Inside The New Forza Motorsport: Turn 10's Radical Technology Revamp
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- Опубліковано 29 тра 2024
- In development for six years, the new Forza Motorsport for Xbox Series consoles and PCs features a complete revamp of the game's core technology. In an extended interview conducted remotely by John Linneman, the Turn 10 team go into depth on the technology behind the series reboot, covering tracks, vehicles, simulation, ray tracing, the various performance modes and much more.
Our Forza Motorsport preview is in the works and will be with you soon.
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00:00 - Introduction
00:51 - Why did Forza Motorsport Require Six Years to Build?
04:26 - Rendering Modes on Xbox Series X|S
06:32 - Switching from MSAA to TAA
09:13 - Why did the team choose to ship on next-gen only?
11:30 - Let's talk ray tracing
16:16 - The new sky system
19:03 - The new post-processing stack
19:58 - Advanced tire and physics simulation
21:37 - How do you make a track in Forza Motorsport?
24:37 - Trees and Crowds
27:22 - New shaders galore
29:53 - How the team handles materials
32:40 - How do they approach updating cars from prior games?
33:54 - DirectStorage
34:52 - The wrap-up - Ігри
The developer at the end just did more for the game than an entire marketing team ever could.
That alone convinced myself of trying out on October via Gamepass. You can see his expressions while talking about his own personal car, and I expect to be the same for us to. To have that project JDM, or go in search of the exclusive Super Car, and not receive super cars all the time each 5 minutes (Cogh cogh Forza Horizon 5)
Is that a middle aged man with purple hair 😂😂😂 good lord help us
Marketing teams do not try to sell people who engage with video games, they are trying to sell it to the rest.
@@DrGreenThumbNZL TIL when you reach a certain age as a man you can no longer dye your hair a colour you want. What's wrong with purple?
FACTS!
Love what the dev said about car collecting at the end. He basically addressed what ruined Forza Horizon 5 for so many people. Instead of getting super cars thrown in your face every 5 minutes, hopefully we get to really appreciate a relationship with a smaller collection, and make every new addition that much more meaningful. Really hoping it plays out like that in the campaign.
That's why I got bored of horizon the constant 'rewards' for completing a basic race and you get the fastest cars in an hour.. what the.hell
That’s how i felt with the older PS1/2 Gran Turismo games. Earning high end cars felt like an achievement but you also got to spend time tuning and using low end cars i.e. the cars we actually drive. FH5 my third car was a new Lamborghini which is cool but now i earned so many cars and don’t use over half of them
@@sean7332 As a counter, Forza Horizon was always meant to be a car playground. For someone like me thats why I've always preferred Horizon style game to Motorsport. Let me race whatever style car I want and adjust AI cars based on my class of car.
@@LRon-ef7ni Exactly!!! The whole reason older GTs were so damn addictive was the journey you went on with your crappy cars and slowly made your way up to better ones. Take that away, and you’ve seen almost everything the game has to offer in a few hrs. It’s what happened to FH and I don’t get why they chose to do it, basically making most of their cars pointless to the average player. A waste of their own work.
@@dougbfresh I don’t think the issue is classes of cars, but the fact you get like 10 of them from each class so damn fast, that earning a new one makes you feel nothing at all. There’s basically no progression of any kind.
honestly, the debug view looks really pretty in its own way. It'd be nice to be able to play the game that way.
Right? We would love that as an option.
I was thinking the same thing! I would honestly not mind playing the entire game like that.
Quickest way to turn Forza into Wipeout Zone mode
What minute is this shown?
@@SToad@12:01
This is what making games (art) is all about. Passion. I know all devs have passion, but they don't get to express it a lot when the top execs don't have it. These guys do.
This was phenomenal and one of the best dev interviews I've seen. It's obvious how much insane work they've put into this new entry. Thank you Turn10/DF.
