Hey! Thanks for being here. Couple of things to know: 1 - This episode was recorded BEFORE Summer Game Fest, so that's why our Alan Wake 2 theorizing at the end doesn't discuss any of the new announcements. 2 - You'll see some comments that are 2 months old, despite the fact the video just released today! That's because we record them in batches (one long, drunken weekend!) and then give them all to patrons as soon as they're ready. The next batch will go live in August. Patreon link is in the description if you want to join us. 3 - The next episode of Lore Dump (starting a new series of games) will NOT go live on August 1st. Because of scheduling conflicts, we're meeting up to record on August 12th so expect the new episode the week after that. 4 - WE HAVE MADE A DISCORD! Join us - discord.gg/2yBdUqN6Xt Enjoy! And see you out on the Wild West in August 🤠
Words cannot describe how excited I am for the ~Wild West~ era of Lore Dump. You’re gonna do awesome Neil!! Don’t be nervous dude, we’ll love it! Edit: Just hearing that teaser made me SO EXCITED for the exaggerated American accent Neil is no doubt gonna do.
Lmao One drunken weekend God I can’t wait til I’m this comfortable as a UA-camr Watching at work right now so Your channel will be my entertainment tonight
I played this with my wife a good bit ago and she kind of picked up a bit of what the space suit entity was saying (thank god for adhd) and from what we can tell he isn’t speaking gibberish. “Spider time” which is what he says at the end indicates that he’s frightened. “School” seems to refer to learning. He got on the ship to learn, hence “school boy boy” and one other thing she picked up on (can’t remember the phrase exactly) is that for some reason he either “can’t go back” or is “afraid of going back” to wherever he came from. I also think him calling someone gerbal is meant as an insult like calling them a rat or pest. It’s been a long time and I don’t know if all of it is important but I thought you’d like to know.
Just responding to the end bit. I'd argue that it isnt necessarily that the Lake likes conventional story structure. It's just that it is safer to use a story that has proper internal logic. Plot holes allow the dark presence to take advantage of them. Zane wrote Barbara back to life but didnt give a reason of HOW that is possible within the constraints of the existing story. So the Dark Presence invented a reason that allowed it to slip free. Like a twisted genie that gives you your wish but finds loopholes to make it dangerous. Writing mistakes, plot holes, thematic inconsistencies, characters behaving contrary to their nature, all of these are loopholes to be taken advantage of.
@@BradLudwigsaccount To explain it properly, the video was unlisted until it was published, which is the date it gives you, but GamingUniversity had access to the video prior to publishing, presumably by having been sent a link via private channels.
Emil Hartman was Tom Zane’s assistant. It was Hartman who encouraged Zane to continue writing after Barbara’s death as a means to bring her back. He continues to bring artists to the lodge at Cauldron Lake to create after Zane disappeared, presumably to “feed” it. He even reached out to Alice Wake and convinced her to bring Alan to the lodge under the guise of his rehabilitation program. Cynthia leaves messages saying “don’t trust Emil”. It makes sense that the Dark entity wouldn’t kill Hartman, as he already served it without being a “taken”. The biggest question, for me at least, is did Alan write Thomas Zane’s story, or did Zane write Wake’s?
Couple little cool details. The increase in AWE activity began in 2010. The year Alan went missing. Also, and yes it's important, Langston's cat is named Alfred. He says he named him after his favorite poet. While the specific poet is not named it is very likely a reference to Lord Alfred Tennyson 🤔🧐
@@MontyZander considering whoever wrote that report wants a return to the esoteric and Langston is all about performing rituals and empathizing with the AIs and OoPs like gods, it makes perfect sense.
Can I also point out that Langston also says he doesn't actually remember where he got Alfred. As a basic rule if I worked in a place like the FBC and I couldn't remember where I got a whole animal I'd be a bit worried right?
@@MontyZander It kinda makes a little bit of sense in that Langston seems to have an unorthodox approach to dealing with the Altered Items. He imbues them with intentionality, talks about empathy being important for dealing with them and about "things they like" as part of the rituals.
@@jubileechambers2604yeah, I was really disappointed in Jesse for not clocking that one, because as soon as I heard him say it I was like 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
One interesting thing from the base game that didn't get mentioned at all but does add a little to this expansion. In AWE the Hiss and the Darkness are somewhat compatible. The darkness becomes louder, the sound becomes darker. But in the main game if you can get the Mold and the Hiss in the same place they are *actively* hostile to each other. They will fight each other even in preference to fighting you. (Pity the Mold is hostile to humans as well).
I like to think of Alan Wake as a Dungeonmaster that doesn't use any non-official material. It's all there and exists, he just pushes the pieces at each other and it's up to Jesse/theplayer to keep the story moving since he can't make them.
A good DM steals from popular culture ... a GREAT DM steals from his players. Player: It would be cool if (insert thing) DM: Well, that's better than what I'd planned, so ... yea, let's do that!
A couple of interesting notes: On Tom looking like Alan, in Alan Wake 1 the Anderson brothers consistently mistake Alan for Tom The Night Springs script you find isnt about Hartman, it describes a scientist and the director of the Federal Bureau of Night Springs passing through a portal into another dimension. While there, the director is taken ovsr by an alien entity that travels into our world through the portal. The script ends with the dirctor putting his pistol to his head and shooting himself. Which is eerily similar to Darling and Trench's journey through the slide doorway where Trench becomes infected by the Hiss, and his later suicide. I do wish more of the pages from American Nightmare were gone into, cause a good handful of them describe how the power to alter reality works. Such as that the energies of the Dark Place are drawn to any genuine act of creation. The written word and stories just gives more precision. In addition, the only people that can remember the old reality after it's been changed are those that have been directly touched by these supernatural powers. Which is interesting, considering Jesse remembered Tom being a poet despite the only Tom Zane the therapist could find was a filmmaker. Alan also mentions that worrying about what's real or who created who are meaningless (very relevant to the debates about Tom and Alan from AW1 when we find the page Tom wrote about Alan), it's all real. There's even more about the nature of reality and causality and consequence that i think might be worth going over for yall selves whenever.
