mmm... I wonder if they would make good stocking stuffers for Christmas. Could there be a business opportunity here? Thinking this through further, JS used the stone with a stovepipe hat. Perhaps a complete translation kit complete with both hat and rock could be a seller.
Believe it or not, some people are making them: www.shapeways.com/product/TG6CPXKWK/mormon-seer-stone The better approach (if you want a real rock) is to look for "iron banded jasper" on e-bay. I got mine for about $20. The ones from Wyoming match pretty well in terms of the stripes.
Believe what you want to about the LDS church... that is your prerogative. But Mormons cannot say with a straight face that the LDS church has been honest about this issue.
+rivenrock Mormons aren't honest about anything. Do you know they tell members not to ask any questions that are skeptical? Prophets say you shouldn't question the church.
Thepillow 360 Do you want the talk? I can find it for you. They say you can only ask questions that don't actually question the church and you can't be skeptical about it. Now what does that tell you? You should ALWAYS be skeptical and NOT believe everything some nut job mormon tells you to believe. I grew up in the cult so I have personal experience. :)
I was a very brief member of the LDS church in the late 90s. I was 18 years old, suffering from severe mental illness, with a supportive family who were not LDS, but really knew nothing about it. I knew nothing about it. At the age of 18, and though I love to read, when I read the Book of Mormon, it confused me. I attributed the confusion to my illness, because it was pretty much a daily state of affairs for me at that time. What drew me in was the people, how absolutely accepting they were of me, and how caring when I would go through the hardest parts of my illness. I've never really seen such a thing since. Say what you will about Mormons, but they are surprisingly progressive when it comes to dealing with people who have mental illness. Have they always been? I know American history hasn't always been kind towards those with mental disorders. I was baptised in the LDS church, can't remember the exact year but it was late 90s. After my baptism, I started reading everything I could get my hands on, including historical sources. This was my undoing. I don't think I ever officially left, but I haven't been for years.
You should watch the recent Mormon stories video on how they "cure" same-sex attraction. Running around naked in the woods with other men is sure to cure the gay!
+tigerpixie In the 70's as a teenager I suffered seriously from anxiety disorder, having grown up in an abusive home. As a teen my father had left and the physical abuse had stopped but the mental/emotional abuse was worse than ever. I met the Mormons who were wonderful to me--until after I was baptized. Then I received blame for the abuse because parents (especially mothers) were supposed to be kind and dear, and you were supposed to want to be sealed to them for time and eternity. I was told not to get mental health services because I needed to pray, have more respect for my mother, and get right with God even though I was keeping all their rules and praying and attending church. In the 80's I continued to get excoriated by Bishops, etc. and although mental health services were recommended I was still told that my problems were because I was "unworthy" or were blamed on my husband. In the early 90's, a stake president told me that God and the Church are mostly what people really need. By the mid-nineties, a turn-around in thinking apparently was starting to happen, but I wasn't active, I heard it through the grapevine. In the late nineties I returned to Church briefly and saw that attitudes were much, much better--but I couldn't get back into the swing of Mormonism. It was simply too late to trust anyone again. In the 20's, the "strange" aspects of LDS history started showing up, but it took a few years for me to do the deep research and realize it wasn't true. What a relief! I didn't have to feel guilty that I no longer wanted to be active. Now I am looking for another church. I'm glad that you had good, supportive family to help you as a teen. Be glad you weren't a teen in the 70's!
Is the church still having a bad attitude about abuse victims? I have dropped out of the LDS world and don't know anymore. But i was treated as though I were the perpetrator, not the victim. In the late 90's I thought the attitude was changing, but I didn't dare to try trusting them again. I have learned so much negative about the church that I'm done with it anyway. I haven't been to al anon in many years, I think I will try again. I do have a therapist.
I was one naive teenager. I actually believed what the missionaries and others taught me about priesthood power and Bishops having all of this Holy Ghost influence and the gift of discernment. I joined the church with great trust of being understood and affirmed, because this was the true church and the Holy Ghost would not lead the Bishop (and other leaders) wrong! You can imagine how hurt I was when I found out the truth. Still it took me decades to learn for sure that the church isn't even true. I think I was afraid that God would punish me if I didn't keep believing it was true. I will be looking for an Al-Anon group in my area.
***** I'm sorry you went through that. My experience with the church itself was so different when it came to my illness. They were surprisingly progressive with that one particular issue. I was never shy about my illness, even then, and everyone in the church knew. When I started learning more, and decided to leave the church, it wasn't because of the people. The people are the reason I wanted to stay. To this day, I have never met a more instantly accepting and loving group of people. I can claim that my personal experience with the LDS church was positive. But even though I am mentally ill, I am also intelligent, and I can't just turn that off. I felt sorry for the people in the church because as I saw it, they'd been conned. They were just telling me what they thought was the truth. I never had a negative experience with the church itself, but I couldn't stay and lie to the people around me. I couldn't unlearn what I had learned. This was before the internet exploded to what it is now, I had to read actual books. It kind of boggles me that there are still believing Mormons out there with information just available the way it is now.
Don't forget that he was arrested and charged for using that "rock of God" without success. Silver? Nope. Gold? Nope. Diamonds, jewels? Nope. An ancient record of the fictional primary ancestors of the native Americans who happened to be of Hebrew origin? Yes! Where's my top hat?
You simply don't understand. As Brigham Young stated, if god doesn't want you to have the treasure he can move it before you're able to dig it up. The peepstone doesn't guarantee that you'll actually find the treasure.
Ah- so God wanted Joseph to get arrested for not finding the treasure on Josiah Stowell's farm. Makes sense. Let's add convicted criminal (1826 Bainbridge, NY) to the resume of a documented liar ("...What a thing it is for a man to be accused of committing adultery, and having seven wives, when I can only find one. I am the same man, and as innocent as I was fourteen years ago; and I can prove them all perjurers." (History of the Church, vol 6, p. 411), child molester and womanizer (marrying at least 2 14 year olds in his late 30s for a total of 7 under the age of 18, and 11 married women including 1 he married after sending her husband on a mission while she was already pregnant, see www.mormonthink.com/joseph-smith-polygamy.htm for a list of sources), a Kinderhook plates liar, a Book of Abraham papyrus liar, shall I go on?! The problem is that I do understand. I know all of the things the church has tried to cover up for at least the past 100 years (like cutting out Joseph's own account of the First Vision which is Trinitarian- nothing like later versions after he changed his view of the godhead to monolatry). One can believe in fairy tales that try to show why something won't work some of the time but will in the hands of an evil liar, but I'd prefer to let the evidence speak for itself.
***** __ Because your church lied about how it happened in the first place as the video clearly points out. __ Then why hide it for well over a 100 years? Why only reveal it when "Anti-Mormons" used proof that it existed to a point where the church had write an essay admitting it (along with essays on other troubling issues)? If it was something to be proud of to prove the church is true, then why wasn't it taught at church? Where is the official church paintings of the use of the seer stone? Where are the official church videos and movies using the seer stone? Where is the hat that Joseph used to translate the Book of Mormon in any of those pictures and videos? Here is what is says in the essay: _According to these accounts, Joseph placed either the interpreters or the seer stone in a hat, pressed his face into the hat to block out extraneous light, and read aloud the English words that appeared on the instrument._ Where is this mentioned in the Pearl of Great Price or again in pictures or videos? Or why does it say this in the essay on the Book of Mormon translation: _The other instrument, which Joseph Smith discovered in the ground years before he retrieved the gold plates, was a small oval stone, or “seer stone." As a young man during the 1820s, Joseph Smith, like others in his day, _*_used a seer stone to look for lost objects and buried treasure_*_._ But in the Pearl of Great Price under *Joseph Smith History **1:56**:* _56 In the year 1823 my father’s family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, _*_to dig for the silver mine_*_, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. _*_Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger_*_._ Yeah, contradiction city. _If modern Church Presidents would use these sacred vessels as an aid, I believe we would see many more revelations instead of inspired pep talks._ Ask yourself why that isn't happening for a second? Think about it long and hard.
