Dune - The Grandfather of Real-Time Strategy
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- Опубліковано 11 кві 2020
- Dune II was one of the most influential games in the industry, but it and its sequels are mostly forgotten today.
Dune Dynasty: dunedynasty.sourceforge.net/
Dune 2000 GruntMods Edition: gruntmods.com/dune_2000_grunt...
OpenRA: www.openra.net/
The Assembly Armada: github.com/TheAssemblyArmada / Discord / discord
Logoless Dune novel cover by u/Zapchi_
Dune 2000 Reviews compiled by MobyGames
Magazine scanes compiled by amr.abime.net/
Brett Sperry interview from The Game Awards 2015
Legal documents from Herbert Limited Partnership v. Electronic Arts Inc., 325 F. Supp. 2d 282 (S.D.N.Y. 2004)
Authentic VHS static from my parents' wedding tape. See? Sometimes you find really interesting stuff when you read the description!
Thanks to Dan for doing some wizard maths for this video
Music by Frank Klepacki, Dwight Okahara, Stéphane Picq, Philippe Ulrich, David Arkenstone and Jarrid Mendelson
/ nostringsprd
Consider supporting future videos on Patreon: / nostringsprd
#Dune #RTS - Ігри
![What Happened to Command & Conquer? [OUTDATED] - A History of Failed Spin-Offs](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zcC7l8xEm0c/mqdefault.jpg)
![What Happened to Command & Conquer? [OUTDATED] - A History of Failed Spin-Offs](/img/tr.png)
Shoutout to that visual glitch at 9:34, introduced to the edit at the very last minute just to keep me on my toes, and I dorped the ball. My B. Also, some corrections courtesy of Nyerguds;
"-It's peculiar how you didn't mention Westwood's own earlier BattleTech games. In terms of game genre, Dune II was a direct continuation of those, with the turn-based part made real-time. In fact, I believe those games are the origin of the sidebar command buttons.
"-Dynasty really isn't a "remake". Unlike OpenRA, which really is a 100% new engine, Dune Dynasty is an enhancement of the original engine, as reverse engineered by the OpenDune project. In other words, it really is the original game, with added enhancements.
"-Intelligent Games didn't make the Red Alert expansions. They are only credited for making multiplayer maps for them. In fact, I know that the expansions' core idea of experimental technologies came from the Westwood people being so impressed by the creativity of the community in utilising the rule tweaks in maps... and back in the original game, sneaky elements inside the company had laid the foundations (the Morse code in the manual) that would force the management to allow them to develop the secret ant missions in the expansion pack. So all that was certainly created by Westwood itself."
Literally unwatchable.
No Strings Prd oh by you way you can play Dune 2 Stefan online
And also Dune 2000 online but empire other hand Well you don.t
No Strings Prd what are you talking about? Don’t do that to yourself your work is all class.
@@bradz9413 Absolutely kicking myself when I noticed that
I'd love ya'd cover the Earth RTS games sometimes (Earth2140/2150/2160) thems some rly good RTS games.... 2150 had so many unique ideas...
As the co-creator, lead programmer, and gameplay-designer of Dune II (Joe Bostic), I have to say this is very accurate. There are a couple of minor nits to pick on some facts, but otherwise a great job! Congrats.
Oh dang, thank you so much for watching! I'd absolutely welcome any nitpicks or corrections if you have some! Big fan of your work!
Legend!
Thank you very much for changing my life as a kid and having a profound impact in it as an adult! I’m old now, but this game shouldn’t stay old.
Dune II inspired me to learn programming and get into game development. Drew sketches of "Dune" units on grid paper and programmed pixel graphics on Basic. I was 9 years old then but still on the same career 25 years later, maybe just a tad more experienced.
Not often you get a chance to say thanks to the person behind some beloved childhood memories ^.^ but thank you
Legend says that every Dune 1 or 2 is mentioned somebody somewhere installs it and plays it again
Worked on me!!! lol
Dune 2 has been sitting on my hard disk since 1995. That's when I got my first PC :)
Stole that joke from Deus Ex 1 eh?
@@Scarletraven87 Haha maybe, I stole it from somewhere but can't remember where. It certainly applies.
Try dune legacy a great newer version of the old dune. Try out openra while your at it
It makes me so happy that there is a bloke out there that cares so much about the Dune RTSs to make a great documentary about them
Totally!
I didn"t realize so few people remember this games. Dune II is the first strategy game I ever saw as a kid. I was about 8, maybe 9, didn"t really understood it at first, but it ended up captivating me .. I finished both Dune II and Dune 2000.
People get old. Im 38 and I where very young when i play this game maybe 8 years.
Dune 2 was also one of, if not the first PC game to feature actual .wav voices of the soldiers when they would respond to commands, and it came out when the Sound Blaster did, so the tech was brand new. Blew my mind.
It was the same for me! Saw it as a kid and could barely comprehend how awesome it was
It has been an honor to watch this documentary.
Bro I miss Arrakis my brother n I have differences nowadays but it’s one of the few places we both love
"But when we zoom out to a more playable height, they look like the same thing"
*Laughs in Supreme commander*
Nice
i think supcom and SCFA are the epitome of perfect RTS games. shame nothing else comes close because I really got that RTS itch.
The thing is that supreme commander still had the distinct icons for the units unlike Emperor where it just had the unit itself. They could have remedied it with a unit photo like in Generals, or done the supreme commander/Red Alert Medic/Mechanic route with the icons.
