Zywoo has a trait which no one else has on the same level. intuition, he always guesses right those 50-50 moments and the way he constructs the rounds in his mind before they play out is mind blowing. We tend to say that he has Wall hack in his eyes (:D) Truly a mastermind of cs.
I think ZywOo plays incredibly smart, he invests a lot of time in knowing the timings from A to B in each map. Based on the timings it takes a player to move between different locations, he constructs a process of elimination in his mind. The impressive thing is, that he can compute this process of elimination very fast. That is his real talent.
Agreed with everything you said, but just one correction. In 2021, NAVI's biggest challengers were not Vitality. May be Gambit or Heroic but definitely not Vitality. In fact, Gambit during and after Covid were insane.
During covid years when Navi were going to have an era of their own is the context here. No one is talking about LAN. G2 only came to picture once LAN began. When Navi won the major. And that was actually the end of the time period discussed in here.
i think zywoo this year is the best zywoo we have ever seen and its not close. i think zywoo has a trait that nobody has to the same degree as him and thats that no matter what weapon he has, no matter how much hp he has, if you are running into him you are dying. i cant count how many times ive watched him have a deagle and seeing multiple players walking towards him and thinking "he gets 3 minimum" and then he actually gets 3. i personally think hes the scariest player of all time. that said he doesn't have the acheivements s1mple has. not to mention zywoo still has so many years to go and s1mple seems to be on the decline. i think when all is said and done zywoo will be ahead of s1mple.
@@skryyper6706 I’m sure, but team wise he didn’t win shit. That’s why I’m saying you can have a year off your best and still end up coming back. S1mple and zywoo have both done it.
s1mples 2018 and 2021 were clearly better than any year zywoo ever had. So much raw impact, it's not even close in that matter. 2019 and 2020 was a coin flip on the other side.
Awesome to see the rise of the great LAU! Been watching for a long while now and the videos only increase in quality with each upload and each new video style. Crazy the BOXR boi is now casting majors.. Here's to hitting a half mill subs by December mang
i guess i like zywoo more, but i think you could argue for both. s1mple will probably be the best csgo player ever, but i think zywoo can make alot happen when cs2 comes out, so having success in the 2 different games will also mean a lot .
6:15 I’d disagree here. The years where ZywOo got top 1 in 2019 & 2020 he was the better player. But s1mple in 2021 and 2022 was better than him for sure.
I think that if Zywoo keeps performing, over time he could become indisputably the goat, but as things stand right now, we just need to see more. Not that he hasn't been playing unbelievably these past few years, its just that we have seen so much of s1mple and what he can do, we just need a little more time to get a full grasp of Zywoo's full potential
Yes, the fact that Zywoo manages to reinvent himself with this international roster, by being more vocal, shows that thing are still evolving and I can't wait to see what the futur holds for us
Exactly this, if he continues goat, if he doesnt just second. Even toh i believe from a mentality standpoint zywoo already beats s1mple. If you are toxic you win less
ZywOo at 22 : -1 major, 1 major mvp -3x top1 and 2x top2 since he was 18 -15 mvps and way more till end of the year -2023 for now highest peak ever seen > 2018 simple simple at 22 : -0 major, 0 major mvp -1x top1 and 1x top2 -10 mvps
@xae7854 simple was nowhere near as good as zywoo in his rookie year while zywoo was number in his rookie year and r years down the line number 2 is his worst ranking, that should tell you a lot.
Not a zywoo fan. But after watching tons of tournaments and playing cs for over 20 years I can honestly say: He is the most efficient, complete, smart, and overall perfect player there is, very similar to Messi, the guy seems to be a human wallhack, just like Messi seems to be able to see every player on the court even if he is blindfoleded. The only thing that he lacks is flashyness, s1mple, kennyS, m0nesy as awpers are way more flashy than him. I hope m0nesy becomes his kryptonite, I dont want to see an astralis type of boring ass dominance by vitality, I want to have a Messi vs CR7 type of new era in CS2. Heroic beat them yesterday, thank god, theyre not unstoppable, but Im 100% this is not peak zywoo.
Well, Zywoo is not flashy for many viewers because he is so smooth, so accurate, has such good positioning and preaim. His flicks are almost always controlled but fast enough to not give the opponents a chance. Thats why he so rarely misses and has bad games (even in bad bo3s he usually ends up with like 1.1+ rating like at blast where, imo at least, he didnt look like zywoo at all).
I could be wrong and it might be early to say, but I have the feeling M0nesy will never deliver on the promise of his talent. I feel he will always be very good, but not as good as ZywOo I think. The issue is that ZywOo does WAY less mistakes, plays smarter and ZywOo can play better with all guns.
@@strahinjastojkovic7724 well, s1mple had the highest peak of all time, s1mple is the most complete player, but you can say the same about zywoo, both can rifle, aggressive and passive awp, both are great with pistols. In my eyes Zywoo is Messi (the efficient and perfect goat), and S1mple is Maradona (a more creative goat). Zywoo still not better than prime s1mple, but he is younger best cs go players reach their peak between 22-25 years old. Zywoo is 22, S1mple is about to turn 26. I believe zywoo will win another major, I dont know if s1mple can do the same.
I feel like you somewhat undersold s1mples major run. Like I get what you are saying in that the pro scene had kind of a general dip during/after corona. But I just dont think the two major runs are that comparable. Vitality won all their BO3s against Tier 2 teams, and while that sobviously not their fault, it still feels kinda similar to Outsiders in Rio. Navi on the other side went into Stockholm as the Nr.1, beat every team ranked #2 to #6, 4 of which in BO3s, with the last game being against a #12 VirtusPro. And despite playing pretty much exclusively the best teams in the scene, he still somehow put up a 1.47 rating. That is just ridiculous. Meanwhile Zywoo "only" got a 1.39 rating in BO1s against the #4 and #9 and BO3s against #22, 23, 27 and 31. Its just not really comparable.
Only looking at rank gives distorted picture though. A lot of the top teams at that time had undergone roster changes and were still figuring stuff out. NaVi pummeled everyone as they were the only top org that had had a stable roster.
Do this video for dev1ce. In terms of trophies s1mple and zywoo are behind him. I think his style is less flashy and it made it harder to see how oppressive his firepower was
device had the best team of all time around him, and its not even close, they were by far the most dominant team of all time if you exclude 2012 nip, but that really shouldnt count. if astralis were in the tournament, they would win it. he was just the best individual player out of the 5, but all 5 players were insane as well, device was great, but he was never a star player.