I was as shocked by the mechanisms or procedures for the translations; as much as how I'm offended that not one other prophet, seer, revelator since Joseph Smith has tried to utilize or speak with and for God. If they kept the rock so sacred and secret, it seems to me that they (the people who claim to be prophets and apostles of Jesus Christ) could attempt to translate apocryphal writings, gnostic gospels, Asian scrolls, American Petroglyphs, cuneiform tablets, etc...In 1975-19176 Hugh Nibley presented a 12 part article on the Book of Enoch, giving his interpretation and providing footnotes and references. Yet this was never pronounced as scriptures or canonized?!? So what was the purpose? What was the purpose for Ancient Nephites and Jaredites to keep records if Joseph could just receive inspired translation? Why was Laban murdered to get the brass plates if they were never used? Why save Gazelem? Why is part of the promise of the Celestial Kingdom that everyone will receive a white rock urim & thummin?Now that I'm out of the corporation, I can honestly say, "It's the most paganistic, idiotic, irrational concept that has ever been presented to mankind."
Glad to see you posting again. Thank you for posting videos on these mormon subjects. It is a really hard subject to find videos on and you are an amazing actor. Keep it up my friend!!!
Clearly, you received the wrong answer because you were not asking the Lord with "true intent". Keep reading but this time ask with true intent. Maybe after the millionth time reading/asking, you will humble yourself to actually ask with "true intent". It totes works guys.
You must ponder and pray until you believe; otherwise you haven't done it enough. There is only one answer, it's just a matter of being worthy so until you are you won't get an answer.
Real intent isn't even enough. You have to ask with faith in Christ. In other words, you already have to believe before getting an answer about whether or not to believe. Moroni's promise uses ironclad logic...
Thank you for posting. What's amazing about the Book of Mormon is that even with the Urim & Thummim, the seer stone, and "the gift and power of God", Smith still couldn't get the translation right. For example, Isaiah 29:10 was not translated correctly in the King James Version of the Bible: "For the LORD hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered." This verse is recorded in the Book of Mormon (2 Nephi 27:5) with Smith adding some words to the text. The issue here is with the word translated "your rulers" in the KJV. The Hebrew word rosh means "head (the head)." According to Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers: "Your rulers - Lit., your heads, the word being in apposition with the seers. The word is emphasized with a keen irony, precisely because they did not see." The Pulpit Commentary says, "As the text stands, the proper translation would be, 'For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes (the prophets), and your heads (the seers) hath he covered.' But it is reasonably conjectured that the expressions 'the prophets' and 'the seers' are glosses, which have crept from the margin into the text. If so, they are probably mistaken glosses, the allusion being, not to particular classes, but to the actual heads and eyes of individual Hebrews, which were closed and covered by the judicial action of the Almighty. In the East a covering is often drawn over the head during sleep." Here is a look at how the English of this verse developed: Coverdale Bible "heades" Great Bible "rulers" Geneva Bible "your chiefe" Bishops Bible "rulers" 1611 KJV "your rulers" 1769 KJV "your rulers" * BOM "your rulers" The Westminster Leningrad Codex confirms that the word in question deals with vision (as in the covering of the head) and not "rulers" or "chiefs" as in heads of people. The verse should read: ".... and has closed your eyes (the prophets), and covered your heads (the seers)" as in the ESV. It seems strange that with all the physical and divine resources at his disposal, Smith still could not provide a correct translation. When considering the English development of this verse it should be painfully clear where Smith got the words for 2 Nephi 27:5 from (the King James Version of the Bible was the source, not ancient plates). This is not an isolated incident as there are many other examples of Smith unknowingly copying KJV translation errors into his book. The appearance of these mistakes suggest that Smith was not translating from an ancient text but instead reliant on an English source. It also suggests that he was not being truthful regarding the origin of the Book of Mormon and witnesses were not telling the truth about the translation process.
My daughter just converted to being a Mormon. I'm trying to understand this, although it makes me cringe and wish she had just smoked some weed and gotten a tattoo (of anything), thanks for these videos, I'm trying to be supported despite my serious reservations. (and BTW did you have to totally copy the FreeMasons?, what is up with that?) vicki
Gospel Principles, (2011), 179-83. Chapter 31: Honesty: Lying is intentionally deceiving others. Bearing false witness is one form of lying. The Lord gave this commandment to the children of Israel: “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” (Exodus 20:16). Jesus also taught this when He was on earth (see Matthew 19:18). There are many other forms of lying. When we speak untruths, we are guilty of lying. We can also intentionally deceive others by a gesture or a look, by silence, or by telling only part of the truth. Whenever we lead people in any way to believe something that is not true, we are not being honest. :) Peace.
I recall many a discussion of tithing that went something like, "Do you think God really needs your tithing money? God could tell the the prophet where to find a huge gold or diamond mine like THAT!" Now I realize some of that discussion was vestiges of things that had happened throughout church history from Smith's pre-prophet days of money digging to investments in gold mines, and, time will tell, the investment of billions in City Creek Mall.
The issue to me isn't: Looking into a hat at a glowing rock is weird...religious stories and myth of all faiths and cultures then is "weird" But not releasing accurate information as soon as you know it (in Joseph Smith's case: immediately) is vile and deceitful. Quite the opposite of what most religions and ethical people strive for. Also, the other points are hard to dispute with any degree of effectiveness...like God tricking you with dinosaur bones or the Grand Canyon being created in days or large non swimming animals arriving in Australia after a worldwide flood.
Jeff Curtis If you look into the Book of Mormon (you can go to a library and read this part) a few pages in it gives the "Testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith". On the third page, about 2/3 down he tells what happened when things were made known. Then also, towards the back of the Book of Mormon there is the History of Joseph Smith. It goes into more detail about him making things known and some of the persecutions wrought upon him because he revealed what he knew. It's only about 11 pages. He wasn't vile and deceitful. He was doing his best to make it known and to get the word out. You can read it in a library and not have to worry about missionaries bugging you. I am only telling you about this because I care that you know about things before making comments. You also need to consider how things were in the days this was happening. And lastly, who are we to challenge how God choose to bring all of this forth? The BoM melds hand in hand with a KJV Bible. I am not an LDS fanatic but I just wanted you to know. Thank you for your time.
This makes so much sense I'm going to join the Mormons today. After I've had another beer or two. BTW, do Mormon magic underpants repel skidmarks because I have a serious problem with skidmarks. I hope they do, because that would be another reason to join.
And what about the Book of Mormon specifically mentioning the "interpreters" that were supposedly included with the gold plates with the express purpose of allowing the future finder to translate them?
