I was interested in the prologue, but I've always been interested in the idea of "if you lose your mind, you don't know you've lost your mind" and what would it feel like to realise that during moments of lucidity. Very interested when the Trollocks charge into Rands home and his escape, father/son bond. But when the book starts dropping cliff hangers on the escape? That's when I was hooked. The chapters are all split to end with "I need to read the start of the next to see what happens". Book 1 is VERY different to the rest though, and they get further away in each one. Move into more grand world encompassing stories. Given that Series 1 ignored the book despite it being the most easily adapted. Series 2 will likely ignore it even more. In fact I'm not expecting anything even remotely related at this point.
Okay... now you have me really intrigued. Are we going to have an unreliable narrator? 😳 Yeah, when the Trollocks attack Rand's house, I got to a whole new level of "hooked." So, the method of ending chapters with cliffhangers is one of the easiest tricks a writer can do to keep a reader reading. I honestly don't understand why more writers don't employ this simple device for turning any story into a page-turner. I haven't heard that about Book 1 being different from the rest. Sounds like it was a smart move on the part of the writer to get us attached to characters and the closer things that matter to them before widening the scope of the conflict and stakes. I haven't watched the series yet, but I did watch the trailer, and I was so underwhelmed that I was annoyed. I'll be uploading a "trailer discussion prior to my first episode review, for sure.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS no unreliable narrator. In your last series there were bits where you were like “the book did it this way, the series did it this way”. In Wheel of Time after episode 3 the book may as well have been set on fire. As to book 1 being separate to the rest. Book 1 is far more like LOTR, hes testing ideas like Aes Sedai powers, many of which never return. But book 1 is a book about a boy. The rest turn into books about people and the world, almost zoomed out. LOTR inspired Wheel of Time, but Wheel of Time inspired Game of Thrones. So you start out as this LOTR boy travel across the world and end up in a very different political intrigue place for large sections.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS unless the unreliable narrator was in comment to my talking about the prologue. If so, no. Its just thats what the prologue was. Its not a spoiler as you read all the information that we get about that section. But it might be that its not in context as to the mechanics of why it all happened that way yet.
For me the prologue hooked me right away. The mood, the moment when his memory is restored just to hurt him and the suicide that created a mountain. I knew I’d hooked for good.
For me, the motionless myrddraal moment was what hooked me. It instantly brought me back to the Fellowship of the Ring, where Frodo and the Hobbits get off the road to hide from the Black Rider.
For me, coming back to read the series for a second time, I was really hooked when they entered the village and Rand started talking to Mat and Egwene. There is something nice about seeing a bunch of characters revert to their naive, pre-hero’s journey, selves.
That's interesting to me. In re-reading The Name of the Wind (where it starts with the MC working at an Inn long after the adventures of his life are over), I really enjoy all the conversations that Kvothe has in the Waystone Inn with his patrons, before he starts telling the story of his life. It's sort of the opposite of your case. I like reading mundane scenes with the MC at the end of his journey. I like seeing his reactions to these conversations about things he's done in his past and how he feels about them in the present.
I was hooked from the end of the first paragraph of the prologue. Not joking. This is the greatest fantasy book ever written. Not even my favorite in the series, but the greatest ever. Watching your videos makes me want to read the book again. I can always go back and read it again and I always find something new. Never fails to entertain.
I'm on my third read through, well audio book this time, but the hook for me is when they go back to the farm and are attacked. That is where suddenly all the fairy tales and children's stories parents use to scare their kids are found to be real, and trying to kill them. That's the point where these ordinary, simple, innocent kids are swept away into the harsh realities of the real world where they are just barely able to stay alive. One of the things I like about The Wheel of Time is that Jordan puts several Matrix moments in the books where on your next read through you go "OH! so that's why.." Great books, gets a little tedious in the middle but worth it. I wish Jordan could have finished the series, Sanderson did a great job but it just isn't the same.
I am pretty stoked about reading the series. So far, I'm enjoying it a lot. Sounds like lots of big fans agree that it's got some flaws, but that it's very rereadable. That's a big selling point for me. I will say, the attack at the farm was the point when I couldn't read fast enough. Loved it.
The moment that "hooked" me was going back to the farm. After completing similar chores to how I spent my days -- except I grew up in a far in South Florida -- where winter was 60⁰ F to suddenly be attacked by these chimeras of Trollocs was fascinating.
I have mentioned in a few other comments that, although I was hooked at the Moiraine encounter, I got to the attack on the farm and I couldn't read (listen) fast enough.
I got hooked in the prologue, just by the names Lews Therin Thelamon and Elan Morin Tedronai I was hooked. The places that they speak about and now by book 7 I still dont know what they are but filled me with curiosity I was hooked. When Lews look at Elan and just by his sheer force and power he who was so confident showed fear, I was hooked. When Lews Therin trows himself directly at the One power seeking God Himself for forgiveness for what he has done. The pain, the desperation, the destruction, I was hooked. That prologue for me is so perfect, so good for me that no adaptation will be good enough for me until I see it bit by bit. I love it and its still one of my favorite parts of the whole series.
as many people have stated in these comments, it was the prologue that got me going, but what really hooked this book into me to the point that I have reread the series 14-15 times was the Winternight and particularly the chapter in which Rand struggles to bring his father to the town through the forest after the Trolloc attack at their farm. And then there were so many individual parts throughout the series that just embedded that hook even further, the Sing for Your Supper chapters where absolutely golden as was the earlier Whitebridge chapter. So many points in this series hit really hard and I am looking forward to seeing your reactions to all these different bits as you get through the rest of the series.
I think Wheel of Time hooked me with how easy it was to get into Rand's head. If not that, then it was definitely Moraine's introduction. Another thing that helps her stand out is that the raven leaves when Moraine arrives, almost as if she made it go away. But what really got me engrossed, to the point where I never wanted to stop reading, was when a character named Loial was introduced. Everything about Rand meeting him just clicked for me and made me want to read more.
Gosh. I get reminded of when I read it the first time. It was on a long flight home from Canada in the summer of 1995. I don’t remember exactly when I got hooked. It probably was reading about Moiraine… How wonderful it was to read it all the first time though. The first book is certainly not the best in the series, but it has a special place in my heart. ❤️
For me, it's a combo of things leading up to a specific moment. First we have the black rider, the eerieness of the scene is great. Then we find out other boys have seen the same, interesting. Then a raven seems to be watching them, creepy. Then a strange noblewoman shows up and she seems off, and far too interested in otherwise uninteresting village boys? And then Tam comes to Rand and says we're going home tonight. Rand is dissapointed, after all they're basically here for christmas/new years eve. But Tam is insistent. And as they're walking home Tam says "the village council had a talk, about 5-6 of you 18yo boys have seen a creepy rider, normally we wouldnt think much of it, but you're all good honest lads. So we're taking it seriously and I don't like the way it feels so we're going home" and Rand feels grateful/proud to hear his father say "we know your good lads we'll take it serious". There's something about that scene and the validation of trusted adults. many stories would just have the adults going "ah your being kids give up the jokes" and then we get the cliche "i told you so/ we should have listened" for the youth MC later. Instead we have a much more realistically written and thought out scene. The validation of trusted adults taking it seriously, talking about it, giving us more evidence from background off page characters and conversations, and treating it the way real people would instead of just how it's most convenient to propel the plot or make our MC look more capable beside incompetent adults. This was the point were I was hooked, I knew something was up, the MC knew something was up, and to have the world respect that and respond to it in a thoughtful way, thats when this village started feeling like a real place, with real people, and making the world feel real hooked me. It's the exact opposite of a common thing in most stories where a place just doesnt feel real or lived in. In video games it's JRPG town syndrome, you cant portray an entire village so you portray 5 buildings and call it a village. Another example, in many books or stories we might see a humble farmboy living in a quiet village, but really he might as well be in the middle of nowhere because the village feels like just a cardboard cutout background set instead of a real place.
You are so right. I really like the way you explained how the book portrayal of the town feels realistic because the adults believe the well-behaved teens. I always hate it in movies and books when someone is willfully ignoring someone who is trying to tell them something vitally important. It always feels forced, to me. Real people don't just blow off a good person trying to be helpful or tell them something important.
It's been 30 years, but as I recall, the Prologue got me interested, which carried me over the slow start of Chapter 1. It was probably not until Moraine's telling of Manatheren's history that I think I really got convinced I wanted to keep going. Which is no doubt due to my overall historical interests, for whatever that's worth. . .
yeah same. the prologue got me reading, the Manatherin story kept me reading not only the first book, but kinda the next 2 as well. books 4 and 5 are fantastic and pushed me through to book 8 (the most recent book when i started). after that i just consumed the books as they released, but boy, it became a tangled mess that Jordan only just started sorting out when he died. the story got away from him, same with GRRM.
Good video. I enjoyed the detail of Emonds Field. Growing up in a small town the details meant alot to me. But i was hooked when Tam gave Rand the sword. And i loved the technicality of the sword fights. And THE FLAME AND THE VOID!!!!! OMG
When was I hooked ? “The Wheel of Time turns, and ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again. In one Age, called the Third Age by some, an Age yet to come, an Age long past, a wind rose in the Mountains of Mist. The wind was not the beginning. There are neither beginnings nor endings to the turning of the Wheel of time. But it was a beginning.” the whole cyclic concept that was outlined was intriguing and new to me and impossible intellectually but still grabbed me ! I was interested in how it would be dealt with. Then other things really grabbed me but you have not reached them in your reading ;-)
The hook point for me was the forming of a small group of young people going on an adventure.. the promise of shared experiences and relationships.. in a world of magic. This might be because when younger, I was very shy and moved around a lot.. never forming a bond with anyone.
The Fade probably is what hooked me originally. Knowing Robert Jordans life experience and reading the books from that perspective has kept me hooked to them.
At the start of the video I actually paused and asked myself the question you posed, and I was surprised we had the same answer, the moment Moiraine becomes an active part of the story it really comes to life.
I was completly lost in your description until I realize that I began by reading New Spring the prequel. It create a different experience because the prequel is a lot about the aes sedai Moraine, Siuan and lan. It explain a lot more the world and the importance of the events before the kid began their adventure
In a new medium, the writing should anticipate that this will be the audience's only exposure to the story. Otherwise, the audience will have moments where they are taken out of the world, which is not good for storytelling.
It's tough to remember what hooked me. I think it was maybe the black rider, or the story about Manetheren. I read it in 1992 when I was 14 so it was a long time ago.
Great question! Let’s see…it’s been a while since I read the book…1997 I think (after it first came out for sure, I didn’t learn of the series for a bit). As I recall, I wasn’t hooked until the Trollocs attacked the town. Some combo of the action and the Trollocs themselves. As for Name of the Wind, I got hooked at the same point as you.
Attack at the farm for me. I was so worried for Rand's dad. I always hate (but also sort of understand) when a heroes' journey is really kicked off with the death of a mentor or loved one. And I just couldn't flip pages fast enough while he was trying to get to town to save his dad.
I watched all of season 1 before buying the audio books so I was already a little hooked. The first couple chapters felt like introductions and as you say; when Moiraine gives them the silver coins is definitely the hook.
My best friend convinced me to give it a shot and he made me promise that I would read at least 100 pages before I judged it. I lost track of pages around the time of the attacks by the trollocs and Rands flight to the village. I remember remembering to check what page I was on around the point where they gathered in the thicket after the flight across the river. I didn't stop reading it til i was done and had to go borrow the next book. DEVOUR!
So back in late 1989 (my wife worked at B. Dalton and snagged an advance copy of the book for me), there was only one way to experience tEotW: reading it. And despite how impressive the audiobooks for WoT are, the prologue is absolutely meant to be read.... and it was like nothing that had come before. The confusion of "who the hell are these people" or "what are the Gates of Paaran Disen?" was secondary to a scene that grew darker and darker with each passing sentence (in a time before grimdark was a thing) and the slow realization of Lews Therin's madness. The fourth book in the series was when I determined this was my favorite fantasy series of all time, but it was in the first few pages of that prologue that I knew I'd be seeing this story through to the end (a journey which, alas, did take over 23 years).
I grew up reading the 'Shannarah' series. It's an excellent case study in how a writer improves over time. For some reason, I never got around to WoTime until I was an adult and some friends wanted to D20 a campaign. It's now my favorite fantasy series.
