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This doesn't make sense! (poplar tray) - 377
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Obviously it's the hole in the bottom of the old tray. All of the expansion and contraction is allowed to escape through that hole.
You got it
Definitely the hole but also in combination with the thickness of that glued three board panel at that thickness. But mostly the hole.
…akin to an acoustic guitar’s fixed construction.
People think they understand wood movement and dont, true professionals that have studied wood movement contraction, and expansion know this to be fact, the vast majority of woodworkers understand that wood moves but dont truely understand the movement of wood when and why and how its not as big a deal as people make it out to be. It depends on the wood, and what type of wood protection / sealer or oil it has once moisture absorption has been addressed which is one of the biggest reasons for wood movement you are only left with one factor temp. I have built stuff glued and screwed / nailed over 30 years ago and have never had the problems people cry about. I know when i can use it and and how to avoid it. There are several books on this issue that are pretty good, but the best way is actually testing scenarios to actually see what is happening and what is causing it and how to prevent it. Some woodworkers on youtube know and i think appease the mass just not to hear any negative comments. This problem comes down to the same thing you get when you have book smart people, the difference in someone only book smart without the experience is they know they read it / were told it but dont understand it. People that studies wood movement and tested / built things and understanding the reason gain the knowledge of why. I never take someone elses word on most anything without testing it myself, I have found listening to people that dont understand things themselves does you know good in gaining knowledge .
Nailed it!
I've not been keeping up with UA-cam for the last 5 years. Your shop has came so far along. It's Awesome i can't wait to see where it goes from here.
That new tray would be a very nice edition to any shop or home. There are many times when I wish that I had one if nothing else to hold my specialty tools while I worked on a project. I could see any woodworker making those trays and selling a bunch of them at craft or flea market locations.
I make small drawer boxes in almost that exact manner all the time.
As long as you use dovetail or box joints, the box itself won’t be bothered by the bottom panel moving. And the bottom panel won’t move very much, maybe a 1/16” max combining expansion and contraction. The glue itself is flexible enough to allow that.
I made a jewelry box for my wife using eastern red cedar for the drawer boxes using this method. The drawer boxes are completely natural with no finish at all, that way it smells like flowers every time she opens it. There haven’t been any sort of issues at all. But the drawer boxes are small, about 6 inches wide.
If I had to make a guess, I would compare the movement of 40 to 50 year old poplar, that was possibly air-dried (or at least "more gently" kiln dried) than current rapid kiln dried poplar. There's also the fact that the sample tray was made of very clear pieces, not a color streak to be seen. Finally, the use of multiple nails on the bottom means that the wood can move, spreading the movement into slight flexing of multiple nails. (The glue bond may be broken.)
I had a conversation with my grandfather about a similar topic years ago. He was a saw miller from 1930s until 1990s. And I dabble with pool cues as a hobby. I noticed a difference in older hardwoods and more contemporary hardwoods. They seemed harder and denser. Pool cue shafts (the tip end) use quarter saw maple, mostly. In snooker, they use ash, mostly. I also noticed less warping from older shafts. I didn't know if this was my imagination or that just the cues that survived would naturally be straighter.
My grandfather offered a possibility that seemed to make since. He believed that our heavy use of wood products, along with popular negative opinions of wood harvesting, led to better timber harvesting methods. This meant that trees could be grown with sufficient sunlight and ground nutrients to raise the trees quicker and more efficient. However, he believed that because they were fully grown and harvested as soon as possible, the density of the wood suffered.
I also believe that kilned wood processing has changed. Today, uses a vacuum kiln process that speeds the time to market. Most pool cue makers prefer a more natural form of drying the wood. Then, trimming after the wood has moved. Waiting again for the wood to settle and trimming again, etc. And trimming until the wood stops moving. This isn't efficient for most industries.
Also, linseed oil is one ingredient used in sealing woods. So this would help with expansion-contraction of the wood. Not sure if that alone, is enough though.
