacksonrelaxin3425
How important is getting an answer from God do you?
My favorite name in the Book of Mormon is Gidgiddoni. What a strangely wonderful name! If Joseph Smith was making up names, then Gidgiddoni was one of his best creations. Except modern archaeologists discovered that the name Gidgiddoni was used by the Assyrians--the same Assyrians Isaiah wrote about and the same Assyrians who besieged Jerusalem in 701 BC--about 100 years before Lehi left Jerusalem. But I'm sure the fact that Gidgiddoni was a great military leader in the Book of Mormon is just a coincidence. ;-)
strjfs That’s definitely a made up name 🤣
Revert Revertz
Yeah, just like “Utah” just a made up name. There is no such thing the state with that name. I am with you Revert...
@@grandpaje4734 When Utah was established as a state, the Mormons requested that the state be named "Deseret". The U.S. government, in spite of the Mormons, named it after the Ute Indians and called it Utah. In those days, naming the state after the Indians was an insult. Little did the government know that they had fulfilled prophecy, for the Indian name "Ute" translates to "top of the mountains" in native Ute Indian language. In Isaiah 2:2-3, we see that "And it shall come to pass in the last days that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the tops of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it." This is a direct scriptural reference to the Salt Lake Temple, which is surrounded by mountains, has people from all over the world traveling to it all year round, and is located in a place that is named "tops of the mountains" not by the church, but by the Indians and the US government. So, the above scripture accurately translates to "...It shall come to pass in the last days that the mountain of the house of the LORD shall be established in Utah...". The Temple construction had been completed in 1893, but the state of Utah wasn't named until 1896 by the government. In other words, the church was well "established" in the state long before it was named after an Indian name that meant "tops of the mountains".
Nasanieru ナサニエル
Thank you so much.
I believe that’s true. Was not made up...
Nasanieru ナサニエル Such an insult that I can think of at least 10 states Native American names BEFORE Utah 🙄
Thank you very much! I love this videos.
In the July/August 2018 edition of "Biblical Archaeology Review" on page 33, is an article "Egyptian Papyrus Sheds New Light on Jewish History." The author is Karel van der Toorn. The article is about a papyrus roll (P. Amherst 63) discovered in the late 19th century at Luxor (ancient Thebes). It took more than 120 years to decipher the text. It was discovered that Egyptian Demotic script had been used to write Aramaic text! The translation turned out to include three Israelite psalms written about 400BC.
This is an example of "reformed Egyptian" used by Israelites and discovered by non-Mormons!!
Obviously not the same "reformed Egyptian", but the idea of Egyptian as a written Jewish language is still valid.
Well the alleged reformed Egyptian certainly did not have king James bible verses in it.
@@raysalmon6566 of course not! In the 19th century, what was considered Scriptures in America was this literary style, though. Joseph Smith did not read much books, but he did read the Bible, and it is quite evident that it's style influenced him while dictating to Oliver Cowdery the words he found. I have heard many linguists and translators support this claim, and I personally have taken such class in college, and what I have learned does support it as well. A translation cannot be word-by-word; a translator will choose the format that is best suited for the language being translated into. Names will be transliterated (writing what it originally "sounds" like) and unknown things will be translated using known words, etc. One great example of the latter is for hippopotamuses : when this specie was discovered, they did not know what they were seeing, so they called them what they knew, "horses", but since they lived mostly in water, they called it "water horses" : ἱπποπόταμος, or ἵππος (horse) ποταμός (river), or horse of the river. In other words, the fact that the Book of Mormon reads in the King James style has nothing to do with it's underlaying and original linguistic style.
@@yanfoo
1 In the past God spoke to our ancestors through the prophets at many times and in various ways,2 but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom also he made the universe
Hebrews 1
There are no more prophets after Jesus
@@raysalmon6566 Heavenly Father indeed spoke through His Son. We both agree with this, but the latter part is not accurate at all. After the ascension of Jesus Christ, the Twelve Apostles were indeed prophets. For example, Acts 11:27-30 is about prophets who came from Jerusalem to Antioch, warning about signs to come, and relief was sent throughout Judea by the hands of Barnabas and Saul. Acts 15:32 also speaks of prophets of God. Furthermore, Paul spoke extensively about prophets, saying : "Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ; Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit" (Ephesians 3:4-5). Paul later explained that Jesus Christ gave to His Church first Apostles, then prophets, then teachers, than evangelists, etc. until we all come to the unity of the faith, and to prevent His Church from being tossed and fro at every wind of doctrine (Ephesians 4:11-14). But what I find the most interesting with your argument is that it is exactly the same the Pharisees used to reject Jesus Christ and the Gospel, saying : "Now we know that thou hast a devil. Abraham is dead, and the prophets; and thou sayest, If a man keep my saying, he shall never taste of death. Art thou greater than our father Abraham, which is dead? and the prophets are dead: whom makest thou thyself?" (John 8:52-53). In short, saying that God no longer speak through prophets is not supported by Scriptures, and is in agreement with those who conspired to kill Christ. Pray about this.
love these vidoes! really helps solidify my own thoughts on the book
I feel sorry for your beliefs how can a smart man be so Seinfeld by a story that couldn’t have ever happened?
@@0l550 Why couldn't they ever happen?
tanner spurlock cause horses were extinct on this continent and only arrived after the Spanish came, there has never been any grapes on this continent nor any steel production of any kind. That doesn’t even address the genetic problem of none of the indigenous people have any genetics that match with the Book of Mormon and the church just changed the definition of the canaanites from all the Indian to a small group that hasn’t been found yet. These are just a small portion of all the problems the church has. I was a Mormon for 30 years until I started to research and I can give my New Testimony it’s all made up sorry it just is.
There is genetics to support this bro look it up
tanner spurlock show me the peer review papers that come from a legitimate scientist one that is accredited all the ones I can find aren’t backed up in any fashion they just look like they are if there was why did the church just redefine how they haven’t found the native tribe that is from Jerusalem.
This stuff is so good. I love how the Book of Mormon is this rich and rewarding to careful readers. Well done, Joseph! Oh wait, haha, Joseph couldn't have done this.
goo.gl/search/egyptian+scriptures+in+the+book+of+Mormon
Reformed Egyptian - Wikipedia The Book of Mormon, a work of scripture of the Latter Day Saint movement, describes itself as having originally been written in reformed Egyptian characters on plates of metal or "ore" by prophets living in the Western Hemisphere from perhaps as early as the 4th century BC until as late as the 5th century AD.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reformed_Egyptian
Reformed Egyptian - Wikipedia
The Mormon church mixes grace with works. Does any of this name stuff matter???
@@johnrowley310 Hi John! Sorry to butt in to your conversation, but you did change the topic.
So I have a few questions for you: in the New Testament of the Bible, what does Paul say about grace and works, and what does James say about grace and works? What did Paul and James say about Abraham's works? And how many non-LDS Bible scholars and writers can Google find discussing that very topic? Then try looking up "grace" and "works" in the Book of Mormon, and compare that with both Paul and James. And remember, Paul and James were talking to new Christians who for the most part had been very good Jews, meaning they were trying to figure out how to step away from "the law" (of Moses) and understand the atonement of Jesus Christ.
As a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, I read in the Book of Mormon: "For we labor diligently to write, to persuade our children, and also our brethren, to believe in Christ, and to be reconciled to God; for we know that it is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do." 2 Nephi 25:23
Looking forward to hearing from you, John!
Thank you! Very informative! Interesting….
Nicely presented Kwaku!
Thankyou wonderful video, The only way really to know if the Book of Mormon is a true account is to ask God, with a sincere heart and open mind. I know its true because i asked him
An excellent presentation. Interesting how most people will reject this evidence, while failing to come up with an alternative theory of how the Book of Mormon came to be.
This does not prove anything. Neither is it intended to. This purely shows us some interesting parallels. All pure and complete truth comes from the spirit of God. This is how I've come to know the Book of Mormon is of God.
It’s not God. It’s a buncha BS written by a con man.