In the July/August 2018 edition of "Biblical Archaeology Review" on page 33, is an article "Egyptian Papyrus Sheds New Light on Jewish History." The author is Karel van der Toorn. The article is about a papyrus roll discovered in the late 19th century at Luxor (ancient Thebes). It took more than 120 years to decipher the text. It was discovered that Egyptian Demotic script had been used to write Aramaic text! The translation turned out to be three Israelite psalms written about 400BC. This is an example of "Reformed Egyptian" used by Israelites and discovered by non-Mormons!!
I worked with a man who was a self-righteous evangelizing mormon, which I found most uncomfortable. One day I took in some Rune Stones, which are an ancient device for fortune-telling. He really didn't like being near them but he did ask me how they were used, I told him that you put them in a hat and then pushed your face into the hat so that all light was blocked out and then words would appear on the stones. He then told me that such a practice was was at best superstitious nonsense, possibly witchcraft, but probably was the work of Satan. When I told him that his beloved BOM was translated that way he got furious, as even though he is a "priest" in the cult of mormon he had always been told that the gold plates were read and translated by Joseph Smith. He did a bit of a google search and found out the truth, then came up with the excuse that to tell the truth at the time of them being translated would have been beyond the understanding of most people and JS would not have been believed. A definite sign of being a victim of the BITE method of cult control.
I wonder why did all those Lehites go to all that trouble of lopping that one dudes head off, and preserving a really really heavy stack of metal plates, when they weren't even needed?!?! hmmmmmmmmm
It doesn't matter how it was translated but IF it was actually translated, the way the church has been lying about so many things it is impossible to trust the institution for any credible information. Now if members are supposed to support the leaders as Prophets, Seers and Revelators then they need to start living up to those titles which imply a higher sense for anticipating human progress. Unfortunately they are powerless when it comes to that, with so much going on in the world and they have absolutely nothing relevant to say, even the Pope is saying more than our "Seers and Revelators" Funny that you say that if people just pray they will get all the answers but the Seers and Revaltors have been contradicting themselves for over a century.
Brother Jake Nice video but please remember that his Chocolate looking seer stone was separate from Urim and Thummim which he was given for time while he translated the book of Mormon. he may used this stone to help translated other scriptures or to help received revelation. but you are right most people had objects that they believed helped them in their communication to god . that includes all religous sects
Mark, to be clear all the eye witness accounts of JS "translating" describe him using the dark stone. The term urim and thummim wasn't introduced until 1833 after W.W. Phelps speculated that it might be the urim and thummim of the old testament.
Sorry Mark, this is incorrect. The Urim and Thummim were taken away after the 116 pages were lost by Martin Harris. There is no record of translation using the Urim and Thummim after that.
Richard Bushman has stated that there is not credible source that verifies that the breastplate was used for any part of the BoM. It was simply added far after the fact.
I remember on my mission Daniel Peterson impressed me very much. We had this CD of church talks that had been given over the decades and his talk over Islam and what it is was included on the CD. I remember hanging on to every word he said. After my mission it surprised me to learn that the introductory books about the history of Mohamed and the rise of Islam differed from Peterson's account. Then I thought why would somebody just use conjecture and opinion in a church talk, and what is worse, why would the church simply condone it and not fact check it? Since I have left the Church it does not surprise me to see that he is still a toady and a creater of propaganda. Nice use of media and sarcasm to support your position B Jake.
If you pray about the Bible you will get good feelings, if muslins people pray about their holy scripture they will also have feelings and confirmation as well. So the LDS knows that if you want to believe something and pray about it there will be some kind of feelings to confirm it, that, however does not make it true or not true. Feelings alone is not the best way to know the truth.
As a current, and 40 consecutive-year temple recommend holder, I enthusiastically endorse this video to be used in all third-hour sessions including High Priests, Elders and Relief Society to help members understand the recent confusion regarding the “seer stone”. Here, Brother Jake covers all aspects of the controversy in a respectful and accurate manner. This will help members understand the elements of the issue and come to a reconciliation with the truth.
You would be right. But then again, members are typically still too stupid to understand facts. I mean come on, most people still believe in the flood story. lol
You go ahead and keep praying while the rest of us read books. I don't even feel sorry for you people anymore. If you want to keep believing in fairy tales then go ahead. Horses are NOT Tapirs and Honey bees are NOT indigenous to America. Read a freaking book!
K Scott Satan and evil get "By me" . Keep worshiping your physical things. Satan loves to make people happy with carnal secirity. At last you're making someone happy. But I will tell you, take a look around the world and understand these calamities are warnings because he is merciful and there's always time to come to him. Christ that is, Jesus Christ the savior the one and only way. He is always q.
Your video is slick. It wd appear from lds documented records Joseph Smith was slick too. Now you have the hidden treasure (b of m) slipping away into the earth as you continue to dig the hole to retain the treasure.
why does the lds church deceive people with the pictures they show of joseph translating the plates? they show him writing next to them and not him looking into a hat!!
Banded jasper or agate. Wow, how unique... Whoops! Wrong state... I looked up Smith's birthplace. Manchester, NY is where he apparently "found" the seer stones... Oooo, crap! New York state may not have an abundance of agate or jasper (although the glaciation is a factor there, too) but it has some delicious-sounding sites for amateurs to collect: beryl, chrysoberyl, large garnets, "crowned" quartz crystals, rose quartz, & even a few kimberlite tubes!! Olivine, spinel, even rubies & sapphires! Then there's lazulite... Hold the phone! Just found jasper! (An agate-like silicate rock that can occur in a banded form...) "Albany County is noted for its flint and jasper that is found in sand and gravel deposits." From: gemsandgemstones.blogspot.com/2011/09/gemstone-occurrences-in-new-york.html
How is the church dealing with it's scattered history of discipline? I have understood that many people have faced serious rebuke, and some even disfellowshipped for asking about this.
Oh it doesn’t matter that Urim and Thumin, which are supposed to be spectacles (by the way- in the picture above why doesn’t he have spectacles on?) Then, no not spectacles.... a random stone found in a well. It does matter. You’re self deceived.
Brother Jake... you haven't studied Moses' stories very well. He used that same staff throughout them all, and whilst in front of Pharaoh, he did do something that some folks would regard as "street magic" - the staff turned into a snake, and then back into a staff.
+David Sarif Yet, I mock your God. I don't take fake Gods seriously you know. If you can't see how your religion has been lying about this issue, then you're a sad, sad, sad individual.