None of this is scientific knowledge. More like "Old Wives Tales." But, I'm curious to hear the conversation. Great topic. Reminds me of scientists trying to figure out why centuries old Stradivarius violins cannot be duplicated. I am sure some will also bring climate change into the conversation as well.
I can’t remember what the video was called but I can remember that in blind testing there was little to no difference in sound quality between a top tier modern violin and a Stradivarius.
It’s my opinion the hole in the bottom center of the tray is the relief area for the expansion and contraction for the wood movement.
I also saw another comment stating the same thing. As for the boiled linseed oil that to me would state that the moisture that is in the wood is now sealed in so when the wood gets hot it still would expand.
Your Thoughts”. Also I’ve been following you for several years now. Thank You I’ve learned so much. God Bless.
There are countless examples of antiques where they just "didn't care" or fully ignored the requirements of allowances for expansion and contraction. SOME have split and come apart, others haven't. A lot of old dressers had their tops glued down to the stretchers and case sides in much the same way as the tray. I also know for a fact that pretty much all early American banjo clocks (1810-1840s) as well as federal mirror clocks (New Hampshire mirror clocks) from around the same period have solid wood backboards glued and nailed across the entire back sides of the cases. They left the outer edges stick out about 1/8" and had a bead detail along it (gentle round). Some have cracks, but most don't. If you want my opinion, I think the seasoning of the wood is the most important factor. A lot of commercial or kiln dried modern wood still has 8-10% moisture, and this does tend to reduce down after a few years to under 7%, and that 3% can make a big difference. The old method was to stack the wood and leave it to dry for 1-2 years, which isn't commercially feasible anymore. As a side note: I don't know if I'm fully convinced that the tray even has any linseed oil on it. Linseed oil turns the wood a yellowish honey colour, and repeated applications would build a finish. Linseed oil polymerizes much like a plastic, and does build a gloss. From the video the tray just looks like raw wood to me with some natural age and skin oils from handling.
I have built a lot boxes (small) less then 24" W. Bottoms were solid wood 1/2" glued only into rebate or groove or butt joint. Nothing ever happened. If you go 36" across and are using thicker woods you will have issues. Sometimes we tend to overthink things.
Did you mean to reverse the pin orientation? The original has three pins on the "front" faces. Maybe it was a matter of height on the new one.
I think you're the first TY woodworker to explain the "packing tape on the pipe clamp" trick for avoiding black marks..
I discovered this a number of years ago, and I bet you can guess how.. that's right, when returning to a glued up panel the following day to find rows of black stains in a few hundred bucks worth of hardwood..
live and learn I guess..
Thanks for the video..
cheers from Down Under ;)
This box is proof that glueing on a panel is perfectly fine and I’ve done it in the past, the whole expansion and contraction thing just seems to have blown up on UA-cam for some reason, just use good glue👍🏼
I think a lot of wood these days isn't dried properly, so there are more extreme cases.
My dad had an old oak desk that he got from his work that had a cracked top because it was attached with pocket screws all the way around. About the same time that I fixed that, my dad bought a new oak kitchen table that was wider than the desk and also attached with pocket screws all the way around. I told my dad that it would be easier to let me fix it now before it cracks. My dad shrugged. Twenty years later the damn thing still hasn't cracked. Some time later I made some 3" cubes out of 1/4" thick poplar with sliding lids. I wasn't too concerned about movement because they are 3". Damn lids wedged themselves so tight it was impossible to open them when the season changed. My conclusion is that wood is stupid.
I'm going to guess a combination of factors: the wood might be quartersawn which will help off the bat. Perhaps most importantly, if it was being regularly oiled then there would have been reduced scope for moisture to absorb/evaporate from the wood. I bet if you made a 100 of them varying (1) the part of the log the wood is sawn from and (2) the types of finish applied and (3) climate/location of the piece you'd see some amount showed noticeable signs of expansion/contraction.