@@zezanje1I don't think dev1ce is the goat, don't get me wrong. But in this case, all 5 of Astralis were star players. Dev1ce isn't "not a star" just because they all were. That's not how that works.
@@juniorgalacto17 device proved that he is just not on simple's,niko's or zywoo's level by joining nip, because at times all 3 of these players had shit teams around them, and the games were decided by them overperforming or not, decided wanted to prove himself and do the same by joining a tier 2 team, and failed miserably, sure he had decent stats, but he never managed to do what niko, simple and zywoo were doing on shitty teams, which is my entire point, he is not a superstar, he is just a fantastic consistent player. device is one of the greatest players of all time, but he will never be able to do with the ak what niko or cold were able to do, and he could never come close to what guardian, kenny or oskar were able to do with the awp. device is a consistent players, but these players are stars, they are the reason their teams were winning games, not the other way around.
@@zezanje1 Yes - once again, I don't think he's the goat... And perhaps he isn't a solo superstar like simple, niko, zywoo, cold. And contrary to what you said, Niko and S1mple have had a lot of perfectly good teams. Take KennyS and Fallen, they were both considered stars in their times. But while perhaps the best players individually on their teams at a lot of times, they weren't carrying. But they're still considered stars. You don't need to be carrying a bad team to be a star. I agree with your superstar terminology but I think a superstar and star are *different* terms. And I think Dev1ce is a *star*
There was a post that compared the hardest carries and it was clear that Zywoo had to carry WAY harder than s1mple, and judging by eye test its obvious that Zywoo is the better player overall.
ZywOo activates when the Team is in a pitch and the team needs him to clutch , not just for the sake of individuality. so in my opinion ZywOo is there for his team to activate Them and also can go solo , i dont know i think his more of a teamplayer and that would win him more game's overall which is the goal.
What I love about s1mple is that when NAVI is in trouble, he’s like “drop me an awp” and he tries to do crazy pics to win a round they should lose. What I love about Zywoo is that he’s a great teammate and understand his team is trying even though no one is at his level. Two very different players, both incredible in their own way.
Overall S1mple is the best player in CSGO from start to end but I know that Zywoo is the best CSGO player starting from his first game in tier 1 in 2019 to 2023 , he had the most MVPs and the highest rating with the highest impact adding to all of that the point that you made and also three number 1 placings including this year and two number 2 placings which makes him unhuman , Imagine being number 1 from the start , it is like if Mbappe won the ballon d'or in his first year with Monaco or Haaland in his first year with Salzburg , incredible really if he continues this form to CS2 he will be the best eSport player in History .
From a stat perspective, we should really filter the economic situation. What is the impact and rating in those different situation : - Both team low buy - low buy Vs high buy - high buy low buy That way, we could kinda take into account the fact that a team is better than an other, making individual comparaison fairer. Though it's really hard to compare.
@@singular9 you need a good team to win. Let's be real here. Device is obviously a great and consistent player over the years. But in terms of individual performance he's not even in the same league as s1m and zyw
I don't think you can add Device in the conversation because .. He was never 1st in HLTV Top 20 ! The guy was super consistent, 8 Times in The HLTV Top 20, 4 Times major Winner.. He archive a lot, but He played in the team with some great players at the time. I will put Device as the third best player of all time in CSGO easy.. but for me in the top 2 are 1st. s1mple (mainly because he was on top of his game for so many years) 2nd. ZywOo (which is probably the most impressive player that CSGO had considering what teammates he had in Vitality during the years and he always delivered his best not matter what). ✌
just gonna point out some reasons why 2021 stockholm was WAY harder for s1mple than paris was for zywoo top 20 players in 2021 s1mple played against in stockholm champions stage: zywoo (2) niko (3) sh1ro (4) ax1le (5) hobbit (6) (potential) top 20 players in 2023 zywoo played against in paris: siuhy? in some universe does he get top 20? certainly nobody on into the breach or apeks is s1mple beat the 5 best players in the world that weren't called s1mple, beat the top 3 teams in the world that weren't called navi, the greatest rifling performance in history by niko, zywoo averaging 1.30 rating 1.42 impact, and a gambit team that didn't drop out of the top 3 from april 2021 to january 2022 (they were absolutely running through everyone if you remember, unbelievable team that year) of course a major is a major and you only beat who's in front of you but not dropping a map to the top 3 teams that aren't your team is absurd
I can see what your are saying but i think you also need to look at who is the better teamplayer, because if you have lets just say old astralis, and they won everything device was the star and all that but if xyp did all the util for device, and took the bad positions, kept the team happy, and just gave a overall god feeling i think that is just as important to do as killing, and if he would leave theey just started losing couldn't replace him that would mean that he was just as importen as the starplayer (in my eyes). Simple is known for being toxic and making his team just wanna quit or not thinking straight because they are scared of what simple will scream at them. Cs go is not only a individual game, it's a team game, so if like zywoo who is a better teamplayer (my opnion), ttheen i think that gives the edge to him because he gets the kills while making his team happy and not nervous about there own teamplayer
@@cotojelolkokos no, i specifically said this because he played way worse on it, he changed back quickly tough. He recorded his worst map ever on 16:9 going 2-17 on overpass :P
Like someone already said, if zywoo continues he will be goat, he already is from a mentality standpoint cuz s1mple is just too toxic for his own good. For aim and such it’s a little early. Also i think that even if major had “tier 2” opponent (even toh they beat t1 teams so i dont really get all the “fluke” major thing) they showed even in rio that they could beat good teams (heroic in grand final in rio), yesterday they beat faze 2 - 0 too so i dont think they really need to show off anymore even considered they dont have that much motivation for a tournament like spring finals when they have just won the major
S1mple doesn't enjoy CS anymore. That's it..Old simple played for passion. He loved the game and He wanted to be best..Now he just plays it cause it's his job and there is no passion involved....Imo that Also contributed his recent demise and poor from....If you lost passion then you can't be simply good enough
@@AK01445 a lifetime? It’s been a year. What planted are you on? I’m not a simple fan at all I, I like watching Navi lose, but they have much more heavy shit going outside the server than most other teams. If you can’t figure that out it’s because your 12.