***** Then you don't need to do anything darling, you are already celestialized and fabulous! [38.media.tumblr.com/a0e6ba654c05abb35b537d5633085f53/tumblr_n1qfarkI1o1tp37lpo1_500.gif]
The OT Prophet: Jeremiah, Chapter 28: 9 The prophet which prophesieth of peace, when the word of the prophet shall come to pass, then shall the prophet be known, that the Lord hath truly sent him. (if he is a prophet that the Lord sent then what he prophesied will happen). The Doctrine and Covenants: Section 129: 1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones- 2 For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. 3 Secondly: the spirits of just men made perfect, they who are not resurrected, but inherit the same glory. 4 When a messenger comes saying he has a message from God, offer him your hand and request him to shake hands with you. 5 If he be an angel he will do so, and you will feel his hand. 6 If he be the spirit of a just man made perfect he will come in his glory; for that is the only way he can appear- 7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the order of heaven for a just man to deceive; but he will still deliver his message. 8 If it be the devil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not feel anything; you may therefore detect him. The Book of Ether, Chapter 3: 4 And I know, O Lord, that thou hast all power, and can do whatsoever thou wilt for the benefit of man; therefore touch these stones, O Lord, with thy finger, and prepare them that they may shine forth in darkness; and they shall shine forth unto us in the vessels which we have prepared, that we may have light while we shall cross the sea. 6 And it came to pass that when the brother of Jared had said these words, behold, the Lord stretched forth his hand and touched the stones one by one with his finger. And the veil was taken from off the eyes of the brother of Jared, and he saw the finger of the Lord; and it was as the finger of a man, like unto flesh and blood; and the brother of Jared fell down before the Lord, for he was struck with fear. 16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh. 17 And now, as I, Moroni, said I could not make a full account of these things which are written, therefore it sufficeth me to say that Jesus showed himself unto this man in the spirit, even after the manner and in the likeness of the same body even as he showed himself unto the Nephites. The Doctrine and Covenants: Section 129: 7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the order of heaven for a just man to deceive; but he will still deliver his message. 8 If it be the devil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not feel anything; you may therefore detect him. The Bible and the LDS Book of Mormon and their Doctrine and Covenants show that Joseph was not a Prophet nor Moroni Because had Jesus really come he would not have been able to touch the stones and Jeremiah, Chapter 28: 9 LDS KJV Bible.
Daily Mail reported: A small onyx stone believed to have been worn in the sacred breastplate of the High Priest of Jerusalem may have been found after being missing for more than 1,000 years. A sardonyx gem, thought to have been one of two that were set in gold on each shoulder of the breastplate and deemed to be 'forms of divine communication', was discovered in South Africa. The owner claims the stone was given to a distant ancestor as a reward from the High Priest in 1189 and has been passed from generation to generation of the family since. Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3789923/Mysterious-onyx-stone-thought-ancient-prophetic-gem-breastplate-High-Priest-Jerusalem.html#ixzz4KReGS8Jz Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebo
Wow, somehow I was thinking the essays would create the shock value necessary to cause most TBMs into questioning their own beliefs and culpability. I guess these shocks are only something like 3.0 on the Richter scale of cognitive dissonance when they really need 10.0 with 9.0 aftershocks. Nevertheless, I think someday in the near future Brother Jake may be embarrassed by his own naivete. Then again, how many genocides happen when someone finally realizes you can't forcibly educate ridiculous beliefs out of anyone?
@@stephenjackson7797 You're right, if he was being satirical, I missed it. Though I might not have if his voice and presentation weren't so incredibly annoying that I stopped watching after a few seconds.
Meh... Not your best work. You must have a new job, baby, training for a triathlon, etc. Not that I could even come close to your worst myself. You're very entertaining. Thanks for all the chuckles!
Brother Jake is not mormon... is he..? I did try to read the book of mormon though.. but it didn't bring me any happiness, at all.. So I went straight back to the book of joy. :) "He entered Jericho and was passing through. 2 And behold, there was a man named Zacchaeus. He was a chief tax collector and was rich. 3 And he was seeking to see who Jesus was, but on account of the crowd he could not, because he was small in stature. 4 So he ran on ahead and climbed up into a sycamore tree to see him, for he was about to pass that way. 5 And when Jesus came to the place, he looked up and said to him, “Zacchaeus, hurry and come down, for I must stay at your house today.” 6 So he hurried and came down and received him joyfully. 7 And when they saw it, they all grumbled, “He has gone in to be the guest of a man who is a sinner.” 8 And Zacchaeus stood and said to the Lord, “Behold, Lord, the half of my goods I give to the poor. And if I have defrauded anyone of anything, I restore it fourfold.” 9 And Jesus said to him, “Today salvation has come to this house, since he also is a son of Abraham. 10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” (Luke 19)
Your scripts are consistently phenomenal. Bravo!
When will the replica seer stones be available in the gift shops?
+Trent Cutler That's what I'm waiting for!
mmm... I wonder if they would make good stocking stuffers for Christmas. Could there be a business opportunity here? Thinking this through further, JS used the stone with a stovepipe hat. Perhaps a complete translation kit complete with both hat and rock could be a seller.
I'll sell you your very own for just two payments of 29.99.
Believe it or not, some people are making them: www.shapeways.com/product/TG6CPXKWK/mormon-seer-stone The better approach (if you want a real rock) is to look for "iron banded jasper" on e-bay. I got mine for about $20. The ones from Wyoming match pretty well in terms of the stripes.
@@scottvance74 that's so cool, and only $44.70. That saves me making my own to bring to sacrament meeting.
a religious institution intentionally and knowingly misrepresenting the history of their miraculous events, im so shocked.
diligenceovertime.blogspot.com/2017/08/the-sorcerer-stone.html
Believe what you want to about the LDS church... that is your prerogative.
But Mormons cannot say with a straight face that the LDS church has been honest about this issue.
+Mark Hansen Of course they can. Many have. That's the nature of mind control.
+rivenrock Mormons aren't honest about anything. Do you know they tell members not to ask any questions that are skeptical? Prophets say you shouldn't question the church.
+Mark Hansen R'Amen
Thepillow 360 Do you want the talk? I can find it for you. They say you can only ask questions that don't actually question the church and you can't be skeptical about it. Now what does that tell you? You should ALWAYS be skeptical and NOT believe everything some nut job mormon tells you to believe. I grew up in the cult so I have personal experience. :)
Nope. Dallin H. Oaks said "It's wrong to criticize leaders of the Church, even if the criticism is true."
You're awesome for making these.
Are you going to do a video explaining planet kolob?
You were ahead of your time brother jake. You would be killing it right now in the exmo world.
Thanks for helping me retain my testimony, I was this close to apostatizing! Lol nice work again
+mbrownie22 *apostasy noise*
I rub a couple of stones almost every day and all I get out of them is guilt. :(
And yet we think him using a rock is so much weirder than using ancient glasses and a breastplate found in New York.
Very good point. I guess it's how we were raised.
one of your best brother jake. thanks for making us laugh instead of cry.
YES I HAVE WAITED SO LONG
I wish I could like this a thousand times. Bravo, sir.
I was a very brief member of the LDS church in the late 90s. I was 18 years old, suffering from severe mental illness, with a supportive family who were not LDS, but really knew nothing about it. I knew nothing about it. At the age of 18, and though I love to read, when I read the Book of Mormon, it confused me. I attributed the confusion to my illness, because it was pretty much a daily state of affairs for me at that time. What drew me in was the people, how absolutely accepting they were of me, and how caring when I would go through the hardest parts of my illness. I've never really seen such a thing since. Say what you will about Mormons, but they are surprisingly progressive when it comes to dealing with people who have mental illness. Have they always been? I know American history hasn't always been kind towards those with mental disorders. I was baptised in the LDS church, can't remember the exact year but it was late 90s. After my baptism, I started reading everything I could get my hands on, including historical sources. This was my undoing. I don't think I ever officially left, but I haven't been for years.
You should watch the recent Mormon stories video on how they "cure" same-sex attraction. Running around naked in the woods with other men is sure to cure the gay!
