EL34 vs 6L6 - Victory V40 The Duchess
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- Опубліковано 31 сер 2016
- Around November 2014, I received my Victory V40 tube amp with JJ EL34 power tubes on. After a year and a half of guitar playing at home, I 've decided to try 6L6s (TAD RT812 TUBES 6L6WGC).
I wanted to find out if there is any difference between those tubes while using the particular amp.
I think that reamping is the right recording technique for such comparisons. That's why in this video you actually see twice the exact same guitar playing. I captured my guitar signal with Radial J48 DI Box and filmed it (you can see that the amp is off on this video) and later I sent my signal through a Radial JCR (reverse DI box) to the amp and recorded it.
I use two microphones (mid-side technique) for this amp, because it sounds more natural to me and I love the stereo image (especially when headphones are used)
Except for a slight Bus Compressor, there was no other effect or EQ applied.
The difference I found, in terms of loudness, is that I had to boost 4dB in post-production for 6L6s to reach EL34s' level.
In terms of tone, to be honest, I find no difference at all..!!
What do you think? Can you hear any difference?
..more of my projects can be found here:
/ bakis.productions
You can download the wav files here:
www.dropbox.com/sh/u9vupwf8ei...
Gear Used:
- Victory V40 guitar amp
www.victoryamps.com/v40-the-du...
- Shitty but good sounding Custom Stratocaster (goeldo parts assembled) with Häussel Pickups
/ guitarsgr
- Voodoo Lab Superfuzz Pedal
www.voodoolab.com/superfuzz.htm
- Focusrite Scarlett 18i20 audio interface
us.focusrite.com/usb-audio-int...
- Cascade Fat Head II ribbon mic
www.cascademicrophones.com/cas...
- Neumann TLM 102 condenser mic
www.neumann.com/?lang=en&id=c...
- Radial J48 DI box
www.radialeng.com/j48.php
- Radial Reamp JCR
www.radialeng.com/jcr.php
i was so intrigued by your tasty playing that I forgot to pay attention to the tonal differences haha
hahaha.. thanks ehoc42!! =)
Literally the same happened to me.
I had to watch it twice for that same reason
I, too, was mesmerized by the tasty playing.
Bravo Bakis! Very impressive video both content-wise and videography-wise alike.
Ευχαριστώ Φλου.. ;-)
I prefer the EL34’s myself, which is what I have in my own V40 luckily. Beautiful playing, I could listen to you all day
thank you very much =)
man! what a gr8 vid! very detailed, and your sound is from another planet!
phenomenal guitarist!!!
samlidippos χαχαχα.. τι παπάρας που είσαι ρε Φίλιππε!
Surprisingly found the el34s to sound better through my speakers. Thanks for the comparison!
Thank you, exactly what I needed to hear.
I love your playing style and I just wish I can be that good some day...
Keep it up man, great sound!
This is so kind of you. Thank you mate =)
Good god man. I could listen to you play all day, that style is fantastic.
D M really flattering! Thanks =)
They both sound sublime.
Awesome video. Great, short introduction and fantastic sound and playing.
I own this very amplifier and am very pleased to hear how great it can sound. Now back to some practicing ;-)
hahaha... a good sound for practising is always welcome!
Thank you for your kind words!! =)
Great demo. I could hear a sound difference in as much as in my opinion, the 6L6 had a more pleasant drive characteristic but the EL34 sounded more pleasant played clean. Cheers, Glyn.
Sounds magic. Fantastic playing!!
nicholaspj 33 that was so kind. Thanx mate =)
Great playing and good demo
:)
Wow....absolutely love your playing!
That's so kind! Thank you =)
Excellent tone and guitar playing! Thanks for the demo. The EL34 sounded a bit warmer to me, personally.
Same as the rest of comments, your playing is stunning and captivating.
Hearing with headphones the difference is minimal. Seems to be that the difference produced by swaping the speakers is the most significant one.
Greetings.
The main reason to like this video is your playing, man :)
Great!
