Pais Dinogad - Britain's Oldest Lullaby
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- Опубліковано 17 січ 2018
- An Old Welsh lullaby found in the margins of a 7th Century Welsh battle poem. Sung here at Old England Hole, the legendary site of Julius Caesar's final defeat of the Kentish warriors in his 54BC invasion of Britain.
I made a 6 day pilgrimage in Anglesey to delve for this melody. The lyrics are Old Welsh, discovered in the margin of a 7th Century manuscript. I went out walking to find a melody that might balm the tensions arising between Britain and Europe.
It was a 300 verse poem and part of it was about a woman whos husband had gone with the 300 strong war party, it tells of her anxious wait to see if he will survive.
Its called Pais Dinogad Amongst the oldest surviving Welsh poetry is an account of battles in the Old North, a text known after the protagonists as Y Gododdin. In the same manuscripts are a couple of odd bits of verse which clearly do not belong, and one of these is a nursery rhyme in which a mother tells her son - the Dinogad of the title - about his father's hunting prowess.
Peis dinogat e vreith vreith.
o grwyn balaot ban wreith.
chwit chwit chwidogeith.
gochanwn gochenyn wythgeith.
pan elei dy dat ty e helya;
llath ar y ysgwyd llory eny law.
ef gelwi gwn gogyhwc.
giff gaff. dhaly dhaly dhwg dhwg.
ef lledi bysc yng corwc.
mal ban llad. llew llywywg.
pan elei dy dat ty e vynyd.
dydygai ef penn ywrch penn gwythwch pen hyd.
penn grugyar vreith o venyd.
penn pysc o rayadyr derwennyd.
or sawl yt gyrhaedei dy dat ty ae gicwein
o wythwch a llewyn a llwyuein.
nyt anghei oll ny uei oradein.
It can be seen how similar the language is to Modern Welsh in which it might be loosely rendered:
Pais Dinogad sydd fraith, fraith,
O groen y bela y mae'i waith.
`Chwí! Chwí!' Chwibanwaith.
Gwaeddwn ni, gwaeddant hwy - yr wyth gaeth.
Pan elai dy dad di i hela -
Gwaywffon ar ei ysgwydd, pastwn yn ei law -
Galwai ar gw+n tra chyflym,
`Giff! Gaff! Dal, dal! Dwg, dwg!'
Fe laddai bysgod o'i gwrwgl
Fel y llada llew fân-filod!
Pan elai dy dad di i'r mynydd
Deuai ef ag un iwrch, un twrch coed, un hydd,
Un rugiar fraith o fynydd,
A physgodyn o readr Derwennydd.
Beth bynnag a gyrhaeddai dy dad â'i bicell -
Boed yn dwrch, yn gath goed, yn lwynog -
Ni ddihangai'r un oni bai'n nerthol ei adenydd.
If you do not yet read Welsh, you might prefer the following loose translation:
Dinogad's shift is speckled, speckled,
It was made from the pelts of martens.
`Wee! Wee!' Whistling.
We call, they call, the eight in chains.
When your father went out to hunt -
A spear on his shoulder, a club in his hand -
He called on his lively dogs,
`Giff! Gaff! Take, take! Fetch, fetch!'
He killed fish from his coracle
Like the lion killing small animals.
When your father went to the mountains
He would bring back a roebuck, a boar, a stag,
A speckled grouse from the mountain,
And a fish from the Derwennydd falls.
At whatever your father aimed his spear -
Be it a boar, a wild cat, or a fox -
None would escape but that had strong wings.
thanks for this...
You're a hero for offering all of this. Thank you so much!!
This is the language king Arthur spoke old Welsh
Brythonic, it precedes Old Welsh, when all of Great Britain spoke like this, not the margins of Cornwall, Wales and Scotland
This is old Welsh 5 to 7 th century
If you go to parts of northern England you can still get Welsh place names specially the Welsh word pen
@@gwynwilliams4222 readr Derwennydd, River Derwent
Pais Dinogad, fraith fraith,
O grwyn balaod ban wraith.
'Chwid, chwid, chwidogaith!'
Gochanwn, gochenyn wythgaith.
Pan elai dy dad di i helia,
Llath ar ei ysgwydd, llory yn ei law,
Ef gelwi gwn gogyhwg:
'Giff, Gaff; daly, daly, dwg, dwg!'
Ef lleddi bysg yng nghorwg
Mal ban lladd llew llywiwg.
Pan elai dy dad di i fynydd
Dyddygai ef pen i wrch, pen gwythwch, pen hydd,
Pen grugiar fraith o fynydd,
Pen pysg o Rhaeadr Derwennydd.
