The Donnager is smaller but the most advanced and powerful out of all of them. Had they knew they were up against advanced stealth ships and taken the fight seriously they would’ve won.
Well, the missile is expected to carry a shitload of megatons in warheads pretty fast across the system, accelerating all the way in, possibly with evasive maneuvers. I assume Delta V, even with an Epstein drive, takes some space.
Makes sense though. Ships in the Expanse are purposely limited in terms of acceleration to ensure the humans aboard don't die. A missile can just go A LOT faster because it doesn't have squishy meatbags to transport. Instead, the whole point is to blow said squishy meatbags up :D
One thing that surprised me is the lack of bomb pumped weapons technology - we've known the practicals of such tech as early as the 1960s, see "Casaba Howitzer"
pretty sure the books say it's about 3.5km long, but the show made it a lot smaller it's not really uncommon, for example in the books Ceres has 10M people and Eros has 1.5M, while in the show Ceres has about 1M and Eros has 100K
@@nddragoon In the books the Canterbury is only about 1km and the Nauvoo is twice as long. But the huge difference is most of the "insid"e of the Canterbury is open to space (and not habitable). The Nauvoo though is almost all habitable.
Hope we see an updated one with ships from Se4/5, esp Barba Picola, Edward Israel, DeWalt, Pella, Zmeya, Chetzemoka, etc, as well as maybe soke smaller stuff like the UNN Air Force One, the Savage Industries spider bot + torpedo, the Revetta Bowers, etc. So many cool deaigns lately.
Ok is nobody else floored the unn defense railgun is literally bigger than the rocinante? “We have a badass ship” “We have a gun bigger than your badass ship” You don’t even have to stress a stem to stern shot with that thing even holing a ship sideways will probably tag the reactor
Makes sense, a present day container ship or supertanker is way bigger than Nimitz class carriers. Nowhere as fast, nowhere as resilient to damage, but when hauling cargo, efficiency is king.
so its the Roci.. the bridge and mechanic shop sets dont fit inside a 46m Rocinante.. specially considering the ship is suposed to have double hull and at least half meter space between hulls
It looks bigger on the show for cinematic effect and to give the camera crews more room to move around. If any vessel you see in the series were real it would be far more cramped inside. Even the corridors and CIC of the Donnager.
@@chrisdanelon Oh badass! Keep doing good work on this awesome show! Got my hopes up that the models might be publically available but I guess I gotta keep searching for fanmade stuff...
The Rocinante from the expanse is 46 meters vs 50 for the upper stage SpaceX Starship. I believe Starship it is about the same width, or a little wider. So we could at least get an interplanetary ship the size of the Rocinante within the next 10-20 years.
Sure but I don't think it could transport people. New research has come out that at this moment humans cannot survive a trip to Mars because of the galactic radiation effects on the kidneys. So that problem will need to be solved if we want humans in long distance spaceships.
@@chrisdanelon I am highly skeptical this is a deal breaker, and that there is not an engineering solution for this problem. My skepticism does not come from my engineering background or having taken courses in aeronautical engineering and modern physics in college. I admit my experience in engineering has mostly been in component manufacturing, or designing facility layouts. And my understanding of the engineering around these issues is mostly limited to reading Zubrin ideas to get around this issue in his Case for Mars book. My skepticism comes from the fact that I only hear about this being a reason starship won’t work from left leaning anti Musk sources. Like channels that clearly have a leftwing anti Musk Bias, and where the people leaving comments seem quick to jump on board with anything that could thwart Elon Musk business goals. I have several friends that vote democrat that all started really hating Musk when he purchased Twitter in 2022, and I find there views on him now to be interesting from a sociological standpoint. It’s wild that you know with about a 90 precent accuracy what someone’s political ideology is based on weather they think space travel to mars in a SpaceX Starship is viable. People have been saying the same thing about solar radiation for years, and they tend to have the same collectivist mindset. It’s probably true that the Apollo mission that missed a sun storm by I believe a few weeks probably really lucked out. And that we didn’t know as much back then. But that does not mean we can’t design around these problems. The nay sayers made a big point in the 1990’s about not being able to get to Mars because of solar radiation particularly from storms. But Zubrin came up with a simple solution. There could be a central room in the craft with extra supplies and everything being transported stored around it. You would be able to get an alert from earth a few minutes before the storm hit the craft as the charged particular don’t move as fast as light, and nasa would see the solar flare developing before it goes off. The crew would have to stay in the center of the ship for several hours or possibly a day or two. But it’s not an end of mission problem. I have not heard any real discussions about why you can’t engineer around galactic radiation that isn’t biased from a source that seems to only want to make Musk look bad. I could be wrong, and maybe these new findings prove it’s it is impractical without some futuristic deflector shield technology. But I doubt it.