Great sounding EQ... Awesome playing, and both tubes sound really good. Each would sound slightly better with certain music, but if I only could pick one, EL34.
Great comparison! High quality sound and nice playing! Thanks for that. And I liked EL34 as its the default one. Sounds more open in mids and lively and glassy. Also I think what they promise as the american sound in the description is coming from that one with a little more live attack. Super amp! Hoping to buy one in near future
Thank you! :-)
gosh dang. That's the best sounding amp i have ever heard in my life on the clean channel. But you have to subtract for the amazing hands playing that. I wished we could invest in youtube channels. This guy can really play. Perfectly.
Jeff Beck thank you very much mate! Very kind. You aren't the real Jeff Beck, are you? :-P
Beautiful playing dude. I think regardless of the tubes we can accept the amp, the guitar and your hands sound dam fine.
Joncan Kavlakoglu oh man, thank you!!
Wonderful playing
Thanks for this video! I just started looking at the V40 and V40 Deluxe and was trying to find exactly what you demonstrated. Great playing, Man! I think for my my playing style and guitars I use (Gretsch Duo Jets), I think the EL34s are the way to go. Very much appreciated!
I am glad you've found this video helpful. Although, I have to point out that there is difference between EL34 and 6L6 on the V40.
The procedure I used doesn't show the difference as I've said in previous comments.
I left the volume and gain knobs at the same position. That caused 4dB difference. In a real life situation, you would raise the master volume with 6L6s to recover this 4dB and attain the same sound volume.
So let's just say that we could have the same sound level with EL34 master volume set at 11 o'clock and 6L6s at 12 o'clock. In this scenario you absolutely can hear the difference. But that should be another video ;-)
So, the best thing for you, I think is the simplest. Find a nice dealer and try both amps, or both tubes!
Trust your ears and not anybody on UA-cam, including myself.
I hope that was also helpful =)
Thanks for the insight! I'm actually looking at the V40 Deluxe, but from what I've read, the tube difference is relatively the same as the regular V40.
The three amps I'm looking at are the V40D, Matchless Avalon and Mesa Boogie LoneStar Classic. Your Strat sound wonderful, BTW, and, again, your playing is extremely tasteful and you have a great touch.
Beautiful playing. Personally speaking, I couldn't tell much difference between the EL34's and the 6L6;s Amp and guitar sounds fantastic!
Some great playing dude!!
Danny Walker GMC Thanx mate =)
Great demo! Thank you. Surprisingly I like the EL34 more
And great playing !
Thank you! =)
Great playing!
I needed some dessert and that mint green strat was it! Thanks!
Great comparison!
Fantastic and very scientific demo! The difference are subtle and you can only get them listening with high quality headphones or speakers. The EL34 have *slightly* more mids and a little softer sounding, which make the 6L6 by contrast seem to have a little bit more presence and *harder* (under your fingers) sounding.
shredgd5 hahaha.. I would prefer the term "accurate" (if it really is) than scientific, but thank you very much!! =)
They all sound good for the superb playing you have.
JoeMat Olivares hahaha.. that wasn't the purpose of the video but thank you very much! Very kind words =)
Amazing tone, amazin guitar player! Inspiring
Diego Tuñas oh man, thanks so much! =)
An interesting and quality demo. Thanks for sharing. Oh, and sound the same to me. Had been wondering what the difference would be.
Adam Richards as I've said before, there is a difference. Not at this video and what you hear, but in real life. If I had turned up the volume on 6L6s to match the volume of the EL34s, you would understand.
Anyway, I found that the feel of the 6L6s wasn't for me.
in this video you are going to hear a very professional narration of what you are going to hear :) Go Bakis! *nice guitar playing
Αχαχαχα.. thanx Έλενα!
I heard pretty much no differences between the EL34s and the 6L6s when played clead.. very surprised!! With crunch I actually slightly preferred the 6L6s (which also kinda surprised me), the difference was veery subtle, though!
Beautiful playing BTW, really musical stuff, excellent phrasing.. I thoroughly enjoyed that!!