I'm a s1mple fan so I'm obviously biased. But the way I look at it is, every year zywoo was #1, s1mple was right there with him (except maybe 2019) to the point it was basically a coin flip. But s1mple now has 2 years that are pretty far above any year zywoo has had. 2018 is the greatest individual year any player has had, and 2021 was the greatest year any player has had (achievements + individual play). He set the record for MVPs, rating at an S tier event, aces at an S tier event, and rating at a Major (and plenty more I'm sure). Zywoo has a great chance to be the CS GOAT if he continues his dominance in CS2, but s1mple at the current time has higher peak + longevity, so it's a no brainer for me.
I thin zywoo is the goat because of the decisions mid round. One example of poor decision making from s1mple is that one knife on nitr0 that he missed and made navi lose the game, i dont think zywoo would ever do such a thing...
@@wayleygg yeah I hope he proves me wrong but especially with the war and how his team won’t pick up any Russian players it seems like he’s reached his plateau. Nothing will ever top his utter dominance earlier on his career though.
I've watched prime coldzera, prime NiKo, prime s1mple and yet none of them comes close to ZywOo, for me. Because you can see that it isn't a skill that he developed overtime, I mean, it is, but it's a lot more natural for him. It's like he's connected to the game and makes it flow and easy, although it isn't easy. Besides his humbleness to know he's good but doesn't rub it off in his teammates' faces or become tilted at somebody. It's this combination that, for me, makes ZywOo the GOAT. s1mple is great but he lacks all of it that I just said. It's funny but if we can compare: Messi is ZywOo (the natural) and Ronaldo is s1mple (the hard worker)
The reason why s1mple is not the nr 1 player is because of his mental/personality. The NAVI team spirit was so bad, when you watch zMoCs translation you can see that... Csgo is more than stats, so I think ZywOo is the best player for sure and honestly, I think IGL´s get way too underrated, they are the reason players like ZywOo, s1mple, iM... can perform in the first place.
ZywOo is the perfect soldier he always plays every situation to his advantage, his timings are silly to watch sometimes but s1mple is just magic on a awp he can do a flashy miracle play every game he plays like a god among mortals these are their play styles and it reflects in their numbers
With Devices return and him showing still an amazing form, I can't help but wonder if this discussion of GOAT would be a three way conversation if he never left for NIP followed by his hiatus. Wasn't a fan of Astralis, Astralis+ Economy changes in CS made the meta less exciting in my opinion, but I feel like Device was an amazingly consistent player who did what was needed while remaining consistent+ ahead of the enemy just like Zwyoo and s1mple. Device was more of a safe player thus not seeming as flashy as the other 2, but I feel that comes from Astralis's structure/ playstyle. While his ratings aren't as flashy either, his pivotal role in the Astralis roster and their success would of been a large part of the discussion for his potential of GOAT if he stayed for me. Sadly because of those "what ifs" he isn't in the discussion/ competing for GOAT.
zywoo is my favoruite player to watch. i think they can both be the greatest... or at least i think that trying to split the hairs is useless. both are just way beyond what other players can see and do in the game. surely s1mple is the GOAT due to longevity and setting the example, its easy to be great when you know its possible its difficult to pave the way
No-one is breaching s1mple 2019-21 form. It is probably the greatest peak of a CS player ever. The amount of recency bias in the community is insane, you can hate the guy but can't deny it's his no. and achievements. S1mple was carrying his team into playoffs and semis in his initial majors whereas a certain "Goat " still doesn't have a victory against the Top 17 teams in the playoffs in major.
No he cant as of now anyone who makes the argument that he is doesnt know what they are talking about could he be yes he needs more years under his belt maybe another major for ring counters but most needs to string together 4 more good years and s1mple needs to shit the bed from now on
s1mple always the GOAT. Some say Pele is the GOAT of Football. No matter what others achieve, he set the bar, he started it. No one can take that away from Pele. I think at the end of the day, you can't disrespect those that have come before.
Lau I m not sure if you got inspired by maui but this seems a bit baity :D Everyone knows s1mple is clear, we don't have to fabricate a fake discussion just to have another discussion, it gets so tiring. If you start the argument by placings in the best player list of some website, it's already a lost case. We all know s1mple could have easily had one or even both number 1s of 2019 and 2020. Many analysts even listed him that. On the other hand: s1mples 2018 was the most hard carry year any player has ever done, not even zywoo was close in any of his years. All while facing prime astralis. Then 2021 he even topped that, but with a better team and a better, more calculated playstyle. s1mple towered high above everyone on these years, even above zywoo despite him of course being excellent. Next argument: playstyle. Everyone with a tiny bit of eye test knows, that s1mple has more impact and breaks the game more than zywoo does. Zywoo is frustrating to watch sometimes, since he is sooo good but also plays by the book so often. Think of his clutch cs g2 on nuke. He only goes for that because it's the last round of the half. Let's not get blinded by s1mple not being himself since a couple of months, we are talking about the GOAT of csgo, not the greatest of some months. Which brings me to the final point: achievements. Yes they both got their major (s1mples run was of course more impressive, let's not start comparing the brackets, it will be devastating), but where is the rest for zywoo? One cologne final? And 2 major quarters? This is the goat? s1mple carried his team to semis and finals of majors in 2016!! Being younger there than zywoo is now. He has made it to 4 major finals, won cologne twice, won kato, the grandslam? There is just no debate. All in all I even find this kind of disrespecting for Dev1ce. If it wasn't for s1mple, he would be clearly the goat. Not zywoo, who played 4 years and won one big event. Love your stuff, peace!
I think the caviar on top of all of this is, simple doesnt have that many years to go. So going into cs2 zywoo, could really 1 up him. We will see. Anyway, i´m gonna love watching both!
I think people are being blinded by HLTV rating when that metric doesn't mean shit. This whole year s1mple has just looked painfully average every time I watch him. He's either washed or in a huge slump because I can't distinguish his style from any other T1 awper at this point(with the exceptions of ZywOo and m0NESY). I don't see anything special when I watch s1mple anymore. It looks like he overoptimized his playstyle and just does the standard 'correct' play in every situation. I don't see him go for that many risky out of pocket plays anymore.