26:50 So, interesting thing about Thomas Zane -- in Alan Wake (as the diver) he was voiced by James McCaffrey, who also does the voice of Max Payne/Alex Casey and Director Trench. Although there's one audio flashback when he's confronting the darkness tornado where he's voiced by Wake's VA, Matthew Porretta, lending credence to a theory that Wake might be some kind of reincarnation of Zane. In the Oceanview cutscenes, Zane's voiced by Ilkka Villi, who's the Finnish actor used as the face model for Alan Wake. So for the first time he's actually voicing himself. So this is probably why he does the whole "kippis" thing: he's literally Finnish. I don't know if there's any deeper meaning (knowing Remedy, probably) but I find it really interesting that the choice of VA for Thomas Zane is, in a very real sense, just another version of Alan Wake. Also, this visit to the Oceanview is the first time it's "night" at the Motel; every other time it's sort of been a lazy sunset with light streaming in through the windows.
51:30 Correction! That Night Springs script he wrote actually describes Director Trench and Dr.Darling entering the Slidescape and Trench getting infected with the Hiss!
59:33 Scratch's creepiest line in American Nightmare was when he was talking about getting "quality time with Alice" because after that he did the Hannibal Lecter slurping noise and said "That's a little something for me. And I deserve it."
58:35 I like the theory that the Alan seen there isn't Scratch, but the real Alan, somehow trying to reach Alice,--his muse and the most important thing to him--but because of the grip the Darkness has over him he's in a madden state and isn't able to control or remember anything he does. Maybe he can also only reach her while she's sleeping, which is when someone is closest to the darkness or something. Of course, I still think Scratch is out there doing his thing though; hell, maybe he's the one sending Manic Wake into the hallway late at night just to torment Alice. Edit: Aw yea that tease! I was actually thinking that particular game might make a good Lore Dump!
It had been years since I played through this dlc, watching this now after Alan Wake 2, it's amazing how many breadcrumbs they laid. I'd forgotten all this foreshadowing. The confusion here of whether it's Scratch or Alan is so great in hindsight lol
You can come across Philip and the fridge before you meet Langston, and then mention Philip to him. His reaction is horrible. "Oh, I forgot about him" like it's nothing. I have an unceasing loathing for Langston because of that 😂
Really like the idea some have posed that the old woman in the AW2 concept art is another artist dragged down into the Dark Place, and that we may encounter a number of different artists from all across different times, because it's doubtful the lake only started having magical properties in the 70s.
Genuinely excited for the AW2 lore dump both because yall are great but also I want to know how the fuck and you gonna explain the Koskela Bros commercials, We Sing are Yotan Yo without literally just playing videos of them hahaha.
I really love your lore videos. Also as a trans person in the U.K. who has had my healthcare taken away, I really really appreciate every time you guys reject JKR and HP. It matters that people care. You rock
Rewatching this ep in particular after Alan Wake 2 is just an experience. Oh, how naive we all were... So much was set up here in particular that it's just insane. This was the ritual to lead us on. Our friends will meet him when we're gone....
In the song, 'Take Control' by Old Gods of Asgard/Poets of the Fall, there's a portion that's backwards speak that says something like, "The pyramid and the stone file becomes the spruce tree." In 'Alan Wake II', the Cult of the Tree uses two upright triangles, which is sometimes described as a spruce tree, as their symbol, and if you read the various files, the symbol was developed by one of the brothers as a mirror of the pyramid on the FBC logo. My personal theory is that the predicted AWE event at the end of the DLC is the Clicker coming back to the material plane.
I just noticed that in the Remedy video for the Oh Deer Thermos, Ilka (spelling) is wearing a necklace with the two triangles on that tree from the AW 2 trailer
I was trying to explain Alan Wake / Remedyverse to a friend and he asked, "Can Alan Wake write a rock so big he can't write a character that could lift it?" To which i replied YES. Enjoying y'all's talks. Just found out about Lore Dump yesterday and buckling up for Kingdom Hearts
Also, Thomas Zane is a director and the foreshadowed antagonist is The Bright Organization, who has a habit of making film studios? They are likely connected, and the Bright stuff is a reference to Zane looking to make a light to push the darkness back and get out.
One thing to note about the Control teaser image ist hat it actually looks like it's on an outside city street, which probably means we're moving outside of the building
11:30 this part reminded me of a fragment of the neverending story. When Bastian (the protagonist, who at this point has the power to get his wishes granted) wishes to fight with an ancient and powerful beast, he meets a multicolor lion and the lion explains him that he has waited for him for centuries. When Bastian explain that is not possible since he was created just a moment ago, the lion says that he's thinking about it wrongly. Even if he's a new story, it can still speak of ancient lore, the past is created alongside it. My point being that if Alan wrote Jesse into existence, she will be created with a past as well
There is another thing. It's hinted that Alan created Casey based on his dreams and that while he dreams, he is possibly clairvoyant. He saw the FBI agent Alex Casey and wrote his NY detective Alex Casey based on his dreams/the real Alex Casey. I've only just got Alan Wake 2 downloaded and haven't had time to play yet, so I'll see if there's any info on that. But it's possible he learned of Faden the same way.
If you want a good theory on Zane and how he's handling mr. Scratch oh, I think that Zane created Mr. Scratch in an effort to get himself out of the lake. Thomas has been trying to get out for a long time, and for all we know he might've sided up with the monster in there to get himself free, driven mad by the loneliness it is desperation to escape. Hell, Zane might have been writing or filming his own story that led to Wake being there and starting the first game off all along.
So Zane made Scratch as an effort to realistically usher in a hero that could overcome the villain and get Zane out of the darkness? Then the hero, Alan Wake, called in the Hiss as an effort to realistically usher in a hero that could overcome the darkness? I like it
There were 3 things that I'm not sure was talked about. Not sure they are acutally relevant, but I think are interesting nonetheless. What I'm talking about is the delicious fungus that turns you into a mushroom person almost Last of Us style (ie another entity corrupting the world probably), the music studio (another example of music being anomalous), and the really weird text game you get to play in the special therapy sessions you can take part in.
i very much have enjoyed this series! 100% not my kinda games so i wont be likely to play Alan wake 2 but whenever you guys get around to it I'm excited to watch the lore dump on it! up until now the connective tissue for the shared universe has seemed more like easter eggs than a real connected universe but this DLC 100% doubles down on it being a shared universe which makes things about 10 times as exciting to me!