Maybe it's accurate to the show, but they seem too small in relation to Holden. There just isn't enough room for people plus engines, plus anything else that you see on the show. Unless they are bigger on the inside?
I thought the Arboghast was way bigger. The main control room basically takes up more than half of the ship. That's just bad design. Also, the Nauvoo/Behemoth kind of loses it's claim on being one of a kind when it's only about four times the size of the Canterbury, which they refer to multiple times as an outdated piece of crap. It's not even a ship as much as it is a gigantic floating drum that can sort of move around. Turning Eros into something other than a weird rock was a much greater achievement of engineering. I'd also have been curious about the size of the Y Que(the belter slingshot racer ship that caused the ring to activate) since it had barely anything in the way of reference points. I always pictured it as the size of a small van, but I could be wrong. Great video, though.
The fact that it's an outdated piece of crap doesn't mean it has to be small. In the books it's mentioned the Cant is a pre-Epstein colony ship used to transport people to the outer planets that was retrofitted with Epstein Drives to haul ice from Saturn to Ceres. A colony ship from the time before the epstein drive would've taken much longer to get from earth to the outer planets and thus would've needed to be much larger, and for hauling enough ice to support 10M people on Ceres you need a ship that is big as fuck, otherwise you'd need thousands of small ships, which just wouldn't make economic sense.
Arboghast is for scientific research, it doesn't need space for weapon, cargo or armor. The Cant is big but mostly empty. It will be just like a giant cargo ship today, with a very small living area compared to the size of the ship. The Y-que is probably similar to Razorback
@@g.waldmeister1851 Which kind of illustrates my point: if they have the ability to build O'Neil colonies, then why aren't they all over the solar system? They would provide a much happier, healthier environment. I realize the Belters have to be miserable for the story, and Mars has to be fanatical about terraforming, but you'd at least expect to see some habs in L4 and L5 around earth, right? Why go all the way to ganymede for food when you could just build a hab in the belt and grow it there?
@@mahatmarandy5977, yeah, you're completely right, it would make sense. All I can offer is speculation myself. Maybe with Mars and Earth in an arms race and the first one spending what little resources they have left on terraforming, building O'Neill-type space stations is either deemed too expensive or not practical? Because we are talking about habitats first and foremost, most space stations we see in The Expanse are commercial or transportation hubs. Remember, the Mormons pretty much spend all the money they had on the Nauvoo, because they never planned on getting back. But a singular O'Neill-type space station in the Belt would be really cool as a vacation destination or something.
@@g.waldmeister1851 Thinking it through from an out-of-universe story perspective, basically things need to be the way they are or else the story doesn't work. You need a certain level of discomfort in the story to goose people along to do the things they do. From an in-universe perspective, it's a bit harder to figure. If they've got the resources, time, and money to colonize Mars and begin terraforming *BEFORE* they've got the Epstein drive, then they certainly have the capabilities to build an O'Neil. Probably the most likely reason is that it was a political decision: The UN could go all-in on Terraforming, or they could do orbital habitats, but could't do both, so they decided on Terraforming, and maybe even passed laws opposing O'Neill Habitats so as not to make people question the Terraforming project. We have seen a certain degree of fanaticism around Terraforming on the show.
I'd actually propose an entirely practical in-universe explanation for this which is that in-universe the largest construction station in orbit around any body is Tycho Station and it certainly wasn't equipped to handle a construction project of considerable size until the Mormons decided to hire them to build Nauvoo. Considering the sheer size that a Space Habitat as you describe would have to be to house many people, it would certainly have to be constructed in space since I'm assuming one large enough to house a million people and that simply wouldn't be capable of being launched into space from planetary surface. Tycho is likely the only place it could be built. Prior to the Nauvoo, they simply didn't have the ambition or resources and following the Nauvoo...well, they're at war.