I think I was hooked after the trollocks attack the al'Thor farm, and Rand is dragging his dad back to the village ... it was something heroic, it informed Rand's character better than a lot of other fantasy books I've read.
Thinking about when you're saying you became hooked, that seems like the moment I most likely became hooked as well (I read The Eye of the World many years ago, when it was first published). Looking at what was going on up to that point, Jordan had introduced the key elements: a protagonist and his companions, a guide/mentor to help them on their way, and an antagonist figure in the shadowy cloaked rider. We had flint, steel, and tinder ready to go, and Moiraine speaking with the boys struck the first spark. Shortly after, the trolloc attack fueled that spark into a raging bonfire.
For me it was Winternight and Rand's journey back to Emond's Field. I think that's where you first realize how skilled Jordan is at writing through the eyes of his characters.
Nice to see you mentioning Prydain. It seems like it has fallen out of attention among newer readers and Booktube, though it was of course very influential. I was lucky that in middle school our English class got to meet the author at home (we were reading Westmark).
WoT has a lot of deep description sections. If you like imagery that is so detailed it makes you see the scene, you will like it. If you get tired of the 10 pages to cover 1 page of info, you might get annoyed. I loved the detail, but at times I speed-read through some of it. I was probably hooked when the lady and warrior shows up... mysterious.
For me, when moiraine tells the Emond's field mob about their heritadge from Manetheren. When Moiraine and Lan is interdused, im interested. The aftermath of the battle with the trollocs, when they want to drive her out and you hear hre monologue, esp in the audiobooks, is quite simply amazing.
Hmm! I can't remember. For one thing when I'm looking for a series to read I'll randomly open pages, usually in 4 spots - splitting the book up. Once I was interested, I opened up the 2nd, 3rd and 4th books and did the same... I liked Moiraine's character! That's the best I can do lol
I usually appreciate the world building at the start of novels that are a bit slow (or cryptic). Trying to figuring out the settings, put the small pieces together in some kind of picture, then soon or later the "action" will start. More than the "hero's journey" genre i think that i appreciate something with a broader concept: the coming of age. When i was a teenager i was reading fantasy books about adventures and so on but i think it was when i started reading some scifi novels in my 20s that i was really hooked by seeing characters going out in the world and growing as a person. It's not only about saving the world or be the strongest, it's experiencing new worlds and widening your perspective on things, making choices you'd not do if had stayed in your own "microcosm". Approach people different from you and find a "chemistry" for any reason (survival, common goal, etc). Sometimes the characters go back to their own home, appreciating what they had and live with a different mindset.. other times they are projected to the future (even society wise) in other journeys that involve something bigger.
Rand dragging his father through the forest probably was it for me. This was in the mid 90s though and I was a young boy who hadn't touched any fantasy at that time (except Narnia and possibly Prydain). It was very exciting to read.
i also remember struggling with the prologue my first time around as well. Took me three tries to through it. I think i was hooked somewhere in chapter 2 as well.
I read The Eye of the World in 1891 when I was a kid. I remember the prologue is a little slow at first but I think it gets better as it goes creating the mountain was awesome and it was tragic. I think I really started to get hooked when Rand saw the dark figure in the road. I loved the rich way it is written and I was not jaded so it was very special and it grabbed my imagination. 🥰
I got caught when Rand saw Egwene and his inner dialogue started going over all the things that was making him nervous about her and the rest of the women in the town. (Especially the amusement she held as she watched him.)
I read this book for the first time back in the 90s. If I remember correctly, I was curious about the Prologue, but it was confusing. I think I got really interested when Rand saw the black rider. I notice you’re getting some pretty negative comments about the show. If you go in expecting a faithful adaptation of Book 1, you will be disappointed. But as someone who has read the books many times over the last 30 years, I feel that the show caught most of the major beats of the first book while also doing world building for the series. To me, the show catches the personalities of the characters well which makes me want to continue watching.
Actually, I was pretty hooked from the meeting with Siuan and Morraine in book two. But mine was a strange approach to the series. I saw that book three had come out, so I looked for book one in my local bookstore. (Yes, this was before Amazon). So I bought book two with the plan of reading it first and then going back to book one, which I did.
I read book three, The Dragon Reborn, first. On county time. I do not remember the order I read them in I think 2 was next. I am not sure what hooked me first as far as a specific moment. Lan, Moraine and Perrin stood out. I really liked the part where Perrin was aware he was a wolf brother but very new to it and uncomfortable with it. That is probably the thing that hooked me. I also liked how little time we spent with Rand who was obviously the guy on the cover. He was a mysterious MC / hero for me. I say Nynaeve or Mat are favorite characters but in all reality Rand is by far my favorite character in the books. His arc is incredible.
The moment that got to me was in the Great Hunt Ingtar's last moment and interaction with Rand was such a subdued and powerful scene. Jordan could have easily wrote a scene where rand's shouts at Ingtar but when it dawns on him what Ingtar was saying, he gives him the rites before leaving him behind. I'm sure the show will find some way to ruin this beautiful moment
I just finished the first book last night. Sadly (?) I watched the streaming series first (which I loved), so my approach to the book was REALLY biased. I love them both, and I'm starting this video series of yours to get another perspective on what changed and might have missed or brushed aside.
Great approach! I really think this will be the best way for people to be able to enjoy both. Sadly, I started finding so many flaws and inconsistencies in the show on its own, not even comparing it to the book, it started getting hard to ignore them or forgive them. But I always truly to be fair. My next S2 review (not yet recorded) is actually probably one of my more positive reviews in the whole series).
For me, I was already used to forcing myself through novels and I had been so hyped up for what the later books of the Wheel of Time held so I forced my way through the first one but I got hooked by it. It was at first at the start, the prologue, but I was then bored after that but I was dragged back to care about the characters when they are introduced to Min, a character who could somewhat see a persons future. I adored how that was implemented and I was really intrigued by how abilities relating to The Pattern could manifest (Ta'veren being the biggest) After reading most of the books I went back to the first and then I was hooked all the way through from beginning to end.
Thank you for mentioning some Books you liked. I’ve been struggling to find another series and I will need to check these out. I have read the king killer chronicles but not the other two. I’m 43 now. I think I first read the wheel of time when I was 16 or 17. So it is hard for me to recall at what point I got hooked. Hooked I got. When I got married I gave my grooms men Seords based off of the heron marked blades kn the book. Not the shows silly katanas. Haha. Anyways I’m on a tnagent. Knowing what peaked my teenage kings interest I suspect I really got hooked when Rand and his dad were attacked at there home by the Trolocs and Rand had to save his dad But I don’t really know for sure.
The part where I got hooked was when Moiraine tells the villagers the song of Manetheren. Another moment shortly after was when Moiraine sunk the man’s boat (?) after they crossed it so that the army wouldn’t cross it, too. Moiraine was such an obviously complex character right off the bat, and that was what hooked me.
i don't remember what point. but i remember telling all my friends to get at least 100 pages into it before deciding if they liked it or not. I read this for the first time around 23 or so years ago.
I doubt we will ever see one. The stories are, on the surface, simplistic. The depth and honesty of the earlier subject matter would be difficult to present to most audiences without making it rather "kiddish".... and the latter subject matter would be too dark to present as something for kids. Unless you get a cast and producers who are willing to be very experimental and come back to shoot only once every two or three years, and do each book as a stage of life... child, young adolescent, older adolescent, very young adult (Taran Wanderer), young adult.... I just cant see anyone doing it right. If I was a billionaire, that's how I would do it. It would be a rather experimental series, where you literally start with a 12 year-old, and end up with a 23 year-old. But there would be elements of darkness and child-like innocence throughout.
I picked up "The Eye of the World" at a PX (post exchange) back in 1990 at Fort Benning, GA, while I was waiting for my basic training cycle to start. The prologue certainly interested me, but Rand seeing the Fade on the road to Emond's Field and then later Winternight itself absolutely hooked me. It might have been because Rand and I were sort of the same age and I suppose someone could say I was starting my own mini-adventure with the Army, but I finished the book in near record time, then ended up re-reading it immediately after graduating and going on leave before I reported to Germany ... I even took it AND "The Great Hunt" with me to Saudi Arabia for Desert Shield where I read them multiple times...
@@gilian2587Other. My MOS was 11M (which no longer exists) or "Mechanized Infantryman" which mean I was a rifleman who would ride in the back of a M2 Bradley and then ostensibly get out and do infantry stuff. So I just sat in the back during Desert Storm, even when the Bradley was engaging Iraqi vehicles. Man, that was a long time ago...
Love the way you put into words what I was thinking first reading the first book of this series. (Nonserious) Spoiler Alert: Ended up loving it. Agree with the critiques of the beginning of the books.
I think i was really hooked after the Trollocs attacked Rand's house, and he was dragging his 'father' through the woods and his 'father' was mumbling stuff. I just thought that was a really interesting bit of character growth and i don't remember having read anything quite like it before. I remember it really well so i think that's the part that really got me
The first hook for me was winternight with Rand and Tam trying to get to safety. The big hook though was Moraine shaming villagers with tale of Manetheren. Good luck with series. I don't ever recommend the series anymore because I think it takes about 3 rereads of first 6 books or so before a reader can really appreciate the story. Having all books available almost worsens the experience . It is just too much for most readers. I also think the series on initial read is tough on audiobook because of Jordans writing style. The little bits of foreshadowing and description that will pay off later just seems like droning initially.
I personally love the audio books, I can't sit and read consistently enough but my job happens to be so mindless I can listen to audio books all day. Maybe because of that I was able to get through them within a few months so it was all still fresh when I finished and I felt satisfied.
You mentioned two prologues. The Ravens prologue wasn’t in the original book. It was added maybe 10 years later when the publisher split the first novel into two parts for marketing for children.
For me it was the part where Rand and his dad went back home and then got attacked. Got a good mix of high stakes in monster creatures. Mystery in what do the creatures want, and what kind of intelligence guides them. And some drama with Rand finding out that he might be adopted.
That's a reasonable moment to get hooked. I was surprised at myself for sorta shrugging at it. That's why I made this video. Realizing I got hooked at an unexpected point.
For my part; I like to read a lot of science fiction, which tends to focus on abstract concepts, mechanics, setting and world building. In science fiction, this is often developed to the detriment of fundamental character development. In the Eye of the World, it was the opening idea that Lews Therin Telamon destroyed the world and that he would come back again, he would likely save the world or potentially destroy it again. It played with a lot of Eastern ideas of reincarnation, quasi-religious ideas of the beginning and the end. And the idea that the fate of Lews Therin's family came in a fit of madness at his hands was quite sad; it made a deep impression on my young, at the time, fourteen year old mind. As an example of the kind of science fiction I have enjoyed in the past -- Isaac Asimov's Foundation series had fascinating ideas involving the process of the rise and fall of civilization -- unfortunately, his character building leaves much to be desired; based on your description of what hooked you in the Wheel of Time -- the characters and their connections, I am pretty sure you would hate Asimov's Foundation series. A lot of what is described as 'hard' science fiction novels have barely functional character development; instead, they focus far more heavily on world building, setting development, description of the mechanics of futuristic technology, often characters are merely an afterthought. You'll see a lot of this in Michael Crichton's writing, as well; he focuses on scientific theory and it's implications on society far more heavily than on character development; as an example, Jurassic Park spends a great deal of time discussing the mechanics of differential equations, population models and the emergence of chaos in complex systems -- the book is completely different from Steven Spielberg's film. Spielberg's film was an outstanding adaption, and simultaneously, an extremely unfaithful adaptation of it's source material. Based on what you've described in this video -- I believe that I could heartily recommend David and Leigh Eddings' Belgeriad and Malloreon series, I suspect you would like them. These books are *heavily* character driven; the setting and the plot are somewhat derivative if you've read many other Hero's Journeys before, however, the characters are very well developed; and I found that you, as the reader, will probably grow pretty attached to them pretty quickly. You care about the main characters because they all extremely likeable.
I've seen a lot of praise for the prologue, but it just made me feel... I was going to say, like it was leaving me behind, but I was never with it in the first place. More like I got dropped into a race halfway through and was trying to catch up to everyone else. Intrigue is good, but too much intrigue loses people. Where that line is will vary from person to person though. Well, I think it's more of a gradient than a line, actually. The prologue didn't completely lose me, I could see the other racers ahead of me the whole time (very far ahead), but I didn't see what the hype was about. I would tell you where it does hook me, but I've barely started the book, and I havent reached that point yet.