Personally, I believe it's Scratch in the picture. Perhaps defeating him with the projector's light did not fully kill him, and now he's back, just weaker to light. And about the 'did Wake release the Hiss' deal, Monty mentions that the Night Springs script is about the Third Thing situation, but from what I remember it was paralleling the opening of slidescape 36 and the distrust between Trench and Darling? Maybe there are 2 scripts? I don't quite remember. Also regarding the hero's journey, in the Alan Wake 2 teaser there is another neon sign that reads "initiation"... Anyways, these Remedy episodes were wonderful to listen to and had me grinning from ear to ear in multiple occasions, cannot wait for Alan Wake 2 and for the next Lore Dump!
The best part about Langston's speech. If you listen it all the way to the end (with Jesse commenting to herself the sometimes), he RESTARTS THE SAME RANT when you leave. "Oh you're back, so anyway as I was saying..." #CanAlanRun in Alan Wake 2?
Mr. Scratch is an urban legend come true, and control is about urban legends coming true. Maybe the urban legends of alan wake got worse the longer he was missing, and while he killed off the old ones in amercan nightmare with Alice's film, it left the door open for the collective consciousness to start dreaming up ghost stories about him that manifest a new Mr. Scratch.
me watching this post AWII with alex casey being a main character and monty saying he thinks casey may be irrelevant: 🤣 cant wait to hear that lore dump whenever you manage to work out how the hell you're gonna do it lol
This makes me wanna believe not only these games are connected but that the FBC may have been responsible for the events of Bright Falls (Or at least investigating the BF incident) and the first Alan Wake game and that we'll get some Control references in Alan Wake 2.
Earning all the exclusive weapon form and character mods in this DLC was one of the best parts of it. I especially love custodial readiness for Pierce (my beloved)
I’m not sure if someone else pointed it out in the comments, but you learn the aftermath of what happened at the cauldron lake lodge attack in one of the Alan Wake comic books.
To anyone who has become a fan of this universe because of these guys just an FYI alan wake is coming to PS plus in July and also control is already a part of the premium ps plus collection if you want to play everything before AW2 drops ❤
"Gerbil" was what Fra called Kirklund the previous head of the Investigation department. The helmet is in his office. Obviously the joke is that "head" is the one word that is actually correct. Fra is asking for his actual head back.
Alan made the FBC and Jesse to create a hero that can help rescue him from the dark place. He needed a hero so he wrote them into existence. I think Jesse will swoop in at the end of Alan Wake 2.
@KoraJayde-TeeJay you might notice I wrote that theory before the 2nd game was released. I too, now know this after the 2nd game confirmed that for all of us. Thanks, though captain obvious.
Can't wait for Jack to show up in his new Nissan to save Alan. Also looking forward to see how Neil keeps the boys on track and to see how many tangents Chase and Monty go on. Thanks for the videos!
38:16 Wow. That came out of nowhere. That's MY video thumbnail. I made that screenshot in game. Heart me bro. I'm gonna take it that just appeared when you googled randomly
That’s exactly where I found it - didn’t realise it was your thumbnail, I just assumed it was taken from some walkthrough. Cheers for getting a decent shot of him!
Awesome job as always gents! For those of you who bought the Control Complete Edition, fair warning that AWE comes in randomly about 75% into the game. Wonderful DLC but it may make those of you already confused by Control's plot even more confused.
Point of order, the screenplay written by Wake for Darkness Springs is eerily similar to the Hiss invasion that starts off the game, which has some troubling implications.
So, some thoughts: Neil's time to shine, bay-beeeee. Legit stoked. I've never played or had an interest in playing any of the Remedy games prior to this series. Wake and company have always been at the edge of my cultural zeitgeist knowledge, but I never had any desire to jump in. Now? I'm ready to get nom'ed up. Control is absolutely on my playlist now, with Wake just behind. Hell, I might even get adult juiced and give Quantum Break a go. I love silly things. Finally, I, too, just started Yakuza games a few weeks ago. Holy God, what a grand time. I'm sure y'all have plenty on the timeline/schedule, but I think that series would do well in this format. And to properly capture the manic energy, I can see it delivered as segments of main story, with the chapter breaks being used to dive into a couple of memorable sidequests/Majima everywheres just to capture/accent the dichotomy of the deadly serious main story with the utter nonsense of everything else.
22:00 ish Blessed Pictures had the Altered movie camera from Foundation and were selling the movies it made, including one where a mailman is chased and essentially eaten by a bunch of dogs. You find out about it in this hilariously amateur podcast episode you can find in the same building as the camera where he doesn't seem to care that the movie has no story and it just kind of abruptly ends with the death of the mailman. He still gives it a good rating lol 47:06 One of the first things I wished for was a flashlight the entire base game. Some areas were way too dark to be navigating without one and you can't tell me there isn't a single blasted flashlight in the entire Oldest House. I hated the last two Hartman fights. For the second to last one (the one with the control room with 4 power cube sockets in a row) I literally had no idea what to do. I had to look up online to figure out the pillars in the room with the Hiss red stuff blocking contained power cubes and you had to shoot some of the red stuff to bring down the barrier. And the final boss fight is ridiculous. He can detach power cubes from their sockets to make the room mostly dark and that completely refills his armor so when you get the lights back on, you can barely make a dent in the armor before he cuts the lights again. After looking up strategies, what worked for me was spamming Grip with the Hellfire mod for 100% chance to reclaim ammo on a hit and then using triple launch to stagger him out of his knocking out power cubes maneuver which let me finally deplete his armor fully and take out the last sliver of health. I got pretty good at the health only stage after the lights turn on having to replay it over and over. Take shots at him (I like Shatter) and then bring up a shield every time he turns red. Wait for his attack, drop the shield and attack until he turns red, evade when he gets close and tries to grab. At least with a fully upgraded shield, his ranged attacks couldn't hurt me and didn't break the shield either. I got so at that stage I didn't lose any health.
Just finished listening this for the first time, and I have to say that probably one of the things that interests me the most is the fact that the role Alan Wake has in the story now reminds me a bit of the role of The Authur in the tv show Once Upon a Time, where everything the person in that role writes comes true, but there are rules. The biggest one being you can't change your story to benefit yourself, like you can't give yourself a million dollars. Instead, you have to write the truth of the matter. You can affect things, even create a few things, but you can't do anything to benefit yourself. Now, obviously, these aren't quite the same, but the discussion of what Alan could or couldn't affect in the world reminded me of that. He's able to shape the lives of others but can't change things to make his life better, at least not directly.