@@dixie_rekd9601 As far as RTS possibilities, GUI and mechanics go, yes, SC stands out and reigns supreme. Whatever you'd like to do, let it be a route, shortcuts, unit behavior or macros, there is a way. Unparalleld. But it somehow lacks a certain "soul" these games (and starcraft for one) had. Total Annihilation had the same problem. It feels distant. Maybe the lack of voiceover and the fact that everything is mechanic or robotic. So in one hand it can be intended. However I have had a deeper connection with the world itself while playing Dune, RA, Tiberian Sun or Starcraft. Gameplay wise though, SC is one of a kind!
@@Wikingking that's a really good point... Supcom and it's sequels are very sterile. Like, they're amazing RTS games but they're super generic. With not much actual story/character.
Those last phrases are pure poetry.
The Dune series deserves to be remembered
LONG LIVE THE FIGHTERS!
Just watched the 2021 movie, and was happy to see many things form the games referenced in the movie. Of course it's based on the book, but it was still cool to see the harvesters, carryalls, ornithopters, refineries, silos...
Also the worm sign. Brought back trauma's as I watched it. Took me every inch of discipline to not shout "worm attack" as it gobbled it up.
I know you mentioned the book, but to be "that guy", you really ought to read the first novel at least. Especially before the 2023-24 sequel.
The game introduced me to the franchise, but the books are incredible
Those things are all in the book, except the refinery as the harvester is both in the book. Ornothopters are also used by every faction and missles and artillery are basically considered "outdated tech"
@@drakesilmore3760 Which sign do you refer to?
@@fernandozavaletabustos205 "Wormsign is a tell-tale signal which indicates that a sandworm was approaching. It usually manifested itself as static charges on the surface of sand dunes."
It just reminds me of being in combat with the enemy and then the game warning me about "wormsign" meaning I had about 20 seconds to figure out which of my 6 harvesters was under threat and get it out of there before it gets eaten and after finding it and getting it to safety I lost the combat and the enemy is raiding my base.
"It's almost been a decade since the last C&C came out" *Shows RA3 instead of C&C4*
Thank you, my good man.
What Rivals?
@blackrave404 garbage fanfiction
@@tengkualiff last time i check c&c4 is what you use to scoop dog shit
There is no C&C4 in Ba Sing Se.
There is not such thing as C&C4.
That era of games was absolutely AMAZING. The full-video cut-scenes, sound, and graphics improvements over the years are all such great memories. I'm 53 years old and will never forget all of the hardware updates I had to make to be able to play those amazing games!
Heavy Gear 2 was my first game that had full-video cut-scenes, and I loved it. Disappointed that didn't stay a thing.
Your comment is everything I wanted to comment myself. Except that I'm *only* 47. Cheers to you mate.
EDIT: Do you also remember the upgrade from 2400 modems to 9600? I don't think there's ever been such a huge leap in computing performance before or since.
@@ashchaya7676 Hey, great minds think alike! 😁 Oh yeah, modem speeds were crazy slow back then...my first one in the mid-80s was *300* baud, the guys with 1200 were considered rich, haha. Do you miss the old modem connecting sounds?
@@kirk1968 I miss the sounds, yes, but not the speeds haha. And oh yeah, I forgot about 300 to 1200. That too was a four-fold increase, but that one was before my time. I entered the online world of computing with 2400 baud around 1990 I think - downloading PC demos and the like :D
@@ashchaya7676 Totally agree about the speeds :D Those PC demos were awesome, right? Our generation was able to see the transition from analog to digital, and we appreciate the increases in technology since the 80s and 90s. I really don't like to hear complaining about speed today compared to back then, hahaha
Heh, this game, when I was stationed in Korea, made me learn hexadecimal so I could tweak the player start equipment.
What I loved best about the cut scenes was the way, when playing Harkonen, your Mentat would start out treating you like a slave and threaten that, should you fail, you would live out the remainder of your days in a pain amplifier. Then, as you continue to win battle after battle, he slowly backs off until the finale, where House Ordos, House Atreides, and the Emperor, would all come at you at once and, whimpering in fear, he begins sniveling something to the effect of: "Oh incredible master, you must save us!"
I think Dune 2000 was one of the very first rts games that got me into the genre, making me love those kinds of games to bits.
Even though I was too young and dumb to actually finish any of the campaigns at the time.
"If it's old it should stay old." Wow, what a slap in the face for some truly unique games. It is almost as if they view it as something they want to stay buried and forgotten, like an old shame or a skeleton in a closet. And hearing that the Herbert Family was happy to revive an old board game instead of Dune 2 only strengthens this feeling for me. Imagine the backlash that would take place if this licensing debacle happened with C&C?
Oh well, as one of those people that look back fondly on Dune 2000 and Emperor (I ended up playing them after General: Zero Hour came out, but I knew about their existence from magazines at the time and that one trailer for Emperor in one of the C&C games (can't remember which one, but I think it was Tiberiun Sun)), I'm happy to at least get to play Dune 2k on OpenRA. And who knows? Maybe EA or Petrogylph will get a license to make a game off of the new Dune movie and we'll get another Dune RTS? How much I want this to happen will depend on how well EA does the remasters of C&C and RA. But it is a nice thought nevertheless.
Depressing
Perhaps the Teaser Trailer you are speaking about (or the sneak peak), it is from Red Alert 2. ua-cam.com/video/77CJY4PyhFI/v-deo.html
Some people in Dune wiki mentioned that Herbert estate aren't big fans of video games. Pains me since I still have collector's edition of the Emperor and to me it's one of the best RTSes ever.