I've made a bunch of small boxes of solid wood, their largest dimensions ranging from three inches to 10 inches, and haven't seen one split. So in addition to the factors ejhill12 lists I would add size of the boards in the structure.
I think there are two factors here. 1. The wood has been sealed with the linseed oil, so it does not draw much moisture. 2. Wood only swells in one direction. It swells perpendicular to the growth ring. If the growth rings are angled near a 45deg, then swelling along the width of the board is 1/2 what it would be if the grain were at a 90deg angle.
Wood expands and contracts around the rings, it was hard to see on my phone, but it looked like the bottom boards on the original were quartersawn, so they would expand and contract vertically, in the axis of the nails, which wouldn’t lead to cracking?
Wood expands more on the heart wood side than the sap wood side of each ring, that is true. But even quartersawn wood expands and contracts; the fact that the rings are perpendicular to the face rather than parallel just means the board wont cup when it does.
When I heard the ticking of the timer while the clamps were being put on, in the back of my head, I wanted to see and explosion like a bomb when it stopped. 😂 to be clear, I’m not trolling the expansion issue, I just know it’s a sensitive topic and I think I would have been a funny play on it.
Awesome work as usual, keep it up!
Hi Jay. If I am not mistaken that drawer bottom has a hole right in the middle. Is it intentional? If so I agree with several others. That hole would be sufficient to relieve stress radially for the entire drawer bottom. You may have discovered an old timers secret. Hard to test though. Could warrant a challenge to Patrick Sullivan. Most worthy video. Thanks.
If you don't constrain it, wood will expand and contract with moisture. If you squeeze or stretch it, wood can take a certain amount before it crushes or cracks. Glueing down an entire cross-grain edge adds stress, but it's better than just the outer edges because it avoids letting all the shrinkage pull in one spot. As long as the glue bond is capable of restraining movement, as in plywood layers, it won't crack that part.
Sounds like a combination. It being sealed so it cant release or gather much moisture and being thin enough that it dont hold much to begin with to expand in heat.
I agree. Perhaps if the sponginess for water was replaced with oil given its thinness, it is more stable, and correct me if I'm wrong but it looks flat-sawn to me which means the expansion is similar to peel-cut veneered plywood, more so on the thickness axis than the lateral axis.
I know little. My speculation is that
1) The oil is a huge factor.
2) The original piece had nails and there was some small splits by the nails. Is that from construction or wood movement?
3) Wood does move and over a larger span it can be truly a problem. I have seen many smaller things, less than 2’ wide that are tightly trapped and have not blown apart. So perhaps there isn’t enough overall movement to be a problem
3a) The Forestry service publishes data on wood movement by species. It wood be interesting to look up how much expension/contraction there is in Poplar.
3b) I wonder how much difference there is in movement based on the cut of the timber and the size/tightness of the rings.
Thanks for sharing this all with us.
Damn, that is a NICE jointer!
Your conveyor motor on the drum sander is wobbly!
It could very well be a combination of old-growth wood (more stable and denser grain), nails which allow for some movement, older glue which isn't as strong as current glues, the finish, and then the thickness. I have similar drawers in my built-in workbench in my house (about 90 years old) and they used old-growth redwood for those. Still working great.
According to my memory of reading the Anarchists Tool Chest book, it was normal to nail in the bottom on tills. As you said, nails can flex so allow for some movement.
But I'm pretty certain it didn't say to glue as well. I would guess that the original tray wasn't glued, only nailed.
My friend built a coffee table with screwed and glued breadboard ends, out of kilned walnut. It pulled itself to pieces within a couple of summers. Wood movement is very real, even with well dried wood.
So I'd be interested to see this reproduction tray in a few years time, see if it's pulled itself apart just like the table.
A quartersawn bottom is the trick here. The expansion makes the bottom mainly thicker and thinner. I would have also not glued the corners -- the bottom can expand and bow the sides a little if its glued in the middle of all the edges.
Is it quarter sawn material on the bottom?