The only time you see old Simple craziness is when NaVi are getting their ass handed to them and he feels the need to try and carry but then just ends up pushing smokes and getting fucked up for it
@@grandmasteryoda503 Exactly. There was that one recent game on nuke where they were down like 10-2 on ct and then he started going for really ridiculous braindead plays.
What about dev1ce? I think he’s more consistent that S1mple. Maybe S1mple has a higher skill ceiling but Dev1ce’s career achievements and accolades are unmatched at the moment!
zywoo got most of his #1s during the online era and most of his MVPs and his major MVP was acquired from beating the worst teams in playoffs of all time to win a major. it’s still not even close between the two if we are talking GOAT. I believe zywoo is probably a better person than s1mple but you can’t deny his greatness is unmatched
S1mple is the goat thanks mostly to his achievment, but taking RATIOs into consideration and solo carry, ZywOo is the BOAT (best of all time), he won 11 MVP with the french washed linup with not even a top30 or top40 player in it, while S1mple only won 1 MVP before electronic joined him.
"A line longer than Charlie Sheen" 😂😂😂 Honestly, Simple is the GOAT of CSGO. However, if Zywoo keeps up this consistency his teammates pick up some of their weight, I could see him being the goat of CS2 I comment to help statistics
Maybe not the place to ask but this reminded me will HLTV have a top 20 for 2023? Ive seen some people say they wont because of CS2, is this true? Really hope its not. Couldnt find anything about it from a quick google
u cant say s1mple's major hjad a caviat he beat vitality in quarters (fresh of epl 2nd place losing to navi and had zywoo peforming) they beat gambit (number 1 team up until colonge and was still a top 3-4 team on lan who only lost to vitality, navi and faze on lan) and g2 with niko in his career form ( a top 5 team who went 2nd at cologne losing to again navi) zywoo beat into the breach, apeks and gamerlegion, like its not even close the level of competition that was played, and on top of that, s1mple had a 1.38-1.4 rating ish in groupstage and ended on 1.47 rating, meaning his playoff peformance was atleast 1.5+ rating overall zywoo was around 1.38 and was 1.39 at the end, good but bro, there are levels and s1mple's mvp run at major was far more impressive than zywoo
I think its also a case of timing. Zywoo comes at a time where a ton of information and help is widely available for everyone at every level, wheras s1mple was apart of that help and was actively creating that information.
S1mple is the GOAT, but Zywoo would have been (if not for CS2 & i think he will be of CS2) and its 'greatest OF ALL TIME' Zywoo short period here plus online era though no fault of his own has to be counted i think when talking GOAT. IMO S1mple is the GOAT and i think for many delivers the most breathtaking memories though his career (russian war i think could have stopped him) but Zywoo may be more natural and will almost certainly be the CS2 goat.
@@risheeeesh512 I concur, based on what we are hearing about movement alone and game changes, while the old guys will still be cracked the new blood for that game are going to be unreal.
Bro casting and uploading at the same time? Dude really does it all.
My guy
@@starseed- lmao this is where cultured men hang out
ZywOo 5yr professional career achievements is unbelievable and unmatchable. So amazing
Publishing mid-cast, elite mentality
Zywoo has a trait which no one else has on the same level. intuition, he always guesses right those 50-50 moments and the way he constructs the rounds in his mind before they play out is mind blowing. We tend to say that he has Wall hack in his eyes (:D) Truly a mastermind of cs.
I think ZywOo plays incredibly smart, he invests a lot of time in knowing the timings from A to B in each map. Based on the timings it takes a player to move between different locations, he constructs a process of elimination in his mind. The impressive thing is, that he can compute this process of elimination very fast. That is his real talent.
@@Augenhose Yeah zywoos main advantage is that he is legit gigabrain when it comes to cs. Super smart player
Agreed with everything you said, but just one correction. In 2021, NAVI's biggest challengers were not Vitality. May be Gambit or Heroic but definitely not Vitality. In fact, Gambit during and after Covid were insane.
shit the bed after the roster got bought by c9 unfortunately
Didn't Gambit shit the bed on LAN though? Still a good team but not even close to their online form, I always thought G2 were top 3 that year
During covid years when Navi were going to have an era of their own is the context here. No one is talking about LAN. G2 only came to picture once LAN began. When Navi won the major. And that was actually the end of the time period discussed in here.
i think zywoo this year is the best zywoo we have ever seen and its not close. i think zywoo has a trait that nobody has to the same degree as him and thats that no matter what weapon he has, no matter how much hp he has, if you are running into him you are dying. i cant count how many times ive watched him have a deagle and seeing multiple players walking towards him and thinking "he gets 3 minimum" and then he actually gets 3. i personally think hes the scariest player of all time. that said he doesn't have the acheivements s1mple has. not to mention zywoo still has so many years to go and s1mple seems to be on the decline. i think when all is said and done zywoo will be ahead of s1mple.
tbf, s1mple has only had like six months off his best, last year zywoo had a really bad year
@@risheeeesh512 last year ZywOo's rating was higher than s1mple
@@skryyper6706 I’m sure, but team wise he didn’t win shit. That’s why I’m saying you can have a year off your best and still end up coming back. S1mple and zywoo have both done it.
s1mples 2018 and 2021 were clearly better than any year zywoo ever had. So much raw impact, it's not even close in that matter. 2019 and 2020 was a coin flip on the other side.
@@HaasTheFirst2019 was in no way a coin flip lmao
Awesome to see the rise of the great LAU! Been watching for a long while now and the videos only increase in quality with each upload and each new video style. Crazy the BOXR boi is now casting majors.. Here's to hitting a half mill subs by December mang
i guess i like zywoo more, but i think you could argue for both.
s1mple will probably be the best csgo player ever, but i think zywoo can make alot happen when cs2 comes out, so having success in the 2 different games will also mean a lot .
6:15 I’d disagree here. The years where ZywOo got top 1 in 2019 & 2020 he was the better player. But s1mple in 2021 and 2022 was better than him for sure.