@@songsclipstrailers5402 Yeah, That is definitely the one I remember seeing. Man, that brings back so many memories.
@@zzzzUS I wonder if that has something to do with the video games adding House Ordos into the mix and essentially making the games fan fiction in a sense. But at this point, I'm just grasping at straws, trying to figure out why they would have no liked them.
Either way, I would have loved a Remaster of Emperor. So many things stick out in my mind about the campaign for that game (Like the brief Harkonnen Civil War) that it is a shame I have to jump through hoops just to be able to play them again. Not that jumping through hoops have stopped me from playing classics before, but that's besides the point.
Dune2 blew my mind as a kid in 90’s. Still does actually. That soundtrack by Frank Klepacki is perfection! Awesome video!!
I still get flashbacks of 'Destructive Minds' every time an election map shows parties claiming their territories.
@@EmperorSigismund Such a good track!! It was good on the mega drive (genesis) also
ua-cam.com/video/nsWLWz8sx4I/v-deo.html
ua-cam.com/video/K_vdZTFYQk8/v-deo.html
I understand and accept his opinion regarding the Dune 2 and 2 000 soundtracks, but the original one. It is unique and I want more of it. Listening to it in 2020 with headphones as the sound travels from one ear to another, it is haunting.
Dune 2000 blew my and my friends' little minds. The idea of units moving out of the way of other units to let them go by was staggering.
The most played game on my Amiga back in the day.
Dune 2 was great, although I found it kinda scary at times. I hadn't even started going to school yet when I played Dune 2.
The Sandworms were the scariest part.
Fun fact: If you want your units to move across the battlefield faster than the enemy, just keep your units on screen, and the enemy offscreen. The game engine gave the units off-screen fewer game ticks to save the processor work.
Having played Dune 2 as a little kid, I was very excited to stumble upon a book in my middle school library called Dune. I was a bit confused by the lack of mention of a house Ordos as first. Loved the Dune book series though. I think I've read close to every book. Even the prequels. There might be an obscure Dune spin-off book I missed somewhere...
Also loved the C&C games.
This was awesome! Don't know why I clicked, but I'm glad I did!
Glad you enjoyed it, cheers!
Praise from Ceasar!
thank fucking god theres no "wow didnt think id see you here 🤓" comment
Got the same feeling. Amazing video.
It rocked.
"Wormsign"
[MUSIC KICKS IT UP]
[my face grins]
BUILDING. CONSTRUCTION COMPLETE. NEW CONSTRUCTION OPTIONS.
Those voices were epic.
I hate it when my damn harvesters run into each other when there's a worm around, and then they take five minutes to finally move, resulting in one (or both) being eaten. I cannot tell you how many times that has happened.
But I have played (and beaten after lots of trouble) each house on the hardest difficulty.
I did really like the challenge curve, though. With some RTS games, a level can take around 30 minutes to an hour to beat from beginning to end. With Dune, it could take 30 minutes to an hour just to set up your base to not be totally destroyed. And then several hours after that, you could finally finish the level. Boy, did it suck having to start over, though.
Ok ok, I think I can now openly admit it. I was the messy kid who didn't put the concete slabs under my buildings to save a few quid.
And I also didn't bother with windtraps, because the radar screen was damn near unreadable on my CRT TV.
Underrated channel. This was fantastic
they might have been paid to do/ say that
Cryo's Dune, to me - is one the the greatest games ever made. Never played anything like that (role playing, rts, adventure and sim management all mixed in one). Loved every second of it.
(subscribed btw for the great content).
It was one of my favourite games at the time.
I loved Cryos version too.
Yeah it's an amazing game, still good to this day, though the rts part is aged. I still listen to its soundtrack to this day.
Totally. The wild blend of genres is still very compelling.
I remember playing the Dune adventure game. I thought it was by LucasArts, but all I could find was Loom which sounds similar phonetically. I thought I was crazy, and misremembered. Turns out it just wasn't on steam or gog because of licensing.
That was introduction to the IP
Dune, Dune 2 and Dune 2000 were some of the best parts of my childhood.
Oh man, after more than 30 years I learned the reason behind the weird Dune / Dune 2 naming.
Same here. I loved Dune Battle for Arrakis on Genesis, and never played Dune 2 on PC since I had that, but I owned Dune 2000 for PC at 13 years of age. Everything was very confusing lol.
Yeah, only a few months ago someone filled me in; I always thought Dune was also a WW game, and Dune 2 just a sequel that focused on the RTS aspect.
I cannot express how much "Dune" is interesting. The tales of Houses and all that Spice and how Frank made a Desert valuable. It's so fricking awesome. It's sad that we might not see more of it in games. I said might. anyway got excited when i saw the little snippet of the GDI logo.
You've done such an outstanding work stefan, absolutely BRILLIANT!!!. A Diamond.
Thank you so much for stopping by, glad you enjoyed it!
Emperor battle for dune was one of my favourite games growing up, the lore was always so enchanting, I wish for a remake one day for that and KKND games
He, who controls the spice, controls the universe!
I read somewhere that there were 2 new Dune games coming up, but they gave no details, any news on that?
DEATH TO THE GDI NOD LIVES
I've never played Dune II or 2k but I did play Emperor. And the atmosphere of that game is simply amazing. I still remember the chilling music and the flashlights of the units and buildings swaying in the dark. The worm, the harvesters, the cliffs and the sands, and the mystique of this far away world.
