I heard you can dress that wheel. Do you know the coating thickness. With all your chains that you have how many do you use the 10° tilt That looks like a 511 clone grinder. This is where Stihl USG grinder has a metal template and the template is asymmetrical so you dress one side to a radius 2.6 Radius for 5.2mm file. I still like the original Oregon 511 AX grinder You explained it well. Flat section of the wheel is good for Hexa V-Cut shapes. You could do a video on that
@@ChainsawUsers The coating is thin and the profile is machined into the steel. It could be possible to change it but I wouldn't bother, it works well how it is Every round chain, excluding chipper, I use tilt. I have narrowed it down to a shape that works best for me and just stick with it. Everything has a reduced side plate - 75-80 for full, 80-90 for semi
In the case of ABN/CBN (or diamond) wheels, or at least those used for chain sharpening, “dressing” is more like cleaning. You don't try to change the shape. Dinasaw has an accessory called Dinasaw Cleaning Stick. The abrasive used there, as in some Tecomec grinding wheels, is silicon carbide. "It effectively breaks down and removes the glaze on ABN and Diamond Grinding Wheels without damaging the wheel’s structure." _Dressing the grinding wheel consists of re-sharpening the small, cutting edges of the wheel’s surface by fracturing the grains in order to create sharp edges. The space in between the grains are also cleaned out, removing material that has clogged the wheel’s face_ The grinder in the video is similar to 511A (or 510A). 511AX differs from 511A in that it has a sliding vise, which 511A does not have. 520 has replaced 511AX in the current range. To get the down angle, the 511AX/520 manual (or other Tecomec grinders with tilting and sliding vices) uses tilting the vise. Sliding vise is used for correction related to the decreasing size of the grinding wheel. Personally, I do not recommend grinding with the flat part of the wheel, if only because of the difficulty of “refreshing” this surface.
I’d think that you’d want to setup the wheel AND grinder to emulate the results of properly handfiled chain. In other words: part of what you’d do is let the wheel simulate a file being used and adjust the grinder for the same outcome. 🤨☹️🤔
@@ToddAdams1234 The extra tilt angle (say 50 instead of 60) is to allow the profiled radius of the wheel to fit in there and form a shape closer to a file. Most people just bring the wheel in at whatever angle they want to the end results to be and run the wheel down lower. It works ok until you need to file the chain. To get it to match the file's profile is the tricky part. Again I'm not the best person to show this because my filing / grinding is different to what most people use
The gullet is NOT irrelevant. The chain has TWO jobs. 1: cut the wood 2: transport the wood chips out of the log. The tooth will keep cutting until the gullet is full of chips which will then lift the tooth off the wood. The tooth will then be able to release its load of chips when it comes free of the wood. It follows that the more available space in the gullet, the longer the tooth will cut and the faster the cut will be completed.
@@bjertnestrefelling8839 That's not how saw chain works. Chips are dropped out of the back of the cutter in the space under the top plate, aptly named the chip channel, and are then carried out on the blank straps between the cutters. It's why depth gauges are called rakers or drags, because they rake / drag the chips out. It's why skip chain is used to improve chip clearance on long chains The gullet on saw chain does not work like a true gullet on something like a cross cut saw. On saw chain it is a space between the depth gauge and cutter so we can put a file / grinding wheel in there. It's probably the least important part of a saw chain due to the clearance angles of a cutter, only the very top of the side plate cuts wood. The exception to this is old chipper chain with a large radius side plate
@@SawChainTheories I was too lazy to comment earlier after watching the video, but in this case I agree with the OP. It's an oversimplification to say that the gullet doesn't matter. _The gullet is a necessary space required in wood chip formation, transportation and egression from the cutting kerf. The gullet space may be optimized for cutting performance_ I know that Oregon uses e.g. such a parameter as the 'chip drag coefficient', which I have not yet explored, but to determine it some dimensions of the cutter link are used. I would love it if the Oregon folks, e.g., on some of the next 'WestCoast Saw' videos, would say something more about this for us mortals. PS I've written about this before, but you can give yourself an experiment that was standard in the early days of saw chains development. Cut a cookie and somewhere in the middle stop the engine/motor, then gently, for example, with a chisel cut a part of it off to see the cutters stopped during operation and where the chips are.
@@SawChainTheories Guess it is just strange that a chain cuts faster with opened gullet then... I certainly see a change in my chains. And: chips are generally wider than the passage between the side plate and the log, with makes the passage trough some of a squeeze
@@bjertnestrefelling8839all sawchain does jump and squeeze to cut. that's why you can see depth gauge tilt to outside a little bit for going straight. old chain or big forestry machine chain doesn't have that. almost chips go behind of the cutter throughout inside of the cutter, but some chips stay gullet. stihl nallow kerf 325 pro apeals opened gullet as feature showing on the reel box.
@@bjertnestrefelling8839 If it works best for you then keep doing it. I was a bit harsh in what I was saying but I keep getting chains where people have focused on filing the gullet and complaining that it doesn't cut. They have completely missed the upper section that does the cutting. If you have a system that works for you, keep doing it. I cut wood types that produce small chips and it doesn't make a difference here. You can leave it in while using the smaller 3 square files without an issue. In wood types that form longer chips, it may have an effect but it's not something I can test. We appear to be on opposite sides of the world cutting different types of trees, what works for me may not work for you
💯
Most chain grinding videos I’ve seen, people get this wrong and grind to the gullet
Great content
I heard you can dress that wheel. Do you know the coating thickness.