I think expansion across a narrow board is insignificant. You need something like a table to really have an effect.
Made in WI transported to MS. My guess is that it was made in a dry period, like winter, and the bottom expansion wasn't enough to overpower the joinery. So the wood just compressed.
I think it’s a couple of factors. One the wood choice. Poplar is a vary stable wood. It’s used plenty in furniture for a secondary wood. Second the thickness.
Per Stumpy Nubs, " The nails allow movement in the panel as the nail flexes and does not stop the movement."
Appreciate that you turned this little project into a video, really makes ya think.
box joint was used on trays that were just lifted and not pulled , faster to make accurately saving time .
Jay, my immediate thought is that the manufacturer may have laid up the three bottom planks with the grain in alternating directions. If one was additionally turned over then the grain of none of the grains would have been running parallel. John Warner. Australia
There is a chance the original bottom is quarter sawn grain old growth poplar, witch is much more stable.
It's been my experience with old growth lumber, that the growth rings are much closer together than lumber available today. I know that quarter sawn material moves much less than flat sawn, and I believe the movement occurs across the width of a board in the spaces between the growth rings, just as it does in a live tree. I see drawer bottoms and wide panels in old furniture frequently that have been nailed, glued, and secured all the time. The ones that are cracked are usually flat sawn material.
Little late to the party, but I think there is more than one reason for the stability of the bottom. First poplar is a relatively stable wood, second it may be rift sawn, which would add a lot to its' stability and third several coats of linseed oil would, I think saturate the pores.
Wood movement will yield to restrictions. Case in point: I have built a small box from fir (sides) and pine (top & bottom, cut from the same board). The top is on hinges. it has shrunk ~1/16". The bottom has not, nor does it have any cracks or splits.
I believe the combination of all those reasons is why it did not fail. I also wonder if the wood probably being air dried and not kiln dried might have played in its favour ?
Jay, Thanks for all your content! Big fan!
To add my two cents with the others who have commented, I believe a number of factors are at play here:
1.The more Radial (Quarter)sawn the wood of the existing bottom is, the less effect that any change in moisture would have.
2.The Linseed oil finish, if reapplied regularly will attenuate moisture in-out flow.
3.The species, Poplar is a good choice as a stable wood. I suspect that if you tried this same construction with Eucalyptus or Pacific Madrone, your results may not be as favorable.
Krenov speaks to this in a number of his books and Bruce Hoadley in "Understanding Wood" covers all of this extensively. It is one of my favorite reference works.
Again, thanks for all your great content, and the discount i got at Bits and Bits!
Cheers!
The growth of the tree the wood is from is a factor too
I think one factor to consider is that it has been inside an air-conditioned climate all these years it has not been outside in the shed or anything like that. So the temperature for the most part has been maintained the same way with very little fluctuation I think that contributes to it a lot.
I loved the technique of making the bottom oversized and then just trimming/flush-trimming the edges. Nice way to get it perfect.
Before you even mentioned boiled linseed oil, I suspected a penetrating oil. BLO and the like can soak in pretty deep, and I imagine it takes up the microscopic spaces where moisture would go.
The original might be made from old poplar. I was at a reconstruction village in Land-Between-The-Lakes in TN a few years back where he was explaining that the poplar logs of the house, after they were there for 50 years become extremely hard in the heartwood, and are termite-proof. So you might have a case where very old poplar has different seasonal expansion characteristics as well. This really has me wondering. I've never been a fan of that green tint that some poplar has, so if I use it, I paint it.
The green tint in poplar fades away in a few seasons. the original tray is poplar and is now a beautiful golden tan.
Another thing that helped stop splitting was the use of nails as fasteners. That coupled with the other things have been mentioned. The ends of the old time pine box coffins were nailed (of course). The ends of the coffins were nailed and the ends of the box was cross grain because nails would not hold if the nails were driven into the end grain. I'm sure they did cause splits from time to time but the customers couldn't complain.