Now that Ahoy refuses to release his videos, this will suffice.
Amazing research, learnt a lot from it.
Yes, that's what I thought too. The style of narration is very similar.
I like how just to spit you, Ahoy released a new video
@@aaronbasham6554 Even if that was the intention, I'm so glad he did.
Seems to me like Dune and C&C have the same sibling relationship that Wolfenstein and DOOM have. The former started the genre whereas the latter perfected it and introduced everything we really know and love as a whole.
Except perhaps that other RTS games of that era weren't known as "Dune clones" as the "Wolfenstein clone" (Spear of Destiny, Blake Stone, Corridor 7, and more) and later "DOOM clone" was.
@@UnitSe7en That's because RTS was coined by the head of Westwood and Dune development from the get go, in fact, it might be before the Dune II development started; resulting from the discussions he had with the guy who thought Strategy was dead, and he, who believed, it had only just begun. The genre always had a proper name, while FPS didn't, probably because Wolfenstein isn't based upon other older shooters like Dune II was, but an RPG instead, and so, Id didn't coin a genre name.
There is an important side note to the original Dune game: it helped sell many add on sound cards (which were just starting to hit the market back then).
I remember being in awe of hearing real speech and music when I first saw the game. Next day I had bought a Soundblaster and the game itself :)
this! I got my Creative SoundBlaster Value Edition for C&C, but when I tried it with Dune 2, my mind was blown. Especially the difference in voice production quality between the English and the German/French version.
Yep, although with me it was the reverse. I already had the Sound Blaster, as the first person in my village, so in comes someone who brought the game with him, and after fiddling with config.sys and autoexec.bat for about 20 minutes we got the game running.
"Dune - The Building of a Dynasty. The planet Arrakis, known as Dune..." HOLY SHIT, THE INTRO IS ACTUALLY TALKING!!!
"Alright, that was pretty fucking awesome. Let's start the game."
"Reporting..."
Holy shit they're event talking in the game!
Less than a month later everyone in my village had Sound Blaster installed.
Yep. This game got me to buy my first soundblaster card
It also put Frank Klepacki on the map as an icon producing the musical score which sounded great even on a cheap Yamaha OPL3 synthesizer chip.
I remember this game making its way around our dorms in college. An IBM 386 with a Soundblaster sound card. A blast to play and then even better when a guy came around with a handful of 3.5 inch floppies and said, "you want to hear them talk?" The disks he had were voice packs that added the unit voices when giving commands. Oh the memories.
As someone who spent countless hours on the first two games, this was a burst of nostalgia. Thanks for the video!
The amount of influence dune 2 had on me is huge. Inspired me to learn to code, wrote a dune level editor in my teens, then wrote my own clone, and later dune 2 the maker. It was a blast!
That sounds amazing! Do you still have those programs? I'd love to take a look at them!
Onomato Poeia yeah you can still find stuff at dune2k.com or dune2themaker.com
"Thoughts have turned to Arrakis." Chills man, literal chills. ^^
I have Dune (the Cryo one) in a box in the loungeroom. Absolutely love that game. Had fun playing Dune II as well but it's DUNE that really holds my heart.
Both have their qualities.
Amazing video. I’m here after the new Dune RTS was just announced. Excited for the future!
Just to be clear it looks more Civ-esque an won’t be anything like the Dune RTS games. Could be good though but not my thing
I still have my Dune 2000 CD. In the jewel case. With the book.
This is on level with Retro Ahoy
Excuse me while I drool on it.
I don't remember where my copy came from. Possibly on floppies. Now lost to the sands of time.
I still have the full size cardboard box, CD & Manual
Same! Big box Dune 2000, first PC game I ever owned, still going strong!
To play games from CD you have to fix what Microsoft broke Sept 8, 2015. google MS15-097 . A user has to open a command prompt and enter the correct command: sc config secdrv start=auto
Got my copy sent from Westwood along with a really nice press kit "Westwood Studios" backpack and a copy of Sole Survivor (Which was a forerunner to all the MMOBA games, taking a single C&C unit and fighting other players with their single units). It was a perk from Louis for the Westwood online Sysops :)
Still have the backpack, Such a shame EA had to be so predatory, Westwood was one of the first of many great gaming companies they Acquired, Said "nothing will change", then dissolved.
Westwood Studios deserved better.
I adored the Cryo Dune game, honestly it’s great and deserves a bit more credit.
Played it a few years back for the first time and I must say it still holds up. It's sort of precursor for "Telltale genre" of adventure games.
The Cryo Dune game was my introduction to Dune, I've read the books numerous times since then. I have the soundtrack and even own a copy of the newly released board game. It started a life long obsession with me.
It had a killer soundtrack that I still listen too today, though you can split your head open trying to figure out how to solve the strategic puzzles in that game. Certainly not something I had the patience for when I first played the game.
Beside demos that came with our first PC, the first games my brother and I got for it was the CD versions of Dune and Day of The Tentacle. Two absolute stone cold classics.
@@TheBroz Oooh.... Day of the Tentacle... now that brings back memories too. I still quote from Day of the Tentacle and people have no idea...
I should say, the ending lines about Dune's legacy running through to modern gaming is not only great at highlighting the influence this rather humble looking game had, but also is rather fitting in the Dune universe. Genetic memory plays a prominent role in Dune, wherein exposure to the Spice can make one aware of the memories of their ancestor, used as a source of guidance by the Atreides and Bene Gesserit.