And how can you have an army on horses when there weren’t any horses on this continent until the Spanish got here how did they drink wine when grapes weren’t on this continent yet there was no steel production on this continent back then there are so many problems yet know one knows this why
DEVON BLAKE then what did they use to pull the chariots? What about the hippos and what about steel production never happened on this continent and how come we have never found anything from this so called massive army that was killed in New York come on dude there is so much wrong with this book you have to see it
DEVON BLAKE how about Enos 1:21 horses are mentioned
And Nephi 18:25
DEVON BLAKE come on dude now you are really trying hard this is different then the Bible this is “ the most complete work from god ever written” rite if so why all the confusion don’t you think god could have figured out a way so that there wasn’t so much confusion Rite or maybe this is a book written by a man and has nothing to do with God rite
Jim Bavelas, You have an interesting view of the Book of Mormon. My experience is that it follows the language pattern of the King James Bible. This is evident by its tendency to quote the Bible using the same or a similar translation.
Yes, The Book of Mormon says there were “horses,” but it doesn’t mention anyone riding them.
The breakdown of the name Nephi was interesting. I was thinking the name was derived from Nephilim, the giants of the Old Testament.
You’re correct. That’s because the Book of Mormon was written with demonic entities help, not angels.
@@jacksonrelaxin3425 Except demons do not have a physical body, which is why they can possess people, even 10,000 in a single person. So they could never reproduce. If they could, why haven't they continued to do so? Are you implying that God was too weak or ignorant to be able to stop them? God is supposed to be all powerful and all knowing. Men are often referred to as sons of God. And while Eve was taken from Adam's rib, so daughters of men makes a kind of sense, they were no less children of God than were men. Nothing about this perverted idea of men makes any sense in light of the evidence. Utter nonsense, for it requires God to be weaker and stupider than demons, so that he couldn't have prevented it in the first place, but stronger and smarter than demons, to stop them from ever doing it again. But the unlearned and gullible will believe any fanciful tale without considering the evidence.
Please make more and deliver the truth to all of the world so that the Gathering of Israel may be hastened
Fantastic presentation, thanks
Very interesting what a young country bumpkin in 19th century New York can read off a rock in a hat.
Hermounts is similar to the Egyptian god hermontis which is the god of wild beasts. This can’t be a coincidence when you read that there were many wild beasts in the place called hermounts in the Book of Mormon.
Why am I not convinced?
Because you don't want to be. Since you require evidence you trust evidence more than God.
Daniel Moore It’s not that at all Daniel.
I am faithful to God and read the bible every day.
The reason that Mormonism doesn’t convince me is because most of the doctrine comes from extra biblical books that teach things that contradict what the bible teaches.
For example Mormons believe that almighty God has a father and a grandfather and a great grandfather
Yet In Isaiah 43:10 it tells us “Before me no God was formed. And after me there has been none.”
So there we have God himself letting us know that he is the only God in the universe and outside the universe, with respect to whatever is outside it.
Not only that but Galatians 1:8 “However even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to you as gospel something beyond the gospel that we declared to you, let him be accursed.”
In other words, the good news of the bible is complete in itself and neither human nor spirit being can add anything to it.
And anyone that does add their own gospel to the one already laid out in the bible, is misleading those that follow his gospel.
Remember try to use your common sense , the bible is thousands of years old, and books such as the Quran and Book of Mormon came many centuries after the bible.
Anything on this earth that has value always has counterfeits.
It’s clear that the author of the Book of Mormon stole ideas found in the bible and twisted them.
The same can be said with the Quran.
The fact that the bible came before any word of these writings is very significant.
@@cultfiction3865
Nothing The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints believes opposes the Bible, including Isaiah 43:10, lots of scriptures conflict your interpretation of Isaiah 43:10, are you claiming all those others in the Bible are false?
What we believe is not beyond the gospel that was already taught, nearly every prophet in the Bible prophesied the gospel would be lost. The parts you claim are additional are the parts which were lost. If your description of a false prophet is someone who makes a prophecy that doesn't pass nearly every prophet in the Bible is a false prophet according to you.
Along with that, through personal study of the Bible I know you deny up to 20% of scriptures in the Bible alone.
I'll save you some time about more scripture.
Revelation 22:18
18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
You use this scripture as an excuse to say all other scriptures written since that one are false, well, unfortunately for you that backfires.
All of today's Bible Scholars know that lots of scriptures in the New Testament were written AFTER that verse, so from your perspective about a fifth of the New Testament is added scripture. So according to you the plagues will fall on all who believe the whole New Testament.
Denying words from the book of Revelations is the same as erasing words from the book of Revelations. If you believe there will never be true prophets again you deny Revelation 11 meaning the plagues in that book shall fall upon you.
The small words in the scriptures are usually more important than you expect. In Revelation 22:18 the most important word is "this"!
"prophecy of THIS book", which book is John talking about?
By saying "this book" is John not declaring that there's more than one book?
You're cherry pickers.
Daniel Moore well the thing about the scripture you mention in revelation is that John seems to have been talking about the book of revelation itself rather than the whole bible.
The other parts of the bible don’t add to
The prophecies in Revelation in the sense that they fully harmonise with the teachings found in the book of Revelation.
Even though they may have been written after, or some of them written after John wrote Revelation, they do harmonise and in that sense they don’t really add anything to that book.
But as far as the scripture I mentioned about there been no God formed before the almighty and no God after him, I don’t see any other way in which that verse can be interpreted since it’s a fairly cut and dried statement.
Now I’m a jw and I do believe in the resurrection hope at some future time in which God will raise the dead
However the LDS church teach that when a person dies his spirit separates from his dead body and goes to some form of afterlife.
Yet Ecclesiastes 9:5 says something very different from that regarding the true state of a dead person.
“For the living know that they will die, but as for the dead they know nothing at all, nor do they have any more reward, because all memory of them is forgotten.
Also their love and their hate and their jealousy have already perished......”
So the bible says something very different about the state of the dead to what the LDS literature tell us.
Doesn’t that concern you?
Because it would concern me.
Also consider the fact that according to what I hear Joseph Smith practiced folk magic.
Yet in the bible practicing magic is condemned.
Would God really choose someone that practiced what he condemns, to be his prophet?
Common sense tells us that no, it wouldn’t make sense if God did that.
Remember a mathematical equation only has one right answer.
If someone has two answers to the same equation then one of those answers must be wrong.
They cannot both be right if they disagree with each other.
So it is with the bible and the Mormon books.
@@cultfiction3865
I'm not surprised you're a JW. When my friends encounter you out on the streets you're all so hateful towards anyone of a different church, you don't see because you don't seek.
You don't want them to harmonize so you twist them.
I will never trust a JW because you're haters, not lovers.
Like you say, you can't serve to masters, so since you don't love us, you hate us. Hatred is not of Christ. You're behaviour of spreading lies about other churches with your leaflets, I don't trust liars like JWs.
A man that gives up everything including his life deserves more respect what have u done with your life smartypants
Trenton are you Referring to Joseph Smith ?
I hardly would say he sacrifice. He actually screwed over a lot of people. Joseph was a False Prophet. And set up a Man Made Religion .The Bible has 66 Testaments that. Jesus is the Christ
Mormons are Foolish to believe in a Man made Religion
@@RobinfuckableDoes the book say good things about Jesus Christ? Are they really your enemy?
Is it possible The reason the names are so different such as nephis family all have Hebrew names but all the -ihah and -antum and -oni names are they jaredite?
Even with all this evidence you still have people like Jeff Durbin who ignore this to get caught up on Faith though grace and the trinity, I just have one thing to say I wanna see anyone of them write a book as compelling as the book of Mormon in 3mo, while looking into a hat coming up with all of this off the top of their brain. come on there is so much to this book that it would be mathematically impossible to come up with all of these said coincidences.
You’re faith is in Joseph Smith then, not God.
Galatians 1:8-9
Thank you, Rival, for reminder of the doctrinal strangeness that came about in fourth century when men with no apostolic authority to invent doctrine came together to create creed - men with affinity for trinity and triune tune. And how much later when Luther would groan with grace-alone in response to the Catholic practice of selling indulgences.
How soon were they removed.