Paul Sellers makes boxes the same way, solid panel and just glue. No hole. I was skeptical however I made a couple this way 2 years ago. No problems so far
Watching a woodworking video wasn't where I expected to find Redwings fan.
Perhaps there has been no expansion or movement because the drawer has been kept in a stable and controlled environment?
I’m not an expert on woodworking at all but all the videos I’ve watched I remember someone saying if you were making a larger board you use smaller pieces with grain on each board running in opposite directions of each other and it would prevent cracking. Not sure if this is right but it sounds good
Possibly because it was built in a very dry climate in its driest form, lived most of its life in a mostly humid climate where it has mostly expanded and little chance to contract. Along with the oil, possible quarter sawn wood, and the bottom appearing to be three equal widths, and I believe it's a recipe for success.
I’m currently over 1000 miles away, can you hear me yelling at you! 🤣😂
I see that you did the box joints opposite to the original. I honestly like your variation better aesthetically.
My guess goes to the boiled linseed oil. Not necessarily, but the fact that it was treated with something. My examples can be lengthy ranging from personal experience over the past 54 years, experience from friends and watching Wranglerstar.
Great work Jay!
My guess is that in the past wood was allowed to season properly for many years. Wood movement is inverse proportional to the number of years you allow for proper seasoning. Makers of violins use wood which has been seasoned for 30+ years! They know why.
What many woodworkers don't know or realise: wood seasoning is more than wood drying. Wood is dry after a relatively short time. Take a piece of wood and weigh it. Let it sit for a while and then weigh it again. As soon as the weight does not change anymore the piece has reached equilibrium - it is as dry as it can be relative to its environment.
When wood is left to sit for a year it experiences the seasons. Times of more and then again of less humidity. It swells and contracts. This cycle is repeated year after year. And something interesting can be observed. The inner cellular structure changes. During the first seasonal cycles wood moves most, but with every passing year this movement lessens. The material relaxes and becomes more and more stable.
The old craftsmen knew about this. They treated wood like red wine or cheese. It has to ripen, to mature.
So plan ahead. Yearly buy lumber, label it by acquisition year and store it (preferably outside) in a covered, shady, dry and well ventilated place. And let nature and time take their course.
After five (but preferably more) years you can start using the oldest pieces for your more precious projects. Enjoy!
im not a woodworker myself but food for thought, the fact that its the same type of wood could be a majour factor being each piece has the same expansion rate
It may also be, aside from the very good suggestions from those below, that since it's an interior tray, it may have been protected from humidity by being enclosed within its chest.
That's the rabbit hole where all one's expansions and contractions go to maintain equilibrium.
I did something similar as an experiment. Back in the spring I made a tool cabinet constructed with a front and a back made of 15” wide pine boards glued and dowelled to the sides. It’s essentially identical to the bottom of that tray. After I built it I monitored it this summer as the humidity went up (it was in a shed so it wasn’t air conditioned). Then I brought it in the basement this fall and I’ve been monitoring it now that the heat is on. So far it hasn’t done anything. I’m starting to think that if you use dry wood and build it in suck a way that the cross grain joint is stronger than the force of the wood expanding it will stay together. If the wood tries to swell up but physically can’t expand it won’t shrink and crack when it dries out. Granted my little experiment has only be going for 8 months now but the internet made it sound like it would have blown apart into a pile of tooth picks by now.
I've seen a walnut table with breadboard ends, screwed and glued, split itself apart in a few years, even though the timber was kiln dried. I'm sure some people might know how to make these wide cross grain to long grain joints work, but I'm definitely not one of them.
I think it's a lot to do with the finish. I made a new vanity got our ensuite and used silky oak, it moved a lot, especially when finish was only on one side but now that it's finished, it's fine, no movement at all.
But the internet likes to prove its knowledge too... ;)
Curious about the cup orientation of the three bottom pieces of the original tray. Could that have an element as to why it didn't crack over the years?