@@breakingbadatron8874 Nope, that is not her, if you are referring to the last shot in the last episode. That is another thing, but very much connected to "Heart of The Tempest" :)
An extremely poor Fantasy that does not go beyond the images of "Star Wars" and computer games! In any case, it is necessary to read the text with the description of the technique more accurately.
If you enjoyed this video you might also like a VR demo I made called The Rocinante Experience: ua-cam.com/video/wY1GdqlBjtw/v-deo.html
The banana for scale is greatly appreciated.
I really wanted to put things into perspective.
That's what she said...
@@chrisdanelon Shoulda done a nice cup of coffee
I would have preferred the SpaceX Starship placed in there as well as the Burj Khalifa.
The banana is perfect to compare to the Donnager!
Canterbury really surprised me ..never thought it would be that big....i thought it was smaller than MCRN donnager .
It's basically a giant empty cargo container welded to an Epstein drive. That whole big rectangular part is the bay where they store ice for shipping.
@@Comrade.Question it was converted, but not 100 years ago. Back then it was one of the first ships to carry people to the belt.
makes sense, todays cargo vessels are also larger then the biggest warships sailing around...
The Donnager is smaller but the most advanced and powerful out of all of them. Had they knew they were up against advanced stealth ships and taken the fight seriously they would’ve won.
I love how a thermonuclear warhead is bigger than a full on racing ship with integrated life support and Epstein drive.
Well, the missile is expected to carry a shitload of megatons in warheads pretty fast across the system, accelerating all the way in, possibly with evasive maneuvers. I assume Delta V, even with an Epstein drive, takes some space.
Makes sense though. Ships in the Expanse are purposely limited in terms of acceleration to ensure the humans aboard don't die. A missile can just go A LOT faster because it doesn't have squishy meatbags to transport. Instead, the whole point is to blow said squishy meatbags up :D
That is the ground launched interplanetary missiles, not the ship to ship nuclear torpedoes. It makes sense.
When you gotta kill the guy, the guy next to the guy, and the moon that they live on.
One thing that surprised me is the lack of bomb pumped weapons technology - we've known the practicals of such tech as early as the 1960s, see "Casaba Howitzer"
The Navoo is kind of big. But we can see this only because we have the banana!
🍌
"Remember the Cant!"
I'm a simple man, I see the expanse I click on it !
👍🤣
It is great. Somewhere people argued how did the Rocinante fit inside the Donnager. Now we can see: easily.
I know right. This video really helps.
Never knew that the cant is that big
Remember the cant
pretty sure the books say it's about 3.5km long, but the show made it a lot smaller
it's not really uncommon, for example in the books Ceres has 10M people and Eros has 1.5M, while in the show Ceres has about 1M and Eros has 100K
@@nddragoon In the books the Canterbury is only about 1km and the Nauvoo is twice as long. But the huge difference is most of the "insid"e of the Canterbury is open to space (and not habitable). The Nauvoo though is almost all habitable.
@@nanderson423 almost all of the a nauvoo is inhabitable. The drum isn't solid
@@snonsig2688 The hollow space in between the center and the outer ring isn't technically "inside" the Nauvoo though
Hope we see an updated one with ships from Se4/5, esp Barba Picola, Edward Israel, DeWalt, Pella, Zmeya, Chetzemoka, etc, as well as maybe soke smaller stuff like the UNN Air Force One, the Savage Industries spider bot + torpedo, the Revetta Bowers, etc. So many cool deaigns lately.
And heart of the tempest and the gathering storm
The fact the mormons built the biggest thing in the solar system is crazy.
Looks like the Cant can hold way more bananas than I ever imagined!
Also many UNN Holdens
Should of had Tycho station as the last one.
Tycho station is smaller than the Behemoth/Nauvoo
Thank You for this meditation on the greatest Sci fi series ever
This was excellent. Happy you made it. The music wasn't even obnoxious. :)
Thanks, stay tuned I got more in the works
i had no idea james holden was a ship. damn lol
Canterberry was HUGEE
yup!!! ua-cam.com/video/vkztAy7QZoA/v-deo.html
North Front does amazing work. Thanks for this wonderful video!
Thank you for the support!!