This is an interesting topic. Your missing other sources. See the Apocrypha, which at one time was I believe the family name Nephi and Laban are mentioned. Also other books such as Jasher or Jubilees may have other linguistic content and correlations with names in the Book of Mormon. They may be classed as Pseudepigrapha, but that doesn't mean they still don't hold valuable content. The other missing parallelism with the Book of Mormon names is within the ancient languages of the Six nations. Niagara and the narrow neck is only a possibility, but If you can find linguistic meanings of Native languages with a comparative word meanings for some of the names within the Book of Mormon let me know.
So you account for 2 other names....ok....what about the rest of the nearly 200 other unique names?
@@tysonyapias5527 Why do Mormons think that BoM names would be hard to make up ?
Example Moses dropped the es add an I and ah equals Mosiah. I could make up lots a names it isnt rocket science
Bin Ren
Because most of the BOM names have legitimate Hebrew or Egyptian roots. It's not just making up names, it's producing names that are also real Hebrew or Egyptian names. And Joseph didn't know either language in 1830.
@@tysonyapias5527 Hello Hebrew names are in the Bible take the root and just add a prefix or suffix. And don't get me started on Egyptian.. The POGP is a fraudulent mess
Adam would not be baptized by water like Smith claimed. That's Ridiculous
And Egyptians didnt practice Human Sacrifice . The Mormonism lies just get bigger and bigger. There is no end to deception. You start to believe the Lies are True Don't you
Bin Ren
One thing at a time. The authentic Egyptian names in the Book of Mormon are completely a different issue from the PoGP.
Pahoran, Paanchi and Pacumeni (in the BOM) are legitimate Egyptian names.
Pahoran appears multiple times in the El Amarna letters (discovered in the 1890s.) There, Pahoran is an administrator in Palestine.
Paanchi is a very popular Egyptian names attested many times throughout the 21st to 27th dynasties.
Pacumeni is more complicated, but likely translates to "the Egyptian" and a name "pkmt" is attested on Iron Age II vases found in Israel.
You can't get those out of the Bible.
Nor can you get complex Hebrew names like Zarahelma "seed of compassion" or Jershon "place of inheritance."
The fact is, there are over 200 unique names in the BoM that are not found in the Bible. And most have Hebrew roots.
Thisbwas so interesting. I have a testimony of the Book of Mormon. It's cool to see scientific proof!
@Daniel Moore I used to be a deeply believing LDS. The "new revelation" which not only recinds the 3 year old "new revelation" but contradicts the word of God has shaken me to my core. I desperately want to regain my testimiony, but I am not willing to turn a blind eye any more. If Heavenly Father is unchanging, I don't understand how can He issue a revelation that contradicts His preivious teachings? I understand the concept of Him showing us enlightenments, and helping us grow - the new ministering program was a perfect example of that. But this goes against His word, and I don't understand. Over time, would He really change His consequence for certain sins?
What about when Jesus said to do away with animal sacrifices and instead come with broken hearts and contrite spirits? Was that contradicting previous teachings? Or what about when He said to not only not kill but to not get angry with our neighbors. Is that new revelation? It wasn't stated in the Ten Commandments.
What's unchanging is God's plan. He won't change for the sake of the world.
@@ethanpetersen810 Thank you for this!! I cannot immediately come up with a 'logical' reason to oppose this! So I will take it as a confirmation and comfort that my Heavenly Father is aware of my struggles and concerns, and will continue to lead me
After more research, and enlightenment, I don't believe the Church is the only "true and living church on the face of the earth." The people are amazing, the desires to be wonderful people are sincere, but there is no truth to the new sccriptures, as attested to by many authorities. Breaks my heart, but the facts are clear.
Don’t lose your faith. There are many more reasons to believe than to disbelieve. Our culture is not God’s culture. He is gradually getting us there. The law of Moses is done away. Change is getting us closer to Christ. Hang in there.
@@sraleigh2178 Why is there no truth to the "new" scriptures?
Good job cherry picking the data. Since the language used was reformed Egyptian and LDS scholars cannot give a single example of reformed Egyptian doing a direct comparison between the language of the plates and English is impossible. Yes, if you look at a lot of words in the Book of Mormon with a lot of languages from the Middle East you will get similarities.
Also, the Book of Mormon covers a period of 1,000 years. Over such a time period one would expect that Native American names to appear in the Book of Mormon. Can you give an example? (You have to have mixing of New World people with Old World people to explain why middle eastern DNA is not present and large number of people mentioned in the battles)
Lee is a family name in England and China - that does not prove Robert E. Lee was of Chinese decent or that his family spent a lot of time in China. When you get Middle Eastern DNA in native populations or writings (in the new or old world) in reformed Egyptian then you have something that indicates the Book of Mormon is not simply Bible fan fiction.
I showed Ancient American Speaks over 100 times on my mission. In the 60s and 70s the LDS Church claimed that were was significant archeological proof for the Book of Mormon. Today Church leader tell the member not to even try to find archeological evidence.
I love that literally EVERY video on this channel is based around the phrase "we don't know, but maybe"
Well, when the entire religion is based on nothing, it's hard to prove anything factually.
@@travisrose7164 its based on Joseph Smiths first vision.
@@getharryonsax oh right and he couldn't possibly have been dishonest about that despite all the other things in his life that prove him to be a liar.
@@travisrose7164 give me one person that was not a liar on earth
@@reimanuteapetis751 Jesus Christ😉
Kwaku!! great job!
Is Reformed Egyptian a Major at BYU?
Thank you! ❤️
This guy said "plausible links".
Ok why all the fuss about Chiasmus. Isn’t Chiasmus a HEBREW literary style? The BOM or JS claims that the BOM was from REFORMED EGYPTIAN (not in existence). Egyptian and Hebrew two opposite ends perhaps? So the question was the BOM REFORMED EGYPTIAN or HEBREW? Can’t have both guys. Discuss!
Firstly, Chiasmus isn't so much a Hebrew literary style as it is a Semitic literary style. It is found in Egyptian and Assyrian texts, for instance.
Secondly, the Nephites were clearly versed in Hebrew, and even same chapter where Moroni calls the language "reformed Egyptian" he states that they could write in Hebrew.
Thridly, Egyptian and Hebrew are not at two ends of the spectrum Actually, they are both semitic languages. It's like English, Spanish and French are all Latin based languages (English not so much). Hebrew and Egyptian are quite similar (though for sure they are different.) The differences though, do not make them wholly incompatible.
Tyson Yapias thanks for clearing up the language connection easy to understand now.
Those "unique" names were found around the homeland and where Joseph Smith grew up, but just one letter changed and most of them the exact same. Do some research, if its true it cannot be harmed.
IZ1111 riiiight. Like Mahonri Moriancumr for instance
Do you have evidence of this or are you just making it up?
Some of these supposed parallels are very strained. For example, if Mosiah is supposed to come from the Hebrew for "saviour," then it would have to be transliterated "Moshia'", because there's no "h" (ה) at the end, but an 'ayin (ע). Also the sin (שׂ) would have to be a shin (שׁ).
Also, why would Nephi even have an Egyptian name? He was born and raised in Judah, so he should have a Hebrew name.
Overall, I'd have to give this an A+ for creativity, but a D for linguistic plausibility.
If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
Are there any non biblical names in the bom that are found in other hebrew sources?
Yes there are. Have a look at the Book of Mormon Onomasticon project (just search this title) hosted at BYU library website. It lists all the proper names in the BM, their possible origins, as well as parallels in ancient languages, many which are outside the Bible.
The seer stones didn’t work to good huh
I'm genuinely curious, how do you defend the fact that a lot of the supposedly unique names can be found on literature of the 1820's. And I'm sorry but plausible connection to ancient words and names is not enogh
Can you provide evidence to prove your point?
Great job I agree ☝️
The Information Presented Was Very Enlightening, Providing More Food For Thought...!!
According to the Book of Mormon Mulek was the son of King Zedekiah. The name Melek is found in the Bible. Melek means “son of a king.” I suppose that Mulek is also a name for royalty because it’s so similar to Melek.
There is no such thing as reformed Egyptian. Stop lying 🤥
How do you know that? There's a comment on this video from Gary K Coleman that shows how there IS such a thing as reformed Egyptian. What's interesting is that Joseph Smith could not have known this in his day unless he was inspired.
dngale41
Scholarly reference works on languages do not acknowledge the existence of either a "reformed Egyptian" language or "reformed Egyptian" script as it has been described in Mormon belief. No archaeological, linguistic, or other evidence of the use of Egyptian writing in ancient America has been discovered.