Been thinking a lot about this as we ramp up to Alan Wake 2 - it’s the most subtle part of his tragedy but I think it’s one that shouldn’t be forgotten - banger comment!
I wish we could get you three reactibg to the pffical AW2 reveal trailer from the Playstation showcase on the end of this. Cause i wanna know your thoughts on what it showed.
2:10 I’m playing Alan wake 2 and without spoilers it seems like similar face/actor may imply alternate universe remedy-verse character so he may actually have some sort of a point
Little late to the party, but not sure if this point has been made: Given the nature of Remedy's universal interconnectivity - the interaction between thresholds/thresholds and the astral plane, and how the passage of time is different in certain situations (certainly "apart", but more so that AND "A part" at the same time - where anything directly involved with the astral plane effects the formula by time equaling zero) - and where Yungian archetypes, collective unconciousness, and all possible reflections either exist, or CAN exist... The pyramid representing The Board suuuuuuure is a real dark presence in the astral plane. Its like it could represent the concepts of greed and unchecked ambition - like the insane bureaucracy that somehow moves a governmental agency forward somehow by stifiling any individual ideas of progress and direction, or a publishing house's corporate executive staff both/either making or forcing creative decisions based on (always increasing) the bottom line... Maybe the former is a representation of Alan Wake in an "area" of the astral plane currently subsumed by the pyramid's influance (most obviously hinted at by the absolute blackness that comprises the pyramid's color) - the entity being "the former" member of "the board", as in, parts of Alan ARE greedy, ambitious, dark, like the board, but the light inside that grain of the board that is now "former" had to be cut out/from/away/adrift ( or, given the darkness that surrounds the inwardly lit former, maybe the cutting process is up to Jesse). Apologies if this has already been brough up/discussed. 😁
I've listened to all your Remedy episodes at least 3 times now, they are so fun! Other stuff too, slowly making my way through Kingdom Hearts episodes xD Can't wait for you to cover Alan Wake 2!
So from watching a few alan wake and control lore videos a lot of people seem to forget that Alan CANNOT CREATE things and people but he CAN ALTER events to create his story. He can also SEE things and people although he is not aware of this ability and thinks its his imagination coming up with plot points for his books. He cant just write he wins and defeat the evil enitiy. His ending has to fit the form of the story that is being created so there has to be struggle and lost Its understandable that these tidbits arent as well known or talked about. I didnt even realize or think about it til it was pointed out to me by a friend whos a big lore nerd for remedy games
Always happy for a new Lore Dump. Quick Q: Is the Remedy Playlist "backward" for anyone else? I keep getting the newest video first and the Alan Wake video last. Something on my end?
And now with Alan wake coming to playstation plus I’m even more excited, can’t wait for Alan Wake 2!!! Love your vids and can’t wait for Neil to host for the Red dead lorde dumps. Edit: I meant lore but that typo is funny.
Let's gooooooo this is the one I've been waiting for ever since you started Control :) Oh btw... Would you consider maybe streaming Alan wake 2 or something when it comes out? Or do you just enjoy playing games offline, by yourself. And THEN making videos on em.
No to streaming - it's just not something any of us think we'd enjoy. I'm planning to do a one-off stream when I hit 100K, documenting how I make videos on my channel, but general game-playing I much prefer doing offline! Although I know Gaming University and Hidden Machine Gaming are two massive Remedy fans and they regularly stream - they might be able to scratch that itch!
@@MontyZander understandable! I know that I def wouldn't enjoy streaming a story game during my first playthrough :P Yeah I'll def be on the lookout for that stuff. Appreciate the answer, mate!! Absolutely love your videos
First time - weird place to jump in, but worked 😂 was preparing to play Alan Wake 2 and wanted to refresh AWE playthrough. Thanks boys this was great, will definitely watch more of your stuff! Loved It ❤ keep up the great work!
Hey! Thanks for being here. Couple of things to know:
1 - This episode was recorded BEFORE Summer Game Fest, so that's why our Alan Wake 2 theorizing at the end doesn't discuss any of the new announcements.
2 - You'll see some comments that are 2 months old, despite the fact the video just released today! That's because we record them in batches (one long, drunken weekend!) and then give them all to patrons as soon as they're ready. The next batch will go live in August. Patreon link is in the description if you want to join us.
3 - The next episode of Lore Dump (starting a new series of games) will NOT go live on August 1st. Because of scheduling conflicts, we're meeting up to record on August 12th so expect the new episode the week after that.
4 - WE HAVE MADE A DISCORD! Join us - discord.gg/2yBdUqN6Xt
Enjoy! And see you out on the Wild West in August 🤠
Words cannot describe how excited I am for the ~Wild West~ era of Lore Dump. You’re gonna do awesome Neil!! Don’t be nervous dude, we’ll love it!
Edit: Just hearing that teaser made me SO EXCITED for the exaggerated American accent Neil is no doubt gonna do.
I am absolutely *FIENDING* for the next episode I need my fix 😂😂😂
Lmao
One drunken weekend
God I can’t wait til I’m this comfortable as a UA-camr
Watching at work right now so Your channel will be my entertainment tonight
Any update on the next episode?
I played this with my wife a good bit ago and she kind of picked up a bit of what the space suit entity was saying (thank god for adhd) and from what we can tell he isn’t speaking gibberish. “Spider time” which is what he says at the end indicates that he’s frightened. “School” seems to refer to learning. He got on the ship to learn, hence “school boy boy” and one other thing she picked up on (can’t remember the phrase exactly) is that for some reason he either “can’t go back” or is “afraid of going back” to wherever he came from. I also think him calling someone gerbal is meant as an insult like calling them a rat or pest. It’s been a long time and I don’t know if all of it is important but I thought you’d like to know.
Just responding to the end bit. I'd argue that it isnt necessarily that the Lake likes conventional story structure. It's just that it is safer to use a story that has proper internal logic. Plot holes allow the dark presence to take advantage of them. Zane wrote Barbara back to life but didnt give a reason of HOW that is possible within the constraints of the existing story. So the Dark Presence invented a reason that allowed it to slip free. Like a twisted genie that gives you your wish but finds loopholes to make it dangerous. Writing mistakes, plot holes, thematic inconsistencies, characters behaving contrary to their nature, all of these are loopholes to be taken advantage of.