I’ll be honest. An ex girlfriend bought The Eye of The World for me as a random gift because she figured I’d like it. I read 2 pages and put it on the shelf. 5 years later I picked it up and decided to give it a serious try and was hooked by the end of the prologue.
I agree that, of course, I knew fantastical happenings were to be expected. Still, the cloak that didn't blow in the wind was when I first perked up. I figured "something's about to happen!" ...and then yes, Moiraine's arrival and her talk with Lan about prophecy were when the story felt like it was first gathering momentum. I think the reason is because, even if it's too early for us to understand the prophecy, I still knew that it was some kind of blueprint or auger for what the story would hold, and it was worthy of attention. I stuck with the audiobooks myself, for this one, but I've done my best with the spelling. ;)
People used to "poo-poo" audiobooking, but it seems to be more acceptable these days. Back in college, I was reading several hours a day, and writing. The last thing I wanted to do to unwind was read more. That was when i got into audiobooks. In the end, I sometimes used audiobooks for school, and sometimes for pleasure. It was nice to be able to get two things done at the same time, which I could never do when I had to sit and read a physical book. Yeah, I don't know what it is about me and getting hooked on stories. Takes me longer than most folks, I think. Might be because when analyzing stories is your job, your taste in story beats is a little wonky.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS My adoption-in-earnest of audiobooks happened when I had discovered The Blade Itself (Joe Abercrombie), just in time for a cross-country move from GA to WA. Switching to audio seemed like the perfect call for all those hours on the road. And you know? I haven't looked back; I now prefer audiobooks for fantasy stories. A talented narrator can add greatly to the tale, and -- as you say -- audiobooks allow me to chop veggies or fold laundry or go walkabout. [I feel torn, though, on those occasions when I think the narrator just doesn't measure up.]
@@dant7677 So true. All that you say. I have listened to enough audio books that I've sought books I wouldn't normally read, because they were narrated by a favovorite narrator (Ian McKellan). I've also found myself enjoying certain books of lower caliber because the narrator did such a bangin job (The Iron Druid Chronicles).
For me i think it was when teh trolloc attacked Rand and Tam's farm house. My mom got like a third of the way thru the first book and was not hooked. On my later rereads tho, as i've gotten older. I was 17ish when Winter's Heart came out, now i've gotten older i've identified a lot more with Thom so i get why you are so intrigued by Morraine, and i didn't disagree with the showrunners making her more the main character in the first season.
I am wondering about your opinion on listening to audiobooks versus reading a book. I mean something specific here and that is first impressions. My current opinion is that reading a book provides a more individual, personal experience. In audiobooks, the narrators decide the tempo of the action and how people sound, which I find influences my impressions of the story, whereas when reading a book myself, its my mind that decides these things. Sadly, I can't remember when I got hooked because I read the first book in 1995. If only I'd known it would become my favourite series! I'll give it some thought in regards to other books and series...
If i had more time to sit and read, I would. I also sit and read for a living, so it's not really what i want to do in my spare time. But I love storytelling. I think it's fine if you are word-conscious. I agree that an audiobook can make or break a good experience with a book, but I'm so analytical about syntax and composition, I actually edit the books as I'm listening to them, sometimes. That being said, you are still right about the audiobook experience being heavily influenced by the performance.
my brother was a super fan and pressured me to read it but i didnt really love it till shadows rising but i like books 1-3 more now than i did the first time
The moment that hooked me was after Rand got back to Emond's field and he had to get Moiraine's help. He thought he was making a deal with the devil and she says the actual devil of their world is after him and I really wanted to know why and where it would lead
I unfortunately read the Prologue to Book 2 first, as I "won" The Great Hunt at a White Elephant Party just before Christmas Break my Fres4year in college 1994. At O'Hare airport I found a display for The Shadow Rising on hard cover and also had books 1-3 in Trade Paperback, so I purchased Books 1 & 3. I was 3 hours early for my flight and read Book 1 and had to board just as Nynaeve found Moiraine and Lan outside of Shadar Logoth. By the time my plane landed in Atlanta for a change of plans I had finished the Eye of the World and reread the Prologue to The Great Hunt. I asked for The Shadow Rising and The Fires of Heaven for Christmas, sadly I received The Fires of Heaven and had to purchase The Shadow Rising.
WoT is my favorite book series - I have read most of the novels at least a dozen times. I think I was hooked when we first observe Moiraine channeling (I love magic systems) and then doubly so when the party gets split up and we begin getting multiple POVs (variety is the spice of life). Since you plan to compare & contrast with s1 of the tv adaptation and other video commenters have made negative remarks on the tv adaptation, I am going to offer a few comments below on why I think some people report being dissatisfied while I have a more favorable outlook on the tv adaptation. However, I will make sure to avoid in-book plot spoilers since you and others here may be new readers. However, I do provide high-level comments on the emphasis Robert Jordan places on certain subjects in his writing (e.g., role of women, Rand relative to other characters, the nature of time and whether it’s cyclical in WoT), which might be considered spoiler-y by those with a strict interpretation of the concept.
In contrast to some of your other commentors, I think s1 of the tv adaptation was solid/okay and I’m excited for future seasons (it’s already renewed thru s3). There is certainly room for improvement, but WoT (and tEotW in particular) possess many features that are difficult to adapt to tv, few stories hit their stride in their first outing (e.g., tEotW is not most WoT fans’ favorite book), and the production faced many challenges (COVID, actor departures and limited availability, studio notes, etc.). My mildly positive assessment is shared by the majority of TV critics, WoT content creators (which includes other similarly hard-core fans who have been attached to the series for decades and held leadership roles with the WoT-focused fansites and convention), and Brandon Sanderson (the author picked by Robert Jordan’s editor/widow to finish the series after RJ’s passing). WoT was Prime Video’s most successful original series launch as of that point in time, with ratings suggesting that millions of non-book readers around the world started and finished the season. The tv adaptation’s commercial success has prompted a resurgence in book sales, which by itself should be considered a win even among those book fans who do not personally enjoy the tv adaptation.
One reason some book fans express for disliking the tv series is that it is not a 1:1 adaptation. A 1:1 adaptation of WoT seems both impractical for the medium of “television” and also inadvisable. A few examples as to why (some of them previously highlighted by Brandon Sanderson): The number of books, words, characters, locations, and production studio-dictated condensing rate (book words -> tv minutes) for WoT exceeds that of commonly-cited peer series (LoTR, GoT, etc.). The type of story told in WoT books varies considerably from books 1-3 (Tolkein-esque quest fantasy), books 4-6 (worldbuilding, political intrigue epic), books 7-10/prequel (really expand the universe, shine the spotlight on different characters and stories), and books 11-14 (return to wrapping up the main story). RJ wrote all of the early books as potentially having a definitive end to the series (since he didn’t know whether he would get the opportunity to publish more books), which creates some narrative repetition. Later, he arguably struggled to balance story arc plotting across several books (creating what is known as “the slog” by some readers). There are inconsistencies between the worldbuilding and metaphysics in the early books (particularly tEotW) versus the rest of the series. Major characters largely disappear for books at a time (not viable for tv shows with actors, contracts, availability, etc.). While Rand accounts for 80% of tEotW’s POV word count, he only accounts for 2% or less of books 3, 10, and 13 (and only 21% of the series as a whole, as it becomes a story where Rand is merely #1 in an ensemble). RJ had enormous strengths as a writer, but also some generally agreed-upon weaknesses (e.g., romance).
Yes, S1 makes MANY changes relative to tEotW (though less if you account for the fact that the tv series is adapting WoT as a whole - s1 is heavily informed by setting up tv audiences for the plot and focus of later books). The tv adaptation certainly could have been made with fewer changes to the books. By the end of s1, I feel that some of the changes were bad (in conception and/or in execution), others an improvement, and the status of others ambivalent or TBD (depends on what happens in s2 or later). However, even for those changes I strongly dislike or feel don’t work, I can almost always see the reasoning behind the changes the tv adaptation makes. At the same time, the show gave me many elements directly from the books, made improvements upon the books in areas, provided me with the first opportunity to speculate about WoT in nearly a decade (what will happen next in the tv adaptation?), allowed me to talk about and enjoy WoT with people who would never read a fantasy 14+ book series, prompted many people to read the books for the first time, and is still telling the same general story as the books (this particular set of heroes’ journeys). I have chosen to focus on the positive of the tv adaptation, rather than the negative, even if it felt like a kick in the stomach the first time I watched each episode because there were so many book->tv changes. Like many book fans (including Brandon Sanderson), I think of the tv adaptation as a different telling of the cyclical WoT story that was originally presented in the books. This interpretation of the tv adaptation is reasonable under WoT metaphysics. The existence of a new telling of the story in tv form does not take anything away from the original books and their telling of the story.
Finally, in case you are not aware of this backstory, I will flag another reason why some people go out of their way to comment negatively about the tv adaptation whenever and wherever possible, even two years after its release, rather than just accept the idea that the adaptation didn’t work for them (but has worked for other hardcore book fans) and move on to focusing on things that bring them joy rather than angst. A small but very vocal group of people who call themselves book fans (although their comments often reveal a rather weak familiarity with the series) see the tv adaptation as a front in the culture wars around issues related to race, gender, and sexuality. They object to people of color being cast in many of the major roles (even though the tv casting largely does not break book canon and RJ rarely emphasized race in his worldbuilding in favor of other possible contrasting dimensions like culture, ideology, or clothing). They also object to the prominence and storytelling beats of female characters relative to male characters in s1 of the tv adaptation (even though female characters have enormously significant roles in the overall book series, women account for a majority of POV words in a majority of the books, and the world in the books is more of a matriarchal society rather than patriarchal society). Likewise, they object to same-sex romances being put in the foreground of the tv adaptation, rather than being relegated to the subtle, indirect references Robert Jordan made when writing his books for a mainstream fantasy audience in the 80s-00s. The challenges and negative emotions some of these so-called book readers experience with ongoing real-world cultural changes, in which many of them identify as cis-white-heterosexual-men who feel like they are losing their privileged status when other types of people receive attention and advancement in society, helps me understand why these individuals continue to irrationally engage with a subject (the WoT tv adaptation) when they otherwise claim that it brings them so much distress. Their behavior strikes me as unhealthy, but I understand that it is often easier for people in pain to lash out rather than address their own personal demons.
Wow! Lots of great notes, here. Hopefully I can give a fair review of this adaptation. I judge storytelling. When it comes to adaptations, I just compare and give my opinion on which was better. And I'll sometimes throw my personal likes or dislikes. As a developmental editor, it's my job to help writers figure out the best story for their intended audience. On this channel, I only look at political and social issues as storytelling elements. But I will definitely mention where major deviations from source material are made, or where I'm seeing overused tropes, or where it seems that changes have been made for political/social reasons at the cost of being an adaptation that stays true to characters and plot and world. If something small is done for improvement, that's one thing. If something is done that makes a character less objectively likable (by editor character likability measures) its never a good idea. Anyway, I'm replying from my cellphone, with my squirming 2 month old niece in one arm. Haha. I'll try to respond mire to some of your other points. But I think, in the end, I'll have to see what the show does before I am confident in my opinion of it. 😅
For me I really got into the books when we got Matts pov. What really put me off for the longest time was all the female casts pov especially eleyne's pov. Heck I was skipping most of the chapters that had female characters pov. But after that long journey the last three books were really worth it.
not sure what initial point hooked me. read it way too long ago on first reading. although i know it was book one as i never had issues completing it first time through.
Honestly, for me it was when Rand and Matt were on the road to Caemlyn and Matt started to psychologically fall apart. That was the point when The Eye of the World started to become something more than a cheap copy of the Fellowship of the Ring. It was when Robert Jordan started to find his voice.
(maybe spoilers) It wouldn't qualify as a hook, but Caemlyn and specifically the whole procession with the climbing, the princess, and the false dragon (and then audience). That's when, for me, it felt like the wider world had hit us (and Rand).
I'm glad you are getting into Wheel of Time, but sadly I thought the show was as bad as shows like Rings of Power when it came to the writing and to being faithful to the source material. What other fantasy book series are you a fan of?
