Nice video! Still so many (almost) hidden gems in the lower regions of the 1855 classification. And... when I have to name just one wine who missed the boat, but deserves to be a GC: Phélan Ségur.
Robin: thx for viewing my video. I think you are right but I am trying to make Bordeaux understandable so I am starting with the Growth wines. Then I will explain Right Bank and then we can go to minor regions and Cru Bourgeois. Please see my video on Chateau de Villambis which I had never heard of until one of my agents brought it to my attention. I like Phelan Segur but the issue is that they make good wines but they never make great wines. I find with the growth wines, they can have some really dog vintages but then once in awhile, they make something to make you understand why they are a growth wine. And they just eat up all the money since they have all the notoriety. Cheers!
breathewithme: it is the 2016 vintage so I haven't opened it yet. 2010 is still pretty tannic but 2004 I would think is drinkable now with some aeration. Cheers!
Eadric: hope you enjoyed the video. Let me know if you have any comments. I also have a video coming out tomorrow on the Bordeaux 2018 as we are just releasing these wines this month in B.C. Cheers!
Really enjoyed your full perspective in this video with your interpretation as history designed it regarding the classification system and what it really should be used for shows you have a great understanding of this concept! I also appreciate you addressing Margeaux as well as Pauillac and the trends with the growths there. I think this is important to know and is certainly being noticed by many wine lovers and critiques. Such a cool video and great concept explaining some wonderful history of the region I agree with a lot of your sentiment in this video. Now for the right bank ! Haha Also oldest bottle of Bordeaux I ever drank was a 1928 Mouton Rothschild and that is the oldest bottle I have drank to date thanks to a very kind friend was absolutely stunning to drink history like that and shows you how long these beauties can live when it’s great it is truly stunning. A toast to Bordeaux 🍷
Hey Wyatt: thanks for your continued support and kind comments. I think for most consumers, the Growth system is only useful in that it is something really neat historically and it is what everyone talks about when you drink at the higher levels. You will see in future videos I do use it to explain pricing and how I determine if something is worth buying. But I do want to change people perspective's from the here and now only to a much longer time frame. There are some magnificent wines that some of these wineries made in the past and it is unfortunate that more consumers can't have access to library wines from these chateaus. I think it would change their perspective and their understanding of the growth wines. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter tasting old wines from many places will change your perspective on an area. I can tell when people have not tried old Napa and wish everyone could taste and experience what I have been fortunate enough too because those old wines here in context of Bordeaux now will give you a clearer understanding of the history and quality presented; knowing that linage and change overtime is important. There is a reason Mouton was one of the few changes to the system in 1973 so there are exceptions!! but only for great reason because their best was truly Top-Echelon over a long period.
@@wyattalexander4041 Yes, I agree. I used to think you couldn't age Napa wine not from experience but just because I heard it from other people. I was fortunate that a friend served me some older Napa and I was so surprised. I wouldn't have paid so much money for an old Napa but now that I have tasted it, I can see I was wrong before. So it does really take wine drinking experience and some friends to share to excel your wine knowledge. Unfortunate but hopefully through some of my tastings, I can demystifying some things and really put wine drinking in perspective. If you just drink wine for the scores and the alcohol, I believe you are missing the point. Anything you take seriously should improve you as person and give you perspectives on other things in life. Cheers!
Daniel: the plan was to collect all the 1885 Classification system bottles and then put them in a wall display. Didn't happen in my current house and not sure if it will ever happen. Hope to give to a restaurant to display but then what happens if that restaurant closes? So I have kept these bottles all these years with no use until this UA-cam channel. At least they are being used to display to my viewers. Cheers!
@@danielplainview4778 probably not as I couldn't imagine anyone paying for these bottles. I would much rather give them to someone who I know would display them...like a restaurant or hotel in return for credit or some PR for my UA-cam channel. But ask me again in a couple of years when I have no idea what to do with all these empty bottles! Maybe someone has a good suggestion or an artist could make some really innovative art piece out of these bottles. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter makes sense, fyi I’m local and also trying to think of a display that contains all classified growths. Just trying to determine if that’s a display that is made up of entire bottles or labels removed from bottles
@@danielplainview4778 I think bottles is much more impressive unless you can put the labels in a huge picture frame. Lots of people have labels but few people collect bottles. The bottles might be different shapes which is more interesting, particularly if you can get them from different eras. If you ever open a restaurant or hotel, let me know. Or if you are missing a few bottles, I am happy to give to you in exchange for free entry into you man cave! Cheers!