How is this video 3 weeks old but this comment is 3 months old?
@@SpiderElm Plot hole
@@SpiderElm They mentioned they recorded this in April. It's hard for them to get together so they do episodes in batches.
@@BradLudwigsaccount To explain it properly, the video was unlisted until it was published, which is the date it gives you, but GamingUniversity had access to the video prior to publishing, presumably by having been sent a link via private channels.
"Tor and Odin could get him out in 10 seconds". Wow
What a great call 😂
Emil Hartman was Tom Zane’s assistant. It was Hartman who encouraged Zane to continue writing after Barbara’s death as a means to bring her back. He continues to bring artists to the lodge at Cauldron Lake to create after Zane disappeared, presumably to “feed” it. He even reached out to Alice Wake and convinced her to bring Alan to the lodge under the guise of his rehabilitation program. Cynthia leaves messages saying “don’t trust Emil”.
It makes sense that the Dark entity wouldn’t kill Hartman, as he already served it without being a “taken”.
The biggest question, for me at least, is did Alan write Thomas Zane’s story, or did Zane write Wake’s?
Couple little cool details. The increase in AWE activity began in 2010. The year Alan went missing.
Also, and yes it's important, Langston's cat is named Alfred. He says he named him after his favorite poet. While the specific poet is not named it is very likely a reference to Lord Alfred Tennyson 🤔🧐
Holy shit that is amazing. Love the idea that Langston has been secretly rebelling
@@MontyZander considering whoever wrote that report wants a return to the esoteric and Langston is all about performing rituals and empathizing with the AIs and OoPs like gods, it makes perfect sense.
Can I also point out that Langston also says he doesn't actually remember where he got Alfred. As a basic rule if I worked in a place like the FBC and I couldn't remember where I got a whole animal I'd be a bit worried right?
@@MontyZander It kinda makes a little bit of sense in that Langston seems to have an unorthodox approach to dealing with the Altered Items. He imbues them with intentionality, talks about empathy being important for dealing with them and about "things they like" as part of the rituals.
@@jubileechambers2604yeah, I was really disappointed in Jesse for not clocking that one, because as soon as I heard him say it I was like 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩
One interesting thing from the base game that didn't get mentioned at all but does add a little to this expansion. In AWE the Hiss and the Darkness are somewhat compatible. The darkness becomes louder, the sound becomes darker.
But in the main game if you can get the Mold and the Hiss in the same place they are *actively* hostile to each other. They will fight each other even in preference to fighting you. (Pity the Mold is hostile to humans as well).
I like to think of Alan Wake as a Dungeonmaster that doesn't use any non-official material. It's all there and exists, he just pushes the pieces at each other and it's up to Jesse/theplayer to keep the story moving since he can't make them.
A good DM steals from popular culture ... a GREAT DM steals from his players.
Player: It would be cool if (insert thing)
DM: Well, that's better than what I'd planned, so ... yea, let's do that!
A couple of interesting notes:
On Tom looking like Alan, in Alan Wake 1 the Anderson brothers consistently mistake Alan for Tom
The Night Springs script you find isnt about Hartman, it describes a scientist and the director of the Federal Bureau of Night Springs passing through a portal into another dimension. While there, the director is taken ovsr by an alien entity that travels into our world through the portal. The script ends with the dirctor putting his pistol to his head and shooting himself.
Which is eerily similar to Darling and Trench's journey through the slide doorway where Trench becomes infected by the Hiss, and his later suicide.
I do wish more of the pages from American Nightmare were gone into, cause a good handful of them describe how the power to alter reality works. Such as that the energies of the Dark Place are drawn to any genuine act of creation. The written word and stories just gives more precision. In addition, the only people that can remember the old reality after it's been changed are those that have been directly touched by these supernatural powers.
Which is interesting, considering Jesse remembered Tom being a poet despite the only Tom Zane the therapist could find was a filmmaker.
Alan also mentions that worrying about what's real or who created who are meaningless (very relevant to the debates about Tom and Alan from AW1 when we find the page Tom wrote about Alan), it's all real.
There's even more about the nature of reality and causality and consequence that i think might be worth going over for yall selves whenever.
26:50 So, interesting thing about Thomas Zane -- in Alan Wake (as the diver) he was voiced by James McCaffrey, who also does the voice of Max Payne/Alex Casey and Director Trench. Although there's one audio flashback when he's confronting the darkness tornado where he's voiced by Wake's VA, Matthew Porretta, lending credence to a theory that Wake might be some kind of reincarnation of Zane.
In the Oceanview cutscenes, Zane's voiced by Ilkka Villi, who's the Finnish actor used as the face model for Alan Wake. So for the first time he's actually voicing himself. So this is probably why he does the whole "kippis" thing: he's literally Finnish.
I don't know if there's any deeper meaning (knowing Remedy, probably) but I find it really interesting that the choice of VA for Thomas Zane is, in a very real sense, just another version of Alan Wake.
Also, this visit to the Oceanview is the first time it's "night" at the Motel; every other time it's sort of been a lazy sunset with light streaming in through the windows.
51:30 Correction! That Night Springs script he wrote actually describes Director Trench and Dr.Darling entering the Slidescape and Trench getting infected with the Hiss!
59:33 Scratch's creepiest line in American Nightmare was when he was talking about getting "quality time with Alice" because after that he did the Hannibal Lecter slurping noise and said "That's a little something for me. And I deserve it."
58:35
I like the theory that the Alan seen there isn't Scratch, but the real Alan, somehow trying to reach Alice,--his muse and the most important thing to him--but because of the grip the Darkness has over him he's in a madden state and isn't able to control or remember anything he does. Maybe he can also only reach her while she's sleeping, which is when someone is closest to the darkness or something. Of course, I still think Scratch is out there doing his thing though; hell, maybe he's the one sending Manic Wake into the hallway late at night just to torment Alice.
Edit: Aw yea that tease! I was actually thinking that particular game might make a good Lore Dump!
It had been years since I played through this dlc, watching this now after Alan Wake 2, it's amazing how many breadcrumbs they laid. I'd forgotten all this foreshadowing. The confusion here of whether it's Scratch or Alan is so great in hindsight lol
Juzt to amswer the moon landing question, it was the Apollo 11, using the Saturn 5 rocket.