I have heard the show was not great. I'm not exactly looking forward to viewing it, but I'll try to be as fair as possible (I already have complaints about the trailer for Season 1, though, so it's not looking good). Oh gosh! I have a few. Harry Potter was the starter, for me, as it was for most (still love the books). Lord of the Rings, The Kingkiller (please finish it, Pat!), Lady Trent Memoirs was a surprising hit with me, Gentlemen Bastards (although I have to read the last book, still... this is the case with a few of my series favorites. I like to make them last). Mistborn (gotta read more Sanderson. I keep starting Stormlight and never finishing [must have listened to the first half of book 1 a half a dozen times). Chronicles of Prydain. The Sharing Knife. I'm dying to get to Malazan. The Chronicles of Ancient Darkness (I audio book this one with Ian McKellan, and I'm convinced he is the greatest audiobook narrator I've ever heard. I've never had a narrator legitimately whisper certain descriptions because the moment was still and tense). The World of Howl (especially books 1 and 2, which I re-read almost every other year). Darkwater Legacy (really enjoyed the first two books, and can't wait for the third). Farseer was a bit boring for me (mainly because the protagonist was so... ugh) but I still enjoyed it. I need to finish the final book, and I know that there's another trilogy in this world that I'm told I will like better. Oh! I can't forget The Old Kingdom series (I audiobook the first three in the series... Tim Curry! One of my top narrators ever!) First Law book 1 was good, and I realyl want to finish that series.... Sheesh! I've given so many and I'm not even halfway through. There's a ton on my TBR, also. I plan to shorten the length of my videos, so hopefully that means I'll have more time to read new stuff.
Upon reflection, I think I get hooked when I reach the point where I understand enough about the world to know how any disturbance in the norm would affect the MC. A death or a loss. A strange occurrence. That moment where something is off is a part of it, but I also like to know WHY it’s off from the characters perspective. Take LOTR for example. War against Mordor is an everyday thing for Boromir. But not to Frodo. Tolkien (I feel) started in the Shire for a reason. That became a baseline for the innocence/ignorance of the character. But if we knew Boromir first (my favorite character btw) then when he meets the hobbits they might seem trivial and pathetic.
That's a great observation. Yeah, I think part of the appeal is also seeing how the big outer world affects an innocent who has grown up otherwise untouched by it. For me, the big moment in LOTR is when the Hobbits hde from the black rider. Whi h happens almost 100 pages in. Lol. But I'm so much enjoying the language and quaint loves of the Hobbits up to that point, that I'm totally relaxed and enjoying the journey up until then.
It was all pretty standard for me; read so much fantasy.... so it was actually in the inn with SPOILER showing up which really pulled me in. Due to being on holiday at the time I read the first two books... and reread them directly after and I was sooo invested then *sooo* much foreshadowing and character moments that made the second time I read the first two books BETTER than the first time. A lot of the TV show references more stuff that happens later in the book series. Book1 is Rand's story.... the book series as a whole is not... and neither is the show.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS Lets just say the author is great at world building ! There's some weaknesses and other (many) strengths you may also notice as you progress. :)
I loved the Wheel of Time series at first, but as the books went on, I grew to really dislike Rand. I expect a flawed protagonist, but he became more than flawed to me. It will be interesting to see how you view him by the end. As to when I was hooked, it was when Moiran (sp?) couldn't tell which of the three was the chosen one.
I am not sure when I got hooked with the WoT. After all, I decided I was going to read it and I *never* give up on a book once I start ... ... ... okay, that's a lie, The Stone and the Flute defeated me :blush: It's been decades since I first read it so I probably won't be able to recall that 'moment' when I was invested in the story. I do recall a gradual settling in to the tale tho', especially as the characters starting doing things I actively disagreed with and, from the safety of my armchair, considered un-heroic. I came across a quote from Robert Jordan recently that gave me a feeling of insight into those 'Not in the Heroic Mould' moments. His time in Vietnam saw our intelligent and eloquent author doing things that he likely could never have imagined and they changed him. It's a big chunk of text for a UA-cam comment so I shall perhaps have to break it up over more than one ...
"I had two nicknames in ‘Nam. First up was Ganesha, after the Hindu god called the Remover of Obstacles. He’s the one with the elephant head. That one stuck with me, but I gained another that I didn’t like so much. The Iceman. One day, we had what the Aussies called a bit of a brass-up. Just our ship alone, but we caught an NVA battalion crossing a river, and wonder of wonders, we got permission to fire before they finished. The gunner had a round explode in the chamber, jamming his 60, and the fool had left his barrel bag, with spares, back in the revetment. So while he was frantically rummaging under my seat for my barrel bag, it was over to me, young and crazy, standing on the skid, singing something by the Stones at the of my lungs with the mike keyed so the others could listen in, and Lord, Lord, I rode that 60. 3000 rounds, an empty ammo box, and a smoking barrel that I had burned out because I didn’t want to take the time to change. We got ordered out right after I went dry, so the artillery could open up, and of course, the arty took credit for every body recovered, but we could count how many bodies were floating in the river when we pulled out. The next day in the orderly room an officer with a literary bent announced my entrance with “Behold, the Iceman cometh.” For those of you unfamiliar with Eugene O’Neil, the Iceman was Death. I hated that name, but I couldn’t shake it. And, to tell you the truth, by that time maybe it fit. I have, or used to have, a photo of a young man sitting on a log eating C-rations with a pair of chopsticks. There are three dead NVA laid out in a line just beside him. He didn’t kill them. He didn’t choose to sit there because of the bodies. It was just the most convenient place to sit. The bodies don’t bother him. He doesn’t care. They’re just part of the landscape. The young man is glancing at the camera, and you know in one look that you aren’t going to take this guy home to meet your parents. Back in the world, you wouldn’t want him in your neighbourhood, because he is cold, cold, cold. I strangled that SOB, drove a stake through his heart, and buried him face down under a crossroad outside Saigon before coming home, because I knew that guy wasn’t made to survive in a civilian environment. I think he’s gone. All of him. I hope so. I much prefer being remembered as Ganesha, the Remover of Obstacles."
I started reading eye of the world in 2000 and, after several attempts finished it late 2002. By 2004, I had read all the way up to book 10 and had to start waiting for the new books to be released. I always remembered the story of the road with the creepy guy behind them. By the time I finished Memory of Light, I had completely forgotten about the prologue. In fact, when I heard they will do a show, I found winter dragon on UA-cam, which is basically a very bad show version of the prologue. I had no Idea, what I was watching. Only when I decided to listen to the audiobooks as a reminder of the series, I figured out, that this prologue existed, and that winter dragon was actually somehow related to the books. 😂 Long story short, I was hooked in the first chapter. And the next thing I remembered well over the years was three stupid boys going on a treasure hunt in a creepy city...
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS There is a very bad 20 minutes clip that was only made to keep the rights to filming the series. It basically covers the prologue. It's quite fun to watch, if you know what you are getting into. There is also a pretty decent fan-film of one chapter (Four Kings). Great to watch!
The prologue gets more detailed in book 2 or 3 will get definitive drops of what happened. Book 4 you will get to one of the best chapters in the series.
More generally, I get hooked either by the language (right off the bat) or when the characters start interacting. You know, in all 37,456 years I've been hearing people rave about The Name of the Wind, I've never heard someone summarize it. It's always just "it's so great, you HAVE TO read it." Since I wasn't hooked by the language, I have again and again come to the conclusion that those people are crazy, and have given up before page 100.
Haha. The story is about a boy who grew up with the Edema Ruh (gypsies). He proves to be unusually gifted in learning new things. Eventually he goes off to University to earn more things, where he makes friends and enemies, and his greatest struggles are figuring out how to pay his tuition. Outside of all that, something big is stirring. The Chandrian, like seven angels of destruction, are in the shadows, working their mysterious purposes. Kvothe finds himself a victim of their machinations, and decides he will take revenge on them all. But to most, the Chandrian are only myth. So, where to start? That's the best I can do. The reader is gi en very subtle clues throughout the two books about whats going on that might be related to the Chandrian (when i say subtle, I mean like the color of a passing butterfly is a clue... in book 2, this actually happens). The bigger plot of the book is unique, in that it doesn't make much progress. But there are many mini plots in-between that manage to have a good deal of tension. Amazingly, Kvothe just trying to get a teacher to agree to let him enroll in a class can be the most important goal for several chapters, but it's written like this is do or die (or get kicked into the streets, anyway, but Kvothe is desperate at these points.) I would say that the insighting incident doesn't happen until chapter 16, and Kvothe doesn't start off on his mission until chapter 30. Hopefully, that helped you get a better idea of what it's about. But I could also argue that this is only half the plot, because there's SOMETHING going on with Bast.
I tried reading EotW about twenty years ago and also found the prologue boring. I got a third of the way through and did not finish, whereas I normally at least skim to the end.
It's been so long since I read WoT for the first time, but I do remember that I didn't care for The Eye of the World so much. I read it because I'd read all the books I had with me and my NCO (I was in the Army at the time) gave it to me to read (he was reading Forrest Gump laughing his butt off). Well not that I didn't like it, it just didn't seem anything special to me. I'm not really a fan of fantasy tbh. I did read The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings when I was like 10 or 11 and it was good at the time. I tried Faust and some others in the 90s but I just couldn't get into it. I'm not even sure why I picked up The Great Hunt, but I know it was in this book when I knew it was special. It was the "Flicker" chapter (don't really think that's a spoiler) and then the end of the book ("or a woman" part). Trying really hard to be vague enough for non-readers... Needless to say, I've read the entirety of the series maybe 10ish times but only the last three books 4 times. Finishing the series was... sad. I don't know how else to put it, I'd never been immersed into a world like this before. I actually loved the characters, hated the villains and finishing the series, and knowing there will never be anymore, just hurt lol
That's a great moment. I didn't even think about it, but that's a moment similar to my hook moment in The Ember Blade. I think when the trollocks attack the farm (which happens before Tam's fever dream) was the point at which I couldn't listen fast enough. Haha. So maybe that's why Tam's fever dream didn't feel as sharp a hook.... because I was already at the maximum level of being hooked. 😋
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS as you said, the hook is the introduction of a mystery. Rand's heritage is the first mystery that is significantly different from the LOTR storyline. So, i sort of remember thinking at that point that there might be more to it. And that made me curious. I was pretty sceptical when starting reading, because of the awful book covers and such. I basically expected a long, drawn out collection of fantasy tropes written in an outdated style. Which is not false. But it also gave me the most amazing group of imaginary friends offering continuous, reinterpretable life lessons.
I was interested in the prologue, but I've always been interested in the idea of "if you lose your mind, you don't know you've lost your mind" and what would it feel like to realise that during moments of lucidity. Very interested when the Trollocks charge into Rands home and his escape, father/son bond. But when the book starts dropping cliff hangers on the escape? That's when I was hooked. The chapters are all split to end with "I need to read the start of the next to see what happens".
Book 1 is VERY different to the rest though, and they get further away in each one. Move into more grand world encompassing stories. Given that Series 1 ignored the book despite it being the most easily adapted. Series 2 will likely ignore it even more. In fact I'm not expecting anything even remotely related at this point.
ah the more critic of the show the happier i get. good work disparu!!
Okay... now you have me really intrigued. Are we going to have an unreliable narrator? 😳 Yeah, when the Trollocks attack Rand's house, I got to a whole new level of "hooked." So, the method of ending chapters with cliffhangers is one of the easiest tricks a writer can do to keep a reader reading. I honestly don't understand why more writers don't employ this simple device for turning any story into a page-turner.
I haven't heard that about Book 1 being different from the rest. Sounds like it was a smart move on the part of the writer to get us attached to characters and the closer things that matter to them before widening the scope of the conflict and stakes.
I haven't watched the series yet, but I did watch the trailer, and I was so underwhelmed that I was annoyed. I'll be uploading a "trailer discussion prior to my first episode review, for sure.
Love your channel, BTW. Keep up the noble work of giving us a laugh. It's the best part of most of these shows we are getting, these days.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS no unreliable narrator. In your last series there were bits where you were like “the book did it this way, the series did it this way”. In Wheel of Time after episode 3 the book may as well have been set on fire.
As to book 1 being separate to the rest. Book 1 is far more like LOTR, hes testing ideas like Aes Sedai powers, many of which never return.
But book 1 is a book about a boy. The rest turn into books about people and the world, almost zoomed out. LOTR inspired Wheel of Time, but Wheel of Time inspired Game of Thrones.