They havnt done much the game looks and sounds garbage, less cars less tracks more grinding using forza 4 car models so not all new tech absolute rubbish
Sad tbh they gas light me
This aged well
Great feature, the team's obviously put a ton of effort into progressing the tech and the series. Appreciate the feature DF!
I think it's great that they didn't just concentrate on car detail like some other games and actually brought the detail up in the environments as well. The cars don't look out of place. The tree detail is something I complain about in almost every racing game. Paper cutout trees.. But here, they look great. I also love the inclusion of atmospheric effects.
Gt7 has better car models, yes
I understand what you mean about adding visual magic to environments....but it does seem odd that this new Forza doesn't have better looking car models than a cross gen Gran Turismo. I need to see this game in person to judge though.
not gonna lie, they listened to the fans being worried about how it would go and made a tech preview with you guys.
This is just amazing. Thank you for doing this and asking all the right questions.
so much nonsense bla bla. hate such videos with developers bla bla
@@mal-avcisi9783 cut and paste angry bot, huh?
@@tonybarnes2920nah they just didn't listen to the fans, it's an always online game ffs, they went worse than fm7, atleast you can still play it if you bought it before the delisting lol
@@mal-avcisi9783no one asked
What an absolutely incredible video. I love how candid they are about the game and the compromises and trade offs and priorities. Just unparalleled content on UA-cam.
Facts so dope
Yeah the whole not able to use old track models due to new fidelity was really interesting
Lol. You don't understand the fact that this is a paid advertisement?
@@gamesandplanes3984they would usually say video that it’s sponsored, for that reason it most likely isn’t
Community requests or expectations were never a priority. 3d trees were.
What an exellent video! I love this, it's so informative. The production quality is also top notch. It's great that the devs can talk about their work here and get deep into the details and explain why they do certain stuff. I hope we get alot more of these interviews with other devs too. I'm here for it, for sure!
so much nonsense bla bla. hate such videos with developers bla bla
@@mal-avcisi9783 cut and paste angry bot, huh?
@@mal-avcisi9783Based on your profile, you really hate DF. Why are you here?
Incredible! Bravo to Turn 10 and to Digital Foundry! Thank you!
It is really great to see such a detailed look behind the scenes. Great work DF and Turn 10!
Incredible preview. The developers are great and you can tell they have put a lot of effort into the game and are comfortable talking to Digital Foundry.
To me its just marketing tour 101 tbh. Its all textbook stuff they say.
@@th3orist Exactly, there is nothing about the game which is new to market apart from gimmicky gamemodes aimed at people who don't know cars, it's a casual xbox racing game, which is fine but i wish they wouldn't claim it to be the best sim or 48X the detail... like really? they are taking pages from the todd Howard playbook XD
@@Barcodez5555no one ever claimed that forza is a sim. It was always a simcade since 2005.
@@PIOVRAME They are marketing it like it's the rebirth of sims lol
@@Barcodez5555name me one game in the last 5 years with a completely unique feature that's never been used before.
love the driveclub music in the background
Damn, what an amazing video. The detailed analysis, the honesty from the development team, and the details that you guys go into are truely first class.
The lighting in this new Forza really is a huge leap over the last game.
Plus, RT in the game at 60fps is truly a new leap for console gaming. They really have managed a miracle in hitting that target.
DF/John, this is another masterpiece of a video. Awesome all round. Loved every second.
Incredible job on this one Digital Foundry! I enjoyed watching this immensely, thank you.
Love these tech breakdown vids!
So glad I came across this video. This type of coverage gives me such a deeper appreciation for what people do to bring us these stunning game experiences. Thanks Digital Foundry and Turn 10!
This isn't coverage. It's a paid promo. Lol. How don't people understand this?
@@gamesandplanes3984 the terms aren’t mutually exclusive, but likely hard to tell from your high horse.
Love that the trees are 3D now! Also, I gotta imagine there's a way to procedurally generate crowds to have more variation, even something as simple as varying the color of their clothing or skin, just so we wouldn't see so many repeats sitting right next to each other. I realize this is a bottom of the barrel priority that will rarely get seen but players, but it's just something that's so jarring when I see it.