You can come across Philip and the fridge before you meet Langston, and then mention Philip to him.
His reaction is horrible. "Oh, I forgot about him" like it's nothing. I have an unceasing loathing for Langston because of that 😂
35:43 Neil, that was unexpected but appreciated
I didn't remember that I'd done that (I was adult-juiced) but was horrified to find out that it was a thing.
Your discussion around the picture of Alan was right on the money haha. I unfortunately never saw that picture when playing the AWE DLC
What a great end to this Lore Dump series, I was smiling ear-to-ear the whole time.
Really like the idea some have posed that the old woman in the AW2 concept art is another artist dragged down into the Dark Place, and that we may encounter a number of different artists from all across different times, because it's doubtful the lake only started having magical properties in the 70s.
the foundation was my first lore dump video. This is my second.
I like you guys' style. Keep it up.
36:40 holy hell i didnt think they set up Lane this far back
Genuinely excited for the AW2 lore dump both because yall are great but also I want to know how the fuck and you gonna explain the Koskela Bros commercials, We Sing are Yotan Yo without literally just playing videos of them hahaha.
I really love your lore videos. Also as a trans person in the U.K. who has had my healthcare taken away, I really really appreciate every time you guys reject JKR and HP. It matters that people care. You rock
Every time a TMA reference is made my urge to make a chart categorising the remedyverse monsters/entities into the Fears grows stronger
Rewatching this ep in particular after Alan Wake 2 is just an experience. Oh, how naive we all were... So much was set up here in particular that it's just insane. This was the ritual to lead us on. Our friends will meet him when we're gone....
In the song, 'Take Control' by Old Gods of Asgard/Poets of the Fall, there's a portion that's backwards speak that says something like, "The pyramid and the stone file becomes the spruce tree." In 'Alan Wake II', the Cult of the Tree uses two upright triangles, which is sometimes described as a spruce tree, as their symbol, and if you read the various files, the symbol was developed by one of the brothers as a mirror of the pyramid on the FBC logo.
My personal theory is that the predicted AWE event at the end of the DLC is the Clicker coming back to the material plane.
I just noticed that in the Remedy video for the Oh Deer Thermos, Ilka (spelling) is wearing a necklace with the two triangles on that tree from the AW 2 trailer
You can always trust the boys to supply videos when they make sense, and not when it's most profitable, here straight from the foundation
wow after playing Alan wake 2 we seriously had no ideas remedy cooked so hard and screamed in faces with this AWE expansion
The real orange peel was the friends we made along the way
Alan:"Where there is an alarm there must be a cause. You have been punched... Sorry I mean warned"
Two Monty videos in the space of a week? We are truly blessed
Love hearing you three together, can't wait for the next series to start
OMG I NEVER NOTICED ALL THAT AW2 FORESHADOWING! Lol all these things make so much sense after playing AW2. Sick!
I was trying to explain Alan Wake / Remedyverse to a friend and he asked, "Can Alan Wake write a rock so big he can't write a character that could lift it?"
To which i replied YES.
Enjoying y'all's talks. Just found out about Lore Dump yesterday and buckling up for Kingdom Hearts
ALSO, I was very happy that Nissan came up at the 11th hour.
I thought it was about time to get that inject of banter with the lads. I do so love these episodes they always make my day. Appreciate what y'all do.
The Night Springs pilot Alan writes is about The Hiss. A Director of a secret organization and his top scientist accidentally let a monster in.
just thought of this *"Hartman Seeker of Darkness"*
Also, Thomas Zane is a director and the foreshadowed antagonist is The Bright Organization, who has a habit of making film studios? They are likely connected, and the Bright stuff is a reference to Zane looking to make a light to push the darkness back and get out.
Lore Dump should do The Professor Layton series not just cause it would be great, but I REALLY want them to reach Diabolical Box and Lost Future
One thing to note about the Control teaser image ist hat it actually looks like it's on an outside city street, which probably means we're moving outside of the building
Control does have *a* good boss fight in the base game, esseJ.
11:30 this part reminded me of a fragment of the neverending story. When Bastian (the protagonist, who at this point has the power to get his wishes granted) wishes to fight with an ancient and powerful beast, he meets a multicolor lion and the lion explains him that he has waited for him for centuries. When Bastian explain that is not possible since he was created just a moment ago, the lion says that he's thinking about it wrongly. Even if he's a new story, it can still speak of ancient lore, the past is created alongside it.
My point being that if Alan wrote Jesse into existence, she will be created with a past as well
There is another thing. It's hinted that Alan created Casey based on his dreams and that while he dreams, he is possibly clairvoyant. He saw the FBI agent Alex Casey and wrote his NY detective Alex Casey based on his dreams/the real Alex Casey. I've only just got Alan Wake 2 downloaded and haven't had time to play yet, so I'll see if there's any info on that. But it's possible he learned of Faden the same way.
Been checking the channel every week or so to see if this episode had been posted, so happy the time has finally come!!!
Spoiler for the Night Springs DLC but like…
Chase was right about Jesse and Beth… like right on the fucking money.
Thank you for not cutting Liam's riff on Eminem!
If you want a good theory on Zane and how he's handling mr. Scratch oh, I think that Zane created Mr. Scratch in an effort to get himself out of the lake. Thomas has been trying to get out for a long time, and for all we know he might've sided up with the monster in there to get himself free, driven mad by the loneliness it is desperation to escape. Hell, Zane might have been writing or filming his own story that led to Wake being there and starting the first game off all along.
So Zane made Scratch as an effort to realistically usher in a hero that could overcome the villain and get Zane out of the darkness?
Then the hero, Alan Wake, called in the Hiss as an effort to realistically usher in a hero that could overcome the darkness?
I like it
There were 3 things that I'm not sure was talked about. Not sure they are acutally relevant, but I think are interesting nonetheless.
What I'm talking about is the delicious fungus that turns you into a mushroom person almost Last of Us style (ie another entity corrupting the world probably), the music studio (another example of music being anomalous), and the really weird text game you get to play in the special therapy sessions you can take part in.
i very much have enjoyed this series! 100% not my kinda games so i wont be likely to play Alan wake 2 but whenever you guys get around to it I'm excited to watch the lore dump on it! up until now the connective tissue for the shared universe has seemed more like easter eggs than a real connected universe but this DLC 100% doubles down on it being a shared universe which makes things about 10 times as exciting to me!