O'r sawl yd gyrhaeddai dy dad di â'i gigwain,
O wythwch a llewyn a llynain,
Nid angai oll ni fai oradain.
Thank you very much!
Wow, Google can’t handle Brythonic at all, eh? Wonder if it thinks it’s Welsh so that’s why the odd phrases?
The most princely thing I have ever heard. An awesome redintion that brought life to paths many walks! You can almost smell the history on some paths in Wales and you really brought that feeling alive.
Roedd e'n dod o'r Hen Ogledd (felly Cumbria neu Strathclyde). Mae'n HEN Hen iawn. Felly ger yr pump canrif, cyn Cymru, cyn Lloegr.
@@nigelsheppard625 sure but still the welsh people and country, as described by macsen
What kind of soul-less monster thumbs down this song!?
It takes all sorts…
A sensitive interpretation. Well done, enormously effective. THANKS!
I've been absolutely spellbound by this recording the past few days since first hearing about Dinogad's Smock in a programme on BBC Four. Really beautifully put together, there's something other worldly about it.
Pure beauty!
You know, I think that word DWG (said like doog, 'bring' - heard doubled in 0:37) is likely where the English word 'dog' comes from.
I've wondered that, because it's not the Germanic hound (hund in the continental cognates) - nor is it the Welsh word for dog:
ci - which is likely related to the Latin canus, for the plural in Welsh is c^wn. Well, so is that hound related to Latin, the cognate to the Latin c (=k) changed to h in the Germanic languages word initially, at least most of the time - and the n is there.
I have thought similarly. Thanks for sharing.
dwg is fetch
@@lemonaurhywiol9831 Thank you. Just fetch, bring - very close. It's important to check these closely similar words when you compare languages, what is borrowed and in which meaning. Like English took travel from French, but travail means working in French. But a long distance traveling is kind of work, especially in the old days.
And bring is the more primal meaning, core idea found in any language: fetch is like a specialized version of it.
Dog comes from the old english word for strong - "docga", and a strong dog, a "docga hund" was a kind of mastiff or the like. They were used before the agricultural revolution to pull small wagons in towns, but were superceded by horses when grain was easier to cultivate.
... or so I am lead to believe.
@@timpuddephatt4996 Wouldn't be odd. Some Native Americans tribes used dogs to pull their property when they travelled, until they got horses to them.
And after the Old English got horses to pull the wagons, they repurposed the Mastiffs, some became bulldogs, some boxers. some remained about the same.
Breathtaking.
Marvellous!
Just wonderful. Thank you! Will be emailing you.
beautiful thank you
Same premise as Bye Baby Bunting, Daddy's gone a hunting to fetch a little rabbit skin to wrap the baby bunting in. Also an ancient rhyme.
absolutely, this must be the root...
That rhyme is from the 18th century.
@@ahammersen1323 not necessarily. It may have much older roots
@@slydoll7877 true, but given its first written down in the 1730s, it's probably not as old as Pais Dinogad which theoretically is 7th century. It could very well be medieval, but the word bunting only came into existence in the 14th century. My objection is referring to it as ancient.
Thanks very much. I've been following your videos for a while and I like them and your style a lot!!
Best greetings, Tim
Wonderful. Thank you for posting this!
John Loker thank you John!
this is cool
Thanks!
I would love to share this in a little Powerpoint talk I am giving in our Welsh class on the subject of Yr Hen Gogledd. It seems that this is not possible . I think because permission has not been given though I am a Powerpoint novice so not sure. Is there any way round this please?
I've added embed permission - hope this helps! And thanks for sharing it...
I don't know why, but when I close my eyes and listens to this I can picture Skarloey and Rheneas singing this together LOL
Amazing!
It's an important song. I have an even older song journey planned for this year...
@@WillWalking I look forward to it!
❤
Sounds good.
Thanks Leo!
My understanding is an existing melody was used and would like to know if there is notation for it
Would it be okay to include this in an educational video I'm making about Pais Dinogad and Y Gododdin? (with credits in the video and in the description along with links to your channel) This is my favorite version, it fits the feel of when it was written perfectly!
Hi, thanks for asking! That sounds fine. Send us a link to the video when it's up! All the best, Will.
@@WillWalking Thank you! I definitely will!
Not trying to be a d*ck but why would 2 men fit the theme better than a woman when it’s a mother’s lullaby to their kid?
Surely it’s more fitting for it to be a woman’s voice?
Wonderful version! Can you share where you got the melody, or if it's original?
The melody came from walking for a week from the Roman fort of Caernarfon to the Druidic holy mountain of Holyhead, in Anglesy. We slept at the battle sites and burial places, hoping to find a melpdy to this lost lullaby that could balm both the European power (Rome) and the British power (Druids). They clashed with such devastating harshness 2000 years ago, and with the rise of Brexit it looked like rising tensions might again occur. So this song was hoped to offer a calming influence. After all, even the most bloodthirsty warrior was once a baby, sung to by their ma...