Great video!
The name Nephi comes from the Apocrypha in the book of 2 Maccabees 1, 34-36
What about the other nearly 150 original names from the book of Mormon?
On the contrary- looking in my KJV Apocrypha the word Nephi does appear- meaning cleansing. Not good.
@@russelllewis5852 they aren't mentioned in this video or by anyone as being linked to Hebrew.
In fact they have been analysed by linguists to prove the contrary.
Anyone can make up names that sound like they are from somewhere
@@getharryonsax Not just anyone could make up names that sound like they came from a certain place and time. They would have to know letter combinations and which letters are not used or not used at certain parts of names, all for a language whose rules had changed over time so that the modern rules could not be applied. Many experts have thought they proved Joseph Smith a fraud with names that are only used for females now, being given to males in The Book Of Mormon, but evidence was discovered that those were used for males at the time The Book Of Mormon is placed in history. Something that no man knew at the time Joseph Smith published The Book Of Mormon, but God knew it. As is also the case for certain Hebrew writing styles found in The Book Of Mormon, but not even identified as writing styles, let alone as writing styles found almost, if not entirely, exclusive to Hebrew. Again no one at Joseph's time even knew of their existence, but God knew. Maybe Joseph Smith was a Hebrew in a past life, but that would make Christianity false, for only Buddhists and Hindus believe in reincarnation. So this knowledge couldn't have come from any scholars in Joseph's day, nor from Joseph's personal experience or study, so it could only have come from God. But why would God help Joseph write a false book? He wouldn't of course. Well your next argument would be that Satan has been around since that time and before, he must have helped Joseph. Help him write a book that teaches to love one another, as well as all other teachings of Jesus Christ, and tells people to pray to God and ask him who giveth to all men liberally if it's true. If Satan fights against Satan he cannot stand.
@@bartonbagnes4605 What if neither God or Satan helped Joseph write the Book of Mormon? How do you know he didn’t write it all by himself?
How can we know if something is a book inspired from God?
Thanks Thanks Thanks a Billion times.
So, absolutely no real evidence at all.
"It is a wicked and adulterous generation that demands a sign (evidence)." --Jesus Christ.
Let God be your guide.
@@chischilisnez7811 You can't actually be serious.
@@curtiscarwile498 Well, Jesus was serious. Why not me? He had just cast out a demon from a man and they accused him of casting out the demon by the devil. Jesus explained who he was, and they said, "We would see a sign from thee (evidence)." He replied that the only sign they'd be given was that of Jonah.
But, I guess you don't take Jesus seriously either.
@@chischilisnez7811 Oh, I take Jesus very seriously. And, you are correct in saying that Jesus had already provided them with abundant evidence of who He was/is. What I am saying is that there is absolutely NO REAL ACTUAL evidence for Mormonism and that the attempt to pass off what this video offers as evidence is no where near approaching actual evidence. It's not that I need MORE to believe; it's that, to believe, I would need SOMETHING, and that is exactly what is not and cannot be provided.
Quaku!!!! Go subscribe to saints unscripted to see more of him and his friends
Plausible links????? Cleverly devised Powerpoint and video fables to serve as evidence for Joseph's fables? Doesn't quite work!
The "Reformed Egyptian Script" mentioned here does not exist, has never have existed, and will never exist!
In 1966, John A. Wilson, professor of Egyptology at the University of Chicago, wrote, "From time to time there are allegations that picture writing has been found in America . ... In no case has a professional Egyptologist been able to recognize these characters as Egyptian hieroglyphs. From our standpoint there is no such language as 'reformed Egyptian'." Anthropologist Michael D. Coe of Yale University, an expert in pre-Columbian Mesoamerican studies, has written, "Of all the peoples of the pre-Columbian New World, only the ancient Maya had a complete script." Fifteen examples of distinct writing systems have been identified in pre-Columbian Mesoamerica, many from a single inscription. Reformed Egyptian, like the Book of Abraham, is a PROVEN fraud!
The video mentions " Scholars with linguistic training" but fails to mention their names!
The poor kid in the video, who would not have been able to enter the LDS temple in the early days due to his skin color, is justifying their doctrine!
Joseph Smith and Brigham Young reasoned that black skin was a result of the Curse of Cain or the Curse of Ham. They used these Biblical curses to justify slavery. Young believed the curse made black people ineligible to vote, marry white people, or hold the priesthood. Successive church presidents continued to use the Biblical curses to justify excluding black men from priesthood ordination and excluding black men and women from the Church's temples. The racist theories that black skin was a curse or mark of inferiority were not officially contradicted until 2013. Young was instrumental in officially legalizing slavery in Utah Territory, teaching that the doctrine of slavery was connected to the priesthood ban!
Joseph Smith and Brigham Young were both power hungry, sex crazed, charlatans who would think very little about using bogus " Reformed Egyptian " to help them obtain their goals!
As Smith had 49 wives and Young had 55 wives, it is plainly obvious what they had on their minds and what their goals really were!
my inner English major is most pleased
Why on earth does near enough every single line in that book start with and it came to pass? How fucking original 😂
I see you!!!
That is how the ancient hebrews wrote.
I have a friend worried that there is racism in the Book of Mormon. How can I explain these verses in a non-racist way?
(2 Ne. 5 : 21) And he had caused the cursing to come upon them, yea, even a sore cursing, because of their iniquity. For behold, they had hardened their hearts against him, that they had become like unto a flint; wherefore, as they were white, and exceedingly fair and delightsome, that they might not be enticing unto my people the Lord God did cause a skin of blackness to come upon them.
(2 Ne. 30 : 6) And then shall they rejoice; for they shall know that it is a blessing unto them from the hand of God; and their scales of darkness shall begin to fall from their eyes; and many generations shall not pass away among them, save they shall be a white [pure, 1981] and a delightsome people.
(Jacob 3 : 5) Behold, the Lamanites your brethren, whom ye hate because of their filthiness and the cursing which hath come upon their skins
(3 Ne. 2 : 14-16) And it came to pass that those Lamanites who had united with the Nephites were numbered among the Nephites; 15 And their curse was taken from them, and their skin became white like unto the Nephites; 16 And their young men and their daughters became exceedingly fair, and they were numbered among the Nephites, and were called Nephites.