So you start out as this LOTR boy travel across the world and end up in a very different political intrigue place for large sections.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS unless the unreliable narrator was in comment to my talking about the prologue. If so, no. Its just thats what the prologue was. Its not a spoiler as you read all the information that we get about that section. But it might be that its not in context as to the mechanics of why it all happened that way yet.
For me the prologue hooked me right away. The mood, the moment when his memory is restored just to hurt him and the suicide that created a mountain. I knew I’d hooked for good.
For me, the motionless myrddraal moment was what hooked me. It instantly brought me back to the Fellowship of the Ring, where Frodo and the Hobbits get off the road to hide from the Black Rider.
Ditto!
Same
There are lots of elements which feel a bit like Fellowship of the rings.
For me, coming back to read the series for a second time, I was really hooked when they entered the village and Rand started talking to Mat and Egwene. There is something nice about seeing a bunch of characters revert to their naive, pre-hero’s journey, selves.
That's interesting to me. In re-reading The Name of the Wind (where it starts with the MC working at an Inn long after the adventures of his life are over), I really enjoy all the conversations that Kvothe has in the Waystone Inn with his patrons, before he starts telling the story of his life. It's sort of the opposite of your case. I like reading mundane scenes with the MC at the end of his journey. I like seeing his reactions to these conversations about things he's done in his past and how he feels about them in the present.
I was hooked from the end of the first paragraph of the prologue. Not joking. This is the greatest fantasy book ever written. Not even my favorite in the series, but the greatest ever. Watching your videos makes me want to read the book again. I can always go back and read it again and I always find something new. Never fails to entertain.
I'm on my third read through, well audio book this time, but the hook for me is when they go back to the farm and are attacked. That is where suddenly all the fairy tales and children's stories parents use to scare their kids are found to be real, and trying to kill them. That's the point where these ordinary, simple, innocent kids are swept away into the harsh realities of the real world where they are just barely able to stay alive.
One of the things I like about The Wheel of Time is that Jordan puts several Matrix moments in the books where on your next read through you go "OH! so that's why.."
Great books, gets a little tedious in the middle but worth it.
I wish Jordan could have finished the series, Sanderson did a great job but it just isn't the same.
I am pretty stoked about reading the series. So far, I'm enjoying it a lot.
Sounds like lots of big fans agree that it's got some flaws, but that it's very rereadable. That's a big selling point for me.
I will say, the attack at the farm was the point when I couldn't read fast enough. Loved it.
The moment that "hooked" me was going back to the farm. After completing similar chores to how I spent my days -- except I grew up in a far in South Florida -- where winter was 60⁰ F to suddenly be attacked by these chimeras of Trollocs was fascinating.
I have mentioned in a few other comments that, although I was hooked at the Moiraine encounter, I got to the attack on the farm and I couldn't read (listen) fast enough.
I got hooked in the prologue, just by the names Lews Therin Thelamon and Elan Morin Tedronai I was hooked. The places that they speak about and now by book 7 I still dont know what they are but filled me with curiosity I was hooked. When Lews look at Elan and just by his sheer force and power he who was so confident showed fear, I was hooked. When Lews Therin trows himself directly at the One power seeking God Himself for forgiveness for what he has done. The pain, the desperation, the destruction, I was hooked. That prologue for me is so perfect, so good for me that no adaptation will be good enough for me until I see it bit by bit. I love it and its still one of my favorite parts of the whole series.
as many people have stated in these comments, it was the prologue that got me going, but what really hooked this book into me to the point that I have reread the series 14-15 times was the Winternight and particularly the chapter in which Rand struggles to bring his father to the town through the forest after the Trolloc attack at their farm. And then there were so many individual parts throughout the series that just embedded that hook even further, the Sing for Your Supper chapters where absolutely golden as was the earlier Whitebridge chapter. So many points in this series hit really hard and I am looking forward to seeing your reactions to all these different bits as you get through the rest of the series.
I think Wheel of Time hooked me with how easy it was to get into Rand's head. If not that, then it was definitely Moraine's introduction. Another thing that helps her stand out is that the raven leaves when Moraine arrives, almost as if she made it go away.
But what really got me engrossed, to the point where I never wanted to stop reading, was when a character named Loial was introduced. Everything about Rand meeting him just clicked for me and made me want to read more.
I love Loial! He's definitely a favorite for me. He's so funny.
Gosh. I get reminded of when I read it the first time. It was on a long flight home from Canada in the summer of 1995. I don’t remember exactly when I got hooked. It probably was reading about Moiraine… How wonderful it was to read it all the first time though. The first book is certainly not the best in the series, but it has a special place in my heart. ❤️
I am not even half way through the first book, and I'm already certain I'll be finishing all 14. I'm in! 😁
For me, it's a combo of things leading up to a specific moment. First we have the black rider, the eerieness of the scene is great. Then we find out other boys have seen the same, interesting. Then a raven seems to be watching them, creepy. Then a strange noblewoman shows up and she seems off, and far too interested in otherwise uninteresting village boys? And then Tam comes to Rand and says we're going home tonight. Rand is dissapointed, after all they're basically here for christmas/new years eve. But Tam is insistent. And as they're walking home Tam says "the village council had a talk, about 5-6 of you 18yo boys have seen a creepy rider, normally we wouldnt think much of it, but you're all good honest lads. So we're taking it seriously and I don't like the way it feels so we're going home" and Rand feels grateful/proud to hear his father say "we know your good lads we'll take it serious".
There's something about that scene and the validation of trusted adults. many stories would just have the adults going "ah your being kids give up the jokes" and then we get the cliche "i told you so/ we should have listened" for the youth MC later.
Instead we have a much more realistically written and thought out scene. The validation of trusted adults taking it seriously, talking about it, giving us more evidence from background off page characters and conversations, and treating it the way real people would instead of just how it's most convenient to propel the plot or make our MC look more capable beside incompetent adults. This was the point were I was hooked, I knew something was up, the MC knew something was up, and to have the world respect that and respond to it in a thoughtful way, thats when this village started feeling like a real place, with real people, and making the world feel real hooked me.
It's the exact opposite of a common thing in most stories where a place just doesnt feel real or lived in. In video games it's JRPG town syndrome, you cant portray an entire village so you portray 5 buildings and call it a village. Another example, in many books or stories we might see a humble farmboy living in a quiet village, but really he might as well be in the middle of nowhere because the village feels like just a cardboard cutout background set instead of a real place.
You are so right. I really like the way you explained how the book portrayal of the town feels realistic because the adults believe the well-behaved teens. I always hate it in movies and books when someone is willfully ignoring someone who is trying to tell them something vitally important. It always feels forced, to me. Real people don't just blow off a good person trying to be helpful or tell them something important.
Just wanted to say your channel was recommended to me and while it rarely happens UA-cam got this one right. Great work. Enjoying the content.
It's been 30 years, but as I recall, the Prologue got me interested, which carried me over the slow start of Chapter 1. It was probably not until Moraine's telling of Manatheren's history that I think I really got convinced I wanted to keep going. Which is no doubt due to my overall historical interests, for whatever that's worth. . .
yeah same. the prologue got me reading, the Manatherin story kept me reading not only the first book, but kinda the next 2 as well. books 4 and 5 are fantastic and pushed me through to book 8 (the most recent book when i started). after that i just consumed the books as they released, but boy, it became a tangled mess that Jordan only just started sorting out when he died. the story got away from him, same with GRRM.
Good video. I enjoyed the detail of Emonds Field. Growing up in a small town the details meant alot to me. But i was hooked when Tam gave Rand the sword. And i loved the technicality of the sword fights. And THE FLAME AND THE VOID!!!!! OMG
When was I hooked ? “The Wheel of Time turns, and ages come and pass, leaving memories that become legend. Legend fades to myth, and even myth is long forgotten when the Age that gave it birth comes again. In one Age, called the Third Age by some, an Age yet to come, an Age long past, a wind rose in the Mountains of Mist. The wind was not the beginning. There are neither beginnings nor endings to the turning of the Wheel of time. But it was a beginning.” the whole cyclic concept that was outlined was intriguing and new to me and impossible intellectually but still grabbed me ! I was interested in how it would be dealt with. Then other things really grabbed me but you have not reached them in your reading ;-)
That was 30 years ago! No idea what hooked me. However, no other fantasy series has grabbed me like this one.
I am hooked only to the books. I was hooked the moment Zam talks about he finds the baby of the battlefield.
The hook point for me was the forming of a small group of young people going on an adventure.. the promise of shared experiences and relationships.. in a world of magic. This might be because when younger, I was very shy and moved around a lot.. never forming a bond with anyone.
The Fade probably is what hooked me originally. Knowing Robert Jordans life experience and reading the books from that perspective has kept me hooked to them.
At the start of the video I actually paused and asked myself the question you posed, and I was surprised we had the same answer, the moment Moiraine becomes an active part of the story it really comes to life.
I was completly lost in your description until I realize that I began by reading New Spring the prequel. It create a different experience because the prequel is a lot about the aes sedai Moraine, Siuan and lan. It explain a lot more the world and the importance of the events before the kid began their adventure
In a new medium, the writing should anticipate that this will be the audience's only exposure to the story. Otherwise, the audience will have moments where they are taken out of the world, which is not good for storytelling.
When Rand climbed the wall and sees Logain for the first time I was hooked.
It's tough to remember what hooked me. I think it was maybe the black rider, or the story about Manetheren. I read it in 1992 when I was 14 so it was a long time ago.
Great question! Let’s see…it’s been a while since I read the book…1997 I think (after it first came out for sure, I didn’t learn of the series for a bit). As I recall, I wasn’t hooked until the Trollocs attacked the town. Some combo of the action and the Trollocs themselves. As for Name of the Wind, I got hooked at the same point as you.
Attack at the farm for me. I was so worried for Rand's dad. I always hate (but also sort of understand) when a heroes' journey is really kicked off with the death of a mentor or loved one. And I just couldn't flip pages fast enough while he was trying to get to town to save his dad.
I watched all of season 1 before buying the audio books so I was already a little hooked. The first couple chapters felt like introductions and as you say; when Moiraine gives them the silver coins is definitely the hook.
My best friend convinced me to give it a shot and he made me promise that I would read at least 100 pages before I judged it. I lost track of pages around the time of the attacks by the trollocs and Rands flight to the village. I remember remembering to check what page I was on around the point where they gathered in the thicket after the flight across the river. I didn't stop reading it til i was done and had to go borrow the next book. DEVOUR!
So back in late 1989 (my wife worked at B. Dalton and snagged an advance copy of the book for me), there was only one way to experience tEotW: reading it. And despite how impressive the audiobooks for WoT are, the prologue is absolutely meant to be read.... and it was like nothing that had come before. The confusion of "who the hell are these people" or "what are the Gates of Paaran Disen?" was secondary to a scene that grew darker and darker with each passing sentence (in a time before grimdark was a thing) and the slow realization of Lews Therin's madness. The fourth book in the series was when I determined this was my favorite fantasy series of all time, but it was in the first few pages of that prologue that I knew I'd be seeing this story through to the end (a journey which, alas, did take over 23 years).
I grew up reading the 'Shannarah' series. It's an excellent case study in how a writer improves over time. For some reason, I never got around to WoTime until I was an adult and some friends wanted to D20 a campaign. It's now my favorite fantasy series.
I think I was hooked after the trollocks attack the al'Thor farm, and Rand is dragging his dad back to the village ... it was something heroic, it informed Rand's character better than a lot of other fantasy books I've read.
Thinking about when you're saying you became hooked, that seems like the moment I most likely became hooked as well (I read The Eye of the World many years ago, when it was first published). Looking at what was going on up to that point, Jordan had introduced the key elements: a protagonist and his companions, a guide/mentor to help them on their way, and an antagonist figure in the shadowy cloaked rider. We had flint, steel, and tinder ready to go, and Moiraine speaking with the boys struck the first spark. Shortly after, the trolloc attack fueled that spark into a raging bonfire.
For me it was Winternight and Rand's journey back to Emond's Field. I think that's where you first realize how skilled Jordan is at writing through the eyes of his characters.
Nice to see you mentioning Prydain. It seems like it has fallen out of attention among newer readers and Booktube, though it was of course very influential. I was lucky that in middle school our English class got to meet the author at home (we were reading Westmark).
