A RARE Charlie Patton 78rpm disc found IN THE WILD!!!!
Вставка
- Опубліковано 10 лют 2023
- A rare (and valuable) Charlie Patton disc has turned up at an estate sale in South Carolina. This is the story behind what might be the biggest "in the wild" find I am ever part of.
Keep digging for records. They are still out there!
Charlie Patton wrote a song about my grandfather called the Tom Rushen Blues. He would give him rides to different honks while my grandfather emptied his juke boxes which had 78's. I still have a box of them. They are really fragile. Anyway, good site. Glad I stumbled on it. Just Sam
Charlie Patton was a badass. I listen to his music quite often. This is an awesome find!
Hey Mark! You might want to know that very recently I finally scored a copy of "Oh Death" in solid E condition! So, now a nice one does indeed exist!
So there are 4 copies now?
Your going to have to upload it if you haven't already!
Can you upload a video of it?
FANTASTIC!
Please do a careful digital transfer of it.
Treat that precious disk right, though!
I still collect 78rpm records after 50 years of buying records. Some of them from the '30s thru the '50s have absolutely sound quality, even better than a vinyl version of the same song. I've always loved records.
The fact that these things still turn up in random places is so great. When Son House's "Clarksdale Moan" was found a few years back my wig was split wide open. Amazing
I wonder if they want to trade? Lol I prefer Son House to Charlie Patton. Don't tell anyone.
Me too
Incredible! A great reminder to keep crate digging.
I am truly jealous.... I see why that is considered a sin and poison for the soul.... To find a Charley Patton in the wild is incredible.... Wow.
Lord only knows what I looked over when I started getting into 78's in the early 1980's. I went through many, many thousand piled up in dusty old junk shops. I honestly can say though, even after over 40 years of collecting, that even in more recent years I have occasionally come across garage sales with a few crates of 78's and you just NEVER see the rare one's. Almost always '40's pop and/or early-mid '20's very common acoustical recordings. Lately you lucky to even find those!
I don't care about "rarity". If I see a box of old shellacs, I'm going to take the entire box - and have - for anywhere from $5 - $10. Nobody else will appreciate them. I have my own Philco floor console record player with the rather uncommon "beam of light" tonearm that gives a unique sound to these old records, and they make a great pair together. I have no idea if any of the records I have would be rare or not, I just like listening to these old melodies. I just picked up a binder thats crumbling in my hands of Victor Talking Machine and Zon-o-fone records at Goodwill for $10.
The best records to buy at estate sales are the least familiar!
I already have most of the stuff I know I want, so I am happy to take a chance.
I'm glad it wasn't me that found it because I'd have just sold it (delta blues isn't my favourite but I'd have known what it was) I collect 78s, have tens of thousands of them and so this would be like me finding a Berliner or a rare jazz or operatic record. I can imagine the thrill you got all too well Mark, awesome stuff and I hope you keep it for ever!
I have a 10 inch 78 Charlie Patton on Coronet records I found at the bottom of a Victrola my grandfather disassembled to refinish the cabinet on back in the sixties and have somewhere unknown now in my collection of stuff.
I Just Discovered Your Post,
I Thank God that There Are People Out there that Understand the Historic Value of this Music and Whish to Preserve it!
I literally have thousands of 78’s, I buy and just store away. My ultimate plan is to go through them all when I retire in 5 or so years, possibly start an online store.
Great, educational commentary from your growing resource of a channel. Many thanks!
I just found your channel. I've always wanted to find a Charlie Patton 78. I was an itinerant piano tuner since 1977, mostly in the Deep South and Texas. I would knock on doors in the small black communities asking to buy records. (The white folks would call the cops.) I found three Robert Johnsons, a Tommy Johnson and many more but never a Patton 78. I found a Kid Bailey 78 at a New Mexico piano customer's house but she wouldn't sell it. So I called John Tefteller and the customer refused his $2,000 offer also. It was her grandmother's. (I noticed that his is the next comment here.) I haven't given up about finding that Patton 78. In fact, I'm on the road in the Texas Panhandle right now. Heckhound on my trail.
I love this channel !!! I love the 78 rpm sound ! Great job !
Amazing find! Congratulations!
Fascinating video!! Thanks for sharing!! 😊😊😊😊
How wonderful and inspiring!
Neat. I love estate sales.........Usually I'm seeking other merchandise, but you can indeed hit some amazing finds that are quite valuable.
Record players are here to stay
My favorite Charley Patton song!
OMG how awesome. My absolute favorite
Have you ever seen the Phonovision test pressings Logie Baird had made in the late 1920s? These discs contained video at 78rpm.