I second this. No one could even come close to ZyWoo's performance in 2019 & 2020
Top5 in CSGO history
1 s1mple
2 zywoo
3 device
4- niko
5- coldzera
Coldzera 😂
@@SSH_74 why not? Also i would probably replace niko with kennys just for achievments which aint that little of an impact
@@SSH_74 Who would you put in 5th then? Cold was a beast at one point in time
@@kivori3438 cold wasn't consistent enough. I'd put olof, ropz or twistz in his place
@@SSH_74 peak performance was high toh, olof could be but i wouldnt say ropz and twistzz tbh, they are very good but not top material imo
I think that if Zywoo keeps performing, over time he could become indisputably the goat, but as things stand right now, we just need to see more. Not that he hasn't been playing unbelievably these past few years, its just that we have seen so much of s1mple and what he can do, we just need a little more time to get a full grasp of Zywoo's full potential
Yes, the fact that Zywoo manages to reinvent himself with this international roster, by being more vocal, shows that thing are still evolving and I can't wait to see what the futur holds for us
Exactly this, if he continues goat, if he doesnt just second. Even toh i believe from a mentality standpoint zywoo already beats s1mple. If you are toxic you win less
Simple will stay the goat of CS:GO not enough time to take that away. But Zywoo might become the goat of CS2 and CS in general
@@Ausstein if we talk about csgo specifically yes, i was talking about cs in general if i said csgo my bad
Compare the first 5 years of S1mple to Zywoo's. No comparison. Zywoo leaves him in the dust.
I'm still snorting copium that Niko can come back
you should do an argument for dev1ce next
yes
Yup
we’re back
Been waiting🙏🏼
bro you're casting zywoo rn get back in the game
ZywOo at 22 :
-1 major, 1 major mvp
-3x top1 and 2x top2 since he was 18
-15 mvps and way more till end of the year
-2023 for now highest peak ever seen > 2018 simple
simple at 22 :
-0 major, 0 major mvp
-1x top1 and 1x top2
-10 mvps
You're just so biased it's funny. Also 2018 s1mple and 2021 s1mple > ZywOo this year. It's really not that close.
@xae7854 simple was nowhere near as good as zywoo in his rookie year while zywoo was number in his rookie year and r years down the line number 2 is his worst ranking, that should tell you a lot.
this is like comparing messi and mbappe
- wrong, 2x top1 not 3
- wrong, s1mple 2018 peak > zywoo 2023 peak
personally experiencing both I'd say s1mple 2021 > ZywOo 2023
Bro the fact that zywoo was born at the same time as cs was released must be scripted in this simulation
Enjoyed watching you and Conner cast the major. MY GOATS
Not a zywoo fan. But after watching tons of tournaments and playing cs for over 20 years I can honestly say: He is the most efficient, complete, smart, and overall perfect player there is, very similar to Messi, the guy seems to be a human wallhack, just like Messi seems to be able to see every player on the court even if he is blindfoleded. The only thing that he lacks is flashyness, s1mple, kennyS, m0nesy as awpers are way more flashy than him.
I hope m0nesy becomes his kryptonite, I dont want to see an astralis type of boring ass dominance by vitality, I want to have a Messi vs CR7 type of new era in CS2. Heroic beat them yesterday, thank god, theyre not unstoppable, but Im 100% this is not peak zywoo.
Well, Zywoo is not flashy for many viewers because he is so smooth, so accurate, has such good positioning and preaim. His flicks are almost always controlled but fast enough to not give the opponents a chance. Thats why he so rarely misses and has bad games (even in bad bo3s he usually ends up with like 1.1+ rating like at blast where, imo at least, he didnt look like zywoo at all).
I could be wrong and it might be early to say, but I have the feeling M0nesy will never deliver on the promise of his talent. I feel he will always be very good, but not as good as ZywOo I think. The issue is that ZywOo does WAY less mistakes, plays smarter and ZywOo can play better with all guns.
I would say zywoo is cr7 and simple is messi.
@@strahinjastojkovic7724 I would say paki
@@strahinjastojkovic7724 well, s1mple had the highest peak of all time, s1mple is the most complete player, but you can say the same about zywoo, both can rifle, aggressive and passive awp, both are great with pistols. In my eyes Zywoo is Messi (the efficient and perfect goat), and S1mple is Maradona (a more creative goat). Zywoo still not better than prime s1mple, but he is younger best cs go players reach their peak between 22-25 years old. Zywoo is 22, S1mple is about to turn 26. I believe zywoo will win another major, I dont know if s1mple can do the same.
I feel like you somewhat undersold s1mples major run. Like I get what you are saying in that the pro scene had kind of a general dip during/after corona. But I just dont think the two major runs are that comparable.
Vitality won all their BO3s against Tier 2 teams, and while that sobviously not their fault, it still feels kinda similar to Outsiders in Rio.
Navi on the other side went into Stockholm as the Nr.1, beat every team ranked #2 to #6, 4 of which in BO3s, with the last game being against a #12 VirtusPro. And despite playing pretty much exclusively the best teams in the scene, he still somehow put up a 1.47 rating. That is just ridiculous.
Meanwhile Zywoo "only" got a 1.39 rating in BO1s against the #4 and #9 and BO3s against #22, 23, 27 and 31. Its just not really comparable.
Only looking at rank gives distorted picture though. A lot of the top teams at that time had undergone roster changes and were still figuring stuff out. NaVi pummeled everyone as they were the only top org that had had a stable roster.
Do this video for dev1ce. In terms of trophies s1mple and zywoo are behind him. I think his style is less flashy and it made it harder to see how oppressive his firepower was
Also really interesting how dev1ce shows that even without the 'Astralis' structure, he still performs
device had the best team of all time around him, and its not even close, they were by far the most dominant team of all time if you exclude 2012 nip, but that really shouldnt count. if astralis were in the tournament, they would win it. he was just the best individual player out of the 5, but all 5 players were insane as well, device was great, but he was never a star player.
@@zezanje1I don't think dev1ce is the goat, don't get me wrong. But in this case, all 5 of Astralis were star players. Dev1ce isn't "not a star" just because they all were. That's not how that works.
@@juniorgalacto17 device proved that he is just not on simple's,niko's or zywoo's level by joining nip, because at times all 3 of these players had shit teams around them, and the games were decided by them overperforming or not, decided wanted to prove himself and do the same by joining a tier 2 team, and failed miserably, sure he had decent stats, but he never managed to do what niko, simple and zywoo were doing on shitty teams, which is my entire point, he is not a superstar, he is just a fantastic consistent player. device is one of the greatest players of all time, but he will never be able to do with the ak what niko or cold were able to do, and he could never come close to what guardian, kenny or oskar were able to do with the awp. device is a consistent players, but these players are stars, they are the reason their teams were winning games, not the other way around.