WoT has a lot of deep description sections. If you like imagery that is so detailed it makes you see the scene, you will like it. If you get tired of the 10 pages to cover 1 page of info, you might get annoyed. I loved the detail, but at times I speed-read through some of it. I was probably hooked when the lady and warrior shows up... mysterious.
Lloyd Alexander represent! With crunchings and munchings!
Gurgy FTW!
Also, Fflewddur Fflam is a highly underrated character.
I was hooked when the trollocs attacked Rand and Tam, though I was actually interested since Moraine appeared as well :)
For me, when moiraine tells the Emond's field mob about their heritadge from Manetheren. When Moiraine and Lan is interdused, im interested. The aftermath of the battle with the trollocs, when they want to drive her out and you hear hre monologue, esp in the audiobooks, is quite simply amazing.
Hmm! I can't remember. For one thing when I'm looking for a series to read I'll randomly open pages, usually in 4 spots - splitting the book up. Once I was interested, I opened up the 2nd, 3rd and 4th books and did the same... I liked Moiraine's character! That's the best I can do lol
I usually appreciate the world building at the start of novels that are a bit slow (or cryptic). Trying to figuring out the settings, put the small pieces together in some kind of picture, then soon or later the "action" will start.
More than the "hero's journey" genre i think that i appreciate something with a broader concept: the coming of age. When i was a teenager i was reading fantasy books about adventures and so on but i think it was when i started reading some scifi novels in my 20s that i was really hooked by seeing characters going out in the world and growing as a person.
It's not only about saving the world or be the strongest, it's experiencing new worlds and widening your perspective on things, making choices you'd not do if had stayed in your own "microcosm". Approach people different from you and find a "chemistry" for any reason (survival, common goal, etc).
Sometimes the characters go back to their own home, appreciating what they had and live with a different mindset.. other times they are projected to the future (even society wise) in other journeys that involve something bigger.
Rand dragging his father through the forest probably was it for me. This was in the mid 90s though and I was a young boy who hadn't touched any fantasy at that time (except Narnia and possibly Prydain). It was very exciting to read.
lol, I wrote this comment before you mentioend Prydain. What are the odds? I almost never hear anyone talking about Lloyd Alexander's work.
@@thehoogard Sounds like it's a series I need to read...
The prologue. I was harpooned by that prologue for the wheel of time.
i also remember struggling with the prologue my first time around as well. Took me three tries to through it. I think i was hooked somewhere in chapter 2 as well.
When the Trollocs kicked in Tam and Rand's door. That was when I was hooked.
I read The Eye of the World in 1891 when I was a kid. I remember the prologue is a little slow at first but I think it gets better as it goes creating the mountain was awesome and it was tragic. I think I really started to get hooked when Rand saw the dark figure in the road. I loved the rich way it is written and I was not jaded so it was very special and it grabbed my imagination. 🥰
Woah... you're a time traveler?!?
I was hooked when they met Tom, and then went across the river on the ferry and evaded the Trollocs. And Moraine sank it.
I got caught when Rand saw Egwene and his inner dialogue started going over all the things that was making him nervous about her and the rest of the women in the town. (Especially the amusement she held as she watched him.)
I read this book for the first time back in the 90s. If I remember correctly, I was curious about the Prologue, but it was confusing. I think I got really interested when Rand saw the black rider.
I notice you’re getting some pretty negative comments about the show. If you go in expecting a faithful adaptation of Book 1, you will be disappointed. But as someone who has read the books many times over the last 30 years, I feel that the show caught most of the major beats of the first book while also doing world building for the series. To me, the show catches the personalities of the characters well which makes me want to continue watching.
Actually, I was pretty hooked from the meeting with Siuan and Morraine in book two. But mine was a strange approach to the series. I saw that book three had come out, so I looked for book one in my local bookstore. (Yes, this was before Amazon). So I bought book two with the plan of reading it first and then going back to book one, which I did.
I read book three, The Dragon Reborn, first. On county time. I do not remember the order I read them in I think 2 was next. I am not sure what hooked me first as far as a specific moment. Lan, Moraine and Perrin stood out.
I really liked the part where Perrin was aware he was a wolf brother but very new to it and uncomfortable with it. That is probably the thing that hooked me.
I also liked how little time we spent with Rand who was obviously the guy on the cover. He was a mysterious MC / hero for me. I say Nynaeve or Mat are favorite characters but in all reality Rand is by far my favorite character in the books. His arc is incredible.
The moment that got to me was in the Great Hunt
Ingtar's last moment and interaction with Rand was such a subdued and powerful scene. Jordan could have easily wrote a scene where rand's shouts at Ingtar but when it dawns on him what Ingtar was saying, he gives him the rites before leaving him behind.
I'm sure the show will find some way to ruin this beautiful moment
I just finished the first book last night. Sadly (?) I watched the streaming series first (which I loved), so my approach to the book was REALLY biased. I love them both, and I'm starting this video series of yours to get another perspective on what changed and might have missed or brushed aside.
Great approach! I really think this will be the best way for people to be able to enjoy both. Sadly, I started finding so many flaws and inconsistencies in the show on its own, not even comparing it to the book, it started getting hard to ignore them or forgive them. But I always truly to be fair. My next S2 review (not yet recorded) is actually probably one of my more positive reviews in the whole series).
For me, I was already used to forcing myself through novels and I had been so hyped up for what the later books of the Wheel of Time held so I forced my way through the first one but I got hooked by it. It was at first at the start, the prologue, but I was then bored after that but I was dragged back to care about the characters when they are introduced to Min, a character who could somewhat see a persons future. I adored how that was implemented and I was really intrigued by how abilities relating to The Pattern could manifest (Ta'veren being the biggest)
After reading most of the books I went back to the first and then I was hooked all the way through from beginning to end.
Min is an outstanding character throughout the series.
Thank you for mentioning some
Books you liked. I’ve been struggling to find another series and I will need to check these out. I have read the king killer chronicles but not the other two.
I’m 43 now. I think I first read the wheel of time when I was 16 or 17. So it is hard for me to recall at what point I got hooked. Hooked I got. When I got married I gave my grooms men Seords based off of the heron marked blades kn the book. Not the shows silly katanas. Haha. Anyways I’m on a tnagent. Knowing what peaked my teenage kings interest I suspect I really got hooked when Rand and his dad were attacked at there home by the Trolocs and Rand had to save his dad
But I don’t really know for sure.
you brought up the prydain chronicles. that's a subscribe from me.
The part where I got hooked was when Moiraine tells the villagers the song of Manetheren. Another moment shortly after was when Moiraine sunk the man’s boat (?) after they crossed it so that the army wouldn’t cross it, too. Moiraine was such an obviously complex character right off the bat, and that was what hooked me.
i don't remember what point. but i remember telling all my friends to get at least 100 pages into it before deciding if they liked it or not. I read this for the first time around 23 or so years ago.
For me it was when Rand is dragging his dad down the road in the woods and the fade seems to be following.
I think the prologue should be like Tolkiens appendices at the end.
I can't stop looking at The Book of Three in the background.......when will we get a faithful movie based on Prydain?!
I doubt we will ever see one. The stories are, on the surface, simplistic. The depth and honesty of the earlier subject matter would be difficult to present to most audiences without making it rather "kiddish".... and the latter subject matter would be too dark to present as something for kids. Unless you get a cast and producers who are willing to be very experimental and come back to shoot only once every two or three years, and do each book as a stage of life... child, young adolescent, older adolescent, very young adult (Taran Wanderer), young adult.... I just cant see anyone doing it right.
If I was a billionaire, that's how I would do it. It would be a rather experimental series, where you literally start with a 12 year-old, and end up with a 23 year-old. But there would be elements of darkness and child-like innocence throughout.
I picked up "The Eye of the World" at a PX (post exchange) back in 1990 at Fort Benning, GA, while I was waiting for my basic training cycle to start. The prologue certainly interested me, but Rand seeing the Fade on the road to Emond's Field and then later Winternight itself absolutely hooked me. It might have been because Rand and I were sort of the same age and I suppose someone could say I was starting my own mini-adventure with the Army, but I finished the book in near record time, then ended up re-reading it immediately after graduating and going on leave before I reported to Germany ... I even took it AND "The Great Hunt" with me to Saudi Arabia for Desert Shield where I read them multiple times...
Air Force?
@@gilian2587 Nah. Army.
@@philnorfleet1371 What was your role, if I can ask? Technician, Radar, Medical, or other?
@@gilian2587Other. My MOS was 11M (which no longer exists) or "Mechanized Infantryman" which mean I was a rifleman who would ride in the back of a M2 Bradley and then ostensibly get out and do infantry stuff. So I just sat in the back during Desert Storm, even when the Bradley was engaging Iraqi vehicles. Man, that was a long time ago...
Love the way you put into words what I was thinking first reading the first book of this series. (Nonserious) Spoiler Alert: Ended up loving it. Agree with the critiques of the beginning of the books.
I think i was really hooked after the Trollocs attacked Rand's house, and he was dragging his 'father' through the woods and his 'father' was mumbling stuff. I just thought that was a really interesting bit of character growth and i don't remember having read anything quite like it before. I remember it really well so i think that's the part that really got me
That's a good spot. The Trolloc attack was so gripping. Then to have that suggestion of a reveal. Chefs kiss.
I became hooked in the story in the transition from the prolog ans chapter 1. The hook was what happened to this world?
The first hook for me was winternight with Rand and Tam trying to get to safety. The big hook though was Moraine shaming villagers with tale of Manetheren. Good luck with series. I don't ever recommend the series anymore because I think it takes about 3 rereads of first 6 books or so before a reader can really appreciate the story. Having all books available almost worsens the experience . It is just too much for most readers. I also think the series on initial read is tough on audiobook because of Jordans writing style. The little bits of foreshadowing and description that will pay off later just seems like droning initially.
I personally love the audio books, I can't sit and read consistently enough but my job happens to be so mindless I can listen to audio books all day. Maybe because of that I was able to get through them within a few months so it was all still fresh when I finished and I felt satisfied.
I think i got hooked to the books at chapter 5. If i remember correct that's when things start to happen.
When I read in the books about Perrin's wife. That's when I was hooked...
You mentioned two prologues. The Ravens prologue wasn’t in the original book. It was added maybe 10 years later when the publisher split the first novel into two parts for marketing for children.
For me it was the part where Rand and his dad went back home and then got attacked.
Got a good mix of high stakes in monster creatures. Mystery in what do the creatures want, and what kind of intelligence guides them. And some drama with Rand finding out that he might be adopted.
I think that was the point where I really couldn't stop. Excellent tension!
Im currently on Book 4 of the Wheel of Time series
I was hooked with the cloaked figure and finding out that Matt and Perrin also saw him. 😂
That's a reasonable moment to get hooked. I was surprised at myself for sorta shrugging at it. That's why I made this video. Realizing I got hooked at an unexpected point.
For my part; I like to read a lot of science fiction, which tends to focus on abstract concepts, mechanics, setting and world building. In science fiction, this is often developed to the detriment of fundamental character development. In the Eye of the World, it was the opening idea that Lews Therin Telamon destroyed the world and that he would come back again, he would likely save the world or potentially destroy it again. It played with a lot of Eastern ideas of reincarnation, quasi-religious ideas of the beginning and the end. And the idea that the fate of Lews Therin's family came in a fit of madness at his hands was quite sad; it made a deep impression on my young, at the time, fourteen year old mind.
As an example of the kind of science fiction I have enjoyed in the past -- Isaac Asimov's Foundation series had fascinating ideas involving the process of the rise and fall of civilization -- unfortunately, his character building leaves much to be desired; based on your description of what hooked you in the Wheel of Time -- the characters and their connections, I am pretty sure you would hate Asimov's Foundation series. A lot of what is described as 'hard' science fiction novels have barely functional character development; instead, they focus far more heavily on world building, setting development, description of the mechanics of futuristic technology, often characters are merely an afterthought. You'll see a lot of this in Michael Crichton's writing, as well; he focuses on scientific theory and it's implications on society far more heavily than on character development; as an example, Jurassic Park spends a great deal of time discussing the mechanics of differential equations, population models and the emergence of chaos in complex systems -- the book is completely different from Steven Spielberg's film. Spielberg's film was an outstanding adaption, and simultaneously, an extremely unfaithful adaptation of it's source material.