Very cool, I’ve always wished I would find a Charley Patton record.
Holy shit nice find! Incredibly jealous
For "easier to locate" finds, I am still collecting the Jockers Brothers violin-piano pop records which they recorded for Columbia from 1914-1918. These are acoustic records on the A series with either the Black label with the notes, or the regular Blue label for the A-series. Some are 12" 78s (extra playing time) and some are 10". Probably about half are already online but I still seek originals for a reissue project of all their recordings. Also all Al Jockers Dance Orchestra sides on Vocalion. Thanks a lot!!!
One record I've never seen a video of or at least be played on a turntable is "Chick Webb - I Can't Dance (I got ants in my Pants)"
Early 78s are definitely still out there. Cheap bulk deals don’t turn up often… but found about 300 in a bulk deal for $10 last spring. Bought a Victor Victrola VV-4-3 Orthophonic for $75 a month ago and the seller threw in about 40 early 78s still in their original sleeves stored in a 78 hard carrying case that’s never been picked over. Included many patriotic WWI records when the US finally entered the war. The stuff still exists.
Sure, "early 78s are definitely out there." But "early 78s"-and "patriotic WWI records"-are not necessarily synonymous with early BLUES 78s.
Yes but not every collector collects the same thing.
There are 2 records of Willie Brown that are still lost. Hopefully someone will find them someday.
I got a sun 78rpm record for 2 dollars that was a good day
Yes it was!! It's been a long time since I stumbled across any Sun discs in the wild. Which one did you find?
@@MarkAtnip I found boppin the blues by Carl Perkins! The b side is all mama’s children :)
Wow, good find!
That's an awesome story. May I ask where those 78 sleeves you have are from? Cheers
*Nauck's ?
Wow, what a coincidence! I was researching Patton just the other day, I discovered him (and 78 records in general) fairly recently and in a short time he became one of my favourite artists. Could you upload the whole transfer somewhere like mediafire? I could try getting rid of the noise without using crappy tools like ClickRepair that kill the sound. Envious of your find btw, who knows how many of these near-unexistent records are still in the basement of an old shack in Mississippi.
Greetings! Check out the answer I posted above (for michaelelsy) for a slightly deep dive into why I didn't (and can't) post the full track.
Love Charlie Patton
We pick up 78s every chance we get! Obviously they aren't always awesome, but we've come across some fun ones. We've begun sharing some of them (but only ones we're pretty sure that they are in the public domain, which is getting easier to identify the more we learn). One cool one we found and shared a couple years ago was "Boy Scout Bugle Calls" from 1924. The sound quality isn't great, but it was still unique enough that we put it out there. We've got a huge stack we're still sorting through! Still looking for those ultra rare and early Blues! Glad we stumbled across your channel - good info here!
Does that Boy Scout have the custom label with the Scout on it? I have seen one like that somewhere and it seems to me that was the contents.
@@MarkAtnip Hi, yes, it had the "Official Boy Scout Record" label - it's on the channel; we posted it on June 2, 2021. Just wish it were a cleaner sound.
One time I found some 78’s (4 or 5?) which looked like had never been played. They were glossy black with no scratches or gray spots. I didn’t play them to hear if they had any scratches! But that must be fairly rare to find. I think one of the songs is “Manhattan Serenade”.
Finding clean, unscratched discs doesn't happen very often. They sound SO good when played on the right equipment.
@@MarkAtnip Thank you for your input, good to hear!
I have crates full of 78s
As a 33 year old newbie at 78’s I’m glad to be a part of this club. I just found some
Mamie Smith on OKey for $5 a piece
I found a 1928 78 from Benny Morten called Morten stomp for $3 this past Friday, I almost cannot believe I found such a thing at a local flea market(Central Kentucky).I'm not sure who in Mamie Smith is, is she blues?.
I had a mamie smith on 78 but unfortunately I dropped it a while ago😭
@@SCORPION89199 Yes, indeed! Mamie Smith has some really good Vaudeville blues and jazz stuff. More importantly, the popularity of her early recordings convinced the recording industry that blues records recorded by black musicians could be a viable financial endeavor, which is why they are available to modern collectors today. Her recording of Crazy Blues reportedly sold over a million copies and before long, most major labels were issuing "race" records.
A couple years ago I found a Billy Murray for a dollar at a church that I couldn’t find anywhere online.
Timathos Bud your not in it for the music but for the dollar amount its worth.
Anything is possible to find no matter how rare when it comes to 78s. Frankly people don't value shellac records as much as vinyl records. Most people would just throw them away or play em to death on a cheap turntable.
wow!!