When Dune 2 was released it caused a massive confusion for some of us who had played Dune and loved it. Still remember loading the game thinking it was a sequel and wondering what was going on as it was nothing like the previous game. However very quickly loved the game and played it so much loving everything about it.
Don't believe the naysayers. Dune 2000 was genuinely good. Controls and graphics are good enough that they are still playable, good unit diversity, and oh those cutscenes.
I completely agree. I am a bit biased because I like the Dune aesthetic more than the C&C one. ^_^
And the music! It's no surprise it featured so heavily in this video.
Oh, boy. I foresee a voyage by ship into pirate infested waters in my near future to aquire some digital bounty.
I want to replay this game so bad. The bigger problem is getting it to run, probably.
@@catburglar82 there's actually great free versions of this available that run like a charm on most systems, by installing Dune Legacy alongside (a sort of patch for modern functionalities). Can't say much more as I don't rightly know how legal such websites and products are after seeing info on where the rights to this game reside. But you know... Google... (-;
@@eskurian8565 I don't care about the legalities, I just care if the videos and music are in it, honestly. If companies fail to provide me with legit ways to purchase something, I stop caring how I get it.
Just want the full package, basically.
I played it few years ago and realized that it was pretty hard. But that's also to say I haven't played any RTS games in at least a decade.
I played dune 2000 a long time ago when I was a kid and liked to watch my dad play it to. After playing it he tried to get me into dune but I wasn't old enough to really be interested in the older scifi. But one day walking though walmart I saw this game and immediately saw this game on the shelf. i picked it up and showed my dad. He just smiled and tossed it in the cart. This game holds a very special place in my heart.
Dune was the first RTS game I played in the very early 1990s. It was at a friend's house and I tried it out having no idea what those types of games were. I started in the evening, only to end up getting hooked and continuously playing up to the break of dawn. It's a core memory of mine of my youth.
No idea if you'll read this but, I cannot explain how much I appreciate your use of "live-action cut-scenes."
As someone who has read the original series several times, after finding the first two books almost by accident, then went on to purchase every book missing from my collection up to 2017-2018 (I have to catch up), I also cannot express in the span of a UA-cam comment my admiration and love for this franchise.
It is quite sad how the Herbert [group] handles their Intellectual property, sometimes feeling as if they are trying to kill it. Thanks to videos like these, what has been made shall not be forgotten. Looking forward to the 2020 movies, it has some gigantic boots to fill.
As I said on another comment:
It is not that the family wants to kill the Dune's books. It was the first Movie franchise, it bombed three times and they obviously hated it.
Now that the IP is gone, they can rebuild it with a NEW movie franchise and a Lore maybe more based on the books... only time will tell
I picked up an ancient, yellowed copy of Dune off of my brother in my teens after playing Dune & Dune II when I was little. One of the best books I every picked up and I'm still pensive about this upcoming movie though.
Maybe they are trying to protect their IP from greedy Hollywood (and others) who just want to exploit it to make money
Look at what happened with Starwars. Disney really dropped the ball. All they had to do was follow what the cartoon series had set up and it would have been a resounding success.
If you make a Starwars movie 5 mins long of a JEDI wielding his lightsaber people go insane.
How can you screw up a trilogy with a limitless budget?
When one can screw up Starwars, they can screw up anything
"Neat" - No Strings Prd
Best recommendation
Neat
Blast from the past. I loved this game when my family got their first computer. And to come by and see all the old visuals, sounds etc, has been soo cool. To also know back story has been an added bonus. I was probably 7 or 8. Now I’m 26 and it still makes me want to play it.
Emperor Battle for Dune was one of my favourite games of all time, i enjoyed that game for hundreds of hours back in the day, the music, ambience, worms and storms, it was fantastic and for me that game had a soul, unlike the generals series, i finished those games once and i didn't feel anything.
Yes Generals has no soul at all. It's just a EA cash grab on the C&C label. I'm glad they redeemed themselves with C&C 3 however. I like Generals but i recall being disappointed by the dull units and story. It's just a generic war rts. Westwood had tons of character to their games.
I spent so much time on Dune Emperor it was a stunning work of art and the best RTS strategy game if not game I ever played and I have played a lot of them. Remember winning a match with only 3 fully promoted Fremen awesome and the Sadukar were just class "For the emperor".
Ah, Dune. First RTS I've played, without realizing it was an RTS at that time XD. I was barely a young teenager back then, and I had to admit, didn't much English at the time but the interface was easy to use and I manage to understand most of the story. It was my much older brother who introduces me to this game. My father saw me and my brother playing this game and decided to try it too. We each took on one faction and beat the game. I had the Ordos. It was...HARD. lol For being a so-called rich and sneaky faction, they were usually behind the other factions in terms of Tech. But the Deviator. That was worth it. Nothing more satisfying than to turn a Devastator again it's own troops and then self-destructing it taking more troops and building with it. But yes, enough about my memories. Nice video. Well constructed and very informative.
Buddy, very similar thing here, I was still a young kid when I had a chance to play the DUNE2 and few years later DUNE 2K, later on it brought towards the books, which I adore to this day and hell, I have Arrakis inspired tattoo on my body. My mother, older brother and I each took to different factions and actually play sort of to their lore and game strengths: Brother took to Harkonnen and overwhelms enemy with brutal (standing on overkill) force. Mom went with Ordos and plays it slow and meticulously by slowly taking the enemy's territories, harvesting every grain of spice on map and having more refineries than towers. I am going with Atreides and their Fremen and airstrikes (in Emperor also superior range), going for direct confrontations only when I must and slowly wearing the enemy down with my resolve while keeping my causalities low since every life of my soldiers matters.