Super awesome video! It was really interesting hearing from the team directly
40 minutes of Nerdy Grahics Engine technology by the people actually working on it and not some Marketing dudes. We can watch this for free thanks to DF being acknowledged by these massives studios. Kudos guys
As an avid sim Racer this was one fascinating clip John. Kudos bro great work! 👍
Finally! A Dev that knows how to code for the full suite of the Series X.
Been a forza Motorsport fan since the first game on the original Xbox this looks absolutely amazing and I can’t wait to jump into it.
Same i hope one day they add New york Long and pacific shipyards🥺🫶
Racing games have come so far, i remember playing Pitstop 2 on my Commodore 64 in the 1980's.
Games in general have come a long way, but yes
I remember playing Wec Le Mans on MSX. I used to dream about games looking this good.
@@ozzyg82 I remember having that on the Spectrum+2 👍
My first racing game was Rad Racer for NES , and yes it’s amazing how far its come
First game i ever played 😭 commodore 64 was so amazing
Great video! Turn10 is such an awesome development team
Some of the shots are looking borderline photorealistic
Thanks for the deep dive into it....just makes me more hyped for playing it. Looks like it will be Performance RT mode for me!
Definitely, no serious racing game player wants to play at 30 fps it's awful. 60 fps with Ray Tracing with other compromises such as lower resolution is the way to go, that is how I play other games like Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart on PS5.
Legends. Thank you for covering this and racing games and I can’t wait to get on track.
I'm not big into sim Racing but I've always enjoyed how open and direct Turn10 has been around their technology. Great video as someone who loves this level of detail.
Good thing this isn't Sim racing. Obviously its not NFS but it aint Full blown sim either.
@@shakengandulf Eh you know what I mean. Motorsport and Gran Turismo for all intents and purposes are console sim racers.
@@dougbfresh No problem.
@@shakengandulfYou know what he means smart ass. It's a sim, period. A sim game doesn't have every damn physics law to be a sim.
@@alexv5581We would need quantum computer gaming consoles to achieve that on a hardware level.
The Drive Club OST was so good.
Glad to hear it throughout the video.
the data collection about performance for each part of the track is pretty great
This was a really informative and entertaining interview. I'd love to keep watching these kinds of interview here the devs discuss the technical details as long as their motivations.
Looks great. Also impressive how well FM7 holds up.
I like the change in ethos about car collecting too. I only ever want to drive a small handful of cars in these games, usually stuff I have owned or could imagine owning IRL.
Thank you for this video. I just love those kinda videos, where you can listen to what the developers of a game can talk about their newest iteration.
Fantastic video, great content as with lots of the DFs videos 👏 watched all and didn't stop. Alll 37mims of interesting details about the game and nice presentation too.
Ah yes the data driven performance testing is great to see as a (non gaming) QA engineer! You need that automation and data to know what the problem is and when you’ve regressed.
Thanks for this. I'm not into these games too much but it's always super interesting to learn more about development. I get the impression that this game will have good performance and cool tech.
23:27 WOW la iluminacion y el detalle de los circuitos es increible!
Glad to have dynamic time of day and weather. I wonder if they include wind and how that affects the car. IRL you’ll feel strong winds push the car. Also it would be cool if the roads get full of wet leaves that affects the handling and such but I doubt they will have such details.
Love the interview videos
I honestly hate this modern graphical trend of "everything is a mirror (and wet)". Have these people never seen a race before? Or a car in general? Cars don't reflect perfect images off one another when driving next to each other. The roofs of cars aren't a mirrored shots of the clouds when you see them from above. Just because it's expensive to render doesn't mean it looks good or realistic.
This is the game I’ve been waiting for this year. I can’t wait to get my hands on it. One of my personal criticisms about FM7 was that I thought the environments felt too “sterile.” They didn’t have a lot of detail outside of the race-able area and so I was always reminded that it was only a video game. All of these graphical improvements appear to finally give the sense of driving around a real track with a real audience.