Outstanding playing man! Teach me to play like you please.
Don't even care about the tube comparison :p
Came here to listen to your beautiful playing!
: ( :
Great video, exactly what I was after. For me, the difference is vast. EL34s (strangely) give so much more clarity and sounds glorious! Just sounds like something’s missing from the 6L6 sound. Just personal preference.
Great playing though! 👍
Sean Connor Guitar Thank you!! =)
nice amp ,well recorded.
To me the 6l6’s had more spank and more presence/ mids. To me the el34’s sounded more “round” and a little warmer.
It ALL sounds awesomely sweet! Love it. Some of us (I'm projecting here) would love to pick up some of these licks. In the future (or maybe reshoot this vid??), would it be possible to show your playing head on? If the Victory has to be in the frame, maybe put in foreground? Will check out your other vids!
Never seen hybrid finger/ plectrum style before, its smooth as silk...nice playing...2 thumbs up for Lenny!
mike degrazia thank you mate =)
take a look at Josh Smith. He is an exceptional guitarist and plays sick hybrid ;-)
The el34 are rich and creamy, the 6l6's are tighter, slightly more rock sounding to me. And damn man, you groove!! Great sound!
I’m picking mine up tomorrow. I’m a Strat and Tele player, and god I hope to sound this good.
???
Sick tone coming from that amp. El34’s for me
Nice playing - very inspiring.
Tried the V40 6L6 - Nice sound but concerned I was running treble at 100% and nowhere else to go if i needed to. Build quality is awesome.
Takes a Strymon Riverside very well by the way.
Trefor Roberts thank you for your comments! =)
Great playing
Ernie Francestine thank you!
EL34s were have slightly more presence and tighter low end. I currently have 6L6's in mine...need to try EL34s!
Sounds amazing with both tubes, but I prefer the 6L6. Great job
ricleao77 thanks mate!
I couldn’t hear a discernible difference. However, I did hear some really terrific guitar playing.
And that's a super kind message!
Thank you mate =)
Nice playing
The clean part makes it tough. but the dirty guitar tones killed it. The EL34'S have so much more harmonic overtones to me there's no comparison! EL34's! Damn dude that picking is off the funking hook dude Omg you could sell 4 minute clips of that stuff its so good!!! \,,/ Props
Tim Stanley hahaha.. thanx a lot Tim!
Great Playing! 6L6 seems more balanced and clean! 🤙
They both sound great but the EL 34 has a little bit more bite but not enough to tell a big difference and great playing my friend
Τρομερο βιντεο! Χιλια Μπραβο! Δεν καταλαβαινω την διαδικασια που ακολουθεις για να ηχογραφησεις! Επειδη με ενδιαφερει η ολη φαση με τα DI boxes κλπ εαν εχεις χρονο εξηγησε μου :D γιατι απο την περιγραφη δεν καταλαβαινω πολλα... thanks και παλι μπραβο, smooth sound!!!
να'σαι καλά φίλε μου! Η διαδικασία έχει ως εξής:
Το σήμα της κιθάρας μπαίνει πρώτα στο DI κι έπειτα στην κάρτα ήχου, ενώ ταυτόχρονα γυρίστηκε το βίντεο, ώστε αυτό που βλέπεις να είναι αυτό που ακούς.
Έπειτα, το ηχογραφημένο σήμα, έφυγε από το pc μέσω κάρτας ήχου, σε ένα reverse DI κι από εκεί στον ενισχυτή.
Η διαδικασία του reverse DI ακολουθήθηκε πριν και μετά την αλλαγή των λαμπών. Έτσι, το παίξιμο είναι ολόιδιο, ανεξαρτήτως λάμπας.
I wanted the the deluxe, but the EL84 were more chimey.Great demo my friend.
84?
I like the bottom end and clearer tone of the 6l6. The el 34 have more of a snarl if that is you want but I play more clean tone and only go to the point of just a little break up. I would never use a stomp box.