I still have the Dune2k CD and i made it run on Windows 10 x64
Same, as a young teenager, I didn't even understand how the game worked the first few minutes, it was completely different from anything I had ever played. Hacking into SCENARIO.PAK.. aw the days...
Lol. Same. Played it on my old Sega Genesis and all this time didn't even know that it was the progenitor of the whole genre.
I remember beating it countless times. So much that some level codes like itsjoebwan, fairmentat and slymelanie are still engrained in my memory lol.
Absolutely on point analysis of the whole roots of the RTS genre, from it's very inception. Very informative with the entire detail of the developer history and their MO, what their goal was. You summarised this perfectly in 20 minutes, which is indicative of the length and breadth of history contained in Westwood Studios, basically. I never subscribe to streamers because I find their content consistently trite but you popped my cherry No Strings.
I really like the look of Dune2000. The color palette really makes the environment feel hot and arid and there’s something strangely satisfying about the gleaming metallic look of the buildings and vehicles. Emperor was kind of missing that but what I liked about that game was how alive the world felt. The sudden sandstorms, the worms, the carryalls constantly flying around. Felt very organic.
After i saw this, i look in my PC Games, and i still owns the original CD's of Dune Emperor Battle for Dune and Dune 2000. I'm so glad i played these games and can say: IT WAS A GREAT CHILDHOOD! :D
This must be the Ahoy of RTS!
Fucking love ahoy
First 30 seconds. Came up to the exact same conclusion.
What a fucking compliment, honestly
Found this video randomly and I have to say I really love your style. And your quote for the Dune book “Neat” had me chuckling. Can’t wait to see more.
I loved Dune 2 and 2000 but I LOVED Dune 1. I don't know why I liked that game so much, I even played it recently and I was totally mesmerised by it. They really captured that magical "religious" experience from the novel and 1984 film so well, I fear the new film may not bring that back with it as it feels most new media is soulless.
I know the games aren't story canon, and just barely lore canon, But I absolutely love Arrakis as the setting for an RTS game. Can only build and control certain areas due to terrain limitations (building on solid rocky areas, cannot build on sand), the effects terrain has on units/buildings (if I remember right some games, units moved slower on sand vs rock. Building concrete slabs so your buildings don't deteriorate), Environmental hazards like Sandworms. I could go on, but damn.
My father's a fan of Dune series as well, and when I was a year old (on 2008), he would show me how to play "Emperor: Battle for Dune" and since then Emperor: Battle for Dune has been my favourite game series after Red Alert. I later on also played Dune 2000 when I was 8 years old and found out about it.
I'm 13 years old now and still listen to it's soundtrack whenever doing something boring, to give that boring work some epicness. :)
Also Stephan, love your channel. I hope that it'll be viewed by all of the Dune and Red Alert fan world wide.
Thank you so much for making the video, it was really helpful.
That's awesome, thank you so much mate!
I think it’s awesome to see young people picking up such awesome games like Dune. Been playing Dune II for 26 years and D2K for 22 years myself, and still consider them as my favorite games of all time. Dune II was in fact my introduction to gaming at the tender age of 3 xD
@@bradlooney7093 nice, man.
I had Dune II for Sega Genesis when I was a kid. I was struggling with one of the final maps so I called the tip line that was in the instruction manual. About a month later my mom started yelling at me. She got the phone bill and there was a charge listed as "Virgin Tips". I was fourteen years old.
the dune RTS franchise is a cornerstone of my childhood, even more than command and conquer. i remember playing dune 2 on the sega emulator back at grade school and later on playing dune 2000 for hours. i may be nostalgic, but these games do deserve praise.
also the sidestory that cryo developed dune 1 despite losing contact with virgin is so funny, even if not an rts as good as dune 2, dune 1 feels much closer to the book than the RTS, and the fact that they kept developing it shows it was a work of art for them
"...or ask a nice man with one leg"
Yarr harr xD
I see understanding of the reference is not unique to me, and I am pleased.
ua-cam.com/video/hBmpDE9-0A4/v-deo.html
Yar Har Indeed.
Haha good to see you here
@@franklyanthony1786 Thankfully haven't seen any fake Nyergudses going around, lol.
Emperor: Battle for Dune was a great game. It's a shame it was so unpopular and forgotten. When i saw a trailer for it in RA2 i was super hyped but i could not find in any store. Maybe it was because of the lack of advertisement.
It was much later when i saw it on a local torrent site i remebered about it and played for the first time and it was super fun. The music was great, the graphics were fine, the gameplay was entertaining and had it's unique features, the story was interesting.
Yeah, I also enjoyed it coming from the originals. Strange though I found it in store and I live in africa.
I remember when I went t buy it. I was really hyped for the game. When I bought it the nerdy guy behind the counter gave me the dune book free of charge. I read it many years later.
I loved the Emperor game! However my biggest gripe with it: the random Blue Screens of Death or complete system freezes!
This was very enjoyable, Stefan. I played all three games for many hours and this video answered many questions I had built up over the years. Thanks for this fine production!
I bought an xbox one solely for Halo Wars 2....all because i fell in love with Dune as a kid...what a lasting impression...
This is going to be fun! I grew up playing Dune II in the 90's in my MS-DOS 5 potato.