"She might be the Knot Mother, since she has so much knotted thread at her feet" 🤣🤣
I love you all, this was great!
Personally, I believe it's Scratch in the picture. Perhaps defeating him with the projector's light did not fully kill him, and now he's back, just weaker to light.
And about the 'did Wake release the Hiss' deal, Monty mentions that the Night Springs script is about the Third Thing situation, but from what I remember it was paralleling the opening of slidescape 36 and the distrust between Trench and Darling? Maybe there are 2 scripts? I don't quite remember.
Also regarding the hero's journey, in the Alan Wake 2 teaser there is another neon sign that reads "initiation"...
Anyways, these Remedy episodes were wonderful to listen to and had me grinning from ear to ear in multiple occasions, cannot wait for Alan Wake 2 and for the next Lore Dump!
The FBC's name for the dark presence is called the Shadow
Another awesome episode! Can't wait for Neil to take over for a wild new series. Gonna be so fun!
1:02:42 "I prefer Matthew Porretta personally." Same here! Absolutely loved him and his character.
The best part about Langston's speech. If you listen it all the way to the end (with Jesse commenting to herself the sometimes), he RESTARTS THE SAME RANT when you leave. "Oh you're back, so anyway as I was saying..."
#CanAlanRun in Alan Wake 2?
Mr. Scratch is an urban legend come true, and control is about urban legends coming true. Maybe the urban legends of alan wake got worse the longer he was missing, and while he killed off the old ones in amercan nightmare with Alice's film, it left the door open for the collective consciousness to start dreaming up ghost stories about him that manifest a new Mr. Scratch.
me watching this post AWII with alex casey being a main character and monty saying he thinks casey may be irrelevant: 🤣
cant wait to hear that lore dump whenever you manage to work out how the hell you're gonna do it lol
This makes me wanna believe not only these games are connected but that the FBC may have been responsible for the events of Bright Falls (Or at least investigating the BF incident) and the first Alan Wake game and that we'll get some Control references in Alan Wake 2.
I like that Langston's ramblings about his cat made me think that his cat isn't completely normal. Maybe Langston took work home.
“He looks like Keanu Reeves” oh yeah there were a lot of Alan Wick jokes
Earning all the exclusive weapon form and character mods in this DLC was one of the best parts of it. I especially love custodial readiness for Pierce (my beloved)
Ahti is definitely the key to everything. He is the Neo in the Darkness Matrix.
I’m not sure if someone else pointed it out in the comments, but you learn the aftermath of what happened at the cauldron lake lodge attack in one of the Alan Wake comic books.
To anyone who has become a fan of this universe because of these guys just an FYI alan wake is coming to PS plus in July and also control is already a part of the premium ps plus collection if you want to play everything before AW2 drops ❤
"Gerbil" was what Fra called Kirklund the previous head of the Investigation department. The helmet is in his office.
Obviously the joke is that "head" is the one word that is actually correct. Fra is asking for his actual head back.
“And he’s just Sam Lake mocapped” LOL
This playlist got me to subscribe to your channel and I’m loving it! Please keep doing what you’re doing.
This is the video that cursed me, I can not hear FBC without Neils rapp playing in my mind.
Jesus I'm so sorry- Neil
Alan made the FBC and Jesse to create a hero that can help rescue him from the dark place. He needed a hero so he wrote them into existence. I think Jesse will swoop in at the end of Alan Wake 2.
@KoraJayde-TeeJay you might notice I wrote that theory before the 2nd game was released. I too, now know this after the 2nd game confirmed that for all of us. Thanks, though captain obvious.
Can't wait for Jack to show up in his new Nissan to save Alan. Also looking forward to see how Neil keeps the boys on track and to see how many tangents Chase and Monty go on. Thanks for the videos!
38:16 Wow. That came out of nowhere. That's MY video thumbnail. I made that screenshot in game. Heart me bro. I'm gonna take it that just appeared when you googled randomly
That’s exactly where I found it - didn’t realise it was your thumbnail, I just assumed it was taken from some walkthrough. Cheers for getting a decent shot of him!
Awesome job as always gents! For those of you who bought the Control Complete Edition, fair warning that AWE comes in randomly about 75% into the game. Wonderful DLC but it may make those of you already confused by Control's plot even more confused.
So ends another great arc of Lore Dump (for now) Can't wait for you boys to return with RDR
Point of order, the screenplay written by Wake for Darkness Springs is eerily similar to the Hiss invasion that starts off the game, which has some troubling implications.
I love how invested everyone is 😄
The Apollo 11 mission was the first Moon Landing!
So, some thoughts:
Neil's time to shine, bay-beeeee. Legit stoked.
I've never played or had an interest in playing any of the Remedy games prior to this series. Wake and company have always been at the edge of my cultural zeitgeist knowledge, but I never had any desire to jump in. Now? I'm ready to get nom'ed up. Control is absolutely on my playlist now, with Wake just behind. Hell, I might even get adult juiced and give Quantum Break a go. I love silly things.
Finally, I, too, just started Yakuza games a few weeks ago. Holy God, what a grand time. I'm sure y'all have plenty on the timeline/schedule, but I think that series would do well in this format. And to properly capture the manic energy, I can see it delivered as segments of main story, with the chapter breaks being used to dive into a couple of memorable sidequests/Majima everywheres just to capture/accent the dichotomy of the deadly serious main story with the utter nonsense of everything else.
1:31:43 looks like a Max Payne lore dump is on the menu boys
22:00 ish Blessed Pictures had the Altered movie camera from Foundation and were selling the movies it made, including one where a mailman is chased and essentially eaten by a bunch of dogs. You find out about it in this hilariously amateur podcast episode you can find in the same building as the camera where he doesn't seem to care that the movie has no story and it just kind of abruptly ends with the death of the mailman. He still gives it a good rating lol
47:06 One of the first things I wished for was a flashlight the entire base game. Some areas were way too dark to be navigating without one and you can't tell me there isn't a single blasted flashlight in the entire Oldest House.
I hated the last two Hartman fights. For the second to last one (the one with the control room with 4 power cube sockets in a row) I literally had no idea what to do. I had to look up online to figure out the pillars in the room with the Hiss red stuff blocking contained power cubes and you had to shoot some of the red stuff to bring down the barrier.