@@towardcivicliteracy I've found this experience of President Kimball showing that with the Indian placement program Lamanite skin color can be changed by living the gospel. Just as the Book of Mormon promised
"I saw a striking contrast in the progress of the Indian people today ... they are fast becoming a white and delightsome people.... For years they have been growing delightsome, and they are now becoming white and delightsome, as they were promised.... The children in the home placement program in Utah are often lighter than their brothers and sisters in the hogans on the reservation." -Spencer Kimball, October 1960 General Conference
How many follow a man even though he lie? If I told you something and it was proven wrong why would you still believe me? What if it happened over and over about tons of stuff I had claimed? The Bible is the True word of God, believed for thousands of years yet some man comes along and starts making claims that it is wrong and you should follow him yet everything the man said has shown to be a lie. (There have been many the same.) Brother I tell you this there have been many false christ and many false prophets. How do we know if they are telling the truth?? God gave us this answer thousands of years ago. TEST that prophet. See if what he says is true. We are not supposed to go on how we feel. If that was the case then every religion in the world would be true. Think about it. Would people be (Deceived) if they didn't feel it was true? The Bible says the heart is DECEITFUL above all. Everything that the Bible teaches goes against what Joseph taught. If you listen to a man's lies over God's holy Word you do not know who God is. He is a Spirit and has been God and has never changed one bit. He got mad at false prophets and teachers in the ancient of days what makes you think He will be ok with what false doctrine you teach? Think for your self. If you're going around spreading a false gospel that men are to become gods, The ONE TRUE God will hold you responsible one day for [all the people you led astray.] Don't you guys even care to consider that what you teach goes against all of the REAL prophets that have been witnesses to the Lord our God? It is written let him be accursed the one who teaches anything contrary to what is written. You are not followers of Christ. If you were then you would have believed what was written about him. I don't care how mean it sounds. I am not trying to smite you. I'm to correct because if I were to say that I love my brothers but not correct them then I am not doing the will of God rather allowing the lie of the serpent. He was proud in his heart, he said "I will become like the Most High." Yet he will be smitten down to the lowest. And be the least of the least. If you want to be the greatest in the kingdom of God you will share the same fate. Think about who is least among the people you know. The one no one looks up too. The one everyone rejected and turn their faces away. HE will be great in the Kingdom of God. Man loves when another praises him. He seeks the approval of them to be considered somebody. Do you think you are that somebody? I bet the leaders are real proud of you. What you really don't understand is that what they think or what I think does not matter. It is the Most High whom you should seek. Brother the things I have told you are not from myself. It is a reflection of the True word of God. He wants you to repent from false doctrine. If I were to not tell you it would be my fault and I would be judged for it. Now that I have told you and have made it clear if you do not open your ear to Him and listen to Him, and repent from the works of a false prophet, you will be just as responsible as he will be when the day of our Lord comes to destroy all that are evil and lies. For the one who says in his heart I will be like the Most High will suffer the same. God did not spare the false prophets of old He is the same today as He was then. He is a Mighty God that will not be lied about. Everyone seems to think it is ok to believe such about GOD. If a man deceive you let him be accursed but if you deceive men you are doing the works of evil not of The Lord our God. Brother read the true Word of God. He wants you to know Him and His Son for who they truly are. If you don't know Him, how can you enter into His gates? Not by a secret handshake brother. Read the Bible it is true. And if anything I told you be a lie, let me be cursed above all. What I tell you I do know is true because it came from no man but has spoken to me from God. I have witnessed his stripes I have glimpse of His Glory in Heaven. Believe me or not believe me. Let me be found a liar but He will always speak truth. And if you hear His voice today and take away the hardness of your heart, He will manifest that what I told you is not from my own mind but from God. Read and know the Bible.
@Johnny Phoenix
Wow dude. You deserve whatever you have coming.
I appreciate your commitment to Jesus Christ. I do read the Bible. I just finished the old testament in eight months. The book of Mormon is a beautiful companion to the old and New Testament and helps to testify of the divinity of the Lord Jesus Christ as our savior.
You should Rejoice. Here's an independent witness of Jesus Christ!
Bt scholars do you mean Mormon scholars , how about independent scholars? References please. Some linguistic near matches don't make up for the anachronisms and improbablities in the BOM. You can't even point to a geographical location or find convincing genetic evidence for a group of Hebrews populating the Americas. You are clutching at straws.
I don't know why Latter-Day Saints are trying to prove it all. I guess they find it fascinating to search out. I suppose they get some clues about the history. It seems like we get arguments on both sides and who is correct? They both seem to have their sources.
So if I play boggle while looking into a hat I can start my own cult too? Sweet!
Sean Canaway if that method of using boggle produced the Book of Mormon within three months then I would be very interested in your cult.
@@zandersturgill I don't get years from the first time I claim to have a vision first? What a rip off!
Sean Canaway sure, I’d give you years to formulate it in your head. But just like how Joseph Smith had never met Oliver Cowdery before they translated, I’d expect you to find a stranger to scribe for you, and for you to bury your head in a hat, for only just three months, and recite a book like the Book of Mormon to a scribe.
@@seancanaway1131 I would also expect you to find at least eleven people to testify until their death that they saw an angel attest of the book of just wrote.
I'd like to see you write a book like the book Mormon but the catch is you can only look at stones in the hat and have someone writing what you see. No notes, and know other sources. And you have 65 working days. And are only allowed just a few grammatical errors.
Theologians by wilco sums it up pretty much
The evidence is compelling that the book is not a creation of the 19th century. It also verifies the claim of near eastern origin.
To determine its religious authenticity there is only one sure method, also outlined in The Book of Mormon in Moroni 10:3-5. In essence it is a challenge to the receiver, similar to that found in Malachi 3:10-11.
Smith made the names up. He did the same with the Book of Abraham
Then he was the best author of all time! Especially for his first work that was solely dictated from a hat with no review and completed the majority in 2 months. Very impressive!
@@schmo7777 Smith had 3 years to draw an outline. He was a story teller
. And it came to passed. One of the most over used phases in the book. 2% of the time
Plus 25 %of the BoM is taken right out of the Holy Bible
Joseph Smith was a False Prophet
Most people would not agree that Joe was the best writer.
Besides he was supposed to be translating.
Ancient records. How does that make him a literary hero. it doesn't . you should not be praising your make believe Prophets
The point of the video is to show why Joseph Smith couldn't simply make up the names.
@@dngale41 Mormons will swallow anything to put their minds at ease. Even things that are Foolish
You must fight to protect the Lies and Deceit of your Man Made Gospel
The Almighty God is God and always will be God. He is not an Exalted man
We can not become gods
Your Works for the Dead are a form of Necromancy which is an abomination to God. You let Lucifer the Light Bearer into your temples. You are no better than the Grave Soakers
@@Robinfuckable How does throwing insults at me help us move closer to truth? Attacking the person and not the argument is a logical fallacy, and it's terrible scholarship. You haven't even backed up your insults with any sources. "Forms of Necromancy?" Prove it. I simply said that the video points out why Joseph should have been incapable of writing the things in The Book of Mormon himself. If I'm wrong, please tell me why I'm wrong instead of making baseless claims.
You do know Joseph Smith read lots of books
Most people in the early 19th century didn't own any books. They were very expensive items and not many families were able to afford them. It was very common for individuals to be able to read decently but not be able to write (hence why Smith needed scribes). Paper was expensive, and writing with a quill time consuming and difficult, and therefore not that common. Newspapers were read out loud in public houses.
In the 1830s and 1840s a new form of printed text emerged that opened up reading for common people: serialised novels in one-penny or twopenny weekly parts.
@@havegottogitgud1864 He probably would have been able to purchase books by scrying which was a decent paying profession meaning he probably had the ability to purchase such literature.
@@havegottogitgud1864 You're exactly right. Besides, libraries were very rare in "frontier" places like these.
@@Karltheknight Pulling stumps and clearing and furrowing farmland didn't pay a whole lot.
@@chischilisnez7811 Public libraries as we know them now did not make their baby steps into society until the 1850s or so. Even then they were few and far between.
Most libraries in the 1820s were private collections of books. There was such a library in Manchester county with a $2 fee membership, though no member of the Smith family appears on any of the secretary's books, of which three are extant.
I didn’t have the will to check all of the claims here, but a simple note here. 4:32 Zedekiah doesn’t mean Lord at all. It comes from Tsedek (צדק) and the ending Yahu (יהו). It means the LORD’s (YHWY’s) Justice. Just taking that little thing will make you question everything else. Quite a stretch to claim a paralelé between Zedekiah and the Lord.
The Lord’s justice and the Lord? Yeah, I’d say that’s a parallel. Beautiful chiastic structure in helaman. And We are just bickering about one line. Check out Alma 36. The whole chapter is written in an inverted parallelism. Not too shabby for a frontier boy with no more than two years of formal backwoods education. Especially dictating without rewrite with his head buried in a hat. It’s hard to believe some people don’t see the miracle in this.
Majestic Liberator of the Oppressed “Chiasms” were not a very difficult concept to imitate. Other authors have done it. This does not prove anything. The Koran also has beautiful poetry in it, doesn’t make it any true though.
Revert Revertz The serious student of the book of Mormon knows that it’s literary complexity is far too much to complement a backwoods Youth of the 19th century. Something much more is going on here.
One still finds the book rich with Hebraisms, Chiastic structure, inverted parallelisms and a host of other internal evidences of Hebraic origin.
Word print analysis Is a technique used to spot authorship. As it turns out, each author gives her or himself away almost as a fingerprint even when attempting to write in different voices. Word print analysis, along with practically every other analysis known to man, has been performed on the BoM. It has been shown to have many distinct and separate authorships. What’s more, none of these fingerprints remotely match Joseph Smith’s writing style. He was only afforded approximately two years of a poor backwoods Education.