Dune is what actually got me interested in RTS games and after that I discovered Red Alert and Tiberium Sun and I was hooked for life on this shit. I can only say - they really don't make them like they used to :(
"Either track down the disks or ask a nice man with one leg" Amazing! fantastic video, with fantastic quality!
This is excellent. I was getting a slight feeling of watching Ahoy with this. I mean that in a good way. Love your editing, this was a great look at a forgotten gem.
Dune 2000 holds a special place in my heart because after it tanked, my local Electronics Boutique put all their copies on clearance, and I bought five of them to give out to friends of mine, so we could play against each other at LAN parties. With two other friends who'd also bought it new like I had, that made eight of us, and anyone who knows LAN parties of that time knows eight was the magical number to have. Good times, great memories.
Cryo's DUNE was the first game I ever played and finished. I had just recently learned to read and I did not know English so that was a blast. I have to replay it every couple of years ever since.
My dad still plays Dune on his emulator. I loved it as a teen when it came out, and also played Herzog.
Genesis had the best strategy games and some great RPGs. Great times!
I also, living in a non-English speaking country, learnt English largely from computer games (mainly Sierra adventure games :)). Thanks to Quest for Glory, King's Quest, Police Quest (and Larry ;)) I excelled in English at school :P
I sense an inspiration from "Ahoy" here, gj
Same, and done quite well too!
Hey! Me too. And this sure beats waiting for Ahoy to release 1 epic video per year. Awesome video mate. Looking forward to follow this channel. Your content and style easily supplants Ahoy.
@@bbuggediffy ahoy makes his own scripts, music (many tracks on his Spotify), editing and art. Combined with real life and family responsibility of course it'll take long.
damn lol was about to say that, very AHOY-ish
Came down here to comment this
What a fantastic documentary about my favorite game developer! Thank you so much for making this!
What a legend of a game. Thks to the creative minds at westwood. Miss those days of gaming pleasure and sound blasters
It is by the Will alone, I set my mind in motion, It is the Juice of Sapho: That thoughts aquire speed, The lips acquire stains, The stains become a warning, It is by the Will alone, I set my mind in motion
I'm only almost 21 but I can still remember my dad playing Dune 2000 all the time waiting for CnC Generals to come out which then became his favourite RTS (and mine).
I still play C&C Generals with my family, as the most versed RTS player I usually clear house with 2 or 3 players on a team against me unfortunately.
I'm 30. My dad and me played Dune 2 a lot of times (~1996-2000) and keep it as a a life changing game with a great amount of fun. :)
After a while I installed Dune (both from floppy disk 3,5) but didn't had the handbook. Cause after some time it require a page number (password) of a picture. So I figured it out myself... without internet. Old times...
I still play Generals too from time to time, you can still play online and there's still a decent amount of people playing. I still have memories beating my little brother at Generals but losing very badly to my Dad who was a top player back in the day.
I should play Dune 2 again sometime, i bet its rough to get back into though since you couldn't queue multiple units and so you had to constantly be clicking to build new units.
I still remember that brutal voice at the begining: "Dune: The Battle fo Arrakis".
I suspected that Dune was (and is) the first rts ever made.
...and this video confirmed this. :)
Well done.
This was such a trip down memory lane. I played all of these dune rts for hours and hours (along the rest of every c&c game made). The production value on this video was phenomenal, I'm glad I stumbled upon it.
"Even going beyond the concrete it lied down for Command & Conquer" @ 20:06, very funny :P
For some reason, this brought tears to my eyes.
And the Dune 2000 score is, imo, the best game score ever produced.
OpenRa, if you want play Dune2k
Dune 2000 was absolutely mind-blowin', I spent so much time playin' this game, so kudos for this gr8 documentary. And may I add, I still listen to the Dune 2000 soundtrack regularly.
I mowed a lawn when I was a kid and rode my bike up to blockbuster to rent a video game for the weekend. My brother and I loved Dune so much that we ended up saving up for it and buying it. My dad saw what we were playing and said "Ya know they made a movie about that...". We are both huge fans of everything Dune related because of that game. Even better that we went on to play all of the games that it inspired. Thank you for sharing this history with everyone.
I remember playing Dune, Dune II and Emperor.
Dune - I remember because of the amazing soundtrack. OMG. Absolutely amazing.
Dune II my introduction to Westwood dramatic/cheesy cut scenes.
Emperor - Forget about the fact it was the first 3d RTS. My god that colour scheme was something else. Truly game the impression that it was on the bleeding edge of the RTS scene ...
Alas
It wasn't the first 3D RTS, though, that was the Nintendo 64 "port" rather remake of Command & Conquer: Tiberian Dawn.
Possibly made by the same company in the predecessor of the engine for Emperor; I'm not sure.
Dune 2000 was one of my first video games I ever played. I remember my dad got it one day and for weeks and weeks I would watch him play. I remember staying up into the wee hours of the night as a ten year old boy playing Dune. To this day Dune 2000 is one of the only video games my father has ever played and enjoyed. We still talk about it occasionally. There is a running joke in my family to say "Building, Training" because that was a common sound you would hear at home lol.
I got half a tear when I saw a clip of KKND2 Krossfire....
11:37 the static, lmao
Doesn't even get called out by name, that game :P
That that... Thing... Shall not be named...
Yup, lmao. That game is a forbidden one for us.
@@NoStringsPrd ... Battle for Middle Earth 1 and 2? :P
I'm really surprised EA never ever tried to make a 4th one.
EVER.
very shocking that something like that NEVER happened.