''Oh move my pillow, and turn my bed around''- easily rivals Emily Dickenson's ''..horse's heads turned towards Eternity''. In fact, it is an even more concrete and vivid image , IMO. Patton, like Son House, was not ''playing'' (or if he was, he was ''playing for keeps''). No ''hokum'' blues here. I've lived with ''O Death'' since the early 90's, the hisses and pops of the old ''Document'' series don't bother me at all, though I recently heard a much enhanced ''34 Blues'' that makes me think that I should reinvestigate the library before YT become s totally intolerable. One mystery that still remains- the fourth volume of the Document series had a white guy on the ''cover'' of the CD. Does anybody have any idea what the story is on that? Liked and subbed.
Have you used the laser turntable. I understand it plays the opposite side of the groove
I have not, although I am familiar with the IRENE system and its caretakers/operators at Cal Berkley which does something similar to a laser turntable, but with better audio results.
I DO have hardware which allows me to play one groove wall or the other, in addition I can record the left and right groove wall separately and then use that data to nullify noise, I just haven't done it. Laziness abounds.
What is the most sought after ethnic jazz accordion country western swing record?
Got just one, Down the Dirt Road Blues/It won't be Long from Bussard around V. It cost me. Worth it though.
NICE!!!! Consider me jealous. Are Bussard's discs starting to make their way out into the world or did you secure it before he passed?
@@MarkAtnip Well I have a good job but not that kind of bread. We were friends for the past 6 years and I even moved out near him and miss him so much. Imagine his daughter may sell them off I guess once they get a handle of what is there and that could take a while. Man he was good times. Most of the time we would spend a whole day just listening to jazz records. He turned me on to such great stuff.
There are many rare records that are one of a kind
Yes there are, and I generally try and highlight records that are rare, interesting, and fun, but not necessarily well known or valuable. I made an exception in this case.
There are thousands of discs out there that are one of a kind, but it helps to know what to look for.
I recognize the background music in the beginning, an old Japanese blues song.
YES!!!! I was wondering how long it would take before someone recognized it! I have been asked many times about what the theme song was but I wanted to see if anyone could identify it before I posted the information. It's a WONDERFUL blues guitar/vocal piece titled Ame No Blues by Awaya Noriko from Japanese Columbia 29761.
@@MarkAtnip The original 1937 version:
ua-cam.com/video/nuc1R-kwbAk/v-deo.html
@@MarkAtnip A very famous Chinese version recording by Tsai Chin which is the greatest version:
ua-cam.com/video/Iwfdait_rQs/v-deo.html
@@LouisLeeKH That's a great recording! A very nice modern update of the 1937 version.
@@LouisLeeKH @MarkAtnip Thank you everybody for your short deviation. I did not know this before - and now that UNBELIEVABLE 1937 song will for sure be on heavy rotation at my place during the next time. Her voice is so beautiful! Thanks again and all the best from a 78rpm collector from Austria
Straordinaria..eccellenza 2023
Did you find this at the estate sale? Want an amazing find!!!
WHAT WAS THE 78 SHUFFLE RECORD THAT INSPIRED THE BEATLES?
What is the music at the start guitar and piano it's great
It's an obscure piece of Japanese Blues music called Ame No Blues by Awaya Noriko which was pressed by Columbia. I have not located the name of the guitar player. I picked it because it sounds like a Western blues tune, but most blues collectors wouldn't recognize it. : )
@@MarkAtnip it's great could you feature it so I can download it. What a great tune :)
@@MarkAtnip is this it? I love this m.ua-cam.com/video/f52PKMNwRs0/v-deo.html I would love it recorded cleanly rather than played on gramophone
How do people know what to look for
As in
When the music is this old ( majoritarily out of living memory)
who’s desirable ?
Good question, Alex. The answer is complicated, however. There are two versions of "desirable". The first is simply whether or not the person who owns the record or someone else wants a copy because they like the music.
The other version is whether or not collectors are looking for it and people are willing to spend money on it. In this case, there are a LOT of people looking for this disc who are willing to spend a lot of cash on it.
Knowing which recordings are valuable is simply a by-product of going through thousands of records over the years. Being able to spot rare discs in a pile of common ones is an acquired skill. Usually it's the artists that AREN'T popular that have a better chance of being desirable. Most Sinatra, Crosby, etc... records have little value, but Mary Willis and other seemingly dull boring names are quite valuable. It's a sense you develop by listening to a lot of records.
CHARLEY PATTON LIVES
How come it's not out of copyright © by now.