There is really no believable explanation that Joseph could have authored such a work with such internal consistency, doctrinal and historical understanding, Hebraic culture, military knowledge, and impressive onomastic understanding of linguistics, history, anthropology, psychology, sociology, philology and topopyny, teaming with Semitic complexity; With hundreds of names, places directions, elevations, relations to keep straight and consistent etc., all the while clarifying and expounding the plain and precious truths of Christ’s gospel; All much to much to complement Joseph with the great literary compilation the Book of Mormon truly is.
Likewise, it is folly, flippant and unscholarly to suppose That he merely compiled a few things here and there from the extant scriptures Into this coherent, consistent and profound literary work. Anyone who has written a book knows the challenge of honing coherent thought. Rewrites are a necessity. One of my favorite chapters is Alma 36. The entire chapter is written as an inverted parallelism. These were not even discovered until the 1960s, over 130 years after its translation. The chapter is in poetic form with the chapter culmination centered on the atonement of Jesus Christ. The chapter follows this Hebraic poetic form mirroring itself backward and forward. There is nothing more obvious to me that this one chapter alone took it’s ancient prophetic author significant time and energy and rewrite. In Joseph’s case in contrast, he would translate hour after hour, stop midsentence, during breaks or interruptions and then continue dictating without having any of the manuscript read back to him. This was a common occurrence. All this in the break neck speed of only about 73 days all the while dealing with persecutions, death threats and having to move to a different township for His and Emma’s safety.
It is thrilling for me to read both the book of Mormon and the Bible. They both testify of our beloved Savior. Good luck on your journey friend
@@majesticliberatoroftheoppr3971 dont forget the farm!
First of all, as the video acknowledges indirectly, 149 of the 337 names in the Book of Mormon are actually found in the Bible, leaving us with 188 unique names. But what is not acknowledged in the video is that a LOT (I admittedly haven’t done an exact count myself) of those 188 unique names are just variations on biblical words and names (the same words/names but with the ending changed). The video above inexplicably goes so far as to try to claim that Sam and Josh are significant “hits” in the text even though they’re just shortened versions of the biblical names Samuel and Joshua!
Next, there are no vowels in Hebrew. Only consonants. This hugely increases ones ability to invent connections where there are no actual connections. It drastically increases the number of possible words one can propose as having a legitimate Hebrew connection when in reality none exists. For example, the name Alma is proposed in the video. If we strip away the vowels that wouldn’t have existed in Hebrew, we have only l and m. In other words, an apologist must only find a word or name in Hebrew that has l and m in it, and they can claim that it could be Alma when in fact it could have been an entirely different word or name when spoken.
The video proposes the word Irreantum as evidence, noting that LDS scholars have found two different possible legitimate ancient linguistic origins for this word that fit with its meaning in the text-one of them being Egyptian, and the other Semitic. But the fact that they can find a parallel with two different languages just suggests that if people want to invent these kind of connections where none legitimately exists, they can fairly easily do so. Because obviously both of those connections cannot be legitimate.
I find the wordplay examples in the video very unimpressive. Really stretching. Also, I think just as likely as “Nephi” deriving from some Egyptian word is that Joseph either got it from the Apocrypha which happens to use it (thinking it was a place name that meant “cleansed”), or perhaps simply came up with it by altering one of many biblical words such as Nephilim, Nephish, Nephishesim, or Nephew.
The video suggests that it’s impressive that the Book of Mormon doesn’t use Q, X or W in its names and that this is consistent with Hebrew names. But honestly, do you know of a lot of names with Q and X in them? I sure don’t!
It’s worth noting that some of the names Joseph chose are arguably problematic and suggest that Joseph got a bit sloppy when coming up with the names of the 12 “disciples” in 3rd Nephi. It seems likely that while dictating this section Joseph was unconsciously being influenced by the New Testament. The names of three of the 12 “disciples” are actually Greek names (Jonas and Timothy, with the name Jonas actually being used for two of the 12 disciples). Interestingly, in the New Testament the name Jonas has connections with the 12 apostles as Jonas was the father of two of the 12 apostles. Two of the disciples in 3rd Nephi have names that seem like re-inventions of Matthew (Mathoni and Mathonihah) who of course was an apostle in the New Testament. Two other names (Kumen and Kumenonhi) are very similar to each other, and 3 other names are popular Old Testament names that appear nowhere else in the Book of Mormon. Dan Vogel aptly noted all these issues in his biography of Joseph Smith, concluding that “one wonders if the list was made up spontaneously and if the rapid succession of derivative names Mathoni/Mathonihah and Kumen/Kumenonhi might suggest that his creativity was being overworked.”
Thanks for actually responding to the arguments in this video. I agree with you as someone who has never been LDS and is interested in Mormon origins. Most of the comments on this video are supremely dumb, reflecting the arrogance of the person who thinks rejecting their childhood religion is evidence of a searching intellect. Your point about Irreantum is key, as most names in the Book of Mormon Onomasticon are like this. Sometimes more than three mutually exclusive etymologies. Obviously, this dramatically reduces the empirical value of these connections by demonstrating, concretely, the possibility of generating at least two chance hits by reworking biblical names.
The only way I would ever consider joining the Mormon Church is if they Produced the Golden Plates and they were independently verified by independent scholars belonging to an Ancient Hebrew Language.
Don't you Mormons find it a bit sus that the Plates just disappeared? Why
It wouldn't be safe for such a record to be kept anywhere. They are too sacred and important to leave on a sinful earth.
I believe that we will recieve further scripture when and learn from the sealed portion of it after the second coming when the world is more ready and willing to accept them despite uncertainty of their existence.
If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
Ridiculous!!! "Probably", "Could be", "Most likely", yet no actual "evidence". Completely unconvincing with hard evidence and facts!!!
The Book of Mormon should be called "The Book of Rubbish". Not one word of it is inspired by God. If you're a Mormon, start reading the real scripture - the Bible - and cast aside the work of fiction that is leading you astray.
A Mormon JUST believes!!
We don't just believe. We require a witness of the Holy Ghost to confirm what we are taught is true. Don't Christians require a witness of the Holy Ghost?
@@elderinisrael no. That’s not what it means. The “witness” means that on Judgement Day, someone who is saved will have the Holy Spirit as his or her witness to essentially testify for them instead of testifying for themselves. Obviously, any human who testifies for himself is going to fall short because God’s standard is perfection and we are imperfect the moment we’re born. This is where the phrase “with God as my witness” comes from because the Holy Spirit is also God.
There are people who falsely claim the Holy Spirit “convicts” them of sin similar to how Mormons claim to pray for truth and knowledge and such. It’s basically a misunderstanding of scripture mixed in with a sense of grandeur to think that the Spirit of God is ready to strike down hellfire vengeance upon them for every foul deed they do. To think that God is specially correcting and monitoring every single little tiny detail we do is just delusional and entitlement.
@@jacksonrelaxin3425 I'm afraid you are mistaken. The Holy Ghost is to witness of the truthfulness of God's word in this life. Romans 8:16 tells us "The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: " The only way we can be converted is by the Holy Ghost. There is no other way to be converted.
You said, " how Mormons claim to pray for truth and knowledge and such." The scriptures disagree with you, James 1:5 " If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him." That is exactly what God is telling us to do, he is telling us if we want to know truth or knowledge to ask him. If one verse isn't good enough, Matthew 7:7, "Ask, and it shall be given you; seek, and ye shall find; knock, and it shall be opened unto you:" It is through prayer that God will give you knowledge. There is a saying I love, God speaks to us through his scriptures, and we speak to God through prayer.
It is Christ who will be our advocate with the Father on our behalf.
@@elderinisrael you’re taking James out of context and misinterpreted him for your own benefit. If you need to “pray for truth” as instructed by a book you shouldn’t even need to question to begin with, then you are asking for a sign. Jesus clearly states that anyone asking for a sign is a fool and when you depend on your worldly senses and experiences to discover truth, you will not find it because you’re already admitting unbelief by looking. The Book of Mormon is no different than the Koran or any other false literature that just happens to conclude a different gospel than was originally given.
@@elderinisrael it says as you stated, “to the spirit bear witness WITH our spirit that we are children of God.” See that? With, not to. If the Spirit of God witnessed TO us then you would be correct, but it clearly states WITH us. Ever seen a criminal get represented by an attorney and no matter how obvious it is that the client is guilty, he still gets a fair chance in court and usually doesn’t say a word? That’s what’s going on, not a magical ghost floating above you showing you stuff.