Terrific video - subbed! I vote 6L6 - there was some extra sparkle at the beginning of 'Lenny' with the 6L6's. I would use pedals for drive, so the 6L6's would likely have smidgen more headroom. Thanks!
thank you mate!! =)
Im a huge EL34 fan so im dying to see witch one i like best! Brb
Great playing. I'm sure you sound good through most amps. Thank you.
Thank you! =)
I would like to try an AC30. I think I will sound like crap (hahaha) with that one, although people say it's a great amp.
no brother, you are good and will sound awesome. even on acoustic.
jamesha175 speechless! Thanx mate!! =)
no brother man, thank you for posting this video. there are a zillion guitar guy videos on youtube but rarely does one merit any attention.
with this one vid you have risen a little bit above the normal pack.
by the way, ya, AC 30? hell to the yes. get one and you will give up regular amps.
It Very Good Voice ,Sound System V40. Very very clear voice to hearing, Use EL.34. & 6L6 tube lamp, .... Bravo.
when someone plays as good as this guy, tubedifferences are forgotten
all in all small difference. both are good tubes, they make the first stage loud
isn't it ?
A great clean tone. Exactly what I like. Very well played.
The reamping technique is a good choice here.
Could you tell a lil more about the mic placement?
Specially interested how you placed the Cascade Ribbon Mic - to get it in phase with the TLM 102.
A picture would be great ofc ;)
Thanks!
Peter Schneider it's a mid/side technique. I don't feel there are phase issues. You might find some answers in the description and also my Facebook page. Give it a try =)
That amp sounds incredible.
You might hear a difference at loud volumes on full power mode. Try biasing the tubes. The EL34 would need at least 34 Milliamps to sound good and be efficient at the same time. Not sure about the idle voltage for the 6L6s. You can also try biasing the voltage down to 20 Milliamps if the amp sounds too bassy.
Thanks for the dropbox links, it is so much clear there!! Was it quick to to the re-biasing?
Great playing!!
DanielG0m3z thanks mate! =)
Yes, the rebias was easy.
They both sound great but I gotta give some love to the el34. I think they are underrated for cleans. Just my opinion. That stray sounds the fire man
Edward McLaughlin I do what needs to be done.
I have an above average pair of headphones. And so, I could easily hear that the EL34's are much more brilliant! Comparatively, the 6L6's were dull with more bass.
Fascinating! You can do that?! Switch EL34s for 6L6?! Yes, I'm a noob.
Also an interesting option in the V40: KT77. Soundwise a mix between the EL34 and the 6L6: smooth highs, very present but not harsh mids and tight lows. Can be used without any problem. Just rebias and done. :)
didn't know that. Thanks mate!
Great playing!Greetings from Austria 🇦🇹!Ive just purchased a v30 with 6l6 tubes in it.Was wondering if I should replace them with el34-s ...On UA-cam I couldn't hear too much of a difference though so I guess I'll wait until they give up working and then I will see...Thanks for the superb quality tone!👍🎸👌
Zsolt Toth thank you mate! Well, I don't know about V30. Either way it's just a matter of personal taste. ;-)
I've just found this video. May I compliment you on your playing? Very tasteful! Yummie :-)
I don't think there is a real tonal difference between the two sets of tubes, but I I hear a little more hair on the EL34s like they distort a little earlier and perhaps a bit more top end and I think I hear more clarity from the 6L6s with more warmth if that makes any sense. I am not sure which set I would prefer though, but the EL34s sound a little more vivid to me.
Toon De Wachter since the difference is not really audible, i think you should compliment my playing. hahaha..
Thanx mate =)
okay. great playing : )
Great video, was really hoping someone would do such test. Very little difference to my ears. Maybe a bit more pronounced attack and tighter bottom end with 6L6? Anyway, I really liked your playing and the sound of your strat. Is it a medium magnet creamback in your cab?
Thank you for your kind words!