The short answer is because it was published after 1923 and won't become public domain in the USA until January 1, 2034. (95 years from the date the audio was affixed to the format...aka the record... plus 5 years)
The long answer is that while the Music Modernization Act allows for "fair use" of such audio for educational purposes, etc, this disc is so rare (three known copies, including this one) that the youtubes assume that the recording of my copy is actually the re-issue and flags it as a copyright violation of the re-release.
I have encountered people in almost identical circumstances who have been unable to pass the youtube process in spite of the fact they have the only copy of a disc and the re-release was made BY THEM from their copy. Oddly there are other uploads of this song that somehow were not flagged nor taken down. Possibly because they were uploaded before the copyright check became as precise as it currently is.
In any event, I support the rights of copyright holders to protect their work, and this is just a hiccup in the system that prevents records like this from being fully shared.
A (most assuredly unsuccessful) battle with the UA-cams isn't worth the effort.
But clearly, it isn't that precise because it thinks your copy is the re-issue, which it isn't.
But it is still very good I guess, despite that.
Thanks for sharing this great find story.
I collect 78s but live in the UK so unlikely to find any rare blues.
Still, I do get to come across UK stuff, which I also like.
I am not so sure about a "battle with the UA-cams" not being worth the effort: IMO when someone is scamming / impersonating a copyright holder or agency; then taking them to court is imperative. Otherwise they'll just continue scamming via false claims, getting good music (which they do not own) taken down, and enriching themselves via deception.
Several friends in the ragtime community have had such scams attempted on them, for their own versions of public-domain music such as "Maple Leaf Rag".
The big issue is that so much of the YT process is automated, that something can be flagged and maybe removed without a person authorizing it(??!) In this case, some of their videos of themselves and/or friends performing were flagged, and my friends fought back against the flag, contesting the claim. I think generally they won.
As a personal example: One of my better performances, of Scott Joplin's "Peacherine Rag", (my own arrangement, definitely NOT the sheet-music version!) was flagged by a bogus "publishing company", and my younger friend who took the vid of me playing in public and put it up, did not realize about the copyfraud epidemic and did not think to challenge it, so the video was yanked and is probably gone forever (I had not saved a copy). He is apologetic but probably learned something. At least I can still play it and could record it again.
I'd imagine that it would be the moral and ethical thing to find the family that owned this record and fairly compensate them. Some of Charlie's better sellers go for $500+. This record is probably worth several thousand dollars or more in horrible condition. I'd pay them what it's actually worth.
They were given a finder's fee commensurate to the value of the disc.
@@MarkAtnip Good to know.
The 't' in 'often' is silent.
I have never been more humiliated in my entire life. Now I am digging through the OED trying to find out where I went wrong. Is Susie Dent a 78rpm listener?
Depends on the regional accent I think.
Well there is clearly a reason why it is rare… the audio is garbage 😂. What was Brunswick thinking when they released this junk?
Whats so special about one record
I usually try and find records that are "normal" records at first glance and then explain (using history, background, etc...) why the record is fun. This one, however, is recognized by the collecting community as being a significant disc by a legendary performer, as well as being extremely rare, in high demand, and valuable. Thus, it was determined by the collecting community to be special. Not by me.
@@MarkAtnip 500 or 5k?
Please get the mic closer to your mouth, sound a little thin.. And to be honest my hearing aids are not in.
Sounds like most other noisy, not that interesting old black blues records. 'Cept Bessie Smith and Mississippi John Hurt. Good luck hunting and dreaming.
Hurt's recordings are among my favorite recordings in any genera. Bessie Smith recorded so many records that some of them begin to run together, but I like those that are novel and stand out from the others.
@@MarkAtnip Bessie's " Nobody knows you when you're down and out" I have enjoyed for years, especially her humming/singing.
Too many other blues singers are lost in the noise of records played with turned (sideways) needles, ah, poverty...
Charlie Patton was one of the most influential recording artists of the 20th century. He was a huge influence on Howlin' Wolf, Bukka White, Son House, Muddy Waters, and everyone else in Delta blues. Wolf said Patton was his favorite bluesman, and he visited Charlie's grave whenever he was nearby. Charlie Patton was in many ways the first rock star. Listen to his "Pony Blues" and you'll hear what I mean. He was so successful that for a while, he had a car and driver to take him to gigs. For his time and place, that's like having a private jet. People said you could hear Charlie singing from a half mile away without amplification. The guitar tricks he did -- playing it behind his back and between his legs -- were picked up by people like Guitar Slim and passed on to Jimi Hendrix and Stevie Ray Vaughan. His overwhelming gravel voice and go-for-broke gusto on guitar made him the essential blues star in the Delta.
Hope someone uncovers one of the missing Willie Brown records