+tigerpixie In the 70's as a teenager I suffered seriously from anxiety disorder, having grown up in an abusive home. As a teen my father had left and the physical abuse had stopped but the mental/emotional abuse was worse than ever. I met the Mormons who were wonderful to me--until after I was baptized. Then I received blame for the abuse because parents (especially mothers) were supposed to be kind and dear, and you were supposed to want to be sealed to them for time and eternity. I was told not to get mental health services because I needed to pray, have more respect for my mother, and get right with God even though I was keeping all their rules and praying and attending church. In the 80's I continued to get excoriated by Bishops, etc. and although mental health services were recommended I was still told that my problems were because I was "unworthy" or were blamed on my husband. In the early 90's, a stake president told me that God and the Church are mostly what people really need. By the mid-nineties, a turn-around in thinking apparently was starting to happen, but I wasn't active, I heard it through the grapevine. In the late nineties I returned to Church briefly and saw that attitudes were much, much better--but I couldn't get back into the swing of Mormonism. It was simply too late to trust anyone again. In the 20's, the "strange" aspects of LDS history started showing up, but it took a few years for me to do the deep research and realize it wasn't true. What a relief! I didn't have to feel guilty that I no longer wanted to be active. Now I am looking for another church. I'm glad that you had good, supportive family to help you as a teen. Be glad you weren't a teen in the 70's!
Is the church still having a bad attitude about abuse victims? I have dropped out of the LDS world and don't know anymore. But i was treated as though I were the perpetrator, not the victim. In the late 90's I thought the attitude was changing, but I didn't dare to try trusting them again. I have learned so much negative about the church that I'm done with it anyway. I haven't been to al anon in many years, I think I will try again. I do have a therapist.
I was one naive teenager. I actually believed what the missionaries and others taught me about priesthood power and Bishops having all of this Holy Ghost influence and the gift of discernment. I joined the church with great trust of being understood and affirmed, because this was the true church and the Holy Ghost would not lead the Bishop (and other leaders) wrong! You can imagine how hurt I was when I found out the truth. Still it took me decades to learn for sure that the church isn't even true. I think I was afraid that God would punish me if I didn't keep believing it was true. I will be looking for an Al-Anon group in my area.
***** I'm sorry you went through that. My experience with the church itself was so different when it came to my illness. They were surprisingly progressive with that one particular issue. I was never shy about my illness, even then, and everyone in the church knew. When I started learning more, and decided to leave the church, it wasn't because of the people. The people are the reason I wanted to stay. To this day, I have never met a more instantly accepting and loving group of people. I can claim that my personal experience with the LDS church was positive. But even though I am mentally ill, I am also intelligent, and I can't just turn that off. I felt sorry for the people in the church because as I saw it, they'd been conned. They were just telling me what they thought was the truth. I never had a negative experience with the church itself, but I couldn't stay and lie to the people around me. I couldn't unlearn what I had learned. This was before the internet exploded to what it is now, I had to read actual books. It kind of boggles me that there are still believing Mormons out there with information just available the way it is now.
“Does it really matter where it came from” 😂😂😂💀
brother jake setting me strait once again
Don't forget that he was arrested and charged for using that "rock of God" without success. Silver? Nope. Gold? Nope. Diamonds, jewels? Nope. An ancient record of the fictional primary ancestors of the native Americans who happened to be of Hebrew origin? Yes! Where's my top hat?
You simply don't understand. As Brigham Young stated, if god doesn't want you to have the treasure he can move it before you're able to dig it up. The peepstone doesn't guarantee that you'll actually find the treasure.
Ah- so God wanted Joseph to get arrested for not finding the treasure on Josiah Stowell's farm. Makes sense. Let's add convicted criminal (1826 Bainbridge, NY) to the resume of a documented liar ("...What a thing it is for a man to be accused of committing adultery, and having seven wives, when I can only find one. I am the same man, and as innocent as I was fourteen years ago; and I can prove them all perjurers." (History of the Church, vol 6, p. 411), child molester and womanizer (marrying at least 2 14 year olds in his late 30s for a total of 7 under the age of 18, and 11 married women including 1 he married after sending her husband on a mission while she was already pregnant, see www.mormonthink.com/joseph-smith-polygamy.htm for a list of sources), a Kinderhook plates liar, a Book of Abraham papyrus liar, shall I go on?! The problem is that I do understand. I know all of the things the church has tried to cover up for at least the past 100 years (like cutting out Joseph's own account of the First Vision which is Trinitarian- nothing like later versions after he changed his view of the godhead to monolatry). One can believe in fairy tales that try to show why something won't work some of the time but will in the hands of an evil liar, but I'd prefer to let the evidence speak for itself.
Zelph Myster For the TBMs it takes courage to have the evidence speak for itself.
You know if anyone sees this information and still tries to find ways to believe in Mormonism... you know they're totally brainwashed!
I know man like I hope one day they find thor.
+Phatooine every religion are brainwashing machines.. =)
+Cristóbal Muñoz Yes, I know.
*****
__
Because your church lied about how it happened in the first place as the video clearly points out.
__
Then why hide it for well over a 100 years? Why only reveal it when "Anti-Mormons" used proof that it existed to a point where the church had write an essay admitting it (along with essays on other troubling issues)? If it was something to be proud of to prove the church is true, then why wasn't it taught at church?
Where is the official church paintings of the use of the seer stone? Where are the official church videos and movies using the seer stone? Where is the hat that Joseph used to translate the Book of Mormon in any of those pictures and videos?
Here is what is says in the essay:
_According to these accounts, Joseph placed either the interpreters or the seer stone in a hat, pressed his face into the hat to block out extraneous light, and read aloud the English words that appeared on the instrument._
Where is this mentioned in the Pearl of Great Price or again in pictures or videos?
Or why does it say this in the essay on the Book of Mormon translation:
_The other instrument, which Joseph Smith discovered in the ground years before he retrieved the gold plates, was a small oval stone, or “seer stone." As a young man during the 1820s, Joseph Smith, like others in his day, _*_used a seer stone to look for lost objects and buried treasure_*_._
But in the Pearl of Great Price under *Joseph Smith History **1:56**:*
_56 In the year 1823 my father’s family met with a great affliction by the death of my eldest brother, Alvin. In the month of October, 1825, I hired with an old gentleman by the name of Josiah Stoal, who lived in Chenango county, State of New York. He had heard something of a silver mine having been opened by the Spaniards in Harmony, Susquehanna county, State of Pennsylvania; and had, previous to my hiring to him, been digging, in order, if possible, to discover the mine. After I went to live with him, he took me, with the rest of his hands, _*_to dig for the silver mine_*_, at which I continued to work for nearly a month, without success in our undertaking, and finally I prevailed with the old gentleman to cease digging after it. _*_Hence arose the very prevalent story of my having been a money-digger_*_._
Yeah, contradiction city.
_If modern Church Presidents would use these sacred vessels as an aid, I believe we would see many more revelations instead of inspired pep talks._
Ask yourself why that isn't happening for a second? Think about it long and hard.
*****
_
This was excellent, made even more by your presentation. Loved it!