As a big Bordeaux drinker, I am loving these videos. Looking forward to the more detailed videos of the classified chateaux. Outside of 1st Growths, what are your top 3 chateaux from the classification that you enjoy the best? Cheers! Edit: By the way, the beginning of the video with the bottles separated by their growth status was a really cool idea.
Hey SC 34: thanks for your continued support. As to which Chateauxs I like, there are quite a few that are up and coming. You will see in my upcoming video on the 2018 Bordeaux release here that I think a lot of the 2nd and 3rd growth Margaux wines are undervalued (since they have been so underachieving in the past). Also some great 5th growth Pauillac that have not performed as well over the last 10 years but are in growth pattern. I actually think Leoville Barton and Beycheville are hitting their stride. Lynch Bages just completed their new winemaking facility so they should also be hitting on all cylinders. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter Hi! I'm already subscribed haha! ;) And I have some projects running in the wine industry yes, The Wine Archive is one of them. all is my own content. This UA-cam channel will be part of a big platform for wine lovers so excited for that.
@@thewinearchive thx for subscribing...must be under a different account as I didn't see you as a subsciber. Content is excellent....way better than my channel in terms of production. You must be pretty involved in the industry to have these connections and to be able to taste these wines. How did you get an "in" with all these wineries? Would love to be your friend! Looking forward to more of your content. Cheers!
banana: thank you for watching my video and your kind comment. Yes, I do speak Cantonese but I really don't want to do videos in Cantonese as I don't think I could go through all the technical terms in Cantonese. It would be more like a comedy if I did the video in Cantonese...but who knows, maybe one day I will do a video in Cantonese and see how it plays. Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
Matthew: thanks for the feedback. Not going through the entire video but if you could point up some place where I used it, if I used the term incorrectly, I will try to edit it out. Cheers!
I agree with you on almost everything but shouldnt we consider at least that ranking based on price per bottle should be a measure of quality. Otherwise it should be viewed as a matter of availability and this was not the case.
tiago: thank you for viewing my video and your comment. You are partially correct. It is a measure of quality but not completely. It is more a measure of popularity. So probably that is 80% quality and 20% brand recognition and how much people like the wine and distribution channels. But I wanted to point out that is was never just solely based on quality. So when people argue whether it is a growth wine or not, it is not a subjective but an objective test based on price per bottle. Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter I see and now I have to agree with you. It does really help making it a point to viewers. Already subscribed obviously, your videos are encyclopaedic. Thank you and please keep them up! Cheers
@@tiagofigueira4525 thank you for your continued support. I see almost everyone make this mistake thinking 1855 was about quality only. It was about price and when you understand that, you understand the classification was and is today mostly for wine investors/traders and not for consumers. It is a means to figure how much the wine is worth at auction, not for consumers to decide what wines they want to drink. Cheers!
Best wine I ever had was a 1982 Château Ducru - Beaucaillou. Just an opinion. I would take this chateau over any other. I know - heresy. 😃 (Phélan - Ségur is another of my preferences.)