@@zezanje1 Yes - once again, I don't think he's the goat... And perhaps he isn't a solo superstar like simple, niko, zywoo, cold. And contrary to what you said, Niko and S1mple have had a lot of perfectly good teams. Take KennyS and Fallen, they were both considered stars in their times. But while perhaps the best players individually on their teams at a lot of times, they weren't carrying. But they're still considered stars. You don't need to be carrying a bad team to be a star. I agree with your superstar terminology but I think a superstar and star are *different* terms. And I think Dev1ce is a *star*
He’s my goat
The woo
Zywoo
There was a post that compared the hardest carries and it was clear that Zywoo had to carry WAY harder than s1mple, and judging by eye test its obvious that Zywoo is the better player overall.
ZywOo activates when the Team is in a pitch and the team needs him to clutch , not just for the sake of individuality. so in my opinion ZywOo is there for his team to activate Them and also can go solo , i dont know i think his more of a teamplayer and that would win him more game's overall which is the goal.
seeing you cast the finals was so awesome. really happy for u
What I love about s1mple is that when NAVI is in trouble, he’s like “drop me an awp” and he tries to do crazy pics to win a round they should lose. What I love about Zywoo is that he’s a great teammate and understand his team is trying even though no one is at his level. Two very different players, both incredible in their own way.
Overall S1mple is the best player in CSGO from start to end but I know that Zywoo is the best CSGO player starting from his first game in tier 1 in 2019 to 2023 , he had the most MVPs and the highest rating with the highest impact adding to all of that the point that you made and also three number 1 placings including this year and two number 2 placings which makes him unhuman , Imagine being number 1 from the start , it is like if Mbappe won the ballon d'or in his first year with Monaco or Haaland in his first year with Salzburg , incredible really if he continues this form to CS2 he will be the best eSport player in History .
so happy to hear you're doing well. beautiful scenes
From a stat perspective, we should really filter the economic situation.
What is the impact and rating in those different situation :
- Both team low buy
- low buy Vs high buy
- high buy low buy
That way, we could kinda take into account the fact that a team is better than an other, making individual comparaison fairer.
Though it's really hard to compare.
You’ve been killing it bro, keep it up
The point about who got the better team is the strongest in my opinion. If you have an electronic or axile by your side, it's much easier to shine.
What about Device? Crazy consistency, 4 majors, meta-defining, longevity...surely a contender in the conversation?
Agreed. Device is by far #1 compared to the two. You can be great, but can you win
@@singular9 you need a good team to win. Let's be real here. Device is obviously a great and consistent player over the years. But in terms of individual performance he's not even in the same league as s1m and zyw
I don't think you can add Device in the conversation because .. He was never 1st in HLTV Top 20 ! The guy was super consistent, 8 Times in The HLTV Top 20, 4 Times major Winner.. He archive a lot, but He played in the team with some great players at the time. I will put Device as the third best player of all time in CSGO easy.. but for me in the top 2 are 1st. s1mple (mainly because he was on top of his game for so many years) 2nd. ZywOo (which is probably the most impressive player that CSGO had considering what teammates he had in Vitality during the years and he always delivered his best not matter what). ✌
Can't be GOAT of a 10 year game in 5 years. Unfortunate for newer players but is how it is.
just gonna point out some reasons why 2021 stockholm was WAY harder for s1mple than paris was for zywoo
top 20 players in 2021 s1mple played against in stockholm champions stage:
zywoo (2)
niko (3)
sh1ro (4)
ax1le (5)
hobbit (6)
(potential) top 20 players in 2023 zywoo played against in paris:
siuhy? in some universe does he get top 20? certainly nobody on into the breach or apeks is
s1mple beat the 5 best players in the world that weren't called s1mple, beat the top 3 teams in the world that weren't called navi, the greatest rifling performance in history by niko, zywoo averaging 1.30 rating 1.42 impact, and a gambit team that didn't drop out of the top 3 from april 2021 to january 2022 (they were absolutely running through everyone if you remember, unbelievable team that year)
of course a major is a major and you only beat who's in front of you but not dropping a map to the top 3 teams that aren't your team is absurd
I can see what your are saying but i think you also need to look at who is the better teamplayer, because if you have lets just say old astralis, and they won everything device was the star and all that but if xyp did all the util for device, and took the bad positions, kept the team happy, and just gave a overall god feeling i think that is just as important to do as killing, and if he would leave theey just started losing couldn't replace him that would mean that he was just as importen as the starplayer (in my eyes). Simple is known for being toxic and making his team just wanna quit or not thinking straight because they are scared of what simple will scream at them. Cs go is not only a individual game, it's a team game, so if like zywoo who is a better teamplayer (my opnion), ttheen i think that gives the edge to him because he gets the kills while making his team happy and not nervous about there own teamplayer
The only way to settle this is that both guys have to switch to 16:9 and see who performs the best on that 😂
i love this
zywoo already played 16:9 for some time and was performing the same
@@cotojelolkokos no, i specifically said this because he played way worse on it, he changed back quickly tough. He recorded his worst map ever on 16:9 going 2-17 on overpass :P
everybody knows launders. and i still believe he is underrated. great video
Like someone already said, if zywoo continues he will be goat, he already is from a mentality standpoint cuz s1mple is just too toxic for his own good. For aim and such it’s a little early. Also i think that even if major had “tier 2” opponent (even toh they beat t1 teams so i dont really get all the “fluke” major thing) they showed even in rio that they could beat good teams (heroic in grand final in rio), yesterday they beat faze 2 - 0 too so i dont think they really need to show off anymore even considered they dont have that much motivation for a tournament like spring finals when they have just won the major
S1mple doesn't enjoy CS anymore. That's it..Old simple played for passion. He loved the game and He wanted to be best..Now he just plays it cause it's his job and there is no passion involved....Imo that Also contributed his recent demise and poor from....If you lost passion then you can't be simply good enough
His country is also in an active war.
that's right, I was thinking the same
@Spetsnazty so is that going to be an excuse for a life time?
@@AK01445 a lifetime? It’s been a year. What planted are you on? I’m not a simple fan at all I, I like watching Navi lose, but they have much more heavy shit going outside the server than most other teams. If you can’t figure that out it’s because your 12.
@@AK01445 No, but it might be an excuse until the war is over you idiot brained manchild.