I was as shocked by the mechanisms or procedures for the translations; as much as how I'm offended that not one other prophet, seer, revelator since Joseph Smith has tried to utilize or speak with and for God. If they kept the rock so sacred and secret, it seems to me that they (the people who claim to be prophets and apostles of Jesus Christ) could attempt to translate apocryphal writings, gnostic gospels, Asian scrolls, American Petroglyphs, cuneiform tablets, etc...In 1975-19176 Hugh Nibley presented a 12 part article on the Book of Enoch, giving his interpretation and providing footnotes and references. Yet this was never pronounced as scriptures or canonized?!? So what was the purpose? What was the purpose for Ancient Nephites and Jaredites to keep records if Joseph could just receive inspired translation? Why was Laban murdered to get the brass plates if they were never used? Why save Gazelem? Why is part of the promise of the Celestial Kingdom that everyone will receive a white rock urim & thummin?Now that I'm out of the corporation, I can honestly say, "It's the most paganistic, idiotic, irrational concept that has ever been presented to mankind."
We can have none of your logic. Sit in the back of the room and stop asking questions.
Absolutely brilliant!!! I love it! Thanks for putting all the time into this.
Yay finally a new vid, so glad I went on UA-cam before going to bed.
This is your best so far Bro.
Glad to see you posting again. Thank you for posting videos on these mormon subjects. It is a really hard subject to find videos on and you are an amazing actor. Keep it up my friend!!!
"If you want to know if the book of mormon is true, you just need to pray and ask God"... He answered. Its not.
Clearly, you received the wrong answer because you were not asking the Lord with "true intent". Keep reading but this time ask with true intent. Maybe after the millionth time reading/asking, you will humble yourself to actually ask with "true intent". It totes works guys.
You must ponder and pray until you believe; otherwise you haven't done it enough. There is only one answer, it's just a matter of being worthy so until you are you won't get an answer.
Real intent isn't even enough. You have to ask with faith in Christ. In other words, you already have to believe before getting an answer about whether or not to believe. Moroni's promise uses ironclad logic...
This might be my favorite Brother Jake Video. Dude, you are so talented. Thank you.
Thank you for posting.
What's amazing about the Book of Mormon is that even with the Urim & Thummim, the seer stone, and "the gift and power of God", Smith still couldn't get the translation right. For example, Isaiah 29:10 was not translated correctly in the King James Version of the Bible: "For the LORD hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes: the prophets and your rulers, the seers hath he covered." This verse is recorded in the Book of Mormon (2 Nephi 27:5) with Smith adding some words to the text. The issue here is with the word translated "your rulers" in the KJV. The Hebrew word rosh means "head (the head)." According to Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers: "Your rulers - Lit., your heads, the word being in apposition with the seers. The word is emphasized with a keen irony, precisely because they did not see." The Pulpit Commentary says, "As the text stands, the proper translation would be, 'For the Lord hath poured out upon you the spirit of deep sleep, and hath closed your eyes (the prophets), and your heads (the seers) hath he covered.' But it is reasonably conjectured that the expressions 'the prophets' and 'the seers' are glosses, which have crept from the margin into the text. If so, they are probably mistaken glosses, the allusion being, not to particular classes, but to the actual heads and eyes of individual Hebrews, which were closed and covered by the judicial action of the Almighty. In the East a covering is often drawn over the head during sleep."
Here is a look at how the English of this verse developed:
Coverdale Bible "heades"
Great Bible "rulers"
Geneva Bible "your chiefe"
Bishops Bible "rulers"
1611 KJV "your rulers"
1769 KJV "your rulers"
* BOM "your rulers"
The Westminster Leningrad Codex confirms that the word in question deals with vision (as in the covering of the head) and not "rulers" or "chiefs" as in heads of people. The verse should read: ".... and has closed your eyes (the prophets), and covered your heads (the seers)" as in the ESV. It seems strange that with all the physical and divine resources at his disposal, Smith still could not provide a correct translation. When considering the English development of this verse it should be painfully clear where Smith got the words for 2 Nephi 27:5 from (the King James Version of the Bible was the source, not ancient plates). This is not an isolated incident as there are many other examples of Smith unknowingly copying KJV translation errors into his book. The appearance of these mistakes suggest that Smith was not translating from an ancient text but instead reliant on an English source. It also suggests that he was not being truthful regarding the origin of the Book of Mormon and witnesses were not telling the truth about the translation process.
this is great as usual, thank you for helping with my faith. :P
That was a weird thing to do.
Moses did preform street magic with his staff before parting the Red Sea? I thought he went around turning the staff into a snake.
4:22 "Nobre"??? You must have pulled that out of a hat. ;)
Came here on the recommendation of TBR. No regrets!
My daughter just converted to being a Mormon. I'm trying to understand this, although it makes me cringe and wish she had just smoked some weed and gotten a tattoo (of anything), thanks for these videos, I'm trying to be supported despite my serious reservations.
(and BTW did you have to totally copy the FreeMasons?, what is up with that?)
vicki
The reason why JS copied Masonry is because it was easier than coming up with something on his own.
Thanks, hehe
Go to lds.org and mormon.org
Amazing, so funny, I wish there was more. Like one on bringham young or the council of 50 or one exclusively about Joseph smith. Love these fo sho!
dum dum dum dum dum
+DeusExMachinae01 Nice South Park reference
Well done Bro. Jake.
Oh, goody! Another Brother Jake video!!
Gospel Principles, (2011), 179-83. Chapter 31: Honesty: Lying is intentionally deceiving others. Bearing false witness is one form of lying. The Lord gave this commandment to the children of Israel: “Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour” (Exodus 20:16). Jesus also taught this when He was on earth (see Matthew 19:18). There are many other forms of lying. When we speak untruths, we are guilty of lying. We can also intentionally deceive others by a gesture or a look, by silence, or by telling only part of the truth. Whenever we lead people in any way to believe something that is not true, we are not being honest. :) Peace.
I sure wish I knew all this before I made various life altering decisions
I'm really confused. What happened to the stones set in silver bows that was attached to the breastplate?
I recall many a discussion of tithing that went something like, "Do you think God really needs your tithing money? God could tell the the prophet where to find a huge gold or diamond mine like THAT!" Now I realize some of that discussion was vestiges of things that had happened throughout church history from Smith's pre-prophet days of money digging to investments in gold mines, and, time will tell, the investment of billions in City Creek Mall.
That was savage! I loved it.
Man, I love these videos. Thank you.
How about a video on the B of M witnesses specifically?
The issue to me isn't: Looking into a hat at a glowing rock is weird...religious stories and myth of all faiths and cultures then is "weird"
But not releasing accurate information as soon as you know it (in Joseph Smith's case: immediately) is vile and deceitful. Quite the opposite of what most religions and ethical people strive for. Also, the other points are hard to dispute with any degree of effectiveness...like God tricking you with dinosaur bones or the Grand Canyon being created in days or large non swimming animals arriving in Australia after a worldwide flood.
Jeff Curtis If you look into the Book of Mormon (you can go to a library and read this part) a few pages in it gives the "Testimony of the Prophet Joseph Smith". On the third page, about 2/3 down he tells what happened when things were made known. Then also, towards the back of the Book of Mormon there is the History of Joseph Smith. It goes into more detail about him making things known and some of the persecutions wrought upon him because he revealed what he knew. It's only about 11 pages. He wasn't vile and deceitful. He was doing his best to make it known and to get the word out. You can read it in a library and not have to worry about missionaries bugging you. I am only telling you about this because I care that you know about things before making comments. You also need to consider how things were in the days this was happening. And lastly, who are we to challenge how God choose to bring all of this forth? The BoM melds hand in hand with a KJV Bible. I am not an LDS fanatic but I just wanted you to know. Thank you for your time.