He didn't translate jack, he stolen the record from Ethan Smith.
@@erichstreuber735 You quit lying! Book of Mor belongs to the Northern Kingdom Hebrew 10 tribes who were already here long before your people(Europeans) arrived. Get over your white privelage already.
@@erichstreuber735 Psalm 147:19-20
See. You cannot understand our book
Wrong
Hasn't that old theory about Ethan Smith been de-bunked?
Okay, I see you
Apple = Alma-Hungarian launguage.
But it has also used by a female personal name since the 18th century.
Seriously this is what passes as evidence rofl
Yes, this is but one small piece of evidence for the Book of Mormon and Joseph Smith as a true prophet. The greatness of the evidence supporting the Book of Mormon as an ancient record and true witness of Jesus Christ is amazing as indicated by the many evidences brought to light by Book of Mormon Central and testimonies of those who have studied and prayed about this book of scripture.
@@Kimmer no the book of Mormon is a lie full of anachronisms, you have been deceived.
@@krissander1 Anachronisms my butt. Take Kim Dahl's advice and go watch Book of Mormon central. They have several videos about the authenticity of Book of Mormon linguistics. Anti-LDS arguments are for people who accept low information, and are too lazy and/or biased to do honest research.
@@joshua.snyder Oh. Wait. The last of those comments were meant for a comment thread on a different video. My bad. krissander1 is in both comment threads. That must've thrown me off in the notification bell list.
Book of Mormon central people are real scholars who do real research on egyptian. Therefore their confirmations of Book of Mormon names being authentic is legit.
Go look up the meaning of evidence these are evidences not proofs. There's a big difference FYI, you make spektics look dumb people.
Any body else think that Joseph Smith made up the Book of Mormon in order to bring more people to the original gospels and keep the church fresh and competitive. Such as giving you “heaven points “ for going on mission trips or the ultimate prize being a god. And changing profits throughout time does keep the meaning fresh. Oh and moving your base camp of followers to the middle of “nowhere “ Utah does definitely give them less exposure to other religions allowing LDS to grow more in their minds. Just keeping it real
And ever realize that the temple is a big white building that stands out in the middle of town and you aren’t allowed to go in unless you’re a Mormon. Seems like a recruiting tool to me
Actually going to the temple is like going into something so sacred it’s hard to even compare. Members do not use it as a recruiting tool that is jumping to conclusions we would like you to come but with a good heart and not a wanting of answers.
@@jiggaboohatenman If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
The temple ceremonies are based on Freemason ceremonies. And how do you get ppl to join the Freemasons? Tell them it’s a big secret and only members can see what’s going on
Well Done Kwaku😇🙏💯💥.
Annoying music
What evidence is this guy talking about really? He just made a bunch of assumptions but didn't provide a shread of evidence.😂
This video is scandalously dishonest. To be fair though, anyone familiar with this many flaws in Mormon doctrine and is convinced by this video deserves to stay in the church. Nice animations.
The critics are the same today as they have been since the days of the prophets and the Savior. The blind and hard-hearted will never believe. If the gold plates were set in front of them the would make some ridiculous excuse or lame story of how they are fake. Christ performed miracles and was crucified by some who even witnessed them. Truth is not determined by popular vote. God knows these things are true and so do I.
the church in its death throws! freedom at last
I disagree. Besides, you have your freedom. Why do you want the church to be destroyed?
Such bull crap why can’t Mormons ask questions and figure out its a scam. Like why did he use a hat and the urmin thumin if he had the golden plates?
Jim Bavelas he only used the hat and a stone didn't he
Kris See yes that’s why it is so weird that the “ golden plates are even part of the story
@@0l550 the golden plates were presented to those involved in the translation process as proof of the divine work that they were engaging in, with translating the record. The Urim and Thummim are in fact ancient tools used for divine work message transference as mentioned in Exodus 28:30. Aaron used the Urim and Thummim attached to the breast plate as a teleprompter of sorts so the message would display in the Urim and Thummim and then Aaron would deliver that message (judgement) to the people.
Likewise, Joseph Smith used the Urim and Thummim as a teleprompter of sorts. the hat was nothing more than a dark place to better see the message displayed on the Urim and Thummim.
scott banta look it up every one when ever say them saw them with there minds eye they never looked upon them them selves do your history and homework on this k
Speaking of reformed Egyptian......that language has never existed.
Do you want to know the truth? Read my comment and you decide who to follow. Follow what God said.
Hogwash!!! Lies lies and more lies!!
🤦♂️
Does this also mean that all the other problems of the book are also solved like there were no horses on this continent until the Spanish brought them no grapes for wine no steel production of any kind nor hav any artifact ever been found and hundreds more this is the worst book ever written and people still believe in it! O well god never said all his children were smart.
There is now evidence of horses in the Americas and there were wild grapes all over the east coast anciently. Do your homework and quit relying on spurious criticisms that have no basis, Friend.
Laura Beauchamp I have I was Mormon for 30 years it was when I was trying to prove it true and I started looking at the history that I learned there wasn’t. If you have horses you have an entire work force of people training horses people making saddles hell even the native Americans have it in there history when they first started to see them it changed there entire way of life!! I am asking YOU to do what I have done actually read up on it there are books that have nothing to do about our religion that talk about how horses came to be on this continent and when. And the grape thing o please do some damn homework just caues you want to believe doesn’t make it true.
Laura Beauchamp there are no findings at all of any horse byproducts no saddles ever found no horse shoes ever found no record of any one ever working on anything that has anything to do with horses why is that??? O ya cause there wasn’t any
Laura Beauchamp also I want you to find out for your self there are grapes you can make wine with and some species you can’t the ones you are talking about can’t. Didn’t you ever wonder why native Americans couldn’t hold or handle alcohol its cause before white man came to this continent they had never had it before there d n a never built up a tolerance like white peoples had because they had never been exposed to it. I know it’s hard to learn this stuff is a lie butt like me you already know it is. Good luck this will be difficult for you.
If Joseph Smith was a true Prophet then he would need to pass the test of a prophet and NOT with feelings or experiences. The bible is clear Deuteronomy 18: 20-22 13: 1-5 But the prophet who presumes to speak a word in my name that I have not commanded him to speak, or who speaks in the name of other gods, that same prophet shall die.’ And if you say in your heart, ‘How may we know the word that the Lord has not spoken?’- when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the word does not come to pass or come true, that is a word that the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously. You need not be afraid of him. TEST #1 Joseph Smith was a False Prophet none of his prophecies came true and all you need is one not the come true Matt @-20 15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. TEST #2 Joseph Smith took between 30-40 wives including other men's wives and mothers and daughters as young as 14 years old. He was a wicked man and a False Prophet Gal 1:8-9 8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. 9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed. TEST #3 Joseph Smith preached a different Gospel. 1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. MANY warnings about false prophets, you are to test the spirits whether they are from God. TEST #4 Joseph is a False Prophet, he couldn't even get his story straight. The Book of Mormon, D&C and Peral of Great Price have ALL been changed thousands of times. Look it up for yourself. Research the first edition and the edition now. (Doesn't your soul deserve time to know the truth? Research and it's very easy to see the Mormons are a False Religion)
If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
❤
“No one will tell you. Joseph Smith HORROR mansion: UA-cam”
Go here if you want to find out how J.S. came up with names in the BOM ua-cam.com/video/Zn5wtXhWNdM/v-deo.html
Joseph Smith lifted some 140+ names from the Bible, and added some 480 Bible verses into his Book of Mormon.
He also deliberately and closely mimicked the King James Bible's (then 200+ year old) literary style.
Little wonder that some were deceived into believing the BOM could be scripture.
Why would Jewish people write in something other than Hebrew?.
Modern day Jews are easily able to read 2,000 year old Hebrew writings.
In Mosiah Ch4:2&3, ( written around 124 BC), Joseph Smith has the people declaring, "we believe in Jesus, about 100 years before the angel revealed that name!
This gentlemen and this slick church presentation cannot hide the fact that the Book of Mormon is bogus in all respects..
Give it a wide berth........