I love this background, great video 💪🏼
What do I have to do to see you on Washington in the arena?
i’ll be out there!
I'm a s1mple fan so I'm obviously biased. But the way I look at it is, every year zywoo was #1, s1mple was right there with him (except maybe 2019) to the point it was basically a coin flip. But s1mple now has 2 years that are pretty far above any year zywoo has had. 2018 is the greatest individual year any player has had, and 2021 was the greatest year any player has had (achievements + individual play). He set the record for MVPs, rating at an S tier event, aces at an S tier event, and rating at a Major (and plenty more I'm sure). Zywoo has a great chance to be the CS GOAT if he continues his dominance in CS2, but s1mple at the current time has higher peak + longevity, so it's a no brainer for me.
Absolutely love these videos keep it up launders ❤
I thin zywoo is the goat because of the decisions mid round. One example of poor decision making from s1mple is that one knife on nitr0 that he missed and made navi lose the game, i dont think zywoo would ever do such a thing...
I think Device should be in that discussion of goat. 4 majors, top 5 multiple years in a row, I think he has the greatest resume of any csgo player
The way it’s looking, s1mple is the goat of CSGO and Zywoo will continue his dominance into CS2 and probably lead the game into a new era
Yep and m0nesy will be close behind Zywoo in CS2. S1mple won’t necessarily fall off, but I don’t think he’ll excel in CS2.
@@wayleygg yeah I hope he proves me wrong but especially with the war and how his team won’t pick up any Russian players it seems like he’s reached his plateau. Nothing will ever top his utter dominance earlier on his career though.
I've watched prime coldzera, prime NiKo, prime s1mple and yet none of them comes close to ZywOo, for me. Because you can see that it isn't a skill that he developed overtime, I mean, it is, but it's a lot more natural for him. It's like he's connected to the game and makes it flow and easy, although it isn't easy. Besides his humbleness to know he's good but doesn't rub it off in his teammates' faces or become tilted at somebody. It's this combination that, for me, makes ZywOo the GOAT.
s1mple is great but he lacks all of it that I just said.
It's funny but if we can compare: Messi is ZywOo (the natural) and Ronaldo is s1mple (the hard worker)
nice to see new upload!
i LOVE these videos man
let’s GO
The reason why s1mple is not the nr 1 player is because of his mental/personality. The NAVI team spirit was so bad, when you watch zMoCs translation you can see that... Csgo is more than stats, so I think ZywOo is the best player for sure and honestly, I think IGL´s get way too underrated, they are the reason players like ZywOo, s1mple, iM... can perform in the first place.
ZywOo is the perfect soldier he always plays every situation to his advantage, his timings are silly to watch sometimes but s1mple is just magic on a awp he can do a flashy miracle play every game he plays like a god among mortals these are their play styles and it reflects in their numbers
i mean, 2/4 simple's major finals were against prime Astralis or prime SK, faze he did drop the ball though
With Devices return and him showing still an amazing form, I can't help but wonder if this discussion of GOAT would be a three way conversation if he never left for NIP followed by his hiatus.
Wasn't a fan of Astralis, Astralis+ Economy changes in CS made the meta less exciting in my opinion, but I feel like Device was an amazingly consistent player who did what was needed while remaining consistent+ ahead of the enemy just like Zwyoo and s1mple. Device was more of a safe player thus not seeming as flashy as the other 2, but I feel that comes from Astralis's structure/ playstyle. While his ratings aren't as flashy either, his pivotal role in the Astralis roster and their success would of been a large part of the discussion for his potential of GOAT if he stayed for me. Sadly because of those "what ifs" he isn't in the discussion/ competing for GOAT.
Fire shirt and video mr lau
best time to upload this video since you are actually casting a vitality game live RIGHT NOW. hehe
you and scrawny casting is the only way my gf will watch cs games, the launders show is every day baybeeeyyy
Now that CSGO over we need a ranked all time best players list lau!
This comment section is so delusional I could die.
"We had a line line than charlie sheen" lol...
zywoo is my favoruite player to watch. i think they can both be the greatest... or at least i think that trying to split the hairs is useless. both are just way beyond what other players can see and do in the game. surely s1mple is the GOAT due to longevity and setting the example, its easy to be great when you know its possible its difficult to pave the way
People are sleeping on Ropz, ngl. He's not flashy but he sure plays consistently every game
No-one is breaching s1mple 2019-21 form. It is probably the greatest peak of a CS player ever. The amount of recency bias in the community is insane, you can hate the guy but can't deny it's his no. and achievements. S1mple was carrying his team into playoffs and semis in his initial majors whereas a certain "Goat " still doesn't have a victory against the Top 17 teams in the playoffs in major.
I think we should add IEM Katowice, IEM Cologne and Intel Grand Slam into argument for s1mple.
No he cant as of now anyone who makes the argument that he is doesnt know what they are talking about could he be yes he needs more years under his belt maybe another major for ring counters but most needs to string together 4 more good years and s1mple needs to shit the bed from now on
s1mple always the GOAT.
Some say Pele is the GOAT of Football. No matter what others achieve, he set the bar, he started it. No one can take that away from Pele.
I think at the end of the day, you can't disrespect those that have come before.
Lau I m not sure if you got inspired by maui but this seems a bit baity :D
Everyone knows s1mple is clear, we don't have to fabricate a fake discussion just to have another discussion, it gets so tiring.
If you start the argument by placings in the best player list of some website, it's already a lost case. We all know s1mple could have easily had one or even both number 1s of 2019 and 2020. Many analysts even listed him that. On the other hand: s1mples 2018 was the most hard carry year any player has ever done, not even zywoo was close in any of his years. All while facing prime astralis. Then 2021 he even topped that, but with a better team and a better, more calculated playstyle. s1mple towered high above everyone on these years, even above zywoo despite him of course being excellent.
Next argument: playstyle. Everyone with a tiny bit of eye test knows, that s1mple has more impact and breaks the game more than zywoo does. Zywoo is frustrating to watch sometimes, since he is sooo good but also plays by the book so often. Think of his clutch cs g2 on nuke. He only goes for that because it's the last round of the half. Let's not get blinded by s1mple not being himself since a couple of months, we are talking about the GOAT of csgo, not the greatest of some months.