Based on what you've described in this video -- I believe that I could heartily recommend David and Leigh Eddings' Belgeriad and Malloreon series, I suspect you would like them. These books are *heavily* character driven; the setting and the plot are somewhat derivative if you've read many other Hero's Journeys before, however, the characters are very well developed; and I found that you, as the reader, will probably grow pretty attached to them pretty quickly. You care about the main characters because they all extremely likeable.
I've seen a lot of praise for the prologue, but it just made me feel... I was going to say, like it was leaving me behind, but I was never with it in the first place. More like I got dropped into a race halfway through and was trying to catch up to everyone else.
Intrigue is good, but too much intrigue loses people. Where that line is will vary from person to person though. Well, I think it's more of a gradient than a line, actually. The prologue didn't completely lose me, I could see the other racers ahead of me the whole time (very far ahead), but I didn't see what the hype was about.
I would tell you where it does hook me, but I've barely started the book, and I havent reached that point yet.
I’ll be honest. An ex girlfriend bought The Eye of The World for me as a random gift because she figured I’d like it. I read 2 pages and put it on the shelf. 5 years later I picked it up and decided to give it a serious try and was hooked by the end of the prologue.
I agree that, of course, I knew fantastical happenings were to be expected. Still, the cloak that didn't blow in the wind was when I first perked up. I figured "something's about to happen!" ...and then yes, Moiraine's arrival and her talk with Lan about prophecy were when the story felt like it was first gathering momentum. I think the reason is because, even if it's too early for us to understand the prophecy, I still knew that it was some kind of blueprint or auger for what the story would hold, and it was worthy of attention.
I stuck with the audiobooks myself, for this one, but I've done my best with the spelling. ;)
People used to "poo-poo" audiobooking, but it seems to be more acceptable these days. Back in college, I was reading several hours a day, and writing. The last thing I wanted to do to unwind was read more. That was when i got into audiobooks. In the end, I sometimes used audiobooks for school, and sometimes for pleasure. It was nice to be able to get two things done at the same time, which I could never do when I had to sit and read a physical book.
Yeah, I don't know what it is about me and getting hooked on stories. Takes me longer than most folks, I think. Might be because when analyzing stories is your job, your taste in story beats is a little wonky.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS My adoption-in-earnest of audiobooks happened when I had discovered The Blade Itself (Joe Abercrombie), just in time for a cross-country move from GA to WA. Switching to audio seemed like the perfect call for all those hours on the road.
And you know? I haven't looked back; I now prefer audiobooks for fantasy stories. A talented narrator can add greatly to the tale, and -- as you say -- audiobooks allow me to chop veggies or fold laundry or go walkabout. [I feel torn, though, on those occasions when I think the narrator just doesn't measure up.]
@@dant7677 So true. All that you say.
I have listened to enough audio books that I've sought books I wouldn't normally read, because they were narrated by a favovorite narrator (Ian McKellan). I've also found myself enjoying certain books of lower caliber because the narrator did such a bangin job (The Iron Druid Chronicles).
For me i think it was when teh trolloc attacked Rand and Tam's farm house. My mom got like a third of the way thru the first book and was not hooked. On my later rereads tho, as i've gotten older. I was 17ish when Winter's Heart came out, now i've gotten older i've identified a lot more with Thom so i get why you are so intrigued by Morraine, and i didn't disagree with the showrunners making her more the main character in the first season.
I am wondering about your opinion on listening to audiobooks versus reading a book. I mean something specific here and that is first impressions. My current opinion is that reading a book provides a more individual, personal experience. In audiobooks, the narrators decide the tempo of the action and how people sound, which I find influences my impressions of the story, whereas when reading a book myself, its my mind that decides these things.
Sadly, I can't remember when I got hooked because I read the first book in 1995. If only I'd known it would become my favourite series! I'll give it some thought in regards to other books and series...
If i had more time to sit and read, I would. I also sit and read for a living, so it's not really what i want to do in my spare time. But I love storytelling. I think it's fine if you are word-conscious. I agree that an audiobook can make or break a good experience with a book, but I'm so analytical about syntax and composition, I actually edit the books as I'm listening to them, sometimes. That being said, you are still right about the audiobook experience being heavily influenced by the performance.
The Chronicles of Prydain was my second favorite book as a child. Pigkeeper is a noble title.
🥰 This book series is one that I re-read every few years.
It really hammers home that the simple life is honorable and worthy of respect.
my brother was a super fan and pressured me to read it but i didnt really love it till shadows rising but i like books 1-3 more now than i did the first time
The moment that hooked me was after Rand got back to Emond's field and he had to get Moiraine's help. He thought he was making a deal with the devil and she says the actual devil of their world is after him and I really wanted to know why and where it would lead
Oh! That's a good hook! I forgot all about that!
I unfortunately read the Prologue to Book 2 first, as I "won" The Great Hunt at a White Elephant Party just before Christmas Break my Fres4year in college 1994. At O'Hare airport I found a display for The Shadow Rising on hard cover and also had books 1-3 in Trade Paperback, so I purchased Books 1 & 3. I was 3 hours early for my flight and read Book 1 and had to board just as Nynaeve found Moiraine and Lan outside of Shadar Logoth. By the time my plane landed in Atlanta for a change of plans I had finished the Eye of the World and reread the Prologue to The Great Hunt. I asked for The Shadow Rising and The Fires of Heaven for Christmas, sadly I received The Fires of Heaven and had to purchase The Shadow Rising.
I love that you recall all the details of how you got into the series. 😁 And dang! You read quickly.
WoT is my favorite book series - I have read most of the novels at least a dozen times. I think I was hooked when we first observe Moiraine channeling (I love magic systems) and then doubly so when the party gets split up and we begin getting multiple POVs (variety is the spice of life).
Since you plan to compare & contrast with s1 of the tv adaptation and other video commenters have made negative remarks on the tv adaptation, I am going to offer a few comments below on why I think some people report being dissatisfied while I have a more favorable outlook on the tv adaptation. However, I will make sure to avoid in-book plot spoilers since you and others here may be new readers. However, I do provide high-level comments on the emphasis Robert Jordan places on certain subjects in his writing (e.g., role of women, Rand relative to other characters, the nature of time and whether it’s cyclical in WoT), which might be considered spoiler-y by those with a strict interpretation of the concept.
In contrast to some of your other commentors, I think s1 of the tv adaptation was solid/okay and I’m excited for future seasons (it’s already renewed thru s3). There is certainly room for improvement, but WoT (and tEotW in particular) possess many features that are difficult to adapt to tv, few stories hit their stride in their first outing (e.g., tEotW is not most WoT fans’ favorite book), and the production faced many challenges (COVID, actor departures and limited availability, studio notes, etc.).
My mildly positive assessment is shared by the majority of TV critics, WoT content creators (which includes other similarly hard-core fans who have been attached to the series for decades and held leadership roles with the WoT-focused fansites and convention), and Brandon Sanderson (the author picked by Robert Jordan’s editor/widow to finish the series after RJ’s passing). WoT was Prime Video’s most successful original series launch as of that point in time, with ratings suggesting that millions of non-book readers around the world started and finished the season. The tv adaptation’s commercial success has prompted a resurgence in book sales, which by itself should be considered a win even among those book fans who do not personally enjoy the tv adaptation.
One reason some book fans express for disliking the tv series is that it is not a 1:1 adaptation. A 1:1 adaptation of WoT seems both impractical for the medium of “television” and also inadvisable. A few examples as to why (some of them previously highlighted by Brandon Sanderson):
The number of books, words, characters, locations, and production studio-dictated condensing rate (book words -> tv minutes) for WoT exceeds that of commonly-cited peer series (LoTR, GoT, etc.).
The type of story told in WoT books varies considerably from books 1-3 (Tolkein-esque quest fantasy), books 4-6 (worldbuilding, political intrigue epic), books 7-10/prequel (really expand the universe, shine the spotlight on different characters and stories), and books 11-14 (return to wrapping up the main story).
RJ wrote all of the early books as potentially having a definitive end to the series (since he didn’t know whether he would get the opportunity to publish more books), which creates some narrative repetition. Later, he arguably struggled to balance story arc plotting across several books (creating what is known as “the slog” by some readers).
There are inconsistencies between the worldbuilding and metaphysics in the early books (particularly tEotW) versus the rest of the series.
Major characters largely disappear for books at a time (not viable for tv shows with actors, contracts, availability, etc.). While Rand accounts for 80% of tEotW’s POV word count, he only accounts for 2% or less of books 3, 10, and 13 (and only 21% of the series as a whole, as it becomes a story where Rand is merely #1 in an ensemble).
RJ had enormous strengths as a writer, but also some generally agreed-upon weaknesses (e.g., romance).
Yes, S1 makes MANY changes relative to tEotW (though less if you account for the fact that the tv series is adapting WoT as a whole - s1 is heavily informed by setting up tv audiences for the plot and focus of later books). The tv adaptation certainly could have been made with fewer changes to the books. By the end of s1, I feel that some of the changes were bad (in conception and/or in execution), others an improvement, and the status of others ambivalent or TBD (depends on what happens in s2 or later). However, even for those changes I strongly dislike or feel don’t work, I can almost always see the reasoning behind the changes the tv adaptation makes.
At the same time, the show gave me many elements directly from the books, made improvements upon the books in areas, provided me with the first opportunity to speculate about WoT in nearly a decade (what will happen next in the tv adaptation?), allowed me to talk about and enjoy WoT with people who would never read a fantasy 14+ book series, prompted many people to read the books for the first time, and is still telling the same general story as the books (this particular set of heroes’ journeys).
I have chosen to focus on the positive of the tv adaptation, rather than the negative, even if it felt like a kick in the stomach the first time I watched each episode because there were so many book->tv changes. Like many book fans (including Brandon Sanderson), I think of the tv adaptation as a different telling of the cyclical WoT story that was originally presented in the books. This interpretation of the tv adaptation is reasonable under WoT metaphysics. The existence of a new telling of the story in tv form does not take anything away from the original books and their telling of the story.
Finally, in case you are not aware of this backstory, I will flag another reason why some people go out of their way to comment negatively about the tv adaptation whenever and wherever possible, even two years after its release, rather than just accept the idea that the adaptation didn’t work for them (but has worked for other hardcore book fans) and move on to focusing on things that bring them joy rather than angst. A small but very vocal group of people who call themselves book fans (although their comments often reveal a rather weak familiarity with the series) see the tv adaptation as a front in the culture wars around issues related to race, gender, and sexuality.
They object to people of color being cast in many of the major roles (even though the tv casting largely does not break book canon and RJ rarely emphasized race in his worldbuilding in favor of other possible contrasting dimensions like culture, ideology, or clothing).
They also object to the prominence and storytelling beats of female characters relative to male characters in s1 of the tv adaptation (even though female characters have enormously significant roles in the overall book series, women account for a majority of POV words in a majority of the books, and the world in the books is more of a matriarchal society rather than patriarchal society).
Likewise, they object to same-sex romances being put in the foreground of the tv adaptation, rather than being relegated to the subtle, indirect references Robert Jordan made when writing his books for a mainstream fantasy audience in the 80s-00s.
The challenges and negative emotions some of these so-called book readers experience with ongoing real-world cultural changes, in which many of them identify as cis-white-heterosexual-men who feel like they are losing their privileged status when other types of people receive attention and advancement in society, helps me understand why these individuals continue to irrationally engage with a subject (the WoT tv adaptation) when they otherwise claim that it brings them so much distress. Their behavior strikes me as unhealthy, but I understand that it is often easier for people in pain to lash out rather than address their own personal demons.
Wow! Lots of great notes, here.
Hopefully I can give a fair review of this adaptation. I judge storytelling. When it comes to adaptations, I just compare and give my opinion on which was better. And I'll sometimes throw my personal likes or dislikes.
As a developmental editor, it's my job to help writers figure out the best story for their intended audience. On this channel, I only look at political and social issues as storytelling elements. But I will definitely mention where major deviations from source material are made, or where I'm seeing overused tropes, or where it seems that changes have been made for political/social reasons at the cost of being an adaptation that stays true to characters and plot and world. If something small is done for improvement, that's one thing. If something is done that makes a character less objectively likable (by editor character likability measures) its never a good idea.
Anyway, I'm replying from my cellphone, with my squirming 2 month old niece in one arm. Haha. I'll try to respond mire to some of your other points. But I think, in the end, I'll have to see what the show does before I am confident in my opinion of it. 😅
For me I really got into the books when we got Matts pov. What really put me off for the longest time was all the female casts pov especially eleyne's pov. Heck I was skipping most of the chapters that had female characters pov.