Jeeze, and I started out thinking you were serious. Got me.
I've been looking forward to this video! Very funny and informative! To both Mormons and non-Mormons curious about the whole seer stone ordeal.
What if the diamond is really glass?
You never disappoint. Great video.
This makes so much sense I'm going to join the Mormons today. After I've had another beer or two.
BTW, do Mormon magic underpants repel skidmarks because I have a serious problem with skidmarks. I hope they do, because that would be another reason to join.
Once again. Pure genius.
And what about the Book of Mormon specifically mentioning the "interpreters" that were supposedly included with the gold plates with the express purpose of allowing the future finder to translate them?
Awesome, I loved every second of this video. Please keep it up!
Brother Jake ROCKS !!! it again !!!!
Dan Peterson: EAT THIS !!!!!
In the July/August 2018 edition of "Biblical Archaeology Review" on page 33, is an article "Egyptian Papyrus Sheds New Light on Jewish History." The author is Karel van der Toorn. The article is about a papyrus roll discovered in the late 19th century at Luxor (ancient Thebes). It took more than 120 years to decipher the text. It was discovered that Egyptian Demotic script had been used to write Aramaic text! The translation turned out to be three Israelite psalms written about 400BC.
This is an example of "Reformed Egyptian" used by Israelites and discovered by non-Mormons!!
bull
I worked with a man who was a self-righteous evangelizing mormon, which I found most uncomfortable. One day I took in some Rune Stones, which are an ancient device for fortune-telling. He really didn't like being near them but he did ask me how they were used, I told him that you put them in a hat and then pushed your face into the hat so that all light was blocked out and then words would appear on the stones. He then told me that such a practice was was at best superstitious nonsense, possibly witchcraft, but probably was the work of Satan. When I told him that his beloved BOM was translated that way he got furious, as even though he is a "priest" in the cult of mormon he had always been told that the gold plates were read and translated by Joseph Smith. He did a bit of a google search and found out the truth, then came up with the excuse that to tell the truth at the time of them being translated would have been beyond the understanding of most people and JS would not have been believed. A definite sign of being a victim of the BITE method of cult control.
I wonder why did all those Lehites go to all that trouble of lopping that one dudes head off, and preserving a really really heavy stack of metal plates, when they weren't even needed?!?! hmmmmmmmmm
Thanks Jake ... That was Fun ....
these are funny. are you on twitter?
Fantastic, once again!
It doesn't matter how it was translated but IF it was actually translated, the way the church has been lying about so many things it is impossible to trust the institution for any credible information. Now if members are supposed to support the leaders as Prophets, Seers and Revelators then they need to start living up to those titles which imply a higher sense for anticipating human progress. Unfortunately they are powerless when it comes to that, with so much going on in the world and they have absolutely nothing relevant to say, even the Pope is saying more than our "Seers and Revelators" Funny that you say that if people just pray they will get all the answers but the Seers and Revaltors have been contradicting themselves for over a century.
I saw the NWN screen! One of my fav games!
That is awesome. That is some slam dunk logic.
Brother Jake Nice video but please remember that his Chocolate looking seer stone was separate from Urim and Thummim which he was given for time while he translated the book of Mormon. he may used this stone to help translated other scriptures or to help received revelation. but you are right most people had objects that they believed helped them in their communication to god . that includes all religous sects
Mark, to be clear all the eye witness accounts of JS "translating" describe him using the dark stone. The term urim and thummim wasn't introduced until 1833 after W.W. Phelps speculated that it might be the urim and thummim of the old testament.
Sorry Mark, this is incorrect. The Urim and Thummim were taken away after the 116 pages were lost by Martin Harris. There is no record of translation using the Urim and Thummim after that.
Richard Bushman has stated that there is not credible source that verifies that the breastplate was used for any part of the BoM. It was simply added far after the fact.
Brother Jake is brilliant.
I wonder why so many changes have been made in the book of Mormon since the exact word would have glowed on the iStone? hmmmmmmm
This makes me question my faith even more so than before.
I miss you!
I remember on my mission Daniel Peterson impressed me very much. We had this CD of church talks that had been given over the decades and his talk over Islam and what it is was included on the CD. I remember hanging on to every word he said. After my mission it surprised me to learn that the introductory books about the history of Mohamed and the rise of Islam differed from Peterson's account. Then I thought why would somebody just use conjecture and opinion in a church talk, and what is worse, why would the church simply condone it and not fact check it? Since I have left the Church it does not surprise me to see that he is still a toady and a creater of propaganda. Nice use of media and sarcasm to support your position B Jake.
Sweet connections, B Jake! Ethics, Smethics.
Well now that you say it that way ... it makes perfect sense.
If you pray about the Bible you will get good feelings, if muslins people pray about their holy scripture they will also have feelings and confirmation as well. So the LDS knows that if you want to believe something and pray about it there will be some kind of feelings to confirm it, that, however does not make it true or not true. Feelings alone is not the best way to know the truth.
Same mentality as Oceania had been at war with Eurasia and allied with South East Asia, except when it's the other way around.
As a current, and 40 consecutive-year temple recommend holder, I enthusiastically endorse this video to be used in all third-hour sessions including High Priests, Elders and Relief Society to help members understand the recent confusion regarding the “seer stone”. Here, Brother Jake covers all aspects of the controversy in a respectful and accurate manner. This will help members understand the elements of the issue and come to a reconciliation with the truth.
L. S. Jensen
Irony (noun): a state of affairs or an event that seems deliberately contrary to what one expects and is often amusing as a result.
SOOOO as a member, Im definitely thinking this sarcasm and a creative way to turn member's against the Church. Correct me if Im wrong .....
You would be right. But then again, members are typically still too stupid to understand facts. I mean come on, most people still believe in the flood story. lol
+Lyman Smith well of course it's a lifetime of learning we will never know all the facts but we can try and learn and pray
You go ahead and keep praying while the rest of us read books. I don't even feel sorry for you people anymore. If you want to keep believing in fairy tales then go ahead. Horses are NOT Tapirs and Honey bees are NOT indigenous to America. Read a freaking book!
Nothing gets by you.
K Scott Satan and evil
get "By me" . Keep worshiping your physical things. Satan loves to make people happy with carnal secirity. At last you're making someone happy. But I will tell you, take a look around the world and understand these calamities are warnings because he is merciful and there's always time to come to him. Christ that is, Jesus Christ the savior the one and only way. He is always q.
Spot on! Love it! 😂 (I came late to the party)
Thank you for being alive in the world.
Technically, Moses did do magic tricks with his staff.
brilliant as always jake!
Isn't that called "scrying" which is prohibited in the Bible...
You are hilarious! 😁👍
Two thumbs up!!!
Brother Jake, I just noticed as I watched your video that you now have 6,666 subscribers! Coincidence? LOL!
Your video is slick. It wd appear from lds documented records Joseph Smith was slick too. Now you have the hidden treasure (b of m) slipping away into the earth as you continue to dig the hole to retain the treasure.
why does the lds church deceive people with the pictures they show of joseph translating the plates? they show him writing next to them and not him looking into a hat!!
Because it maximized tithing.
Banded jasper or agate. Wow, how unique...
Whoops! Wrong state... I looked up Smith's birthplace. Manchester, NY is where he apparently "found" the seer stones...