And the icing on the cake was the talk at the end about the “built not bought” car progression.
FANTASTIC work DF!!
Great interview! very insighfull. I love the way high geometry trees looks with RTAO
the return of 3D crowds is nice. I remember going from forza 4 to 5 and one of the first things I noticed was that the crowds had all gone from 3D people to paper cutouts with the occasional 3D person waving a flag.
Xb 360 CPU was very fast for 720p gaming, the slow jag CPU in the xbone was a bad call from MS and the main reason most games ran poor.
@@miguelroman4294the DDR3 ram didn’t help either
@@MinnevanThat was probably its biggest weakness.
Crowds pretty useless, 3D or not, it does not affect me or make any difference to the game, cuz i don't pay attention to them
Yea both 360 and PS4 suffered from that jaguar CPU debacle. It has been said that the Cell on PS3 was faster. Thankfully newer Ryzens are a turn-around for AMD@@miguelroman4294
All they are missing now is having the spectators react to the action on track and the weather like Project Gotham Racing 3 and 4.
Have always been a forza guy and after I got my ps5 I thought gt7 was underwhelming. That all changed with gt7/VR, I really can’t see how forza is going to pull me back without VR.
Looks amazing. Can't wait to get on the track.
Excellent work as always John!
how?? all he did was play clips of other people talking.
them talking to DF means they care
I appreciate the subtle Driveclub music playing in the background :)
Thanks DF for this documentary. Seeing true custom devtools such as that performance investigator is amazing! Kudos to the Forza team for this amazing piece of art. Cant wait for the release and whats next!
20 race tracks, upgrade system that removes all player choice, capped frame rate in multiplayer, and cars being brought over from Xbox 360 era were spotted in content creator previews. I love the Forza Motorsport series, I have been playing it since day 1 on original Xbox, but there are some obvious red flags with this title that I am surprised exist at all. :(
Poor guy 😂
I agree this is not good they need to,do,somethimg about the poor models soon
Forza has reached the uncanny valley version of cars for me. There are times that it looks like real cars racing and then others when it just looks like a video game, colors too vibrant and sharp. I think in 10 years we finally reach actual photo realism for racing games.
Yes something weird going on with the lighting of cars here…..everything too shiny and reflecty, race cars just don’t look like that, real life doesn’t look like that. I was quite disappointed in the visuals shown tbh
No doubt there's some impressive stuff they've done but I'm glad I'm not the only one that feels it still looks a bit off. Something GT7 has absolutely nailed is the way they handle paint simulation, the way paint reacts to lighting, and the materials in car interiors can look pretty photoreal at times. Forza still misses the mark with these three.
@@resetreflectt This Forza is actually more reminiscent of the original and 360 Forza games. They always had a more gamey bold look to them that made the franchise stand out from Gran Turismo. A bit of that was lost last gen in my opinion.
This type of video is unique to your channel and I love it
This was a very interesting watch. Thank you Gents!
This is what Grand Turismo needs... a developer that cares about making something fresh and next gen.
GT7 looks much better than anything Ive seen from Forza footage so far.
@@bigweedonly you're crazy, I'm a huge gt fan and 7 was a rehash.
I know this is a DF video so of course the focus is on the technical aspects but I hope they spent some serious time making the career compelling- something a Forza Motorsports game hasn't been since FM4.
The color of the car next to you reflecting off your paint. Perfect
Thanks DF/T10 for the video, the game is looking 🔥
Kinda sucks that MSAA is removed. Even on the YT footage, FM7 footage looks sharper than the new game. The new game does manage to have less aliasing and less shimmering at places but it just looks blurry. I hope the pc version has optional msaa.
That's cause TAA sucks.
Exactly, I hate when I can’t disable it because developers don’t allow it, I hope that won’t be the case here. Else I have to use heavy super resolution to try to mitigate the blurry mess that will tank the performance and still come out less sharp than native image without TAA
Honestly can’t wait for this game - the last was really cool and immersive.