Which brings me to the final point: achievements. Yes they both got their major (s1mples run was of course more impressive, let's not start comparing the brackets, it will be devastating), but where is the rest for zywoo? One cologne final? And 2 major quarters? This is the goat? s1mple carried his team to semis and finals of majors in 2016!! Being younger there than zywoo is now. He has made it to 4 major finals, won cologne twice, won kato, the grandslam? There is just no debate.
All in all I even find this kind of disrespecting for Dev1ce. If it wasn't for s1mple, he would be clearly the goat. Not zywoo, who played 4 years and won one big event.
Love your stuff, peace!
Simple is like the Senna of csgo. There can (will) be new stars in new times
What about device?
I think the caviar on top of all of this is, simple doesnt have that many years to go. So going into cs2 zywoo, could really 1 up him. We will see. Anyway, i´m gonna love watching both!
I think people are being blinded by HLTV rating when that metric doesn't mean shit. This whole year s1mple has just looked painfully average every time I watch him. He's either washed or in a huge slump because I can't distinguish his style from any other T1 awper at this point(with the exceptions of ZywOo and m0NESY). I don't see anything special when I watch s1mple anymore. It looks like he overoptimized his playstyle and just does the standard 'correct' play in every situation. I don't see him go for that many risky out of pocket plays anymore.
The only time you see old Simple craziness is when NaVi are getting their ass handed to them and he feels the need to try and carry but then just ends up pushing smokes and getting fucked up for it
@@grandmasteryoda503 Exactly. There was that one recent game on nuke where they were down like 10-2 on ct and then he started going for really ridiculous braindead plays.
Bro is the goat of all the casters and analysts. 🙏
What about dev1ce? I think he’s more consistent that S1mple. Maybe S1mple has a higher skill ceiling but Dev1ce’s career achievements and accolades are unmatched at the moment!
device never got #1 even though his average was really high and s1mple continued to get 1/2 even during his break
@@launders that’s true. But won’t you agree that device is more consistent than simple? Maybe the most consistent.
The GOAT for sure. 2023 is also his.
s1mple got a haircut, ZywOo better buckle in
whats the song used in the intro?
the bane of his existance, good one lau
Thankyou kz boy 😳
I know this intro is not new but it is sick
simple had that fear factor
the people want demo reviews back
zywoo got most of his #1s during the online era and most of his MVPs and his major MVP was acquired from beating the worst teams in playoffs of all time to win a major.
it’s still not even close between the two if we are talking GOAT. I believe zywoo is probably a better person than s1mple but you can’t deny his greatness is unmatched
S1mple is the goat thanks mostly to his achievment, but taking RATIOs into consideration and solo carry, ZywOo is the BOAT (best of all time), he won 11 MVP with the french washed linup with not even a top30 or top40 player in it, while S1mple only won 1 MVP before electronic joined him.
⛵
I am going to use this BOAT term forever now, and nobody can stop me
actually lol’d at 🚤
But yeah I kinda agree tbh. Excited to see what Zyw0o can bring in the future. Maybe he hasn’t even peaked yet?
"A line longer than Charlie Sheen" 😂😂😂
Honestly, Simple is the GOAT of CSGO. However, if Zywoo keeps up this consistency his teammates pick up some of their weight, I could see him being the goat of CS2
I comment to help statistics
Maybe not the place to ask but this reminded me will HLTV have a top 20 for 2023? Ive seen some people say they wont because of CS2, is this true? Really hope its not. Couldnt find anything about it from a quick google
Prof said in multiple hltv confirmee that there will be a top20
@@skryyper6706 Ah okay thanks. Thats good news
its GOAT talk time
He is the ONE!
u cant say s1mple's major hjad a caviat
he beat vitality in quarters (fresh of epl 2nd place losing to navi and had zywoo peforming)
they beat gambit (number 1 team up until colonge and was still a top 3-4 team on lan who only lost to vitality, navi and faze on lan)
and g2 with niko in his career form ( a top 5 team who went 2nd at cologne losing to again navi)
zywoo beat into the breach, apeks and gamerlegion, like its not even close the level of competition that was played, and on top of that, s1mple had a 1.38-1.4 rating ish in groupstage and ended on 1.47 rating, meaning his playoff peformance was atleast 1.5+ rating overall
zywoo was around 1.38 and was 1.39 at the end, good but bro, there are levels and s1mple's mvp run at major was far more impressive than zywoo
Who is worse, dupreeh now or Edward/Zeus/flamie in 2018 lol
I think its also a case of timing. Zywoo comes at a time where a ton of information and help is widely available for everyone at every level, wheras s1mple was apart of that help and was actively creating that information.
What about shroud?
why underplay magisk :( been doing great as of lately
this mickey mouse paris major win doesnt compare to navi major win.
keehehehehahah testtube baby of CT and zywoo's smile cracked me up bruv
What the intro music?
the field wasn't that thick
if ZywOo has more long career in CSGO,he'll be the true GOAT...
When you look at what B1t achieved in his first pro year, I don't even think you can make the argument that Zywoo had the best rookie year.
it’s actually easy, he was #1 in his rookie year AND had way worse team. 😂
@@launders Trophies > HLTV ranking
@@rhetorics7178 Playing alongside s1mple and electronic doesn't matter when judging individual level, got it 🙂
b1t would achieve the same in 2021 even if he averaged 0.95 rating with how simple and electronic were carrying lmao
❤ love your content
zywoo has perfect play, s1mple does the impossible. that's how i'd differentiate the way they dominate the game
Well put sir! one is a perfect csgo android, built to make the perfect plays...while one is a monster/demon, that just massacres everyone in its path
im pretty sure the guy you stole that from is the one you're now saying it to
S1mple is the GOAT, but Zywoo would have been (if not for CS2 & i think he will be of CS2) and its 'greatest OF ALL TIME' Zywoo short period here plus online era though no fault of his own has to be counted i think when talking GOAT.
IMO S1mple is the GOAT and i think for many delivers the most breathtaking memories though his career (russian war i think could have stopped him) but Zywoo may be more natural and will almost certainly be the CS2 goat.
i think csgo players will go into the background for cs2 and a new generation of players will end up being the goat
@@risheeeesh512 I concur, based on what we are hearing about movement alone and game changes, while the old guys will still be cracked the new blood for that game are going to be unreal.
I wanna See"the Argument for dupreeh", Dude was at all19 Majors, Winning 5, more than anyone Else, thats gotta be Worth Something right