I hadn't noticed that, but my Dad (a joiner) taught me that technique, for that reason.
Did you intend to do the box joints reversed to the original?
I wondered the same. Even the original drawing (timestamp 7.51) shows it the way it is done on the original tray.
I came here looking for this exact comment. Phew, not crazy.
Most old drawers had poplar for all secondary wood even internal frames in a lot of them so maybe the old timers knows more about wood then we do today? Remember they only had hand tools so they did not want to do the work twice like we do with all our power tools 😁
Very nice to see a non CNC project!
I really enjoy the hands on work you do.
Are the box joints glued on the piece you're copying, or just friction fit and held together by the bottom? Is there any noticeable opening and closing of the box joints through the seasons?
Simple video but cool!
wood expansion is real but less of an issue than we make it out to be.
Jay l just watched you say you didn't understand why it lasted so long without splitting. If you see there is a hole in the center of the bottom that will allow it to release stress which leads to cracking.
How much do people think that small amount of wood moves from temp? It doesnt move that much on temp, does it move? sure but not on the scale people think, aside from twisting. People say but look at these bread board ends on this table. Most of those instances are to high of moisture in the project when it was made/ improperly sealed. I still have some of my grandpas tool boxes that are over 60 years old, were nailed and glued, not quite that wide but not far from it, no issues at all.
If the trays are inside a chest that is closed most of the time, it may be likely that the humidity of the air inside the chest changes less than outside the chest. Another factor could be what was put in the trays which would affect the circulation of the air at the surface of the tray bottom. These are factors that would apply to a table top or a bed head board. Just guesses.
The moisture debate is overblown. If the wood is properly sealed you shouldn't have a problem
question good sir! Was the tray A) outside in the shade / in an open barn or garage or B) inside but no climate control
Thank you! You may not know for Wisconsin but sounds like you might for Mississippi. From this info I can calculate the magnitude of humidity change from 6am to 3pm and month to month. Philip
Yes the oil
The hole in the bottom. And I'm betting that the linseed oil doesn't hurt.
Seems reasonable if there was a lot of oil-based finish soaked in, and take into consideration the research recently discussed by J. Katz-Moses that wood doesn't actually move nearly as much as we think that it does. Also, just a lot of luck. I will say to those who claim that quartersawn wood (which this doesn't seem to be -- the grain patterns are wrong) would only expand in the direction of the nails ... the fibers swell, so the board would get both thicker *and* wider (but not longer), so that wouldn't be the explanation. Quartersawn wood is preferred because the direction of that expansion is fairly linear, since heartwood swells at a different rate so can actually cause the wood to cup/bow while it expands.
I'll go with the fact that it is three different pieces of wood on the bottom. The two on the outside are only screwed on three sides, not all four. This allows the forth side to be able to contract and expand. The middle piece is only screwed on two sides allowing it room to contract and expand in both directions and flex for the other two outside pieces. The glue is an adhesive, but also a spacer in this case.
But then again, that's just a guess. Y'all have a great day.
The hole in the middle of bottom panel in conjunction with the finger joints and possibly quartersawn poplar could be most of the trick
What is the auger bit you are using at 10:53? How does this compare to Forstner bits? Is there a reason you didn't duplicate the hole in the middle of the bottom?
As an aside, I bought your plans for the mitersaw workstation and tailored it to fit my shop and metric resources. The documentation in the plans is outstanding!
Wood owl overdrive bit. And I forgot about the hole until reading the comments here. Oops!
@@JayBates Thanks! Unfortunately, not available in metric.
Nice project, even something simple can look great. What type of glue did you use? Did you use biscuits for your bottom panel? Love the idea of the shipping tape, I have been using wax paper....my wife got me a roll because she didn't like the sawdust that I was bringing back when returning her wax paper! lol!
If the bottom were just nailed, I would assume the nails give enough to account for movement, sort of like a 6 board chest. With glue, I guess just luck of all the dimensions.