Fantastic interview! Love these guys.
2 minutes in i got live service vibes though and 15:15 confirmed it. It sounds like you buy car parts to upgrade your car? Little worried
Pre ordered. This was an amazing video can not wait!!!!!
I'm usually a Horizon guy, but I'd love to see how this looks and runs on my computer! It sounds like they're doing the right thing with raytracing and only using it for its strengths.
Hopefully the game is more than just a graphical showcase. The physics and wheel support need to be good as well.
This. The game can look stunningly gorgeous but if I hop in my cockpit with my direct drive wheel and loadcell pedals and the game drives like crap, I’m going right back to gran turismo
@@Frankenslide Yeah, driving is after all the most important thing in a driving game.
oh so you've played it?
If you tweak settings in the game it will probably play and feel similar to gt7 I reckon. main things are turn up road feel, turn down or off wheel damper and use sim steering, other stuff to change too. if you like drifting turn up mechanical trail thing.@@Frankenslide
@@FrankenslideBecause that's definitely how the majority of players will be playing.
Very good video nicely done
I like how they're using driveclub ost for their racing games related videos.
Absolutely looking forward to John's tech review when the game drops. The GT7 review and the DF Retro videos of GT are my favorite DF videos. Extremely well made!
Turn10 and Playground are two of the best game developers in the industry when it comes to creating visually stunning games that run smoothly on a machine. Their games are always highly optimized. Even though FH5 is a last-gen game, it is still one of the most optimized games out there, despite having a memory leak issue. It can push a GPU's performance to its limits, which is something that many other games cannot achieve over time.
4:31 The Driveclub theme took me soooo back 😭Lovely coverage!
From my time spent in iRacing I would agree that I focus on one car at a time since you really have to learn it and I bet most people are doing this so smart decision by devs here to notice that and apply it to latest version of FM.
Lookingbforward to playing it on PC. Also I can hear the Driveclub music in the background. I miss that game.
If their mission was to make a clean, noise and artifact "free" image, they succeeded. But, I am disappointed that the focus wasn't on more photorealism. For example, it appears that in none of the footage, that headlights actually cast shadows from other cars or physical objects. The headlights also don't light up the underside of the cars on the rear, as that "shadow field" seems to be there all the time, regardless of changing lighting. Forza Horizon 4 actually had this shadow casting on quality setting, and on PC it had it affecting other objects too (like roadside fences).
This is where I hate 4K and I hate Raytracing. They are so prioritized over physics and other much more impactful graphical features. This is why I'm glad Starfield went the way it did. The physics simulation and light simulation in that game is absolutely beautiful, without any gimmicks.
Yup something really off about a lot of that footage
I agree about RT, not 4k thought. Soft images is the worst imo. Mjch rather see other things sacrifised than image sharpness. Nothing has a greater impact on image quality than a blury image.
Also, funny you mentioned Starfield's lights, cause within the first 2 min of gameplay the one thing that bothered me was that npc's light didn't cast a shadow from the player - only ither npcs. Really bothered me for some reason :p
RT literally looks LOADS better in every scenario
@@andytaylor1 yeah it looks very "low budget" in that sense. Like an indie Unity game.
Thank you. I hope the actual tech breakdown of the game doesn't ignore the cars missing shadows and GI issues. It's hard to hear what they're saying and take it seriously over this weird looking footage. The game has looked this way all year. 2022's demo looked amazing.
6:49 That’s definitely Modern Vintage Gamer’s doppelgänger! Very similar looking dudes!
In car view is the true racing view
Nice video DF roll on Oct 5th ,🏎️🏁🏆
It's awesome Digital Foundry has such a close relationship with Microsoft, gaining access to Xbox Studios and special previews of their games and hardware
@@Michael-jj8gz
🧂🧂🧂🧂🧂😂
@@Michael-jj8gznot to mention that is a lie and you’re just a salty fanboy
In fairness, it’s DF’s job and a PR hit for MS…. Friendship has nothing to do with it, it’s just business.