But after that long journey the last three books were really worth it.
not sure what initial point hooked me. read it way too long ago on first reading. although i know it was book one as i never had issues completing it first time through.
Honestly, for me it was when Rand and Matt were on the road to Caemlyn and Matt started to psychologically fall apart. That was the point when The Eye of the World started to become something more than a cheap copy of the Fellowship of the Ring. It was when Robert Jordan started to find his voice.
(maybe spoilers) It wouldn't qualify as a hook, but Caemlyn and specifically the whole procession with the climbing, the princess, and the false dragon (and then audience). That's when, for me, it felt like the wider world had hit us (and Rand).
Rand's journey to get Tam back to the village.
😳 Spoiler!
For me it was Rand seeing the Fade
it was the prologue for me, and you will not understand the whole prologue until near the end of the series.
I'm glad you are getting into Wheel of Time, but sadly I thought the show was as bad as shows like Rings of Power when it came to the writing and to being faithful to the source material. What other fantasy book series are you a fan of?
I have heard the show was not great. I'm not exactly looking forward to viewing it, but I'll try to be as fair as possible (I already have complaints about the trailer for Season 1, though, so it's not looking good).
Oh gosh! I have a few. Harry Potter was the starter, for me, as it was for most (still love the books). Lord of the Rings, The Kingkiller (please finish it, Pat!), Lady Trent Memoirs was a surprising hit with me, Gentlemen Bastards (although I have to read the last book, still... this is the case with a few of my series favorites. I like to make them last). Mistborn (gotta read more Sanderson. I keep starting Stormlight and never finishing [must have listened to the first half of book 1 a half a dozen times). Chronicles of Prydain. The Sharing Knife. I'm dying to get to Malazan. The Chronicles of Ancient Darkness (I audio book this one with Ian McKellan, and I'm convinced he is the greatest audiobook narrator I've ever heard. I've never had a narrator legitimately whisper certain descriptions because the moment was still and tense). The World of Howl (especially books 1 and 2, which I re-read almost every other year). Darkwater Legacy (really enjoyed the first two books, and can't wait for the third). Farseer was a bit boring for me (mainly because the protagonist was so... ugh) but I still enjoyed it. I need to finish the final book, and I know that there's another trilogy in this world that I'm told I will like better. Oh! I can't forget The Old Kingdom series (I audiobook the first three in the series... Tim Curry! One of my top narrators ever!) First Law book 1 was good, and I realyl want to finish that series....
Sheesh! I've given so many and I'm not even halfway through. There's a ton on my TBR, also. I plan to shorten the length of my videos, so hopefully that means I'll have more time to read new stuff.
Upon reflection, I think I get hooked when I reach the point where I understand enough about the world to know how any disturbance in the norm would affect the MC. A death or a loss. A strange occurrence. That moment where something is off is a part of it, but I also like to know WHY it’s off from the characters perspective. Take LOTR for example. War against Mordor is an everyday thing for Boromir. But not to Frodo. Tolkien (I feel) started in the Shire for a reason. That became a baseline for the innocence/ignorance of the character. But if we knew Boromir first (my favorite character btw) then when he meets the hobbits they might seem trivial and pathetic.
That's a great observation. Yeah, I think part of the appeal is also seeing how the big outer world affects an innocent who has grown up otherwise untouched by it.
For me, the big moment in LOTR is when the Hobbits hde from the black rider. Whi h happens almost 100 pages in. Lol. But I'm so much enjoying the language and quaint loves of the Hobbits up to that point, that I'm totally relaxed and enjoying the journey up until then.
It was all pretty standard for me; read so much fantasy.... so it was actually in the inn with SPOILER showing up which really pulled me in.
Due to being on holiday at the time I read the first two books... and reread them directly after and I was sooo invested then *sooo* much foreshadowing and character moments that made the second time I read the first two books BETTER than the first time.
A lot of the TV show references more stuff that happens later in the book series. Book1 is Rand's story.... the book series as a whole is not... and neither is the show.
I was hooked because I read the glossary. Really!
Haha! That's a new one.
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS Lets just say the author is great at world building !
There's some weaknesses and other (many) strengths you may also notice as you progress. :)
@@kuahyeow I can relate -- I am also easily impressed with solid worldbuilding.
I loved the Wheel of Time series at first, but as the books went on, I grew to really dislike Rand. I expect a flawed protagonist, but he became more than flawed to me. It will be interesting to see how you view him by the end. As to when I was hooked, it was when Moiran (sp?) couldn't tell which of the three was the chosen one.
I think it's pretty normal for Rand to be least liked of the EF5 among the fandom.
First three books; my favorite characters were Loial and Perrin. It eventually got to the point that I hated reading Perrin's POV.
I am not sure when I got hooked with the WoT. After all, I decided I was going to read it and I *never* give up on a book once I start ... ... ... okay, that's a lie, The Stone and the Flute defeated me :blush:
It's been decades since I first read it so I probably won't be able to recall that 'moment' when I was invested in the story. I do recall a gradual settling in to the tale tho', especially as the characters starting doing things I actively disagreed with and, from the safety of my armchair, considered un-heroic. I came across a quote from Robert Jordan recently that gave me a feeling of insight into those 'Not in the Heroic Mould' moments. His time in Vietnam saw our intelligent and eloquent author doing things that he likely could never have imagined and they changed him. It's a big chunk of text for a UA-cam comment so I shall perhaps have to break it up over more than one ...
"I had two nicknames in ‘Nam. First up was Ganesha, after the Hindu god called the Remover of Obstacles. He’s the one with the elephant head. That one stuck with me, but I gained another that I didn’t like so much. The Iceman. One day, we had what the Aussies called a bit of a brass-up. Just our ship alone, but we caught an NVA battalion crossing a river, and wonder of wonders, we got permission to fire before they finished.
The gunner had a round explode in the chamber, jamming his 60, and the fool had left his barrel bag, with spares, back in the revetment. So while he was frantically rummaging under my seat for my barrel bag, it was over to me, young and crazy, standing on the skid, singing something by the Stones at the of my lungs with the mike keyed so the others could listen in, and Lord, Lord, I rode that 60. 3000 rounds, an empty ammo box, and a smoking barrel that I had burned out because I didn’t want to take the time to change.
We got ordered out right after I went dry, so the artillery could open up, and of course, the arty took credit for every body recovered, but we could count how many bodies were floating in the river when we pulled out. The next day in the orderly room an officer with a literary bent announced my entrance with “Behold, the Iceman cometh.” For those of you unfamiliar with Eugene O’Neil, the Iceman was Death. I hated that name, but I couldn’t shake it. And, to tell you the truth, by that time maybe it fit.
I have, or used to have, a photo of a young man sitting on a log eating C-rations with a pair of chopsticks. There are three dead NVA laid out in a line just beside him. He didn’t kill them. He didn’t choose to sit there because of the bodies. It was just the most convenient place to sit. The bodies don’t bother him. He doesn’t care. They’re just part of the landscape. The young man is glancing at the camera, and you know in one look that you aren’t going to take this guy home to meet your parents.
Back in the world, you wouldn’t want him in your neighbourhood, because he is cold, cold, cold. I strangled that SOB, drove a stake through his heart, and buried him face down under a crossroad outside Saigon before coming home, because I knew that guy wasn’t made to survive in a civilian environment. I think he’s gone. All of him. I hope so. I much prefer being remembered as Ganesha, the Remover of Obstacles."
Uncle Tom's Cabin and A Tale of Two Cities are two of the most powerful soporifics that I've ever come across.
I started reading eye of the world in 2000 and, after several attempts finished it late 2002. By 2004, I had read all the way up to book 10 and had to start waiting for the new books to be released. I always remembered the story of the road with the creepy guy behind them. By the time I finished Memory of Light, I had completely forgotten about the prologue. In fact, when I heard they will do a show, I found winter dragon on UA-cam, which is basically a very bad show version of the prologue. I had no Idea, what I was watching. Only when I decided to listen to the audiobooks as a reminder of the series, I figured out, that this prologue existed, and that winter dragon was actually somehow related to the books. 😂
Long story short, I was hooked in the first chapter. And the next thing I remembered well over the years was three stupid boys going on a treasure hunt in a creepy city...
Wait... there's another show version of this series???!!!! I must watch, now!
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS There is a very bad 20 minutes clip that was only made to keep the rights to filming the series. It basically covers the prologue. It's quite fun to watch, if you know what you are getting into.
There is also a pretty decent fan-film of one chapter (Four Kings). Great to watch!
@@Nathius_16 lol. If I forget at the end of Season 1, remind me to go watch this. I'm so curious.
The prologue gets more detailed in book 2 or 3 will get definitive drops of what happened. Book 4 you will get to one of the best chapters in the series.
More generally, I get hooked either by the language (right off the bat) or when the characters start interacting.
You know, in all 37,456 years I've been hearing people rave about The Name of the Wind, I've never heard someone summarize it. It's always just "it's so great, you HAVE TO read it." Since I wasn't hooked by the language, I have again and again come to the conclusion that those people are crazy, and have given up before page 100.
Haha. The story is about a boy who grew up with the Edema Ruh (gypsies). He proves to be unusually gifted in learning new things. Eventually he goes off to University to earn more things, where he makes friends and enemies, and his greatest struggles are figuring out how to pay his tuition.
Outside of all that, something big is stirring. The Chandrian, like seven angels of destruction, are in the shadows, working their mysterious purposes. Kvothe finds himself a victim of their machinations, and decides he will take revenge on them all. But to most, the Chandrian are only myth. So, where to start?
That's the best I can do. The reader is gi en very subtle clues throughout the two books about whats going on that might be related to the Chandrian (when i say subtle, I mean like the color of a passing butterfly is a clue... in book 2, this actually happens). The bigger plot of the book is unique, in that it doesn't make much progress. But there are many mini plots in-between that manage to have a good deal of tension. Amazingly, Kvothe just trying to get a teacher to agree to let him enroll in a class can be the most important goal for several chapters, but it's written like this is do or die (or get kicked into the streets, anyway, but Kvothe is desperate at these points.)
I would say that the insighting incident doesn't happen until chapter 16, and Kvothe doesn't start off on his mission until chapter 30.
Hopefully, that helped you get a better idea of what it's about. But I could also argue that this is only half the plot, because there's SOMETHING going on with Bast.
I tried reading EotW about twenty years ago and also found the prologue boring. I got a third of the way through and did not finish, whereas I normally at least skim to the end.
It's been so long since I read WoT for the first time, but I do remember that I didn't care for The Eye of the World so much.
I read it because I'd read all the books I had with me and my NCO (I was in the Army at the time) gave it to me to read (he was reading Forrest Gump laughing his butt off). Well not that I didn't like it, it just didn't seem anything special to me. I'm not really a fan of fantasy tbh. I did read The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings when I was like 10 or 11 and it was good at the time. I tried Faust and some others in the 90s but I just couldn't get into it.
I'm not even sure why I picked up The Great Hunt, but I know it was in this book when I knew it was special. It was the "Flicker" chapter (don't really think that's a spoiler) and then the end of the book ("or a woman" part). Trying really hard to be vague enough for non-readers...
Needless to say, I've read the entirety of the series maybe 10ish times but only the last three books 4 times. Finishing the series was... sad. I don't know how else to put it, I'd never been immersed into a world like this before. I actually loved the characters, hated the villains and finishing the series, and knowing there will never be anymore, just hurt lol
probably when Tam speaks in the fever dream ....
That's a great moment. I didn't even think about it, but that's a moment similar to my hook moment in The Ember Blade. I think when the trollocks attack the farm (which happens before Tam's fever dream) was the point at which I couldn't listen fast enough. Haha. So maybe that's why Tam's fever dream didn't feel as sharp a hook.... because I was already at the maximum level of being hooked. 😋
@@TheSwordAndThePenREFLECTIONS as you said, the hook is the introduction of a mystery. Rand's heritage is the first mystery that is significantly different from the LOTR storyline. So, i sort of remember thinking at that point that there might be more to it. And that made me curious. I was pretty sceptical when starting reading, because of the awful book covers and such. I basically expected a long, drawn out collection of fantasy tropes written in an outdated style. Which is not false. But it also gave me the most amazing group of imaginary friends offering continuous, reinterpretable life lessons.