Stephen: Yes, Ducru, along with Pichon Lalande are my favourite 2nd growths. I got a Ducru from long storage.....so maybe! Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
Cory: yes, caught me off guard and one of these relatively obscure ones I can't get straight whether it is 3rd or 4th...I actually find those the hardest to remember .1, 2 and 5th growths are much easier since you see most of them quite often and most of the lesser ones, good bet they are 5th growth. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter - I happen to have a bottle decanting for this evening, otherwise I probably wouldn’t have known 😁. When you were discussing Pauillac and 5th Growths I immediately thought of Chateau Pontet-Canet. It is highly rated year after year like a 2nd or 3rd Growth. It’s ratings and reviews are backed up by the quality & improvements at the winery over the last decade or so. Nice complexity to this wine. Problem is that the price has caught up to its quality. 🍷
@@coryz6880 Yes, but have you tried 1960s and 1970s Pontet Canet? You would change your opinion totally. That is why we need historical context as you have take the wine's history for the last 150 years, not just the last 10 years. I agree you buy based on current trends but the growth system is over a longer period of time. I visited Pontet Canet and they are making great wines today. But the challenge is can they continue this for 10, 20, 30, or 50 years. What has happened with Pontet Canet is happening right now in Margaux. A lot of the underachieving 2nd and 3rd growths are coming around. So are the 5th growth Pauillac.. It all comes in waves...then there will be renaissance in St. Estephe and St. Julien. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter - I have not been fortunate enough to try the Pontet-Canet from those vintages. The “professionals” began giving this wine high ratings consistently from 2009 on. They are a good point of reference, but not the end all be all. 🍷
@@coryz6880 Yes, I agree. The problem is that most people use the "growths" for the wrong purpose. It is really meant to be used by people trading wine as a yardstick of the relative worth of each wine. You will see my other video about the Bordeaux 2018 release in B.C. and how I use the growth system to assess the "worth" of each wine. It really is just knowledge and not that a big deal for normal consumers. But it is still important for those who trade in wines and at auction. If you like a wine, you will drink it no matter what growth level. But the classification system helps assess in any given year whether a wine is a buy or not for collectors and those who trade in wines. My only point is that sometime we focus too much on the modern age (like the last 20 years) but we have to realize wineries in Old World have hundreds of years of history. So a lull of 10 years is, relatively speaking, not that big a deal for them and likewise a period of greatness for 10 years, is just a start. I am trying to give viewers perspective and understanding how Old World philosophy towards wine is very different from North America. BTW, I love 2009 Pontet Canet. I agree that I would prefer this wine to many 3rd growth wines. They really got it right and perfect balance between New World fruit forward and Classic Bordeaux elegance. That was the first year they started using wine from their amphora vessels and their wines taste much more vibrant that previous vintages. Cheers!
loved your presentation! This made me understand confusing classification! Thank you.
Sanjay: thank you for your continued support and glad you enjoyed the video. Cheers!
Nice video! Still so many (almost) hidden gems in the lower regions of the 1855 classification. And... when I have to name just one wine who missed the boat, but deserves to be a GC: Phélan Ségur.
Robin: thx for viewing my video. I think you are right but I am trying to make Bordeaux understandable so I am starting with the Growth wines. Then I will explain Right Bank and then we can go to minor regions and Cru Bourgeois. Please see my video on Chateau de Villambis which I had never heard of until one of my agents brought it to my attention. I like Phelan Segur but the issue is that they make good wines but they never make great wines. I find with the growth wines, they can have some really dog vintages but then once in awhile, they make something to make you understand why they are a growth wine. And they just eat up all the money since they have all the notoriety. Cheers!
Very much agree, Robin. 😋👌👍
I see a Langoa Barton in the background there. How are you liking it? I got me some 2010 and 2004 but have yet to open any bottles.
breathewithme: it is the 2016 vintage so I haven't opened it yet. 2010 is still pretty tannic but 2004 I would think is drinkable now with some aeration. Cheers!
i am so excited for this!
Eadric: hope you enjoyed the video. Let me know if you have any comments. I also have a video coming out tomorrow on the Bordeaux 2018 as we are just releasing these wines this month in B.C. Cheers!
Enjoying your videos!
Great!
Excellent video, again.
Thanks!
Really enjoyed your full perspective in this video with your interpretation as history designed it regarding the classification system and what it really should be used for shows you have a great understanding of this concept! I also appreciate you addressing Margeaux as well as Pauillac and the trends with the growths there. I think this is important to know and is certainly being noticed by many wine lovers and critiques.
Such a cool video and great concept explaining some wonderful history of the region I agree with a lot of your sentiment in this video. Now for the right bank ! Haha
Also oldest bottle of Bordeaux I ever drank was a 1928 Mouton Rothschild and that is the oldest bottle I have drank to date thanks to a very kind friend was absolutely stunning to drink history like that and shows you how long these beauties can live when it’s great it is truly stunning.
A toast to Bordeaux 🍷
Hey Wyatt: thanks for your continued support and kind comments. I think for most consumers, the Growth system is only useful in that it is something really neat historically and it is what everyone talks about when you drink at the higher levels. You will see in future videos I do use it to explain pricing and how I determine if something is worth buying. But I do want to change people perspective's from the here and now only to a much longer time frame. There are some magnificent wines that some of these wineries made in the past and it is unfortunate that more consumers can't have access to library wines from these chateaus. I think it would change their perspective and their understanding of the growth wines. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter tasting old wines from many places will change your perspective on an area. I can tell when people have not tried old Napa and wish everyone could taste and experience what I have been fortunate enough too because those old wines here in context of Bordeaux now will give you a clearer understanding of the history and quality presented; knowing that linage and change overtime is important. There is a reason Mouton was one of the few changes to the system in 1973 so there are exceptions!! but only for great reason because their best was truly Top-Echelon over a long period.