All that was missing was the Protogen stealth ships and maybe Epstein’s yacht
and the Morrigan class patrol boat.. or the Leonidas class battleship.. frequent screen holders
Where'd he get the banana? Is it just for scale?
banana is for scale reference
@@chrisdanelon is it a stealth banana?
@@arthurfisher1857 why yes
Shoulda been a cup of coffee
protobananana
Wish this had the ring and station as their scale always confuses me in my head.
Beautiful!! Would've loved to see Tycho station and the ring... Also, banana scale gave sense to the whole thing.
I've a feeling the Nauvoo/Behemoth/Medina is even bigger than Tycho.
@@mcallisterwill I agree
Whoa, I never realized how comparatively teeny tiny the Rosci is. And the Cant could eat the Donnager.
Great video!
I really thought the Donnager was bigger than the Cant. At least that's the impression you get in the first book.
Ok is nobody else floored the unn defense railgun is literally bigger than the rocinante?
“We have a badass ship”
“We have a gun bigger than your badass ship”
You don’t even have to stress a stem to stern shot with that thing even holing a ship sideways will probably tag the reactor
I would like to see one of these with the space stations. Asteroids, moons, and ships.
Cool. I did not realize the Canterbury was that big. hauling Ice I suppose it would have to be.
Makes sense, a present day container ship or supertanker is way bigger than Nimitz class carriers. Nowhere as fast, nowhere as resilient to damage, but when hauling cargo, efficiency is king.
The Razorback has to be a bit bigger than that, form the inside shots in the film
so its the Roci.. the bridge and mechanic shop sets dont fit inside a 46m Rocinante.. specially considering the ship is suposed to have double hull and at least half meter space between hulls
It looks bigger on the show for cinematic effect and to give the camera crews more room to move around. If any vessel you see in the series were real it would be far more cramped inside. Even the corridors and CIC of the Donnager.
MCRN stealth ship ,i think its the missile platform
Thank you! That puts my place in the universe in perspective. :-0
Where did you get the models for this?
How big is the ring compared to things like ceres or ships
The ring has a diameter of 1000 km and the Nauvoo (the largest ship in this video) is 2.07 km
Dang this is awesome! How do you get your hands on the models?
I work on the production.
@@chrisdanelon Oh badass! Keep doing good work on this awesome show! Got my hopes up that the models might be publically available but I guess I gotta keep searching for fanmade stuff...
Fantástico!!! Obrigada!
Wish we'd gotten a model of the Truman-class as well.
1:20
The Rocinante from the expanse is 46 meters vs 50 for the upper stage SpaceX Starship. I believe Starship it is about the same width, or a little wider. So we could at least get an interplanetary ship the size of the Rocinante within the next 10-20 years.
Sure but I don't think it could transport people. New research has come out that at this moment humans cannot survive a trip to Mars because of the galactic radiation effects on the kidneys. So that problem will need to be solved if we want humans in long distance spaceships.
@@chrisdanelon I am highly skeptical this is a deal breaker, and that there is not an engineering solution for this problem. My skepticism does not come from my engineering background or having taken courses in aeronautical engineering and modern physics in college. I admit my experience in engineering has mostly been in component manufacturing, or designing facility layouts. And my understanding of the engineering around these issues is mostly limited to reading Zubrin ideas to get around this issue in his Case for Mars book.
My skepticism comes from the fact that I only hear about this being a reason starship won’t work from left leaning anti Musk sources.
Like channels that clearly have a leftwing anti Musk Bias, and where the people leaving comments seem quick to jump on board with anything that could thwart Elon Musk business goals. I have several friends that vote democrat that all started really hating Musk when he purchased Twitter in 2022, and I find there views on him now to be interesting from a sociological standpoint.
It’s wild that you know with about a 90 precent accuracy what someone’s political ideology is based on weather they think space travel to mars in a SpaceX Starship is viable.
People have been saying the same thing about solar radiation for years, and they tend to have the same collectivist mindset.
It’s probably true that the Apollo mission that missed a sun storm by I believe a few weeks probably really lucked out. And that we didn’t know as much back then. But that does not mean we can’t design around these problems.