With all your chains that you have how many do you use the 10° tilt
That looks like a 511 clone grinder.
This is where Stihl USG grinder has a metal template and the template is asymmetrical so you dress one side to a radius 2.6 Radius for 5.2mm file.
I still like the original Oregon 511 AX grinder
You explained it well.
Flat section of the wheel is good for Hexa V-Cut shapes.
You could do a video on that
@@ChainsawUsers The coating is thin and the profile is machined into the steel. It could be possible to change it but I wouldn't bother, it works well how it is
Every round chain, excluding chipper, I use tilt. I have narrowed it down to a shape that works best for me and just stick with it. Everything has a reduced side plate - 75-80 for full, 80-90 for semi
In the case of ABN/CBN (or diamond) wheels, or at least those used for chain sharpening, “dressing” is more like cleaning. You don't try to change the shape. Dinasaw has an accessory called Dinasaw Cleaning Stick. The abrasive used there, as in some Tecomec grinding wheels, is silicon carbide.
"It effectively breaks down and removes the glaze on ABN and
Diamond Grinding Wheels without damaging the wheel’s structure."
_Dressing the grinding wheel consists of re-sharpening the small, cutting edges of the wheel’s surface by fracturing the grains in order to create sharp edges. The space in between the grains are also cleaned out, removing material that has clogged the wheel’s face_
The grinder in the video is similar to 511A (or 510A). 511AX differs from 511A in that it has a sliding vise, which 511A does not have. 520 has replaced 511AX in the current range.
To get the down angle, the 511AX/520 manual (or other Tecomec grinders with tilting and sliding vices) uses tilting the vise. Sliding vise is used for correction related to the decreasing size of the grinding wheel.
Personally, I do not recommend grinding with the flat part of the wheel, if only because of the difficulty of “refreshing” this surface.
I’d think that you’d want to setup the wheel AND grinder to emulate the results of properly handfiled chain. In other words: part of what you’d do is let the wheel simulate a file being used and adjust the grinder for the same outcome. 🤨☹️🤔
@@ToddAdams1234 The extra tilt angle (say 50 instead of 60) is to allow the profiled radius of the wheel to fit in there and form a shape closer to a file.
Most people just bring the wheel in at whatever angle they want to the end results to be and run the wheel down lower. It works ok until you need to file the chain. To get it to match the file's profile is the tricky part.
Again I'm not the best person to show this because my filing / grinding is different to what most people use
The gullet is NOT irrelevant. The chain has TWO jobs. 1: cut the wood 2: transport the wood chips out of the log.
The tooth will keep cutting until the gullet is full of chips which will then lift the tooth off the wood. The tooth will then be able to release its load of chips when it comes free of the wood.
It follows that the more available space in the gullet, the longer the tooth will cut and the faster the cut will be completed.
@@bjertnestrefelling8839 That's not how saw chain works. Chips are dropped out of the back of the cutter in the space under the top plate, aptly named the chip channel, and are then carried out on the blank straps between the cutters.
It's why depth gauges are called rakers or drags, because they rake / drag the chips out. It's why skip chain is used to improve chip clearance on long chains
The gullet on saw chain does not work like a true gullet on something like a cross cut saw. On saw chain it is a space between the depth gauge and cutter so we can put a file / grinding wheel in there. It's probably the least important part of a saw chain due to the clearance angles of a cutter, only the very top of the side plate cuts wood. The exception to this is old chipper chain with a large radius side plate
@@SawChainTheories
I was too lazy to comment earlier after watching the video, but in this case I agree with the OP. It's an oversimplification to say that the gullet doesn't matter.
_The gullet is a necessary space required in wood chip formation, transportation and egression from the cutting kerf. The gullet space may be optimized for cutting performance_
I know that Oregon uses e.g. such a parameter as the 'chip drag coefficient', which I have not yet explored, but to determine it some dimensions of the cutter link are used.
I would love it if the Oregon folks, e.g., on some of the next 'WestCoast Saw' videos, would say something more about this for us mortals.
PS
I've written about this before, but you can give yourself an experiment that was standard in the early days of saw chains development. Cut a cookie and somewhere in the middle stop the engine/motor, then gently, for example, with a chisel cut a part of it off to see the cutters stopped during operation and where the chips are.
@@SawChainTheories Guess it is just strange that a chain cuts faster with opened gullet then... I certainly see a change in my chains. And: chips are generally wider than the passage between the side plate and the log, with makes the passage trough some of a squeeze
@@bjertnestrefelling8839all sawchain does jump and squeeze to cut. that's why you can see depth gauge tilt to outside a little bit for going straight. old chain or big forestry machine chain doesn't have that.
almost chips go behind of the cutter throughout inside of the cutter, but some chips stay gullet. stihl nallow kerf 325 pro apeals opened gullet as feature showing on the reel box.
@@bjertnestrefelling8839 If it works best for you then keep doing it. I was a bit harsh in what I was saying but I keep getting chains where people have focused on filing the gullet and complaining that it doesn't cut. They have completely missed the upper section that does the cutting.
If you have a system that works for you, keep doing it. I cut wood types that produce small chips and it doesn't make a difference here. You can leave it in while using the smaller 3 square files without an issue.
In wood types that form longer chips, it may have an effect but it's not something I can test. We appear to be on opposite sides of the world cutting different types of trees, what works for me may not work for you