And the final boss fight is ridiculous. He can detach power cubes from their sockets to make the room mostly dark and that completely refills his armor so when you get the lights back on, you can barely make a dent in the armor before he cuts the lights again. After looking up strategies, what worked for me was spamming Grip with the Hellfire mod for 100% chance to reclaim ammo on a hit and then using triple launch to stagger him out of his knocking out power cubes maneuver which let me finally deplete his armor fully and take out the last sliver of health. I got pretty good at the health only stage after the lights turn on having to replay it over and over. Take shots at him (I like Shatter) and then bring up a shield every time he turns red. Wait for his attack, drop the shield and attack until he turns red, evade when he gets close and tries to grab. At least with a fully upgraded shield, his ranged attacks couldn't hurt me and didn't break the shield either. I got so at that stage I didn't lose any health.
Just finished listening this for the first time, and I have to say that probably one of the things that interests me the most is the fact that the role Alan Wake has in the story now reminds me a bit of the role of The Authur in the tv show Once Upon a Time, where everything the person in that role writes comes true, but there are rules. The biggest one being you can't change your story to benefit yourself, like you can't give yourself a million dollars. Instead, you have to write the truth of the matter. You can affect things, even create a few things, but you can't do anything to benefit yourself. Now, obviously, these aren't quite the same, but the discussion of what Alan could or couldn't affect in the world reminded me of that. He's able to shape the lives of others but can't change things to make his life better, at least not directly.
Been thinking a lot about this as we ramp up to Alan Wake 2 - it’s the most subtle part of his tragedy but I think it’s one that shouldn’t be forgotten - banger comment!
Ffs what a cool concept for a show you guys. Congrats. New sub.
32:34 I think it's because Hartman had no artistry or creativity the Dark Presence could use.
I wish we could get you three reactibg to the pffical AW2 reveal trailer from the Playstation showcase on the end of this. Cause i wanna know your thoughts on what it showed.
4:36 Not to worry Monty we'll keep you honest, like with Muse being good, actually
Both are among my favorite games... how I welcomed that DLC.
48:00
Fuck yeah Neil!
I laughed and fist pumped at the same time.
Perfect mid-point to the video lmao
YES! GO NEIL! YOUR TURN IN THE CHAIR, MAN!
2:10 I’m playing Alan wake 2 and without spoilers it seems like similar face/actor may imply alternate universe remedy-verse character so he may actually have some sort of a point
Little late to the party, but not sure if this point has been made:
Given the nature of Remedy's universal interconnectivity - the interaction between thresholds/thresholds and the astral plane, and how the passage of time is different in certain situations (certainly "apart", but more so that AND "A part" at the same time - where anything directly involved with the astral plane effects the formula by time equaling zero) - and where Yungian archetypes, collective unconciousness, and all possible reflections either exist, or CAN exist...
The pyramid representing The Board suuuuuuure is a real dark presence in the astral plane. Its like it could represent the concepts of greed and unchecked ambition - like the insane bureaucracy that somehow moves a governmental agency forward somehow by stifiling any individual ideas of progress and direction, or a publishing house's corporate executive staff both/either making or forcing creative decisions based on (always increasing) the bottom line...
Maybe the former is a representation of Alan Wake in an "area" of the astral plane currently subsumed by the pyramid's influance (most obviously hinted at by the absolute blackness that comprises the pyramid's color) - the entity being "the former" member of "the board", as in, parts of Alan ARE greedy, ambitious, dark, like the board, but the light inside that grain of the board that is now "former" had to be cut out/from/away/adrift ( or, given the darkness that surrounds the inwardly lit former, maybe the cutting process is up to Jesse).
Apologies if this has already been brough up/discussed. 😁
I fully believe Chase is correct, specifically that it is actually “knot” mother and not “not” mother 🤣
Yeeeeeesssssss! I've been waiting for this since the first control episode!!!!!!!! Let's GOOOOO!!!!! ❤❤🎉🎉❤❤
So excited for Neil’s episode hope it well for ya!
I've listened to all your Remedy episodes at least 3 times now, they are so fun! Other stuff too, slowly making my way through Kingdom Hearts episodes xD
Can't wait for you to cover Alan Wake 2!
So from watching a few alan wake and control lore videos a lot of people seem to forget that Alan CANNOT CREATE things and people but he CAN ALTER events to create his story. He can also SEE things and people although he is not aware of this ability and thinks its his imagination coming up with plot points for his books.
He cant just write he wins and defeat the evil enitiy. His ending has to fit the form of the story that is being created so there has to be struggle and lost
Its understandable that these tidbits arent as well known or talked about. I didnt even realize or think about it til it was pointed out to me by a friend whos a big lore nerd for remedy games
Always happy for a new Lore Dump. Quick Q: Is the Remedy Playlist "backward" for anyone else? I keep getting the newest video first and the Alan Wake video last. Something on my end?
Nope - that's my bad! I've reordered them in the playlist by accident. Sorting now! - Monty
And now with Alan wake coming to playstation plus I’m even more excited, can’t wait for Alan Wake 2!!! Love your vids and can’t wait for Neil to host for the Red dead lorde dumps.
Edit: I meant lore but that typo is funny.
Let's gooooooo this is the one I've been waiting for ever since you started Control :)
Oh btw... Would you consider maybe streaming Alan wake 2 or something when it comes out? Or do you just enjoy playing games offline, by yourself. And THEN making videos on em.
No to streaming - it's just not something any of us think we'd enjoy. I'm planning to do a one-off stream when I hit 100K, documenting how I make videos on my channel, but general game-playing I much prefer doing offline! Although I know Gaming University and Hidden Machine Gaming are two massive Remedy fans and they regularly stream - they might be able to scratch that itch!
@@MontyZander understandable! I know that I def wouldn't enjoy streaming a story game during my first playthrough :P
Yeah I'll def be on the lookout for that stuff. Appreciate the answer, mate!! Absolutely love your videos
First time - weird place to jump in, but worked 😂 was preparing to play Alan Wake 2 and wanted to refresh AWE playthrough. Thanks boys this was great, will definitely watch more of your stuff! Loved It ❤ keep up the great work!
Neil in the chair! The man with the plan
Fan theory Thomas Zane is Mr scratch or controlled by him
LOVE THIS!!! Especially the rap ❤