The Harkonnen suite of music from Emperor was the soundtrack of my dissertation writing at university,
especially the power anthem that is Victory Is Inevitable
My father rented Dune for the Sega Genesis for me and we both loved it but had to return it. Couldn’t find it again. Months later happened to be at an EB games and asked the cashier if they had it. They didn’t but a man in line behind us overheard the conversation and actually had the game and was willing to sell it. Few weeks later we got it in the mail and that started our road down the rts genre.
Dune 2000 was my first RTS game and I still have fond memories of spending hours harvesting spice.
Just wow. I read Dune when I was like 10, and it blew my mind. So the game was one of my early favorites and one of the most influential for me personally, rts is still my passion almost 30 years later. I would just like to say thank you for creating this wonderful expose on the people and ideas that lead to this game, how it evolved, what it influenced and also how and why it disappeared. I felt a huge nostalgic twinge and also, in a strange way, a sense of closure.
What a delightful trip down memory lane. I enjoyed all of these games as a kid. Thanks.
It's only been a year, but I come back to this video fairly regularly, it was fantastically put together.
I really like the Ahoy vibes this video gives off, you've done your research and put it together in a very intriguing and entertaining way! Good stuff!
This was my first game ever. It set my trajectory for becoming a try hard gamer. 32 now and happy you tell people the story of this gem.
29 yo, my gaming life started early with Dune, Dune 2000, and Commander Keen. I second this notion
@@GamerKey91 30 and same. I have fond memories of playing Firefight over lan with my dad, and crashing the entire network with Dune2k. Aparantly they never had a unit limit, and they really should have.
I am 33 (2021) and same with me :)
This has got to be one of the best game documentaries I've seen so far. From the tastefully used in-game soundtracks in the background, to the overall production quality, to the clearly meticulous research you have done into the history behind the Dune game franchise. I thought I knew all there was to know about the Dune games, but by the end of the video, I had learned quite a few new things still.
There is however one interesting link you omitted, albeit a potential one. Towards the end of the video, you mentioned how Tencent had required the game development rights to the Dune IP, and how unlikely they were to release a Dune RTS. But guess which other prominent game company with RTS experience Tencent has a stake in? That's right, Blizzard! Imagine that, a new Dune RTS game developed by Blizzard, Westwood's fiercest competitor back in the day! Even if they used an existing engine such as the Starcraft engine for such a game, it would still have the potential to be amazing.
If Westwood were still around, such a prospect would obviously be sacriligious, but since EA killed Westwood, and nobody likes EA, perhaps it would be kind of appropriate for Blizzard to pick up the mantle, not unlike how Rocky avenged his old rival Apollo against Drago in Rocky IV. (EA obviously being Drago in this allegory.)
Unlikely, I know, but hey, a game geek can dream, right?
Anyway, this was an amazing video and a nostalgic treat to watch. Well done! 😊
My only thoughts are that it wasn't Tencent who secured the dev rights, but Funcom themselves, even if Tencent owns them. I'm not sure how transfer of the rights goes, though I guess Westwood could do that with IG. It's an interesting thought!
Thank you so much, glad you enjoyed it!
Tencent was the nail in the coffin of blizzard downfall, sadly.
Great script for this production, just the right amount of overview combined with technical detail and lore, well written Sir.
One of great things in Dune II was, even it pre dates Warcraft, it had 3 factions, computer to Warcraft with 2 factions.
I never knew much about Dune or the dune series, I wanted to pick it up when i was very young, but had no money and my parent's weren't crazy about Video games..
thanks so much for this video! I always appreciate your work!
Here's a playlist for all things Dune: ua-cam.com/play/PLRXGGVBzHLUdsgN_vFaZmfjc6bXxPqajV.html
Excellent video, thanks for making this. Dune almost single handedly got me into PC gaming. I actually played the game before reading the books. I love it dearly to this day.
One thing I always remember is how I got the original Dune novel; I'd watched my brother play Dune II on his Amiga a lot in the early 90s, then when Dune 2000 came out for some reason when he bought it in 1998 it came with a free copy of the book. I only read it some years later, purely out of curiosity from liking the games. I've since read it several times and the others up to Heretics. Have Chapter House but haven't decided to read it yet... will do so once I have time to re-read all of them together.
So the games kind of both indirectly and directly lead me to the book.
Couldn't get Dune 2 to run for quite some time. Ended up looking at the pictures in the manual for hours. I was so fascinated by all this machinery. What a great game and i have some fond memories of the 2000 edition as well.
I want to thank you for making this video and comment in a normal way. Nowadays most youtube videos are just edited in a way where I got to pause the video every minute or so just to give it time to sink in. Your video is more natural and better to understand for me.
Dune1 Is still one of the best games to this day. It ages like a fine wine or whiskey. It's 2d graphics are brilliant, storytelling magnificent and gameplay intriguing. How many RTS games can say that they are love storys, adventure and a rpg at the same time?
Those were my personal favorite games. I spent like years playing those. the best the mother of all strategy games maybe
Death hand... APPROACHING!
I'm still playing this on my Un approved 486! ;-)
Yes, and I had honor to play Dune 2 when I was kid. It never leave my mind.
I still have Emperor on hard copy... now, who's got a machine that can play it?
Back at that time I wan't sure if Dune 2 or Siege (I had the "Dogs of War" add on) were the way to go with the genre since I loved both. It seems history made a decision on that one. Still love Siege though.
RIP Westwood Studios. My buddies and I used to play Red Alert after school in the computer lab back in 96/97.