The cabinet is V112C with Celestion G12M-65 Creamback speaker
I changed the stock EL34s that came with the amp for Preferred Series 6L6WGC and I found a noticeable difference. I think the ELs had a bit more in the mids and a little more sparkly in the top end,, and when I cranked the vol they distorted more. But I do like the 6l6s better they seem creamier and smoother in the mids, and overall maybe a tad darker. They seem to take gain pedals way better. That being said I do favor a "creamy" mid rich distortion sound, so at the end of the day I think its down to tastes.
Πολύ ωραίος φιλε μου! Βιντεο-ήχος-παίξιμο {Ποιότητα}!!! (Ντούκας Παρτκαστερ είναι η κυρία;;)
ευχαριστώ πολύ! =)
Ναι, καλά την κατάλαβες ;-)
@@BakisProductions Εχω και εγώ μια από τον Σταύρο, μπορεί να έχουν συναντηθεί σε κάποιο εργαστηριο οι κύριες 😅.
I have to say it really depends of the amp and the style. Some amps like a Mesa Rectifier greatly benefit of having EL34 to cut the booming low end and to get them to sound cleaner, more focused and less scooped, while other amps sound like crap with them.
On your amp I preferred the EL34 on the clean and 6L6 on the drive channel
Yes, I think an amp's architecture/design defines more the actual sound than the tube choice.
Thank you for your comment.
P.S the "drive channel" is just a pedal in front of the clean amp. Just sayin' =)
maybe the difference wuld be more apparent wyhen the amp was turned right up , I think maybe the gainy part of the bideo was a bit brighter with the 6l6 , a great video at any rate , the amp sounds wonderful
aron hallam thank you mate =)
way too similar to really be bothered...sick playing dude
Pe Peroni true dat.. the similarity I mean ;-)
Thanks for your good video and I fount an adapter (SAT UB-1) that can connect headphones by connecting to the amplifier speaker terminal on etsy. ...
Lovely playing man. Got a bit lost concentrating on that rather than the tones!
well, I guess then that I have failed on the basic purpose of the video! hahaha
Thanks for your kind words mate =)
Very good comparison. Thank you.
I do not appreciate too many differences between the two valves. Maybe, I would choose the EL34 (more musical?) for this amp.
One question: is it appropriate to play at home at low volume? Do the 1.6W and 0.5W work well?
Thank you mate! =)
The low output setting, even at 0.5Watt, doesn't make the amp sound quiet. At least not as anyone would imagine. It just helps the valves to reach that breakup point at lower levels.
So, I don't use that option. I always use full power and adjust my Master Volume. I can play at night and have a beautiful tone without bothering at all my neighbors. ;-)
Thanks for the reply. I really like that amp!
What speaker in the cabinet? ... Victory cabinets looks rather expensive
Yes, they are expensive. But think about it for a second. The speaker is the closest thing to your ear. I mean, if you change tubes, this will change your sound, let's say 10%. If you change speaker or cabinet, I am sure it will have an impact of 50%. (ok, the numbers are not precisely calculated, but you get the idea).
The best sollution is to try different cabinets and decide which one fits your taste the best.
I didn't. I trusted Victory and bought their product. Ignorance is bliss ;-)
Speakers: 1 x Celestion G12M-65 Creamback
Hahahahaha .... Very good answer. Completely agree with you!
wow, I can't hear any real differences either and that's a surprice :-O
There is an actual feel difference. But that can't be captured in a video. And those 4dB are a difference too.
Nice playing! What is your eq set at on the amp? I’m trying to get a little brighter sound.
thanks! EQ on amp is set as you see it at 0:16
Great chops!!!! Gear is ok
Wonderful playing. What's the second song?
Hi, great playing..... quick question. Are the el 34 and 6l6 in the amp at the same time ( looks like it from the beginning of the video).
Thanks
Duncan Cartledge thanx mate!
No, they are not. I guess you can't have them at the same time, due to the different bias they need. The photo shows them at the same time, just to get an idea of their dimensions.
Beautiful amp...and playing. Not too much difference IMO. Great demo.
thanx.. =)
Don't call that strat shitty, it sounds and looks great! Nice playing.