@@wyattalexander4041 Yes, I agree. I used to think you couldn't age Napa wine not from experience but just because I heard it from other people. I was fortunate that a friend served me some older Napa and I was so surprised. I wouldn't have paid so much money for an old Napa but now that I have tasted it, I can see I was wrong before. So it does really take wine drinking experience and some friends to share to excel your wine knowledge. Unfortunate but hopefully through some of my tastings, I can demystifying some things and really put wine drinking in perspective. If you just drink wine for the scores and the alcohol, I believe you are missing the point. Anything you take seriously should improve you as person and give you perspectives on other things in life. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter Really appreciate the ending take away from your statement couldn’t be more on board with how to look at it.
Do you display all the bottles somehow? I’m thinking of collecting all of them but not sure how to display either the empty bottles or the labels
Daniel: the plan was to collect all the 1885 Classification system bottles and then put them in a wall display. Didn't happen in my current house and not sure if it will ever happen. Hope to give to a restaurant to display but then what happens if that restaurant closes? So I have kept these bottles all these years with no use until this UA-cam channel. At least they are being used to display to my viewers. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter would you consider selling them?
@@danielplainview4778 probably not as I couldn't imagine anyone paying for these bottles. I would much rather give them to someone who I know would display them...like a restaurant or hotel in return for credit or some PR for my UA-cam channel.
But ask me again in a couple of years when I have no idea what to do with all these empty bottles! Maybe someone has a good suggestion or an artist could make some really innovative art piece out of these bottles. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter makes sense, fyi I’m local and also trying to think of a display that contains all classified growths. Just trying to determine if that’s a display that is made up of entire bottles or labels removed from bottles
@@danielplainview4778 I think bottles is much more impressive unless you can put the labels in a huge picture frame. Lots of people have labels but few people collect bottles. The bottles might be different shapes which is more interesting, particularly if you can get them from different eras. If you ever open a restaurant or hotel, let me know. Or if you are missing a few bottles, I am happy to give to you in exchange for free entry into you man cave! Cheers!
As a big Bordeaux drinker, I am loving these videos. Looking forward to the more detailed videos of the classified chateaux.
Outside of 1st Growths, what are your top 3 chateaux from the classification that you enjoy the best?
Cheers!
Edit: By the way, the beginning of the video with the bottles separated by their growth status was a really cool idea.
Hey SC 34: thanks for your continued support. As to which Chateauxs I like, there are quite a few that are up and coming. You will see in my upcoming video on the 2018 Bordeaux release here that I think a lot of the 2nd and 3rd growth Margaux wines are undervalued (since they have been so underachieving in the past). Also some great 5th growth Pauillac that have not performed as well over the last 10 years but are in growth pattern. I actually think Leoville Barton and Beycheville are hitting their stride. Lynch Bages just completed their new winemaking facility so they should also be hitting on all cylinders. Cheers!
Nice! Then I think you would like our content as well! Looking forward to your feedback! Cheers!
@@thewinearchive looks like you have good content...are you in the industry or just taking videos from others? Please subscribe to my channel. Thx.
@@TrophyWineHunter Hi! I'm already subscribed haha! ;)
And I have some projects running in the wine industry yes, The Wine Archive is one of them. all is my own content. This UA-cam channel will be part of a big platform for wine lovers so excited for that.
@@thewinearchive thx for subscribing...must be under a different account as I didn't see you as a subsciber. Content is excellent....way better than my channel in terms of production. You must be pretty involved in the industry to have these connections and to be able to taste these wines. How did you get an "in" with all these wineries? Would love to be your friend! Looking forward to more of your content. Cheers!
Thank you for the videos! It’s very informative. Btw, is there any chance you can speak Cantonese 😂
banana: thank you for watching my video and your kind comment. Yes, I do speak Cantonese but I really don't want to do videos in Cantonese as I don't think I could go through all the technical terms in Cantonese. It would be more like a comedy if I did the video in Cantonese...but who knows, maybe one day I will do a video in Cantonese and see how it plays. Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
Nice and informative summary, but you should look up the definition of "notoriety". Misuse of that word many times, which dilutes your presentation.