Kind regards to all, especially Mormons.
If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
Evidence: there is none. But it helps us make money and exploit the women. So all G.
So you're telling me that a 14-year-old boy with a third-grade education wrote The book of Mormon and all its complexity? If you believe that I have some oceanfront property in Arizona I want to sell you.
@@elderinisrael Your whole premise is broken. Nice try, though.
@@error.418 If the gold plates never existed, how did Joseph get numerous witnesses to stand by their stories until their dying day, even when some of them later became angry with Joseph and left the Church?
How could Joseph have known about ancient cement technology in the first century B.C. in Mesoamerica?
How could Joseph Smith make up dozens of names in the Book of Mormon that would later be shown to be authentic ancient Semitic names?
Where did Joseph Smith get the idea of ancient scriptures written on metal plates?
How did Joseph Smith know about ancient practices regarding preservations of sacred texts?
Why do other ancient documents support the Book of Mormon's idea that the ancient Joseph prophesied of Moses and Aaron?
If there was no apostasy in the Church of Jesus Christ, then what happened to prophets?
If Joseph Smith just made up the idea of vicarious baptism for the dead, why do numerous ancient documents validate the LDS claim that this was an authentic early Christian practice?
At a time when all Christian churches taught that temples were no longer needed, how did Joseph so effectively restore the ancient temple concept on his own?
What other church better corresponds with early Christianity in terms of teaching the true relationship between faith, grace, and works?
Why do the earliest Christian writings sound much closer to LDS theology than they to modern "mainstream" Christianity?
If it's unchristian, unbiblical, and evil to believe that humans have divine potential, why do many Biblical and early Christian sources speak of the humans becoming "gods"?
If the Bible is infallible, by whose authority were the various books of the Bible selected in an infallible manner? By whose authority were the infallible translations made and approved?
Who authorized the changes in the ritual of baptism that occurred since the New Testament Church? And who in your church has true authority from God to perform baptisms?
If the Book of Abraham is a fraud, then how do you account for the details in the text that would later be given extensive support by numerous ancient documents that were not available to Joseph Smith?
Do you know that more than 100 names found in the BOM came from the Bible? And that Nephi's name appears in the 2nd Maccabees chapt.1:36 of the Apocryphal bible (KJV, 1611) 😇
It mentions that in the video. It makes perfect sense, given that they are both the tales of two parallel tribes of Israel and share a lineage, history, and culture.
Where can I find that verse?
🤦♂️🤦♂️🤦♂️ Spin spin spin... no substance, just hey, it works if you think like this and only like this
He fails to mention that, when The Book of Mormon was written, "Alma" was a male name. He also fails to mention that the name "Nephi" occurs in an English translation (KJV) of the Apocrypha (2 Maccabees 1:36).
It was a male name for centuries, obviously. But it is a fact that Alma was a major criticism of the Book of Mormon for decades because the name was not known to be used for males.
What? Word play is proof?! As Vince Lombardi once said “What the hell is going on out here?!” Chasms huh? How about Snoop Doggy Dog. He has chiasmus in his rap music for example, “I got my mind on my money and my money on my mind” Boom!!
It is highly unlikely that Joseph Smith knew about chiasmus and consciously implemented this literary form hundreds of times in the Book of Mormon:
knowhy.bookofmormoncentral.org/content/how-much-could-joseph-smith-have-known-about-chiasmus-in-1829
knowhy.bookofmormoncentral.org/content/does-chiasmus-prove-anything-about-the-book-of-mormon
@@joshua.snyder Well, first of all, chiasmus in the Book of Mormon is anything but crude (I'm not sure where you got that idea. I don't know any serious literary critics who go that far). It contains some of the best examples of chiasmus in world literature. Moreover, its usage in the Book of Mormon is varied, creative, and pervasive, far more pervasive than anything we find in modern writing--which both separates it from the modern literary milieu and argues strongly that its presence isn't do to mere chance.
The probability is obviously low that Joseph identified the feature on his own from reading the Bible (just go ask any non-scholarly Bible reader if they've consciously noticed the feature on their own, or consider the fact that it took over 130 years for ANYONE to draw attention to this feature of the text). The chances are also low that Joseph had access to some of the fledgling biblical literature on the topic (see the Welch article in the KnoWhy I highlighted above). And even if Joseph did have access to such research, the chances are low that he could have so expertly integrated such features with his limited literary experience, especially under the translation circumstances described by the witnesses, and even more so will all of the other details that needed to be kept track of. So, in my opinion, in order to push back against chiasmus as evidence, one has to rely on a combination of fairly unlikely and unsupportable assumptions.
Maybe some find those assumptions more palatable than the story of angels and gold plates, but they certainly aren't good by any measure when evaluated on their own merits.
@@joshua.snyder Yours is the argument that makes me scratch my head. If Joseph Smith was not inspired, then he has got to be a superhuman. Have you ever met someone with an eidetic or photographic memory like you say Joseph must've had? They are ANYTHING but charismatic people persons that are great speakers and leaders. They are people that would today find themselves squarely on the Autistic spectrum. I get it if you can't get past the things in his history, the claims of angels and gold plates, rock in the hat, etc....but to suggest that the Book of Mormon doesn't stand out as unique (especially given that it has only ever been done once in human history and has caused many millions of people to change their lives) betrays your true aims here on youtube....
The point of the video is to show why Joseph Smith could not have simply wrote or known about these things.
Was Snoop Doggy Dog claiming that his statement was scripture written down anciently by a Hebrew offshoot and then brought into our time by the power of God? Wow.
Even if all of this is true that means we can live how we want and just get baptized in spirit prison .If that's correct why live a mormon life?
I'm not sure I totally understand your question, but it seems like you're wondering why we should be a Latter-day Saint now, when we will just be baptized one after we die. The reason is because we are judged according to the truths we accept now. So if you had the chance to accept the restored gospel in this life, and denied it, then you'll be judged for that. However, there are many people who have not had the chance to accept the gospel during their mortal lives, and they'll have that chance after they die. So the reason you want to live a Latter-day Saint life now is because it'll bring you blessings sooner, rather than later. It'll bring you even closer to God sooner, rather than later. But if we think it's all make-believe, and make fun of it, without even considering it honestly, then we will be judged for that rash decision.
@Molly Jones What belief are we specifically talking about? We talked about a few things here. If we are talking about Baptisms for the Dead, it's mostly a new doctrine that God restored through Joseph Smith. Latter-day Saints believe that God speaks to us through his prophets, just like he did with Moses. Imagine living at the time of Moses, and seeing Moses coming down from a mountain with tablets that he claimed were given to him from God. That's not too different compared to Joseph Smith coming down a hill with plates of gold from God that he translated. Joseph Smith restored teachings of God that were lost.
But Baptisms for the Dead are mentioned briefly in the Bible in 1 Cor. 15:29 here: "Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?" We believe that over thousands of years, these teachings were lost from the Bible, through different translations and so forth. God restored the full doctrine of Baptisms for the Dead, which is briefly mentioned in the Bible, through Joseph Smith. And isn't it beautiful? This means that the billions of people who have died without the Bible, or the gospel, can hear it in the next life, and have a chance for salvation like you and I do now.
Awesome video again... thanks guys
@@zandersturgill gotcha! Thank you for the info
You are implying with your question that members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints believe that baptism is what "saves" a person. That is not true. We do believe there are ordinances, like baptism, that are essential for salvation as taught in the Bible and other LDS scriptures. However, that is quite different than saying that these ordinances automatically "save" someone. We believe that salvation comes through the atoning grace of Jesus Christ, but that we must do our part to make the atonement effective by obedience to God's commandments. This is in accordance with James 2 where it discusses how faith without works is dead and that we will be judged according to our works in this life. Baptisms for the dead simply provide this essential ordinance for those who didn't have the opportunity in this life and is consistent with the use of this ordinance in the ancient Church of Christ.
What??? Say that again -- what??! Where the heck did they find this ignoramus???...
this is a horrible straw man argument full of false information and incorrect presumptions from beginning to end
Mormon is the name of a Scottish folk magician.
Sam, Scam--what's the fucking difference? The Book of Mormon, The Book of Morgan--what's the fucking difference?
fucking bullish!