The nay sayers made a big point in the 1990’s about not being able to get to Mars because of solar radiation particularly from storms. But Zubrin came up with a simple solution. There could be a central room in the craft with extra supplies and everything being transported stored around it. You would be able to get an alert from earth a few minutes before the storm hit the craft as the charged particular don’t move as fast as light, and nasa would see the solar flare developing before it goes off.
The crew would have to stay in the center of the ship for several hours or possibly a day or two. But it’s not an end of mission problem. I have not heard any real discussions about why you can’t engineer around galactic radiation that isn’t biased from a source that seems to only want to make Musk look bad.
I could be wrong, and maybe these new findings prove it’s it is impractical without some futuristic deflector shield technology. But I doubt it.
Brilliant thank you .
Mi favorita la rocinante 😀
Maybe it's accurate to the show, but they seem too small in relation to Holden. There just isn't enough room for people plus engines, plus anything else that you see on the show. Unless they are bigger on the inside?
How is Rocinante being 46 m in height, able to carry dozens of torpedoes when the torpedoes themselves be 24ish?
Those Torpedoes are not the ones the Roci carries, the Roci carries much smaller warheads
Holden had to do it to em’
The missiles seem out of scale because at their size, the Rocinante would be unable to carry any missiles at all.
the Roci's torpedos are much smaller than those missiles.
The Nauvoo Really deserve the name of "behemoth"
What's this song???
Senpai Ru - Ala persona
What is this?! A spaceship for ants who can't read good?!!
I thought the Arboghast was way bigger.
The main control room basically takes up more than half of the ship. That's just bad design.
Also, the Nauvoo/Behemoth kind of loses it's claim on being one of a kind when it's only about four times the size of the Canterbury, which they refer to multiple times as an outdated piece of crap. It's not even a ship as much as it is a gigantic floating drum that can sort of move around. Turning Eros into something other than a weird rock was a much greater achievement of engineering.
I'd also have been curious about the size of the Y Que(the belter slingshot racer ship that caused the ring to activate) since it had barely anything in the way of reference points. I always pictured it as the size of a small van, but I could be wrong.
Great video, though.
The fact that it's an outdated piece of crap doesn't mean it has to be small. In the books it's mentioned the Cant is a pre-Epstein colony ship used to transport people to the outer planets that was retrofitted with Epstein Drives to haul ice from Saturn to Ceres.
A colony ship from the time before the epstein drive would've taken much longer to get from earth to the outer planets and thus would've needed to be much larger, and for hauling enough ice to support 10M people on Ceres you need a ship that is big as fuck, otherwise you'd need thousands of small ships, which just wouldn't make economic sense.
Arboghast is for scientific research, it doesn't need space for weapon, cargo or armor. The Cant is big but mostly empty. It will be just like a giant cargo ship today, with a very small living area compared to the size of the ship. The Y-que is probably similar to Razorback
Why not just mark it as UNN Truman-Class?
I thought people might be more familiar with the actual name(s) of the ship. Maybe next time I'll do that.
@@chrisdanelon The names mean something to me, the classes do not so I appreciate the choice you made.
Drummer has the big drum. 🙆♂️
ah yes my favorite ship, James Holden
So cool!
Thanks :D
didnt think the Canterbury was this large
Where is the Tynan tho...
I've often wondered why there's no O'Neil-style space habitats in The Expanse.
But that's what the Nauvoo is.
@@g.waldmeister1851 Which kind of illustrates my point: if they have the ability to build O'Neil colonies, then why aren't they all over the solar system? They would provide a much happier, healthier environment. I realize the Belters have to be miserable for the story, and Mars has to be fanatical about terraforming, but you'd at least expect to see some habs in L4 and L5 around earth, right?
Why go all the way to ganymede for food when you could just build a hab in the belt and grow it there?
@@mahatmarandy5977, yeah, you're completely right, it would make sense. All I can offer is speculation myself. Maybe with Mars and Earth in an arms race and the first one spending what little resources they have left on terraforming, building O'Neill-type space stations is either deemed too expensive or not practical? Because we are talking about habitats first and foremost, most space stations we see in The Expanse are commercial or transportation hubs. Remember, the Mormons pretty much spend all the money they had on the Nauvoo, because they never planned on getting back.
But a singular O'Neill-type space station in the Belt would be really cool as a vacation destination or something.