For some, DF is either biased towards Sony or towards MS apparently.
It's not even about a close relationship, the dev team wanted to talk about the game and what they've done to it and microsoft went ok
The one gripe I have with the new lighting model is the raised black levels. Most scenes lack good contrast compared to previous Forza titles.
I really hate it when games have too bright blacks. It makes it look really bad, especially in darker scenes
Agreed
totally agree I noticed that straight away
Turn the in game contrast down to suit your tastes
yeah its really jarring. much less punch to the image and I don't really know if its any more "realistic"
I love the ethereal music John puts in his videos. Really immerses you
amazing content. thanks!
Microsoft is always open about Forza tech. I remember a similar video about FH5. Great stuff.
Man rip MSAA. Still the King of AA for me
Man now I’m hyped. Especially there at the end.
This interview was awesome 👏
More excited for this than I was for Starfield
Right on the 💰 and all the right questions asked👍🏻
Big 👏 to DF.
This should be the new standard for all AAA games. Interviews like this one calms the mind👍🏻.
Again insane production value and hat's of to DF👍🏻
Glad they implemented three different display modes. Performance RT definitely seems like the way to go.
Very impressed and surprised Df got to show so much from these guys
Forza is why i game on xbox
Bold of you to use DriveClub music in a Forza video. Possible DF Retro in the future?
Driveclub music on the background is a nice hidden poke))
Still the king of car game visuals.
Awesome review.
I just don't like is the huge TAA focus cause even on my phone with small screen a lot of parts look like a damn lot of vaseline on top, so blurred.
Guess it's one of those I have to use AMD sharpening with way overblown sharpness for my eyes to stand it.
Hope AA can be disabled and doesn't look broken like some games.
I'm glad they finally moved on to volumetric clouds, i hope the Forza Horizon games will do the same. Most other engines/games have moved on to volumetric for a good reason.
They don't take up nearly as much space, they are 100% customizable/adaptive, can interact with light and weather systems and they don't need a team of people taking hundreds of hours of capture.
They "stole" it from Playground Games. Forza Horizon 5 was first game that uses Forzatech to have them.
@@UltraCasualPenguinBoth of them share tech with eachother.
@@UltraCasualPenguin Horizon 5 still uses the old ForzaTech
Well you still need a lot of capture, hahaha, but yeah the process is definitely less tedious.
@@RanielEber FH5 doesn't use same cloud system that was used in FM7.
Love this kind of video. Do more 👏👏
Awesome coverage! Makes me even more excited for the 40min technical deep dive on the upcoming F-Zero!
Fzero was announced?
@@dnegel9546 Leaked. To be announced in the upcoming direct.
@@julealgon ......
@@PrinceVegetaBrief What.
@@julealgon You were expecting a real F-Zero, weren't you?
To me everything except the cars themselves look great. I can't put my finger on it, it's either the texture material for the car paint or the way the light interacts with these painted surfaces and glass windows and headlights that make the cars look decidedly last gen. In many shots they look like they belong in a mobile game. It is really baffling to me because I played Forza Horizon 5 for 200+ hours and the cars in that game never looked this bad to me.
The models are not rescanned. The rule is, whichever game they first appeared in, it's the exact same model with some texture and lighting tricks, but the underlying geometry is the same. Hence they look dated, most car models are from the Xbox 360 games.
@@nO_d3N1AL it shows
@nO_d3N1AL yeah their cars polygonal count is noticeably lower than that of cars from GT7 and even GT Sport. GT cars always seem to be extremely high end in detail.
I'm Series S and hope it looks and plays good
Of course it will it's turned 10
Sharing that much information in such an open way. Respect!
The Indian lady's accent was very cute. She struggled with pronouncing the gpu jargons that we take for granted.
Looking forward to it. Whenever i play a new Forza game i like to load up my Lo-Fi Playlist and just cruise. Its so relaxing.