If you did notice several of the nail puncture points had edge split. Years ago there was a guy named Homer Formby that maintained all wood should be periodically treated with lemon oil to "hydrate" the wood. I have viewed several yt'ers that claim that is BS. BUT! Is it really a valid concept? I have used lemon oil and it PENETRATES!
Thanks for sharing those tips!
My totally unscientific guess at the answer (I'm only 4 minutes in, not sure what's to come): The expansion isn't enough to blow out those corner joints, because they're poplar (moderately hard) large box joints. I also wonder if the nails helped defeat the old rule? Glue is like the lignin, a bit stronger, but no expansion is gonna break nails. Nails would, of course, break the panel, but not the amount of panel between those closely-spaced nails? Plywood layers also want to expand, but are prevented from doing so by alternating layers being laminated 90 degrees to each other. So the force of the expansion _can_ be canceled out by fastening the radially- and tangentially-oriented grain that wants to expand, to longitudinally-oriented grain that does not. Perhaps these measures, glue, nails and strong corner joints, has done so here?
(EDIT: Having just finished watching the entire video, I'm gonna stay with my original guess and say that the combination of glue, nails and strong corner joints prevented expansion and contraction from splitting the panel or blowing out the joints. So when the client adds his period-specific cut nails, so long as he does so at the close spacing of the original, he should enjoy its same success.)
Has anyone noted that your box joints are backwards to the original?
Yes
Very interesting. I am thinking the oil finish is the key here, since all sides are oiled.
It's not like it will expand a half an inch!
It is not the wood that moves, it is only yourself...
That said, maybe the wood is moving, but the structure as a whole deforms?
Interesting that you deviated from the original panel width dimensions. Was that due to stock on hand? I think alot of the myths eminate from the vast differences in glue formulations that were "secret family recipes", whereas today alot of the formulations for wood glue are themselves more stable.
Interesting. Maybe the wood was super dry and old by the time it was turned into this tray? Therefore it had done most of its expansion etc end had become largely stable? I’m sure if it was a thicker piece of wood it might be an issue.
Yes , the hole in the center makes all the difference!:)
Just curious why the box joints are different in the two boxes.
Why didn't you put the hole in the center of the bottom?
There was a hole in the original tray. Does it help to avoid cracking?
Man, did you ever screw up. Your were supposed to build that tray in Wisconsin. What 's wrong with you? It's gonna 'splode!
All kidding aside, ya, some of the comments said something about quarter sawn lumber and such, and how it particularly expands/contracts. Sounds good to me. I'm at the plywood stage of these types of builds.
Thanks for making this video. It's an interesting subject, and it opens up a lot of discussion.
I enjoyed this video a lot. Glad you made it. Good job!
If you keep the new tray, you will know in 40 yrs!!! LOL...
Are you sure the bottom of that piece was glued, not just nailed ? Nails without glue would make sense for movement more
Yes. It's glued
@@JayBates so weird ! :)
Jay, I believe it's the wood. I believe a true hardwood would have cracked. And the boiled linseed oil didn't
hurt. I've always heard that popular is the poor mans hardwood. It is for sure a nice wood to work with.
Jay, it looks like you got the joints wrong on the corners. In the original, I see the end-grain of the side panels in the "middle" slots of the corners, while on your reproduction I see the long grain of the end panels in the "middle" slots.
3:45 Nope, not quartersawn boards.
Poplar is a rather forgiving species. Perhaps if he had built it with oak (which loves to split) we could've seen some damage?
I think the wood movement thing is way overdone.
I have many older wood peaces from lamps to bedroom
Chest of drawers. I never had any issue with them.
The only time I have seen this isue, was when a pice was
garage over many years with the cars going in and out
through winter snow and summer rain. Twenty years on
I had to redo the finish and a few boards that split and
warped. Other then harsh conditions is the only time
I have seen it.
Just my thought
many
years
getting wet cold snow in it being very demp.