Matthew: thanks for the feedback. Not going through the entire video but if you could point up some place where I used it, if I used the term incorrectly, I will try to edit it out. Cheers!
I agree with you on almost everything but shouldnt we consider at least that ranking based on price per bottle should be a measure of quality. Otherwise it should be viewed as a matter of availability and this was not the case.
tiago: thank you for viewing my video and your comment. You are partially correct. It is a measure of quality but not completely. It is more a measure of popularity. So probably that is 80% quality and 20% brand recognition and how much people like the wine and distribution channels. But I wanted to point out that is was never just solely based on quality. So when people argue whether it is a growth wine or not, it is not a subjective but an objective test based on price per bottle. Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter I see and now I have to agree with you. It does really help making it a point to viewers. Already subscribed obviously, your videos are encyclopaedic. Thank you and please keep them up! Cheers
@@tiagofigueira4525 thank you for your continued support. I see almost everyone make this mistake thinking 1855 was about quality only. It was about price and when you understand that, you understand the classification was and is today mostly for wine investors/traders and not for consumers. It is a means to figure how much the wine is worth at auction, not for consumers to decide what wines they want to drink. Cheers!
Best wine I ever had was a 1982 Château Ducru - Beaucaillou. Just an opinion. I would take this chateau over any other. I know - heresy. 😃 (Phélan - Ségur is another of my preferences.)
Stephen: Yes, Ducru, along with Pichon Lalande are my favourite 2nd growths. I got a Ducru from long storage.....so maybe! Please like, subscribe and keep watching. Cheers!
LB = 3rd Growth 🍷
Cory: yes, caught me off guard and one of these relatively obscure ones I can't get straight whether it is 3rd or 4th...I actually find those the hardest to remember .1, 2 and 5th growths are much easier since you see most of them quite often and most of the lesser ones, good bet they are 5th growth. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter - I happen to have a bottle decanting for this evening, otherwise I probably wouldn’t have known 😁. When you were discussing Pauillac and 5th Growths I immediately thought of Chateau Pontet-Canet. It is highly rated year after year like a 2nd or 3rd Growth. It’s ratings and reviews are backed up by the quality & improvements at the winery over the last decade or so. Nice complexity to this wine. Problem is that the price has caught up to its quality. 🍷
@@coryz6880 Yes, but have you tried 1960s and 1970s Pontet Canet? You would change your opinion totally. That is why we need historical context as you have take the wine's history for the last 150 years, not just the last 10 years. I agree you buy based on current trends but the growth system is over a longer period of time. I visited Pontet Canet and they are making great wines today. But the challenge is can they continue this for 10, 20, 30, or 50 years. What has happened with Pontet Canet is happening right now in Margaux. A lot of the underachieving 2nd and 3rd growths are coming around. So are the 5th growth Pauillac.. It all comes in waves...then there will be renaissance in St. Estephe and St. Julien. Cheers!
@@TrophyWineHunter - I have not been fortunate enough to try the Pontet-Canet from those vintages. The “professionals” began giving this wine high ratings consistently from 2009 on. They are a good point of reference, but not the end all be all. 🍷
@@coryz6880 Yes, I agree. The problem is that most people use the "growths" for the wrong purpose. It is really meant to be used by people trading wine as a yardstick of the relative worth of each wine. You will see my other video about the Bordeaux 2018 release in B.C. and how I use the growth system to assess the "worth" of each wine. It really is just knowledge and not that a big deal for normal consumers. But it is still important for those who trade in wines and at auction. If you like a wine, you will drink it no matter what growth level. But the classification system helps assess in any given year whether a wine is a buy or not for collectors and those who trade in wines. My only point is that sometime we focus too much on the modern age (like the last 20 years) but we have to realize wineries in Old World have hundreds of years of history. So a lull of 10 years is, relatively speaking, not that big a deal for them and likewise a period of greatness for 10 years, is just a start. I am trying to give viewers perspective and understanding how Old World philosophy towards wine is very different from North America.
BTW, I love 2009 Pontet Canet. I agree that I would prefer this wine to many 3rd growth wines. They really got it right and perfect balance between New World fruit forward and Classic Bordeaux elegance. That was the first year they started using wine from their amphora vessels and their wines taste much more vibrant that previous vintages. Cheers!