@@g.waldmeister1851 Thinking it through from an out-of-universe story perspective, basically things need to be the way they are or else the story doesn't work. You need a certain level of discomfort in the story to goose people along to do the things they do.
From an in-universe perspective, it's a bit harder to figure. If they've got the resources, time, and money to colonize Mars and begin terraforming *BEFORE* they've got the Epstein drive, then they certainly have the capabilities to build an O'Neil.
Probably the most likely reason is that it was a political decision: The UN could go all-in on Terraforming, or they could do orbital habitats, but could't do both, so they decided on Terraforming, and maybe even passed laws opposing O'Neill Habitats so as not to make people question the Terraforming project. We have seen a certain degree of fanaticism around Terraforming on the show.
I'd actually propose an entirely practical in-universe explanation for this which is that in-universe the largest construction station in orbit around any body is Tycho Station and it certainly wasn't equipped to handle a construction project of considerable size until the Mormons decided to hire them to build Nauvoo. Considering the sheer size that a Space Habitat as you describe would have to be to house many people, it would certainly have to be constructed in space since I'm assuming one large enough to house a million people and that simply wouldn't be capable of being launched into space from planetary surface. Tycho is likely the only place it could be built. Prior to the Nauvoo, they simply didn't have the ambition or resources and following the Nauvoo...well, they're at war.
What about the Laconian Ships :)
haha maybe one day
Season 6 there should be the Proteus... and then season 7 for the crystal space whales!
@@patrickhenry1249 they hadn't announced that season 6 would the last tv season when I made that comment. No words what their plans are now
nice plus loved the music
Very cool. anyone know the song?
Senpai Ru - Ala persona
MORE ABOUT THAT MEGA BANANA PLEASE
Sounds good
Ever felt small before?
you forgot the ring.
источник энергии для всего этого ?
В книгах наверно более подробно останавливались на этом моменте, чем в сериале.
@@shizikbruev ну да ... в сериале не заморачивались точно.
@@маркмеррц я только один момент помню, когда упоминали двигатель Эпштейна это когда Наоми Нагато сваливала от Марко Инаруса в самом начале и всё).
Wait, how big is that banana though?
banana sized
Banán for scale? Are you from imgur my friend?
Bananas are the most logical thing for scale reference. Most people know how big a banana is.
I thought the Rocinante would be a bit more bigger.
The Roci needs to fit inside the Donnager and it's a Light Frigate class, so that might explain the size.
@@chrisdanelon i assume the interior sets as designed don't fit into the exterior dimensions. i know that's true for at least the Razorback.
@@thontor I'm thinking about doing a video about that topic.
@@chrisdanelon I would love to see that
The behemoth is big af
wow
Wait til you see the size of 'The heart of the tempest"
What's that? O_o
@@andreagrazianodibenedetto1464 you might see it next season, big might
@@breakingbadatron8874 ah okay, sounds like the mothership of the Laconian Empire ^^
@@andreagrazianodibenedetto1464 I think we just saw she :')
@@breakingbadatron8874 Nope, that is not her, if you are referring to the last shot in the last episode. That is another thing, but very much connected to "Heart of The Tempest" :)
Можно ссылку на музыку? Сериал реально крут
remember the CANT beltalowda ✊✊
Damn! I thought Cant is the same size as Rocinante. It's even taller than Burj Khalifa.
Construction is easier in space with no gravity or atmosphere to worry about
what is a missle?
A spelling mistake, (can't spell)
Remember the CANT
Behimonth
Only those who read the books know)
Meh.. Warhammer 40k ships are larger which smallest of them are larger than the largest ship in this video
please tell me there is a banana for scale reference
@@chrisdanelon you mean custodes?
@@whiteeye9584 I mean a banana or any other plantain. If they were holding a banana that could work too.
I would like to see a custodes holding a banana, standing next to Holden... for scale
Гора родила мыш.....
I bet his banana is quite bigger
Серьезно?Нахера эта еще заморочка?
Много свободного времени). А так фанатам сериала будет интересно).
An extremely poor Fantasy that does not go beyond the images of "Star Wars" and computer games!
In any case, it is necessary to read the text with the description of the technique more accurately.
What the hell are you even trying to say?
dont put that annoying music pls
When I put The Expanse music the video gets copyright claimed, thus I have to use UA-cam's music.
@@chrisdanelon The music's fine.