Oooo, crap! New York state may not have an abundance of agate or jasper (although the glaciation is a factor there, too) but it has some delicious-sounding sites for amateurs to collect: beryl, chrysoberyl, large garnets, "crowned" quartz crystals, rose quartz, & even a few kimberlite tubes!! Olivine, spinel, even rubies & sapphires! Then there's lazulite...
Hold the phone! Just found jasper! (An agate-like silicate rock that can occur in a banded form...) "Albany County is noted for its flint and jasper that is found in sand and gravel deposits."
From: gemsandgemstones.blogspot.com/2011/09/gemstone-occurrences-in-new-york.html
Y U NO HAVE MORE SUBS? *insert that one meme face*
How is the church dealing with it's scattered history of discipline? I have understood that many people have faced serious rebuke, and some even disfellowshipped for asking about this.
great
Your back! Yeeesss!!
B JAKE! Long time! :)
Bob Ross why dud ????
Oh it doesn’t matter that Urim and Thumin, which are supposed to be spectacles (by the way- in the picture above why doesn’t he have spectacles on?) Then, no not spectacles.... a random stone found in a well. It does matter. You’re self deceived.
Jake is being sarcastic.
‘That is some slam dunk logic’ hahaha awesome.
Brother Jake... you haven't studied Moses' stories very well. He used that same staff throughout them all, and whilst in front of Pharaoh, he did do something that some folks would regard as "street magic" - the staff turned into a snake, and then back into a staff.
You can mock Joseph Smith all you want but at the end, this information is not relevant to my Salvation. Ok?
+David Sarif That one caused me to hurt myself when I fell off my chair, laughing.
*****
God will not be mocked. Please repent.
To repent, I'd have to pent first. I've never pented.
+David Sarif Yet, I mock your God. I don't take fake Gods seriously you know.
If you can't see how your religion has been lying about this issue, then you're a sad, sad, sad individual.
*****
Then you don't need to do anything darling, you are already celestialized and fabulous!
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The OT Prophet: Jeremiah, Chapter 28: 9 The prophet which prophesieth of peace, when the word of the prophet shall come to pass, then shall the prophet be known, that the Lord hath truly sent him. (if he is a prophet that the Lord sent then what he prophesied will happen).
The Doctrine and Covenants: Section 129: 1 There are two kinds of beings in heaven, namely: Angels, who are resurrected personages, having bodies of flesh and bones-
2 For instance, Jesus said: Handle me and see, for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have.
3 Secondly: the spirits of just men made perfect, they who are not resurrected, but inherit the same glory.
4 When a messenger comes saying he has a message from God, offer him your hand and request him to shake hands with you.
5 If he be an angel he will do so, and you will feel his hand.
6 If he be the spirit of a just man made perfect he will come in his glory; for that is the only way he can appear-
7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the order of heaven for a just man to deceive; but he will still deliver his message.
8 If it be the devil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not feel anything; you may therefore detect him.
The Book of Ether, Chapter 3: 4 And I know, O Lord, that thou hast all power, and can do whatsoever thou wilt for the benefit of man; therefore touch these stones, O Lord, with thy finger, and prepare them that they may shine forth in darkness; and they shall shine forth unto us in the vessels which we have prepared, that we may have light while we shall cross the sea.
6 And it came to pass that when the brother of Jared had said these words, behold, the Lord stretched forth his hand and touched the stones one by one with his finger. And the veil was taken from off the eyes of the brother of Jared, and he saw the finger of the Lord; and it was as the finger of a man, like unto flesh and blood; and the brother of Jared fell down before the Lord, for he was struck with fear.
16 Behold, this body, which ye now behold, is the body of my spirit; and man have I created after the body of my spirit; and even as I appear unto thee to be in the spirit will I appear unto my people in the flesh.
17 And now, as I, Moroni, said I could not make a full account of these things which are written, therefore it sufficeth me to say that Jesus showed himself unto this man in the spirit, even after the manner and in the likeness of the same body even as he showed himself unto the Nephites.
The Doctrine and Covenants: Section 129: 7 Ask him to shake hands with you, but he will not move, because it is contrary to the order of heaven for a just man to deceive; but he will still deliver his message.
8 If it be the devil as an angel of light, when you ask him to shake hands he will offer you his hand, and you will not feel anything; you may therefore detect him.
The Bible and the LDS Book of Mormon and their Doctrine and Covenants show that Joseph was not a Prophet nor Moroni Because had Jesus really come he would not have been able to touch the stones and Jeremiah, Chapter 28: 9 LDS KJV Bible.
Great. Use mythical nonsense to disprove other mythical nonsense.
Daily Mail reported:
A small onyx stone believed to have been worn in the sacred breastplate of the High Priest of Jerusalem may have been found after being missing for more than 1,000 years.
A sardonyx gem, thought to have been one of two that were set in gold on each shoulder of the breastplate and deemed to be 'forms of divine communication', was discovered in South Africa.
The owner claims the stone was given to a distant ancestor as a reward from the High Priest in 1189 and has been passed from generation to generation of the family since.
Read more: www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3789923/Mysterious-onyx-stone-thought-ancient-prophetic-gem-breastplate-High-Priest-Jerusalem.html#ixzz4KReGS8Jz
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Dumb-dumb takes white shirt and tie and head out of sand to spout nonsense again.
THAT IS MY MAGIC STONE I USE TO TALK OTHER TURDS
Wow, somehow I was thinking the essays would create the shock value necessary to cause most TBMs into questioning their own beliefs and culpability. I guess these shocks are only something like 3.0 on the Richter scale of cognitive dissonance when they really need 10.0 with 9.0 aftershocks. Nevertheless, I think someday in the near future Brother Jake may be embarrassed by his own naivete. Then again, how many genocides happen when someone finally realizes you can't forcibly educate ridiculous beliefs out of anyone?
Jake is being sarcastic. Talk about naivete on full display.
@@stephenjackson7797 You're right, if he was being satirical, I missed it. Though I might not have if his voice and presentation weren't so incredibly annoying that I stopped watching after a few seconds.
Meh... Not your best work. You must have a new job, baby, training for a triathlon, etc. Not that I could even come close to your worst myself. You're very entertaining. Thanks for all the chuckles!
Brother Jake is not mormon... is he..?
I did try to read the book of mormon though.. but it didn't bring me any happiness, at all.. So I went straight back to the book of joy. :)
"He entered Jericho and was passing through. 2 And behold, there was a man named Zacchaeus. He was a chief tax collector and was rich. 3 And he was seeking to see who Jesus was, but on account of the crowd he could not, because he was small in stature. 4 So he ran on ahead and climbed up into a sycamore tree to see him, for he was about to pass that way. 5 And when Jesus came to the place, he looked up and said to him, “Zacchaeus, hurry and come down, for I must stay at your house today.” 6 So he hurried and came down and received him joyfully. 7 And when they saw it, they all grumbled, “He has gone in to be the guest of a man who is a sinner.” 8 And Zacchaeus stood and said to the Lord, “Behold, Lord, the half of my goods I give to the poor. And if I have defrauded anyone of anything, I restore it fourfold.” 9 And Jesus said to him, “Today salvation has come to this house, since he also is a son of Abraham. 10 For the Son of Man came to seek and to save the lost.” (Luke 19)