@@WillWalking I love that. It’s certainly a balm to me.
Kind of bloody :D
It is an absolutely beautiful lullaby and I have loved it ever since finding it here - ua-cam.com/video/ZBl7ZFI-QP8/v-deo.html - by Ffynnon / Lynne Denman.
I love your singing of it too, Ed & Will :)
I never tire of listening to the song and I hope some folk memory is coming down to me here in Oz, through my Welsh great grandfather's line!!! RjB
I love their version too!
Have you tried making up your own?
I love this piece and I would like to know more about where the melody came from. It fits so perfectly!
Hello Ariel, we made a pilgrimage from the Roman fort of Segontium to the Druidic holy moutnain of Holyhead, following the old battle sites where Rome smashed the British native spiritual tradition. We slept and sang in all the holy places, burial mounds, island churches etc. We drank from the wells and immersed in the sacred lakes. And we searched for a melody for this song, which we considered a potential balm to the uprosing tension between Britain and Europe, which we have seen so many times before cause such devastation. All the dead soldiers were babies once, so what better song to calm the arising madness than a lullaby - Britain's oldest. The lyrics were found in a 7th century battle poem. So on pur pilgrimage, at each sacred site, built and natural, we listened, and we sang. And eventually, at the peak of the mountain, this melody is what we found. It is split into 2 parts, the first Will's, the second Guy's, for our different experience of the places.
Will , thank you so much for sharing your experience. How profound and moving it must have been for you to revisit these ancient sites of long memory. May I have permission to use your melody and your story in a bardic circle over here in Canada? It is truly inspiring.
Please do sing!
@@WillWalking I did! It was so well received!! Thank you!
I'm so glad! Well done and thank you.
I'm researching ancient Welsh music for Medieval re-enactment purposes, may i use this video as a reference?
yes please do!
Hard to imagine a form of welsh was spoken across Britain. I wonder if The Romans or Anglo-Saxons did not invade, that modern day Britain would be full of welsh and Gaelic
DrumtotheBass Woop I suppose we can look to Ireland, which was not invaded by Rome. Gaelic is spoken widely, but it so very very widely...?
The Normans, after all, came too - and they came hard...
William Parsons il like to respectfully disagree, because if Celtic Britain was left alone up to the Norman Invasions. They may have prevailed, not to mention the centuries of colonisation from Anglo interference in Ireland, may have not happened. But I guess it’s all hypothetical.
It's actually Cumbrian. Passed on through oral tradition and finally 'written' down in old Welsh.
No it's was originally old welsh
@@lemonaurhywiol9831 Nope...It was composed in Cumbria, probably near the Lodore falls. The language spoken was Cumbric...a Brittonic language... similar to old welsh but different.
@@jumberly the area you are taking about the river Darwen in english was controlled by Gwynedd and southern Rheged. There really wouldn't bae any major differences in language
it was 'finally' written down over a thousand years ago, most guesses put it at 7th century. It is the brithonic language which has evolved into modern welsh. So 'old welsh' is the native language of britain.
Do you all have an available record of you?
I have an old album called Songs by Ed, Will and Ginger. It’s on Bandcamp somewhere…?
Was there lions in europe 7th century
In some places, although they were wiped out due to excessive hunting in the 10th century.
@@Aron-ru5zk I meant to say england specifically
Lynx skeletons have been found in the area recently.
Marianne
No lions in Britain, but lions were known about from the Bible
Well we had lots of kings and princes with the name llewellyn which means lion ( LLEW )and this song is so old that it is possible to date it because of the animals mentioned in the song the linx was killed of in southern Britain about 5 century a little later northern Britain one American historian did some work on this song and suggests it could be pri Roman that's 2000 years old but it's Definitely older than 5 century
What a load of rubbish you speak Will Parsons, it was from the Cymru/Welsh poem about Brythonic warriors (Welsh)coming from the south to the north to stop your Saxon invasion it had nothing to do with Kent. It was written in the 6th century by Aneirin and some academics say Taliesin also, it is called Y Gododdin (Welsh) is a Romano/ Brythonic Welsh poem consisting of a series of elegies to the men of the Brittonic (Welsh) kingdom of Gododdin and its allies who, according to the conventional interpretation, died fighting the Angles of Deira and Bernicia at a place named Catraeth in about AD 600. It is traditionally ascribed to the bard Aneirin and survives only in one manuscript, the Book of Aneirin.
Ti’n iawn, mae yn amdano Goddoddin mynd lawr i cattraeth.