It had several issues. Some of them serious. It's not just the looks and the sound. ;-)
Both sound amazing. It's a wash
Fabulous playing. What are the speakers in the cab? 2x12?
Thank you Mark. It's the V112C cab by Victory with 1 x Celestion G12M-65 Creamback.
So, 1x12.
SRV would often use Marshalls for his clean sounds (EL34s) but Fenders/Dumbles (L6Ls) for his overdriven tones
this sounds so amazing. Could you please show us how you record the speakers? What mics you use and how you do the gain staging in your audio interface and your guitar amp? I see it in the descriptions, but the positioning of the mic, i can't see, Thank you! And i prefer the 6l6
Thanks mate. Go check my Facebook page and you will find a photo of the mic placement, inside the relative folder ;-)
However I obviously don't remember the audio interface settings.
@@BakisProductions thank you very much!
@@BakisProductions which speaker cabinet is it btw?
@@jasonshrestha 1x12
I usually prefer the 6L6, but I like the EL34 with this amp much better. What was the second song you played clean, the one after the Lenny riff?
aboukal I prefer the same. =)
The second song, isn't a song really. Just a riff and a chord progression of mine.
Hi great playing. What tune are you playing (apart from Lenny)? Would it be possible for you to make a video on which we could see your left hand on the neck? With that camera angle it hard to decifer...
thanx mate! =)
It is not a specific tune. It was just a riff I used to play the period I made the video. My left hand might be shown in the future (not the same tune)
There is a purpose of this camera angle.
- you understand the dynamics of my right hand (pick or fingers)
- better frame in terms of photography
- seems like Mick Taylor's! :-D
Thanks for the answer. Can you please just tell me the chords name then... I'll figure the rest by myself.
well, in order of appearance.. haha..
E, F#7, Amaj7, B11
E, F#7, Asus2(add6), F#/A#, B11, G#/B#
C#m, B/D#, Eadd6, G#m7(#5), Aadd6
C#m, B/D#, Eadd6, G#m7(#5), G7, F#7
that's it! more or less.
Have fun mate =)
I hear the 6L6s as being more bassey (aka warmer). I have a 6L6-fitted Duchess and am really pleased with it but I find that the bass knob needs to be rolled back almost to 1, the mid back to 4 and the treble upped to 10. My gear is a wonderful ported 12" Montage speaker with a Type-A Celestion (chosen to compliment the 6L6s) and a Fender US Standard Delux with Lace Gold PUs. The Victory Duchess is a wonderful amp. This new rig has led me to use the bridge pu much more than I used to with my Laney VC30.
Bass to 1, Treble to 10 and bridge pickup..???
That sounds really scary and dangerous!!
Yeh. Those numbers look all wrong for sure. But it is still bassy-warm!!!!
I have a V40 also, and it's got a whole bunch of bass. I'm used to playing el84, so I also crank up the treble and the bass down to 1. It's still got plenty of bass indeed.
Colin Nickel I'm going to try putting a Fuzzface in the loop for a gig tonight. You are not supposed to but I think it will sound less wild that way..... Here goes nothing!
Stephen Smith I tried that with my heavier distortion and she just couldn't handle it, but hopefully it worked out well for you. I also spoke with Martin at Victory and he gave me a mod to calm the bass response. Switch out some resistors and a cap, so nothing too crazy.
6L6 all the way, great playing
I heard a difference, the 6L6s sound deeper in the bass and a bit sparkly on top- I missed the graphic at the start, so it wasn’t confirmation bias. The differences are subtle but there.
I’m hearing the same in the clean examples and I don’t know what graphic you’re talkin’, I fforwarded the start
Awesome playing man!! What kind of pick are you using?
Thanks mate =)
Steve Vai's Ibanez picks
Hi there! What two mics did you use???? The quality is awesome!
Please check the description and you will find all the information you need =)
awesome tone man! what guitar pick do you use?
Thanx mate. Steve Vai's picks by Ibanez.